1
00:00:08,840 --> 00:00:10,960
Speaker 1: Hell loa and welcome to Savor production of iHeart Radio.

2
00:00:10,960 --> 00:00:12,120
Speaker 1: I'm Annie Reese and I'm.

3
00:00:12,039 --> 00:00:14,319
Speaker 2: Lauren Vogel Bam, and today we have an episode for

4
00:00:14,360 --> 00:00:15,680
Speaker 2: you about Turkish delight.

5
00:00:16,720 --> 00:00:19,680
Speaker 3: Yes, was there any particular reason this was on your mind?

6
00:00:19,720 --> 00:00:20,040
Speaker 4: Lauren?

7
00:00:20,640 --> 00:00:21,800
Speaker 3: Well ed?

8
00:00:21,880 --> 00:00:25,320
Speaker 2: Alpha tyre was this past weekend. It's a holiday celebrating

9
00:00:25,400 --> 00:00:28,280
Speaker 2: the end in the breaking of the fast of the

10
00:00:28,320 --> 00:00:32,200
Speaker 2: holy month of Ramadan. And it's a family and community holiday,

11
00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:34,599
Speaker 2: you know, like people dress up nice kids especially might

12
00:00:34,640 --> 00:00:38,240
Speaker 2: get gifts. There's feasting and a lot of treats, and

13
00:00:38,840 --> 00:00:40,880
Speaker 2: you know, of course there are all kinds of traditions

14
00:00:40,880 --> 00:00:43,720
Speaker 2: and cuisines attached to eat all around the world. But

15
00:00:44,960 --> 00:00:47,839
Speaker 2: a treat that I saw come up pretty often was

16
00:00:47,960 --> 00:00:50,280
Speaker 2: Turkish delight, and I've been wanting to do an episode

17
00:00:50,280 --> 00:00:50,600
Speaker 2: about it.

18
00:00:50,680 --> 00:00:55,600
Speaker 1: So here we are, Here we are. Yes, I don't

19
00:00:55,720 --> 00:00:58,520
Speaker 1: have too much experience with Turkish delight. I think I've

20
00:00:58,560 --> 00:01:01,200
Speaker 1: had some none of it. I think has been the

21
00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:02,520
Speaker 1: good stuff, shall we say?

22
00:01:02,800 --> 00:01:06,200
Speaker 2: Oh okay, yeah, I haven't had the fancy kinds, but

23
00:01:06,760 --> 00:01:11,000
Speaker 2: just the plain old like like rosewater jelly cubes type

24
00:01:11,800 --> 00:01:16,039
Speaker 2: is actually one of my favorite things. And I know

25
00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:19,160
Speaker 2: that that makes like I've seen a lot of There

26
00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:25,479
Speaker 2: have been many words spoken about how terrible Turkish delight

27
00:01:25,600 --> 00:01:30,080
Speaker 2: is on the internet. I think mostly from people who

28
00:01:30,080 --> 00:01:32,280
Speaker 2: didn't know what it was when they read Lion, the Witch,

29
00:01:32,319 --> 00:01:34,360
Speaker 2: and the Wardrobe and were imagining chocolate.

30
00:01:35,400 --> 00:01:39,160
Speaker 3: And but I really like rose water.

31
00:01:40,880 --> 00:01:45,520
Speaker 1: Yes, which, speaking of you can see our fictional foods

32
00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:48,520
Speaker 1: episode that we did on Chronicles of Narnia where we

33
00:01:48,560 --> 00:01:49,440
Speaker 1: did talk about this.

34
00:01:50,480 --> 00:01:55,360
Speaker 2: Or our rosewater episode maybe like marshmallow vaguely related?

35
00:01:55,600 --> 00:02:01,160
Speaker 3: Sure, yeah, cream of Tartar an episode of that I

36
00:02:01,280 --> 00:02:01,960
Speaker 3: definitely did.

37
00:02:02,120 --> 00:02:06,200
Speaker 2: Yes, Oh yes, I consulted my notes for that in here,

38
00:02:06,440 --> 00:02:08,520
Speaker 2: so uh perfect.

39
00:02:08,680 --> 00:02:12,440
Speaker 1: Well, I guess that breaks us to you our questions. Sure,

40
00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:19,280
Speaker 1: Turkish delight, what is it?

41
00:02:19,880 --> 00:02:20,200
Speaker 3: Well?

42
00:02:20,639 --> 00:02:23,919
Speaker 2: Turkish delight, also called lookum, is a type of soft

43
00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:27,440
Speaker 2: jelly candy that can come in any number of flavors

44
00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:32,320
Speaker 2: and like combinations with other confectionery items, but at its simplest,

45
00:02:32,400 --> 00:02:36,560
Speaker 2: you're looking at a bite sized flavored gel candy that's

46
00:02:36,560 --> 00:02:40,480
Speaker 2: sort of bouncy or slightly chewy or like tender gummy

47
00:02:40,560 --> 00:02:43,840
Speaker 2: in texture and very sweet, usually with a coating of

48
00:02:43,880 --> 00:02:47,000
Speaker 2: powdered sugar and starch to prevent the separate pieces from

49
00:02:47,000 --> 00:02:49,600
Speaker 2: sticking together in the box, or you know, whatever receptacle

50
00:02:49,639 --> 00:02:53,360
Speaker 2: they come in. The flavor might be rose water or

51
00:02:53,440 --> 00:02:57,640
Speaker 2: another floral, maybe vanilla, or citrus like orange or lemon,

52
00:02:57,880 --> 00:03:00,840
Speaker 2: or another fruit like pomegranate or bear of some kind.

53
00:03:01,440 --> 00:03:03,960
Speaker 2: The gel tends to be brightly colored, often with food coloring.

54
00:03:04,680 --> 00:03:06,320
Speaker 3: But all of that is.

55
00:03:06,760 --> 00:03:12,359
Speaker 2: Just the tip of the Turkish delight iceberg. Because locum

56
00:03:12,600 --> 00:03:15,720
Speaker 2: can be studded or rolled in chopped nuts like mustachios

57
00:03:15,760 --> 00:03:19,560
Speaker 2: or almonds, or dried fruit like dates or coconut. It

58
00:03:19,560 --> 00:03:21,560
Speaker 2: can be layered with nougat and rolled up like a

59
00:03:21,600 --> 00:03:24,040
Speaker 2: little jelly roll. You can wrap it around a cream

60
00:03:24,080 --> 00:03:25,720
Speaker 2: filling or coated with chocolate if.

61
00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:26,000
Speaker 4: You want to.

62
00:03:27,080 --> 00:03:29,840
Speaker 2: It's often served as a snack or a dessert, especially

63
00:03:29,840 --> 00:03:33,399
Speaker 2: with like strong coffee or tea, and on special occasions,

64
00:03:34,120 --> 00:03:38,480
Speaker 2: each piece is just a sweet, squoshy little pillow. It's like,

65
00:03:39,640 --> 00:03:42,920
Speaker 2: you know how there's always some brand of stuffed animals

66
00:03:43,240 --> 00:03:46,000
Speaker 2: that becomes like a pop culture thing, you know, like

67
00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:49,480
Speaker 2: beanie babies or squish mollows or whatever it is at

68
00:03:49,520 --> 00:03:52,880
Speaker 2: the time, But like stuffed animals themselves are just incredibly

69
00:03:52,920 --> 00:03:57,240
Speaker 2: classic because they're just soft and nice. Yeah, locum is

70
00:03:57,280 --> 00:04:00,840
Speaker 2: like eating a hug with a fun stuffed animal.

71
00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:06,360
Speaker 3: I'm pillow pit partial myself.

72
00:04:06,480 --> 00:04:12,440
Speaker 1: Oh uh huh yeah yeah, but it is lovely, yeah right,

73
00:04:12,880 --> 00:04:14,640
Speaker 1: and there's it's just fun.

74
00:04:15,360 --> 00:04:19,400
Speaker 3: There's nothing wrong fun, no, there is it?

75
00:04:22,880 --> 00:04:27,600
Speaker 2: So uh yes, a Turkish delight is within the category

76
00:04:27,680 --> 00:04:30,760
Speaker 2: of like jelly or gummy type candies. So what you're

77
00:04:30,760 --> 00:04:34,440
Speaker 2: looking to do when you're making it is to figure

78
00:04:34,440 --> 00:04:38,440
Speaker 2: out a way to make sugar slightly chewy. And there

79
00:04:38,480 --> 00:04:40,800
Speaker 2: are a number of ways to do that, like sugar

80
00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:43,720
Speaker 2: just by itself, plus water can be cooked to it

81
00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:46,599
Speaker 2: to a soft chewy stage. But we're looking for a

82
00:04:46,680 --> 00:04:49,000
Speaker 2: gel here, which means that you're gonna want to add

83
00:04:49,040 --> 00:04:52,159
Speaker 2: something that'll glom onto water and form like a like

84
00:04:52,200 --> 00:04:56,480
Speaker 2: a soft scaffold kind of kind of thing within the mass.

85
00:04:57,240 --> 00:05:00,400
Speaker 2: And that something can be a starch like cornstarcher pectin

86
00:05:00,920 --> 00:05:06,320
Speaker 2: and or a protein like gelatin. Gelatin is controversial. Don't

87
00:05:06,320 --> 00:05:14,160
Speaker 2: come at me, people do use it. I'm sorry, I'm

88
00:05:14,200 --> 00:05:20,120
Speaker 2: like a little nervous. This is something that people have

89
00:05:20,160 --> 00:05:24,880
Speaker 2: opinions about, for sure, you know, we love strong opinions.

90
00:05:25,320 --> 00:05:28,239
Speaker 2: But also right, I'm not telling you, I'm just reporting

91
00:05:28,279 --> 00:05:34,640
Speaker 2: the facts. Okay, So to make crystallized sugar into a

92
00:05:34,720 --> 00:05:38,279
Speaker 2: chewy gel, you heat it with water or other liquid

93
00:05:38,360 --> 00:05:40,800
Speaker 2: until it dissolves, and then keep cooking it to simmer

94
00:05:40,839 --> 00:05:44,280
Speaker 2: out a bunch of the water and sugar.

95
00:05:44,360 --> 00:05:45,000
Speaker 4: But by which I.

96
00:05:44,920 --> 00:05:48,520
Speaker 2: Mean soucrose here really likes being a crystal, so you

97
00:05:48,600 --> 00:05:53,239
Speaker 2: have to do this carefully. To prevent recrystallization. You can

98
00:05:53,400 --> 00:05:57,400
Speaker 2: add an already stable liquid sugar like corn starch, and

99
00:05:57,640 --> 00:06:00,440
Speaker 2: or add cream of tartar, which breaks soup grows down

100
00:06:00,440 --> 00:06:03,200
Speaker 2: into fruitose and glucose, which don't care as much about

101
00:06:03,200 --> 00:06:06,000
Speaker 2: being in crystal form. How much water you simmer out

102
00:06:06,040 --> 00:06:09,760
Speaker 2: during this process depends. I've read recipes for softball stage

103
00:06:09,880 --> 00:06:13,080
Speaker 2: and for hardball stage, which are candy making terms that

104
00:06:13,160 --> 00:06:15,839
Speaker 2: describe what the sugar will do when it cools down.

105
00:06:16,480 --> 00:06:19,240
Speaker 2: But in either case you wind up with this gel

106
00:06:19,279 --> 00:06:21,320
Speaker 2: instead of like a toffi or caramel sort of thing,

107
00:06:21,480 --> 00:06:23,839
Speaker 2: because that starch that you add will will hold on

108
00:06:23,920 --> 00:06:26,640
Speaker 2: to a bit of extra water dispersed evenly through the

109
00:06:26,680 --> 00:06:30,240
Speaker 2: sugar mixture. When you heat starch and water, it'll gelatinize,

110
00:06:30,240 --> 00:06:35,040
Speaker 2: forming a flexible matrix. The set on the final candy

111
00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:38,200
Speaker 2: can be anywhere from like pillowy, soft gummy like sort

112
00:06:38,240 --> 00:06:41,560
Speaker 2: of like a extra soft gum drop in texture to

113
00:06:41,760 --> 00:06:46,000
Speaker 2: more stretchy or chewy. People have opinions about which is

114
00:06:46,120 --> 00:06:51,600
Speaker 2: correct or preferable. Again, I'm not here to tell you

115
00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:53,080
Speaker 2: your Turkish delight business.

116
00:06:54,440 --> 00:06:56,000
Speaker 3: No no no, no no no.

117
00:06:57,560 --> 00:07:01,640
Speaker 2: Flavorings can vary. A lot water or orange blossom water

118
00:07:01,760 --> 00:07:04,680
Speaker 2: are perhaps the most traditional. A lot of recipes do

119
00:07:04,760 --> 00:07:07,160
Speaker 2: call for some tart citrus juice like lemon or lime

120
00:07:07,240 --> 00:07:09,240
Speaker 2: in with the water as you're cooking down the sugar.

121
00:07:09,480 --> 00:07:11,280
Speaker 2: It'll provide a little bit of flavor and also help

122
00:07:11,280 --> 00:07:15,040
Speaker 2: prevent crystallization. You can use almost all fruit juice, though,

123
00:07:15,120 --> 00:07:18,360
Speaker 2: like maybe pomegranate or BlackBerry. You can use milk. You

124
00:07:18,400 --> 00:07:21,320
Speaker 2: can add flavoring like mint or coffee to the jel itself.

125
00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:24,160
Speaker 2: You can add flavoring to the powder coating, like maybe

126
00:07:24,160 --> 00:07:29,560
Speaker 2: cinnamon or cocoa. But once you get beyond the territory

127
00:07:29,640 --> 00:07:33,160
Speaker 2: of this is a soft gummy candy and into the

128
00:07:33,720 --> 00:07:37,560
Speaker 2: arena of this is a base for something more complicated.

129
00:07:38,320 --> 00:07:43,200
Speaker 2: People do all kinds of wild things, any fruit flavor,

130
00:07:43,240 --> 00:07:46,080
Speaker 2: you can imagine, any type of nuts, all kinds of

131
00:07:46,120 --> 00:07:50,240
Speaker 2: cream fillings or jams, or like soft chocolate, you know,

132
00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:53,680
Speaker 2: coat it in any dang thing you like, rice, crispies,

133
00:07:53,960 --> 00:08:02,400
Speaker 2: I don't know, crushed oreos, saffron, Okay, confusing but cool. Yeah,

134
00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:04,920
Speaker 2: Turkish delight can also be used as a filling in

135
00:08:05,040 --> 00:08:09,480
Speaker 2: chocolates or pastries. And yeah, it can be a simple

136
00:08:09,520 --> 00:08:13,440
Speaker 2: treat with coffee or a fancy gift or a snack

137
00:08:13,480 --> 00:08:16,800
Speaker 2: at celebrations. I understand that. I read that in some

138
00:08:16,840 --> 00:08:21,280
Speaker 2: Turkish funerary traditions, locum is served to mourners on specific

139
00:08:21,280 --> 00:08:26,040
Speaker 2: anniversaries of the loved one's death. I couldn't find much

140
00:08:26,040 --> 00:08:27,880
Speaker 2: more about it than that, so if you have any

141
00:08:27,920 --> 00:08:30,920
Speaker 2: experience with this, please write in. I know asking about

142
00:08:30,960 --> 00:08:33,280
Speaker 2: funerary traditions on a food show is a little weird,

143
00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:35,120
Speaker 2: but you know us that it's not that weird.

144
00:08:36,840 --> 00:08:40,480
Speaker 1: No, and there are a lot of funerary traditions that

145
00:08:40,600 --> 00:08:44,439
Speaker 1: involve food. So oh of course, yeah, m hm, Well

146
00:08:44,920 --> 00:08:51,360
Speaker 1: what about the nutrition. Sugar is a treat? Treats are nice? Yes, yes, indeed,

147
00:08:53,240 --> 00:08:55,440
Speaker 1: we do have a couple numbers for you, we do.

148
00:08:56,080 --> 00:08:56,880
Speaker 4: Okay, So.

149
00:08:58,320 --> 00:09:01,600
Speaker 2: Turkish delight is not only from Turkey, but it's from

150
00:09:02,040 --> 00:09:06,439
Speaker 2: the wider surrounding area but there are laws in Turkey

151
00:09:06,880 --> 00:09:10,720
Speaker 2: about what canon cannot be called Turkish delight, and one

152
00:09:10,800 --> 00:09:14,120
Speaker 2: that I found very specific is that the moisture content

153
00:09:15,160 --> 00:09:20,600
Speaker 2: in locom can only be sixteen percent that otherwise it's

154
00:09:20,640 --> 00:09:27,200
Speaker 2: not locom. Wow, yeah, that is very specific. Well, it

155
00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:30,080
Speaker 2: can be under that, but it cannot be run that anyway. Okay,

156
00:09:30,240 --> 00:09:33,160
Speaker 2: sixteen percent. As of two thousand and one, locum made

157
00:09:33,240 --> 00:09:37,560
Speaker 2: up some ten percent of Turkey's confectionery industry, which amounted

158
00:09:37,600 --> 00:09:39,640
Speaker 2: to about forty two thousand tons.

159
00:09:42,120 --> 00:09:44,480
Speaker 4: Wow. Yeah, that's only ten percent.

160
00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:49,320
Speaker 3: People like candy treats are nice.

161
00:09:49,320 --> 00:09:56,040
Speaker 2: It's true, that's true. There has also this isn't there's

162
00:09:56,080 --> 00:09:59,600
Speaker 2: a number in here. There has been a wide scoping

163
00:09:59,679 --> 00:10:04,920
Speaker 2: music festival in Macedonia called Locomfest for a couple decades.

164
00:10:05,160 --> 00:10:07,800
Speaker 2: It was named after like the spirit of sharing cultures

165
00:10:07,840 --> 00:10:09,920
Speaker 2: and customs over a little bit of locom and some

166
00:10:10,040 --> 00:10:13,480
Speaker 2: coffee in like old marketplaces like it's held in an

167
00:10:13,559 --> 00:10:17,160
Speaker 2: Ottoman era, bizarre from like the fourteen hundreds. It was

168
00:10:17,160 --> 00:10:20,880
Speaker 2: in its seventeenth year in twenty twenty three, having hosted

169
00:10:20,920 --> 00:10:23,319
Speaker 2: some eighty bands over the years, but their website has

170
00:10:23,360 --> 00:10:26,360
Speaker 2: not been updated since then. So I do not know

171
00:10:26,400 --> 00:10:30,200
Speaker 2: the fate of Locomfest.

172
00:10:29,120 --> 00:10:34,080
Speaker 1: Once again, listeners, Yeah, if you know, please write it.

173
00:10:35,200 --> 00:10:39,360
Speaker 1: But yes, there is a very interesting history behind this street.

174
00:10:40,000 --> 00:10:42,360
Speaker 2: There is, yes, and we are going to get into

175
00:10:42,360 --> 00:10:43,880
Speaker 2: that as soon as we get back from a quick

176
00:10:43,880 --> 00:10:51,840
Speaker 2: break forward from our sponsors.

177
00:10:55,120 --> 00:10:58,600
Speaker 4: And we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you. Okay.

178
00:10:59,280 --> 00:11:03,640
Speaker 1: So the origins of Turkish delight are locum are hard

179
00:11:03,720 --> 00:11:07,720
Speaker 1: to pin down. Some believe that this sweet or something

180
00:11:07,840 --> 00:11:10,840
Speaker 1: very similar to it, was invented by Arabs the ninth

181
00:11:10,880 --> 00:11:15,040
Speaker 1: century CE. Others claim it wasn't until the eighteenth century

182
00:11:15,040 --> 00:11:19,400
Speaker 1: when it was invented. Others point to similar candies that

183
00:11:19,440 --> 00:11:20,960
Speaker 1: were being made in the Middle Ages.

184
00:11:21,960 --> 00:11:22,840
Speaker 4: Mysteries history.

185
00:11:23,040 --> 00:11:26,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, the predecessors of Turkish delight as we know

186
00:11:26,920 --> 00:11:29,840
Speaker 2: it today would have had a slightly different flavor and texture.

187
00:11:30,480 --> 00:11:33,680
Speaker 2: The sugar component would have been honey or a syrup

188
00:11:33,720 --> 00:11:37,480
Speaker 2: made from cooking down juice like grape or figs or mulberries,

189
00:11:37,960 --> 00:11:40,520
Speaker 2: and the starch would have been flour, So a little

190
00:11:40,520 --> 00:11:41,280
Speaker 2: bit of a different thing.

191
00:11:42,400 --> 00:11:44,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, which is always an issue when we try to

192
00:11:44,880 --> 00:11:49,560
Speaker 1: get to the bottom of these things. But there is

193
00:11:49,640 --> 00:11:52,640
Speaker 1: one big name that comes up when trying to get

194
00:11:52,679 --> 00:11:55,280
Speaker 1: to the bottom of the history of Turkish delight, and

195
00:11:55,320 --> 00:11:59,360
Speaker 1: that is Turkey's Hadja Bakir and I apologize if I'm

196
00:11:59,360 --> 00:12:03,000
Speaker 1: mispronouncing it, please write in let me know. Which was

197
00:12:03,160 --> 00:12:08,079
Speaker 1: a confectionery opened in seventeen seventy seven in modern day Istanbul.

198
00:12:08,800 --> 00:12:12,720
Speaker 1: It was the brainchild of a confectioner named Bakir, and

199
00:12:12,760 --> 00:12:18,239
Speaker 1: it specialized in locum and this treat was incredibly popular

200
00:12:18,320 --> 00:12:21,720
Speaker 1: and words spread throughout the Ottoman Empire. They were so

201
00:12:21,960 --> 00:12:26,320
Speaker 1: popular that Sultan Mahmoud the Second hired Baker to serve

202
00:12:26,360 --> 00:12:29,480
Speaker 1: as the palace as chief confectioner, a position that remained

203
00:12:29,520 --> 00:12:32,760
Speaker 1: in his family until nineteen twenty, when the Ottoman Empire

204
00:12:32,840 --> 00:12:36,480
Speaker 1: came to an end. By this point, they were already

205
00:12:36,559 --> 00:12:39,960
Speaker 1: exporting their products to other countries around the world, and

206
00:12:40,040 --> 00:12:42,760
Speaker 1: travelers from places like England would bring the treats back

207
00:12:42,800 --> 00:12:45,560
Speaker 1: home with them too, so they were really making a

208
00:12:45,600 --> 00:12:49,320
Speaker 1: name for themselves. The business remains in the family. You

209
00:12:49,360 --> 00:12:52,800
Speaker 1: can still read about them, and they claimed the recipe

210
00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:56,880
Speaker 1: hasn't changed since the addition of cornstarch to replace the

211
00:12:57,000 --> 00:13:01,640
Speaker 1: flower in the mid eighteen hundreds. That being said, it

212
00:13:01,720 --> 00:13:06,400
Speaker 1: is also more than possible another confectioner or confectioners working

213
00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:09,200
Speaker 1: in the Palace were the ones responsible for locum, and

214
00:13:09,320 --> 00:13:14,360
Speaker 1: Hadja Bikir was the first to export it, so they

215
00:13:14,400 --> 00:13:16,839
Speaker 1: were often viewed as the original creators because of that,

216
00:13:16,920 --> 00:13:20,640
Speaker 1: but you know how it goes, probably a lot of

217
00:13:20,679 --> 00:13:22,160
Speaker 1: people were involved.

218
00:13:22,559 --> 00:13:23,319
Speaker 3: Yep, yep.

219
00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:27,079
Speaker 2: Processed sugar started being used as it became more available

220
00:13:27,679 --> 00:13:28,880
Speaker 2: in the eighteen hundreds as well.

221
00:13:30,080 --> 00:13:34,600
Speaker 1: Yes, and these early versions were flavored with almonds, pistachios, musk,

222
00:13:34,720 --> 00:13:36,359
Speaker 1: and or rose oil.

223
00:13:36,960 --> 00:13:39,200
Speaker 2: Mastic was another flavoring that was used. It's a type

224
00:13:39,200 --> 00:13:41,680
Speaker 2: of tree resin with like a kind of piny cedery

225
00:13:41,800 --> 00:13:42,440
Speaker 2: sort of flavor.

226
00:13:44,679 --> 00:13:48,120
Speaker 1: And while the ingredients were fairly simple, a recipe printed

227
00:13:48,120 --> 00:13:51,800
Speaker 1: in a journal in eighteen ninety four described the rather

228
00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:56,839
Speaker 1: arduous process of making it lots of very specific stirring

229
00:13:57,040 --> 00:14:00,319
Speaker 1: and specific directions that required two people to get the

230
00:14:00,400 --> 00:14:06,199
Speaker 1: right consistency, and perhaps because of that difficulty, Locum was

231
00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:10,199
Speaker 1: not really successfully replicated outside of Turkey for.

232
00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:11,079
Speaker 4: A long time.

233
00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:16,640
Speaker 1: That being said, jumping ahead a bit, in the nineteen twenties,

234
00:14:16,840 --> 00:14:20,880
Speaker 1: confectioners in the US began offering similar products to Locum

235
00:14:20,960 --> 00:14:24,760
Speaker 1: under a variety of names, and perhaps The most notable

236
00:14:24,840 --> 00:14:30,200
Speaker 1: example was applets, which was made with fresh apples, honey

237
00:14:30,240 --> 00:14:34,840
Speaker 1: and walnuts, and cutlets, which was the same but apricots

238
00:14:34,880 --> 00:14:38,920
Speaker 1: instead of apples. All right, so they were the product

239
00:14:38,960 --> 00:14:45,560
Speaker 1: of two Armenian immigrants, Arman Turtsegian and Mark Balaban. After

240
00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:48,480
Speaker 1: arriving in America, the two met at a YMCA in

241
00:14:48,520 --> 00:14:51,640
Speaker 1: Seattle and they decided to go into business together. They

242
00:14:51,720 --> 00:14:54,120
Speaker 1: tried a couple of things that didn't work out before

243
00:14:54,240 --> 00:14:58,400
Speaker 1: they purchased and orchard in Kashmir, Washington to use up

244
00:14:58,440 --> 00:15:03,320
Speaker 1: any extra fruit they had started making these candies. Both

245
00:15:03,400 --> 00:15:07,280
Speaker 1: had experience with locum from their childhoods in Armenia, but

246
00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:12,360
Speaker 1: they eventually realized they couldn't provide shelf stability and quality

247
00:15:12,360 --> 00:15:17,320
Speaker 1: control using the fresh off the orchard apples, so they

248
00:15:17,400 --> 00:15:21,600
Speaker 1: sold the orchards. They were intent on becoming the first

249
00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:24,760
Speaker 1: commercial producers of locum in the US, though they did

250
00:15:24,760 --> 00:15:30,280
Speaker 1: not give up this. Their product, especially the applets, gained

251
00:15:30,360 --> 00:15:34,400
Speaker 1: a lot of popularity and became a sought after tourist item.

252
00:15:35,560 --> 00:15:38,920
Speaker 1: In nineteen sixty two, the product was offered at the

253
00:15:39,040 --> 00:15:44,920
Speaker 1: Seattle's World Fair and that gave it even more popularity. Eventually,

254
00:15:46,080 --> 00:15:50,240
Speaker 1: they decreased the amount of rosewater they used and added

255
00:15:50,280 --> 00:15:53,880
Speaker 1: in some pectin. For a while they really avoided the

256
00:15:53,920 --> 00:15:58,360
Speaker 1: Turkish Delight label due to the tensions between Turkey and Armenia,

257
00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:02,360
Speaker 1: but they eventually decided to it. But when I looked

258
00:16:02,400 --> 00:16:05,720
Speaker 1: it up in their shop, you can still get applets

259
00:16:05,720 --> 00:16:10,200
Speaker 1: and cottlets and fruit delights, but you can also get

260
00:16:10,200 --> 00:16:14,640
Speaker 1: Turkish Delights. Yeah, they have a history on their website

261
00:16:14,680 --> 00:16:16,240
Speaker 1: if you want to check it out. It's really interesting.

262
00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:22,920
Speaker 1: And then yes, in nineteen fifty C. S. Lewis's The Lion,

263
00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:27,480
Speaker 1: the Witch and the Wardrobe introduced many people to Turkish Delight.

264
00:16:27,560 --> 00:16:29,480
Speaker 1: Many people who hadn't heard of it before didn't know

265
00:16:29,520 --> 00:16:35,360
Speaker 1: it right, perhaps Americans. Yes, yes, I think that is accurate.

266
00:16:36,760 --> 00:16:40,360
Speaker 1: And this was the candy that tempted Edmund Pevensey and

267
00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:45,640
Speaker 1: led him to betraying his siblings. Prior to the book's release,

268
00:16:46,280 --> 00:16:51,800
Speaker 1: the English apparently called the Sweet Lumps of Delight. In

269
00:16:51,840 --> 00:16:54,960
Speaker 1: either case, the book really made this candy sound like

270
00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:56,160
Speaker 1: it was the best thing ever.

271
00:16:57,120 --> 00:17:00,800
Speaker 4: Basically, this is what you want actually if you were

272
00:17:00,840 --> 00:17:01,320
Speaker 4: a kid.

273
00:17:02,720 --> 00:17:06,000
Speaker 1: And there are a couple of reasons why Lewis chose

274
00:17:06,160 --> 00:17:10,840
Speaker 1: this treat to exemplify that. So the UK had been

275
00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:15,280
Speaker 1: importing Turkish lights since at least eighteen sixty one, and

276
00:17:15,359 --> 00:17:19,119
Speaker 1: it was so popular a treat that specialty stores started

277
00:17:19,160 --> 00:17:19,760
Speaker 1: popping up.

278
00:17:20,320 --> 00:17:24,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, the good stuff was generally imported and expensive.

279
00:17:25,680 --> 00:17:28,560
Speaker 1: Yes, and during World War Two people would line up

280
00:17:28,720 --> 00:17:29,720
Speaker 1: for these treats.

281
00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:33,320
Speaker 2: For candy in general, Yeah, sugar was already being rationed

282
00:17:33,359 --> 00:17:35,960
Speaker 2: early on in the war by the beginning of nineteen forty.

283
00:17:37,359 --> 00:17:40,200
Speaker 1: After nineteen forty two, confectioneries were placed in the category

284
00:17:40,280 --> 00:17:43,960
Speaker 1: of items that needed both coupons and additional money to purchase.

285
00:17:44,640 --> 00:17:49,959
Speaker 1: Even with ration coupons, they were expensive. So because of this,

286
00:17:50,040 --> 00:17:54,359
Speaker 1: they became somewhat associated with Christmas as like a gift,

287
00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:57,960
Speaker 1: something people couldn't have all the time. And if you

288
00:17:58,080 --> 00:18:01,560
Speaker 1: remember from our fictional foods at episode, or perhaps your

289
00:18:01,600 --> 00:18:03,920
Speaker 1: own reading of The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe,

290
00:18:04,680 --> 00:18:09,159
Speaker 1: when we first encounter Nardia, it was always winter and

291
00:18:09,240 --> 00:18:13,800
Speaker 1: never Christmas. That story also took place during World War Two,

292
00:18:14,000 --> 00:18:16,480
Speaker 1: which is when Lewis himself was writing the book. So

293
00:18:16,560 --> 00:18:18,520
Speaker 1: it makes sense in a lot of ways that Turkish

294
00:18:18,520 --> 00:18:21,000
Speaker 1: delight was the suite that Lewis went with.

295
00:18:21,480 --> 00:18:26,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, Honestly, like Edmund is being a total goober when

296
00:18:26,880 --> 00:18:30,000
Speaker 2: he asks the White Witch for it, specifically, because it's

297
00:18:30,040 --> 00:18:32,280
Speaker 2: not just like, hey can I have candy? It's like,

298
00:18:32,480 --> 00:18:37,080
Speaker 2: hey can I have like the fancy imported candy. To

299
00:18:37,160 --> 00:18:40,760
Speaker 2: be fair, he was having a rough time, But I like.

300
00:18:40,840 --> 00:18:42,920
Speaker 3: This strong opinions about Edmund.

301
00:18:49,520 --> 00:18:50,080
Speaker 4: It's fair.

302
00:18:50,480 --> 00:18:52,600
Speaker 2: That's the entire point of the character is that he's

303
00:18:52,640 --> 00:18:54,359
Speaker 2: being a goober, and then he learns how to be

304
00:18:54,480 --> 00:18:57,320
Speaker 2: less Gooberriy, that's the whole that's the whole concept. It's

305
00:18:57,359 --> 00:19:00,920
Speaker 2: not it's yes Lewis's opinion mine.

306
00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:02,919
Speaker 4: They should print that on the back of the book.

307
00:19:03,960 --> 00:19:05,000
Speaker 4: That should be a review.

308
00:19:08,240 --> 00:19:12,119
Speaker 2: I remember seeing online and now I have no idea

309
00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:15,040
Speaker 2: if like, I don't think I just invented it whole cloth.

310
00:19:15,240 --> 00:19:20,480
Speaker 2: But I remember seeing on the internet a review for

311
00:19:21,040 --> 00:19:23,400
Speaker 2: The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe on like Amazon

312
00:19:23,520 --> 00:19:30,040
Speaker 2: or something, and some cranky old fellow being like, this

313
00:19:30,119 --> 00:19:33,560
Speaker 2: book is just chilling for Turkish delight. And I don't

314
00:19:33,560 --> 00:19:40,000
Speaker 2: even know what that is. I don't know if it

315
00:19:40,040 --> 00:19:41,040
Speaker 2: was made up or not.

316
00:19:41,359 --> 00:19:47,000
Speaker 1: But that's so funny. Someone, if that's true, that someone

317
00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:53,080
Speaker 1: took the time to be like I have to say,

318
00:19:53,080 --> 00:19:56,480
Speaker 1: as a kid, When I read that book, I had

319
00:19:56,560 --> 00:20:01,239
Speaker 1: never heard of Turkish delight, and it sounded like it

320
00:20:01,359 --> 00:20:04,200
Speaker 1: did to me, sound like, this is the best thing ever.

321
00:20:04,600 --> 00:20:07,160
Speaker 1: I must get my hands on it. And I read

322
00:20:07,200 --> 00:20:11,960
Speaker 1: a lot of kind of funny articles where they had

323
00:20:12,000 --> 00:20:15,720
Speaker 1: a similar experience, and when they tried Turkish delights, the

324
00:20:15,800 --> 00:20:19,040
Speaker 1: quality we cannot say what it was, because I again

325
00:20:19,119 --> 00:20:21,280
Speaker 1: think I probably haven't had really good Turkish light.

326
00:20:22,080 --> 00:20:23,000
Speaker 4: They're disappointed.

327
00:20:24,760 --> 00:20:27,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's also I do understand that rose water is

328
00:20:28,359 --> 00:20:32,960
Speaker 2: not a very common flavor that a lot of Americans

329
00:20:33,760 --> 00:20:36,479
Speaker 2: have encountered modernly, you know, like we that whole thing

330
00:20:36,480 --> 00:20:39,600
Speaker 2: where we really switched hard to vanilla sometime in the

331
00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:43,960
Speaker 2: eighteen hundreds. But yeah, it's you know, he just doesn't

332
00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:46,400
Speaker 2: like, like C. S. Lewis doesn't put a lot of description

333
00:20:46,520 --> 00:20:48,320
Speaker 2: into the book because it's kind of like, you know,

334
00:20:48,359 --> 00:20:50,399
Speaker 2: from his point of view, you don't really have to

335
00:20:50,440 --> 00:20:52,920
Speaker 2: describe it. It's just Turkish delight. It's something that everyone

336
00:20:53,520 --> 00:20:58,439
Speaker 2: is familiar with. But yeah, it's in this fancy box

337
00:20:58,960 --> 00:21:02,480
Speaker 2: and hears magically because the White Witch just kind of

338
00:21:02,520 --> 00:21:06,439
Speaker 2: summons it. And yeah, the only thing that he writes

339
00:21:06,520 --> 00:21:08,720
Speaker 2: is that each piece was sweet and light to the

340
00:21:08,840 --> 00:21:12,480
Speaker 2: very center and Edmund had never tasted anything more delicious.

341
00:21:13,240 --> 00:21:18,920
Speaker 4: That's it. The imagination does wonder story.

342
00:21:23,240 --> 00:21:24,359
Speaker 3: I mean, you gotta figure it.

343
00:21:24,440 --> 00:21:26,520
Speaker 2: I mean, you know it's you gotta figure it's good

344
00:21:26,600 --> 00:21:29,000
Speaker 2: because he's willing to sell out his family for more

345
00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:29,760
Speaker 2: Turkish delight.

346
00:21:31,240 --> 00:21:32,159
Speaker 4: Yeah, but I.

347
00:21:32,320 --> 00:21:34,280
Speaker 2: Think you're missing. I mean, that's missing the point that

348
00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:38,399
Speaker 2: it's enchanted. It's you know, right, it's not just the

349
00:21:38,440 --> 00:21:42,880
Speaker 2: Turkish delight, right, but especially it.

350
00:21:43,320 --> 00:21:44,800
Speaker 1: As a kid who had never heard of it, and

351
00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:47,359
Speaker 1: you're like, oh, why can't I get this?

352
00:21:47,560 --> 00:21:53,119
Speaker 4: What is this? Yeah? But you can.

353
00:21:53,280 --> 00:21:53,800
Speaker 2: I mean.

354
00:21:55,240 --> 00:21:59,520
Speaker 1: Turkish Light is still going strong, a lot of story,

355
00:21:59,560 --> 00:22:02,720
Speaker 1: special life in it. The store we mentioned still going

356
00:22:02,840 --> 00:22:04,480
Speaker 1: and how's a really interesting history if you want to

357
00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:04,879
Speaker 1: look it up.

358
00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:11,480
Speaker 2: Uh yeah, yeah, and right in America that's Liberty Orchards, Yes,

359
00:22:11,920 --> 00:22:14,920
Speaker 2: that is yes. And then yeah, there are all kinds

360
00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:19,000
Speaker 2: of guides to all the best sweet shops around Istanbul

361
00:22:19,040 --> 00:22:22,800
Speaker 2: and beyond. If oh, if you ever have gotten a

362
00:22:22,880 --> 00:22:26,359
Speaker 2: chance to go, if you have a favorite like weird

363
00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:30,480
Speaker 2: cool flavor, if yes, one want to know all about it?

364
00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:31,600
Speaker 4: We do.

365
00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:35,360
Speaker 1: But that is what we have to say about Turkish.

366
00:22:35,119 --> 00:22:35,760
Speaker 4: Delight for now.

367
00:22:37,119 --> 00:22:39,239
Speaker 2: We do already have some listener mail for you, though,

368
00:22:39,280 --> 00:22:40,560
Speaker 2: and we are going to get into that as soon

369
00:22:40,600 --> 00:22:42,320
Speaker 2: as we get back from one more quick break for

370
00:22:42,320 --> 00:22:53,880
Speaker 2: a word from our sponsors, and we're back.

371
00:22:53,920 --> 00:22:58,720
Speaker 3: Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you, and we're back with listen.

372
00:23:00,960 --> 00:23:05,919
Speaker 4: May Delight.

373
00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:07,080
Speaker 3: Yeah.

374
00:23:07,720 --> 00:23:13,760
Speaker 1: Yes, speaking of Michael wrote and one of your recent

375
00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:17,080
Speaker 1: listener mails you were discussing hatch green chili and ask

376
00:23:17,080 --> 00:23:20,280
Speaker 1: for recipes. Here's a link to the way back machine

377
00:23:20,280 --> 00:23:22,280
Speaker 1: that has a copy of the now out of print

378
00:23:22,480 --> 00:23:25,679
Speaker 1: Coachina Day, New Mexico. This is a recipe book that

379
00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:28,080
Speaker 1: was put out by the Power Company of New Mexico

380
00:23:28,320 --> 00:23:31,760
Speaker 1: P and M. This book is what our family used

381
00:23:31,960 --> 00:23:35,600
Speaker 1: for years. It has the basis for some really good

382
00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:40,640
Speaker 1: green chili dishes and other local favorites. Okay, so listeners,

383
00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:43,040
Speaker 1: if you want to write in, if you if you

384
00:23:43,119 --> 00:23:46,000
Speaker 1: want the link, write in, we'll send it to you.

385
00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:47,520
Speaker 4: But thank you.

386
00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:52,320
Speaker 1: We'd love we'd love recipes. We love books, yes, and

387
00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:54,800
Speaker 1: I love I love green chili.

388
00:23:55,040 --> 00:23:59,280
Speaker 4: So I have some canned stuff.

389
00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:03,440
Speaker 1: I know it's not as good as the real.

390
00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:07,640
Speaker 4: Thing, but I do love it. I love it so much.

391
00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:14,560
Speaker 2: A little bit little bit of a chili fanatic over here, yeah,

392
00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:20,520
Speaker 2: just a little bit. A listener who did not include

393
00:24:20,560 --> 00:24:22,959
Speaker 2: their name wrote, I thought i'd give you my family's

394
00:24:23,000 --> 00:24:26,000
Speaker 2: Irish soda bread recipe, adjusted by me for weight based

395
00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:28,800
Speaker 2: so that I can make it super quickly. Okay, So

396
00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:31,960
Speaker 2: two hundred and fifty grams of white flour, two hundred

397
00:24:31,960 --> 00:24:33,960
Speaker 2: and fifty grams of whole meal flour, one and a

398
00:24:33,960 --> 00:24:36,159
Speaker 2: half teaspoons of salt, one and a half teaspoons of

399
00:24:36,359 --> 00:24:39,600
Speaker 2: bicarbonate of soda, four hundred and fifty grams of buttermilk.

400
00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:43,840
Speaker 2: Preheat oven to two hundred celsius. I'm not going to

401
00:24:43,880 --> 00:24:46,840
Speaker 2: do that translation for you. Sorry, not sorry, And line

402
00:24:46,880 --> 00:24:49,080
Speaker 2: a dust pan with flour. Sift to the flowers, the

403
00:24:49,119 --> 00:24:51,440
Speaker 2: salt and the soda. Add the buttermilk and mix with

404
00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:54,040
Speaker 2: a spoon until it's come together. Tip onto a surface,

405
00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:56,520
Speaker 2: bring into a ball, Put onto a tray, and with

406
00:24:56,600 --> 00:24:59,080
Speaker 2: a flowered long sharp knife, cut across on the top

407
00:24:59,119 --> 00:25:01,879
Speaker 2: of the dough about three centimeters deep. Bake for twenty

408
00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:05,080
Speaker 2: to thirty five minutes until the loaf sounds hollow when

409
00:25:05,119 --> 00:25:08,600
Speaker 2: tapped underneath. Transferred to a wire rackt to cool completely

410
00:25:08,800 --> 00:25:12,480
Speaker 2: before serving. I love it with butter and marmalade.

411
00:25:16,520 --> 00:25:17,560
Speaker 4: Thank you so much. Again.

412
00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:24,160
Speaker 1: We love recipes and this sounds very simple, like possibly

413
00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:28,600
Speaker 1: I won't mess it up. That's the whole point of

414
00:25:28,640 --> 00:25:35,399
Speaker 1: this bread Annie, Yes, I know, but I yeah, just

415
00:25:35,480 --> 00:25:39,320
Speaker 1: sounds super easy. And I do love like the insider

416
00:25:39,400 --> 00:25:42,800
Speaker 1: tips of you know, tapping on the just tap it

417
00:25:42,840 --> 00:25:45,600
Speaker 1: and see if it sounds hollow or things like that. Yeah,

418
00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:48,160
Speaker 1: I just love these sort of things we pass along

419
00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:51,000
Speaker 1: to people. My friend has one with watermelon when she's like,

420
00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:54,320
Speaker 1: if you look for the yellow spot and if you

421
00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:56,960
Speaker 1: tap it, it sounds like this, that's a good water.

422
00:25:57,640 --> 00:26:05,240
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, yeah, no, that's absolutely still haven't still haven't

423
00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:06,120
Speaker 2: done any baking yet.

424
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:11,879
Speaker 4: We're falling down, Lord, we are. We need to catch up.

425
00:26:13,600 --> 00:26:15,280
Speaker 2: Our feast is ever increasing.

426
00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:19,119
Speaker 4: That feast is gonna kill us.

427
00:26:21,880 --> 00:26:23,680
Speaker 2: It's gonna have to be like a month long event,

428
00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:28,679
Speaker 2: savor fest feast something like that.

429
00:26:30,080 --> 00:26:33,520
Speaker 1: Well, thank you so much to both of these listeners

430
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:35,600
Speaker 1: for writing in. If you would like to write shows,

431
00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:38,600
Speaker 1: you can. Our email is hello at saberpod dot com.

432
00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:40,840
Speaker 2: We're also on social media. You can find us on

433
00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:43,600
Speaker 2: blue Sky and Instagram at saver pod and we do

434
00:26:43,640 --> 00:26:46,480
Speaker 2: hope to hear from you. Savor Is production of iHeartRadio.

435
00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:48,800
Speaker 2: For more podcasts from my heart Radio, you can visit

436
00:26:48,840 --> 00:26:51,879
Speaker 2: the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to

437
00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:54,800
Speaker 2: your favorite shows. Thanks as always to our super producers

438
00:26:54,880 --> 00:26:57,520
Speaker 2: Dylan Pagan and Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening.

439
00:26:57,600 --> 00:26:59,320
Speaker 2: Can we hope that lots more good things are coming

440
00:26:59,359 --> 00:27:01,080
Speaker 2: your way