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Speaker 1: Previously on Queen of the Cohn She infiltrated my life.

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Speaker 1: She became my best friend. In her exact words, I

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Speaker 1: was the sister that she never had.

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Speaker 2: Kristin Williams, the wife of NFL running back Ricky Williams,

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Speaker 2: starts unraveling financial manager Peggy Fulford's massive, multi million dollar fraud.

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Speaker 1: We realized that we're paying for Peggy's lavish lifestyle, the

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Speaker 1: Bentley Rolls, Royce, the range Rovers, all of her homes.

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Speaker 2: The only problem is Kristin's husband, Ricky Williams, refuses to

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Speaker 2: believe it. Peggy's got him snowed with her Oscar worthy performances.

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Speaker 3: She's like ball of crying. She's like, I hope you

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Speaker 3: don't believe this, Like I would never do this to Ricky,

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Speaker 3: And she's like staying all this up, and I'm just like,

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Speaker 3: I don't believe you.

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Speaker 2: And what did Ricky get from her?

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Speaker 3: Like he got from her that she put his money

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Speaker 3: in stocks and like his money is spread out, So

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Speaker 3: in his mind he's thinking, Okay, let's give her time.

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Speaker 2: And Ricky gives Peggy plenty of time, but he never

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Speaker 2: sees any of his money ever again. And it's the

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Speaker 2: beginning of the end of Peggy Fulford's many scams. But

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Speaker 2: the crazy, unbelievable drama is just getting started. I shouted

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Speaker 2: out loud when I saw that. I literally said, and

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Speaker 2: I said, you fucking way, is what I said. I'm

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Speaker 2: Jonathan Walton and this is Queen of the con The

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Speaker 2: Athlete Whisperer Episode five, deceit from the very beginning.

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Speaker 3: Once it all happened with the Irs, because Kristen I

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Speaker 3: was one of the first people that she called once

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Speaker 3: the IRS called them and said how much they owe

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Speaker 3: and blah blah blah.

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Speaker 2: That's Chantelle Cohen again, Ricky William's lifelong friend. Peggy had

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Speaker 2: successfully driven a wedge between Ricky's wife Kristin and Chantelle,

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Speaker 2: but now both of them are finally talking and they

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Speaker 2: have a lot to say.

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Speaker 3: We sat on the phone for hours of just thinking

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Speaker 3: of all these stories and things she said to us,

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Speaker 3: and just all the way down to how she played

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Speaker 3: Kristin and I against each other to where I didn't

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Speaker 3: think Kristin liked me, she didn't think that I liked her,

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Speaker 3: to where we wouldn't talk.

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Speaker 2: So she kept you guys separate.

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Speaker 3: Separate so she could do whatever she needed to do

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Speaker 3: over in that house, and I was over here because

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Speaker 3: I said to Kristin months into them hiring Peggy, and

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Speaker 3: I said, make sure that she gives you like an

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Speaker 3: outomized thing of what she's paying monthly for you guys,

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Speaker 3: so you know exactly where your money's going. Maybe it's

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Speaker 3: something that she puts in the refrigerator. She just stops

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Speaker 3: by and drops it off at you, guys. You should

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Speaker 3: know where your money's going, like, even though she's given

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Speaker 3: you guys an allowance, like, you should know where your

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Speaker 3: money's going. I don't know if Kristin mentioned it to Peggy.

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Speaker 2: I'm guessing she did, and that's one of the reasons

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Speaker 2: Peggy made sure Kristin and Chantelle never spoke again. But

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Speaker 2: now Peggy's lies are laid there, out in the open

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Speaker 2: for everyone to see.

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Speaker 3: Because even with Dennis Rodman, he didn't want to come

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Speaker 3: out and say anything. I know, his person was one

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Speaker 3: of my good friends. So we talked about it, and

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Speaker 3: I was like, no, you have to tell Dennis like

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Speaker 3: he's on a trip with her son.

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Speaker 2: That's right, Remember, Elkin, my responsibilities were to like completely

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Speaker 2: run Dennis. Peggy convinced Dennis Rodman that Elkin was her brother,

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Speaker 2: when in reality he's her son. And at this point

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Speaker 2: in twenty thirteen, Elkin is with Dennis Rodman in North

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Speaker 2: Korea while Chantelle and Kristen are realizing Peggy is a

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Speaker 2: con artist, and Chantelle is urging Dennis's assistant over the

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Speaker 2: phone to tell Dennis Rodman asap, like.

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Speaker 3: You have to let him know what's going on with us,

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Speaker 3: and so that person had to talk with Dennis, and

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Speaker 3: Dennis is like, I don't want to deal with it.

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Speaker 3: Then we have to get lawyers and blah blah blah.

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Speaker 3: But then it was like the more stuff started coming out,

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Speaker 3: then there's no way for you to not deal with it,

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Speaker 3: you know, at the end of the day. So he

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Speaker 3: had to deal with it, and it all came.

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Speaker 2: Out, and by this point, Ricky Williams finally sees the

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Speaker 2: truth about Peggy, and on December sixteenth, twenty thirteen, six

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Speaker 2: years after hiring Peggy to manage their finances, he and

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Speaker 2: his wife Kristen file a lawsuit in Houston against Peggy,

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Speaker 2: accusing her of fraud.

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Speaker 4: Plaintiffs Ricky and Kristin Williams, collectively plaintiffs filed this verified

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Speaker 4: complaint and application for temporary restraining order and pliminary injunction.

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Speaker 2: My buddy, Evan Goldstein, and I are examining all the

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Speaker 2: legal filings in that lawsuit. It took me weeks to

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Speaker 2: dig up all these court records and then figure out

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Speaker 2: who all the court reporters were and make formal requests

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Speaker 2: for transcripts and audio recordings. But my god, these filings

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Speaker 2: tell one hell of a story.

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Speaker 4: In two thousand and seven, mister Williams engaged Miss Wilford

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Speaker 4: and King Management, collectively defendants, to manage all of his

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Speaker 4: finances and investments.

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Speaker 2: So this is two years before Dennis Rodman signs on.

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Speaker 2: Dennis Rodman signs on hires Peggy in two thousand and nine.

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Speaker 2: Ricky Williams is two years earlier, in two thousand and seven.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, and she kind of met Dennis Robin because Ricky

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Speaker 4: Williams was opening a restaurant right that was kind of

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Speaker 4: her way in with rod.

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Speaker 2: One led to the other. It's a chess game for her.

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Speaker 2: And while we're talking about Ricky Williams restaurant, the one

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Speaker 2: on South Beach called Proof, it actually ended up closing

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Speaker 2: and according to Ricky's business partner, A credit card machine

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Speaker 2: in that restaurant was secretly swapped out for another credit

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Speaker 2: card machine that allegedly fed directly into a bank account

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Speaker 2: controlled by Peggy.

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Speaker 3: And we had to shut down Proof because allegedly she

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Speaker 3: was still in money from Proof.

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Speaker 2: And Chantel Cohen watched it all happen without realizing what

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Speaker 2: she was actually witnessing until years later.

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Speaker 1: I was like.

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Speaker 3: Cleaning my house a few years ago and I found

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Speaker 3: postcards that she would send me from like China, Paris.

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Speaker 3: Like I'm like, was this on Dennis's dime, Ricky's dime?

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Speaker 2: Like ooh?

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Speaker 3: Was treated in these trips? And I've seen multiple cars,

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Speaker 3: big houses, just like all this stuff. And I'm just like,

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Speaker 3: when you came into this, how much money did you

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Speaker 3: actually have? Like how much was actually your money before

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Speaker 3: you started doing X, Y and Z with all these people.

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Speaker 2: I don't think any of it was her money ever.

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Speaker 2: As for Ricky Williams lawsuit.

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Speaker 4: Miss Fulford maybe served at two eight four to one

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Speaker 4: Northeast thirty fifth Court, Fort Lauderdale, Florida.

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Speaker 2: Now that's a hell of a house she's living in

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Speaker 2: in Fort laud Is it like a mansion, Yes, it's

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Speaker 2: a mansion on the on the Intracoastal. Oh yeah, waterfront.

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Speaker 2: Those are super nice. It's got BMW's and Bentley's in

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Speaker 2: the driveway. She is a baller. I remember every sense

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Speaker 2: of the word.

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Speaker 4: When I was a kid, I went down the Inner

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Speaker 4: Coastal Waterway and like on a tour and they're like, oh,

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Speaker 4: there's Madonna's house.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there's it.

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Speaker 4: Like it's just very very well to do, very big

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Speaker 4: giant houses, and they have they all have their kind

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Speaker 4: of like docks in the back with their little dinghies

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Speaker 4: and like boats, and it's it's uppercrust and it's.

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Speaker 2: A million dollar lifestyle that she's using Ricky Williams money

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Speaker 2: to furnish.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, that's a hell of an address.

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Speaker 2: And I'm posting pictures of that address, Peggy's three point

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Speaker 2: six million dollar Fort Lauderdale mansion inside and outside, front

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Speaker 2: and back at Queen of the Con on Instagram so

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Speaker 2: you can see for yourself one of the opulent smoke

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Speaker 2: screens Peggy used to trick victims into thinking she was

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Speaker 2: a multi millionaire investing whiz.

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Speaker 4: Between two thousand and seven and twenty twelve, mister Williams

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Speaker 4: earn income of approximately eleven million dollars.

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Speaker 2: So it's like two million plus a year. That's the

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Speaker 2: money he's making, and that's the money she has access to.

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Speaker 4: Onor about August fifteenth, two thousand and eight, miss Fulford

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Speaker 4: and mister Williams established a joint checking count at SunTrust

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Speaker 4: Bank in Orlando, Florida, without the knowledge or permission of plaintiffs.

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Speaker 4: Miss Fulford received and used a debit card for the

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Speaker 4: joint account. Plaintiffs were never provided a debit card for

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Speaker 4: the joint account. So this is like her funny money fund.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's she gets a debit card for their account

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Speaker 2: and doesn't give them a debit card.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, it's just like straight to the Fendi bags and stuff.

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Speaker 4: After opening the joint account, miss Fulford is ablished at

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Speaker 4: least six other accounts at sun Trust Bank under several

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Speaker 4: different names, including King Management. So she's just like moving

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Speaker 4: this around.

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Speaker 2: In the end, though, court record show Peggy actually opened

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Speaker 2: eighty five different bank accounts that she used to steal

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Speaker 2: from her clients, including Ricky Williams.

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Speaker 4: Between opening the joint account in August twenty twelve, approximately

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Speaker 4: six million dollars was transferred via account transfers, wire transfers,

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Speaker 4: check card debits, written checks, or cash withdrawals out of

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Speaker 4: the joint account by miss Fulford without plaintiffs authorization or knowledge.

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Speaker 4: Six million dollars she's moving around like that seems like

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Speaker 4: such an oversight.

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Speaker 2: How do they not miss that like six million dollars? Well,

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Speaker 2: here's why. Because she pitched them as this financial guru

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Speaker 2: who's going to put them on a strict budget, invest

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Speaker 2: the access of their money, and create what she kept

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Speaker 2: calling generational wealth for their kids. So they believe her.

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Speaker 4: They try to say, this money is not liquid anyway

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Speaker 4: she's in. It's not like they could just pull it

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Speaker 4: out of the stock market or whatever money market, whatever

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Speaker 4: she says she's doing.

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Speaker 2: They're not missing it because they think she's investing in.

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Speaker 4: She's building wealth with it. Right, It's just leave it there,

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Speaker 4: don't touch it. This is for your kids and your kids' kids.

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Speaker 2: Let it ride. Yep. But the craziest part of this

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Speaker 2: whole lawsuit is after the break, we'll be right back.

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Speaker 2: Welcome back to Queen of the con. My buddy Evan

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Speaker 2: and I are going through the Ricky and Kristen Williams

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Speaker 2: lawsuit accusing Peggy of fraud.

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Speaker 4: Paige by Page Honor about September twenty thirteen, Miss Fulford

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Speaker 4: ceased all communications with Miss Williams. So it's kind of

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Speaker 4: like years go by, what's going on with our money?

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Speaker 4: And then basically by twenty thirteen she's like, Okay.

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Speaker 2: Bye, I gotta go. She ghosted them, She totally ghost it.

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Speaker 2: She ghosted them, and she ghosted Dennis Rodmins people, and

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Speaker 2: she ghosted Rashad mccent's people. This is her thing. When

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Speaker 2: she gets found out, she ghosts and she's on to

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Speaker 2: the next. But here's what's different. Travis Best kept it quiet.

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Speaker 2: Rashad mccent kept it quiet. Ricky Williams's wife is pissed.

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Speaker 4: One question is like, would she have gotten away with

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Speaker 4: this had Ricky Williams wife not have been pressing her,

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Speaker 4: you know, if it was just Ricky Williams.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, she just scammed another day for maybe she would

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Speaker 2: have got away with it. It was the wife. It

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Speaker 2: was the wife. Yeah. By all accounts, she was the

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Speaker 2: catalyst to take her down. Evan continues reading from the lawsuit.

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Speaker 4: Mister williams twenty ten personal income tax return was prepared

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Speaker 4: by Miss Fulford honor about August twenty twelve. The internal

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Speaker 4: Revenue Service audited mister Williams twenty ten personal tax record

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Speaker 4: and contacted mister Williams for additional information.

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Speaker 2: She's getting him audited. And it's similar to the way

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Speaker 2: Travis Best found out he got conned. He got a

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Speaker 2: letter from the IRS that he thought Peggy was paying

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Speaker 2: his taxes. Turns out she wasn't. I mean, it's identical

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Speaker 2: if you recall from season two what I don't care

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Speaker 2: for this show.

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Speaker 4: I don't really listen to it.

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Speaker 2: What Lizzie Mulder was doing to scam her victim. She

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Speaker 2: claimed to be paying their taxes, and she was just

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Speaker 2: depositing all those checks that were earmark for taxes into

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Speaker 2: her own account for years, banking that tax no one

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Speaker 2: knew for years.

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Speaker 4: The coup de gras was the checking account with the

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Speaker 4: name income tax Payments.

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Speaker 2: She can just go to Bank of America and open

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Speaker 2: up an account called income tax payments. Yeah, and they don't.

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Speaker 2: That doesn't raise a red flag for them. Yeah, No,

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Speaker 2: that's just bullshit. But this is what puzzles me about

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Speaker 2: con artists. I don't know the answer. I just see

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Speaker 2: a trend in all these cases. How do they not

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Speaker 2: know or how do they not care? They're going to

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Speaker 2: get caught one day, at some point the jig is up.

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Speaker 4: Maybe it's just, you know, they get away with it.

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Speaker 4: Year one, they're probably nervous. Year two, maybe a little

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Speaker 4: less nervous. Year after year, getting this money, nothing happening

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Speaker 4: to them, they just start to lose their fear. Maybe

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Speaker 4: they just become more emboldened because they low themselves into

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Speaker 4: this kind of false sense of security where it's like, oh,

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Speaker 4: I didn't get caught the last ten years or whatever

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Speaker 4: six years.

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Speaker 2: And they feel confident delivery get caught. Maybe remember con

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Speaker 2: artist is short for confidence artist, because they not only

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Speaker 2: gain your confidence to scam you, but they're also inordinately

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Speaker 2: confident they'll get away with whatever scam they're pulling anyway.

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Speaker 2: On January tenth, twenty fourteen, things take a crazy, freaking turn,

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Speaker 2: a chain of whiplash inducing events on fold that no

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Speaker 2: one sees coming first. Nearly one month after Ricky Williams

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Speaker 2: and his wife Kristen file a lawsuit against Peggy alleging fraud,

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Speaker 2: they end up dropping it out of the blue, and

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Speaker 2: Peggy breathes a huge sigh of relief because she appears

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Speaker 2: to be getting away with what she's done. Wow, Ricky

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Speaker 2: Williams is spending I would guess hundreds of thousands of

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Speaker 2: dollars on this lawyer to pursue this case, not just

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Speaker 2: filing it in Texas, but then refiling it in Florida.

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Speaker 2: And maybe that's one of the reasons he ultimately dismissed

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Speaker 2: is because it's like, I don't have any more money

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Speaker 2: to keep trying to get blood from a stone. Nothing.

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Speaker 2: Anyone could sue anyone for anything, So it's not really

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Speaker 2: a big deal when you file a civil lawsuit, but

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Speaker 2: it made the local paper in Houston, the Houston Chronicle.

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Speaker 2: An FBI agent in Houston who is a sports fan

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Speaker 2: is reading about this Ricky Williams lawsuit and it piques

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Speaker 2: his interest, so almost he goes rogue because this is

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Speaker 2: not an investigation that was officially assigned to him. He

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Speaker 2: just starts looking into the case and eventually he's convinced

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Speaker 2: that Peggy's a major con woman who needs to go down.

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Speaker 2: So this FBI agent, let's call him Agent Karma, actually

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Speaker 2: gets the Department of Justice on board, and before long,

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Speaker 2: Peggy Fulford is the subject of a federal investigation, and

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Speaker 2: one by one, every victim and every witness to Peggy's

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Speaker 2: many scams, gets interviewed on record by the FBI, including

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Speaker 2: Chantel Cohen.

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Speaker 3: The crazy thing about the FBI is that when they

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Speaker 3: first came about the case, they did not want to

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Speaker 3: arrest her with all the information me and Kristen gave them.

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Speaker 3: Did not want to arrest her because they wanted to

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Speaker 3: build a case against her. They watched her for a

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Speaker 3: year and a half. The FBI gets involved, they already

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Speaker 3: have so much evidence against you, Like this is not

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Speaker 3: something they make up.

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Speaker 4: They've been following you and.

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Speaker 3: They have so much stuff. And so when they called

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Speaker 3: me and said like the thing that they had, I

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Speaker 3: was like on the floor, mouth wide open, like wait

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Speaker 3: what I missed all that too? So just what I know?

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Speaker 3: And then we have all that like that that's crazy

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Speaker 3: to me.

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Speaker 2: What the FBI uncovers is that from more than a decade,

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Speaker 2: Peggy Fulford has been impersonating a financial manager and scamming

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Speaker 2: millions and millions of dollars from a bunch of different athletes.

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Speaker 4: Fulford falsely told victims that she graduated from Harvard Law

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Speaker 4: School and Harvard Business School.

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Speaker 2: My buddy Evan Goldstein, again reading filings from the Federal

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Speaker 2: case against Peggy Fulford.

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Speaker 4: And at various times that she had one made millions

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Speaker 4: on Wall Street, two made millions by buying and selling hospitals,

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Speaker 4: or three made millions on real estate in the Bahamas.

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Speaker 2: Stories from far away hard to prove. That's a red flag.

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Speaker 2: You're in the midst of a con.

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Speaker 4: Right and who has the patience to look up someone

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Speaker 4: else's life?

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Speaker 2: No? One. You're going to prove she didn't buy and

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Speaker 2: sell a hospital. Yeah, how are you going to do that? Yeah?

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Speaker 2: When you meet someone new, when they start telling you

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Speaker 2: stories from far away places, yeah, be suspicious. On December thirteenth,

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Speaker 2: twenty sixteen, three whole years after Ricky Williams files a

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Speaker 2: civil lawsuit against Peggy for fraud and then drops it,

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Speaker 2: the Department of Justice actually indicts her and issues this

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Speaker 2: press release.

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Speaker 4: Peggy Ann Fulford, fifty eight, formerly of Houston and now

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Speaker 4: residing in New Orleans, is charged with wire fraud, mail fraud,

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Speaker 4: interstate transportation of stolen property, and money laundering. A federal

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Speaker 4: grand jury in Houston returned the eight count indictment December thirteenth,

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Speaker 4: twenty sixteen, which was unsealed upon her arrest.

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Speaker 2: Today, what I've learned interviewing federal prosecutors in the past,

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Speaker 2: is they're charging her with these eight counts. They could

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Speaker 2: have charged her with one hundred other counts. But at

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Speaker 2: some point it's overkill because if she's convicted on all

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Speaker 2: eight counts, she's going to jail forever. Oh right, Each

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Speaker 2: count carries five to ten years for this. You know,

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Speaker 2: if you add them all up and she's convicted of

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Speaker 2: all of them, it's enough to put her in jail forever.

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Speaker 4: But if they want her in jail longer, why wouldn't

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Speaker 4: they just do more counts, because then you could be

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Speaker 4: like guilty of more accunts. Like let's say they don't

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Speaker 4: find her guilty of all the eight counts. Maybe they

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Speaker 4: find she's guilty of two of these counts or whatever,

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Speaker 4: and it's just less time she has to do.

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Speaker 2: Well, here's what I've learned, and this might shock you.

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Speaker 2: They don't want her in jail at all. By that,

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Speaker 2: I mean, based on my experience dealing with the Department

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Speaker 2: of Justice and with various district attorneys and state attorneys'

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Speaker 2: offices across the country, the most important thing to any prosecutor,

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Speaker 2: especially at the federal level, is securing a conviction period.

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Speaker 2: That's a win for them, and we all want to win, right,

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Speaker 2: especially federal prosecutors. And keep in mind, all of Peggy's

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Speaker 2: scams are classified as white collar crime, and the vast

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Speaker 2: majority of white collar criminals never see a day behind bars.

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Speaker 2: Prosecutors know that, so they don't care about jail time

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Speaker 2: or no jail time per se. They just want a conviction,

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Speaker 2: ideally from a guilty plea, because that can't be appealed,

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Speaker 2: whereas a conviction a trial can be. They want her

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Speaker 2: to plead guilty. They don't want a trial. Prosecutors don't

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Speaker 2: want to prosecute in a trial because a trial a

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Speaker 2: is expensive. A trial, a federal trial can cost millions

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Speaker 2: and millions of dollars. You got to impanel a jury

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Speaker 2: and a backup jury. You might have to sequester them

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Speaker 2: in a hotel three meals a day. It could go

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Speaker 2: on for weeks or months. Add to that, what the

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Speaker 2: judge is being paid to preside over a trial every

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Speaker 2: day for months, what the US attorneys are being paid,

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Speaker 2: and what all the expert witnesses and forensic accountants are

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Speaker 2: being paid, not to mention the dozens of federal court

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Speaker 2: house employees like the bailiffs and the court reporters.

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Speaker 4: It's a lot of money.

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Speaker 2: It's uncertain. You have one juror who doesn't say guilty.

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Speaker 2: It's a hung jury, it's a mistrial. You got to

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Speaker 2: do it again. There is such a level of difficulty

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Speaker 2: and uncertainty with a trial. Nobody wants a trial. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: so how they're writing this indictment with just a sliver

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Speaker 2: of these crimes. They want to frighten her. They want

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Speaker 2: to say, look, we got your number, lady, plead guilty.

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Speaker 2: If you're convicted on eight of these charges, you're going

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Speaker 2: to jail for good. So plead. Take a plea. Take

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Speaker 2: a plea, Take a plea. That's the parenthetical in this

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Speaker 2: whole indictment. Take a plea. They want her to take

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Speaker 2: a plee. Not just her, they want every criminal to

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Speaker 2: take a plea because a trial is a huge time

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Speaker 2: suck and money suck, and they could get away. They

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Speaker 2: could be found not guilty totally. So that's why from

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Speaker 2: counts five to eight, these are tiny slivers of time

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Speaker 2: and money. We're talking millions and millions of dollars. She

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Speaker 2: still ultimately, but they're not accounting for all of that. Here,

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Speaker 2: give me like a Cliff's notes, and you won't believe

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Speaker 2: where Peggy's living when federal agents go searching for her

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Speaker 2: right after this break. Welcome back to Queen of the Cohn.

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Speaker 2: At this point in twenty sixteen, all the athletes Peggy

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Speaker 2: was managing the finances for have cut ties with her,

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Speaker 2: and she's hit hard times. Gone is her Fort Lauderdale

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Speaker 2: mansion and luxury cars. She's short on cash now and

380
00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:39,040
Speaker 2: living in an old apartment building in New Orleans, dealing

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Speaker 2: with noisy neighbors, air condition problems, and cockroaches. And when

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Speaker 2: federal agents from the FBI knock on Peggy's door on

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Speaker 2: December thirteenth, twenty sixteen, they arrest her and get her

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Speaker 2: into handcuffs, and then they start looking around her place

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Speaker 2: and they immediately notice a check on her nightstand for

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Speaker 2: nearly two hundred thousand dollars. Apparently Peggy's got another scam cooking.

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Speaker 2: She tricked a local doctor into believing she bought a

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Speaker 2: shuttered high school in the Lower ninth Ward of New

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Speaker 2: Orleans and was in the process of renovating it and

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Speaker 2: planning to reopen it as a retirement home and make

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Speaker 2: millions of dollars in profits. The only problem is none

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Speaker 2: of that's true. According to authorities.

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Speaker 5: In New Orleans, this doctor invested many thousands of dollars

394
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Speaker 5: one hundred and ninety seven thousand dollars to be accurate

395
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Speaker 5: in that particular project known as a Holy Cross project,

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Speaker 5: and as it turned out upon investigation, the property was

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Speaker 5: not for sale.

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Speaker 2: Luckily, that unsuspecting doctor got his check back in the

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Speaker 2: nick of time.

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Speaker 5: If the New Orleans I had arrested her one day later,

401
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Speaker 5: that money would have been deposited, that money would have

402
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Speaker 5: been gone.

403
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Speaker 2: But sadly, Peggy did get away with stealing the other

404
00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:12,840
Speaker 2: check he gave her for one hundred and seventy four

405
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Speaker 2: thousand dollars weeks before cops come in. You have a

406
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Speaker 2: check sitting on your nightstand, like, what is going on?

407
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Speaker 2: Chantelle Cohen again?

408
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Speaker 3: But that shows you that she has to catch back up.

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Speaker 3: So she's going to figure out a way to do

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Speaker 3: whatever she's been doing this whole time to get back

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Speaker 3: to the fancy life as she loves to live. So

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Speaker 3: that's what I'm nervous about of whoever her next victim is.

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Speaker 2: And the US attorney prosecuting Peggy for the Southern District

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Speaker 2: of Texas knows that now more.

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Speaker 6: Than ever, Peggy Fulford is a financial predator. She looks

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Speaker 6: for prey. She's looking for someone that she can ingratiate

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Speaker 6: herself with, earn their trust, and steal their money.

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Speaker 2: For more than a year, from late twenty sixteen to

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Speaker 2: early twenty eighteen, the federal case against Peggy Fulford makes

420
00:24:06,480 --> 00:24:11,080
Speaker 2: its way through the crowded criminal justice system. In the meantime,

421
00:24:11,280 --> 00:24:15,639
Speaker 2: Peggy is free on bond awaiting federal trial, and she

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00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:20,359
Speaker 2: pleads not guilty to all eight counts against her. She

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00:24:20,520 --> 00:24:23,520
Speaker 2: says she can't afford to hire a lawyer now, so

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Speaker 2: she requests a public defender who she doesn't have to

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Speaker 2: pay anything to. And Peggy seems to really want to

426
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Speaker 2: go to trial at first. But here's the thing about

427
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Speaker 2: federal cases that go to trial. The vast majority of them,

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Speaker 2: nearly one hundred percent, end with a conviction, and a

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Speaker 2: scammer convicted at trial is usually sentenced to way more

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Speaker 2: prison time than a scammer who throws prosecutors a bone

431
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Speaker 2: and takes a plea deal. Actually, in a lot of

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Speaker 2: those cases, if there's no violent criminal history, the scammer

433
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Speaker 2: can usually get off with just probation and no prison

434
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Speaker 2: time or very little prison time. And that's exactly what

435
00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:13,600
Speaker 2: Peggy's public defender explains to her. So Peggy changes her mind,

436
00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:21,000
Speaker 2: and on February first, twenty eighteen, she agrees to plead

437
00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:26,360
Speaker 2: guilty to just one count, interstate transportation of stolen property.

438
00:25:27,200 --> 00:25:31,200
Speaker 2: At this point, it's entirely possible that Peggy could walk

439
00:25:31,240 --> 00:25:37,840
Speaker 2: away with zero prison time. But suddenly something unforeseen happens

440
00:25:38,160 --> 00:25:41,680
Speaker 2: that shocks the living hell out of the federal prosecutor.

441
00:25:42,720 --> 00:25:45,159
Speaker 6: I was busy and we were preparing for the sentencing

442
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:47,240
Speaker 6: the next day, and I got a message on my

443
00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:48,399
Speaker 6: voicemail at work.

444
00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:53,359
Speaker 2: That voicemail is from an engineer named Ray Thompson. Hi,

445
00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:57,120
Speaker 2: my name is Ray Thompson, who says Peggy just scanned

446
00:25:57,200 --> 00:26:00,520
Speaker 2: him in the days after pleading guilty to scan all

447
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:04,960
Speaker 2: those other people. And Engineer Ray Thompson is mad as hell.

448
00:26:05,119 --> 00:26:06,000
Speaker 4: I'm so upset.

449
00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:10,359
Speaker 6: He'd been working in Saudi Arabia to rebuild his life

450
00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:13,880
Speaker 6: because he had lost everything after Katrina, and she convinced

451
00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:17,520
Speaker 6: him that for a twenty five thousand dollars investment they

452
00:26:17,520 --> 00:26:20,480
Speaker 6: were going to make a lot of money together. That

453
00:26:20,760 --> 00:26:23,960
Speaker 6: I think really was the nail in the coffin about

454
00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:26,480
Speaker 6: whether she was going to stop or not, and.

455
00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:29,919
Speaker 2: It certainly doesn't inspire the federal judge who's about to

456
00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:34,480
Speaker 2: sentence Peggy to let her off with probation. The other

457
00:26:34,640 --> 00:26:38,280
Speaker 2: crazy scam that emerges before Peggy's sentencing hearing is that

458
00:26:38,560 --> 00:26:43,080
Speaker 2: she actually stole someone's social Security number and used it

459
00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:47,240
Speaker 2: to fraudulently file for bankruptcy in an attempt to hang

460
00:26:47,280 --> 00:26:50,359
Speaker 2: on to the Florida real estate she owns that corresponds

461
00:26:50,400 --> 00:26:55,600
Speaker 2: to her real social Security number. So during Peggy's sentencing hearing,

462
00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:58,520
Speaker 2: prosecutors planned to make a case to the judge to

463
00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:02,760
Speaker 2: give her the maximum ten years behind bars.

464
00:27:03,320 --> 00:27:05,679
Speaker 6: We were ready to stop her because we knew that

465
00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:09,200
Speaker 6: she was probably out victimizing people every day.

466
00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:17,240
Speaker 2: It's November seventh, twenty eighteen, and Peggy's sentencing hearing is

467
00:27:17,359 --> 00:27:21,880
Speaker 2: now in session. Three of her victims suddenly show up

468
00:27:21,960 --> 00:27:25,199
Speaker 2: in the courtroom and they desperately want to talk to

469
00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:31,639
Speaker 2: the judge. The first one to speak is Kristen Williams.

470
00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:36,119
Speaker 1: Thank you very much for giving me the time and

471
00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:40,840
Speaker 1: opportunity to speak at this hearing today. Please know that

472
00:27:40,920 --> 00:27:43,560
Speaker 1: I am speaking on behalf of myself as well as

473
00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:46,840
Speaker 1: my former husband, Ricky Williams, who is not able to

474
00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:47,240
Speaker 1: be here.

475
00:27:49,280 --> 00:27:54,159
Speaker 2: Former husband Wow. The sad truth of the matter is,

476
00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:58,360
Speaker 2: after getting scammed by Peggy out of millions and millions

477
00:27:58,359 --> 00:28:03,399
Speaker 2: of dollars, Ricky Williams and Kristin are now divorced, but

478
00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:06,800
Speaker 2: they appear to be on good terms. As Kristin explains

479
00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:10,560
Speaker 2: to the judge why Ricky can't be here today, he.

480
00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:13,600
Speaker 1: Is in the middle of midterm exams and working in California.

481
00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:17,679
Speaker 1: He had to start a second career after losing every

482
00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:21,240
Speaker 1: dollar he earned playing football in the NFL for twelve

483
00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:25,280
Speaker 1: years to Peggy. Although I've had lots of time to

484
00:28:25,320 --> 00:28:28,080
Speaker 1: prepare for this, I was never quite sure how to

485
00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:30,679
Speaker 1: put everything I would want you to know about Peggy

486
00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:34,320
Speaker 1: and the turmoil and hardship she has caused in our

487
00:28:34,440 --> 00:28:39,640
Speaker 1: lives into words. I thought perhaps I could start with

488
00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:43,880
Speaker 1: December one, twenty thirteen, when I discovered that not only

489
00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:46,240
Speaker 1: was there not enough money for me to go to

490
00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:49,800
Speaker 1: the grocery store in my checking account, but that nearly

491
00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:53,720
Speaker 1: ten million dollars that my husband had worked so hard

492
00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:57,360
Speaker 1: to save for our family was all gone.

493
00:28:57,840 --> 00:28:58,680
Speaker 4: Or maybe the.

494
00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:01,320
Speaker 1: Day I discovered that we had thirty days to prove

495
00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:06,280
Speaker 1: my husband's innocence to the irs. You see, Peggy had

496
00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:09,160
Speaker 1: received a fraudulent three hundred and thirty four thousand dollars

497
00:29:09,240 --> 00:29:12,400
Speaker 1: tax refund in his name and deposited it into one

498
00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:16,560
Speaker 1: of her more than eighty five bank accounts and promptly

499
00:29:16,880 --> 00:29:20,680
Speaker 1: spent it. We have since discovered that that sort of

500
00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:23,520
Speaker 1: thing was actually easy for her to do, because she

501
00:29:23,560 --> 00:29:26,480
Speaker 1: would use her driver's license that had the last name

502
00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:32,200
Speaker 1: Williams on it and just pretend to be Ricky's wife.

503
00:29:33,680 --> 00:29:37,600
Speaker 2: When Kristen finishes speaking, what happens next in the courtroom

504
00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:42,960
Speaker 2: stuns me. The judge seems to push back on Kristin Williams.

505
00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:46,840
Speaker 7: You're obviously an intelligent woman, and I'm sure your husband

506
00:29:46,880 --> 00:29:50,200
Speaker 7: had access to advice and counsel from the National Football League.

507
00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:54,280
Speaker 7: Wasn't she an unlikely choice to manage money or manage investments?

508
00:29:55,000 --> 00:30:00,960
Speaker 1: No, Peggy claimed to be a Harvard edge kated attorney.

509
00:30:01,400 --> 00:30:05,480
Speaker 1: She had made up pleques on her walls. She supposedly

510
00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:10,160
Speaker 1: had an NBA from Harvard. Her third husband, Force King.

511
00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:14,480
Speaker 1: She told everyone everyone that they started the first HMO

512
00:30:14,560 --> 00:30:18,320
Speaker 1: in the country. That he retired from practicing medicine because

513
00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:21,200
Speaker 1: he had made so much money with his investments that

514
00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:26,120
Speaker 1: everyone flocked to them. She claimed to be able to

515
00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:29,760
Speaker 1: give us all generational wealth to take care of our families,

516
00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:36,120
Speaker 1: and she had the highest friends in the highest places.

517
00:30:36,480 --> 00:30:40,640
Speaker 1: She had an extreme amount of money. It appeared she

518
00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:44,400
Speaker 1: drove fancy cars, she looked like and acted like she

519
00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:47,720
Speaker 1: was all of these things. She hung out with well

520
00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:50,200
Speaker 1: known attorneys. I mean, it was just, I mean, I

521
00:30:50,360 --> 00:30:53,120
Speaker 1: don't have enough time to sit here and tell you

522
00:30:53,160 --> 00:30:58,760
Speaker 1: all of the things.

523
00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:01,960
Speaker 2: Next up to speak is a woman named Rebecca Hilliard,

524
00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:06,120
Speaker 2: the wife of NFL player Lex Hilliard. Peggy scammed them

525
00:31:06,160 --> 00:31:08,880
Speaker 2: both out of one hundred and thirty two thousand dollars

526
00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:13,200
Speaker 2: and then continued scamming them even after they confronted her.

527
00:31:13,920 --> 00:31:16,560
Speaker 8: A year or so after we fired her, she started

528
00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:19,440
Speaker 8: up another account in both of our names, signed Lex's name,

529
00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:21,800
Speaker 8: and put power of attorney, which she did not have,

530
00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:25,840
Speaker 8: and then she filed our taxes in Montana, in Minnesota,

531
00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:29,680
Speaker 8: and Florida and got three different tax refunds in our names.

532
00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:34,880
Speaker 2: And as insane as that is, it's not quite as

533
00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:38,920
Speaker 2: insane as Peggy scamming sixty four year old Ray Thompson

534
00:31:39,400 --> 00:31:43,240
Speaker 2: while she was out on bond after actually pleading guilty

535
00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:47,880
Speaker 2: to scamming everyone else. Now it's raised her to take

536
00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:50,760
Speaker 2: the stand and tell the judge how Peggy tricked him

537
00:31:50,840 --> 00:31:54,400
Speaker 2: out of twenty five thousand dollars, claiming she had a

538
00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:58,320
Speaker 2: profitable medical management business in Phoenix and was going to

539
00:31:58,360 --> 00:32:02,240
Speaker 2: give Ray a huge return on his investment. Oh and

540
00:32:02,360 --> 00:32:06,880
Speaker 2: she told Ray her name was Peggy Jones. I imagine

541
00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:09,520
Speaker 2: just in case Ray ever googled her real name and

542
00:32:09,560 --> 00:32:13,680
Speaker 2: found news reports about her recent FBI arvest and federal indictment.

543
00:32:14,640 --> 00:32:16,760
Speaker 9: So I gave her money, a total of twenty five

544
00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:18,160
Speaker 9: thousand dollars cash.

545
00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:19,480
Speaker 2: I trusted her, and.

546
00:32:19,400 --> 00:32:22,120
Speaker 9: Even to know that her name wasn't even Peggy Jones,

547
00:32:22,440 --> 00:32:24,720
Speaker 9: it just seemed like deceit from the beginning.

548
00:32:27,400 --> 00:32:33,840
Speaker 2: Now it's up to the judge. But before he issues

549
00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:37,960
Speaker 2: Peggy's sentence, is there anything else you would like to say?

550
00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:43,200
Speaker 9: News Walford, Yes, your honor, please go ahead.

551
00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:47,360
Speaker 2: And the stuff Peggy is about to tell this judge.

552
00:32:47,800 --> 00:32:51,160
Speaker 2: You're gonna think I'm making up, but I promise you

553
00:32:51,560 --> 00:32:54,000
Speaker 2: every word is true.

554
00:32:54,200 --> 00:32:57,480
Speaker 7: You seem like you have so many skills, so much experience.

555
00:32:57,800 --> 00:32:59,880
Speaker 7: Why was it necessary to do this. Was it simply

556
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:01,920
Speaker 7: shortage of cash?

557
00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:04,960
Speaker 9: No, your honor, Can I explain something.

558
00:33:11,960 --> 00:33:13,800
Speaker 2: Next time on Queen of the Khan.

559
00:33:14,440 --> 00:33:17,120
Speaker 9: They know where the money went. That's what I will

560
00:33:17,200 --> 00:33:20,520
Speaker 9: tell you is they definitely know where the money went.

561
00:33:20,800 --> 00:33:23,240
Speaker 2: Peggy tries to play a federal judge.

562
00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:26,400
Speaker 9: I know they painted a really ugly picture, but I

563
00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:30,280
Speaker 9: was actually married to an anesthesiologist during that time. I

564
00:33:30,360 --> 00:33:31,920
Speaker 9: was married to an orthodontist.

565
00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:34,680
Speaker 2: Those cars a Roseworth.

566
00:33:34,280 --> 00:33:37,080
Speaker 9: Ghost and all of that that was not in my name,

567
00:33:37,640 --> 00:33:41,760
Speaker 9: That was in their names, Amasarati, that was in their names.

568
00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:43,640
Speaker 4: All I'm saying, your Honor.

569
00:33:43,480 --> 00:33:47,760
Speaker 9: Is that I was married to people who also made money.

570
00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:50,840
Speaker 2: But will the judge fall for her charm offensive?

571
00:33:51,520 --> 00:33:54,240
Speaker 7: I appreciate your candor, I really do. Thank you very much.

572
00:33:55,080 --> 00:33:56,240
Speaker 9: You're welcome, your honor.

573
00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:03,040
Speaker 2: If you're enjoying Queen of the Con, leave us a

574
00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:06,680
Speaker 2: five star review, reviews, help other listeners find us, and

575
00:34:06,760 --> 00:34:10,200
Speaker 2: by all means, click that share button and send Queen

576
00:34:10,200 --> 00:34:12,440
Speaker 2: of the Con to anyone you think might be into it.

577
00:34:18,600 --> 00:34:21,320
Speaker 2: Queen of the Cohn The Athlete Whisperer is a production

578
00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:25,680
Speaker 2: of AYR Media and iHeartMedia, hosted by me Jonathan Walton

579
00:34:26,000 --> 00:34:30,560
Speaker 2: Executive producers Jonathan Walton for Jonathan Walton Productions and Elisa

580
00:34:30,640 --> 00:34:36,560
Speaker 2: Rosen for AYR Media. Consulting producer Evan Goldstein, consulting producer,

581
00:34:36,760 --> 00:34:42,480
Speaker 2: Trace Shean. Written by Jonathan Walton, Sound design by Zach Hirsch,

582
00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:47,960
Speaker 2: Edited and mixed by Zach Hirsch, Audio engineer Justin Longerbean,

583
00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:54,480
Speaker 2: audio engineer Chris Desmond, studio engineer Graham Gibson. Mastered by

584
00:34:54,920 --> 00:35:00,440
Speaker 2: Justin Longerbean Legal counsel for AYR Media. Johnny Douglas, executive

585
00:35:00,480 --> 00:35:06,000
Speaker 2: producer for iHeartMedia. Maya Howard Voice acting by Darnell Baldwin,

586
00:35:06,640 --> 00:35:14,560
Speaker 2: Tyree Saxton, Junior Courtney, Hettrick Milan, Faxis, Jorge Farragut, David Teitelbaum,

587
00:35:15,239 --> 00:35:24,799
Speaker 2: Terina Pouncey, Kim Ganier, Stuart Chait, Teresa Prindle. Statements from

588
00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:27,920
Speaker 2: press reports, public interviews, and from court records were dramatized

589
00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:30,960
Speaker 2: verbatim on this season of Queen of the Khan, b

590
00:35:31,080 --> 00:35:35,480
Speaker 2: E t's American Gangster Trap, Queens, TNTs Rich and Shameless,

591
00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:41,240
Speaker 2: CNBC's American Greed, The Guardian, Sports, Illustrated, The Times, Picky June,

592
00:35:41,440 --> 00:35:45,879
Speaker 2: The Opportunist Podcast, victim interviews and Countless court records were

593
00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:48,520
Speaker 2: the sources used on this season of Queen of the

594
00:35:48,600 --> 00:35:48,880
Speaker 2: Khan