1
00:00:02,240 --> 00:00:12,000
Speaker 1: Uh Man oh Man Behind the Bastards, the podcast about

2
00:00:12,560 --> 00:00:18,720
Speaker 1: people who aren't good by people who are good. This week,

3
00:00:18,800 --> 00:00:24,960
Speaker 1: our person who are good is Jamie Loftus. How are

4
00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:29,000
Speaker 1: you doing? I'm doing good. It's real hot. I'm excited

5
00:00:29,040 --> 00:00:32,600
Speaker 1: for the episode. But you know what a random lady

6
00:00:32,680 --> 00:00:36,159
Speaker 1: told me once in Georgia, What when you feel the

7
00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:40,200
Speaker 1: sun on your back, that's just Jesus smiling at you. Wow,

8
00:00:40,400 --> 00:00:44,000
Speaker 1: that's a that's a good positive spin for global warming.

9
00:00:44,320 --> 00:00:48,360
Speaker 1: Like us, there's a good chance that lady didn't believe

10
00:00:48,360 --> 00:00:51,920
Speaker 1: in global warming. So she was a white lady in

11
00:00:52,000 --> 00:00:54,560
Speaker 1: rural Georgia, so there's there's not a lot of ways

12
00:00:54,600 --> 00:00:57,240
Speaker 1: that story is gonna end super happy. You know what

13
00:00:57,280 --> 00:01:00,080
Speaker 1: a white lady in rural Georgia told me once I

14
00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:02,840
Speaker 1: tried to special order a hot dog? What was that?

15
00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:07,280
Speaker 1: She said, this isn't burger king. You don't get it

16
00:01:07,360 --> 00:01:11,720
Speaker 1: your way? Fuck off. I love that lady. I love

17
00:01:11,760 --> 00:01:16,960
Speaker 1: her too. Hot dog. She gave me a really nearly

18
00:01:17,040 --> 00:01:21,800
Speaker 1: hot dog. It was wet. That's what you get for

19
00:01:21,880 --> 00:01:25,839
Speaker 1: bringing your goddamn big city bullshit to her wholesome, small

20
00:01:25,880 --> 00:01:30,280
Speaker 1: town hot dog. Whatever it was, I came hot. I

21
00:01:30,319 --> 00:01:33,840
Speaker 1: was swinging my dick around exactly. You're swinging your dick

22
00:01:33,880 --> 00:01:36,720
Speaker 1: around at a hot dog shop, which is basically full

23
00:01:36,760 --> 00:01:40,560
Speaker 1: of dicks already, so nobody's impressed. Yeah, I I it

24
00:01:40,640 --> 00:01:44,400
Speaker 1: was disrespectful and I go swinging. You go swinging your

25
00:01:44,440 --> 00:01:48,400
Speaker 1: dick around at a euro place. Well, that's pretty much perfect.

26
00:01:48,440 --> 00:01:51,360
Speaker 1: Because the hero is basically a pocket. You know, it's

27
00:01:51,360 --> 00:01:55,720
Speaker 1: the most it's easy to start having sex with the hero.

28
00:01:56,120 --> 00:01:58,760
Speaker 1: It is very it's incredibly easy. A hero or a hero,

29
00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:03,080
Speaker 1: both of them very easy to fuck. Yeah. Yeah, although

30
00:02:03,160 --> 00:02:06,840
Speaker 1: you have more opportunity to get like some hip working

31
00:02:07,200 --> 00:02:09,320
Speaker 1: with the hero because the hero it's just going to

32
00:02:09,400 --> 00:02:12,880
Speaker 1: come out the sides. You know, wait, I'm trying to

33
00:02:13,000 --> 00:02:16,080
Speaker 1: visualize this. It's going to come out the sides. As

34
00:02:16,160 --> 00:02:19,000
Speaker 1: long as you're fine with penetrating the gero, right, pushing

35
00:02:19,040 --> 00:02:23,120
Speaker 1: through that that back. Uh yeah, that's not then it'll

36
00:02:23,160 --> 00:02:26,720
Speaker 1: it'll stay, especially if you like hold the edges up.

37
00:02:26,800 --> 00:02:29,520
Speaker 1: Whereas the hero it's just kinda because it's an open

38
00:02:29,600 --> 00:02:34,400
Speaker 1: sided sandwich, right, So that okay, the open sidedness of it.

39
00:02:35,040 --> 00:02:36,919
Speaker 1: You're not gonna you're not going to punch your dick

40
00:02:36,960 --> 00:02:38,840
Speaker 1: through the bread of the hero though, because you can

41
00:02:38,880 --> 00:02:41,920
Speaker 1: just suck straight through and they're usually longer than anybody.

42
00:02:41,960 --> 00:02:46,160
Speaker 1: But you know what, what's that guy? What's that the

43
00:02:46,200 --> 00:02:49,160
Speaker 1: guy who was really Will Chamberlain. Unless you're Wilt Chamberlain,

44
00:02:49,240 --> 00:02:55,160
Speaker 1: then you might wilt. What the fuck? I learned your

45
00:02:55,160 --> 00:03:00,680
Speaker 1: Will Chamberlain was through a cartoon Network cartoon only because yeah,

46
00:03:00,800 --> 00:03:03,560
Speaker 1: Foster's Home for Imaginary Friends. Oh, I think I learned

47
00:03:03,560 --> 00:03:05,680
Speaker 1: about him from an episode of Wasn't he was a

48
00:03:05,720 --> 00:03:10,720
Speaker 1: guest on Scooby Doo right, Yes he was. Yeah, yeah,

49
00:03:10,720 --> 00:03:13,040
Speaker 1: it was the Mystery of the Man with the Enormous Cock.

50
00:03:14,840 --> 00:03:19,000
Speaker 1: Okay that script Okay, once again, the script is really long.

51
00:03:19,680 --> 00:03:24,280
Speaker 1: It is almost six words. Yes, just birthing there. I'm

52
00:03:24,320 --> 00:03:28,400
Speaker 1: not I'm I'm down to fuck a hero sandwich with

53
00:03:28,480 --> 00:03:34,320
Speaker 1: a with a strap on, for sure, absolutely doubt absolutely,

54
00:03:34,360 --> 00:03:36,680
Speaker 1: And and I think it's just like about finding the

55
00:03:36,800 --> 00:03:39,200
Speaker 1: right shop in the right and there in the right hero.

56
00:03:39,440 --> 00:03:41,000
Speaker 1: You know, you know, you don't want to be like

57
00:03:41,120 --> 00:03:43,440
Speaker 1: pressured if you're not feeling it in the moment. Maybe

58
00:03:43,480 --> 00:03:48,080
Speaker 1: somebody puts like like the like like uh, halapenos, but

59
00:03:48,120 --> 00:03:50,440
Speaker 1: not like the pickled kind that that go really good

60
00:03:50,440 --> 00:03:52,760
Speaker 1: with lettuce, and you're like well, I don't really want

61
00:03:52,800 --> 00:03:55,120
Speaker 1: like just a straight up hallapeno on this. I want

62
00:03:55,160 --> 00:03:57,520
Speaker 1: like that texture change you get when they're pickled, you know,

63
00:03:57,720 --> 00:04:00,360
Speaker 1: and there's just some food you don't want on your crotch.

64
00:04:00,480 --> 00:04:05,839
Speaker 1: It's like, have you ever accidentally have you ever accidentally

65
00:04:05,920 --> 00:04:11,920
Speaker 1: put Dr Brauner's soap on your private absolutely? Oh my god?

66
00:04:12,120 --> 00:04:16,640
Speaker 1: After shaving for a party once horrible. No one told

67
00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:20,920
Speaker 1: me I didn't the bottle. The bottle famously has too

68
00:04:20,920 --> 00:04:23,160
Speaker 1: many words. I'm not going to read that, but there

69
00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:26,160
Speaker 1: are a couple of very important words. Don't put them

70
00:04:26,200 --> 00:04:35,680
Speaker 1: directly onto your it burns. Like, yeah, I stopped listening

71
00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:40,919
Speaker 1: when Jamie said it was wet. I was showering with

72
00:04:41,080 --> 00:04:43,599
Speaker 1: someone Robert, and I did that, and then I had

73
00:04:43,640 --> 00:04:51,039
Speaker 1: to play it off like it was humillion. And then

74
00:04:51,080 --> 00:04:54,479
Speaker 1: it's like he absolutely he saw what I had done,

75
00:04:55,040 --> 00:04:57,320
Speaker 1: but I couldn't admit my mistake I was doing. Know,

76
00:04:57,440 --> 00:05:00,960
Speaker 1: this feels good, It feels like I want to stay here,

77
00:05:01,839 --> 00:05:05,760
Speaker 1: let's have breakfast. Yeah, I enjoy the feeling of my

78
00:05:05,760 --> 00:05:09,440
Speaker 1: my junk getting burned by a schizophrenic man soup. I

79
00:05:10,680 --> 00:05:13,839
Speaker 1: once again, if it just feels nice just to say

80
00:05:13,839 --> 00:05:17,120
Speaker 1: it out loud, before I'm glad we're having this five

81
00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:19,719
Speaker 1: minute long conversation before I had introduced the topic of

82
00:05:19,760 --> 00:05:21,960
Speaker 1: the episode. But before you get to that, I just

83
00:05:21,960 --> 00:05:25,600
Speaker 1: want to say that somebody please clip this out for TikTok,

84
00:05:25,720 --> 00:05:30,800
Speaker 1: for me, for me, Yeah, let's become TikTok stars. Jamie,

85
00:05:30,920 --> 00:05:34,760
Speaker 1: how do you speaking of burning Genitalia, do you think

86
00:05:34,760 --> 00:05:38,960
Speaker 1: about Goop often? Yes, I've been thinking about Goop quite

87
00:05:38,960 --> 00:05:42,760
Speaker 1: a bit, layeah. Not the Gwyneth No, not the Gwyneth flame.

88
00:05:42,880 --> 00:05:44,960
Speaker 1: I was speaking of the Gwyneth one, but yeah, goog

89
00:05:45,040 --> 00:05:49,080
Speaker 1: Gwyneth Paltrow's like like snake oil brand or about Q

90
00:05:49,279 --> 00:05:51,400
Speaker 1: and on a lot. Q just came back on right

91
00:05:51,440 --> 00:05:53,880
Speaker 1: after the appeal of Roe v Wade started posting that's

92
00:05:53,920 --> 00:05:57,800
Speaker 1: not great. Yeah, on your mind a little bit, a

93
00:05:57,839 --> 00:06:01,120
Speaker 1: little alarming and and literal not sees. Those are probably

94
00:06:01,160 --> 00:06:04,080
Speaker 1: on your mind occasionally, right, They're on my mind far

95
00:06:04,120 --> 00:06:06,400
Speaker 1: more than I'd like to admit. What if I were

96
00:06:06,440 --> 00:06:09,520
Speaker 1: to tell you that the ideas behind all of these

97
00:06:09,560 --> 00:06:12,839
Speaker 1: groups have a single origin point, and in fact an

98
00:06:12,880 --> 00:06:15,839
Speaker 1: origin point in a single woman. They can all trace

99
00:06:15,880 --> 00:06:18,520
Speaker 1: their lineage back to one broad What if I were

100
00:06:18,560 --> 00:06:20,919
Speaker 1: to tell you that Jamie I would say, I know

101
00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:23,240
Speaker 1: exactly who that broad is and I can't wait for

102
00:06:23,279 --> 00:06:26,039
Speaker 1: you to tell me. Yeah. Yeah, we are talking today

103
00:06:26,080 --> 00:06:30,600
Speaker 1: about Helena Blovotsky Um, a woman so influential that the

104
00:06:30,640 --> 00:06:33,240
Speaker 1: only way to start her episode was by spending five

105
00:06:33,279 --> 00:06:36,120
Speaker 1: minutes talking about burning Genitalia as the result of a

106
00:06:36,200 --> 00:06:39,640
Speaker 1: variety of mistakes and fucking sandwiches. And I honestly don't

107
00:06:39,640 --> 00:06:42,000
Speaker 1: know where she would fall on any of those issues,

108
00:06:42,040 --> 00:06:44,920
Speaker 1: to be perfectly honest. Well that's interesting. We're going to

109
00:06:45,000 --> 00:06:47,440
Speaker 1: get into this. But she would claim most of her

110
00:06:47,800 --> 00:06:51,400
Speaker 1: her life as a prominent figure that she was utterly celibate,

111
00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:54,600
Speaker 1: but her biograph at least one of her biographers claim

112
00:06:54,839 --> 00:06:58,640
Speaker 1: she was just like as as the kids say. She

113
00:06:58,839 --> 00:07:02,440
Speaker 1: was balls deep in that year row, you know. Okay, Okay,

114
00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:04,960
Speaker 1: so she she was in the in the hero. Okay,

115
00:07:05,120 --> 00:07:07,440
Speaker 1: I'm excited for this because she has I mean, I

116
00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:08,720
Speaker 1: know we're going to talk about it, but she has

117
00:07:08,760 --> 00:07:12,760
Speaker 1: a jumping off point of the that directly intersects with

118
00:07:12,800 --> 00:07:15,640
Speaker 1: the show I was just working on Ghost She's she

119
00:07:15,760 --> 00:07:19,120
Speaker 1: started with some spiritualism stuff and then and then she

120
00:07:19,240 --> 00:07:21,360
Speaker 1: really took it to an a level. She the least

121
00:07:21,400 --> 00:07:24,640
Speaker 1: pleasant way. What's interesting. So because your show is about

122
00:07:24,720 --> 00:07:28,040
Speaker 1: spiritual specifically American spiritualism, because there's different strains of it,

123
00:07:28,520 --> 00:07:30,240
Speaker 1: she was kind of you know what a magpie is,

124
00:07:30,280 --> 00:07:33,360
Speaker 1: that bird that like lays its eggs in another bird's nest.

125
00:07:33,600 --> 00:07:36,600
Speaker 1: She was that for spiritualism. She was never a spiritualist.

126
00:07:36,680 --> 00:07:39,520
Speaker 1: She just snuck in there to sell her own thing. Um,

127
00:07:39,560 --> 00:07:43,600
Speaker 1: it's a very cool story. I'm very very excited because

128
00:07:43,600 --> 00:07:46,160
Speaker 1: I started researching her for the show, and then it

129
00:07:46,240 --> 00:07:48,600
Speaker 1: just quickly became apparent that not only is there at

130
00:07:48,640 --> 00:07:53,360
Speaker 1: least a sixteen thousand words script if he had about it, Yeah,

131
00:07:53,600 --> 00:07:56,120
Speaker 1: and also that like like you're saying, like she wasn't

132
00:07:56,160 --> 00:08:00,440
Speaker 1: actually and she was just interested in the eyes and

133
00:08:00,560 --> 00:08:03,720
Speaker 1: ears that spiritualism had. Yeah, And it's one of those things,

134
00:08:04,280 --> 00:08:07,480
Speaker 1: the religion she creates, theosophy. I'm sure there's going to

135
00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:09,280
Speaker 1: be some theosophus that are just going to be livid

136
00:08:09,320 --> 00:08:11,600
Speaker 1: with us that the things we leave out. It's I

137
00:08:11,880 --> 00:08:15,200
Speaker 1: read two biographies about this woman. Both of them were

138
00:08:15,360 --> 00:08:18,560
Speaker 1: very long. Both of them have so much detail no

139
00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:21,680
Speaker 1: one would ever need unless you're interested in specific arguments

140
00:08:21,720 --> 00:08:26,720
Speaker 1: that weirdo occult people were having in eight like, and

141
00:08:27,040 --> 00:08:30,680
Speaker 1: it's interested and of course you all know who this

142
00:08:30,760 --> 00:08:34,000
Speaker 1: guy is. He wrote that, like, Um, I'm trying to

143
00:08:34,040 --> 00:08:37,320
Speaker 1: boil most of that out. It's also worth noting both

144
00:08:37,320 --> 00:08:40,520
Speaker 1: of the biographers I read are like believers. So no,

145
00:08:40,760 --> 00:08:43,120
Speaker 1: there are no credible sources for most of this. There

146
00:08:43,120 --> 00:08:45,320
Speaker 1: are a few facts that we can say for certain.

147
00:08:45,320 --> 00:08:47,920
Speaker 1: And then it's like, here's one story, here's another story.

148
00:08:47,960 --> 00:08:51,000
Speaker 1: Because she's like, she's an Elron Hubbard figure. She she

149
00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:55,559
Speaker 1: she never told the same story about her background twice. Basically, UM,

150
00:08:55,640 --> 00:08:57,880
Speaker 1: So we're gonna do our best here. But first we're

151
00:08:57,880 --> 00:09:02,199
Speaker 1: going to start um before the birth of Helena Blobotsky

152
00:09:02,480 --> 00:09:07,160
Speaker 1: UM by talking about the concept of orientalism. UM. Now, today,

153
00:09:07,280 --> 00:09:11,120
Speaker 1: Oxford Languages describes Orientalism as quote, the representation of Asia,

154
00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:13,720
Speaker 1: especially the Middle East, in a stereotyped way that is

155
00:09:13,720 --> 00:09:18,000
Speaker 1: regarded as embodying a colonialist attitude. UM. I think today

156
00:09:18,040 --> 00:09:19,640
Speaker 1: when people use the word, they're mainly thinking of like

157
00:09:19,679 --> 00:09:23,640
Speaker 1: specifically China. UM. But this includes a lot of colonialist

158
00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:27,000
Speaker 1: atitudes towards India and obviously towards the Middle East, towards

159
00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:30,560
Speaker 1: Northern Africa. UM. And this is a bad thing if

160
00:09:30,600 --> 00:09:33,160
Speaker 1: somebody accuses you of being an Orientalist, they're accusing you

161
00:09:33,200 --> 00:09:35,960
Speaker 1: of a very specific kind of white supremacy. Right, But

162
00:09:36,240 --> 00:09:39,440
Speaker 1: back in the sixteen hundreds, Orientalism was still a thing,

163
00:09:40,160 --> 00:09:44,240
Speaker 1: but it wasn't necessarily white supremacist. You could definitely say

164
00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:48,320
Speaker 1: it was racist, although even that's a little off to me. Basically,

165
00:09:48,360 --> 00:09:51,880
Speaker 1: it's it was based on stereotypes of Asia, many of

166
00:09:51,880 --> 00:09:55,480
Speaker 1: which were wrong. But the stereotypes weren't based in hate

167
00:09:55,480 --> 00:09:57,240
Speaker 1: as much as the fact that it was the sixteen

168
00:09:57,320 --> 00:09:59,080
Speaker 1: hundreds and it was kind of hard to get good

169
00:09:59,160 --> 00:10:02,640
Speaker 1: information about out India if you were like living in France, right,

170
00:10:02,840 --> 00:10:05,320
Speaker 1: So like people just like believed things and didn't really

171
00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:10,200
Speaker 1: have any way to confirm them. Um. Now, specifically, Orientalism

172
00:10:10,200 --> 00:10:12,679
Speaker 1: in the six hundreds would have actually centered more around

173
00:10:12,760 --> 00:10:15,600
Speaker 1: Cairo in Egypt than it would have because that was

174
00:10:15,640 --> 00:10:18,839
Speaker 1: the East, right, that was the that was the the like, um,

175
00:10:18,880 --> 00:10:22,560
Speaker 1: that was the kind of old world to people in

176
00:10:22,600 --> 00:10:25,360
Speaker 1: that period of time, this Enlightenment period, and it was

177
00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:28,679
Speaker 1: it was the center of historic knowledge. Right Cairo had

178
00:10:28,679 --> 00:10:31,240
Speaker 1: had had the Library of Alexandria. This kind of mythic

179
00:10:31,280 --> 00:10:32,920
Speaker 1: I mean, it did exist in some form, but this

180
00:10:33,040 --> 00:10:36,960
Speaker 1: like also very mythical library that supposed to contain all

181
00:10:37,040 --> 00:10:39,360
Speaker 1: of the knowledge human beings. That it's this, it's this

182
00:10:39,400 --> 00:10:41,560
Speaker 1: place where you go to find the secret truths of

183
00:10:41,559 --> 00:10:44,719
Speaker 1: the ancients. Hey, I misspoke here and said Cairo had

184
00:10:44,760 --> 00:10:47,079
Speaker 1: the Library of Alexandria. I meant to say Egypt had it.

185
00:10:47,160 --> 00:10:51,040
Speaker 1: Obviously the Library of Alexandria was in Alexandria. It is

186
00:10:51,080 --> 00:10:53,680
Speaker 1: so fascinating, like whenever you look at texts from that time,

187
00:10:53,720 --> 00:10:56,000
Speaker 1: like I know that we're absolutely skull fucked when it

188
00:10:56,040 --> 00:11:00,880
Speaker 1: comes to the proliferation, like the proliferation of all info now.

189
00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:05,360
Speaker 1: But just like people in the West, their perception of

190
00:11:05,360 --> 00:11:07,240
Speaker 1: Egypt would have been formed by only just like a

191
00:11:07,280 --> 00:11:11,680
Speaker 1: couple of random Western people, And it's just so incredibly

192
00:11:12,200 --> 00:11:16,240
Speaker 1: vague and entitled, and it's just it's also I mean,

193
00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:18,080
Speaker 1: one of the things that's interesting. So again in the

194
00:11:18,120 --> 00:11:22,600
Speaker 1: sixteen hundreds, Um, Egypt is kind of like the occult

195
00:11:22,640 --> 00:11:27,600
Speaker 1: center of Western conceptions of like magic and stuff. Um,

196
00:11:27,640 --> 00:11:29,720
Speaker 1: the same as kind of true for the ancient Romans.

197
00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:33,960
Speaker 1: That's for how fucking old Egyptian civilization is two thousand

198
00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:36,920
Speaker 1: years ago, and like Caesar's day, like hip Romans are

199
00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:40,440
Speaker 1: going to Alexandria Cairo to like do some of the

200
00:11:40,520 --> 00:11:43,079
Speaker 1: same ship because they're like interested in this like ancient

201
00:11:43,320 --> 00:11:47,640
Speaker 1: mystical tradition and stuff and like multiple gods. Yeah, I

202
00:11:47,679 --> 00:11:51,600
Speaker 1: can't believe it. Yeah, it's it's I mean they had

203
00:11:51,640 --> 00:11:54,960
Speaker 1: multiple gods too, but um yeah, it's even the Romans did.

204
00:11:54,960 --> 00:11:57,040
Speaker 1: But I'm talking about once once we get to just

205
00:11:57,559 --> 00:12:00,920
Speaker 1: one one big guy. Yeah, it haines. This kind of

206
00:12:01,200 --> 00:12:04,360
Speaker 1: there's has always been this fascination with with Cairo and

207
00:12:04,440 --> 00:12:07,040
Speaker 1: with with Egypt in particular as this kind of like

208
00:12:07,120 --> 00:12:11,400
Speaker 1: center of occult traditions. Um. And it's also worth knowing

209
00:12:11,400 --> 00:12:14,840
Speaker 1: than the sixteen hundreds like ship, like the pyramids, like legitimately,

210
00:12:14,880 --> 00:12:18,040
Speaker 1: they couldn't imagine how they could have been constructed. Um.

211
00:12:18,120 --> 00:12:20,880
Speaker 1: They addressed that in the first scene of Despicable Me.

212
00:12:21,440 --> 00:12:25,480
Speaker 1: Oh good, I'm glad. Yeah it was well, no, it

213
00:12:25,520 --> 00:12:28,880
Speaker 1: was inflatable, oh okay, okay, and then the minions and

214
00:12:28,920 --> 00:12:31,280
Speaker 1: it was the minions. The minions put it there. They

215
00:12:31,360 --> 00:12:33,800
Speaker 1: used all their little minion breath and then they went

216
00:12:33,880 --> 00:12:36,440
Speaker 1: to sleep while Hitler was doing his thing. Huh. You know,

217
00:12:36,480 --> 00:12:40,360
Speaker 1: it's funny the minions. The other massacres, like where the

218
00:12:40,440 --> 00:12:42,959
Speaker 1: minions during Rwanda, Like were they helping out with that ship?

219
00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:45,839
Speaker 1: Like were the minions aiding slobadon moloss of it and

220
00:12:45,880 --> 00:12:51,240
Speaker 1: the massacre? It's Rebernitza like canonically, canonically the minions serve

221
00:12:51,400 --> 00:12:55,280
Speaker 1: the most evil person. I want to recut that documentary

222
00:12:55,320 --> 00:12:58,160
Speaker 1: the Act of Killing for when that like Indonesian fascist

223
00:12:58,200 --> 00:13:01,880
Speaker 1: is talking God, well, there's like an elderly minion behind

224
00:13:01,920 --> 00:13:04,400
Speaker 1: him with the wire. Who are not putting minions in

225
00:13:04,440 --> 00:13:09,120
Speaker 1: the act of killing? Someone needs to Jamie Loftus. So, look,

226
00:13:09,960 --> 00:13:13,720
Speaker 1: the way in which Europeans during the Enlightenment treat Egypt

227
00:13:13,840 --> 00:13:15,800
Speaker 1: is not very different from how a lot of New

228
00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:18,920
Speaker 1: Age truth seekers treat India today, right right down to

229
00:13:18,960 --> 00:13:21,360
Speaker 1: the fact that like people from Europe would move there

230
00:13:21,480 --> 00:13:28,920
Speaker 1: to like get do fancy spiritual stuff. Now, obviously it

231
00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:31,200
Speaker 1: is kind of like India's kind of the spot for

232
00:13:31,240 --> 00:13:33,720
Speaker 1: that today, right, particularly a couple of cities like Rishikesh,

233
00:13:33,800 --> 00:13:35,720
Speaker 1: for like white people love to go to like learn

234
00:13:36,200 --> 00:13:43,439
Speaker 1: different sort of like Eastern uh spiritual traditions and whatnot. Um, yeah,

235
00:13:43,520 --> 00:13:46,080
Speaker 1: and and Cairo is not so much, right, You don't

236
00:13:46,240 --> 00:13:48,320
Speaker 1: hear of a lot of Westerners going to Cairo to

237
00:13:48,440 --> 00:13:52,199
Speaker 1: like get involved in spiritual stuff today. And the reason

238
00:13:52,240 --> 00:13:55,560
Speaker 1: why that switch happened, why kind of the capital of

239
00:13:56,200 --> 00:13:59,920
Speaker 1: I guess what you'd call Western Eastern spiritualism, uh moves

240
00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:01,800
Speaker 1: from Egypt to India. Has a lot to do with

241
00:14:01,800 --> 00:14:06,079
Speaker 1: the dude you've probably heard of named Voltaire um And

242
00:14:06,240 --> 00:14:09,760
Speaker 1: and Voltaire is real into this, this idea that there

243
00:14:09,760 --> 00:14:13,840
Speaker 1: are sacred truths in like kind of Eastern and Asian

244
00:14:14,240 --> 00:14:18,920
Speaker 1: religion and mythology that Westerners have forgotten um And specifically

245
00:14:18,920 --> 00:14:21,200
Speaker 1: in a way that, like he thinks, gives them kind

246
00:14:21,200 --> 00:14:24,400
Speaker 1: of moral superiority over Westerners. In Candide, he gives kind

247
00:14:24,400 --> 00:14:27,600
Speaker 1: of the final word in the book to a Turkish dervish.

248
00:14:27,600 --> 00:14:30,120
Speaker 1: In The Princess of Babylon, he depicts a Golden Age

249
00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:33,520
Speaker 1: civilization on the banks of the Ganji's. Um Voltaire was

250
00:14:33,600 --> 00:14:38,280
Speaker 1: probably are classic Voltaire. I know so much about him,

251
00:14:38,320 --> 00:14:41,960
Speaker 1: I I know every word. Yeah, you're you've you've famously

252
00:14:42,040 --> 00:14:46,040
Speaker 1: got Voltaire's face tattooed across your lower back. Um. Voltaire

253
00:14:46,320 --> 00:14:49,440
Speaker 1: is not mainly something I associate with one line in

254
00:14:49,480 --> 00:14:55,000
Speaker 1: the Princess Diaries one definitely so Um. He was probably

255
00:14:55,040 --> 00:14:58,240
Speaker 1: the best known influence and most influential orientalist of his day,

256
00:14:58,280 --> 00:15:01,000
Speaker 1: which was like most of the seventeen hundreds, this guy

257
00:15:01,080 --> 00:15:03,640
Speaker 1: lived for fucking ever. He was born in six and

258
00:15:03,680 --> 00:15:06,720
Speaker 1: died in seventeen seventy eight. Pretty good run for that

259
00:15:06,760 --> 00:15:09,480
Speaker 1: period in time. I think he had a lot of

260
00:15:09,480 --> 00:15:12,280
Speaker 1: civilist by the inn there. But who didn't does he?

261
00:15:12,400 --> 00:15:14,880
Speaker 1: Did he not go outside? How do you how do

262
00:15:14,920 --> 00:15:17,880
Speaker 1: you achieve that he did all right for the day?

263
00:15:17,920 --> 00:15:20,800
Speaker 1: I mean, that's pretty pretty good for now. Um. So

264
00:15:21,040 --> 00:15:23,360
Speaker 1: one of the things that he wrote during his very

265
00:15:23,400 --> 00:15:27,360
Speaker 1: long life was an essay on the Spirit of Nations um,

266
00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:29,920
Speaker 1: which listed China and India. He's kind of going through

267
00:15:29,920 --> 00:15:32,520
Speaker 1: in a list what he uses like the oldest civilizations,

268
00:15:32,880 --> 00:15:35,600
Speaker 1: and it lists he lists China and India as as

269
00:15:35,800 --> 00:15:39,600
Speaker 1: the very oldest of civilizations. Um. Now, Voltaire was not

270
00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:43,480
Speaker 1: making any kind of archaeological argument here, um, certainly not

271
00:15:43,560 --> 00:15:45,280
Speaker 1: in the sense that you or I would talk about today.

272
00:15:45,520 --> 00:15:48,120
Speaker 1: He was instead arguing in favor of a concept in

273
00:15:48,200 --> 00:15:51,560
Speaker 1: vogue at the time called diffusionism. Now, today we map

274
00:15:51,640 --> 00:15:54,840
Speaker 1: cultural inventions, like say, de Phoenician alphabet, back to specific

275
00:15:54,840 --> 00:15:58,080
Speaker 1: origin points. Right, at some point a person or persons

276
00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:01,000
Speaker 1: in Phoenicia made an alphabet and it became popular, right

277
00:16:01,040 --> 00:16:02,640
Speaker 1: in the same way that like, at some point some

278
00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:06,760
Speaker 1: motherfucker's made an iPhone and it became popular. But diffusionists

279
00:16:06,880 --> 00:16:11,000
Speaker 1: didn't think that that's how inventing stuff worked. They believe

280
00:16:11,040 --> 00:16:13,960
Speaker 1: that there had been some great civilization in the past

281
00:16:14,080 --> 00:16:17,240
Speaker 1: in which all great cultural inventions came from. Right, there

282
00:16:17,280 --> 00:16:22,640
Speaker 1: was some golden age. Yeah, like an ideological Pangaea situation,

283
00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:26,640
Speaker 1: Like that's exactly what they think. That's exactly what. Well

284
00:16:26,680 --> 00:16:30,720
Speaker 1: that that's that's an interesting idea. I think diffusionists believe

285
00:16:30,760 --> 00:16:32,840
Speaker 1: there had been kind of like a couple of civilizations

286
00:16:32,840 --> 00:16:36,000
Speaker 1: in the past that everything came from. Radical diffusionists went

287
00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:38,960
Speaker 1: that all believe that all human culture and technology had

288
00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:42,960
Speaker 1: like a single origin point. Um. Now, one of the

289
00:16:42,960 --> 00:16:45,560
Speaker 1: things that was cool about Voltaire was that he argued,

290
00:16:45,760 --> 00:16:47,560
Speaker 1: and this is what he was doing by listing China

291
00:16:47,600 --> 00:16:50,000
Speaker 1: and India as like old because basically, if you believe this,

292
00:16:50,240 --> 00:16:53,000
Speaker 1: the older a civilization is that the closer it is

293
00:16:53,040 --> 00:16:56,800
Speaker 1: to like the human original ideal civilization, you know, like

294
00:16:56,840 --> 00:16:59,880
Speaker 1: the further back you go. So by arguing that in

295
00:17:00,160 --> 00:17:02,360
Speaker 1: in China were older than like any of kind of

296
00:17:02,360 --> 00:17:06,960
Speaker 1: the Judeo Christian civilizations, he was arguing against the primacy

297
00:17:07,000 --> 00:17:09,880
Speaker 1: of Judaeo Christian beliefs in the broad sweep of human history,

298
00:17:09,920 --> 00:17:11,800
Speaker 1: which is a pretty cool thing to be doing at

299
00:17:11,800 --> 00:17:15,200
Speaker 1: the time. Um So, when he listed India and China

300
00:17:15,280 --> 00:17:17,960
Speaker 1: as coming before Judaism in his essay, he was making

301
00:17:17,960 --> 00:17:20,639
Speaker 1: the claim that Christianity and Judaism we're kind of copying

302
00:17:20,760 --> 00:17:24,000
Speaker 1: or descending from older belief systems. Now, a thing that

303
00:17:24,080 --> 00:17:27,040
Speaker 1: doesn't rock about this is that Voltaire also described the

304
00:17:27,119 --> 00:17:30,640
Speaker 1: Jews as basically stealing their culture from other people. Um

305
00:17:31,480 --> 00:17:36,159
Speaker 1: that does seem exactly there's probably it's good that, like,

306
00:17:36,200 --> 00:17:39,879
Speaker 1: okay on the six hundreds, Probably Christian people needed a

307
00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:42,080
Speaker 1: little bit of like, hey, you're not the center of

308
00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:46,080
Speaker 1: human development, right. That's parts they don't like. They don't

309
00:17:46,119 --> 00:17:49,080
Speaker 1: like hearing that round, They hate that ship. And the

310
00:17:49,119 --> 00:17:51,560
Speaker 1: bad part is that Voltaire focuses a lot on the

311
00:17:51,640 --> 00:17:54,600
Speaker 1: Jews and and specifically them as stealing their culture from

312
00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:57,520
Speaker 1: older cultures and not inventing anything of their own, which

313
00:17:57,560 --> 00:18:02,000
Speaker 1: is a central pillar of anti semity and particularly Nazi ideology,

314
00:18:02,080 --> 00:18:04,760
Speaker 1: focuses a lot on like Jewish cultural theft. It's like

315
00:18:04,760 --> 00:18:07,800
Speaker 1: a huge thing the Naziser, which for a bunch of

316
00:18:07,880 --> 00:18:10,800
Speaker 1: Christians is very funny. But anyway, whatever I mean outside

317
00:18:10,840 --> 00:18:14,760
Speaker 1: outside of like just like bald faced anti Semitism, is

318
00:18:14,760 --> 00:18:17,800
Speaker 1: there a reason that he does not accuse Christians of

319
00:18:17,800 --> 00:18:20,040
Speaker 1: the same thing like I think he kind of does,

320
00:18:20,119 --> 00:18:25,199
Speaker 1: but he really just focuses on Jewish people. Um, he

321
00:18:25,560 --> 00:18:27,639
Speaker 1: I'm not an expert on Voltaire, but he's but he

322
00:18:27,680 --> 00:18:29,800
Speaker 1: does spend I think most people will agree he was

323
00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:33,040
Speaker 1: a bit anti Semitic. Now anti semitic for the time.

324
00:18:33,200 --> 00:18:36,959
Speaker 1: That's probably too much to say, because it was everyone like,

325
00:18:37,520 --> 00:18:40,359
Speaker 1: there's regular programs and ship in this period, you know,

326
00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:42,600
Speaker 1: so he's he's pretty in line with a lot of

327
00:18:42,640 --> 00:18:46,239
Speaker 1: Europeans in this moment um. I want to quote now

328
00:18:46,280 --> 00:18:50,080
Speaker 1: from a fascinating right up by Dan Edelstein titled Hyperborean Atlantis.

329
00:18:50,280 --> 00:18:52,919
Speaker 1: Quote the Jews as well as every other people that

330
00:18:53,000 --> 00:18:57,440
Speaker 1: succeeded the er civilization, which is like the the Golden

331
00:18:57,480 --> 00:19:01,440
Speaker 1: Age civilization. Everything comes from merely actuated a complete cultural

332
00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:04,760
Speaker 1: system which they inherited from the prima genitors of human society.

333
00:19:05,040 --> 00:19:07,520
Speaker 1: At a time when polygenetic theories about the origin of

334
00:19:07,600 --> 00:19:11,600
Speaker 1: human races were rampant, radical diffusionism was further bolstered by

335
00:19:11,600 --> 00:19:14,239
Speaker 1: the notion that only certain select peoples could have had

336
00:19:14,280 --> 00:19:17,840
Speaker 1: would have had the requisite qualities for inventing culture. According

337
00:19:17,880 --> 00:19:21,159
Speaker 1: to Voltaire, these prima genitors of all human knowledge were Indian.

338
00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:24,840
Speaker 1: This hypothesis was particularly seductive as it could be extended

339
00:19:24,880 --> 00:19:28,280
Speaker 1: to the most sophisticated aspects of human culture, namely the sciences.

340
00:19:28,600 --> 00:19:31,640
Speaker 1: The belief in the super sophistication of Brahmanic culture grew

341
00:19:31,680 --> 00:19:35,879
Speaker 1: stronger after Sir William Jones's discovery of Sanskrit grammar, but

342
00:19:35,960 --> 00:19:39,840
Speaker 1: even before the Asiatic researchers saw the day, Brahmanism was

343
00:19:39,880 --> 00:19:43,760
Speaker 1: being hailed as the original science. And this is you'll

344
00:19:43,800 --> 00:19:45,960
Speaker 1: see bits of this today if you listen to like

345
00:19:46,000 --> 00:19:48,280
Speaker 1: people talk about the Baga bad Gida, there's a lot

346
00:19:48,320 --> 00:19:51,680
Speaker 1: of focus, particularly in the West onlike passages that could

347
00:19:51,680 --> 00:19:54,639
Speaker 1: be talking about witnessing a nuclear weapon and stuff. And

348
00:19:55,000 --> 00:19:58,359
Speaker 1: right this even goes both ways because famously, um was

349
00:19:58,400 --> 00:20:00,840
Speaker 1: Oppenheimer quotes from the Baga Bodh when he sets off

350
00:20:00,880 --> 00:20:03,680
Speaker 1: the first atomic bomb. Right now, I am become death,

351
00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:07,080
Speaker 1: such and such destroyer of world's YadA YadA um. But

352
00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:11,200
Speaker 1: there's these like you can find a lot of conspiracies

353
00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:14,280
Speaker 1: about like, oh, these these things from the Vetas or whatnot,

354
00:20:14,280 --> 00:20:16,560
Speaker 1: are these like bits of Indian art kind of look

355
00:20:16,640 --> 00:20:18,679
Speaker 1: like they could be like a spaceship or something, And

356
00:20:18,720 --> 00:20:22,080
Speaker 1: so maybe like the maybe maybe these these ancient Hindu

357
00:20:22,119 --> 00:20:26,600
Speaker 1: texts are talking about some like prehistoric war between advanced

358
00:20:26,640 --> 00:20:29,280
Speaker 1: with an advanced human civilization that tow itself apart and

359
00:20:29,560 --> 00:20:31,720
Speaker 1: we're all living in there. It's a thing people talk

360
00:20:31,760 --> 00:20:35,200
Speaker 1: about today, right, And that's not a particularly common Hindu belief,

361
00:20:35,440 --> 00:20:38,439
Speaker 1: but it's like a thing particularly Westerners will talk about today.

362
00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:41,000
Speaker 1: So that's that's kind of like my that's kind of

363
00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:45,960
Speaker 1: my big question so far as like when Voltaire and

364
00:20:45,960 --> 00:20:50,560
Speaker 1: and the Voltaire adjacents talk about India and Egypt, are

365
00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:54,080
Speaker 1: they talking about the Western perception of Egypt is anything

366
00:20:54,080 --> 00:20:58,120
Speaker 1: they're saying based in actual fact? Yeah, there's usually ten

367
00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:03,439
Speaker 1: or fifteen percent actual fact. You'll get, like you know, people,

368
00:21:03,720 --> 00:21:05,439
Speaker 1: a lot of it is like some road for for

369
00:21:05,480 --> 00:21:08,400
Speaker 1: the Egyptian stuff. Some Roman or some Greek like spent

370
00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:11,720
Speaker 1: time in Egypt and like wrote about religious and half

371
00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:13,720
Speaker 1: of what the writing is like maybe they saw some

372
00:21:13,800 --> 00:21:16,160
Speaker 1: like worship, and half of it is like some dude

373
00:21:16,160 --> 00:21:18,320
Speaker 1: at a bar told them about a ritual and that

374
00:21:18,359 --> 00:21:21,160
Speaker 1: all kind of gets like mashed together into like herodotus

375
00:21:21,200 --> 00:21:24,399
Speaker 1: writing about like what the Egyptians believed, and then a

376
00:21:24,440 --> 00:21:26,639
Speaker 1: thousand is a couple of thousand years later, some like

377
00:21:26,680 --> 00:21:30,640
Speaker 1: European in fucking Paris or London reads that and like,

378
00:21:31,040 --> 00:21:33,800
Speaker 1: you know, off to the race as we go. Um,

379
00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:36,119
Speaker 1: you know, I'm hanging out at the wrong bars. The

380
00:21:36,119 --> 00:21:38,720
Speaker 1: bar I went to last week said that overturning Roe v.

381
00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:41,280
Speaker 1: Wade was good for me. I just didn't know it yet.

382
00:21:41,600 --> 00:21:44,120
Speaker 1: Oh well, that's it sounds like a bar in Florida

383
00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:51,160
Speaker 1: UM or or Orange County um or parts of San

384
00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:56,000
Speaker 1: Bernardino Atwater Village. Shout out at Water Village for having

385
00:21:56,040 --> 00:22:01,400
Speaker 1: some anti abortion old men. Continue sounds right, So speaking

386
00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:06,000
Speaker 1: of old men, Voltaire argued strongly that India, not Egypt,

387
00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:08,240
Speaker 1: should be considered the font of civilization. So he's saying,

388
00:22:08,359 --> 00:22:11,280
Speaker 1: like even the Egyptians are just kind of like copying

389
00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:15,480
Speaker 1: off of this great original Indian civilization. Um. And as

390
00:22:15,520 --> 00:22:18,840
Speaker 1: you probably has occurred to a couple of people listening

391
00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:21,600
Speaker 1: right now. Um, the things that he's arguing about and

392
00:22:21,600 --> 00:22:24,200
Speaker 1: that other argument are like writers in the same vein

393
00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:27,360
Speaker 1: are arguing about mesh is pretty well with like the

394
00:22:27,400 --> 00:22:34,480
Speaker 1: most popular myth in Western mythological canon, Atlantis. Right, yes,

395
00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:40,120
Speaker 1: there's there's like this perfect Golden Age civilization with advanced

396
00:22:40,119 --> 00:22:43,040
Speaker 1: technology that that's like somehow got destroyed and we're all

397
00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:46,560
Speaker 1: descended from them. Um, Like that's not that far off

398
00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:49,359
Speaker 1: from how a lot of people interpret Atlantis. Now, the

399
00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:53,919
Speaker 1: original myth of Atlantis comes from like Plato, as written

400
00:22:53,960 --> 00:22:56,639
Speaker 1: by some other dude, right, Like, it's not not like

401
00:22:57,119 --> 00:23:00,440
Speaker 1: Michael J. Fox movie. Yeah no, this is like, this

402
00:23:00,520 --> 00:23:03,040
Speaker 1: is like when Plato got played by you and McGregor

403
00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:08,119
Speaker 1: um twenty years later, or when Salvador Dolly got played

404
00:23:08,119 --> 00:23:10,720
Speaker 1: by Robert Pattinson. I feel like, people, oh my god,

405
00:23:10,760 --> 00:23:14,200
Speaker 1: that did happen. What a bad ship thing to do,

406
00:23:14,640 --> 00:23:20,080
Speaker 1: especially absolutely unhinged if you are casting Dolly, fucking pedro

407
00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:22,880
Speaker 1: Pascal is right there, and he has proven his willingness

408
00:23:22,920 --> 00:23:25,959
Speaker 1: to grow a mustache. Oh he's and he can actually

409
00:23:25,960 --> 00:23:27,919
Speaker 1: do it. You know who did do it the role

410
00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:33,800
Speaker 1: Robert Pattinson. Baby, it's that and remember me iconically bad

411
00:23:33,880 --> 00:23:40,240
Speaker 1: Robert Pattinson rum absolutely outstanding shit good movie night vibe

412
00:23:40,240 --> 00:23:43,840
Speaker 1: as continue, according to Plato, was written by some other dude,

413
00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:47,199
Speaker 1: Atlantis was the home of a very advanced people. Modern

414
00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:49,880
Speaker 1: writers always take that to mean like spaceships and free

415
00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:52,920
Speaker 1: energy in Plato's day and advanced civilization, but like their

416
00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:55,439
Speaker 1: aqueducts worked better, right, Like that's what he was not

417
00:23:55,680 --> 00:23:58,840
Speaker 1: advantaging imagining starships. He was like, yeah, and they're really

418
00:23:58,840 --> 00:24:09,520
Speaker 1: good at making water, incredible at it. In time, Atlantis

419
00:24:09,600 --> 00:24:12,400
Speaker 1: mutated as a myth into a pre Egyptian globe spanning

420
00:24:12,400 --> 00:24:15,280
Speaker 1: civilization that had colonized the world in a manner similar

421
00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:17,200
Speaker 1: to how Europeans has started to colonize it in the

422
00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:21,320
Speaker 1: sixteen hundreds. Right, the Atlanti Smith kind of transforms to

423
00:24:21,680 --> 00:24:24,920
Speaker 1: ape what Europeans are doing at the same time. Right,

424
00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:28,199
Speaker 1: Europeans see themselves conquering the entire world and colonizing it.

425
00:24:28,680 --> 00:24:31,040
Speaker 1: And because these myths, like they kind of adapt the

426
00:24:31,080 --> 00:24:34,639
Speaker 1: Atlantis Smith in media rez to be oh, this happened before,

427
00:24:34,880 --> 00:24:42,320
Speaker 1: and confirmation bias when people manufacture their own confirmation bias myths. Yeah,

428
00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:45,760
Speaker 1: galaxy brain shit. There's a lot of guys who are

429
00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:48,400
Speaker 1: like super hard for this or a good example, Sir

430
00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:52,320
Speaker 1: Francis Bacon gets his like like it's just coming constantly

431
00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:56,480
Speaker 1: over fucking Atlantis in the early sixteen hundreds, and um, yeah,

432
00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:59,359
Speaker 1: in the late seventeen hundreds, near the end of Voltaire's life,

433
00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:04,439
Speaker 1: a s astronomer named Jean Sylvain Bailey decides to find Atlantis,

434
00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:08,360
Speaker 1: right this, like because it's all it's this they've decided

435
00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:11,440
Speaker 1: there's because of folks like Voltaire. They don't really believe

436
00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:14,359
Speaker 1: that Atlantis is this like Greek Island anymore. Um And

437
00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:16,119
Speaker 1: in fact, a lot of people are like placing it

438
00:25:16,160 --> 00:25:18,840
Speaker 1: in the east, but nobody knows where it was. So

439
00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:21,280
Speaker 1: they all very much believe in this place that kind

440
00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:24,919
Speaker 1: of its existence, especially if you if you imagine that

441
00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:27,879
Speaker 1: you're going to find some artifacts that like maybe have

442
00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:31,160
Speaker 1: some writing and stuff that looks Latin or something in there.

443
00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:33,760
Speaker 1: It's existence could kind of justify what you're doing and

444
00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:36,920
Speaker 1: colonize in the world, right if some previous civilization had

445
00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:39,920
Speaker 1: ruled the world and you're kind of descended from them.

446
00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:44,440
Speaker 1: You know, that's how what a lot of people are thinking, right. Um.

447
00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:45,920
Speaker 1: So it's so funny to me. It's like the fact

448
00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:47,920
Speaker 1: the fact that there are people looking for Atlantis back

449
00:25:47,960 --> 00:25:50,879
Speaker 1: in the day and people like it. They are just

450
00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:54,480
Speaker 1: like the Bigfoot hunters of their time, basically, and people

451
00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:56,800
Speaker 1: act like it's the most uncivilizing in the world. I

452
00:25:56,920 --> 00:25:59,680
Speaker 1: was like, dude, this used to be a thriving industry.

453
00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:02,880
Speaker 1: It's a dying industry. If I were at the point

454
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:05,080
Speaker 1: I am in my career now, in like the early

455
00:26:05,200 --> 00:26:07,560
Speaker 1: nineteen nineties, which was famously a period in which there

456
00:26:07,560 --> 00:26:10,080
Speaker 1: were no problems, I would be doing nothing but looking

457
00:26:10,119 --> 00:26:14,760
Speaker 1: for Atlantis in Bigfoot, Like, Yeah, the thing is, it's

458
00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:19,199
Speaker 1: not the silliest thing you could do. I don't like

459
00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:22,320
Speaker 1: when it's trained in that way. The silliest thing you

460
00:26:22,359 --> 00:26:26,120
Speaker 1: can do is right, a book about how history has

461
00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:29,240
Speaker 1: come to an end. Um, That's right, Fuku Yama, Go

462
00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:34,320
Speaker 1: look for Atlantis, motherfucker. So Jean Sylvain Bailey decides I'm

463
00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:37,400
Speaker 1: gonna find Atlantis, and because history is actually not as

464
00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:40,120
Speaker 1: cool as fiction, he does not put together a badass

465
00:26:40,119 --> 00:26:42,840
Speaker 1: steampunk expedition with hot air balloons and ship, which is

466
00:26:43,480 --> 00:26:49,040
Speaker 1: part devastating Jamie, absolutely devastating. So he's not doing the

467
00:26:49,080 --> 00:26:52,600
Speaker 1: steampunk cartoon movie that I used to know it is.

468
00:26:53,080 --> 00:26:55,800
Speaker 1: It wrenches my soul in Twain. But he writes a

469
00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:57,840
Speaker 1: bunch of really boring books trying to use math and

470
00:26:57,880 --> 00:26:59,960
Speaker 1: logic to like figure out where it would have been

471
00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:04,600
Speaker 1: and um, you know, fuck you, Jean Sylvain Bailey like

472
00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:09,919
Speaker 1: go to suck a home. I want to go to Atlantis,

473
00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:15,199
Speaker 1: bitch anyway. Whatever. In Bailey, we see the synthesis of

474
00:27:15,200 --> 00:27:18,240
Speaker 1: the diffusionist trend with a new eighteenth century appreciation for

475
00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:21,080
Speaker 1: the value of myths previously rejected as being the beliefs

476
00:27:21,080 --> 00:27:24,600
Speaker 1: of pre rational civilizations, which is the fund up term.

477
00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:26,760
Speaker 1: But that's what they're talking about, right, They view civil

478
00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:30,280
Speaker 1: earlier civilizations as pre rational. I don't believe that's the case,

479
00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:32,840
Speaker 1: because you can't survive as a hunter gather if you're

480
00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:35,840
Speaker 1: not pretty rational. But whatever. And also they are even

481
00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:41,240
Speaker 1: arguing that the West was rational at this time. This

482
00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:44,040
Speaker 1: is this is how they were talking about it scholars

483
00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:47,160
Speaker 1: in this period. Um though, this is actually kind of

484
00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:49,920
Speaker 1: kind of in some ways of positive trend, where like

485
00:27:49,960 --> 00:27:52,119
Speaker 1: they're there's a lot of scholars are going against this

486
00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:55,719
Speaker 1: attitude that earlier civilizations have been like just fundamentally irrational

487
00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:58,920
Speaker 1: and there's nothing to learn about their mythology. Scholars start

488
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:00,480
Speaker 1: to argue that, like, well no, there's actually a lot

489
00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:02,920
Speaker 1: of truth in in certain myths. That's why, like they

490
00:28:02,960 --> 00:28:07,720
Speaker 1: spread um and the good the aspect of this is healthiest.

491
00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:10,399
Speaker 1: And so we should like study and appreciate the different

492
00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:13,640
Speaker 1: mythologies and whatnot that human beings have embraced over time,

493
00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:16,160
Speaker 1: because they can teach us a lot about ourselves. Instead,

494
00:28:16,200 --> 00:28:19,520
Speaker 1: a lot of scholars decide, like, well, this must mean

495
00:28:19,760 --> 00:28:22,119
Speaker 1: that all of these myths are like branches of some

496
00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:24,960
Speaker 1: great historic truth that has been corrupted over time. And

497
00:28:25,000 --> 00:28:27,159
Speaker 1: if we can figure out like a secret set of

498
00:28:27,200 --> 00:28:29,520
Speaker 1: codes that allow us to like peel away the parts

499
00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:31,720
Speaker 1: of the myths that have gotten corrupted over time, you

500
00:28:31,760 --> 00:28:36,639
Speaker 1: could unlock a sacred discourse that reveals the truth about history. Um,

501
00:28:36,720 --> 00:28:42,160
Speaker 1: so that's not discord And that was a very funny.

502
00:28:42,280 --> 00:28:45,000
Speaker 1: There is a special discord board that people are doing

503
00:28:45,040 --> 00:28:48,560
Speaker 1: that there is now. Uh So, Dan Edelstein writes, quote

504
00:28:48,800 --> 00:28:51,719
Speaker 1: Hercules is twelfth and last labor in the traditional sequence

505
00:28:51,800 --> 00:28:54,680
Speaker 1: led him beneath ground to capture Cerberus, just as Persephone

506
00:28:54,720 --> 00:28:57,720
Speaker 1: and other solar figure had disappeared underground for half the year.

507
00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:01,760
Speaker 1: These episodes and others Bailey surmise, symbolize the complete disappearance

508
00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:04,160
Speaker 1: of the sun. The inventors of the myth must therefore

509
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:06,840
Speaker 1: have lived in a latitude where the sun periodically vanished

510
00:29:06,840 --> 00:29:10,400
Speaker 1: from the sky. Dismissing earlier theories about the location of Atlantis,

511
00:29:10,640 --> 00:29:13,680
Speaker 1: Bailey thus reached the surprising conclusion that Atlantis Lane near

512
00:29:13,680 --> 00:29:18,000
Speaker 1: the North Pole, roughly where the Novaya Zimilia archipelago is situated.

513
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:19,600
Speaker 1: So you see what he's doing there, He's being like

514
00:29:19,680 --> 00:29:22,080
Speaker 1: number one, he's saying that, like, well, because all of

515
00:29:22,120 --> 00:29:24,960
Speaker 1: these myths have a common origin point and it's much older.

516
00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:29,200
Speaker 1: It can't be like Greece, like it has to be older. Um,

517
00:29:29,320 --> 00:29:32,120
Speaker 1: the Hercules myths can't have just been something some Greek

518
00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:34,040
Speaker 1: dudes came up with when they were drunk as around.

519
00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:37,360
Speaker 1: It has to originate from somewhere. So let's well, let's

520
00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:40,440
Speaker 1: pinpoint within the story. They're talking about an eclipse, which

521
00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:45,239
Speaker 1: must mean that they live near the North Pole. I

522
00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:49,440
Speaker 1: in some ways you gotta handed to it. It's very funny.

523
00:29:49,440 --> 00:29:55,360
Speaker 1: It's very funny the way logic works, Like and you're Africa,

524
00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:58,840
Speaker 1: Africa is also here, like there, there's other places we

525
00:29:58,920 --> 00:30:02,360
Speaker 1: can explore and then trace the myth, I mean, not exploit.

526
00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:05,479
Speaker 1: But again it is funny that like this is one

527
00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:10,720
Speaker 1: of those cases where the people earlier and who were

528
00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:13,360
Speaker 1: generally wronger about a lot of things, were right about

529
00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:17,400
Speaker 1: the origin of civilization or writer when they like proposed

530
00:30:17,440 --> 00:30:19,600
Speaker 1: that it was in Egypt because like, yeah, it did

531
00:30:19,640 --> 00:30:21,880
Speaker 1: start in like North Africa. Like that's more and more

532
00:30:21,920 --> 00:30:27,320
Speaker 1: or less, it's only Egypt that is worth exploit. So

533
00:30:27,440 --> 00:30:31,760
Speaker 1: they go to the Hercules myth too. Yeah, they go

534
00:30:31,920 --> 00:30:35,480
Speaker 1: the I mean Hercules clearly grew up in the North

535
00:30:35,560 --> 00:30:38,920
Speaker 1: Pole Jamie, I don't know if you've read Hercules. Look,

536
00:30:39,120 --> 00:30:42,800
Speaker 1: would I watched that movie? A million percent? I would

537
00:30:42,800 --> 00:30:45,720
Speaker 1: watch that movie there. I I like to think. I

538
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:49,600
Speaker 1: was like, what would be the like popular current myth

539
00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:56,200
Speaker 1: that people could that once society collapses, that future cryptids

540
00:30:56,240 --> 00:31:00,760
Speaker 1: can assume is based on truth? And like, is it Aragon?

541
00:31:01,720 --> 00:31:03,840
Speaker 1: Is it? Yeah? Let's let's let's have it be the

542
00:31:03,920 --> 00:31:07,160
Speaker 1: rip off of Ja or Token, Like, let's have it

543
00:31:07,240 --> 00:31:11,520
Speaker 1: be Aragon or my favorite vampire story, Cirque to freak.

544
00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:14,240
Speaker 1: Let's have it be served to freak. There you go, Jamie,

545
00:31:14,480 --> 00:31:18,960
Speaker 1: Let's yeah, it'll be cirrud to freak. Um, that's our

546
00:31:19,040 --> 00:31:23,120
Speaker 1: our foundational myth um. Also, I think that Santa Claus

547
00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:29,960
Speaker 1: should start traveling around with Hercules. But but specifically young

548
00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:33,880
Speaker 1: Arnold Schwarzenegger Hercules where he can't really talk like in English,

549
00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:37,080
Speaker 1: like he's just like he's just like pronouncing words fonetically

550
00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:40,320
Speaker 1: because he doesn't know what he's saying. I want that

551
00:31:40,560 --> 00:31:43,880
Speaker 1: Hercules hanging out with Santa Claus, just hucking people into

552
00:31:43,920 --> 00:31:49,480
Speaker 1: the East Bay. Um North Hercules is a strong idea

553
00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:54,360
Speaker 1: for a franchise. Free ip folks, come on, Disney, money

554
00:31:54,400 --> 00:31:56,440
Speaker 1: on the table. You know what else's money on the table?

555
00:31:56,520 --> 00:31:59,680
Speaker 1: Jamie Loftus, tell me what the products and services that

556
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:02,360
Speaker 1: support with this podcast money we're taking, which is why

557
00:32:02,360 --> 00:32:04,840
Speaker 1: you're about to hear these ads. I hope they're about

558
00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:06,760
Speaker 1: to try. I hope Quinny is about to try to

559
00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:12,200
Speaker 1: sell you a jade egg. Wouldn't that be amazing? Fingers crossed, well,

560
00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:22,160
Speaker 1: other times crossed. We're back. Oh, so have you ever

561
00:32:22,320 --> 00:32:25,400
Speaker 1: have you ever seen a jade egg, Robert, I've seen

562
00:32:25,520 --> 00:32:29,640
Speaker 1: jade eggs. I haven't seen anyone the kind that you stick.

563
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:32,760
Speaker 1: I've seen some people put some things inside them. I'll

564
00:32:32,800 --> 00:32:36,360
Speaker 1: tell you that much. Oh my god, friend, who can

565
00:32:36,440 --> 00:32:39,880
Speaker 1: put one of those metal coke straws all the way up? Anyway? Um?

566
00:32:39,920 --> 00:32:41,560
Speaker 1: I used to use I used to use one as

567
00:32:41,560 --> 00:32:44,760
Speaker 1: a stage prop where I did a show where at

568
00:32:44,760 --> 00:32:46,880
Speaker 1: the end, like I would have the jade egg in.

569
00:32:47,440 --> 00:32:49,880
Speaker 1: I would put it in at the beginning of the show,

570
00:32:49,920 --> 00:32:52,320
Speaker 1: and then people would totally forget I had done that,

571
00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:54,960
Speaker 1: and they would also assume I never actually did it.

572
00:32:55,320 --> 00:32:58,520
Speaker 1: And then at the end and at the end I

573
00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:01,280
Speaker 1: would they would watch me pull it out and then

574
00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:05,160
Speaker 1: and and people hated it. They did not like it.

575
00:33:06,880 --> 00:33:09,920
Speaker 1: But I had a great times a kid. I had

576
00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:13,720
Speaker 1: great parties that only happened because somebody was able to

577
00:33:13,800 --> 00:33:15,840
Speaker 1: hide a bag full of pills inside themselves in a

578
00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:19,120
Speaker 1: similar way and drive across Dallas when there were a

579
00:33:19,840 --> 00:33:22,400
Speaker 1: checkpoints set up. That's a good comrade. That's that's a

580
00:33:23,040 --> 00:33:28,200
Speaker 1: good buddy. Um. So we're talking about Bailey and his

581
00:33:28,240 --> 00:33:31,160
Speaker 1: conclusion that Atlantis lays near the north pole, right, and

582
00:33:31,200 --> 00:33:33,840
Speaker 1: this this is what brings us the concept that is

583
00:33:33,880 --> 00:33:38,600
Speaker 1: called today like Hyperborean Atlantis. Hyperborea is this like mythical

584
00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:41,440
Speaker 1: in some myths, it's like it's it's like a whole

585
00:33:41,480 --> 00:33:44,160
Speaker 1: like Pangaea style continent way back in the day. But

586
00:33:44,200 --> 00:33:47,200
Speaker 1: the Hyperboreans are like this mythical people who had supposedly

587
00:33:47,320 --> 00:33:50,880
Speaker 1: existed somewhere in the far north of green like far

588
00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:54,960
Speaker 1: north of Greece and worshiped Apollo and these kind of Hyperboreans.

589
00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:57,080
Speaker 1: Kind of that Hyperborea becomes kind of the word for

590
00:33:57,120 --> 00:34:01,160
Speaker 1: the civilization, the great civilization that anything it originated from.

591
00:34:01,360 --> 00:34:04,120
Speaker 1: It's also the civilization that Conan the Barbarian comes from

592
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:06,440
Speaker 1: in the Robert Howard novels. But that's because Howard is

593
00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:10,359
Speaker 1: specifically a fan of this like mythology. He's like growing up.

594
00:34:10,520 --> 00:34:13,080
Speaker 1: This is all still very like when Robert Howard, the

595
00:34:13,080 --> 00:34:15,720
Speaker 1: guy who creates Conan the Barbarian, is like writing the stories.

596
00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:21,360
Speaker 1: This mythology is incredibly common because of Helena Blovotsky. Um.

597
00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:24,480
Speaker 1: But yeah, so hyper boring Atlantis is the concept that

598
00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:27,000
Speaker 1: kind of comes up out as a result of Bailey's work.

599
00:34:27,560 --> 00:34:30,839
Speaker 1: Um and Bailey argues that the Hyperboreans had been real

600
00:34:31,000 --> 00:34:33,440
Speaker 1: and that they've lived up near the Arctic back when

601
00:34:33,440 --> 00:34:36,920
Speaker 1: the world was warmer. Um. And again it's face failure.

602
00:34:36,920 --> 00:34:39,480
Speaker 1: That's just another silly myth theory. There's a bunch of

603
00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:42,879
Speaker 1: different myths about early human beings that are all very fun,

604
00:34:43,280 --> 00:34:47,120
Speaker 1: very fun, but not literally true, literally true. I mean,

605
00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:50,040
Speaker 1: for example, the the opening of the movie Minions offers

606
00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:53,879
Speaker 1: some really interesting ideas about how Minions came to be. Well,

607
00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:57,279
Speaker 1: you know, and and Jamie. Actually that's based heavily on

608
00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:00,920
Speaker 1: Catholic doctrine that's been buried beneath the Vatic for centuries.

609
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:06,400
Speaker 1: But minions do believe in in dinosaurs. Dinosaurs are a

610
00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:13,560
Speaker 1: thing for minions. There is for Catholics. Yeah, really Catholicism.

611
00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:16,759
Speaker 1: They've always been shitty about abortion, but like they've been

612
00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:20,680
Speaker 1: good about evolution for a long time. Um, okay, well

613
00:35:20,719 --> 00:35:24,360
Speaker 1: that's good to know. I lapsed. What they're bad about

614
00:35:24,600 --> 00:35:28,239
Speaker 1: is strong molestation. Um, which the Minions probably helped with.

615
00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:32,280
Speaker 1: You have to assume, right, Okay, No they didn't, Robert Jamie.

616
00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:34,560
Speaker 1: They're helping all of the villains. What's more of a

617
00:35:34,640 --> 00:35:38,160
Speaker 1: villain than the Catholic Church in Ireland and like fifty

618
00:35:38,239 --> 00:35:41,919
Speaker 1: years Ireland over the last time you do see them,

619
00:35:42,040 --> 00:35:46,000
Speaker 1: I believe, unless I'm unless I was misreading who they were.

620
00:35:46,239 --> 00:35:48,400
Speaker 1: You see them help at the beginning of the movie.

621
00:35:48,800 --> 00:35:50,640
Speaker 1: You see them help. Then you see them help a

622
00:35:50,680 --> 00:35:53,560
Speaker 1: t rex. You see them help the meanest cave man.

623
00:35:54,080 --> 00:35:56,000
Speaker 1: Why is the t rex a bad guy? It's just

624
00:35:56,040 --> 00:36:00,880
Speaker 1: an animal. I hate this fucking show. You see you

625
00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:05,160
Speaker 1: see them help Napoleon Bonaparte. Oh, Napoleon was not a

626
00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:08,879
Speaker 1: bad guy. He was the only hero in European history. Look,

627
00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:12,120
Speaker 1: that's my opinion. What happens in the movie that and

628
00:36:12,160 --> 00:36:16,719
Speaker 1: then they find Grew who is um Steve Correll and

629
00:36:16,880 --> 00:36:20,200
Speaker 1: he's Hitler. Yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna take that as

630
00:36:20,320 --> 00:36:25,239
Speaker 1: as given. So Jamie he is Hitler. Yeah. Again, At

631
00:36:25,280 --> 00:36:28,080
Speaker 1: face value, this idea of like a hyperboreing Atlantis just

632
00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:32,000
Speaker 1: sounds like another silly myth. But as Edelstein continues, the

633
00:36:32,040 --> 00:36:37,200
Speaker 1: impact of Bailey's conclusions here was significant. Quote Bailey dissociated

634
00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:40,440
Speaker 1: Atlantis from the Atlanteans, the place from the people. He

635
00:36:40,520 --> 00:36:43,799
Speaker 1: thus mobilized the myth, tracing its progress from the North

636
00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:47,319
Speaker 1: Pole through Asia via Mongolia down to India, and from

637
00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:51,319
Speaker 1: there from east to west. Atlantis became a floating signifier,

638
00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:54,960
Speaker 1: an indicator of cultural superiority and originality that could be

639
00:36:55,000 --> 00:36:57,520
Speaker 1: affixed to any place in people with whom the migrant

640
00:36:57,560 --> 00:37:01,360
Speaker 1: Atlanteans might have come into contact. By situating their original

641
00:37:01,400 --> 00:37:04,840
Speaker 1: homeland beyond the scope of empirical inquiry, under the concealing

642
00:37:04,880 --> 00:37:07,520
Speaker 1: lid of polar ice sheets. He turned the Atlanteans into

643
00:37:07,520 --> 00:37:10,440
Speaker 1: what would soon become the nineteenth century myth par excellence,

644
00:37:10,680 --> 00:37:13,520
Speaker 1: the myth of race, and more specifically the white of

645
00:37:13,560 --> 00:37:18,920
Speaker 1: the white races pere peregrineation. I don't know how to

646
00:37:18,960 --> 00:37:21,960
Speaker 1: say that word. Um. So basically, what he's doing, let

647
00:37:21,960 --> 00:37:23,320
Speaker 1: me let me tell you, let me explain it. So

648
00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:25,480
Speaker 1: basically what he's doing is he's saying, like, the Atlanteans

649
00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:28,600
Speaker 1: came from this area near the North Pole, which is

650
00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:30,640
Speaker 1: now under ice. You can't find it, so there's no

651
00:37:30,760 --> 00:37:34,959
Speaker 1: documentation of it. And after this great calamity, the Atlanteans

652
00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:38,480
Speaker 1: migrated down like through China and then into India and

653
00:37:38,520 --> 00:37:41,319
Speaker 1: then through the Middle East and then eventually to Europe. Right,

654
00:37:41,719 --> 00:37:47,600
Speaker 1: So that number one, there's elements of like actual history

655
00:37:47,640 --> 00:37:50,000
Speaker 1: that jels with. Right. You have like the Indo Arians,

656
00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:51,480
Speaker 1: we're not coming from the North Pole. But you have

657
00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:55,200
Speaker 1: these like different groups of people primarily defined by their language,

658
00:37:55,239 --> 00:37:58,920
Speaker 1: that do migrate from vast swaths of like of the

659
00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:02,040
Speaker 1: globe over period of time. And so there's bits and

660
00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:05,240
Speaker 1: pieces of like evidence that shows like, oh, these people here,

661
00:38:05,640 --> 00:38:09,520
Speaker 1: you know, originally like uh came from or at least

662
00:38:09,520 --> 00:38:11,600
Speaker 1: people migrated down from this area and like you can

663
00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:14,279
Speaker 1: see evidence of that, which when you just have bits

664
00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:16,680
Speaker 1: of it kind of seems to confirm, Oh, there's this

665
00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:20,319
Speaker 1: like migrating race that's bringing civilization in its way, right,

666
00:38:20,640 --> 00:38:22,640
Speaker 1: So basically a lot of white supremacists will eventually this

667
00:38:22,719 --> 00:38:24,920
Speaker 1: will evolve into like the Aryan myth, right that there's

668
00:38:24,960 --> 00:38:29,240
Speaker 1: this like ancient Areyan race that brought civilization to Europe

669
00:38:29,280 --> 00:38:31,279
Speaker 1: and it's being corrupted now. But there is this like

670
00:38:31,320 --> 00:38:33,360
Speaker 1: original pure race that you can trace and like the

671
00:38:33,440 --> 00:38:38,759
Speaker 1: Nazis do trace back around to that. Yeah, I mean,

672
00:38:38,800 --> 00:38:41,520
Speaker 1: and it again there's bits of actual because there there

673
00:38:41,600 --> 00:38:45,160
Speaker 1: is like an Indo Aryan like people that travel up

674
00:38:45,160 --> 00:38:49,040
Speaker 1: from India and eventually make it into Eastern Europe and stuff. Um,

675
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:51,439
Speaker 1: but it's not like what the Nazis you're talking about.

676
00:38:51,440 --> 00:38:54,000
Speaker 1: But the Nazis do they sit The Nazis sind researchers

677
00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:57,360
Speaker 1: to India to like, um, the fucking Himalayas and shipped

678
00:38:57,400 --> 00:39:00,560
Speaker 1: to talk with um people that they leaved are like

679
00:39:00,600 --> 00:39:03,040
Speaker 1: the ancestors of the Arians. Like there's a lot when

680
00:39:03,239 --> 00:39:05,480
Speaker 1: they when are they doing that? And like the in

681
00:39:05,480 --> 00:39:08,640
Speaker 1: the thirties and there's an SS well in the thirties,

682
00:39:08,640 --> 00:39:12,600
Speaker 1: particularly once the Nazis gained power. There's an SS division

683
00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:15,320
Speaker 1: called on an Air Bay, which is like the SS

684
00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:19,040
Speaker 1: kind of occult history division. A lot of like historians

685
00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:22,359
Speaker 1: and researchers are funded by the Nazis to go over

686
00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:25,640
Speaker 1: into India and find evidence of the ancient Arians, because

687
00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:28,480
Speaker 1: the Nazis believed so strongly in this idea that there's

688
00:39:28,480 --> 00:39:32,560
Speaker 1: this er culture that are our ancestors that traveled through

689
00:39:32,600 --> 00:39:34,759
Speaker 1: the world and they've just been kind of like corrupted

690
00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:37,960
Speaker 1: by mistakenly breeding and like the Jews come into this

691
00:39:38,040 --> 00:39:40,200
Speaker 1: at a certain point. Um, so you just have to

692
00:39:40,280 --> 00:39:42,640
Speaker 1: like send someone to find a scrap of information to

693
00:39:42,680 --> 00:39:46,399
Speaker 1: create your confirmation by a smith. Yeah, and we can. Yeah,

694
00:39:46,600 --> 00:39:48,680
Speaker 1: I'm going to continue that quote. Now we can now

695
00:39:48,719 --> 00:39:52,200
Speaker 1: fully fathom the political thrust of Bailey's gesture. Rather than

696
00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:56,520
Speaker 1: orientalized Atlantis, which is what Voltaire had done, he atlantic

697
00:39:56,520 --> 00:40:00,120
Speaker 1: sized the orient making a snow white northern Europe and

698
00:40:00,239 --> 00:40:04,520
Speaker 1: people the Hyperboreans responsible for the cultural achievements and splendors

699
00:40:04,520 --> 00:40:07,440
Speaker 1: of the East. He did not deny Oriental achievements. On

700
00:40:07,480 --> 00:40:10,240
Speaker 1: the contrary, he'd been over backwards to concur with Voltaire

701
00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:14,040
Speaker 1: that Asian civilizations were truly awe inspiring, but a Hyperborean

702
00:40:14,080 --> 00:40:16,560
Speaker 1: Atlantis allowed him to credit a European stock with the

703
00:40:16,600 --> 00:40:19,960
Speaker 1: foundation of these ancient cultures. So well, tears like obviously,

704
00:40:20,040 --> 00:40:22,560
Speaker 1: like we we we in Europe are not so fancy

705
00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:24,279
Speaker 1: and we shouldn't be as proud of ourselves. Look at

706
00:40:24,280 --> 00:40:26,960
Speaker 1: how much like grander these civilizations in the East were.

707
00:40:27,400 --> 00:40:29,279
Speaker 1: And Bailey comes along and he's like, yes, and it's

708
00:40:29,320 --> 00:40:34,359
Speaker 1: because these white Hyperborean Atlanteans brought them civilization before they

709
00:40:34,360 --> 00:40:37,120
Speaker 1: brought it here, when their civilization was like closer to peer,

710
00:40:37,200 --> 00:40:39,560
Speaker 1: and that's why they had all these achievements. But it's

711
00:40:39,560 --> 00:40:46,680
Speaker 1: still like white people, right, yeah, yeah, it's definitely yeah. Okay,

712
00:40:47,040 --> 00:40:51,319
Speaker 1: So Bailey's ideas did not gain tremendous ground in his time.

713
00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:54,200
Speaker 1: Jules Verne actually mocks it. The whole book twenty tho

714
00:40:54,440 --> 00:40:56,440
Speaker 1: Leagues under the Sea is Jules Verne making fun of

715
00:40:56,480 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 1: this guy pretty much. Um, it's one of those things

716
00:40:59,160 --> 00:41:01,799
Speaker 1: you don't catch now because like it's this argument between dudes.

717
00:41:01,840 --> 00:41:03,719
Speaker 1: We've been dead for hundred Yeah, but Verne is kind

718
00:41:03,719 --> 00:41:07,920
Speaker 1: of like mocking Bailey specifically in that book. I always

719
00:41:08,000 --> 00:41:10,239
Speaker 1: enjoy something like that. Where you're like, yeah, you could

720
00:41:10,239 --> 00:41:12,080
Speaker 1: read the like when you find out the Wizard of

721
00:41:12,080 --> 00:41:14,359
Speaker 1: Oz is an allegory for something that you're like, well,

722
00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:17,279
Speaker 1: I didn't know about these agrarians, Like what this is

723
00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:20,160
Speaker 1: not relevant to me. But at the time people were like, oh,

724
00:41:20,200 --> 00:41:22,560
Speaker 1: he got their asses well, and that is the mark

725
00:41:22,640 --> 00:41:27,000
Speaker 1: to me of like great like like you know, shitty political,

726
00:41:27,200 --> 00:41:30,160
Speaker 1: shitty fiction. It's very obvious that like this is just

727
00:41:30,200 --> 00:41:33,160
Speaker 1: some like stupid political rant, and if it's really good fiction,

728
00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:36,000
Speaker 1: you know there's probably some dumb political rant there, because

729
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:38,120
Speaker 1: all authors do that kind of ship, but you don't

730
00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:43,480
Speaker 1: notice it. It's like Taking was actually extremely angry about

731
00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:46,880
Speaker 1: about Tory fiscal policy, and that's really what he's talking

732
00:41:46,920 --> 00:41:50,799
Speaker 1: about when he discusses the delineation of the different orci

733
00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:53,920
Speaker 1: Ish people's from the elves, um, it's all. It's all

734
00:41:55,040 --> 00:41:59,520
Speaker 1: that was Tory economic policy. To continue this joke, that

735
00:41:59,560 --> 00:42:02,359
Speaker 1: was a lie. I've not found the patients in this

736
00:42:02,480 --> 00:42:05,520
Speaker 1: lifetime to to dive into Tolkien and Laura. I don't

737
00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:07,920
Speaker 1: think it's going to happen for me. Oh, it's funny.

738
00:42:07,960 --> 00:42:11,040
Speaker 1: He really hated the idea that anybody would read anything

739
00:42:11,080 --> 00:42:17,600
Speaker 1: into his books, but like but like he the man

740
00:42:17,760 --> 00:42:20,560
Speaker 1: lives through a battle of the psalm in which thousands

741
00:42:20,600 --> 00:42:23,480
Speaker 1: of his comrades are like sucked into mud and drowning

742
00:42:23,520 --> 00:42:25,879
Speaker 1: it like while he watches. And then he like writes

743
00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:28,480
Speaker 1: in his book about this battle where thousands of corpses

744
00:42:28,480 --> 00:42:31,359
Speaker 1: are like trapped forever in a bog and people are like,

745
00:42:31,680 --> 00:42:34,359
Speaker 1: was this about, like you like writing about World War

746
00:42:34,360 --> 00:42:35,840
Speaker 1: One at all? And he like hits them in the

747
00:42:35,880 --> 00:42:38,759
Speaker 1: face with a beer bottle like, fuck you, p assuming

748
00:42:40,200 --> 00:42:47,680
Speaker 1: um exhausting, what a king? So Jamie, Yeah, this somewhat

749
00:42:47,719 --> 00:42:51,560
Speaker 1: meandering discussion. Um, you know, Bailey think it's been very

750
00:42:51,560 --> 00:42:55,080
Speaker 1: on topic. Yeah, thank you. So Bailey is kind of

751
00:42:55,120 --> 00:42:57,439
Speaker 1: ignored in his time, mocked by guys like Jules Verne.

752
00:42:57,440 --> 00:43:00,160
Speaker 1: But about sixty years after he publishes his work, aman

753
00:43:00,360 --> 00:43:02,440
Speaker 1: is going to be born who will take his ideas,

754
00:43:02,719 --> 00:43:05,440
Speaker 1: expand them, and carry them forward into a new and

755
00:43:05,480 --> 00:43:10,279
Speaker 1: bloodier age. Her name is Helena Petrovna von Hahn, and

756
00:43:10,360 --> 00:43:13,200
Speaker 1: she's born on August twelfth, eighteen thirty one, in a

757
00:43:13,239 --> 00:43:19,520
Speaker 1: Katarina slav Now she's a leah so a little bit

758
00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:24,600
Speaker 1: showy Robert and her her whole childhood is in in Ukraine. Specifically,

759
00:43:24,600 --> 00:43:26,320
Speaker 1: it's in like a lot of the parts of Ukraine

760
00:43:26,320 --> 00:43:29,000
Speaker 1: that are people are fighting and dying over right now.

761
00:43:29,840 --> 00:43:34,120
Speaker 1: Her hometown, um, Katerinoslav was a very modern city by

762
00:43:34,120 --> 00:43:36,400
Speaker 1: the standards of the Russian Empire. It had been built

763
00:43:36,440 --> 00:43:39,160
Speaker 1: just a century before um, and it specifically was like

764
00:43:39,200 --> 00:43:42,520
Speaker 1: a city they had established in like honor of Catherine

765
00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:45,760
Speaker 1: the Great, um, who is uh, the ruler of Russia

766
00:43:45,800 --> 00:43:48,640
Speaker 1: for quite a while. Very interesting lady, also a good

767
00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:52,640
Speaker 1: friend of Voltaire. Just interesting note. Um, now you may

768
00:43:52,680 --> 00:43:55,480
Speaker 1: have noticed that she is there's a Vaughan in her name, right,

769
00:43:55,520 --> 00:43:59,120
Speaker 1: she's she's Helena Petrovna von Hahn. Um. This means that

770
00:43:59,200 --> 00:44:03,920
Speaker 1: she's nobility. But you also might not like v is German,

771
00:44:04,200 --> 00:44:06,960
Speaker 1: right Yeah, if you're a Vaughan, is like a marker

772
00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:08,920
Speaker 1: that you're a member of, like the nobility in in

773
00:44:09,440 --> 00:44:14,840
Speaker 1: German culture. Umm. Yeah, I feel like I should have

774
00:44:14,920 --> 00:44:17,319
Speaker 1: known that. Does it does everywhere? Not? Yeah? I think

775
00:44:17,400 --> 00:44:20,239
Speaker 1: like the guy who assassinated Hitler close von Staffenberg's was

776
00:44:20,280 --> 00:44:24,719
Speaker 1: Prussian nobility, right um. Yeah, it's why a lot of

777
00:44:24,800 --> 00:44:27,600
Speaker 1: grifters put Vaughan in their name, and like the eighteen hundreds,

778
00:44:27,640 --> 00:44:31,400
Speaker 1: nineteen hundreds, it's because they're like pretending to be European nobles. Um.

779
00:44:31,440 --> 00:44:34,640
Speaker 1: And obviously von Hahn is a German name. She's German,

780
00:44:34,680 --> 00:44:37,480
Speaker 1: but she's Russian because a huge chunk of the Russian

781
00:44:37,520 --> 00:44:41,040
Speaker 1: aristocracy are actually German. This is going to cause serious

782
00:44:41,080 --> 00:44:43,319
Speaker 1: problems for some of them in about a century. But

783
00:44:43,360 --> 00:44:46,440
Speaker 1: at the time everybody's fine about it because like their surfs,

784
00:44:46,440 --> 00:44:47,919
Speaker 1: and they don't have any choice but to be fine

785
00:44:47,960 --> 00:44:51,440
Speaker 1: about it. So anyway, she's German, but she's Russian, and

786
00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:54,440
Speaker 1: she lives in Ukraine. This is the Russian Empire, not

787
00:44:54,560 --> 00:44:57,040
Speaker 1: weird at the time. The first great event of her

788
00:44:57,080 --> 00:44:59,600
Speaker 1: childhood would have been a cholera epidemic, which killed so

789
00:44:59,680 --> 00:45:01,960
Speaker 1: many people that coffins piled up in the streets of

790
00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:07,439
Speaker 1: her hometown unburied. Um. Now, her mother was seventeen when

791
00:45:07,480 --> 00:45:09,719
Speaker 1: she had her, which, um, we're gonna be talking about

792
00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:12,360
Speaker 1: that quite a bit. Her mom is also named Helena,

793
00:45:12,440 --> 00:45:15,600
Speaker 1: and she is not in particularly good health. Uh. She

794
00:45:15,840 --> 00:45:19,840
Speaker 1: and her new baby both catch cholera and nearly die. Um.

795
00:45:19,920 --> 00:45:22,440
Speaker 1: And in fact, young Helena the baby was so sick

796
00:45:22,480 --> 00:45:25,720
Speaker 1: that her godparents and a household called for a priest

797
00:45:25,800 --> 00:45:29,040
Speaker 1: to baptize her immediately. As a newborn infant because like

798
00:45:29,400 --> 00:45:32,600
Speaker 1: they thought she was going to die. Um and according

799
00:45:32,640 --> 00:45:35,160
Speaker 1: to family legends, Helena's aunt, who was actually also a

800
00:45:35,239 --> 00:45:37,480
Speaker 1: child at the time, accidentally set the priest's robes on

801
00:45:37,520 --> 00:45:40,960
Speaker 1: fire during the baptism, which is a pretty cool thing

802
00:45:40,960 --> 00:45:44,480
Speaker 1: to have happened at your baptist That's pretty funny. You

803
00:45:44,520 --> 00:45:47,120
Speaker 1: have to you have to hand it. There is something,

804
00:45:47,400 --> 00:45:50,960
Speaker 1: there is something about a near death experience as a

805
00:45:51,120 --> 00:45:54,800
Speaker 1: baby that will just like set you on the most

806
00:45:54,880 --> 00:45:58,239
Speaker 1: bizarre life paths. And unfortunately, I am thinking about an

807
00:45:58,440 --> 00:46:03,080
Speaker 1: Elvis Presley and how his twin died and now they're like,

808
00:46:03,160 --> 00:46:05,160
Speaker 1: you have to live the life of two men. And

809
00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:08,440
Speaker 1: then like you just if something happened, if you almost

810
00:46:08,719 --> 00:46:11,000
Speaker 1: died as a baby, you're going to have a very

811
00:46:11,040 --> 00:46:13,880
Speaker 1: fucked up life due to the baggage that you're like

812
00:46:14,080 --> 00:46:19,160
Speaker 1: constantly reminded of. Yeah, that's why we should hollow out

813
00:46:19,200 --> 00:46:20,680
Speaker 1: the center of the country and make it a giant

814
00:46:20,719 --> 00:46:22,640
Speaker 1: child prison. But that's a story for another day. So

815
00:46:22,719 --> 00:46:27,600
Speaker 1: Jamie the Old Tidings, Helena and her mom both survived

816
00:46:27,600 --> 00:46:30,880
Speaker 1: the epidemic. You may notice that I have not mentioned

817
00:46:30,880 --> 00:46:33,600
Speaker 1: her father yet. This is because he was a captain

818
00:46:33,640 --> 00:46:37,600
Speaker 1: with Russia's horse artillery with some fancy royal unit, and

819
00:46:37,640 --> 00:46:40,040
Speaker 1: he was generally not at home. He first meets his

820
00:46:40,120 --> 00:46:43,000
Speaker 1: daughter when she's six months old, um, and this is

821
00:46:43,040 --> 00:46:44,799
Speaker 1: going to be like the pattern for her life. He

822
00:46:44,880 --> 00:46:50,600
Speaker 1: is away all the time. Um. Now for US horse

823
00:46:50,719 --> 00:46:53,960
Speaker 1: artillery is like an elite military unit in this period,

824
00:46:54,040 --> 00:46:55,880
Speaker 1: like you're you're dragging like it allows you to like

825
00:46:55,960 --> 00:46:58,959
Speaker 1: drag cannons around and move them a position quickly. And

826
00:46:59,640 --> 00:47:02,000
Speaker 1: Peter on Haunt is kind of like an elite military

827
00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:04,680
Speaker 1: commander for Zar Nicholas the First, he wins awards for

828
00:47:04,760 --> 00:47:07,719
Speaker 1: helping to suppress a bunch of different uprisings. He's a

829
00:47:07,719 --> 00:47:11,040
Speaker 1: shock trooper for the empire. UM. And Nicholas the First,

830
00:47:11,040 --> 00:47:12,960
Speaker 1: who is like the Czar at the time, is one

831
00:47:13,000 --> 00:47:15,680
Speaker 1: of the most brutal and effective tsars in the history

832
00:47:15,719 --> 00:47:19,840
Speaker 1: of the Russian Empire. So while Peter's daughter is struggling

833
00:47:19,880 --> 00:47:22,880
Speaker 1: with her seventeen year old mom to survive cholera, he

834
00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:25,400
Speaker 1: is helping to crack down on an uprising in Poland,

835
00:47:25,400 --> 00:47:29,160
Speaker 1: and they kill thousands of people like stopping this uprising.

836
00:47:29,200 --> 00:47:33,000
Speaker 1: It is nat blood running through the streets. Ship Now

837
00:47:33,160 --> 00:47:35,600
Speaker 1: the primary impact that all this has on young Helena's

838
00:47:35,640 --> 00:47:38,759
Speaker 1: life is that they move constantly. Um. Also her dad

839
00:47:38,840 --> 00:47:42,040
Speaker 1: is thirty four and her mom is seventeen, which is

840
00:47:42,280 --> 00:47:48,160
Speaker 1: not cool. Uh, Elvis parallel not at all uncommon for

841
00:47:48,320 --> 00:47:50,440
Speaker 1: the aristocracy. At the time, this would have been kind

842
00:47:50,480 --> 00:47:52,719
Speaker 1: of cheered, I think for like normal people, but for

843
00:47:52,760 --> 00:47:56,279
Speaker 1: aristocrats not uncommon. Were they were they vaguely related? Do

844
00:47:56,360 --> 00:48:01,319
Speaker 1: we know? I mean probably right, but I don't don't specifically. Now. Yeah,

845
00:48:02,160 --> 00:48:05,319
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna we could get into their genealogy. I'm

846
00:48:05,320 --> 00:48:06,839
Speaker 1: sure a lot more if we wanted to, But who's

847
00:48:06,880 --> 00:48:10,239
Speaker 1: got that kind of time. So the primary impact again,

848
00:48:10,280 --> 00:48:12,799
Speaker 1: they move constantly, and they're generally because he's like a

849
00:48:12,840 --> 00:48:15,799
Speaker 1: military officer whose job is to help put down rebellions.

850
00:48:16,040 --> 00:48:18,640
Speaker 1: They're not saying in the good cities in Russia right

851
00:48:18,680 --> 00:48:21,680
Speaker 1: there in backwaters. You know, they're far from famous all

852
00:48:21,920 --> 00:48:25,359
Speaker 1: art like from the art and cultural scene in Russia. Um.

853
00:48:25,400 --> 00:48:28,399
Speaker 1: And this is a problem for Helena's mother, who's again

854
00:48:28,440 --> 00:48:32,719
Speaker 1: also Helena, because she becomes a celebrated novelist. Um, she's

855
00:48:32,719 --> 00:48:35,560
Speaker 1: a really interesting lady. Actually again she's she marries her

856
00:48:35,640 --> 00:48:38,600
Speaker 1: husband when he's like she's a child. Um. But she

857
00:48:38,800 --> 00:48:41,280
Speaker 1: as a young adult, she starts writing novels that become

858
00:48:41,320 --> 00:48:44,640
Speaker 1: actually very popular in Russia, and they're all about women

859
00:48:44,719 --> 00:48:48,520
Speaker 1: who are in unhappy marriages to brutes. Um, so like

860
00:48:48,640 --> 00:48:50,680
Speaker 1: a part of her history that I was like, this

861
00:48:50,800 --> 00:48:56,480
Speaker 1: is very cool, Like her mom is a really interesting person. Um.

862
00:48:56,520 --> 00:48:58,440
Speaker 1: I want to quote a passage from one of her books,

863
00:48:58,520 --> 00:49:01,920
Speaker 1: titled The World's Judgment, which I found exerted and exerted

864
00:49:02,000 --> 00:49:05,920
Speaker 1: in a Gary Lachman's biography of Madame Blovotsky. The fine,

865
00:49:06,040 --> 00:49:08,279
Speaker 1: sharp and fast mind of my husband, as a rule,

866
00:49:08,320 --> 00:49:11,680
Speaker 1: accompanied by a cutting irony, smashed every day one of

867
00:49:11,719 --> 00:49:15,480
Speaker 1: my brightest, most innocent and pure aspirations and feelings. All

868
00:49:15,520 --> 00:49:17,719
Speaker 1: that was sacred to my heart was either laughed at

869
00:49:17,840 --> 00:49:20,160
Speaker 1: or was shown to me in the pitiless and cynical

870
00:49:20,239 --> 00:49:26,840
Speaker 1: light of his cold and cruel reasoning. Oh so, I

871
00:49:26,840 --> 00:49:30,440
Speaker 1: think you can grasp a lot about their relationship from

872
00:49:30,480 --> 00:49:34,160
Speaker 1: that passage. I love, I mean as I just always

873
00:49:34,160 --> 00:49:36,959
Speaker 1: I don't know. My my favorite areas of history are

874
00:49:37,480 --> 00:49:41,200
Speaker 1: women with no rights finding the way to to subtweet

875
00:49:41,600 --> 00:49:46,040
Speaker 1: their oppressors into fucking oblivion. Like that is so fun,

876
00:49:46,640 --> 00:49:52,319
Speaker 1: And not to draw another minions parallel. Robert but the

877
00:49:52,440 --> 00:49:56,040
Speaker 1: man who is at least the co creator. One could

878
00:49:56,080 --> 00:49:58,680
Speaker 1: argue the creator of the Minions, co director of the

879
00:49:58,680 --> 00:50:03,480
Speaker 1: Despicable Me franchise, Pierre Coffin, raised by a very famous

880
00:50:03,760 --> 00:50:07,720
Speaker 1: Indonesian feminist who wrote novels when she was still working

881
00:50:07,719 --> 00:50:11,480
Speaker 1: as a flight attendant that became very famous, very influential.

882
00:50:11,760 --> 00:50:14,400
Speaker 1: She marries a French guy. They have a uh, you know,

883
00:50:14,840 --> 00:50:17,360
Speaker 1: a little Pierre Coffin, and what does he do to

884
00:50:17,480 --> 00:50:24,080
Speaker 1: thank her creates the minions? Huh, an entire bunch of

885
00:50:24,320 --> 00:50:28,160
Speaker 1: from two generations of a family. Or you can interpret

886
00:50:28,200 --> 00:50:31,359
Speaker 1: it as all the minions are are men. They're all

887
00:50:31,400 --> 00:50:34,600
Speaker 1: men doing evil things, and you're like, where where is

888
00:50:34,600 --> 00:50:37,320
Speaker 1: he going with this? Does he realize it's all connected

889
00:50:37,360 --> 00:50:39,520
Speaker 1: in the way that I I do when I go

890
00:50:39,560 --> 00:50:43,360
Speaker 1: on my long walks. You know, we don't know, we

891
00:50:43,360 --> 00:50:47,239
Speaker 1: don't know. So Jamie, that's uh, that's that's pretty. And

892
00:50:47,400 --> 00:50:50,080
Speaker 1: I think we can assume from that passage also sex

893
00:50:50,120 --> 00:50:54,880
Speaker 1: probably wasn't great. Uh no, probably not very good. Probably

894
00:50:55,120 --> 00:50:58,880
Speaker 1: probably I'm gonna guess Peter worse at sex than say

895
00:51:00,280 --> 00:51:05,000
Speaker 1: hears him a foot a foot long subway sandwich, one

896
00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:10,960
Speaker 1: of the ones on the the the herbs and spices bread. Well,

897
00:51:11,080 --> 00:51:13,279
Speaker 1: that's the best bread to fuck. If you're gonna fuck

898
00:51:13,360 --> 00:51:15,320
Speaker 1: some bread, you want to be sucking that herbs and spices.

899
00:51:15,400 --> 00:51:17,360
Speaker 1: You know, that's the best bread. But I feel like

900
00:51:17,400 --> 00:51:21,520
Speaker 1: it might have a doctor Brauner's kind of effect on. Yeah,

901
00:51:21,680 --> 00:51:23,840
Speaker 1: it's it's gonna be a little peppery. That's why you

902
00:51:23,920 --> 00:51:27,160
Speaker 1: have him at extra mayo. You really need to wash

903
00:51:27,360 --> 00:51:30,480
Speaker 1: right away? Yeah, you want to and wash with mayo? Right,

904
00:51:30,640 --> 00:51:32,880
Speaker 1: It's it's like washing your eyes out with milk if

905
00:51:32,920 --> 00:51:35,160
Speaker 1: you get don't do that. If you get tear gast,

906
00:51:35,200 --> 00:51:37,880
Speaker 1: I'm sorry. I don't even want to spread that. Um

907
00:51:38,120 --> 00:51:42,399
Speaker 1: funny though, right. So anyway, Helena, the mom was never

908
00:51:42,480 --> 00:51:44,560
Speaker 1: in because again they're both named Polina, was never in

909
00:51:44,640 --> 00:51:48,000
Speaker 1: good health. Uh so she doesn't ever fully get better

910
00:51:48,160 --> 00:51:51,440
Speaker 1: from getting horribly sick, and they move constantly, which is

911
00:51:51,480 --> 00:51:53,919
Speaker 1: bad for her health. They live in army housing, which

912
00:51:53,960 --> 00:51:57,560
Speaker 1: isn't good either, although she and her baby still have

913
00:51:57,680 --> 00:52:00,480
Speaker 1: like again, they're rich. They have a small army servants

914
00:52:00,520 --> 00:52:03,560
Speaker 1: at their back and call. So it's it's like hard

915
00:52:04,000 --> 00:52:07,160
Speaker 1: but not hard compared to how most people in Russia

916
00:52:07,160 --> 00:52:10,520
Speaker 1: would be living at the time. Um. When she was

917
00:52:10,600 --> 00:52:14,640
Speaker 1: too when Helena the Baby are Helena was to her mom. Also,

918
00:52:14,719 --> 00:52:18,160
Speaker 1: Helena has another baby named Sasha who dies immediately, which

919
00:52:18,200 --> 00:52:20,520
Speaker 1: was tradition for roughly half of babies at the time.

920
00:52:20,840 --> 00:52:24,600
Speaker 1: And you know who else kills babies roughly half the time?

921
00:52:25,680 --> 00:52:29,279
Speaker 1: Is it the people who sponsor this show on their

922
00:52:29,320 --> 00:52:33,520
Speaker 1: special child hunting island off the coast of Indonesia. Um,

923
00:52:33,560 --> 00:52:37,480
Speaker 1: that's been leaving a chicken with its throat slid on

924
00:52:37,560 --> 00:52:41,920
Speaker 1: my front porch every week for six years. I can't

925
00:52:41,920 --> 00:52:45,200
Speaker 1: pay them to stop. That's right, Jamie. You know why

926
00:52:45,239 --> 00:52:47,200
Speaker 1: they're doing that, So you keep your mouth shut about

927
00:52:47,200 --> 00:52:52,160
Speaker 1: the child hunting island off the coast of Indonesia. You're right, anah,

928
00:52:52,239 --> 00:53:01,160
Speaker 1: And and here we are. It's never gonna end. Uh.

929
00:53:01,200 --> 00:53:05,400
Speaker 1: We're back after making Sophie mark a bunch of places

930
00:53:05,400 --> 00:53:09,320
Speaker 1: in the episode to bleep out the name of Cool.

931
00:53:11,760 --> 00:53:15,560
Speaker 1: So like how you keep calling her Helena the baby, Um,

932
00:53:15,760 --> 00:53:20,520
Speaker 1: it does make her sound like a TikTok rapper. Deathmakers

933
00:53:20,560 --> 00:53:23,920
Speaker 1: sound like a TikTok She would have Oh my god,

934
00:53:24,160 --> 00:53:26,200
Speaker 1: I have to say, of all of the bastards we've

935
00:53:26,200 --> 00:53:28,759
Speaker 1: talked about on this show, easily would have had the

936
00:53:28,800 --> 00:53:34,640
Speaker 1: best TikTok. I do see what you're saying. Unfortunately, we'll

937
00:53:34,680 --> 00:53:36,319
Speaker 1: get to that she would have done. I mean, her

938
00:53:36,440 --> 00:53:40,720
Speaker 1: legacy lives on on TikTok unfortunately. But now Saddam Hussein,

939
00:53:41,120 --> 00:53:46,600
Speaker 1: that's a Twitter head. You get Saddam on Twitter. Ain't

940
00:53:46,600 --> 00:53:50,719
Speaker 1: nothing else happening on Twitter. Oh man, that would have

941
00:53:50,760 --> 00:53:54,759
Speaker 1: been a good time he would be making. He would

942
00:53:54,840 --> 00:53:59,120
Speaker 1: be using the threat emoji for oh my god. It

943
00:53:59,120 --> 00:54:02,880
Speaker 1: would have been a bible. So after this, the family

944
00:54:02,880 --> 00:54:05,800
Speaker 1: moved briefly to St. Petersburg. Right, they get like stationed

945
00:54:05,800 --> 00:54:08,400
Speaker 1: there for a year or two, which thrills Mom Helena

946
00:54:08,440 --> 00:54:11,040
Speaker 1: because St. Petersburg is like the cultural center of Russia.

947
00:54:11,480 --> 00:54:14,160
Speaker 1: She's this is when her her literary career starting to

948
00:54:14,200 --> 00:54:16,319
Speaker 1: take off, and she's able to like go to art

949
00:54:16,360 --> 00:54:20,640
Speaker 1: galleries and fancy parties and and sit at salons with

950
00:54:20,680 --> 00:54:23,840
Speaker 1: other adults who aren't like drunken soldiers. This is like

951
00:54:23,880 --> 00:54:26,080
Speaker 1: her dream life. She finally gets to live for like

952
00:54:26,360 --> 00:54:28,640
Speaker 1: the only two years or a year or whatever that

953
00:54:28,680 --> 00:54:32,200
Speaker 1: she will actually get to be anything close to happy. Um.

954
00:54:32,239 --> 00:54:34,520
Speaker 1: When baby Helena is six, Peter tells them that they're

955
00:54:34,520 --> 00:54:36,080
Speaker 1: going to have to move again to the middle of

956
00:54:36,080 --> 00:54:41,399
Speaker 1: nowhere to brutalize people. And this time mom Helena says no. Um.

957
00:54:41,480 --> 00:54:44,080
Speaker 1: She refuses to move with her husband and like go

958
00:54:44,239 --> 00:54:48,840
Speaker 1: with the army basically. Um. So she stays in St. Petersburg, awhile,

959
00:54:49,000 --> 00:54:51,399
Speaker 1: and then her father comes to her and asks if

960
00:54:51,400 --> 00:54:55,040
Speaker 1: she and her daughter want to go on an adventure. Um. Now,

961
00:54:55,280 --> 00:54:58,640
Speaker 1: Helena's maternal grandfather father had been made a trustee for

962
00:54:58,680 --> 00:55:02,240
Speaker 1: the Kalmuk, which was wandering tribe of horse riding warriors

963
00:55:02,239 --> 00:55:05,520
Speaker 1: who like part of the area that they lived and

964
00:55:05,640 --> 00:55:07,560
Speaker 1: they had like a moving city and stuff that they

965
00:55:07,560 --> 00:55:09,200
Speaker 1: took with him, and like part of the area that

966
00:55:09,280 --> 00:55:13,560
Speaker 1: they they live in is in is in Russia. Um.

967
00:55:13,680 --> 00:55:15,759
Speaker 1: I think they go to a number of places, but

968
00:55:15,840 --> 00:55:18,000
Speaker 1: like they live like within kind of the bounds of

969
00:55:18,040 --> 00:55:21,839
Speaker 1: the Russian Empire because it's big and there's different kind

970
00:55:21,880 --> 00:55:24,200
Speaker 1: of rules for tribal peoples. And one of the things

971
00:55:24,239 --> 00:55:26,680
Speaker 1: is you've got like this guy who's appointed by the

972
00:55:26,719 --> 00:55:29,600
Speaker 1: government to be the intermediary of the tribe and the

973
00:55:29,640 --> 00:55:33,320
Speaker 1: Russian government. And Helena's maternal grandmother gets that job for

974
00:55:33,440 --> 00:55:36,520
Speaker 1: this this group of like horse riding warrior nomads who

975
00:55:36,520 --> 00:55:40,800
Speaker 1: are also Buddhist. Right. So again Russia is very fucking

976
00:55:40,840 --> 00:55:46,279
Speaker 1: big um. So he takes his daughter and his granddaughter

977
00:55:46,280 --> 00:55:48,520
Speaker 1: on a journey to a city called Ostra Khan in

978
00:55:48,560 --> 00:55:51,719
Speaker 1: the very distant steps, where the Kalmuk are like camping out,

979
00:55:52,040 --> 00:55:55,359
Speaker 1: and young Helena, as like seven something eight years old,

980
00:55:55,880 --> 00:55:58,680
Speaker 1: gets to spend time in direct contact with Buddhists. This

981
00:55:58,760 --> 00:56:02,120
Speaker 1: is her first experience with Eastern religion, and this legitimately happens.

982
00:56:02,440 --> 00:56:06,160
Speaker 1: Gary Lachman writes quote here, the young Helena Blovotsky was

983
00:56:06,239 --> 00:56:09,319
Speaker 1: exposed to the Mongolian lemaic system and had her first

984
00:56:09,360 --> 00:56:12,680
Speaker 1: taste of Tibetan Buddhism. Her mother, too, was inspired by

985
00:56:12,680 --> 00:56:15,080
Speaker 1: the meeting and later wrote a novel about Calmuc life,

986
00:56:15,080 --> 00:56:17,960
Speaker 1: which was translated into French. The prince spent his days

987
00:56:17,960 --> 00:56:20,320
Speaker 1: in prayer in a Buddhist temple he had built himself.

988
00:56:20,640 --> 00:56:23,600
Speaker 1: The colors, the images, the incense, the strange words murmured

989
00:56:23,640 --> 00:56:26,240
Speaker 1: in an unfamiliar tongue must have made a deep impression

990
00:56:26,280 --> 00:56:27,680
Speaker 1: on the six year old. I guess she was six,

991
00:56:27,760 --> 00:56:31,000
Speaker 1: who had already led a remarkably adventurous life. Bulovotsky would

992
00:56:31,080 --> 00:56:33,640
Speaker 1: later say that her interest in Tibet began at that time.

993
00:56:35,960 --> 00:56:39,800
Speaker 1: So and again Tibet is this kind of mythical place.

994
00:56:40,160 --> 00:56:42,399
Speaker 1: It is a real place, but like you can't go

995
00:56:42,480 --> 00:56:45,440
Speaker 1: to Tibet if you're like a Westerner. It's it's pretty,

996
00:56:45,640 --> 00:56:49,160
Speaker 1: it's it's closed. Um. But you know this guy, Tibet's

997
00:56:49,239 --> 00:56:51,240
Speaker 1: you know, obviously like kind of one of the centers

998
00:56:51,239 --> 00:56:54,600
Speaker 1: of Buddhism. And so this like horse Nomad prince is

999
00:56:54,640 --> 00:56:56,799
Speaker 1: like talking to this little girl about Tibet and she

1000
00:56:57,239 --> 00:56:59,959
Speaker 1: kind of falls in love with with, you know, East

1001
00:57:00,040 --> 00:57:05,959
Speaker 1: during religion and mysticism. Um. And after this period of time,

1002
00:57:06,000 --> 00:57:08,560
Speaker 1: which legitimately sounds like a pretty rat experience to have

1003
00:57:08,600 --> 00:57:11,319
Speaker 1: as a six year old, the family all wind up

1004
00:57:11,360 --> 00:57:15,200
Speaker 1: back together with Peter in Odessa Um, mainly because Helena

1005
00:57:15,280 --> 00:57:18,360
Speaker 1: the mom is really sick again and Odessa has these

1006
00:57:18,400 --> 00:57:22,080
Speaker 1: mineral baths that are thought to be good for her health. Yeah.

1007
00:57:22,400 --> 00:57:26,560
Speaker 1: Like I love old school rich people. It's like you

1008
00:57:26,680 --> 00:57:29,960
Speaker 1: just just go sit in some salt water. You'll be fine,

1009
00:57:30,080 --> 00:57:33,000
Speaker 1: It'll be good. You just do rich people ship people.

1010
00:57:33,480 --> 00:57:35,760
Speaker 1: It's back then, so they just go sit in baths

1011
00:57:35,760 --> 00:57:38,160
Speaker 1: when they could take simple prescription medicine any of us

1012
00:57:38,160 --> 00:57:41,600
Speaker 1: could get from a pharmacy today, like go to walbrafool, dumbasses,

1013
00:57:42,040 --> 00:57:45,959
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, did you not consider going to CVS? Yeah,

1014
00:57:46,040 --> 00:57:50,360
Speaker 1: motherfucker's loser. Your death's on you. I don't even care

1015
00:57:50,600 --> 00:57:53,680
Speaker 1: like it takes. We're about to We're about to get canceled.

1016
00:57:54,120 --> 00:57:58,920
Speaker 1: Yeah we are. So she probably had um what's the thing?

1017
00:57:59,080 --> 00:58:05,120
Speaker 1: Uh uh, it's like consumption. UM. I think is generally

1018
00:58:05,160 --> 00:58:06,920
Speaker 1: like what people assumed she had. Right, They just kind

1019
00:58:06,920 --> 00:58:08,800
Speaker 1: of described her as sickly. So she had some sort

1020
00:58:08,840 --> 00:58:12,680
Speaker 1: of like chronic lung illness that eventually kills her. Um

1021
00:58:12,720 --> 00:58:14,440
Speaker 1: that again, you could probably knock out in like ten

1022
00:58:14,480 --> 00:58:19,640
Speaker 1: minutes today. Anyway, she dies in eighteen forty two. Her baby, Helena,

1023
00:58:20,080 --> 00:58:23,600
Speaker 1: now the only Helena, was eleven at the time. Um.

1024
00:58:23,600 --> 00:58:28,440
Speaker 1: Her mother was twenty eight years old when she died. Wow. Yeah,

1025
00:58:28,560 --> 00:58:31,760
Speaker 1: so that's has her kid at seventeen. She's got her novel,

1026
00:58:32,800 --> 00:58:38,600
Speaker 1: her novels done before. That's impressive. Ship, that's impressive ship. Um.

1027
00:58:38,680 --> 00:58:41,120
Speaker 1: And probably what killed her ultimately was the fact that

1028
00:58:41,120 --> 00:58:44,560
Speaker 1: her doctors kept taking all of her blood um, because again,

1029
00:58:45,000 --> 00:58:49,120
Speaker 1: medicines not great. In eighteen forty two, she dies in

1030
00:58:49,160 --> 00:58:51,360
Speaker 1: her mother's arms, which is one of the saddest ways

1031
00:58:51,360 --> 00:58:55,760
Speaker 1: of year old can die. Um, yeah, yeah, that's not

1032
00:58:55,760 --> 00:59:02,080
Speaker 1: not great. Her mother, who's probably like forty eight. Um,

1033
00:59:02,080 --> 00:59:06,400
Speaker 1: so Helena was presumably like, you know, the daughter, Helena

1034
00:59:06,480 --> 00:59:10,560
Speaker 1: was presumably pretty devast. Life goes on, though, and soon

1035
00:59:10,640 --> 00:59:12,880
Speaker 1: she and her siblings she has two siblings now are

1036
00:59:12,920 --> 00:59:15,960
Speaker 1: all sent to live with her grandparents because army guy, like,

1037
00:59:16,080 --> 00:59:17,640
Speaker 1: Army Dad's not gonna take care of him. Like, he's

1038
00:59:17,640 --> 00:59:19,560
Speaker 1: not going to be a single Army Dad Like, no,

1039
00:59:19,840 --> 00:59:25,720
Speaker 1: they're gonna go grew again, desiably in fairness, these are

1040
00:59:25,720 --> 00:59:28,480
Speaker 1: all rich people. So they're staying with their grandparents at

1041
00:59:28,480 --> 00:59:31,200
Speaker 1: like basically a castle, you know, like they're they're living

1042
00:59:31,240 --> 00:59:35,080
Speaker 1: in like a mansion type palace deal. Uh, you know,

1043
00:59:35,200 --> 00:59:38,600
Speaker 1: in in in kind of like the eastern e well

1044
00:59:38,600 --> 00:59:43,680
Speaker 1: not east for Russia, but East for Europe, part of Russia. Um.

1045
00:59:43,720 --> 00:59:47,080
Speaker 1: Gary Lachman writes quote. She was, according to her sister Vera,

1046
00:59:47,160 --> 00:59:50,040
Speaker 1: the strangest girl one has ever seen, with a distinct

1047
00:59:50,200 --> 00:59:54,240
Speaker 1: dual nature. One side of her was mischievous, combative, and obstinate,

1048
00:59:54,280 --> 00:59:58,680
Speaker 1: while another was mystical and metaphysically inclined, characteristics that those

1049
00:59:58,720 --> 01:00:01,480
Speaker 1: who got to know the mature Helena Blovotsky would agree on.

1050
01:00:01,840 --> 01:00:04,200
Speaker 1: Her aunt Nadia, just a few years older than her,

1051
01:00:04,440 --> 01:00:06,720
Speaker 1: tells us that from an early age she was sympathetic

1052
01:00:06,760 --> 01:00:08,760
Speaker 1: to the lower classes and preferred to play with the

1053
01:00:08,800 --> 01:00:11,400
Speaker 1: servants children rather than those of her own class, and

1054
01:00:11,440 --> 01:00:14,840
Speaker 1: often made friends with ragged street boys. This solidarity with

1055
01:00:14,880 --> 01:00:17,600
Speaker 1: her social inferiors wasn't uniform, and she once had to

1056
01:00:17,600 --> 01:00:21,680
Speaker 1: apologize to an elderly servant whom she had slapped. Again,

1057
01:00:22,120 --> 01:00:25,520
Speaker 1: Lachman likes and defends her. So it's very funny that

1058
01:00:25,560 --> 01:00:27,959
Speaker 1: he's like, she loved the poor. She didn't slap that guy,

1059
01:00:28,280 --> 01:00:31,640
Speaker 1: she loved the poor. Well. I also like how it's

1060
01:00:31,680 --> 01:00:35,840
Speaker 1: included in texting. Well, she apologized, so you know she

1061
01:00:35,960 --> 01:00:40,400
Speaker 1: must have just been having a bad day. Jesus Christ. Yeah,

1062
01:00:40,440 --> 01:00:42,040
Speaker 1: I mean she was made to it. He does say

1063
01:00:42,040 --> 01:00:45,960
Speaker 1: she had to apologize, right, so we're not okay, she

1064
01:00:46,000 --> 01:00:50,920
Speaker 1: didn't mean just that. I mean again, this is why

1065
01:00:50,960 --> 01:00:53,720
Speaker 1: the servants are a bad thing to have, because any

1066
01:00:53,760 --> 01:00:55,480
Speaker 1: kid who has a chance to slap an adult and

1067
01:00:55,480 --> 01:00:57,640
Speaker 1: get away with it's going to try. You know, that's

1068
01:00:57,640 --> 01:01:00,640
Speaker 1: just being a child. I mean that is true. Yeah,

1069
01:01:00,960 --> 01:01:05,960
Speaker 1: so uh yeah, um. Again, Lachman claims a lot that

1070
01:01:06,000 --> 01:01:08,880
Speaker 1: she like deeply loves the poor and the lower class.

1071
01:01:09,120 --> 01:01:12,080
Speaker 1: I I don't see any actual documented evidence of that

1072
01:01:12,600 --> 01:01:14,680
Speaker 1: at all. And the fact that even he is like, yeah,

1073
01:01:14,680 --> 01:01:18,080
Speaker 1: she would slap around the servants makes me I wonder

1074
01:01:18,200 --> 01:01:20,640
Speaker 1: maybe she wasn't playing with the servant kids just because

1075
01:01:20,680 --> 01:01:22,680
Speaker 1: they had to do what she told them, because she's

1076
01:01:22,720 --> 01:01:25,919
Speaker 1: the noble girl. I don't know. I do appreciate that

1077
01:01:26,040 --> 01:01:29,840
Speaker 1: he that he left it in any ways, even though

1078
01:01:29,880 --> 01:01:33,400
Speaker 1: it directly undermines his point. I'm like, Okay, not the

1079
01:01:33,440 --> 01:01:36,360
Speaker 1: worst journalism, but I mean, the logical thing to do

1080
01:01:36,400 --> 01:01:39,360
Speaker 1: would be to just simply omit that. But yeah, i mean,

1081
01:01:39,560 --> 01:01:43,240
Speaker 1: like all of these by people who write about Blovotsky,

1082
01:01:43,440 --> 01:01:46,080
Speaker 1: he's like enthralled by her, but there's a there's so

1083
01:01:46,160 --> 01:01:48,520
Speaker 1: much shady ship. She don't like. He can't keep it out.

1084
01:01:48,800 --> 01:01:51,280
Speaker 1: So there's these moments where you can tell like he

1085
01:01:51,400 --> 01:01:54,080
Speaker 1: just he has to include something negative about her even

1086
01:01:54,080 --> 01:01:58,280
Speaker 1: though it hurts him. Um. Anyway, it's very funny all

1087
01:01:58,320 --> 01:02:01,120
Speaker 1: of these books about Blovotsky or a little like that. Um,

1088
01:02:01,360 --> 01:02:03,360
Speaker 1: So there is some ample evidence so that she was

1089
01:02:03,440 --> 01:02:05,680
Speaker 1: kind of a pretty what I would call a fun kid.

1090
01:02:06,680 --> 01:02:08,720
Speaker 1: The most detailed stories about her, it makes her sound

1091
01:02:08,760 --> 01:02:13,000
Speaker 1: like the proto Wednesday Adams right like she she's she's

1092
01:02:13,200 --> 01:02:16,920
Speaker 1: constantly hearing spirits and ghosts the family manner like that

1093
01:02:16,960 --> 01:02:19,560
Speaker 1: she grows up on. There's the subterranean basement system that

1094
01:02:19,600 --> 01:02:22,560
Speaker 1: she spends her time exploring. She's often found down there

1095
01:02:22,560 --> 01:02:26,400
Speaker 1: by man servants, like sleepwalking or talking to invisible companions,

1096
01:02:26,400 --> 01:02:32,120
Speaker 1: so like servants will find her wandering ghosts. Yeah, that's dope.

1097
01:02:32,320 --> 01:02:38,520
Speaker 1: That's a cool kid, I like. Um. She frequently played

1098
01:02:38,560 --> 01:02:40,600
Speaker 1: with beings no one else could see, who she called

1099
01:02:40,640 --> 01:02:43,840
Speaker 1: the hunchbacks, and sometimes she would threaten other kids to

1100
01:02:43,920 --> 01:02:45,919
Speaker 1: like sick her invisible friends on them if they didn't

1101
01:02:45,920 --> 01:02:49,280
Speaker 1: do what she said. Um, and I bet they totally believed.

1102
01:02:49,360 --> 01:02:53,200
Speaker 1: Ah man, witchy kids are so funny. It does sound

1103
01:02:53,200 --> 01:02:57,800
Speaker 1: pretty cool. Yeah, that's that's that's a great use of

1104
01:02:58,600 --> 01:03:02,959
Speaker 1: child ghost power. That sucking rocks absolutely, Her sister later

1105
01:03:02,960 --> 01:03:05,600
Speaker 1: recalled quote. Helena used to dream aloud and tell us

1106
01:03:05,600 --> 01:03:08,640
Speaker 1: of her visions, evidently clear, vivid, and as palpable as life.

1107
01:03:08,680 --> 01:03:11,080
Speaker 1: To her, it was her delight to gather around herself

1108
01:03:11,120 --> 01:03:13,680
Speaker 1: a party of us younger children at twilight and after

1109
01:03:13,720 --> 01:03:16,000
Speaker 1: taking us into the large dark museum to hold us

1110
01:03:16,040 --> 01:03:19,280
Speaker 1: there spell bound with her weird stories. Then she narrated

1111
01:03:19,320 --> 01:03:22,120
Speaker 1: to us the most inconceivable tales about herself, the most

1112
01:03:22,200 --> 01:03:24,920
Speaker 1: unheard of adventures of which she was the heroine every night,

1113
01:03:24,960 --> 01:03:28,120
Speaker 1: as she explained, so she was like telling them lies

1114
01:03:28,160 --> 01:03:29,800
Speaker 1: about going on adventures with her. I was in the

1115
01:03:30,080 --> 01:03:32,160
Speaker 1: I got taken by like a spirit to this place

1116
01:03:32,200 --> 01:03:33,600
Speaker 1: and like I had to do this and you know,

1117
01:03:33,640 --> 01:03:37,240
Speaker 1: fought this other spirit or whatever. Like she's you know what,

1118
01:03:37,320 --> 01:03:40,280
Speaker 1: you know what Helena Blovotsky really would have thrived with

1119
01:03:41,800 --> 01:03:43,680
Speaker 1: is some friends to play D and D with when

1120
01:03:43,680 --> 01:03:46,200
Speaker 1: she was like eleven. It does it just yeah, it's

1121
01:03:46,200 --> 01:03:49,200
Speaker 1: it's a big imagination kid thing. And it just sounds

1122
01:03:49,240 --> 01:03:53,520
Speaker 1: like she didn't have anyone matching that level of imagination

1123
01:03:53,640 --> 01:03:56,200
Speaker 1: around her, which just means that you'll be we finally

1124
01:03:56,280 --> 01:03:58,760
Speaker 1: gets it. It's going to be with adults. But like, also,

1125
01:03:58,800 --> 01:04:00,680
Speaker 1: this is a period in which you're into that there's

1126
01:04:00,680 --> 01:04:03,720
Speaker 1: not like a fictional outlet like today. A lot of

1127
01:04:03,720 --> 01:04:05,720
Speaker 1: the bad stuff maybe wouldn't have happened. Maybe she would

1128
01:04:05,760 --> 01:04:08,280
Speaker 1: have gotten really into fan fiction and eventually started writing

1129
01:04:08,280 --> 01:04:11,200
Speaker 1: around ship um and stuff like well, I think it's

1130
01:04:11,240 --> 01:04:14,800
Speaker 1: interesting because her mom was a novelist. So you think

1131
01:04:14,800 --> 01:04:17,440
Speaker 1: that there would have been that like baseline of like

1132
01:04:17,520 --> 01:04:19,840
Speaker 1: game write some of the ship down. You know, there's

1133
01:04:19,880 --> 01:04:22,400
Speaker 1: bits of that happening here, but especially like it's this.

1134
01:04:22,560 --> 01:04:24,440
Speaker 1: I mean again, we're kind of like in the period

1135
01:04:24,480 --> 01:04:27,400
Speaker 1: where like Mary Shelley is going to invent the concept

1136
01:04:27,400 --> 01:04:29,720
Speaker 1: of science fiction. So there's not a lot of there's

1137
01:04:29,760 --> 01:04:32,200
Speaker 1: not a ton of role models in terms of like

1138
01:04:32,240 --> 01:04:35,400
Speaker 1: taking your weird dreams about ghosts and spirits and turning

1139
01:04:35,400 --> 01:04:41,560
Speaker 1: it into a mythology. Um, learning that Mary Shelley lost

1140
01:04:41,640 --> 01:04:46,200
Speaker 1: her virginity against her mother's own grave was really just

1141
01:04:46,400 --> 01:04:51,160
Speaker 1: like I think maybe the highlight of my well, well,

1142
01:04:51,240 --> 01:04:55,640
Speaker 1: well we'll do Mary Shelly in behind the Ladies who rocked. Um, yeah,

1143
01:04:55,800 --> 01:05:03,360
Speaker 1: behind behind the unimpeachable women. Uh god. So okay, so

1144
01:05:03,400 --> 01:05:07,720
Speaker 1: she's she's yeah, so she's making up stories about spirits

1145
01:05:07,720 --> 01:05:11,040
Speaker 1: and ghosts, hanging out in the catacombs scaring kids. Um,

1146
01:05:11,040 --> 01:05:13,720
Speaker 1: pretty dope. So while she's living with her grandparents and

1147
01:05:13,760 --> 01:05:16,040
Speaker 1: this isn't a town on the border of Russia and Kazakhstan.

1148
01:05:16,640 --> 01:05:19,120
Speaker 1: She she claims, Now we're getting into the things that

1149
01:05:19,200 --> 01:05:22,080
Speaker 1: I don't think happened. She claims during this period, she

1150
01:05:22,480 --> 01:05:27,240
Speaker 1: discovered her great grandfather's massive occult library. Um, now I

1151
01:05:27,280 --> 01:05:30,160
Speaker 1: want to read you how one reasonably credible account written

1152
01:05:30,200 --> 01:05:35,120
Speaker 1: for an unpronounceable Polish magazine by Thomas Stalwartsinski describes it quote.

1153
01:05:35,760 --> 01:05:38,320
Speaker 1: There she found hundreds of decaying books by the sixteenth

1154
01:05:38,320 --> 01:05:41,560
Speaker 1: and seventeenth century masters of alchemy and her medic philosophy,

1155
01:05:41,760 --> 01:05:47,000
Speaker 1: such as Paracelsus, Heinrich Cornelius Agrippa, and Heinrich Kunrath. Helena's

1156
01:05:47,000 --> 01:05:49,640
Speaker 1: great grandfather, a high ranked freemason who in the seventeen

1157
01:05:49,720 --> 01:05:53,240
Speaker 1: seventies was initiated into the Rosicrucian mysteries, selected the books

1158
01:05:53,240 --> 01:05:59,040
Speaker 1: for his meticulous kid. We're talking about that crucious we'll

1159
01:05:59,080 --> 01:06:01,960
Speaker 1: talk about it. Collected the books for his collection with

1160
01:06:02,000 --> 01:06:05,320
Speaker 1: meticulous care. Helena devoured them with passion, and it wasn't

1161
01:06:05,320 --> 01:06:07,320
Speaker 1: long and until she became an expert in the field

1162
01:06:07,320 --> 01:06:10,520
Speaker 1: of occultism. The only other person she could tell about

1163
01:06:10,520 --> 01:06:14,520
Speaker 1: her spiritual adventures was Prince Alexander Golitzen, a colorful character

1164
01:06:14,560 --> 01:06:17,880
Speaker 1: and a frequent guest at Helena's grandparents house. Glitzen was

1165
01:06:17,920 --> 01:06:20,840
Speaker 1: a freemason and a practicing maige who searched for ancient

1166
01:06:20,840 --> 01:06:24,200
Speaker 1: occult secrets had led him to travel to Greece, Iran, India, Egypt,

1167
01:06:24,360 --> 01:06:26,880
Speaker 1: and numerous other places. We don't know much about his

1168
01:06:26,920 --> 01:06:30,040
Speaker 1: relationship with Helena, but without doubt it is Glitzen who

1169
01:06:30,080 --> 01:06:33,080
Speaker 1: instilled the yearning for faraway travels in her. Helena wanted

1170
01:06:33,080 --> 01:06:36,480
Speaker 1: to seek out the unknown, the magical, the mysterious. Now

1171
01:06:37,080 --> 01:06:39,440
Speaker 1: there is a lot going on in those paragraphs. So

1172
01:06:39,760 --> 01:06:45,720
Speaker 1: that is as like a fifteen year old girl her

1173
01:06:45,720 --> 01:06:49,240
Speaker 1: best friend is a prince wizard um the wizard Prince Golitzon,

1174
01:06:49,560 --> 01:06:53,960
Speaker 1: which is pretty cool. That's again very cool, there is it.

1175
01:06:54,880 --> 01:06:57,360
Speaker 1: I know that Bolotsky goes in a wildly different direction,

1176
01:06:57,440 --> 01:07:00,040
Speaker 1: but it's like, I don't know, just like imagine it

1177
01:07:00,200 --> 01:07:04,680
Speaker 1: of kids creating going on to create, uh, controversial religions

1178
01:07:05,400 --> 01:07:08,400
Speaker 1: huge in this time because that was also how spiritualism started,

1179
01:07:08,480 --> 01:07:10,920
Speaker 1: was with like and there's two sisters playing a prank

1180
01:07:12,320 --> 01:07:16,240
Speaker 1: more like yeah, like, So Glitzen is a legitimately interesting guy.

1181
01:07:16,400 --> 01:07:19,120
Speaker 1: He was in the circle of a lot of major

1182
01:07:19,240 --> 01:07:23,040
Speaker 1: Masonic and spiritual proto gurus in in the day. One

1183
01:07:23,040 --> 01:07:25,600
Speaker 1: of his good friends was a Christian mystic named Carl

1184
01:07:25,640 --> 01:07:29,720
Speaker 1: von Eckerthhausen. Um who was like like one of the

1185
01:07:29,800 --> 01:07:33,560
Speaker 1: major dudes who inspired Alistair Crowley. Um. Again, Crowley is

1186
01:07:33,600 --> 01:07:36,280
Speaker 1: like a generation later basically, So that's the set that

1187
01:07:36,320 --> 01:07:38,479
Speaker 1: Helena is hanging out with as like a teenage girl.

1188
01:07:38,520 --> 01:07:42,200
Speaker 1: These weirdo occultists who are like a generation back from Crowley.

1189
01:07:42,440 --> 01:07:45,760
Speaker 1: Um now Glitzens circle of dudes are all just super

1190
01:07:45,800 --> 01:07:51,080
Speaker 1: obsessed with secret societies. Eckerchausen's wrote about a secret interior

1191
01:07:51,200 --> 01:07:53,880
Speaker 1: church and they were all very into the Rosa Crucians.

1192
01:07:53,880 --> 01:07:56,120
Speaker 1: Now you had a reaction to that. You probably you

1193
01:07:56,240 --> 01:07:58,600
Speaker 1: don't know who the Rosa Crucians are, right, I don't

1194
01:07:58,600 --> 01:08:02,520
Speaker 1: know who the Rosa Crucians, but most the first thing

1195
01:08:02,760 --> 01:08:05,840
Speaker 1: about them is that they didn't exist. Probably didn't exist.

1196
01:08:05,880 --> 01:08:08,360
Speaker 1: So when she claims your great grandfather was one, that's

1197
01:08:08,360 --> 01:08:11,680
Speaker 1: her myth making, right. But I'm gonnacote again from Stalazinski

1198
01:08:11,800 --> 01:08:15,680
Speaker 1: about the Rosicrucians. In sixteen twelve and the German city

1199
01:08:15,680 --> 01:08:18,120
Speaker 1: of Castle, an anonymous brochure was published. It was a

1200
01:08:18,160 --> 01:08:21,559
Speaker 1: manifesto of the Rosicrucian Order, an organization nobody had ever

1201
01:08:21,560 --> 01:08:24,880
Speaker 1: heard of before. The manifesto claimed that medieval occultist Christian

1202
01:08:24,960 --> 01:08:28,160
Speaker 1: Rosencroy had founded an order that gave its members access

1203
01:08:28,200 --> 01:08:30,760
Speaker 1: to the universal mystical truth about human nature and the

1204
01:08:30,800 --> 01:08:33,760
Speaker 1: ways of the world. Two years later, another manifesto was

1205
01:08:33,800 --> 01:08:38,080
Speaker 1: released called The Chemical Wedding of Christian Rosencroy. Rosencroy, it's

1206
01:08:38,200 --> 01:08:41,120
Speaker 1: cruts rousing, crutz. I don't know r O s e

1207
01:08:41,240 --> 01:08:43,760
Speaker 1: n k r e U t z, I don't know

1208
01:08:45,240 --> 01:08:48,160
Speaker 1: ROSENKROI yeah, Rose Lacroix. The hero of the story is

1209
01:08:48,200 --> 01:08:52,320
Speaker 1: presented as Hermes tris tri majistice, a god of Hellenic

1210
01:08:52,360 --> 01:08:58,600
Speaker 1: and Egyptian origins, and Hermes is the alleged author of

1211
01:08:58,640 --> 01:09:02,120
Speaker 1: the Emerald Tablet, which is like a European alchemical text

1212
01:09:02,320 --> 01:09:05,560
Speaker 1: um and definitely like a central mystic document of the

1213
01:09:05,600 --> 01:09:08,320
Speaker 1: Renaissance era um. And both of those books had been

1214
01:09:08,320 --> 01:09:11,240
Speaker 1: written by a guy named Johan Andrea, who was a writer,

1215
01:09:11,360 --> 01:09:15,360
Speaker 1: a mathematician, a theologists and a cabalist um. So the

1216
01:09:15,479 --> 01:09:18,599
Speaker 1: history of the Rosicrucian Order and its founder were like

1217
01:09:21,120 --> 01:09:24,519
Speaker 1: books written by this by by Johan Andre. This like

1218
01:09:24,640 --> 01:09:28,599
Speaker 1: mystic theologist and cobbalist who like invents this guy rosen Croy,

1219
01:09:28,680 --> 01:09:32,120
Speaker 1: who isn't real and a mysterious order. It's like, it's

1220
01:09:32,160 --> 01:09:35,479
Speaker 1: not it's it's a it's a it's I don't know

1221
01:09:35,479 --> 01:09:37,120
Speaker 1: if it's a prank because I don't know the degree

1222
01:09:37,160 --> 01:09:41,479
Speaker 1: to which this guy writes a fake manifesto that he

1223
01:09:41,640 --> 01:09:45,160
Speaker 1: that he he credits to a guy who doesn't exist,

1224
01:09:45,200 --> 01:09:49,799
Speaker 1: who's based in part of like Hellenic and Egyptian mythological figures.

1225
01:09:50,600 --> 01:09:53,800
Speaker 1: It's a little too it's a little bit too calculated

1226
01:09:53,840 --> 01:09:58,200
Speaker 1: to be classified as a prank. Yeah. So basically in

1227
01:09:58,320 --> 01:10:01,679
Speaker 1: six twelve, this like Rosa Crue manifesto gets like posted

1228
01:10:01,720 --> 01:10:05,519
Speaker 1: up in Germany. And again there's not real Rosicrucians as

1229
01:10:05,560 --> 01:10:07,920
Speaker 1: far as anyone's ever been able to prove. But because

1230
01:10:07,960 --> 01:10:10,240
Speaker 1: this thing it gets goes kind of viral, this like

1231
01:10:10,360 --> 01:10:14,160
Speaker 1: manifesto being published, they become like a conspiracy theory, right,

1232
01:10:14,200 --> 01:10:16,200
Speaker 1: Like people are like, oh, the Rosicrucians are behind this,

1233
01:10:16,280 --> 01:10:17,960
Speaker 1: or that they're the secret Order and they have all

1234
01:10:17,960 --> 01:10:20,519
Speaker 1: this influence here and this influence here, and it's like

1235
01:10:20,560 --> 01:10:23,920
Speaker 1: a popular belief or is a kind of a little necessary.

1236
01:10:24,439 --> 01:10:27,840
Speaker 1: Dudes are fucking writing conspiracy theories about the Rosicrucians um

1237
01:10:27,920 --> 01:10:32,400
Speaker 1: into the twenty first century. Um, it goes very viral.

1238
01:10:32,640 --> 01:10:35,799
Speaker 1: So Helena is hanging out with dudes who are super

1239
01:10:35,840 --> 01:10:38,920
Speaker 1: into the idea of the Rosicrucians in this period with occultists,

1240
01:10:38,920 --> 01:10:44,280
Speaker 1: and she has another entry point um into uh weird

1241
01:10:44,320 --> 01:10:48,439
Speaker 1: occult conspiracy theories from the seventeenth century. Um anyway, So

1242
01:10:48,439 --> 01:10:50,559
Speaker 1: so she has another entry point into kind of like

1243
01:10:50,880 --> 01:10:54,759
Speaker 1: occult conspiracy culture, which are the books of her favorite author,

1244
01:10:55,000 --> 01:10:59,679
Speaker 1: Edward Bulwer Lytton. Now this guy number one. Her mom

1245
01:10:59,760 --> 01:11:02,280
Speaker 1: had translated a number of this dude's books into Russia.

1246
01:11:02,360 --> 01:11:05,000
Speaker 1: This is like one of her mom's side jobs. Bulmer

1247
01:11:05,080 --> 01:11:08,800
Speaker 1: Litton publishes a very famous book in eighteen seventy one

1248
01:11:08,960 --> 01:11:12,560
Speaker 1: titled The Coming Race. And now it's about an underground

1249
01:11:12,680 --> 01:11:19,080
Speaker 1: master race. Yeah, yeah, The Coming Race, Baby, I've watched

1250
01:11:19,120 --> 01:11:24,200
Speaker 1: that one. Um. It's like the Great American Bake Off,

1251
01:11:24,280 --> 01:11:27,920
Speaker 1: but less horny. So The Coming Race is about an

1252
01:11:27,960 --> 01:11:31,439
Speaker 1: underground master race who have a secret energy called real

1253
01:11:31,640 --> 01:11:34,599
Speaker 1: that they used to like. It's they're kind of occult

1254
01:11:34,640 --> 01:11:40,839
Speaker 1: electricity almost. Um. And yeah, this book, it's not Bulward

1255
01:11:40,880 --> 01:11:43,639
Speaker 1: Letton obviously, this is published eighteen seventy one. Not a Nazi.

1256
01:11:43,680 --> 01:11:45,880
Speaker 1: I don't even think he's particularly a white supremacist, but

1257
01:11:45,960 --> 01:11:48,280
Speaker 1: his book is going to become extremely influential to the

1258
01:11:48,280 --> 01:11:51,840
Speaker 1: weirdest kind of Nazis. Nazis loved talking about real today

1259
01:11:52,120 --> 01:11:54,960
Speaker 1: um and secret underground Nazi bases in the art tech.

1260
01:11:55,040 --> 01:11:57,439
Speaker 1: All of that has its origin point in Bulwer Lytton's

1261
01:11:57,439 --> 01:12:02,559
Speaker 1: The Coming Race um So Buller is a Edward Bulwer

1262
01:12:02,600 --> 01:12:04,600
Speaker 1: Litton is a very popular author. His books has been

1263
01:12:04,600 --> 01:12:07,760
Speaker 1: translated again his Helena's mom translate them when she's a

1264
01:12:07,800 --> 01:12:10,519
Speaker 1: little girl. Um And one of the books that Helena

1265
01:12:10,520 --> 01:12:13,080
Speaker 1: would have grown up loving from this guy is Zononi,

1266
01:12:13,320 --> 01:12:15,720
Speaker 1: which is about a secret order of rosa Crucians who

1267
01:12:15,720 --> 01:12:19,200
Speaker 1: had psychic powers and lived forever. This is probably why

1268
01:12:19,240 --> 01:12:22,280
Speaker 1: Helena later claimed that her great grandfather had been a Rosicrucian,

1269
01:12:22,520 --> 01:12:24,439
Speaker 1: because she loves these books as a kid, and she

1270
01:12:24,520 --> 01:12:26,760
Speaker 1: wants to like tie herself and her family to them

1271
01:12:26,800 --> 01:12:29,000
Speaker 1: so that she can claim to have some connection with

1272
01:12:29,080 --> 01:12:33,120
Speaker 1: these like Rosicrucians from her favorite book that become part

1273
01:12:33,160 --> 01:12:36,920
Speaker 1: of her like conspiratorial belief system about the world. Right.

1274
01:12:37,479 --> 01:12:40,840
Speaker 1: It's like she's making her own occult superhero origin story

1275
01:12:40,960 --> 01:12:43,439
Speaker 1: right by tying herself and like, no, my grandfather was

1276
01:12:43,479 --> 01:12:46,960
Speaker 1: with the Rosicrucians, and like you know these these fiction

1277
01:12:47,000 --> 01:12:49,720
Speaker 1: books by Bulwer Lytton aren't fiction. They're him telling the

1278
01:12:49,760 --> 01:12:51,840
Speaker 1: real story. But he has to keep it secret because

1279
01:12:51,880 --> 01:12:55,880
Speaker 1: it's like a conspiracy. You know, God, I mean this

1280
01:12:56,080 --> 01:13:02,639
Speaker 1: is such fantasy, kid, behave still still? I mean you see,

1281
01:13:03,000 --> 01:13:06,880
Speaker 1: there's variants of this this basic art, like a lot

1282
01:13:06,880 --> 01:13:10,240
Speaker 1: of secret knowledge conspiracy grifters in the modern era have

1283
01:13:10,560 --> 01:13:14,280
Speaker 1: similar stories. Bill Cooper, who's the father of modern conspiracy theories,

1284
01:13:14,280 --> 01:13:16,640
Speaker 1: the first Alex Jones. His whole backstory is that like

1285
01:13:16,720 --> 01:13:18,960
Speaker 1: he when he was working at the Pentagon, he snuck

1286
01:13:18,960 --> 01:13:21,799
Speaker 1: into his boss's file cabinet and he like saw evidence

1287
01:13:21,800 --> 01:13:23,640
Speaker 1: of all the conspiracies. Who had spend the rest of

1288
01:13:23,640 --> 01:13:26,280
Speaker 1: his life talking about Keith Rawnieri claimed that he had

1289
01:13:26,320 --> 01:13:29,120
Speaker 1: like interviewed all of this most successful people in the

1290
01:13:29,120 --> 01:13:32,519
Speaker 1: world and had like synthesized the secret information about how

1291
01:13:32,520 --> 01:13:35,120
Speaker 1: to have success from their backgrounds and stuff. Right, this

1292
01:13:35,200 --> 01:13:38,559
Speaker 1: is like well trod guru grifter ground the idea that

1293
01:13:38,640 --> 01:13:41,800
Speaker 1: like at some point, as a younger person, you came

1294
01:13:41,840 --> 01:13:45,080
Speaker 1: across like the font of all secret knowledge, and so

1295
01:13:45,200 --> 01:13:47,920
Speaker 1: you got it directly from the source and you can't

1296
01:13:47,960 --> 01:13:50,800
Speaker 1: show anyone else for like whatever reason. Right, you don't

1297
01:13:50,800 --> 01:13:53,000
Speaker 1: have it anymore, but you remember it all and that's

1298
01:13:53,000 --> 01:13:55,640
Speaker 1: why they should listen to you. Okay. So that that

1299
01:13:55,720 --> 01:13:59,000
Speaker 1: brings up an interesting point to which is like, it's not, yeah,

1300
01:13:59,080 --> 01:14:03,240
Speaker 1: it's not just like fantasy fan behavior, because most fantasy

1301
01:14:03,240 --> 01:14:07,680
Speaker 1: fans don't have the access and like wealth to take it.

1302
01:14:07,920 --> 01:14:10,519
Speaker 1: As far as what you just described and like what

1303
01:14:10,560 --> 01:14:13,639
Speaker 1: Blovotsky would have had access to, it's like, oh, yeah,

1304
01:14:13,800 --> 01:14:17,120
Speaker 1: you can like try to attempt to make it happen

1305
01:14:17,120 --> 01:14:19,160
Speaker 1: because you have more influence and power and money and

1306
01:14:19,160 --> 01:14:21,160
Speaker 1: all that. Yeah, And this brings us to the last

1307
01:14:21,200 --> 01:14:23,519
Speaker 1: well documented part of her early life, her marriage at

1308
01:14:23,560 --> 01:14:26,679
Speaker 1: age seventeen, just like her mom, to a middle aged

1309
01:14:26,680 --> 01:14:30,960
Speaker 1: as man named Nikophor Blovotsky. He was the vice governor

1310
01:14:31,040 --> 01:14:35,439
Speaker 1: of aravan Uh in modern day and also within day Armenia. Um,

1311
01:14:35,560 --> 01:14:37,640
Speaker 1: like I think today it's the capital of Armenia. So

1312
01:14:37,680 --> 01:14:40,599
Speaker 1: he's like he's like the second guy in command of

1313
01:14:40,640 --> 01:14:44,800
Speaker 1: basically that of Russian art like Russia controlled Armenia in

1314
01:14:44,840 --> 01:14:49,160
Speaker 1: the period um of their marriage, Lachman writes, quote. One

1315
01:14:49,200 --> 01:14:51,519
Speaker 1: story is that she did so to spite her governess,

1316
01:14:51,520 --> 01:14:54,160
Speaker 1: who said that no man would have so unruly ill

1317
01:14:54,160 --> 01:14:56,720
Speaker 1: tempered and unpredictable a woman for a wife, not even

1318
01:14:56,720 --> 01:14:59,120
Speaker 1: the old gentleman she had recently taunted and laughed at

1319
01:14:59,200 --> 01:15:03,240
Speaker 1: so much. Faced with such a challenge, the teenaged Blovotsky

1320
01:15:03,280 --> 01:15:06,200
Speaker 1: cast her spell, and her plumeless raven was quickly netted.

1321
01:15:06,479 --> 01:15:08,599
Speaker 1: Another story is that hearing of the plan to run

1322
01:15:08,600 --> 01:15:11,400
Speaker 1: away with Prince Golitzen, the family felt duty bound to

1323
01:15:11,400 --> 01:15:14,000
Speaker 1: protect her honor and its own, and hastily shanghaied the

1324
01:15:14,040 --> 01:15:17,160
Speaker 1: old by their standards Nikophor into making an honest woman

1325
01:15:17,200 --> 01:15:19,919
Speaker 1: of her. A third possibility is that she married Nikophor

1326
01:15:19,960 --> 01:15:22,639
Speaker 1: out of anger at her father, who had recently remarried

1327
01:15:22,680 --> 01:15:25,600
Speaker 1: to a Countess von Lane. Yet Blovotsky herself tells a

1328
01:15:25,640 --> 01:15:28,960
Speaker 1: different story. Prince Prince Golitzen, it seems, wasn't the only

1329
01:15:28,960 --> 01:15:31,760
Speaker 1: one who took her mystical passion seriously. In the letter

1330
01:15:31,800 --> 01:15:34,559
Speaker 1: to her friend Prince Alexander, I'm not going to try

1331
01:15:34,560 --> 01:15:37,360
Speaker 1: to pronounce that last name mentioned earlier, she wrote, do

1332
01:15:37,400 --> 01:15:40,360
Speaker 1: you know why I married an old Blovotsky? Because whereas

1333
01:15:40,360 --> 01:15:43,120
Speaker 1: all the young men laughed at my magical superstitions, he

1334
01:15:43,200 --> 01:15:45,840
Speaker 1: believed in them. She explained that her suitor had so

1335
01:15:45,880 --> 01:15:48,400
Speaker 1: often talked to me about the sorcerers of Aravan or

1336
01:15:48,400 --> 01:15:50,760
Speaker 1: the mysterious science of the Kurds and the Persians, that

1337
01:15:50,800 --> 01:15:52,280
Speaker 1: I took him in order to use him as a

1338
01:15:52,320 --> 01:15:55,400
Speaker 1: latch key to the latter. Right. So Number one, there's

1339
01:15:55,120 --> 01:15:58,120
Speaker 1: a myth that like or some people will argue she

1340
01:15:58,280 --> 01:16:00,960
Speaker 1: and Prince Golitzen had like a thing, which by the way,

1341
01:16:00,960 --> 01:16:03,760
Speaker 1: would have been him molesting her because she would have

1342
01:16:03,800 --> 01:16:08,439
Speaker 1: been like sixteen. But whatever that, her family marries her

1343
01:16:08,439 --> 01:16:10,400
Speaker 1: off to another middle aged man in order to get

1344
01:16:10,400 --> 01:16:14,080
Speaker 1: her away from this, this this prince. Um. She claims that, no,

1345
01:16:14,360 --> 01:16:18,040
Speaker 1: I took advantage of this guy. I married him because

1346
01:16:18,080 --> 01:16:20,559
Speaker 1: I wanted to get over to like these these Armenian

1347
01:16:20,600 --> 01:16:22,760
Speaker 1: and these Kurdish and Persian mystics, and he was a

1348
01:16:22,760 --> 01:16:24,639
Speaker 1: powerful man in that area, and I knew he would

1349
01:16:24,640 --> 01:16:26,840
Speaker 1: like open the door to me getting into there. I

1350
01:16:26,920 --> 01:16:30,080
Speaker 1: actually think she's probably telling the truth about that she

1351
01:16:30,240 --> 01:16:32,880
Speaker 1: has this guy kind of wrapped around her finger for

1352
01:16:33,040 --> 01:16:35,479
Speaker 1: most of the time that he's alive. Um. I don't

1353
01:16:35,520 --> 01:16:38,160
Speaker 1: have trouble believing that she this was a calculated move

1354
01:16:38,200 --> 01:16:40,880
Speaker 1: on her bath she he's good at that, Um. And

1355
01:16:40,920 --> 01:16:44,599
Speaker 1: obviously you're a fucking seventeen year old Russian noble girl

1356
01:16:44,640 --> 01:16:46,720
Speaker 1: in this period of time. You don't want to grow

1357
01:16:46,840 --> 01:16:49,360
Speaker 1: up like your mom did married to some like miserable

1358
01:16:49,400 --> 01:16:51,519
Speaker 1: ass fucking soldier. Dude. If you want to take some

1359
01:16:51,600 --> 01:16:53,960
Speaker 1: autonomy in your life, you have to scheme a bit, right,

1360
01:16:54,240 --> 01:16:58,200
Speaker 1: So maybe that's what she does. Um now, Madame Blovotsky,

1361
01:16:58,240 --> 01:17:00,559
Speaker 1: as she becomes known later with aim for the rest

1362
01:17:00,600 --> 01:17:02,880
Speaker 1: of her life. That quote I never was his wife,

1363
01:17:03,320 --> 01:17:05,800
Speaker 1: by which she means that the marriage was never consummated.

1364
01:17:05,840 --> 01:17:08,559
Speaker 1: They did not fuck. This is a topic of heavy

1365
01:17:08,560 --> 01:17:10,640
Speaker 1: debate which I see no reason to wait to the

1366
01:17:10,680 --> 01:17:15,320
Speaker 1: two biographers that I hey, I mean, of course the

1367
01:17:15,400 --> 01:17:18,120
Speaker 1: biographers who are followers and fans of hers are going

1368
01:17:18,160 --> 01:17:22,000
Speaker 1: to want to heavily speculate about who when she was

1369
01:17:22,720 --> 01:17:25,479
Speaker 1: exhausting it is. We will talk about it more because

1370
01:17:25,520 --> 01:17:27,759
Speaker 1: it is relevant because a big part of the religion

1371
01:17:27,800 --> 01:17:29,760
Speaker 1: she makes is like a staticism, and a lot of

1372
01:17:29,760 --> 01:17:33,559
Speaker 1: it involves sex denial, and there's credibility issues that like, well,

1373
01:17:33,600 --> 01:17:35,439
Speaker 1: she was fucking the whole time, and obviously that does

1374
01:17:35,560 --> 01:17:41,040
Speaker 1: matter if you're like right, because there was the celibacy thing. Right. Anyway,

1375
01:17:41,080 --> 01:17:44,040
Speaker 1: this is a topic of debate. Gary Lackman just takes

1376
01:17:44,080 --> 01:17:46,840
Speaker 1: it as like, takes her word for it. It's like, no,

1377
01:17:46,920 --> 01:17:49,599
Speaker 1: she was celibate, she might even have been. Lackman kind

1378
01:17:49,600 --> 01:17:52,960
Speaker 1: of described her as possibly even a sexual. Um. Meanwhile,

1379
01:17:53,000 --> 01:17:55,439
Speaker 1: the other biographer I use for this Mary and Meade,

1380
01:17:55,479 --> 01:17:58,919
Speaker 1: who is more both way more into woo. She describes

1381
01:17:58,920 --> 01:18:01,640
Speaker 1: herself as like a PSI practitioner with side powers, but

1382
01:18:01,680 --> 01:18:05,960
Speaker 1: also a much more critical biographer of Blovotsky. Um. We'll

1383
01:18:06,040 --> 01:18:09,400
Speaker 1: note that she has at least two husbands at one point,

1384
01:18:09,400 --> 01:18:11,519
Speaker 1: she has two husbands at the same time, I should

1385
01:18:11,520 --> 01:18:17,240
Speaker 1: say she has numerous lovers. She may have had some kids. Um,

1386
01:18:17,320 --> 01:18:21,680
Speaker 1: And that basically she she fucks. And one of the

1387
01:18:21,720 --> 01:18:23,960
Speaker 1: fun things is that like later again, later in her life,

1388
01:18:23,960 --> 01:18:26,200
Speaker 1: when she's a guru, sorry to skip ahead a little bit,

1389
01:18:26,479 --> 01:18:30,360
Speaker 1: but she gets like a doctor's uh to examine her

1390
01:18:30,479 --> 01:18:32,680
Speaker 1: her bits, and the doctors like, it doesn't look like

1391
01:18:32,720 --> 01:18:35,559
Speaker 1: you've had a kid, And she takes that little bit

1392
01:18:35,640 --> 01:18:38,120
Speaker 1: and she strong arms him into writing a note that

1393
01:18:38,160 --> 01:18:41,320
Speaker 1: says quote, I hereby certify that Madame Blovotsky has never

1394
01:18:41,360 --> 01:18:44,040
Speaker 1: been pregnant for with a child, and so consequently can

1395
01:18:44,080 --> 01:18:46,880
Speaker 1: never have had a child, and then she she uses

1396
01:18:46,920 --> 01:18:49,000
Speaker 1: this note to claim that also she's a virgin, even

1397
01:18:49,000 --> 01:18:50,720
Speaker 1: though that's not really what the doctor says. But she

1398
01:18:50,920 --> 01:18:53,360
Speaker 1: gets a doctor to write something and then like uses

1399
01:18:53,400 --> 01:18:56,959
Speaker 1: that as part of it. Okay, that is kind of funny.

1400
01:18:57,000 --> 01:18:59,800
Speaker 1: That is kind of funny. I do I made it,

1401
01:19:00,040 --> 01:19:04,200
Speaker 1: Like any any like information about how doctors treated vaginas

1402
01:19:04,240 --> 01:19:07,680
Speaker 1: at this time is just like so hysterically wrong, Like

1403
01:19:07,720 --> 01:19:09,880
Speaker 1: this was at the same time where you would possible that,

1404
01:19:10,000 --> 01:19:12,080
Speaker 1: Like she had that doctor looking at her foot and

1405
01:19:12,080 --> 01:19:14,080
Speaker 1: he was like, this seems like a vagina to me.

1406
01:19:14,479 --> 01:19:17,600
Speaker 1: I'm a man in the eighteen seventies, none of the

1407
01:19:17,920 --> 01:19:22,000
Speaker 1: seventies you could be like, okay, like you can examine me,

1408
01:19:22,200 --> 01:19:24,479
Speaker 1: but the lights have to be off, like and then

1409
01:19:24,520 --> 01:19:27,080
Speaker 1: you're like, okay, ghosts are coming out of my vagina.

1410
01:19:27,160 --> 01:19:30,719
Speaker 1: And if you don't believe me, um, you hate women.

1411
01:19:30,760 --> 01:19:33,479
Speaker 1: It's the best, it's the best, good time to be

1412
01:19:33,720 --> 01:19:36,840
Speaker 1: got to bring back or a vagina. So, for her part,

1413
01:19:36,920 --> 01:19:40,639
Speaker 1: Blovotsky claimed quote, never physically speaking, has there ever existed

1414
01:19:40,680 --> 01:19:43,040
Speaker 1: a girl or woman colder than I. I had a

1415
01:19:43,080 --> 01:19:46,840
Speaker 1: volcano when conscient constitucent eruption in my brain and a

1416
01:19:46,840 --> 01:19:50,840
Speaker 1: glacier at the foot of the mountain. Okay, that's kind

1417
01:19:50,880 --> 01:19:55,080
Speaker 1: of sexual icon I've had. I've had ex boyfriends who

1418
01:19:55,080 --> 01:19:59,880
Speaker 1: have said similar things about me. Yeah. So again the

1419
01:20:00,040 --> 01:20:03,040
Speaker 1: to the two arguments here, either she was basically a

1420
01:20:03,120 --> 01:20:06,920
Speaker 1: sexual or she was fucking constantly. Um. I don't know

1421
01:20:07,000 --> 01:20:10,120
Speaker 1: the truth, but there's a lot of fun stories. So

1422
01:20:10,960 --> 01:20:13,639
Speaker 1: she was about to hit the world like goddamn bomb, right,

1423
01:20:13,680 --> 01:20:17,240
Speaker 1: She's she's basically an adult. She's she's wants to get

1424
01:20:17,240 --> 01:20:20,080
Speaker 1: out there and travel to all the different mystical centers

1425
01:20:20,080 --> 01:20:22,599
Speaker 1: of the world. But she has to do one thing first, Jamie,

1426
01:20:22,760 --> 01:20:25,760
Speaker 1: and that's get away from her dorcass nerdi of a husband, Right,

1427
01:20:26,040 --> 01:20:29,800
Speaker 1: you can't have that dude hanging around. Um. So she

1428
01:20:29,920 --> 01:20:32,479
Speaker 1: claims that, like she warned her husband he was making

1429
01:20:32,479 --> 01:20:35,960
Speaker 1: a big mistake before the wedding and begged him to talk.

1430
01:20:36,040 --> 01:20:40,200
Speaker 1: She escaped before the wedding briefly and then got caught. Um,

1431
01:20:40,280 --> 01:20:43,800
Speaker 1: and after they were married, she escaped. Fun indication of

1432
01:20:43,840 --> 01:20:50,559
Speaker 1: things to come the sed of your own wedding. Yeah yeah, yeah,

1433
01:20:50,640 --> 01:20:53,439
Speaker 1: Right before their honeymoon, she like bribes some Kurdish warriors

1434
01:20:53,479 --> 01:20:57,320
Speaker 1: to smuggle her out and she gets caught. Um, I

1435
01:20:57,320 --> 01:21:00,320
Speaker 1: think she might have made it to Iran. UM hate

1436
01:21:00,360 --> 01:21:02,920
Speaker 1: that she was put in this position, but I love

1437
01:21:03,000 --> 01:21:06,080
Speaker 1: her tactics to not she is, it's pretty fun. It's

1438
01:21:06,120 --> 01:21:09,120
Speaker 1: pretty fun. She's like, she's like bribing these like nomadic

1439
01:21:09,160 --> 01:21:11,759
Speaker 1: warriors to like help her escape and like getting caught

1440
01:21:11,800 --> 01:21:14,920
Speaker 1: and it's this, it's this, she's she's like dealing with

1441
01:21:14,960 --> 01:21:19,960
Speaker 1: massagy with a real dramatic flair. She is, it's pretty

1442
01:21:19,960 --> 01:21:23,920
Speaker 1: pretty wild stuff. So she gets caught again. For a while,

1443
01:21:23,960 --> 01:21:27,679
Speaker 1: she's under constant guard in her husband's palace, but Helena

1444
01:21:27,800 --> 01:21:30,320
Speaker 1: keeps her focus and she eventually, yeah, she escapes to

1445
01:21:30,360 --> 01:21:33,599
Speaker 1: Tiflis in Georgia, where she gets caught again and her

1446
01:21:33,640 --> 01:21:36,040
Speaker 1: husband sends her back to her family so that they

1447
01:21:36,080 --> 01:21:38,840
Speaker 1: can send her and her servants to St. Petersburg to

1448
01:21:38,880 --> 01:21:41,519
Speaker 1: try to like keep a lock on her while they

1449
01:21:41,520 --> 01:21:44,760
Speaker 1: figure out what to do about her. Um. So, like

1450
01:21:44,840 --> 01:21:48,559
Speaker 1: she's basically going supposed to be traveling with her servants

1451
01:21:48,600 --> 01:21:51,400
Speaker 1: to St. Petersburg to be like locked up somewhere until

1452
01:21:51,439 --> 01:21:54,280
Speaker 1: they can break her spirit. But while she's on her

1453
01:21:54,280 --> 01:21:56,799
Speaker 1: way back home, she bribes the captain of an English

1454
01:21:56,800 --> 01:21:59,160
Speaker 1: boat to help her, and with the help of an

1455
01:21:59,280 --> 01:22:02,599
Speaker 1: escape kayak. She kayaks to safety, evading her servants, and

1456
01:22:02,640 --> 01:22:05,320
Speaker 1: like gets on this boat and gets taken to Constantinople.

1457
01:22:07,479 --> 01:22:09,799
Speaker 1: I know in that dope, that's a pretty cool story.

1458
01:22:09,880 --> 01:22:13,880
Speaker 1: This is cool, This is goddamn and it's like, I

1459
01:22:13,920 --> 01:22:16,160
Speaker 1: know where this story is going, but I didn't know

1460
01:22:16,280 --> 01:22:19,599
Speaker 1: these details and they're all cool, and that's dope as hell.

1461
01:22:19,680 --> 01:22:21,160
Speaker 1: And that's what we're going to end for today. All

1462
01:22:21,360 --> 01:22:25,559
Speaker 1: Blotsky has escaped on a kayak to Constantinople, which is

1463
01:22:25,560 --> 01:22:27,360
Speaker 1: pretty cool. I mean, she kayaks a boat and that

1464
01:22:27,360 --> 01:22:31,160
Speaker 1: takes you to Constantinople, but still pretty cool, really impressive.

1465
01:22:32,320 --> 01:22:35,759
Speaker 1: All right, Jamie, have you ever had to kayak away

1466
01:22:35,800 --> 01:22:40,479
Speaker 1: from a bad marriage? No, I've I've kayaked towards a

1467
01:22:40,560 --> 01:22:48,800
Speaker 1: bad relationship. Yeah, baby, Um, have you ever had to

1468
01:22:49,040 --> 01:22:53,599
Speaker 1: paddle away? I have had. I've had. I've had some

1469
01:22:53,640 --> 01:22:57,360
Speaker 1: adventures while kayaking that involved a sunken kayak um. And

1470
01:22:57,400 --> 01:23:00,760
Speaker 1: I've definitely had some some strenuous arguments while kayaking with

1471
01:23:00,800 --> 01:23:03,639
Speaker 1: a part. Oh. No, I don't like kayaking. I'm gonna

1472
01:23:03,640 --> 01:23:06,360
Speaker 1: be honest with you. I'm not a big fan. Sorry,

1473
01:23:06,360 --> 01:23:10,679
Speaker 1: I got so upset about your kayaking. Anecdote that I left. Yeah,

1474
01:23:10,720 --> 01:23:12,800
Speaker 1: you have. You have a tattoo of a kayak on

1475
01:23:12,920 --> 01:23:19,320
Speaker 1: your bicep that says yeah, it says, do not tread

1476
01:23:19,400 --> 01:23:21,840
Speaker 1: on me. Right before you came in this morning, you

1477
01:23:21,880 --> 01:23:28,280
Speaker 1: were drilling holes in canoes. Um, because kayakers hate canoeists. Yeah,

1478
01:23:28,400 --> 01:23:30,639
Speaker 1: I mean you don't feel like you're in a safe

1479
01:23:30,640 --> 01:23:33,400
Speaker 1: womb like space in a canoe. I like to feel

1480
01:23:33,400 --> 01:23:35,439
Speaker 1: like I'm being born when I get out of the

1481
01:23:35,479 --> 01:23:38,400
Speaker 1: little boat. Okay, that's that's right. That's right. Like like

1482
01:23:38,520 --> 01:23:42,840
Speaker 1: Jim Carrey in the second Aman Share a movie, It's like,

1483
01:23:42,960 --> 01:23:46,720
Speaker 1: where is this going? Yes, exactly? Do you want to

1484
01:23:46,720 --> 01:23:50,479
Speaker 1: plug your ship? Yeah? I guess that the best plug

1485
01:23:50,560 --> 01:23:53,160
Speaker 1: for this is listen to Ghost Church. It's the limited

1486
01:23:53,160 --> 01:23:58,080
Speaker 1: series I just finished that is Blovotsky Adjacent, which I

1487
01:23:58,080 --> 01:24:00,800
Speaker 1: think will become clearer in the next episode. But it's

1488
01:24:00,800 --> 01:24:03,519
Speaker 1: about American spiritualism and a bunch of time I spent

1489
01:24:03,960 --> 01:24:09,200
Speaker 1: with some psychics and mediums in Central Florida. Roberts in it,

1490
01:24:09,360 --> 01:24:12,600
Speaker 1: Paul left Compkins is in it. Sophie produced it and

1491
01:24:12,800 --> 01:24:16,640
Speaker 1: edited it. It's just it's just a cool zone jamboree,

1492
01:24:16,800 --> 01:24:19,280
Speaker 1: and uh, it's all. Every episode is out now. So

1493
01:24:19,320 --> 01:24:21,360
Speaker 1: you can listen to all of it and if and

1494
01:24:21,360 --> 01:24:25,519
Speaker 1: then follow me on Twitter and Instagram. Uh that if

1495
01:24:25,560 --> 01:24:30,240
Speaker 1: you want listening to Ghost Church. It personally hurts my feelings. Yeah,

1496
01:24:30,280 --> 01:24:32,679
Speaker 1: if you don't listen to Ghost Church, I will find

1497
01:24:32,760 --> 01:24:35,679
Speaker 1: you and I will put your children on the Blue

1498
01:24:35,720 --> 01:24:39,000
Speaker 1: Apron Iron Island where they'll be hunted by Elon Musk

1499
01:24:39,080 --> 01:24:43,679
Speaker 1: for food. Yeah it's Elon Musk and all of his

1500
01:24:43,680 --> 01:24:46,599
Speaker 1: his kids. Go. Somebody's listening with his kids, their kids

1501
01:24:46,720 --> 01:24:48,600
Speaker 1: right now. And I want you to know, children, that

1502
01:24:48,680 --> 01:24:52,760
Speaker 1: was a threat there. Your parents better listen to Ghost Church.

1503
01:24:53,720 --> 01:24:57,720
Speaker 1: I feel Look, it's it's high, it's high octane ship.

1504
01:24:58,000 --> 01:25:00,640
Speaker 1: I just got I do what I would. I I

1505
01:25:00,760 --> 01:25:05,559
Speaker 1: still cut and check Apple podcast reviews sometimes, and I checked.

1506
01:25:06,040 --> 01:25:09,920
Speaker 1: I checked them, and I had one that said, uh,

1507
01:25:10,080 --> 01:25:12,240
Speaker 1: I liked the whole show, but I'm going to stop

1508
01:25:12,360 --> 01:25:18,000
Speaker 1: listening now because Jamie wants the Supreme Court to be abolished.

1509
01:25:18,160 --> 01:25:22,000
Speaker 1: But they still gave me four stars. I just lost

1510
01:25:22,200 --> 01:25:27,439
Speaker 1: one star incredibly based. I think. Look, yeah, it's like

1511
01:25:27,520 --> 01:25:30,600
Speaker 1: you know, that's pretty fair and balanced. Yeah, I have

1512
01:25:30,720 --> 01:25:33,680
Speaker 1: to give credit where it's due. Look, they understand that

1513
01:25:33,760 --> 01:25:36,040
Speaker 1: this isn't the content for them. But they're not going

1514
01:25:36,120 --> 01:25:39,160
Speaker 1: to punish your show for it. They're like, look, I

1515
01:25:39,280 --> 01:25:41,200
Speaker 1: enjoyed the whole show, but we have we have a

1516
01:25:41,240 --> 01:25:44,400
Speaker 1: personal disagreement, and I have to dock you a star.

1517
01:25:44,560 --> 01:25:48,400
Speaker 1: I'm like, all right, you know what, yeah, look, you

1518
01:25:48,439 --> 01:25:56,200
Speaker 1: know what. Good for you, good for them, Good for them,