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Speaker 1: Welcome back to the Carol Marketwood Show on iHeartRadio. My

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Speaker 1: guest today is Joel Angel. Joel is an author, co author,

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Speaker 1: and even ghost author of nearly forty non fiction books biography, autobiography, essays, history, comedy, health, law,

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Speaker 1: true crime, adventure, war and corruption. And he's one of

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Speaker 1: my favorite people on the app that used to be

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Speaker 1: known as Twitter. Hi, Joel, So nice to have you on.

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Speaker 2: So great to be here with you.

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Speaker 1: So we've never met, and that's crazy because I feel

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Speaker 1: like I've known you a long time. But I would

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Speaker 1: love to know how you got into this crazy thing

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Speaker 1: of ours and what led you to become a writer.

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Speaker 2: Well, let's see.

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Speaker 3: I for some reason, when I was young, I know

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Speaker 3: I wanted to be a writer. I don't know why

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Speaker 3: I wanted to be a writer. I love to read,

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Speaker 3: so I after college went to school in Berkeley.

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Speaker 2: After college, I had well in college, I had read.

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Speaker 3: A Movable Feast by Hemingway, and I thought, okay, I'm

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Speaker 3: going to move to Paris after college.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And because until then I didn't.

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Speaker 3: Have anything to write about. So if you want to

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Speaker 3: be a writer, you have to have things to write about.

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Speaker 3: I didn't have anything to write about it.

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Speaker 2: I'll go to Paris, I'll have some adventures, and I'll

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Speaker 2: have something to write out.

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Speaker 3: What happened was I fell in love with a woman

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Speaker 3: who had a really beautiful voice.

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Speaker 2: I played guitar, she sang.

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Speaker 3: We played in the first in the streets or first

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Speaker 3: in the subways, in the streets and clubs. Then we

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Speaker 3: traveled all around Western Europe and North Africa playing and

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Speaker 3: all of that. And so I had all of these

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Speaker 3: wonderful adventures for.

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Speaker 2: A year or more and she broke my heart and

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Speaker 2: that was it. I came back.

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Speaker 1: I was hoping, this is like and we're still married today.

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Speaker 3: No, no, no, no. And so all of those adventures

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Speaker 3: I've written about. None of them. The whole reason I

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Speaker 3: went there. I had the things I wanted to do,

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Speaker 3: and I didn't write any When it came back, I

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Speaker 3: started writing journalism, and then that I got an offer

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Speaker 3: from an agent to who had read something I think

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Speaker 3: in the New York Times if you ever thought about

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Speaker 3: writing books, Yeah, of course I thought about writing books.

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Speaker 3: And so that's basically how it started. And then it

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Speaker 3: just kept going. And I never specialized in anything, because

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Speaker 3: I was always just interested in people and stories and

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Speaker 3: the best story.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, everything. So if it was a good story

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Speaker 2: and I thought I could tell it, I did.

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Speaker 1: So you've never written about that time in Paris, playing

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Speaker 1: on the Metro and falling in love and traveling around

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Speaker 1: Western Europe, because I feel like maybe you should write that.

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Speaker 2: Well, I'm actually I'm now writing. I'm literally, I'm.

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Speaker 3: About two weeks away from the end of the first

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Speaker 3: draft of my first novel. I'm actually writing a novel finally.

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Speaker 3: But it's not anything about that, and I'm calling it

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Speaker 3: a character driven revenge love story. So literally none of

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Speaker 3: what happened to me personally is in this, but it's

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Speaker 3: all everything in there is based on someone I've known.

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Speaker 2: I guess, I think.

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Speaker 3: I just I don't feel like it's enough years in

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Speaker 3: between then, even though it's been decades.

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Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, I don't feel like.

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Speaker 1: I need a little more space, a little more space.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So, which is your favorite of your almost forty books

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Speaker 1: that you've written. Which one feels closest to you?

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Speaker 3: Well, I wrote the two best true stories I ever heard.

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Speaker 3: I wrote books about one of his best true story

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Speaker 3: I ever heard, and I was told by the detective,

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Speaker 3: the LAPD detective, former LAPD detective who solved the case.

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Speaker 3: He told it to me in nineteen ninety, but it

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Speaker 3: took me twenty two years to figure out how to

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Speaker 3: tell it properly. The story that had never been told

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Speaker 3: was about a serial rapist terrorizing the city's Lovers Lanes,

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Speaker 3: Los Angeles in nineteen fifty.

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Speaker 2: Six, posing as a cop.

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Speaker 3: He was a black man, and the man who was

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Speaker 3: falsely accused of it and jailed for it was a

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Speaker 3: black former cop who got fired, they said for kuiding

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Speaker 3: a check. But really what he had done is he

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Speaker 3: dated a white woman, and so they thought, and that's

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Speaker 3: so the story is basically about racism. So the detective

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Speaker 3: who solved it, he was a Latino man, I think

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Speaker 3: the first Latina detective in the LAPD named Danny Galindo,

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Speaker 3: and he solved it. Danny was the guy who was

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Speaker 3: the technical advisor on Dragnet. So when there would be

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Speaker 3: a homicide which Dragnet didn't do and they did give

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Speaker 3: it to Galindo.

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Speaker 2: That was just the one I got by.

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Speaker 3: So I wrote that this is called La fifty six, okay,

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Speaker 3: and then I wrote, I, actually this is a co author.

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Speaker 3: So he told his story for him. So It's by

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Speaker 3: him and me. A man named Zelware Junior. He was

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Speaker 3: black man born in nineteen forty one in the heart

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Speaker 3: of jim Crow, Mississippi. His mother and father were kicked

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Speaker 3: out of town by the Kkkin. He was raised on

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Speaker 3: his grandparents sharecropping, grandparents dirt floor shack. But he had

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Speaker 3: two dreams in life. One of them was to be

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Speaker 3: a pilot and the other was to be a general.

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Speaker 3: These are he may have as well have said, I

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Speaker 3: want a right heard of unicorns. But he accomplished both

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Speaker 3: of those in his life. But the story is built

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Speaker 3: around this. The book is built around his adventure story.

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Speaker 3: He was shot down in Vietnam. He was a helicopter pilot.

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Speaker 3: He was shot down in the jungles of Vietnam. Had

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Speaker 3: this three week incredible adventure story in which he'd saved

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Speaker 3: the life of his white racist captain who he was

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Speaker 3: shot down with.

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Speaker 1: It's really what is that one called?

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Speaker 3: That's called by duty bounds. So that's a very good story,

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Speaker 3: I have to say. So both of those are my favorites.

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Speaker 1: I think, did you have a plan B if the

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Speaker 1: writing thing didn't work out? Would you be busking in

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Speaker 1: the metro?

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Speaker 2: You know? That's funny.

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Speaker 1: You live in LA there's not even a public transportation

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Speaker 1: that you could be busking in, right, I was.

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Speaker 3: I think it was early two thousand and two when

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Speaker 3: that famous episode of This American Life called Plan B

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Speaker 3: came out.

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Speaker 2: Do you know this episode?

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Speaker 1: I know I always ask about Plan b's on this show,

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Speaker 1: but no, I don't know.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. So I'm driving.

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Speaker 3: I'm driving along and I think about it, and I

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Speaker 3: go so all these people talking about their Plan b's,

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Speaker 3: and I'm starting to feel really terrible about it that

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Speaker 3: I just I had blinders on and I kept my

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Speaker 3: Plan A. And then it turns out this is truly funny.

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Speaker 3: One of the stories they told was the story of

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Speaker 3: Barry Keenan, who was the man who kidnapped Frank Sinatra Junior.

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Speaker 1: I remember the story in.

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Speaker 3: Nineteen sixty three. I had spent a week with him

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Speaker 3: about a year and a half prior getting his story,

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Speaker 3: because I was going to tell it because it.

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Speaker 2: Was so amazing.

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Speaker 3: And then we found that I found out that I

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Speaker 3: really couldn't monetize it because of the son of Sam

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Speaker 3: Loss but.

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Speaker 2: So and then I thought, okay, good, I'm on.

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Speaker 1: Plan If I know you were going to tell me

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Speaker 1: he had a plan B.

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Speaker 2: That was his plan B.

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Speaker 1: That was his plan B.

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Speaker 4: The kids.

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Speaker 1: That was the plan A.

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Speaker 2: His plan.

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Speaker 3: He had been a stockbroker and then the market crashed

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Speaker 3: and he lost everything, and then he had mental illness,

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Speaker 3: which wasn't helpful and so his plan. That's the reason

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Speaker 3: they included him. I see, yeah, included him was because

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Speaker 3: kidnapping Frank Sinatcher Junior was his plan BEA.

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Speaker 2: So when I heard.

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Speaker 3: That, I did a complete three sixty for an hour

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Speaker 3: in the car love it.

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Speaker 4: We're going to take a quick break and be right

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Speaker 4: back on the Carol Markowitz Show.

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Speaker 1: So you do still write columns, and you do still

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Speaker 1: write journalism. It's not just books, right, What do you

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Speaker 1: enjoy writing about on a more day.

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Speaker 2: To day basis?

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Speaker 3: Well, enjoy is not the I feel an obligation to

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Speaker 3: write as much as possible about the anti Semitism that's

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Speaker 3: going on. Which so about a month or three weeks

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Speaker 3: after October seventh, on a column in the Wall Street

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Speaker 3: Journal about how lifeless has turned around for American Jews

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Speaker 3: seeing the explosion of anti Semitism in the country, and

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Speaker 3: I closed the column by saying, we don't want to

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Speaker 3: you know, we don't want to redefine never again. To me,

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Speaker 3: never again. Well, we allow Nazi Germany to kill six

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Speaker 3: million Jews between January nineteen thirty three and May teen

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Speaker 3: forty five, But that is what is happening. If you

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Speaker 3: had told me a week prior that on October eighth

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Speaker 3: there would be provomos, really river to the sea demonstrations

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Speaker 3: after something like that, I would have thought you were

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Speaker 3: out of your mind.

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Speaker 1: Really, so you were surprised, I was. I didn't feel

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Speaker 1: that kind of surprise.

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Speaker 2: Really.

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Speaker 1: Well, I think about that because I really wasn't shocked.

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Speaker 1: I had been writing about anti Semitism growing in New

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Speaker 1: York for a long time, and I guess the thing

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Speaker 1: was that people had compartmentalized what was happening, which to

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Speaker 1: me was Orthodox Jews were being daily beat up in

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Speaker 1: the streets of New York. And yes, to me, that

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Speaker 1: was a four alarm fire, because I knew the only

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Speaker 1: reason I wasn't being attacked was because I didn't look

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Speaker 1: the part. But that's all that was saving me. So

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Speaker 1: I was fully not surprised about October eighth. I thought

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Speaker 1: this was clearly where we were heading for a while.

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Speaker 1: Did you feel maybe was it different in California. I

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Speaker 1: guess Brooklyn is actually the epicenter of violent anti Semitism.

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Speaker 1: It's number one in the country for violence against shoes.

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Speaker 1: So maybe I just had it close up to me.

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Speaker 1: And could it be the California kept you away from that?

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Speaker 3: Well, it's that I didn't. I followed the same things

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Speaker 3: you did. Maybe, well, certainly not to the degree that

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Speaker 3: you did. But I had no idea how widespread it was.

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Speaker 3: How the guy down the block for me, yeah, may

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Speaker 3: very well hate me. And I didn't know that all along.

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Speaker 3: It never occurred to me that it ran so deep.

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Speaker 3: But it was like on October seventy, it was like

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Speaker 3: an on button button was pushed. Yeah, and it continues

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Speaker 3: to grow. It's like the blob that continues to eat

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Speaker 3: everything in its way. You look at Zeniels and h

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Speaker 3: Cohort is so amenable to hitlery youth that it's frightening.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. And even beyond just about Jews, that Cohort is

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Speaker 1: extremely supportive of political violence. For example, like you know,

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Speaker 1: leaving a part Israel, leaving a part Jews. They think

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Speaker 1: it's okay to kill people when you disagree with them.

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Speaker 1: In numbers that are astronomical. I think we have a

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Speaker 1: wider problem. It is an immediate problem for Jews in America,

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Speaker 1: but I think the overarching issues way bigger and worse,

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Speaker 1: actually more problematic than it seems.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, indeed, you.

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Speaker 3: Know, not for nothing are Jews called the canary and

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Speaker 3: the coal mart Yeah, so the horseshoe theory is now,

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Speaker 3: it's the tips are coming together. It's turning into a news.

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Speaker 3: Jews will be the first one hang, but not nearly

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Speaker 3: the last.

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Speaker 2: These people that.

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Speaker 3: You're just talking about, it's sort of like the difference

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Speaker 3: between what they used to say, radical Muslim and a

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Speaker 3: moderate Muslim. The radical Muslim is the one willing to

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Speaker 3: do the killing, and the moderate Muslim stands there and watching, goes,

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Speaker 3: oh yeah, so these they may not pull the trigger themselves,

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Speaker 3: these young people, but they they're applauding it. It's just

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Speaker 3: the weirdest thing to say. We get compared a lot

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Speaker 3: to nineteen sixty eight. But in nineteen sixty eight, even

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Speaker 3: which I was sentient enough to pay attention to the center,

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Speaker 3: held that you would never have seen that sort of thing.

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Speaker 3: But another example is the idea that males would play

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Speaker 3: female sports, or males would go into female locker rooms

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Speaker 3: and bathrooms. The center was holding for something like that.

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Speaker 3: Now I don't even know if there is a center.

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Speaker 1: I don't know that issue. I feel like the center

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Speaker 1: is holding. The center's actually saying that they The Democrats

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Speaker 1: are so fringe about it. Even other Democrats Bill Maher's

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Speaker 1: of the world and stuff. I feel like they've woken

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Speaker 1: up to how big of a threat this is.

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Speaker 2: But how did we get here?

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Speaker 1: Oh? Yeah, so how we got here is a terrible

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Speaker 1: story of allowing people to really bully others into having

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Speaker 1: the same opinion of that as them, even though we

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Speaker 1: all knew the emperor had no clothes. That's what it was.

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Speaker 1: It was a bullying situation.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 1: Cancel culture, Peak, wokeness, met covid Era, and all of

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Speaker 1: that combined to create a really crazy time. Which leads

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Speaker 1: me to the most obvious question, when an't you moving

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Speaker 1: to Florida? Because this is it. We have our little

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Speaker 1: haven insanity here and this is the only spot in town.

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Speaker 3: I have spent quite a bit of time in Florida.

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Speaker 3: My mother Blessed Memory, spent the last thirty years of

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Speaker 3: her life in Florida, except for the final year of

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Speaker 3: her life when she lived with us, and if I

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Speaker 3: was able to endure humidity.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Right. Also, my wife went to college in Florida and she.

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Speaker 1: Goes, never again, No, no, no, I'm never going back.

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Speaker 1: Are you going to wait out the California in sanity?

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Speaker 1: Is it crazy over there?

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Speaker 2: It's it's it's crazy.

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Speaker 3: But then I walk out my backyard there's the Santa

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Speaker 3: Monica Mountains.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, no, is beautiful.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: It used to be my plan B. Like I was like,

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Speaker 1: if New York goes to shit, like I'm going to California.

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Speaker 2: That got really new York.

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Speaker 1: That got super funny right around twenty twenty, you know.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, since I'm saying the reason you left that that

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Speaker 3: didn't apply.

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Speaker 1: No, not at all.

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Speaker 2: It was worse here than where you left.

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Speaker 1: California schools didn't open for longer than New York schools.

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Speaker 1: And yeah, it turned out California was not that great

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Speaker 1: of a plan B for myself.

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Speaker 3: That this governor thinks he asked she has a chance

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Speaker 3: to become president is really one of the most mortally

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Speaker 3: funny things I can think of.

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Speaker 1: I'm scared, I don't know.

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Speaker 3: Oh, just all you have to do is run video

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Speaker 3: of life on the streets in our cities.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and that if it's not over for that.

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Speaker 3: Well, on the other hand, you have the Attorney General

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Speaker 3: of Virginia who is on record wishing the death of

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Speaker 3: his opponent and his children. Yeah, he's in the once

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Speaker 3: upon a time in the not very long ago pass

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Speaker 3: that would be out within four hours.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and now it's like not a big deal, and

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Speaker 1: all the Democrats are standing by him. So I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I'm I'm worried about Gavin Newsom because a lot of

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Speaker 1: people are under some spell that makes them believe a

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Speaker 1: lot of crazy things, and the Democrats are very good

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Speaker 1: at rallying around their people in a way that I'm

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Speaker 1: not sure Republicans are quite as good.

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Speaker 3: I whant I The way to watch Gavin Newsom is

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Speaker 3: with the sound off and you can you see how

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Speaker 3: holy Agnecy is. But also the thing about Gavin Newsom

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Speaker 3: is I imagine him with male pattern baldness at five nine,

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Speaker 3: and his entire reason for being in politics disappears.

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Speaker 2: That's all true because he has nothing.

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Speaker 1: Else, right, No, Yeah, he has the slimy look that

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Speaker 1: apparently some people enjoy. Let's keep an eye on that one,

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Speaker 1: because I do.

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Speaker 2: I do.

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Speaker 1: I would like the angles to move to Florida, but

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Speaker 1: not because the rest of the country has gotten elected.

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Speaker 3: Gavin Newsom, what's going to happen after your governor is

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Speaker 3: turned out?

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Speaker 1: You know, I don't know, but that might what I've

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Speaker 1: what I've been saying the whole time, and when I'm

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Speaker 1: we moved here. You can't move for a politician. You

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Speaker 1: can't go somewhere because one guy is doing a great job.

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Speaker 1: DeSantis has been incredible. I moved here because the sanity

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Speaker 1: of the people. It was the the people were like, no,

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Speaker 1: our schools are going to open, you know in twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty No, our kids are not going to be wearing

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Speaker 1: masks in twenty twenty one. They just they Even the Democrats,

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Speaker 1: That's that was the thing. Even the Democrats in Florida

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Speaker 1: are so much saner than the Democrats or even some

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Speaker 1: Republicans in New York. So that's what did it for me.

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Speaker 1: I have faith in Floridians more than I have faith

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Speaker 1: in any politician. You have to say, California, Now, do

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Speaker 1: you have that kind of faith Californians?

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Speaker 3: No, No, I have. I have zero faith in the

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Speaker 3: Only thing I have faith in here is the weather

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Speaker 3: and the topography.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and listen, those are not going to change hopefully no.

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Speaker 1: So at least made it one of my three questions

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Speaker 1: that I ask all my guests, what are you most

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Speaker 1: proud of in your life?

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Speaker 3: I am most proud of my marriage, which in a

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Speaker 3: few days will be forty four years.

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Speaker 2: Wow.

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Speaker 1: Yes, my wife super young to have forty four years

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Speaker 1: of marriage.

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Speaker 2: Thank you.

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Speaker 3: I think the La fifty LA fifty sixth book I

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Speaker 3: talked about earlier, dedicated to my wife, it said, if

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Speaker 3: I remember correctly, to my wife friend who has endured

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Speaker 3: the click clacking of a keyboard low these many years

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Speaker 3: without ever telling me to get a real job. And

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Speaker 3: the second thing I'm proud of is the product of

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Speaker 3: that marriage are spectacularly wonderful light on the world.

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Speaker 2: Daughter mate. Yeah, she's about to turn thirty nine.

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Speaker 1: Ah, definitely don't look old enough to have a thirty

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Speaker 1: nine year.

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Speaker 2: Old, thank you.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, she's got two wonderful little boys, one of them one, one, four,

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Speaker 3: And she's just a great moment I great human being

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Speaker 3: who married a great man.

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Speaker 1: That's so wonderful. That's really that's all I'm looking for

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Speaker 1: my kids to get married to great people and give

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Speaker 1: me some grandchildren.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well that you a few years down the line.

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Speaker 1: Yes, my oldest is fifteen, so not not tomorrow or anything,

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Speaker 1: but yeah.

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Speaker 3: Really smart you really smart kids. I love when you

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Speaker 3: post about your kids and your interactions with them. That's

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Speaker 3: just really one of my favorite things on the thank you.

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Speaker 1: I really appreciate that they love when I post about them.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: People sometimes say, like, you know, you shouldn't post about

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Speaker 1: your kids. I never use their real names or anything.

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Speaker 1: I just use their ages. And they love going back

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Speaker 1: and looking at like things I tweeted about them five

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Speaker 1: years ago, ten years ago, and they really enjoy that.

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Speaker 2: That's great. That's just really lovely.

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Speaker 1: Give us a prediction five years out. It could be anything,

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Speaker 1: you know, the world, the country, music, whatever you think.

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Speaker 3: Well, the world in the country obviously primary. I'm not

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Speaker 3: optimistic that because social media is a centrifuge and it's driving,

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Speaker 3: it's spinning faster, and it's driving people further apart. There

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Speaker 3: is no not even in the culture, there's no countervailing

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Speaker 3: such centripetal force bring anyone together. The Charlie Kirk assassination

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Speaker 3: had for about fifteen minutes the chance to.

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Speaker 2: Do that, like Okay, boy, all right, we've stepped over

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Speaker 2: the line. It's like you know, when you drink too much,

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Speaker 2: you know much of this?

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Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, right, So that that didn't that didn't last

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Speaker 3: immediately or sixteen minutes later, congratulations to the shooter and

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Speaker 3: all of that started. So I'm not it's weird because

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Speaker 3: you can have a civil war geographically. So we had

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Speaker 3: the North against the South. That was that was the

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Speaker 3: civil war. It was the North against the South. Now

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Speaker 3: it's my neighbor there, yeah, my neighbor there.

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Speaker 2: How do you fight this? Where is it going? How

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Speaker 2: do how do you do that?

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Speaker 3: So I'm not great at predictions. I have lost a

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Speaker 3: number of bets betting on the future in politics, so

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Speaker 3: I'm not great at that. But I don't unless something happens,

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Speaker 3: unless some kind of centripetal force is formed or forms

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Speaker 3: by itself, I don't see how we're not going to

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Speaker 3: be separate entities. At some point, you're going to have

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Speaker 3: to choose where to live and you're going to have

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Speaker 3: to move there.

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Speaker 2: Okay, you can move there, like the man in the

403
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Speaker 2: high Castle.

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Speaker 3: You could move the you know, part of the country

405
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Speaker 3: is going to live on the japan East side and

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Speaker 3: on the German side.

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Speaker 1: So the thing about that is that I, you know,

408
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Speaker 1: people talk about that national divorce all the time. It's

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Speaker 1: not even I'm not against it at all. I think

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Speaker 1: that we are doing I have been doing the great

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Speaker 1: sort in the last few years, and we have been

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Speaker 1: sorting into where we want to be ideologically and actually

413
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Speaker 1: moving to those places. But the thing is, you can't

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Speaker 1: predict what people. People change, people have kids who are

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Speaker 1: not the same ideologically as them, because we can't predict

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Speaker 1: any of that, and because things change, Republican Party today

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Speaker 1: or the Democrats today or nothing like they were even

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Speaker 1: thirty years ago.

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Speaker 2: Correct, I don't.

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Speaker 1: Know that the national divorce thing will work. So I

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Speaker 1: fully agree with your prediction. I think that five years

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Speaker 1: from now, are still at each other's throats and things

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Speaker 1: are very divided. But I don't think we get over that.

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Speaker 1: Like I don't think that we somehow divide ourselves into

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Speaker 1: being happier apart. We were going to have to come

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Speaker 1: back together eventually or things will get worse.

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Speaker 3: Really well, I don't know how you come back from

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Speaker 3: I want you dad.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a tough one.

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Speaker 2: I just don't know how you come back from that.

431
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Speaker 3: I don't know if anyone's ever come back from that, right,

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Speaker 3: So again, I hope you're right. We do have to

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Speaker 3: come back, but before we're colonized by really bad people.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's that that's really the concern, that our division

435
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Speaker 1: makes us so weak that any outside for can can

436
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Speaker 1: easily right, you know, TikTok their way into capturing our attention.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, the when, the when the pillars, when the supports

438
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Speaker 3: are chipped away and chipped away and chipped away. That's

439
00:23:14,600 --> 00:23:16,920
Speaker 3: the problem with the left. They don't build anything. They

440
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Speaker 3: only want to tear down things, and they make it

441
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Speaker 3: easy for things to crumble by chipping away.

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Speaker 2: A little bit, a little bit, a little bit.

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Speaker 3: They're not it's you know, once upon a time that

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Speaker 3: I don't know when liberalism I'm not sure exactly the

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Speaker 3: point when liberalism became leftism, but that whatever day that

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Speaker 3: future historians, if they do exist, if they can pinpoint that,

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Speaker 3: that will be the hinge of history.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Absolutely, we're going to take a quick break and be

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Speaker 4: right back on the Carol Marcowitz Show.

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Speaker 1: Joel, I have loved this conversation. I can't believe this

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Speaker 1: is the first time that we've ever actually spoken sort

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Speaker 1: of in person. You are awesome and I'm so glad

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Speaker 1: you came on the show. And here with your best

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Speaker 1: tip for my listeners on how they can improve their lives.

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Speaker 2: I have too ones.

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Speaker 3: Kind of well, okay, so one is I think everybody

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Speaker 3: should every day keep a kind of journal or diary

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Speaker 3: in which you you list the main things that you

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Speaker 3: did that day, and it could be just bullet points,

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Speaker 3: and then how you your emotional moods. If there were

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Speaker 3: more than one during the day, it could be it

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Speaker 3: could be just five minute entries.

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Speaker 2: And then every well, then every ninety you go.

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Speaker 3: Back over the ninety days worth of entries and you

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Speaker 3: can determine ascertain if you're on some sort of vector

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Speaker 3: that you didn't know that you were one that oh

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Speaker 3: this is this is this is vectors leading me in

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Speaker 3: a place that I don't want to go. So what

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Speaker 3: are the kinds of things I need to do? And

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Speaker 3: then you do that for the next thirty days and

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Speaker 3: see if you have corrected course. So the second one

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Speaker 3: is one that has a meet it benefits, and that

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Speaker 3: is when you called any place for customer service, don't

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Speaker 3: expect it to go well expect.

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Speaker 1: I think that's because you're in California.

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Speaker 3: No matter where you call for support, whether it's your ISP,

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Speaker 3: whatever it is, just know it's going to go badly,

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Speaker 3: and that way you won't have given too much emotion

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Speaker 3: to the disappointment.

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Speaker 1: No disappointment if you expect things to go poorly. I

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Speaker 1: love it. Thank you so much. He is Joel Engel.

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Speaker 1: Check out all of his amazing books and follow him

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Speaker 1: on x at Joel Engel. Thank you so much, Joel.

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Speaker 2: Great to be with you, Carol,