WEBVTT - A New York (Mag) State of Mind 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:03.760 I'm off my game today. No, you're not. People are 0:00:03.800 --> 0:00:05.640 going to have to start making better content. I think 0:00:05.640 --> 0:00:07.160 we're gonna be talking about this for a long time. 0:00:07.240 --> 0:00:10.200 When you program for everyone, you program for no one. 0:00:10.240 --> 0:00:12.319 I think it's that we're purpose driven platform, like we're 0:00:12.320 --> 0:00:15.600 trying to get to substance. How was that? Are you 0:00:15.680 --> 0:00:19.200 happy with that? This is marketing therapy right now? It 0:00:19.480 --> 0:00:30.480 really is? What's up? Laura And I'm Alexa Kristin. Welcome 0:00:30.480 --> 0:00:34.279 back to Atlantia. Laura's in New Jersey today calling in 0:00:34.720 --> 0:00:37.920 so close but so far away. I miss you. I 0:00:38.000 --> 0:00:41.200 miss you in the studio. So today we have Pam 0:00:41.200 --> 0:00:45.400 Wasserstein coming in UM from New York Media. They own 0:00:45.680 --> 0:00:50.159 brands like New York Magazine, Vulture, The Cut, the Strategists, Intelligence, 0:00:50.159 --> 0:00:54.640 are lots of other brands. Kind of an amazing story 0:00:54.880 --> 0:00:57.320 because what I don't think a lot of people know 0:00:57.760 --> 0:01:00.600 is that they're privately owned company, one of the few 0:01:01.440 --> 0:01:04.520 uh still around. You know. Pam has been on board 0:01:04.640 --> 0:01:07.000 for a few years now as CEO, and they have 0:01:07.120 --> 0:01:09.880 really pushed and she's really pushed the company to think 0:01:09.920 --> 0:01:14.960 about and get into very quickly, UH digital publishing. They 0:01:15.000 --> 0:01:17.840 didn't have what I think a lot of companies have, 0:01:18.440 --> 0:01:25.119 which is creating brands more organically and in the digital space. Yeah, 0:01:25.280 --> 0:01:28.800 it stands for a perspective, and there's certainly a sort 0:01:28.840 --> 0:01:31.399 of level of premium associated with that. I think that's 0:01:31.400 --> 0:01:33.960 reflective in the fact that they just created a paywall 0:01:34.000 --> 0:01:37.840 in front of their content. Um, they're moving into merchandise 0:01:37.920 --> 0:01:40.440 with some of their brands. They're thinking about, you know, 0:01:40.560 --> 0:01:43.559 how to take the business offline and really tap into 0:01:43.560 --> 0:01:46.440 the community and create a closer one to one engagement. 0:01:46.560 --> 0:01:49.120 And so even though the brands, the individual brands which 0:01:49.120 --> 0:01:52.560 you just mentioned earlier are leading UM with their unique 0:01:52.720 --> 0:01:56.080 sort of perspective and what they're covering, sort of the 0:01:56.400 --> 0:01:59.600 quality when you step back of what you expect from 0:01:59.600 --> 0:02:02.880 New York Media backed properties, I think is consistent and 0:02:02.880 --> 0:02:06.280 it'll be fun to hear um that perspective from Pam. 0:02:06.320 --> 0:02:10.880 So with that, Pam from New York Media, we'll be 0:02:10.960 --> 0:02:26.760 right back. We are back in the studio with Pam Wasserstein, 0:02:26.919 --> 0:02:32.639 CEO of New York Media, Vulture, The Cut, New York Magazine. 0:02:32.840 --> 0:02:36.240 What other brands intelligence are the Strategist You guys have 0:02:36.320 --> 0:02:40.320 so many amazing brands. Welcome Pam, Thank you so much 0:02:40.720 --> 0:02:43.480 happy to be here. Guys, We're so happy to have you. 0:02:43.639 --> 0:02:47.280 Laura's calling in from Jersey. Hi. Everyone. So Pam, before 0:02:47.320 --> 0:02:50.720 we get into the business, we want to talk about 0:02:50.720 --> 0:02:54.560 how you came to be CEO of the business. Uh. Well, 0:02:54.600 --> 0:02:57.560 I definitely did not start my career in media at all. 0:02:57.600 --> 0:03:00.440 I was a corporate lawyer for several years, and then 0:03:00.440 --> 0:03:03.600 I worked in private equity on the investment side, totally 0:03:03.600 --> 0:03:07.440 different world, very very different. And then well, so for me, 0:03:07.639 --> 0:03:11.360 I wanted to do something more entrepreneurial, something more creative. 0:03:11.400 --> 0:03:14.640 I ended up working at Tribeca Film which was you know, 0:03:14.760 --> 0:03:19.640 Tribeca Film Festival, and UM a bunch of other things, 0:03:19.880 --> 0:03:23.640 and I ended up leading corporate development there. Stayed for 0:03:23.680 --> 0:03:25.920 about five years, and then I came over to New 0:03:26.000 --> 0:03:29.000 York Media, originally as a head of strategy and then 0:03:29.240 --> 0:03:32.520 UM moving into the CEO position. So what was the 0:03:32.600 --> 0:03:35.320 kind of for you, the thought process or the kind 0:03:35.320 --> 0:03:38.440 of passion that drove you into like, yep, this this 0:03:38.480 --> 0:03:41.000 feels right, this is right. I always loved media. I 0:03:41.040 --> 0:03:44.480 was passionate about media, but I was neither a journalist 0:03:44.640 --> 0:03:47.880 nor an advertising salesperson, and back in the day that 0:03:47.960 --> 0:03:50.560 was sort of where the opportunities were in the industry, 0:03:50.600 --> 0:03:53.520 one of those paths typically, right, So I think what 0:03:53.760 --> 0:03:57.760 changed for me was that the industry changed and then 0:03:57.800 --> 0:04:01.680 the business changed, and so suddenly there were a much 0:04:02.080 --> 0:04:05.720 bigger set and frankly for me, a more interesting set 0:04:05.960 --> 0:04:11.040 of problems and opportunities to start to dig into. So 0:04:11.360 --> 0:04:14.720 you know, you suddenly are thinking about and a lot 0:04:14.760 --> 0:04:17.839 of them tie to the future broadly, like what what 0:04:18.080 --> 0:04:21.240 is the future um of marketing, what is the future 0:04:21.560 --> 0:04:27.000 of content consumption and business models? Yeah, for sure, New 0:04:27.080 --> 0:04:31.599 York was such an incredible brand that was still fresh 0:04:31.680 --> 0:04:35.640 and vibrant and had a lot of I think opportunity 0:04:35.960 --> 0:04:41.680 in the digital world and a really loyal, you know, 0:04:41.800 --> 0:04:44.280 kind of core audience that we could build on. It's 0:04:44.279 --> 0:04:46.440 a mainstay. I mean, so I would say, like in 0:04:46.480 --> 0:04:50.000 New York the Post, in New York Magazine, and you 0:04:50.000 --> 0:04:52.480 can walk into a New Yorker's home and you'll see 0:04:52.520 --> 0:04:56.159 both of those publications. It's a mainstay and part of 0:04:56.160 --> 0:04:59.599 the opportunity for our business, right was moving from that 0:04:59.680 --> 0:05:03.920 kind and traditional in print. We're sort of four hundred 0:05:03.920 --> 0:05:09.080 thousand circulation and New York d m a right, Um, 0:05:09.160 --> 0:05:11.120 so it does tend to be more regional, and then 0:05:11.279 --> 0:05:15.000 digitally we're like million monthly uniques on our own and 0:05:15.040 --> 0:05:19.120 operated sites, and you know, quite national and even international. 0:05:19.720 --> 0:05:23.039 What we're able to do when the Internet arrived just 0:05:23.120 --> 0:05:27.280 kind of take that voice and authority which was always 0:05:27.600 --> 0:05:29.840 through the fifty year history of New York Magazine sort 0:05:29.880 --> 0:05:34.720 of ambitious and not really tied or limited to the geography. 0:05:34.800 --> 0:05:38.200 It was always sort of trying to lead a cultural conversation. 0:05:38.600 --> 0:05:43.080 But now there's so many new opportunities to achieve that. 0:05:43.440 --> 0:05:45.920 One of the things that you all are obviously known 0:05:45.960 --> 0:05:48.839 for very well is covering things that are central to 0:05:48.920 --> 0:05:52.440 New York, right but understandably to scale and you know, 0:05:52.640 --> 0:05:55.640 reach forty five million people with information that obviously goes 0:05:55.680 --> 0:06:01.080 beyond what's happening within New York City. What was sort 0:06:01.120 --> 0:06:05.000 of the reason to move into things like the strategists 0:06:05.080 --> 0:06:07.839 or intelligence or like, what were the insights that said, hey, 0:06:07.880 --> 0:06:12.159 we need to expand beyond covering or talking about things 0:06:12.279 --> 0:06:16.160 just happening specific to New York. So that kind of 0:06:16.320 --> 0:06:21.719 strategic push toward truly national coverage has been a long 0:06:21.720 --> 0:06:24.719 time coming. I would spend probably twelve years now since 0:06:24.760 --> 0:06:28.320 we first started UM one of what we call our 0:06:28.440 --> 0:06:32.320 our verticals, our our digital brands, which was for scrub Street, 0:06:32.400 --> 0:06:36.799 which covers restaurants and food, and Vulture came pretty quickly 0:06:36.839 --> 0:06:40.799 after that, which covers culture and entertainment. Several legacy print publishers, 0:06:40.839 --> 0:06:44.440 I think we're more hesitant to publish digitally because you know, 0:06:44.480 --> 0:06:47.159 concerned about cannibalization of the print model and so forth. 0:06:47.600 --> 0:06:52.080 We didn't really have that. Yeah. Yeah, for us, it 0:06:52.279 --> 0:06:55.320 was like, oh, we you know, our audience loves our 0:06:55.360 --> 0:06:58.520 cultural coverage. We can do so much more of it, 0:06:58.800 --> 0:07:02.040 you know, in this arment and like serve our audience 0:07:02.080 --> 0:07:06.239 better and more with our sensibility, take that lens and 0:07:06.480 --> 0:07:10.320 kind of mix it with Internet voice and optimized for 0:07:11.160 --> 0:07:15.440 you know, digital audiences. So it was relatively early, certainly, 0:07:15.600 --> 0:07:19.080 I think for legacy print publishers that that we were 0:07:19.760 --> 0:07:22.520 very gung ho about that, and I think on the 0:07:22.560 --> 0:07:25.080 one the end, there was opportunity to serve our audience 0:07:25.720 --> 0:07:27.840 even more. And then on the other hand, the business 0:07:27.920 --> 0:07:33.320 model encouraged national coverage, so um digitally in an advertising 0:07:33.320 --> 0:07:38.920 based model, typically local is a tough, tough business, a 0:07:39.000 --> 0:07:43.480 tough business, right, So, and even when we started grab Street, 0:07:43.520 --> 0:07:46.400 which was more local and its coverage because it was 0:07:46.480 --> 0:07:49.720 more service and news around New York restaurant scene. And 0:07:49.760 --> 0:07:53.880 then Vulture. What we quickly found was that you know, 0:07:53.920 --> 0:07:57.560 for sort of the same resources, that you could talk 0:07:57.600 --> 0:08:00.440 about something with more local interest, you could talk about 0:08:00.480 --> 0:08:02.920 at the time, gossip Girl or Madman something like that 0:08:03.760 --> 0:08:07.920 and reach an enormous, really engaged audience and find new audiences. 0:08:07.920 --> 0:08:11.720 So that was a pretty exciting discovery for us, and 0:08:12.040 --> 0:08:16.240 we just kept kind of growing, growing and building on that. Yeah, 0:08:16.400 --> 0:08:20.280 has that impacted the voice of New York magazine? The 0:08:20.400 --> 0:08:24.040 need to go national? Do you find yourselves appealing to 0:08:24.080 --> 0:08:26.760 an audience beyond New York? Do you find that that's 0:08:26.840 --> 0:08:30.480 changed the way you cover news or politics or style 0:08:30.600 --> 0:08:33.400 or do you still feel that you have a specific 0:08:33.840 --> 0:08:36.800 lens at what you're covering things. It's a great question. 0:08:37.000 --> 0:08:40.840 I think our voice is everything, Like differentiation in the 0:08:40.880 --> 0:08:43.480 digital world, I think is everything, and so we we 0:08:43.679 --> 0:08:48.320 try really hard to stay specific and true to that voice. Yes, 0:08:48.760 --> 0:08:52.080 and you know that that's how we build real loyalty 0:08:52.080 --> 0:08:55.360 and connection with our audience. I think just going scale 0:08:55.440 --> 0:08:58.760 for the sake of scale is not ultimately a winning game. 0:08:58.840 --> 0:09:02.320 You really need um you do need to achieve scale, 0:09:02.360 --> 0:09:06.400 but you also need a loyal, engaged audience, and to 0:09:06.440 --> 0:09:09.439 do that, your brand has to mean something and continue 0:09:09.640 --> 0:09:12.880 to mean something over time. There does need to be 0:09:12.920 --> 0:09:15.000 I think of voice and a sensibility, and at least 0:09:15.400 --> 0:09:18.520 in our case, we're very, very focused on that and 0:09:19.120 --> 0:09:21.520 kind of think of that as our core asset from 0:09:21.559 --> 0:09:26.200 which the business follows. People that are in the kind 0:09:26.200 --> 0:09:31.679 of cultural no like Saturday Night Live bring you guys 0:09:31.760 --> 0:09:34.720 up in their skits, and it's this hilarious thing to me, 0:09:34.800 --> 0:09:39.760 that culture when he's on Saturday Left. But and it's 0:09:39.840 --> 0:09:41.360 I think happened a couple of times where they like, 0:09:41.400 --> 0:09:43.400 if you didn't read it in Vulture, then you don't know, 0:09:43.520 --> 0:09:45.559 like if it's not in Vulture, then it doesn't exist, 0:09:45.679 --> 0:09:47.880 or something like that. You know, something to that effect. 0:09:48.280 --> 0:09:50.480 And I think it's funny because at the end of 0:09:50.480 --> 0:09:52.880 the day, as a New Yorker, as New Yorkers, we 0:09:52.920 --> 0:09:54.960 know the SNL is like kind of this, it is 0:09:55.000 --> 0:09:58.160 the New York Lens, but everyone in the world is watching. 0:09:58.720 --> 0:10:01.240 It's very very SIMI learned to that, right. Yeah, that's 0:10:01.240 --> 0:10:03.760 a great analogy actually, And it's funny because I also 0:10:03.840 --> 0:10:07.160 think there's this halo of that brand, but then there's 0:10:07.200 --> 0:10:10.760 a core that voice in that perspective that no matter 0:10:10.960 --> 0:10:15.920 where you are, it's not about geography, it's about mindset 0:10:15.960 --> 0:10:20.120 and mentality our audience. We try to understand our audience 0:10:20.160 --> 0:10:23.040 really well and they it's sort of a psychographic right 0:10:23.320 --> 0:10:27.000 it is. And the voice is also is not New 0:10:27.040 --> 0:10:29.480 York the place. It's New York the idea of sort 0:10:29.480 --> 0:10:34.160 of sophisticated, smart, witty, empathetic and and that's what we're 0:10:34.160 --> 0:10:37.440 going for and there are a lot of people who 0:10:37.880 --> 0:10:41.400 are really hungry for that right now in particular, but 0:10:41.679 --> 0:10:45.199 over years as well. Yeah, So with a further push 0:10:45.200 --> 0:10:49.120 into digital, you know, obviously you've launched podcast now you 0:10:49.240 --> 0:10:54.040 are kind of two days. You've also implemented a paywall 0:10:54.160 --> 0:10:56.880 in front of your content, So there's a lot of 0:10:57.440 --> 0:11:01.400 change and use of technology to obviously both build community 0:11:01.440 --> 0:11:04.800 but now also recognize the premium nature I'm assuming, which 0:11:04.840 --> 0:11:07.080 is why you have the paywall of the content that 0:11:07.120 --> 0:11:10.360 you're producing. Can you talk about some of those changes 0:11:10.520 --> 0:11:13.840 that you're making as we move into twenty nineteen that 0:11:13.960 --> 0:11:16.360 the marketplace needs to be aware of and sort of 0:11:16.600 --> 0:11:20.960 new platforms and why the paywall. So our digital subscription 0:11:21.080 --> 0:11:25.240 which we launched actually this week, which is exciting and 0:11:26.080 --> 0:11:28.920 thank you. And on the tech side, we largely built 0:11:28.920 --> 0:11:32.640 it ourselves. We have a custom content management system that 0:11:32.720 --> 0:11:36.040 we developed ourselves that we actually license and partner with 0:11:36.080 --> 0:11:39.199 other publishers on as well, and then so we've built 0:11:39.240 --> 0:11:43.520 our subscription capabilities into that and it's an exciting next 0:11:43.600 --> 0:11:47.040 step for our business. Been a year now that we've 0:11:47.080 --> 0:11:50.960 been seriously working on implementing the paywall, not not even 0:11:50.960 --> 0:11:53.960 from the tech perspective, but the messaging and marketing is 0:11:54.440 --> 0:11:58.000 really goes hand in hand, especially because the subscription goes 0:11:58.040 --> 0:12:01.680 across all our brands, which is a great value. And 0:12:01.800 --> 0:12:04.920 part of the theory is that because there is really 0:12:05.040 --> 0:12:08.240 a tight DNA around all our brands, and the subject 0:12:08.280 --> 0:12:11.840 matter and focus is different, you know, that's between Vulture, 0:12:11.880 --> 0:12:16.640 the Cut, Intelligencer, etcetera, but the sensibility is quite tightly similar. 0:12:17.000 --> 0:12:21.240 And so if you are a Vulture reader a Vulture user, 0:12:21.520 --> 0:12:24.760 you're likely reading about politics somewhere, or you're likely reading 0:12:24.760 --> 0:12:28.520 about a technology and new ideas somewhere, and you're probably 0:12:28.559 --> 0:12:32.559 going to love Intelligencer, and if you're not, then kind 0:12:32.600 --> 0:12:36.160 of tightening to our consumers. The connection among all our 0:12:36.200 --> 0:12:39.040 brands I think helps bring value to them and introduce 0:12:39.120 --> 0:12:44.120 them to more opportunities to engage with us and engage 0:12:44.120 --> 0:12:47.600 with these brands that they will likely really enjoy. New 0:12:47.679 --> 0:12:52.240 York Media is a pretty unknown brand. You say New 0:12:52.320 --> 0:12:54.840 York Meg and people are like, oh, yeah, okay, right 0:12:54.840 --> 0:12:57.880 of course, right are you thinking about New York Media 0:12:58.200 --> 0:13:01.560 kind of that brand coming out more or is it 0:13:01.640 --> 0:13:03.480 stay in the background. Is it just a kind of 0:13:03.520 --> 0:13:05.880 more of a business brand and you let the kind 0:13:05.880 --> 0:13:10.160 of individual publications shine through. So that is our corporate name. 0:13:10.320 --> 0:13:13.400 It was frankly somewhat of an accidental corporate name which 0:13:13.440 --> 0:13:16.120 didn't really matter for a while. It doesn't really It 0:13:16.160 --> 0:13:19.640 almost still it almost still doesn't matter unless it needs to. 0:13:19.840 --> 0:13:21.920 I think from a like a business perspective, and it 0:13:21.960 --> 0:13:24.080 depends on where you're taking it, and it depends on 0:13:24.120 --> 0:13:27.120 how you're thinking about it. Well, we did have some 0:13:27.240 --> 0:13:30.560 conversation around our digital subscription. What do you call the 0:13:30.640 --> 0:13:34.960 thing if Vulture, which now has a pretty loyal and 0:13:35.240 --> 0:13:40.880 independent of New York mag audience, to introduce them to 0:13:41.240 --> 0:13:45.120 this subscription, what do you call it? And what we 0:13:45.240 --> 0:13:47.960 decided is to call it the New York subscription. I 0:13:48.000 --> 0:13:49.920 love that, but I think it's right. I think it's 0:13:49.960 --> 0:13:53.319 simple and it has again it's that lens, right. So 0:13:53.480 --> 0:13:55.840 I think for now New York Media will stay a 0:13:55.920 --> 0:13:59.560 kind of corporate and not really consumer facing brand. But 0:13:59.640 --> 0:14:01.920 New York Work is very much a consumer facing brand. 0:14:02.040 --> 0:14:05.440 So that's the way we treat it. Have you acquired 0:14:05.520 --> 0:14:09.679 any brands, they've really been you've built, it's been organic. Yeah. 0:14:10.040 --> 0:14:14.800 We did acquire Splitsider, which is a comedy focused site 0:14:15.080 --> 0:14:18.960 and really had a passionate fan base in the comedy community, 0:14:19.000 --> 0:14:21.680 and we incorporated that into Vulture and kind of made 0:14:21.680 --> 0:14:25.440 it the heart of the comedy vertical within Vulture. So 0:14:25.480 --> 0:14:29.560 many of these individual brands have followings, right, They have 0:14:29.640 --> 0:14:32.760 these communities. And one of the things that I've enjoyed 0:14:33.040 --> 0:14:37.200 watching the brand do, particularly New York Mag and The Cut, 0:14:37.320 --> 0:14:40.360 is the ability to reach the community offline around things 0:14:40.480 --> 0:14:43.520 like Fashion Week and some of the events that you curry. 0:14:43.600 --> 0:14:46.760 I think there's this expectation that sort of you get 0:14:46.800 --> 0:14:49.880 this insider perspective when you're hanging out with New York 0:14:49.920 --> 0:14:53.000 Mag and The Cut. Can you talk about that sort 0:14:53.040 --> 0:14:57.800 of online offline aspect of your business. Look, we are 0:14:58.240 --> 0:15:03.160 trying to engage our audience and sort of be that trusted, 0:15:03.360 --> 0:15:08.800 authoritative um friend for our audiences as much as we 0:15:08.840 --> 0:15:12.440 can be and deep in connections. One way to deepen 0:15:12.520 --> 0:15:15.920 connection and have a tangible relationship with a publishing brand 0:15:16.000 --> 0:15:18.280 is through print. It's not the only way, but you know, 0:15:19.000 --> 0:15:23.400 in an ephemeral world, to have like a thing that 0:15:23.480 --> 0:15:28.080 you kind of snuggle up with and enjoy is actually 0:15:28.160 --> 0:15:32.920 pretty powerful. But another form of tangible connection is around events. 0:15:33.480 --> 0:15:36.120 We just did a Vulture Festival in l A a 0:15:36.120 --> 0:15:39.720 couple of weeks ago, which you know, something like over 0:15:39.760 --> 0:15:42.840 ten thousand people come to and the programming of Vulture 0:15:42.880 --> 0:15:47.480 Festival is designed towards the Vulture voice, and it's a 0:15:47.520 --> 0:15:50.280 little bit like witty and quirky and interesting, and we 0:15:50.400 --> 0:15:54.920 got stars of the Vulture universe to come and interact 0:15:54.960 --> 0:15:58.720 with the audience in bringing The Cut to We have 0:15:58.800 --> 0:16:01.800 a co production with let Media now for the Cuts 0:16:01.800 --> 0:16:05.280 podcasts The Cut on Tuesdays, which there too, It's like, okay, 0:16:05.360 --> 0:16:08.880 how can we deepen our relationship with our audience and 0:16:09.200 --> 0:16:12.800 be more of a habit for you and be your 0:16:12.840 --> 0:16:16.080 partner for your life for a lot of aspects of 0:16:16.120 --> 0:16:21.080 your life, um, help you be informed and help you 0:16:21.720 --> 0:16:26.040 understand the world, be entertained all of that. Who are 0:16:26.080 --> 0:16:28.640 some people that you're following in things that you're thinking 0:16:28.640 --> 0:16:33.440 about to expand not just the brands, but expand their footprint, 0:16:33.520 --> 0:16:38.520 expand the kind of offline online relationship where you guys 0:16:38.560 --> 0:16:41.280 show up our brand. The Strategist is a little bit 0:16:41.280 --> 0:16:45.000 different from the restaurant brands in the sense it's a 0:16:45.000 --> 0:16:49.200 product recommendation site. The tagline is shop Smartly, or we 0:16:49.240 --> 0:16:54.120 have another tagline that's an obsessively curated internet emporium and 0:16:54.160 --> 0:16:57.520 it's doing really well and has all these like passionate 0:16:57.640 --> 0:17:03.360 fans who basically come the Strategists to help navigate internet shopping. 0:17:04.000 --> 0:17:07.679 So there too, we took authority that we had historically 0:17:08.280 --> 0:17:11.080 in the case of shopping. New York Magazine from day 0:17:11.080 --> 0:17:14.520 one in nineteen sixty was publishing something like best Bets 0:17:14.560 --> 0:17:17.600 and telling you cool new things to buy, what's a deal, 0:17:17.840 --> 0:17:21.399 what's what's beautiful, what's different? I'm always looking for the 0:17:21.480 --> 0:17:25.000 what's different, and that's kind of the strategist sweet spot. 0:17:25.480 --> 0:17:29.359 UM is there's a sense of discovery and it should 0:17:29.400 --> 0:17:33.280 be something typically that you wouldn't necessarily find on your own. 0:17:33.440 --> 0:17:35.359 One of the trends that Alex and I have been 0:17:35.400 --> 0:17:37.720 monitoring for quite some time has been the idea of 0:17:37.760 --> 0:17:42.200 personality as platform and the idea that communities galvanized around 0:17:42.240 --> 0:17:46.480 people's perspectives and opinions. How are you thinking about elevating 0:17:47.080 --> 0:17:51.520 journalists as talent? I think yes absolutely that. You know, 0:17:51.640 --> 0:17:56.440 the individual brand in journalism and elsewhere is very much 0:17:56.800 --> 0:18:00.960 a trend and a trend that's continuing. Ideally there mutually 0:18:01.119 --> 0:18:06.639 reinforcing kind of synergistic relationship between the editorial brand and 0:18:06.680 --> 0:18:12.080 then the individuals where everyone is made better and offers 0:18:12.160 --> 0:18:14.359 a better product at the end of the day to 0:18:14.400 --> 0:18:19.440 your audience. Intelligence Or which recently Uh kind of launched 0:18:19.520 --> 0:18:22.080 in a more ambitious way, has this really cool homepage 0:18:22.119 --> 0:18:26.040 experience you like slack integration with the editors, right, and 0:18:26.119 --> 0:18:30.000 so you can actually talk to them and find out 0:18:30.000 --> 0:18:32.840 what they're thinking about certain things that are happening. I'm 0:18:32.880 --> 0:18:36.199 personally just such a fan of that because in my 0:18:36.280 --> 0:18:40.560 own life, lurking in our editorial slack channels is like, 0:18:41.160 --> 0:18:44.560 it's just the phenomenal. Yeah, it's so phenomenal, And we 0:18:44.600 --> 0:18:47.480 wanted to kind of bring a piece of that experience 0:18:47.560 --> 0:18:50.479 to our audience, and people seem to really love it. 0:18:50.720 --> 0:18:54.200 Also in a time where there's some distrust of media, 0:18:54.440 --> 0:18:57.960 right a thing showing your work a little bit, and 0:18:58.200 --> 0:19:04.000 I think helping our audiences understand what goes into what 0:19:04.040 --> 0:19:06.919 we do, proving out kind of why we do have 0:19:07.040 --> 0:19:10.360 the authority that we have with our audiences is powerful. 0:19:10.720 --> 0:19:13.159 What are some of the partnerships that you've executed or 0:19:13.440 --> 0:19:18.760 are working towards executing that demonstrate where the business is headed. Well, So, 0:19:18.880 --> 0:19:20.760 one partner that we work with in a lot of 0:19:20.920 --> 0:19:24.879 front ways is Amazon right this Strategist, which is a 0:19:25.000 --> 0:19:29.639 truly editorial product, but you know, it's largely an affiliate 0:19:29.800 --> 0:19:33.000 revenue business, which is of fascinating because we're we're suddenly 0:19:33.200 --> 0:19:37.600 in the commerce business. We've done a lot of you know, 0:19:37.720 --> 0:19:44.840 internal technology work to produce really interesting and useful insights 0:19:45.080 --> 0:19:48.640 around purchase behavior people are saying, and then actually we're 0:19:48.640 --> 0:19:52.360 able to take those insights to our grand clients and 0:19:52.560 --> 0:19:58.680 help you know them build better eCOM experiences or content 0:19:58.760 --> 0:20:02.720 experiences a around their objectives. What are your thoughts on 0:20:03.160 --> 0:20:06.240 the status of print as a media channel. How does 0:20:06.280 --> 0:20:08.959 that affect the decisions that you're making on the business side, 0:20:09.200 --> 0:20:13.520 and what would your advice be two buyers in the market, 0:20:13.600 --> 0:20:16.720 who are you know, deciding whether or not that's a 0:20:16.800 --> 0:20:18.879 channel they want to think about in their media plans. 0:20:18.880 --> 0:20:22.199 In I do think it should continue to be an 0:20:22.200 --> 0:20:26.200 important piece of a media plan. It's a great brand play, 0:20:26.359 --> 0:20:31.000 and I think sometimes in the marketing mix, some advertisers 0:20:31.080 --> 0:20:37.919 have moved too far, too far down the funnel, and 0:20:38.600 --> 0:20:42.040 you're not going to see the impact of that right away, right. 0:20:42.119 --> 0:20:44.560 But if you're if you're really like being strategic about 0:20:44.560 --> 0:20:46.480 your marketing mix, you need the lower funnel and you 0:20:46.480 --> 0:20:52.000 also need the upper funnel. We agree with that. To agree, Um, 0:20:52.040 --> 0:20:55.400 you know, it's it's not digital all the time. It's 0:20:55.440 --> 0:20:58.719 definitely not print all the time. But it's where those 0:20:58.760 --> 0:21:02.320 things and how you use those things and the content 0:21:02.680 --> 0:21:07.120 right obviously matters. And people, you know, print subscribers, they 0:21:07.200 --> 0:21:12.040 really love those publications, right, and they are an engaged audience. 0:21:12.280 --> 0:21:15.959 It's a pleasure, it's a treat to I haven't to 0:21:15.960 --> 0:21:19.000 cuddle up with your favorite magazine. There are a ton 0:21:19.080 --> 0:21:21.520 of digital brands that you know not to mention away 0:21:21.560 --> 0:21:24.440 suitcases like DTC brands who are coming out with their 0:21:24.480 --> 0:21:28.440 own publication. Yes, I think there's a reason why so 0:21:28.480 --> 0:21:32.520 many of businesses still go to the New York Times, 0:21:32.520 --> 0:21:36.280 still go to New York mag to create an impact, right, 0:21:36.320 --> 0:21:38.760 to make a statement, and to really create sort of 0:21:38.760 --> 0:21:42.000 a clear, concise communication that's going to get attention in 0:21:42.000 --> 0:21:44.600 a way that digital I just don't think has the 0:21:44.640 --> 0:21:48.119 ability to do. So. I am all in on print. 0:21:48.320 --> 0:21:51.560 Yeah it is. It's a high impact medium. Yeah, I 0:21:51.880 --> 0:21:55.520 totally agree, Pam. What would you kill? What would you buy? 0:21:55.560 --> 0:21:58.560 And then what would you do yourself? What would you 0:21:59.000 --> 0:22:05.200 what would you kill some of the self reporting fake stuff? 0:22:05.480 --> 0:22:09.920 What would you buy for both buy and build. I've 0:22:09.960 --> 0:22:13.200 been thinking a lot about products these days, bringing new 0:22:13.359 --> 0:22:18.200 exciting experiences to our audiences. How can we developed products 0:22:18.440 --> 0:22:23.840 like physical physical products? Yeah, The Cut has done these 0:22:23.960 --> 0:22:26.520 T shirts and collaboration with Amazon. There's a new T 0:22:26.640 --> 0:22:30.080 shirt every week. We've thought about it as content you 0:22:30.119 --> 0:22:34.280 can live in. Basically an Amazon had originally encouraged us 0:22:34.440 --> 0:22:36.560 to offer a lot of variety and a lot of 0:22:36.560 --> 0:22:40.320 different skews and you know, different options, colors, etcetera. Like 0:22:40.520 --> 0:22:44.680 that's typically how the playbook for doing well on Amazon. 0:22:44.840 --> 0:22:49.960 And we're really just offering this one thing, and it's 0:22:50.000 --> 0:22:52.760 gone really well to the point where apparently they've been 0:22:53.200 --> 0:22:56.400 using it as kind of a case study internally, and like, 0:22:58.560 --> 0:23:01.680 by the way, that's brand right, that's a brand. That's 0:23:01.720 --> 0:23:05.760 brand pulling through the funnel right, by the way. Yeah, great, 0:23:06.920 --> 0:23:09.000 it's a great example. Okay, what would you what would 0:23:09.000 --> 0:23:13.520 you do yourself? TV? We're interested in TV. Where. Um, 0:23:13.520 --> 0:23:16.320 that's great explaining I p for TV, Pam. If people 0:23:16.320 --> 0:23:18.520 want to get ahold of you, how do they find you? 0:23:18.840 --> 0:23:23.960 I think you can email me. Wow, everybody, get out 0:23:23.960 --> 0:23:27.280 your pen the pen you bought from the article on 0:23:27.320 --> 0:23:30.359 the strategies exactly. First go buy a pen from the 0:23:30.400 --> 0:23:33.520 strategist and then use that pen to write down my 0:23:33.600 --> 0:23:37.240 email address. It's Pam dot Wasserstein at and my meg 0:23:37.320 --> 0:23:39.600 dot com. Pam. This is awesome. Thank you so much 0:23:39.600 --> 0:23:44.679 for coming by. Big thanks to Pam. Thank you so 0:23:44.760 --> 0:23:47.240 much for coming by. I think we've been talking about 0:23:47.240 --> 0:23:49.440 having you on the show at least for a year, 0:23:49.640 --> 0:23:52.800 so it's been long time coming. Thank you big. Thanks 0:23:52.800 --> 0:23:57.119 to Dana, our producer. Everyone at Panoply Atlantia will be 0:23:57.160 --> 0:24:01.760 talking to you in a couple of weeks. Full disclosure 0:24:01.760 --> 0:24:02.840 Our opinions are our own.