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Speaker 1: If you have your own story of being in a

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Speaker 1: cult or a high control group, or if.

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Speaker 2: You've had experience with manipulation or abusive power that you'd

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Speaker 2: like to share.

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Speaker 1: Leave us a message on our hotline number at three

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Speaker 1: four seven eight six trust.

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Speaker 2: That's three four seven eight six eight seven eight seven eight, or.

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Speaker 1: Shoot us an email at trust Me pod at gmail

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Speaker 1: dot com.

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Speaker 3: Trust me.

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Speaker 4: Trust Me.

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Speaker 5: I'm like a swat person.

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Speaker 4: I've never lived to you.

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Speaker 6: And we never live.

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Speaker 2: If you think that one person has all the answers,

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Speaker 2: don't welcome to trust Me. The podcast about cults, extreme

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Speaker 2: belief and manipulation from two fans of the movie Stalker

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Speaker 2: by Andre Tarkowski who've actually experienced it.

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Speaker 1: I am Lo La Blanc and I'm Megan Elizabeth And.

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Speaker 2: This week our guests are fellow podcast one podcasters Jamie

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Speaker 2: Beebe and Jake Deptula, hosts of the podcast Strictly Stalking.

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Speaker 2: We're gonna be a little off of Colts today and

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Speaker 2: talk about, as you might have guessed, Stocking. They're going

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Speaker 2: to tell us about some of the scarier stories they've

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Speaker 2: heard from Stalking survives on their show, how Hollywood romanticizes

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Speaker 2: controlling relationship dynamics, what triggers people to stock, and the

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Speaker 2: parallels with fandom.

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Speaker 1: We'll also get into the power dynamics of stoking, the

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Speaker 1: empathy many victims feel for their stalkers, the importance of

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Speaker 1: establishing and keeping boundaries, and whether restraining orders do anything.

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Speaker 1: I think this episode is very about cults. I think

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Speaker 1: stalkers are cult leaders.

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Speaker 2: You think they're cult leaders like little Baby, Yeah, two

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Speaker 2: person cult leaders.

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Speaker 1: Their baby cult leaders. The parallels are unbelievable.

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Speaker 2: Well, I think a point you brought up when we

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Speaker 2: stopped recording the other day, which I thought was really interesting, interesting.

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Speaker 1: Was perfect timing for me to bring it up when

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Speaker 1: we're no longer recording.

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Speaker 2: Was had a lot of cults who are, you know,

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Speaker 2: more on the side of the kinds of groups that

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Speaker 2: really want to keep people in because whatever they're a

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Speaker 2: different the spectrum will resort to stalking like behaviors to

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Speaker 2: harass and or intimidate their form of members. That is

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Speaker 2: something that definitely happens a lot, even in the form

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Speaker 2: of just like legal harassment, but also like showing up

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Speaker 2: like scientology tactics. I would say, definitely you're into stalking,

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Speaker 2: and it's it's more organized it's less about like one

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Speaker 2: mentally you know, unstable person, but a lot of those

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Speaker 2: behaviors and tactics very similar.

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Speaker 1: It seems pretty similar. Yeah, they all seem to have

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Speaker 1: a little narcissist at the center, but his to say.

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Speaker 2: I feel like there are probably so many different diagnoses

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Speaker 2: that come with the with stocker territory. I'd be very

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Speaker 2: curious to talk to someone who has experienced with that.

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Speaker 2: But anyway, Yes, what's your cultiest thing?

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Speaker 1: I have a really good one this week. In fact,

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Speaker 1: I think it might be my best one ever.

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Speaker 3: Okay, can't wait?

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Speaker 1: Are you ready? Yeah, I'm scrolling through Instagram and I

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Speaker 1: follow this girl who is a life coach. Okay, I

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Speaker 1: like her or whatever. But she's like, do you want

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Speaker 1: to know what one thing you can say to make

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Speaker 1: everybody stop scrolling and and come to your page to

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Speaker 1: be life coached? It's are you feeling stuck? Because everyone

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Speaker 1: feels stuck and everyone will go there. And I was like,

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Speaker 1: you know, that's interesting because one of the components of

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Speaker 1: being an adult is that you are kind of stuck.

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Speaker 1: You know, you have to be to like survive. Even

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Speaker 1: my friend who lives in Bali and like hops around

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Speaker 1: still feels very stuck in many ways because she still

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Speaker 1: has to make money and she still has to do

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Speaker 1: all of these things. So it's like everyone is going

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Speaker 1: to feel a little bit stuck as an adult.

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Speaker 3: That's interesting.

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Speaker 2: I would probably have said the opposite that as a kid,

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Speaker 2: you're sort of under you know, the armed guard of

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Speaker 2: your parents.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I guess it would work on kids too.

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Speaker 1: Are you feeling stuck? I don't know. No, there's no

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Speaker 1: healthy way to not feel stuck for any really long

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Speaker 1: period of time in a general all sense.

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Speaker 3: I don't know if.

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Speaker 2: I agree with that, but if what you're saying is

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Speaker 2: that we will always have obligations to like support ourselves

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Speaker 2: and make money, not.

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Speaker 1: Even that, because I do know other people who have

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Speaker 1: trust funds and they still feel stuck. It just seems

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Speaker 1: like it seems like the part of the human experience.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yes, I think phases of stuckness.

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Speaker 1: For sure.

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Speaker 2: I don't think that I feel especially stuck, but there

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Speaker 2: have definitely been periods. Like I would say, no one

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Speaker 2: goes their whole life without getting stuck, like that's part

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Speaker 2: of being person.

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Speaker 1: Right, And I would say it's not necessarily sometimes a

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Speaker 1: bad thing, like sometimes you could be like, I feel

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Speaker 1: stuck because you just had a fucking baby, and you're

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Speaker 1: like I should leave the baby, and it's like, no, it's.

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Speaker 3: Don't leave the baby.

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Speaker 1: Guys, what happens Like we can feel stuck.

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Speaker 3: So I think, yes, it sounds like what you're saying.

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Speaker 2: It's like stability, Like part of maturity is stability. It's

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Speaker 2: a slightly different lifestyle than just like ruming all the

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Speaker 2: time and partying everywhere and doing whatever you want.

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Speaker 3: At all times. But also we just get too tired

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Speaker 3: to do that.

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Speaker 1: It stuck out to me that she was like the

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Speaker 1: one thing everybody's always going to poke on or pick

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Speaker 1: to open is feeling stuck because we just do totally.

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Speaker 1: That's mine. What about you?

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Speaker 6: Uh?

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Speaker 2: Okay, I've been circling around talking about this for weeks,

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Speaker 2: and I was hesitant because there are people I directly

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Speaker 2: know in my life who are very into this person,

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Speaker 2: and I didn't want to, you know, insult anyone. But guys,

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Speaker 2: we got to talk about Joe Despenza. We got to

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Speaker 2: talk about quote doctor heavy quotes, Joe Despenza.

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Speaker 3: You know who he was, So can you describe him?

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Speaker 3: How do you conceive of him?

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Speaker 1: I think of him as somebody who has a very

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Speaker 1: strange voice, who does online meditations and lectures about changing

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Speaker 1: your reality. He wrote Becoming Supernatural, which I have, and

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Speaker 1: then a bunch of other books which I don't have.

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Speaker 3: Cool, great, great introduction.

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Speaker 2: So I this came up because somebody that I know

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Speaker 2: sent an email saying that they were on a retreat

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Speaker 2: with doctor Joe Despenza.

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Speaker 3: So I'm going to just quote this.

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Speaker 2: Rolling Stone article because it says a lot of this

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Speaker 2: better than I could in this moment that we have

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Speaker 2: right now. An immensely popular influencer with two point one

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Speaker 2: million followers on Instagram who touts himself as a New

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Speaker 2: York Times bestselling author and quote researcher of epigenetics, quantum physics,

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Speaker 2: and neuroscience. He has all these breathing exercises and meditations

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Speaker 2: about it's all about synchronizing your energy with its vibration.

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Speaker 2: This fool is not a neuroscientist.

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Speaker 3: He is a chiropractor.

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Speaker 2: Who is licensed by a school that lost accreditation in

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Speaker 2: two thousand and two for its subpar teaching methods. Uh oh,

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Speaker 2: he is not a doctor, you guys. He's not a doctor,

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Speaker 2: and he's talking about quantum physics in terms that do

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Speaker 2: not actually apply to quantum physics. From everything that I

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Speaker 2: understand about quantum physics. He's talking about like you know,

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Speaker 2: stuff that kind of applies to psychology, and like that's.

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Speaker 1: The beautiful thing about quantum physics, as you can just

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Speaker 1: say it's quantum physics and nobody knows anything about quantum

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Speaker 1: physics and not yet for us to be like, no,

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Speaker 1: it's not right.

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Speaker 2: But in terms of how like quantum physicists just talk

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Speaker 2: about it's not like this isn't actually the field of

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Speaker 2: quantum physics. This is just like new age stuff, And

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Speaker 2: a lot of people in the new age world will

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Speaker 2: take that phrase quantum physics and reference like one study

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Speaker 2: they don't really they aren't even really describing accurately, and

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Speaker 2: turn that into we can all create our own realities

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Speaker 2: and energy isn't or matter isn't even anything, and we

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Speaker 2: can do anything we want.

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Speaker 1: Are you talking about like a particle study or something?

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Speaker 6: All right?

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Speaker 2: So Dispensa previously the in house chiropractor and master teacher

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Speaker 2: for Roma School of Enlightenment, led by Jay Z. Knight,

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Speaker 2: a spiritual leader who has claimed to be clairvoyant and

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Speaker 2: telepathic and has also claimed to channel the ancient thirty

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Speaker 2: five thousand year old La Marian were Ramtha, and he's

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Speaker 2: attracted attention from the Southern Poverty Law Center for espousing

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Speaker 2: homophobic anti smetic fuse.

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Speaker 1: Oh my goodness.

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Speaker 2: Dispensa has claimed to have healed himself after cycling accident

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Speaker 2: in the eighties. Promotes the idea that one can cure

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Speaker 2: any illness through the power of thought. This is so

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Speaker 2: fucking dangerous, you guys. There was a woman interviewed on

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Speaker 2: a podcast Conspiratuality, which sound we should really have them on,

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Speaker 2: who alleges that her husband died of pancreatic cancer at

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Speaker 2: the age of forty five, at one point contemplating stopping

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Speaker 2: chemot therapy due to his belief that Despense's meditation tactics

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Speaker 2: could potentially be more effective. So this kind of thing.

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Speaker 2: What's really really interesting, and what someone on Reddit pointed

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Speaker 2: out is that when you google him, even when you

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Speaker 2: google like fraud or scam, there are really very few results.

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Speaker 2: They get removed from the Internet, like he has an

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Speaker 2: amazing team that removes this shit from the internet. But

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Speaker 2: he went a little viral. And I will keep this

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Speaker 2: short because I know I know I could go on

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Speaker 2: about this for a while. He went a little viral

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Speaker 2: a few months ago because there is a popular internet

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Speaker 2: girl who I also don't want a name because I

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Speaker 2: really like her. But she went on a retreat with

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Speaker 2: him and posted about it and did all these posts

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Speaker 2: about how amazing this retreat was. Gonna just quote one

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Speaker 2: of the things from her story here. This meditation retreat

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Speaker 2: is not one of those relaxing spa ones my friends

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Speaker 2: think I'm relaxing and chilling, Nabro. I'm working. I'm clocking

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Speaker 2: in four hours of sleep every day, waking up at

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Speaker 2: three am to meditate for five hours straight, no breaks,

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Speaker 2: not even for a bathroom. Then we eat, then learn

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Speaker 2: science for two hours, then meditate again, then break, and

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Speaker 2: then meditate again.

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Speaker 3: It's work. What does that sound like to you?

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Speaker 1: It sounds like our guests who said that he was

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Speaker 1: in the cult of meditation.

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Speaker 2: It sounds like our guests who were an exiom. It

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Speaker 2: sounds like our guests who it sounds like so many

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Speaker 2: of our guests.

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Speaker 3: Because this is like.

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Speaker 2: Like, there are retreats, and that's great, but sleep deprivation

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Speaker 2: and like constantly like breaking down someone's sense of self,

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Speaker 2: similar to also to the boota Field like, so, I

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Speaker 2: feel like so many of our guests have described their

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Speaker 2: cults as experience is similar to this. I don't think

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Speaker 2: retreats are inherently bad at all, but what the way

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Speaker 2: that this is being described, in the way that a

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Speaker 2: number of people who I know and just who I

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Speaker 2: see online are posting about it really feels like this

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Speaker 2: guy is getting like a like a really firm hold

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Speaker 2: on them.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I have a lot of I mean, I have

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Speaker 1: a lot of people in my life who really love him.

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Speaker 1: They seem to have improved a bit, so maybe he

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Speaker 1: has something good going in his meditations. But as I said,

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Speaker 1: his voice is insane.

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Speaker 2: So light meditation, not hours of meditation, as we've talked about,

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Speaker 2: but light meditation has pretty well researched benefits and a

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Speaker 2: lot of the things he's touting these are not new ideas.

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Speaker 3: None of these are new ideas.

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Speaker 2: What is a problem for me is pretending to be

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Speaker 2: a doctor when you're not.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that is that is problematic.

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Speaker 3: Acting like you can heal.

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Speaker 2: And in one of the posts I saw, one of

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Speaker 2: the people who tended his retreats claimed that they themselves

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Speaker 2: healed someone. And also the way the seminars are described.

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Speaker 2: Is just like a constant, constant, constant upselling, right, constantly

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Speaker 2: trying to sell more.

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Speaker 3: Workshops, more workshops.

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Speaker 2: These are all really big red flags, and the fact

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Speaker 2: that they are not like widely available to learn about

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Speaker 2: when you look this person up.

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Speaker 3: Is alarming to me.

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Speaker 2: I agreed, So you know, I'm not saying there's nothing

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Speaker 2: interesting about of course, every all these people have something

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Speaker 2: interesting to say, you guys.

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Speaker 3: That's the whole fucking thing. Yep, all right, that's my spiel.

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Speaker 1: All right, I love it. Thank you, you are so welcome.

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Speaker 1: Should we get into it. Let's do it.

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Speaker 3: Welcome Jamie Babe and Jake Deptula to trust me.

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Speaker 6: Thank you for having used to be here.

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Speaker 2: Thank you for joining us. I feel like you're friends

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Speaker 2: of the show. I would consider you guys friends of

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Speaker 2: the show. I've known Jamie for a while.

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Speaker 5: Yes, they're sordid pass Can you guys just tell us

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Speaker 5: really briefly what that is or she knows my ex

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Speaker 5: who is actually a really horrible abuse a person, to

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Speaker 5: be honest, and luckily like neither was hanging out with

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Speaker 5: him anymore obviously, but that's.

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Speaker 6: How we know each other.

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Speaker 7: And so then we met up again recently, like after

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Speaker 7: that whole thing had ended, and I was like super

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Speaker 7: nervous because I didn't know she was still knew him.

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Speaker 6: Yeah in a work.

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Speaker 7: Way, right, gross way, Like I knew him, but in

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Speaker 7: a work way. So I wasn't sure she still knew him.

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Speaker 7: So I was like, oh my god, like I kind

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Speaker 7: of want to say hi, but I kind of don't.

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Speaker 7: And then I just blurted everything out kind of like

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Speaker 7: I just did, and she's like, yeah, no, that dude's

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Speaker 7: a douche.

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Speaker 1: That's the best feeling when, yeah, when you find somebody

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Speaker 1: who also agrees and yeah it was the truth, and

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Speaker 1: you can just yeah.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm learning things too. To be fair, we don't

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Speaker 4: talk like this basically that much, so it's all by

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Speaker 4: text basically, so you preferred not to talk on the phone,

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Speaker 4: but this is all stuff. I didn't know how you

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Speaker 4: knew each other because we had met during the like

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Speaker 4: the True Crime gathering. Yeah, well put together, which was amazing.

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Speaker 2: Well I knew, I knew I recognized Jamie, and I

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Speaker 2: was like, is this I was trying to avoid eye contact,

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Speaker 2: Yeah she was.

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Speaker 7: I felt that guy's going to throw up like that.

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Speaker 7: But anybody that knew him. That's how I feel if

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Speaker 7: I run into them, because yeah, that person is.

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Speaker 6: Horrible, horrible person.

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Speaker 2: I definitely didn't know any of that stuff, and I'm

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Speaker 2: nobody glad you are, but I'm really open about it now.

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Speaker 6: That's great.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and Sketch People leads us into why we're here

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Speaker 1: today exactly, Sketchy Good People, Thank you. Thanks.

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Speaker 2: So you both host a show called Strictly Stalking Sister

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Speaker 2: show here on Podcast one half.

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Speaker 3: First of all, why stalking podcast? How?

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Speaker 1: Why?

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Speaker 6: Oh wow?

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Speaker 7: It was the kind of random I called Jaque Day

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Speaker 7: and I was like, I really want to do a podcast,

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Speaker 7: but everyone's already doing all the cool murder, so I

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Speaker 7: can't do a podcast, and now my life is over

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Speaker 7: because I'm a very dramatic person, especially when it comes

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Speaker 7: to like things like that, and so Jake is very

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Speaker 7: logical and like has to think everything through and I

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Speaker 7: don't think anything through.

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Speaker 6: So I'd already like.

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Speaker 7: Had like had to fake podcasts in my mind that

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Speaker 7: I gave up because everyone else is already doing it.

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Speaker 7: And so He's like, well, yeah, no one's doing stalking,

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Speaker 7: and I was like, I don't even know what stalking

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Speaker 7: is as stupid, and I hung up on him. A

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Speaker 7: lot of our phone calls, I don't really like talking

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Speaker 7: on the phone. And then a few minutes later, I

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Speaker 7: was like on Google, you know, like.

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Speaker 6: What the fuck is stalking?

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Speaker 7: And I'm like, wow, this is a whole crime that

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Speaker 7: I knew nothing about. Like that's horrible and rad at

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Speaker 7: the same time, like we can totally I don't know

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Speaker 7: about it. Other people don't really know about it either, right,

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Speaker 7: you know, because I'm yeah, I feel like I'm pretty intelligent, because.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, stalking is different than harassment, right, there's all different

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Speaker 1: words for it, but stalking is something very particular, right.

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Speaker 7: So then I get kind of obsessed with it pen incended,

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Speaker 7: and I, you know, we like I built out this

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Speaker 7: whole deck. I stayed up for three days. I'm like

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Speaker 7: I'm doing this podcast, like let's do it. And I

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Speaker 7: sent it to Jake and Jake was like, okay, cool,

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Speaker 7: like let's do it. And then Jake, did you know

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Speaker 7: all the fixings of everything? Because I'm very like, okay,

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Speaker 7: I'm done, Like I did it.

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Speaker 4: And then it's like first draft submission pretty much.

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Speaker 7: I'm like the first drafter and then you know, Jake

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Speaker 7: kind of fixed it up and that was it.

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Speaker 3: He was yin yang partnership.

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Speaker 4: You know, there's many ways that it works, and I

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Speaker 4: think that in terms of her like, the way we

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Speaker 4: describe it is that Jamie jumps in the pool and

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Speaker 4: then I check if there's.

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Speaker 1: Water and great.

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Speaker 4: That's literally the mind.

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Speaker 7: I'm really like that in all my things.

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Speaker 3: Listen, it's good you, it's good you have each other.

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Speaker 4: Absolutely.

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Speaker 2: Your show is structured such that you have first person

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Speaker 2: stories on. You have guests coming on and talking about

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Speaker 2: their personal experiences, much like we do on our show.

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Speaker 3: So I would love.

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Speaker 2: To start out if you feel comfortable walking us through

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Speaker 2: maybe each of your kind of favorite or most compelling

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Speaker 2: or memorable stories that you guys have kind of had

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Speaker 2: on your show.

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Speaker 6: Wow, Jake can go first. I know it's fun. He's

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Speaker 6: gonna say, verst predictable.

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Speaker 4: Well, okay, I'm going to feel this.

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Speaker 6: Because Wild Rabbit over.

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Speaker 4: Thank you. Generally speaking, it's like every stalking story is different.

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Speaker 4: There's really not one that's actually you know, like the

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Speaker 4: cookie Cutter situation, like most stalker's behaviors are very similar.

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Speaker 4: But you know, we've done over one hundred and thirty

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Speaker 4: four stories so far and not one of them is

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Speaker 4: the same. It can come from a domestic partner, it

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Speaker 4: can come from a driving instructor, it can come from

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Speaker 4: a parent. You just never know where that's going to come.

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Speaker 1: Well, I listened to the driving instructor one, and holy shit,

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Speaker 1: that is creepy.

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Speaker 4: Thirty five, about thirty five years older than her. Basically

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Speaker 4: she's eighteen, yeah, exactly, So basically just sort of controlled her,

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Speaker 4: started making these TikTok videos, started like you wanting to

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Speaker 4: kind of live within her life and sort of like

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Speaker 4: take over, and you know, he started adapting to her.

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Speaker 4: He's like, I'm going to make a TikTok video. I'm

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Speaker 4: gonna make this little remaking.

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Speaker 3: Erald knows that I make TikTok videos because I'm still struggling.

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Speaker 1: I don't even know how to walk again.

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Speaker 3: There's some older people on TikTok.

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Speaker 1: But he said, I stayed up all night making it

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Speaker 1: tick and take a while, and that is the problem,

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Speaker 1: because I find myself if I get into a little

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Speaker 1: stalking situation with somebody, I find myself feeling very sorry

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Speaker 1: for them. And I can see how she got sucked

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Speaker 1: into that by him being like, I was up all

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Speaker 1: night making this TikTok.

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Speaker 4: So, you know, there's a lot of guilt when it

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Speaker 4: comes to these things, and a lot of people in

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Speaker 4: their lives telling them, you know, maybe you did something,

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Speaker 4: maybe you sent out a signal. A lot of guilt

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Speaker 4: plays into that, which is extremely inappropriate. But that's one

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Speaker 4: of those things is that stalkers know how to plan

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Speaker 4: someone's sympathy. They really understand how to control, ultimately the

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Speaker 4: emotion that someone's going to put forth.

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Speaker 2: And how to do Can you tell us about it?

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Speaker 2: The story that you think about the most maybe to me.

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Speaker 4: The stories that really resonate, or any time there's domestic

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Speaker 4: abuse involved where someone can't get away from their stalker,

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Speaker 4: there are certain stories that come in. We had one

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Speaker 4: where a woman actually fought back against her stalker. It

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Speaker 4: was a military guy and he was basically surveilling her,

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Speaker 4: using all the things he learned in the military, all

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Speaker 4: this espionage and all these things in order to do that,

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Speaker 4: and she ended up trapping him and setting up a

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Speaker 4: sting to put him behind bars. So those are those

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Speaker 4: kind of stories. It really is trapping her stalker Episode

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Speaker 4: one sixteen, It was really Oh, I don't want to

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Speaker 4: tell too much, but basically the whole thing was set

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Speaker 4: up like a sting where basically she ended up planting

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Speaker 4: a device on his his car and able to like

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Speaker 4: flip the turn of the tables, so literally she was

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Speaker 4: able to use his own tricks and tools against him

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Speaker 4: in order to carry that out.

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Speaker 3: Amazing.

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Speaker 4: So it was yeah, one hundred percent. So those are

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Speaker 4: those kind of stories. But the other ones that come

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Speaker 4: up are the ones where people are literally trapped up

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Speaker 4: with their stalker and they're under a realm of domestic abuse,

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Speaker 4: all these things, and they can't get away. We had

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Speaker 4: one case on where a woman was told by her

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Speaker 4: the elders in her church that she should marry his

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Speaker 4: stalker so he would stop stalking her. Because this is

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Speaker 4: how a man pursues a woman. He's very aggressive, very

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Speaker 4: obsessive with this, and he ends up taking it to

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Speaker 4: that next level and they end up giving her the device.

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Speaker 4: So guess what, she marries the stalker.

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Speaker 1: I guess that is the quickest way to make a

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Speaker 1: man lose interest in you is to marry him.

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Speaker 6: I agree.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I'm sure this observation has been made by

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Speaker 2: y'all on your show many times, but I just think

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Speaker 2: of franchises.

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Speaker 3: Like Twilight and fifty Shades of Gray.

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Speaker 2: And this We and Even You, which I don't personally

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Speaker 2: think makes him look like a good guy. But some

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Speaker 2: people their takeaway is, oh, he's so hot when he's stocking.

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Speaker 2: I mean, he's objectively hot, right, but it's physically he

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Speaker 2: is hot, right, the stocking is maybe not as hot.

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Speaker 4: Well, I think I think what strictly stalking does is

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Speaker 4: it pulls back and pulls away the romanticism of stalking.

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Speaker 4: And you really hear the words in the people that

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Speaker 4: have lived through this, you really kind of understand that

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Speaker 4: the media unfortunately, I mean I learned about stalking through

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Speaker 4: film and TV. I didn't know anything really about stalking

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Speaker 4: before we got into the show and started to take

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Speaker 4: a deep dive and hear these words, you know, from

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Speaker 4: the actual people who have been gone through it. But

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Speaker 4: it really does pull away the romantic feelings and the

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Speaker 4: vibes and really kind of, yeah, dissects what media presents

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Speaker 4: versus what really happens.

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Speaker 2: Even growing up, I feel like just regular rom coms

444
00:20:35,600 --> 00:20:38,200
Speaker 2: presented love is this thing that would be kind of

445
00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:41,919
Speaker 2: obsessive and unusually quick to fall in love, which is

446
00:20:41,960 --> 00:20:44,119
Speaker 2: all which is a red flag and not how healthy

447
00:20:44,160 --> 00:20:49,480
Speaker 2: relationships most of the time should start like shit, really, Jamie,

448
00:20:50,280 --> 00:20:53,000
Speaker 2: I'm just dying, just kidding.

449
00:20:53,000 --> 00:20:53,040
Speaker 4: No.

450
00:20:53,119 --> 00:20:54,000
Speaker 3: I mean, obviously there are.

451
00:20:53,960 --> 00:20:55,880
Speaker 2: Exceptions to that, but I think generally, you know, love

452
00:20:55,920 --> 00:20:59,560
Speaker 2: bombing is a red flag and we grow up seeing

453
00:20:59,600 --> 00:21:02,320
Speaker 2: this and thinking, oh, look, that's what romance is.

454
00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:04,600
Speaker 3: That means somebody's like really into me, and this is.

455
00:21:04,560 --> 00:21:05,320
Speaker 1: Love for sure.

456
00:21:05,720 --> 00:21:08,000
Speaker 4: We talked about, like say anything when if you've seen

457
00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:12,200
Speaker 4: that when John Cusack holds the boombox outside's Diane's house.

458
00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:15,719
Speaker 4: That literally it's so romantic in the movie. But will

459
00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:17,600
Speaker 4: imagine if somebody did that in real life. I guess

460
00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:19,119
Speaker 4: just somebody who's on your parents lawn and.

461
00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:22,320
Speaker 2: Love Actually the fucking guy shows up to his best

462
00:21:22,359 --> 00:21:28,199
Speaker 2: friend's wife's new wife and like, Mary Christmas.

463
00:21:27,720 --> 00:21:29,480
Speaker 3: I love you until I die.

464
00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:32,919
Speaker 2: I just filmed you and only you at your wedding.

465
00:21:34,280 --> 00:21:36,840
Speaker 2: That was weird, and everyone thinks it's so romantic.

466
00:21:37,040 --> 00:21:39,840
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean that's like the movie Magic though. Yeah,

467
00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:42,960
Speaker 6: like they're not going to make the Joe from you.

468
00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:47,000
Speaker 6: They're not gonna make him like super ugly right hot.

469
00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:48,919
Speaker 6: But I nobody knean like that's part of it. Like

470
00:21:48,920 --> 00:21:49,960
Speaker 6: they're trying to make you like.

471
00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:52,280
Speaker 7: Him, otherwise you're not going to keep watching. Yeah, you know,

472
00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:54,000
Speaker 7: we're all a little bit in film. We're in la so

473
00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:56,640
Speaker 7: like we kind of understand that, but other people out

474
00:21:56,640 --> 00:21:59,520
Speaker 7: there don't really, I think understand that. Part of it

475
00:21:59,560 --> 00:22:01,800
Speaker 7: is that it's the movie magic part it makes.

476
00:22:01,600 --> 00:22:03,120
Speaker 6: You like them. It's the writing.

477
00:22:03,359 --> 00:22:05,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, but there are I think there are ways to

478
00:22:05,359 --> 00:22:08,240
Speaker 2: do that that also depict like healthier kinds of love.

479
00:22:08,280 --> 00:22:14,400
Speaker 2: And I'm not saying uh fucking I can't think right now,

480
00:22:14,440 --> 00:22:18,639
Speaker 2: but there are some And by what's her face, fancy.

481
00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:24,240
Speaker 3: Nancy, you've got mail? Thank you? That is a That

482
00:22:24,359 --> 00:22:27,320
Speaker 3: is the healthy long over. They get to know each

483
00:22:27,320 --> 00:22:29,920
Speaker 3: other over time, you guys, Although he does pretend.

484
00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:29,840
Speaker 4: To be.

485
00:22:31,960 --> 00:22:36,360
Speaker 2: The bookstore owner, but they are getting to know each

486
00:22:36,359 --> 00:22:38,719
Speaker 2: other slowly and they have a real friendship and that

487
00:22:38,840 --> 00:22:44,200
Speaker 2: is what counts he's lying about. Also, he's in corporate.

488
00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:51,560
Speaker 1: That's fine, listen there, It is true. What's portrayed in

489
00:22:51,560 --> 00:22:54,320
Speaker 1: the media isn't what in real life is going to

490
00:22:54,359 --> 00:22:58,760
Speaker 1: be actually good because it's not as fun to watch.

491
00:22:59,119 --> 00:23:02,879
Speaker 1: But sometimes it's okay, right of course, of course whatever.

492
00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:04,960
Speaker 2: But it's good to interrogate that because I feel like

493
00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:08,880
Speaker 2: storytelling up until the past ten years was really emphasizing though.

494
00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:11,400
Speaker 1: Like I'm in love with you immediately and I will

495
00:23:11,400 --> 00:23:11,879
Speaker 1: not leave you.

496
00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:15,359
Speaker 3: Oay, exactly right, right, So, Jamie, do you have a favorite?

497
00:23:15,800 --> 00:23:15,960
Speaker 7: Oh?

498
00:23:16,000 --> 00:23:16,240
Speaker 4: I do.

499
00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:19,800
Speaker 7: I don't remember her name, unfortunately, because we use a

500
00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:22,000
Speaker 7: lot of pseudonyms to.

501
00:23:21,960 --> 00:23:23,960
Speaker 6: Protect people's safety and identity and whatever.

502
00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:27,880
Speaker 7: But it was this college girl and she had moved

503
00:23:27,880 --> 00:23:30,520
Speaker 7: into her like her first place by herself, you know,

504
00:23:30,840 --> 00:23:35,560
Speaker 7: big time, and she started noticing that like her underwear

505
00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:39,920
Speaker 7: was missing, and then like all her underwear was gone,

506
00:23:40,240 --> 00:23:42,639
Speaker 7: like things were being moved, like things were happening in

507
00:23:42,760 --> 00:23:46,119
Speaker 7: her house. And the best part of it though, and

508
00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:48,760
Speaker 7: I just this girl's so cool. But she was like

509
00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:51,080
Speaker 7: I said, well, like, what did you think when you

510
00:23:51,280 --> 00:23:53,320
Speaker 7: ran out of underw Like there were no more underwear

511
00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:55,520
Speaker 7: in your house? You know, she's going out a lot

512
00:23:55,560 --> 00:23:58,360
Speaker 7: like whatever by Pye not leaving her underwear everywhere. We've

513
00:23:58,400 --> 00:24:01,359
Speaker 7: all done that, but like Pine not loved them. And

514
00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:04,200
Speaker 7: she's like, I don't know, like I just stopped wearing it,

515
00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:07,760
Speaker 7: but I still really because I'm like the fuck that's me.

516
00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:10,520
Speaker 7: Like I would have been like, I don't know, remind

517
00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:12,359
Speaker 7: where it was like the dog eate like I'd just

518
00:24:12,359 --> 00:24:15,400
Speaker 7: stop wearing it, you know, wow to But yeah, So

519
00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:18,479
Speaker 7: what happened was she had a guy living up in

520
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:22,320
Speaker 7: her attic, like in her crawl space, and you know,

521
00:24:22,359 --> 00:24:24,639
Speaker 7: by the time they finally caught the guy and she

522
00:24:24,840 --> 00:24:27,880
Speaker 7: was asking like she had the business or the maintenance

523
00:24:27,920 --> 00:24:29,719
Speaker 7: people come over and they're like, yeah, no one can

524
00:24:29,800 --> 00:24:32,200
Speaker 7: get in your house, like it's fine. And the maintenance people, eventually,

525
00:24:32,240 --> 00:24:35,600
Speaker 7: I think, were the ones that discovered him. And I

526
00:24:35,600 --> 00:24:37,040
Speaker 7: mean she didn't even know there was a crawl space,

527
00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:40,000
Speaker 7: was like in her closet and he was just living

528
00:24:40,040 --> 00:24:42,000
Speaker 7: up there. And by the time they finally found him,

529
00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:43,920
Speaker 7: he had like a rape kid up there and like

530
00:24:43,960 --> 00:24:47,399
Speaker 7: there were photos over like super super creepy. Even after that,

531
00:24:47,520 --> 00:24:49,159
Speaker 7: like I went home and checked my house and I

532
00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:51,360
Speaker 7: have like I had two large dogs that would have

533
00:24:51,520 --> 00:24:53,280
Speaker 7: one of them definitely would have killed for me. So

534
00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:54,920
Speaker 7: I'm like, there's no one in here, but like I'm

535
00:24:55,040 --> 00:24:55,919
Speaker 7: just gonna look around.

536
00:24:56,440 --> 00:25:01,600
Speaker 2: Yes, even just stories about like you know on house

537
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:03,760
Speaker 2: people living in the side, Like anyone living in your

538
00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:06,600
Speaker 2: space that you don't know is living there is already

539
00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:08,120
Speaker 2: scary is frogging.

540
00:25:08,240 --> 00:25:10,439
Speaker 7: Yeah, well we were on the show frogging. It's a

541
00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:13,520
Speaker 7: lifetime show. Oh they brought us on? Oh and yeah,

542
00:25:13,600 --> 00:25:16,240
Speaker 7: so's it actually happens. A lot happens more than you

543
00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:18,399
Speaker 7: would think. I mean, I just feel like when you

544
00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:21,560
Speaker 7: want the we know somehow that someone else is in

545
00:25:21,560 --> 00:25:21,960
Speaker 7: your house.

546
00:25:22,000 --> 00:25:22,359
Speaker 6: I don't know.

547
00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:24,760
Speaker 2: I feel like people would probably honestly mostly think that

548
00:25:24,840 --> 00:25:26,080
Speaker 2: there was a ghost in the house.

549
00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:30,080
Speaker 6: I feel like some people do. Yeah, which okay, yeah,

550
00:25:30,119 --> 00:25:32,680
Speaker 6: you know what, that's funny. Someone ghost is digging arounderwear.

551
00:25:32,880 --> 00:25:34,439
Speaker 6: Somebody stole all of our shoes.

552
00:25:34,480 --> 00:25:36,679
Speaker 3: I would if I were a ghost like this.

553
00:25:36,920 --> 00:25:39,360
Speaker 1: The stalker was in our neighborhood and he kept stealing

554
00:25:39,400 --> 00:25:41,280
Speaker 1: my roommate and I his shoes and kind of a

555
00:25:41,320 --> 00:25:44,120
Speaker 1: similar head pissed me off where we were like why

556
00:25:44,160 --> 00:25:47,119
Speaker 1: are we losing our shoes so much? And then finally

557
00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:48,840
Speaker 1: the police caught him with it was like there's something

558
00:25:48,840 --> 00:25:51,359
Speaker 1: about mary. He had just like a ton of everyone's shoes.

559
00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:54,320
Speaker 1: So we got them back, but it was.

560
00:25:55,800 --> 00:25:58,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, did you wear I got them back.

561
00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:02,040
Speaker 1: I'm not caring. I were tainted. Who knows what he

562
00:26:02,119 --> 00:26:05,080
Speaker 1: did with them, but yeah, he wasn't living in our house,

563
00:26:05,119 --> 00:26:07,600
Speaker 1: thank god? Is that something you've had more than one

564
00:26:07,640 --> 00:26:09,000
Speaker 1: person experience on the show.

565
00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:12,760
Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, no, Wow, more than you would think.

566
00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:14,479
Speaker 7: I mean they did a whole TV show about it

567
00:26:14,520 --> 00:26:17,400
Speaker 7: on Lifetime, so it actually happens more than you would think.

568
00:26:17,800 --> 00:26:19,000
Speaker 3: Wow. Yeah.

569
00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:21,240
Speaker 4: We had another case that actually was featured in the

570
00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:25,160
Speaker 4: Lifetime show called road See. It was Road to Survival

571
00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:27,320
Speaker 4: and was based by this woman who had a guy

572
00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:29,880
Speaker 4: who was playing games in her house and would move

573
00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:33,520
Speaker 4: things around, had a Sirreillan's camera in her bathroom where

574
00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:37,200
Speaker 4: her teenage daughter was, planted them around the house, and

575
00:26:37,280 --> 00:26:39,760
Speaker 4: she ended up becoming a big, big truck driver because

576
00:26:39,760 --> 00:26:42,359
Speaker 4: her logic was that if she kept moving in a

577
00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:45,280
Speaker 4: big piece of steel like that, nobody could get to her.

578
00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:49,080
Speaker 1: Oh how did she find out?

579
00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:53,360
Speaker 4: She basically had somebody come in, a private investigator come

580
00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:56,600
Speaker 4: in and basically find all these things debug the house.

581
00:26:57,400 --> 00:26:57,760
Speaker 1: Wow.

582
00:26:58,880 --> 00:27:02,199
Speaker 7: I think it happens more like with somebody maybe that

583
00:27:02,240 --> 00:27:03,959
Speaker 7: you know leak. You break up with somebody and they

584
00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:05,560
Speaker 7: already know kind of how to get in your house

585
00:27:05,600 --> 00:27:07,320
Speaker 7: and stuff, and they know how and they want to

586
00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:08,040
Speaker 7: like fuck with you.

587
00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:11,199
Speaker 6: But the stranger ones are way crapy.

588
00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:13,280
Speaker 1: That's what I'm going to ask what's the statistics on that.

589
00:27:13,359 --> 00:27:15,399
Speaker 1: Is it mostly people that already know you or is

590
00:27:15,440 --> 00:27:18,359
Speaker 1: it strangers or is it a mix of both. Is

591
00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:19,720
Speaker 1: there a lands Probably.

592
00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:23,240
Speaker 6: A little more people that know you from like most.

593
00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:25,480
Speaker 4: Of the cases. Yeah, we've had about forty percent of

594
00:27:25,520 --> 00:27:28,359
Speaker 4: the cases that we've covered have been somebody they know

595
00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:31,119
Speaker 4: or have been in a domestic relationship with. So and

596
00:27:31,160 --> 00:27:33,040
Speaker 4: we've done one hundred and next one hundred and thirty

597
00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:35,880
Speaker 4: five now or one hundred and thirty four to thirty five,

598
00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:38,840
Speaker 4: So yeah, it's it's quite a bit of people that

599
00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:42,800
Speaker 4: you know. And also too, mentioning that usually sometimes they

600
00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:45,959
Speaker 4: have access to things like your social media accounts, your emails,

601
00:27:46,200 --> 00:27:48,320
Speaker 4: password to bank account, things like that. So that's where

602
00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:51,040
Speaker 4: cores of control comes in as well. So if you're

603
00:27:51,040 --> 00:27:54,000
Speaker 4: living with somebody you know, they can even if you

604
00:27:54,040 --> 00:27:56,040
Speaker 4: break up with them, they can still stalk you via

605
00:27:56,080 --> 00:27:58,560
Speaker 4: those channels as well. I mean, those are things you

606
00:27:58,560 --> 00:27:59,639
Speaker 4: have to safeguard as well.

607
00:27:59,720 --> 00:27:59,960
Speaker 1: Right.

608
00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:03,120
Speaker 2: I would imagine if you're a public figure of some kind,

609
00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:06,200
Speaker 2: then it becomes more strangers than people.

610
00:28:06,320 --> 00:28:07,120
Speaker 6: Yeah, right, yea.

611
00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:11,359
Speaker 2: I'm sure Lenora has been on your show. She's Beast

612
00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:12,600
Speaker 2: number one.

613
00:28:12,320 --> 00:28:15,680
Speaker 4: She was actually our first, our first interview and episode

614
00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:18,560
Speaker 4: number two Stalking Back.

615
00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:22,840
Speaker 2: We're talking about Stocking what do you call it, the

616
00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:24,800
Speaker 2: Stocking Victims Advocate.

617
00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:29,760
Speaker 4: Yeah, she's an amazing consulting firm where she actually deals, as

618
00:28:29,760 --> 00:28:33,600
Speaker 4: you know, with media and how to depict certain things

619
00:28:33,640 --> 00:28:36,439
Speaker 4: in helping victims within the scope of that, which is

620
00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:38,640
Speaker 4: pretty amazing. So even the stuff we talked about earlier

621
00:28:38,840 --> 00:28:41,200
Speaker 4: in terms of how the perspective is from the victim's

622
00:28:41,280 --> 00:28:44,440
Speaker 4: advocacy role versus people that haven't you gone through it

623
00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:45,640
Speaker 4: or don't really understand what.

624
00:28:45,520 --> 00:28:46,920
Speaker 3: That's like totally totally.

625
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:49,520
Speaker 1: What do they want? They just want to be with

626
00:28:49,560 --> 00:28:50,200
Speaker 1: you all the time.

627
00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:53,760
Speaker 7: I mean it depends like sometimes there you break up

628
00:28:53,800 --> 00:28:55,840
Speaker 7: with somebody, they can't handle it, they're obsessed.

629
00:28:56,040 --> 00:28:57,000
Speaker 6: They do want with you.

630
00:28:58,760 --> 00:29:02,400
Speaker 7: Sometimes, you know, they just want that they want to

631
00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:06,240
Speaker 7: keep that control. Sometimes, Like it's hard to say because

632
00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:10,800
Speaker 7: some stalkers have mental clear mental illnesses. You know, they

633
00:29:11,920 --> 00:29:14,480
Speaker 7: obviously have clear mental illnesses, and some of them are

634
00:29:14,520 --> 00:29:16,840
Speaker 7: like someone that you dated, so like in my case,

635
00:29:16,880 --> 00:29:20,760
Speaker 7: clear mental illnesses. You know, it just it's always a

636
00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:23,800
Speaker 7: different reason why they stalk. But overall it's like this

637
00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:27,640
Speaker 7: obsessive thing. It's like an addiction. It's like smoking cigarettes

638
00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:29,680
Speaker 7: or drinking or you know, just the addiction.

639
00:29:30,120 --> 00:29:32,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, I almost wonder if it's more fun for them

640
00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:37,280
Speaker 1: to be stalking than for them to actually be Yeah, sometimes.

641
00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:40,000
Speaker 4: There's a psychology. But I've had many discussions about this.

642
00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:42,600
Speaker 4: Why does a stalker stock? And a lot of times,

643
00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:45,600
Speaker 4: you know, most of the stalkers that we've covered, the

644
00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:48,360
Speaker 4: cases about the people who've been stalked or males obviously

645
00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:52,720
Speaker 4: males stock so many, so much more than females and

646
00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:55,520
Speaker 4: the male ego and how it kind of spins off

647
00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:58,360
Speaker 4: access Like not knowing if someone could be a stalker

648
00:29:58,400 --> 00:30:00,280
Speaker 4: is very interesting too, because they could go through the

649
00:30:00,320 --> 00:30:02,440
Speaker 4: whole life and all of a sudden something triggers that

650
00:30:02,560 --> 00:30:05,520
Speaker 4: within their brain, within their psyche in order to start stalking.

651
00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:09,000
Speaker 4: And as you just said, the chase sometimes in the

652
00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:12,960
Speaker 4: obsession may be more of the satisfaction than the actual

653
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:16,080
Speaker 4: results of a healthy relationship. To be fair, you know,

654
00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:17,960
Speaker 4: like how dare you do this to me? How could

655
00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:21,320
Speaker 4: you reject me like this? And there's something sort of

656
00:30:21,400 --> 00:30:25,360
Speaker 4: caught up in that in between there that's very dangerous

657
00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:27,040
Speaker 4: and unfortunately very addicting.

658
00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:31,400
Speaker 2: I mean, I've dated people who I could see going

659
00:30:31,520 --> 00:30:34,080
Speaker 2: in that direction. Who while they did not have an

660
00:30:34,120 --> 00:30:38,920
Speaker 2: official diagnosis, I personally casually diagnose them with borderline personality

661
00:30:38,920 --> 00:30:42,760
Speaker 2: disorder because they had all the hallmarks, which is just

662
00:30:42,800 --> 00:30:47,080
Speaker 2: like extreme fixation or like if they felt rejected in

663
00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:51,160
Speaker 2: any way, they had to like do such extreme behaviors

664
00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:53,080
Speaker 2: to try to make up for that and to kind

665
00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:56,520
Speaker 2: of devalue me and like control me in whatever.

666
00:30:56,240 --> 00:30:57,000
Speaker 3: Way that they could.

667
00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:00,080
Speaker 2: There are cases in which like the person wants to

668
00:31:00,160 --> 00:31:01,960
Speaker 2: control the person or get back together with them, and

669
00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:04,560
Speaker 2: then cases where they kind of want to be them

670
00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:06,160
Speaker 2: or like take over their Like.

671
00:31:06,280 --> 00:31:08,040
Speaker 3: Is there are there different kinds like that?

672
00:31:08,320 --> 00:31:10,120
Speaker 6: Yeah? Sure, I mean that's happened a lot.

673
00:31:11,480 --> 00:31:15,160
Speaker 7: One thing that I will say from what you said,

674
00:31:15,200 --> 00:31:17,520
Speaker 7: like people that you're like, oh, this person could totally

675
00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:20,600
Speaker 7: stock me or whatever if we broke up. Most of

676
00:31:20,680 --> 00:31:25,240
Speaker 7: the time there's abuse in the relationship and then stocking.

677
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:28,440
Speaker 7: So like you, it's clear abuse, like you've been hit,

678
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:31,160
Speaker 7: you've been punched, you've been hair pult like the whole thing,

679
00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:35,080
Speaker 7: clear abuse, mental, physical, the whole thing, and then the

680
00:31:35,120 --> 00:31:36,400
Speaker 7: stocking starts when.

681
00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:37,120
Speaker 6: You try to get away.

682
00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:39,040
Speaker 3: So right, that makes sense.

683
00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:41,360
Speaker 7: Yeah, So it's not just like, this person's weird, I'm

684
00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:43,400
Speaker 7: dating them anyway, and they might stalk me later, but

685
00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:46,200
Speaker 7: it's like this person is fully abusive, and they might.

686
00:31:46,920 --> 00:31:49,959
Speaker 2: Yeah, if there's a really controlling dynamic within the relationship

687
00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:53,040
Speaker 2: and you break up, that control could extend and like

688
00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:54,080
Speaker 2: evolve into stocking.

689
00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:57,720
Speaker 4: Basically to your question too. We have had some single

690
00:31:57,720 --> 00:32:01,520
Speaker 4: white female scenarios before where you usually happens around social media.

691
00:32:01,640 --> 00:32:04,920
Speaker 4: Like we had one case where a woman's ex husband

692
00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:08,320
Speaker 4: started dating a younger lookalike to her, and the younger

693
00:32:08,360 --> 00:32:11,680
Speaker 4: lookalike starts posting photos that look just like her, Like

694
00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:14,360
Speaker 4: she rides motorcycles, so she's on a motorcycle, she's getting

695
00:32:14,640 --> 00:32:17,840
Speaker 4: a tattoo that's similar, she's wearing the same clothes, doing

696
00:32:17,880 --> 00:32:21,560
Speaker 4: the same Instagram layout. So that kind of stuff happens too,

697
00:32:21,640 --> 00:32:23,440
Speaker 4: and it's just this taunting kind of thing.

698
00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:27,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I know a girl who's an influencer.

699
00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:30,240
Speaker 3: A fashion Have I told you this story, I.

700
00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:32,720
Speaker 1: Think because our TikTok ended up following her.

701
00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:36,440
Speaker 3: Yes, Oh my god, that was so creepy. There's a

702
00:32:36,560 --> 00:32:40,240
Speaker 3: fashion influencer who you know, I had black hair like

703
00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:42,960
Speaker 3: a black bob for a long time. And she also

704
00:32:43,040 --> 00:32:44,240
Speaker 3: had a black bob, and.

705
00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:53,040
Speaker 2: Prior to this like second wave of interactions, she basically

706
00:32:53,120 --> 00:32:55,440
Speaker 2: like texted my friend like one hundred something text messages

707
00:32:55,480 --> 00:32:58,000
Speaker 2: in a row about me and started adding all of

708
00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:00,440
Speaker 2: my friends on Facebook and leaving comments every So I

709
00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:03,040
Speaker 2: blocked her and everything didn't hear from her for years.

710
00:33:03,080 --> 00:33:05,760
Speaker 2: We end up in the same like Instagram like boost group,

711
00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:08,280
Speaker 2: which was a thing a few years ago, just where

712
00:33:08,280 --> 00:33:11,240
Speaker 2: of like influencers like comment on each other's stuff to

713
00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:14,920
Speaker 2: boost your engagement. I don't know if that's the thing anymore,

714
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:18,640
Speaker 2: but anyway, and I know and I know, Uh, she's

715
00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:21,760
Speaker 2: commented a couple of times, uh, we're twins.

716
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:22,120
Speaker 1: Ha ha.

717
00:33:22,280 --> 00:33:25,239
Speaker 3: Look everyone says we're twins. Ha ha, and then ha

718
00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:26,480
Speaker 3: ha ha.

719
00:33:27,720 --> 00:33:30,280
Speaker 2: And then in the Booze group, I like saw her post.

720
00:33:30,320 --> 00:33:31,920
Speaker 2: I hadn't thought about it for years, and I noticed

721
00:33:31,960 --> 00:33:34,080
Speaker 2: she did a post really similar to mine, and her

722
00:33:34,080 --> 00:33:36,680
Speaker 2: look is now exactly the same as mine, which it

723
00:33:36,760 --> 00:33:39,400
Speaker 2: wasn't when I first met her. So I blocked her

724
00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:45,600
Speaker 2: and she immediately noticed, because who the fuck notices the

725
00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:47,560
Speaker 2: second someone blocks you? How do you even do that?

726
00:33:47,640 --> 00:33:49,080
Speaker 2: Are you're just constantly checking?

727
00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:50,840
Speaker 6: Some people are constantly checking?

728
00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:54,040
Speaker 4: Yeah, there are people, I know, certain celebrities that have

729
00:33:54,360 --> 00:33:58,479
Speaker 4: people that follow them that one celebrity made the fortunate

730
00:33:58,520 --> 00:34:01,800
Speaker 4: mistake to like one of their posts. Oh no, and

731
00:34:01,880 --> 00:34:06,240
Speaker 4: they literally in their Instagram bio put that I've seen

732
00:34:06,280 --> 00:34:07,160
Speaker 4: that post.

733
00:34:06,960 --> 00:34:10,760
Speaker 2: Like Kardashian, like my post four eleven o seven that

734
00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:11,839
Speaker 2: was twenty years ago.

735
00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:14,880
Speaker 4: Now I'm not I'm not shaming the people that do that,

736
00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:16,719
Speaker 4: but what I am saying is that you got to

737
00:34:16,760 --> 00:34:19,680
Speaker 4: be very careful about the weight of what you do

738
00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:22,239
Speaker 4: and the actions in the words, because it means a

739
00:34:22,280 --> 00:34:24,160
Speaker 4: hell of a lot more to someone else out there

740
00:34:24,520 --> 00:34:26,359
Speaker 4: than it would to you, and you just don't know

741
00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:28,799
Speaker 4: what kind of level of obsession. And they're used to it.

742
00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:30,640
Speaker 4: I mean there are people, I mean, no celebrities, as

743
00:34:30,680 --> 00:34:31,919
Speaker 4: you just said before at the top of the show,

744
00:34:32,400 --> 00:34:35,200
Speaker 4: they are used to this. They have people there who

745
00:34:35,239 --> 00:34:37,160
Speaker 4: deal with this, whether it be they like their fan

746
00:34:37,239 --> 00:34:40,040
Speaker 4: club people or their security or anything else like that.

747
00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:42,960
Speaker 4: So they're kind of usually given a playbook about avoid this,

748
00:34:43,040 --> 00:34:44,960
Speaker 4: avoid that, you know, this kind of thing. But social

749
00:34:45,000 --> 00:34:47,759
Speaker 4: media has really just blown off the doors on, you know,

750
00:34:47,760 --> 00:34:50,000
Speaker 4: the capabilities and the access that people have to them.

751
00:34:50,200 --> 00:34:53,279
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, this girl what she found she.

752
00:34:53,320 --> 00:34:56,800
Speaker 2: Found out that I've blocked her, and she immediately messaged

753
00:34:56,800 --> 00:35:00,480
Speaker 2: me from another account, just like telling me that I'm

754
00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:02,880
Speaker 2: a bad feminist and I don't support women and all

755
00:35:02,920 --> 00:35:04,600
Speaker 2: this stuff. So I was like, please don't contact me.

756
00:35:04,920 --> 00:35:10,200
Speaker 2: So she started leaving like harassing comments from multiple accounts,

757
00:35:10,200 --> 00:35:12,680
Speaker 2: pretending it wasn't her when it was obviously her, because

758
00:35:12,719 --> 00:35:15,759
Speaker 2: the way she types is exactly the same, like, you know,

759
00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:20,200
Speaker 2: not very stable sounding. And then she started messaging everyone

760
00:35:20,239 --> 00:35:22,439
Speaker 2: in the boot group. She messaged like thirty people telling

761
00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:24,359
Speaker 2: them I'm a bad person and a bad feminist who

762
00:35:24,360 --> 00:35:27,279
Speaker 2: she started emailing me and kept emailing me, and I

763
00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:31,759
Speaker 2: was like, please don't contact me again. And I eventually

764
00:35:31,880 --> 00:35:33,480
Speaker 2: she chilled out and she stopped.

765
00:35:33,480 --> 00:35:35,960
Speaker 3: But it was so fucking creepy. Yeah, I don't know

766
00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:38,759
Speaker 3: what that is. I don't know what like brand of stalking.

767
00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:41,200
Speaker 1: Have you thought about doing something extra hideous with your

768
00:35:41,200 --> 00:35:42,760
Speaker 1: hair and seeing if she follows?

769
00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:43,360
Speaker 3: Well, I already have.

770
00:35:46,120 --> 00:35:51,799
Speaker 7: I I mean I would say she probably has some

771
00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:55,960
Speaker 7: mental I mean definitely needs a little therapy. Yeah, I

772
00:35:56,000 --> 00:35:57,360
Speaker 7: would say, yeah, I love everything.

773
00:35:57,440 --> 00:35:58,040
Speaker 6: Therapy is great.

774
00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:01,480
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that is that the main.

775
00:36:03,000 --> 00:36:05,640
Speaker 2: It seems like a terror of something that like it

776
00:36:05,680 --> 00:36:07,520
Speaker 2: seems to me like it's coming from a place of.

777
00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:11,640
Speaker 1: Fear, narystem's terror, right, and it's having no sense of self.

778
00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:15,319
Speaker 4: Well, have you found this in terms of social media?

779
00:36:15,360 --> 00:36:17,680
Speaker 4: Anytime you post something, do you find people that are

780
00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:20,480
Speaker 4: like regular followers that kind of want to control you

781
00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:22,680
Speaker 4: or want to kind of steer your content towards a

782
00:36:23,160 --> 00:36:27,960
Speaker 4: direction or anything like that. Like that sounds m yet, Well,

783
00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:29,600
Speaker 4: there's a couple of people that I've talked to that

784
00:36:29,640 --> 00:36:32,719
Speaker 4: I've had that happen where they're like, they give a

785
00:36:32,760 --> 00:36:35,560
Speaker 4: suggestion right to someone out there in the media, and

786
00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:38,120
Speaker 4: when the person doesn't take that, they get very upset

787
00:36:38,360 --> 00:36:38,839
Speaker 4: very much.

788
00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:41,359
Speaker 2: Oh, that happened to my mom and it was very

789
00:36:41,440 --> 00:36:45,080
Speaker 2: scary actually, But yeah, I don't know, I'll go into

790
00:36:45,080 --> 00:36:45,720
Speaker 2: that whole story.

791
00:36:45,760 --> 00:36:47,959
Speaker 3: But she there was a detail of her story that.

792
00:36:47,880 --> 00:36:49,440
Speaker 2: She didn't want to include because she didn't want to

793
00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:52,960
Speaker 2: invite just whatever. Victims don't have to tell every detail

794
00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:55,000
Speaker 2: of their story. And he was a fellow victim of

795
00:36:55,040 --> 00:36:57,719
Speaker 2: someone of hers and when she didn't tell it the

796
00:36:57,719 --> 00:37:00,000
Speaker 2: way he wanted her to tell it, he like basically

797
00:37:00,120 --> 00:37:00,520
Speaker 2: tried to.

798
00:37:00,520 --> 00:37:03,640
Speaker 3: Ruin her life. Love of people try to ruin other

799
00:37:03,680 --> 00:37:04,239
Speaker 3: people's lives.

800
00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:05,920
Speaker 1: That's fine, but where do they have the time, Like,

801
00:37:05,920 --> 00:37:07,360
Speaker 1: how do these people have so much time?

802
00:37:08,120 --> 00:37:10,440
Speaker 7: I don't know, because sometimes like I look at the

803
00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:12,839
Speaker 7: clock and it's five o'clock and have I even been awake?

804
00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:17,200
Speaker 1: I know, I feel like the only people who can

805
00:37:17,200 --> 00:37:18,560
Speaker 1: get stuff done are a little.

806
00:37:19,680 --> 00:37:24,320
Speaker 4: You'd be surprised, like I get stuff done. You'd be

807
00:37:24,360 --> 00:37:27,560
Speaker 4: surprised when people do that, and how they dedicate that time.

808
00:37:27,600 --> 00:37:29,120
Speaker 4: And it almost, because we've talked of this in the

809
00:37:29,120 --> 00:37:31,640
Speaker 4: show before, it almost becomes a hobby to them, Like

810
00:37:31,680 --> 00:37:33,680
Speaker 4: they don't have a social life, they don't have this,

811
00:37:33,840 --> 00:37:38,360
Speaker 4: it's just stalking is their hobby, right, Interesting.

812
00:37:38,160 --> 00:37:41,440
Speaker 2: So what are some of the hallmarks of how can

813
00:37:41,480 --> 00:37:44,839
Speaker 2: you tell that maybe you're getting stocked versus someone who's

814
00:37:44,880 --> 00:37:46,800
Speaker 2: just like into you or a fan or something.

815
00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:51,320
Speaker 4: Boundaries play a big role in stocking cases. Sometimes you

816
00:37:51,400 --> 00:37:53,760
Speaker 4: don't get to communicate that, especially if it's a stranger stalking,

817
00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:57,040
Speaker 4: especially if someone's trying to ruin you online or anything else,

818
00:37:57,120 --> 00:37:59,840
Speaker 4: or trying to basically cause harm to you or anyone

819
00:37:59,880 --> 00:38:07,040
Speaker 4: in your life. If you find that you're uncomfortable instinctually

820
00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:10,440
Speaker 4: there's issues that are going on. You feel that you've

821
00:38:10,480 --> 00:38:14,680
Speaker 4: already communicated that, and there are people that are literally

822
00:38:15,200 --> 00:38:21,799
Speaker 4: wanting to harass you, wanting to continue to basically contact you,

823
00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:24,640
Speaker 4: and you've already made that clear. You can basically go

824
00:38:24,680 --> 00:38:28,319
Speaker 4: along the same path of that being stocking. So there

825
00:38:28,320 --> 00:38:30,560
Speaker 4: are fine lines with that, and every community has a

826
00:38:30,600 --> 00:38:33,000
Speaker 4: different sort of you know, it's illegal in fifty states,

827
00:38:33,040 --> 00:38:36,160
Speaker 4: but every community has different laws and different standards on

828
00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:40,040
Speaker 4: how to appreciate and approach what a stocking case is.

829
00:38:40,120 --> 00:38:42,399
Speaker 4: You know, you can go to a big city and assume, oh,

830
00:38:42,400 --> 00:38:44,240
Speaker 4: they're going to take care of it. They don't do anything.

831
00:38:44,320 --> 00:38:47,480
Speaker 4: You go to a small town, the shafful drive by

832
00:38:47,520 --> 00:38:49,680
Speaker 4: your house every every day just to make sure that

833
00:38:49,680 --> 00:38:52,520
Speaker 4: nobody's taspassing. So it really does depend on that. But

834
00:38:52,600 --> 00:38:55,520
Speaker 4: that's the whole thing too, is that I would always say,

835
00:38:55,840 --> 00:38:57,880
Speaker 4: you know, go to your research look up. I mean

836
00:38:57,920 --> 00:39:00,160
Speaker 4: a lot of the people we've on the show have

837
00:39:00,239 --> 00:39:03,640
Speaker 4: been looking for stocking support and they end up finding

838
00:39:03,680 --> 00:39:05,279
Speaker 4: the show and they find other things and they were

839
00:39:05,360 --> 00:39:06,640
Speaker 4: able to kind of piece it together.

840
00:39:06,840 --> 00:39:08,640
Speaker 1: Mmmm. I thought that must be so nice for them

841
00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:10,120
Speaker 1: to have a community of people.

842
00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:13,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, seriously, can I just talk to us a little

843
00:39:13,000 --> 00:39:15,880
Speaker 2: bit about the power dynamics between a stalker and a stocky,

844
00:39:16,320 --> 00:39:18,640
Speaker 2: like what the ways in which they kind of can

845
00:39:18,760 --> 00:39:21,680
Speaker 2: control and assert their power over their victims.

846
00:39:22,960 --> 00:39:26,640
Speaker 7: I think that the power dynamic between you know, someone

847
00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:29,360
Speaker 7: doing the stocking and someone being stalked, it really depends

848
00:39:29,440 --> 00:39:34,000
Speaker 7: on the overall relationship where they together beforehand. So like

849
00:39:34,120 --> 00:39:37,640
Speaker 7: a domestic stocking, you get divorced and your husband, so

850
00:39:37,880 --> 00:39:42,160
Speaker 7: your ex husband starts stalking you. This person knows everything

851
00:39:42,160 --> 00:39:44,319
Speaker 7: about you. They know how to get und your skin,

852
00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:47,000
Speaker 7: they know what to do, they know how to hurt

853
00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:47,560
Speaker 7: you the most.

854
00:39:47,680 --> 00:39:50,920
Speaker 6: They know everything. So that's really terrifying.

855
00:39:50,960 --> 00:39:53,280
Speaker 7: And that's you know, like murder and slow motion because

856
00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:59,400
Speaker 7: usually not usually, but in those cases sometimes that's the

857
00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:03,080
Speaker 7: end result, that is what they're looking for, and sometimes

858
00:40:03,080 --> 00:40:06,520
Speaker 7: they just want to ruin your life per se.

859
00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:07,799
Speaker 6: But I think that.

860
00:40:09,600 --> 00:40:12,400
Speaker 7: You know that that dynamic is just it's the course

861
00:40:12,440 --> 00:40:18,040
Speaker 7: of control, it's the abusiveness, you know, and and they

862
00:40:18,040 --> 00:40:21,440
Speaker 7: already know everything about you and so that's where their

863
00:40:21,480 --> 00:40:25,360
Speaker 7: power comes from. And then you know, more of a

864
00:40:25,400 --> 00:40:28,960
Speaker 7: stranger stocking or something like that, those are the ones

865
00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:31,440
Speaker 7: that kind of I think are all over the board

866
00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:35,800
Speaker 7: more like maybe they have you know, this mental illness

867
00:40:36,160 --> 00:40:40,080
Speaker 7: or you know, they see Kim Kardashian on TV and

868
00:40:40,120 --> 00:40:42,920
Speaker 7: on Instagram and they just get obsessed and you know

869
00:40:42,920 --> 00:40:45,640
Speaker 7: whatever that might be. So that's like I think, less

870
00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:49,799
Speaker 7: power and more obsession, where I think that if it's

871
00:40:49,960 --> 00:40:54,239
Speaker 7: like a relationship type stocking, it's more power along with

872
00:40:54,239 --> 00:40:54,880
Speaker 7: the obsession.

873
00:40:55,239 --> 00:40:57,080
Speaker 2: I was we had like a we had a former

874
00:40:57,080 --> 00:40:59,279
Speaker 2: one direction stand on and it just makes me think

875
00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:03,360
Speaker 2: about fandom and how much you know, she was talking

876
00:41:03,360 --> 00:41:08,960
Speaker 2: about how like music's music, celebrities teams will like really

877
00:41:09,040 --> 00:41:13,000
Speaker 2: encourage this obsessive fandom, and I actually think like it

878
00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:17,360
Speaker 2: can from the outside, looking at a Stan versus a Stoker,

879
00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:20,400
Speaker 2: that behavior can look really really similar, and I wonder

880
00:41:20,480 --> 00:41:23,560
Speaker 2: where that line is and how we tell the difference.

881
00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:27,080
Speaker 4: Well, you know, I mean, celebrities by nature need fans. Obviously,

882
00:41:27,239 --> 00:41:31,520
Speaker 4: musicians need fans. I need the encouragement to follow us,

883
00:41:32,040 --> 00:41:34,680
Speaker 4: buy things that we put out and promote and so

884
00:41:34,920 --> 00:41:39,120
Speaker 4: ultimately though, but again, you're not bringing fans technically, I mean,

885
00:41:39,280 --> 00:41:41,720
Speaker 4: you're not bringing fans into your house. You're not bringing

886
00:41:41,719 --> 00:41:44,759
Speaker 4: fans in private areas where you don't want these things

887
00:41:44,800 --> 00:41:48,319
Speaker 4: to be. Social media gives the illusion that there is

888
00:41:48,360 --> 00:41:53,399
Speaker 4: a connection oftentimes a very personal connection, especially if someone engages.

889
00:41:53,520 --> 00:41:55,200
Speaker 4: And that's the one thing I think that was more

890
00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:58,319
Speaker 4: about the psychology of fandom, whereas before you were a

891
00:41:58,320 --> 00:42:01,279
Speaker 4: lot more distanced. But social media has really sort of

892
00:42:01,320 --> 00:42:05,000
Speaker 4: broken down things and made things very sort of connective,

893
00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:08,200
Speaker 4: and people internalize that. They're like, wow, they out of

894
00:42:08,239 --> 00:42:11,000
Speaker 4: all the posts in the world, they noticed mine mine.

895
00:42:11,280 --> 00:42:11,520
Speaker 6: Right.

896
00:42:11,680 --> 00:42:13,920
Speaker 3: Do you think social media has increased stocking?

897
00:42:14,560 --> 00:42:17,359
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, for sure exponentially.

898
00:42:17,440 --> 00:42:17,680
Speaker 2: Yeah.

899
00:42:17,800 --> 00:42:19,440
Speaker 1: Do you guys like the movie Angrey Goes.

900
00:42:19,239 --> 00:42:21,680
Speaker 3: West I saw a while back.

901
00:42:22,360 --> 00:42:24,759
Speaker 6: You have to, I've seen it. It was good, but

902
00:42:24,800 --> 00:42:26,960
Speaker 6: I don't remember. It was something about social media.

903
00:42:27,560 --> 00:42:29,200
Speaker 1: It's about stucking. Everybody, watch it tonight.

904
00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:30,759
Speaker 4: It's like a watch party. Start.

905
00:42:31,120 --> 00:42:34,200
Speaker 2: She's like shocking an influencer, right, like a social media Wow,

906
00:42:35,280 --> 00:42:39,960
Speaker 2: it's a few years old, right, Yeah, it's hilarious and.

907
00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:40,640
Speaker 6: Yeah, I feel like I remember it being funny though.

908
00:42:40,719 --> 00:42:43,120
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it's very funny. But it's also scary because

909
00:42:43,160 --> 00:42:46,280
Speaker 1: you can, like, you can see how it could go badly,

910
00:42:46,320 --> 00:42:48,200
Speaker 1: and then you know, you see in the news where

911
00:42:48,239 --> 00:42:51,279
Speaker 1: it's like, you, guys, I watched doctor Phil Okay, I

912
00:42:51,320 --> 00:42:55,080
Speaker 1: did it, but you see somebody that's like Eminem's my dad,

913
00:42:55,160 --> 00:42:58,239
Speaker 1: and it's like, no, he's not. But she's convinced that

914
00:42:58,320 --> 00:43:01,399
Speaker 1: Eminem is her father, or that I'm in love with

915
00:43:01,880 --> 00:43:05,000
Speaker 1: Tyler Perry. And they've never met these people, but it's

916
00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:08,040
Speaker 1: like complete convinced.

917
00:43:08,920 --> 00:43:11,680
Speaker 4: I mean, obviously those are outliers. To be fair, I mean,

918
00:43:11,680 --> 00:43:14,360
Speaker 4: not everybody thinks, you know, if Eminem has you know,

919
00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:17,120
Speaker 4: ten million people out there that think that he's their.

920
00:43:17,080 --> 00:43:21,520
Speaker 3: Dad, Eminem is my dad. Daddy.

921
00:43:22,719 --> 00:43:26,040
Speaker 4: That's different. I mean, yeah, exactly, A.

922
00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:30,440
Speaker 6: Little like twins.

923
00:43:32,400 --> 00:43:34,239
Speaker 1: Do you look a little like twins?

924
00:43:34,440 --> 00:43:38,720
Speaker 7: I think though, Like with the fans versus soccer's famous people,

925
00:43:39,120 --> 00:43:43,520
Speaker 7: I think it really is individual fans, you know, Like

926
00:43:43,600 --> 00:43:47,640
Speaker 7: it's not I mean, okay, like I there's a band

927
00:43:47,680 --> 00:43:48,760
Speaker 7: that I absolutely loved.

928
00:43:49,600 --> 00:43:51,359
Speaker 6: I still love them. They're like my favorite band.

929
00:43:51,360 --> 00:43:54,400
Speaker 7: I'm not gonna na name Oh come on, I'm not

930
00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:56,440
Speaker 7: gonna genre genre rock and roll.

931
00:43:56,520 --> 00:43:59,759
Speaker 2: Okay, I'm not gonna I'm not gonna name names.

932
00:43:59,760 --> 00:44:01,799
Speaker 6: Just be because I'll tell you the rest of the story.

933
00:44:01,840 --> 00:44:05,440
Speaker 7: And I mean, like one of my first concerts I

934
00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:09,080
Speaker 7: went to, like I followed them around the country for

935
00:44:09,160 --> 00:44:12,040
Speaker 7: a while, like obsessed, but not like creepy obsessed.

936
00:44:12,120 --> 00:44:13,640
Speaker 6: Right, and then but I was like.

937
00:44:13,640 --> 00:44:16,400
Speaker 7: Front row and stuff, and you know, the lead singer

938
00:44:16,440 --> 00:44:19,000
Speaker 7: noticed me and brought me backstage and we dated for

939
00:44:19,040 --> 00:44:19,400
Speaker 7: a while.

940
00:44:19,880 --> 00:44:23,040
Speaker 6: Was I an obsessed fan? Was I stalking him?

941
00:44:23,440 --> 00:44:25,040
Speaker 7: I mean I went to a lot of shows, but

942
00:44:25,080 --> 00:44:26,600
Speaker 7: I wasn't like showing up at his hat well.

943
00:44:26,560 --> 00:44:29,719
Speaker 6: Until he invited me. Then I was showing up at

944
00:44:29,719 --> 00:44:30,520
Speaker 6: his house.

945
00:44:30,440 --> 00:44:33,520
Speaker 7: Right, but so like obviously didn't make him feel afraid,

946
00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:36,680
Speaker 7: you know, so like it's still like that gut thing

947
00:44:36,880 --> 00:44:40,160
Speaker 7: even with because there were other people that were out

948
00:44:40,200 --> 00:44:43,239
Speaker 7: every show that I knew, you know, being also at

949
00:44:43,239 --> 00:44:45,400
Speaker 7: the shows, and those people were freaky and they were

950
00:44:45,440 --> 00:44:47,800
Speaker 7: weird and they were like I heard the band is

951
00:44:47,840 --> 00:44:50,719
Speaker 7: saying here, and I'm like okay, Like I'm just like

952
00:44:50,760 --> 00:44:52,640
Speaker 7: I just want to go see the show, and like, yeah,

953
00:44:52,680 --> 00:44:55,120
Speaker 7: you know, yeah Little Fantasy is not the lead singer,

954
00:44:55,160 --> 00:44:55,920
Speaker 7: which all came.

955
00:44:55,760 --> 00:45:02,280
Speaker 3: True, honestly, so impressive, but we're.

956
00:45:02,160 --> 00:45:03,880
Speaker 6: Still kind of like friends to this day, which is

957
00:45:03,920 --> 00:45:04,439
Speaker 6: super cool.

958
00:45:04,560 --> 00:45:07,319
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, but yeah, yeah, I mean I don't think

959
00:45:07,360 --> 00:45:10,400
Speaker 2: being a super fan is wrong, Like there's nothing wrong

960
00:45:10,440 --> 00:45:12,840
Speaker 2: with that, anything wrong with going to public shows that

961
00:45:12,880 --> 00:45:14,880
Speaker 2: they're putting on for fans to go.

962
00:45:15,000 --> 00:45:16,000
Speaker 6: I think That's what I'm trying to say.

963
00:45:16,040 --> 00:45:18,280
Speaker 7: It's like the other people that were they even creeped

964
00:45:18,360 --> 00:45:20,719
Speaker 7: me out, were like, yeah, like I heard they're staying here,

965
00:45:20,840 --> 00:45:22,040
Speaker 7: they ate dinner here, Like how.

966
00:45:22,640 --> 00:45:23,720
Speaker 6: Do you know where they ate dinner?

967
00:45:23,920 --> 00:45:25,520
Speaker 3: Like that's weird.

968
00:45:25,320 --> 00:45:27,120
Speaker 7: Unless you happen to be at the same dinner place

969
00:45:27,160 --> 00:45:29,360
Speaker 7: because it's near the venue, but like that's weird.

970
00:45:29,400 --> 00:45:31,200
Speaker 6: But they always kind of knew, you know.

971
00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:34,960
Speaker 1: Yeah. The thing that the One Direction Stan told us

972
00:45:35,000 --> 00:45:38,400
Speaker 1: that I'd never thought of before was that and this

973
00:45:38,480 --> 00:45:42,359
Speaker 1: is so obvious, but when One Direction got a win,

974
00:45:42,760 --> 00:45:45,000
Speaker 1: she felt like it was her win. It was like

975
00:45:45,320 --> 00:45:49,120
Speaker 1: her psyche had connected to theirs, so she felt like

976
00:45:50,120 --> 00:45:52,319
Speaker 1: something good happened in their life, something good happened in

977
00:45:52,360 --> 00:45:53,000
Speaker 1: her life.

978
00:45:53,200 --> 00:45:56,520
Speaker 4: You've heard this with sports teams before, Like, yeah, Passionately,

979
00:45:56,760 --> 00:45:59,600
Speaker 4: I think fandom is a healthy thing bottom line. But

980
00:45:59,640 --> 00:46:02,400
Speaker 4: I also think this too, is that people do personalize

981
00:46:02,440 --> 00:46:05,279
Speaker 4: someone else's experiences, and I think that can be very

982
00:46:05,320 --> 00:46:08,960
Speaker 4: healthy too. You're living vicariously through people's victories. But again,

983
00:46:09,120 --> 00:46:12,040
Speaker 4: these outliers where they take it to that that next level,

984
00:46:12,120 --> 00:46:14,719
Speaker 4: Like even what Jamie said before, you know kind of

985
00:46:14,920 --> 00:46:17,120
Speaker 4: there's one thing about Hey, let's check out the band,

986
00:46:17,080 --> 00:46:18,960
Speaker 4: and then the next level is Okay, here's what they ate,

987
00:46:19,000 --> 00:46:21,279
Speaker 4: here's here's where they're staying. Let's let's camp out in

988
00:46:21,320 --> 00:46:24,120
Speaker 4: the parking lotvel Like there's a certain sort of boundary

989
00:46:24,280 --> 00:46:26,479
Speaker 4: that you're really sort of trapesing over.

990
00:46:27,280 --> 00:46:29,400
Speaker 7: Camping on the parking lot is cool. I just have

991
00:46:29,480 --> 00:46:31,760
Speaker 7: to rewind that, Like I've done that for a million

992
00:46:32,160 --> 00:46:33,759
Speaker 7: back in the day when you had to go to

993
00:46:33,840 --> 00:46:37,120
Speaker 7: Ticketmaster and buy the show, like buy the tickets like I'm.

994
00:46:36,960 --> 00:46:38,040
Speaker 6: Older, No, that's fair.

995
00:46:38,760 --> 00:46:41,719
Speaker 7: And also like sometimes there's there's many times you can

996
00:46:41,760 --> 00:46:42,680
Speaker 7: camp out in the parking line.

997
00:46:42,680 --> 00:46:45,640
Speaker 3: I'm just gonna say that their home.

998
00:46:47,360 --> 00:46:48,200
Speaker 4: That's the point I want to.

999
00:46:50,360 --> 00:46:54,160
Speaker 6: Hear the show exactly. That's fine, Yeah, because that's really fun.

1000
00:46:54,680 --> 00:46:57,480
Speaker 1: I will say that I always thought that a male

1001
00:46:57,560 --> 00:46:59,880
Speaker 1: stocker would be more dangerous than a female stocker. But

1002
00:47:00,160 --> 00:47:03,280
Speaker 1: then a friend of mine got stocked by a woman

1003
00:47:03,440 --> 00:47:08,279
Speaker 1: who honestly ruined his life. He had to change his name,

1004
00:47:08,360 --> 00:47:11,440
Speaker 1: he had to move, he had to change his number

1005
00:47:11,560 --> 00:47:15,920
Speaker 1: fifteen times, and she will she left a dead animal

1006
00:47:16,440 --> 00:47:19,600
Speaker 1: on his porch. I guess the animals get involved in

1007
00:47:19,640 --> 00:47:22,480
Speaker 1: stalking a lot, Yeah, they get in this process.

1008
00:47:22,600 --> 00:47:25,600
Speaker 4: Is that I think said can happen anything that's precious

1009
00:47:25,640 --> 00:47:28,440
Speaker 4: to the victim, They go after. This is the one thing.

1010
00:47:28,480 --> 00:47:31,320
Speaker 4: Anything this is, you know, family, friends, you know, pets,

1011
00:47:31,480 --> 00:47:34,080
Speaker 4: anything like that, to harm or cause any sort of

1012
00:47:34,160 --> 00:47:37,359
Speaker 4: violation into their life, to cause any sort of like

1013
00:47:38,600 --> 00:47:41,560
Speaker 4: bad things to happen within that scope, they'll do. I

1014
00:47:41,560 --> 00:47:41,759
Speaker 4: mean that.

1015
00:47:41,880 --> 00:47:44,759
Speaker 7: I think I think that men and women can stock

1016
00:47:44,920 --> 00:47:48,600
Speaker 7: very similarly. I think the one difference though, is if

1017
00:47:48,640 --> 00:47:50,520
Speaker 7: you're a man being stocked by a woman.

1018
00:47:51,520 --> 00:47:53,080
Speaker 6: Okay, so if you're a woman being stocked.

1019
00:47:52,880 --> 00:47:55,879
Speaker 7: By man and he approaches you on the street and

1020
00:47:55,960 --> 00:47:58,359
Speaker 7: you scream and run away like someone's going to help

1021
00:47:58,400 --> 00:48:00,840
Speaker 7: you and notice that you're screaming and running hopefully, or

1022
00:48:00,880 --> 00:48:03,600
Speaker 7: you can fight against them, right like you have your peppers,

1023
00:48:03,719 --> 00:48:06,799
Speaker 7: your pepper spram or whatever it is. Now, if you're

1024
00:48:06,840 --> 00:48:11,120
Speaker 7: a man and a female is following you, are you

1025
00:48:11,160 --> 00:48:13,920
Speaker 7: going to defend yourself because the people around you are

1026
00:48:13,920 --> 00:48:15,520
Speaker 7: going to meet the ship out of the guy. Like

1027
00:48:15,920 --> 00:48:18,560
Speaker 7: everyone's going to defend the girl even though she is

1028
00:48:18,640 --> 00:48:21,279
Speaker 7: the aggressor. But if they don't know the situation, you

1029
00:48:21,280 --> 00:48:22,080
Speaker 7: can't defend yourself.

1030
00:48:22,080 --> 00:48:23,359
Speaker 6: If you're a guy, right and.

1031
00:48:23,360 --> 00:48:26,560
Speaker 7: Tops don't take you seriously, it's more like, oh, like,

1032
00:48:26,600 --> 00:48:28,319
Speaker 7: what did you do to make her come after?

1033
00:48:28,440 --> 00:48:28,480
Speaker 5: You?

1034
00:48:28,840 --> 00:48:31,719
Speaker 7: Like, the sex must have been great, because you, guys know,

1035
00:48:32,320 --> 00:48:33,440
Speaker 7: if the dick is good, we.

1036
00:48:33,440 --> 00:48:37,160
Speaker 1: Will This girl was very attractive, she was a porn

1037
00:48:37,280 --> 00:48:40,600
Speaker 1: star and she and I mean that was his experience.

1038
00:48:40,880 --> 00:48:43,560
Speaker 1: I mean lucky you They're so lucky. And that's what.

1039
00:48:43,760 --> 00:48:46,880
Speaker 7: Yes, that's what also say, like they can't wrap their

1040
00:48:46,920 --> 00:48:49,719
Speaker 7: head around it that women can be just as dangerous.

1041
00:48:49,840 --> 00:48:53,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I think women are typically in more physical

1042
00:48:53,680 --> 00:48:57,240
Speaker 2: danger just because of the nature of male and female

1043
00:48:57,280 --> 00:48:58,560
Speaker 2: anatomy or not.

1044
00:48:58,760 --> 00:49:01,280
Speaker 3: But you know what I mean, well, stature and as.

1045
00:49:01,200 --> 00:49:03,640
Speaker 7: Three women here, that's what you think. I mean, that's

1046
00:49:03,680 --> 00:49:06,600
Speaker 7: what we're gonna definitely. I mean men are bigger than us,

1047
00:49:06,800 --> 00:49:07,319
Speaker 7: right like.

1048
00:49:07,640 --> 00:49:10,839
Speaker 3: And intend towards violence typically more.

1049
00:49:10,880 --> 00:49:14,680
Speaker 2: I agree. I mean that's just statistically true. Yeah, but

1050
00:49:14,920 --> 00:49:18,680
Speaker 2: also that creates a silent sort of victimhood for men

1051
00:49:18,719 --> 00:49:20,759
Speaker 2: who don't really get to be heard in that way.

1052
00:49:20,800 --> 00:49:23,440
Speaker 2: And I like, yeah, I think in general, when men

1053
00:49:23,480 --> 00:49:26,799
Speaker 2: are victims, it is much harder to get hurt, to

1054
00:49:26,840 --> 00:49:28,000
Speaker 2: be hurt, and to get help.

1055
00:49:28,320 --> 00:49:30,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, for reasons.

1056
00:49:30,560 --> 00:49:31,240
Speaker 1: It's so scary.

1057
00:49:33,000 --> 00:49:35,399
Speaker 2: Let's go back to what Megan have mentioned earlier, which

1058
00:49:35,440 --> 00:49:38,720
Speaker 2: is this idea of like feeling bad for your stalker,

1059
00:49:38,760 --> 00:49:41,319
Speaker 2: because I'm thinking about the types of people who are

1060
00:49:41,360 --> 00:49:44,239
Speaker 2: engaging in this, and I'm guessing the majority of them

1061
00:49:44,280 --> 00:49:47,000
Speaker 2: have some kind of mental illness, right, And we don't

1062
00:49:47,040 --> 00:49:49,799
Speaker 2: want to like shame people for having mental illness. But

1063
00:49:49,840 --> 00:49:53,279
Speaker 2: that can be such a hairy situation because where's.

1064
00:49:52,960 --> 00:49:56,279
Speaker 3: The line between empathy and like safety. And I mean,

1065
00:49:56,320 --> 00:49:57,919
Speaker 3: I don't know if you had more anyone to say,

1066
00:49:57,960 --> 00:49:59,280
Speaker 3: not just somebody lonely?

1067
00:49:59,520 --> 00:50:03,880
Speaker 1: Is my heart strings so hard? And somebody who maybe

1068
00:50:03,920 --> 00:50:07,680
Speaker 1: is making an appropriate bed to connect with me, But

1069
00:50:07,719 --> 00:50:10,400
Speaker 1: I'm like, they're just lonely, they don't they need a friend,

1070
00:50:10,719 --> 00:50:14,840
Speaker 1: And then you end up in a circumstance that's fully insane.

1071
00:50:15,200 --> 00:50:17,520
Speaker 4: To your point, most of the guests we have on

1072
00:50:17,560 --> 00:50:20,120
Speaker 4: the show want their stalker to get help. When we

1073
00:50:20,160 --> 00:50:22,400
Speaker 4: ask them what you think should happen, most of the

1074
00:50:22,400 --> 00:50:25,640
Speaker 4: guests say, I hope they get help. There's a real

1075
00:50:25,719 --> 00:50:27,600
Speaker 4: sympathy when it comes to these things, in a real

1076
00:50:27,600 --> 00:50:30,200
Speaker 4: compassion that you would think after all they've been through.

1077
00:50:30,239 --> 00:50:32,279
Speaker 4: We've had some guests that have been stocked, like for

1078
00:50:32,280 --> 00:50:35,840
Speaker 4: four decades, and you would think that through multiple marriages,

1079
00:50:36,680 --> 00:50:39,640
Speaker 4: children involved, all these things. So you got to understand

1080
00:50:39,719 --> 00:50:42,360
Speaker 4: is like in terms of that, it's very interesting to

1081
00:50:42,400 --> 00:50:45,400
Speaker 4: go down that path and sort of see the compassion

1082
00:50:45,600 --> 00:50:48,240
Speaker 4: and the sympathy that they carry through all these times.

1083
00:50:48,280 --> 00:50:50,719
Speaker 4: And not everyone's like that, but most of ours like that.

1084
00:50:51,080 --> 00:50:54,200
Speaker 6: I wouldn't be like that. I wouldn't.

1085
00:50:54,239 --> 00:50:54,920
Speaker 1: You're a legend.

1086
00:50:55,000 --> 00:50:55,799
Speaker 6: I believe you.

1087
00:50:56,040 --> 00:50:59,560
Speaker 7: Yeah, like we're talking about I've been and abuse a relationship.

1088
00:50:59,600 --> 00:51:03,239
Speaker 7: I think he should rotten how I mean, did.

1089
00:51:02,920 --> 00:51:04,240
Speaker 1: He stalk you?

1090
00:51:03,840 --> 00:51:03,880
Speaker 5: No?

1091
00:51:05,200 --> 00:51:06,280
Speaker 1: Have you been stopped?

1092
00:51:06,440 --> 00:51:10,120
Speaker 6: I have not, No interesting you.

1093
00:51:10,280 --> 00:51:13,319
Speaker 4: I've had some interesting encounters, but I wouldn't now after

1094
00:51:13,320 --> 00:51:16,000
Speaker 4: doing the show, I would never label them stalking. You know,

1095
00:51:16,080 --> 00:51:20,160
Speaker 4: harassment different you know exes showing up and knocking on

1096
00:51:20,200 --> 00:51:23,080
Speaker 4: the bedroom window, kind of stuff like the little you know,

1097
00:51:23,320 --> 00:51:25,640
Speaker 4: those kind of things like the boundaries. But I wouldn't

1098
00:51:25,640 --> 00:51:26,240
Speaker 4: call it stalking.

1099
00:51:27,239 --> 00:51:29,360
Speaker 3: Stalking light that's.

1100
00:51:29,280 --> 00:51:31,560
Speaker 4: I would say. I would say, yeah, I'd say there's

1101
00:51:31,719 --> 00:51:33,600
Speaker 4: the level of harassment and everything else like that.

1102
00:51:33,719 --> 00:51:36,600
Speaker 7: But yeah, in that I do think though, that mental

1103
00:51:36,600 --> 00:51:40,919
Speaker 7: illness is so prevalent in stalking, and I just don't

1104
00:51:40,960 --> 00:51:45,200
Speaker 7: think it's recognized very well. I mean, it's when I

1105
00:51:45,239 --> 00:51:47,120
Speaker 7: see it when I think about it. I mean, I

1106
00:51:47,280 --> 00:51:50,239
Speaker 7: I can equate it to smoking cigarettes, Like, but when

1107
00:51:50,239 --> 00:51:53,360
Speaker 7: you're smoking cigarettes, like you're only hurting yourself or enjoying

1108
00:51:53,400 --> 00:51:56,560
Speaker 7: it whatever it is, right, but you know, it's when

1109
00:51:56,600 --> 00:51:58,319
Speaker 7: you're doing it to somebody else and you're hurting them

1110
00:51:58,560 --> 00:52:01,239
Speaker 7: so but it's still it's I think it's just kind

1111
00:52:01,239 --> 00:52:03,600
Speaker 7: of a little bit of a brain malfunction somewhere. You know,

1112
00:52:03,640 --> 00:52:06,800
Speaker 7: maybe you don't have like severe mental illness, but something

1113
00:52:07,000 --> 00:52:09,319
Speaker 7: popped off a little. It doesn't make you have like

1114
00:52:09,440 --> 00:52:12,320
Speaker 7: severe mental illness. You have to be put away somewhere.

1115
00:52:12,360 --> 00:52:14,440
Speaker 7: I mean, I know I joked about it earlier, but like,

1116
00:52:14,560 --> 00:52:17,439
Speaker 7: therapy is amazing. Therapy is one of the best things

1117
00:52:17,440 --> 00:52:19,640
Speaker 7: I think that most people can do. And I think

1118
00:52:19,680 --> 00:52:24,280
Speaker 7: that you know, if you're questioning yourself and having weird

1119
00:52:24,320 --> 00:52:28,080
Speaker 7: feelings about somebody, like and you're checking your Instagram every

1120
00:52:28,080 --> 00:52:31,480
Speaker 7: two seconds and you can't do other work because you're

1121
00:52:31,520 --> 00:52:34,200
Speaker 7: watching them on Facebook, I don't even know face because

1122
00:52:34,200 --> 00:52:38,719
Speaker 7: the thing anymore. But yeah, or like we joke like, oh,

1123
00:52:38,719 --> 00:52:41,879
Speaker 7: I'm gonna drive by his house that like, actually don't

1124
00:52:41,880 --> 00:52:45,200
Speaker 7: do that, Like that's not actually cool, Like you probably

1125
00:52:45,280 --> 00:52:48,399
Speaker 7: should go talk to someone go talk to and tell

1126
00:52:48,440 --> 00:52:51,960
Speaker 7: them how you're feeling, because if you can, I think

1127
00:52:51,960 --> 00:52:55,640
Speaker 7: that there's a point when some people maybe start stalking,

1128
00:52:55,640 --> 00:52:57,880
Speaker 7: when they're like, I know this might be wrong, but

1129
00:52:59,080 --> 00:53:00,839
Speaker 7: I'm just gonna do it, you know, like and then

1130
00:53:00,880 --> 00:53:04,040
Speaker 7: it becomes this weird obsession and yeah, so much so

1131
00:53:04,120 --> 00:53:06,040
Speaker 7: I think that you know, if you do have those

1132
00:53:06,080 --> 00:53:08,919
Speaker 7: weird feelings, maybe you know, just go talk to someone,

1133
00:53:09,000 --> 00:53:11,440
Speaker 7: get some therapy, and I think that that would curb

1134
00:53:11,640 --> 00:53:12,920
Speaker 7: a lot of the problems.

1135
00:53:13,120 --> 00:53:16,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, literally completely different in every way. But we talk

1136
00:53:16,760 --> 00:53:19,120
Speaker 2: about how you know, you shouldn't go to one person

1137
00:53:19,440 --> 00:53:21,759
Speaker 2: for all of your information because that's how you get

1138
00:53:21,800 --> 00:53:23,800
Speaker 2: into a culty situation.

1139
00:53:24,400 --> 00:53:25,279
Speaker 3: Also, you shouldn't go.

1140
00:53:25,320 --> 00:53:27,919
Speaker 2: To one person for all of your emotional needs by

1141
00:53:28,120 --> 00:53:31,319
Speaker 2: you know, making your life about them and fixating one

1142
00:53:31,360 --> 00:53:34,960
Speaker 2: person just should never be a fixation for us. That

1143
00:53:35,120 --> 00:53:38,439
Speaker 2: probably isn't healthy, whatever the dynamic is. And I would

1144
00:53:38,480 --> 00:53:41,520
Speaker 2: say maybe that's the point which to try to get help, well.

1145
00:53:41,320 --> 00:53:44,319
Speaker 4: Even finding your support system within that. I mean a

1146
00:53:44,320 --> 00:53:46,840
Speaker 4: lot of times we have guests on that their you know,

1147
00:53:46,960 --> 00:53:50,240
Speaker 4: their own families either don't take them seriously, or somebody

1148
00:53:50,239 --> 00:53:52,400
Speaker 4: else or their friends or things like that. So it's

1149
00:53:52,400 --> 00:53:55,160
Speaker 4: almost like it's sometimes hard to get people to listen

1150
00:53:55,200 --> 00:53:58,279
Speaker 4: to you. And what we've been able to offer, you know,

1151
00:53:58,400 --> 00:54:00,839
Speaker 4: very grateful to do so is get people a chance

1152
00:54:00,920 --> 00:54:03,960
Speaker 4: to basically release and not be judged, you know what

1153
00:54:03,960 --> 00:54:05,839
Speaker 4: I'm saying, be able to share their story and kind

1154
00:54:05,880 --> 00:54:08,200
Speaker 4: of release that level of trauma to say, Okay, I'm

1155
00:54:08,200 --> 00:54:10,640
Speaker 4: going to be believed. I'm going to get on and

1156
00:54:10,719 --> 00:54:12,239
Speaker 4: share this because a lot of times they'll share it

1157
00:54:12,239 --> 00:54:13,960
Speaker 4: with their own family and friends, because it's not like

1158
00:54:14,000 --> 00:54:16,200
Speaker 4: you're gonna say, oh, by the way, it's Thanksgiving, let's

1159
00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:18,360
Speaker 4: talk about my stocking case that that doesn't happen, or

1160
00:54:18,640 --> 00:54:21,040
Speaker 4: it's and pieces. So this is the most complete narrative

1161
00:54:21,040 --> 00:54:22,800
Speaker 4: a lot of them have had up to this point.

1162
00:54:23,000 --> 00:54:25,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, I can imagine it being a very isolating experience

1163
00:54:25,800 --> 00:54:28,080
Speaker 2: if you don't know anyone who's been through it before.

1164
00:54:28,520 --> 00:54:30,440
Speaker 7: Well, and I think a lot of people also feel

1165
00:54:30,640 --> 00:54:34,480
Speaker 7: shame for it, especially if it's Yeah, I think it's

1166
00:54:34,480 --> 00:54:40,240
Speaker 7: a relationship stocking situation. I mean, and you know, because

1167
00:54:40,239 --> 00:54:42,480
Speaker 7: there is a lot of like domestic violence and stuff

1168
00:54:42,480 --> 00:54:44,640
Speaker 7: in stalking. I mean, just to equate it back to that,

1169
00:54:44,680 --> 00:54:47,560
Speaker 7: how many women that are actively being abused or like

1170
00:54:47,680 --> 00:54:49,040
Speaker 7: putting it on Instagram.

1171
00:54:49,120 --> 00:54:50,440
Speaker 6: Yo, so he hit me again and.

1172
00:54:50,440 --> 00:54:54,719
Speaker 7: I like ya, rad Like, no, they do the opposite

1173
00:54:54,800 --> 00:54:56,000
Speaker 7: because it's very shameful.

1174
00:54:56,320 --> 00:54:58,160
Speaker 6: It's your you know, you feel like it's your fall.

1175
00:54:58,280 --> 00:55:00,520
Speaker 7: It's that kind of thing, and so you're like posting

1176
00:55:00,640 --> 00:55:03,040
Speaker 7: on Instagram like I love this person so much.

1177
00:55:03,160 --> 00:55:05,960
Speaker 2: They're the best because I just got flowers after he

1178
00:55:06,040 --> 00:55:07,759
Speaker 2: hit me, you know, Like it's like that.

1179
00:55:07,960 --> 00:55:10,920
Speaker 7: Yeah, But it's like it's very similar with stalking, like

1180
00:55:10,960 --> 00:55:13,399
Speaker 7: why is this person stalk? Like you know, I think

1181
00:55:13,480 --> 00:55:15,520
Speaker 7: that the mentality they go back into, like what did

1182
00:55:15,520 --> 00:55:17,600
Speaker 7: I do to make this person do this? And like,

1183
00:55:17,800 --> 00:55:21,400
Speaker 7: you didn't do anything. It's on them. It's always on them,

1184
00:55:21,560 --> 00:55:25,600
Speaker 7: but it's still it's that victim shaming thing that.

1185
00:55:25,400 --> 00:55:27,800
Speaker 6: We as a society do, especially to women.

1186
00:55:28,239 --> 00:55:30,200
Speaker 2: I wonder also, if it's someone you were in a

1187
00:55:30,239 --> 00:55:33,040
Speaker 2: relationship with, if there's have you seen an element of

1188
00:55:33,080 --> 00:55:35,400
Speaker 2: like still wanting to protect them to some degree?

1189
00:55:36,239 --> 00:55:39,640
Speaker 7: I think maybe I think it takes like a certain

1190
00:55:40,040 --> 00:55:43,799
Speaker 7: turning point and in your own mind to be like

1191
00:55:44,360 --> 00:55:47,000
Speaker 7: this person has problems, like I'm.

1192
00:55:46,880 --> 00:55:47,839
Speaker 6: Gonna speak out about it.

1193
00:55:47,880 --> 00:55:51,720
Speaker 7: I'm gonna get help for myself, for them, I'm leaving

1194
00:55:51,719 --> 00:55:54,719
Speaker 7: the situation, like it's always a turning point, Like you know,

1195
00:55:54,800 --> 00:55:58,640
Speaker 7: women leave a visa relationships so many times before they

1196
00:55:58,640 --> 00:55:59,600
Speaker 7: can actually leave.

1197
00:55:59,680 --> 00:56:00,680
Speaker 6: You know, it's the same thing.

1198
00:56:00,719 --> 00:56:03,600
Speaker 7: You're like, well, like maybe it was my fault or

1199
00:56:03,719 --> 00:56:07,120
Speaker 7: maybe this or yeah. I mean so you feel that

1200
00:56:07,320 --> 00:56:09,920
Speaker 7: tog and you do want to protect them, Yeah, for

1201
00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:12,520
Speaker 7: sure until you hit that final turning point, which is

1202
00:56:12,520 --> 00:56:17,560
Speaker 7: different for everybody. But when once you turn out, I

1203
00:56:17,600 --> 00:56:19,680
Speaker 7: don't think that you want to protect them anymore. I

1204
00:56:19,680 --> 00:56:20,799
Speaker 7: think that's the certain point.

1205
00:56:20,920 --> 00:56:21,440
Speaker 3: Interesting.

1206
00:56:22,960 --> 00:56:27,480
Speaker 2: So if you are noticing someone is being inappropriate with

1207
00:56:27,520 --> 00:56:31,520
Speaker 2: you and violating your boundaries, what do you do?

1208
00:56:31,520 --> 00:56:32,360
Speaker 6: Do not engage?

1209
00:56:32,840 --> 00:56:36,239
Speaker 7: I mean, definitely let them know that you don't want

1210
00:56:36,280 --> 00:56:37,839
Speaker 7: to be contacted by them.

1211
00:56:38,040 --> 00:56:38,400
Speaker 6: That's it.

1212
00:56:38,440 --> 00:56:41,319
Speaker 7: You don't need to there's no name called. Just let

1213
00:56:41,400 --> 00:56:45,640
Speaker 7: them know and then block, delete, Do not engage. That's

1214
00:56:45,680 --> 00:56:50,000
Speaker 7: like number one. And if it continues, then go get

1215
00:56:50,000 --> 00:56:53,440
Speaker 7: the cops involved sooner than later, because you don't know

1216
00:56:53,440 --> 00:56:57,920
Speaker 7: what where someone's mind is that really, and it's kind

1217
00:56:57,920 --> 00:57:01,200
Speaker 7: of weird to think about, like if I get the

1218
00:57:01,239 --> 00:57:03,759
Speaker 7: cops involved and then this person like I could have

1219
00:57:03,840 --> 00:57:06,160
Speaker 7: been wrong or whatever. But if you have that feeling

1220
00:57:06,600 --> 00:57:09,400
Speaker 7: you're probably not wrong, like, and if they're still bothering

1221
00:57:09,480 --> 00:57:12,080
Speaker 7: you and you don't want to be bothered, it's not

1222
00:57:12,360 --> 00:57:13,960
Speaker 7: I think you need to get the cops involved, like

1223
00:57:14,080 --> 00:57:16,480
Speaker 7: it shouldn't be. You do not need to fight that battle.

1224
00:57:16,480 --> 00:57:18,280
Speaker 7: You need to stand up for yourself and advocate for

1225
00:57:18,320 --> 00:57:19,800
Speaker 7: yourself with the authorities.

1226
00:57:20,040 --> 00:57:22,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, it's a very weird thing to do.

1227
00:57:22,480 --> 00:57:25,120
Speaker 1: If somebody says stop talking to me, to keep talking

1228
00:57:25,160 --> 00:57:29,280
Speaker 1: to them, right, that's strange. So automatically we've got a problem,

1229
00:57:29,560 --> 00:57:31,600
Speaker 1: you know. Yeah, I can see that.

1230
00:57:31,640 --> 00:57:34,320
Speaker 2: I mean, I have a particular friend who you know

1231
00:57:34,360 --> 00:57:37,440
Speaker 2: who that's literally everyone she ever dates.

1232
00:57:38,560 --> 00:57:41,400
Speaker 1: But that's they stop talking to me, and they won't.

1233
00:57:41,480 --> 00:57:43,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, they will never ever ever wall I mean, you

1234
00:57:43,680 --> 00:57:45,960
Speaker 2: have to be to firm in your boundaries.

1235
00:57:46,000 --> 00:57:47,360
Speaker 7: Yeah, you have to be firm in your boundary. You

1236
00:57:47,400 --> 00:57:49,439
Speaker 7: can't go back on it, you can't nothing like that.

1237
00:57:49,480 --> 00:57:52,600
Speaker 7: And then the number two is keep a log book

1238
00:57:52,800 --> 00:57:57,080
Speaker 7: of every single incident, even if you're like, well, I

1239
00:57:57,280 --> 00:57:59,320
Speaker 7: heard a knock on the door and I think it

1240
00:57:59,360 --> 00:58:02,440
Speaker 7: was my stucker, write it down with time where it was.

1241
00:58:03,160 --> 00:58:08,560
Speaker 7: Those kinds of things. Get cameras, get alarm systems, don't

1242
00:58:08,560 --> 00:58:12,680
Speaker 7: walk anywhere alone. I mean, you know, as it progresses,

1243
00:58:12,840 --> 00:58:15,040
Speaker 7: you know, like you have to be safe and take

1244
00:58:15,080 --> 00:58:17,800
Speaker 7: care of yourself, but definitely get the cops involved. Call

1245
00:58:17,800 --> 00:58:20,080
Speaker 7: the cops every time that you see this person, get

1246
00:58:20,120 --> 00:58:23,040
Speaker 7: the restraining order, every time they break the restraining order.

1247
00:58:23,080 --> 00:58:26,080
Speaker 7: I mean, it's it's a hard battle. It's a full

1248
00:58:26,080 --> 00:58:28,440
Speaker 7: time job for the victim to advocate for themselves to

1249
00:58:28,480 --> 00:58:28,840
Speaker 7: get help.

1250
00:58:29,040 --> 00:58:30,360
Speaker 6: Many times it's a full time job.

1251
00:58:30,280 --> 00:58:31,840
Speaker 1: Because it's a full time job for this person to

1252
00:58:31,880 --> 00:58:35,800
Speaker 1: be stocking them. They are going fully in. And just

1253
00:58:35,840 --> 00:58:37,880
Speaker 1: to be clear, I kind of meant more, you know,

1254
00:58:37,960 --> 00:58:39,919
Speaker 1: if you've been dating somebody and you're like step talking

1255
00:58:39,920 --> 00:58:42,040
Speaker 1: to me. Of course sometimes they keep reaching out, but

1256
00:58:42,120 --> 00:58:45,040
Speaker 1: I mean the like total random house people where you're like,

1257
00:58:45,360 --> 00:58:48,680
Speaker 1: you're making me uncomfortable, like your girl, like why is

1258
00:58:48,720 --> 00:58:49,800
Speaker 1: she still reaching out to you?

1259
00:58:49,920 --> 00:58:52,120
Speaker 3: That's so stranger time fake accounts.

1260
00:58:52,200 --> 00:58:54,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, you know so.

1261
00:58:54,360 --> 00:58:57,680
Speaker 3: I mean, and that is a problem, Yeah, weird.

1262
00:58:57,800 --> 00:59:00,160
Speaker 7: I would probably try to get a restraining order at

1263
00:59:00,160 --> 00:59:02,800
Speaker 7: that point, you know, I would make a full log

1264
00:59:02,840 --> 00:59:04,400
Speaker 7: of it, because that's what they're gonna want to see.

1265
00:59:05,520 --> 00:59:07,840
Speaker 7: If you go to the plastation and get a restraining order,

1266
00:59:07,960 --> 00:59:11,600
Speaker 7: make I mean every day everything, every little thing that happens,

1267
00:59:11,640 --> 00:59:15,200
Speaker 7: every screenshot, everything. I mean, it takes a lot of work,

1268
00:59:15,440 --> 00:59:20,160
Speaker 7: but you know it might be worth it. And also stalkers,

1269
00:59:20,240 --> 00:59:24,400
Speaker 7: people are stalking, Like she's stalking you, and then you

1270
00:59:24,480 --> 00:59:26,520
Speaker 7: notice that, like you were saying the other girl, like

1271
00:59:26,560 --> 00:59:28,600
Speaker 7: she's kind of bothering the other girl too, stalking the

1272
00:59:28,600 --> 00:59:30,960
Speaker 7: other girl. I mean, she's not gonna stop. Yeah, so

1273
00:59:31,120 --> 00:59:33,400
Speaker 7: like it's going to keep going whether you stop her

1274
00:59:33,520 --> 00:59:36,160
Speaker 7: or someone else stops her. Like I don't know, I

1275
00:59:36,200 --> 00:59:39,720
Speaker 7: mean I would I would say, like as a woman

1276
00:59:39,840 --> 00:59:41,640
Speaker 7: and you know, taking things in your own hands, like

1277
00:59:41,920 --> 00:59:46,320
Speaker 7: maybe that restraining order from you would save someone else's

1278
00:59:46,320 --> 00:59:47,040
Speaker 7: life down the road.

1279
00:59:47,120 --> 00:59:47,320
Speaker 1: Right.

1280
00:59:47,800 --> 00:59:49,760
Speaker 2: I want to come back to the restraining order in

1281
00:59:49,800 --> 00:59:52,520
Speaker 2: a second, but before I do, can you just talk

1282
00:59:52,560 --> 00:59:55,120
Speaker 2: a little bit more about not engaging and like how

1283
00:59:55,160 --> 00:59:58,040
Speaker 2: what that actually looks like logistically, because I think a

1284
00:59:58,040 --> 01:00:01,160
Speaker 2: lot of people are like, seriously, I but stop talking

1285
01:00:01,160 --> 01:00:01,400
Speaker 2: to me.

1286
01:00:01,760 --> 01:00:03,320
Speaker 3: Why are you still talking about you're violet?

1287
01:00:03,400 --> 01:00:05,520
Speaker 2: And like we'll continue to engage in a way that

1288
01:00:05,560 --> 01:00:07,680
Speaker 2: they think is like telling them to stop, And can

1289
01:00:07,720 --> 01:00:10,280
Speaker 2: you just explain why that doesn't really work well?

1290
01:00:10,280 --> 01:00:13,520
Speaker 7: Because that breaks your boundaries that's you're breaking your own boundary.

1291
01:00:13,520 --> 01:00:16,400
Speaker 7: If you just said, do not contact me again, we

1292
01:00:16,800 --> 01:00:20,320
Speaker 7: will have no more contact, right, And then you block

1293
01:00:20,400 --> 01:00:22,640
Speaker 7: them and they get you on another phone, they get

1294
01:00:22,640 --> 01:00:25,480
Speaker 7: another phone number and they text you, and then so

1295
01:00:25,560 --> 01:00:27,080
Speaker 7: you read it and you text them back again.

1296
01:00:27,080 --> 01:00:28,240
Speaker 6: Well, you just broke your boundary.

1297
01:00:28,880 --> 01:00:30,560
Speaker 3: So they gave them attention.

1298
01:00:30,760 --> 01:00:32,600
Speaker 7: Well, and you gave them more attention too, so they're

1299
01:00:32,600 --> 01:00:34,880
Speaker 7: getting what they want too, because they're like, well, I

1300
01:00:34,920 --> 01:00:36,160
Speaker 7: want them to talk to me, so I'll use a

1301
01:00:36,160 --> 01:00:38,360
Speaker 7: different phone number and hope that they'll talk to me.

1302
01:00:38,880 --> 01:00:40,080
Speaker 6: And then you do again.

1303
01:00:40,280 --> 01:00:42,840
Speaker 3: A negative attention. They don't care if it's positive or negative.

1304
01:00:43,120 --> 01:00:45,120
Speaker 6: I don't think it matters. No, yeah, it's just it's

1305
01:00:45,160 --> 01:00:45,760
Speaker 6: any attention.

1306
01:00:46,040 --> 01:00:47,800
Speaker 3: They just want you to engage, no matter what it

1307
01:00:47,800 --> 01:00:48,120
Speaker 3: looks like.

1308
01:00:48,240 --> 01:00:52,200
Speaker 7: Right, So, like the non engaging is really don't engage.

1309
01:00:52,360 --> 01:00:55,240
Speaker 7: Write it down, screenshot it, take all the logs of

1310
01:00:55,640 --> 01:00:59,320
Speaker 7: write everything down, get all the evidence and everything together,

1311
01:00:59,400 --> 01:01:01,200
Speaker 7: always because you don't know how things are going to go.

1312
01:01:02,480 --> 01:01:06,080
Speaker 7: And then yeah, do not engage means like do not engage,

1313
01:01:06,200 --> 01:01:09,160
Speaker 7: don't if you see them in public, call the police,

1314
01:01:09,280 --> 01:01:12,080
Speaker 7: call your friends, leave, do that, don't go up to them,

1315
01:01:12,080 --> 01:01:12,840
Speaker 7: and confront them.

1316
01:01:12,920 --> 01:01:14,840
Speaker 6: That's what they're looking for, right.

1317
01:01:14,920 --> 01:01:16,080
Speaker 3: Right, Okay?

1318
01:01:16,080 --> 01:01:18,200
Speaker 2: And then and then as far as the restraining orders go,

1319
01:01:18,480 --> 01:01:20,960
Speaker 2: So I have known a number of girls who've had

1320
01:01:20,960 --> 01:01:22,080
Speaker 2: to get restraining orders.

1321
01:01:21,880 --> 01:01:25,280
Speaker 3: Against men who are stocking them.

1322
01:01:25,720 --> 01:01:29,600
Speaker 2: It seems like it hasn't been very effective, and so

1323
01:01:29,640 --> 01:01:32,080
Speaker 2: I want to hear a little bit about like what

1324
01:01:32,120 --> 01:01:35,240
Speaker 2: the system is actually doing to protect people, and are

1325
01:01:35,240 --> 01:01:38,760
Speaker 2: their movements in place to sort of strengthen or like

1326
01:01:38,840 --> 01:01:40,480
Speaker 2: bolster the protections against stocking.

1327
01:01:40,640 --> 01:01:43,840
Speaker 7: I don't think that restanding orders are useful at all

1328
01:01:44,040 --> 01:01:48,040
Speaker 7: in the way that they're intended. Like if you get

1329
01:01:48,080 --> 01:01:50,320
Speaker 7: if you slep restraining order and someone they're not gonna

1330
01:01:50,320 --> 01:01:51,600
Speaker 7: be like, oh I have this restanding order.

1331
01:01:51,640 --> 01:01:52,480
Speaker 6: I'm just gonna.

1332
01:01:52,200 --> 01:01:56,200
Speaker 7: Stop like maybe one in a thousand to Like However,

1333
01:01:56,240 --> 01:01:58,360
Speaker 7: many people maybe that works right because they're like, oh shit,

1334
01:01:58,400 --> 01:01:59,880
Speaker 7: I got a restrained order, Like I fucked up.

1335
01:02:00,200 --> 01:02:02,800
Speaker 6: Maybe I need to get some help. But most people are.

1336
01:02:02,600 --> 01:02:05,280
Speaker 7: Like okay, so what, Like they're obsessed, they're still gonna

1337
01:02:05,360 --> 01:02:08,000
Speaker 7: keep doing it. But what the restraining order does is

1338
01:02:08,120 --> 01:02:11,160
Speaker 7: now the cops know you have this piece of paper,

1339
01:02:11,200 --> 01:02:13,200
Speaker 7: which just means you're gonna get more and more pieces

1340
01:02:13,200 --> 01:02:15,240
Speaker 7: of paper with more and more restraining orders and more,

1341
01:02:15,520 --> 01:02:18,480
Speaker 7: until finally you can hopefully put them in jail for

1342
01:02:18,640 --> 01:02:20,840
Speaker 7: some amount of time, which probably isn't going to be

1343
01:02:20,920 --> 01:02:25,200
Speaker 7: that long unfortunately, unless they do harm you or murder

1344
01:02:25,240 --> 01:02:26,200
Speaker 7: you or whatever that might be.

1345
01:02:27,400 --> 01:02:29,080
Speaker 6: But no, it and it sucks.

1346
01:02:29,280 --> 01:02:31,840
Speaker 7: But that's why, like that first restraining order that early

1347
01:02:31,920 --> 01:02:35,280
Speaker 7: you can get it. It's essential. The earlier the better.

1348
01:02:35,360 --> 01:02:37,880
Speaker 7: And then you keep calling, I have a restraining order.

1349
01:02:38,240 --> 01:02:40,760
Speaker 7: This they just violated the restraining orders. You can only

1350
01:02:40,840 --> 01:02:44,320
Speaker 7: violate a restraining order so many times until they will

1351
01:02:44,320 --> 01:02:45,280
Speaker 7: do something.

1352
01:02:45,240 --> 01:02:49,400
Speaker 2: So basically it's like insurance that they'll eventually get arrested

1353
01:02:49,480 --> 01:02:51,560
Speaker 2: when once the behavior inevitably.

1354
01:02:51,120 --> 01:02:52,800
Speaker 6: I mean, that's yeah, that's how I see it.

1355
01:02:52,880 --> 01:02:53,280
Speaker 3: Mm hmm.

1356
01:02:53,520 --> 01:02:53,840
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1357
01:02:54,160 --> 01:02:56,480
Speaker 2: I've had I've had friends who had had trouble even

1358
01:02:56,480 --> 01:03:00,280
Speaker 2: getting a restraining order because the person didn't literally threaten

1359
01:03:00,440 --> 01:03:03,040
Speaker 2: even though they were showing up at their house and

1360
01:03:03,120 --> 01:03:06,600
Speaker 2: like calling them forty five times in a row and

1361
01:03:06,640 --> 01:03:09,360
Speaker 2: like doing all of the creepy things. But because they

1362
01:03:09,360 --> 01:03:11,600
Speaker 2: didn't literally say I'm going to kill you, they were

1363
01:03:11,600 --> 01:03:13,240
Speaker 2: not granted a restraining order.

1364
01:03:13,280 --> 01:03:14,840
Speaker 3: Have you heard of this.

1365
01:03:15,200 --> 01:03:18,120
Speaker 4: Proving these things? Especially with social media are very tough.

1366
01:03:18,160 --> 01:03:20,720
Speaker 4: Like you had mentioned before, there's all these sort of

1367
01:03:20,800 --> 01:03:22,760
Speaker 4: like fake accounts and all this kind of stuff. It's

1368
01:03:22,800 --> 01:03:25,520
Speaker 4: like even giving me the bottom of proving that that's

1369
01:03:25,560 --> 01:03:27,520
Speaker 4: the person behind this. When you talk to this on

1370
01:03:27,560 --> 01:03:31,200
Speaker 4: the show, stalkers are unfortunately very clever and they understand

1371
01:03:31,200 --> 01:03:33,520
Speaker 4: how to sort of get around and navigate through not

1372
01:03:33,560 --> 01:03:36,440
Speaker 4: only the laws but also the technology too. They're the

1373
01:03:36,440 --> 01:03:39,800
Speaker 4: ones who are using it against people who just want

1374
01:03:39,840 --> 01:03:43,240
Speaker 4: to freely live their lives and just have no cumbersome

1375
01:03:43,600 --> 01:03:47,000
Speaker 4: things that happen to them. But I think that ultimately

1376
01:03:47,040 --> 01:03:49,440
Speaker 4: it's like finding a way to sort of, you know,

1377
01:03:50,200 --> 01:03:52,920
Speaker 4: get everything into some a case. You just never know

1378
01:03:52,960 --> 01:03:54,880
Speaker 4: where it's going to come up in terms of a law,

1379
01:03:55,160 --> 01:03:57,720
Speaker 4: you know, basically your court case or anything like that.

1380
01:03:57,880 --> 01:04:01,280
Speaker 4: So it's from the documentation to keeping records, and as

1381
01:04:01,280 --> 01:04:02,800
Speaker 4: you mentioned for it is kind of a full time

1382
01:04:02,880 --> 01:04:05,080
Speaker 4: job depending upon the degree of the shocking and what

1383
01:04:05,160 --> 01:04:05,760
Speaker 4: you're going through.

1384
01:04:06,080 --> 01:04:08,760
Speaker 7: When I think with what you're saying is sometimes you can't.

1385
01:04:08,800 --> 01:04:10,680
Speaker 7: It's hard to get every straining order if they're not

1386
01:04:10,800 --> 01:04:13,919
Speaker 7: like saying I'm going to kill you right now. That's

1387
01:04:14,240 --> 01:04:17,480
Speaker 7: very true, and we've seen that a lot The best

1388
01:04:17,480 --> 01:04:19,680
Speaker 7: thing that I can say is to keep going back,

1389
01:04:19,960 --> 01:04:22,840
Speaker 7: ask for somebody different, go to I mean used to

1390
01:04:22,840 --> 01:04:25,120
Speaker 7: have to be the squeaky wheel. And the other part

1391
01:04:25,160 --> 01:04:28,440
Speaker 7: of that too is it's like when you go to

1392
01:04:28,480 --> 01:04:31,720
Speaker 7: the police station or whatever, you cannot have any emotions.

1393
01:04:32,400 --> 01:04:34,760
Speaker 7: You think that you'd want to show, like I'm fearful

1394
01:04:34,760 --> 01:04:38,400
Speaker 7: for my life, I'm crying, I'm emotional, But they don't.

1395
01:04:38,640 --> 01:04:40,840
Speaker 7: Cops see all kinds of things.

1396
01:04:41,000 --> 01:04:43,720
Speaker 3: Oh a crazy woman, she's so whooped to.

1397
01:04:44,160 --> 01:04:46,560
Speaker 7: It could be that, or you know, maybe that cop

1398
01:04:46,680 --> 01:04:49,480
Speaker 7: like he just you know, took a dead kid out

1399
01:04:49,480 --> 01:04:51,520
Speaker 7: of the river. Like, we don't know what they're going through.

1400
01:04:51,600 --> 01:04:56,000
Speaker 7: So you giving them your emotion doesn't actually help the

1401
01:04:56,040 --> 01:04:57,000
Speaker 7: situation at all.

1402
01:04:57,160 --> 01:04:59,200
Speaker 6: That is so mean to give them the facts.

1403
01:04:59,320 --> 01:05:00,920
Speaker 3: Yeah it sucks.

1404
01:05:00,960 --> 01:05:02,560
Speaker 6: Yeah, got to be facts and logic.

1405
01:05:03,040 --> 01:05:08,200
Speaker 2: Are there any organizations to like provide advocates to stalking victims.

1406
01:05:08,560 --> 01:05:11,880
Speaker 4: Spark is a great one, Stalking Prevention Awareness Resource Center.

1407
01:05:12,480 --> 01:05:17,040
Speaker 4: They provide amazing stats. They have a great organization. We've

1408
01:05:17,040 --> 01:05:21,160
Speaker 4: worked with quite a few of them. Nova is another one.

1409
01:05:21,600 --> 01:05:25,280
Speaker 4: There is let's see a variety of ones out of

1410
01:05:25,600 --> 01:05:30,240
Speaker 4: the UK, ones out of Ireland as well, and we

1411
01:05:30,280 --> 01:05:32,920
Speaker 4: put a lot of those into our Instagram bio so

1412
01:05:32,960 --> 01:05:35,360
Speaker 4: that you can basically go So we encourage people to

1413
01:05:35,480 --> 01:05:38,600
Speaker 4: just check out as much information as possible and start searching,

1414
01:05:39,000 --> 01:05:40,200
Speaker 4: and a lot of the people will be have on

1415
01:05:40,200 --> 01:05:43,120
Speaker 4: the show end up coming to us and share more

1416
01:05:43,160 --> 01:05:45,480
Speaker 4: details with us, and they become this community where it's

1417
01:05:45,520 --> 01:05:47,680
Speaker 4: like everybody you know. Even some of our guests contact

1418
01:05:47,720 --> 01:05:50,800
Speaker 4: each other and they form friendships, which is really amazing,

1419
01:05:50,800 --> 01:05:53,760
Speaker 4: and they support each other throughout their journey and sort

1420
01:05:53,800 --> 01:05:55,960
Speaker 4: of give each other sort of tips and tricks and

1421
01:05:55,960 --> 01:05:57,680
Speaker 4: things like that to work within their own case.

1422
01:05:58,240 --> 01:05:59,960
Speaker 2: I would be so pissed if someone sort of stalk

1423
01:06:00,160 --> 01:06:02,680
Speaker 2: me right now because I'm too fucking busy to take

1424
01:06:02,720 --> 01:06:03,720
Speaker 2: on another job.

1425
01:06:03,960 --> 01:06:07,160
Speaker 3: I can't. Absolutely not. If you're thinking about doing it,

1426
01:06:07,240 --> 01:06:08,000
Speaker 3: please do not.

1427
01:06:08,560 --> 01:06:11,960
Speaker 7: That's I mean, it's true, it's it. It takes away

1428
01:06:11,960 --> 01:06:15,720
Speaker 7: your whole life just to try to get.

1429
01:06:15,800 --> 01:06:17,920
Speaker 6: Justice for yourself, anytime of justice.

1430
01:06:18,280 --> 01:06:21,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, it really makes me. I'm so grateful for the

1431
01:06:21,480 --> 01:06:24,120
Speaker 1: work you guys did. It just makes me be even

1432
01:06:24,120 --> 01:06:27,360
Speaker 1: more aware of like, don't if you get a bad feeling,

1433
01:06:27,520 --> 01:06:30,520
Speaker 1: just nip it in the bud. Don't feel bad and

1434
01:06:30,600 --> 01:06:31,880
Speaker 1: keep engaging.

1435
01:06:32,120 --> 01:06:34,480
Speaker 7: You don't have to be you don't have to You're right,

1436
01:06:35,320 --> 01:06:36,720
Speaker 7: it's done a long time to learn that.

1437
01:06:36,920 --> 01:06:39,720
Speaker 1: But yeah, no, yeah, if you get a bad gup feeling,

1438
01:06:39,760 --> 01:06:42,400
Speaker 1: don't don't be polite. I will just also say I

1439
01:06:42,440 --> 01:06:45,080
Speaker 1: did troll my friend stock her. He was actually my

1440
01:06:45,080 --> 01:06:47,480
Speaker 1: ex boyfriend, the guy who dated or not dated but

1441
01:06:47,560 --> 01:06:50,720
Speaker 1: got stocked by the girl. I got a weird text

1442
01:06:50,760 --> 01:06:53,680
Speaker 1: from a random number that was like, hey, is this Jeremy.

1443
01:06:53,840 --> 01:06:56,400
Speaker 1: I'm just looking for something And I wrote back, no, my,

1444
01:06:56,600 --> 01:06:58,600
Speaker 1: this isn't Jeremy. And I wrote back, it's and I

1445
01:06:58,640 --> 01:07:00,800
Speaker 1: put her name and send it back to her and

1446
01:07:00,840 --> 01:07:04,479
Speaker 1: then suddenly blocked all gone, and it was really really fun. Yeah,

1447
01:07:04,760 --> 01:07:05,080
Speaker 1: thank you.

1448
01:07:05,320 --> 01:07:07,600
Speaker 4: Yeah, even on that path, it's like you just don't

1449
01:07:07,640 --> 01:07:09,800
Speaker 4: know where this information is coming from. Like sometimes you

1450
01:07:09,840 --> 01:07:12,160
Speaker 4: get these things and like I often check, Like if

1451
01:07:12,160 --> 01:07:13,840
Speaker 4: somebody sends an email to us and it seems a

1452
01:07:13,840 --> 01:07:16,240
Speaker 4: little bit like off kilter, I'll go to the Instagram

1453
01:07:16,240 --> 01:07:17,720
Speaker 4: and say, hey, did you just send that? You just

1454
01:07:17,800 --> 01:07:18,920
Speaker 4: never know what's coming.

1455
01:07:18,720 --> 01:07:20,400
Speaker 6: Here with I never chend that stuff.

1456
01:07:20,520 --> 01:07:26,640
Speaker 7: Jake is like, oh Jake is overly extra like conspiracy.

1457
01:07:26,680 --> 01:07:29,320
Speaker 6: They're like I think people are out together. I'm like, Jake,

1458
01:07:29,440 --> 01:07:30,040
Speaker 6: is just an email.

1459
01:07:30,080 --> 01:07:33,120
Speaker 7: Just delete it and it looks funny, don't like, don't

1460
01:07:33,120 --> 01:07:34,360
Speaker 7: click a link, just delete it.

1461
01:07:34,480 --> 01:07:37,320
Speaker 4: Like that's totnically not true. I'm not a conspiracy theorist.

1462
01:07:37,840 --> 01:07:40,920
Speaker 4: What she's painting me in a very bad picture. But

1463
01:07:41,720 --> 01:07:44,800
Speaker 4: I'm very safe and very someone who is you know,

1464
01:07:45,000 --> 01:07:47,960
Speaker 4: very about precautions, yeah, and kind of taking smart making

1465
01:07:48,040 --> 01:07:50,480
Speaker 4: smart decisions in order to kind of like level out.

1466
01:07:50,560 --> 01:07:52,280
Speaker 1: Well, if I was doing the work you guys said

1467
01:07:52,320 --> 01:07:54,240
Speaker 1: and calling these people out, I be a little scared.

1468
01:07:54,480 --> 01:07:56,560
Speaker 7: But it is really I think it is really time

1469
01:07:56,600 --> 01:07:59,040
Speaker 7: consuming to like go through each spam email and be

1470
01:07:59,080 --> 01:08:01,680
Speaker 7: like I'm wondering, so, you know, I think it's super

1471
01:08:01,720 --> 01:08:04,080
Speaker 7: time consuming. Whereas I'm kind of like, Okay, it looks

1472
01:08:04,080 --> 01:08:06,120
Speaker 7: like a spaming mail, like just delete it, like if

1473
01:08:06,120 --> 01:08:08,840
Speaker 7: it's if someone shows up, you know, I mean, there's

1474
01:08:08,960 --> 01:08:10,680
Speaker 7: there's a spam mail.

1475
01:08:10,720 --> 01:08:12,960
Speaker 6: Doesn't give me a bad scary feeling.

1476
01:08:13,120 --> 01:08:15,120
Speaker 4: It doesn't give me either. But we have had some

1477
01:08:15,200 --> 01:08:17,519
Speaker 4: interesting things that have come up, which are things you

1478
01:08:17,560 --> 01:08:19,680
Speaker 4: really should note. You know, I'm saying. We've had other

1479
01:08:19,720 --> 01:08:22,439
Speaker 4: people on the show and they've contacted us, try to

1480
01:08:22,439 --> 01:08:24,600
Speaker 4: contact our families, things like that. So these kind of

1481
01:08:24,640 --> 01:08:26,600
Speaker 4: things do happen, and so I think it.

1482
01:08:27,040 --> 01:08:30,559
Speaker 7: Yeah so, but but when we when we ignored them,

1483
01:08:30,600 --> 01:08:31,200
Speaker 7: they went away.

1484
01:08:33,560 --> 01:08:34,680
Speaker 6: I mean for the most part, you.

1485
01:08:34,680 --> 01:08:38,000
Speaker 1: Say, you guys by somebody who said they were being stalked.

1486
01:08:39,160 --> 01:08:43,719
Speaker 7: For us, got by someone's stalker, I see net stock,

1487
01:08:43,800 --> 01:08:46,360
Speaker 7: we got docks online, gotch and that was about it,

1488
01:08:46,560 --> 01:08:49,679
Speaker 7: I mean, and then they like drew mean pictures of us.

1489
01:08:49,720 --> 01:08:54,800
Speaker 4: Like basically, anytime you're in the public eye, yeah, you're

1490
01:08:54,840 --> 01:08:56,720
Speaker 4: going to face that. But I think that ultimately, like

1491
01:08:56,800 --> 01:08:58,200
Speaker 4: what I what I tend to do is I try

1492
01:08:58,240 --> 01:09:00,679
Speaker 4: to assess things on a very critical level when information

1493
01:09:00,720 --> 01:09:03,479
Speaker 4: comes in. I don't like literally spend all this inorderate

1494
01:09:03,520 --> 01:09:05,519
Speaker 4: amount of time doing things. But we were in a

1495
01:09:05,600 --> 01:09:08,240
Speaker 4: very sensitive arena, to be fair, and I owe it

1496
01:09:08,280 --> 01:09:11,479
Speaker 4: to our guests and anyone who contacts us to protect

1497
01:09:11,520 --> 01:09:13,599
Speaker 4: them and be able to like make sure that there

1498
01:09:13,760 --> 01:09:15,800
Speaker 4: as safe as they can be. And ultimately they were

1499
01:09:16,040 --> 01:09:18,240
Speaker 4: communicating with them. So that's literally what I do is

1500
01:09:18,320 --> 01:09:20,720
Speaker 4: kind of set that tone for those kind of things.

1501
01:09:20,800 --> 01:09:22,120
Speaker 7: I think it's very serious, but I think that's I

1502
01:09:22,200 --> 01:09:25,120
Speaker 7: think that's good way we're partner, Like, yeah, because I'm

1503
01:09:25,160 --> 01:09:27,880
Speaker 7: the opposite of that, I'm like, look, nothing bad is

1504
01:09:27,880 --> 01:09:30,040
Speaker 7: probably gonna happen. I'm gonna go camp out on an

1505
01:09:30,040 --> 01:09:33,200
Speaker 7: active volcano that a few years ago killed seventy people.

1506
01:09:33,280 --> 01:09:37,040
Speaker 7: Like I'm I'm like, you know, I feel like, probably

1507
01:09:37,080 --> 01:09:39,800
Speaker 7: nothing bad will happen, Like no single it's gonna get

1508
01:09:39,840 --> 01:09:43,160
Speaker 7: me right, you're a care for you. But but that's

1509
01:09:43,240 --> 01:09:44,840
Speaker 7: kind of like part of why I me and Jake

1510
01:09:45,040 --> 01:09:47,880
Speaker 7: make great partners because he does look out and he does,

1511
01:09:48,479 --> 01:09:51,280
Speaker 7: you know, do all the extra things that I kind

1512
01:09:51,280 --> 01:09:54,360
Speaker 7: of like, well, I'm gonna go on vacation, not really,

1513
01:09:54,400 --> 01:09:57,800
Speaker 7: but you know, I'm I'm more like move like let's

1514
01:09:57,800 --> 01:10:00,519
Speaker 7: get this done, Like let's do this, like we'll figure

1515
01:10:00,520 --> 01:10:02,799
Speaker 7: this out later, but like we're just gonna keep going.

1516
01:10:02,880 --> 01:10:04,760
Speaker 6: And Jake's like, actually, we have to figure out now

1517
01:10:04,800 --> 01:10:06,600
Speaker 6: or we can't keep going, you know.

1518
01:10:06,920 --> 01:10:10,760
Speaker 7: Or I like, yeah, it is dangerous when someone docks you.

1519
01:10:10,920 --> 01:10:14,560
Speaker 7: I mean they they put you know, my my sister's

1520
01:10:14,800 --> 01:10:18,080
Speaker 7: kids info out there, like but it was like some

1521
01:10:18,200 --> 01:10:21,439
Speaker 7: weird dark web internet thing that like I couldn't even

1522
01:10:21,479 --> 01:10:21,800
Speaker 7: find it.

1523
01:10:21,840 --> 01:10:25,439
Speaker 3: Like to me, I'm like, okay, and they do mean.

1524
01:10:25,400 --> 01:10:29,560
Speaker 7: Pictures of me, which some of the pictures were likenesses

1525
01:10:29,760 --> 01:10:31,920
Speaker 7: and somewhere, you know, some kind of did like a

1526
01:10:31,920 --> 01:10:35,400
Speaker 7: little like kind of the pictures of Jake were the best,

1527
01:10:36,000 --> 01:10:36,640
Speaker 7: just gonna say it.

1528
01:10:38,439 --> 01:10:39,320
Speaker 3: Well, you obviously have to.

1529
01:10:39,320 --> 01:10:41,640
Speaker 6: Say found all of Jake's nude photos.

1530
01:10:43,080 --> 01:10:46,000
Speaker 7: There's no new, no, but you know, to me, I

1531
01:10:46,080 --> 01:10:48,320
Speaker 7: was like, okay, well, like let's wait and see what

1532
01:10:48,400 --> 01:10:53,800
Speaker 7: else they maybe do, which probably isn't the most appropriate

1533
01:10:53,960 --> 01:10:57,599
Speaker 7: way to go about that. So instead of me being

1534
01:10:57,640 --> 01:11:01,120
Speaker 7: like that, like Jake did the extra things to help

1535
01:11:01,200 --> 01:11:03,080
Speaker 7: keep us a little bit more safe. So like that's

1536
01:11:03,120 --> 01:11:04,439
Speaker 7: just I just want to say, like that, It's like

1537
01:11:04,439 --> 01:11:07,880
Speaker 7: our partnership is we're very opposite people and we're making

1538
01:11:07,920 --> 01:11:08,280
Speaker 7: it work.

1539
01:11:08,520 --> 01:11:11,360
Speaker 4: You need to be Yeah, we could not be more

1540
01:11:11,400 --> 01:11:14,120
Speaker 4: opposite in every single way. We do. Share love for

1541
01:11:14,160 --> 01:11:14,920
Speaker 4: your dog, Cabo.

1542
01:11:15,320 --> 01:11:18,479
Speaker 6: Yeah, No, Jake watches mine. I go out of town

1543
01:11:18,479 --> 01:11:18,760
Speaker 6: a lot.

1544
01:11:19,000 --> 01:11:20,679
Speaker 4: Did she mentioned that I'm going to be dog saying

1545
01:11:20,680 --> 01:11:23,200
Speaker 4: for her when she's gonna be roasting marshmallows on the volcano?

1546
01:11:23,479 --> 01:11:24,320
Speaker 6: Yeah, I can't wait.

1547
01:11:24,800 --> 01:11:26,800
Speaker 7: No, Jake, Jake does watch my dog all the time

1548
01:11:26,800 --> 01:11:28,799
Speaker 7: for me, which is awesome because I go out of town.

1549
01:11:29,280 --> 01:11:29,800
Speaker 6: Quite a bit.

1550
01:11:30,800 --> 01:11:34,320
Speaker 2: I'm with you, Jake, I'm I'm not very trusting generally

1551
01:11:34,400 --> 01:11:35,280
Speaker 2: of people on.

1552
01:11:35,720 --> 01:11:38,320
Speaker 4: That's the title of this podcast, trust me. I kind

1553
01:11:38,320 --> 01:11:39,080
Speaker 4: of figured that when I.

1554
01:11:39,040 --> 01:11:42,360
Speaker 2: Was saying now, I also like, what you know, not

1555
01:11:42,640 --> 01:11:45,040
Speaker 2: just my cult leader growing up, but a number of

1556
01:11:45,320 --> 01:11:48,840
Speaker 2: people were sort of predators when I was a child,

1557
01:11:48,880 --> 01:11:50,559
Speaker 2: So I was exposed to that at a very young age,

1558
01:11:50,640 --> 01:11:53,960
Speaker 2: and that kind of made me be like, who are you?

1559
01:11:54,160 --> 01:11:55,960
Speaker 3: What are you doing here? What email is?

1560
01:11:56,000 --> 01:11:56,160
Speaker 2: This?

1561
01:11:56,280 --> 01:11:57,200
Speaker 1: Is this legit? You know?

1562
01:11:57,439 --> 01:12:00,000
Speaker 2: And I'm probably a little too far on that end.

1563
01:12:00,400 --> 01:12:03,639
Speaker 2: All right, Well, where can people find you?

1564
01:12:03,640 --> 01:12:09,920
Speaker 7: You got my address, like Jake, like sweating Jamie, do kno?

1565
01:12:09,960 --> 01:12:10,920
Speaker 6: Give your address out.

1566
01:12:13,080 --> 01:12:17,360
Speaker 7: Our instagram for the podcast is at strictly Stalking Pod

1567
01:12:18,080 --> 01:12:21,320
Speaker 7: and my personal instagram is Feathergirl seventy seven.

1568
01:12:21,760 --> 01:12:25,840
Speaker 4: Jk Ed three thousand, Jacob three thousand at instagram and

1569
01:12:26,479 --> 01:12:29,439
Speaker 4: at Instagram just in case somewhere knows, and yeah, just

1570
01:12:30,160 --> 01:12:33,160
Speaker 4: the show. As Jamie said, strictly Stalking Pod at gmail

1571
01:12:33,200 --> 01:12:35,599
Speaker 4: dot com. If anyone has any stories or any cases

1572
01:12:35,640 --> 01:12:38,439
Speaker 4: or anything they want to ask us, please share there.

1573
01:12:38,880 --> 01:12:42,280
Speaker 3: Thank you, Thank you guys so much for joining us.

1574
01:12:42,439 --> 01:12:45,880
Speaker 2: All right, Megan, Okay, what's the closest you've ever come

1575
01:12:46,000 --> 01:12:47,000
Speaker 2: to stalking someone.

1576
01:12:47,360 --> 01:12:51,519
Speaker 1: Oh I have I have a really lame answer. But

1577
01:12:52,720 --> 01:12:57,960
Speaker 1: I fell in love with this random boy in college.

1578
01:12:58,520 --> 01:13:01,960
Speaker 1: I don't know what happened to my brain, but I

1579
01:13:02,000 --> 01:13:04,960
Speaker 1: would feel the urge when I was just driving home

1580
01:13:05,000 --> 01:13:07,280
Speaker 1: from school to like take a weird route to drive

1581
01:13:07,320 --> 01:13:10,519
Speaker 1: by his frat house to like look at his window.

1582
01:13:11,200 --> 01:13:11,879
Speaker 1: It was psycho.

1583
01:13:13,439 --> 01:13:14,599
Speaker 3: Wait but you were how old?

1584
01:13:14,760 --> 01:13:15,559
Speaker 1: Twenty one?

1585
01:13:15,800 --> 01:13:16,040
Speaker 6: Wow?

1586
01:13:16,479 --> 01:13:18,839
Speaker 1: You know, I don't know. I mean it was pretty strange.

1587
01:13:18,880 --> 01:13:21,320
Speaker 1: I don't like I've looked him up now and I've

1588
01:13:21,560 --> 01:13:25,600
Speaker 1: seen he's very random. I have no idea, you know what.

1589
01:13:25,640 --> 01:13:31,720
Speaker 1: It probably was lela a past life, but uh yeah,

1590
01:13:31,160 --> 01:13:35,559
Speaker 1: I got really really weird about this person for a minute.

1591
01:13:35,600 --> 01:13:37,439
Speaker 2: So you were just trying to see if you could

1592
01:13:37,439 --> 01:13:38,599
Speaker 2: see it and see if he was home.

1593
01:13:38,880 --> 01:13:41,760
Speaker 1: I don't even think it was like just seeing his

1594
01:13:41,880 --> 01:13:44,600
Speaker 1: window was enough. It was like a compulsion.

1595
01:13:44,920 --> 01:13:46,440
Speaker 3: Wow, that's interesting.

1596
01:13:46,840 --> 01:13:50,000
Speaker 1: Like he didn't need to be at the window. I

1597
01:13:50,040 --> 01:13:51,800
Speaker 1: didn't need to see a light on, he didn't need

1598
01:13:51,840 --> 01:13:55,679
Speaker 1: to be home. I just like needed to see the window.

1599
01:13:56,200 --> 01:13:59,160
Speaker 1: Interestingly enough, I'm just putting something together right now.

1600
01:13:59,240 --> 01:14:00,240
Speaker 3: What is it?

1601
01:13:59,800 --> 01:14:00,400
Speaker 6: What is it?

1602
01:14:00,840 --> 01:14:05,519
Speaker 1: He kind of like got too forceful with me the

1603
01:14:05,560 --> 01:14:09,759
Speaker 1: first time we hooked up, and maybe like my brain

1604
01:14:09,960 --> 01:14:12,320
Speaker 1: was trying to keep safe from him or something.

1605
01:14:12,880 --> 01:14:15,720
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, that's super interesting, like a weird sort

1606
01:14:15,720 --> 01:14:21,599
Speaker 2: of protective mechanism where it's almost like you're reconstructing it somehow,

1607
01:14:21,640 --> 01:14:22,880
Speaker 2: but from a position of power.

1608
01:14:23,000 --> 01:14:23,720
Speaker 6: Uh huh.

1609
01:14:23,760 --> 01:14:26,720
Speaker 1: And then it was like romantic and I couldn't like,

1610
01:14:27,080 --> 01:14:31,479
Speaker 1: I was like, I love this person. It's so strange.

1611
01:14:31,479 --> 01:14:36,440
Speaker 1: And I've dated so much more interesting, wonderful, more attractive

1612
01:14:36,680 --> 01:14:40,800
Speaker 1: people to me, and I've certainly been a lurker, but

1613
01:14:41,120 --> 01:14:44,800
Speaker 1: never have I been a stalker to this degree.

1614
01:14:45,400 --> 01:14:45,839
Speaker 6: Wow.

1615
01:14:47,160 --> 01:14:49,679
Speaker 2: I feel like the closest I've ever come is literally

1616
01:14:49,800 --> 01:14:55,479
Speaker 2: just like looking at someone's everything online, like I don't Yeah.

1617
01:14:55,320 --> 01:14:56,200
Speaker 3: I mean that's not true.

1618
01:14:56,200 --> 01:14:59,920
Speaker 2: I'm sure I've like gone to parties or events like

1619
01:15:00,160 --> 01:15:02,479
Speaker 2: that I wouldn't have gone to otherwise knowing that a

1620
01:15:02,560 --> 01:15:04,160
Speaker 2: person was probably going to be there.

1621
01:15:04,960 --> 01:15:08,240
Speaker 1: That's not stocking, that's just just having a crush normally.

1622
01:15:10,080 --> 01:15:13,559
Speaker 2: I feel like I'm actually weirdly like most of my friends,

1623
01:15:13,560 --> 01:15:15,400
Speaker 2: when they like break up with someone, they have a

1624
01:15:15,400 --> 01:15:17,120
Speaker 2: really hard time not looking at their page and going

1625
01:15:17,160 --> 01:15:19,400
Speaker 2: to I don't have that problem same.

1626
01:15:19,760 --> 01:15:22,400
Speaker 1: I am done with you for like I block. No,

1627
01:15:22,720 --> 01:15:25,120
Speaker 1: I'm not going to torture myself, and I'm not interested.

1628
01:15:25,160 --> 01:15:27,640
Speaker 2: I don't even have to block. I'm just like goodbye,

1629
01:15:28,040 --> 01:15:31,000
Speaker 2: I will mute them. I mean, occasionally I might look

1630
01:15:31,080 --> 01:15:34,360
Speaker 2: like just to be like, hmm, wonder how that's going.

1631
01:15:34,920 --> 01:15:38,200
Speaker 2: I don't like to torture myself. I don't find that interesting.

1632
01:15:38,400 --> 01:15:41,960
Speaker 1: You no me either, It's absolutely awful. It's also like

1633
01:15:42,000 --> 01:15:44,120
Speaker 1: when people are sad and they play sad music. I

1634
01:15:44,160 --> 01:15:44,880
Speaker 1: can't do that well.

1635
01:15:44,920 --> 01:15:48,599
Speaker 2: That is, I actually primarily play that music because it's

1636
01:15:48,640 --> 01:15:51,200
Speaker 2: the only way that I can feel my feelings for

1637
01:15:51,240 --> 01:15:52,120
Speaker 2: the most part.

1638
01:15:52,000 --> 01:15:56,040
Speaker 1: So I can feel my feelings every second of every day.

1639
01:15:56,840 --> 01:15:59,200
Speaker 3: That's not like that's interesting.

1640
01:16:01,880 --> 01:16:02,320
Speaker 1: Anyway.

1641
01:16:02,520 --> 01:16:05,360
Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, we did it all right. Other episode in

1642
01:16:05,439 --> 01:16:06,360
Speaker 3: the Canother.

1643
01:16:06,000 --> 01:16:07,000
Speaker 1: Episode in the Can.

1644
01:16:07,320 --> 01:16:09,760
Speaker 3: Good job everyone, You guys have a wonderful week.

1645
01:16:09,960 --> 01:16:13,280
Speaker 1: Come back next week, and as always, remember to follow

1646
01:16:13,320 --> 01:16:17,599
Speaker 1: your gut, watch out for red flags, and never ever

1647
01:16:18,320 --> 01:16:19,200
Speaker 1: trust to mess me.

1648
01:16:19,760 --> 01:16:20,479
Speaker 4: Night Night.

1649
01:16:24,680 --> 01:16:27,400
Speaker 2: Trust Me is produced by Kirsten Woodward, Gabby Rapp and

1650
01:16:27,439 --> 01:16:28,320
Speaker 2: Steve Delemator.

1651
01:16:28,400 --> 01:16:30,400
Speaker 1: The special thanks to Stacy Para.

1652
01:16:30,240 --> 01:16:32,719
Speaker 3: And our theme song was composed by Holly amber Church.

1653
01:16:32,920 --> 01:16:35,800
Speaker 1: You can find us on Instagram. At trust Me Podcast,

1654
01:16:35,960 --> 01:16:39,320
Speaker 1: Twitter at trust Me Cult pod or on TikTok at

1655
01:16:39,400 --> 01:16:41,040
Speaker 1: trust Me Cult Podcast.

1656
01:16:41,200 --> 01:16:44,520
Speaker 3: I'm Oola Lola on Instagram and Ola Lola on Twitter.

1657
01:16:44,280 --> 01:16:47,960
Speaker 1: And I am Megan Elizabeth eleven on Instagram and Babraham

1658
01:16:48,040 --> 01:16:49,080
Speaker 1: Hicks on Twitter.

1659
01:16:49,240 --> 01:16:51,559
Speaker 3: Remember to rate and review and spread the word.