WEBVTT - Ep. 421: Backwoods University - Saving Wild Turkeys 0:00:03.120 --> 0:00:07.200 Welcome to Backwoods University, a place where we focus on wildlife, 0:00:07.320 --> 0:00:10.440 wild places and the people who dedicate their lives to 0:00:10.480 --> 0:00:13.480 conserving both. Big shout out to ONEX Hunt for their 0:00:13.520 --> 0:00:16.959 support of this podcast. I'm your host, Lake Pickle, and 0:00:17.000 --> 0:00:19.639 if you remember when we last spoke, I said that 0:00:19.760 --> 0:00:23.000 in this episode we would be learning about some life 0:00:23.040 --> 0:00:26.800 altering conservation work. My friends, this is the kind of 0:00:26.840 --> 0:00:29.760 wildlife conservation story that makes me want to stand up 0:00:29.800 --> 0:00:32.519 and start cheering. This is the kind of story that 0:00:32.560 --> 0:00:34.680 you'll want to tell your friends about. And believe me 0:00:34.760 --> 0:00:37.760 when I say, if you have ever had the privilege 0:00:37.800 --> 0:00:41.480 of hunting, hearing, or watching wild turkeys in the springtime, 0:00:41.720 --> 0:00:45.400 which we are quickly approaching, I dare say this story 0:00:45.479 --> 0:00:48.639 and conversation will send shills down your spine and make 0:00:48.720 --> 0:00:51.680 you even more thankful for every turkey you hear, see, 0:00:51.800 --> 0:00:54.240 or take. From here on out, let's get into it. 0:01:07.840 --> 0:01:11.399 Yeah that's good. 0:01:11.600 --> 0:01:18.160 Come on in, sir, Hey, how are you good morning? 0:01:18.200 --> 0:01:25.039 I'm Lake. Nice to meet you, Lake, Yes, ma'am. Yeah, okay, 0:01:25.360 --> 0:01:32.520 yes I can. It's early February and I've driven a 0:01:32.520 --> 0:01:35.399 few hours north from my home in central Mississippi to 0:01:35.440 --> 0:01:38.080 meet a man named mister Benny Herring to talk about 0:01:38.080 --> 0:01:41.720 his involvement in one of the greatest wildlife conservation wins 0:01:41.760 --> 0:01:42.880 in the country's history. 0:01:43.520 --> 0:01:45.480 Oh, just now, what what do you need to do? 0:01:45.520 --> 0:01:47.560 You want to just sit down and visit or how 0:01:47.600 --> 0:01:48.280 do you want to do this? 0:01:48.440 --> 0:01:51.640 I was, now, yes I do. Steve said, I need 0:01:51.640 --> 0:01:54.480 to ask you about your turkey room. 0:01:55.200 --> 0:02:02.680 This is my room. Yeah, that's fifty something years. 0:02:02.400 --> 0:02:03.960 Of junk junk. 0:02:04.320 --> 0:02:11.320 Yeah. Yeah, I have been pretty fortunate. I've been able 0:02:11.320 --> 0:02:16.400 to hunt a lot of places, and yes, been pretty 0:02:16.400 --> 0:02:20.280 well about as blessed as you can be, as far 0:02:20.280 --> 0:02:22.680 as being able to hunt and go with your wife, 0:02:22.800 --> 0:02:28.560 being very supportive and had quite a career. And I've 0:02:28.680 --> 0:02:31.560 just been fortunate. Yeah, I can tell you. 0:02:32.360 --> 0:02:34.640 I followed mister Benny to his office in his house. 0:02:34.919 --> 0:02:38.200 The room is lined all the way around with turkey beards, 0:02:38.520 --> 0:02:41.520 various wildlife and hunting photos of him and his friends 0:02:41.760 --> 0:02:44.320 taken from all around the country and other parts of 0:02:44.360 --> 0:02:47.359 the world. I see pictures of buffalo hunting in Africa, 0:02:47.639 --> 0:02:51.560 wingshooting in Argentina, along with deer, elk and antelope skulls, 0:02:51.840 --> 0:02:54.600 and some of the longest turkey spurs. I have ever 0:02:54.680 --> 0:02:57.680 laid eyes on. It became very clear to me that 0:02:57.760 --> 0:03:02.320 this man has seen and done a lot lot quite 0:03:02.320 --> 0:03:05.920 a collection of beards and spurs, and I've been lucky. 0:03:05.960 --> 0:03:09.679 Of course. I've been hunting turkeys a long time, A 0:03:09.760 --> 0:03:10.320 long time. 0:03:11.720 --> 0:03:14.560 Yeah, you got some long spurred turkeys. 0:03:14.120 --> 0:03:16.720 Mike, Well, yes, I've got some pretty good ones they 0:03:17.320 --> 0:03:19.480 olly my goodness. 0:03:19.680 --> 0:03:21.640 Yeah, yeah, thank you for doing this. 0:03:21.840 --> 0:03:26.880 Well, you're welcome. I always try to bene fifty turkeys 0:03:27.000 --> 0:03:31.040 best again, you know, work with them for years, and 0:03:31.040 --> 0:03:34.960 when you're about it, you don't never really quit being one. 0:03:35.480 --> 0:03:36.280 Can you this chair? 0:03:37.000 --> 0:03:40.320 Yeah? Move it, do whatever you need to do. Just 0:03:40.720 --> 0:03:43.960 you know, I'm following your lead. You just the way 0:03:44.000 --> 0:03:44.400 you want to. 0:03:45.040 --> 0:03:49.680 Mister Biddy possesses a rare quality. Truly, that's not blowing smoke. 0:03:50.200 --> 0:03:54.400 The zeal And adoration for wildlife, and particularly the wild turkey, 0:03:54.840 --> 0:03:57.400 was so evident in the first few minutes of meeting 0:03:57.400 --> 0:03:59.840 this man. I was just so excited to set up 0:03:59.840 --> 0:04:02.600 my podcast gear and get this interview under way. I 0:04:02.680 --> 0:04:05.920 knew before the formal conversation even got started that this 0:04:06.000 --> 0:04:08.200 man was going to have some incredible things to share 0:04:08.200 --> 0:04:10.520 with all of us. And believe me, he did. 0:04:13.040 --> 0:04:19.480 I started turkey hunting in nineteen seventy. Okay a Tyler County, 0:04:19.520 --> 0:04:24.120 which is the county just south of Montgomery County, opened 0:04:24.800 --> 0:04:28.600 their turkey season in nineteen seventy and my friend Won 0:04:28.680 --> 0:04:35.320 O'Neill lived in Caraziesco. And he and another fella were 0:04:35.360 --> 0:04:38.880 about the only two turkey hunted in Tyler County. And 0:04:39.000 --> 0:04:41.400 I got invited down there to go turkey hunton. And 0:04:41.480 --> 0:04:44.719 that was in nineteen seventy, the first time I ever 0:04:44.839 --> 0:04:46.279 went turkey hunting in my life. 0:04:46.480 --> 0:04:49.440 Did you had you heard of anyone doing it prior 0:04:49.480 --> 0:04:52.320 to that? Was there anybody around that was turkey hunt not. 0:04:52.400 --> 0:04:56.400 Here in this county. Now One O'Neill of course lived 0:04:56.440 --> 0:05:00.719 at Carazisco. He had turkey hunted some in the southern 0:05:00.720 --> 0:05:06.120 part of the state. And I did not know anybody 0:05:06.640 --> 0:05:10.760 personally that turkey hunting. Now later on, of course, we 0:05:10.800 --> 0:05:15.960 opened aparts from Montgomery County the following year and there 0:05:16.080 --> 0:05:18.320 was about three of us here in the county that 0:05:18.400 --> 0:05:25.000 turkey hunted. Yeah, it was just you know, things were 0:05:25.040 --> 0:05:31.240 different then you could turkey hunt anywhere in the county 0:05:31.279 --> 0:05:36.920 and never see another individual. Uh so about three of 0:05:37.000 --> 0:05:39.240 us and that was about it, and of course it 0:05:39.440 --> 0:05:40.719 changed as time went on. 0:05:41.160 --> 0:05:43.200 I wish there was three turkey hunters in the county 0:05:43.240 --> 0:05:43.880 I live in now. 0:05:44.960 --> 0:05:49.359 Yeah, well I understand it, I really do. 0:05:50.120 --> 0:05:52.560 There's a few key things we can pull out from 0:05:52.560 --> 0:05:55.160 this first little bit mister Benny has shared with us. 0:05:55.440 --> 0:05:58.880 In that one short story, he made mention of several 0:05:58.960 --> 0:06:02.679 things that demonstrate how different turkey hunting and turkey hunting 0:06:02.680 --> 0:06:06.680 culture was back in nineteen seventy when he started Number one, 0:06:06.800 --> 0:06:10.120 the county he started turkey hunting in opened their season 0:06:10.120 --> 0:06:14.360 in nineteen seventy, as in turkey hunting wasn't allowed before then. 0:06:14.800 --> 0:06:17.599 Think back once again to the Fanny Cook episode and 0:06:17.640 --> 0:06:20.720 the Mississippi Game and Fish Commission being established in nineteen 0:06:20.839 --> 0:06:23.560 thirty two. One of the first things that commission did 0:06:23.880 --> 0:06:27.360 was start protecting game species that had been grossly over hunted, 0:06:27.600 --> 0:06:30.679 turkey's being one of them. Mister Betty started hunting turkeys 0:06:30.760 --> 0:06:33.719 right at the very beginning of some hunting starting to 0:06:33.720 --> 0:06:37.600 be opened back up in a very limited manner. Number two, 0:06:38.000 --> 0:06:39.880 did you hear him say that he was one of 0:06:40.000 --> 0:06:42.840 three turkey hunters in the entire county and that he 0:06:42.920 --> 0:06:46.479 didn't know of anyone not a soul that turkey hunting 0:06:46.520 --> 0:06:48.240 in the county that he lived in at the time. 0:06:48.720 --> 0:06:52.120 My friends, if that alone does not screen that we 0:06:52.160 --> 0:06:55.320 are talking about an entirely different era. I don't know 0:06:55.360 --> 0:06:58.320 what does These days in Mississippi you can throw a 0:06:58.440 --> 0:07:01.719 rock and hit three turkey hunters. It's a different time. 0:07:02.279 --> 0:07:05.080 But mister Benny was coming up in a crucial part 0:07:05.120 --> 0:07:08.920 of turkey conservation history, and we're gonna fully dive into that, 0:07:09.200 --> 0:07:11.760 but before we do, I want to hear the last 0:07:11.800 --> 0:07:14.720 bit of this story so that we can really appreciate 0:07:14.880 --> 0:07:17.720 how much this man loves wild turkeys. 0:07:18.280 --> 0:07:20.720 That first year was fruitful, and of course after I 0:07:20.760 --> 0:07:23.000 shot that first turkey, it was all over. 0:07:23.080 --> 0:07:26.000 I should see you were able to call a turkey 0:07:26.080 --> 0:07:26.880 in that first year? 0:07:27.040 --> 0:07:27.680 Sure was? 0:07:27.800 --> 0:07:28.600 What was that? Like? 0:07:29.640 --> 0:07:35.240 Unbelievable? You know, nowadays, when you see a turkey approaching 0:07:35.800 --> 0:07:39.520 in full strut and gobbling, you've probably done it a 0:07:39.520 --> 0:07:44.040 good bit and you don't, I reckon, you kind of 0:07:44.240 --> 0:07:48.480 take it for granted. But that first time, now, you 0:07:48.560 --> 0:07:54.600 don't ever recover from that. If you really really love turkey, Yeah. 0:07:53.600 --> 0:07:55.120 That's a good way to put it. You don't ever 0:07:55.160 --> 0:07:59.960 recover and never recover. Mister Benny Herring loves wild turkeys. 0:08:00.200 --> 0:08:03.040 That much is clear. So now let's get into the 0:08:03.080 --> 0:08:05.880 meat of this conversation and learn about his work as 0:08:05.880 --> 0:08:10.920 a wildlife biologist. How did you get into the biology 0:08:10.960 --> 0:08:11.480 side of it? 0:08:12.040 --> 0:08:17.840 Well, I graduated from Delfas State with a BS and biology, 0:08:18.600 --> 0:08:22.239 and I thought I might want to be a teacher, 0:08:24.280 --> 0:08:30.200 but I soon found out that with a BS you 0:08:31.240 --> 0:08:34.120 could hardly live on what you'd get paid as a teacher. 0:08:34.920 --> 0:08:38.040 And at that time I heard about a wildlife school 0:08:38.040 --> 0:08:41.560 at Mississippi State University, and I went over there and 0:08:41.559 --> 0:08:46.680 applied and was accepted and got my master's degree in 0:08:46.720 --> 0:08:51.400 wildlife in Mississippi State, and immediately went to work for 0:08:51.440 --> 0:08:54.680 the Game and Fish and I spent thirty two years 0:08:54.679 --> 0:09:00.760 there with him, and I had numerous probly that I 0:09:00.920 --> 0:09:05.319 was involved in. I was involved in Morning the project 0:09:05.440 --> 0:09:08.880 where we increased finally got to increase in the bag 0:09:08.960 --> 0:09:13.880 limit UH. And then our turkey biologiest at that time 0:09:14.040 --> 0:09:17.880 was named Champ Clark, and he was killed on one 0:09:17.920 --> 0:09:20.360 of our wildlife managineers when he fell off of a 0:09:20.440 --> 0:09:24.840 tractor and the disk ran over him. And I had 0:09:24.880 --> 0:09:27.520 been working with Champ a good bed at that time, 0:09:27.840 --> 0:09:32.359 and uh, it just somehow another failed my lot to 0:09:32.400 --> 0:09:38.240 start doing the turkeys restoration. And so for the next 0:09:38.280 --> 0:09:42.520 ten years I was heavily involved in that, and we 0:09:42.559 --> 0:09:46.680 trapped turkeys in numerous locations throughout the state. 0:09:47.840 --> 0:09:51.680 As mentioned earlier, this was an important time in wild 0:09:51.679 --> 0:09:55.760 turkey conservation history. You heard mister Benny just make reference 0:09:55.800 --> 0:09:58.600 to trapping turkeys. This was a huge part of the 0:09:58.600 --> 0:10:03.640 restoration process, trapping turkeys and then relocating them to where 0:10:03.679 --> 0:10:06.680 there were none and then allowing them to repopulate. I 0:10:06.720 --> 0:10:08.640 want to ask him more about this, and just the 0:10:08.679 --> 0:10:11.360 heads up, you're going to hear him mention something called 0:10:11.520 --> 0:10:15.720 cannon netting, also sometimes referred to as rocket netting. It's 0:10:15.720 --> 0:10:19.760 a bird capturing technique used to safely catch large numbers 0:10:19.760 --> 0:10:22.560 of birds, and it's carried out by using cannons to 0:10:22.600 --> 0:10:25.040 fire a large net over the top of a group 0:10:25.080 --> 0:10:29.080 of birds. How far along had turkey restoration been going 0:10:29.120 --> 0:10:30.559 on when you got put in that position? 0:10:31.800 --> 0:10:36.239 Of course, the restoration of the turkey and in Mississippi 0:10:36.320 --> 0:10:39.720 and the Southeast really began in the late med the 0:10:39.800 --> 0:10:45.920 late sixties when they realized that cannon netting, which was 0:10:46.040 --> 0:10:49.880 used to trap waterfowl first could also be used to 0:10:50.160 --> 0:10:54.080 trap wile turkeys for restoration, and that's when things begin 0:10:54.200 --> 0:10:57.679 to really take off and improve. Up to then, you know, 0:10:58.480 --> 0:11:00.600 they had been all kind of f it's made of 0:11:01.520 --> 0:11:06.480 raising turkeys and releasing them, and of course it was ineffective, sure, 0:11:06.720 --> 0:11:10.120 but when you took the wild turkeys and put them 0:11:10.160 --> 0:11:13.280 into good habitat, they flourished real quick. 0:11:13.480 --> 0:11:14.080 Yeah. 0:11:14.559 --> 0:11:18.480 So it started in the late sixties and in the 0:11:18.880 --> 0:11:25.000 in seventies up until the mid eighties. Yeah, it really well. 0:11:25.240 --> 0:11:29.520 In fact, we repopulated the state of Mississippi. Yeah, yeah, 0:11:29.600 --> 0:11:30.000 there it did. 0:11:30.480 --> 0:11:33.960 That's why. Well, one you really were in at the 0:11:33.960 --> 0:11:35.120 beginning of it then. 0:11:35.280 --> 0:11:36.440 Right close to the star. 0:11:36.760 --> 0:11:41.440 Yeah, and it's so you know, talking to folks that 0:11:41.559 --> 0:11:44.760 hunt around the southeast. Now, I mean there's counties that 0:11:44.840 --> 0:11:46.480 don't have a lot of turkeys, but I don't know 0:11:46.480 --> 0:11:48.200 if there's any counties that don't have any. 0:11:48.480 --> 0:11:52.760 I think I think I'm correct on this, and that 0:11:53.320 --> 0:11:58.840 in Mississippi all are parts of the county has some 0:11:59.040 --> 0:11:59.920 type of turkey sea. 0:12:00.280 --> 0:12:03.959 And hearing you know, hearing you and other folks talk 0:12:04.040 --> 0:12:06.880 about these times were because there were counties back then 0:12:06.960 --> 0:12:10.080 that didn't have turkeys, correct, none the different world. 0:12:10.720 --> 0:12:13.560 Well see, at that time, of course, it wasn't just 0:12:14.040 --> 0:12:16.240 you go catch turkeys and turn them loose. You had 0:12:16.280 --> 0:12:18.800 to go through a process. You'd have a munch of 0:12:18.880 --> 0:12:22.600 club of joining landowners that would get together and they 0:12:22.640 --> 0:12:24.920 would request from the Game and Fish of a far 0:12:25.080 --> 0:12:29.200 my wildlife to be put on the list to receive 0:12:29.400 --> 0:12:33.320 a release of wild turkeys. And course when we got 0:12:33.360 --> 0:12:37.480 their requests, of biologists went and evaluated the property to 0:12:37.559 --> 0:12:41.800 be considered and back and then you know, we thought, okay, 0:12:42.360 --> 0:12:46.360 if you got ten thousand acres under agreement, you can 0:12:46.400 --> 0:12:50.200 provide good protection and the birds will do well. We 0:12:50.320 --> 0:12:54.600 have since learned that it didn't have to be that large, okay, yeah, 0:12:54.640 --> 0:12:58.160 but at that time we did right. And of course 0:12:58.200 --> 0:13:00.920 at that time we didn't think that you could drivive 0:13:01.720 --> 0:13:07.079 in pine plantations. See the turkeys that we were familiar 0:13:07.200 --> 0:13:11.640 with were in good hardwood block September Man. 0:13:12.840 --> 0:13:15.320 That's wild. Yeah, well, I mean, because I mean, just 0:13:15.360 --> 0:13:17.760 thinking about today, it's like not i mean not a 0:13:17.800 --> 0:13:21.240 mismanaged pine plantation, but a pine plantation that's taken care 0:13:21.280 --> 0:13:24.040 of and you know, burned and such a turkey be 0:13:24.160 --> 0:13:26.600 all in there, all in there, But back then they 0:13:26.679 --> 0:13:31.439 all didn't know. That's right, different world. Yeah, absolutely, that's fascinating. 0:13:32.080 --> 0:13:36.320 Yeah yeah, man. I cannot tell you just how much 0:13:36.400 --> 0:13:40.160 I love these old school conservation stories, just thinking about 0:13:40.240 --> 0:13:42.760 those men and women with little more than a love 0:13:42.840 --> 0:13:46.480 for wild things and wild places and determination to figure 0:13:46.480 --> 0:13:49.360 out how to keep that kind of stuff on this landscape. 0:13:49.640 --> 0:13:52.680 Just those tiny little details like not knowing a turkey 0:13:52.679 --> 0:13:55.880 could survive on a pine plantation. Heck, these days, a 0:13:55.920 --> 0:13:58.360 turkey gobblin in the pines goes together like a worm 0:13:58.400 --> 0:14:02.080 on a brim hook. But it does is because these 0:14:02.120 --> 0:14:05.960 wildlife conservationists that came before us picked up the torch 0:14:06.280 --> 0:14:09.199 and they figured it out. So let's learn how they 0:14:09.240 --> 0:14:12.839 figured it out when y'all started canning that and how 0:14:12.840 --> 0:14:16.120 did you figure how did you determine a location? I mean, 0:14:16.200 --> 0:14:18.120 I mean, I'm having to think that there was a 0:14:18.120 --> 0:14:19.760 little bit of like, how do we even do this? 0:14:19.920 --> 0:14:20.080 You know? 0:14:20.080 --> 0:14:26.200 Okay, Well, if like on Friest Point Refuge, you had 0:14:26.240 --> 0:14:30.200 a fairly good population of birds there, so what we 0:14:30.240 --> 0:14:33.440 would do? Wayne Shrider the main one, he was the 0:14:33.480 --> 0:14:36.200 main trapper, and I helped him every all I could 0:14:36.600 --> 0:14:38.720 of course, first thing he would look for was an 0:14:38.760 --> 0:14:42.920 opening or a space big enough that you could fire 0:14:43.000 --> 0:14:46.400 the net in. And it was about sixty B sixty, 0:14:46.640 --> 0:14:49.200 but you could get along one of those roads or 0:14:49.440 --> 0:14:52.720 junction of roads. And what we would do we would 0:14:52.800 --> 0:14:57.240 prebate using wheat most of the time, and we would 0:14:57.240 --> 0:15:00.760 string a bait line, probably a quarter mile each direction 0:15:00.920 --> 0:15:03.680 down that road. And then you go to checking it, 0:15:04.120 --> 0:15:07.120 see what kind of usage you're getting. And then when 0:15:07.120 --> 0:15:10.600 they get at the main location and they're taking it, 0:15:11.320 --> 0:15:13.960 cleaning it up every day, you sit you in it. 0:15:15.280 --> 0:15:19.440 And when they come to feed the next time, you 0:15:19.520 --> 0:15:19.960 catch them. 0:15:20.080 --> 0:15:22.720 Yeah, that's cool. Yeah, And what do you so you 0:15:22.760 --> 0:15:24.880 get these turkeys in the net? How do you get 0:15:24.880 --> 0:15:26.760 them and get them into a place where you could 0:15:26.760 --> 0:15:27.360 transport them? 0:15:27.440 --> 0:15:32.800 Okay, what you do prior to catching the turkeys? We 0:15:32.840 --> 0:15:37.240 would buy a bunch of pasteboard boxes and we would 0:15:37.240 --> 0:15:40.640 put them together, tape them together, and we'd cut a 0:15:41.040 --> 0:15:43.480 flap in the bottom of that box that we could 0:15:43.560 --> 0:15:47.160 stick the turkey in and then turn it upside down 0:15:47.280 --> 0:15:50.440 with a flap down on the ground with a turkey 0:15:50.480 --> 0:15:53.800 standing on it, and we would take them all out 0:15:53.840 --> 0:15:56.120 of the net, put them in a box and then 0:15:56.200 --> 0:15:59.160 we would load them in a truck. And most of 0:15:59.200 --> 0:16:01.720 the time we would have people from the area that 0:16:01.840 --> 0:16:07.200 the turkeys were going to station somewhere within two or 0:16:07.200 --> 0:16:10.480 three miles of us, and we would either call them 0:16:10.520 --> 0:16:12.880 to come to us or we'd carry the turkeys to them. 0:16:13.600 --> 0:16:16.800 And we tried to and we didn't ever get it exact, 0:16:17.000 --> 0:16:20.960 but we wanted to have ten hens and five goblers 0:16:21.000 --> 0:16:22.040 per release sight. 0:16:22.400 --> 0:16:23.320 Ah. 0:16:23.920 --> 0:16:28.200 Sometimes we'd have more hens than that, sometimes less. Sometimes 0:16:28.240 --> 0:16:31.880 we'd have more gobless and sometimes less. Sure and then 0:16:32.000 --> 0:16:35.680 they would go and release the birds. And when they 0:16:35.840 --> 0:16:37.520 release them, of course they'd take them out of that 0:16:37.640 --> 0:16:40.880 truck that they were transported in, put them on the ground, 0:16:41.600 --> 0:16:44.760 open all of the flaps, cut the tape at the 0:16:44.840 --> 0:16:48.720 flaps and open them at the same time so all 0:16:48.720 --> 0:16:50.720 the birds could go simultaneous. 0:16:50.720 --> 0:16:52.240 Ah, Yes, they'd be together. 0:16:52.400 --> 0:16:56.200 Yeah, And then we would do the best we could 0:16:56.480 --> 0:17:02.200 monitor those birds. And under most circum stances it would 0:17:02.240 --> 0:17:06.520 be five years and we would open short seasons. That's 0:17:06.560 --> 0:17:10.840 how fast they would respond to good habitat. Yeah, yeah, man. 0:17:11.200 --> 0:17:13.800 Yeah, How did you monitor them well? 0:17:13.880 --> 0:17:17.240 Of course, first off, if you consulted with the conservation 0:17:17.359 --> 0:17:21.359 officer in that county, and he had contacts with the 0:17:21.440 --> 0:17:25.159 clubs that had requested and they would keep records and 0:17:25.240 --> 0:17:29.120 tell him when they saw poles and hens here, gobblers here. 0:17:29.960 --> 0:17:34.480 And also we used county mail carriers, the local mail 0:17:34.560 --> 0:17:37.840 carrier that he had a world of information. 0:17:37.880 --> 0:17:38.560 Just seeing them. 0:17:39.040 --> 0:17:41.400 Where did you see turkeys? How many did you see? 0:17:42.600 --> 0:17:45.560 So you've put all of that together, and you assume 0:17:46.080 --> 0:17:50.639 that you've had pretty good reproduction for four to five years, 0:17:51.240 --> 0:17:54.360 and if you did, then you opened a short gobblers 0:17:54.400 --> 0:17:55.120 only season. 0:17:55.320 --> 0:17:57.520 What would the season look like sometimes when you open 0:17:57.560 --> 0:17:58.720 the season up, what would you say? 0:17:58.760 --> 0:18:04.520 Sometime it would be two weekends, sometimes short, fair short? Yeah, 0:18:04.560 --> 0:18:08.760 always started off fair shot. Yeah, and if you know 0:18:08.880 --> 0:18:12.160 you could if you had success and things went well, 0:18:12.320 --> 0:18:14.840 then just like the rest of the state in the 0:18:14.920 --> 0:18:18.320 deer season, turkey season and everything, you gradually increased. 0:18:18.400 --> 0:18:21.399 Yeah. What was the attitudes like if you know, in 0:18:21.440 --> 0:18:25.320 an area where you've done one of these relocations, four 0:18:25.400 --> 0:18:27.760 or five years later, y'all open up a short season 0:18:28.400 --> 0:18:31.240 and folks get to go out and hunt these turkeys 0:18:31.280 --> 0:18:34.800 a little bit. How were they just drilled? Thrilled? 0:18:35.000 --> 0:18:35.440 Thrilled? 0:18:36.040 --> 0:18:38.320 When mister Benny shared this part of the story with me. 0:18:38.560 --> 0:18:41.080 I caught myself trying to get in the headspace of 0:18:41.160 --> 0:18:43.800 one of those county residents that had watched or at 0:18:43.880 --> 0:18:48.720 least known about turkey relocations and then after five years, 0:18:48.840 --> 0:18:52.560 got to experience an actual spring turkey season. They were 0:18:52.600 --> 0:18:56.240 watching wildlife conservation and restoration happen right in front of 0:18:56.240 --> 0:18:59.719 their eyes back then. And seriously, how cool would it 0:18:59.760 --> 0:19:02.520 be to track down one of those mail carriers from 0:19:02.520 --> 0:19:04.920 that time period and talk to them about their job 0:19:04.960 --> 0:19:10.000 as an official turkey observer man. That is just too cool. Seriously, 0:19:10.320 --> 0:19:13.160 if anyone out there has any connection to someone who 0:19:13.200 --> 0:19:15.359 was a mail carrier at that time and help the 0:19:15.400 --> 0:19:19.040 Game Commission back then, please let me know. I would 0:19:19.119 --> 0:19:31.600 love to talk to them. Okay, so we have a 0:19:31.640 --> 0:19:34.720 good idea about the actual process of how they caught 0:19:34.760 --> 0:19:37.119 these turkeys and released them. But I now want to 0:19:37.160 --> 0:19:39.160 move into what I believe is one of the most 0:19:39.160 --> 0:19:43.720 important and also really cool parts of this story, and honestly, 0:19:43.960 --> 0:19:46.639 enrolling the mail carrier's help is a good example of 0:19:46.680 --> 0:19:49.560 the direction we're going now. The Game and Fish Commission 0:19:49.600 --> 0:19:52.200 at the time was one small agency to be able 0:19:52.240 --> 0:19:55.679 to carry out this turkey restoration at the statewide scale 0:19:55.680 --> 0:19:58.200 that they wanted to, they would have to have help. 0:19:58.800 --> 0:20:02.119 Like I've said before, I'm interested in the relationship that 0:20:02.160 --> 0:20:05.480 we as humans have with our wildlife and the impacts 0:20:05.520 --> 0:20:08.480 that we have never ceased to amaze me, and this 0:20:08.600 --> 0:20:10.879 part of the story is worth highlighting. 0:20:11.800 --> 0:20:15.919 Probably the premier place that we trapped turkeys was on 0:20:16.040 --> 0:20:19.480 Friar's Point Refuge, which is in Kahoma County on the 0:20:19.560 --> 0:20:23.320 river between the river and the levee. There's a family 0:20:23.400 --> 0:20:26.440 over there that still own land over there, a name 0:20:26.520 --> 0:20:31.440 of McKees, and mister and mus McKee set up about 0:20:31.520 --> 0:20:36.520 four thousand acres as a refuge for us to trap 0:20:36.600 --> 0:20:37.960 and transplant turkeys on. 0:20:38.520 --> 0:20:42.320 Were these people so they own this land, yeah, and 0:20:42.359 --> 0:20:44.160 they set it aside. They didn't hunt it at all. 0:20:45.520 --> 0:20:47.119 Were they turkey hunters themselves? 0:20:47.280 --> 0:20:48.520 I don't think so. 0:20:49.800 --> 0:20:51.040 What was their motive for? 0:20:51.160 --> 0:20:55.320 I think that I never met mister McKee, but I 0:20:55.400 --> 0:20:59.240 met Ms McKee later on, and they had such an 0:20:59.320 --> 0:21:03.800 indust in the promotion of wildlife conservation in the state 0:21:03.840 --> 0:21:09.120 of Mississippi. And at that time we called them game 0:21:09.200 --> 0:21:11.560 warders back then, but there was a game warder who's 0:21:11.600 --> 0:21:15.000 a conservation officer now by the name of Wayne Striter 0:21:15.200 --> 0:21:18.399 that lived in Kahoma County, and he was very good 0:21:18.400 --> 0:21:22.560 friends with the McKees. Yeah, and he was instrumental in 0:21:23.480 --> 0:21:27.120 that refuse being set up. And he was also instrumental 0:21:27.760 --> 0:21:32.480 and catching no telling how many turkeysh for restoration in 0:21:32.520 --> 0:21:35.440 the state of Mississippi. Yeah, very few people ever heard 0:21:35.480 --> 0:21:39.320 of Wayne Strid but he that's a name you should remember. 0:21:39.960 --> 0:21:44.720 He was a real good conservation auser. He was a 0:21:44.760 --> 0:21:50.280 better turkey trapper and I got to know him real 0:21:50.320 --> 0:21:54.320 well and spent a lot of time with him trapping 0:21:54.359 --> 0:21:55.439 and releasing turkeys. 0:21:56.280 --> 0:21:59.520 I just think it's I mean, I knew from just 0:21:59.600 --> 0:22:01.679 doing some research. I knew a good bit of the 0:22:01.720 --> 0:22:04.560 trap and for relocation took place somewhere along the river. 0:22:05.040 --> 0:22:08.119 I had no idea. It was some private landowners that 0:22:08.200 --> 0:22:09.480 set it aside for y'all to do that. 0:22:09.560 --> 0:22:12.840 Well, that was the main place. There were other places 0:22:12.880 --> 0:22:16.520 like middle Point Home Club, Catfish Porn hung Club. They 0:22:16.680 --> 0:22:20.240 allowed us to trap turkeys at various times for restoration, 0:22:21.080 --> 0:22:26.480 and other private individuals around Columbia. Mister Bill Walker allowed 0:22:26.560 --> 0:22:29.480 us to trap on his place. And it was just 0:22:29.600 --> 0:22:32.640 a lot of private people that knew that they had 0:22:32.680 --> 0:22:36.400 good turkey populations, and they wanted to see them all 0:22:36.440 --> 0:22:37.119 over the state. 0:22:37.480 --> 0:22:39.240 So really it was a collective effort. 0:22:39.680 --> 0:22:41.040 It was Oh, yes, man. 0:22:41.240 --> 0:22:42.560 Yes, I love that. 0:22:42.800 --> 0:22:44.960 Yeah. Oh it's it's great. 0:22:45.880 --> 0:22:48.840 I'm gonna once again refer back to the Fanny Cook 0:22:48.880 --> 0:22:51.639 episode to a quote that we pulled by out of 0:22:51.760 --> 0:22:55.080 Leopold when he was talking about the wildlife challenges that 0:22:55.119 --> 0:22:57.800 the state of Mississippi was up against. This is what 0:22:57.880 --> 0:23:01.440 he wrote. There's one office to all of these defects, 0:23:01.800 --> 0:23:06.040 a widespread and intense popular interest in game and hunting. 0:23:06.400 --> 0:23:10.280 In this respect, Mississippi excels any other state so far 0:23:10.440 --> 0:23:13.520 surveyed by me. Leephold then goes on to say in 0:23:13.600 --> 0:23:16.960 so many words that leveraging this popularity of hunting by 0:23:17.040 --> 0:23:20.000 using education at agencies was going to be the only 0:23:20.080 --> 0:23:23.080 way to maintain a game supply in the state. And 0:23:23.160 --> 0:23:25.800 we found out back in nineteen thirty two that they 0:23:25.800 --> 0:23:29.880 were seeing very clear lines connecting hunters and conservationists as 0:23:29.960 --> 0:23:34.040 the clear pathway to saving wildlife. Fast forward to the 0:23:34.119 --> 0:23:37.320 late nineteen sixties and nineteen seventies. To win the Mississippi 0:23:37.320 --> 0:23:40.919