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Speaker 1: Futuro investigates Putioduro Investilla.

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Speaker 2: Alexa, who will win the next American election? The twenty

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Speaker 2: twenty four American election will not take place. There will

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Speaker 2: be no winner, will powers resolution.

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Speaker 3: In August of twenty twenty three, a video was shared online,

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Speaker 3: and in that video, a white man wearing an army

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Speaker 3: green trucker hat asks Alexa, Amazon's AI voice assistant about

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Speaker 3: the twenty twenty four election. Alexa seemingly responds that the

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Speaker 3: election is not happening. It's a lie, of course. Still,

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Speaker 3: soon after, infamous conspiracy theorist Alex Jones decided to share

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Speaker 3: the video with the millions of people who visit his

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Speaker 3: far right platform info Wars every month.

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Speaker 2: So the buzz is out there that there won't be

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Speaker 2: a twenty twenty four election. Now, I'm not saying that's

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Speaker 2: gonna happen.

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Speaker 4: I'm saying we're not in normal situation, and let's play

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Speaker 4: the club I just talked about with Alexa.

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Speaker 3: And just like that, the video takes off. It soon

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Speaker 3: appears on YouTube.

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Speaker 2: Alexa, who will win them?

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Speaker 5: Who?

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Speaker 2: Instagram?

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Speaker 3: What's good? Some posts still up have millions of views

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Speaker 3: as it's snowballed.

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Speaker 6: This video was also shared on one of those weird

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Speaker 6: Facebook pages with subtitles of Spanish.

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Speaker 3: Of course, that's Evelyn Bedezberdia, the founder of We Are mass,

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Speaker 3: a consulting firm where she's been focusing on countering disinformation

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Speaker 3: like the No. Twenty twenty four election lie. Evelyn first

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Speaker 3: came across the Alexa video in late twenty twenty three

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Speaker 3: when We Are Muss partnered with Brown University in order

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Speaker 3: to track election related concerns among Latinos.

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Speaker 6: And what we did is we asked them two questions

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Speaker 6: for six weeks, what are you hearing in your communities

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Speaker 6: and are there any rumors you're hearing?

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Speaker 3: Evelyn says. They received over five hundred responses.

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Speaker 6: But only twenty percent were rumors. But within that twenty percent,

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Speaker 6: there were two people, a nicaragua and American and a

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Speaker 6: Venezuelan American that did not know each other, and at

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Speaker 6: the same time, both of them were mentioning about Alexa,

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Speaker 6: saying that there was not going to be an election

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Speaker 6: in twenty twenty.

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Speaker 3: Four because that Alexa alex Jones video had moved on

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Speaker 3: and it was now targeting Spanish speakers from Futuro Media

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Speaker 3: and FPRX. It's Latino USA. I'm Maria nor Josa Today

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Speaker 3: the Misinformation Web a new Futuro investigation. This story is

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Speaker 3: part of our election coverage, The Latino Factor How we Vote.

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Speaker 3: With just days left before the presidential election, we meet

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Speaker 3: face to face with social media content creators driving miss

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Speaker 3: and disinformation in Spanish and we attempt to answer some

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Speaker 3: elusive but key questions how much money are they making

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Speaker 3: off of this? And is anybody funding them? Is influencer?

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Speaker 3: Who is Venezuelan? For months, our team at Puturo Investigates

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Speaker 3: researched digital creators who share political and election content on

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Speaker 3: social media in Spanish. In particular, we focused on two

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Speaker 3: prolific YouTubers who have been very engaged with you as

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Speaker 3: politics in the lead up to the election, and when

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Speaker 3: Juan Torris was one of them, John Aquaviva, who also

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Speaker 3: happens to be Venezuelan, was the other one. Yes, these

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Speaker 3: creators have a combined following of over half a million

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Speaker 3: subscribers and counting. Both are very passionate about what's happening

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Speaker 3: in the United States, but neither one of them has

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Speaker 3: any direct ties to this country. Yes, you heard that right,

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Speaker 3: and yet despite living outside of the United States and

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Speaker 3: not being US citizens and can't even vote in this country,

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Speaker 3: their influence and reach is local. In our month long

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Speaker 3: research of misinformation in Spanish, we also came upon conspiracies

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Speaker 3: about the FBI raid at Donald Trump's Mara A Lago estate,

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Speaker 3: lies about Kamala Harris being a Marxist, theories about President

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Speaker 3: Joe Biden's decis to not run for reelection. All of

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Speaker 3: these narratives originated in English, only to be repurposed soon

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Speaker 3: after in Spanish. It's not new that Latinos in the

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Speaker 3: US are prime targets of misinformation, particularly in Spanish. After all,

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Speaker 3: over forty percent of US consume news in Spanish. What's

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Speaker 3: different this election cycle is a growth of both content

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Speaker 3: creators attracted by the ever expanding Latino market and the

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Speaker 3: online platforms themselves. Seventeen percent of US adults now get

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Speaker 3: news from TikTok, compared to just three percent in twenty

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Speaker 3: twenty and X formerly Twitter has now expanded because it

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Speaker 3: pays verified users, and so more users started trying to

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Speaker 3: go viral. And going viral is good for business because

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Speaker 3: it means more followers, more clicks, and ultimately more money.

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Speaker 3: It's hard to know how many creators are putting out

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Speaker 3: fake content in this election cycle, Experts have told us

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Speaker 3: there simply aren't enough resources dedicated to tracking them all,

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Speaker 3: especially in Spanish, so posts en Espanol just live on

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Speaker 3: and on and on, fueling a wave of disinformation that

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Speaker 3: drowns out the facts and ultimately drowns out the truth. Sadly,

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Speaker 3: it's Latinos who are often the ones spreading this content

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Speaker 3: to our own communities and sometimes from Afar. Because, dear listener,

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Speaker 3: as we dug into how this underworld of misinformation operates

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Speaker 3: and who the players are, we actually had to leave

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Speaker 3: the United States in order to get the answers.

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Speaker 4: Nomre Juan Jose Torres eetra Tango and quarruan Jonlandia as

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Speaker 4: Manuel Livia Venezuela Sol.

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Speaker 3: Juan Jose Torres Estrada, who goes by Juan Torres on

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Speaker 3: his social media, is a twenty four year old Venezuelan

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Speaker 3: man who told us he lives in Iceland. Yes you

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Speaker 3: heard that right, Iceland. Yet he runs two YouTube channels

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Speaker 3: which focus almost entirely on US politics and on the

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Speaker 3: US election. His main channel, Venezuela News, has over one

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Speaker 3: hundred and seventy thousand subscribers, and his political videos started

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Speaker 3: in May of twenty twenty three, and that's what really

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Speaker 3: caught our attention. Why a channel called Venezuela News is

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Speaker 3: actually all about us politics. On this video, posted in

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Speaker 3: early August, Jue tries to paint a dark picture of

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Speaker 3: what a Kamala Harris presidency would look like. He says

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Speaker 3: she would abolish ice, the fin that she would defund

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Speaker 3: the police, con confiscate your arms. The list of lies

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Speaker 3: goes on. As we tracked Jue's videos, the question persisted

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Speaker 3: why a young Venezuelan who has never lived in the

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Speaker 3: United States was so interested in our election, so much

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Speaker 3: so to produce and post, according to his account, five, yes,

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Speaker 3: five videos about it daily. So we reached out to

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Speaker 3: Juan and asked for an interview. He agreed pretty quickly,

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Speaker 3: but when we told him that we were willing to

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Speaker 3: fly out to Iceland to meet him in person, he refused,

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Speaker 3: agreeing only to a virtual interview, and so in early September,

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Speaker 3: je joined us from the same place that we see

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Speaker 3: in most of his videos. The background on his screen

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Speaker 3: is blurred, but you can see a kitchen behind him.

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Speaker 2: This is like on the kitchen and a studio at

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Speaker 2: the same time.

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Speaker 3: Purple led lights illuminate the space, and he tells me

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Speaker 3: it's his favorite color. He has a round face. He

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Speaker 3: has dark hair that's short and neatly trimmed, along with

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Speaker 3: the goatee. Today he's wearing a black T shirt, which

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Speaker 3: is the casual look that he sports in most of

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Speaker 3: his videos. When we asked Juan about how he prepares

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Speaker 3: his videos and who are his sources, he gives us

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Speaker 3: just one answer. He says, my sources are x aka Twitter.

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Speaker 2: Those he METEGO me for my ex Basicamente.

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Speaker 3: Del Parsa One said everything is researched by him using

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Speaker 3: quote trusted sources from the Republican Party and other accounts

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Speaker 3: in English to gather information. But a review of his

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Speaker 3: video shows that he often just takes content from an

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Speaker 3: ex post in English and simply translates it on screen

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Speaker 3: for his audience. So I asked him the question that's

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Speaker 3: been on my mind since I first watched his videos.

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Speaker 3: Why is a twenty four year old Venezuelan in Iceland

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Speaker 3: so invested in the.

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Speaker 2: US asser Keeria Guardo.

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Speaker 4: Princes Manteezuelauela.

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Speaker 3: One says he wants to see core principles of the

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Speaker 3: GOP transferred to Venezuela.

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Speaker 2: Nottoya guard against senor.

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Speaker 3: Like not teaching children about gender in.

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Speaker 2: Schools deecho de elba.

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Speaker 3: And about the right to bear arms. So your entire

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Speaker 3: motive for what you are doing is to impact the

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Speaker 3: politics of Venezuelamento, to create a new movement in Venezuela

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Speaker 3: republic and that that movement is based on the Republican

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Speaker 3: Party of the United States.

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Speaker 5: See.

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Speaker 3: We first came across Jue through fact ce Cuiado, which

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Speaker 3: is a nonprofit initiative that counters miss and disinformation aimed

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Speaker 3: at Spanish speakers in the US. In an article about

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Speaker 3: the FBI search of Donald Trump's estate in mar Lago

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Speaker 3: in August of twenty twenty two, they used one of

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Speaker 3: Juan's videos as a perfect example of misinformation.

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Speaker 7: Pimbnido Venezuela news Iberda in fronteas lefmente so lad de la.

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Speaker 3: Lagu Earlier this year, Donald Trump twisted the standard language

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Speaker 3: in an FBI document about the raid to falsely claim

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Speaker 3: that the Biden administration was trying to kill him. This

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Speaker 3: claim spread like wildfire. Juan disseminated it.

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Speaker 7: Too basicamente and conclusion el de partment cita. I said,

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Speaker 7: chuto n Trump ka manera de in citaro al ya

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Speaker 7: si e repondre comunic Donald Trump fra primo.

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Speaker 3: Jue cites Julie Kelly as his source, calling her a journalist.

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Speaker 3: Kelly describes herself on x as a conspiracy theorist and

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Speaker 3: insurrection denier. One's loose definition of journalist extends to himself.

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Speaker 3: On X he identifies as a quote independent journalist sharing

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Speaker 3: true story and free speech. But then he confirmed to

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Speaker 3: us that he's never studied journalism. But on Twitter, you

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Speaker 3: did call yourself a journalist corrector, Yes, he says he's

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Speaker 3: a content creator. Well, content creator and journalist. Do you

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Speaker 3: see them as the same thing? No, no, no, no,

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Speaker 3: not the same, he tells me. But you did call

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Speaker 3: yourself a journalist on X see, but you just said

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Speaker 3: you didn't identify yourself as a journalist. One says he

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Speaker 3: doesn't have the title, but personally, it's how he identifies.

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Speaker 3: He brings up his abilities that, according to him, validate

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Speaker 3: his work.

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Speaker 4: Mocho potenziang in de de conversation the Politica politicaner, he.

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Speaker 3: Says he has quote a lot of potential when it

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Speaker 3: comes to discussing politics about the United States, Venezuela, or

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Speaker 3: the world. When immigration comes up in our conversation, one

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Speaker 3: gets excited and then tries to debate the border with me.

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Speaker 3: King hell IoT genoin Porta, No mere del hefedl border

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Speaker 3: patrol orgue because the system of what's the problem with

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Speaker 3: the border actually is decades in the making. Okay, by

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Speaker 3: both Republicans and Democrats. Okay, perfect his story. Okay, but

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Speaker 3: I'm not gonna do this one. Hold on, a second,

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Speaker 3: hold on, Okay. I love the fact that you're a

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Speaker 3: smiling but I'm not No, no, no, no, no. Here's

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Speaker 3: the thing. One, I'm not going to get into a

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Speaker 3: debate with you about what's happening at the border when

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Speaker 3: you're in Iceland. Our team had prepped for these interviews,

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Speaker 3: but I hadn't prepped for being confronted by what felt

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Speaker 3: like a real, live troll. When I asked one his

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Speaker 3: thoughts on the two US presidential candidates, he said he

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Speaker 3: doesn't support Kamala Harris or her policies, but that Trump

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Speaker 3: goes beyond politics. He has a long history of real

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Speaker 3: estate investments, and Trump knows how to deal with tough people,

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Speaker 3: he says. So I asked him what he thinks about

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Speaker 3: Trump being a convicted felon. He says, those urges, they're

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Speaker 3: all lies. When I tell him that it's a fact

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Speaker 3: that Donald Trump has been convicted of multiple felonies, Juan says,

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Speaker 3: it's all a witch hunt. Ultimately, Donald Trump was found

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Speaker 3: guilty by a jury of his peers. Juan tells us

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Speaker 3: he lives in Keflavik, Iceland. We tried to confirm this

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Speaker 3: location ourselves, but Juan's digital footprint is scarce and pretty puzzling.

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Speaker 3: The more we looked into it, the more confusing it was.

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Speaker 3: For instance, we found some old Facebook posts that Juan

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Speaker 3: had made looking for apartments in Iceland, but across his

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Speaker 3: social media accounts he tells a different story. On YouTube,

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Speaker 3: his location for his two channels are set to Mexico.

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Speaker 3: On x he says he's in the US. In his videos,

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Speaker 3: he does talk about moving to Iceland. And then we

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Speaker 3: found a clue in an old Facebook post on his

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Speaker 3: page for bed Dades Sinfronteas, which is Quan's second YouTube channel.

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Speaker 8: When you change something on Facebook, like you change your

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Speaker 8: relationship status or your location.

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Speaker 3: It'll send it also as a post.

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Speaker 8: And so there's a post that just says Vedada Sinfrontea

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Speaker 8: updated their address. And so when you click that, it

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Speaker 8: takes you to this map on bing and as this

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Speaker 8: pin when we're able to determine, okay, it's pointing at

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Speaker 8: this building or this structure here.

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Speaker 3: When our producer Nor Saudi narrowed down the pin on

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Speaker 3: the map, it indicated an address somewhere in direct Florida,

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Speaker 3: not Venezuela, not Iceland, not Mexico. But as we zeroed in,

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Speaker 3: Nor saw that this wasn't a house, It wasn't even

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Speaker 3: an apartment building. It was a warehouse. So we decided

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Speaker 3: maybe we should go there to find out if we

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Speaker 3: could see signs of Juan Torres there seventy nine oh two.

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Speaker 3: Here it is seventy nine fifty. Okay, well then stop

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Speaker 3: start stops up stuff to.

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Speaker 9: See what it's what.

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Speaker 3: Coming up on Latino USA. Our quest to find out

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Speaker 3: more about the content creators making a living pushing out

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Speaker 3: misleading content and lies ends up taking us to some

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Speaker 3: unlikely places. That's after the break. Stay with us, not there, yes, hey,

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Speaker 3: welcome back. We just heard from Juan Torres, a YouTuber

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Speaker 3: from Venezuela who lives in Iceland, or so he claims.

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Speaker 3: Before the break. We found a Facebook post from twenty

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Speaker 3: twenty one where he listed an address in Miami as

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Speaker 3: the location of his page. Now, there was no way

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Speaker 3: to verify what this location was or where it was

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Speaker 3: and how Juan, who has never lived in the United States,

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Speaker 3: was connected to this place unless we went there ourselves.

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Speaker 3: So we are in Doral and what we are looking

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Speaker 3: for is the address that Juan Torres has put as

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Speaker 3: his address in the United States. Definitely, no one lives here.

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Speaker 3: This is a warehouse on Logic Express, Corn Logic Express

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Speaker 3: Casierro Internacional. In the place where Jue had once listed

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Speaker 3: as the address for his YouTube channel. We found a

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Speaker 3: shipping service and this particular address was part of a

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Speaker 3: maze of one story warehouses behind locked doors, and so

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Speaker 3: it felt like we ended up literally in the middle

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Speaker 3: of nowhere. So we're gonna try and find a human.

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Speaker 7: Here we go.

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Speaker 3: On the side walls and in the back were shelves

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Speaker 3: where cardboard boxes and other wrap packages were sitting, some

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Speaker 3: as big as a refrigerator, and all of these packages

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Speaker 3: were getting ready to ship. On the right. When you

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Speaker 3: first walk in, there was a small glass window revealing

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Speaker 3: an office on the other side. A woman was sitting

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Speaker 3: at the desk behind the window. As we explained what

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Speaker 3: we were doing there, an older man quickly walked out

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Speaker 3: from the small office.

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Speaker 7: So I'm not shooting.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, we're looking for a business that said it

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Speaker 3: was located in the same address.

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Speaker 2: Do you know disaddress?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, seventy nine fifty what street that's exactly sixty six? Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 3: we're here for two years, so two years. JUNI. This

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Speaker 3: is Diego. He's fifty nine years old with a medium

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Speaker 3: build and short gray hair, and like one he is

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Speaker 3: also from Venezuela. Diego and his wife run con Logic Express,

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Speaker 3: which functions basically like a shipping middleman. So someone in

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Speaker 3: Venezuela could buy something from Amazon here in the US.

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Speaker 3: Amazon ships it to Diego's warehouse and then they'd prepare

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Speaker 3: the packages and give it to a freight forward to ship.

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Speaker 2: Do you know who was here before?

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Speaker 4: It was?

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Speaker 2: It was a transportential company? It was a transport hawk

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Speaker 2: Hawk Express.

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Speaker 3: Has anybody ever come looking for hre that is in

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Speaker 3: front ras or never heard someone by the name of

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Speaker 3: Juan Torres. What would you think if I told you

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Speaker 3: that there is a YouTube influencer who creates content on

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Speaker 3: YouTube aimed at Spanish speakers talking about uh Donald Trump

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Speaker 3: and Kamala Harris and then his address said he was

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Speaker 3: based here. What what I do? What would you think?

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Speaker 3: We showed Diego Jue's YouTube page. One.

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Speaker 10: Yeah, all right, so young guy.

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Speaker 2: Yeah four, let me see if he is registered with US.

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Speaker 3: Diego decides to join us in our investigation as to

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Speaker 3: the address that one has used. Now, Diego pulls out

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Speaker 3: a black swivel chair and sits down and starts searching

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Speaker 3: his database for one. No, one, yeah, this one.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, let's see what I'd say.

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Speaker 1: M hmm.

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Speaker 2: Okay.

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Speaker 10: So he registered with us some time and then twenty

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Speaker 10: twenty one and he sent some package to maybe.

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Speaker 3: We were able to confirm it was the same Juan

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Speaker 3: Torres because the email on the receipt was the same

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Speaker 3: one we found in our research for one. That's why

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Speaker 3: he's using our words. Oh so it was one way

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Speaker 3: to make sense of it, because if one thing was

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Speaker 3: for certain, one had never had that address as his own.

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Speaker 2: He's not telling the truth. This is not his dress.

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Speaker 10: I mean, we are here for two years maybe and

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Speaker 10: the people before us it was another company, So when

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Speaker 10: is this guy was here when?

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Speaker 3: At this point, Diego's Marionilla got very concerned about the

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Speaker 3: conversation we were having and she jumped in.

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Speaker 2: At cleant Ennesota.

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Speaker 3: Marionella is also Venezuelan. She has a medium tan complexion

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Speaker 3: and straight brown hair that reaches just past her shoulders.

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Speaker 3: When she learns about what was happening, she gets visibly upset.

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Speaker 9: Baraka. He says, do you know why I contact that?

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Speaker 9: I'll Facebook? ILOs to.

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Speaker 3: Marionella begins to get adamant. What if Je gets into

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Speaker 3: trouble and they connect him back to them? She tells

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Speaker 3: us she's going to contact him on Facebook and tell

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Speaker 3: him to remove this address. If he refuses, she says

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Speaker 3: she's willing to report him to the police. Diego, on

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Speaker 3: the other hand, didn't seem as worried. As far as

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Speaker 3: he's concerned, this was all just a way to make

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Speaker 3: money from YouTube.

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Speaker 2: He's trying to.

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Speaker 10: What he's doing, as I can sit here, is making money.

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Speaker 3: That During our interview, we did ask Quan straight out

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Speaker 3: about the address that he had listed. When we spoke

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Speaker 3: to him. He told us matter of factly that he

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Speaker 3: needed an address in the US in order to get

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Speaker 3: paid for his content.

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Speaker 2: I politic.

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Speaker 3: Basicament one says he cannot monetize his Facebook content in Iceland,

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Speaker 3: which is why he needs a US location. Quan tells

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Speaker 3: me this is basically the most logical approach. You have

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Speaker 3: to have a US address in order to get paid. Now,

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00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:13,280
Speaker 3: misrepresenting your location on Meta the owner of Facebook violates

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Speaker 3: the company's community standards. It's unclear if que did this

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Speaker 3: or if he used the address to make money. In

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Speaker 3: any case, despite once declaring a US address on Facebook, one,

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Speaker 3: we remind you has never ever lived in the United States,

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Speaker 3: and as he told us, YouTube is his full time job.

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Speaker 3: It's how he makes all of his money. Now, and

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Speaker 3: what's the largest amount of money that you have received.

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Speaker 3: Let's say fifteen thousand dollars for one video, no bottle

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Speaker 3: miss for one month?

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Speaker 2: Okay.

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Speaker 3: Depending on which country someone is based in, YouTube, x TikTok,

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Speaker 3: and Facebook all offer creators opportunities to make money off

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Speaker 3: their content, usually through ad revenue that's based on their

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Speaker 3: post's popularity. We reached out to YouTube to ask them

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Speaker 3: the size of their Spanish language moderation team. They replied

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Speaker 3: saying they have twenty thousand moderators globally quote, including many

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Speaker 3: with Spanish language expertise unquote. That's twenty thousand people monitoring

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Speaker 3: the over seven hundred and twenty million hours of video

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00:27:28,840 --> 00:27:38,320
Speaker 3: uploaded to YouTube on a daily basis. A few days

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Speaker 3: after we visited Diego and Marinella, the Durrel address had

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Speaker 3: been removed from one's profile on Facebook. Diego told us

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Speaker 3: that they didn't get to reach out to Juan to

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Speaker 3: ask him to delete it, So we tried to ask

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Speaker 3: Quan why he was no longer listing the location, then

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Speaker 3: why he had used it in the first place, But

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Speaker 3: after speaking to us for two hours on video, Juan

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Speaker 3: declined a second interview. With our follow ups, we kept

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Speaker 3: on trying. We even tried to get answers in writing,

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Speaker 3: but again Juan declined to offer any explanation. Still, Juan

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00:28:17,320 --> 00:28:20,640
Speaker 3: remained a bit of a mystery for me. Maybe it's

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00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:24,560
Speaker 3: as simple as Diego from the warehouse thought, you know, us,

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00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:27,719
Speaker 3: politics is just a money grab. Maybe that's why new

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Speaker 3: creators like Juan are popping up on the scene. But

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Speaker 3: what is their impact on Latinos and Latinas just before

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00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:42,240
Speaker 3: this presidential election. So after hanging out in remote warehouses

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00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:45,640
Speaker 3: in the middle of nowhere, our journey to discover more

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00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:50,400
Speaker 3: about miss and disinformation continued. So we got in our

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00:28:50,520 --> 00:28:54,400
Speaker 3: car and decided to move towards the Latino and Latina

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Speaker 3: neighborhoods of South Florida, one place that has been rampant

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Speaker 3: with misinformation in the past elections. That's due to the

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00:29:02,760 --> 00:29:06,840
Speaker 3: area's high concentration of Cubans and now more and more

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00:29:06,880 --> 00:29:11,800
Speaker 3: of an Isuelan's because misinformation campaigns aimed at them have

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00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:16,240
Speaker 3: exploited their fears of socialism and Marxism in order to

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00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:28,080
Speaker 3: attack Biden before and now to attack Harris. In dorel

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Speaker 3: which actually is now referred to as Doral Suela, we

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00:29:33,640 --> 00:29:36,360
Speaker 3: asked folks on the streets where they were getting their

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00:29:36,440 --> 00:29:41,680
Speaker 3: news and while a few answered with some traditional news

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Speaker 3: sources Fox News and is that your most trusted sources.

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Speaker 1: Trust most trusted sources CNN.

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Speaker 3: Are, others pointed to social media. Where do you get

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Speaker 3: your information?

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Speaker 2: I st.

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Speaker 3: In Miami. We also met up with Anna Maria Carano

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Speaker 3: in fact Check, Ciado's managing editor. Remember this is one

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00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:17,560
Speaker 3: of the main organizations in the US that's tracking misinformation

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00:30:17,920 --> 00:30:29,920
Speaker 3: in Spanish. She and her very excited dog welcomed us

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Speaker 3: into her home.

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Speaker 1: We've seen that as close as we get to elections,

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Speaker 1: there are more fake content in social media targeting Hispanic people.

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Speaker 3: We wanted to speak to her in order to understand

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Speaker 3: if Juan's videos are having a real impact on US.

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00:30:46,200 --> 00:30:50,640
Speaker 1: Soil Latinas tend to get informed basically on social media,

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00:30:50,840 --> 00:30:53,680
Speaker 1: and they rely a lot in their families and people

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00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:59,240
Speaker 1: they know, so they don't trust official sources more intend

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00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:03,440
Speaker 1: to rely on other sources that not necessarily are well informed.

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00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:07,960
Speaker 3: And not everyone who shares misinformation has ill intentions.

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00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:12,320
Speaker 1: It could be your grandma or your friend that you

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00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:14,480
Speaker 1: know very well, and they think that this is true

415
00:31:14,640 --> 00:31:19,840
Speaker 1: because they are looking at the logo of New Salad

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00:31:20,080 --> 00:31:21,440
Speaker 1: and they think that this is true.

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00:31:23,200 --> 00:31:27,680
Speaker 3: So you have people with verified accounts and huge audiences

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00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:31,920
Speaker 3: like Elon Musk with two hundred million followers on x

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00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:35,160
Speaker 3: or even Juan Torres, who has more than about two

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00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:40,000
Speaker 3: hundred thousand subscribers on YouTube. When they share claims about

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00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:44,600
Speaker 3: Kamala Harris being a Marxist, those lies can spread more

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00:31:44,720 --> 00:31:50,960
Speaker 3: quickly because their peddlers seem to be reputable, as.

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00:31:51,000 --> 00:31:59,440
Speaker 2: As Carmela Harris numerouno take missus poult Carmela Harris numetal

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00:31:59,520 --> 00:32:02,160
Speaker 2: dos no importa.

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00:32:04,520 --> 00:32:07,360
Speaker 3: Videos like the one we just heard that not only

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00:32:07,680 --> 00:32:13,080
Speaker 3: mispronounces Harris's name but also repeats a common lie, for example,

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00:32:13,520 --> 00:32:17,480
Speaker 3: that prices will immediately shoot up if she becomes president.

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00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:22,720
Speaker 3: It's the old law of propaganda. Repeat a lie often enough,

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00:32:23,240 --> 00:32:30,680
Speaker 3: and it becomes the truth. I sat down with Ana

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00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:34,240
Speaker 3: Maria to look at some examples of miss and disinformation

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00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:38,440
Speaker 3: that factche Ciao has flagged. One of them was an

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00:32:38,520 --> 00:32:43,640
Speaker 3: AI generated image of Kamala Harris posted on x by

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00:32:43,800 --> 00:32:48,880
Speaker 3: the platform's owner, Elon Musk. So you have a situation

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Speaker 3: where Elon Musk has actually tweeted out a picture of

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00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:57,680
Speaker 3: Kamala Harris wearing a red outfit and a cap with

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00:32:57,920 --> 00:33:02,120
Speaker 3: the sickle hammer, looking like a communist and it says

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00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:05,280
Speaker 3: Kamala vows to be a communist dictator on day one.

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Speaker 3: Can you believe she wears that outfit?

439
00:33:08,440 --> 00:33:09,600
Speaker 5: Wow? Wow.

440
00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:15,720
Speaker 3: This connection between Kamala Harris and Marxism or communism has

441
00:33:15,760 --> 00:33:19,160
Speaker 3: been pushed by the far right repeatedly over the last

442
00:33:19,280 --> 00:33:23,320
Speaker 3: several years, but specifically over the last year. For example,

443
00:33:23,720 --> 00:33:27,640
Speaker 3: the Digital Democracy Institute of the Americas tracks hundreds of

444
00:33:27,760 --> 00:33:32,280
Speaker 3: Spanish language public WhatsApp groups and they found that since

445
00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:36,160
Speaker 3: January of this year, at least twenty four thousand Latinos

446
00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:42,160
Speaker 3: were likely exposed to content connecting Vice President Harris to communism,

447
00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:45,400
Speaker 3: and around a third of this exposure to these lies

448
00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:49,360
Speaker 3: happened in the week following the presidential debate in September,

449
00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:52,160
Speaker 3: when Trump repeated those claims.

450
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:57,920
Speaker 1: And this narrative is basically trying to tackle emotions into

451
00:33:57,960 --> 00:33:58,560
Speaker 1: the voters.

452
00:33:58,840 --> 00:34:02,560
Speaker 3: Can you will live ill? A mosque posited this image

453
00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:03,920
Speaker 3: of come so.

454
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:08,000
Speaker 1: Often that he's so easy to spread out instead of facts.

455
00:34:08,120 --> 00:34:10,280
Speaker 2: Facts are not sexy to talk about.

456
00:34:14,239 --> 00:34:18,319
Speaker 3: Being a political influencer has been a lucrative job for one,

457
00:34:18,880 --> 00:34:21,960
Speaker 3: but he's not the only online creator making a living

458
00:34:22,080 --> 00:34:26,480
Speaker 3: by talking about US politics from outside of the United States.

459
00:34:27,320 --> 00:34:31,480
Speaker 3: So part of our investigation is trying to understand how

460
00:34:31,600 --> 00:34:35,680
Speaker 3: some creators are making so much money off of Spanish

461
00:34:35,840 --> 00:34:39,719
Speaker 3: language content. And this ended up taking us on a

462
00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:45,200
Speaker 3: plane across the pond, yes, across the Atlantic, because our

463
00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:46,279
Speaker 3: next stop.

464
00:34:46,560 --> 00:34:48,600
Speaker 1: Good morning, evering, I'm welcome to London, where the local

465
00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:50,080
Speaker 1: time is approximately ten.

466
00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:54,440
Speaker 3: Is England, and our goal is to meet face to

467
00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:57,759
Speaker 3: face with someone named John Aquaviva.

468
00:34:57,960 --> 00:35:01,360
Speaker 5: If for me hint does John a Amanda.

469
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:08,120
Speaker 3: John Aquaviva is another Venezuelan YouTuber. His channel has over

470
00:35:08,239 --> 00:35:11,440
Speaker 3: three hundred and forty thousand subscribers and he's published more

471
00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:15,760
Speaker 3: than a thousand videos. Some date back years, most often

472
00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:19,759
Speaker 3: covering Venezuelan issues, but in the lead up to the

473
00:35:19,880 --> 00:35:24,560
Speaker 3: twenty twenty election, his content shifted to focus primarily on

474
00:35:24,840 --> 00:35:25,879
Speaker 3: US politics.

475
00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:33,640
Speaker 5: Plata form.

476
00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:37,879
Speaker 3: John is thirty one years old. Back in Venezuela and Colombia,

477
00:35:38,040 --> 00:35:42,160
Speaker 3: he was a professional athlete in something called freestyle football.

478
00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:45,920
Speaker 3: He moved to England in twenty fourteen, where his mom's

479
00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:49,160
Speaker 3: family lived. When we reached out to request an interview,

480
00:35:49,320 --> 00:35:52,600
Speaker 3: he agreed to meet us in person. He did not

481
00:35:52,800 --> 00:35:57,080
Speaker 3: want to share his home address or hometown. Instead, he

482
00:35:57,200 --> 00:36:01,480
Speaker 3: agreed to meet us in downtown London Leicester Square, which

483
00:36:01,560 --> 00:36:04,799
Speaker 3: is essentially like Times Square, and he was staying at

484
00:36:04,840 --> 00:36:09,200
Speaker 3: the swanky Londoner Hotel. That's where my producer More and

485
00:36:09,360 --> 00:36:16,000
Speaker 3: I headed to meet him. John walks over to us

486
00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:19,960
Speaker 3: where we are waiting in the lobby. He's tall, frankly,

487
00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:24,360
Speaker 3: towering over me, and he has these big, broad shoulders.

488
00:36:28,719 --> 00:36:32,920
Speaker 3: He's dressed pretty sleekily with a black jacket over a

489
00:36:33,000 --> 00:36:36,680
Speaker 3: white shirt and jeans. He's got a light complexion, dark hair,

490
00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:40,440
Speaker 3: and dark brown eyes. John tells me he keeps his

491
00:36:40,640 --> 00:36:44,719
Speaker 3: home address private ever since a group called then in

492
00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:50,320
Speaker 3: Inane Venezuelan's in England reported him to the police because

493
00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:54,279
Speaker 3: of pro Trump posts he had made back in twenty sixteen.

494
00:36:55,000 --> 00:36:59,040
Speaker 3: John then says the police came to his home, busted

495
00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:03,440
Speaker 3: his front window and confiscated air rifles that he had

496
00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:07,120
Speaker 3: been displaying in his living room for all to see.

497
00:37:07,840 --> 00:37:12,160
Speaker 3: Ten minutes into our conversation, John, just like Juan Torres,

498
00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:17,680
Speaker 3: tries to provoke a debate with me. So let me

499
00:37:17,840 --> 00:37:19,160
Speaker 3: ask you, though, why.

500
00:37:19,160 --> 00:37:21,800
Speaker 5: Why would you put I like, what's the problem. Obviously

501
00:37:21,840 --> 00:37:24,200
Speaker 5: you do produce your against grones. Well that's just a

502
00:37:24,200 --> 00:37:26,719
Speaker 5: different subject. As you say, obviously you do see a

503
00:37:26,760 --> 00:37:30,160
Speaker 5: problem with it. Produce your against grones. Well that's your opinion.

504
00:37:30,640 --> 00:37:32,479
Speaker 3: Can find Wait a second, what are you talking about.

505
00:37:32,480 --> 00:37:35,239
Speaker 5: I've seen your opinions about gun control opinions.

506
00:37:35,320 --> 00:37:38,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, you'd have to specifically show me something that shows

507
00:37:38,040 --> 00:37:38,560
Speaker 3: an opinion.

508
00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:42,640
Speaker 5: You've spoken endlessly about my shooting endlessly. Yeah, okay, I

509
00:37:42,680 --> 00:37:44,279
Speaker 5: actually have some quotes. Do you want to read them?

510
00:37:44,760 --> 00:37:44,800
Speaker 8: No?

511
00:37:49,920 --> 00:37:53,440
Speaker 3: So once again I had to push back against getting

512
00:37:53,520 --> 00:37:57,520
Speaker 3: baited to get into a debate with John. And so

513
00:37:57,960 --> 00:38:01,320
Speaker 3: the answer to the question of why you focus on

514
00:38:01,760 --> 00:38:03,560
Speaker 3: US politics is.

515
00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:07,120
Speaker 5: Because at the moment, US politics influences Venezuela more than

516
00:38:07,200 --> 00:38:10,120
Speaker 5: Venezuelan politics. So if you're going to be interested in

517
00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:13,560
Speaker 5: creating the most amounts of growth possible, you're going to support.

518
00:38:13,640 --> 00:38:15,279
Speaker 5: I think if you're living in the West, or if

519
00:38:15,280 --> 00:38:17,719
Speaker 5: you're living in any Latin American country, you're going to

520
00:38:17,760 --> 00:38:21,279
Speaker 5: support who you think is the best option to lead

521
00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:22,560
Speaker 5: the United States.

522
00:38:22,360 --> 00:38:25,080
Speaker 3: Because the United States is going to impact yes, exactly.

523
00:38:27,480 --> 00:38:31,960
Speaker 3: YouTube and Instagram and a smaller telegram channel are the

524
00:38:32,120 --> 00:38:35,400
Speaker 3: primary platforms John spends most of his time on.

525
00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:39,839
Speaker 5: Now, I decided this is what I'm most passionate about.

526
00:38:40,040 --> 00:38:43,040
Speaker 5: This is what I actually think is what I'm meant

527
00:38:43,120 --> 00:38:44,880
Speaker 5: to do the moment. For the past few years, have

528
00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:49,839
Speaker 5: been a content creator, political analyst, opinadorre, whatever you want

529
00:38:49,920 --> 00:38:52,360
Speaker 5: to call me. Well, yeah, I living from my content

530
00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:53,040
Speaker 5: the same way you do.

531
00:38:53,760 --> 00:38:57,840
Speaker 3: A review of John's YouTube channel shows it's clear he

532
00:38:57,960 --> 00:38:58,760
Speaker 3: favors Trump.

533
00:38:59,040 --> 00:39:01,520
Speaker 5: I'm supporting Trump, obviously. I think that when you compare

534
00:39:01,560 --> 00:39:05,000
Speaker 5: them to obviously, I think he's the best option out

535
00:39:05,040 --> 00:39:07,279
Speaker 5: of what is available. As soon as you're president, you

536
00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:09,320
Speaker 5: have to do what you've promised. I'm not going to

537
00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:11,600
Speaker 5: keep supporting you if you're not doing what you promise

538
00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:11,800
Speaker 5: to do.

539
00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:13,840
Speaker 3: You don't vote in the United States. No, you're not

540
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:16,520
Speaker 3: a US citizen. No, you have no plans to move

541
00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:17,400
Speaker 3: to the United States.

542
00:39:17,440 --> 00:39:17,960
Speaker 5: Thoughts about it.

543
00:39:18,120 --> 00:39:20,320
Speaker 3: I just find that fascinating, because you know, you're so

544
00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:22,879
Speaker 3: engaged with you as politics, but literally you have nothing

545
00:39:22,920 --> 00:39:26,120
Speaker 3: to do with the United States. I continued in my

546
00:39:26,239 --> 00:39:31,360
Speaker 3: conversation and asked John specifically about his position on Kamala Harris.

547
00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:34,120
Speaker 5: How can you trust someone who has said that the

548
00:39:34,280 --> 00:39:36,840
Speaker 5: main cause of one of the main culprits of a

549
00:39:37,000 --> 00:39:40,520
Speaker 5: high grocery prices in americant moment is that the supermarkets

550
00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:44,440
Speaker 5: are charging too much. That is exactly what happened in Venezuela.

551
00:39:44,440 --> 00:39:46,640
Speaker 5: Madya Challis said exactly the same thing.

552
00:39:47,280 --> 00:39:50,920
Speaker 3: John doesn't go as far as calling Harris a Marxist

553
00:39:51,080 --> 00:39:54,600
Speaker 3: or Communist like the other content creators have, but he

554
00:39:54,719 --> 00:40:01,759
Speaker 3: says on this policy point, essentially they're equal Coming up

555
00:40:01,920 --> 00:40:04,960
Speaker 3: after the break, we look at what solutions are being

556
00:40:05,040 --> 00:40:09,360
Speaker 3: put in place to combat misinformation, and we keep digging

557
00:40:09,600 --> 00:40:36,560
Speaker 3: into the money mystery. Stay with us, Yes, Welcome back,

558
00:40:36,600 --> 00:40:41,879
Speaker 3: dear listener. In this episode, we've heard from two YouTubers who,

559
00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:46,040
Speaker 3: despite having never lived in the United States, focus virtually

560
00:40:46,320 --> 00:40:50,040
Speaker 3: all of their content on the upcoming US presidential election,

561
00:40:50,760 --> 00:40:55,960
Speaker 3: including many times misleading information, and all of it in Spanish.

562
00:40:56,760 --> 00:41:00,320
Speaker 3: And the question at the front of our minds was, Oh, ways,

563
00:41:00,920 --> 00:41:04,839
Speaker 3: who's funding all of this? And so I asked Juan

564
00:41:04,920 --> 00:41:09,719
Speaker 3: Torres and John Aquaviva directly if someone was paying them

565
00:41:09,800 --> 00:41:13,200
Speaker 3: to do this or if they got any help from

566
00:41:13,280 --> 00:41:19,480
Speaker 3: any organization, and they both quickly said no. So which

567
00:41:19,520 --> 00:41:20,400
Speaker 3: sponsors do you have?

568
00:41:21,719 --> 00:41:21,759
Speaker 8: No?

569
00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:32,160
Speaker 3: Zero zero institutional nosteleis news navi No. Every expert we

570
00:41:32,320 --> 00:41:36,800
Speaker 3: spoke to talked about the difficulty in tracing the money factor.

571
00:41:37,400 --> 00:41:40,919
Speaker 3: This is what Anna Maria, Factcheckiado's editor, who we heard

572
00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:44,279
Speaker 3: from earlier, had to say about this. Where's all this.

573
00:41:44,360 --> 00:41:45,120
Speaker 5: Money coming from?

574
00:41:46,440 --> 00:41:46,480
Speaker 11: Me?

575
00:41:46,600 --> 00:41:51,520
Speaker 1: There? I have ideas, but I wouldn't say that aloud

576
00:41:51,680 --> 00:41:55,319
Speaker 1: because as a fact checker, I have to to tell

577
00:41:55,440 --> 00:41:56,400
Speaker 1: what I know and.

578
00:41:56,800 --> 00:41:58,200
Speaker 2: What is truth.

579
00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:01,880
Speaker 3: Evelyn of We arem Us, who we heard from at

580
00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:04,960
Speaker 3: the top of the show, also shared some thoughts.

581
00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:09,640
Speaker 6: What we've heard from some journalists in Latin America is

582
00:42:09,719 --> 00:42:13,239
Speaker 6: a lot of the money comes from the Kremlin to

583
00:42:13,440 --> 00:42:18,960
Speaker 6: Latin America through certain accounts. There's connections with Venezuela and

584
00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:21,040
Speaker 6: other places, and then it gets disseminated.

585
00:42:22,640 --> 00:42:26,719
Speaker 3: Now, we have no evidence that either Juantres or John

586
00:42:26,840 --> 00:42:31,239
Speaker 3: Aquaviva are funded by Russia or any other government, either

587
00:42:31,480 --> 00:42:35,839
Speaker 3: directly or indirectly. But the truth is that Russia has

588
00:42:36,040 --> 00:42:41,759
Speaker 3: repeatedly interfered with US elections. In fact, in September, as

589
00:42:41,840 --> 00:42:46,680
Speaker 3: we were flying to London, an FBI investigation found evidence

590
00:42:47,080 --> 00:42:51,399
Speaker 3: that the state run media outlet RT formerly known as

591
00:42:51,680 --> 00:42:57,160
Speaker 3: Russia Today, sent millions of dollars to Tenant Media, Tennessee

592
00:42:57,320 --> 00:43:02,239
Speaker 3: based content creation company. It's the goal of spreading pro

593
00:43:02,480 --> 00:43:08,440
Speaker 3: Russia propaganda across YouTube, TikTok, and other major platforms in

594
00:43:08,760 --> 00:43:12,320
Speaker 3: order to influence the American public and in order to

595
00:43:12,480 --> 00:43:15,399
Speaker 3: sew division. Here's Evelyn again.

596
00:43:16,040 --> 00:43:20,400
Speaker 6: Content is created in Latin America and content is created

597
00:43:20,440 --> 00:43:25,560
Speaker 6: in the United States that is being shared to scare

598
00:43:25,719 --> 00:43:29,360
Speaker 6: family and friends with whatever they want. The purpose to be.

599
00:43:29,960 --> 00:43:33,279
Speaker 3: Fear is a central part of this from your analysis

600
00:43:33,520 --> 00:43:34,680
Speaker 3: the role of fear.

601
00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:40,280
Speaker 6: The role of fear to weaken democratic institutions.

602
00:43:42,880 --> 00:43:47,319
Speaker 3: And we heard about this fear firsthand from a Latina voter.

603
00:43:48,360 --> 00:43:52,279
Speaker 3: At Evelyn's home in Weston in South Florida, she introduces

604
00:43:52,440 --> 00:44:03,000
Speaker 3: us to Esperanza, who is Evelyn's hairstylist. Now, Esperanza is

605
00:44:03,160 --> 00:44:06,920
Speaker 3: not the hairstylist's real name because she wants to remain

606
00:44:07,080 --> 00:44:11,560
Speaker 3: anonymous in order to protect her business. But Esperanza was

607
00:44:11,920 --> 00:44:15,960
Speaker 3: part of the pilot program with Brown University that Evelyn

608
00:44:16,080 --> 00:44:19,759
Speaker 3: worked on that we mentioned earlier in the episode. Esperanza

609
00:44:19,880 --> 00:44:23,440
Speaker 3: had been hearing and seeing a lot of misinformation from

610
00:44:23,520 --> 00:44:27,319
Speaker 3: her clients at the hair salon. One person put her

611
00:44:27,360 --> 00:44:31,320
Speaker 3: in a telegram group called gau Salidad, the word in

612
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:35,480
Speaker 3: Spanish for cause or origin. The word is spelled with

613
00:44:35,560 --> 00:44:38,960
Speaker 3: a C, but in this telegram group it was spelled

614
00:44:39,160 --> 00:44:43,200
Speaker 3: with a Q, as in QAnon, the far right political

615
00:44:43,280 --> 00:44:50,800
Speaker 3: conspiracy movement. The lies and conspiracies Esperanza says she heard

616
00:44:50,880 --> 00:44:55,840
Speaker 3: from her clients ranged from the persistent lie that President

617
00:44:55,960 --> 00:45:00,120
Speaker 3: Joe Biden is allowing criminals to cross the border the

618
00:45:00,160 --> 00:45:05,680
Speaker 3: way to Biden being behind the first attempted assassination of Trump.

619
00:45:07,360 --> 00:45:13,040
Speaker 3: That information where we're where was it coming from. Even

620
00:45:13,080 --> 00:45:16,040
Speaker 3: though Esperanza works at her hair salon and here's the

621
00:45:16,160 --> 00:45:19,239
Speaker 3: talk of politics day in and day out, she still

622
00:45:19,320 --> 00:45:23,080
Speaker 3: believes that she's not entirely informed about politics in the US.

623
00:45:23,719 --> 00:45:27,080
Speaker 3: But she told us she definitely will not be voting

624
00:45:27,160 --> 00:45:27,920
Speaker 3: for Donald Trump.

625
00:45:28,640 --> 00:45:33,120
Speaker 6: Letronico Sarmas.

626
00:45:34,360 --> 00:45:36,040
Speaker 2: Mil Conelte mail racism.

627
00:45:36,600 --> 00:45:41,120
Speaker 3: She says she's afraid of Trump because of two particular issues,

628
00:45:41,680 --> 00:45:45,680
Speaker 3: guns and racism. But she tells us that a majority

629
00:45:45,719 --> 00:45:48,200
Speaker 3: of the women she's spoken to with the salon are

630
00:45:48,320 --> 00:45:51,280
Speaker 3: telling her they are going to vote for Donald Trump,

631
00:45:51,840 --> 00:45:57,719
Speaker 3: influenced by those entrenched rumors they've heard about Democrats equally socialism.

632
00:46:02,800 --> 00:46:05,960
Speaker 3: Evelyn says misinformation is a problem that needs to be

633
00:46:06,280 --> 00:46:10,239
Speaker 3: urgently addressed by the government, by journalists, and by academics.

634
00:46:11,040 --> 00:46:15,920
Speaker 6: My frustration, to be honest with you, Maria, was I

635
00:46:16,000 --> 00:46:19,520
Speaker 6: felt like the Cassandra of Greek mythology, right because I

636
00:46:19,600 --> 00:46:21,680
Speaker 6: kept on saying, look at this, look at how this

637
00:46:21,840 --> 00:46:25,440
Speaker 6: is affecting our communities. And the response so many advisors

638
00:46:25,480 --> 00:46:28,759
Speaker 6: and consultants to them was, you know what.

639
00:46:28,880 --> 00:46:30,560
Speaker 2: You just need to laugh it off.

640
00:46:31,040 --> 00:46:34,160
Speaker 3: And as we saw before, when Elon Musk shares a

641
00:46:34,320 --> 00:46:38,000
Speaker 3: fake photo of Kamala Harris in a communist get up,

642
00:46:38,520 --> 00:46:42,120
Speaker 3: it passes off as a meme. Some people might laugh,

643
00:46:42,680 --> 00:46:46,759
Speaker 3: but on the ground it has a real impact from

644
00:46:46,880 --> 00:46:48,600
Speaker 3: the neighborhoods of Miami.

645
00:46:50,360 --> 00:46:53,680
Speaker 10: I don't buy into that she's a communist or anything,

646
00:46:54,080 --> 00:46:56,840
Speaker 10: but her social views are right up there with people

647
00:46:56,880 --> 00:46:58,399
Speaker 10: who I would not support.

648
00:46:58,840 --> 00:47:02,600
Speaker 3: A Kamala Harris presidency. What concerns you about that?

649
00:47:02,880 --> 00:47:04,600
Speaker 2: What's tradition socialism?

650
00:47:04,880 --> 00:47:08,839
Speaker 3: Yes, I believe that Kamala Harris elected would lead to socialism.

651
00:47:09,200 --> 00:47:13,960
Speaker 2: I think so, but I tell you I'm not complete informed.

652
00:47:14,760 --> 00:47:17,440
Speaker 3: And all the way to New Jersey, which has one

653
00:47:17,440 --> 00:47:21,040
Speaker 3: of the highest populations of Cuban Americans in the country,

654
00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:22,360
Speaker 3: are you going to involve.

655
00:47:22,120 --> 00:47:22,720
Speaker 10: In the dialection?

656
00:47:23,080 --> 00:47:23,279
Speaker 8: Yes?

657
00:47:23,560 --> 00:47:24,960
Speaker 2: You know who for Trump?

658
00:47:25,239 --> 00:47:25,520
Speaker 4: Okay?

659
00:47:25,600 --> 00:47:28,480
Speaker 11: And why well, my dad is from Cuba, and like

660
00:47:28,600 --> 00:47:30,840
Speaker 11: people that come from a communist country, they already know

661
00:47:30,840 --> 00:47:32,520
Speaker 11: what's going to happen, and everything is diviral.

662
00:47:32,520 --> 00:47:33,560
Speaker 2: We don't know what's going to happen.

663
00:47:34,160 --> 00:47:37,560
Speaker 11: It's not a real thing that she can do for us,

664
00:47:37,920 --> 00:47:41,280
Speaker 11: for the Latin people, because you know, when they are elected,

665
00:47:41,840 --> 00:47:44,960
Speaker 11: they change all the things, So I think this is

666
00:47:45,040 --> 00:47:47,560
Speaker 11: afraid for us the immigrant.

667
00:47:54,440 --> 00:47:57,799
Speaker 3: Back in Miami in her home office, Evelyn played us

668
00:47:57,840 --> 00:48:05,160
Speaker 3: a recording from a local radio station called kamalai Ian

669
00:48:05,440 --> 00:48:06,640
Speaker 3: and Tampon.

670
00:48:13,160 --> 00:48:13,200
Speaker 2: So.

671
00:48:13,360 --> 00:48:18,000
Speaker 3: On this Spanish language radio show, the hosts are criticizing

672
00:48:18,160 --> 00:48:22,239
Speaker 3: Kamala Harris and her running mate Tim Walls for allegedly

673
00:48:22,680 --> 00:48:27,640
Speaker 3: taking a photograph at the offices of an organization allegedly

674
00:48:27,840 --> 00:48:33,600
Speaker 3: called Revolutionary Communists of America where you see Kamala Harris

675
00:48:33,960 --> 00:48:38,680
Speaker 3: and Tim Walls with a hammer and sickle insignia behind

676
00:48:38,800 --> 00:48:44,120
Speaker 3: them huge on the wall. Evelyn was immediately suspicious of this,

677
00:48:44,880 --> 00:48:47,759
Speaker 3: so she picked up the phone, called the station and

678
00:48:47,880 --> 00:48:50,960
Speaker 3: asked a friend who worked there to center the information.

679
00:48:51,520 --> 00:48:55,840
Speaker 3: The friend sent her a video on WhatsApp of a TikTok.

680
00:48:56,280 --> 00:48:57,520
Speaker 11: I am not asked this year.

681
00:48:57,680 --> 00:48:58,600
Speaker 2: I'm gonna get myself.

682
00:48:59,760 --> 00:49:08,480
Speaker 3: Saw the TikTok and the account that posted it is

683
00:49:08,600 --> 00:49:12,600
Speaker 3: now deleted. But on What's App, Evelyn saw the note

684
00:49:12,719 --> 00:49:17,560
Speaker 3: above the video that said forwarded many times. It's a

685
00:49:17,719 --> 00:49:22,320
Speaker 3: notice what app adds to content forwarded too many times?

686
00:49:22,719 --> 00:49:32,560
Speaker 3: In order to help prevent spamming and misinformation, Evelyn called

687
00:49:32,600 --> 00:49:37,000
Speaker 3: the station back and insisted that this wasn't a real photo,

688
00:49:37,400 --> 00:49:41,760
Speaker 3: it wasn't a real video. The backdrop had been photoshopped

689
00:49:41,880 --> 00:49:45,960
Speaker 3: behind Kamala Harris and Tim Walls. A short while later,

690
00:49:46,600 --> 00:49:49,640
Speaker 3: the station went on the air and issued a correction.

691
00:49:52,840 --> 00:49:58,560
Speaker 3: But when I tell You Pacific, the radio anchor acknowledged

692
00:49:58,600 --> 00:50:02,080
Speaker 3: that the video was in fact fake, but then followed

693
00:50:02,160 --> 00:50:06,920
Speaker 3: up by saying this lie that Kamala Harris's Marxist tendencies

694
00:50:07,320 --> 00:50:13,280
Speaker 3: were still very very real across social media. The line

695
00:50:13,360 --> 00:50:19,520
Speaker 3: between misinformation and opinion gets murkier and murkier. That's the

696
00:50:19,600 --> 00:50:23,680
Speaker 3: same reasoning John Aquaviva gave us when we asked about

697
00:50:23,760 --> 00:50:28,080
Speaker 3: accusations against him, that he's pushing miss and disinformation.

698
00:50:29,560 --> 00:50:33,200
Speaker 5: Misinformation could be an opinion. Disinformation is where I take

699
00:50:33,600 --> 00:50:35,239
Speaker 5: issue with, and then you have to prove that I

700
00:50:35,440 --> 00:50:36,320
Speaker 5: lied about somethinniy.

701
00:50:36,600 --> 00:50:39,960
Speaker 3: So what about the fact that you said that Democratic

702
00:50:40,040 --> 00:50:43,960
Speaker 3: Party leaders quote unquote intentionally pushed Joe Biden's June debate

703
00:50:44,360 --> 00:50:45,000
Speaker 3: against Trump.

704
00:50:45,120 --> 00:50:48,200
Speaker 5: Joe Biden said that it was obvious. Why else would

705
00:50:48,200 --> 00:50:49,960
Speaker 5: they push for it to be so, if not to

706
00:50:50,040 --> 00:50:53,000
Speaker 5: give Kamala Harris a chance to create her own campaign. Well,

707
00:50:53,080 --> 00:50:54,080
Speaker 5: is that coincidence on.

708
00:50:54,120 --> 00:50:55,600
Speaker 3: A second, Hold on a second, I just want to say,

709
00:50:55,600 --> 00:50:57,920
Speaker 3: when you were saying it's so obvious, it's not that

710
00:50:58,040 --> 00:51:02,960
Speaker 3: you have any written documentary or actually journalism politics.

711
00:51:03,040 --> 00:51:06,440
Speaker 5: When something is a huge coincidence, like a huge coincidence,

712
00:51:06,800 --> 00:51:09,960
Speaker 5: I lean on the side of it not being a coincidence.

713
00:51:10,160 --> 00:51:11,960
Speaker 5: Do I have the proof of that they didn't. No,

714
00:51:12,120 --> 00:51:12,880
Speaker 5: But it's my opinion.

715
00:51:15,239 --> 00:51:19,120
Speaker 3: Anamaria from fact check Yado has heard this before.

716
00:51:19,840 --> 00:51:23,640
Speaker 1: If they're saying, well, in my opinion, I think that

717
00:51:23,880 --> 00:51:28,120
Speaker 1: probably so. You can't fact check an opinion because people

718
00:51:28,239 --> 00:51:32,320
Speaker 1: have the right to have their opinions. So if someone

719
00:51:32,440 --> 00:51:36,200
Speaker 1: get famous by telling their opinion, how do you censor it?

720
00:51:38,760 --> 00:51:41,000
Speaker 3: And at the end of the day, research has shown

721
00:51:41,120 --> 00:51:46,239
Speaker 3: that it's not that Latinos are more inherently susceptible to misinformation,

722
00:51:46,960 --> 00:51:49,480
Speaker 3: but that the real root of the problem is a

723
00:51:49,600 --> 00:51:54,000
Speaker 3: lack of accurate resources and tools to combat miss and

724
00:51:54,120 --> 00:51:59,600
Speaker 3: disinformation that directly targets them in Spanish, and with the

725
00:51:59,680 --> 00:52:05,400
Speaker 3: e of artificial intelligence, fake content spreads more easily and

726
00:52:05,640 --> 00:52:09,760
Speaker 3: more widely, Like the lie about the election being canceled

727
00:52:10,200 --> 00:52:11,840
Speaker 3: that we started our show with.

728
00:52:12,640 --> 00:52:15,520
Speaker 1: They want you to act based on fear, on an

729
00:52:15,560 --> 00:52:17,480
Speaker 1: emotion that you can't control.

730
00:52:25,480 --> 00:52:29,400
Speaker 3: Dear listener. What we've learned in our investigation is that

731
00:52:29,640 --> 00:52:33,839
Speaker 3: the problem of dis and misinformation in our community will

732
00:52:33,920 --> 00:52:38,840
Speaker 3: continue to grow because it feeds on emotions, emotions that

733
00:52:38,960 --> 00:52:44,440
Speaker 3: among Latinos and Latinas can overpower facts. And then there

734
00:52:44,560 --> 00:52:49,319
Speaker 3: is the perpetually elusive question of the money behind all

735
00:52:49,400 --> 00:52:53,319
Speaker 3: of these disinformation efforts. You should know, dear listener. We're

736
00:52:53,360 --> 00:52:56,680
Speaker 3: going to continue to press on this. What is clear

737
00:52:57,239 --> 00:53:01,320
Speaker 3: is that there simply aren't enough resources in Spanish to

738
00:53:01,520 --> 00:53:07,240
Speaker 3: counter these lies, resources like learning the basics of media literacy,

739
00:53:07,640 --> 00:53:11,040
Speaker 3: for example, how to triple source a piece of information,

740
00:53:11,680 --> 00:53:16,040
Speaker 3: because that's hard to come by in our community, especially

741
00:53:16,480 --> 00:53:20,160
Speaker 3: when the lies come from others who speak and look

742
00:53:20,719 --> 00:53:30,160
Speaker 3: and sound just like us. The Misinformation Web is an

743
00:53:30,200 --> 00:53:34,920
Speaker 3: original production of Futuro Investigates in collaboration with Latino USA.

744
00:53:35,360 --> 00:53:38,440
Speaker 3: This episode was produced by Nur Saudi and edited by

745
00:53:38,560 --> 00:53:43,440
Speaker 3: Andrea Lopez Crusado. Additional research and support by Arduro Ahil

746
00:53:43,800 --> 00:53:47,440
Speaker 3: and our associate producer, Roxanna Guire. Fact checking for this

747
00:53:47,600 --> 00:53:52,120
Speaker 3: episode by Elizabeth Loenthal Torris, scoring and sound design by

748
00:53:52,239 --> 00:53:56,960
Speaker 3: Jacob Rossati. Our piece was mixed by Gabriel Abiez. To

749
00:53:57,120 --> 00:54:00,959
Speaker 3: find out more about the misinformation web and to read

750
00:54:01,080 --> 00:54:05,760
Speaker 3: our articles, visit Futuro Investigates dot Org. Again, that's Fuduro

751
00:54:05,960 --> 00:54:11,000
Speaker 3: Investigates dot Org. The Latino USA team also includes Julia Caruso,

752
00:54:11,239 --> 00:54:17,239
Speaker 3: Jessica Ellis, Victoria Strada, Frinando Junior, Stephanie lebou Luis Luna Jordi,

753
00:54:17,320 --> 00:54:22,120
Speaker 3: mar Marquez, Marta Martinez, and Nancy Trujillo. Benilee Ramirez is

754
00:54:22,239 --> 00:54:25,560
Speaker 3: our co executive producer along with myself and I'm your

755
00:54:25,600 --> 00:54:28,960
Speaker 3: host Maria Josa. Join us again on our next episode.

756
00:54:29,000 --> 00:54:31,879
Speaker 3: In the meantime, look for us on social media. I'll

757
00:54:31,920 --> 00:54:35,359
Speaker 3: see you on the gram and as usual, lotevayas.

758
00:54:39,360 --> 00:54:44,160
Speaker 2: Latino USA is made possible in part by the Geraldine R.

759
00:54:44,440 --> 00:54:48,960
Speaker 9: Dodge Foundation, working toward a just an equitable New Jersey,

760
00:54:50,120 --> 00:54:54,240
Speaker 9: the Taal Foundation and Skyline Foundation,