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Speaker 1: And now move the sticks with Daniel Jeremiah and Bucky Brooks.

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Speaker 2: Was up everybody it moved this stick. I'm Bucky brook

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Speaker 2: Come here with Lancey. We're gonna recap everything had a

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Speaker 2: big D line and the linebacker's working out. I was

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Speaker 2: kind of a fantastic watch looking at the big guys

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Speaker 2: moved down the turf. Last what your thought? Give me

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Speaker 2: initial thoughts on what you saw on Thursday from the

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Speaker 2: big guy.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so the big guys were running again. The big

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Speaker 1: guys were moving.

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Speaker 2: I thought.

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Speaker 1: One guy I want to mention that I thought had

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Speaker 1: a good day just because he got on the scale

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Speaker 1: three sixty six. I know that sounds crazy, but there's

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Speaker 1: a lot of the streets were talking about to and

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Speaker 1: Andre Sweat coming in heavy and look, he's a heavy

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Speaker 1: man anyway. But three sixty six, believe it or not,

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Speaker 1: and running five to two seven. That didn't hurt him. I

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Speaker 1: don't think he came in maybe slightly under the weight

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Speaker 1: he played at the University of Texas. From what I'm hearing,

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Speaker 1: I think he may have lost some weight here recently

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Speaker 1: to get down. But what matters is he hit that scale.

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Speaker 1: Now here's what's gonna happen. He's three sixty six and

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Speaker 1: his weigh in. Then Bucky before he runs, they weigh

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Speaker 1: him again. They get the real weight. They don't get

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Speaker 1: that boxer weight, right, They get the real weight and

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Speaker 1: then he runs. So the teams are gonna get the

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Speaker 1: real workout weight, the weight he was at at the workout.

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Speaker 1: So that'll be interesting for the teams. That's not going

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Speaker 1: to be released publicly, But I thought to andanre Sweat.

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Speaker 1: Sweat helped himself out, not just not just with his

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Speaker 1: you know weight being down to three sixty six, but

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Speaker 1: the dude's a talented player and he moved well, he jumped,

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Speaker 1: I mean twenty six and a half ins vert. I

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Speaker 1: don't hate him for a guy who wears three sixty six.

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Speaker 1: But the star, I think, one of the stars. There's

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Speaker 1: two real stars for me, Bucky and that was his teammate,

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Speaker 1: Byron Murphy and then Florida State's Braden Fist. I mean,

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Speaker 1: that guy killed it on every drill. Imaginable.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, let's talk about Let's talk about a teammate first,

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Speaker 2: So tell me what you like about Byron Murphy. Did

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Speaker 2: we're talking about fifth?

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Speaker 1: Well? I thought Byron Murphy, so one he tested. Look,

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Speaker 1: he ran in the four eights, and I was disappointed.

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Speaker 1: I'm like, that's it because I was expecting to hit

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Speaker 1: four sevens, which would have been insane at two hundred

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Speaker 1: ninety seven pounds. But you know, he had a good

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Speaker 1: broad up. Like the workout, the testing was fine. But

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Speaker 1: on the field, man, he's got such great body composure,

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Speaker 1: great body control, and all the change of direction stuff

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Speaker 1: that they do, especially on that turf, you see a

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Speaker 1: lot of slipping. Guys get they don't they get their

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Speaker 1: legs out from under them, their feet in their upper

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Speaker 1: body are not aligned, and so you'll see a lot

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Speaker 1: of slipping on change of direction. Never the case of

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Speaker 1: Byron Murphy except once, I guess he ran the hoop well,

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Speaker 1: which showed the bend he was able to get over

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Speaker 1: the bag, you know, the quickness doing bag drills like

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Speaker 1: Byron Murphy did the football stuff on the field like

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Speaker 1: a really really good football player. He looked like a pro. Physically,

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Speaker 1: he looked like a pro, but also from an athleticism standpoint,

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Speaker 1: he looked different than some of those guys. So you know,

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Speaker 1: that's what I liked about Byron Murphy and Braiden Fisk.

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Speaker 1: He tested great great vertical lead broad jump. He ran

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Speaker 1: in a four four sixes for six ' nine. I

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Speaker 1: think was Braiden Fist, like, that's crazy. And he's a

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Speaker 1: defensive tackle who never stops, so he's got thirty one

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Speaker 1: inch arms, which you don't love. But he's so quick

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Speaker 1: out of the stance when you watch him that he's

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Speaker 1: on top of blockers quickly so that the length really

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Speaker 1: doesn't catch up with them that much because he's on

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Speaker 1: top of guys and he is relentless. And what we

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Speaker 1: saw is we saw him attack the combine yesterday the

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Speaker 1: same way he attacks blocks. He attacks the pocket, He

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Speaker 1: attacked the combine, he put his work in and man,

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Speaker 1: he showed office is really one of the preeminent testers

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Speaker 1: yesterday from the big men. And he looked good in

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Speaker 1: the drills too, So I thought it was a big

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Speaker 1: day to solidify Braiden Fisk as an early second round

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Speaker 1: pick more than likely.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. No, when you think about Braden Fist, he's the

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Speaker 2: boss coming out of combine, the way he work, the

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Speaker 2: way that he moved thirty half in in virtual talk

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Speaker 2: about a nine by jump, four seven eight forty yard dash,

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Speaker 2: and when you think about someone doing that at six

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Speaker 2: four ninety two. That's a wild performance. And you know

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Speaker 2: a lot of people want section, but he quietly put

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Speaker 2: together that that four to three seven short shuttle. You

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Speaker 2: just talk about the quickness all that that he put

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Speaker 2: into play. I mean, that's an exceptional time. And when

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Speaker 2: you think about just what we're looking for in interior

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Speaker 2: playmakers and the tape and how how he performed lines

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Speaker 2: up with the high motor player that he is on tape.

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Speaker 2: He helped himself because now the first thing that coach

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Speaker 2: is going to do is like, hey man, who's this

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Speaker 2: guy who's just got moving around like that? And as

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Speaker 2: we all know, this is really the first exposure that

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Speaker 2: the coaches have to the prospect. Fisk is certainly going

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Speaker 2: to be kind of like the center of attention and

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Speaker 2: a bunch of these predapt discussions.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think another guy that may help himself

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Speaker 1: a little bit that from the old acc was Ruco

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Speaker 1: Horror Horror from Clemson. You know, he just kind of

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Speaker 1: was okay this year and I talked about it with

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Speaker 1: a team and I said, you know, I really had

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Speaker 1: high hopes for him. He looked he flashed so much

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Speaker 1: last year, and what I was told was, well, you know,

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Speaker 1: be careful because he may have been a guy who

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Speaker 1: kind of regretted not coming out. And then you get

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Speaker 1: in the middle of season and like you're seeing everyone

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Speaker 1: else's playing pro ball and you're you're just waiting until

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Speaker 1: you can become a pro. And I think there was

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Speaker 1: a question about if he became a little I don't

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Speaker 1: want to say disinterested, but maybe he just didn't have

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Speaker 1: the same juice this year. And then because I had,

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Speaker 1: you know, I think he's a very has a lot

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Speaker 1: of potential. Then he runs a four to eight nine,

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Speaker 1: and he's doing that what was his way Yesterually at

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Speaker 1: two ninety four, he runs a four to eight nine

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Speaker 1: at two ninety four, jumps thirty two inches, broad jump

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Speaker 1: nine to eight. I mean, those are good explosion numbers.

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Speaker 1: I think he's somebody who kind of just woke some

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Speaker 1: people up and reminded him, hey, don't forget about me.

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Speaker 1: And Wingo was the same way at LSU. Now, Bucky,

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Speaker 1: do you care that a guy comes in at two

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Speaker 1: hundred and eighty four pounds like Makai Wingo. He's only

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Speaker 1: you know, you're talking about thirty two inch arms. He's

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Speaker 1: only six foot in a quarter to eighty four. I

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Speaker 1: guess that's where you got to go back to your

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Speaker 1: sources at LSU and find out what his true weight

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Speaker 1: was during the season, don't you.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you got to figure that out. I mean that's

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Speaker 2: why you're always trying to stay in contact with those sources.

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Speaker 2: So your sources at schools are important because it allows

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Speaker 2: you to cross reference those things. Two hundred and eighty

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Speaker 2: two or six ft is definitely not ideal. But if

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Speaker 2: there were things that you want to talk about, you

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Speaker 2: want to verify, you want to check it out, and

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Speaker 2: then you want to get from the school, Hey, what

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Speaker 2: was his work, what was his work? Ethic? Life? Like?

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Speaker 2: How different is this than what you guys know him

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Speaker 2: to be? You know, is you better work it? Anticipate

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Speaker 2: it is just better than he shown all of those things.

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Speaker 2: You want to kind of put it together because you

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Speaker 2: just don't know how guys were wired. They spend it

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Speaker 2: three or four years on camp.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and there was somebody you know, I actually really

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Speaker 1: I really like the field work in the field drills

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Speaker 1: because you do see guys who are gonna move a

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Speaker 1: little differently. Now you got to you also have to

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Speaker 1: understand when you're watching that stuff and you know, this

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Speaker 1: guy's a little stiff, he doesn't change direction. Well, what's

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Speaker 1: he asked to do. If you just have a guy

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Speaker 1: who's a two gapper that you want to have some

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Speaker 1: power like, you're not really going to see that. And

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Speaker 1: the guys who are going to be stacking shed guys,

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Speaker 1: you don't see that in combine workout that you won't

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Speaker 1: You're only going to get that in the tape. So

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Speaker 1: for some of the players, these big men, they're not

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Speaker 1: built for the combine to impress you. They're built for

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Speaker 1: the mud. They're built to get down in there and

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Speaker 1: make it messy, and that's not going to show up

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Speaker 1: on the combine. So that's all those are the tape guys,

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Speaker 1: the combine guys, the workout guys. You want to make

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Speaker 1: sure those are the ones who are the disruptors or

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Speaker 1: the guys who have expanded tackle radiuses like Iron Murphy

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Speaker 1: because he gets down the down the line so quick.

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Speaker 1: Now you mess around to have a big man that

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Speaker 1: also tests well, when then you've got a guy who's

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Speaker 1: going to shoot up the draft because that's you know,

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Speaker 1: that's something that's not the don Terry Poe's of the world.

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Speaker 1: We don't see that often, so those guys get pushed

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Speaker 1: up the draft because big, explosive and quick. Who doesn't

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Speaker 1: want that?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, everybody wants that, And that's the thing. And that's

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Speaker 2: why with these workouts with the d linemen, particularly the

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Speaker 2: interior guys, you want to make sure you keep them

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Speaker 2: in perspective because you don't expect some of your run

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Speaker 2: stoppers to be your best athlete, but you also expect

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Speaker 2: your guys that have pass vershability to be able to

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Speaker 2: show some of the athleticism that you want from high

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Speaker 2: end players. But at the end of the day, as

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Speaker 2: much as we will talk about the performances that take

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Speaker 2: place over the next two or three days at the combine,

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Speaker 2: it really comes down to matching up what they did

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Speaker 2: and Lucas Oilfield Stadium with what they've done on the tape.

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Speaker 2: However they doubz it on the turf over the course

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Speaker 2: of the weekend, that's great, but you better have some

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Speaker 2: tape that a sufficient. So that's why when we talk

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Speaker 2: about guys moving up and doing those things, they are

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Speaker 2: to the point of they will move up because they'll

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Speaker 2: have more opportunities to be talked about and that gives

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Speaker 2: them a chance to move up to charge, not necessarily

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Speaker 2: just because of workout. Then leads to everyone just kind

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Speaker 2: of sliding their name up the board.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, no doubt. How about the how about some of

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Speaker 1: the edge guys we saw?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, look, man, we knew this coming in

199
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Speaker 2: old Port Chop slash chop Robinson as advertised. When you

200
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Speaker 2: talk about the bisis and what he displayed, I mean,

201
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Speaker 2: I look, I knew he was a freak athlete, and

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Speaker 2: I knew he was on run vast and all that.

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Speaker 2: But lance the fact that he was two fifty four

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Speaker 2: he ran four four eight thirty four inch thirty four

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Speaker 2: and a half inch vertical ten eight broadject. But I

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Speaker 2: want everyone to understand the correlation between the jumps and

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Speaker 2: the forty times significant because that just kind of validates

208
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Speaker 2: the overall explosiveness that is amazing. The ten yard split

209
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Speaker 2: time of one five to four crazy. They said it

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Speaker 2: tie him amongst the fourth asses two hundred and fifty

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Speaker 2: plus pounds defenders since two thousand and three. Think about

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Speaker 2: that two thousand and three. If it's some tie for fourth,

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Speaker 2: he has definitely put himself in the conversation. As the

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Speaker 2: first round game we could talk about the production and

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Speaker 2: all that other stuff. I just know that there's the

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Speaker 2: d Lion coach that is going to stump for him

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Speaker 2: being the first round pick because they're gonna say, hey,

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Speaker 2: I can get that pass Russ stuff out of him

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Speaker 2: because he has he has the body, he has the

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Speaker 2: athleticism to be a good pass rush.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Four two five pro progility as well, which is

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Speaker 1: the short shuttle four two five is is a really

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Speaker 1: good time. He didn't run three Coner's a lot of

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Speaker 1: guys here who don't like the tracks, so they don't

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Speaker 1: run three cone here. They'll run it at their place.

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Speaker 1: He's going to be in the sixes. He's going to

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Speaker 1: break seven on three cone drill is testing. I expect

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Speaker 1: them to be a huge tester, which is why frankly,

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Speaker 1: I've got him rated higher than everyone else. I've got

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Speaker 1: a projection grade. So let's talk about that for a second. Bucky,

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Speaker 1: you've got guys like Latsu who You've got great tape,

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Speaker 1: you've got great production, and actually I thought he actually

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Speaker 1: tested pretty well, like he ran pretty well, which was good.

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Speaker 1: His biggest test is going to be something we don't see,

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Speaker 1: which is a combine medicals but then you have guys

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Speaker 1: like Uhda odafe O Way. I gave him on high

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Speaker 1: projection grade a few years ago. I'm doing the same

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Speaker 1: thing with Chop. So let's talk about a projection grade,

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Speaker 1: Bucky and what that means in terms of when you

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Speaker 1: look at look at who they are now versus who

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Speaker 1: they're going to be, because I think that gets to

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Speaker 1: fans sometimes get it mistaken and they want to they

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Speaker 1: think all the grades have to come off tape now,

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Speaker 1: But the reality is you're grading for three and five

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Speaker 1: years down the road.

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Speaker 2: You are greating for down the road, and it's one

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Speaker 2: of the things that everyone needs to do. And it's

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Speaker 2: that that fine line that you that you kind of

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Speaker 2: tow when you're when you're a scout. Hey, I love

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Speaker 2: the production now, but what is he going to be

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Speaker 2: like down the road? When we get him in the

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Speaker 2: right program, Maybe we can put him in a better scheme,

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Speaker 2: maybe he gets maybe he gets with the right coach

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Speaker 2: that can unlock some of those super hero powers he is,

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Speaker 2: I mean like child Brominson is one of those guys

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Speaker 2: talking about and you're right, he will benefit from the

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Speaker 2: fact that always flash during the time at Baltimore, there

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Speaker 2: have been other athletic freaks, like a Rashan Gary who

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Speaker 2: had maybe better athletic traits than he had production during

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Speaker 2: the time at Michigan. He'll benefit from from all of

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Speaker 2: those things. So it should be h It should be

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Speaker 2: fun to kind of watch his game develop and to

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Speaker 2: watch how someone kind of like just falls in love

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Speaker 2: and says, oh, no, I got it. I'm gonna make

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Speaker 2: this happen.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but I mean you saw, we saw it. I

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Speaker 1: know he's in the linebacker group, but the edge player,

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Speaker 1: Dallas Turner, I mean, my gosh, forty and a half

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Speaker 1: inch vertical, ten to seven broad and then he ends

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Speaker 1: up running a four four to six at two hundred

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Speaker 1: and forty seven pounds, just seven pounds lighter than Shop

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Speaker 1: with thirty four and three eights arms, almost a seven

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Speaker 1: foot wingspan for a player who is checked in at

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Speaker 1: six two and three quarters. These are seriously freaking numbers.

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Speaker 1: You're a you got a six to three guy with

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Speaker 1: a seven foot wingspan who jumps forty inches, runs in

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Speaker 1: the four fours and had a broad damn near what

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Speaker 1: chops was this is?

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Speaker 2: Like?

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Speaker 1: These are some serious, serious elite type traits. I mean,

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Speaker 1: you'd like it. Maybe a little more if he were

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Speaker 1: almost six foot four, but the wingspan kind of cancels

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Speaker 1: out your need for height. I mean, at almost sixty

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Speaker 1: three with a seven inch wingspan, you don't really care

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Speaker 1: if he's six four six four and a half.

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Speaker 2: Now, and I think what you what you allude to

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Speaker 2: is something that's really really important, that debt, wingspan, debt rank.

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Speaker 2: That's everything because when you got long arms, and we'll

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Speaker 2: talk about it when it comes to Dallas turning like

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Speaker 2: in terms of just being able to stick that arm

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Speaker 2: right in the middle of an offensive lineman's chest and

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Speaker 2: then that way you can control them whether you're going

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Speaker 2: up and around and you're coming inside. It's everything. And

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Speaker 2: then when you add what you talk about the explosive numbers,

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Speaker 2: I mean, it's what you're looking for and just in

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Speaker 2: being around elite passers and those things you just talk about,

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Speaker 2: the get off quickness and what you're able to do

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Speaker 2: when you're ask that explosive if you can just find

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Speaker 2: a mover or two, just makes it really hard on

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Speaker 2: the opponent. So I'm with you on on just the

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Speaker 2: intrigue of the athleticism.

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Speaker 1: Think about this to put it in perspective. So it's

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Speaker 1: a lot like boxing. If you ever watch boxing or

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Speaker 1: MMA or whatever, you know the guy with the long

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Speaker 1: arms or the guy with the best jab is the

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Speaker 1: one who can keep the other guy from getting inside.

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Speaker 1: Offensive linemen do not want pass rushers into their frame.

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Speaker 1: Pass rushers do not want offensive linemens into their frames.

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Speaker 1: So there's like a saying first hands that he's a

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Speaker 1: first hands player. He gets in. Whether it's with linked

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Speaker 1: with timing, because some long aren't guys had bad timing

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Speaker 1: and so they don't play to their length. But if

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Speaker 1: you can play to your length, and Alabama guys play

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Speaker 1: to their link. They are very tight with the hands,

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Speaker 1: very well timed, very efficient getting hands on you quickly.

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Speaker 1: With a guy like Dallas Turner, you're not going to

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Speaker 1: the offensive tackles are not going to be first into him.

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Speaker 1: It's just not going to happen. So it's easier. When

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Speaker 1: you can separate and have the best amount of control

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Speaker 1: on the player across from you, you got the best

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Speaker 1: chance to win. And that's why offensive line coaches they

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Speaker 1: want their tackles to have thirty four inch plus arms.

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Speaker 1: Dallas Turner, I mean for him to have that length,

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Speaker 1: who's going to be able to get into him bucket.

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Speaker 1: It's going to be hard. As long as he throws

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Speaker 1: his hands quickly, he can stay separate. And if you

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Speaker 1: stay separated and you're that kind of athlete, well then

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Speaker 1: you've got a chance to get to the ball all

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Speaker 1: the time.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And so that's the thing you talk about, being

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Speaker 2: able to get to the ball when you watch him,

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Speaker 2: And we talked about it, like in the combine today.

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Speaker 2: We talked about his length, we talked about breaking down

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Speaker 2: his movements and those things. But when you talk about

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Speaker 2: just that wingspan lance, we just talked about the prototypes

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Speaker 2: and what plays in this league for a long time.

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Speaker 2: I mean, we've just seen the amount of pass rushes

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Speaker 2: that have had a lot of success in this league

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Speaker 2: with supersize limp. He has that, and we have a

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Speaker 2: good motor, and you have a move or two that

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Speaker 2: is pretty defined and already refined going into the league

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Speaker 2: and just gives you a chance. One of the reasons

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Speaker 2: why like people always bang scouts and why they're so

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Speaker 2: obsessed with like the link and the hands, eye and

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Speaker 2: those things is just the traits. Man. You just see

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Speaker 2: the traits, and sometimes men the traits just are so

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Speaker 2: overwhelming that you have to just gamble on the traits

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Speaker 2: and hope that you got a really good coach that

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Speaker 2: can kind of take the athleticism, refine it, give us

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Speaker 2: some skills, and allow the player to play at a

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Speaker 2: high level.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and it matters. But because you know, I hear

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Speaker 1: people act like it doesn't matter. Go do a study

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Speaker 1: if you want to. These are already being done. They've

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Speaker 1: already been done. By the way you can see studies.

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Speaker 1: Teams do studies on which traits are predictive, and the

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Speaker 1: very best players, they're pro bowl players, the Hall of Famers.

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Speaker 1: They'll do different levels to find out is their commonality,

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Speaker 1: and the commonality is traits. It's already been done. The

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Speaker 1: studies have all been done. Certain guys with speed, there's

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Speaker 1: certain three cone drills they like. There's certain explosion metrics

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Speaker 1: they like. There's certain types of of arm links that

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Speaker 1: typically are more predictive as opposed to less predictive. It

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Speaker 1: doesn't mean you're going to be a pro bowler, but

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Speaker 1: these guys tend to have things in common. They tend

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Speaker 1: to have things in common, whether it's get off, explosiveness,

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Speaker 1: a certain level of power, and when you tie them

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Speaker 1: all together. I mean, why would you not want to?

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Speaker 1: It's like a It's like at a blackjack table, you okay,

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Speaker 1: you're going to hit sixteen. How come because the math

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Speaker 1: tells you to. The math also tells you and the analytics,

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Speaker 1: and the analytics is just a study of past performances.

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Speaker 1: They tell you that guys with certain traits have a

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Speaker 1: better chance of being the best players. That's just how

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Speaker 1: it is.

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Speaker 2: Look, it really is that lance when you go back

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Speaker 2: and you look at it, it's a league for the prototypes.

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Speaker 2: And I know Chris Ballad is one of your boys.

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Speaker 2: And we talked about what the Indianapolis Coasts have gone

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Speaker 2: all in on, Like we used to talk about scouts

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Speaker 2: being traits guys. I don't know if there's a team

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Speaker 2: or a general manager that is more traits and toolsy

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Speaker 2: than Chris Ballad. When you look at what the Indianapolis

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Speaker 2: Coasts have done over the last two years, they go

385
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Speaker 2: all in on the freak, on the super freaks, the

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Speaker 2: high weight speed athletic freaks that are at the upper

387
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Speaker 2: prof like the upper percentile of the athletic spectrum. They've

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Speaker 2: gone all in on that. And look, based on how

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Speaker 2: they played this year, you can't say they're wrong because

390
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Speaker 2: all those young guys, Josh Downs and all those guys,

391
00:18:56,400 --> 00:18:58,480
Speaker 2: they're beginning to play, and they're playing really, really well.

392
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Speaker 2: As those teams have success banking on trades, there are

393
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Speaker 2: more guys that are going to fall in line with that.

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Speaker 2: And so as much as I love the production, there

395
00:19:07,359 --> 00:19:11,240
Speaker 2: is something about the projection that comes with having prototypical

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Speaker 2: dimensions in athleticism and that stuff.

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Speaker 1: You just look at the best players. Michael Parsons trades Guy,

398
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Speaker 1: Josh Allen pass Rusher, Trades guy, uh t. J Watt's

399
00:19:21,600 --> 00:19:24,359
Speaker 1: okay from a trade standpoint. JJ Watt, big time tester,

400
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Speaker 1: Trades guy. It's it doesn't always work like sometime. There

401
00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:31,080
Speaker 1: are some trades guys who are average, of course, but

402
00:19:32,440 --> 00:19:37,320
Speaker 1: DeForest Buckner rare height, weight, length, explosiveness, who plays inside,

403
00:19:37,560 --> 00:19:40,160
Speaker 1: Eric Armstead. You know San Francisco builds off trades too.

404
00:19:40,400 --> 00:19:42,560
Speaker 1: If you look at them a lot of their interior

405
00:19:42,680 --> 00:19:47,399
Speaker 1: Nick Bosa, Eric Armstead, DeForest Buckner, look at how they draft.

406
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Speaker 1: They have a tendency to draft certain types of athletes.

407
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Speaker 1: Your guy from South Carolina, Uh yeah, look at Ken

408
00:19:57,040 --> 00:20:00,560
Speaker 1: Law freak shows. So they've got a certain time they

409
00:20:00,640 --> 00:20:03,919
Speaker 1: like certain freak shows height, weight, length, lean body types.

410
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Speaker 1: That's the same way Ballery it is. That's the same

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Speaker 1: way San Francisco is. Bill Parcells used to like them

412
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Speaker 1: a certain way. You know, there's certain teams that really

413
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Speaker 1: really believe in that. And I know Parcels famously said

414
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Speaker 1: there are only a certain amount of men who walk

415
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Speaker 1: the planet who look a certain way, so they've got

416
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Speaker 1: the best chances to become the freakiest guys in terms

417
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Speaker 1: of players. So that's why we talk about link. That's

418
00:20:29,560 --> 00:20:33,640
Speaker 1: why linked is. It's more of a battle of geometry

419
00:20:34,240 --> 00:20:37,359
Speaker 1: and and it really does matter. The big hands you

420
00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:39,960
Speaker 1: can control players more. If you've got big hands, you

421
00:20:40,000 --> 00:20:42,440
Speaker 1: can just try to grip a football or basketball, try

422
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Speaker 1: dunk in the basket, try to try paul in a basketball.

423
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Speaker 1: At the small hand, you can't control as well. John

424
00:20:47,520 --> 00:20:51,080
Speaker 1: Stockton had these famous like ten and a half inch hands.

425
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Speaker 1: Some did you ever see a picture of that bucket?

426
00:20:53,640 --> 00:20:56,040
Speaker 1: I know it used to make the round there was

427
00:20:56,119 --> 00:21:00,639
Speaker 1: John Stockton's hands almost covered an entire eight and a

428
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Speaker 1: half by eleven sheet of paper. There's a there's a

429
00:21:04,840 --> 00:21:07,879
Speaker 1: xerox and what it allot. I remember talking to Dennis Lindsay,

430
00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:09,439
Speaker 1: who was with the Rockets at one point and it

431
00:21:09,520 --> 00:21:12,600
Speaker 1: was GM and president of the Jazz for years. He said,

432
00:21:12,680 --> 00:21:14,359
Speaker 1: I said, why is that so important? He said, because

433
00:21:14,359 --> 00:21:16,960
Speaker 1: you can control the ball and maneuver the ball quicker

434
00:21:17,359 --> 00:21:19,800
Speaker 1: and easier. What's the same thing with quarterbacks. It's the

435
00:21:19,840 --> 00:21:23,720
Speaker 1: same things with you know, pass catchers. Like those things

436
00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:25,959
Speaker 1: just give you a They give you a leg up

437
00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:28,360
Speaker 1: when it comes time to decide between the traits guy

438
00:21:28,680 --> 00:21:31,000
Speaker 1: and a guy maybe doesn't have the traits. A lot

439
00:21:31,000 --> 00:21:33,880
Speaker 1: of people are gonna go with those. Byron Murphy's, they're

440
00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:38,240
Speaker 1: gonna go with those, you know, uh, Chop Robinson's. I'd

441
00:21:38,240 --> 00:21:40,800
Speaker 1: ask this Bucky can Shop. You know, there's some talented

442
00:21:40,800 --> 00:21:46,760
Speaker 1: pass rushers, Jared Verus a lot too. Dallas Turner. I

443
00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:49,240
Speaker 1: feel I always feel like I'm forgetting another ed rusher.

444
00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:52,919
Speaker 1: But and then you throw chopping there can chop this

445
00:21:53,080 --> 00:21:55,440
Speaker 1: kind of workout? Can he? He can he spring ahead

446
00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:57,239
Speaker 1: of the other guys. I don't know if you can

447
00:21:57,280 --> 00:21:59,520
Speaker 1: spring ahead of Dallas Turner because he maybe out worked

448
00:21:59,520 --> 00:22:00,000
Speaker 1: out you.

449
00:22:01,320 --> 00:22:04,080
Speaker 2: Yeah. No, I think I think what he can do

450
00:22:04,160 --> 00:22:05,760
Speaker 2: is I think he can put himself in the conversation

451
00:22:05,800 --> 00:22:08,359
Speaker 2: where he's firmly in the first round, and maybe he

452
00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:11,200
Speaker 2: becomes a top fifteen because he becomes the fourth guy

453
00:22:11,640 --> 00:22:13,639
Speaker 2: behind those top three guys. To think about those top

454
00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:17,360
Speaker 2: three guys, they are established pass rushing, like they got

455
00:22:17,400 --> 00:22:20,479
Speaker 2: production to go with, like the talents and stuff like that.

456
00:22:20,560 --> 00:22:22,159
Speaker 2: He doesn't have the production, So it makes it a

457
00:22:22,200 --> 00:22:25,439
Speaker 2: little harder unless someone's just willing to bank on the upside.

458
00:22:25,480 --> 00:22:27,679
Speaker 2: But the other guys with reception of a lot too,

459
00:22:27,760 --> 00:22:31,760
Speaker 2: because Lat two has the medical stuff. The other guys

460
00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:34,560
Speaker 2: are more established. Russian guy got a guy who is

461
00:22:34,600 --> 00:22:37,879
Speaker 2: not really a traditional traits guy, but he has a

462
00:22:37,960 --> 00:22:39,879
Speaker 2: really good combine and it comes on the hills of

463
00:22:39,960 --> 00:22:42,080
Speaker 2: having a really good senior ball East West Shrine game.

464
00:22:42,119 --> 00:22:46,919
Speaker 2: I mean Mohammed Kamara from Colorado State. So at the

465
00:22:46,920 --> 00:22:48,440
Speaker 2: East West Ron he was the dust guy there in

466
00:22:48,520 --> 00:22:51,360
Speaker 2: terms of pastors, had thirteen sacks. He was mound the West.

467
00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:54,680
Speaker 2: I think co defensive player of the year uh six eight.

468
00:22:55,080 --> 00:22:57,640
Speaker 2: But the forty yard dash four five seven one five

469
00:22:57,760 --> 00:22:59,840
Speaker 2: eight split when it came to the ten yard split

470
00:23:00,480 --> 00:23:03,800
Speaker 2: doesn't have the link because his arms are like thirty

471
00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:07,639
Speaker 2: two and three eighths. But man, you talk about that

472
00:23:07,760 --> 00:23:10,639
Speaker 2: kind of first step quickness and get off. It just

473
00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:14,080
Speaker 2: validates some of the stuff that you saw on the tape.

474
00:23:14,480 --> 00:23:18,280
Speaker 2: His get off, his napcount, anticipation and quickness is everything.

475
00:23:18,359 --> 00:23:21,920
Speaker 2: And when we're thinking about third round, guys are trying

476
00:23:21,960 --> 00:23:24,280
Speaker 2: to find that hitt and gym, that guy that can

477
00:23:24,359 --> 00:23:27,160
Speaker 2: kind of pop like Barring Young did for the La

478
00:23:27,280 --> 00:23:30,720
Speaker 2: Rams Mohama Kamara could be kind of like that guy

479
00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:33,199
Speaker 2: that gives you that pass us ability outside of the

480
00:23:33,240 --> 00:23:33,760
Speaker 2: first round.

481
00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:37,880
Speaker 1: So think about this when you look at mol Kamara

482
00:23:38,800 --> 00:23:41,760
Speaker 1: and from I'm going to pull up his data right here.

483
00:23:41,920 --> 00:23:46,320
Speaker 1: He's incredibly productive. He you know, as you mentioned, does

484
00:23:46,359 --> 00:23:48,560
Speaker 1: he have all the size you want to know? Hit

485
00:23:48,720 --> 00:23:51,640
Speaker 1: thirty three tackles for loss over the last two years,

486
00:23:52,040 --> 00:23:54,879
Speaker 1: go the year before then we're talking forty two and

487
00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:58,200
Speaker 1: a half over a three year run. Hit thirteen sacks

488
00:23:58,200 --> 00:24:00,200
Speaker 1: this year, eight and a half the year before, six

489
00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:03,119
Speaker 1: and a half a year before, the same thing happened

490
00:24:03,119 --> 00:24:05,920
Speaker 1: with his with his tackles for lost, he's stare stepping

491
00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:10,280
Speaker 1: every year, is getting better and better. He has forced

492
00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:13,199
Speaker 1: five fumbles during his career. So when he gets on

493
00:24:13,240 --> 00:24:15,399
Speaker 1: top of you, he's looking to strip the ball, strip sacks.

494
00:24:15,600 --> 00:24:18,400
Speaker 1: So now we take a highly productive player. He had

495
00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:20,760
Speaker 1: a ten foot seven broad jump in a in a

496
00:24:21,960 --> 00:24:25,520
Speaker 1: one five four to ten yard split. Those are explosion numbers.

497
00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:27,720
Speaker 1: So now I know I got a guy that's explosive.

498
00:24:27,760 --> 00:24:29,800
Speaker 1: I hadn't seen what he benched or if he even bench,

499
00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:31,840
Speaker 1: but I doubt a lot of guys are waiting to

500
00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:35,200
Speaker 1: bench if they do bench. But on tape, he's really explosive,

501
00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:38,320
Speaker 1: and he's really strong and powerful. Do you take give

502
00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:41,920
Speaker 1: me power and give me explosiveness. And those are the

503
00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:45,359
Speaker 1: guys who tend to you know, Marshawn Kneeland. I'm not

504
00:24:45,359 --> 00:24:47,440
Speaker 1: as high on Marshaw Neilan as other people, and yet

505
00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:50,000
Speaker 1: you get the testing thirty five and a half inch burt.

506
00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:53,000
Speaker 1: He had a four to eighteen short shuttle with a

507
00:24:53,080 --> 00:24:56,639
Speaker 1: seven oh two three cone rare short area stuff for

508
00:24:57,600 --> 00:25:00,760
Speaker 1: I should say rare. Smith's fairly rare though for a

509
00:25:00,800 --> 00:25:03,919
Speaker 1: player like Marshawn Kneeland coming out of Western Michigan usually

510
00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:07,760
Speaker 1: don't see those guys tests like that. So Kamara and

511
00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:10,280
Speaker 1: I will go ahead and say Kneeland too. Those are

512
00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:14,359
Speaker 1: guys that really helped themselves out. But Kamara has really

513
00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:16,879
Speaker 1: crazy production that a lot of people aren't talking about

514
00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:20,239
Speaker 1: So I don't care as much about the link if

515
00:25:20,280 --> 00:25:22,919
Speaker 1: you're that explosive because at two forty eight he plays

516
00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:25,280
Speaker 1: much heavier than two hundred and forty eight pounds. Yeah

517
00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:28,080
Speaker 1: he plays, he plays firm.

518
00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:33,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, he plays firm. He's super explosive. And we've seen it,

519
00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:37,320
Speaker 2: like jack, production translate in the National Football League, particularly

520
00:25:37,359 --> 00:25:39,280
Speaker 2: when you got back to back years of multiple years

521
00:25:39,280 --> 00:25:43,280
Speaker 2: of elite production that normally plays out well in the league,

522
00:25:43,280 --> 00:25:46,760
Speaker 2: but when you combine to product the production with the

523
00:25:46,800 --> 00:25:49,080
Speaker 2: first step quickness and to get off. I mean, just

524
00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:51,080
Speaker 2: think about all the great pass uses that we've seen

525
00:25:51,119 --> 00:25:54,560
Speaker 2: that have outstanding first step quickness in stamp count anticipation.

526
00:25:55,000 --> 00:25:56,560
Speaker 2: If you can get off the stamp man, it just

527
00:25:56,560 --> 00:25:58,640
Speaker 2: puts so much pressure on the offensive dack or whether

528
00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:01,399
Speaker 2: it's the right or the left offensive tackle. If you

529
00:26:01,480 --> 00:26:02,959
Speaker 2: get off and you're kind of like a bat out

530
00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:05,480
Speaker 2: of hell coming around the corner, this makes life miserable

531
00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:08,359
Speaker 2: for the quarterback. Moham and Kamar is one of those guys.

532
00:26:08,359 --> 00:26:10,280
Speaker 2: If there's some other guys that we can talk about

533
00:26:10,280 --> 00:26:12,520
Speaker 2: being able to do it, you just fall in love

534
00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:13,840
Speaker 2: with those guys because you can do it.

535
00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:17,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, no question and that's uh, you know, that's

536
00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:19,600
Speaker 1: what you want to see. Some of these guys, these

537
00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:23,199
Speaker 1: pass rushers, these big defensive ends that are productive. You

538
00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:25,880
Speaker 1: just think, all right, what can they get around NFL tackles.

539
00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:27,440
Speaker 1: And one of the best ways to see that there's

540
00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:30,800
Speaker 1: some on field drills. You know, the obviously running the

541
00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:32,800
Speaker 1: hoop shows you who's tight in the hips and who's not.

542
00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:35,359
Speaker 1: But some of these the short air that like the

543
00:26:35,440 --> 00:26:38,720
Speaker 1: testing that Marshawn Neeland did. Now I got to go

544
00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:40,560
Speaker 1: back and look at more tape. I know DJ's been

545
00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:43,240
Speaker 1: high on Kneeland. I had what amounts to like a

546
00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:45,720
Speaker 1: fourth round grade on him. I didn't love them on tape,

547
00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:47,879
Speaker 1: but when you put together this combine, this is what

548
00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:50,160
Speaker 1: you're supposed to do. I see all these numbers, I'm like, well,

549
00:26:50,200 --> 00:26:55,200
Speaker 1: he's explosive, great short area burst, He's got very good

550
00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:57,800
Speaker 1: change of direction and body control. I need to go

551
00:26:57,840 --> 00:26:59,640
Speaker 1: see if I just had a bad day that day

552
00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:02,359
Speaker 1: and just kind of song, because sometime that happens. You

553
00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:05,320
Speaker 1: spend all this time watching guys and then you, especially me,

554
00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:06,879
Speaker 1: I don't I don't get to watch them for as

555
00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:09,479
Speaker 1: long as the scouts do. I may just go through

556
00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:11,200
Speaker 1: a day where I'm tired. I mean I may have

557
00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:13,720
Speaker 1: hit that tequila two hard the night before. You know,

558
00:27:13,760 --> 00:27:17,439
Speaker 1: I may have had a heavy test mets lunch, just

559
00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:21,120
Speaker 1: sitting sitting kind of heavy. So you know you got

560
00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:23,000
Speaker 1: to go back and say, oh, you know what, Yeah,

561
00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:24,439
Speaker 1: I was too hard on this guy. Let me let

562
00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:25,160
Speaker 1: me bump that great.

563
00:27:25,920 --> 00:27:28,639
Speaker 2: Yeah, No, that's funny. It's great. Man. But we talk

564
00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:31,800
Speaker 2: about these pastors, We talked about these players and just

565
00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:36,440
Speaker 2: how it is. Let me ask you, God, was there

566
00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:39,359
Speaker 2: anyone before we move on and talk about lumbers, was

567
00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:42,280
Speaker 2: there anyone else that you wanted to mention? Anybody want

568
00:27:42,320 --> 00:27:43,560
Speaker 2: to give a shout out to in terms of their

569
00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:47,239
Speaker 2: performance that either surprised or kind of validated. Uh the

570
00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:49,240
Speaker 2: love affair that you made you may have with me.

571
00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:53,600
Speaker 1: Uh yeah, I want to mention one guy. I don't

572
00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:56,600
Speaker 1: think it's talked about. Jordan Jefferson from LSU. He was

573
00:27:56,640 --> 00:27:59,720
Speaker 1: at senior ball. He's three hundred and thirteen pounds, thirty

574
00:27:59,720 --> 00:28:02,159
Speaker 1: three an eighths arm, which is pretty good for an

575
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:07,120
Speaker 1: interior guy. He jumped thirty one inches at three thirteen.

576
00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:09,920
Speaker 1: That's pretty good. Thirty one inches at three thirteen is

577
00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:12,600
Speaker 1: a pretty good vert. He was eight eight and abroad,

578
00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:15,000
Speaker 1: which is okay, but I just want to mention him

579
00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:18,639
Speaker 1: because this joker is really powerful at the point of attack.

580
00:28:18,680 --> 00:28:20,679
Speaker 1: I don't think enough people were talking about George Jefferson.

581
00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:22,920
Speaker 1: He had some snaps at Senior Bowl that were impressive.

582
00:28:23,520 --> 00:28:26,480
Speaker 1: And I see a you know, I see a vert

583
00:28:26,600 --> 00:28:28,280
Speaker 1: like that. It's just one of those little things. I

584
00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:31,680
Speaker 1: circle and say, huh. I kind of liked him anyway,

585
00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:35,159
Speaker 1: and I see his you know, his while he's only

586
00:28:35,280 --> 00:28:37,600
Speaker 1: what does he check in at? George Jefferson checks in

587
00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:40,560
Speaker 1: and almost six foot three. But then when I look

588
00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:42,880
Speaker 1: at the wingspan, which gives you a broad back. You know,

589
00:28:42,920 --> 00:28:44,760
Speaker 1: you can have long arms, but not as broad a back.

590
00:28:44,800 --> 00:28:48,640
Speaker 1: The wing won't be as much. But his wingspan comes

591
00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:52,360
Speaker 1: out to what a six foot eight, a six foot

592
00:28:52,360 --> 00:28:55,880
Speaker 1: eight defensive lineman, and so that for me is a

593
00:28:55,920 --> 00:28:58,880
Speaker 1: six foot seven. That's good to me. That's good if

594
00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:01,040
Speaker 1: you've got that kind of wingspan. I'd like to take

595
00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:03,920
Speaker 1: your wingspan turn it into a height, because that's one

596
00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:06,280
Speaker 1: of those things if you're an interior lineman. And I

597
00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:08,640
Speaker 1: don't I know he's already strong. I want to know,

598
00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:11,560
Speaker 1: can he get his hands on guys separate because once

599
00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:13,880
Speaker 1: you can separate, it's easier to shed. But then you

600
00:29:13,920 --> 00:29:16,600
Speaker 1: show me that explosive thirty one in vert. That means

601
00:29:16,600 --> 00:29:19,640
Speaker 1: he can fire from his hips, which means off the snap,

602
00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:22,600
Speaker 1: he's getting into you quick. So he's a guy I

603
00:29:22,640 --> 00:29:24,640
Speaker 1: kind of wanted to shout out because I already like

604
00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:28,400
Speaker 1: the tape, but now I found an explosive metric that

605
00:29:28,480 --> 00:29:30,440
Speaker 1: I can also pair into his grading.

606
00:29:31,840 --> 00:29:35,360
Speaker 2: You gotta like that, and having those metrics really really

607
00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:38,440
Speaker 2: helped because it pushed in a situation where you're like, man,

608
00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:40,479
Speaker 2: I see it on tape, but now I have an

609
00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:43,000
Speaker 2: opportunity to really go hard on the player because I

610
00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:45,920
Speaker 2: got solid data that backs up what my eyes tell me.

611
00:29:46,560 --> 00:29:48,520
Speaker 2: So let's transition. We're gonna take a break, and when

612
00:29:48,560 --> 00:29:50,480
Speaker 2: we come back on the other side, we can talk

613
00:29:50,480 --> 00:29:53,440
Speaker 2: about linebackers and that means a lot of conversation about

614
00:29:53,440 --> 00:30:00,760
Speaker 2: Peyton Will. All right, welcome back to MTS. We are

615
00:30:00,880 --> 00:30:03,640
Speaker 2: breaking down the NFL combine. We're talking about the big guys.

616
00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:06,480
Speaker 2: We talked about the defensive tackles and defensive ends, but

617
00:30:06,560 --> 00:30:09,320
Speaker 2: now let's go to the linebackers. And when we go

618
00:30:09,400 --> 00:30:13,040
Speaker 2: to the linebackers, it begins and ends with the performance

619
00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:16,200
Speaker 2: of Peyton Wilson from NC State, one of the top

620
00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:19,920
Speaker 2: linebackers in the draft. I think he kind of created

621
00:30:19,920 --> 00:30:23,680
Speaker 2: a little buzz. You know, sometimes in the stadium when

622
00:30:23,680 --> 00:30:27,320
Speaker 2: guys run, you hear everyone kind of whisper. When Peyton

623
00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:31,239
Speaker 2: Wilson went four four four into forty, there was a

624
00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:35,160
Speaker 2: lot of conversation that was going on about, scout, tell

625
00:30:35,200 --> 00:30:37,040
Speaker 2: me what you saw from the linebacker when you had

626
00:30:37,040 --> 00:30:38,880
Speaker 2: a chance to kind of take a deep dive of

627
00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:39,840
Speaker 2: their workout.

628
00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:42,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I went down on the field because I

629
00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:44,560
Speaker 1: wanted to, really, I wanted to see. Peyton Wilson was

630
00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:45,840
Speaker 1: one of the guys I wanted to see. There's some

631
00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:48,200
Speaker 1: guys I really like in this group and guys I'm

632
00:30:48,240 --> 00:30:51,040
Speaker 1: kind of curious about. And Peyton Wilson was somebody that.

633
00:30:51,360 --> 00:30:53,760
Speaker 1: And I don't know where, I don't know where my

634
00:30:53,800 --> 00:30:56,400
Speaker 1: grade came from. I gotta go see because I'm like, hm,

635
00:30:57,320 --> 00:31:01,400
Speaker 1: I mean, he just ran like a running bag. He

636
00:31:02,280 --> 00:31:05,640
Speaker 1: was super smooth. Well, he was pretty smooth in most

637
00:31:05,680 --> 00:31:08,040
Speaker 1: of the agility stuff that he did. But it's not

638
00:31:08,160 --> 00:31:11,360
Speaker 1: just that, I mean had a good vert at thirty

639
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:14,360
Speaker 1: four and a half, a pretty good broad jump in

640
00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:18,520
Speaker 1: nine to eleven. He's very well defined, Bucky. He's at

641
00:31:18,560 --> 00:31:21,240
Speaker 1: six foot four, like he's kind of that Leyton vander

642
00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:26,240
Speaker 1: Esch tall rangy player. So he's long and can run well.

643
00:31:26,280 --> 00:31:28,840
Speaker 1: That gives you great sideline. The sideline, I think one

644
00:31:28,840 --> 00:31:30,560
Speaker 1: of the things that's kind of interesting from a body

645
00:31:30,600 --> 00:31:34,240
Speaker 1: type standpoint is he's well defined, but he's not he's

646
00:31:34,280 --> 00:31:38,720
Speaker 1: not really very thick in the lower body, like you know,

647
00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:41,320
Speaker 1: the he's got those you know, he looks like he's

648
00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:44,160
Speaker 1: got basketball calves. He's got the calves of a two guard,

649
00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:48,000
Speaker 1: and so it's it's muscular and well defined, but he's

650
00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:50,080
Speaker 1: not a real thick player in his lower half. So

651
00:31:50,120 --> 00:31:52,560
Speaker 1: that's that's for a guy who has some shoulder issues

652
00:31:52,640 --> 00:31:54,800
Speaker 1: in his background. The only thing that concerns me is

653
00:31:54,840 --> 00:31:56,520
Speaker 1: can you how do you take on blocks? So you're

654
00:31:56,520 --> 00:31:57,959
Speaker 1: gonna be able to take on blocks? What do the

655
00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:01,280
Speaker 1: medicals say? But honestly, from the way he moved around,

656
00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:05,400
Speaker 1: the way he ran his his length, like, I don't

657
00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:07,080
Speaker 1: see how you can come away at two hundred and

658
00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:09,440
Speaker 1: thirty three. That's a good weight nowadays, they don't, you know,

659
00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:12,600
Speaker 1: they don't mind that it's hard to get away from

660
00:32:12,600 --> 00:32:16,240
Speaker 1: his workout and not be super impressed with what he did.

661
00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:18,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that'd be super impressed. And I think that

662
00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:20,480
Speaker 2: I think NFL Networks may have done on my solid

663
00:32:20,520 --> 00:32:23,920
Speaker 2: But they showed his wrestling highlights doing that. I don't

664
00:32:23,920 --> 00:32:26,600
Speaker 2: know if you saw it anything. Oh really, no, they

665
00:32:26,680 --> 00:32:29,640
Speaker 2: showed him wrestling. They showed him. They showed him wrestling

666
00:32:29,680 --> 00:32:32,320
Speaker 2: in high school at Orange High School in Hillsboro, which

667
00:32:32,320 --> 00:32:36,760
Speaker 2: is right outside of Chapel Hill. He's like Goldberg. He's

668
00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:39,240
Speaker 2: not there spearing folks. He's taking him straight to the ground.

669
00:32:39,560 --> 00:32:43,960
Speaker 2: I mean, his physicality shows up. It was unbelievable to watch.

670
00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:47,719
Speaker 2: As scals. We always talked about multi sport athletes, but man,

671
00:32:47,760 --> 00:32:50,200
Speaker 2: when you get a guy that's been a wrestler, particularly

672
00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:52,960
Speaker 2: a linebacker that's been a wrestler, you already know he's

673
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:56,800
Speaker 2: tough his nail. But that just watching those clips and

674
00:32:56,800 --> 00:33:00,240
Speaker 2: how he's dumping folks. Oh, I see why he is

675
00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:06,040
Speaker 2: a little differently as a middle linebacker because that dude

676
00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:08,440
Speaker 2: nonsense to his game that I absolutely love.

677
00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:12,800
Speaker 1: Now I literally just google it. I'm literally just turning

678
00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:14,880
Speaker 1: it on right now. He's got his head gear and

679
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:18,360
Speaker 1: all that stuff. It's before he got the ball. This

680
00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:23,200
Speaker 1: is before high schools, before he was a mird guy.

681
00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:26,000
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, he tearing them uplands. He's out there just

682
00:33:26,400 --> 00:33:29,480
Speaker 2: getting after it. And like I just wanted the listeners

683
00:33:29,480 --> 00:33:31,800
Speaker 2: to understand, like it, scouts, you're always digging in someone's

684
00:33:31,840 --> 00:33:34,160
Speaker 2: background in high school to see what other sports they

685
00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:41,080
Speaker 2: participated in, because there's some carryover wrestling. We talk about physicality, contact, balance, leverage,

686
00:33:41,600 --> 00:33:44,560
Speaker 2: just the overall toughness that's required to really excel in

687
00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:47,000
Speaker 2: that sport. He has that in his background. Then you

688
00:33:47,040 --> 00:33:51,640
Speaker 2: think about other sports like basketball and handout coordination, baseball, depth, perception,

689
00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:57,160
Speaker 2: all that. But Peyton Wilson being a dominant high school wrestler, man,

690
00:33:57,200 --> 00:33:58,600
Speaker 2: I just love it. And I think you have a

691
00:33:58,600 --> 00:34:01,400
Speaker 2: lot of defensive coaches that celebrate that part of his

692
00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:02,880
Speaker 2: game and that part of his background.

693
00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:05,960
Speaker 1: Who's the last good wrestler you saw who wasn't tough.

694
00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:12,040
Speaker 1: It doesn't exist. They're all tough. I don't want any

695
00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:14,719
Speaker 1: part of the color flower ears ever. I am, I am.

696
00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:17,399
Speaker 1: I am not looking for smoke from guys with color

697
00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:19,600
Speaker 1: flower ears as they I am.

698
00:34:19,680 --> 00:34:22,319
Speaker 2: I am not. I'm telling you, I'm telling you last.

699
00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:25,920
Speaker 2: I've seen many, many a fight not go the way

700
00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:29,799
Speaker 2: that people thought because somebody decided on a smaller guy

701
00:34:30,200 --> 00:34:32,520
Speaker 2: and they didn't see the little guy had a little

702
00:34:32,600 --> 00:34:36,239
Speaker 2: califlower ear before he broke them off the bar, So

703
00:34:36,320 --> 00:34:37,960
Speaker 2: you better. You just had to be careful.

704
00:34:38,520 --> 00:34:44,120
Speaker 1: You got to look at it, y'all. Y'all are checking

705
00:34:44,120 --> 00:34:45,520
Speaker 1: the arms. I'm checking the ears.

706
00:34:48,760 --> 00:34:51,160
Speaker 2: You gotta do that. So look. Coming into the event,

707
00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:53,759
Speaker 2: Edrian Cooper from Texas and him was to cast me

708
00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:56,480
Speaker 2: out at the position. The overall workout was solid, but

709
00:34:56,480 --> 00:34:58,960
Speaker 2: tell me what you saw from the the aggie.

710
00:34:59,560 --> 00:35:02,719
Speaker 1: So Edren Cooper ran fast. I expected him to run fast.

711
00:35:02,719 --> 00:35:05,480
Speaker 1: He was my choice to have the fastest forty. He

712
00:35:05,560 --> 00:35:07,680
Speaker 1: did not, but he was fast four to five to one.

713
00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:13,680
Speaker 1: He's got twenty two mile per hour you know rpm

714
00:35:14,239 --> 00:35:17,239
Speaker 1: or mph I should say at Texas A and M

715
00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:19,120
Speaker 1: when he played, so I know that guy can roll,

716
00:35:19,160 --> 00:35:21,600
Speaker 1: and he did. His workout was pretty good. Vertical is

717
00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:24,879
Speaker 1: pretty good. Broad jump was okay. Watching him on the field,

718
00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:26,920
Speaker 1: he's kind of a little different body type. And this

719
00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:30,280
Speaker 1: is why Bucky. I can't stress this enough. The guys

720
00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:33,600
Speaker 1: who do this for a living for NFL teams, they

721
00:35:33,760 --> 00:35:35,719
Speaker 1: want to look at body types. They want to see

722
00:35:35,719 --> 00:35:38,880
Speaker 1: body types once again. Certain body types can at times

723
00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:41,960
Speaker 1: be predictive. There's certain things Bucky like knock knees with

724
00:35:42,040 --> 00:35:44,400
Speaker 1: offensive line You know, a lot of teams believe that

725
00:35:44,400 --> 00:35:47,480
Speaker 1: can lead to injuries and can be a predictive factor.

726
00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:51,160
Speaker 1: So there's certain things that teams look for. He's got

727
00:35:51,239 --> 00:35:53,680
Speaker 1: kind of a different body type. He's not built the

728
00:35:53,719 --> 00:35:57,120
Speaker 1: same way as a lot of the other linebackers. It's

729
00:35:57,160 --> 00:36:00,520
Speaker 1: a little different from a body type standpoint, but the

730
00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:04,200
Speaker 1: way he moves he is a very When it turns

731
00:36:04,239 --> 00:36:10,239
Speaker 1: into a straight line action, he is ultra explosive. I

732
00:36:10,239 --> 00:36:13,279
Speaker 1: think the agility stuff was pretty good for him, but

733
00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:16,280
Speaker 1: it is interesting getting through some of the different workouts

734
00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:19,200
Speaker 1: with different players because what they look like in one direction,

735
00:36:19,320 --> 00:36:21,680
Speaker 1: they don't necessarily look the same. Going aside this, I

736
00:36:21,680 --> 00:36:24,440
Speaker 1: thought Cedric Gray actually struggled a little bit with some

737
00:36:24,440 --> 00:36:26,720
Speaker 1: of the agility stuff I saw. I wasn't as smooth

738
00:36:27,239 --> 00:36:30,319
Speaker 1: as like Jeremiah Trotter. He's made for that. Jeremiah Trotter

739
00:36:30,440 --> 00:36:32,359
Speaker 1: is not going to run real fast, but he's going

740
00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:35,600
Speaker 1: to be smooth. With all the agility stuff and the

741
00:36:35,680 --> 00:36:39,960
Speaker 1: workouts with Cedric, Cedric is going to hit He's going

742
00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:42,239
Speaker 1: to knock the taste out of your mouth, is what

743
00:36:42,280 --> 00:36:45,520
Speaker 1: he does. But he's not going to be shifting through

744
00:36:45,600 --> 00:36:48,720
Speaker 1: bags as smooth as like Jeremiah Trotter. So they're different guys,

745
00:36:48,800 --> 00:36:50,320
Speaker 1: you know, They're just different guys.

746
00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:54,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, crazy different guys. Anybody idea that stood out to

747
00:36:54,200 --> 00:36:57,759
Speaker 2: you when it comes to being a guy that is

748
00:36:59,560 --> 00:37:01,759
Speaker 2: I don't know. Either had a good performer, so just

749
00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:03,840
Speaker 2: a left and stellar performance. They kind of still to

750
00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:04,440
Speaker 2: you in a position.

751
00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:10,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, I tell you what I thought because I got

752
00:37:10,239 --> 00:37:12,120
Speaker 1: my notes. I wrote notes when I was down there

753
00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:13,960
Speaker 1: on a lot of these guys. I think Tommy Eikenberg

754
00:37:14,080 --> 00:37:16,759
Speaker 1: is a little stiff from Ohio State. I thought he

755
00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:18,239
Speaker 1: was on tape, but I wanted to give him a

756
00:37:18,320 --> 00:37:21,000
Speaker 1: chance to prove me wrong. I still think he's a

757
00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:25,000
Speaker 1: Day three kind of a backup player. Deloche from oh

758
00:37:25,160 --> 00:37:28,600
Speaker 1: Kaylen Delouche from Florida State. I got a top Kaylen

759
00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:33,640
Speaker 1: Deloche moves well. Has been rock solid, very fluid, good speed,

760
00:37:34,040 --> 00:37:37,480
Speaker 1: sure enough, he ran a four four seven forty yard

761
00:37:37,560 --> 00:37:41,640
Speaker 1: dash checks in not not real long arms. But the

762
00:37:41,719 --> 00:37:45,319
Speaker 1: problem is he's two hundred ten pounds, So like, what

763
00:37:45,360 --> 00:37:47,440
Speaker 1: are we doing with this guy? Who's two hundred ten

764
00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:49,759
Speaker 1: pounds of five to eleven. But I'm telling you, man,

765
00:37:49,800 --> 00:37:52,400
Speaker 1: he looked great in the drills, looked really great in

766
00:37:52,440 --> 00:37:55,080
Speaker 1: the drills. But now I got to go back and say, well,

767
00:37:55,080 --> 00:37:57,279
Speaker 1: what do I do with him two hundred and ten

768
00:37:57,320 --> 00:37:59,960
Speaker 1: pounds Bucky? I mean, I love that he's fast. He's

769
00:38:00,120 --> 00:38:02,479
Speaker 1: not a safety because I remember watching tape and saying, Okay,

770
00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:06,280
Speaker 1: he's not a safety. So can you take a player

771
00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:10,440
Speaker 1: who's an outstanding athlete and a good football player as well,

772
00:38:10,480 --> 00:38:12,880
Speaker 1: but he's only two hundred and ten bucket? Is the

773
00:38:13,040 --> 00:38:17,279
Speaker 1: league versatile enough to take a player like that and

774
00:38:18,080 --> 00:38:20,160
Speaker 1: figure out a role for a two hundred and ten

775
00:38:20,200 --> 00:38:21,040
Speaker 1: pound linebacker.

776
00:38:22,160 --> 00:38:25,640
Speaker 2: I think so. And the reason why I think you

777
00:38:25,680 --> 00:38:28,520
Speaker 2: can do that is because the way they can change

778
00:38:28,600 --> 00:38:32,319
Speaker 2: so much, big nickel and things of that nature. I

779
00:38:32,360 --> 00:38:34,480
Speaker 2: think you can kind of find a way to put

780
00:38:34,520 --> 00:38:38,120
Speaker 2: somebody on the field in one of those roles. Now,

781
00:38:38,120 --> 00:38:39,640
Speaker 2: you got to be careful because if you put him

782
00:38:39,680 --> 00:38:43,040
Speaker 2: on the field too much, they will absolutely get obliterated

783
00:38:43,120 --> 00:38:45,640
Speaker 2: in the run game. But if you're two hundred and

784
00:38:45,640 --> 00:38:47,200
Speaker 2: ten pounds and you can run around and you can

785
00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:48,719
Speaker 2: make play, there's a way that you can get them

786
00:38:48,719 --> 00:38:50,120
Speaker 2: on the field in a slub package.

787
00:38:51,719 --> 00:38:54,080
Speaker 1: Yeah. Another guy who I thought had a good day

788
00:38:54,160 --> 00:39:00,759
Speaker 1: was Jordan McGee from Temple. He he is. He was explosive,

789
00:39:01,000 --> 00:39:04,359
Speaker 1: he jumped well, he ran fast, and he moved really

790
00:39:04,400 --> 00:39:06,480
Speaker 1: well through the bags and then with his workout. So

791
00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:08,520
Speaker 1: he's a guy that I want to go check out

792
00:39:09,080 --> 00:39:11,719
Speaker 1: a little bit more, double check everything on tape and

793
00:39:11,719 --> 00:39:15,880
Speaker 1: see if it matches the workout or not. I know

794
00:39:15,960 --> 00:39:18,200
Speaker 1: this guy is not a linebacker, but I'm gonna mention

795
00:39:18,239 --> 00:39:20,239
Speaker 1: him because he worked out with linebackers and I know

796
00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:25,000
Speaker 1: you watched him at UCLA. Gab Murphy had a really impressive,

797
00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:28,719
Speaker 1: explosive pro day. He ran a four to six eight

798
00:39:28,840 --> 00:39:31,280
Speaker 1: and he checks in at two hundred and forty seven pounds.

799
00:39:31,520 --> 00:39:33,600
Speaker 1: Four to six eight is a good time thirty nine

800
00:39:33,600 --> 00:39:36,080
Speaker 1: and a half inch vertical ten foot three broad jumps,

801
00:39:36,080 --> 00:39:38,400
Speaker 1: So you see all kinds of explosiveness in the hips.

802
00:39:38,840 --> 00:39:41,200
Speaker 1: And I know he's in a linebacker group, but he's

803
00:39:41,560 --> 00:39:45,040
Speaker 1: a pass rusher and a lot too. Is terrific on

804
00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:47,680
Speaker 1: one side. You know, Murphy plays a lot like Latsu,

805
00:39:47,880 --> 00:39:52,399
Speaker 1: really efficient hands, really efficient movements. Not a long armed guy,

806
00:39:52,440 --> 00:39:55,280
Speaker 1: but man, these explosion numbers are hard to get away

807
00:39:55,280 --> 00:39:58,520
Speaker 1: from when you watch tape. That is pretty impressive tape

808
00:39:58,520 --> 00:39:59,000
Speaker 1: with Murphy.

809
00:39:59,400 --> 00:40:02,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think Murphy's part of a twin. We saw

810
00:40:02,160 --> 00:40:05,560
Speaker 2: he and his brother at Yucia at the East Fresh

811
00:40:05,640 --> 00:40:08,960
Speaker 2: Ryan game, and he got after it. He made some

812
00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:11,040
Speaker 2: plays as quick as a hiccup coming off the edge.

813
00:40:11,360 --> 00:40:13,200
Speaker 2: There's a lot to like about him. You talked about

814
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:16,000
Speaker 2: those explosive trade they show up. They show up when

815
00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:17,440
Speaker 2: you watch him play. He was one of the stars

816
00:40:17,440 --> 00:40:19,520
Speaker 2: of the East West Ryan game, so I'm not surprised

817
00:40:19,760 --> 00:40:21,080
Speaker 2: that he kind of put on a little bit of

818
00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:22,160
Speaker 2: a show at the Combine.

819
00:40:22,800 --> 00:40:27,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, Trevan, a couple other combine monsters were at Dufwan.

820
00:40:28,080 --> 00:40:33,200
Speaker 1: Ulu Focio from Washington almost forty inch vertical lead, ten

821
00:40:33,280 --> 00:40:35,400
Speaker 1: eight broad jump was about as long as we saw

822
00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:38,160
Speaker 1: the entire day. Now, he is a twitched up guy,

823
00:40:38,239 --> 00:40:41,320
Speaker 1: but I just think that the tape doesn't always match

824
00:40:41,360 --> 00:40:45,120
Speaker 1: the workout. And then Trevin Wallace from Kentucky. He ran

825
00:40:45,200 --> 00:40:49,279
Speaker 1: a four to five to one and vertical leap of

826
00:40:49,320 --> 00:40:50,919
Speaker 1: thirty seven and a half with a ten to seven

827
00:40:51,000 --> 00:40:54,640
Speaker 1: broad Those are really really good numbers for a legitimate linebacker.

828
00:40:54,680 --> 00:40:56,960
Speaker 1: This is not an edge player. This is a linebacker

829
00:40:57,000 --> 00:41:01,000
Speaker 1: two hundred and thirty seven pounds with pretty good arm lenk.

830
00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:03,120
Speaker 1: He's one of those guys I think made himself some

831
00:41:03,120 --> 00:41:06,239
Speaker 1: money yesterday because he was he was solid in the

832
00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:10,279
Speaker 1: field work, but really tested great. And one thing you

833
00:41:10,360 --> 00:41:13,560
Speaker 1: have to know about linebackers is if they run fast

834
00:41:13,719 --> 00:41:17,040
Speaker 1: or explosive and show a level of aggression on tape,

835
00:41:17,080 --> 00:41:19,520
Speaker 1: these guys can get pushed up to third and fourth

836
00:41:19,600 --> 00:41:23,320
Speaker 1: round status because teams say back up and a special

837
00:41:23,360 --> 00:41:27,560
Speaker 1: teams and a five face special teams player. Immediately, you

838
00:41:27,600 --> 00:41:29,920
Speaker 1: go find me a workout guy. We'll put them on

839
00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:31,800
Speaker 1: special teams and we'll see if we can take this

840
00:41:32,560 --> 00:41:35,560
Speaker 1: freak daddy workout guy and turn them into a legitimate linebacker.

841
00:41:36,400 --> 00:41:39,200
Speaker 2: Yeah. Like, sometimes you just want to make sure that

842
00:41:39,239 --> 00:41:42,680
Speaker 2: you're able to take those guys, take the best athletes,

843
00:41:42,680 --> 00:41:44,839
Speaker 2: put them in a situation where they can have a

844
00:41:44,880 --> 00:41:48,040
Speaker 2: tremendous amount of success just doing what they do, fast,

845
00:41:48,120 --> 00:41:50,839
Speaker 2: free flow to the ball. Some of these guys will

846
00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:53,120
Speaker 2: get that opportunity because not only are we talking about

847
00:41:53,160 --> 00:41:56,760
Speaker 2: evaluating guys as position players, we're thinking about which guys

848
00:41:56,800 --> 00:42:00,280
Speaker 2: have the trade to be core special teamers. Because remember

849
00:42:00,840 --> 00:42:03,080
Speaker 2: your teams is a gateway to being able to get

850
00:42:03,120 --> 00:42:06,160
Speaker 2: on the field. Sometimes you can take a superior athlete,

851
00:42:06,320 --> 00:42:09,160
Speaker 2: let him kind of learn and develop why he's making

852
00:42:09,160 --> 00:42:11,920
Speaker 2: contributions as a special teamer, and then you look up

853
00:42:11,960 --> 00:42:13,680
Speaker 2: two three years down the line, you end up having

854
00:42:13,719 --> 00:42:18,160
Speaker 2: a player who's actually a key contributor on your team.

855
00:42:18,280 --> 00:42:20,120
Speaker 1: Well, but that's it for me, man. I want to

856
00:42:20,160 --> 00:42:21,840
Speaker 1: get I got to get something to eat, get my

857
00:42:21,920 --> 00:42:24,239
Speaker 1: shower in, and do part two. Day two.

858
00:42:24,360 --> 00:42:28,279
Speaker 2: Now, well, here's what you have. My only request for

859
00:42:28,320 --> 00:42:29,920
Speaker 2: you is make sure you don't go get text next

860
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:31,400
Speaker 2: before we get up there, because I don't want you

861
00:42:31,440 --> 00:42:36,120
Speaker 2: to have no heavy, the heavy and all that when

862
00:42:36,120 --> 00:42:41,439
Speaker 2: we're doing it. Because set Friday, we have the yes

863
00:42:41,480 --> 00:42:43,120
Speaker 2: to track me. We've got a defensive back, so we've

864
00:42:43,080 --> 00:42:44,600
Speaker 2: got a tight ends going to work. So I'm gonna

865
00:42:44,600 --> 00:42:46,440
Speaker 2: need you to be alert and focus, ready to go.

866
00:42:46,840 --> 00:42:49,080
Speaker 1: I'll be ready. Don't worry, all.

867
00:42:49,080 --> 00:42:51,040
Speaker 2: Right, man, make sure Yeah, but you got check in

868
00:42:51,120 --> 00:42:53,200
Speaker 2: with us the rest of the weekend. We got a

869
00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:56,839
Speaker 2: couple more podcasts where we're going to review what takes

870
00:42:56,880 --> 00:43:00,839
Speaker 2: place up here in Indianapolis at the combine until the dance.

871
00:43:01,040 --> 00:43:18,200
Speaker 2: We'll talk to you said MHM