1 00:00:00,480 --> 00:00:06,200 Speaker 1: Hello, dear listener, It's Maria Inojosa and I really hope 2 00:00:06,200 --> 00:00:09,680 Speaker 1: you're enjoying the holidays, getting some time off, spending some 3 00:00:09,720 --> 00:00:13,000 Speaker 1: time with your loved ones and looking at nature and birds. 4 00:00:13,039 --> 00:00:15,280 Speaker 1: Of course, Oh my god, it's so hard to believe 5 00:00:15,280 --> 00:00:19,439 Speaker 1: that twenty twenty two is almost over. Today, I want 6 00:00:19,440 --> 00:00:22,800 Speaker 1: to share with you a conversation I had with Dominican 7 00:00:22,920 --> 00:00:27,440 Speaker 1: Colombian American actor and storyteller Christopher Rievas on his new 8 00:00:27,440 --> 00:00:32,080 Speaker 1: podcast called Brown Enough. In his podcast, Christopher talks to 9 00:00:32,200 --> 00:00:35,920 Speaker 1: brown activists, creators, and change makers about what it means 10 00:00:36,080 --> 00:00:40,000 Speaker 1: to be brown enough in America today. Quite a big question, 11 00:00:40,280 --> 00:00:44,600 Speaker 1: right Anyway. Here's my conversation with Christopher Rievas and a 12 00:00:44,680 --> 00:00:47,400 Speaker 1: quick warning, there's going to be some explicit language in 13 00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:51,880 Speaker 1: this conversation. It'll probably make you laugh, enjoy, and subscribe 14 00:00:51,920 --> 00:00:52,720 Speaker 1: to brown Enough. 15 00:00:53,760 --> 00:00:55,080 Speaker 2: What do you think about the color brown? 16 00:00:55,840 --> 00:00:58,760 Speaker 3: Brown is a beautiful color. It's a very rare color 17 00:00:58,760 --> 00:01:00,000 Speaker 3: to find when you go shop. 18 00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:03,200 Speaker 2: Have you noticed that I don't know that I have. 19 00:01:03,840 --> 00:01:05,800 Speaker 3: Well, when you go shopping, I want you to tell 20 00:01:05,800 --> 00:01:07,840 Speaker 3: me if you see a lot of brown pants, a 21 00:01:07,840 --> 00:01:10,160 Speaker 3: lot of brown shirts, a lot of suits that are 22 00:01:10,160 --> 00:01:13,720 Speaker 3: brown it's a very difficult color. It's hard to combine. 23 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:15,839 Speaker 2: Yo. My pops is one of a kind. 24 00:01:16,200 --> 00:01:18,440 Speaker 4: His name is William Reevas, and no, he is not 25 00:01:18,480 --> 00:01:21,759 Speaker 4: a stylist, although his fashion tips are classic and legendary. 26 00:01:22,120 --> 00:01:24,880 Speaker 3: The bell has to match the shoes. It's very rare 27 00:01:24,880 --> 00:01:28,640 Speaker 3: for you to find brown slacks. Look for it, Abigail. 28 00:01:29,000 --> 00:01:32,440 Speaker 3: Send somebody from Stitchers to go look for it brown pants. 29 00:01:34,560 --> 00:01:36,720 Speaker 4: Sorry, Pops, but my producers don't have time for those 30 00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:39,959 Speaker 4: kinds of errands. And unfortunately, this podcast is not about 31 00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:42,240 Speaker 4: my dad. But don't worry. You will still hear from 32 00:01:42,280 --> 00:01:45,520 Speaker 4: him here and there, that is for sure. This show is, however, 33 00:01:45,959 --> 00:01:58,520 Speaker 4: about brown being brown. This podcast was born out of 34 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:01,560 Speaker 4: the feeling of not feeling enough as a brown man 35 00:02:02,000 --> 00:02:05,120 Speaker 4: in a white black world. I don't necessarily speak the 36 00:02:05,160 --> 00:02:08,240 Speaker 4: best Spanish, or look the most Dominican or the most Colombian, 37 00:02:08,240 --> 00:02:11,920 Speaker 4: whatever that means. I'm just me, and yet I felt 38 00:02:12,000 --> 00:02:13,760 Speaker 4: like I didn't know where I fit in. I was 39 00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:17,040 Speaker 4: always trying to be something else for someone else, especially 40 00:02:17,040 --> 00:02:20,040 Speaker 4: as an actor in Hollywood. And that's until I started 41 00:02:20,080 --> 00:02:23,040 Speaker 4: to take back my own experiences and my own stories. 42 00:02:23,639 --> 00:02:26,560 Speaker 4: I even made a podcast about the person who inspired 43 00:02:26,600 --> 00:02:29,440 Speaker 4: me to do all this. His name is Portfitio Rubi Rosa, 44 00:02:29,440 --> 00:02:33,280 Speaker 4: and he is no Laya, the real James Bond, it 45 00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:37,600 Speaker 4: is true, but he's Dominican. Through learning about Ruby, I 46 00:02:37,680 --> 00:02:41,880 Speaker 4: learned a lot about myself and I realized I'm not alone. 47 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:45,639 Speaker 4: There are so many incredible, amazing Brown change makers out 48 00:02:45,639 --> 00:02:48,919 Speaker 4: here figuring out how to navigate this world, how to 49 00:02:48,960 --> 00:02:51,480 Speaker 4: take up space and own their self worth, how to 50 00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:54,120 Speaker 4: let go of the white gaze. And so I created 51 00:02:54,120 --> 00:02:57,000 Speaker 4: this space for all of us, a place to discuss 52 00:02:57,040 --> 00:02:59,840 Speaker 4: what our experiences are like. And today I have got 53 00:03:00,120 --> 00:03:03,120 Speaker 4: real treat for y'all. A legend, someone who knows what 54 00:03:03,160 --> 00:03:04,399 Speaker 4: it means to break barriers. 55 00:03:04,720 --> 00:03:08,400 Speaker 1: Well, my name is Maria no Josa, and I'm a 56 00:03:08,520 --> 00:03:12,280 Speaker 1: journalist in the United States trying to shake things up 57 00:03:12,560 --> 00:03:16,160 Speaker 1: continuously and also have a lot of good fun and laugh. 58 00:03:17,000 --> 00:03:18,120 Speaker 2: Madia's no rookie. 59 00:03:18,200 --> 00:03:21,240 Speaker 4: She has decades long career as a TV and radio journalist. 60 00:03:21,440 --> 00:03:23,760 Speaker 4: She'd just want to pull Zer prize y'all for her 61 00:03:23,760 --> 00:03:27,440 Speaker 4: podcast called Suave, a show about Maria's relationship with a 62 00:03:27,440 --> 00:03:31,040 Speaker 4: man incarcerated as a teen. In twenty twenty, she published 63 00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:34,280 Speaker 4: her memoir Once I was you, and this year she 64 00:03:34,360 --> 00:03:38,560 Speaker 4: adapted the book for young readers. Madia has fought tirelessly 65 00:03:38,640 --> 00:03:41,880 Speaker 4: to tell stories about her people, our people for her 66 00:03:42,040 --> 00:03:45,360 Speaker 4: entire career, and she is still doing the work She 67 00:03:45,400 --> 00:03:48,520 Speaker 4: had to prove over and over that her brownness is enough. 68 00:03:48,920 --> 00:03:51,320 Speaker 4: Today we'll talk about how her parents experience in the 69 00:03:51,440 --> 00:03:54,160 Speaker 4: US shaped how she thinks about this country, and what 70 00:03:54,240 --> 00:03:58,320 Speaker 4: she hopes for the next generation of brown journalist. My 71 00:03:58,400 --> 00:04:01,520 Speaker 4: name is Christopher Revas and this is brown Enough stories 72 00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:02,600 Speaker 4: between black and white. 73 00:04:02,840 --> 00:04:03,600 Speaker 2: Here we go, y'all. 74 00:04:20,560 --> 00:04:23,719 Speaker 4: Madia has reported for the biggest media outlets in the US. 75 00:04:23,920 --> 00:04:27,560 Speaker 4: We're talking CNN and PR PBS, and in twenty ten 76 00:04:27,960 --> 00:04:31,480 Speaker 4: she founded an independent, nonprofit newsroom and production company called 77 00:04:31,520 --> 00:04:35,839 Speaker 4: Futuro Media. There she became the executive producer of Latino USA. 78 00:04:36,360 --> 00:04:39,160 Speaker 4: It is one of the longest running national LATINX news 79 00:04:39,160 --> 00:04:42,560 Speaker 4: programs in the country. They cover everything from music to 80 00:04:42,839 --> 00:04:45,279 Speaker 4: Latin American history and of course immigration. 81 00:04:46,279 --> 00:04:48,880 Speaker 1: People are always like, oh god, Madia, oh man, you 82 00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:51,320 Speaker 1: just love to report on immigration so much because you're 83 00:04:51,320 --> 00:04:54,880 Speaker 1: a Mexican immigrant. Oh my god, you're so Mexican. 84 00:04:55,000 --> 00:04:55,080 Speaker 5: Ye. 85 00:04:55,320 --> 00:04:57,159 Speaker 1: Why are you wrong with Oh are you as reporting 86 00:04:57,160 --> 00:05:01,480 Speaker 1: about immigrant? Ye? And I'm like, oh, you think I'm 87 00:05:01,520 --> 00:05:05,760 Speaker 1: obsessed with immigrants and refugees. No, no, no, no, I'm 88 00:05:05,800 --> 00:05:12,000 Speaker 1: obsessed with the capacity of this country's inhumanity towards people 89 00:05:12,040 --> 00:05:14,279 Speaker 1: who simply were not born in this country, and that 90 00:05:14,320 --> 00:05:17,200 Speaker 1: includes me. That's what I'm obsessed with. 91 00:05:18,160 --> 00:05:20,960 Speaker 4: Maria has met children who've been taken away from their 92 00:05:21,000 --> 00:05:24,440 Speaker 4: relatives and caged in detention centers by the US government. 93 00:05:24,920 --> 00:05:28,039 Speaker 4: Her Mexican heritage has impacted how she reports on immigration. 94 00:05:28,839 --> 00:05:32,640 Speaker 1: So I was not born in this country. I was 95 00:05:32,680 --> 00:05:37,280 Speaker 1: born in Mexico. I'm a proud Mexican. Uh well, I'm 96 00:05:37,279 --> 00:05:39,000 Speaker 1: not a citizen because when I chose to become a 97 00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:40,960 Speaker 1: citizen of the United States, I had to give up 98 00:05:41,000 --> 00:05:45,440 Speaker 1: my Mexican citizenship. At that time, there was no dual citizenship. 99 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:51,960 Speaker 1: And so for me, my journalism is like, BLI canz aura, 100 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:55,760 Speaker 1: I'm an American citizen. Okay, now you all have to like, 101 00:05:55,839 --> 00:05:59,000 Speaker 1: I'm going to make sure that you you live up 102 00:05:59,000 --> 00:06:00,960 Speaker 1: to everything that you told me that you were going 103 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:02,600 Speaker 1: to be this country that I just chose to be 104 00:06:02,680 --> 00:06:08,600 Speaker 1: a citizen of. And so I really think it has 105 00:06:08,600 --> 00:06:10,360 Speaker 1: a lot to do with me choosing to become an 106 00:06:10,360 --> 00:06:18,120 Speaker 1: American citizen and therefore feeling this extraordinary weight to challenge 107 00:06:18,160 --> 00:06:20,960 Speaker 1: this country, to not let it get away with we're 108 00:06:21,000 --> 00:06:25,800 Speaker 1: the best American exceptionalism. And then it for me as 109 00:06:25,839 --> 00:06:30,039 Speaker 1: a journalist. My godfather, the one who I always turned to, 110 00:06:30,400 --> 00:06:34,080 Speaker 1: is Frederick Douglas. There was a quote that I'm in 111 00:06:34,160 --> 00:06:37,520 Speaker 1: a mangle of Frederick Douglas's, which is basically like, it's 112 00:06:37,560 --> 00:06:39,880 Speaker 1: only because you love this country so much that you're 113 00:06:39,920 --> 00:06:43,039 Speaker 1: going to criticize it so much. And that's how I feel. 114 00:06:43,080 --> 00:06:46,039 Speaker 1: I'm like, bro, I love this country, but yeah, my 115 00:06:46,240 --> 00:06:48,000 Speaker 1: job is to criticize. 116 00:06:48,520 --> 00:06:51,400 Speaker 4: Madia is the youngest of four children. She grew up 117 00:06:51,400 --> 00:06:54,360 Speaker 4: in the vibrant neighborhood of Hyde Park, Chicago, where her 118 00:06:54,360 --> 00:06:56,760 Speaker 4: father was hired to work at the University of Chicago. 119 00:06:57,240 --> 00:07:00,719 Speaker 4: Madia spent summers in Mexico with her extended family. Crossing 120 00:07:00,720 --> 00:07:03,480 Speaker 4: the border between the US and Mexico became a regular 121 00:07:03,520 --> 00:07:04,040 Speaker 4: part of her. 122 00:07:03,960 --> 00:07:07,839 Speaker 1: Life for most of my life. From the time that 123 00:07:07,920 --> 00:07:10,840 Speaker 1: I was like six or seven, we were driving from 124 00:07:10,920 --> 00:07:14,280 Speaker 1: Chicago to Mexico every year, all six of us in 125 00:07:14,520 --> 00:07:19,960 Speaker 1: the green station wagon, and that was a part of 126 00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:23,680 Speaker 1: my life. I would literally get to the border between 127 00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:26,920 Speaker 1: Texas and Mexico, and it was like, okay, goodbye United States. Okay, 128 00:07:26,920 --> 00:07:31,440 Speaker 1: iut at so leventem almost al Espanol, La raduos en Espanol, 129 00:07:32,640 --> 00:07:37,680 Speaker 1: La musica is Mexicana. And I would become my Mexican 130 00:07:38,240 --> 00:07:43,680 Speaker 1: self when we would cross back. I do, and as 131 00:07:43,720 --> 00:07:46,400 Speaker 1: I wrote in the Young Reader's version of my memoir, 132 00:07:46,400 --> 00:07:48,720 Speaker 1: once I was you, there was a lot of fear, 133 00:07:49,320 --> 00:07:51,400 Speaker 1: even though it was not a very scary place. It 134 00:07:51,440 --> 00:07:54,200 Speaker 1: was not militarized the way it is now the border. 135 00:07:54,320 --> 00:07:56,720 Speaker 1: But I always did feel a little bit like, oh, 136 00:07:56,760 --> 00:07:59,600 Speaker 1: and a lot of mixed emotions. I was leaving Mexico behind, 137 00:07:59,640 --> 00:08:01,720 Speaker 1: but I would is coming back to the country that 138 00:08:01,760 --> 00:08:06,400 Speaker 1: I knew well, the United States, always some trepidation because 139 00:08:06,440 --> 00:08:11,160 Speaker 1: the border patrol was always around. There were agents. You know, 140 00:08:11,200 --> 00:08:15,120 Speaker 1: we were six Mexicans driving home in a loaded station wagon, 141 00:08:15,200 --> 00:08:18,720 Speaker 1: so we would get sent to secondary inspection a bit. 142 00:08:19,280 --> 00:08:22,000 Speaker 1: And I did not like that and as a result, 143 00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:24,840 Speaker 1: did not like the border patrol. But you know, a 144 00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:27,240 Speaker 1: lot of my life and the stories revolve around this, 145 00:08:27,360 --> 00:08:29,679 Speaker 1: you know, being a border crosser, whether it was Mexico 146 00:08:29,800 --> 00:08:33,560 Speaker 1: US or whether it was you know, Chicago, moving south, 147 00:08:33,880 --> 00:08:38,400 Speaker 1: crossing all of the States borders. But the thing that 148 00:08:38,520 --> 00:08:41,360 Speaker 1: really kind of changed this whole relationship that I have 149 00:08:41,400 --> 00:08:43,440 Speaker 1: with the borders when I in the process of writing 150 00:08:43,480 --> 00:08:46,600 Speaker 1: the adult version of Once I Was You and I 151 00:08:46,640 --> 00:08:49,720 Speaker 1: had to come to terms with, you know, the Donald 152 00:08:49,720 --> 00:08:55,720 Speaker 1: Trump zero tolerance family separation policy, and my mom calling 153 00:08:55,760 --> 00:08:59,079 Speaker 1: me in the midst of that in tears and revealing 154 00:08:59,120 --> 00:09:01,640 Speaker 1: to me, like, look, when we came to this country 155 00:09:01,679 --> 00:09:06,040 Speaker 1: and we flew in, the immigration agent tried to take you. 156 00:09:06,840 --> 00:09:09,120 Speaker 1: So you were almost one of those babies who was 157 00:09:09,160 --> 00:09:12,000 Speaker 1: taken from their parents, and I was almost one of 158 00:09:12,040 --> 00:09:12,880 Speaker 1: those moms. 159 00:09:13,440 --> 00:09:16,439 Speaker 4: Upon arriving at an immigration checkpoint in Texas in nineteen 160 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:19,560 Speaker 4: sixty two, baby Maria was about to be taken into 161 00:09:19,600 --> 00:09:23,000 Speaker 4: quarantine because an agent saw she had a rash. But 162 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:25,800 Speaker 4: Mania's mother did not let this happen. She raised her 163 00:09:25,880 --> 00:09:28,920 Speaker 4: voice at the tall, blonde Texan agent and told him 164 00:09:28,920 --> 00:09:31,840 Speaker 4: that he would not take her baby away, and he didn't. 165 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:35,120 Speaker 4: When Maria's mother told her this story as an adult, 166 00:09:35,600 --> 00:09:38,920 Speaker 4: Maria couldn't believe how powerful her mother was. She understood 167 00:09:38,920 --> 00:09:41,760 Speaker 4: her rights as an American before she even had citizenship. 168 00:09:42,280 --> 00:09:45,040 Speaker 4: In her book, Maria describes her mother as a feminist, 169 00:09:45,120 --> 00:09:46,120 Speaker 4: jingana badass. 170 00:09:46,520 --> 00:09:48,640 Speaker 1: And when my mom kind of came to this revelation 171 00:09:49,559 --> 00:09:54,120 Speaker 1: in her eighties, that's when, as we say in Mexican Spanish, 172 00:09:54,200 --> 00:10:00,359 Speaker 1: migaiol ginto, and I understood exactly why I am theournalist 173 00:10:00,400 --> 00:10:03,199 Speaker 1: that I am. That I really felt like holy shit, 174 00:10:03,440 --> 00:10:06,960 Speaker 1: Like that trauma of almost being taken by an immigration 175 00:10:07,040 --> 00:10:09,679 Speaker 1: agent upon your arrival for the first time to this 176 00:10:09,720 --> 00:10:15,680 Speaker 1: country left an indelible, profound imprint on me. And that's 177 00:10:15,679 --> 00:10:17,640 Speaker 1: why I do the kind of journalism that I do. 178 00:10:18,320 --> 00:10:21,040 Speaker 4: Maria's father was another person she looked up to. He 179 00:10:21,160 --> 00:10:24,480 Speaker 4: was a scientist recruited by the University of Chicago. He 180 00:10:24,520 --> 00:10:26,640 Speaker 4: moved to the US before Maria and her family in 181 00:10:26,679 --> 00:10:29,120 Speaker 4: the nineteen fifties, smack dab in the middle of the 182 00:10:29,120 --> 00:10:32,240 Speaker 4: civil rights movement. There's an incredible story you share about 183 00:10:32,280 --> 00:10:34,840 Speaker 4: your father during the nineteen fifties before he gets hired 184 00:10:34,880 --> 00:10:37,960 Speaker 4: by the University of Chicago. His story reminded me about 185 00:10:37,960 --> 00:10:41,360 Speaker 4: my own pops, who chose to identify as white on 186 00:10:41,400 --> 00:10:44,440 Speaker 4: his driver's license. Can you please share the story about 187 00:10:44,480 --> 00:10:46,280 Speaker 4: your dad choosing which bathroom to use? 188 00:10:47,200 --> 00:10:53,160 Speaker 1: Wow, So your dad choosing white as a Dominican man 189 00:10:53,320 --> 00:10:57,920 Speaker 1: is so layered because I'm married to a Dominican man, 190 00:10:57,960 --> 00:11:01,680 Speaker 1: so I understand that right with the erasure in the 191 00:11:01,720 --> 00:11:05,800 Speaker 1: Dominican Republic of anything that is black, and in my 192 00:11:05,960 --> 00:11:11,199 Speaker 1: father's case, as a brown Mexican when he finds himself 193 00:11:11,240 --> 00:11:13,319 Speaker 1: in the US for the first time in Texas by 194 00:11:13,400 --> 00:11:16,959 Speaker 1: bus coming north to Chicago to the University of Chicago, 195 00:11:17,080 --> 00:11:19,839 Speaker 1: and they stop at the bus stop, and you know, 196 00:11:20,480 --> 00:11:25,840 Speaker 1: Mexico saw the United States as an advanced, industrialized, modern country, 197 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:29,800 Speaker 1: and so it's the nineteen fifties and my dad gets 198 00:11:29,840 --> 00:11:32,400 Speaker 1: off the bus to go to the bathroom and it's 199 00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:34,440 Speaker 1: and I'm sure he was probably like, nope, was bastad 200 00:11:34,480 --> 00:11:36,960 Speaker 1: mususio or noop was you know, it's gonna be dirty, 201 00:11:37,000 --> 00:11:38,880 Speaker 1: Like that was probably the thing he was thinking about. 202 00:11:39,440 --> 00:11:46,440 Speaker 1: And instead he's faced with you know, colored versus white, 203 00:11:46,559 --> 00:11:52,160 Speaker 1: and he was like kissisto colored or white. And he 204 00:11:52,200 --> 00:11:53,840 Speaker 1: looked at his skin and he's like, well, I'm definitely 205 00:11:53,920 --> 00:11:58,920 Speaker 1: not white, but I'm I'm not black. And so I'm 206 00:11:58,960 --> 00:12:01,360 Speaker 1: gonna choose the p right and I'm going to err 207 00:12:01,400 --> 00:12:02,800 Speaker 1: on the side of this. And I think this is 208 00:12:02,800 --> 00:12:06,240 Speaker 1: the complex conversation about Latinos and latinas right is our 209 00:12:06,320 --> 00:12:09,760 Speaker 1: proximity to whiteness, our ability to choose it if we 210 00:12:10,160 --> 00:12:12,679 Speaker 1: like in my father's case. But I think this marked 211 00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:15,760 Speaker 1: my dad because he felt like one. I think he 212 00:12:15,800 --> 00:12:18,959 Speaker 1: felt kind of shafted by the United States, like, you 213 00:12:19,040 --> 00:12:21,520 Speaker 1: guys portray yourselves as so advanced and yet you're doing 214 00:12:21,559 --> 00:12:27,760 Speaker 1: this kind of ridiculous bullshit. I also think my dad thought, well, 215 00:12:27,800 --> 00:12:30,280 Speaker 1: if they have a bathroom door for white people and 216 00:12:30,320 --> 00:12:33,360 Speaker 1: one for colored people, will there soon be one for Mexicans, 217 00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:38,480 Speaker 1: you know, And we're kind of not far fetched. And 218 00:12:38,520 --> 00:12:42,640 Speaker 1: then I think my father felt like he kind of 219 00:12:44,000 --> 00:12:46,600 Speaker 1: like he got under, he got by, like he squeezed in, 220 00:12:46,720 --> 00:12:49,240 Speaker 1: like he wasn't his full self right, because his full 221 00:12:49,240 --> 00:12:51,320 Speaker 1: self would have been, well, I'm not white. So I 222 00:12:51,360 --> 00:12:53,120 Speaker 1: always feel like that he felt like a part of 223 00:12:53,200 --> 00:12:55,760 Speaker 1: him was being erased in this country, and that he 224 00:12:56,640 --> 00:13:00,120 Speaker 1: gave my dad an element of distrust about the United States. 225 00:13:00,160 --> 00:13:04,280 Speaker 1: And you know what, I'm really thankful that it did, 226 00:13:04,760 --> 00:13:11,640 Speaker 1: because I think my dad passed down to me Gringosik, 227 00:13:11,880 --> 00:13:14,600 Speaker 1: you know, you know, there was always a little bit 228 00:13:14,600 --> 00:13:17,720 Speaker 1: of why no sepal And I'm glad because that makes 229 00:13:17,720 --> 00:13:20,560 Speaker 1: me a better journalist. Again. Happy to be an American 230 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:25,559 Speaker 1: citizen as my father was, but also glad that he 231 00:13:25,600 --> 00:13:30,200 Speaker 1: did not kind of believe, you know, hook line and sinker. 232 00:13:30,240 --> 00:13:35,000 Speaker 1: He was just like, I'm gonna demand certain things from 233 00:13:35,000 --> 00:13:38,160 Speaker 1: this country too, and it should be better. There should 234 00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:43,760 Speaker 1: not never have been segregation at that level in this country, 235 00:13:43,800 --> 00:13:47,840 Speaker 1: and yet it is a core part of this country's identity. 236 00:13:47,840 --> 00:13:51,360 Speaker 4: Still is and still is right hard to answer, Still 237 00:13:51,440 --> 00:13:53,640 Speaker 4: want to ask it, what do you think you would 238 00:13:53,640 --> 00:13:54,760 Speaker 4: have done in your pops issues? 239 00:13:56,720 --> 00:14:01,680 Speaker 1: Uh, in that moment, Yeah, Uh, I probably would have 240 00:14:01,679 --> 00:14:05,520 Speaker 1: done the same thing because I think that we have 241 00:14:05,559 --> 00:14:10,640 Speaker 1: to remember the amount of fear that now already was 242 00:14:10,720 --> 00:14:15,280 Speaker 1: clear that if you were black, you were a target, 243 00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:21,840 Speaker 1: You were you could be targeted, you were targeted, And 244 00:14:21,920 --> 00:14:24,400 Speaker 1: so I think that I would have probably said, well, 245 00:14:24,400 --> 00:14:26,320 Speaker 1: I don't you know, I don't want to be targeted. 246 00:14:26,360 --> 00:14:29,720 Speaker 1: I don't want to be attacked. And so you're right, 247 00:14:29,800 --> 00:14:32,840 Speaker 1: it's kind of like it's the privilege of being able 248 00:14:32,880 --> 00:14:34,520 Speaker 1: to say and so I can choose to do this. 249 00:14:36,200 --> 00:14:39,800 Speaker 1: And again, I think this is this is like the 250 00:14:39,840 --> 00:14:42,640 Speaker 1: next level of conversation, not the next level, because people 251 00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:44,480 Speaker 1: like you and me, we've been having this conversation for 252 00:14:44,520 --> 00:14:47,000 Speaker 1: a while but for the rest of the country, it's like, oh, 253 00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:50,520 Speaker 1: you think Latinos are just like this one thing, and like, 254 00:14:50,600 --> 00:14:52,960 Speaker 1: you know, they eat dacos and they speak Spanish and 255 00:14:53,000 --> 00:14:55,760 Speaker 1: they dance. Okay, you know, it's like you have no 256 00:14:56,000 --> 00:15:02,560 Speaker 1: idea how complex these communities are. You know, our different nationalities, 257 00:15:02,560 --> 00:15:05,000 Speaker 1: what we bring with us, the politics of it, our 258 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:09,240 Speaker 1: cultural divisions are race. But most of American mainstream media 259 00:15:09,280 --> 00:15:11,960 Speaker 1: you're not going to hear the conversation of how complex 260 00:15:12,040 --> 00:15:13,280 Speaker 1: Latinos and Latinas are. 261 00:15:14,120 --> 00:15:17,280 Speaker 4: You are an activist. You talk about activism a lot 262 00:15:17,280 --> 00:15:19,920 Speaker 4: in your book. You got to go to like civil 263 00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:22,440 Speaker 4: rights protests with your family in the sixties. What did 264 00:15:22,480 --> 00:15:24,480 Speaker 4: you see happening at these protests? Can you paint a. 265 00:15:24,400 --> 00:15:24,960 Speaker 2: Picture for me? 266 00:15:26,080 --> 00:15:28,360 Speaker 1: You know, they were kind of very similar to the 267 00:15:28,400 --> 00:15:31,480 Speaker 1: civil rights protests happening over the last two years here 268 00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:35,960 Speaker 1: in our country now, after the horrible murder of George Floyd. 269 00:15:35,960 --> 00:15:39,360 Speaker 1: May he rest in peace, but no reason for him 270 00:15:39,400 --> 00:15:41,080 Speaker 1: to be resting. He should be with us. That would 271 00:15:41,120 --> 00:15:45,800 Speaker 1: be justice. But oh, you know, the ones that I 272 00:15:45,920 --> 00:15:48,960 Speaker 1: went to, they were small, they were in our community, 273 00:15:49,840 --> 00:15:53,120 Speaker 1: they were you know, five blocks from my grammar school. 274 00:15:53,280 --> 00:15:59,960 Speaker 1: They were families with poster board. You know. It was 275 00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:06,000 Speaker 1: for education and equality and education, and they were very joyful. 276 00:16:07,280 --> 00:16:11,600 Speaker 1: It was a sense of community. It was, oh my god, 277 00:16:11,640 --> 00:16:15,800 Speaker 1: if we all chant together, WHOA that sense chills up 278 00:16:15,840 --> 00:16:18,440 Speaker 1: and down my spine. Well this is And you know 279 00:16:18,480 --> 00:16:20,960 Speaker 1: I wasn't a citizen then my whole family, the only 280 00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:23,280 Speaker 1: my dad was a citizen. And so it was a 281 00:16:23,320 --> 00:16:24,600 Speaker 1: sense of like, we can be a part of this 282 00:16:24,600 --> 00:16:27,280 Speaker 1: country even though we can't vote. And that's always been 283 00:16:27,480 --> 00:16:29,520 Speaker 1: you know. I became a democracy junkie, I think in 284 00:16:29,560 --> 00:16:31,760 Speaker 1: part because of that, and I'd love to call myself 285 00:16:31,800 --> 00:16:37,000 Speaker 1: a democracy junkie. And it is about understanding that democracy 286 00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:41,240 Speaker 1: exists in multiple forms. It is not just going to 287 00:16:41,280 --> 00:16:44,720 Speaker 1: the ballot box. It is in everything that we do. 288 00:16:44,800 --> 00:16:51,200 Speaker 1: We live at Elmos, you know, inspire and aspire and 289 00:16:51,400 --> 00:16:53,120 Speaker 1: inhale and exhale democracy. 290 00:16:54,480 --> 00:16:59,280 Speaker 4: I think journalists can be activists. I don't think all 291 00:16:59,360 --> 00:17:04,200 Speaker 4: journalists are activist, you know, as an inspiration to many journalists, 292 00:17:04,240 --> 00:17:06,240 Speaker 4: what are your thoughts on activism and journalism. 293 00:17:06,920 --> 00:17:08,840 Speaker 1: You have called me an activist, and I'm like m 294 00:17:10,400 --> 00:17:12,520 Speaker 1: And the reason why I take pause is because I 295 00:17:12,680 --> 00:17:17,280 Speaker 1: was once an activist in college and right before I 296 00:17:17,320 --> 00:17:20,600 Speaker 1: started my career, I was an activist. I would go 297 00:17:20,600 --> 00:17:24,399 Speaker 1: to political meetings. I was a massive note taker. I 298 00:17:24,480 --> 00:17:28,959 Speaker 1: had ridiculous amounts of schedules, strategies, and I know what 299 00:17:29,000 --> 00:17:31,520 Speaker 1: it takes to be an activist. It takes a hell 300 00:17:31,640 --> 00:17:34,600 Speaker 1: of a lot. So if you say I'm an activist 301 00:17:34,600 --> 00:17:36,960 Speaker 1: in journalism, then I would say, well, I'm an activist 302 00:17:37,000 --> 00:17:43,080 Speaker 1: for the truth. I'm actually an activist for representation, for equity, right. 303 00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:47,919 Speaker 1: But as a journalist per se, you know, part of 304 00:17:47,920 --> 00:17:50,119 Speaker 1: what I've had to do and always do and pride 305 00:17:50,160 --> 00:17:53,120 Speaker 1: myself on doing is speaking with people who don't look 306 00:17:53,160 --> 00:17:55,800 Speaker 1: like me, sound like me, or think like me, and 307 00:17:55,920 --> 00:17:59,040 Speaker 1: finding a way to talk with them. In that sense, 308 00:17:59,080 --> 00:18:02,879 Speaker 1: I'm an activist for my profession. I want us to 309 00:18:02,880 --> 00:18:08,800 Speaker 1: do better journalism. I'm sick of this both sides ism 310 00:18:09,119 --> 00:18:12,480 Speaker 1: of like, you know, the pros and cons of cannibalism or, 311 00:18:12,480 --> 00:18:14,919 Speaker 1: in the case of Donald Trump, the pros and cons 312 00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:19,280 Speaker 1: of staging an attempted coup. It's like, shut the fuck up. 313 00:18:20,240 --> 00:18:22,560 Speaker 1: No no, no, no, no, no, no no. And so 314 00:18:23,160 --> 00:18:26,280 Speaker 1: in that sense, I want a journalism that is much 315 00:18:26,400 --> 00:18:33,040 Speaker 1: more aware of our role as as protecting our democracy, 316 00:18:34,200 --> 00:18:39,000 Speaker 1: as understanding the use of propaganda and authoritarianism and anti 317 00:18:39,119 --> 00:18:49,200 Speaker 1: democratic tactics that are used by politicians. So that does 318 00:18:49,240 --> 00:18:52,080 Speaker 1: sound kind of activisty, like as I'm hearing myself, I'm like, God, not, yeah, 319 00:18:52,119 --> 00:19:01,320 Speaker 1: you're some, But I'm getting really about about my profession. 320 00:19:02,119 --> 00:19:08,240 Speaker 1: And again, my mentor is Frederick Douglas and he was 321 00:19:08,280 --> 00:19:13,760 Speaker 1: a journalist of conscience. So I want journalists of conscience 322 00:19:14,480 --> 00:19:19,400 Speaker 1: to be journalists that are leading in this country. And 323 00:19:19,480 --> 00:19:22,280 Speaker 1: we're not there yet, but I would say I'm an 324 00:19:22,320 --> 00:19:26,200 Speaker 1: activist for the truth and for my professional. 325 00:19:30,320 --> 00:19:33,359 Speaker 4: Y'all, we need more journalists like Maria out here, those 326 00:19:33,400 --> 00:19:36,800 Speaker 4: who are seeking the truth and sharing underrepresented stories. 327 00:19:37,240 --> 00:19:38,280 Speaker 2: The tragic killing of. 328 00:19:38,240 --> 00:19:41,480 Speaker 4: George Floyd in twenty twenty made it apparent that newsrooms 329 00:19:41,520 --> 00:19:44,919 Speaker 4: across the US need to be more diverse, more black 330 00:19:44,920 --> 00:19:48,280 Speaker 4: and brown voices, but very little has been done. Take 331 00:19:48,320 --> 00:19:51,760 Speaker 4: for example, the Associated Press, seventy six percent of their 332 00:19:51,800 --> 00:19:54,920 Speaker 4: full time news reporters in the US are white, eight 333 00:19:54,960 --> 00:19:58,240 Speaker 4: percent or Latino, seven percent are black, and six percent 334 00:19:58,240 --> 00:20:01,760 Speaker 4: are Asian, and their news manage is eighty one percent white. 335 00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:05,280 Speaker 4: The decision makers, y'all, we're going to take a quick break, 336 00:20:05,320 --> 00:20:07,680 Speaker 4: and when we come back Maria tells us one of 337 00:20:07,720 --> 00:20:11,000 Speaker 4: her favorite fashion choices for being on camera. Stick around, 338 00:20:24,960 --> 00:20:28,479 Speaker 4: and we are back with Maria hino Hosa. Before winning 339 00:20:28,520 --> 00:20:31,840 Speaker 4: a Pulitzer Prize and becoming the EP of the longest 340 00:20:31,920 --> 00:20:35,719 Speaker 4: running LATINX media organization, Maria was in the busy streets 341 00:20:35,720 --> 00:20:38,760 Speaker 4: of New York reporting for CNN. Here's a clip of 342 00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:41,439 Speaker 4: her wearing a winter jacket, a white vest, and some 343 00:20:41,560 --> 00:20:43,640 Speaker 4: glittering hoop earrings on a snowy day. 344 00:20:44,359 --> 00:20:45,919 Speaker 1: All right, well, so here we have it. 345 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:49,879 Speaker 5: That is a statue of Mahatma Gandhi taking the snow 346 00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:54,520 Speaker 5: quite peacefully actually, even though a little bit chilly here 347 00:20:54,560 --> 00:20:56,400 Speaker 5: in New York there has been snowfalling. 348 00:20:56,480 --> 00:20:58,600 Speaker 4: What is your relationship to hoops or do they have 349 00:20:58,600 --> 00:21:00,960 Speaker 4: any significance other than the you just like them. 350 00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:02,879 Speaker 1: So ear rings have always been a thing for me. 351 00:21:03,320 --> 00:21:06,840 Speaker 1: I think that's the thing. Big ear rings have always 352 00:21:06,880 --> 00:21:10,840 Speaker 1: been a very big deal for me. But then as 353 00:21:10,880 --> 00:21:12,840 Speaker 1: I got older, you know, it was harder for me 354 00:21:12,920 --> 00:21:16,120 Speaker 1: to wear very big earrings because my my lobes kind 355 00:21:16,119 --> 00:21:19,880 Speaker 1: of grew a little bit. So hoops just make it 356 00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:24,840 Speaker 1: super easy. I see them as a representation of everything 357 00:21:24,920 --> 00:21:29,959 Speaker 1: Latina to me. Whether it is the Afro Guanas, you know, 358 00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:33,639 Speaker 1: and I'm part Cuban in my legacy, or whether it 359 00:21:33,880 --> 00:21:38,920 Speaker 1: is Lasin, Dinas, Casi Pretin and sou Oro, of which 360 00:21:38,960 --> 00:21:44,880 Speaker 1: I am also a descendant. I hoops in the nineteen 361 00:21:45,080 --> 00:21:50,360 Speaker 1: sixties were like a very big deal. Angela Davis wore hoops, 362 00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:55,040 Speaker 1: So they are a political statement. And also I think 363 00:21:55,080 --> 00:21:59,679 Speaker 1: that they're just super easy clean, and they do make 364 00:21:59,720 --> 00:22:04,280 Speaker 1: a stick. And like I said, easy, I'd like easy way. 365 00:22:04,119 --> 00:22:06,800 Speaker 4: Before the journalism and the Pulitzer. I read that you 366 00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:10,320 Speaker 4: wanted to be an actress. What makes you think about 367 00:22:10,320 --> 00:22:12,840 Speaker 4: becoming an actress? Was there a movie that influenced you? 368 00:22:13,880 --> 00:22:17,720 Speaker 1: Oh god, well, well you read about this. Yes, it's true. 369 00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:20,520 Speaker 1: I did get inspired by Natalie Wood playing a Latina 370 00:22:20,560 --> 00:22:23,160 Speaker 1: and I was like, her name is Madiya, and oh 371 00:22:23,200 --> 00:22:25,280 Speaker 1: my god, I saw West Side Story. I think you know. 372 00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:28,040 Speaker 1: I did start doing theater when I was eight years old. 373 00:22:29,119 --> 00:22:31,600 Speaker 1: I did come to New York after watching zoot Suit 374 00:22:31,680 --> 00:22:36,159 Speaker 1: on Broadway, the first La Latina play on Broadway. I closed, 375 00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:39,000 Speaker 1: as you know, famously, maybe two or three weeks later. 376 00:22:39,040 --> 00:22:42,640 Speaker 1: It was terrible. It was a great play, but New 377 00:22:42,680 --> 00:22:46,280 Speaker 1: York wasn't ready and I did. I was like, I'm 378 00:22:46,320 --> 00:22:47,840 Speaker 1: going to go to New York. I'm gonna go to college, 379 00:22:47,880 --> 00:22:51,679 Speaker 1: but I'm in an audition on the side. And then 380 00:22:51,920 --> 00:22:54,320 Speaker 1: a director kind of killed my spirit. He was just like, 381 00:22:54,400 --> 00:22:57,320 Speaker 1: you know, you're you gave a good audition, but I 382 00:22:57,359 --> 00:23:00,760 Speaker 1: don't really know. It's like, you know, you're not really 383 00:23:01,000 --> 00:23:03,920 Speaker 1: Latina enough, you're not white enough, you're not tall enough, 384 00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:05,879 Speaker 1: you're not short enough, you're not street enough, you're not 385 00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:10,400 Speaker 1: sophisticated enough. I'm not exactly sure you know how where 386 00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:12,920 Speaker 1: you're going to fit in this business. I gave him 387 00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:16,119 Speaker 1: my power and I let him pop that bubble and 388 00:23:16,160 --> 00:23:18,080 Speaker 1: I fell into all of my insecurities. But you know, 389 00:23:18,119 --> 00:23:20,480 Speaker 1: the good news is, of course I became a journalist, 390 00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:23,199 Speaker 1: and there's a lot of things that you learn in 391 00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:27,000 Speaker 1: acting that are good for journalism, you know, having to 392 00:23:27,080 --> 00:23:30,560 Speaker 1: be different personas in different moments, be very powerful even 393 00:23:30,600 --> 00:23:33,400 Speaker 1: though you're not feeling that way. But I haven't given 394 00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:36,359 Speaker 1: up totally on my dream of being an actor. 395 00:23:37,280 --> 00:23:38,200 Speaker 2: Oh there's still time. 396 00:23:38,800 --> 00:23:41,720 Speaker 1: Well, I mean you saw in the Heights, right, Yeah, 397 00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:43,919 Speaker 1: so that was me? Who is the protest leader? 398 00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:46,240 Speaker 2: Whoa stop? Really? I don't think. 399 00:23:48,520 --> 00:23:50,440 Speaker 1: You'll go back now? You'll be like, oh my god. 400 00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:50,800 Speaker 2: Yeah. 401 00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:54,880 Speaker 1: You know, usually when I'm on television. You know they 402 00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:57,399 Speaker 1: back then, when we would go to do television and 403 00:23:57,400 --> 00:23:59,000 Speaker 1: go in the studio and have hair and makeup, you know, 404 00:23:59,000 --> 00:24:00,960 Speaker 1: I'd look very you know, my hair would be all 405 00:24:01,000 --> 00:24:04,480 Speaker 1: done and all. When I for my role in Hollywood, 406 00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:06,480 Speaker 1: I went to hair and makeup and I was like, oh, 407 00:24:06,480 --> 00:24:08,480 Speaker 1: they're totally going to do me up. They did nothing. 408 00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:11,320 Speaker 1: They're like, no, we don't hear some lipstick. I was like, 409 00:24:11,600 --> 00:24:14,520 Speaker 1: can I get some concealer? They were like, okay. There 410 00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:18,120 Speaker 1: was very little makeup on purpose because I was an 411 00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:20,880 Speaker 1: act I was playing the role of Juana, the activist. 412 00:24:22,200 --> 00:24:23,960 Speaker 1: I started the one. I was the one who was 413 00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:27,639 Speaker 1: leading the chant tell our stories under the direction of 414 00:24:27,720 --> 00:24:30,679 Speaker 1: John m chu who directed In the Heights, which I 415 00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:34,240 Speaker 1: believe should have won multiple Oscars. Don't get me started. 416 00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:36,800 Speaker 4: Yeah, I had to go back and rewatch in the 417 00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:39,560 Speaker 4: Heights to see Maria sin Asuana, and there she was 418 00:24:39,640 --> 00:24:45,640 Speaker 4: surrounded by the crowd of protesters. 419 00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:48,280 Speaker 1: A kid from some benevolent saint, right. 420 00:24:51,160 --> 00:25:01,840 Speaker 4: Me, watch out, Hollywood, Maria HEINOJSA is coming to a 421 00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:06,359 Speaker 4: theater near you. You've mentioned a lot. Frederick Douglass. What 422 00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:09,320 Speaker 4: other journalists made it like a big first impression on 423 00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:11,320 Speaker 4: you or did you ever see a journalist growing up 424 00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:13,960 Speaker 4: that you were like, That's who I'm trying to be. 425 00:25:14,840 --> 00:25:20,240 Speaker 1: There were no women journalists in the United States for 426 00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:24,760 Speaker 1: me to look up to as a little girl. In 427 00:25:24,840 --> 00:25:28,360 Speaker 1: the writing of both the memoir and then the young 428 00:25:28,400 --> 00:25:31,119 Speaker 1: reader's version of Once I Was You, I had a 429 00:25:31,160 --> 00:25:34,320 Speaker 1: revelation which was really beautiful. It was actually Mexican women 430 00:25:35,119 --> 00:25:38,760 Speaker 1: who were journalists on the radio and on television. They 431 00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:41,680 Speaker 1: were the ones who kind of inspired me. I don't 432 00:25:41,680 --> 00:25:46,399 Speaker 1: remember their names, but the first journalist that I remember 433 00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:50,040 Speaker 1: just being like, whoa Ed Bradley. 434 00:25:50,520 --> 00:25:55,040 Speaker 2: This is the East Coast of Malaysia final destination. Thousands 435 00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:56,960 Speaker 2: of refugees lay in Vietnam. 436 00:25:58,680 --> 00:26:03,520 Speaker 1: Black correspond for CBS News. He was on the ground 437 00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:05,600 Speaker 1: in Vietnam, and he was a black man, and he 438 00:26:05,680 --> 00:26:08,920 Speaker 1: was a journalist, and he was so suave and smart. 439 00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:12,359 Speaker 1: And please forgive me when I say this, but yes, 440 00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:17,760 Speaker 1: I was very impressed by seeing Heraldo Rivera. This is 441 00:26:17,800 --> 00:26:21,520 Speaker 1: back when Heraldo was actually a great investigative journalist. If 442 00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:24,960 Speaker 1: you have never watched the Willow book reporting that he 443 00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:31,399 Speaker 1: did uncovering abuse at mental health facilities in New York. 444 00:26:32,440 --> 00:26:35,040 Speaker 4: It's been more than six years since Robert Kennedy walked 445 00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:37,000 Speaker 4: out of one of the wars here Willowbrook and told 446 00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:38,840 Speaker 4: newsmen of the horror he'd seen insaw. 447 00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:43,159 Speaker 1: That was his claim to fame. He did great journalism 448 00:26:43,200 --> 00:26:46,960 Speaker 1: at that point. And I remember, just like Heraldo Rivera, 449 00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:48,000 Speaker 1: you are. 450 00:26:48,520 --> 00:26:51,040 Speaker 4: A leader, whether you identified it or not. And I 451 00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:55,320 Speaker 4: will say that just because you were the first Latino 452 00:26:55,359 --> 00:26:59,920 Speaker 4: correspondent on NPR. You were the first Latino correspondent on. 453 00:27:01,400 --> 00:27:04,880 Speaker 1: And until the lucky few stop winning, millions, Americans will 454 00:27:04,920 --> 00:27:09,320 Speaker 1: continue playing the game. Maria Ino Josa, CNN, New York. 455 00:27:09,680 --> 00:27:11,560 Speaker 2: What's it feel like to be a first? 456 00:27:13,119 --> 00:27:15,639 Speaker 1: You know, when when I first wrote the book Garis 457 00:27:17,040 --> 00:27:18,960 Speaker 1: and so, what was it like to be in that newsroom? 458 00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:20,840 Speaker 1: You know, when you first got your job as the 459 00:27:20,880 --> 00:27:23,800 Speaker 1: first Latin at NPR, and I was like, girl, I 460 00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:25,920 Speaker 1: was thankful I had a job. It was a recession. 461 00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:29,159 Speaker 1: So the first thing that came to mind was like, 462 00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:34,680 Speaker 1: I'm just thankful I got a job. To me, the 463 00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:38,080 Speaker 1: sense of being a first means total responsibility. It means 464 00:27:38,119 --> 00:27:41,520 Speaker 1: while this privilege, ohsay, you worked really hard to get 465 00:27:41,560 --> 00:27:44,800 Speaker 1: to this point. But you have had ridiculous amounts of 466 00:27:44,840 --> 00:27:47,040 Speaker 1: privilege to help you get to this point. And now 467 00:27:47,040 --> 00:27:51,120 Speaker 1: that you're in you have a deep responsibility to use 468 00:27:51,359 --> 00:27:57,040 Speaker 1: your voice and to afflict right the people in power, 469 00:27:57,840 --> 00:28:00,760 Speaker 1: including my bosses, my editors, to a flick them, to 470 00:28:00,920 --> 00:28:04,840 Speaker 1: always be just like kind of not prepared to take 471 00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:08,399 Speaker 1: it sitting down. And I felt like that was part 472 00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:14,920 Speaker 1: of my responsibility. It was scary. I had a great 473 00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:18,359 Speaker 1: have a great husband, a Dominican man who is liked 474 00:28:18,720 --> 00:28:26,280 Speaker 1: LEAs you know, just like that white man isn't gonna 475 00:28:26,280 --> 00:28:28,080 Speaker 1: bean a thing to you in five years, you know, 476 00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:31,439 Speaker 1: just keep doing you know, like so it took a 477 00:28:31,480 --> 00:28:35,280 Speaker 1: lot from me, you know, doing therapy talking about imposter syndrome, 478 00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:41,800 Speaker 1: worried that I was never good enough. But I'm I'm 479 00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:45,000 Speaker 1: I'm happy to be that person who was the first 480 00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:48,360 Speaker 1: because I I I know that I brought a tremendous 481 00:28:48,400 --> 00:28:51,840 Speaker 1: sense of responsibility. And I mean, okay, you keep on 482 00:28:51,920 --> 00:28:53,840 Speaker 1: saying you're a leader. I'm like, okay, but you know, 483 00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:56,360 Speaker 1: I don't. I hope that I'm a leader in the 484 00:28:56,440 --> 00:28:58,680 Speaker 1: sense that I'm always trying to be like but I'm 485 00:28:58,760 --> 00:29:01,720 Speaker 1: just like you, like don't. That's why whenever people introduce 486 00:29:01,800 --> 00:29:02,920 Speaker 1: me and they're like, oh my god, and she won 487 00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:05,760 Speaker 1: this award and that award, and I'm like stop, because 488 00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:09,440 Speaker 1: ultimately I'm just I mean, I'm just like you. Maybe 489 00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:11,280 Speaker 1: that's why I love the title of the book, Once 490 00:29:11,320 --> 00:29:13,200 Speaker 1: I Was You, because in many ways, I try to 491 00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:17,000 Speaker 1: see myself in the person most unlike me. At all times. 492 00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:20,800 Speaker 4: You have been in our community and in our lives 493 00:29:20,840 --> 00:29:23,640 Speaker 4: and representing Latinos for so. 494 00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:25,520 Speaker 2: Long. 495 00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:34,080 Speaker 4: Was there ever a moment where it became too much pressure, 496 00:29:34,080 --> 00:29:36,160 Speaker 4: where it was like, oh, I have to now, I 497 00:29:36,200 --> 00:29:36,760 Speaker 4: have to do this. 498 00:29:36,880 --> 00:29:38,080 Speaker 2: Now I'm the you know. 499 00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:41,160 Speaker 4: I'm sure there was a joy at some point, did 500 00:29:41,160 --> 00:29:43,560 Speaker 4: the joy of relieving it became pressure, Like, I you know, 501 00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:45,440 Speaker 4: I'm the first in this, I'm the first in this. 502 00:29:45,560 --> 00:29:46,600 Speaker 4: I have to keep going. 503 00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:51,840 Speaker 1: Well, I mean, I did feel like I had to 504 00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:56,920 Speaker 1: prove myself at every turn for the first two decades 505 00:29:56,960 --> 00:30:00,239 Speaker 1: of my career. Tight so I got a while, oh 506 00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:01,200 Speaker 1: for sure. 507 00:30:02,840 --> 00:30:03,080 Speaker 2: You know. 508 00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:06,320 Speaker 1: And then I create my own company and I had 509 00:30:06,400 --> 00:30:09,719 Speaker 1: no idea what I was doing, I mean zero idea, 510 00:30:09,880 --> 00:30:12,320 Speaker 1: and just had kind of a hope and people who 511 00:30:12,360 --> 00:30:20,640 Speaker 1: believed in it. I feel a tremendous historical responsibility. The 512 00:30:20,680 --> 00:30:23,720 Speaker 1: pressure that I feel is like in a morning, on 513 00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:25,600 Speaker 1: a morning like today, I had a rough night a 514 00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:27,920 Speaker 1: little bit. I mean I could sleep, but there were 515 00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:30,520 Speaker 1: you know, I'll wake up and I'll be like, how 516 00:30:30,600 --> 00:30:34,000 Speaker 1: is this person in prison? Or you know, is this 517 00:30:34,040 --> 00:30:36,080 Speaker 1: person going to make it across the border, or is 518 00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:38,640 Speaker 1: this person being abused? Like all of the people who 519 00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:42,120 Speaker 1: I know, the souls who I'm reporting about, and it 520 00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:44,360 Speaker 1: does sometimes just feel like, oh my god, this is 521 00:30:44,400 --> 00:30:46,880 Speaker 1: too much. This is just too much. And then it's 522 00:30:46,920 --> 00:30:49,920 Speaker 1: like see and you wake up and it's about just 523 00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:53,800 Speaker 1: chipping away. I love that term, chipping away, just a 524 00:30:53,800 --> 00:30:57,120 Speaker 1: little by little, chipping away, doing everything that you can. 525 00:30:57,760 --> 00:31:00,960 Speaker 1: And so I don't see this as pressure. I see 526 00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:04,560 Speaker 1: this as I mean, it is pressure, and it is 527 00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:08,080 Speaker 1: a lot. That's why I have need for release, which 528 00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:11,160 Speaker 1: is why I go boxing, et cetera. But I don't 529 00:31:11,680 --> 00:31:15,000 Speaker 1: see I don't take the pressure and feel horrified by 530 00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:17,360 Speaker 1: it and just feel like, oh my god. You know, 531 00:31:18,520 --> 00:31:21,760 Speaker 1: maybe I did in the past, but now I'm like, no, 532 00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:26,720 Speaker 1: I understand this pressure. There are not many of us, 533 00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:30,600 Speaker 1: and I include you Greece. In the conversation of Latinos 534 00:31:30,600 --> 00:31:35,920 Speaker 1: and Latinas and LATINX and Latine who are deeply involved 535 00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:40,240 Speaker 1: in the conversation about our future identity, our power, our politics, 536 00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:46,080 Speaker 1: and so we don't have a choice. We have to 537 00:31:46,080 --> 00:31:47,400 Speaker 1: do this, and we have to do it with joy 538 00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:47,960 Speaker 1: and gusto. 539 00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:52,560 Speaker 4: Your memoir exists for a youth audience. What are you 540 00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:54,960 Speaker 4: hoping the youth gets away from reading your book? Like, 541 00:31:55,000 --> 00:31:58,240 Speaker 4: what's the the major differences between that audience and the 542 00:31:58,280 --> 00:31:59,080 Speaker 4: older audience. 543 00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:04,120 Speaker 1: So when my agent, Adriana Doromingez said, look, I think 544 00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:07,280 Speaker 1: you might want to think about doing a young adult book, 545 00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:13,080 Speaker 1: and I was like why, Like, no, no, I don't 546 00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:16,080 Speaker 1: write for kids. Why would you even suggest that? Are 547 00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:20,160 Speaker 1: you crazy? And she said, well, it's a very competitive market, 548 00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:25,440 Speaker 1: many many books are sold, and I was like, huh, 549 00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:29,720 Speaker 1: that's interesting. And then coupled that with the data about 550 00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:32,360 Speaker 1: the median age of Latinos and Latinas in the United 551 00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:36,200 Speaker 1: States right now, which is eleven. Hence why I wrote 552 00:32:36,200 --> 00:32:39,360 Speaker 1: a book aimed at you know, ten year olds, basically 553 00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:43,280 Speaker 1: because this is where I feel the responsibility. Oh hell yes, 554 00:32:43,760 --> 00:32:46,040 Speaker 1: And I'm like, oh my god, I hope this book 555 00:32:46,120 --> 00:32:48,720 Speaker 1: is read by thousands apon thousands about thousands of kids 556 00:32:48,760 --> 00:32:53,000 Speaker 1: of all backgrounds because I want them to understand a 557 00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:55,239 Speaker 1: little bit of history and their role in it and 558 00:32:55,280 --> 00:33:02,560 Speaker 1: how to see their own power. So I've really understood 559 00:33:02,640 --> 00:33:05,800 Speaker 1: how important it is that we are talking to younger people. 560 00:33:06,120 --> 00:33:08,480 Speaker 1: And I was always that journalist who was talking to 561 00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:10,680 Speaker 1: like kids in high school. That was some of my 562 00:33:10,760 --> 00:33:15,160 Speaker 1: earliest award winning reporting was talking to kids, non white kids. 563 00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:20,320 Speaker 1: It was like people didn't do that. And so it's 564 00:33:20,360 --> 00:33:22,720 Speaker 1: not a surprise now that I'm talking to even younger 565 00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:26,440 Speaker 1: kids right because we need to get them before they're 566 00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:29,040 Speaker 1: in high school. We need to get them to understand 567 00:33:29,040 --> 00:33:33,240 Speaker 1: their power and place in this country before high school. 568 00:33:34,480 --> 00:33:38,720 Speaker 1: I am hoping that it feels it makes kids feel 569 00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:41,000 Speaker 1: like they belong and that they have a voice, and 570 00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:45,400 Speaker 1: that they are visible and seeing, And in particular, you know, 571 00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:48,360 Speaker 1: the beginning of the book, I write about kids who 572 00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:52,479 Speaker 1: are taken from their parents, and I want them to 573 00:33:52,600 --> 00:33:57,080 Speaker 1: read this book and to know that they belong in 574 00:33:57,120 --> 00:34:00,160 Speaker 1: this country, that we love them and want them here. 575 00:34:00,840 --> 00:34:03,760 Speaker 2: What are your hopes for the new generation of brown journalists? 576 00:34:05,080 --> 00:34:09,040 Speaker 1: Oh my god, I love that question. I hope that 577 00:34:09,120 --> 00:34:14,360 Speaker 1: they do the work to understand the kind of responsibility 578 00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:16,759 Speaker 1: that they have in the work that they do. And 579 00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:19,320 Speaker 1: I say this as seriously as I say this to you, Chris, 580 00:34:19,360 --> 00:34:22,360 Speaker 1: as a as an artist and as a storyteller and 581 00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:26,640 Speaker 1: arts activist, right is that we need them to own 582 00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:30,960 Speaker 1: their full selves and understand that this is the best 583 00:34:30,960 --> 00:34:33,239 Speaker 1: thing that they can do for American journalism is to 584 00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:38,160 Speaker 1: be their full selves in the newsrooms where they are. 585 00:34:39,320 --> 00:34:43,360 Speaker 1: That they need to eat their fear. As my Dominican husband, 586 00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:48,520 Speaker 1: I need them to eat their fear so that they 587 00:34:48,560 --> 00:34:52,160 Speaker 1: can become the newsroom leaders that we need them to be. 588 00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:57,640 Speaker 1: We Latinos and Latinas, particularly in the field of journalism, 589 00:34:57,680 --> 00:35:03,000 Speaker 1: I've found some of our highest is sometimes still overwhelmed 590 00:35:03,000 --> 00:35:05,520 Speaker 1: by their own insecurities, and that's not surprising to me. 591 00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:09,360 Speaker 1: And we need to have Latinos and Latinas on prime 592 00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:15,560 Speaker 1: time and we need to be leading news divisions, leading 593 00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:20,440 Speaker 1: investigative units. So I'm all about eat your fear because 594 00:35:20,480 --> 00:35:26,560 Speaker 1: we need them to be journalists of conscience in this country. 595 00:35:32,080 --> 00:35:37,480 Speaker 4: Go eat your fear, y'all. I'm not a journalist, but 596 00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:38,960 Speaker 4: I know what it feels like to be in the 597 00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:42,280 Speaker 4: position of being scared to take a leap, being scared 598 00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:45,439 Speaker 4: to take action to make change, especially when I'm trying 599 00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:47,040 Speaker 4: to make it out here in Hollywood or as a 600 00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:50,160 Speaker 4: brown man in a white world. I know it's hard, y'all, 601 00:35:50,560 --> 00:35:52,720 Speaker 4: but we got to take risk and fight our battles, 602 00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:55,600 Speaker 4: whether it's in the newsroom, the conference room, a studio. 603 00:35:55,560 --> 00:35:56,160 Speaker 2: Or at home. 604 00:35:57,320 --> 00:35:59,759 Speaker 4: Maria, I cannot wait to see you in Hollywood. Hey, 605 00:36:00,000 --> 00:36:01,640 Speaker 4: it might be a chance we've bumped into each other 606 00:36:01,680 --> 00:36:04,000 Speaker 4: on a set. In the meantime, you can check out 607 00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:07,200 Speaker 4: Maria's book Once I Was You, available for adults and 608 00:36:07,640 --> 00:36:11,960 Speaker 4: young adults, and please rate and review this podcast, y'all. 609 00:36:12,080 --> 00:36:14,960 Speaker 4: Don't forget to share it with your friends. Cousin, Padimas, Pudimos, 610 00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:19,800 Speaker 4: Stostia's uncles and aunts. Tell everyone, y'all, peace and love. 611 00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:24,480 Speaker 4: Brown Enough is a production of Stitcher. It's created and 612 00:36:24,520 --> 00:36:28,360 Speaker 4: hosted by me Christopher Reevas, and I'm also an executive producer. 613 00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:33,520 Speaker 4: Our team includes producer Manolo Morales, Senior producer Abigail Kiel, 614 00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:38,600 Speaker 4: technical director Casey Holford, Production assistant Gabrielle Gladny, and executive 615 00:36:38,640 --> 00:36:42,919 Speaker 4: producer Camille Stanley. Original music by Casey Holford. Special thanks 616 00:36:42,920 --> 00:36:46,480 Speaker 4: to Brendan Burns, Carlos e. Hernandez of Ekey Guy Management 617 00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:49,800 Speaker 4: is also an executive producer of Brown Enough. Don't forget 618 00:36:49,840 --> 00:36:52,480 Speaker 4: to subscribe, y'all or follow brown Enough so you never 619 00:36:52,520 --> 00:36:56,640 Speaker 4: miss an episode next time on brown Enough. 620 00:36:57,640 --> 00:36:59,120 Speaker 2: Have you been reading anything. 621 00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:00,920 Speaker 3: About your book? I haven't even gotten a. 622 00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:05,520 Speaker 2: Book in Amazon. No, not about my book, just in general. 623 00:37:05,520 --> 00:37:07,520 Speaker 2: If you read anything else in the world, that's that's 624 00:37:07,520 --> 00:37:08,200 Speaker 2: that's interesting. 625 00:37:08,320 --> 00:37:10,840 Speaker 4: We're talking about books and the publishing industry with my 626 00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:13,000 Speaker 4: very own publisher, y'all row House. 627 00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:35,360 Speaker 2: You won't want to miss it. Witness docs from Stitcher