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Speaker 1: Last time on SNAFU.

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Speaker 2: Heavyweight boxers Joe Praise You'er and Mihamed Atli meet in

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Speaker 2: New York's Madison Square Garden Monday night.

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Speaker 3: There was a huge stack of mail, but this one

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Speaker 3: stood out because of the return address, which was Liberty

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Speaker 3: Publications Media, Pennsylvania.

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Speaker 4: As long as I am Director of the FBI, it

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Speaker 4: will continue to maintain its high and impartial standards of investigation.

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Speaker 2: Last month, Burglars had an FBI a resident office and

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Speaker 2: took files which subsequently have been made public.

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Speaker 3: The FBI entered my life very soon after that.

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Speaker 1: Reporter Betty Medsker now lived in San Francisco. Two decades

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Speaker 1: had passed since she first received an envelope from a

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Speaker 1: mysterious group called the Citizens Commission to Investigate the FBI.

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Speaker 1: That envelope contained fourteen top secret FBI files showing America's

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Speaker 1: beloved g men were surveilling American citizens with the goal

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Speaker 1: of quote enhancing paranoia. She still had no idea who

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Speaker 1: sent her those files that led to her bombshell reporting.

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Speaker 1: She had no idea about the incredible heist that pried

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Speaker 1: them out of the FBI's hands, and she might not

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Speaker 1: have ever known these things were it not for one

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Speaker 1: faithful evening in nineteen eighty nine, Betty was taking a

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Speaker 1: trip back to her old stomping grounds, Philadelphia.

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Speaker 3: There were a number of people professionally and personally who

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Speaker 3: were very important to me, and I hadn't seen them

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Speaker 3: in a long time.

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Speaker 1: Like John and Bonnie Rains, a young couple she'd known

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Speaker 1: from her days reporting on religion for the Philadelphia Evening Bulletin.

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Speaker 3: And I called and said I was going to be

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Speaker 3: a town could we get together? And they immediately invited

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Speaker 3: me to come to their home for dinner that Friday night,

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Speaker 3: and I was very much looking forward to it.

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Speaker 1: When Betty first met them, Bonnie was a young mother,

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Speaker 1: juggling her grad school studies and education, her job running

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Speaker 1: a daycare, and her three children. Her husband, John was

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Speaker 1: a young Methodist minister who taught religion at Temple University.

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Speaker 1: He was a gifted speaker, and he knew it. Some

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Speaker 1: might say he talked a little too much. Betty would

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Speaker 1: soon learn how true that was.

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Speaker 3: We hadn't seen each other in a very long time.

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Speaker 3: We talked for quite a while and had a couple

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Speaker 3: classes of wine, catching each other up. On the last

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Speaker 3: decade of our lives. And at some point in the

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Speaker 3: middle of dinner, their youngest child came in. She had

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Speaker 3: a question for John. Then John said when he was

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Speaker 3: done answering her question, he said, Mary, this is Betty Metzker.

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Speaker 3: We want you to know Betty because many years ago,

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Speaker 3: when your dad and mother had information about the FBI

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Speaker 3: that we wanted to give to the public, we gave

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Speaker 3: it to Betty. And I was just absolutely stunned.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I would think, oh my gosh.

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Speaker 3: Mary was sort of lingering a little bit, but you

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Speaker 3: could just tell from the expression on her face that

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Speaker 3: this meant absolutely nothing.

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Speaker 1: Sure, and she's like, what are you talking about?

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Speaker 4: Dad?

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Speaker 3: And then when she left the room, I said, you know,

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Speaker 3: are you telling me that you were you broke into

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Speaker 3: the FBI. And they had these wonderful white smiles on

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Speaker 3: their faces and said, yes. It just it just it

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Speaker 3: popped out, popped out. I think it was a combination

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Speaker 3: of the fact that we were so happy to see

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Speaker 3: each other and we were telling each other tales at

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Speaker 3: a little bit of wine. Here we are sitting in

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Speaker 3: their beautiful suburban home, you know, four children, nice black

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Speaker 3: dog named Jezebel, and the station wagon, which they've always had.

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Speaker 3: But also I just simply know them. I had no

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Speaker 3: idea how radical they were that night. I'm just asking

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Speaker 3: one question after another and finding it all pretty unbelievable.

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Speaker 1: I'm at Helms and this is Snapoo, a show about

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Speaker 1: history's greatest screw ups. This is season two Medburgh, the

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Speaker 1: story of a daring heist and the colossal FBI Snapoo.

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Speaker 1: It exposed today a young couple's decision to put everything

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Speaker 1: on the line.

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Speaker 3: Super testing one, two, three, four, five six.

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Speaker 1: That's Betty Metzger interviewing John and Bonnie Rains.

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Speaker 5: When the idea introduced you, well, let's see, I think

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Speaker 5: it was something like September or October.

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Speaker 1: In September or October of nineteen seventy, John and Bonnie

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Speaker 1: Rains got a phone call from a friend, a man

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Speaker 1: by the name of Bill Davidan. Bill was a Navy veteran,

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Speaker 1: a physicist, a father of two. He was a noun

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Speaker 1: assuming man, calm, thoughtful, and deeply practical. Oh and a

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Speaker 1: dedicated anti war activist, just like John and Bonnie.

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Speaker 6: I think he just initially, he just called John and

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Speaker 6: me from his home in Haverford and asked us if

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Speaker 6: we would we want to come to a party.

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Speaker 1: That's Bonnie. Again, there was no actual party for activists.

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Speaker 6: This was code for thinking about an action, and would

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Speaker 6: you want to come and talk about it?

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Speaker 1: A protest action? That is Bonnie and John accepted the invitation.

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Speaker 6: So we met with him at his home and we

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Speaker 6: walked outside in the field behind his home to talk

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Speaker 6: about it. And that's when he floated the idea to

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Speaker 6: John and me.

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Speaker 1: It was casual, you know, in the way that someone

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Speaker 1: today might propose starting a fantasy football league. Bill simply asked, hey,

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Speaker 1: what do you guys think about burglarizing an FBI office?

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Speaker 6: And it took us back a bit crazy. That's crazy.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you're not wrong, Bonnie.

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Speaker 6: Is this crazy or is this something we ought to

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Speaker 6: really take seriously?

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Speaker 1: You had it right the first time. It's definitely crazy.

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Speaker 1: The FBI was the biggest baddest law enforcement agency in

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Speaker 1: the biggest baddest nation on earth. And who were John

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Speaker 1: and Bonnie Rains Uh, not professional burglars, not spies, just

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Speaker 1: a nice young couple with three children in a station wagon.

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Speaker 1: How the hell were they supposed to break into an

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Speaker 1: FBI office? And if the FBI caught them.

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Speaker 7: No, they'll lock you in a room, and.

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Speaker 2: So with a room.

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Speaker 1: Thank you, Steven Soderberg. Anyway, unlike most sane people, the

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Speaker 1: Rainses would actually consider Bill Davidan's proposition because for months

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Speaker 1: they'd been suspicious that there was something very wrong with

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Speaker 1: the FBI, and this might be an opportunity to prove

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Speaker 1: it well.

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Speaker 3: Astar I was born in ran Rapids, Michigan, met waitressing

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Speaker 3: tables in the resort, and there in Michigan with family summer.

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Speaker 1: Cottage, long before they would consider breaking into an FBI office.

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Speaker 1: Bonnie and Clyde excuse me. Bonnie and John were just

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Speaker 1: two young people meeting by chance on a beautiful summer evening.

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Speaker 1: Bonnie was a waitress at the Homestead, a resort that

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Speaker 1: overlooked Lake Michigan. And John was a young Methodist minister, tall,

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Speaker 1: handsome and dining alone.

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Speaker 6: And he was at one of my tables, and he

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Speaker 6: was this absolutely gorgeous man in a blue sport coat

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Speaker 6: and these brilliant blue eyes. Part of our job description

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Speaker 6: was to kind of chat up the guests, so I

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Speaker 6: proceeded to start a chat with him, I guess. So

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Speaker 6: we found some things to talk about.

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Speaker 1: They sure did, Bonnie asked John how his day was,

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Speaker 1: and John told Bonnie that he just arrived. Literally, this

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Speaker 1: was his first dinner since getting back from the Deep South,

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Speaker 1: where he'd been jailed for participating in the nineteen sixty

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Speaker 1: one Freedom Rides.

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Speaker 8: It was the experience for the first time in my life,

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Speaker 8: the fact that things were not okay with this country, that.

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Speaker 9: There were very deep things that were not okay with

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Speaker 9: this country.

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Speaker 1: The Freedom Rides were a courageous civil rights protest action.

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Speaker 1: Black and white passengers alike boarded greyhound buses headed into

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Speaker 1: the Jim Crow South. It was a few months after

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Speaker 1: the Supreme Court had ruled that interstate travel facilities be desegregated,

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Speaker 1: but before most of the South had accepted the new

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Speaker 1: reality of this ruling.

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Speaker 8: A mob had gathered as our bus came into a

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Speaker 8: little Rock, Arkansas, and.

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Speaker 6: There was confrontation of a mob that, as John said,

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Speaker 6: they wanted to kill me. They really would have killed

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Speaker 6: me if they gotten their hands on me.

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Speaker 1: The Freedom Riders, including John, were arrested for breaching the peace.

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Speaker 1: They were fined, found guilty, and told to get out

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Speaker 1: of the state.

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Speaker 9: But sure we did, going south deeper into the balance,

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Speaker 9: it was a very powerful experience for me, and it

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Speaker 9: exposed me to the power of the African American Southern

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Speaker 9: community of resistance.

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Speaker 8: It had great moral authority, It acted under conditions of

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Speaker 8: great danger. It exposed itself to that danger. I began

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Speaker 8: to see law and order as a system which controls

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Speaker 8: other folks, oftentimes the black majority who.

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Speaker 9: Could not vote.

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Speaker 8: Bonnie hears this story, which is fresh off the press,

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Speaker 8: and I think she was intrigued by. Oh, yeah, I

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Speaker 8: think what I had for me. Maybe my blue eyes.

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Speaker 1: I'm not sure they don't hurt John, they don't hurt.

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Speaker 6: I really admired him and thought this is a special

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Speaker 6: kind of man, and he he was very interested in me.

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Speaker 6: I guess he thought I was pretty and funny. I

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Speaker 6: had goals, I had ambition, I had spunk, and I

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Speaker 6: was willing to not just settle for the comfortable life

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Speaker 6: that I could have settled for.

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Speaker 3: I wanted an adventure.

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Speaker 6: I wanted my life to be an adventure.

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Speaker 3: And he liked joke.

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Speaker 6: He said it took him eight glasses of iced tea

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Speaker 6: to work up to asking me out on a date.

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Speaker 1: Less than a year later, John and Bonnie were married.

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Speaker 1: Three kids quickly followed but they made a promise to

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Speaker 1: each other that they wouldn't allow family to stand in

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Speaker 1: the way of fighting injustice, and there was plenty of

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Speaker 1: injustice to fight.

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Speaker 10: I signed it up.

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Speaker 2: About eight poumes from a US started on a mighty

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Speaker 2: role from so Alabama, the workers there who are striking

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Speaker 2: for a decent way, for decent working conditions.

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Speaker 11: At the time when the operation of the machine becomes

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Speaker 11: so odious makes you so sick and marked that unless

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Speaker 11: you're framed the machine wing, I.

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Speaker 1: Didn't come working at all.

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Speaker 6: There was so much at risk at that time in

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Speaker 6: our democracy that you were either an activist or you

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Speaker 6: went along with things.

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Speaker 3: That were wrong.

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Speaker 6: You had a choice you had to make, and we

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Speaker 6: made the choice to be activists. And if it meant

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Speaker 6: some risks that were involved, well that's what citizens sometimes

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Speaker 6: have to do.

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Speaker 1: John and Vonnie Rain spent the nineteen sixties protesting for

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Speaker 1: civil rights, for women's rights, for labor rights. By nineteen

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Speaker 1: sixty nine, they were living in Philadelphia and becoming entrenched

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Speaker 1: in the fight against America's war in Vietnam.

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Speaker 7: Asafia, the NAZE official, the military chief of Kuang Nai Province,

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Speaker 7: today denied charges that American soldiers on the ground executed

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Speaker 7: several hundred villagers. The villagers version of the incident was

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Speaker 7: given by survivors yesterday. They said a patrol of one

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Speaker 7: hundred Americans stormed into the hamlet, drove all the residents

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Speaker 7: out of their huts, and then opened fire with automatic weapons.

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Speaker 1: On November twelfth, nineteen sixty nine, almost fifteen years after

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Speaker 1: American involvement in Vietnam began, report surface that US troops

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Speaker 1: had raided the Vietnamese village of Meli. The Americans had

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Speaker 1: burned huts, killed hundreds of civilians, including children, and committed

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Speaker 1: other atrocities. The army initially claimed that Meli was a

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Speaker 1: quote fierce firefight where one hundred and twenty eight enemy

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Speaker 1: troops and twenty civilians had been killed. But that was

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Speaker 1: a lie. It wasn't a battle, It was a slaughter.

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Speaker 8: I might killed about ten to fifteen.

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Speaker 1: Men, women and children, men, women, shure, babies and movies.

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Speaker 12: Why did you do it?

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Speaker 1: Why did I do it?

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Speaker 12: Because I feel like I was ordered to do it.

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Speaker 1: Two days after these news reports, half a million Americans

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Speaker 1: marched in Washington. It was the largest anti war protest

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Speaker 1: in history.

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Speaker 6: Be about today.

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Speaker 3: People were hopeful at the beginning.

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Speaker 1: Here's Betty Metzker. When she was a young reporter in Philly,

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Speaker 1: she sometimes covered the peace movement.

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Speaker 3: In order for protest to happen, there has to be

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Speaker 3: a deep feeling that there can be a result because

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Speaker 3: of what we're doing, and people really did feel that way.

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Speaker 11: We come out of the street, pour out with our

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Speaker 11: visions and our dreams and.

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Speaker 6: The beauty that is within us.

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Speaker 13: We will come as a new nation.

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Speaker 6: You want us to stay.

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Speaker 3: I don't love my country.

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Speaker 10: I entered on with a final better solution that joined and.

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Speaker 1: Hey, but despite the massive protests, the administration just wasn't interested, like,

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Speaker 1: not even a bit. While half a million Americans marched

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Speaker 1: in protest right outside the White House, President Nixon sat

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Speaker 1: inside and watched a football game on TV. People like

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Speaker 1: John and Bonnie had seen firsthand how protests can affect change,

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Speaker 1: but as the war dragged on, even they had to

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Speaker 1: acknowledge a sobering truth. Marching and demonstrating didn't seem like

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Speaker 1: it was going to stop this war. Here's John.

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Speaker 5: It was a time in which we had a growing

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Speaker 5: feeling that the moral authority of the country was with

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Speaker 5: we the people, and was not in the administration in Washington.

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Speaker 1: Nixon later wrote in his memoirs that these protests quote

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Speaker 1: destroyed whatever small possibility may still have existed of ending

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Speaker 1: the war in nineteen sixty nine, which makes about as

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Speaker 1: much sense as smoking six packs a day and then

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Speaker 1: blaming your inphysema on the doctor who told you to quit.

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Speaker 1: Whoever's fault it was. And I happened to blame the

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Speaker 1: commander in chief of the United States Military, But that's

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Speaker 1: just me. The war did not end in nineteen sixty nine. Instead,

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Speaker 1: as the year came to a close, Nixon drafted a

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Speaker 1: whole new generation of men into the military to kill

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Speaker 1: and be killed in Vietnam.

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Speaker 3: Everybody, literally everybody knew a young man who was going

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Speaker 3: to Vietnam. You thought about your boyfriend, you thought about

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Speaker 3: your husband or your brother.

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Speaker 1: Christmas time, nineteen sixty nine, every family that included a

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Speaker 1: draft eligible young man crowded around their television set.

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Speaker 4: Pursue into the executive order, the Director's Sellective Service is

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Speaker 4: going to establish tonight random selection sekuch for induction for nineteen.

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Speaker 1: Seven eight teenagers just barely men perched on the edge

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Speaker 1: of their living room sofas nervously bouncing their knees and

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Speaker 1: drumming their fingers. Their parents hovered as the lottery unfolded

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Speaker 1: on the TV. Representatives in stiff suits reached their arms

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Speaker 1: into a fish bowl of blue plastic capsules, and the

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Speaker 1: young men at home prayed their birthdays wouldn't be called

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Speaker 1: September fourteen.

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Speaker 13: September fourteen zero zero one, April twenty four.

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Speaker 2: April twenty four is zero zero two.

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Speaker 13: December thirty, December thirty zero zero three.

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Speaker 6: In March, you rally, you write letters to members of Congress,

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Speaker 6: and none of it was making any difference whatsoever. In fact,

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Speaker 6: the war was worsening. Our voices were not being heard.

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Speaker 6: So there was a lot of anger and frustration, and

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Speaker 6: we decided to pursue a different kind of civil disobedience.

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Speaker 1: John and Bonnie's activism was about to get hardcore. Their

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Speaker 1: pursuit of civil disobedience brought them into contact with the

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Speaker 1: Catholic Peace Movement. To be clear, America's Catholic leadership were

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Speaker 1: not peacenicks. In fact, in nineteen sixty eight, the Archbishop

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Speaker 1: of New York counter protested at a peace rally, but

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Speaker 1: at the local level, many parish priests and their parishioners

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Speaker 1: felt the war contradicted their religious beliefs. They thought the

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Speaker 1: draft was wrong, and some of them were even willing

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Speaker 1: to violate earthly laws to fight it.

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Speaker 6: Strategy was to go into draft boards in the middle

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Speaker 6: of the night, to break into draft boards and remove

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Speaker 6: draft files and destroy them.

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Speaker 1: All American men aged eighteen to twenty five were required

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Speaker 1: to register with their local draft boards. These small offices

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Speaker 1: would store their draft files, which were necessary for actually

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Speaker 1: calling these men up to serve, but there were no

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Speaker 1: digital copies. Of course, everything ran on paper, which meant

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Speaker 1: that if someone broke into those draft boards and removed

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Speaker 1: or destroyed the files, the men in those files couldn't

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Speaker 1: be called up. It wasn't only the Catholic Peace movement

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Speaker 1: planning these raids, but many prominent draft board raiders were

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Speaker 1: priests or people close to them.

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Speaker 6: We love to say that we learned our burglary skills

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Speaker 6: from nuns and priests.

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Speaker 1: The draft board raids were strategic targeting offices specifically located

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Speaker 1: in poor neighborhoods.

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Speaker 6: The men that they were drafting were all low income,

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Speaker 6: disadvantaged men who were just caught up in the draft

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Speaker 6: and sent over there to be slaughtered or to slaughter.

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Speaker 3: Rich people were more likely to be able to hire

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Speaker 3: attorneys that would be able to get them out of serving,

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Speaker 3: get doctors to find either valid or invalid reasons why

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Speaker 3: they shouldn't serve. There was learning how to fake mental illness.

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Speaker 1: So Bonnie John and a gaggle of nuns and priests

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Speaker 1: broke into federal draft board offices and made off with

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Speaker 1: draft files in the dead of night. Then they mailed

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Speaker 1: the files to the young men, along with a letter

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Speaker 1: explaining that they believed the war in Vietnam was unjust,

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Speaker 1: and now these men had a choice. They could report

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Speaker 1: to their Draft board office and offer to serve if

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Speaker 1: they wished, or they could keep their file and sleep

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Speaker 1: a little better at night knowing they would never be called.

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Speaker 6: Well, we were triumphant. I mean we felt pretty good

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Speaker 6: about it. So I think we felt at least that

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Speaker 6: was one very concrete thing that we could do, that

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Speaker 6: we could accomplish.

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Speaker 1: But they weren't naive. These raids weren't slowing the war.

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Speaker 1: Young men were still going to Vietnam at alarming rates,

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Speaker 1: many of them never to come home.

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Speaker 3: There was such a feeling of deep despair and less hopefulness.

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Speaker 3: People really came to feel like we're having no impact.

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Speaker 3: This war is not going to end. People were debating

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Speaker 3: whether or not violence is appropriate.

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Speaker 1: Some fringe groups formed, like the infamous Weather Underground. They

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Speaker 1: began building bombs and blowing up public buildings. They issued

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Speaker 1: warnings in advance and usually struck at night when offices

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Speaker 1: were empty, but they wouldn't avoid casualties. On one tragic occasion,

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Speaker 1: a Weather Underground bomb accidentally detonated inside a townhouse in

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Speaker 1: New York City in the West Village, killing two members

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Speaker 1: of the group. The peace movement was worried that all

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Speaker 1: this escalation would discredit the movement, and soon that escalation

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Speaker 1: would be brutally answered by the government. On May fourth,

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Speaker 1: nineteen seventy, at Kent State University, more than two thousand

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Speaker 1: students gathered to protest the war. The scene was tense.

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Speaker 1: The National Guard fired tear gas into the crowd, then

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Speaker 1: protesters through rocks. Then the National Guard fired sixty seven

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Speaker 1: shots into the crowd. Nine unarmed students were injured and

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Speaker 1: four were killed. The war was coming home in a

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Speaker 1: horrifying way, which Neil Young eloquently captured in Ohio, a

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Speaker 1: song he wrote in the immediate aftermath of Kent State

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Speaker 1: as Summari. It was the first time American citizens were

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Speaker 1: killed while protesting the war in a gallup pole. Fifty

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Speaker 1: eight percent of Americans blamed the students for the shooting.

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Speaker 1: The peace movement was growing tired and exasperated, and on

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Speaker 1: top of all that, there was a growing paranoia amongst

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Speaker 1: activists in John and Bonnie's community, a lingering feeling that

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Speaker 1: a very powerful force was watching from the shadows.

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Speaker 6: We were very aware that the FBI was everywhere in Philadelphia. Surveillance, surveillance,

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Speaker 6: and intimidation were everywhere. Most of us were acutely aware

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Speaker 6: that that was happening.

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Speaker 1: According to Bonnie, it was easy to suss out the spies.

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Speaker 1: The peace movement had a certain fashion sense, long hair,

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Speaker 1: secondhand clothing, leather, fringe tied eye. But occasionally one would

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Speaker 1: spot somebody in the corner wearing all that stuff, with

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Speaker 1: a crew cut and wingtip shoes, also wielding a camera.

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Speaker 6: Pretty apparent that they were just everywhere everywhere.

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Speaker 1: March is meetings, you know, peaceful, legal, constitutionally protected assemblies,

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Speaker 1: and worse.

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Speaker 6: I would take the children to school in a carpool

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Speaker 6: and there would be a car behind us with two

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Speaker 6: men in it, and one of my kids would say,

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Speaker 6: do you think that's the FBI. I mean, that's how

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Speaker 6: pervasive it was that even my children wondered whether we

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Speaker 6: were being followed and watched. It's intimidating. It's really it

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Speaker 6: is intimidating.

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Speaker 1: To be fair, if this surveillance focused only on the

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Speaker 1: people who were illegally breaking into draft boards, well that

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Speaker 1: would be one thing, but all sorts of protesters felt

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Speaker 1: they were being watched, surveiled simply for exercising their First

382
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Speaker 1: Amendment right to free speech. Here's John Rains.

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Speaker 5: There was a feeling that the FBI worked for the

384
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Speaker 5: other side, the feeling that the FBI was used as

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Speaker 5: not simply an instrument of investigation, but an instrument of

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Speaker 5: intimidation that was using its power to pursue what we

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Speaker 5: felt to be highly unjust policies in Southeast Asil.

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Speaker 1: There's a term for this when a government starts keeping

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Speaker 1: tabs on people not because they're breaking the law, but

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Speaker 1: because they're criticizing the government. It's called a police state.

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Speaker 1: John and Bonnie had the nagging feeling that America was

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Speaker 1: becoming one, but they had no way of knowing for sure,

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Speaker 1: that is until they got a call from Bill Davidon

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Speaker 1: inviting them to a party. By nineteen seventy, peace activists

395
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Speaker 1: in Philadelphia had the eerie feeling that they were being

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Speaker 1: watched by the FBI. But what could be done about it?

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Speaker 1: It was incredibly hard to prove this was actually happening,

398
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Speaker 1: so people resigned themselves to this new reality, but not everyone.

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Speaker 8: I was becoming increasingly involved in things like peace marches

400
00:26:25,400 --> 00:26:28,920
Speaker 8: and giving talks against government policy.

401
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Speaker 1: This is Bill Davidan.

402
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Speaker 8: Another whole part of the movement.

403
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Speaker 5: I've had to do with draft resistance and sort of

404
00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:39,000
Speaker 5: actions which many people consider illegal.

405
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Speaker 1: Bill has passed away, but here he is in an

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Speaker 1: interview from twenty twelve.

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Speaker 10: I grew up in Newark, New Jersey. My childhood was

408
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Speaker 10: not somewhat unconventional one. I got interested in some aspects

409
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Speaker 10: of politics.

410
00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:03,640
Speaker 1: Bill's activism started early. When he was only eleven years old,

411
00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:06,000
Speaker 1: he heard the mayor of Jersey City had banned a

412
00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:09,760
Speaker 1: socialist from speaking there, so he boarded a bus all

413
00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:13,879
Speaker 1: by himself to protest, supporting a stranger's First Amendment rights.

414
00:27:14,760 --> 00:27:17,399
Speaker 1: When I was eleven, I spent weekends trading baseball cards

415
00:27:17,560 --> 00:27:21,119
Speaker 1: and picking up fart jokes. But Bill Daviadon was already

416
00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:23,159
Speaker 1: going miles out of his way to stand up for

417
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Speaker 1: free speech in the face of government repression. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I guess he could have also traded a few baseball

419
00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:32,000
Speaker 1: cards while he was there, But the point is when

420
00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:35,159
Speaker 1: he saw injustice, Bill took a stand.

421
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Speaker 10: I was concerned about political matters, but my energies were

422
00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:43,960
Speaker 10: more directed towards the threat of nuclear weapons.

423
00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:48,720
Speaker 1: Bill was studying to become a theoretical physicist. When the

424
00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:52,960
Speaker 1: United States dropped the first atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki,

425
00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:56,600
Speaker 1: he was devastated that the science he loved was being

426
00:27:56,640 --> 00:28:01,720
Speaker 1: corrupted for mass human casualty. Decades later, he was afraid

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00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:05,600
Speaker 1: that his country would use nuclear weapons in Vietnam. He

428
00:28:05,640 --> 00:28:09,119
Speaker 1: began protesting in Philadelphia, and it wasn't long before he

429
00:28:09,160 --> 00:28:13,439
Speaker 1: was rubbing shoulders with the Catholic peace movement. Bill was

430
00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:17,760
Speaker 1: a scientist and as such, a methodical and practical problem solver.

431
00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:23,200
Speaker 1: He often preferred simple solutions. Breaking into draft boards was dangerous,

432
00:28:23,760 --> 00:28:26,920
Speaker 1: but that didn't necessarily mean it always had to be complicated.

433
00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:30,399
Speaker 10: There are a number of different ways to open the

434
00:28:30,440 --> 00:28:34,000
Speaker 10: doors to draft boards. One of the simplest is that

435
00:28:34,080 --> 00:28:37,280
Speaker 10: in a couplifications we just put up a little sign

436
00:28:37,359 --> 00:28:41,360
Speaker 10: that said, please don't lock the door, and generally people

437
00:28:41,400 --> 00:28:42,360
Speaker 10: didn't lock the door.

438
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Speaker 14: He was a brilliant person. I think he had a

439
00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:54,200
Speaker 14: lot of motivation and determination and drive.

440
00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:57,480
Speaker 1: This is Sarah davidan Bill's daughter.

441
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Speaker 14: So we lived in a little town called Haverford, and

442
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:06,480
Speaker 14: there was a TV appliant store in Brinmar, which was

443
00:29:06,480 --> 00:29:08,760
Speaker 14: the next town over, maybe like a three or four

444
00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:12,440
Speaker 14: mile walk, And so he bought a TV and thought

445
00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:14,640
Speaker 14: that he could just walk back to his apartment with

446
00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:20,360
Speaker 14: this TV. And he's carrying this huge box down Lancaster Avenue,

447
00:29:20,600 --> 00:29:22,640
Speaker 14: and you know, that was pre cell phone, so he

448
00:29:23,080 --> 00:29:25,520
Speaker 14: couldn't like, you know, call an uber and say, yeah,

449
00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:30,480
Speaker 14: I was wrong. So he did the whole walk with

450
00:29:30,520 --> 00:29:33,720
Speaker 14: this TV, stopping like every half a block. And by

451
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:35,600
Speaker 14: the time he got there, I mean, he was just

452
00:29:35,640 --> 00:29:38,240
Speaker 14: like pouring sweat and he was like, you know, wiping

453
00:29:38,280 --> 00:29:42,040
Speaker 14: the sweat off of his face. But he got that

454
00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:46,760
Speaker 14: TV back to his apartment and he said, oh, it

455
00:29:46,880 --> 00:29:48,760
Speaker 14: ended up being a little bit heavier than I thought

456
00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:53,360
Speaker 14: it was, and I don't know why. That story in

457
00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:55,520
Speaker 14: particular is sort of like, you know, reminds me of

458
00:29:55,520 --> 00:29:56,880
Speaker 14: who my dad is. But I think it was just

459
00:29:56,880 --> 00:30:00,280
Speaker 14: sort of like this needs to be done, I'm going

460
00:30:00,320 --> 00:30:02,920
Speaker 14: to do it, like he just wanted to get things done,

461
00:30:03,080 --> 00:30:05,360
Speaker 14: like he wanted to get shit done. You know.

462
00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:10,760
Speaker 1: Bill was a doer and the kind of person his

463
00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:14,600
Speaker 1: community trusted, the kind of person you might come to

464
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:17,440
Speaker 1: if you thought big Brother was spying on you.

465
00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:23,440
Speaker 10: A lot of people felt they're being watched. Perfectly legitimate

466
00:30:23,520 --> 00:30:29,560
Speaker 10: organizations suspected FBI surveillance getting people to look over their

467
00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:33,400
Speaker 10: shoulder and to constantly worry about whether they're being watched

468
00:30:33,520 --> 00:30:36,400
Speaker 10: or not, and should create an atmosphere of fear.

469
00:30:38,520 --> 00:30:41,120
Speaker 1: If it was true that the FBI was surveilling peace

470
00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:44,640
Speaker 1: activists simply because of their protest activity, that would be

471
00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:47,200
Speaker 1: a violation of the First Amendment rights of the very

472
00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:51,520
Speaker 1: citizens the FBI was sworn to protect. But Bill also

473
00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:55,680
Speaker 1: worried that all of this surveillance might have another effect.

474
00:30:57,560 --> 00:31:03,200
Speaker 3: He felt that if act had this feeling that there

475
00:31:03,240 --> 00:31:08,280
Speaker 3: was FBI agent in their midst, it would build cynicism

476
00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:12,920
Speaker 3: and probably would lead to activists dropping out and to

477
00:31:12,960 --> 00:31:17,760
Speaker 3: other people just not coming into activism. For Bill, dissent

478
00:31:18,080 --> 00:31:22,000
Speaker 3: was at the heart of democracy. If the FBI was

479
00:31:22,040 --> 00:31:26,480
Speaker 3: spying on people, he regarded it as a crime, and

480
00:31:26,520 --> 00:31:28,520
Speaker 3: a crime that needed to be solved.

481
00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:31,680
Speaker 1: But Bill knew it would be no use accusing the

482
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:36,120
Speaker 1: FBI of such a crime unless he had cold, hard proof.

483
00:31:36,800 --> 00:31:40,840
Speaker 10: As frustrating party, because it's hard to get people to

484
00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:47,080
Speaker 10: be actively concerned with threats that are not visible.

485
00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:52,760
Speaker 1: Bill was a walking set of contradictions. Born to Jewish parents,

486
00:31:52,760 --> 00:31:55,720
Speaker 1: he was an atheist, yet actively involved in the Catholic

487
00:31:55,720 --> 00:31:59,280
Speaker 1: peace movement. Bill was quiet but still a natural leader,

488
00:31:59,760 --> 00:32:02,480
Speaker 1: had a rare gift for comprehending the mysteries of the

489
00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:06,880
Speaker 1: physical universe, and yet also purchased a big ass TV

490
00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:10,080
Speaker 1: with no plan for how to get it home. By

491
00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:13,920
Speaker 1: the early nineteen seventies, Bill and other activists started hearing

492
00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:17,440
Speaker 1: strange noises when they picked up their phones. Guys in

493
00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:22,120
Speaker 1: unconvincing hippie garb were showing up at protests and taking photos.

494
00:32:22,840 --> 00:32:26,440
Speaker 1: People who protested the war were being followed and intimidated.

495
00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:30,120
Speaker 1: So Bill looked at this evidence and formed a hypothesis

496
00:32:30,520 --> 00:32:34,480
Speaker 1: some organization, a federal law enforcement agency, to be precise

497
00:32:34,960 --> 00:32:39,440
Speaker 1: must be surveilling the anti war movement. Like any good scientists,

498
00:32:39,520 --> 00:32:43,960
Speaker 1: Bill knew the next step test the hypothesis.

499
00:32:43,560 --> 00:32:46,680
Speaker 3: And so he finds himself thinking about, would you dare

500
00:32:46,760 --> 00:32:48,640
Speaker 3: break into an FBI office?

501
00:32:49,080 --> 00:32:51,600
Speaker 14: How complicated would it be to go into the office.

502
00:32:53,160 --> 00:32:53,920
Speaker 7: Yeah, you know, I've no.

503
00:32:55,960 --> 00:33:01,080
Speaker 8: Records on what kinds of disruption.

504
00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:07,240
Speaker 1: If Bill was right about the FBI surveiling the peace movement,

505
00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:11,680
Speaker 1: then that meant they were probably keeping files documenting that surveillance.

506
00:33:12,440 --> 00:33:15,520
Speaker 1: Find the files and he'd have proof that the government

507
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:19,160
Speaker 1: was suppressing free speech. He didn't know anything for certain,

508
00:33:19,520 --> 00:33:22,239
Speaker 1: but even the possibility that this was going on was

509
00:33:22,280 --> 00:33:27,160
Speaker 1: intolerable to Bill Davidan. So Bill decided to throw a party.

510
00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:30,160
Speaker 1: He invited John and Bonnie Rains.

511
00:33:34,440 --> 00:33:37,720
Speaker 3: We stayed up late a lot talking about it.

512
00:33:38,400 --> 00:33:42,400
Speaker 6: Of course, we had more at risk because we had

513
00:33:42,440 --> 00:33:44,600
Speaker 6: three children under the age of ten.

514
00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:48,400
Speaker 1: John and Bonnie had already decided that if they said yes,

515
00:33:49,040 --> 00:33:52,640
Speaker 1: they'd take this action together, which made the decision that

516
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:56,840
Speaker 1: much more serious. This wasn't like breaking into a draft board.

517
00:33:57,320 --> 00:33:59,800
Speaker 1: People who'd been caught for that usually served a year

518
00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:03,840
Speaker 1: two at most, But breaking into an FBI office and

519
00:34:03,880 --> 00:34:07,880
Speaker 1: stealing confidential documents. That was the kind of crime that

520
00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:12,160
Speaker 1: came with decades of prison time. Their kids would lose

521
00:34:12,280 --> 00:34:14,160
Speaker 1: their mom and their dad.

522
00:34:15,120 --> 00:34:17,799
Speaker 6: I mean, you really can't use the fact that you're

523
00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:21,520
Speaker 6: a parent as an excuse to step back and not

524
00:34:21,600 --> 00:34:25,680
Speaker 6: be engaged. It just seemed that that was the one

525
00:34:25,719 --> 00:34:29,719
Speaker 6: and only way to reveal the truth. I mean, basically,

526
00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:32,759
Speaker 6: what it came down to were threats to our democracy.

527
00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:36,360
Speaker 6: I was raised with those kinds of values and the

528
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:42,360
Speaker 6: idea that you have an individual responsibility to protect our

529
00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:46,000
Speaker 6: fragile democracy and to tell the truth.

530
00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:51,640
Speaker 3: I was just really angry.

531
00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:56,239
Speaker 6: Really, and I was feeling so helpless and frustrated, and

532
00:34:56,280 --> 00:35:01,600
Speaker 6: I thought, here's something that might just make a great,

533
00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:05,280
Speaker 6: big difference, and maybe we can make it happen.

534
00:35:06,080 --> 00:35:10,399
Speaker 1: They called Bill, they said we're in. But they had

535
00:35:10,520 --> 00:35:14,919
Speaker 1: no idea what they were about to unleash, no way

536
00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:18,120
Speaker 1: of knowing that their action would fundamentally change the way

537
00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:22,160
Speaker 1: Americans thought about their country, their government, and the people

538
00:35:22,200 --> 00:35:26,840
Speaker 1: who were supposed to be keeping them safe. Oh yeah,

539
00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:29,720
Speaker 1: one more thing I should mention at this very moment

540
00:35:29,880 --> 00:35:32,440
Speaker 1: that Bonnie and John called Bill and agreed to be

541
00:35:32,520 --> 00:35:35,799
Speaker 1: part of his plot to burgle an FBI office. The

542
00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:44,680
Speaker 1: FBI was tapping Bill Davidan's phone. Next time on SNAFU,

543
00:35:45,200 --> 00:35:47,960
Speaker 1: david plans his attack on Goliath.

544
00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:50,720
Speaker 7: There is nothing mysterious about the meta which the Federal

545
00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:52,680
Speaker 7: Bureau of Investigation works.

546
00:35:53,120 --> 00:35:56,200
Speaker 12: He called me and asked me if I was interested

547
00:35:56,239 --> 00:35:59,720
Speaker 12: in going to a party, which was you know code,

548
00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:01,120
Speaker 12: I said, sign me on.

549
00:36:02,120 --> 00:36:05,600
Speaker 6: There were no alarms over the doors. I couldn't see

550
00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:07,960
Speaker 6: any security measures whatsoever.

551
00:36:08,239 --> 00:36:10,440
Speaker 12: It's really not hard and you can get through almost

552
00:36:10,520 --> 00:36:13,120
Speaker 12: any door in twenty seconds if you are any good.

553
00:36:13,800 --> 00:36:15,520
Speaker 6: I just felt like I was living in the heart

554
00:36:15,560 --> 00:36:17,759
Speaker 6: of the dragon and it was just my job to

555
00:36:17,800 --> 00:36:20,520
Speaker 6: stop the fire, and this seemed like a way to

556
00:36:20,600 --> 00:36:21,000
Speaker 6: do it.

557
00:36:34,640 --> 00:36:38,239
Speaker 1: Snapfoo is a production of iHeartRadio, Film, Nation Entertainment, and

558
00:36:38,280 --> 00:36:42,680
Speaker 1: Pacific Electric Picture Company in association with Gilded Audio. This

559
00:36:42,760 --> 00:36:45,239
Speaker 1: season of Snapfoo is based on the book The Burglary

560
00:36:45,320 --> 00:36:48,799
Speaker 1: The Discovery of j Edgar Hoover's Secret FBI, written by

561
00:36:48,800 --> 00:36:53,680
Speaker 1: Betty Metzger. It's executive produced by me Ed Helms, Milan Papelka,

562
00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:58,120
Speaker 1: Mike Walbo, Whitney Donaldson, Andy Chugg, Dylan Fagan, and Betty Metzger.

563
00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:02,719
Speaker 1: Our lead producers are Sarah Joyner and Alyssa Martino. Producer

564
00:37:02,800 --> 00:37:06,120
Speaker 1: is Stephen Wood. This episode was written by Albert Chen,

565
00:37:06,239 --> 00:37:08,920
Speaker 1: Sarah Joyner, and Stephen Wood, with additional writing and story

566
00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:12,560
Speaker 1: editing from Alissa Martino and Ed Helms. Tory Smith is

567
00:37:12,560 --> 00:37:16,160
Speaker 1: our associate producer. Nevin Calla Poly is our production assistant.

568
00:37:16,719 --> 00:37:20,680
Speaker 1: Fact checking by Charles Richter. Our creative executive is Brett Harris.

569
00:37:21,040 --> 00:37:25,120
Speaker 1: Sensitivity consult from Olowa Kemi, Ala de Sui, editing, sound

570
00:37:25,120 --> 00:37:28,600
Speaker 1: design and original music by Ben Chubg, Engineering and technical

571
00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:32,640
Speaker 1: direction by Nick Dooley. Additional editing from Kelsey Albright, Olivia

572
00:37:32,719 --> 00:37:36,960
Speaker 1: Canny and Jimma Castelli Foley. Theme music by Dan Rosatto.

573
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:40,640
Speaker 1: Special thanks to Alison Cohen, Daniel well shand Ben Rizak.

574
00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:43,919
Speaker 1: Additional thanks to director Johanna Hamilton for letting us use

575
00:37:43,920 --> 00:37:47,520
Speaker 1: some of the original interviews from her incredible documentary nineteen

576
00:37:47,600 --> 00:37:52,440
Speaker 1: seventy one. Finally, our deepest gratitude to the courageous Citizens

577
00:37:52,440 --> 00:37:56,880
Speaker 1: Commission to Investigate the FBI, Bill Davidon, Ralph Daniel, Judy

578
00:37:56,920 --> 00:38:01,120
Speaker 1: Fine Gold, Keith Forsyth, Bonnie Rains, John n Rains, Sarah

579
00:38:01,160 --> 00:38:03,319
Speaker 1: Schumer and Bob Williamson.

580
00:38:14,880 --> 00:38:14,920
Speaker 6: H