WEBVTT - Sweet Daddy Grace: The Gospel According to Daddy 0:00:04.240 --> 0:00:06.480 First time I heard his name whispered in my family, 0:00:06.800 --> 0:00:10.520 I was around nine. When I was eleven, I first 0:00:10.560 --> 0:00:14.960 heard the shout music coming from down the block. At thirteen, 0:00:15.280 --> 0:00:20.079 I first tasted the church's legendary food. At nineteen, I 0:00:20.160 --> 0:00:23.000 first saw a photo of Daddy Grace standing in front 0:00:23.040 --> 0:00:26.920 of his packard in an elegant white suit, with attendants 0:00:26.960 --> 0:00:27.680 by his side. 0:00:29.040 --> 0:00:30.240 It felt like I knew. 0:00:30.080 --> 0:00:32.519 Him and that he knew me. 0:00:37.200 --> 0:00:44.760 All preoper resim say man, Hey, man ay man, all 0:00:44.880 --> 0:00:47.520 broad children after bad Hands. 0:01:00.040 --> 0:01:02.240 This is a story of a man who's fascinated me. 0:01:02.960 --> 0:01:05.800 I'm tempted to say haunted me for most of my life. 0:01:06.880 --> 0:01:10.680 His name was sweet Daddy Grace, and that's a name 0:01:11.040 --> 0:01:14.880 you don't forget. They say he sold plots into heaven. 0:01:15.360 --> 0:01:17.880 They say he wore suits made of one hundred dollar bills. 0:01:18.600 --> 0:01:22.280 They say he was God himself. There are a lot 0:01:22.319 --> 0:01:25.280 of legends around Daddy Grace, but let me tell you 0:01:25.400 --> 0:01:29.920 some facts. Daddy Grace was born Marcellino Manuel de Grasa 0:01:30.160 --> 0:01:34.440 in the early eighteen eighties on the island of Bravakabuvid, 0:01:34.720 --> 0:01:38.080 West Africa, which at the time was a Portuguese colony. 0:01:38.959 --> 0:01:41.560 He arrived in New Bedford, Massachusetts, at the turn of 0:01:41.640 --> 0:01:44.919 the twentieth century, along with the wave of Cape Verdian 0:01:45.000 --> 0:01:48.680 migrants who crossed the Atlantic Ocean on whaling ships headed 0:01:48.720 --> 0:01:49.559 for the Americas. 0:01:50.520 --> 0:01:54.760 As the Cape Verdian immigrants were fleeing this land of hunger, 0:01:55.320 --> 0:01:59.120 they saw opportunity to make their way to maybe improve 0:01:59.240 --> 0:02:02.760 their lives. Daddy Grace had seven dollars in his pocket 0:02:02.840 --> 0:02:03.680 when he immigrated. 0:02:05.240 --> 0:02:09.280 After he arrived, he began calling himself Charles Manuel Grace, 0:02:09.919 --> 0:02:13.720 not unusual for an immigrant in America, americanizing your name 0:02:14.040 --> 0:02:17.280 or having it americanized for you. Within a couple of 0:02:17.400 --> 0:02:20.560 decades after arriving in the United States, he was going 0:02:20.639 --> 0:02:25.280 by more names, Bishop Grace, Daddy Grace, or Sweet Daddy Grace. 0:02:25.760 --> 0:02:31.119 And that last name was given to him by his followers. Yes, followers, 0:02:31.840 --> 0:02:35.200 the man had thousands of them, some say as many 0:02:35.240 --> 0:02:39.320 as three million. Because in nineteen nineteen, Bishop Grace founded 0:02:39.360 --> 0:02:42.040 a church, the United House of Prayer for All People. 0:02:43.160 --> 0:02:45.760 He built the first one in West Wareham, Massachusetts, for 0:02:45.919 --> 0:02:50.560 under forty dollars. From there, he took his evangelical mission 0:02:50.600 --> 0:02:54.240 on the road, venturing below the Mason Dixon line and beyond, 0:02:54.760 --> 0:02:58.720 setting up tent meetings and baptizing people in oceans and rivers, 0:02:59.160 --> 0:03:17.799 and defiantly preaching to captivated and non segregated audiences. He 0:03:18.160 --> 0:03:24.600 was colorful, opulent, and unapologetic, and his personal style influenced 0:03:24.639 --> 0:03:29.600 black cultural and spiritual leaders, including James Brown. He was 0:03:29.639 --> 0:03:32.359 a visionary who built a fortune as a black man 0:03:32.480 --> 0:03:35.320 during Jim Crow during the Depression. 0:03:36.400 --> 0:03:43.040 He bought huge complex in Manhattan that didn't rent the Negroes. 0:03:43.400 --> 0:03:47.640 He had a coffee farm in Brazil and egg farm 0:03:47.760 --> 0:03:48.320 and Cuba. 0:03:49.520 --> 0:03:54.880 He was also controversial. He was often in the press 0:03:54.960 --> 0:03:59.360 for one scandal or another, illegitimate children tax fraud, and 0:03:59.680 --> 0:04:03.240 he narrowly avoided serving a year in prison for allegedly 0:04:03.320 --> 0:04:07.720 transporting a woman across state lines for quote immoral purposes. 0:04:09.120 --> 0:04:11.800 By the time he passed in nineteen sixty, his net 0:04:11.880 --> 0:04:14.960 worth was estimated to be as much as twenty five 0:04:15.040 --> 0:04:18.760 million dollars, which is two hundred and fifty million dollars today. 0:04:19.440 --> 0:04:22.840 His body traveled by train from California to Massachusetts, and 0:04:23.320 --> 0:04:25.760 it was more like a final tour than a professional 0:04:26.279 --> 0:04:30.120 making several stops along the way, attracting thousands of mourners 0:04:30.680 --> 0:04:35.600 and gawgers. But today, outside of his church, which is 0:04:35.680 --> 0:04:38.880 still around, not very many people seem to know about him, 0:04:39.279 --> 0:04:43.720 or at least talk about him. Why is that? Why 0:04:43.760 --> 0:04:45.760 would a man who was said to have raised his 0:04:45.880 --> 0:04:48.760 own sister from the dead, who had obituaries in Ebony 0:04:49.000 --> 0:04:52.599 and the New York Times, whose buildings house thousands of people, 0:04:53.120 --> 0:04:56.640 who started out with so little and ended with so much, 0:04:57.440 --> 0:05:02.039 why do so few people today remember that very memorable name. 0:05:02.680 --> 0:05:05.480 He Race sort of wiped out, And I wonder if 0:05:05.560 --> 0:05:10.080 this was done intentionally. That's a way of silencing and 0:05:10.240 --> 0:05:12.960 making sure that someone's legacy is not carried on. 0:05:15.440 --> 0:05:18.080 And there's one more piece of the puzzle, a big 0:05:18.120 --> 0:05:21.680 one for me. My grandmother is a Grace, a Cape 0:05:21.800 --> 0:05:25.920 Verdean Grace. Her family is also from the same island 0:05:26.040 --> 0:05:29.240 of Brava. I grew up overhearing my cousins say that 0:05:29.440 --> 0:05:32.680 we were related to Daddy Grace. But here's where things 0:05:32.760 --> 0:05:35.880 get murky. Every time I asked the elder members of 0:05:35.960 --> 0:05:41.040 my family, they denied it, often vehemently. The more I 0:05:41.160 --> 0:05:44.440 learned about Bishop Grace and all of his exceptional accomplishments, 0:05:44.640 --> 0:05:47.040 the more bewildered I was that this man who I 0:05:47.120 --> 0:05:49.920 shared roots with had been completely left out of the 0:05:50.040 --> 0:05:52.560 history books that I grew up reading. There are no 0:05:52.680 --> 0:05:56.159 public plaques or monuments to him in his native Caboved 0:05:56.440 --> 0:05:59.440 nor in his home of New Bedford, Massachusetts, except for 0:05:59.480 --> 0:06:02.320 the one that he paid for himself. How could a 0:06:02.400 --> 0:06:05.640 man who was beloved by so many, who fed people 0:06:05.800 --> 0:06:09.840 food for their souls and their bellies, also be so 0:06:10.120 --> 0:06:13.600 despised that people didn't even want to admit that they 0:06:13.640 --> 0:06:16.800 were related to him? And what about the air of 0:06:16.839 --> 0:06:19.799 mystery that Daddy Grace seemed to cultivate around himself. 0:06:20.520 --> 0:06:22.960 Why was he hiding something? 0:06:23.839 --> 0:06:28.040 What was behind my relative's rejection of him? This is 0:06:28.080 --> 0:06:33.040 a story about Sweet Daddy Grace, but for me it's personal. 0:06:34.480 --> 0:06:38.000 I'm Mercy Dupena and from iHeart podcasts and Force a 0:06:38.080 --> 0:06:41.080 media group. This is Sweet Daddy Grace. 0:06:45.440 --> 0:06:46.159 To be happy. 0:07:31.800 --> 0:07:34.480 Before we get too far ahead of ourselves, let's go 0:07:34.680 --> 0:07:37.080 back a bit. Let me take you to the Cape 0:07:37.160 --> 0:07:40.600 Verdian community of New Bedford, Massachusetts, where I grew up. 0:07:41.400 --> 0:07:43.880 New Bedford is a place where Cape Verdians have made 0:07:43.920 --> 0:07:46.640 their mark, and everyone in the city is proud of that. 0:07:47.520 --> 0:07:50.800 You can eat foods like couscous, kachuopa and jag and 0:07:50.880 --> 0:07:54.840 here creoles spoken everywhere, and you have to make sure 0:07:54.880 --> 0:07:58.240 that you don't do anything regretful in public, because before 0:07:58.280 --> 0:08:01.200 you even reach home, someone are already called your mother. 0:08:02.040 --> 0:08:05.240 Growing updating, you have to ask any potential made of 0:08:05.480 --> 0:08:08.120 all of their last names, just to make sure that 0:08:08.200 --> 0:08:11.040 they're not your cousin. And the parade that happens on 0:08:11.160 --> 0:08:14.840 Independence weekend, it's not your typical Fourth of July affair. 0:08:15.520 --> 0:08:19.080 It's actually the Cape Verdian Independence Day Parade, which is 0:08:19.160 --> 0:08:24.000 celebrated on July fifth. Throughout my upbringing, we learned about 0:08:24.080 --> 0:08:28.360 revolutionaries who called New Bedford their home, people like Frederick 0:08:28.400 --> 0:08:31.680 Douglas and Jabriel Kazan of the Greensboro four. 0:08:32.440 --> 0:08:34.679 Bishop Grace not so much. 0:08:35.320 --> 0:08:39.280 Good morning Marcy as well as good morning, cous This. 0:08:39.440 --> 0:08:42.440 Is my older cousin, Jonathan. He grew up a few 0:08:42.480 --> 0:08:45.079 towns over and we spent a lot of time together 0:08:45.160 --> 0:08:48.440 as children. I lived in the heart of New Bedford's 0:08:48.480 --> 0:08:53.000 Cape Verdian community and its Black Power movement. Around the 0:08:53.040 --> 0:08:56.720 corner from my house was the NAACP and the former 0:08:56.840 --> 0:09:00.719 local headquarters of the Black Panther Party. So prayer was 0:09:00.800 --> 0:09:03.640 part of this nestled in between the two of them 0:09:04.520 --> 0:09:06.920 at the time, though I didn't know it was Daddy 0:09:06.960 --> 0:09:07.680 Grace's church. 0:09:08.559 --> 0:09:10.880 What was your first, like really good memory of that 0:09:11.640 --> 0:09:14.000 when we first moved there, and like hearing the music 0:09:14.120 --> 0:09:15.760 all the time and being like, what is that? 0:09:15.880 --> 0:09:18.800 Man? It was clearly church music. It was definitely gospel. 0:09:18.880 --> 0:09:22.240 It was definitely you know, lots of loud horns. 0:09:24.480 --> 0:09:27.959 They really turned it up over there, they really did. 0:09:28.240 --> 0:09:31.559 But my first actual like interaction with the church was 0:09:32.040 --> 0:09:34.839 going there, but my friends invited me to come and 0:09:34.960 --> 0:09:37.720 eat soul food. They had soul food there on Saturdays, 0:09:38.000 --> 0:09:40.400 fried chicken and fish and collard. 0:09:40.200 --> 0:09:41.800 Greens and mac and cheese and corn. 0:09:43.720 --> 0:09:46.480 I always thought of it as being an African American 0:09:46.600 --> 0:09:52.240 church because they served soul food. Everybody that I encountered 0:09:52.360 --> 0:09:54.839 when I went to the church to eat was not 0:09:55.040 --> 0:09:56.560 Cape Verdian, at least. 0:09:56.640 --> 0:09:57.199 That I knew of. 0:09:59.280 --> 0:10:01.800 It wasn't a until I was about thirteen when I 0:10:01.920 --> 0:10:04.440 overheard my parents and some of their friends who had 0:10:04.480 --> 0:10:07.679 attended services at the United House of Prayer going on 0:10:08.040 --> 0:10:11.160 and on about their experience. That's when I started to 0:10:11.160 --> 0:10:14.360 put it all together. Of Course, I'd eaten there a 0:10:14.400 --> 0:10:17.079 bunch of times, a lot of people did, but I 0:10:17.160 --> 0:10:20.439 had never even heard of anyone actually going to a service. 0:10:21.520 --> 0:10:24.280 It was considered off limits, and I really didn't know 0:10:24.400 --> 0:10:28.240 why they were talking about how long the church services 0:10:28.280 --> 0:10:32.080 were and how everyone cried and shouted Sweet Daddy Grace, 0:10:32.840 --> 0:10:36.120 even though Daddy Grace had died decades ago. As I 0:10:36.280 --> 0:10:39.920 eavesdropped on their conversation, they traded wild stories that they'd 0:10:39.960 --> 0:10:42.440 heard about Bishop Grace, like how. 0:10:42.360 --> 0:10:45.800 He healed people instantly with his hands, and that he 0:10:45.960 --> 0:10:46.880 had a style of. 0:10:46.920 --> 0:10:51.520 A pimp, complete with a cane, long hair, flashy suits, 0:10:51.800 --> 0:10:55.880 and even a fleet of luxury vehicles. They also mentioned 0:10:56.280 --> 0:10:57.440 that he was Cape Verdian. 0:10:58.559 --> 0:11:02.320 That was a complete shock. Daddy Grace is Kate Perdian. 0:11:02.920 --> 0:11:04.160 How did I not know this? 0:11:05.040 --> 0:11:07.720 And then I started thinking about his name and how 0:11:07.800 --> 0:11:10.199 his last name was the same as my grandmother's, and 0:11:10.440 --> 0:11:13.240 I was like, wait a minute. We're a small community. 0:11:13.880 --> 0:11:15.320 We have to be related. 0:11:16.280 --> 0:11:19.720 And that's when the spirit of Sweet Daddy Grace really 0:11:19.840 --> 0:11:25.880 began to reveal himself to me. You've met my cousin 0:11:25.960 --> 0:11:29.760 Jonathan already, but let me introduce you to another important 0:11:29.840 --> 0:11:30.880 Jonathan in my life. 0:11:32.440 --> 0:11:38.840 Jonathan Peppina, arm Marcy's dad. My parents are Jonathan Depina 0:11:39.040 --> 0:11:45.000 Senior and Lydia Grace Stepina, and both of them are 0:11:45.120 --> 0:11:49.120 in the heavens but very much with us all the time. 0:11:49.920 --> 0:11:53.760 My grandparents belonged to the religiously conservative Evangelical Church of 0:11:53.800 --> 0:11:58.480 the Nazarene. My grandmother, I called her Nana, was born 0:11:58.640 --> 0:12:02.680 Lydia Anna Grace. She was always cooking on the phone, 0:12:02.800 --> 0:12:06.640 talking in Creole, working in the garden, and gathering items 0:12:06.679 --> 0:12:08.719 along with money to send to people back in the 0:12:08.800 --> 0:12:12.559 old country. Both she and my papa were devout Christians, 0:12:12.800 --> 0:12:16.199 and like most Cape Verdians, they were upright folks who 0:12:16.559 --> 0:12:20.080 often spoke about the importance of reputation and honoring your 0:12:20.120 --> 0:12:23.680 family name, which meant that my father's dad, my Papa, 0:12:24.080 --> 0:12:27.839 was not a fan of a flamboyant preacher like Daddy Grace. 0:12:28.559 --> 0:12:31.520 My dad kind of looked at him like the devil 0:12:32.800 --> 0:12:35.520 and I can't remember him. Daddy Grace would be on 0:12:35.600 --> 0:12:38.120 TV and he'd say, look at that guy with that 0:12:38.360 --> 0:12:39.000 money suit. 0:12:39.880 --> 0:12:43.079 It wasn't just the money suits. It was his fingernails 0:12:43.120 --> 0:12:46.439 which were over three inches long. It was the loud 0:12:46.559 --> 0:12:50.319 shout music and dancing which seemed like possession, and it 0:12:50.440 --> 0:12:52.720 was the long list of products sold by the United 0:12:52.760 --> 0:12:56.640 House of Prayer that promised to heal you and also 0:12:56.720 --> 0:12:59.920 make your hair grow long and pretty, just like Daddy Grace. 0:13:01.080 --> 0:13:04.160 You know how my thought was when he was critical 0:13:04.240 --> 0:13:08.920 of something, he let you know and he was so 0:13:09.280 --> 0:13:13.280 critical of him, but he never said anything in public 0:13:13.360 --> 0:13:16.280 about him that I know. My dad wasn't that type 0:13:16.280 --> 0:13:19.120 of person anyway to go spouting off his mouth in public. 0:13:19.440 --> 0:13:22.240 But within our family, he made it very clear that 0:13:22.440 --> 0:13:24.680 this guy was not welcome. 0:13:26.480 --> 0:13:29.880 My dad's older sister, my aunt Judy, also remembers her 0:13:29.920 --> 0:13:33.520 father talking about Daddy Grace, especially when he would arrive 0:13:33.600 --> 0:13:37.480 in Massachusetts after his various travels on the road preaching, 0:13:38.240 --> 0:13:39.080 and when he did. 0:13:39.080 --> 0:13:41.880 Come to New Bedford, it was a big tutu. Oh my, 0:13:42.160 --> 0:13:44.720 you know, Daddy Grace is in town. He's coming to town. 0:13:45.320 --> 0:13:48.040 And I remember my father saying, oh yeah, they're laying 0:13:48.080 --> 0:13:51.080 out the red carpet for Daddy Grace. And they said 0:13:51.160 --> 0:13:53.920 that he had little girls dressed in white that would 0:13:53.960 --> 0:13:56.320 be fanning him where as he sat on the porch. 0:13:56.920 --> 0:14:00.800 I can just imagine. I'm like, oh, mamma. My mother 0:14:01.000 --> 0:14:04.680 denied that they were related. Nobody wanted to be because 0:14:04.720 --> 0:14:07.240 the man was out there. He's a cult. 0:14:09.120 --> 0:14:11.920 This is something I've heard before. I once asked my 0:14:12.080 --> 0:14:14.880 great uncle Abel if Daddy Grace was part of the family, 0:14:15.040 --> 0:14:16.520 and he said, absolutely not. 0:14:17.200 --> 0:14:18.880 We have nothing to do with that man. 0:14:19.400 --> 0:14:22.520 There were rumors and even some allegations that might suggest 0:14:22.560 --> 0:14:25.000 that Daddy Grace had less than pure intentions with some 0:14:25.120 --> 0:14:30.160 of his congregants, especially the young women, including my very 0:14:30.200 --> 0:14:33.360 own grandmother. I talked to my cousin Jonathan about this, 0:14:34.160 --> 0:14:38.080 Do you know anything about Daddy Grace trying to get 0:14:38.720 --> 0:14:43.520 Nana to join his congregation and any interaction with our 0:14:43.560 --> 0:14:44.240 great grandfather. 0:14:44.800 --> 0:14:47.160 Our great grandfather was not too happy about that. 0:14:48.800 --> 0:14:51.240 What I was told is that being met our great 0:14:51.280 --> 0:14:52.960 grandfather didn't want her to go. 0:14:53.200 --> 0:14:56.920 That he was really stern, so to speak. 0:14:57.240 --> 0:14:59.800 Almost to the point of being very physical about it. 0:15:01.200 --> 0:15:03.880 Jonathan said he'd heard this story from a couple of people, 0:15:04.480 --> 0:15:07.600 including my uncle Abel, who was my Nana's youngest brother. 0:15:08.000 --> 0:15:10.240 Uncle Abel would say, you know, I had so many 0:15:10.320 --> 0:15:13.880 different saying, I don't want to twist it, but he 0:15:14.120 --> 0:15:18.000 was like that man showed up on the farm thinking 0:15:18.160 --> 0:15:21.440 he could talk to your grandmother. My father would have 0:15:21.680 --> 0:15:25.120 no part of it, and then he would go into 0:15:25.240 --> 0:15:29.160 speaking Creole where he would say showing him the acts 0:15:29.880 --> 0:15:33.600 and saying, you know this is the axe, I'll sharpen 0:15:33.680 --> 0:15:34.360 it on your head. 0:15:36.000 --> 0:15:39.200 The thing was, while Daddy Grace's methods for getting people 0:15:39.280 --> 0:15:43.160 to join his congregation may have been at best un orthodox, 0:15:43.800 --> 0:15:46.760 his church, the United House of Prayer, was in many 0:15:46.840 --> 0:15:50.320 ways pretty similar to other Black Pentecostal churches at the time. 0:15:51.000 --> 0:15:55.440 That meant long sermons, lots of music, and something that 0:15:55.640 --> 0:15:59.720 didn't sit particularly well with my mainly Catholic and Nazarene 0:15:59.720 --> 0:16:05.000 relay latives, speaking in tongues. When someone speaks in tongues, 0:16:05.360 --> 0:16:08.640 it's supposed to show that they're communicating with God in 0:16:08.760 --> 0:16:12.920 God's language, which is only spoken and interpreted by those 0:16:13.040 --> 0:16:17.440 who are anointed. But a lot of Cape Verdians who 0:16:17.520 --> 0:16:20.400 were not members of Daddy Grace's church said that they 0:16:20.560 --> 0:16:22.200 did understand what he was saying. 0:16:23.000 --> 0:16:25.640 One of the stories that I remember them talking about, 0:16:25.800 --> 0:16:29.080 they'd always be like he was up there speaking creole 0:16:29.160 --> 0:16:31.200 and they all thought he was speaking in tongues. 0:16:32.320 --> 0:16:34.720 Yeah, I've heard that, actually more than once. 0:16:35.600 --> 0:16:39.680 I have heard that same exact story from several people 0:16:40.000 --> 0:16:42.840 who knows right I mean, we weren't there, so I didn't. 0:16:42.680 --> 0:16:46.000 You were never there there. And you know, a good 0:16:46.080 --> 0:16:52.560 story gets better as kids. Here's what I do know. 0:16:53.520 --> 0:16:57.440 Bishop Grace was a contentious figure. He was called a charlatan, 0:16:57.680 --> 0:17:01.640 a race denier, and a predator. Yet he was beloved 0:17:01.720 --> 0:17:05.480 by hundreds of thousands. He built a massive flock and 0:17:05.680 --> 0:17:08.480 ensured that his legacy would live through his church, and 0:17:08.600 --> 0:17:11.240 in the nineteen fifties he was said to be the 0:17:11.440 --> 0:17:13.359 richest black preacher in America. 0:17:14.400 --> 0:17:15.240 How did he do it? 0:17:16.240 --> 0:17:19.960 What was his secret? I asked my dad how he 0:17:20.119 --> 0:17:23.680 thought this could have happened? What do you make of 0:17:23.840 --> 0:17:27.080 the massive amount of success and wealth that he was 0:17:27.200 --> 0:17:31.399 able to amass during his life? And you know, to 0:17:31.520 --> 0:17:34.440 be able to be a man who emigrated from a 0:17:34.560 --> 0:17:37.399 country that was so poor and you know, with very 0:17:37.440 --> 0:17:42.920 little resources for him to be able to purchase luxury 0:17:43.000 --> 0:17:46.720 apartment buildings in Manhattan and you know, eighty three room 0:17:46.880 --> 0:17:51.760 mansions and have a fleet of luxury vehicles and attendance. 0:17:52.359 --> 0:17:53.960 What do you make of that? 0:17:55.160 --> 0:18:02.800 Donald Trump, who wots doll trum? He has that power. 0:18:03.320 --> 0:18:08.719 Daddy Grace had that power that he could talk people 0:18:09.200 --> 0:18:13.240 into giving him all the money they had in hopes 0:18:13.320 --> 0:18:16.399 that they were going to heaven or they would be healed. 0:18:17.320 --> 0:18:20.240 He had that ability. 0:18:25.560 --> 0:18:29.320 It's interesting what people correlate with Daddy Grace. For my 0:18:29.400 --> 0:18:33.560 great grandfather, it was his perceived dangerousness. For my dad, 0:18:33.880 --> 0:18:38.359 it was his way with words, his Trumpian charisma. For me, 0:18:39.080 --> 0:18:43.480 it was his audacity. And for doctor Marilyn Halter, who 0:18:43.680 --> 0:18:46.760 is not only my stepmother but also one of the 0:18:46.800 --> 0:18:50.440 pre eminent scholars of Cape Verdie in American history, it's 0:18:50.520 --> 0:18:54.639 how effortlessly he transformed from a poor immigrant into a 0:18:54.800 --> 0:18:55.879 powerful American. 0:18:56.880 --> 0:19:04.080 What struck me about his life story was the extent 0:19:04.280 --> 0:19:10.120 to which he seemed to be constantly reinventing himself. When 0:19:10.160 --> 0:19:15.960 I've thought about his life history, the person who comes 0:19:16.040 --> 0:19:21.080 to mind that seems most akin to is Bob Dylan. 0:19:21.520 --> 0:19:26.200 His persona is very different than his actual history. 0:19:26.760 --> 0:19:29.879 There's virtually nothing about him at all prior to his 0:19:30.080 --> 0:19:35.399 arrival in the United States, which makes him somewhat, you know, mysterious, right, And. 0:19:35.480 --> 0:19:38.840 I think he cultivated that mystery. I mean, I think 0:19:39.000 --> 0:19:44.719 that is very much a part of who Daddy Grace 0:19:45.240 --> 0:19:51.240 became and continued to become, was, you know, creating mystery 0:19:51.359 --> 0:19:52.240 around himself. 0:19:55.160 --> 0:19:58.119 I think some of this mysteriousness is inherent to be 0:19:58.200 --> 0:20:03.560 in Cape Verdian thing about us. We're like chameleons thanks 0:20:03.600 --> 0:20:06.520 to our history. We have so many elements to our culture, 0:20:06.680 --> 0:20:11.600 our language, and our worldview, and due to colonialism, blending 0:20:11.680 --> 0:20:15.359 in has been a mode of survival. Daddy Grace did 0:20:15.440 --> 0:20:19.600 more than survive, though he thrived. He built an empire 0:20:19.760 --> 0:20:24.119 at a scale no Cape Verdian had achieved before or since, 0:20:24.720 --> 0:20:28.080 and became one of the pioneers of what would become 0:20:28.560 --> 0:20:38.159 the modern Black megachurch. That dream of a land in 0:20:38.280 --> 0:20:41.560 which life should be better and richer and fuller for 0:20:41.800 --> 0:20:46.560 every man, with opportunity for each according to his ability 0:20:47.080 --> 0:20:53.680 or achievement. That's historian James Truslow Adams describing the American dream, 0:20:54.359 --> 0:20:58.040 a term he put into the national consciousness in nineteen 0:20:58.119 --> 0:21:04.080 thirty one. Marlino Manuel de Grasa aka Charles Manuel Grace 0:21:04.680 --> 0:21:09.240 aka Sweet Daddy Grace certainly saw the possibility in those words, 0:21:10.040 --> 0:21:14.520 but I'm sure he also recognized their fallacy. He certainly 0:21:14.680 --> 0:21:18.639 experienced the struggle that people of color had in the 0:21:18.760 --> 0:21:23.639 United States that for most black people, racism could not 0:21:23.800 --> 0:21:26.080 be separated from the American dream. 0:21:27.280 --> 0:21:33.440 The American dream is an ideal that mainly realized historically 0:21:33.720 --> 0:21:39.080 by white man who come from Anglo backgrounds. Right, So 0:21:39.880 --> 0:21:43.000 I think he's just an exception in some ways to 0:21:43.119 --> 0:21:47.320 the American dream in terms of being able to forge 0:21:47.760 --> 0:21:54.240 such a successful outcome in his life as a black 0:21:54.320 --> 0:21:56.679 immigrant or an immigrant of color. 0:21:57.560 --> 0:22:00.560 But I think Daddy Grace is keep Verdian identity allowed 0:22:00.600 --> 0:22:03.800 him to have a different perspective. Cape Verdians were the 0:22:03.840 --> 0:22:07.840 first voluntary African immigrants to come to the US. No 0:22:07.960 --> 0:22:10.760 matter how tough it may have been in America, it 0:22:10.920 --> 0:22:14.800 was still better than being in colonial Capoved where countless 0:22:14.840 --> 0:22:18.760 people died during extreme droughts and famine. Unaided by the 0:22:18.800 --> 0:22:26.000 Portuguese government. Immigration offered hope. Daddy Grace probably felt like 0:22:26.080 --> 0:22:29.880 America had streets paved with gold, and those were exactly 0:22:30.000 --> 0:22:31.879 the kind of streets that he wanted to live on. 0:22:35.680 --> 0:22:38.320 In doing this podcast, is this like kind of really 0:22:38.359 --> 0:22:40.720 curious what your goal is to achieve out of all 0:22:40.800 --> 0:22:41.000 of this? 0:22:41.920 --> 0:22:45.720 Is there like something that you're hoping to find or 0:22:46.280 --> 0:22:46.600 what is. 0:22:46.600 --> 0:22:48.800 It that you're looking to get out of this? Well, 0:22:48.840 --> 0:22:51.000 I think the main reason why I'm doing this is 0:22:51.119 --> 0:22:54.000 because my entire life, like Daddy Grace has been there, 0:22:54.160 --> 0:22:58.640 You've always felt this strong connection to him, and then 0:22:58.760 --> 0:22:59.639 you know, found out. 0:22:59.520 --> 0:23:02.080 That he was right across the street from my high school. 0:23:02.800 --> 0:23:04.720 You know, went to go see the grave and I 0:23:04.960 --> 0:23:08.680 literally heard him saying, like, tell my story, and that 0:23:08.960 --> 0:23:12.480 was like a whoa, Okay, I don't know what this 0:23:12.640 --> 0:23:15.399 is about, but all right. And I know that a 0:23:15.440 --> 0:23:19.920 lot of Cape Verdians were very embarrassed by him. His appearance, 0:23:20.600 --> 0:23:25.320 his style of delivering the word, his religion, the money 0:23:25.880 --> 0:23:28.800 really made people feel very uncomfortable. I think people had 0:23:28.800 --> 0:23:31.360 a lot of questions about whether he was a legitimate 0:23:31.680 --> 0:23:34.240 man of God or not. I really want to highlight 0:23:34.320 --> 0:23:37.000 his story because I think it's an incredible American story. 0:23:37.080 --> 0:23:40.639 I think it's an incredible Cape Verdian American story, and 0:23:40.800 --> 0:23:44.280 I really do want to know are we really connected 0:23:44.359 --> 0:23:45.320 to this man or not? 0:23:45.680 --> 0:23:47.399 Like is there a relation or not. 0:23:51.280 --> 0:23:54.600 In African cultures, the oral tradition is the primary way 0:23:54.640 --> 0:23:58.600 that stories get passed down, and in African spirituality, our 0:23:58.680 --> 0:24:02.760 ancestors service guide throughout our lives on Earth. I've been 0:24:02.840 --> 0:24:05.560 communicating with these guides for as long as I can remember, 0:24:06.200 --> 0:24:11.399 in the form of dreams, intuitions, and visions. Since childhood, 0:24:11.480 --> 0:24:15.080 I've worn a sabichi or conto doju, which is a 0:24:15.119 --> 0:24:19.000 cape Verdian beide that protects you from evil spirits. I've 0:24:19.040 --> 0:24:22.679 always had the understanding that music, dance, and storytelling are 0:24:22.720 --> 0:24:26.240 ways to communicate with a higher power. It's been a 0:24:26.320 --> 0:24:29.080 long time since I encountered his photo and heard Daddy 0:24:29.119 --> 0:24:34.280 Grace say, tell my story, but he never stopped reminding me. 0:24:35.440 --> 0:24:38.120 In my twenties, there was this mansion that I drove 0:24:38.200 --> 0:24:43.080 by every single day. Recently I discovered it once belonged 0:24:43.280 --> 0:24:46.000 to Daddy Grace. Then it was a man who I 0:24:46.119 --> 0:24:48.600 was madly in love with. He had an affair while 0:24:48.640 --> 0:24:51.200 we were together with a woman who just happened to 0:24:51.320 --> 0:24:55.399 impersonate Daddy Grace in a performance piece. It's taken years 0:24:55.600 --> 0:24:57.920 for me to find the courage to make this podcast 0:24:58.080 --> 0:25:01.119 because there are so many layers, so many unknowns, and 0:25:01.880 --> 0:25:07.080 it involves my family and my community. It's sensitive and 0:25:07.200 --> 0:25:12.800 I feel vulnerable telling my story. But I'm ready not 0:25:13.040 --> 0:25:15.440 just to tell the story of one man, but of 0:25:15.560 --> 0:25:20.639 his people, my people. I came from the land beyond 0:25:20.680 --> 0:25:23.760 the sea. Is the saying that Daddy Grace used to 0:25:23.880 --> 0:25:28.240 describe his origins and journey from Cobblevid. It's where the 0:25:28.320 --> 0:25:32.320 boy called Marcellino was from. Where Sweet Daddy Grace is from, 0:25:33.040 --> 0:25:40.920 Where my family is from. That's next time. Sweet Daddy 0:25:40.960 --> 0:25:43.879 Grace is a production of iHeart Podcasts and Force a 0:25:44.000 --> 0:25:48.240 Media Group. This show is hosted by Me Marcy de Pina. 0:25:49.040 --> 0:25:53.320 It's written and produced by Marissa Brown and Me. Our 0:25:53.400 --> 0:25:59.040 story editors are Darryl Stewart, Duncan Riedel, and Zarren Burnett. Editing, 0:25:59.359 --> 0:26:04.600 sound design and theme music by Jonathan Washington. Original music 0:26:05.040 --> 0:26:10.679 by Enrique Silva of Acasia Mayor. Show cover art by 0:26:10.800 --> 0:26:17.000 Viviana Salgado of Studio Creative Group. Fact checking by Austin Thompson. 0:26:18.000 --> 0:26:23.720 Our executive producers are Marcy Depina and Jason English. Special 0:26:23.800 --> 0:26:29.080 thanks to Will Pearson, Nikki Ettore, Ali Perry, Tamika Campbell, 0:26:29.400 --> 0:26:33.320 and Lulu Phillip of iHeartMedia and all of my family 0:26:33.400 --> 0:26:37.320 members who talked to me for this show, my ancestors, 0:26:37.840 --> 0:26:40.520 the United House of Prayer for All People, and the 0:26:40.760 --> 0:26:44.480 countless number of people who shared their memories of Sweet 0:26:44.520 --> 0:26:48.440 Daddy Grace with me. Thanks also to doctor Marie Dollam. 0:26:48.640 --> 0:26:52.399 And doctor Danielle brun Sigler, whose academic work on Sweet 0:26:52.440 --> 0:26:57.480 Daddy Grace has been incredibly helpful. And finally, I want 0:26:57.480 --> 0:27:00.800