WEBVTT - The Bristol Princess

0:00:00.760 --> 0:00:06.200
<v Speaker 1>You're listening to Hoax, a production of iHeart Podcasts.

0:00:06.240 --> 0:00:06.880
<v Speaker 2>Folks.

0:00:07.120 --> 0:00:12.600
<v Speaker 1>It's a huge.

0:00:12.440 --> 0:00:15.480
<v Speaker 2>When us Evil Blood to see you there.

0:00:20.760 --> 0:00:23.439
<v Speaker 3>Welcome to Hoax, a podcast about the lies we wish

0:00:23.480 --> 0:00:25.759
<v Speaker 3>were true and truths that sound like lies.

0:00:26.280 --> 0:00:27.840
<v Speaker 1>I'm the ghost of Danish Worts and.

0:00:27.880 --> 0:00:31.000
<v Speaker 2>I'm the evil twin of Lizzie Logan. Welcome to the show.

0:00:31.520 --> 0:00:35.120
<v Speaker 3>So Lizzie, this is a rare time in this podcast

0:00:35.200 --> 0:00:37.320
<v Speaker 3>where I am going to be talking about a hoax

0:00:37.400 --> 0:00:39.520
<v Speaker 3>that I have covered on Noble Blood my other.

0:00:39.479 --> 0:00:42.280
<v Speaker 2>Podcast, Self Plagiarisms.

0:00:41.640 --> 0:00:44.280
<v Speaker 3>Self Plagiarism. I did go back to the same well

0:00:44.320 --> 0:00:47.720
<v Speaker 3>of research. But the reason that I wanted to talk

0:00:47.760 --> 0:00:50.080
<v Speaker 3>about it is because I feel like sometimes the format

0:00:50.280 --> 0:00:52.840
<v Speaker 3>of Noble Blood one this is just a quintessential hoax

0:00:52.880 --> 0:00:55.760
<v Speaker 3>and it is delightful. But also I think the form

0:00:56.040 --> 0:00:59.200
<v Speaker 3>of Noble Blood is like a scripted show with a

0:00:59.480 --> 0:01:03.520
<v Speaker 3>one single narratives sometimes means I can't explore things in

0:01:03.640 --> 0:01:05.480
<v Speaker 3>as wide reaching away as I want to.

0:01:06.240 --> 0:01:07.400
<v Speaker 2>It lacks a little Lizzy.

0:01:07.720 --> 0:01:10.200
<v Speaker 1>I mean, that's actually what I was gonna say. I'm

0:01:10.280 --> 0:01:11.440
<v Speaker 1>not on Noble Blood.

0:01:11.600 --> 0:01:14.480
<v Speaker 3>Really, I was gonna say it doesn't have Lizzy's take

0:01:14.560 --> 0:01:16.440
<v Speaker 3>on it, and you know, I would never. I don't

0:01:16.480 --> 0:01:19.880
<v Speaker 3>really often pause Noble Blood episodes to be like I

0:01:19.959 --> 0:01:23.600
<v Speaker 3>always take the historical consensus. But I never paused and like, oh,

0:01:23.720 --> 0:01:25.960
<v Speaker 3>this source is this, and this source says that, and

0:01:26.360 --> 0:01:27.840
<v Speaker 3>I mean, very rarely do I do that.

0:01:28.120 --> 0:01:29.760
<v Speaker 1>So I am excited to.

0:01:29.760 --> 0:01:33.279
<v Speaker 3>Talk a little bit about the broader historical context around

0:01:33.319 --> 0:01:35.800
<v Speaker 3>a hoax called Princess Cariboo.

0:01:36.600 --> 0:01:38.959
<v Speaker 2>Okay, great, I think I've listened to this Noble Blood episode,

0:01:39.040 --> 0:01:41.080
<v Speaker 2>but I think it was a long time ago.

0:01:41.240 --> 0:01:42.000
<v Speaker 1>It was a long time.

0:01:42.120 --> 0:01:45.880
<v Speaker 2>I have a vision of myself listening to it at

0:01:45.959 --> 0:01:48.480
<v Speaker 2>the gym, and it's been so long since I went

0:01:48.560 --> 0:01:50.800
<v Speaker 2>to on Ghim, and I'm like, it couldn't have been

0:01:50.880 --> 0:01:53.080
<v Speaker 2>this year, and it couldn't have been last year.

0:01:54.040 --> 0:01:56.840
<v Speaker 3>It was, in fact, a very long time ago. Okay,

0:01:57.000 --> 0:02:01.280
<v Speaker 3>So we're going to start the story on April Good Friday.

0:02:01.400 --> 0:02:04.440
<v Speaker 3>Some people say it took place at Thursday before, but

0:02:05.080 --> 0:02:09.000
<v Speaker 3>most of the story takes place Good Friday, eighteen seventeen. Okay,

0:02:09.320 --> 0:02:12.880
<v Speaker 3>so Frankenstein's about to be written. I think Bridgerton is

0:02:12.919 --> 0:02:16.440
<v Speaker 3>probably happening around this time. Anatomy a love story if

0:02:16.480 --> 0:02:19.200
<v Speaker 3>you're thinking about costumes and what's happening.

0:02:18.960 --> 0:02:21.000
<v Speaker 1>In England at this time, and we're in England. We

0:02:21.080 --> 0:02:21.560
<v Speaker 1>are in England.

0:02:21.600 --> 0:02:24.239
<v Speaker 3>We're in Bristol, which is the far west of England,

0:02:24.360 --> 0:02:27.600
<v Speaker 3>like almost whales, okay. And a woman arrives at the

0:02:27.680 --> 0:02:31.000
<v Speaker 3>small town of Almondsbury, which is right outside Bristol, and

0:02:31.120 --> 0:02:34.919
<v Speaker 3>she's wearing what are described as exotic clothes, which in

0:02:35.000 --> 0:02:37.880
<v Speaker 3>this case just means like a black turbin a head

0:02:37.960 --> 0:02:41.320
<v Speaker 3>covering a black gown with like a muslin frill at

0:02:41.360 --> 0:02:43.480
<v Speaker 3>the neck and a red and black shawl.

0:02:43.960 --> 0:02:45.919
<v Speaker 1>To me, looking pretty cool outfit pictures of it.

0:02:46.040 --> 0:02:48.760
<v Speaker 3>It kind of looks like a like a stereo, like

0:02:48.840 --> 0:02:51.120
<v Speaker 3>a child dressing like a flamenco dancer.

0:02:51.480 --> 0:02:54.519
<v Speaker 1>Oh funny, Like I'm not an accurate reflection of that,

0:02:54.600 --> 0:02:56.799
<v Speaker 1>but it's like a girl like putting a scarf on

0:02:56.880 --> 0:02:59.560
<v Speaker 1>and being like I'm Spanish, yes, like a child.

0:03:00.600 --> 0:03:00.760
<v Speaker 4>Yes.

0:03:01.000 --> 0:03:04.200
<v Speaker 3>And she has a bundle and this is important, carrying soap.

0:03:04.600 --> 0:03:09.440
<v Speaker 3>Just a few haypennies and a counterfeit sixpence and that's

0:03:09.480 --> 0:03:12.000
<v Speaker 3>all she has. And this young woman goes to the

0:03:12.080 --> 0:03:14.480
<v Speaker 3>house of a cobbler first and talks.

0:03:14.240 --> 0:03:15.040
<v Speaker 1>To him and his wife.

0:03:15.400 --> 0:03:19.400
<v Speaker 3>But she's not speaking English, just sort of an unintelligible language,

0:03:19.400 --> 0:03:22.280
<v Speaker 3>and she mimes that she's hungry. They give her some food,

0:03:22.639 --> 0:03:25.040
<v Speaker 3>and then she mimes like, oh, can I sleep here,

0:03:25.480 --> 0:03:28.760
<v Speaker 3>and they're like no, yeah, no, no no. And the

0:03:28.840 --> 0:03:32.200
<v Speaker 3>cobbler's wife takes this woman to the Overseer of the poor,

0:03:32.639 --> 0:03:35.280
<v Speaker 3>who's a person who's in charge of what It sounds

0:03:35.360 --> 0:03:38.720
<v Speaker 3>like he's like the one who levies taxes on people

0:03:38.840 --> 0:03:42.800
<v Speaker 3>and then manages those taxes to manage poorhouses and distribute food, money,

0:03:42.840 --> 0:03:45.760
<v Speaker 3>and clothing. Feels like the overseer of the poor is

0:03:46.280 --> 0:03:48.320
<v Speaker 3>exactly he should be overseeing this situation.

0:03:49.120 --> 0:03:49.880
<v Speaker 1>That's who you call.

0:03:50.640 --> 0:03:55.040
<v Speaker 3>And the overseer, though also pawnts her off on someone else.

0:03:55.400 --> 0:03:58.600
<v Speaker 3>He goes to like the local magistrate, sort of the

0:03:58.680 --> 0:04:03.320
<v Speaker 3>mayor equivalent of this town. Samuel Wirrel and his American

0:04:03.400 --> 0:04:06.800
<v Speaker 3>born wife Elizabeth to like figure out this whole thing.

0:04:07.280 --> 0:04:10.480
<v Speaker 2>Two questions, how old does this woman appear to be?

0:04:10.760 --> 0:04:17.400
<v Speaker 1>And like what color is she? Young? Pretty? You're asking

0:04:17.560 --> 0:04:19.000
<v Speaker 1>like race, like.

0:04:19.520 --> 0:04:22.960
<v Speaker 2>Just appearance wise, because if she can't talk, then she

0:04:23.040 --> 0:04:26.120
<v Speaker 2>can't really explain her ethnicity, but just like like purely

0:04:26.200 --> 0:04:28.680
<v Speaker 2>on the surface, so again it means she could talk.

0:04:28.880 --> 0:04:33.360
<v Speaker 2>In the nineteenth century, our understanding of race is different

0:04:33.680 --> 0:04:37.359
<v Speaker 2>than it is now. She has dark hair and dark eyes. Okay,

0:04:37.640 --> 0:04:41.960
<v Speaker 2>she is in fact like a white person, but that

0:04:42.440 --> 0:04:45.480
<v Speaker 2>she's also sort of just like swarthy. Okay, so she

0:04:45.560 --> 0:04:46.760
<v Speaker 2>doesn't seem English.

0:04:46.520 --> 0:04:50.160
<v Speaker 3>Maybe doesn't seem English. And again she's not dressed like

0:04:50.200 --> 0:04:53.640
<v Speaker 3>an English woman. She's speaking another language. And she's a

0:04:53.760 --> 0:04:56.159
<v Speaker 3>poor beggar woman. But this is also a case where

0:04:56.160 --> 0:04:59.159
<v Speaker 3>I do feel like pretty privileged really does exist. Oh yeah,

0:04:59.360 --> 0:05:02.760
<v Speaker 3>where this isn't just like an old crone. This is

0:05:02.839 --> 0:05:05.520
<v Speaker 3>like a very pretty young woman, and I think that

0:05:05.680 --> 0:05:07.600
<v Speaker 3>makes a difference in the story. And so as you're

0:05:07.640 --> 0:05:10.040
<v Speaker 3>listening to the story and how people are treating her,

0:05:10.400 --> 0:05:14.000
<v Speaker 3>I think the fact that she is pretty makes a difference,

0:05:14.120 --> 0:05:17.880
<v Speaker 3>oh totally, which is just an unfortunate reality of the

0:05:17.960 --> 0:05:21.200
<v Speaker 3>world then as it is now, I feel like fundamentally

0:05:21.360 --> 0:05:24.000
<v Speaker 3>there was a big to do. I think the equivalent

0:05:24.080 --> 0:05:25.880
<v Speaker 3>to the stories, there's a big to do because there

0:05:25.920 --> 0:05:29.080
<v Speaker 3>was a very handsome convict at one point.

0:05:29.320 --> 0:05:33.800
<v Speaker 5>Do you remember this, oh, like yeah, the hot felon,

0:05:33.920 --> 0:05:36.120
<v Speaker 5>the hot felon, And there's a whole account that's like

0:05:36.320 --> 0:05:39.720
<v Speaker 5>mug Shouty's yeah, like bugshot of like Shouty's.

0:05:39.839 --> 0:05:42.840
<v Speaker 3>I think fundamentally, if you see an unhoused person or

0:05:42.920 --> 0:05:47.480
<v Speaker 3>a convict, a felon who is very conventionally attractive, something

0:05:47.520 --> 0:05:49.760
<v Speaker 3>in you is like, well, that person shouldn't be there,

0:05:49.839 --> 0:05:51.800
<v Speaker 3>they should be doing pilates.

0:05:52.240 --> 0:05:53.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, oh yeah, I mean.

0:05:54.000 --> 0:05:57.400
<v Speaker 2>Jim Gaffigan has a whole bit about how actors are

0:05:57.480 --> 0:06:01.520
<v Speaker 2>way too good looking to be believable, like in certain

0:06:01.760 --> 0:06:06.520
<v Speaker 2>roles where he talks about like halle Berry and Monster's Ball,

0:06:06.600 --> 0:06:08.839
<v Speaker 2>He's like, she played that poverty stricken woman.

0:06:08.880 --> 0:06:09.400
<v Speaker 1>The whole time.

0:06:09.440 --> 0:06:11.800
<v Speaker 2>I was like, why doesn't she just become a model?

0:06:12.680 --> 0:06:14.279
<v Speaker 2>She could be the next sale Berry.

0:06:15.200 --> 0:06:18.760
<v Speaker 3>So basically they bring her to this magistrate to figure

0:06:18.760 --> 0:06:21.880
<v Speaker 3>out what her deal is, and she acts pretty unusually.

0:06:22.120 --> 0:06:25.159
<v Speaker 3>She sleeps only on the floor of the room, even

0:06:25.160 --> 0:06:28.200
<v Speaker 3>though there's a bed. And then when they bring her

0:06:28.279 --> 0:06:31.560
<v Speaker 3>to like a local inn called the Bowl, their botanical

0:06:31.640 --> 0:06:33.960
<v Speaker 3>prints are very popular around this time, like on the wall,

0:06:34.160 --> 0:06:37.120
<v Speaker 3>and she sees a botanical print of a pineapple and

0:06:37.240 --> 0:06:40.840
<v Speaker 3>says nanas, which is nanas are like is a word

0:06:40.960 --> 0:06:43.520
<v Speaker 3>for pineapple and Indonesian but also a lot of other

0:06:43.720 --> 0:06:47.720
<v Speaker 3>different languages, and people are like, oh, she knows what

0:06:47.880 --> 0:06:50.840
<v Speaker 3>the exotic fruit, pineapple is and then they show her

0:06:50.880 --> 0:06:53.839
<v Speaker 3>pictures of China and she gets like very animated and excited,

0:06:53.880 --> 0:06:56.200
<v Speaker 3>even though they don't know what language she's speaking. So

0:06:56.279 --> 0:06:59.600
<v Speaker 3>they're like, Okay, maybe this woman came from Asia. So again,

0:06:59.640 --> 0:07:03.600
<v Speaker 3>sam Old Worrel is the magistrate of this town, but

0:07:04.080 --> 0:07:07.760
<v Speaker 3>he doesn't want to be associated with a counterfeitter because

0:07:07.800 --> 0:07:11.480
<v Speaker 3>they had found a counterfeit coin in her purse, and

0:07:11.600 --> 0:07:13.560
<v Speaker 3>he's like, I don't want to get in trouble for this.

0:07:14.120 --> 0:07:16.560
<v Speaker 3>I'm going to have this woman be tried for vagrancy

0:07:16.840 --> 0:07:19.200
<v Speaker 3>in Bristol because he thinks she's just a vagrant.

0:07:20.040 --> 0:07:23.720
<v Speaker 2>I don't want to get in trouble for being around

0:07:23.800 --> 0:07:25.120
<v Speaker 2>this person who did this crime.

0:07:25.360 --> 0:07:26.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's my job.

0:07:27.200 --> 0:07:29.880
<v Speaker 3>Well you should turn her into the authorities, all right.

0:07:30.400 --> 0:07:34.760
<v Speaker 3>I will also say different sources sometimes characterize Samuel Warrel

0:07:35.000 --> 0:07:37.920
<v Speaker 3>very ungenerously, like people are like he's a drunk and

0:07:38.000 --> 0:07:41.440
<v Speaker 3>a cruel man, and I take those with the grain

0:07:41.480 --> 0:07:44.320
<v Speaker 3>of salt, because a lot of contemporary sources just don't

0:07:44.360 --> 0:07:47.080
<v Speaker 3>comment on his personality. And I think if you are

0:07:47.200 --> 0:07:50.680
<v Speaker 3>embellishing this story, you want to like add a little

0:07:50.720 --> 0:07:52.960
<v Speaker 3>spice to the side. Characters and you're like, ah, well,

0:07:52.960 --> 0:07:55.080
<v Speaker 3>he sent her to be tried for vagrancy. What a

0:07:56.000 --> 0:08:00.160
<v Speaker 3>cruel man, presumably a drunkard. So you might see when

0:08:00.240 --> 0:08:02.760
<v Speaker 3>researching this story, might see things like that. I just

0:08:02.840 --> 0:08:04.400
<v Speaker 3>am like, I don't know. He didn't want to get

0:08:04.440 --> 0:08:06.960
<v Speaker 3>involved with this strange woman acting in a weird way.

0:08:07.440 --> 0:08:10.920
<v Speaker 3>But she is briefly imprisoned, and it's while she's in

0:08:11.000 --> 0:08:15.240
<v Speaker 3>Bristol that she meets a Portuguese sailor and sometimes in

0:08:15.360 --> 0:08:18.080
<v Speaker 3>some sources he's named Manuel Ennis, but I've also seen

0:08:18.160 --> 0:08:22.480
<v Speaker 3>Manuel Inesso, and he says that he actually understands the

0:08:22.600 --> 0:08:25.840
<v Speaker 3>language that she's speaking, and he's able to translate and

0:08:25.960 --> 0:08:29.320
<v Speaker 3>says that according to this woman, her name is Princess Caribou.

0:08:29.720 --> 0:08:32.920
<v Speaker 3>She's from the island of Javasu in the Indian Ocean,

0:08:33.040 --> 0:08:36.560
<v Speaker 3>right off of Sumatra. She was kidnapped from her homeland

0:08:36.640 --> 0:08:40.319
<v Speaker 3>by pirates, managed to escape by jumping overboard, and that's

0:08:40.360 --> 0:08:44.359
<v Speaker 3>how she ended up in Bristol. And from this translation

0:08:44.559 --> 0:08:47.520
<v Speaker 3>of the Portuguese sailor, we learned that she's the daughter

0:08:47.760 --> 0:08:51.199
<v Speaker 3>of a Chinese person of rank and a male woman,

0:08:52.040 --> 0:08:56.360
<v Speaker 3>which is a indigenous tribe to this group, like an

0:08:56.400 --> 0:09:00.959
<v Speaker 3>indigenous ethnic group in what we now call the Indonesian Islands.

0:09:01.480 --> 0:09:04.440
<v Speaker 3>Javasu again located off the coast of Sumatra.

0:09:04.559 --> 0:09:05.240
<v Speaker 1>But I'm going to do a.

0:09:05.280 --> 0:09:08.760
<v Speaker 3>Brief spoiler for people who maybe are like, I don't

0:09:08.760 --> 0:09:12.160
<v Speaker 3>know where Javasu is. That's not a real place. Oh yeah,

0:09:12.760 --> 0:09:16.480
<v Speaker 3>it doesn't sound real. It well sounds kind of like Java, yes,

0:09:16.840 --> 0:09:21.120
<v Speaker 3>and Sumatra. But you're like, okay, sort of put them together. Yeah,

0:09:21.240 --> 0:09:24.160
<v Speaker 3>but it's not real. But what's happening right now in

0:09:24.320 --> 0:09:29.160
<v Speaker 3>England is the exotic is very exciting.

0:09:29.360 --> 0:09:29.560
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

0:09:30.280 --> 0:09:32.839
<v Speaker 3>And so this woman is let out of prison and

0:09:32.960 --> 0:09:37.120
<v Speaker 3>the worlds, drunk and cruel, are not take her back

0:09:37.320 --> 0:09:40.520
<v Speaker 3>to their house. And this is where like two months

0:09:40.600 --> 0:09:44.760
<v Speaker 3>of the best summer we ever had started. So she

0:09:45.040 --> 0:09:47.839
<v Speaker 3>is staying with the worlds in this small town and

0:09:47.960 --> 0:09:48.720
<v Speaker 3>it is just like.

0:09:49.360 --> 0:09:52.959
<v Speaker 2>Do they keep this Portuguese guy around to continue translating? No,

0:09:53.040 --> 0:09:55.800
<v Speaker 2>it seems like he's really key to this whole thing.

0:09:56.160 --> 0:10:00.040
<v Speaker 3>By this point, she's able to communicate enough, okay, And

0:10:00.080 --> 0:10:03.840
<v Speaker 3>I think part of like her childlike inability to articulate

0:10:03.960 --> 0:10:07.400
<v Speaker 3>things is part of her I'm gonna say air quotes charm.

0:10:07.559 --> 0:10:07.839
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

0:10:08.520 --> 0:10:11.480
<v Speaker 3>I also again want to be like she's very pretty.

0:10:11.920 --> 0:10:14.599
<v Speaker 3>She has this sort of childlike approach to things, and

0:10:14.679 --> 0:10:17.000
<v Speaker 3>I think that's why people get very excited about her.

0:10:17.240 --> 0:10:21.079
<v Speaker 2>There's a great YouTube video that as far as I know,

0:10:21.400 --> 0:10:24.160
<v Speaker 2>this YouTube video is what coined the term, but it's

0:10:24.240 --> 0:10:27.360
<v Speaker 2>a term that people use now to describe this character

0:10:27.960 --> 0:10:33.200
<v Speaker 2>trope in movies mostly born sexy, yesterday born sexy.

0:10:33.320 --> 0:10:34.760
<v Speaker 1>That's exactly what she is.

0:10:35.040 --> 0:10:39.439
<v Speaker 4>Where it's like Leelu in The Fifth Element or a

0:10:39.520 --> 0:10:44.599
<v Speaker 4>little bit Madison and Splash, Yeah, or Bella in a

0:10:44.880 --> 0:10:48.599
<v Speaker 4>Poor Things, where it's usually a woman who has the

0:10:48.720 --> 0:10:51.560
<v Speaker 4>body of a hot woman and the brain of a child,

0:10:52.640 --> 0:10:55.440
<v Speaker 4>not for creepy reasons, but for like sci fi reasons.

0:10:55.600 --> 0:10:59.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and so she's very helpless and then she's also

0:10:59.520 --> 0:11:00.520
<v Speaker 2>very sex for.

0:11:00.600 --> 0:11:03.360
<v Speaker 3>Some reason, my brain also goes to like mermaid things.

0:11:03.520 --> 0:11:06.559
<v Speaker 3>So I'm going to like, you know, the woman in

0:11:06.640 --> 0:11:12.240
<v Speaker 3>Splash Yeah, like in Aquamarine, Yes, that girl where it's

0:11:12.280 --> 0:11:15.160
<v Speaker 3>just like I'm just so helpless and silly and naive

0:11:15.240 --> 0:11:18.360
<v Speaker 3>with my strange custom Yeah, like how do this work? Yeah,

0:11:18.480 --> 0:11:21.400
<v Speaker 3>it's othering a foreigner, but it's not racist. If she's

0:11:21.440 --> 0:11:21.880
<v Speaker 3>a mermaid.

0:11:22.240 --> 0:11:25.880
<v Speaker 2>It's infantilizing a grown woman so that you can still

0:11:26.160 --> 0:11:29.160
<v Speaker 2>want to fuck her, and also she has no agency.

0:11:29.320 --> 0:11:31.880
<v Speaker 3>That is exactly what's happening with this woman. So a

0:11:32.000 --> 0:11:35.080
<v Speaker 3>ton of visitors are coming through Almondsbury because they're all

0:11:35.280 --> 0:11:38.080
<v Speaker 3>so excited to see her. The Worls are very excited

0:11:38.160 --> 0:11:41.040
<v Speaker 3>that they have a royal visitor. And Samuel Wirrel is

0:11:41.080 --> 0:11:44.079
<v Speaker 3>actually starting a private bank at this time, and he

0:11:44.240 --> 0:11:47.000
<v Speaker 3>feels like the publicity and sort of the esteem of

0:11:47.120 --> 0:11:51.240
<v Speaker 3>having a royal guest is like bolstering his local business.

0:11:51.720 --> 0:11:54.040
<v Speaker 1>Surely the answer to this question will be no.

0:11:54.840 --> 0:11:58.800
<v Speaker 2>But does anyone have the idea of like, oh, we

0:11:58.840 --> 0:11:59.920
<v Speaker 2>should probably get her home.

0:12:00.800 --> 0:12:04.640
<v Speaker 1>No, Okay, she's an England now, I wonderful. She's a

0:12:04.760 --> 0:12:06.880
<v Speaker 1>princess where she's from. Why does she want to leave

0:12:06.880 --> 0:12:10.240
<v Speaker 1>with these people? Because maybe because she's having a freaking blast.

0:12:11.240 --> 0:12:12.520
<v Speaker 1>She's a princess, I know.

0:12:17.720 --> 0:12:20.800
<v Speaker 3>So there's all these anecdotes because a few I'm not

0:12:20.880 --> 0:12:23.280
<v Speaker 3>to jump ahead, but newspapers get word of her and

0:12:23.360 --> 0:12:25.120
<v Speaker 3>we'll write all these anecdotes. So a lot of our

0:12:25.200 --> 0:12:30.000
<v Speaker 3>sources for these unusual things she does come from newspapers.

0:12:30.080 --> 0:12:33.120
<v Speaker 3>But according to one source, this gentleman who had visited

0:12:33.240 --> 0:12:37.320
<v Speaker 3>Malae in recent years brought out a souvenir sword and caribou.

0:12:37.400 --> 0:12:40.760
<v Speaker 3>The princess gets very excited and recognizes it as belonging

0:12:40.840 --> 0:12:44.360
<v Speaker 3>to her country, and they even say she tries to

0:12:44.440 --> 0:12:47.679
<v Speaker 3>grab at it, but quote from prudence, it was denied her,

0:12:47.760 --> 0:12:49.240
<v Speaker 3>which is very born sexy.

0:12:49.320 --> 0:12:52.880
<v Speaker 1>Yesterday it's like, well, she can't have a night, uh, and.

0:12:52.920 --> 0:12:56.079
<v Speaker 3>Then she but she placed the dagger to her right side,

0:12:56.240 --> 0:12:59.160
<v Speaker 3>where according to this gentleman who had visited Malley, the

0:12:59.280 --> 0:13:02.600
<v Speaker 3>Malay people wore it, which quote confirmed to this gentleman

0:13:02.679 --> 0:13:06.720
<v Speaker 3>that she perfectly understood the custom, though not the language

0:13:06.760 --> 0:13:09.680
<v Speaker 3>of that country, because she is not speaking malee okay,

0:13:09.840 --> 0:13:12.960
<v Speaker 3>she is in fact not speaking any language that anyone

0:13:13.040 --> 0:13:17.640
<v Speaker 3>really recognizes. There's a sort of a local expert, like

0:13:17.720 --> 0:13:21.720
<v Speaker 3>a polymath named doctor Wilkinson, who shows her this book

0:13:21.880 --> 0:13:25.599
<v Speaker 3>Edmund Fry's Pantagraphia, which has is like a manual of

0:13:25.640 --> 0:13:29.679
<v Speaker 3>different languages, and she picks hers, which he identifies as

0:13:29.760 --> 0:13:33.560
<v Speaker 3>one called Reijng, which is I believe spoken in Sumatra.

0:13:34.160 --> 0:13:37.480
<v Speaker 3>And this doctor also identifies that she has strange markings

0:13:37.600 --> 0:13:41.080
<v Speaker 3>on her head, scars that could only have come he says,

0:13:41.120 --> 0:13:45.720
<v Speaker 3>from Eastern medicine practices, some sort of barbaric surgery.

0:13:46.400 --> 0:13:49.440
<v Speaker 2>Wow, okay, so she's from like all over.

0:13:49.679 --> 0:13:52.160
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, she has some strange scars on her head and

0:13:52.280 --> 0:13:54.280
<v Speaker 3>we're like, we don't know what that is. They send

0:13:54.480 --> 0:13:57.280
<v Speaker 3>samples of her language to Oxford to be like, do

0:13:57.400 --> 0:14:00.640
<v Speaker 3>you know what this is? And they're like no, so

0:14:00.840 --> 0:14:04.760
<v Speaker 3>no one quite. I mean this doctor Wilkinson identified what

0:14:04.880 --> 0:14:07.280
<v Speaker 3>he thought the language was, but no one quite knows

0:14:07.400 --> 0:14:10.240
<v Speaker 3>what she's saying, even though some of the words she's

0:14:10.360 --> 0:14:14.720
<v Speaker 3>using are specific to Indonesian languages.

0:14:15.880 --> 0:14:18.880
<v Speaker 2>Did you in middle school read The Island of the

0:14:18.920 --> 0:14:19.600
<v Speaker 2>Blue Dolphins.

0:14:19.760 --> 0:14:23.000
<v Speaker 1>Yes, I love that book. It's like the real version

0:14:23.080 --> 0:14:25.960
<v Speaker 1>of this, real version of Island of the Blue Dolphins. Well, no,

0:14:26.200 --> 0:14:27.840
<v Speaker 1>the Island of the Blue Dolphins is based on a

0:14:27.920 --> 0:14:31.480
<v Speaker 1>real lady. What a woman's whole family left her behind

0:14:31.560 --> 0:14:34.440
<v Speaker 1>on an island. I think they all died or something.

0:14:34.560 --> 0:14:37.000
<v Speaker 2>And then she was like the if I'm remembering fourth

0:14:37.040 --> 0:14:41.600
<v Speaker 2>grade correctly, she got separated from her family or whatever

0:14:41.960 --> 0:14:44.680
<v Speaker 2>and became the last person in the world who spoke

0:14:44.720 --> 0:14:45.360
<v Speaker 2>her language.

0:14:45.760 --> 0:14:47.960
<v Speaker 3>Okay, I did not realize Island of the Blue Dolphin

0:14:48.040 --> 0:14:49.400
<v Speaker 3>was inspired by a real story.

0:14:50.440 --> 0:14:53.320
<v Speaker 2>Can we very quickly check if I'm write yes.

0:14:54.680 --> 0:14:58.200
<v Speaker 3>Yes, the lone woman of San Nicholas Island left the

0:14:58.200 --> 0:14:59.240
<v Speaker 3>one for eighteen years.

0:15:00.040 --> 0:15:00.240
<v Speaker 1>Wow.

0:15:00.560 --> 0:15:03.840
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yeah, this woman crazy again. No one, it's it's

0:15:03.920 --> 0:15:05.840
<v Speaker 3>hard to get to the place that she came from.

0:15:05.960 --> 0:15:08.480
<v Speaker 3>No one really understands the language. But they're having just

0:15:08.560 --> 0:15:12.520
<v Speaker 3>a fun summer with Okay, she's doing She swims naked.

0:15:12.960 --> 0:15:13.640
<v Speaker 1>Hot hot.

0:15:13.880 --> 0:15:18.600
<v Speaker 3>She practices archery and is apparently very good at it. Okay, good, badass,

0:15:18.760 --> 0:15:22.880
<v Speaker 3>badass cooks a chicken curry, performs a war dance with

0:15:22.960 --> 0:15:26.320
<v Speaker 3>a gong, and prays on the roof to a god

0:15:26.400 --> 0:15:28.720
<v Speaker 3>that she calls a La tala, which is also a

0:15:28.880 --> 0:15:31.080
<v Speaker 3>name for a god in a bunch of a few

0:15:31.120 --> 0:15:31.960
<v Speaker 3>other languages.

0:15:32.200 --> 0:15:36.600
<v Speaker 1>Allah is yeah, most great. Yeah.

0:15:37.320 --> 0:15:41.120
<v Speaker 3>She also declines to drink alcohol. She brings one or

0:15:41.160 --> 0:15:43.520
<v Speaker 3>both of her hands to her forehead to greet people.

0:15:43.960 --> 0:15:47.640
<v Speaker 3>She quote bathed more than more often than was the custom,

0:15:48.360 --> 0:15:52.440
<v Speaker 3>and we're a shawl while praying. They also just put

0:15:52.480 --> 0:15:56.160
<v Speaker 3>her in exotic clothing and have her portrait painted and

0:15:56.280 --> 0:15:58.840
<v Speaker 3>throw a ball for her in her honor and bath.

0:16:00.120 --> 0:16:02.400
<v Speaker 1>Kind of like et. Yeah, but they're all having a

0:16:02.480 --> 0:16:04.880
<v Speaker 1>great time. I mean, what to do next?

0:16:05.560 --> 0:16:09.000
<v Speaker 3>So this doctor doctor Wilkinson, who examined her head and

0:16:09.280 --> 0:16:13.760
<v Speaker 3>examined her language, published her findings. There's a Telegraph article

0:16:13.800 --> 0:16:14.560
<v Speaker 3>written about her.

0:16:15.240 --> 0:16:16.240
<v Speaker 1>This is you know, June.

0:16:16.280 --> 0:16:19.600
<v Speaker 3>At this point, one of the war el servants, allegedly

0:16:19.880 --> 0:16:22.880
<v Speaker 3>who's a Greek Man, doesn't think she's legit, and he

0:16:23.040 --> 0:16:24.880
<v Speaker 3>decides to test her, and in the middle of the

0:16:25.000 --> 0:16:27.600
<v Speaker 3>night he walks around and shouts fire to see if

0:16:27.640 --> 0:16:30.440
<v Speaker 3>she would react, because that would prove that she knew English.

0:16:31.200 --> 0:16:31.760
<v Speaker 1>But she didn't.

0:16:33.280 --> 0:16:36.520
<v Speaker 3>This story, over the course of about eight weeks, gains

0:16:36.560 --> 0:16:42.440
<v Speaker 3>in popularity. I think I understand why, which is kind

0:16:42.480 --> 0:16:44.360
<v Speaker 3>of I don't want to get ahead of myself. But

0:16:44.480 --> 0:16:47.040
<v Speaker 3>the reason people are so interested in this story, I

0:16:47.080 --> 0:16:50.920
<v Speaker 3>think is kind of the main fascination here. But this

0:16:51.040 --> 0:16:55.320
<v Speaker 3>story becomes so well known that this woman named missus Neil,

0:16:55.360 --> 0:16:58.320
<v Speaker 3>who runs a boarding house in Bristol, hears about it

0:16:58.440 --> 0:17:02.760
<v Speaker 3>and sees a photograph photographs he's a drawing of this

0:17:02.920 --> 0:17:06.240
<v Speaker 3>young woman in the newspaper, and she recognizes the picture

0:17:06.280 --> 0:17:09.159
<v Speaker 3>of her published in the Bristol Journal and goes to

0:17:09.320 --> 0:17:12.920
<v Speaker 3>inform the worlds that, oh, this girl that you're calling

0:17:12.960 --> 0:17:16.600
<v Speaker 3>Princess Caribou, I know her. She's a former servant and

0:17:16.680 --> 0:17:19.240
<v Speaker 3>her name is Mary Wilcox and when she lived in

0:17:19.320 --> 0:17:21.520
<v Speaker 3>the boarding house that I ran, she just like would

0:17:21.560 --> 0:17:23.760
<v Speaker 3>sometimes wear a turban and do a made up language

0:17:23.760 --> 0:17:24.120
<v Speaker 3>for fun.

0:17:26.040 --> 0:17:28.800
<v Speaker 1>I'm obsessed with her. I love her so much. This

0:17:28.960 --> 0:17:32.480
<v Speaker 1>is incredible. I love how much she has committed to

0:17:32.480 --> 0:17:32.719
<v Speaker 1>the best.

0:17:32.840 --> 0:17:35.879
<v Speaker 3>She's She's really the patron saint of committing to the bit.

0:17:36.160 --> 0:17:41.159
<v Speaker 2>I mean, this is like Nathan Fielder wishes like, this

0:17:41.400 --> 0:17:45.919
<v Speaker 2>is jury duty, but uno, reverse Uh, this is.

0:17:46.400 --> 0:17:49.080
<v Speaker 1>Just her turning everyone else into the jury duty.

0:17:49.160 --> 0:17:53.240
<v Speaker 2>She's just pranking. I mean, the greatest character actress of

0:17:53.320 --> 0:17:53.880
<v Speaker 2>our time.

0:17:54.119 --> 0:17:54.320
<v Speaker 1>I do.

0:17:54.600 --> 0:17:56.480
<v Speaker 3>I want to point out, and we'll get to this

0:17:56.520 --> 0:18:00.680
<v Speaker 3>a little later. She is exploiting in other people of

0:18:00.720 --> 0:18:04.679
<v Speaker 3>different races. Yeah, to be like a slight buzzkill here,

0:18:04.920 --> 0:18:08.320
<v Speaker 3>she's not just doing like a quirky character, but she

0:18:08.480 --> 0:18:09.639
<v Speaker 3>is the queen of committing to the bit.

0:18:10.480 --> 0:18:14.680
<v Speaker 2>I'm gonna not give her a pass for being of

0:18:15.240 --> 0:18:21.720
<v Speaker 2>her time, but I'm gonna contextualize her as being of

0:18:21.840 --> 0:18:23.720
<v Speaker 2>all of the things that people are doing.

0:18:24.200 --> 0:18:27.919
<v Speaker 1>Yes, in the pre Civil war world, I.

0:18:27.960 --> 0:18:31.280
<v Speaker 2>Realize this is in England. Yeah, this to be does

0:18:31.359 --> 0:18:32.720
<v Speaker 2>not rank among the atrocities.

0:18:32.840 --> 0:18:35.680
<v Speaker 3>So not the atrocities to people of color, and I

0:18:35.760 --> 0:18:37.600
<v Speaker 3>also want to point out I don't think the problem

0:18:37.800 --> 0:18:40.919
<v Speaker 3>is as much with her as it is everyone around her.

0:18:41.320 --> 0:18:44.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, if they didn't want to believe in racist stereotypes,

0:18:44.800 --> 0:18:47.000
<v Speaker 2>there would have been no stereotypes for her to exploit.

0:18:47.160 --> 0:18:47.720
<v Speaker 1>That is it.

0:18:47.880 --> 0:18:52.440
<v Speaker 3>It's everyone around her delighted that she is indulging exactly

0:18:52.520 --> 0:18:54.320
<v Speaker 3>the racist stereotype that they.

0:18:54.320 --> 0:18:56.200
<v Speaker 1>Want to enjoy. What a grifter?

0:18:56.480 --> 0:19:00.160
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, So who is Mary Wilcox. She was born we're

0:19:00.160 --> 0:19:03.600
<v Speaker 3>in seventeen ninety one or ninety two in Devonshire. Her

0:19:03.680 --> 0:19:06.600
<v Speaker 3>father was a cobbler. We don't know anything about her mother.

0:19:06.720 --> 0:19:08.760
<v Speaker 1>Is that why she went to a cobbler house? Oh?

0:19:09.400 --> 0:19:11.840
<v Speaker 1>Because she was like, I know how to get around

0:19:11.880 --> 0:19:15.399
<v Speaker 1>a cobbler house. Maybe I never even put that together.

0:19:16.160 --> 0:19:19.680
<v Speaker 1>This is what I do. These things are not coming

0:19:19.760 --> 0:19:20.280
<v Speaker 1>up on Noble.

0:19:21.200 --> 0:19:23.520
<v Speaker 3>Her dad apparently said that when she was young she

0:19:23.600 --> 0:19:27.280
<v Speaker 3>suffered from rheumatic fever, which affected her mentally after that.

0:19:27.800 --> 0:19:29.760
<v Speaker 3>So we don't even know what's going on up there.

0:19:29.840 --> 0:19:32.960
<v Speaker 3>She little kookie, she's a little kookie. She left home

0:19:33.040 --> 0:19:35.720
<v Speaker 3>at nineteen, came to London and she got very sick

0:19:36.160 --> 0:19:39.760
<v Speaker 3>and went to a poorhouse hospital and received an improperly

0:19:39.880 --> 0:19:42.639
<v Speaker 3>done cupping operation on her head and that was what

0:19:42.800 --> 0:19:45.640
<v Speaker 3>gave her the scars, which I find very funny. It's

0:19:45.720 --> 0:19:49.679
<v Speaker 3>like people being like, oh, only a primitive Eastern country

0:19:49.720 --> 0:19:51.720
<v Speaker 3>could have possibly done this her, and it's like, no,

0:19:51.960 --> 0:19:54.800
<v Speaker 3>this happened in London. Yeah bye, because she was a

0:19:54.840 --> 0:19:58.000
<v Speaker 3>poor person at the hospital. Yeah, it's people not realizing

0:19:58.200 --> 0:20:02.159
<v Speaker 3>the barbaric practices are what they're doing in their own communities.

0:20:02.760 --> 0:20:02.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

0:20:04.560 --> 0:20:07.040
<v Speaker 3>She worked as a nurse maid for a family in

0:20:07.119 --> 0:20:09.960
<v Speaker 3>Clapham and apparently the children really liked her. She was

0:20:10.080 --> 0:20:13.240
<v Speaker 3>very imaginative with stories, so I like it. Then she

0:20:13.359 --> 0:20:17.879
<v Speaker 3>got very interested in their Jewish neighbors. She just like

0:20:18.000 --> 0:20:21.000
<v Speaker 3>loved their language and their prayers. I mean, we love

0:20:21.000 --> 0:20:23.160
<v Speaker 3>an ally, we love someone being interested in the community.

0:20:23.920 --> 0:20:27.600
<v Speaker 1>What it's an anti Semite, like a pro Semite.

0:20:28.160 --> 0:20:31.160
<v Speaker 3>She gets fired from her job for attending a Jewish wedding.

0:20:32.320 --> 0:20:33.840
<v Speaker 2>I know that is insane.

0:20:34.040 --> 0:20:36.320
<v Speaker 3>I know it's I like, I love an Ally, but

0:20:36.440 --> 0:20:39.320
<v Speaker 3>I also there's like the bit of balance here where

0:20:39.560 --> 0:20:42.320
<v Speaker 3>she was like maybe a little too interested in their

0:20:42.400 --> 0:20:44.320
<v Speaker 3>prayer and language, where I do feel a little like

0:20:44.840 --> 0:20:47.320
<v Speaker 3>have you read that Judge Judy interview with RuPaul?

0:20:48.280 --> 0:20:48.440
<v Speaker 1>Oh?

0:20:49.040 --> 0:20:54.080
<v Speaker 3>Yes, yes, We're like, incorporating Judaism into your personality is

0:20:54.119 --> 0:20:55.320
<v Speaker 3>maybe something you don't need.

0:20:56.080 --> 0:20:58.879
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but like attending a wedding to me is like

0:20:59.320 --> 0:21:01.680
<v Speaker 2>the wedding is great, Like that's fun.

0:21:01.840 --> 0:21:05.320
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, Like go celebrate, Go celebrate. She shouldn't have gotten fired.

0:21:05.640 --> 0:21:09.359
<v Speaker 3>No justice for Mary Wilcox, Yeah, but she did. This

0:21:09.560 --> 0:21:12.399
<v Speaker 3>is also one of the most iconic details about her

0:21:12.440 --> 0:21:15.800
<v Speaker 3>that I love. She gets admitted to a Magdalen hospital

0:21:15.880 --> 0:21:18.959
<v Speaker 3>for fallen women, which is like where us text workers

0:21:19.000 --> 0:21:22.800
<v Speaker 3>would go because quote, she admired the uniform of brown

0:21:22.880 --> 0:21:26.560
<v Speaker 3>dresses and straw hats for the inmates. So she sees

0:21:26.680 --> 0:21:29.880
<v Speaker 3>that these women, these fallen women in a Magdalen hospital

0:21:30.240 --> 0:21:32.480
<v Speaker 3>are wearing brown dresses and straw hats, and she's like,

0:21:32.720 --> 0:21:34.840
<v Speaker 3>I like that, and so she gets in.

0:21:35.080 --> 0:21:38.280
<v Speaker 2>That's like the opposite of Maria von Trapp being like

0:21:38.600 --> 0:21:40.800
<v Speaker 2>I love what's going on with the nuns, I'll become

0:21:40.840 --> 0:21:42.879
<v Speaker 2>a nun. She's like, I love what's going on with

0:21:42.960 --> 0:21:45.800
<v Speaker 2>the sex workers. I'll hang out with the sex worker.

0:21:45.960 --> 0:21:48.119
<v Speaker 3>She gets kicked out when it's discovered that she's not

0:21:48.240 --> 0:21:51.240
<v Speaker 3>actually a sex worker, and then we get pieces of

0:21:51.320 --> 0:21:55.120
<v Speaker 3>her backstory from here where we're just kind of assuming

0:21:55.240 --> 0:21:58.640
<v Speaker 3>and putting pieces together. We know, she hops around, possibly

0:21:58.720 --> 0:22:02.240
<v Speaker 3>goes to France, where she learned some French. She becomes pregnant,

0:22:02.320 --> 0:22:04.600
<v Speaker 3>gives birth in secret. At first she says the father

0:22:04.840 --> 0:22:07.359
<v Speaker 3>was a brick layer from Essex. Later she'll say it

0:22:07.440 --> 0:22:09.960
<v Speaker 3>was a Frenchman she met in a bookshop. The child

0:22:10.080 --> 0:22:13.400
<v Speaker 3>passes away very tragically. And this is when Mary hits

0:22:13.440 --> 0:22:17.399
<v Speaker 3>the road with a group of Romani people. And this

0:22:17.600 --> 0:22:19.600
<v Speaker 3>is kind of important because there's a lot of their

0:22:19.800 --> 0:22:24.159
<v Speaker 3>language and culture that she'll sort of imitate in her

0:22:24.240 --> 0:22:26.639
<v Speaker 3>own little way. She'll take the seeds and then have

0:22:26.840 --> 0:22:30.160
<v Speaker 3>fun with it. Yeah, she becomes a beggar in Bristol

0:22:30.640 --> 0:22:32.880
<v Speaker 3>because she got fired for going to a Jewish wedding

0:22:33.080 --> 0:22:35.080
<v Speaker 3>what she was supposed to do. And this is kind

0:22:35.080 --> 0:22:37.440
<v Speaker 3>of where the seeds of the Caribou trick are born,

0:22:37.920 --> 0:22:41.879
<v Speaker 3>because she notices in Bristol there are girls who are

0:22:41.920 --> 0:22:46.119
<v Speaker 3>from Brittany who are like ethnic Bretons and that's like

0:22:46.400 --> 0:22:50.120
<v Speaker 3>a Celtic ethnic group. And she noticed that the Breton

0:22:50.240 --> 0:22:53.720
<v Speaker 3>girls make more money because they're begging in their traditional

0:22:54.160 --> 0:22:58.720
<v Speaker 3>Breton clothing. And she's like, hmm, okay, whether it's like

0:22:58.720 --> 0:23:01.800
<v Speaker 3>because you're getting attention, you look more unique or something

0:23:01.840 --> 0:23:05.320
<v Speaker 3>about it. Mary puts on a turban and pretends to

0:23:05.400 --> 0:23:09.560
<v Speaker 3>be French as a beggar. But then they take her

0:23:09.640 --> 0:23:13.520
<v Speaker 3>to the French console and she doesn't actually speak all

0:23:13.600 --> 0:23:17.440
<v Speaker 3>that well, and so she pretends to be Spanish, and

0:23:17.520 --> 0:23:20.280
<v Speaker 3>then at the French console they're like, oh, we have

0:23:20.320 --> 0:23:23.480
<v Speaker 3>a cookoo Spanish. Hold on one second, and then she's

0:23:23.520 --> 0:23:25.800
<v Speaker 3>like wait, wait, wait, no, no, no, just kidding. And

0:23:25.920 --> 0:23:28.000
<v Speaker 3>I think this is probably the point where she realizes

0:23:28.080 --> 0:23:30.720
<v Speaker 3>that if she's going to fake an ethnicity, she needs

0:23:30.800 --> 0:23:31.720
<v Speaker 3>one that no one can call.

0:23:31.880 --> 0:23:32.040
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

0:23:32.160 --> 0:23:36.840
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, So then that's I think how the Princess Caribou

0:23:36.920 --> 0:23:40.840
<v Speaker 3>situation began. We can kind of assume that the Portuguese

0:23:40.880 --> 0:23:41.760
<v Speaker 3>guy was in on it.

0:23:42.880 --> 0:23:47.399
<v Speaker 2>It sounds like, yeah, she maybe not from the beginning,

0:23:47.520 --> 0:23:50.200
<v Speaker 2>but maybe she like met him and was like you

0:23:50.240 --> 0:23:51.399
<v Speaker 2>want to tell people?

0:23:51.760 --> 0:23:55.359
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, okay. I mean we don't have any information on that.

0:23:55.720 --> 0:23:58.480
<v Speaker 3>We don't know what their relationship was, but it kind

0:23:58.520 --> 0:24:01.160
<v Speaker 3>of reading between the lines, like I assumed she would

0:24:01.240 --> 0:24:02.840
<v Speaker 3>just like go along with this, well, ITT's have fun

0:24:03.160 --> 0:24:06.640
<v Speaker 3>and again, pretty young girl, so I think more people

0:24:06.720 --> 0:24:07.840
<v Speaker 3>were willing to go along with it.

0:24:08.480 --> 0:24:11.879
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so is that how it ended was when this

0:24:12.080 --> 0:24:14.200
<v Speaker 2>woman like outed her after seeing her in the paper.

0:24:14.440 --> 0:24:15.439
<v Speaker 1>Well, so once she.

0:24:15.600 --> 0:24:17.800
<v Speaker 3>Sort of outed and again I think this woman also

0:24:17.920 --> 0:24:19.520
<v Speaker 3>outed her in a very polite way.

0:24:19.600 --> 0:24:21.280
<v Speaker 1>It doesn't seem like it was a real like cancel

0:24:21.359 --> 0:24:23.040
<v Speaker 1>culture way. She was just like, oh, by the way,

0:24:23.119 --> 0:24:25.200
<v Speaker 1>I know her. She used to talk Gibberish.

0:24:25.359 --> 0:24:29.640
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, the language was sort of now they realized it's

0:24:29.640 --> 0:24:34.240
<v Speaker 3>a combination of Gibberish and Romani words. And technically, because

0:24:34.320 --> 0:24:38.600
<v Speaker 3>this is right after the Napoleonic War and imposting was

0:24:38.920 --> 0:24:43.080
<v Speaker 3>an actual crime under British law. But I mean because

0:24:43.080 --> 0:24:45.160
<v Speaker 3>they're scared of spies during the war, so like you're

0:24:45.160 --> 0:24:48.280
<v Speaker 3>not allowed to be an impostor, so what she's doing

0:24:48.400 --> 0:24:51.440
<v Speaker 3>is against the law, but she isn't punished, which is

0:24:51.520 --> 0:24:54.240
<v Speaker 3>like kind of cool. And what really happened the person

0:24:54.359 --> 0:24:57.320
<v Speaker 3>too pretty, But really it was just like, well, this

0:24:57.520 --> 0:24:59.840
<v Speaker 3>was all in good fun. And who everyone makes fun

0:24:59.880 --> 0:25:03.639
<v Speaker 3>of of is sort of the Bristol elites for believing

0:25:03.680 --> 0:25:06.880
<v Speaker 3>that they were hosting a princess. Oh yes, like look

0:25:06.920 --> 0:25:10.359
<v Speaker 3>at these stupid rich people in Bristol who were so

0:25:10.600 --> 0:25:14.000
<v Speaker 3>amused and like patting themselves on the back for having

0:25:14.040 --> 0:25:15.080
<v Speaker 3>a royal guest.

0:25:15.359 --> 0:25:16.080
<v Speaker 1>It's like when you.

0:25:16.400 --> 0:25:19.080
<v Speaker 2>See roundups of really really drunk people who thought they

0:25:19.119 --> 0:25:21.840
<v Speaker 2>about celebrities. Yeah, and it's just someone who took a

0:25:21.880 --> 0:25:24.000
<v Speaker 2>picture with like a redheaded guy and was like I

0:25:24.080 --> 0:25:25.760
<v Speaker 2>met Ed Sheeran, and it's like it's.

0:25:25.680 --> 0:25:30.040
<v Speaker 3>Not that's it exactly. Everyone is laughing at the people

0:25:30.160 --> 0:25:33.240
<v Speaker 3>around her and like kind of give her a pass.

0:25:33.800 --> 0:25:38.520
<v Speaker 3>I think mister Nora, mister Worrel's bank collapses, probably because

0:25:38.520 --> 0:25:40.359
<v Speaker 3>everyone's like, oh, yeah, this guy's terrible judgment.

0:25:41.080 --> 0:25:43.480
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I wouldn't trust him with my money.

0:25:43.640 --> 0:25:46.879
<v Speaker 3>No, and again maybe he's a cruel drunk. According to

0:25:46.960 --> 0:25:50.760
<v Speaker 3>some sources, Missus Worrel, his wife, who was born in America,

0:25:50.880 --> 0:25:53.960
<v Speaker 3>I think, feels bad because there's a lot of negative

0:25:54.000 --> 0:25:57.240
<v Speaker 3>publicity around Mary now and arranges for her to travel

0:25:57.280 --> 0:26:01.680
<v Speaker 3>to Philadelphia, possibly to escape the back. Basically, once she

0:26:01.720 --> 0:26:04.520
<v Speaker 3>comes to America, she starts a show. She becomes like

0:26:04.600 --> 0:26:08.959
<v Speaker 3>a performer, a very pt Barnum style, but a little earlier.

0:26:09.520 --> 0:26:12.000
<v Speaker 3>And so some of the things that she says I

0:26:12.119 --> 0:26:14.880
<v Speaker 3>will say are not true because she is saying them

0:26:14.920 --> 0:26:20.119
<v Speaker 3>on stage. But according to lore, allegedly when she was

0:26:20.160 --> 0:26:23.240
<v Speaker 3>on the ship to America, a storm blew her off course,

0:26:23.640 --> 0:26:26.600
<v Speaker 3>and they came so close to Saint Helena, where Napoleon

0:26:26.720 --> 0:26:29.160
<v Speaker 3>was being held captive, that she took a small boat

0:26:29.280 --> 0:26:31.480
<v Speaker 3>and rowed it on shore and met him, and he

0:26:31.600 --> 0:26:35.840
<v Speaker 3>was enchanted by her and possibly became his mistress. Oh funny,

0:26:36.320 --> 0:26:41.359
<v Speaker 3>maybe maybe not? Yeah, probably not no no no liar

0:26:41.480 --> 0:26:50.480
<v Speaker 3>tells Storyeh, but amusing. So in the US, she tries

0:26:50.560 --> 0:26:53.320
<v Speaker 3>to kind of capitalize on her fame and appear on

0:26:53.480 --> 0:26:57.000
<v Speaker 3>stage as caribou. The thinking is that Americans are still

0:26:57.040 --> 0:26:59.600
<v Speaker 3>smarting from the War of eighteen twelve, and so the

0:26:59.680 --> 0:27:01.639
<v Speaker 3>idea like, oh, aren't you going to be entertained by

0:27:01.680 --> 0:27:04.359
<v Speaker 3>this woman who fooled these dumb British people. And I

0:27:04.480 --> 0:27:09.000
<v Speaker 3>also kind of think it's interesting how nowadays if someone

0:27:09.160 --> 0:27:11.760
<v Speaker 3>is like quote unquote canceled, they kind of do their

0:27:12.760 --> 0:27:16.120
<v Speaker 3>like villain arc tour. Yes, and the way they try

0:27:16.160 --> 0:27:19.879
<v Speaker 3>to capitalize on that notoriety for money and public with

0:27:20.000 --> 0:27:24.200
<v Speaker 3>that publicity is happening one hundred years two hundred years ago.

0:27:25.040 --> 0:27:27.520
<v Speaker 3>Oh yeah, you would just like write a tell all book. Yeah,

0:27:27.560 --> 0:27:29.320
<v Speaker 3>this is this is her tell all, This is her

0:27:29.400 --> 0:27:31.720
<v Speaker 3>tell her going on call her daddy, She's going on

0:27:31.840 --> 0:27:35.119
<v Speaker 3>call her daddy, except she's going on the Philadelphia stage.

0:27:36.160 --> 0:27:38.920
<v Speaker 3>She writes a letter back to the worlds saying that

0:27:39.040 --> 0:27:42.920
<v Speaker 3>it's really hard to be a celebrity, just like her notoriety.

0:27:43.119 --> 0:27:44.959
<v Speaker 3>Like it's not like, oh, it's so hard to be famous,

0:27:45.000 --> 0:27:48.359
<v Speaker 3>but like it's very uncomfortable the way ever knows me,

0:27:48.560 --> 0:27:51.280
<v Speaker 3>I don't like living here. And in eighteen twenty four,

0:27:51.560 --> 0:27:54.399
<v Speaker 3>so a handful of years later, she comes back to Britain,

0:27:54.840 --> 0:27:59.040
<v Speaker 3>and then her life becomes pretty normal. In eighteen twenty eight,

0:27:59.119 --> 0:28:02.520
<v Speaker 3>she's living at a widow which is possibly not true.

0:28:02.600 --> 0:28:05.080
<v Speaker 3>Maybe she just is living as a widow with the

0:28:05.200 --> 0:28:07.920
<v Speaker 3>last name of a cousin, Mary Burgess, so it seems

0:28:07.960 --> 0:28:10.200
<v Speaker 3>like she just sort of took on a fake name

0:28:10.359 --> 0:28:13.680
<v Speaker 3>to avoid the notoriety. From all of this, she marries

0:28:13.720 --> 0:28:16.359
<v Speaker 3>a man named Richard Baker, which is why sometimes if

0:28:16.400 --> 0:28:18.879
<v Speaker 3>you see stories about her, she's referenced as Mary Baker.

0:28:19.480 --> 0:28:21.920
<v Speaker 3>She gives birth to a daughter, Mary Anne, and in

0:28:22.040 --> 0:28:25.600
<v Speaker 3>nineteen twenty nine, so a little over a decade after

0:28:25.680 --> 0:28:28.720
<v Speaker 3>all of this, she's making a living selling leeches to

0:28:28.800 --> 0:28:32.840
<v Speaker 3>a eighteen twenty nine, eighteen twenty nine, Thank you. Eighteen

0:28:32.920 --> 0:28:36.399
<v Speaker 3>twenty nine, she is making a living selling leeches to

0:28:36.480 --> 0:28:39.880
<v Speaker 3>the Bristol Infirmary Hospital, which is a thing that you

0:28:40.000 --> 0:28:42.880
<v Speaker 3>need to do. Yeah, these hospitals need leeches. They gotta

0:28:42.920 --> 0:28:45.560
<v Speaker 3>get them for the blood in the humors. Someone has

0:28:45.600 --> 0:28:49.240
<v Speaker 3>to collect those leeches. And apparently she's making a respectable living,

0:28:50.120 --> 0:28:54.520
<v Speaker 3>but she is still embarrassed about her notoriety. Children would

0:28:54.560 --> 0:28:57.920
<v Speaker 3>run after her, calling caribou. It's kind of like when

0:28:58.000 --> 0:29:00.400
<v Speaker 3>a person who was on a sitcom then like works

0:29:00.440 --> 0:29:03.800
<v Speaker 3>at Trader Joe's. Yes, because she's just do She's just

0:29:03.880 --> 0:29:06.640
<v Speaker 3>the leech lady. She's just trying to have a respectable

0:29:06.720 --> 0:29:10.040
<v Speaker 3>job with her husband and child. But that kind of

0:29:10.120 --> 0:29:16.320
<v Speaker 3>embarrassment of this youthful summer is by all accounts, making

0:29:16.360 --> 0:29:20.920
<v Speaker 3>her very uncomfortable. But she lives until her seventies. She

0:29:21.080 --> 0:29:23.400
<v Speaker 3>dies around seventy two or seventy three years old and

0:29:23.680 --> 0:29:27.160
<v Speaker 3>Christmas Eve buried in Bristol and unmarked grave because they

0:29:27.200 --> 0:29:30.200
<v Speaker 3>were very poor. And then this is like the very

0:29:30.400 --> 0:29:33.560
<v Speaker 3>sad part about her story is her daughter takes up

0:29:33.600 --> 0:29:37.240
<v Speaker 3>the family leech business and lives alone with a bunch

0:29:37.280 --> 0:29:39.120
<v Speaker 3>of cats for the rest of her life until she

0:29:39.280 --> 0:29:41.120
<v Speaker 3>dies in a fire in nineteen hundred.

0:29:41.280 --> 0:29:43.240
<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, I mean.

0:29:43.360 --> 0:29:45.560
<v Speaker 2>Congrats on having a lot of cats. We love cats.

0:29:45.600 --> 0:29:47.920
<v Speaker 1>We love cats. That's very sad.

0:29:48.200 --> 0:29:52.000
<v Speaker 3>It just is a very strange, sad, anticlimactic ending again

0:29:52.080 --> 0:29:54.680
<v Speaker 3>because she lives for decades after where it's like she

0:29:54.840 --> 0:29:57.920
<v Speaker 3>really shined very bright this summer where she was in

0:29:58.040 --> 0:30:01.400
<v Speaker 3>the news and on everyone's lips and then tried to

0:30:02.160 --> 0:30:06.320
<v Speaker 3>capitalize on it in this show and knew in America

0:30:06.440 --> 0:30:09.440
<v Speaker 3>that wasn't that successful, came back and tried to live

0:30:09.440 --> 0:30:13.240
<v Speaker 3>a normal life, was sort of haunted by her reputation,

0:30:14.120 --> 0:30:15.480
<v Speaker 3>and then did the best she could.

0:30:16.240 --> 0:30:17.200
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it a little bit.

0:30:17.320 --> 0:30:22.719
<v Speaker 2>I mean I think that taking advantage of stereotypes aside,

0:30:22.880 --> 0:30:27.840
<v Speaker 2>I find her quote unquote crime like mostly harmless.

0:30:27.480 --> 0:30:29.000
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and like that kind of fun.

0:30:29.160 --> 0:30:32.800
<v Speaker 3>She's also not imitating a specific racial group. She's speaking nonsense.

0:30:33.000 --> 0:30:33.200
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

0:30:33.880 --> 0:30:36.360
<v Speaker 2>But what it a little bit reminds me of is

0:30:36.520 --> 0:30:41.800
<v Speaker 2>like there's a comedian an actor like lied about surviving

0:30:41.920 --> 0:30:45.880
<v Speaker 2>nine to eleven and like that is just all he's ever.

0:30:45.800 --> 0:30:49.880
<v Speaker 1>Going to be known for. Yeah, and like it's just done. Yeah,

0:30:50.000 --> 0:30:51.080
<v Speaker 1>like the nine to eleven guy.

0:30:51.200 --> 0:30:55.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, like that's it, and like whatever boost he got

0:30:55.800 --> 0:31:01.120
<v Speaker 2>from that is completely I hope he enjoyed, like whatever

0:31:01.200 --> 0:31:03.600
<v Speaker 2>auditions that anecdote got him.

0:31:03.760 --> 0:31:07.240
<v Speaker 1>But is over and again.

0:31:07.360 --> 0:31:10.720
<v Speaker 3>It's like, this is a woman who was possibly mentally ill,

0:31:11.240 --> 0:31:14.600
<v Speaker 3>I mean, suffered from mental issues after her rheumatism when

0:31:14.640 --> 0:31:18.640
<v Speaker 3>she was a child, who was impoverished for her entire life.

0:31:18.640 --> 0:31:21.440
<v Speaker 3>I'm not here to like cancel this poor woman who

0:31:21.480 --> 0:31:23.760
<v Speaker 3>was a beggar for most of her life. I think

0:31:23.960 --> 0:31:27.160
<v Speaker 3>the larger issue to examine is that she was like

0:31:27.240 --> 0:31:32.120
<v Speaker 3>a symptom of this nineteenth century British obsession with Eastern exoticism,

0:31:32.840 --> 0:31:36.840
<v Speaker 3>and they were so amused by what was so obviously

0:31:36.960 --> 0:31:40.080
<v Speaker 3>a fraud because they wanted to believe it. I read

0:31:40.080 --> 0:31:44.520
<v Speaker 3>a few scholarly articles about this and this Historian Matthew

0:31:44.640 --> 0:31:48.400
<v Speaker 3>Isaac Cohen wrote an article about British performances of Java

0:31:49.240 --> 0:31:52.320
<v Speaker 3>eighteen eleven to eighteen twenty two, and specifically he wrote

0:31:52.320 --> 0:31:55.680
<v Speaker 3>about those years because not to get too deep into history,

0:31:55.720 --> 0:31:58.560
<v Speaker 3>but I've heard of like the East Indies, Dutch East Indies,

0:31:59.280 --> 0:32:03.160
<v Speaker 3>the Dutch college those islands, and then England colonized those

0:32:03.200 --> 0:32:04.840
<v Speaker 3>islands and then they went back. So this was like

0:32:04.880 --> 0:32:08.600
<v Speaker 3>a period right after British colonization of the Indies. And

0:32:09.320 --> 0:32:12.200
<v Speaker 3>he wrote that her performance offered quote a ground for

0:32:12.360 --> 0:32:15.160
<v Speaker 3>imperial fantasy. I'm just going to quote what he says,

0:32:15.200 --> 0:32:18.800
<v Speaker 3>which is a theatricalized front to a British audience that

0:32:18.960 --> 0:32:21.600
<v Speaker 3>was keen to believe in the possibility of the other

0:32:22.120 --> 0:32:26.320
<v Speaker 3>coexisting in their midst a representative of a foreign culture

0:32:26.640 --> 0:32:29.840
<v Speaker 3>who was both totally unlike them and also not so

0:32:30.040 --> 0:32:35.600
<v Speaker 3>distinct as to cause offense. It's like the perfect version

0:32:35.800 --> 0:32:39.160
<v Speaker 3>of an quote unquote other, which is like, it's not

0:32:39.680 --> 0:32:43.480
<v Speaker 3>too many people, You're not gonna over You're still my immigration,

0:32:43.800 --> 0:32:47.720
<v Speaker 3>not immigration, it's just one quirky princess who happens to

0:32:47.760 --> 0:32:50.480
<v Speaker 3>be like a beautiful young woman doing fun things for

0:32:50.600 --> 0:32:51.240
<v Speaker 3>our amusement.

0:32:51.640 --> 0:32:51.840
<v Speaker 1>Sex.

0:32:51.920 --> 0:32:56.360
<v Speaker 2>They couldn't treat Megan Markle like that. Oh gosh, she

0:32:56.400 --> 0:32:57.600
<v Speaker 2>should have been quirkier.

0:32:57.360 --> 0:32:59.200
<v Speaker 1>You know they you know, they treat like that. As

0:32:59.280 --> 0:33:03.520
<v Speaker 1>Aria Baldwin realized this, oh my god, I would look

0:33:04.080 --> 0:33:07.120
<v Speaker 1>I mean Laria Baldwin episode when I.

0:33:07.160 --> 0:33:09.440
<v Speaker 3>Mean, yeah, let's not get too deep into this, but

0:33:09.560 --> 0:33:12.800
<v Speaker 3>Alaria is doing a Princess Caribou. She realizes you get

0:33:12.880 --> 0:33:14.320
<v Speaker 3>more attention somewhere.

0:33:14.040 --> 0:33:17.120
<v Speaker 2>Between Ilaria Baldwin and like Rachel Dole was all yeah,

0:33:17.880 --> 0:33:20.280
<v Speaker 2>because it's like clearly she's not doing it.

0:33:20.360 --> 0:33:21.960
<v Speaker 1>To fit in with a real group of people. She's

0:33:22.040 --> 0:33:23.360
<v Speaker 1>just doing it for attention, and.

0:33:23.480 --> 0:33:26.840
<v Speaker 3>She's fully just Again, this is she's not pretending to

0:33:26.920 --> 0:33:29.200
<v Speaker 3>be a specific culture. She's saying she's from a made

0:33:29.280 --> 0:33:31.280
<v Speaker 3>up place and speaking a gibberish language.

0:33:31.360 --> 0:33:33.120
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, she is definitely.

0:33:32.960 --> 0:33:40.200
<v Speaker 3>Using exoticized trappings of Romani people and East Asian people,

0:33:40.280 --> 0:33:44.400
<v Speaker 3>but she's not doing she's specifically imitating a group that

0:33:44.560 --> 0:33:45.480
<v Speaker 3>no one else is a part of.

0:33:45.960 --> 0:33:48.760
<v Speaker 2>Really, what this more so reminds me of is like

0:33:49.480 --> 0:33:53.240
<v Speaker 2>singers who pretend to be really poor growing up, or

0:33:53.360 --> 0:33:56.719
<v Speaker 2>like you know what I mean, or like how I mean.

0:33:56.760 --> 0:33:59.520
<v Speaker 2>We talk all the time about how artists always have

0:33:59.600 --> 0:34:04.160
<v Speaker 2>to imbell their backstories and present themselves as like really

0:34:04.560 --> 0:34:09.640
<v Speaker 2>unusual and coming from some unexpected place when it's like, no,

0:34:09.840 --> 0:34:11.080
<v Speaker 2>you just like went to Idlewild.

0:34:11.320 --> 0:34:13.440
<v Speaker 1>Yeah you don't. No one wants to be an artist

0:34:13.520 --> 0:34:15.120
<v Speaker 1>who grew up in Brentwood.

0:34:15.719 --> 0:34:18.640
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but it's like you could get a bunch of

0:34:18.680 --> 0:34:21.239
<v Speaker 2>face tattoos and now you're interesting and different and we

0:34:21.360 --> 0:34:22.439
<v Speaker 2>want to listen to you rap.

0:34:22.680 --> 0:34:25.080
<v Speaker 3>I mean, that's the interesting thing is like she knew

0:34:25.239 --> 0:34:28.719
<v Speaker 3>as a beggar that she would get more attention by

0:34:28.840 --> 0:34:32.800
<v Speaker 3>being distinct and different, and she was completely correct. She

0:34:33.520 --> 0:34:35.640
<v Speaker 3>became so famous in this one summer that we are

0:34:35.719 --> 0:34:38.840
<v Speaker 3>still talking about her. Yeah, and I think that the

0:34:38.920 --> 0:34:40.759
<v Speaker 3>person who should like be in trouble, the bad guy

0:34:40.840 --> 0:34:44.120
<v Speaker 3>of this episode isn't necessarily her. It's the system that

0:34:44.560 --> 0:34:47.719
<v Speaker 3>did that. What I kind of find interesting is there's

0:34:47.760 --> 0:34:50.360
<v Speaker 3>been like a slate of projects where she's sort of

0:34:50.480 --> 0:34:54.920
<v Speaker 3>just the ngenu, not even like an unlikable female character.

0:34:55.080 --> 0:34:57.879
<v Speaker 3>Like there's a nineteen ninety four movie starring.

0:34:57.640 --> 0:35:01.000
<v Speaker 2>Phoebe Kates that is such good casting.

0:35:01.520 --> 0:35:05.520
<v Speaker 1>Well here's not also really interesting thing. Kates is half

0:35:05.680 --> 0:35:06.600
<v Speaker 1>Chinese Filipino.

0:35:07.040 --> 0:35:09.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, because she's a little bit ethnically ambiguous. Yeah, but

0:35:10.080 --> 0:35:12.480
<v Speaker 2>also just like a dropped dead hotti.

0:35:12.400 --> 0:35:15.200
<v Speaker 3>Dropped dead hottie. No one talked about the fact that

0:35:15.320 --> 0:35:18.399
<v Speaker 3>she was, you know, East Asian when they were making

0:35:18.440 --> 0:35:18.759
<v Speaker 3>that movie.

0:35:18.800 --> 0:35:19.600
<v Speaker 1>That was not relevant.

0:35:19.640 --> 0:35:21.800
<v Speaker 2>She was just read she was in a ninety Just

0:35:21.840 --> 0:35:24.440
<v Speaker 2>say she reads ethnically ambiguous. I'm not saying that Phoebe

0:35:24.560 --> 0:35:27.239
<v Speaker 2>Kate's herself is just like an ambiguous blob in the world.

0:35:27.360 --> 0:35:30.520
<v Speaker 3>No, But I think what's interesting is obviously she's like

0:35:30.600 --> 0:35:33.120
<v Speaker 3>a real person nineties, Phoebe Kates was just white.

0:35:33.480 --> 0:35:36.319
<v Speaker 1>Yes, that's just like you see her, You're like white lady. Yeah.

0:35:36.560 --> 0:35:38.400
<v Speaker 3>But what I do find interesting is the fact that

0:35:38.480 --> 0:35:42.040
<v Speaker 3>she actually is closer to what quote unquote Caribou was

0:35:42.080 --> 0:35:44.880
<v Speaker 3>pretending to be. This is, by all accounts, not a

0:35:45.000 --> 0:35:46.920
<v Speaker 3>very good movie. You can watch a trailer.

0:35:47.000 --> 0:35:48.680
<v Speaker 1>I watched a trailer for it on YouTube.

0:35:49.160 --> 0:35:53.279
<v Speaker 3>Apparently Laura Bonanti, not ethnically ambiguous, to the best of

0:35:53.360 --> 0:35:56.120
<v Speaker 3>my knowledge, hosted a workshop for a musical version in

0:35:56.160 --> 0:35:59.080
<v Speaker 3>two thousand and four, and then in twenty sixteen there

0:35:59.200 --> 0:36:02.200
<v Speaker 3>was an off West It's then musical about her amazing,

0:36:02.840 --> 0:36:06.320
<v Speaker 3>which I kind of do feel like, maybe.

0:36:06.600 --> 0:36:08.719
<v Speaker 2>Maybe the Brits need to reckon with this a little bit.

0:36:08.880 --> 0:36:11.239
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I'm like the nineteen ninety four version. I read

0:36:11.280 --> 0:36:13.400
<v Speaker 3>the Wikipedia and I watched the trailer. I did not

0:36:13.520 --> 0:36:16.680
<v Speaker 3>watch the movie because my time is very limited. But

0:36:16.840 --> 0:36:19.759
<v Speaker 3>it's very much sort of like a fairy tale version

0:36:19.840 --> 0:36:22.799
<v Speaker 3>of this story where there's kind of no bad guys. Yeah,

0:36:22.920 --> 0:36:27.160
<v Speaker 3>and it's absolutely not reckoning with like racial othering. Yeah,

0:36:27.280 --> 0:36:29.759
<v Speaker 3>that's just not what that movie is about. But I

0:36:29.880 --> 0:36:31.960
<v Speaker 3>do think there is if you are going to make

0:36:32.000 --> 0:36:36.160
<v Speaker 3>a piece of art about Princess Caribou. That does seem

0:36:36.239 --> 0:36:38.400
<v Speaker 3>to be the thing that you need to touch on,

0:36:38.920 --> 0:36:42.239
<v Speaker 3>because otherwise there's just not a lot of there. There's yea,

0:36:42.640 --> 0:36:45.320
<v Speaker 3>it is just quirky that a random girl put on

0:36:45.400 --> 0:36:48.719
<v Speaker 3>a turban and started acting insane and an entire town

0:36:48.840 --> 0:36:51.560
<v Speaker 3>fell in love with her and she became an international

0:36:51.680 --> 0:36:55.759
<v Speaker 3>news story. Yeah, that's so funny because she was a princess. Yeah,

0:36:56.239 --> 0:36:58.040
<v Speaker 3>I mean you also wonder how long did she think

0:36:58.120 --> 0:36:59.160
<v Speaker 3>she was going to pull this off?

0:36:59.640 --> 0:37:03.000
<v Speaker 2>Also, like what was the like, girl, you gotta stash

0:37:03.040 --> 0:37:04.680
<v Speaker 2>away your money, Like, well, you know what, you got

0:37:04.760 --> 0:37:05.440
<v Speaker 2>to have an exit plan.

0:37:05.560 --> 0:37:07.480
<v Speaker 3>You know what the exit plan should have been if

0:37:07.520 --> 0:37:09.840
<v Speaker 3>I were get married. You have to you have to

0:37:09.960 --> 0:37:11.000
<v Speaker 3>phase out the accent.

0:37:12.320 --> 0:37:16.000
<v Speaker 1>Have you seen that ross on Friends? Many times? If

0:37:16.040 --> 0:37:18.000
<v Speaker 1>you start with an accent, you have to phase it out.

0:37:18.000 --> 0:37:21.160
<v Speaker 3>I mean, she quote unquote learns English, she learns English,

0:37:21.440 --> 0:37:24.600
<v Speaker 3>stops talking in an accent. And then in like a year,

0:37:25.719 --> 0:37:27.920
<v Speaker 3>you just people forget that you are the missing princess

0:37:27.920 --> 0:37:30.480
<v Speaker 3>and you're like, oh, yes, my ancestry is quite exotic.

0:37:30.560 --> 0:37:32.360
<v Speaker 1>And then you marry a rich guy. Yeah, marry a

0:37:32.440 --> 0:37:35.040
<v Speaker 1>rich guy that would have I guess been my plan

0:37:35.120 --> 0:37:37.759
<v Speaker 1>if I had been forced into a Cariboo situation. But

0:37:37.880 --> 0:37:38.880
<v Speaker 1>she really it was.

0:37:39.440 --> 0:37:42.280
<v Speaker 3>This con did not last long. I mean it lasted

0:37:43.360 --> 0:37:46.840
<v Speaker 3>about two months. Special Summer, one special summer, one amazing

0:37:47.320 --> 0:37:48.160
<v Speaker 3>wild summer.

0:37:48.440 --> 0:37:50.360
<v Speaker 1>That is the story of Princess Cariboo.

0:37:50.480 --> 0:37:55.520
<v Speaker 3>A story about how we love sexy dumb ladies or

0:37:55.640 --> 0:37:59.640
<v Speaker 3>foreignlyan or smart smart like possibly smart ladies acting very

0:37:59.719 --> 0:38:00.840
<v Speaker 3>dumb and childlike.

0:38:01.120 --> 0:38:03.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Lizzie Logan, where can the good people find you?

0:38:04.600 --> 0:38:08.279
<v Speaker 2>You can talk to us at Hooks the Podcast on Instagram.

0:38:08.680 --> 0:38:11.080
<v Speaker 1>We love chatting. We love chatting.

0:38:11.160 --> 0:38:13.879
<v Speaker 2>Follow us, Yeah, go ahead, do it doesn't hurt.

0:38:15.120 --> 0:38:18.600
<v Speaker 1>And Dana, what about you? Hooks Thepodcast at gmail dot com.

0:38:18.760 --> 0:38:21.200
<v Speaker 3>I will get to your emails sometimes a little slowly,

0:38:21.280 --> 0:38:24.200
<v Speaker 3>but I do read all the emails. And Dana Schwartz

0:38:24.320 --> 0:38:26.799
<v Speaker 3>on Instagram and TikTok with three z's, and I will

0:38:26.800 --> 0:38:28.439
<v Speaker 3>also beg you. If you're a listener for the show,

0:38:28.840 --> 0:38:31.759
<v Speaker 3>please please pre order a copy of the book The R.

0:38:31.840 --> 0:38:34.880
<v Speaker 3>Kane Arts. Pre orders are the most important thing in

0:38:34.920 --> 0:38:37.279
<v Speaker 3>the book world. They tell a publisher that this book

0:38:37.440 --> 0:38:41.200
<v Speaker 3>is worth caring about and putting in bookstores. So if

0:38:41.239 --> 0:38:44.359
<v Speaker 3>you like anything I'm doing please pre order that book.

0:38:44.760 --> 0:38:45.799
<v Speaker 3>This podcast is free.

0:38:46.320 --> 0:38:48.360
<v Speaker 1>So it is and if you like it, share it

0:38:48.440 --> 0:38:51.080
<v Speaker 1>with a friends, share it with a friend, send it

0:38:51.200 --> 0:38:52.760
<v Speaker 1>to someone. Thanks for listening.

0:38:52.960 --> 0:39:07.719
<v Speaker 2>Please hoax responsibly Bye. Poax is a production of iHeart Podcasts.

0:39:08.120 --> 0:39:11.280
<v Speaker 2>Our hosts are Danas Schwortz and Lizzie Logan. Our executive

0:39:11.320 --> 0:39:14.920
<v Speaker 2>producers are Matt Frederick and Trevor Young, with supervising producer

0:39:15.080 --> 0:39:18.800
<v Speaker 2>Rima L. Kali and producers Nomes Griffin and Jesse Funk.

0:39:19.320 --> 0:39:22.600
<v Speaker 2>Our theme music was composed by Laine Montgomery. For more

0:39:22.680 --> 0:39:26.520
<v Speaker 2>podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or

0:39:26.560 --> 0:39:27.920
<v Speaker 2>wherever you get your podcasts.

0:39:28.360 --> 0:39:29.160
<v Speaker 1>Thanks for listening.