Speaker 1: My name is Alex, and I voted. But now what
Speaker 1: do I do? No, alright, alright, We'll be alright forever. No, alright, alright,
Speaker 1: alright forever. I'm gonna tell you guys my story about uncertainty,
Speaker 1: because that's kind of how I feel right now, and
Speaker 1: that's kind of how I think a lot of people
Speaker 1: have felt for the last four years. Um. But before
Speaker 1: we get into how it's been for the last four years,
Speaker 1: I'll tell you guys how the last few days have been. Um.
Speaker 1: Today it is November six, Uh, it is Friday, Um,
Speaker 1: the Friday after election day, which was now four days ago,
Speaker 1: and it's been an interesting one. And UH, for the
Speaker 1: last four days, I've been wildly uncertain. I've been in
Speaker 1: the studio writing, and out of the four sessions I've had,
Speaker 1: I've written one song. Uh. Most of them have just
Speaker 1: been all of us talking about what the hell the
Speaker 1: world's gonna look like. Um, they're still counting ballots at
Speaker 1: this point. Uh. Nevada announced that they're not going to
Speaker 1: be done until Saturday Sunday. UM, we've had a few
Speaker 1: swing states already, flip, We've had just it's just been
Speaker 1: an insane amount of time Um, but it's been really
Speaker 1: really interesting for me because I really don't know kind
Speaker 1: of what's next. Like I feel like I'm playing a
Speaker 1: video game and I and were and there's a really
Speaker 1: really hard level and um, you know, I'm not going
Speaker 1: to speak too soon, but we potentially beat that hard
Speaker 1: level and you celebrate because you beat the level, but
Speaker 1: then now you got the rest of the game to play.
Speaker 1: And uh, and I think where I'm not, where I'm
Speaker 1: at now is trying to figure out, um, what the
Speaker 1: game is that's next or what the next level is. Um,
Speaker 1: you know, obviously knock on wood. Again, I don't want
Speaker 1: to speak too soon, but Joe Biden becoming president doesn't
Speaker 1: mean that racial injustice is all solved. And it doesn't
Speaker 1: mean that um my l g B t Q plus
Speaker 1: you know, brothers, sisters and non gender conforming family member
Speaker 1: is are are completely uh you know, protected in every
Speaker 1: state and every city. And it doesn't mean that all
Speaker 1: of the problems are solved, especially with our environment, but
Speaker 1: it is, as it is potentially again a win that
Speaker 1: I think that we need to to celebrate. But I
Speaker 1: think most of the time, I have a great story
Speaker 1: right now, I'm I'm wildly uncertain, and that got me thinking,
Speaker 1: how do we figure out the next right thing? No,
Speaker 1: what's up, y'all? Welcome to let's get into it. I'm
Speaker 1: alex Iono and this is our podcast that is post
Speaker 1: election day, but not necessarily post election. We are in
Speaker 1: a weird, a weird situation. Uh. And and when I
Speaker 1: say we, it means I have I have the help
Speaker 1: of two very very smart people and and I'm gonna
Speaker 1: introduce you to them right now. First, we got hip
Speaker 1: hop artist also a poet, political activists and m c
Speaker 1: co host of the Red Couch podcast with his wife.
Speaker 1: Dr Alma Sarrego is a petty and you may know
Speaker 1: him from shows like Behind the Police with Robert Evans,
Speaker 1: the One and only propaganda prop What's up? Man? What what? What?
Speaker 1: What Up? What a day? Oh man? What a day?
Speaker 1: And we can we'll talk about it a bit, but
Speaker 1: first I want to introduce our other, our other guests.
Speaker 1: She is the creator and the host of the hit
Speaker 1: podcast Mega and is regularly featured on a p m
Speaker 1: S Live from Here. She's an alumnus of the Second
Speaker 1: City main Stage in Chicago, as well as the founding
Speaker 1: member of the long standing improv group The Reckoning. She also,
Speaker 1: a fun fact if you're a drunk history fan, holds
Speaker 1: the record for the highest blood alcohol on one of
Speaker 1: the seasons, and that she appeared, and also might hold
Speaker 1: the record for most tears in the previous season, which
Speaker 1: I don't even know if we give trophies, if we
Speaker 1: if we pat on the back or if we I
Speaker 1: don't know. But she is the also one and only
Speaker 1: Holly Laurent. Holly, how are you so good? So uncertain?
Speaker 1: Just like you, you know how when you're walking around
Speaker 1: town and like there's a sports bar that kind of
Speaker 1: like erupts at the same time everyone starts screaming because
Speaker 1: like someone kicked a goal and you're like, whoa, what happened?
Speaker 1: Everybody's excited. I keep thinking we're going to hear that
Speaker 1: any minute about the election of like is everybody screaming?
Speaker 1: Is it good? And and and like I had mentioned,
Speaker 1: not we're not going to try and lie about what
Speaker 1: day it is today because we are wildly uncertain it
Speaker 1: is Friday, the day after or the first Friday after
Speaker 1: election day. Um. We have Catherine um my producer here,
Speaker 1: who has got one ear with us in one ear
Speaker 1: on the on news right now, and she's gonna let
Speaker 1: us know if anything crazy happens during this episode recording.
Speaker 1: But we all three of us, I'm excited that I'm
Speaker 1: not the only one who's uncertain. I think that's the
Speaker 1: basis of my whole podcast in general, is like making
Speaker 1: people feel like whatever they're feeling are going through, they're
Speaker 1: not the only person. Um. And I'm excited to talk
Speaker 1: about you know, everything about that. We're gonna talk about first, Um,
Speaker 1: prop you and I are gonna be talking about kind
Speaker 1: of living with indecision and living in and kind of
Speaker 1: navigating lie life when when you don't really know what's
Speaker 1: what's coming next. Uh. And then after that, Holly, you
Speaker 1: and I are going to be talking about reckoning with
Speaker 1: the future pun intended. Um. And then lastly, all three
Speaker 1: of us are going to be talking about the soul
Speaker 1: of the nation. I think it's a very interesting time.
Speaker 1: And Um, the numbers were staggering in a great way
Speaker 1: and staggering in a in a sad way in terms
Speaker 1: of how many people voted, but at the same time
Speaker 1: also the amount of people that's still kind of support um,
Speaker 1: you know, Donald Trump. This is a very clear podcast,
Speaker 1: and I always talk about where I stand. But before
Speaker 1: we get into that stuff, UM, I want to ask
Speaker 1: a question that I ask all of my guests, especially now,
Speaker 1: especially now that we are past the election. Um, what
Speaker 1: are you doing this week to improve yourself? This week?
Speaker 1: I have voted. I voted this week, and that's what
Speaker 1: I did to to better myself. I actually had sent
Speaker 1: in my vallot a while ago, but because this is
Speaker 1: election week, I figured that would be the best thing
Speaker 1: for me. You know, I think voting while I vote
Speaker 1: it in the past, this this election and this vote
Speaker 1: that I've put in, and as we've seen in the
Speaker 1: numbers that have been insanely close, Um, every person's vote matters.
Speaker 1: And so it felt it felt a lot different, a
Speaker 1: lot better, and a lot it felt very powerful to
Speaker 1: vote this week. And so I get to proudly say
Speaker 1: that that's what I did to better myself this week.
Speaker 1: I know it's kind of a cop out, but I
Speaker 1: think it makes me feel good. Um, Holly, do you
Speaker 1: got something for me? I was actually patting myself on
Speaker 1: the back yesterday because I was like, damn, I made
Speaker 1: my bed, I got dressed and bathed today, and that's
Speaker 1: there we go. That's a big pandemic win. That's a
Speaker 1: pandemic win right there. Yeah, and um, I think in general,
Speaker 1: the word for me right now that I'm clinging to
Speaker 1: is it's it's somewhere between listen and like channel. I
Speaker 1: feel like as artists we are kind of supposed to
Speaker 1: be like radios right now, like putting up antenna's and
Speaker 1: just channeling and like the wisdom the way the patients.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I I do t M. I practiced,
Speaker 1: I practice the specific TM meditation and that's the only
Speaker 1: way I've really been able to get dressed and make
Speaker 1: my bed this week. We'll look at that. That's a win.
Speaker 1: That's a win for sure. Prop What do you got
Speaker 1: for us? Yeah? I think for me, uh, similarly, like
Speaker 1: just holding to my like daily rituals and traditions to
Speaker 1: like keep the discipline of like waking up, doing some
Speaker 1: sort of mindful meditation, some sort of breathing exercise, working
Speaker 1: out yoga, like just knowing it ain't got to be pretty,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying, Like I'm not the most
Speaker 1: you know, you know, you know Instagram videos trying to
Speaker 1: trying to downward dog out this mug, but uh, making
Speaker 1: sure like making myself despite what's happening in the world,
Speaker 1: be like no, you can't break rhythm. So I think
Speaker 1: for me, which is like new you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: would be like usually like when when when it's like
Speaker 1: you gear up for like the stressful moment, and then
Speaker 1: when the stress comes, like you forget all your training,
Speaker 1: you know I'm saying, So like, ah, for me, it
Speaker 1: was like, yo, this is the first time I got
Speaker 1: stuck with it in like kept that calm you know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying, and made myself like y'all remember your
Speaker 1: remember your training. You know what I'm saying, right, right,
Speaker 1: So I think for me, like that's that's the win
Speaker 1: this week, man. I mean that's a major when I
Speaker 1: think it's specifically on what you had just said in
Speaker 1: terms of um sticking to your you know, sticking to
Speaker 1: what you know is right, whether it's waking up early,
Speaker 1: whether it's getting your meditation, whether it's doing yoga, whether
Speaker 1: it's eating healthy, any of those things. Especially in times
Speaker 1: right now and we're we're obviously going to talk about it,
Speaker 1: I think it's very important to stick to your metaphorical
Speaker 1: guns and uh and and really you know, hold true
Speaker 1: to what you know makes you, you know, the most
Speaker 1: productive and successful version of yourself. All right, let's let's
Speaker 1: talk about some uncertainty. Holly, We'll be with you in
Speaker 1: just a bit, but prop um, Yeah, let's get into it.
Speaker 1: How have you been processing I mean, you had mentioned
Speaker 1: um already that you you are. You know, it's very
Speaker 1: uncertain times right now, and I think all of America
Speaker 1: is sitting in this uncertainty. How have you been processing? Um,
Speaker 1: those those nerves, those feelings mask good man. Uh yeah,
Speaker 1: I think of a lot of things. I think that,
Speaker 1: like how I'm doing with it. You know, I'm like
Speaker 1: the election updates. You know, I'm saying like you gotta
Speaker 1: check every hour you feel me like because maybe right
Speaker 1: maybe an hour ago, I was like, are you kidding me?
Speaker 1: I'm floating, bro, Like I'm in a state of nirvana,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. But I think, like, overall,
Speaker 1: a few things that I do is I always try to, like,
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm a history nerd, you know, I always
Speaker 1: try to like couch whatever moment I'm having in the
Speaker 1: context of like a longer history and try to remember that, like, Okay,
Speaker 1: when has it ever been certain? You say it? When
Speaker 1: if we when if we ever known what was going on?
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying, right when? You know when?
Speaker 1: And then like if y'all can't see this on the pod,
Speaker 1: but y'all in this video or can't tell by my
Speaker 1: voice in case you ain't noticed, I'm black, you know
Speaker 1: I'm saying, so like when when has it been peaceful
Speaker 1: for black America? You feel me so like me trying
Speaker 1: to couch that that not as an excuse, but as
Speaker 1: like a rudder if you will that like, Okay, this
Speaker 1: isn't any sort of aberration. You know. We make treasure
Speaker 1: out of trash. That's what we do all the time. Um,
Speaker 1: we shouldn't have to live this way, but here we are,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. So I think that for me,
Speaker 1: that's one thing I try to remember. And then just
Speaker 1: like you know, keep a uh you know, a gratitude
Speaker 1: lists of like things that I'm like actually thankful for
Speaker 1: even in the midst of this chaos, you know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying. That like you know, was and and it's
Speaker 1: as as I got older, like saying things like, yo,
Speaker 1: you have a roof over your head. You know when
Speaker 1: you're a kid, you like Okay, great, dad saying like, yeah,
Speaker 1: there's a house. I mean you live in it too,
Speaker 1: Like it's fine, you know what I'm saying. But like
Speaker 1: now as an adult being like, dang, God, like our
Speaker 1: economy said, we could have lost we could have lost
Speaker 1: our place to live, you know what I mean, And like, dang,
Speaker 1: what would I do? How would I feed my children?
Speaker 1: Like like I'm grateful that that didn't happen, you know, absolutely,
Speaker 1: So yeah, for me, it's like, you know, just like
Speaker 1: I said, like couching in history, kind of remembering that
Speaker 1: like we never really had certainty. You know. I'm I'm
Speaker 1: so glad that you I'm so glad that you said
Speaker 1: you're bringing up history because that's something that I've kind
Speaker 1: of you know, I talked to a bunch of people
Speaker 1: and and whether it's somebody's like, well, don't forget like
Speaker 1: the two thousand election was really close to and they
Speaker 1: we're talking about history, and and there's a balance because
Speaker 1: like you mentioned, when have when has there ever been
Speaker 1: you know, certainty and it's fullness. But also on the
Speaker 1: other end of that is like we are so insanely
Speaker 1: unprecedented right now. Like I remember seeing a video that
Speaker 1: was posted last night of George Bush Senior giving his
Speaker 1: speech after losing the election and saying, you know, I
Speaker 1: that's the American way, It's what makes American beautiful. I'm I'm,
Speaker 1: me and my team are going to do everything we
Speaker 1: can to make this flow of in this transition of power.
Speaker 1: And you really start thinking like that's I think not
Speaker 1: to play Devil's Advocate, and I probably will most of
Speaker 1: this episode because wild was certain but like, while there
Speaker 1: is like, yeah, there's never been uncertainty, but there's also
Speaker 1: been There's also never been somebody who is if everything
Speaker 1: continues on the trajectory that has been on the last
Speaker 1: twenty four hours, there's never been a squatter in the
Speaker 1: White House, you know. So it's like it's there's an
Speaker 1: old reference, Like I mean, it's a little bit it's
Speaker 1: more like my sister's jen. I'm the youngest in my family,
Speaker 1: but like in my sister's Jin, the like the first
Speaker 1: generation of video games, you only programmed a certain amount
Speaker 1: of space, and there would be a time that like
Speaker 1: your little your little you know, bit map like eight
Speaker 1: big character would go to a place where there's no graphics,
Speaker 1: and it was like because they didn't make they didn't
Speaker 1: have the memory for that, graphics didn't go that part. Why,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. So you're just like where
Speaker 1: You're like, I don't know how my character got out here,
Speaker 1: but there's nothing over here, yo said. So in a
Speaker 1: lot of ways, we were like, Yo, we off the
Speaker 1: map now, like we really are. We just got everybody's
Speaker 1: just gotta start painting some new stuff and spirals and circles.
Speaker 1: So don't get me wrong, Like we definitely off the map,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. Um, And that said, I
Speaker 1: mean America itself was off the map, Like you know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying. There was like when I when I
Speaker 1: think about the idea of like a president in general,
Speaker 1: like if you would right now have to say, I
Speaker 1: need to make up out of the clear blue sky,
Speaker 1: a new version of the head of a government. I
Speaker 1: just make one up, you know what I'm saying. Like
Speaker 1: it's like we are that's where, but that's where we
Speaker 1: were when we started the country. It was just like,
Speaker 1: what is it? What is the president? There's no such
Speaker 1: thing there was, There's no such thing as a president.
Speaker 1: So we were like, well, we don't know what this is.
Speaker 1: We don't know how to pick him. How do we
Speaker 1: not make him just a monarch? Well he's not a
Speaker 1: prime minister. Well he's not. It's not the church, was
Speaker 1: it the state? Like? What is this thing? So like
Speaker 1: even being off the map, We've been off the map before,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. So I'm not saying that
Speaker 1: that's any comfort. You know what I'm saying, Like, it
Speaker 1: don't make me feel better, It don't ease the anxiety again.
Speaker 1: It just but it like for me, it's like there's
Speaker 1: a map for being off the map, if I can
Speaker 1: mix my metaphor you know, yeah, absolutely. Um So I
Speaker 1: think now again, back to back to history now, because
Speaker 1: I do have some some questions that I really think
Speaker 1: that you might have great answers to. Um. I think
Speaker 1: I rewind the clock back to when Obama was president, right,
Speaker 1: and I think a lot of us kind of we
Speaker 1: were just celebrating. It was all good. Everybody was chilling.
Speaker 1: We kind of were in this mode of like, don't worry,
Speaker 1: Obama's got it, we got this, don't worry about it.
Speaker 1: And I think what actually happened, Um, you know, I
Speaker 1: think it really kind of muddied the importance of voting
Speaker 1: still and I think not enough progressives voted in two
Speaker 1: thousen and two twelve, and then we kind of spent
Speaker 1: the next six years hitting roadblocks which ended up of
Speaker 1: course here in twenty or not here. But they're in
Speaker 1: with you know, this new guy in the White House.
Speaker 1: Do you think that if, um, if Biden, if the
Speaker 1: if the path continues on its on its way now
Speaker 1: and Biden becomes the president, do you think that he
Speaker 1: will be able to make more progress or do you
Speaker 1: think that we are you know where where do you
Speaker 1: where do you stand with that? That's a good question.
Speaker 1: And I think like the the the reality of like
Speaker 1: yeah again, like we're off the map, so like predictions
Speaker 1: are silly, you know. Uh, but I will say this,
Speaker 1: like yeah, it's hard to say, like when you have
Speaker 1: someone like a firebrand, just like whatever the hell Trump was,
Speaker 1: like the to be able to like survey the effects
Speaker 1: on our democracy. Like I think we may not even
Speaker 1: know for years the effects of what he's done to
Speaker 1: our democracy. Um. And I also know that like no
Speaker 1: one president is the answer, you know what I'm saying. Um.
Speaker 1: I think going back to what you said, like we
Speaker 1: were lulled into this like superman, Um. Sort of complex,
Speaker 1: like we got lazy, you know, UH as a country
Speaker 1: with Obama because he was so smooth, because he was
Speaker 1: so well spoken, and even like I even you know,
Speaker 1: as a black man, I'm like, I'll always give him
Speaker 1: a pass like I can't help it. But at the
Speaker 1: same time, I'm like, there were decisions I think he made,
Speaker 1: like in our geopolitics that I was like, man, that's
Speaker 1: not I don't know fam like his some of his
Speaker 1: some of his uh immigration issues I'm married at first
Speaker 1: gin Latina. I was like, yo, you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: Like you're kind of hard hard on our immigrants, you
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying. Like, So there was some stuff
Speaker 1: that like, even in me being happy with who he was,
Speaker 1: I felt like his moral compass was was Um was great,
Speaker 1: But I honestly don't think we're ever going to go
Speaker 1: back to brunching, Like yeah, no, I mean, I think
Speaker 1: this is It reminds me. It reminds me of an
Speaker 1: interaction I had with UM with somebody who commented on
Speaker 1: one of my voting posts, and basically it said, you know,
Speaker 1: there's no point in voting for Joe Biden. There's no
Speaker 1: point in voting for for Trump, because like, neither of
Speaker 1: them are going to make a difference, and and we
Speaker 1: might as well just keep Trump because at least he's
Speaker 1: doing stuff, and he had, you know, kind of had
Speaker 1: that whole stance. He's like, I don't like him, but
Speaker 1: we might as well stay. And I really like instead
Speaker 1: of kind of bashing or going back, and like, I
Speaker 1: just messaged him and I was just like, listen, man,
Speaker 1: like we gotta start little by little. Like I I personally,
Speaker 1: I am of the end. Maybe I'm a little bit
Speaker 1: too cynical, but like I agree with you in the
Speaker 1: sense of, like I don't think one president is going
Speaker 1: to make a huge difference, which is why I think
Speaker 1: even if he wins, I still feel uncertain, which is
Speaker 1: why I'm doing this episode, you know. But I think
Speaker 1: my own personal view is if we keep voting the
Speaker 1: same way that we voted and hopefully it pans out,
Speaker 1: But if we keep voting the way that we voted
Speaker 1: in and we vote with our hearts, and that was
Speaker 1: something that I said a lot leading up to election day,
Speaker 1: is like voting with your heart, not with your party,
Speaker 1: not with your family, not with your friends, but with
Speaker 1: your heart. And I think if we keep doing that,
Speaker 1: then we can start making real progress. And I think
Speaker 1: a lot of us learned that. Yeah. I feel like
Speaker 1: one of my one of my principles I always try
Speaker 1: to say is like I vote with Mike, my neighbors, uh,
Speaker 1: best interests, you know what I'm saying. Like, so I
Speaker 1: try to think of like who is this, what is this?
Speaker 1: Who's going to be the most oppressed in this in
Speaker 1: this decision? And I try to think of whatever it
Speaker 1: is and put it, put myself in their shoes and
Speaker 1: be like, how would I vote if this was going
Speaker 1: to cause pain to someone I love? You know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying, and kind of try to like use that
Speaker 1: as like my moral compass, but also say this man
Speaker 1: even specifically to that, to that um, to that post. Uh.
Speaker 1: I think of like what's what's what's a good example.
Speaker 1: If you're gonna make a chicken dinner. Okay, yes, you're
Speaker 1: gonna make a chicken dinner. Uh, the absolute very least
Speaker 1: you can do is cook the chicken. You gotta cook it. Okay,
Speaker 1: that's that's voting. Now It's gonna be some bland ass
Speaker 1: chicken if you don't season it up, Like can you
Speaker 1: put some like salt and pepper and some peprika dog.
Speaker 1: Like you understand what I'm saying, Like, yeah, like you
Speaker 1: gotta like you gotta season the chicken. You feel me,
Speaker 1: And that's your activism, that's you continuing to participate in
Speaker 1: the process and and learning and going too things. That's
Speaker 1: so like and like, which is what you're saying, is like,
Speaker 1: it's the long game. You gotta keep seasoning his chicken.
Speaker 1: Now that said, you can't just season chicken and then
Speaker 1: not cook it right, so you need both so exactly
Speaker 1: to that point. You know, Um, if Biden wins, there's
Speaker 1: a lot of uh, there's a lot of things that
Speaker 1: he clearly wants to do in support of, you know,
Speaker 1: in support of the Black Lives Matter movement, in support
Speaker 1: of LGBT plus rights, in supportive healthcare, and support of
Speaker 1: um climate change or not in supportive climate in fight
Speaker 1: we feel you climate change. You gotta get me. Um,
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna pin every you know, I'm not gonna
Speaker 1: pin every different type of person in every group and
Speaker 1: every oppressed people. Um for you to answer. But I
Speaker 1: think more specifically, you know, I think I still I
Speaker 1: still feel like we are not even close to the
Speaker 1: middle of the fight for racial equality and for really
Speaker 1: kind of uprooting and getting rid of the systemic racism.
Speaker 1: Even though now we've won, and you know, like that
Speaker 1: was kind of like the biggest thing, you know, I
Speaker 1: think I kept replaying in my mind killer Mike saying,
Speaker 1: you know, beat him up in the polls, and everybody's saying,
Speaker 1: if you want to get back, don't loot stores, like
Speaker 1: go and vote. And now we've run that as a
Speaker 1: black man, as somebody who is you know, woke in
Speaker 1: every you know, in every facet. What's something that you
Speaker 1: would recommend for allies, um, to the Black Lives Matter
Speaker 1: movement specifically, UM, but to just allies of of of
Speaker 1: all of the you know, and not to group everybody together,
Speaker 1: but all of those oppressed groups of people. What's what's
Speaker 1: what would you recommend for the for the allies more specifically,
Speaker 1: if we could have a good outcome of this man,
Speaker 1: that's good. And I think like there's a lot of like,
Speaker 1: you know, kind of listening and trust us, you know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying that, like, you know, we kind of
Speaker 1: been in there, uh, and usually bear the brunt of
Speaker 1: the pain and then also lead the charge in fixing
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. Um, So I think a
Speaker 1: little bit of like yeah, like like trust us, you
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying, and um, and trust us when
Speaker 1: it's like when it's not in style, you know, when
Speaker 1: it's gonna cost you a little bit, like like trust us,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. Um, We've constantly are calling
Speaker 1: America too to be its best version of itself. Like
Speaker 1: that's that's the attitude of justice work is like, Yo,
Speaker 1: you made promises. I'm just I'm gonna demand you to
Speaker 1: be what you said you were going to be. You
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying. I'm not gonna let off the gas. Um.
Speaker 1: I think you know this isn't the question you asked me.
Speaker 1: But like conversely, I think what we can do as
Speaker 1: black people is while like you're kind of having to
Speaker 1: hold two ideas at the same time, right, So like
Speaker 1: holding the idea of the specificity of just the anti
Speaker 1: black sentiment across the board, that there is a specificity
Speaker 1: about the prejudice of being dark skinned, black slave descendant.
Speaker 1: There's there's something very specific about that. That said, understanding
Speaker 1: interlocking systems, how our freedom is is intertwined with the
Speaker 1: freedoms of the immigrant, the l g B t Q,
Speaker 1: the trans community, and how like all of those things
Speaker 1: play into a collective freedom, um and just and remembering
Speaker 1: that like you know, I I oftentimes remember this in
Speaker 1: a in a unfortunately like these are things that have
Speaker 1: to course correct, often in a very like cynical way,
Speaker 1: to be like, um, oh, they're gonna come for you too,
Speaker 1: you bro, liked you? Don't you think you different? You
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying, Like they're gonna come for you,
Speaker 1: you know, um, rather than saying like no, bro, listen,
Speaker 1: it's gonna crush you too, like from a more loving perspective,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. Um, So I think while
Speaker 1: again like I can't stress this enough, like not abandoning
Speaker 1: the uniqueness of the specificity of being of anti black
Speaker 1: sentiment at the same time understand that like yo, the
Speaker 1: liberation of all oppressed people, you know, is a part
Speaker 1: of our own liberation too, absolutely so yeah, so I
Speaker 1: just think that like what I would ask for allies.
Speaker 1: It's like yo, just like man, trust like like trust me,
Speaker 1: trust me Joe saying like we we no. It's it's
Speaker 1: a great point. And if you if you if you
Speaker 1: aren't familiar with Problems podcasts. UM. You talk a lot
Speaker 1: about ally ship like that, and I think these next
Speaker 1: few days they're either going to be incredible and we're
Speaker 1: gonna be like, Wow, this is awesome, or they're gonna
Speaker 1: be like a letdown and we're gonna be like, Okay,
Speaker 1: let's keep going. And I think not in a bad way,
Speaker 1: but I really hope that either way, that it goes
Speaker 1: people of of every walk of life, whether you're an
Speaker 1: ally or whether you are in the middle of it.
Speaker 1: I hope that we all feel the fire that we felt,
Speaker 1: you know that. I hope we still all and not
Speaker 1: even feel, but still all have that fire that we've
Speaker 1: felt since June three or or you know, since since
Speaker 1: we've started, you know, since the uprising of you know,
Speaker 1: the Black Lives Matter movement and the fight against racial
Speaker 1: injustice UM started. I just I really hope no matter
Speaker 1: what that happens, UM, probably you are again insanely well rounded,
Speaker 1: and by the way, you're academic. I want to point
Speaker 1: that out. You are academic, but outside of the election,
Speaker 1: you're an artist, you know, and as as a fellow artist,
Speaker 1: uncertainty isn't something that only happens every four years. During
Speaker 1: the election. I think, especially when you are an entrepreneur,
Speaker 1: whether you are fighting for whether you're going to school
Speaker 1: even and you're trying to get a job, uncertain t
Speaker 1: runs rampant through life, right. Yeah. The biggest, the biggest
Speaker 1: quote that I think of is Winston Churchill's um quota
Speaker 1: saying like, if you're going through hell, keep going and
Speaker 1: uh and and that's something that really is always stuck
Speaker 1: with me every time I'm going through a hard time. Um,
Speaker 1: but what advice do you have for anybody outside of politics?
Speaker 1: Because by the time this air is it could be
Speaker 1: the airing on Tuesday, and like you never know that
Speaker 1: everything to be different by Tuesday. But what's your advice
Speaker 1: for for uncertainty in general? People going through that, dealing
Speaker 1: with that? Um and and and what would you what
Speaker 1: would you give to the listener who is still uncertain
Speaker 1: about things that aren't politics. Yeah, that's man, that's good man.
Speaker 1: Um to try to not I'm gonna try to synthesize it,
Speaker 1: because yeah, like being an artist, you you just gather
Speaker 1: so many different like small moments and try to put
Speaker 1: them into one one thing to be like, yo, this
Speaker 1: is this is it. You know what I'm saying, um,
Speaker 1: But I think ultimately it's like you keep your feet
Speaker 1: under you, you know what I'm saying, You keep the
Speaker 1: sky above you. You do your best to like you
Speaker 1: worry about what's in your what's in your arms, reach,
Speaker 1: what is available to you. Nipsey, Um, you know got
Speaker 1: rest his soul. Nipsey would talk about like his movement
Speaker 1: was always like I used what was available to me
Speaker 1: when we when we had a closet and a USB mic,
Speaker 1: we made albums with a closet and the USB MIC.
Speaker 1: When we were able to get like a back room studio,
Speaker 1: we used the back room studio. And then we went
Speaker 1: to Universal and then and now we're there. You know,
Speaker 1: we use what's about. We don't worry about. We don't
Speaker 1: worry about more than what we have. We don't worry
Speaker 1: about what we don't have it at, what we don't
Speaker 1: have access to we can. We we worry about what's
Speaker 1: in our hands. So I think that like as an artist,
Speaker 1: you know, as an entrepreneur, like look, man, if there's
Speaker 1: no venture capitalist knocking on your door, cool Trump said,
Speaker 1: it's fine, use what you got, you know, um, and
Speaker 1: then like just you know, to get woo woo on you,
Speaker 1: like just the outcome, the outcomes out of your hands somehow.
Speaker 1: The outcome is it's divine, it's magic, it's you know,
Speaker 1: it's something it's not material, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: So I just think when you when you focus on that,
Speaker 1: on that thing, that's like there's no math for for me.
Speaker 1: That's where like the anxiety starts happening, you know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying. Where I'm like, I'm trying to control something
Speaker 1: that like it's just not on there's it's just not empirical.
Speaker 1: There's no there's no material for this, you know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying. So I just think like when you let
Speaker 1: things that are immaterial, just let them be that, Let
Speaker 1: let divine be divine. Let let the magic be the magic,
Speaker 1: and you just you again, keep your feet under you,
Speaker 1: do what's available to you and rest at rest, your
Speaker 1: rest your head at night knowing that you gave a
Speaker 1: dent and and even if you didn't have a hundred percent,
Speaker 1: all you have left. Cool. Bro. That is a perfect
Speaker 1: way for us to end this segment, because that's what
Speaker 1: I think is the is the you know, the kryptonite
Speaker 1: to uncertainty is like you said, keeping your keeping your
Speaker 1: feet under you, the sky above you, and just keep
Speaker 1: on going through it. We're gonna take a quick break
Speaker 1: when we come back. Um, Holly's gonna hop on. Prop
Speaker 1: Thank you so much. We'll talk with you in a bit,
Speaker 1: my pleasure. We'll be right back. We are back. This
Speaker 1: is let's get into it, Holly. We are here with
Speaker 1: you right now. Um, we are reckoning with the future.
Speaker 1: How have before we get into that, how have your
Speaker 1: nerves been? I I got to ask prop this where
Speaker 1: where where's your head been last four days or the
Speaker 1: last four years? Really? I mean it's been a roller coaster.
Speaker 1: And um, a year ago, I remember starting to think
Speaker 1: where am I going to place myself in the world
Speaker 1: for the election, Like maybe it's best to like go
Speaker 1: to Joshua Tree and do a bunch of psychedelics and
Speaker 1: just blast off and be like I'll check in in
Speaker 1: a week and like I'm not gonna like go on
Speaker 1: the whole emotional ride. Um. But then there was something
Speaker 1: about the Dodgers winning the World Series last week where
Speaker 1: I started thinking, I was like, two teams come into
Speaker 1: the World Series. Neither of those teams come in saying,
Speaker 1: oh boy, this could go real bad for us. They
Speaker 1: each come in saying I'm going to take this because
Speaker 1: like we are going to win because we're the best.
Speaker 1: And I was like, why are we all shaking being
Speaker 1: like this could go so bad for us? We need
Speaker 1: to be like we're the best. There's actually more of
Speaker 1: us and we're the best team. And so I got
Speaker 1: a ton of swagger going into actual election day and
Speaker 1: then um, and then I got a little bit shaken
Speaker 1: by Tuesday night. I was like, I guess, uh, Game
Speaker 1: one did not go your way and um, and I
Speaker 1: kind of faltered and I got very sad to just
Speaker 1: see the numbers again of like, my god, his support
Speaker 1: has gone up. Half a quarter of a million people
Speaker 1: are dead and his support has gone up, and uh,
Speaker 1: and white women have increased their like after everything. It's
Speaker 1: it's it's sobering to say the least, and it's worrisome.
Speaker 1: And yes, it's incredible numbers showing up to vote, thank goodness.
Speaker 1: But I am I also am like it might be
Speaker 1: because we have never been so divided. We used to
Speaker 1: have shitty turnout because everyone's like, yeah, well you know,
Speaker 1: and now everybody's like no, my team, no, my team,
Speaker 1: you know, like it can be kind of worrisome, but
Speaker 1: like I I honestly think it's it's huge. Like even
Speaker 1: if we just take the White House, it's huge because
Speaker 1: at least we can get some cabinet members in there
Speaker 1: who are actual experts and who have hearts in their chest,
Speaker 1: and like we can start working on things like police reform,
Speaker 1: voter suppression. There's there's so much work to be done,
Speaker 1: and it's time to start now. And like what I
Speaker 1: think a ton of white people woke up to this
Speaker 1: summer was like, oh, when when we keep saying like, oh,
Speaker 1: the system is broken America, system is broken, we're like, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: it was designed to to keep white men in power.
Speaker 1: It's working perfectly, like the if you study the history
Speaker 1: of the police in the United States, it is built
Speaker 1: on racism. The electoral college is built on racism. Like
Speaker 1: we have things in place to keep women and people
Speaker 1: of color small and quiet and oppressed and and and
Speaker 1: with with a knee on their necks and like and
Speaker 1: and the system is right now like actual the voice
Speaker 1: of the people is having a moment, But there's so
Speaker 1: much work to be done. And if we take the
Speaker 1: White House but not the Senate, and if that Mitch
Speaker 1: McConnell is an obstructionist, like like the what they like,
Speaker 1: what they did to Obama and and no policy can
Speaker 1: be made. That is a much different story than if
Speaker 1: this runoff in Georgia helps us tie up the Senate
Speaker 1: and we can actually create laws. So like what's happening
Speaker 1: in the Supreme Court right now, Yes it is stacked
Speaker 1: against us, but the Court's job is to interpret the law.
Speaker 1: They don't make the laws. So we made the Senate
Speaker 1: so we can make the laws to protect our brothers
Speaker 1: and sisters and family members. We make the laws in
Speaker 1: the Senate and then the court interprets them. So like
Speaker 1: now there's so much work to be done. Goodness gracious.
Speaker 1: The trial of George Floyd's murders is still coming up,
Speaker 1: like ship is going to get wild and really weird,
Speaker 1: and like there's you're exactly right, what you what you
Speaker 1: were both talking about, Like there's so much uncertainty, and
Speaker 1: it's true, like we're always uncertain, like we're always improvising.
Speaker 1: I'm actually an improv teacher and I'm always telling my
Speaker 1: students like you're always improvising, like unless you're actually in
Speaker 1: a movie or TV show or a play and you're
Speaker 1: on book like saying words that someone else wrote for you.
Speaker 1: Any other time besides those moments like you're improvising and
Speaker 1: so everything is unsure all the time. And um, I
Speaker 1: think like we have such a fight on our hands
Speaker 1: and none of us have a crystal ball, and um man,
Speaker 1: it's anybody's ball game. But uh, I mean I think
Speaker 1: between now in January with the Georgia runoff, it's going
Speaker 1: to be very very interesting. Alright, so number one go off,
Speaker 1: then like number one, number two you can now add
Speaker 1: next time somebody does a bio for you as an
Speaker 1: intro to um to their podcast asks, not only are
Speaker 1: you the highest blood alcohol level on drunk history, you're
Speaker 1: also the first person to say the C word on
Speaker 1: my podcast. So that's pretty fun. There's really no other
Speaker 1: way to describe Mitch McConnell. It's just it's the only
Speaker 1: appropriate adjective. Wait, wait, wait, this is the funniest conversation
Speaker 1: I've had in a long time, because I just feel
Speaker 1: like there's so much wrong with that man that like
Speaker 1: some of the stuff is just like low hanging fruit
Speaker 1: that I'm like, I want to stick to. What is
Speaker 1: like why he's so dangerous to our country. But but
Speaker 1: my brain gets so full of the things you're saying,
Speaker 1: because I'm going that, like, he looks like a turtle,
Speaker 1: and I don't understand how anyone can Like when you
Speaker 1: stand in front of me, I'm like, I can't think
Speaker 1: of anything else except that you look like a turtle,
Speaker 1: Like how do you? How is anyone like? How can you?
Speaker 1: How do I take you? And I'm like, it's like
Speaker 1: it's one of those things. It's like it's like the
Speaker 1: blue It's like the eight underground gorilla, like the white
Speaker 1: oleman in the room. How it's like, how come nobody's
Speaker 1: acknowledging the fact that this man looked like a turtle?
Speaker 1: Like can we acknowledge that he looks like a turtle?
Speaker 1: He also sounds like a turtle. He sounds like a
Speaker 1: car tool turtle. And this is probably the probably the
Speaker 1: meanest disk you can make, because it's actually sadly true.
Speaker 1: He doesn't read out loud very well. You can't read
Speaker 1: out loud well. And that's the biggest disk that I
Speaker 1: think if somebody told me that, I would be devastated.
Speaker 1: If somebody said, hey, Alex, you can't read out loud
Speaker 1: really well, I would be so devastated because that's such
Speaker 1: a crushing blow. Uh. And that's and and that just
Speaker 1: the way that that's the way the cookie crumbles. All right,
Speaker 1: So where are we? Okay? So one go off to
Speaker 1: you're the first person to say the sea word on
Speaker 1: my podcast, which is exciting. We're really getting spicy these days. Um,
Speaker 1: because you just came at me with the biggest fireball,
Speaker 1: I'm I'll return your fire with my UM disheartened feelings.
Speaker 1: I guess it is that I saw throughout for the
Speaker 1: last four days. Um, and it was that even though
Speaker 1: Joe Biden has the most votes for him in presidential
Speaker 1: history and he's you know, he's clearly winning the popular vote,
Speaker 1: I really was disheartened by how many people came out
Speaker 1: and voted for Trump still after the last four years.
Speaker 1: And I think that the biggest thing I remember is
Speaker 1: my manager Billy had said, UM, when you're going to
Speaker 1: the polls, think about if you are happier with your
Speaker 1: life than you were four years ago. And I know
Speaker 1: for a fact. I mean, I obviously I'm very lucky,
Speaker 1: I met my girlfriend the last four years. I love life.
Speaker 1: I love these things. But like in terms of where
Speaker 1: we are as a world zero percent, and so I
Speaker 1: think it's it's it was really disheartening for me, and
Speaker 1: I think for a lot of people, uh to see
Speaker 1: you know, to see so many places still go yeah,
Speaker 1: we should do this, let's run that back, let's do
Speaker 1: that thing again. What advice do you have for anybody
Speaker 1: who's feeling that way? I honestly, when I try to
Speaker 1: wrap my head around it, I'm like, what is going on?
Speaker 1: Because we know that we are operating with two totally
Speaker 1: different pieces of information, Like we are living in uh,
Speaker 1: two information bubbles, Like people who are watching Fox News
Speaker 1: have a totally different perspective of the world than we do.
Speaker 1: We're operating with different information period. But I I sit
Speaker 1: and think about um, people who vote for Trump, and
Speaker 1: I'm like, even if they just even if they're not
Speaker 1: listening to what the commentators tell them to believe, if
Speaker 1: they just listen to the words out of the horse's mouth, still,
Speaker 1: how can they justify it? And I the only thing
Speaker 1: I can come up with is, I think it's that
Speaker 1: people want to be um. They're looking out for theirs.
Speaker 1: They're looking out for their their jobs, their security, their
Speaker 1: white privilege, and they want to maintain that it's comfortable,
Speaker 1: it's familiar, it's cozy, and like prop was saying that
Speaker 1: the damage that has been done will continue to reveal
Speaker 1: itself to us for years, because even if we were
Speaker 1: to take the House, the Senate and the and the
Speaker 1: the Oval Office, like Trump has riled up like and
Speaker 1: and given created space and made room for people who
Speaker 1: have been quietly racist for a really long time to
Speaker 1: now be overtly racist, and and that is really scary
Speaker 1: and I and I feel like um uh in the
Speaker 1: way like John Lewis talked about, like to to really
Speaker 1: create change, like people are going to be beaten and killed,
Speaker 1: like even to get the vote that happened, and I
Speaker 1: think that that might happen again. Like where it's going,
Speaker 1: like ship is going to get very very intense, Like
Speaker 1: how much of an ally are you? How much of
Speaker 1: an ally? Am I? What am I willing to do?
Speaker 1: Am I going to like stay behind lock and key
Speaker 1: and get really quiet when the ship starts to hit
Speaker 1: the fan, because like this is going to be an
Speaker 1: interesting fight and and Trump has riled up his base
Speaker 1: and who knows, Like even it's it seems like we're
Speaker 1: waiting for really good news right now in terms of
Speaker 1: the presidency. But then what's the backlash going to be?
Speaker 1: I mean, right now we have this flaming orange ball
Speaker 1: of vulgarity that is the backlash to Obama. Like, what
Speaker 1: is the backlash to this gonna be? It's it's it's
Speaker 1: a it's unnerving. But um, yeah, yeah, yeah, I think
Speaker 1: I think the thing that that came to mind while
Speaker 1: you were speaking is the orange backlash Trump was the
Speaker 1: backlash to Obama, and now we are looking at what
Speaker 1: is this backlash too to Trump? And here and you
Speaker 1: talk about being an ally and I think the backlash
Speaker 1: where I stand, and it's obviously in a hopeful place,
Speaker 1: is like the backlash is love. I think that a
Speaker 1: lot of the time, especially this year, we've talked about
Speaker 1: its got to get worse to get better, and I
Speaker 1: think that as shitty as it feels and as shitty
Speaker 1: as it is, it's gotten worse. And I think we're
Speaker 1: still in the worse. And my hope is that if
Speaker 1: the backlash to Trump can be love, if the backlash
Speaker 1: like shoutouts to Arizona my hometown have never been more
Speaker 1: proud to say from Arizona than this election. But like
Speaker 1: if our backlash too, Arizona, which has been for a
Speaker 1: long time just conservative. We're not increasing the education budget,
Speaker 1: We're not you know, legalizing marijuana. We're gonna stay red.
Speaker 1: We're gonna support you know, um division, and we're gonna
Speaker 1: But now we're here, I think if we combat all
Speaker 1: of this and the backlash too, Donald Trump is taking
Speaker 1: care of each other and taking care of our country
Speaker 1: and taking care of our plan it it's gonna be
Speaker 1: a process. And I think where you were talking about allies,
Speaker 1: and it's how much of an ally are you? Are
Speaker 1: you an ally enough that you can disarm your friends
Speaker 1: and family and hug them and welcome them into the
Speaker 1: love club or you know, whatever it is of inclusivity
Speaker 1: and acceptance. I know I sound like a hippie as
Speaker 1: I'm saying all of this ship, but like I really
Speaker 1: do feel that that is the way, not in the polity,
Speaker 1: in the political sense, but in the human sense, that
Speaker 1: we become the backlash of of you know, of Trump. Um.
Speaker 1: But I want to get back to something else that
Speaker 1: you said in your in your amazing which I think
Speaker 1: could be like the your rant, like it was just
Speaker 1: you like literally I was like, yeah, but what about oh,
Speaker 1: she's and then she covered it. It It was incredible. Um,
Speaker 1: I want to talk about you know, you had mentioned
Speaker 1: like the fight's not over and we have, you know,
Speaker 1: George Floyd's murder trials. We have still the fight for
Speaker 1: racial justice and um, whether that be in the form
Speaker 1: of reparations, whether it be in the form of police reform,
Speaker 1: whether it be in the form of you know, whatever
Speaker 1: have you. You have the fight to continue fighting for
Speaker 1: lgbt Q plus rights. With Amy Colmbarrett as a Supreme
Speaker 1: Court justice, we are now going to literally be fighting
Speaker 1: for women's reproductive rights. All of these fights right, and
Speaker 1: it does still feel like even though we knocked one
Speaker 1: of those things off the list, which was getting out
Speaker 1: and voting, we still have so many things to do
Speaker 1: and we still feel super uncertain. We still feel super unstable.
Speaker 1: How do we find what is the next right thing?
Speaker 1: Just like the same way that it was, our focus
Speaker 1: was we need to vote, We need to vote, We
Speaker 1: need to vote. We still were protesting, you know, Black
Speaker 1: Lives Matter. We still were outside of Jackie Lacey's house,
Speaker 1: you know, protesting. We're still like doing all those things.
Speaker 1: Now that that sector has gone, how do we find
Speaker 1: out Okay, what do we all do next? You know,
Speaker 1: properly talked about how as an ally UM to the
Speaker 1: Black Lives Matter movement and that, and as an ally
Speaker 1: to any of an oppressed group of people, the best
Speaker 1: thing we can do is listen. What do you think
Speaker 1: I guess is the next move? Where do we sin?
Speaker 1: Who should we listen to? Who do you think should
Speaker 1: be leading the next fight, the next charge. I think
Speaker 1: Killer Mike did an incredible job and was very, very
Speaker 1: crucial to how Georgia ended up voting because he is
Speaker 1: such a hero out there, especially in Atlanta. UM, I
Speaker 1: know I just turned that question into seven million questions,
Speaker 1: but let me let me go back to the main question,
Speaker 1: which is how do we find out what the next
Speaker 1: right thing to do is. One of my favorite teachers,
Speaker 1: trans woman named Alexandra Billings one time said to me,
Speaker 1: when the student is ready, the teacher appears. And that's
Speaker 1: some Nanny McPhee shit, Remember Nanny McPhee where it's like,
Speaker 1: when you need me, I'll be there. And it was
Speaker 1: just like, sorry, that just turned me there. I agree,
Speaker 1: and I have been feeling that in my life. I
Speaker 1: realized that more and more what she meant that, UM,
Speaker 1: I start to realize that as I experience heart openings
Speaker 1: and that word you said, listen, the more I listen,
Speaker 1: and we're in a reply culture now where everyone's just
Speaker 1: screaming and it's it's it's not productive. Um. The more
Speaker 1: I listen, the more I start recognizing teachers everywhere, like
Speaker 1: they are around us. But until you are ready, like you,
Speaker 1: you cannot hear them. They're there and they're talking. But UM,
Speaker 1: I am seeing these teachers emerged. There's a teacher. There's
Speaker 1: a teacher. There's a teacher, you know, Killer Mike Rick Rubin,
Speaker 1: anyone who is speaking to you on on a level
Speaker 1: where it's rattling your cage, where it's ringing your bell
Speaker 1: a little bit like oh, that makes me feel uncomfortable
Speaker 1: or curious or or challenged in some way. When the
Speaker 1: student is ready, the teacher appears. And what I truly
Speaker 1: think is not to be all hippie ship like you
Speaker 1: were saying. But I do think that it's love. And
Speaker 1: I think that I can only control me, and so
Speaker 1: I think who I have to listen to first and
Speaker 1: foremost as I as I make myself available to the
Speaker 1: teaching of the teachers who are emerging around me. I
Speaker 1: have to learn how to listen to myself better my intuition.
Speaker 1: I have to listen to my anger, because our anger
Speaker 1: is information. Especially I don't know about for you being guys,
Speaker 1: but for me as a as a female, Like, we've
Speaker 1: really been trained culturally to hide and disapprove of and
Speaker 1: avoid our anger. It's not lady like, you know, it's not.
Speaker 1: And and I've come to a point of like, oh,
Speaker 1: my anger is here to help me. My anger is
Speaker 1: here as clear information. So I can listen to my
Speaker 1: anger and say, like, what is my anger telling me? Oh,
Speaker 1: anger happens when a boundary has crossed. You've crossed a
Speaker 1: boundary and it has fueled, you know, when somebody almost
Speaker 1: hits you when you're driving in your car and you're
Speaker 1: like and then you're like, yo, funck face. Like your
Speaker 1: anger comes first from like you were afraid. They crossed
Speaker 1: a boundary, they came into your space. They it was dangerous.
Speaker 1: And so our anger tells us where our boundaries are.
Speaker 1: Our boundaries tell us what our values are. And so
Speaker 1: listen to your anger suit that you can identify those boundaries,
Speaker 1: to that you can more clearly articulate your values and
Speaker 1: those values of love and of um honesty and of
Speaker 1: listening are more important than ever now. But I think
Speaker 1: any time I pay attention a lot to that word should,
Speaker 1: like so and so should be doing this, the GOP
Speaker 1: should stand come out against so and so should do this.
Speaker 1: Like I realized that any time I'm in a should land,
Speaker 1: I'm outside of my mind. I'm out of my mind
Speaker 1: because I'm over in somebody else's mind trying to tinker
Speaker 1: in their ship, and like I can only do this,
Speaker 1: like I've noticed recently, like with my my husband, I
Speaker 1: I'm just really really super tidy. Like a lot of
Speaker 1: times he'll take out a shirt to like put it
Speaker 1: on his body for clothes that day, and he'll be like,
Speaker 1: where did my shirt go? And I've already hung it
Speaker 1: back up because I'm like, this doesn't go here. This
Speaker 1: goes here, and he's like I was about to put
Speaker 1: that on, but um, like I noticed that. I go
Speaker 1: around the house and he used some scissors and he
Speaker 1: left him on the counter, and I'm like, he should
Speaker 1: put these back where the scissors go. The scissors don't
Speaker 1: go here, he should put them back. And it's just
Speaker 1: slowly made me realize, like, oh, that's only driving me crazy.
Speaker 1: Like if I want the scissors to be in a
Speaker 1: certain place, I'll put him there. And the more I
Speaker 1: waste time on wishing he would do the stuff, that's
Speaker 1: the way I want it. I'm that's like completely like
Speaker 1: drained energy that went nowhere. I can just put them
Speaker 1: where I want him to be and then like we
Speaker 1: have a peaceful home, Like I'm the one who wants
Speaker 1: it to be like this, so I'm gonna make it
Speaker 1: like this, And I think that's how we have to
Speaker 1: be in our souls, in our homes, in our cities,
Speaker 1: and in our countries. Like, honestly, I think that's a
Speaker 1: great place to end. We're gonna take a quick break
Speaker 1: when we come back. I got propped back with me.
Speaker 1: Holly still here, and we're talking about the soul of
Speaker 1: a nation. Don't go anywhere I was up. We are back.
Speaker 1: This is let's get into it. And now I have
Speaker 1: Holly and prop with me and we are talking about
Speaker 1: the soul of a nation. But first I want to
Speaker 1: know for you and maybe for the listener elsewhere, with
Speaker 1: all of this uncertainty, with all of this, you know
Speaker 1: you'll have protests. You know, everybody was getting ready for
Speaker 1: protests on either side. No matter the outcome of the election,
Speaker 1: there is still a lot of negative energy in the air.
Speaker 1: There's still a lot of uncertainty in the air, a
Speaker 1: lot of instability. What are the best places that we
Speaker 1: can find joy? Oh? Do you have it? Man? Um?
Speaker 1: I just think man, like, uh, family, you know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying, Like things that you enjoy. I think that,
Speaker 1: like you know, if you have like some sort of
Speaker 1: like spirituality, like you know, leaning into that. I just
Speaker 1: think ultimately, like for me, it's been the mindset of
Speaker 1: the permission to check out, you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: like giving myself the permission to do something brainless, you know. Um.
Speaker 1: And also as a person of color, like I always say,
Speaker 1: like I need to go do black shit. Whether it's
Speaker 1: like you know, just barbecue, funk music, you know, so
Speaker 1: whatever it is, you know what I'm saying, Like, whatever
Speaker 1: it is that feeds you sold. My wife is first
Speaker 1: gin so she's first in Mexican. So for her it's
Speaker 1: like Combia, She's gonna go do, She's gonna go, you
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying. Like and my house and my
Speaker 1: house turns into all Spanish, you know what? I'm saying,
Speaker 1: it's like if feeds are soul, you know, so in
Speaker 1: my mind, I'm like, you know, yeah, identify that stuff,
Speaker 1: give yourself permission and just like and make space for it,
Speaker 1: like put it on your calendar when somebody's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: like from twelve to four, I'm busy. I'm busy doing nothing.
Speaker 1: I love I love that, man. I think that's really
Speaker 1: truly what it is. I think getting in tune with
Speaker 1: the things that make you happy, whether it's something as
Speaker 1: big as celebrating with your family or being with your family,
Speaker 1: or if it's something as easy as like a milkshake
Speaker 1: or a popcorn in a funny movie, or you know,
Speaker 1: a joint or a little a little martini or whatever
Speaker 1: it is. Yes, yes, I have been noticing. I've been
Speaker 1: uh telling myself. I've been calling it like snapshot where
Speaker 1: I'm like spinning in some kind of anxiety or playing
Speaker 1: out some like potential thing that could happen or go
Speaker 1: wrong or whatever. And if I just pull back and
Speaker 1: I say, if somebody took a picture of me right
Speaker 1: now and I studied the picture, what do I see, Like,
Speaker 1: what's the snapshot? I'm actually living in Okay, regardless of
Speaker 1: where my mind is spinning out and my anxiety is
Speaker 1: taking me. If I had to describe the snapshot of
Speaker 1: the picture I am currently in, like wow, look where
Speaker 1: I am, Like it's it's beautiful outside, I have food
Speaker 1: in my refrigerator, I have clothes on my back, and
Speaker 1: I have the ability to reach out to the people
Speaker 1: that I love and send them light and love like
Speaker 1: I've been trying to do that right now and all
Speaker 1: the uncertainty, like this week particularly, is when I feel
Speaker 1: the most despair, I just pick up my phone and
Speaker 1: I send like a text to someone that I'm thinking
Speaker 1: of and just say I'm sending you light and love,
Speaker 1: like just my I'm trying to uh, we are vibrating
Speaker 1: all the time. So um that gratitude that prop was
Speaker 1: talking about of like count my blessings. Look at the
Speaker 1: snapshot I'm actually living in and I've been and the
Speaker 1: snapshot has changed before, Like this summer, I was at
Speaker 1: the corner of Kwanga and Hollywood Boulevard when UM cops
Speaker 1: in riot gear started like setting off flashbangs and like
Speaker 1: attacking like peaceful protesters, and I was running for my
Speaker 1: life and seeing things that with my own eyes where
Speaker 1: I was like, oh my god, the snapshot I'm in
Speaker 1: is like, holy sh it, this is some like the
Speaker 1: images I saw in black and white of like the
Speaker 1: civil rights movement, if John Louis and all of a
Speaker 1: sudden like so um. Sometimes the snapshot is like damn,
Speaker 1: this is touch and go. But also I have to
Speaker 1: look at the snapshot of like wow, I'm standing looking
Speaker 1: at a sunset and there's a hummingbird, and there's bumblebees,
Speaker 1: and those bumblebees are working three mile radius to make
Speaker 1: sure that like cherries get like right right right for
Speaker 1: you know, and and and so I think that snapshot
Speaker 1: and trying to send little vibrations of love and and
Speaker 1: not dealing in should but just being like, what's under
Speaker 1: my control, that's all we can do. I love that.
Speaker 1: I love that the snapshot thing. That that's I've never
Speaker 1: even thought about life like that, Like if somebody took
Speaker 1: a picture of me right now, Like what would this
Speaker 1: this this image be? Um. You guys are both entertainers,
Speaker 1: and you both have a pretty deep relationship with poetry.
Speaker 1: I'm more curious, just for on a personal tip, is
Speaker 1: there any particular work or poet that's been getting you
Speaker 1: through like this time, Like I know, in the midst
Speaker 1: of all of the racial injustice stuff, like I really
Speaker 1: swayed to Sam Cook and I was listening to everything,
Speaker 1: you know, lots of lots of music that was really
Speaker 1: of the time then that was dealing with true, uh issues.
Speaker 1: And then I would listen to everything from One Man
Speaker 1: Can Change the World, the Big Sean and Legend record
Speaker 1: that came around when when Obama was um running for president,
Speaker 1: and you have all of these songs that are really
Speaker 1: like important. So as a musician that really spoke to
Speaker 1: my heart. UM. I don't have such a deep relationship
Speaker 1: with poetry, but I was interested if if either of
Speaker 1: you guys had a specific work or a poet or
Speaker 1: even another artist that's been that that got you through
Speaker 1: um that time or more specifically like this time of uncertainty.
Speaker 1: Definitely one of my one of my all time favorites
Speaker 1: is Mary Oliver, and I've the more I've been in
Speaker 1: her poetry this week, the more I've realized how much
Speaker 1: she went into nature for her own sanity. That was
Speaker 1: her way of kind of like handling her anxiety. And Um,
Speaker 1: I all week I've been saying the beginning of one
Speaker 1: of her poems that honestly is life changing to me
Speaker 1: is It's called Wild Geese by Mary Oliver, and the
Speaker 1: beginning of it is exactly what we're talking about today.
Speaker 1: She says, you do not have to be good. You
Speaker 1: do not have to walk on your knees for a
Speaker 1: hundred miles through the desert repenting. You only have to
Speaker 1: let the soft animal of your body love what it loves. Oh,
Speaker 1: it goes on, like on the end of the podcast.
Speaker 1: I'm not saying nothing after that. Boy, let's just I
Speaker 1: need you to say that bit again. I don't think
Speaker 1: anybody's ready for more. I think we just need to
Speaker 1: really sit and marinade with that first half. Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: and and there's a whole second half of the poem
Speaker 1: and like, but but for me, especially again growing up
Speaker 1: female being so deeply ingrained in me to stay small
Speaker 1: and quiet and subservient and kind and good natured, and
Speaker 1: to take care of everyone's needs before my own, and
Speaker 1: all of those things that are built into girls like
Speaker 1: to hear. That word, to me is a revolutionary phrase.
Speaker 1: You do not have to be good. You do not
Speaker 1: have to be good. You do not have to be good.
Speaker 1: The irony of this poem is that it's excellent. She
Speaker 1: is excellent, like she's so good at it. But like,
Speaker 1: you do not have to be good you. You do
Speaker 1: not have to walk on your knees for a hundred
Speaker 1: miles through the desert repenting. You only have to let
Speaker 1: the soft animal of your body love what it loves.
Speaker 1: Tell me about your despair yours, and I will tell
Speaker 1: you mine. Meanwhile, the wild geese high in the clean
Speaker 1: blue air are heading home again, like I'll stop again,
Speaker 1: but it keeps going. But the reason it's so important
Speaker 1: to listen to your body and your anger is that
Speaker 1: that soft animal of your body that your consciousness is
Speaker 1: dwelling inside of right now, is full of information. So
Speaker 1: that letting your body love what it loves also takes
Speaker 1: us to our values, which shows us the fight, which
Speaker 1: shows us our next step forward. And the term soft
Speaker 1: animal is like insane, because it's really truly you break
Speaker 1: this outer shell that we've either been raised to have,
Speaker 1: or that it's been passed down inherently, or it's been
Speaker 1: something that we picked up because of what's happened to us,
Speaker 1: you know, externally, and now we have the shell. You
Speaker 1: cracked that shell, and that's why I love the soft
Speaker 1: animal reminds me of when you like you bite into
Speaker 1: a rollo or you bite into like you know, like
Speaker 1: you kiss with Karmen and you bite that outer shell
Speaker 1: and then you're inside and it's just like a nice
Speaker 1: warm So that's that that's beautiful with This is not
Speaker 1: a poetry you know, this isn't a poetry review podcast,
Speaker 1: but it might be soon to get because I because
Speaker 1: I will literally just sit in that poem with you
Speaker 1: for the next hour. I'm going to try and bring
Speaker 1: us back to where we are today. UM. Biden called
Speaker 1: this campaign the soul of the nation, which I think
Speaker 1: is like, I think it's beautiful because it's really what
Speaker 1: we were fighting for, is the soul of this nation,
Speaker 1: which you had mentioned it and prohaps mentioned it so far.
Speaker 1: The system was never broken, The system was never blank.
Speaker 1: The soul was just different. The soul was just it was.
Speaker 1: It was working exactly the way it was planned. And
Speaker 1: that's why I love this, this term the soul of
Speaker 1: the nation, because what we were voting for, more than
Speaker 1: the President, more than Senate, more than propositions, was this
Speaker 1: soul of the nation. Who are we going to be
Speaker 1: moving forward? Um? I also know that it's almost the holidays,
Speaker 1: and I know that there's a lot of family time
Speaker 1: that we're going to be spending, and I know that
Speaker 1: there's a lot of Luckily, I have an incredible family
Speaker 1: and we all share views, but there's a lot of
Speaker 1: family members who are going to be spending the holidays with. UM. Actually,
Speaker 1: Catherine and Holly, we're all um and and proper. I
Speaker 1: don't know if if this fits you as well, but
Speaker 1: we were talking before you got on that all three
Speaker 1: of us were raised, you know, in in very conservative upbringings.
Speaker 1: I was raised in Arizona, and Catherine and Holly were
Speaker 1: raised in in Chicago, which um, as diverse as it
Speaker 1: is as a city, still Middle America, still very conservative.
Speaker 1: UM So, my my question for the both of you
Speaker 1: is because I can't help but think about how many
Speaker 1: people are going to be spending time with somebody who
Speaker 1: maybe a month ago would be protesting directly on the
Speaker 1: opposite side of the front lines. Can we get along
Speaker 1: with with anybody you know with family members or friends
Speaker 1: who have openly racist or damaging views or voted for
Speaker 1: Donald Trump? Can we and and and should we even
Speaker 1: try to? Wow? It's hard man, Yeah, that's why did
Speaker 1: you guys here. Yeah. Man, I just think I think
Speaker 1: it's so complicated, right because like, um, my family, my
Speaker 1: father was a black panther, so there's that, and uh
Speaker 1: so we were you know, we're Christians, you know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying. Our our our home, you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: but very far from conservative, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: So it's always interesting when I say, yeah, I come
Speaker 1: from like my family's Christian. I'm like, but I mean
Speaker 1: something very different than you probably do, yo saying. Uh,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. I mean like Martin Luther
Speaker 1: King's was a pastor, you know what I'm saying. Like,
Speaker 1: so when I say Christian, I mean that you know
Speaker 1: what I mean. Um, you know so that said, you know,
Speaker 1: obviously like the LGBTQ situation comes up and it gets
Speaker 1: kind of uncomfortable in our home when we start pushing
Speaker 1: back and stuff like that. Yeah, I man, I just
Speaker 1: I think that there's a reality of like when you
Speaker 1: know you're on the right side of history, Um, which
Speaker 1: I think in this situation is pretty clear. It's like
Speaker 1: it now is on us too. Somehow appeal to the
Speaker 1: higher nature inside of that person buried under a gang
Speaker 1: of fear and pain and misinformation, which is what um,
Speaker 1: which Holly you would kind of mentioned, and is like
Speaker 1: we built you're they're building safeguards around owned the fear
Speaker 1: of losing something. You know what I'm saying, Um, that
Speaker 1: that you know, for us, it's like somehow, somehow a
Speaker 1: march towards equality, somehow equals a loss of privilege for
Speaker 1: those who've been on top, you know what I'm saying, Um,
Speaker 1: And it's it's now like I said, it's it's incumbent
Speaker 1: on us to go, Hey, I recognize that you're afraid.
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying, Um, You're afraid that you're
Speaker 1: losing something, and that is a valid We all are
Speaker 1: afraid of losing something. Now are you in fact losing
Speaker 1: it is a different situation, you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: Like you're not you know what I'm saying, Like this
Speaker 1: is a lyric in my songs, like you know, equalities oppression.
Speaker 1: If all you know it's privileged, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: So like if that's all you know, then it feels
Speaker 1: like oppression, you know what I'm saying. But like, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like it's one of those things to where it's
Speaker 1: like you you have to have the wisdom. It's unfortunate,
Speaker 1: but this is just the the burden of being on
Speaker 1: the right side of history is just being like, I
Speaker 1: have to navigate a higher conversation than this person is
Speaker 1: desiring for me to get into. You know what I'm saying, Like,
Speaker 1: I'm not like so for me, it's like like you said,
Speaker 1: like I'm not gonna not gonna debate you. You know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying because most of the time, especially now,
Speaker 1: like uh, you know Holly was saying to like this
Speaker 1: fear of of of this silo is so it's a
Speaker 1: sealed off ecosystem that like there's no amount of reasoning.
Speaker 1: I can't pierce it like it' said. You know, there's
Speaker 1: no numbers, there's no facts, there's no grounding in reality
Speaker 1: that could make that could pierce into your world. So
Speaker 1: I'd rather pull back and say, hey, dude, like I
Speaker 1: it sounds like you're afraid of losing something that you
Speaker 1: hold dear. And I'm like, yo, so am I you
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying, I don't want to lose something
Speaker 1: I hold dear, which is my actual physical life. Right.
Speaker 1: I got a question that actually feeds directly to that
Speaker 1: exact conversation that you're talking about having um and and
Speaker 1: and it's written down right here. It's like convictions are convictions?
Speaker 1: Do you think that the way that you would the
Speaker 1: way that you addressed it, I think is is incredible,
Speaker 1: especially for that conversation. Is look, you, I know that
Speaker 1: you're afraid of losing something. I I too am afraid
Speaker 1: of losing something. But at the end of the day,
Speaker 1: do you think that people who are just completely convinced
Speaker 1: who's whose privilege or whose equality feels like oppression because
Speaker 1: all they know is privileged like you had mentioned um,
Speaker 1: do you think that they have that there's still a
Speaker 1: chance that those minds can change or are you kind
Speaker 1: of do you feel like a conviction on the just convictions?
Speaker 1: Now I'm on the I'm on the holly side. I
Speaker 1: think that like I can't that's something that like that's
Speaker 1: an alchemy I can't control, you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: Like I don't know, you know what I mean. I
Speaker 1: know that my mind has changed in a lot of ways.
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying. I know that I'm not
Speaker 1: I don't think the way I did when I was
Speaker 1: twenty you know what I'm saying, And that was experience
Speaker 1: and learning and meeting new people and understanding and traveling
Speaker 1: the world and just being like, oh yeah, I got
Speaker 1: exposed to things that made me know better. You know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying, Um that the dissolving of the psyche
Speaker 1: to reimagine it, you know what I'm saying, Like I
Speaker 1: went through that. You know what I mean. I think
Speaker 1: that it's unfortunate when a person is not willing to
Speaker 1: do it, but it's also I also understand it's painful,
Speaker 1: Like you know, I'm I'm asking you, like, like, if
Speaker 1: you think about a person like you said that milk
Speaker 1: toast person, what I'm asking you to do is say
Speaker 1: everything you learned about your nation's origin stories is bullshit,
Speaker 1: all of it. That's that. That's a that's a statement.
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying, Like, No, that's all bullshit.
Speaker 1: Everything you know is reality's bullshit? Like what you know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying? Like, so I know what I'm asking
Speaker 1: of you. You know what I'm saying. And so for me,
Speaker 1: I'm like, I am not sitting at old Thanksgiving table
Speaker 1: to convince nobody of anything. What I am doing is
Speaker 1: I'm loving my uncle. And if my uncle, if my
Speaker 1: uncle want to be an asshole, I mean, my uncle's
Speaker 1: an asshole. Like I don't know what you want me
Speaker 1: to say, like the asshole. Yeah, but but I but
Speaker 1: I will say again uncle, my uncle, he's scared. You
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying. I got, I got you know,
Speaker 1: I got family member like in and out of jail
Speaker 1: that I look at them like what did you doing? Man?
Speaker 1: Like just you? I mean, I'm following. I logically understand
Speaker 1: your train of thought, but this is ridiculous, bro, Like
Speaker 1: you don't. You don't have to live this way. You
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying that said, let me get some
Speaker 1: of them, Kyla Green's my one request is let's not
Speaker 1: do any of the arguing at the Thanksgiving table, because
Speaker 1: like there's some people there who who might just want
Speaker 1: to be eating dinner and and and that's where if
Speaker 1: you want to have your arguments, do them outside because
Speaker 1: like for me, I'm saying, if I'm having my meal
Speaker 1: and then somebody interrupts it by trying to come up
Speaker 1: with some crazy conspiracy theories or any of that, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna be really upset because I've waited all year for
Speaker 1: Thanksgiving and my mom only makes cream corn once and
Speaker 1: that's my mom, that's my moment. So don't take that
Speaker 1: away from Holly. I have a question for you, Um,
Speaker 1: and I think just because and we're still seeing it now.
Speaker 1: You know, in over the last four years, we've seen
Speaker 1: that the dangerous rhetoric nationalism, Trump is um, conspiracy theories,
Speaker 1: racism have all kind of been opened, like the gates
Speaker 1: to that being an okay thing to have, like to
Speaker 1: to be a part of your life. It's been opened
Speaker 1: and accepted a lot more than I would hope, and
Speaker 1: I think that a lot of us would hope now
Speaker 1: that hopefully we are starting to turn a corner. Do
Speaker 1: you still feel like things like that are going to
Speaker 1: be diminished? You know, like there's some people who are
Speaker 1: thinking Trump's gonna start his own news channel if it
Speaker 1: doesn't work, and then he's gonna just kind of create
Speaker 1: this this even to the right of Fox News type
Speaker 1: of thing. Ing, Uh, where where do you think we're
Speaker 1: gonna turn with all of this? Because for the last
Speaker 1: four or five years, we've tried on the on the
Speaker 1: right side of history. We've tried to let them say
Speaker 1: what they want, and we just take it on the chin.
Speaker 1: But then it got to a point where we had
Speaker 1: no choice. Like I think that it got to a
Speaker 1: point where there is no choice because they were they
Speaker 1: were coming down with such heaviness in their conspiracy theories,
Speaker 1: in their nationalism, and the racism in the in the
Speaker 1: damaging rhetoric. Uh. Do you think that as we're turning
Speaker 1: this corner with hopefully um you know, Joe Biden winning
Speaker 1: this presidency and hopefully us making that a cornerstone of
Speaker 1: of change. Uh, do you think that that's gonna die down?
Speaker 1: Do you think it's gonna go up? What can we
Speaker 1: do about it? I think it's gonna go up. I
Speaker 1: think it's gonna get way worse before it gets better. Unfortunately. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And I think it's what Props said to at the
Speaker 1: end of the day, it's it's really going to be like, well,
Speaker 1: I think that's powerful what you said prop about, Like, well,
Speaker 1: I love my uncle. He might have dick head views,
Speaker 1: but I'm going to I'm going to continue to behave
Speaker 1: in a loving way to him. I one time heard
Speaker 1: someone say something about like the way a parent is
Speaker 1: to a child when a child starts losing it ship.
Speaker 1: A lot of times the parents is like, oh, you're
Speaker 1: so tired. You you didn't I know actually that you
Speaker 1: didn't get your nap today or you didn't sleep last night.
Speaker 1: You're so tired. The parents like looks for the most
Speaker 1: gracious explanation for that behavior, and and and why don't
Speaker 1: we do that like with our partners, with our spouses,
Speaker 1: with our wives, like when our when our when our spouse,
Speaker 1: you know, behaves like an asshole? Why aren't we like, oh,
Speaker 1: exactly what prop is saying? Like, Oh you're tired, Oh
Speaker 1: you're scared, like I look at um. The last few weeks,
Speaker 1: I've had almost no contact with my family. My parents
Speaker 1: are big Trump supporters, and it is so deeply painful
Speaker 1: to me, and has been for four years. I walk
Speaker 1: every day like trying to pen the perfect letter, to
Speaker 1: craft the perfect argument to show them the light too,
Speaker 1: like and and it's all been such wasted energy. And
Speaker 1: what's happened over these last four years is that our
Speaker 1: relationship has grown really, really distant. And it hit me
Speaker 1: this week. While we've been waiting for the outcome, I've
Speaker 1: had the thoughts several times like, well, I'm just gonna
Speaker 1: wait and see how this goes before I contact my
Speaker 1: parents so that I know what landscape I'm living in
Speaker 1: before the call, And then it hit me like a
Speaker 1: ton of bricks where I was like, oh, wait, am
Speaker 1: I that sore of a loser that like I gotta
Speaker 1: wait and see, like did things go my way? Cool?
Speaker 1: I'm going to call you and be cool. And then
Speaker 1: it makes me look at this last four years and like,
Speaker 1: WHOA was I that bad of a loser that for
Speaker 1: four years I have let distance grow in this relationship
Speaker 1: and my confusion at how you can be these one
Speaker 1: issue voters and the way that it It makes me
Speaker 1: feel ashamed of my legacy and sad and disappointed in
Speaker 1: you as people that you that you aren't more critical thinkers,
Speaker 1: that you're not fighting for the information. But again it
Speaker 1: goes back to like that's me being out of my mind.
Speaker 1: I'm trying to be inside their minds, tinkering with how
Speaker 1: they're thinking. When I have to come back into my
Speaker 1: mind and instead of living out of my mind, be
Speaker 1: in my mind and be like, oh wow, I was
Speaker 1: a bad loser. I'm going to be more gracious and
Speaker 1: loving and reach out once I have like like like
Speaker 1: you said, like Game one went bad but like now
Speaker 1: with the series, if if the series is like three
Speaker 1: one or something like now I'm gonna call I'm feeling,
Speaker 1: you know, and that being said to I've had the
Speaker 1: thought before. Honestly, I've had the thought, you know, because
Speaker 1: you can do tinktures and stuff of cannabis, and um,
Speaker 1: I've like I've thought of just putting a little bit
Speaker 1: of cannabis and all of the Thanksgiving dishes, you know,
Speaker 1: like in the without them knowing, and I'm like, this
Speaker 1: could go great, and this may be the only that, like,
Speaker 1: you know, what might save Thanksgiving. You're starting to give
Speaker 1: me some ideas, Holly, at to give me a little
Speaker 1: bit ideas, Holly, if it's undetectable and all of a sudden,
Speaker 1: they're just like everybody's really chill, laughing, having a good
Speaker 1: time and like lighthearted and remembering like, oh wait, I
Speaker 1: love all these people. You run out of thanks you.
Speaker 1: The only thing that happens then, though, is you run
Speaker 1: out of food, and then people get angry because the
Speaker 1: munchies kicking you go at home. But the end, everybody's
Speaker 1: asleep on the couch at this point. Um, My only
Speaker 1: question that I have and it's it's for both of you,
Speaker 1: is is Listen, I think if we were talking about,
Speaker 1: you know, twelve election, right, and you're at Thanksgiving after
Speaker 1: the twelve election, and it was Mitt Romney versus Obama,
Speaker 1: but it was just like it was it was realistic,
Speaker 1: like and and for lack of better term, it was
Speaker 1: just politics. Right, How do you How does that does
Speaker 1: that change at all? Though? Because, like I listened to
Speaker 1: when I think about you saying like you're a sore
Speaker 1: loser because you're only talking to them once your guy wins.
Speaker 1: But at the same time, I'd like to think that
Speaker 1: Joe Biden potentially sorry I keep knocking on, would um
Speaker 1: potentially winning this election means a lot more to me
Speaker 1: than just my guy one, you know what I mean? Like, then,
Speaker 1: so does it change at all to either of you
Speaker 1: in the sense of because I totally get it. I
Speaker 1: am the same exact where it's like, if you're down
Speaker 1: to zero in in the playoffs. I know we keep
Speaker 1: making sports like sports analogies, but if you're down to
Speaker 1: zero in the playoffs, you're not saying anything. But once
Speaker 1: you're up three two in the playoffs, you're talking. You're
Speaker 1: talking all of this ship in the world and so
Speaker 1: I think in my own opinion and maybe I'm wrong,
Speaker 1: that's different to me than what is what this is now?
Speaker 1: I I mean because again, to me, a part of
Speaker 1: it is like the way that I see it is
Speaker 1: like the backlash to Trump is love. And so maybe
Speaker 1: you don't, you know, in my mind is like maybe
Speaker 1: you're not calling your mom and your dad and you're like,
Speaker 1: guess what, losers, But you're saying like, hey, I know
Speaker 1: that this has been a really divided time and and
Speaker 1: I don't want to call because like not I'm not
Speaker 1: trying to be you're you know, you're take family therapist.
Speaker 1: But like that's the only thing I was thinking as
Speaker 1: you're saying that is like to me, I was kind
Speaker 1: of thinking, like, give yourself a break, because you're not
Speaker 1: just saying you're not mad that that that Romney beat Obama.
Speaker 1: You're you were mad that we we voted in something
Speaker 1: that created such a divisive um and just separating kind
Speaker 1: of negativity. Yo, I'd say this, I'd say this, dude.
Speaker 1: It's like, Okay, so obviously there's like there's ditches on
Speaker 1: both sides of the roads, right, There's there's silos in
Speaker 1: both you know, spheres of super progressive or super conservative.
Speaker 1: They're they're silos, and there's problems in both of our circles,
Speaker 1: right Uh, At the same time, there is a big difference.
Speaker 1: Like you know, at least in in the world I
Speaker 1: exist in. Nobody see Biden as like to come in Messiah,
Speaker 1: Like he's not gonna like he's not gonna save the world.
Speaker 1: You understand what I'm saying, Like we are under no
Speaker 1: delusion for that. So there's no like Biden cult. So
Speaker 1: I think that like with that, with that said, I
Speaker 1: think that, um, what we can do is like remember that,
Speaker 1: like culture is made up, and it's made up by us, right, So,
Speaker 1: like like Trump, Trump tapped into an angst that was
Speaker 1: already there and he turned up the fire. You feel me,
Speaker 1: So it's our turn now if we are the people
Speaker 1: in if we're gonna say the people on top, if
Speaker 1: you wich is a stupid like metaphor because it's one nation,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. But like if we if
Speaker 1: we are that, then what we get to do is say, hey,
Speaker 1: you just gave us control. We're going to turn the
Speaker 1: fire down a little bit and just say here's here's
Speaker 1: how we're looking at this He's just a man, He's
Speaker 1: just a person, a part of a longer history. Um,
Speaker 1: we are hoping to see people's lives get better. I'm
Speaker 1: not gonna you know what I'm saying, Like that's what
Speaker 1: was weird. That's I think one of the unique things
Speaker 1: about this Trump situation was like like they were sore winners.
Speaker 1: I never never meant nobody that was a sore winner.
Speaker 1: Like what I'm saying, like like for you one, like
Speaker 1: why are you acting like this? You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: So I just think that like there's a way that
Speaker 1: you know, if we get to set the temperature of
Speaker 1: the room, which we do because that's how temperature is made,
Speaker 1: we make it so then so so rather than make predictors,
Speaker 1: let's just be you know what I'm saying, what we're
Speaker 1: looking for and just being like I'm gonna set the tone,
Speaker 1: like you're going back to like the uh the like
Speaker 1: parents situations, but like I get to set the tone,
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying, Like if my if my
Speaker 1: five year old is spiraling out of control, that's ridiculous
Speaker 1: to let me go in there and spiral with her
Speaker 1: like no, like you five, you know what I'm saying like,
Speaker 1: let me, I'm gonna set the tone here, you know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying, and it but it again, it takes
Speaker 1: the work on on myself, the willing to look myself
Speaker 1: in the face, like like Holly just said, it was like, yo,
Speaker 1: she looked herself in the face, Like dog, I'm actually
Speaker 1: kind of guilty of this, you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: and like willing to like do that work. I think
Speaker 1: that that's the call now, is like yo, do that work,
Speaker 1: do that homework. Where where are your blind spots? Where
Speaker 1: are those things? So when you walk into a room
Speaker 1: that you already know it's toxic, you understand what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: And because it's clearly toxic, and like even even among conservatives,
Speaker 1: like I'm even looking at like the GOP, which is
Speaker 1: um as a long answer, but like what I look at,
Speaker 1: like what the GOLP is doing, Like I do a
Speaker 1: pod call hood politics too, because I just I just
Speaker 1: think that like politics is really just gang banging in
Speaker 1: nice suits, like y'all just gang bang. So like so
Speaker 1: so when I look at the GOP, I'm like, Okay,
Speaker 1: the boss is going down, right, So what are you
Speaker 1: gonna do? You're gonna go down with the boss. He's
Speaker 1: gonna die, You're gonna go to You're gonna go to
Speaker 1: jail with him? Or are you gonna cut ties and
Speaker 1: try to set yourself up for the next boss. I
Speaker 1: started acting like, oh well, I ain't never really ride
Speaker 1: with him anyway, you know. And if you the go op,
Speaker 1: you was like, look, we got what we needed. We
Speaker 1: got we we was on top. We got a couple
Speaker 1: of Senate seats, we got three three Supreme Court sissies
Speaker 1: were good Trump. You know what I'm saying, Like they
Speaker 1: got what they needed because the hood stands, you know,
Speaker 1: saying they're like, we'll rebrand later, We'll be fine. You
Speaker 1: understand what I'm saying. So I know with within that
Speaker 1: conservative because you and I have lived coincided with conservatives
Speaker 1: four years, you're saying, we like we've lived with these
Speaker 1: people forever, you know. And so now I get to go, Okay,
Speaker 1: So I know in there somewhere is a logical human
Speaker 1: being that just wants to see the that just has
Speaker 1: different a different solution for how we could get to
Speaker 1: or have a different path to the same solution. Like
Speaker 1: I understand that. So and that's the beauty of the system.
Speaker 1: Were posted to pull and tug at each other and
Speaker 1: fight over these different things to get to the best answer.
Speaker 1: That's what we're supposed to be doing. So now I
Speaker 1: feel like we get to make that culture. We get
Speaker 1: to say, Okay, now I'm gonna turn down to fire
Speaker 1: here like, I'm not not here to gas like nobody like.
Speaker 1: It's not that's not the game. That's what was wrong.
Speaker 1: Was just the gas lighting? You wrong. I'm not gonna
Speaker 1: do that, you know what I'm saying. Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: I have one last question though, and and it's for
Speaker 1: both of you, and I want both you guys to
Speaker 1: give me an answer because I think it will help, Honestly,
Speaker 1: it'll help with my uncertainty, and I think it will
Speaker 1: help with a lot of listeners uncertainty if we're all
Speaker 1: kind of together with it. What are your hopes for
Speaker 1: the next four years as we wait for the answers,
Speaker 1: if they potentially, you know, uh, come out our way.
Speaker 1: I have I have such high hopes. I mean, I
Speaker 1: hope we can. I hope we can expand the court.
Speaker 1: I hope we can eliminate the electoral college. I would
Speaker 1: like to abolish the applice the police. But if if
Speaker 1: we just have to go for defund whatever reform can
Speaker 1: possibly take place. UM put in protections for voters. Um
Speaker 1: uh undergird black lives matter, like really do the boots
Speaker 1: on the groundwork now? And honestly, UM, my husband works
Speaker 1: with the LGBT Center in Hollywood. They have a group
Speaker 1: called the Leadership Lab and they like flipped Orange County
Speaker 1: Ineen and they are about they call it deep canvassing,
Speaker 1: which is based on listening where they go door to
Speaker 1: door and they've been in Pennsylvania for the last month
Speaker 1: and look at what Pennsylvania chef's kiss. But like, um,
Speaker 1: their whole essence for their their whole thing is that
Speaker 1: like when you talk to someone, Um, you've never convinced
Speaker 1: someone to change their mind by telling them what you
Speaker 1: think or telling them what you believe is right. Never
Speaker 1: it just doesn't work. It's like it's like a high
Speaker 1: school kid who's like stoned in English class, like I'm
Speaker 1: not there to learn, I'm just trying to get through
Speaker 1: the day. So this teachers, like you're the teacher is
Speaker 1: falling on deaf ears. It's like when the student is ready,
Speaker 1: the teacher appears and what they've learned is that the
Speaker 1: only way to affect change through story. And so they
Speaker 1: don't tell anyone why they're at the door. They don't
Speaker 1: tell them who they believe is the better candidate or whatever.
Speaker 1: They ask them questions about their story, worry, and through
Speaker 1: listening to their story, they help that person articulate their
Speaker 1: values and how their vote can um align with their
Speaker 1: values and and like Props said, like helping their neighbor,
Speaker 1: helping their grandmother, helping their child, my vote can actually
Speaker 1: create change for people. And the only way that we,
Speaker 1: um I think we can do that is through the
Speaker 1: power of story and listening to people's stories and and
Speaker 1: shutting the hell up. Like I've actually I've never learned
Speaker 1: anything by talking, but I've learned almost every time I've listened.
Speaker 1: So maybe we just have to shut the hell up
Speaker 1: for a while. I should have been that should have
Speaker 1: been campaign plan is just like, hey, everybody, shut the
Speaker 1: hell up for a while. Uh. It has been hard,
Speaker 1: Like looking at the images like on the screen burned
Speaker 1: into my retinas. Now I'm like, man, it's so hard
Speaker 1: to feel excited when it's just it's two old white
Speaker 1: guys Like I don't feel like I'm looking at the future.
Speaker 1: That's not the future. The future is not old white men.
Speaker 1: Thank god, prop what you got for us? Are you
Speaker 1: what are you hoping to see in the next four years? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think, um, reimagining of like how we relate to
Speaker 1: the planets. Like I'd love to see us get back
Speaker 1: into the Paris Agreement, you know, because we're running out
Speaker 1: of water, Like I just don't understand how the partisan
Speaker 1: issue breathe the air man like so like, uh, I'd
Speaker 1: love to see that. I'd love to see some some
Speaker 1: healthcare change. I'd love to see some defunding of police also,
Speaker 1: you know, um, but I think ultimately, you know, obviously,
Speaker 1: like at some point i'd love to can we can
Speaker 1: we talk about reparations? Can I be can I feel
Speaker 1: know I'm saying, uh, but yeah, so, but I think,
Speaker 1: like you know, in the in the from the like
Speaker 1: ten thousand foot perspective, Like I think, like I don't
Speaker 1: want to say a return of civility because even during
Speaker 1: civil times, like you know how black people still going
Speaker 1: to prison twice as much as everybody else. So it's
Speaker 1: like you're just saying it nicer, you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: Like pens. That's like a pincerer in the Trump like
Speaker 1: you just the it's the nice version. You know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying, Like I'm not looking for that, but I
Speaker 1: am looking for somebody to say, like the our congressman
Speaker 1: that got in in California, David Kim, he was he
Speaker 1: uses his term like human based economic economics. You know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying it where it's like where the matrix
Speaker 1: isn't some like how do we judge how good the
Speaker 1: economy is going? Is not some like abstract chart. It's
Speaker 1: like no, how are humans doing? Like Joe saying like
Speaker 1: it's the economy good? Well are you hungry? Can you
Speaker 1: got a job? Well then okay, well I guess your
Speaker 1: job paying enough for I guess it's not doing well.
Speaker 1: You know what I'm saying, So like not some arbitrary
Speaker 1: number that only affect twenty people, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: So so I just think I would love to see
Speaker 1: if like that, like just the overall tenor of our
Speaker 1: nation to start just thinking human first. You know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying, like like how is this person doing? You
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying, Like when you just you step
Speaker 1: back and just again think about like the immigration issues,
Speaker 1: like you put a child in a cage, like I
Speaker 1: just I don't understand what version of paperwork or would
Speaker 1: make you forget that that's a living person, Like I
Speaker 1: just even if even if you could be the strictest
Speaker 1: most like to the t you need to follow directions
Speaker 1: to gain citizenship, Okay, cool, but you gotta put them
Speaker 1: in a cage though, Like you know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: Like you just just so I just would love to
Speaker 1: see something like that that we could come back to
Speaker 1: being like can we just remember like we're talking about
Speaker 1: people here, like yeah, these are people man, you know.
Speaker 1: So that's really like my hope for the next like
Speaker 1: you know, I don't. I mean, that's my lofty hope
Speaker 1: and it's not I don't think any of as much
Speaker 1: as I love it, I don't think all of the
Speaker 1: things that you both just said, which I share it
Speaker 1: a hundred percent, in all of the hopes that both
Speaker 1: of you have to me the way that I view it.
Speaker 1: Um as we're closing out, it's my takeaway from this
Speaker 1: whole episode of this uncertainty, things like where do we
Speaker 1: go moving forward? Even if we don't know it's going
Speaker 1: to be it's like we gotta lead with love. I
Speaker 1: think something that would be amazing is like we gotta
Speaker 1: separate politics from just human like you said, like just
Speaker 1: regular human rights, you know, like I think taking out
Speaker 1: all of the things that are like we all want
Speaker 1: to have a planet, right, Okay, cool, we all want air, right,
Speaker 1: we want water. Everybody wants to be treated nicely like
Speaker 1: And I think, however, whatever the whatever the byproducts of
Speaker 1: those necessities are, whether it be you know, reforming police
Speaker 1: or defunding police or abolishing police, whether it be through reparations,
Speaker 1: whether it be through through legalizing um L, G B,
Speaker 1: t Q plus rights across the board in every state,
Speaker 1: every city, whether it be you know, all of those things.
Speaker 1: Like I think it's to me, the way that I
Speaker 1: view it is like we gotta we gotta really say,
Speaker 1: hey guys, this, this group of things are politics. Taxes.
Speaker 1: We can talk about this, We can talk about that. Yeah, yaha,
Speaker 1: this stuff not politics. We can't. We're not we're not
Speaker 1: voting on whether the color your skin gets to decide
Speaker 1: how likely you are to go to prison. We're not
Speaker 1: go We're not good. We can't vote for those things.
Speaker 1: We can't like those aren't options to choose from. Um,
Speaker 1: so I one. More than anything, I'm just really grateful
Speaker 1: that both of you guys were here because I'm not
Speaker 1: gonna lie like I've been hella uncertain the last four days.
Speaker 1: I know, I said my earlier story like, I've just
Speaker 1: I've been unproductive. I've been like lethargic, I've been ANTSI
Speaker 1: checking my phone every day like it's the fridge like,
Speaker 1: and I just and I'm really grateful that both of
Speaker 1: you guys came on here today. So thank you both
Speaker 1: so much. Um this is my favorite part of the show.
Speaker 1: As I let you guys go, it is called not
Speaker 1: So Shameless Promo. UM this. I want you guys to
Speaker 1: just hype everywhere that people can find you, especially after
Speaker 1: this episode, because I know that the listeners are gonna
Speaker 1: want to hear more from both of you guys. Ah man,
Speaker 1: um mind short, I'll go first. Mega. The podcast is
Speaker 1: um my comedy podcast, fully improvised satire and um uh yeah,
Speaker 1: and you can follow me at Polly Laurent quick and
Speaker 1: easy and effective. Yeah maybe I'm subscribing right now. I'm
Speaker 1: subscribing right now too, God Glass. Yeah. Uh so for me,
Speaker 1: everything is just prop hip hop dot com and all
Speaker 1: the app mentions. Uh, there's a that's links to all
Speaker 1: the podcasts and the coffee stuff. I'm somewhat of a
Speaker 1: coffee nerd uh. It's so um. I just think even
Speaker 1: if the world joint by, at least your coffee shop
Speaker 1: and stuck. So like, get some good coffee. You know
Speaker 1: what I'm saying. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and U so yeah yeah.
Speaker 1: Just prop hip hop dot com. That's pop dot com.
Speaker 1: I love that. Thank you both so much. Thank you
Speaker 1: know me alex ion O A I O n oh,
Speaker 1: you can find me everywhere. It's the best part about
Speaker 1: having a weird last name. Um, if you have the time,
Speaker 1: please rate and subscribe our podcast. Let me see hold on,
Speaker 1: make sure if it was that one. Yeah yeah, mega,
Speaker 1: thank you, there it is. I'm going to reach out
Speaker 1: to you. Yeah yeah, let's go. Let's go reach out
Speaker 1: to reach out to me. Please, but yes, please rate
Speaker 1: in our Please rate and subscribe to the podcast. That's
Speaker 1: how we grow. If you want, you can leave a review.
Speaker 1: I'd love to see what you think. But thank you
Speaker 1: so much for listening. Again, God bless America. Huh. We'll
Speaker 1: talk to you guys next time. All right. We really
Speaker 1: want you to get the help you need, so if
Speaker 1: you need help, please seek independent advice from a competent
Speaker 1: healthcare or mental health professional. The views and opinions expressed
Speaker 1: in this podcast are solely those of the podcast author
Speaker 1: or individuals participating in the podcast, and do not represent
Speaker 1: the opinions of I Heart Media or its employees. This
Speaker 1: podcast should not be used as medical advice, mental health advice, counseling,
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Speaker 1: patient relationship with hosts or guests of alex IONO, Let's
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Speaker 1: on this podcast, Wolf That's a Doozy