WEBVTT - CLASSIC: Have dreams really predicted the future? Chapter I 0:00:00.720 --> 0:00:04.680 Fellow conspiracy realist, thank you for joining us here. On 0:00:04.880 --> 0:00:09.040 December thirty first, the end of the western calendar year. 0:00:09.400 --> 0:00:12.960 Now a lot of people will look back on a year, 0:00:13.200 --> 0:00:17.840 and especially around this time, we'll start thinking about the future. 0:00:18.320 --> 0:00:22.480 This made us think of a series we did beginning 0:00:22.680 --> 0:00:29.040 in August of twenty twenty about precognition, about the idea 0:00:29.320 --> 0:00:33.720 of having a dream that violates linear time. 0:00:35.880 --> 0:00:38.200 Right, be it a dream or taking a step further 0:00:38.240 --> 0:00:40.760 a premonition. I think it's also appropriate in these holiday times, 0:00:40.760 --> 0:00:44.640 thinking about like Charles Dickens a Christmas Carol and ebeneze 0:00:44.640 --> 0:00:48.160 rescrewed flying through the various versions of what his life 0:00:48.360 --> 0:00:51.040 might hold, where he'd to go down certain paths. 0:00:52.760 --> 0:00:55.000 Yeah, we got a fresh sign of twelve months on 0:00:55.080 --> 0:01:00.320 the way. What will they hold you guys more Epstein file. 0:01:03.080 --> 0:01:07.920 We dive into the science of dreams, right. I think 0:01:07.959 --> 0:01:13.000 we were all surprised to learn that modern human science 0:01:13.120 --> 0:01:17.520 doesn't fully understand what happens when you pass out, you know, 0:01:17.640 --> 0:01:21.640 for your three to twelve hours every twenty four hours. 0:01:22.040 --> 0:01:27.360 Thank you, Apaolo, Let's keep it in This is our 0:01:27.560 --> 0:01:34.240 classic episode. Joined us after this in oh January first, 0:01:34.360 --> 0:01:38.280 twenty twenty six for have dreams really predicted the future? 0:01:38.680 --> 0:01:42.679 Chapter two? For now, let's roll the tape. 0:01:42.800 --> 0:01:47.240 From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 0:01:47.360 --> 0:01:51.680 riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 0:01:51.760 --> 0:01:54.680 learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A 0:01:54.800 --> 0:01:57.320 production of Iheartrading. 0:02:06.760 --> 0:02:09.080 Welcome back to the show. My name is Matt, my. 0:02:09.240 --> 0:02:09.840 Name is Nolah. 0:02:10.200 --> 0:02:11.120 They call me Ben. 0:02:11.240 --> 0:02:14.200 We are joined as always with our super producer Paul, 0:02:14.320 --> 0:02:19.000 Mission control decand most importantly, you are you. You are here, 0:02:19.360 --> 0:02:22.880 and that makes this stuff they don't want you to know. 0:02:23.360 --> 0:02:27.520 Let's begin today's episode, which gets very strange, with a 0:02:27.760 --> 0:02:34.040 question Fello listeners, what's the most vivid dream you've ever experienced? 0:02:34.360 --> 0:02:37.600 You know, for many people this answer will come to 0:02:37.639 --> 0:02:41.880 your mind immediately in a flash of images, sensations, or 0:02:41.919 --> 0:02:46.520 emotions that are often almost indistinguishable from experiences in the 0:02:46.600 --> 0:02:51.760 waking world. Before the dawn of recorded history, these things 0:02:51.800 --> 0:02:57.120 called dreams haunted us, They inspired, terrified, and guided our ancestors. 0:02:57.160 --> 0:03:00.720 And dreams, you know, everyone knows they're often central plot 0:03:00.760 --> 0:03:04.560 points in ancient myths, and who hasn't, of course, heard 0:03:04.600 --> 0:03:08.640 the more modern tales of a visionary scientist, an inventor 0:03:08.800 --> 0:03:12.919 and artist, a writer, or someone receiving inspiration and suddenly 0:03:12.919 --> 0:03:15.880 solving a problem in a dream and having a real 0:03:15.960 --> 0:03:19.200 solution to a problem when they wake up. Long story short, 0:03:19.440 --> 0:03:22.799 dreams have been pivotal throughout the span of human existence, 0:03:22.840 --> 0:03:25.600 and we still don't understand them. We still don't completely 0:03:26.200 --> 0:03:28.680 get what's happening with dreams. We know they tell us 0:03:28.720 --> 0:03:32.040 about the past, we know they recontextualize the present, but 0:03:32.120 --> 0:03:34.520 could they also tell us about the future? 0:03:35.040 --> 0:03:35.960 Here are the. 0:03:35.800 --> 0:03:38.960 Facts, My goodness, you know, I don't want to lose 0:03:39.000 --> 0:03:42.880 any time here, but I have a reoccurring dream when 0:03:42.880 --> 0:03:46.880 I'm very stressed out where I am physically jumping across 0:03:47.000 --> 0:03:50.680 asteroids that are flowing at me, or like moving towards me. 0:03:51.360 --> 0:03:53.800 You guys, have any like stressed dreams that you've ever 0:03:53.800 --> 0:03:55.960 had like that or maybe a positive. 0:03:55.600 --> 0:03:58.520 Wad, Dude, I have this recurring dream where I'm like 0:03:58.600 --> 0:04:00.840 I've made it, my band has made it, and we're 0:04:00.920 --> 0:04:03.360 like playing before you know, the biggest crowd I've ever 0:04:03.400 --> 0:04:05.920 seen in the entire history of playing music, and I 0:04:05.960 --> 0:04:09.160 don't know any of the songs. I'm like dreadfully underprepared, 0:04:09.320 --> 0:04:13.000 or maybe like I'm in the arcade fire cool and 0:04:13.280 --> 0:04:15.160 I just freeze. I don't know any of the songs 0:04:15.200 --> 0:04:17.520 I have that dream a lot. What does it mean, guys? 0:04:17.520 --> 0:04:18.120 What does it mean? 0:04:18.720 --> 0:04:21.800 Well, hopefully today we're gonna find out, because we do 0:04:22.000 --> 0:04:25.120 know what dreams are, or at least we have a 0:04:25.120 --> 0:04:28.160 pretty good understanding of what they are. A fancy way 0:04:28.200 --> 0:04:31.120 to phrase it would be something like dreams are patterns 0:04:31.120 --> 0:04:35.520 of information, specifically something that we have taken in as 0:04:35.560 --> 0:04:39.440 sensory information, and the dream occurs when the brain is 0:04:39.480 --> 0:04:43.840 in a resting state and somehow using this information and 0:04:44.080 --> 0:04:47.480 making essentially a story or at least patterns from it. 0:04:47.720 --> 0:04:51.040 And if we want to be a little more blunt 0:04:51.080 --> 0:04:54.760 about it, dreams are hallucinations. They take every box for 0:04:54.960 --> 0:04:58.800 everything that's ever been described as a hallucination. And we've 0:04:58.800 --> 0:05:01.520 talked about it in previous episodes, But if you describe 0:05:01.560 --> 0:05:05.680 the process of dreaming or even just sleeping to some 0:05:06.200 --> 0:05:09.760 life form that had never encountered it, it sounds so bizarre. 0:05:10.040 --> 0:05:12.920 We've just all sort of accepted that anywhere from four 0:05:12.960 --> 0:05:16.320 to eight hours out of every twenty four hours, we 0:05:16.360 --> 0:05:20.240 will we will pass out, our bodies will be useless, 0:05:20.560 --> 0:05:24.440 we'll go into some weird other world and then we 0:05:24.480 --> 0:05:27.560 gain control of our body again and everybody acts like 0:05:27.600 --> 0:05:28.400 nothing happened. 0:05:28.720 --> 0:05:30.000 It's odd, right. 0:05:30.080 --> 0:05:32.640 And every once in a while we encounter shadow people 0:05:32.720 --> 0:05:35.279 that want to thwart our plans of living. 0:05:35.440 --> 0:05:38.960 Those pesky shadow people always trying to suffocate us in 0:05:39.000 --> 0:05:43.320 our sleep. That's no fun. But we're talking specifically today 0:05:43.360 --> 0:05:45.159 about I don't know, Ben, you have this really great 0:05:45.960 --> 0:05:49.680 analogy for dreams, just the idea of like your brain 0:05:49.839 --> 0:05:51.960 kind of as at hard drive, sort of like sorting 0:05:52.000 --> 0:05:54.960 out the bits or like defragging, like kind of cleaning 0:05:55.000 --> 0:05:58.360 out the cobwebs, I guess of the day and subconsciously 0:05:58.480 --> 0:06:02.160 maybe doing some internal problem solving. Even if it's not 0:06:02.200 --> 0:06:04.200 like you wake up with some kind of aha moment, 0:06:04.560 --> 0:06:07.800 it is somehow doing some good for you, like in 0:06:07.880 --> 0:06:12.080 terms of, you know, maybe uncluttering your subconscious Let's say, 0:06:12.200 --> 0:06:15.039 is that about the span of it, Ben. 0:06:15.200 --> 0:06:17.960 Yeah, yeah, Before we jump to, you know, the kind 0:06:17.960 --> 0:06:20.120 of theories that we have about dreams because we don't 0:06:20.120 --> 0:06:23.119 know what they are, let's bust one myth really quick. 0:06:23.600 --> 0:06:26.800 We've all heard that dreams only occur during a specific 0:06:26.880 --> 0:06:32.760 phase of sleep. Ram great band, the phrase Ram stands 0:06:32.760 --> 0:06:35.680 for rapid eye movement. It's like the fifth stage of sleep. 0:06:36.040 --> 0:06:38.720 That's where the dreams are supposed to happen. However, we 0:06:38.800 --> 0:06:42.200 know that multiple studies have shown maybe we dream mainly 0:06:42.240 --> 0:06:46.919 in the RAM phase, but we also dream in other phases. 0:06:47.000 --> 0:06:50.599 We can't be the dream process cannot be quite as 0:06:50.640 --> 0:06:53.280 easily categorized as we would like, and that's where the 0:06:53.279 --> 0:06:56.440 theories come in. So one of those leading theories. There 0:06:56.480 --> 0:06:59.960 are loads and loads of great research pieces on dreams. 0:07:00.279 --> 0:07:02.599 One of those theories is just what you described, that 0:07:03.200 --> 0:07:07.039 dreams are a part of memory processing, meaning that it 0:07:07.240 --> 0:07:11.600 helps us consolidate things we've learned while also transferring our 0:07:11.640 --> 0:07:16.280 short term memory to our long term memory storage. So yes, 0:07:16.440 --> 0:07:20.280 I think the analogy holds that. To me, it seems 0:07:20.320 --> 0:07:23.760 like a good description is the brain's defragging the hard drive. 0:07:23.840 --> 0:07:27.000 But then again, is the brain the hard drive? What's 0:07:27.080 --> 0:07:30.920 doing the defragging? Is it the software? Is that the consciousness? 0:07:30.640 --> 0:07:33.080 This gets very strange, very quickly. 0:07:33.360 --> 0:07:38.840 But yeah, in that concept, it's as though all of 0:07:38.840 --> 0:07:42.600 those connections that your neurons have made, it's solidifying them, 0:07:42.680 --> 0:07:46.000 right if they're necessary. It's almost like the brain itself 0:07:46.040 --> 0:07:49.240 is trying to decide what's important. It's really weird. It's 0:07:49.480 --> 0:07:54.400 weird to think about your brain in its unconscious state 0:07:54.880 --> 0:07:58.280 doing one of the most important things that you can imagine, 0:07:58.640 --> 0:08:02.040 figuring out what you actually learned and what you should remember, 0:08:02.400 --> 0:08:03.080 or or. 0:08:03.040 --> 0:08:05.320 How you actually feel about things. Sometimes I mean, like, 0:08:05.360 --> 0:08:09.520 perhaps my recurring dream about being unprepared is a signal 0:08:09.840 --> 0:08:13.520 or a symptom of me feeling overwhelmed at certain times. 0:08:13.560 --> 0:08:15.760 I don't have this dream all the time, but when 0:08:15.760 --> 0:08:18.040 I do have this dream, I think it's a product 0:08:18.040 --> 0:08:20.640 of me maybe feeling a little underwater with work or 0:08:20.680 --> 0:08:22.840 a little bit like I'm out of my depth or something, 0:08:23.080 --> 0:08:25.760 or like I kind of am a little bit adrift 0:08:25.800 --> 0:08:27.760 and maybe need a little bit of a course correction. 0:08:28.040 --> 0:08:29.720 So they can be interesting when you have these over 0:08:29.720 --> 0:08:31.040 and over and you're like, oh, maybe this is a 0:08:31.080 --> 0:08:32.720 signal pointing towards something. 0:08:32.960 --> 0:08:35.800 That's really a great observation, because another thing it could 0:08:35.800 --> 0:08:39.839 be is really just a problem solving activity that your 0:08:39.880 --> 0:08:43.079 brain goes through a way to go through those difficult, 0:08:43.120 --> 0:08:48.480 complicated things that you know are more deeply psychological than 0:08:48.600 --> 0:08:53.040 perhaps you appreciate it in the moment, and to get 0:08:53.080 --> 0:08:56.480 balance back in a way or to maybe put things 0:08:56.559 --> 0:08:57.960 in the right perspective for you. 0:08:58.360 --> 0:09:00.760 But at the end of the day, it's all just kems, right, Like, 0:09:00.800 --> 0:09:05.240 it's all just firing neurons and you know, electrical impulses 0:09:05.360 --> 0:09:06.200 bouncing around. 0:09:06.840 --> 0:09:09.840 Yeah, but that's like saying that music is only math 0:09:10.200 --> 0:09:12.360 for you know what I mean, it's a matter of perspective. 0:09:12.720 --> 0:09:15.920 I think that's an important theory to bring up as well. 0:09:16.720 --> 0:09:22.360 The bit more, I wouldn't say reductionists, but the theory 0:09:22.480 --> 0:09:26.200 that wants to remove the concept of consciousness from the 0:09:26.280 --> 0:09:32.120 equation and says that dreams are simply the brain responding 0:09:32.280 --> 0:09:37.319 to an array of biochemical changes and electrical pulses that 0:09:37.520 --> 0:09:41.920 impulses that fire as you are asleep, whatever you might be, 0:09:42.480 --> 0:09:45.880 and the dream then is seen as nothing more than 0:09:46.040 --> 0:09:51.760 a side effect, right Like sunsets look pretty, but that 0:09:51.880 --> 0:09:55.720 wasn't part of some grand plan. This argument says, it's 0:09:55.880 --> 0:10:00.760 just a very small side effect of graph in orbit. 0:10:01.559 --> 0:10:06.040 So we have these theories and they all The thing 0:10:06.160 --> 0:10:09.760 is that none of them, on the outset seem just 0:10:09.960 --> 0:10:14.680 straight wrong, none of them seem demonstrably incorrect. They just 0:10:14.720 --> 0:10:20.080 seem like the old adage of the mice describing an elephant, right, 0:10:20.600 --> 0:10:23.160 you know, different mice see different parts of the elephant. 0:10:23.160 --> 0:10:26.600 They think it's a bunch of different objects instead of 0:10:26.640 --> 0:10:31.840 one large thing. We do, luckily know on numerous levels 0:10:32.000 --> 0:10:35.960 what happens when we dream. Every dream you have has 0:10:36.040 --> 0:10:39.040 some of the same guide posts. We tend to be 0:10:39.160 --> 0:10:41.840 the main characters of our own lives and our dreams. 0:10:41.960 --> 0:10:45.079 Just as in the waking world, you are in your dreams. 0:10:45.240 --> 0:10:47.280 Even when you feel like you're watching something happen, you 0:10:47.320 --> 0:10:52.000 are in it. Things are happening, You're taking actions. The environment, 0:10:52.200 --> 0:10:55.240 the reality of the dream is responding to your actions, 0:10:55.840 --> 0:11:00.679 and in the universe of the dream, those are responses, 0:11:00.840 --> 0:11:05.280 and those actions they make sense. This is not really 0:11:05.320 --> 0:11:08.320 the case once you wake up and you think, wow, my, 0:11:09.559 --> 0:11:13.280 you know, like, my great aunt has been dead for years. 0:11:13.520 --> 0:11:16.920 She never played the Obo, and I have never been 0:11:17.000 --> 0:11:17.800 to Portugal. 0:11:18.320 --> 0:11:20.480 Right, They're like, yeah, how come when I eat a 0:11:20.559 --> 0:11:23.360 chocolate covered pretzel in the real world, it's delicious treat. 0:11:23.360 --> 0:11:26.000 But in a dream, all my teeth fallout and I'm 0:11:26.080 --> 0:11:29.520 naked in front of a high school gym of my 0:11:29.640 --> 0:11:31.640 peers and they're all laughing at me. Why are they 0:11:31.679 --> 0:11:32.240 laughing at me? 0:11:32.800 --> 0:11:35.360 Or like in the Far Side. One of the one 0:11:35.360 --> 0:11:40.839 of the greatest modern American comic strips, the the recurrent 0:11:40.960 --> 0:11:44.120 fear of showing up to a lecture without one's duck. 0:11:44.679 --> 0:11:48.520 That's a that's a deep cut for folks. But but yeah, 0:11:48.600 --> 0:11:51.360 it is true. These things have an internal logic. And 0:11:51.440 --> 0:11:55.480 if you practice dream journaling, which can be a tremendously 0:11:55.559 --> 0:11:58.680 useful psychological tool, then what you'll notice when you try 0:11:58.679 --> 0:12:01.200 to write out the plot points of your dreams is 0:12:01.240 --> 0:12:05.360 that things change, especially scenery. I didn't I didn't talk 0:12:05.400 --> 0:12:07.600 about any of my recurrent dreams because they're weird. They 0:12:07.679 --> 0:12:10.480 kind of all occur in the same universe, and things 0:12:10.559 --> 0:12:13.960 that happen in one affect things in the other. 0:12:15.600 --> 0:12:18.920 Whoa you have like a Ben Bolen cinematic dream universe. 0:12:19.559 --> 0:12:20.960 It's not as cool as it sounds. 0:12:21.000 --> 0:12:22.440 Man, that's pretty cool. 0:12:22.679 --> 0:12:24.959 I don't know, it's not as cool as it sounds. 0:12:25.000 --> 0:12:27.400 But but we all But the thing is, it makes 0:12:27.440 --> 0:12:30.240 sense when you're in the moment, right Like of course, 0:12:31.120 --> 0:12:35.440 my teeth falling out that is a tremendously common, uh 0:12:36.800 --> 0:12:40.680 dream trope, especially in the West. Maybe it's maybe has 0:12:40.679 --> 0:12:43.040 something to do with dentists. Maybe it has something to 0:12:43.080 --> 0:12:45.320 do with the rite of passage we experience when our 0:12:45.360 --> 0:12:49.199 baby teeth fall out. But yeah, yeah, so it's kind 0:12:49.200 --> 0:12:51.800 of programmed into us. But when we think about it, 0:12:51.840 --> 0:12:54.480 when we're awake, all of our thoughts have a kind 0:12:54.480 --> 0:12:58.320 of familiar logic to them. Right, I did A because 0:12:58.320 --> 0:13:02.080 I want B or I did see because someone is 0:13:02.160 --> 0:13:06.280 going to do D later. And our brain, which is 0:13:06.400 --> 0:13:09.920 hugely underrated in the in the sort of avengers of 0:13:09.960 --> 0:13:13.600 our body. Our brain is always working through all this 0:13:13.800 --> 0:13:19.800 internal external stimuli. And your brain, like your heart, once 0:13:19.880 --> 0:13:22.959 it starts going, it doesn't get a break. It's not 0:13:23.000 --> 0:13:25.319 supposed to get a break until you die. If your 0:13:25.360 --> 0:13:29.760 brain or your heart stop doing what they do, getting 0:13:29.760 --> 0:13:32.800 down how they get down, then you are very much 0:13:32.840 --> 0:13:35.720 in trouble. So when you're when you're asleep, your brain. 0:13:35.559 --> 0:13:36.200 Is still active. 0:13:36.480 --> 0:13:39.520 The brain is like the great white shark of the body. 0:13:39.920 --> 0:13:45.040 You know, if it stops, then it dies. And that's 0:13:45.240 --> 0:13:47.480 because of a couple of things. So the brain is 0:13:47.480 --> 0:13:49.800 divided into segments. As we know, we've got the limbic 0:13:49.920 --> 0:13:53.560 system in the mid brain, which deals with emotion in 0:13:53.640 --> 0:13:57.200 both waking and dreaming states. It's interesting there these these 0:13:57.240 --> 0:14:01.960 parts kind of have shared responsibilities and do similar functions 0:14:02.160 --> 0:14:04.640 when you're awake and when you're asleep. And that includes 0:14:04.720 --> 0:14:08.480 the amygdala, which is particularly active when you're in a 0:14:08.600 --> 0:14:09.240 dream state. 0:14:09.800 --> 0:14:13.160 Right, and then we've got the cortex. The cortex is 0:14:13.280 --> 0:14:18.079 what if the cortex had a job, If your dreams 0:14:18.160 --> 0:14:22.160 were a soulist corporation, and the cortex was an employee 0:14:22.280 --> 0:14:26.160 of your dreams, then it would have the title content creator, 0:14:26.560 --> 0:14:31.240 which is not a favorite title of mind. So the 0:14:31.280 --> 0:14:34.200 reason that's important is everything that your cortex does, your 0:14:34.240 --> 0:14:38.840 cortex rights and directs your dreams right, comes up with 0:14:38.880 --> 0:14:42.880 the plot lines. Everything you feel, from floating in a 0:14:43.000 --> 0:14:46.560 vast and knowable ocean to flying to jumping from one 0:14:46.560 --> 0:14:50.240 impossible across one impossible chasm to another. All the people 0:14:50.280 --> 0:14:52.960 you meet, all the monsters that chase you, they all 0:14:53.000 --> 0:14:57.040 come from your cortex and the visual cortex right there 0:14:57.080 --> 0:14:59.240 at the back of your brain. If you're human, when 0:14:59.240 --> 0:15:02.480 you're listening to the this is especially active because we 0:15:02.520 --> 0:15:05.400 are such, you know, visual creatures, kind of the way 0:15:05.440 --> 0:15:08.120 that dog that dogs are olfactory creatures. 0:15:08.280 --> 0:15:09.640 This made me wonder. 0:15:09.680 --> 0:15:11.280 I don't have the science on it yet, but I 0:15:11.320 --> 0:15:13.240 wonder if dogs mainly dream and smell. 0:15:13.520 --> 0:15:13.680 Well. 0:15:13.680 --> 0:15:18.320 It's interesting too because I never really recall sounds from dreams, 0:15:18.600 --> 0:15:21.160 and I know that's that's a thing that happens. There's 0:15:21.160 --> 0:15:23.720 even a story Paul McCartney says that he came up 0:15:23.720 --> 0:15:27.280 with the melody to I Believe Yesterday in a dream 0:15:27.320 --> 0:15:28.800 and he woke up and he had this melody, and 0:15:28.800 --> 0:15:31.520 he said, and being a musical dude, I don't think 0:15:31.520 --> 0:15:33.640 I've ever dreamt of a melody. I think of it 0:15:33.640 --> 0:15:37.960 as a very specifically in the realm of visual hallucinatory 0:15:38.080 --> 0:15:40.480 kind of state, you know. So I think that's pretty 0:15:40.520 --> 0:15:42.680 special for Paul to come out of a dream state 0:15:42.760 --> 0:15:45.000 with that melody. Have you guys ever dreamt sounds or 0:15:45.000 --> 0:15:46.840 remembered sounds from a dream? 0:15:47.040 --> 0:15:47.200 Oh? 0:15:47.240 --> 0:15:50.000 Yes, yeah, really happen at all. 0:15:50.800 --> 0:15:57.000 I have several highly talkative monsters that inhabit my dreamscape, 0:15:57.520 --> 0:16:03.920 very talkative and in fascinating uh vocalizations. I highly recommend 0:16:03.960 --> 0:16:06.880 checking out one of these if you get a chance, one. 0:16:06.800 --> 0:16:07.720 Of these mad brands. 0:16:08.240 --> 0:16:14.600 Yeah, I'll oh yeah, just hot back there and my 0:16:14.800 --> 0:16:16.200 oh my underlit jimbae. 0:16:16.200 --> 0:16:16.600 Look at that. 0:16:17.120 --> 0:16:20.040 Uh So, you know it's fascinating that you're talking about 0:16:20.040 --> 0:16:22.600 that the cordex been. I think it's You're absolutely right. 0:16:22.600 --> 0:16:26.360 The cortex is the reason why we're almost It feels 0:16:26.440 --> 0:16:28.120 a lot of times for me and maybe a lot 0:16:28.160 --> 0:16:30.920 of others that you're kind of just a passenger in 0:16:30.960 --> 0:16:34.080 your dreams, like you're moving, you're going places, you're seeing things, 0:16:34.080 --> 0:16:36.520 things are changing, but you just kind of accept it. 0:16:36.520 --> 0:16:38.320 You just kind of go with it. You're just headed 0:16:38.320 --> 0:16:41.720 in that direction, unless, of course, you've unlocked you know, 0:16:41.760 --> 0:16:44.000 the ability to locid dream, which is a whole other thing. 0:16:44.600 --> 0:16:47.320 But one of the reasons that it's that dreams are 0:16:47.360 --> 0:16:50.440 like that is because these parts of our brain, the 0:16:50.560 --> 0:16:53.800 lobes that are talked about so frequently, kind of the 0:16:53.840 --> 0:16:58.920 logic systems, those are the least active parts of your 0:16:58.960 --> 0:17:03.320 brain when you are dreaming, which it really explains why 0:17:04.160 --> 0:17:07.600 you know, things don't feel so strange until you wake up. 0:17:08.040 --> 0:17:10.000 And maybe it's also one of the main reasons you 0:17:10.040 --> 0:17:11.120 don't remember too much. 0:17:11.320 --> 0:17:14.240 My Great Gods is dead. She never played the Obo, 0:17:14.720 --> 0:17:18.480 I've never been to Portugal, and you know, and if 0:17:18.520 --> 0:17:20.560 I don't write it down in twenty three minutes, I'll 0:17:20.560 --> 0:17:21.600 forget dude. 0:17:21.600 --> 0:17:23.400 But that, yeah, that's it, that's right, that's another thing 0:17:23.440 --> 0:17:25.960 like I've never been a dream journaler, and there's it 0:17:26.040 --> 0:17:28.080 has to be my dream has to pack such a 0:17:28.119 --> 0:17:30.639 waile up for me to remember it at all. But 0:17:30.720 --> 0:17:32.480 when it does, I do, and they stick with me 0:17:32.520 --> 0:17:35.080 and I remember them for many years. But typically unless 0:17:35.119 --> 0:17:37.119 you write it down super quick, you're still in that 0:17:37.200 --> 0:17:40.080 kind of like waking dreaming between state and then you 0:17:40.160 --> 0:17:41.960 kind of lose it. Right, Are you guys good at 0:17:42.000 --> 0:17:42.960 remembering dreams? 0:17:43.200 --> 0:17:43.320 Uh? 0:17:43.480 --> 0:17:45.960 What would you say your odds are or like in 0:17:46.040 --> 0:17:48.040 terms of like waking up and being able to recall 0:17:48.080 --> 0:17:49.200 specifics from a dream. 0:17:50.240 --> 0:17:52.800 I keeping notes on my phone and it's always right 0:17:52.840 --> 0:17:55.679 by my bed, and yeah, constantly doing that. 0:17:55.720 --> 0:17:57.239 What about you? Ben? Uh? 0:17:58.119 --> 0:18:02.080 I I don't know necessarily think it's a good thing, 0:18:02.400 --> 0:18:08.840 but yes, yeah, okay, pretty I do. Well, it's no 0:18:08.960 --> 0:18:11.840 secret longtime listeners. I don't like sleep. 0:18:12.480 --> 0:18:13.200 I resent it. 0:18:13.359 --> 0:18:17.480 I think that science should already be at the point 0:18:17.680 --> 0:18:21.320 like where, you know, if I can call someone in 0:18:21.440 --> 0:18:24.639 freaking Bhutan and talk to them in real time with 0:18:24.800 --> 0:18:27.880 something you know, the size of an open hand, then 0:18:27.960 --> 0:18:30.639 I shouldn't have to I shouldn't have to sleep. We 0:18:30.640 --> 0:18:33.720 should have figured some some way around it. Well, then 0:18:33.800 --> 0:18:36.320 be someone to space. We said people to space. 0:18:38.200 --> 0:18:40.879 But then, ben if if you do have to sleep 0:18:40.960 --> 0:18:47.840 because unfortunately our analog bodies require it for some dang reason. Uh, 0:18:48.320 --> 0:18:51.360 why not at least record as much as you possibly can. 0:18:51.760 --> 0:18:55.040 One day we're gonna be able to plug in somehow 0:18:55.359 --> 0:18:58.200 and just get that stuff like roll on quick time 0:18:58.240 --> 0:19:00.600 while I'm dreaming. And I can't wait for that. 0:19:00.600 --> 0:19:03.560 Too, right, man. There's there's one thing though, to add 0:19:03.600 --> 0:19:03.840 with that. 0:19:06.119 --> 0:19:09.000 You know, I spend a lot of time researching kind 0:19:09.040 --> 0:19:12.000 of what we talked about with lucid dreams, which is 0:19:12.040 --> 0:19:15.760 probably a story for another day, but I end up 0:19:15.800 --> 0:19:20.120 getting a lot of work done in dreams. It feels 0:19:20.240 --> 0:19:21.919 like I'm doing a lot of work. And then I 0:19:22.000 --> 0:19:23.840 wake up and I think, oh, I got to write 0:19:23.840 --> 0:19:26.200 this amazing story down. And then I write it down, 0:19:26.960 --> 0:19:29.600 go get some coffee or something. I come back and 0:19:29.640 --> 0:19:32.800 I'm like, Wow, the most amazing part of this story 0:19:32.880 --> 0:19:36.399 is that I thought it was good and because my 0:19:36.480 --> 0:19:40.159 frontal lobes were turned off right, And I think I 0:19:40.200 --> 0:19:41.840 think we do that a lot. To your point in 0:19:41.880 --> 0:19:48.120 all about how how we process in dreams, it's unless 0:19:48.160 --> 0:19:52.800 people have you know, PTSD or some sort of condition 0:19:53.359 --> 0:19:59.080 that gives them violent, nightmarish, recurrent horrific visions every time 0:19:59.119 --> 0:20:03.000 they sleep. Most people would prefer dreams to a dreamless sleep, 0:20:03.240 --> 0:20:08.080 you know, Otherwise it's really disconcerting to have everything go 0:20:08.280 --> 0:20:12.160 dark at say, four point fifty three am and then 0:20:12.280 --> 0:20:16.000 wake up at I don't know, two thirty seven pm. 0:20:16.600 --> 0:20:19.040 I just sort of hope nothing important happened. 0:20:19.600 --> 0:20:22.240 So, I mean, we probably won't really truly be able 0:20:22.320 --> 0:20:25.040 to answer definitively like why do a dream? We've got 0:20:25.080 --> 0:20:28.560 some good theories, but there are experts in mental health 0:20:28.560 --> 0:20:31.360 that do believe that it's an important part of maintaining 0:20:31.600 --> 0:20:34.960 some semblance of sanity or like self awareness or understanding 0:20:35.000 --> 0:20:38.520 of ourselves. But there's you know, not like a definitive 0:20:38.600 --> 0:20:43.160 like this is what dreams are four But for different people, 0:20:43.200 --> 0:20:45.280 there for a lot of things. And like like I said, 0:20:45.280 --> 0:20:48.040 if you're Paul McCartney, it makes you write a song 0:20:48.119 --> 0:20:51.320 that's been covered by over three thousand artists and probably 0:20:51.320 --> 0:20:53.399 one of the most recognizable songs in the history of 0:20:53.480 --> 0:20:56.919 recorded music. That's just my hot take on yesterday. But 0:20:57.240 --> 0:20:59.439 it's a thing that came from a dream, So they 0:20:59.480 --> 0:21:02.760 certainly have value. I mean, so many artists recreate images 0:21:02.800 --> 0:21:04.800 from their dreams. And to your point, then, whether I 0:21:04.800 --> 0:21:06.679 think you're selling yourself short with the quality of your 0:21:06.760 --> 0:21:09.600 dream stories. But they are things that you've pulled from 0:21:09.880 --> 0:21:12.119 a dream state that you can then translate into the 0:21:12.160 --> 0:21:15.520 real world and do something with. They're functional in that way. 0:21:16.000 --> 0:21:19.760 Yeah, I mean, evolution is a brutal editor. So we 0:21:20.000 --> 0:21:24.520 know that dreams exist for some purpose, right, and it's 0:21:24.560 --> 0:21:31.080 probably not a vestigial leaving of our earlier arboreal ancestors. 0:21:31.440 --> 0:21:33.760 But we do know to your point, even if we 0:21:33.800 --> 0:21:38.080 can't fully answer the question why when it comes to dreams, 0:21:38.280 --> 0:21:41.720 we know they do inform the waking world. I mean, 0:21:41.760 --> 0:21:45.719 we have examples, Like, just to rattle off a few examples, 0:21:46.240 --> 0:21:50.399 one of my favorites, there's a guy named Dimitri mend Leave, 0:21:50.760 --> 0:21:54.239 the guy who made the periodic table. He's got an 0:21:54.240 --> 0:21:58.960 element named after him. He's legit his story. His claim, 0:21:59.280 --> 0:22:02.040 which is very difficult to prove about how he figured 0:22:02.040 --> 0:22:06.119 out the periodic table is that he was going mad 0:22:06.400 --> 0:22:10.199 looking at all these mismatched cards. Kind of picture his 0:22:10.359 --> 0:22:13.399 version of index cards, where he wrote down everything he 0:22:13.480 --> 0:22:17.040 knew about an element, and he's like having his Charlie 0:22:17.160 --> 0:22:20.760 Day conspiracy theory thing. He's trying to have his beautiful 0:22:20.800 --> 0:22:23.920 mind moment, it doesn't make sense. The guy passes out 0:22:24.080 --> 0:22:27.280 on top of these cards, and then in a dream 0:22:27.640 --> 0:22:30.520 he watches them sort of get up and dance around, 0:22:31.000 --> 0:22:34.480 and then they put themselves in order of their atomic weight, 0:22:34.760 --> 0:22:39.600 and he wakes up and he goes, Eureka. 0:22:38.200 --> 0:22:41.199 What a satisfying feeling. That must have been, just the 0:22:41.240 --> 0:22:44.520 idea of making order out of chaos and then waking 0:22:44.600 --> 0:22:48.120 up and having an actual concrete idea from that. That's awesome. 0:22:48.480 --> 0:22:51.800