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Speaker 3: Hey everyone, it's Captain Ron and each week on Beyond Contact,
Speaker 3: we'll explore the latest news and you discuss some of
Speaker 3: the classic cases and bring you the latest information from
Speaker 3: the newest cases as we talk with the top experts.
Speaker 4: Welcome back to another episode of Beyond Contact. I'm Captain Ron,
Speaker 4: and today we're going to be speaking with Thomas Jane.
Speaker 4: Thomas is an actor, director, and producer who's had an
Speaker 4: incredible acting career, appearing in well over fifty movies and
Speaker 4: TV shows. He's also a triple Golden Globe nominee. For
Speaker 4: the comedy series hung He's with us today because he
Speaker 4: just about completed his nonfiction book, A Humans Guide to
Speaker 4: Advanced Visiting Aliens. More than that, he's genuinely dove into
Speaker 4: this material and is incredibly well versed on the topic
Speaker 4: and he's got many great insights. Hey, Thomas, how you doing.
Speaker 5: I'm doing great, Ron, It's nice to be here.
Speaker 4: Thanks.
Speaker 5: I'm glad we got to do this.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I am too.
Speaker 5: Did you Is the book done? Where are we at
Speaker 5: with the book? The book is being edited now. I'm
Speaker 5: completing that. I'm actually going to take a two week
Speaker 5: sabbatical in the beginning of September and where I'm just
Speaker 5: going to do nothing but do that, you know, and
Speaker 5: wrapping up press on my show Tropo, which is now
Speaker 5: number four on Prime Video.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 5: So in between that and so I just said, I
Speaker 5: got to get I got to like clear out the
Speaker 5: decks and just get some time in front of the computer.
Speaker 5: And I'm doing that at the end of the month.
Speaker 4: Okay. Cool. So it was in twenty twenty four. Was
Speaker 4: that your first experience at a UFO conference, coming to
Speaker 4: contact in the desert? What'd you think of that?
Speaker 5: I was number one? Yeah, I didn't know what to expect. Yeah,
Speaker 5: but I got to tell you, I'm not sure that
Speaker 5: the other conventions or conferences can beat that one. That
Speaker 5: was relaxed. Everyone felt comfortable. There's a lot of people
Speaker 5: to talk to. The people that just show up for
Speaker 5: the conference, they're all fascinating. They've all been into this
Speaker 5: stuff for years and all, you know, and you've got
Speaker 5: the whole gamut from selling the crystal skulls in the
Speaker 5: on the tables and listening to Avi Lobe. So it's
Speaker 5: a really great I had a blast.
Speaker 4: It's fun that, you know, we have the whole building,
Speaker 4: so everybody there that you talk to is part of
Speaker 4: the community, and you could talk to anybody. Anybody there
Speaker 4: has something to say about this topic. Either they're new
Speaker 4: to it, or they've had an experience, or they're interested
Speaker 4: for one reason or another. Right, It really makes it
Speaker 4: a fascinating unique thing. Some of these other conferences I've
Speaker 4: gone to, you know, they're like in the middle of
Speaker 4: a casino or whatever. There's a thousand other things happening
Speaker 4: and it's just kind of like you can't find your people.
Speaker 4: This is you know, all your people. We've all made
Speaker 4: a pilgrimage to that location.
Speaker 5: Yeah, they take over the whole resort. The resort's gorgeous.
Speaker 5: I was pleasantly surprised, and how much fun I had.
Speaker 4: That's good. Glad to hear it. Man. So you clearly
Speaker 4: have taken a deep dive into the subject, and I
Speaker 4: really appreciate a lot of your perspectives on it. I
Speaker 4: thought your lecture was outstanding, by the way, Thank you.
Speaker 4: It sounds like you started with the idea that UFOs
Speaker 4: weren't even real at all, that you actually thought it
Speaker 4: was like made up by Hollywood or something, right, That.
Speaker 5: Was my first impression.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 5: I remember there was a TV show based on Project
Speaker 5: Blue Book back in the seventies or something, and at
Speaker 5: the end of every episode it would always be a
Speaker 5: weather balloon or you know, a be caught in them
Speaker 5: between two panes of glass, and I bought it. And
Speaker 5: then when the flying saucer stuff, I thought that flying
Speaker 5: saucers versus the Earth, just like every other Hollywood creation, monster,
Speaker 5: space alien, that's what it was. I mean, they even
Speaker 5: looked really simple. It kind of looked low budget, you know,
Speaker 5: because they were just these saucers like placed on end.
Speaker 5: You're like Okay, yeah, that sets perfect Hollywood right exactly.
Speaker 4: So we are, we're both on the HDA board, and
Speaker 4: I think we would both agree. I'll let you speak
Speaker 4: for yourself, but I think we would agree that Hollywood
Speaker 4: does an awful job at how they deal with the
Speaker 4: subject of UFO is an alien life. In just one example,
Speaker 4: I'll give you take the Travis Walton case, which I
Speaker 4: think is an excellent case. I've got a lot of
Speaker 4: experience with Travis directly. It's a very credible case. He's
Speaker 4: a good guy. Here. We have this amazing story of
Speaker 4: this guy and his co workers who came across this
Speaker 4: UFO and he goes aboard the ship. And yet when
Speaker 4: they make the story, they make the film Fire in
Speaker 4: the Sky, they have to change everything. It frustrated Travis,
Speaker 4: it frustrated me, and I even spoke to Tracy tore Me,
Speaker 4: the director of that film, and to a degree, he
Speaker 4: wanted to do it differently. So why why is this
Speaker 4: story not incredible enough that we can't take it word
Speaker 4: for word out of Travis's mouth? I mean, talk about
Speaker 4: a story that doesn't need embellishing. It should be that one.
Speaker 5: I think that there's a kind of momentum that Hollywood has.
Speaker 5: In other words, if something has worked in the past,
Speaker 5: producers who are going to give you millions of dollars
Speaker 5: are trying to ensure that they get their money back.
Speaker 5: So if anything has worked before, then that's what they
Speaker 5: want to imitate. And they'll, you know, they'll mix it up,
Speaker 5: you know, they'll put a little more vegetables, a little
Speaker 5: less meat, but it's the same dish. And that's what
Speaker 5: happens with Fire. And this guy actually work with the
Speaker 5: director of Fire and this guy he did an episode
Speaker 5: of The Traces did he directed an episode of the
Speaker 5: expanse All and we got to talk about the show,
Speaker 5: and I remember him being frustrated. You know, the directors
Speaker 5: are caught in the same spot that the script writers are.
Speaker 5: You know, it's you're serving a master. And until we
Speaker 5: have a film that makes a lot of money that
Speaker 5: is true to the events as we understand them to be,
Speaker 5: this will continue. I think we're at an inflection point now, though.
Speaker 5: I think that the subject is getting more attention than
Speaker 5: it's ever gotten before in a way that it's never
Speaker 5: gotten before, thanks to the Internet, thanks to social media,
Speaker 5: thanks to the dissemination of information that is happening in
Speaker 5: the world today. I think we're right for a change
Speaker 5: and this hopefully with the Hollywood Disclosure Alliance and interested
Speaker 5: writers and directors, we can finally break through.
Speaker 4: There's no doubt that there's more interest in this topic now,
Speaker 4: there's more just in general about this topic in the
Speaker 4: real world. But don't you think the Hollywood itself that
Speaker 4: the industry has changed with streaming services and everything to
Speaker 4: make one of these movies. That's why we're seeing so
Speaker 4: many sequels, right, We're seeing a lot of sequels. We're
Speaker 4: seeing less movies made, therefore their bigger budgets. I think
Speaker 4: it's harder and harder to get one of these real
Speaker 4: stories made today, wouldn't you agree.
Speaker 5: I think that if we look back at the history
Speaker 5: of Hollywood, sequels have always been a thing, you know,
Speaker 5: and they ebb and flow like everything else. We're still
Speaker 5: living in the Marvel universe, and that's finally starting to
Speaker 5: lose its grip a little bit, which again usually makes
Speaker 5: room for something else to come in and take its place.
Speaker 5: It's cyclical, for sure. We're always looking for great stories.
Speaker 5: We're always looking for a great script and a great
Speaker 5: story to tell. The truth is those are rare and
Speaker 5: everything else is kind of filler. That's why when you know,
Speaker 5: look back at any given year nineteen fifty, there'll be
Speaker 5: seven films are really memorable out of the hundreds that
Speaker 5: came out that year, and that's true of every year.
Speaker 4: Yeah, how about has Renegade Entertainment ever thought about taking
Speaker 4: on this subject? Have you seen any of those come
Speaker 4: across with us?
Speaker 5: Absolutely? Yeah, and I'm starting to see those come across
Speaker 5: my desk. Now, there's a couple of really interesting stories
Speaker 5: that I think would be really fun to tell. First,
Speaker 5: there's always a remake of the Travis Walton story. I
Speaker 5: think that that would be phenomenal. He's ever wanting to
Speaker 5: do that for I know, Yeah, he's poor guy. I
Speaker 5: feel for him because I think that, yeah, he wants
Speaker 5: to get he wants people to see it the way
Speaker 5: that he experienced it. It makes perfect sense, you know,
Speaker 5: good for him. The other great story is Pascagoula nineteen
Speaker 5: seventy three. Absolutely, Calvin Parker and Charles Hickson's that's a story.
Speaker 4: No doubt of. You just lost him though, yep.
Speaker 5: We did, but we have we have enough documented books
Speaker 5: and stuff. Philip Mantle, of course, who has been really
Speaker 5: instrumental in keeping that story alive. And the other story
Speaker 5: that I really like is nineteen sixty six, Dale spar
Speaker 5: and Barney Neff. There were two cops who actually saw UFO,
Speaker 5: and that UFO somehow stayed with them as they chased
Speaker 5: it in their cop cars eighty six miles through two states,
Speaker 5: calling everybody. The whole police force was a buzz with this,
Speaker 5: so much that so that it became headline news Project
Speaker 5: blue Book. Quintin Nella had to be brought in interviewing everybody.
Speaker 5: Heinek was there. I mean, it was sort of a
Speaker 5: peak event in the Project blue Book sort of saga
Speaker 5: which would then be shut down three or four years later,
Speaker 5: right jail Sparr basically lost his mind after that, he
Speaker 5: got hit with a sledgehammer. He woke up one dude
Speaker 5: and went to bed another, and that other dude that
Speaker 5: he woke up with one day, he was never the same.
Speaker 5: His wife left him, you know, he got fired, He
Speaker 5: ended up living in a shack. He got destroyed, you know,
Speaker 5: because he became that cop that saw the UFO when
Speaker 5: nobody almost nobody believed him.
Speaker 4: You know, especially back then.
Speaker 5: Right, Yeah, that's a that's a peak story because it's
Speaker 5: the confluence of the phenomena and human society, right, And
Speaker 5: that's interesting, that confluence where the two meet. The phenomena
Speaker 5: which is what it is, and then how we deal
Speaker 5: with it, interpret it, ridicule it, and then the effect
Speaker 5: that that has on real experiencers that have seen something
Speaker 5: that nobody believes is true. That's a good story.
Speaker 4: Absolutely. When we come back, we're going to talk more
Speaker 4: with Thomas Jane about what made him interested in this topic.
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Speaker 4: You're back on Beyond Contact with Captain Ron. We're talking
Speaker 4: to Thomas, Jane Thomas. We were just talking about that
Speaker 4: case from nineteen sixty six and how that guy's life
Speaker 4: he went to bed one guy and woke up another.
Speaker 4: You know, you hear these stories. I'm sure you've seen
Speaker 4: these accounts of how people's lives get turned upside down.
Speaker 4: They lose their job, they get divorced, they've had a
Speaker 4: normal job. You know, they had a normal life or
Speaker 4: an accountant. They're forty eight years old, they've got the
Speaker 4: same life, and then all of a sudden, this experience happens. Yeah,
Speaker 4: the whole thing falls apart.
Speaker 5: You're putting in a tough spot because if you've seen
Speaker 5: something that is dead real, right, and you don't understand
Speaker 5: and it's obvious some sort of futuristic technology. Sometimes they
Speaker 5: see alien beings and it's not a dream, and then
Speaker 5: you have to somehow integrate that experience with the world
Speaker 5: that you live in, and the world that you live
Speaker 5: in knows absolutely nothing about that. But some people feel
Speaker 5: an obligation. In my opinion, most people just keep their
Speaker 5: mouths shut, but some people the experience is so overwhelming
Speaker 5: that they feel an obligation, like Charles Hickson, like, hey man,
Speaker 5: this might be the beginning of war of the world's
Speaker 5: or something. Is there more of them out there? Is
Speaker 5: this going to start happening to other people? They have
Speaker 5: no idea, so they feel an obligation and go to
Speaker 5: the Air Force and go to the cops and go, look, man,
Speaker 5: I don't know what's going on, but this has happened
Speaker 5: to me, And they feel like they're doing their civic
Speaker 5: duty and then all hell breaks loose.
Speaker 4: I think they are. I think of these people as heroes.
Speaker 4: Good for them coming forward and stepping up and doing that.
Speaker 4: I mean, I think most people, certainly back in the
Speaker 4: day wouldn't have done it. It's a little bit more
Speaker 4: open now. I think it would be a little less
Speaker 4: slightly less ridicule from someone coming forward with a story
Speaker 4: like this, but it's still tough. Yeah.
Speaker 5: There's a guy named Aaron Schultz who I talk about
Speaker 5: in my Contact in the Desert lecture. So he came
Speaker 5: out on Twitter, you know, and his experiences happened to
Speaker 5: him in the nineties, but because of the attention that
Speaker 5: the phenomenon started to receive, he felt like he could
Speaker 5: add something to the conversation by relaying his He has
Speaker 5: three abduction experiences that he remembers without he's never done hypnosis,
Speaker 5: but he's lived with this since he was nine years old, right,
Speaker 5: and tried to learn about it. But then, you know,
Speaker 5: we get congressional hearings about UFOs and the guy's like, well,
Speaker 5: here's my experience. And he has taken a lot of
Speaker 5: shit on Twitter. But also he has supporters. There's a
Speaker 5: lot of people probably more than ever who take his
Speaker 5: account seriously. But he's a hero. The guy is brave
Speaker 5: enough to come out and tell the truth about something
Speaker 5: that happened to him. All those guys are here heroic.
Speaker 4: I feel the same way. I agree. I feel thank
Speaker 4: God for them for coming forward with that. You know,
Speaker 4: you and I are pretty well versed in We've read
Speaker 4: the books, we've met the people, we've interviewed people, we've
Speaker 4: talked to people we know about this topic. If I
Speaker 4: woke up and found one of these beings at my bed,
Speaker 4: my head would still explode. I wouldn't know how to
Speaker 4: deal with that. Oh, absolutely, And I'm embedded in this community.
Speaker 4: It's still an overwhelming experience. That's true.
Speaker 5: That's very true. I think about that too myself, you know,
Speaker 5: and I'd probably be terrifying, but I'd also be, you know,
Speaker 5: utterly fascinated. And I would give anything to have a
Speaker 5: close encounter, you know, to see a UFO that's close
Speaker 5: enough that I could see the material that it was
Speaker 5: made out of.
Speaker 4: Oh, a ship. I'm fine. You and I we talked
Speaker 4: before we came on here that I feel we're very
Speaker 4: aligned in this. Here's what we differ. Thomas there's no
Speaker 4: way I want to see the being the ship. I
Speaker 4: think would be great if a ship came up right
Speaker 4: outside of the window, I'd be fine with that. I
Speaker 4: do not want to wake up with a big ied
Speaker 4: being at the end of my bed. I do not
Speaker 4: want that.
Speaker 5: I would be fascinated to just try to get a
Speaker 5: look at what their biology really is, if you can
Speaker 5: even call it biology, whether they're biosynthetic organisms or they're
Speaker 5: you know, natural born creatures from another planet or something else.
Speaker 5: I mean, I would be fascinated. I've always tried to
Speaker 5: go through abductee accounts. They're pretty good. Up until now,
Speaker 5: we've just had basically police sketch drawings. Some of them
Speaker 5: are better than others, so you get a kind of
Speaker 5: an idea, but it's always an artist's interpretation, right. But
Speaker 5: to see the skin, to see how the musculature is
Speaker 5: put together, to see what kind of frame that musculature
Speaker 5: hangs on, to just get a glimpse at that alien biology,
Speaker 5: you know, and that.
Speaker 4: Rminator kind of being. Is there flesh on mechanics? Is
Speaker 4: it right? Is it? Yeah? Yeah?
Speaker 5: And I think that any biologist or scientists would lose
Speaker 5: their minds to study this phenomena, if we can just
Speaker 5: get them over the hump, the sociological hump of actually
Speaker 5: taking a chance and taking it seriously. I think a
Speaker 5: lot of people do privately. In fact, I know scientists
Speaker 5: do privately to be able to study this and to
Speaker 5: submit papers and to get feedback and peer review. That's
Speaker 5: what we need.
Speaker 4: It's remarkable how often, I mean, I still talk to people.
Speaker 4: I've met people that work at NASA, for example, and
Speaker 4: they fully believe in all of this. They don't come
Speaker 4: out publicly with it, which is interesting. They like their jobs,
Speaker 4: you know, yeah, exactly of all places you can't come
Speaker 4: out and talk about it. So you've delved into this
Speaker 4: subject matter pretty heavily. What was it that pushed you
Speaker 4: over the edge into thinking, you know what, there's really
Speaker 4: something to this.
Speaker 5: In twenty eleven, I had an experience that I don't
Speaker 5: talk about, but that I couldn't explain, and I've kept
Speaker 5: it under my hat for almost fifteen years, doing the
Speaker 5: research privately. Like everyone else with an interest in this
Speaker 5: thing outside of the UFO researchers who make it their
Speaker 5: business to do so. For me, it was just an
Speaker 5: all encompassing hobby, a side project that eventually grew. The
Speaker 5: most amazing thing about it is how much information there
Speaker 5: is out there. I've been doing this for fifteen years
Speaker 5: and I still have only scratched the surface. It's just
Speaker 5: such a complex, deep, all encompassing subject that touches on
Speaker 5: every aspect of human existence and existence itself. So that
Speaker 5: list led to me to start taking notes, and then
Speaker 5: the notes led to paragraphs, and that led to some chapters,
Speaker 5: and before I knew it, I had a book. Actually
Speaker 5: have two books on the topic. Yeah, so the first
Speaker 5: one I'm editing and then the second one. After that
Speaker 5: one comes out, I'll start editing the second one.
Speaker 4: Awesome. When you were looking into this research, did you
Speaker 4: have a favorite case, what's the strongest evidence that you
Speaker 4: felt you saw in someone else's work and you said, oh,
Speaker 4: this is what's the point too.
Speaker 5: Well, I've been affected by quite a number of different
Speaker 5: books and researchers, but I guess the one that really
Speaker 5: caught my imagination the most was David Jacob's work with
Speaker 5: abductees and the hybrid breeding program. Now, a common misconception
Speaker 5: is that the gray alien is all there is that
Speaker 5: were being visited by aliens. They're gray and they like
Speaker 5: to abduct people and apparently have something to do with
Speaker 5: sexual reproduction and all that crap. That's just a sliver
Speaker 5: of the actual phenomenon. I would direct people to Preston
Speaker 5: Dennet's work, who has a YouTube channel.
Speaker 4: Every Friday.
Speaker 5: Preston Dnnet on YouTube Every Friday, he'll do ten or
Speaker 5: so contact cases. He combs through the literature, going all
Speaker 5: the way back as far as the literature goes, and
Speaker 5: selects different contact cases and puts those together. He's got
Speaker 5: alien encounters. You know, there's a few gray alien stuff
Speaker 5: in there, but the rest is completely almost unique. You know.
Speaker 5: Some of these aliens you'll see described repeatedly. A lot
Speaker 5: of them you've never seen before or been described before.
Speaker 5: So you're like, where are these little dudes coming from?
Speaker 5: Some of them are so little. Some of them are
Speaker 5: two meters tall. Basically, you go from about thirty centimeters
Speaker 5: to about two meters, and that's sort of the range
Speaker 5: you know that I do. I'm like, why is that?
Speaker 5: Why don't we see little three inch dudes?
Speaker 4: You know?
Speaker 5: Right, So that's the range. It seems to be about
Speaker 5: two feet to two meters. Most of them fall between
Speaker 5: three and a half to five or six, right, But
Speaker 5: then you've got a few outliers. So that's fascinating. Does
Speaker 5: that have something to do with habitable planets? And they're
Speaker 5: the gravitational pull of different planets. A planet that's too small,
Speaker 5: it doesn't create intelligent life. A planet is too big.
Speaker 5: You know, there's too much.
Speaker 4: That person's interpretation and their account, you know, their recounting
Speaker 4: of the story has to factor.
Speaker 5: You have to get into all that. But it's interesting,
Speaker 5: you know. So say you're dealing with one hundred cases
Speaker 5: and seventy five percent of them don't get the height
Speaker 5: exactly right. But when you put them all together, you're
Speaker 5: going to get a range. You know, one person's account
Speaker 5: might not be the whole truth, but when you get
Speaker 5: one hundred people's accounts, you start putting that together, you
Speaker 5: start to narrow in on sort of like, you know,
Speaker 5: well the guy wasn't three hundred and fifty pounds, you know,
Speaker 5: the guy with the gun and you're testifying. You know,
Speaker 5: well he wasn't a big fat dude.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 5: But you'll get a range and you'll be able to
Speaker 5: zero in on absolutely or break here.
Speaker 4: When we come back on beyond contact, we'll pick this
Speaker 4: up with Thomas Jane. You're listening to Beyond Contact on
Speaker 4: the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal podcast network.
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Speaker 4: We are back on Beyond Contact. I'm keptain Ron. We're
Speaker 4: talking to Thomas Jane about accounts of alien abduction and
Speaker 4: first hand accounts with different people. Yeah, it's interesting how
Speaker 4: people have these different and interpretations of what's happened to them.
Speaker 4: Not only do they see different beings and different entities,
Speaker 4: which all may be true or may may not be true,
Speaker 4: but they also are seeing it through their own paradigm lens.
Speaker 4: You know a lot of these guys, maybe they have
Speaker 4: a religious overtone and they might consider it a spiritual being,
Speaker 4: or some people might think it's, you know, a demon
Speaker 4: or whatever. They all have their own sort of view on.
Speaker 5: It, right, right, right, right, that's right. Yeah, that the
Speaker 5: fish bowl that humanity sees reality through is limited. It's
Speaker 5: incredibly limited. We only see a little bit of the truth.
Speaker 5: Donald Hoffman, you know, the brand guy. He says, where
Speaker 5: we've been tuned to survival, we pick up on what's
Speaker 5: most important to our survival. You know, if you took
Speaker 5: the electromagnetic spectrum and you rolled it out as a
Speaker 5: roll of thirty five millimeter film, and you started in
Speaker 5: Los Angeles and rolled it all the way to New
Speaker 5: York City, the visible light spectrum in that role of
Speaker 5: film would be one frame.
Speaker 4: Oh my god.
Speaker 5: So we're already these tiny little receivers that receive a
Speaker 5: very specific radio channel, and then we have to interpret
Speaker 5: that radio channel, right, So that's two layers of obfuscation.
Speaker 5: We can only see a little bit, we can only
Speaker 5: hear a little bit. There's only there's limits to what
Speaker 5: we can observe. And then what we do observe is
Speaker 5: limited again by our education, by our belief system, by
Speaker 5: a whole host of other things. If we woke up
Speaker 5: pissed off of your wife that morning, all these different
Speaker 5: things have an effect. So again, I think that taking
Speaker 5: the bulk of the information that we have and trying
Speaker 5: to filter it out, filter it into, I think that'll
Speaker 5: get us closer to what's actually going on than any
Speaker 5: one specific case exactly.
Speaker 4: You mentioned doctor David Jacobs. I'll tell you what this
Speaker 4: I think is. He's not as recognized or known as
Speaker 4: I think he should be. I feel he's one of
Speaker 4: the top important people in this community. I think he's
Speaker 4: done incredible work because you know, he does have data,
Speaker 4: as Richard Martinez says, you know you can pull data
Speaker 4: from objective data from subjective comments. If you ask everybody
Speaker 4: the same question, so you know, he sees the same
Speaker 4: exact accounts with repeating the exact same story. You know,
Speaker 4: his research is I think incredibly valuable.
Speaker 5: I think it's some of the best we have, you know.
Speaker 5: I think John Mack of course did his own work,
Speaker 5: and Bud Hopkins did his own work. Those are the
Speaker 5: three giants. John Carpenter did great work, and Druffel. So
Speaker 5: there's a lot of different people who are making contributions.
Speaker 5: I think Jacobs, for me, is at the top of
Speaker 5: the pile. You know, I agree, and he's an awesome guy.
Speaker 5: I don't know if you ever had a chance to
Speaker 5: talk to him.
Speaker 4: I certainly have. He's got a very no nonsense approach
Speaker 4: to this. He's like, yeah, it seems absolutely insane and ridiculous,
Speaker 4: but just telling you that's what the data show is like.
Speaker 4: He's matter of fact.
Speaker 5: And at the beginning of his books he always says,
Speaker 5: there is no world in which I am completely right
Speaker 5: about any of this, you know, which I admire. He's
Speaker 5: taking as objective an approach as can be done with
Speaker 5: the tools that we have, and so I think there
Speaker 5: is something to what he's reporting. I think there is
Speaker 5: a hybrid breeding program, as crazy as that sounds, and
Speaker 5: I think we are in the middle of some sort
Speaker 5: of operation program something. And my own failing is that
Speaker 5: we're not the first that this is. This program that
Speaker 5: we're interacting with or being engaged with, whether we like
Speaker 5: it or not, is so detailed that it feels like
Speaker 5: it's been done hundreds or thousands of times before.
Speaker 4: Agreed, and Jacobs points that out that this goes back generation,
Speaker 4: generation generation, and it doesn't discriminate. It doesn't care where
Speaker 4: you live on the planet. It doesn't care what your
Speaker 4: income is, races, none of that. That's right.
Speaker 5: The technology that they use, the ships, the equipment they
Speaker 5: have on board, all of that points to me as
Speaker 5: a program that they've done on other civilizations on other
Speaker 5: planets who may or may not be at similar levels
Speaker 5: of development than we are. So we're being engaged in
Speaker 5: a program that doesn't begin and end with Planet Earth.
Speaker 5: It's just another number. It's just another coordinate on their
Speaker 5: map that's been circled and you know, targeted.
Speaker 4: That's another interesting aspect of this. I didn't even think about. Yeah,
Speaker 4: that's true, it could be going on in all these
Speaker 4: other different things.
Speaker 5: I think it must be. You know, it's completely possible
Speaker 5: that we're the only ones.
Speaker 4: But just feel you look at a math, there's no
Speaker 4: possible way, and most most physicists will say that as well.
Speaker 4: I mean, now we're just getting into the billions and
Speaker 4: building millions of trillions of galaxy. I mean, it just
Speaker 4: gets worse every time.
Speaker 5: The odds are against the people who still hold out
Speaker 5: for the rare Earth hypothesis, which was very popular in
Speaker 5: the nineteen eighties and nineties, you know, because we didn't
Speaker 5: have James Webb or the Hubble that time, we no
Speaker 5: exo planets had been discovered. The leading theory among cosmologists
Speaker 5: was the rare Earth hypothesis, which is there's way too
Speaker 5: much fine tuning going on. There's way too many happenstance
Speaker 5: events that have happened to create life on Earth. It's
Speaker 5: way too hard, you know, when you look at it,
Speaker 5: it's just like ridiculous. No, it's ridiculous that this happened randomly, right,
Speaker 5: But that's what our best science said. This happened randomly,
Speaker 5: this life thing, and then intelligence that hadn't happened randomly,
Speaker 5: And I think we're still caught in this random loop.
Speaker 5: But when you look at all the different species that
Speaker 5: are visiting us. When you look at the abduction program
Speaker 5: and say, this looks like part of a program that's
Speaker 5: been very well rehearsed. That points to what you were
Speaker 5: just saying, which is the idea that there are thousands
Speaker 5: or hundreds of thousands of planets or maybe millions who knows,
Speaker 5: with life on them that are developing intelligence. And if
Speaker 5: that's true, then you have to say, well, why are
Speaker 5: they interested in these these young civilizations that are just
Speaker 5: learning about atomic nuclear physics, you know, that are that
Speaker 5: are seemed to be on the cusp of artificial intelligence?
Speaker 5: You know, goes to the Richard Dolan thing. Dolan thought
Speaker 5: that we were part of a breakaway civilization. Anyway, it's
Speaker 5: a program, it's been around for a long time. Why
Speaker 5: why are they doing it? Why are they here?
Speaker 4: You know? Well, Jacob says he has no idea, and
Speaker 4: he's looked at seven thousand cases, so he you know,
Speaker 4: it's like, right, we don't know. That's the problem.
Speaker 5: And Dolan says, well, it's probably because we're on the
Speaker 5: cusp of breaking into their sphere year or whatever that is,
Speaker 5: you know what I mean, Like we could be one
Speaker 5: scientific revolution away from interstellar travel.
Speaker 4: Well, listen, I think we are listen to this. I think, well,
Speaker 4: I'm astually interstellar travel. But we are certainly one step
Speaker 4: away from knowing more about these alien beings because as
Speaker 4: we get each new technology. When we first got the
Speaker 4: Wilson Telescope in nineteen twenties, we suddenly learned that what
Speaker 4: we thought was the universe is in fact just our
Speaker 4: little galaxy, and in fact, there are galaxies beyond ours,
Speaker 4: and there's a whole universe out there. Then we get
Speaker 4: the you know, Kepler, and we get James webs. Now
Speaker 4: we have all this new knowledge, and I think we're
Speaker 4: just going to have new technology that's going to reveal
Speaker 4: the aliens to us. Because we learned to see in
Speaker 4: the infrared. We never could see in the infrared before.
Speaker 4: Maybe there's another spectrum or of vibration that we'll be
Speaker 4: able to pick up on our future.
Speaker 5: And it's so quick, you know, it was just like
Speaker 5: less than one hundred years ago that we didn't even
Speaker 5: know what a galaxy was. You're right, You're right. Probably
Speaker 5: before we you know, start zipping around with interstellar machines,
Speaker 5: we will learn that we are not alone and that
Speaker 5: really is what we're on the cusp of, isn't it.
Speaker 5: We're on the cusp of a neo Copernican revolution where
Speaker 5: we will never be the same again. And now it
Speaker 5: will be the before disclosure or and there's after disclosure
Speaker 5: a D. Right, that's what the book is by by
Speaker 5: Richard Dolan, A D after Disclosure. That's a completely different
Speaker 5: universe you know that we will be living in and
Speaker 5: it will be a major upheaval.
Speaker 4: We have only known there are galaxies beyond ours for
Speaker 4: less than one hundred years. It's incredible. We'll be right
Speaker 4: back with Thomas Jane on Beyond Contact on the iHeartRadio
Speaker 4: and Coast to Coast am Paranormal Podcast Network.
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Speaker 4: We are back on beyde Contact. We're talking with Thomas
Speaker 4: Jane here. Thomas, this is interesting stuff in it. It's
Speaker 4: like as we learn more knowledge and we get more technology,
Speaker 4: we have more access to more information, which I think
Speaker 4: may actually one day be how we find out more
Speaker 4: about these beings.
Speaker 5: We are on the verge of a revolution. Our biggest
Speaker 5: question is why are they here? And we can only
Speaker 5: put clues together. It's we're like a detective trying to
Speaker 5: solve a crime. You know, we have no idea, we
Speaker 5: don't know, we don't have a suspect. All we have
Speaker 5: are these events. We have potential suspects, we have unsubs
Speaker 5: unidentified suspects, and we're trying to piece together what the
Speaker 5: hell is going on. And I think that that's a
Speaker 5: big clue. Where we are in our own technological evolution
Speaker 5: is a clue. And if you think about it, aliens
Speaker 5: have arrived at least eighty years before that disclosure moment,
Speaker 5: which means that after that disclosure moment, when the world
Speaker 5: understands when scientists understand because that for me, that's real disclosure.
Speaker 5: When the scientists who study this stuff say we have
Speaker 5: evidence of alien civilizations, we're not alone.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 5: I don't care about any president, I don't care about
Speaker 5: any congressman, I don't care about Twitter. I care about
Speaker 5: the cosmologists who study this for a living, and they
Speaker 5: have to admit. Then we'll create a reassessment of all
Speaker 5: the evidence that all the great UFO researchers have collected
Speaker 5: for the past eighty years, and that will become some
Speaker 5: of the most important body of evidence that humankind has
Speaker 5: ever had, the UFO researchers and the heroes that have
Speaker 5: done that kind of work up until now.
Speaker 4: Now, I know this is a complete unknown, But after
Speaker 4: looking at so many first hand accounts as you have,
Speaker 4: do you have an inclination as to what you might
Speaker 4: guess could be happening? Like do you think this is
Speaker 4: an interplanetary beings coming here across the galaxy? Do you
Speaker 4: think they're from Earth maybe? Or the future? Or interdimensional
Speaker 4: which seems to be the front running theories right now.
Speaker 5: The only different dimension that I can think of that
Speaker 5: science says exists the dimension that light lives in. A
Speaker 5: photon will take one hundred thousand years to cross the
Speaker 5: galaxy from our point of view Einsteinian at the speed
Speaker 5: of light, space and time disappear. There is no time,
Speaker 5: and there is no space at the speed of light,
Speaker 5: and that's a measurable thing. It's three hundred thousand kilometers
Speaker 5: a second from our point of view, but from photon's
Speaker 5: point of view, there is no time between the point
Speaker 5: of emission when a photon blasts out the Sun to
Speaker 5: the point of absorption wherever it may land. So that
Speaker 5: creates a dimension timeless and spaceless that I think that
Speaker 5: aliens might utilize to travel the stars because it would
Speaker 5: literally be instantaneous, which is amazing because then the entire
Speaker 5: universe is your oyster.
Speaker 4: Perhaps that technology to do that. You know, we're limited
Speaker 4: by what we can see with our vision as human beings,
Speaker 4: that's how our spectrum is, and then we're limited by
Speaker 4: our technology, which sees a little bit more than what
Speaker 4: we can see.
Speaker 5: To answer your question, I think the most obvious answer
Speaker 5: is probably the right one. That there are trillions of planets.
Speaker 5: It's like two hundred quintillion plants.
Speaker 4: Oh, it's so insanely high. And you know what you
Speaker 4: just brought up that we saw our first exo planet,
Speaker 4: like what late eighties, nineties right in there, that was
Speaker 4: the first one. So before that, we never even thought
Speaker 4: there were any planets out there. Then we found one,
Speaker 4: then we found two. Keeps going up. Now it's believed
Speaker 4: that for every star that we can see, I think
Speaker 4: it's one, one in five will have an north like planet.
Speaker 5: One in five we'll have a rocky planet, a rocky planet.
Speaker 5: One in five stars out there have a rocky planet.
Speaker 5: And then some percentage of those will be in the
Speaker 5: Goldilock zone, and some percentage of those will have actually
Speaker 5: given birth to what we define as life.
Speaker 4: Now, when you talk about the trillions of stars that
Speaker 4: we know of, the math starts getting pretty likely that
Speaker 4: there's intelligent life out here. Of course, the debates whether
Speaker 4: or not it's been here exactly, and how in the
Speaker 4: world they would do that.
Speaker 5: You know, I mean, for a long time it's nothing
Speaker 5: can travel at the speed of light. Well, yeah, nothing
Speaker 5: physical can travel at the speed of light, but light
Speaker 5: travels at the speed of light. So if there was
Speaker 5: a way to convert regular matter into photonic substance and
Speaker 5: then back again, and this might be why we hear
Speaker 5: reports of UFOs breaking into two pieces merging back together
Speaker 5: when some people enter a UFO, that the UFO will
Speaker 5: be thirty meters across and inside it will be the
Speaker 5: size of a football field. They obviously can play with matter, space,
Speaker 5: and time in ways that we can't fathom. It might
Speaker 5: be why UFOs appear to blink out of existence faster
Speaker 5: than the eye can follow. There's a lot of evidence
Speaker 5: pointing to the fact that they may have technology like
Speaker 5: that that can somehow convert matter into light and back again.
Speaker 4: Where these guys talk about folding space that they're not
Speaker 4: really transversing that distance. They're folding space right, doing a
Speaker 4: wormhole thing. So maybe they have the technology to do that.
Speaker 4: And it's not a long journey. When people say you
Speaker 4: can't get there from here because it would take us
Speaker 4: one hundred years to get there or whatever, that makes
Speaker 4: no sense to me because that's just going on the
Speaker 4: rockets that we have today.
Speaker 5: Oh yeah, that's Stanton Friedman. He tore that apart.
Speaker 4: He looked great with that.
Speaker 5: You know, he's one of the heroes of ufology because
Speaker 5: he just ripped that to shreds as a nuclear physicist.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it was awesome. There's enough evidence of something going
Speaker 4: on here to warrant more scientific investoration of these claims.
Speaker 5: I think it's the only thing that's going on that
Speaker 5: truly warrants more scientific investigation. Look, science itself has been
Speaker 5: at a standstill for fifty years. Okay, we have made
Speaker 5: zero progress in physics. I mean we've lost sight of
Speaker 5: the real problems of physics, you know, one of which
Speaker 5: is why the hell does time and space disappear at
Speaker 5: three hundred thousand kilometers a second? What's going on there?
Speaker 4: What happened to three oh one?
Speaker 5: Exactly?
Speaker 4: That's good stuff, Thomas. I want to get your thoughts
Speaker 4: on what you think our government might know, and if
Speaker 4: you'll indulge me for just a second here, I wanted
Speaker 4: to kind of run through a couple of these things
Speaker 4: for you. They have this huge history of what certainly
Speaker 4: appears to be intentional denial of any knowledge of ET
Speaker 4: life or UFOs, going back to nineteen forty eight, Project
Speaker 4: sign forty nine had Project Grunge, and then we had
Speaker 4: Project Blue Book of course for seventeen years, and then
Speaker 4: there was these other series of reports that came out
Speaker 4: in fifty three we had the Robertson Panel, then the
Speaker 4: Content Committee, and in sixty eight leave not to mention
Speaker 4: the nonsense that they put out about Roswell. In forty
Speaker 4: seven it was a weather balloon, and in ninety four
Speaker 4: it was Project Mogul, and then in ninety seven it
Speaker 4: was a parachute crash test dummy, all of which do
Speaker 4: not seem to be true. So then we finally get
Speaker 4: some actual information in twenty seventeen when they said that
Speaker 4: the a TIP program, the Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program,
Speaker 4: was made public, admitting that they were in fact looking
Speaker 4: into these aerial phenomena. Then in twenty twenty one, the
Speaker 4: Director of National Intelligence released reports saying we cannot explain
Speaker 4: one hundred and forty three of these one hundred and
Speaker 4: forty four UAP cases. So we get to twenty twenty
Speaker 4: four and this new department ARROW, the All Domain Anomaly
Speaker 4: Resolution Office, is finally going to give us some information.
Speaker 4: And what happens even though all these things happen in
Speaker 4: twenty seventeen, and even though all these people gave them
Speaker 4: all this information, they come out and say there's no
Speaker 4: evidence of anything at all being extraterrestrial. It could have
Speaker 4: at least said we can't explain everything, but they didn't.
Speaker 4: They went the other way. To me exposes them as
Speaker 4: merely a proper Ganda organization.
Speaker 5: What do you think, Well, that's exactly what they are.
Speaker 5: They're doing their job. They're trying to put the toothpaste
Speaker 5: back into the tube. Government, the control, the structures of control, right,
Speaker 5: the pillars of power that run this world and have
Speaker 5: run the world for the last two thousand years. You know,
Speaker 5: we're still living under a rain. You know, there are
Speaker 5: kings and queens. Now it's a money rain. They've just
Speaker 5: changed the names and the faces. But we still live
Speaker 5: under a serious power structure. And that power structure is
Speaker 5: struggling with something right now that no other power structure
Speaker 5: has had to before, and that is the democratization of information.
Speaker 5: That's why they're trying to shut down TikTok. You know,
Speaker 5: it's not because the Chinese are stealing information. All those
Speaker 5: companies have access to all of the information. Of course
Speaker 5: they do. It's a commodity. What they don't want is
Speaker 5: some kid on TikTok learning about what's really going on
Speaker 5: in the Ukraine, right right, that's what they don't want one.
Speaker 5: That's why we're dealing with the advent of what I
Speaker 5: think is totalitarian control here in the West, and in
Speaker 5: a lot of ways, the UFO phenomenon is the tip
Speaker 5: of the spear. That's the one thing that could blow
Speaker 5: this whole thing wide open. They can't have that. They
Speaker 5: also understand that it's happening, so trying to get a handle,
Speaker 5: trying to get ahead of it, trying to stay in
Speaker 5: control of it is their number one job. So it's
Speaker 5: people like you, it's people like us, it's everyone listening.
Speaker 5: It's the people who are interested in this. We're the
Speaker 5: only hope. We're the last and only hope to keep
Speaker 5: the flame alive to get the truth out there, because
Speaker 5: it will happen. I mean, it's inevitable, the truth will
Speaker 5: out right.
Speaker 4: I definitely think we're on the right side of history here.
Speaker 4: I definitely believe that. Well, brother, we got to stop
Speaker 4: there now. A lot of fun. Brother, Thanks again for
Speaker 4: coming on. We will be back next week with an
Speaker 4: all new episode. You can follow me Captain Ron on
Speaker 4: Twitter and Instagram at CD underscore Captain Ron. Stay connected
Speaker 4: by checking out Contact in the Desert dot com. Stay
Speaker 4: open minded and rational as we explore the unknown right
Speaker 4: here on the iHeartRadio and Coast to Coast AM Paranormal
Speaker 4: Podcast Network.
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