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Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and I welcome to Stuff Mom

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Speaker 1: Never Told your production of I Heart Radio's House Stuff Parts.

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Speaker 1: It is the first female first. We are joined once

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Speaker 1: again by our good friend and co worker, eavese Hi.

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Speaker 1: Thanks so much for being here, Thank you for having

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Speaker 1: me again. We just had a rousing discussion about aliens

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Speaker 1: and how they should look, resolutions, running um and disliking running,

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Speaker 1: and then a little bit of our kind of disastrous mornings.

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Speaker 1: Even I had a bit of a mishaps. We made

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Speaker 1: it through them, which is an important part. We did.

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Speaker 1: We did. You're here to tell the tale that actually

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Speaker 1: is probably a very important part to a lot of

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Speaker 1: these female first we talked about. Yeah, you're right, because

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Speaker 1: they do get pretty intense in some parts, Like they

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Speaker 1: went through a lot, they struggled a lot, and they

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Speaker 1: fought a lot, but you know they did a lot

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Speaker 1: of good things too. Yes, and the one, the person

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Speaker 1: you brought for us today, she did so much and

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Speaker 1: very important to the discussions we're having now around the

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Speaker 1: environment and sustainability things that are on a lot of

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Speaker 1: people's minds. As it should be. Yeah, that's exactly what

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Speaker 1: I was thinking. I was like, I feel like it's

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Speaker 1: really good to be able to talk about today. We're

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Speaker 1: going to be talking about when Gary moved to Mattai,

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Speaker 1: UM and she did a lot of stuff that had

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Speaker 1: to do with environmental activism, and that is clearly something

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Speaker 1: that we're talking about right now today. And I didn't

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Speaker 1: choose say, oh, let me find somebody who's doing something

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Speaker 1: that has to do with the environment. It just kind

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Speaker 1: of came like, Oh, she's someone who is, you know,

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Speaker 1: first of all from the African continent, which I feel

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Speaker 1: like maybe we've maybe we've discussed somebody from the African

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Speaker 1: continent so far, I can't remember, but yeah, like that

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Speaker 1: was really important to me. And also the actual work

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Speaker 1: that she's doing is so relevant into what we're talking about,

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Speaker 1: and it's also very recent and also had a very

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Speaker 1: global impact. UM. And she knows what she's talking about,

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Speaker 1: she knows what she's doing, and she's also left a

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Speaker 1: great legacy behind her that just kind of touched people

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Speaker 1: of all different cultures and people of all different nationalities,

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Speaker 1: which I think is a really cool thing. Yeah, And

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Speaker 1: I was reading her her story. I we always stress

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Speaker 1: the importance of context and these stories that we um

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Speaker 1: that you bring to us, UM and it's it is recent,

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Speaker 1: and it's kind of shocking how much she did and

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Speaker 1: how much things have changed just through the sixties and seventies,

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Speaker 1: kind of just this tumultuous cauldron of all these things happening.

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Speaker 1: And it's also just, you know, very indicative of the

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Speaker 1: actual issues that people were going through in Kenya and

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Speaker 1: on the African continent at the time, because obviously environmental

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Speaker 1: issues are global issues, but they're also very specific to

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Speaker 1: the locales and the climates in which all the activists

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Speaker 1: separately reside. Um they're all different but also related in

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Speaker 1: some way, and I think her perspective and how she

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Speaker 1: kind of got into her activism and her work is

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Speaker 1: indicative of that. But I feel like I'm getting ahead

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Speaker 1: of myself right now. Yeah, let's go. I'm just like,

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Speaker 1: oh my god, she's amazing, and I haven't who she

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Speaker 1: really is. So yeah. But I was the first African

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Speaker 1: woman to win the Nobel Prize, and she was the

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Speaker 1: first woman to become an assistant professor at the University

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Speaker 1: of Nairobi. She was the first woman to head a

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Speaker 1: university department in Kenya and the first woman in Eastern

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Speaker 1: and Central Africa to earn a PhD. So a lot

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Speaker 1: of First, that's what we're here for, right, that's right.

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Speaker 1: So she was born on April first, nineteen forty and Neary, Kenya,

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Speaker 1: and she was the daughter of kiku You subsistence farmers.

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Speaker 1: The kiku You are an ethnic group in Kenya. She

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Speaker 1: had five siblings and she was raised in an area

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Speaker 1: of Kenya that was known as the White Highlands, which

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Speaker 1: is so called because there was policy that certain agricultural

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Speaker 1: lands and Kenya should be reserved for Europeans. So her

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Speaker 1: older brother convinced their parents that she go to school

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Speaker 1: rather than focus on household responsibilities, which you could imagine

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Speaker 1: were plentiful because she had so many siblings um rather

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Speaker 1: big family to take care of. She went to the

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Speaker 1: Tea Primary School, the St. Cecilia School and then the

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Speaker 1: Laredo Lemuro Girls School. So after completing school there, she

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Speaker 1: got a scholarship. And that's because the Kennedy administration in

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Speaker 1: the US at the time was funding initiatives for people

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Speaker 1: in Eastern Africa and then Kenya specifically to study in

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Speaker 1: the US, and so that's how she got a scholarship

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Speaker 1: to study at university in the US, so where she

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Speaker 1: ended up going was Mount Saint Scholastica College in Kansas,

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Speaker 1: and she stayed in US to study at university for

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Speaker 1: a bit. She graduated with her bachelor's in biology in

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Speaker 1: nineteen sixty four, and then she stayed in the US.

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Speaker 1: She got her masters from the University of Pittsburgh in Pennsylvania.

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Speaker 1: And then so by this time when she returned to

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Speaker 1: Kenya after she graduated, the whole Eastern colonialism processes and

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Speaker 1: then Kenya had gained its independence and when she went

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Speaker 1: back there was she had a research assistant position that

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Speaker 1: had been promised to her. So she was recruited to

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Speaker 1: be a research assistant in zoology and that was at

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Speaker 1: the University of Narrobi, and she found out when she

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Speaker 1: got to the campus that she had been denied the position,

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Speaker 1: and she thought that that was because of gender discrimination.

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Speaker 1: So after that she got another research assistant position and

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Speaker 1: this time it was in the department of Veterinary Anatomy.

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Speaker 1: So she started she continued working. She was not discouraged

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Speaker 1: by that, so she started pursuing her doctoral studies in Germany.

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Speaker 1: She got her PhD from the University of Nairobi. So

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Speaker 1: she was the first woman to get a doctorate degree

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Speaker 1: in Eastern Central Africa. Wow, that's pretty I can't even

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Speaker 1: imagine writing the first person or a woman anything. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that level of achievement, that level of achievement. Yeah yeah,

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Speaker 1: my first surb not not on that same plane. That's cool,

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Speaker 1: though he didn't lead a pathway for other women, not

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Speaker 1: that I know of accomplished such a thing, not that

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Speaker 1: I know of. I mean, just like I wonder the

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Speaker 1: reporting on it or they're like, wow, look, this woman

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Speaker 1: has become the first to do this, and all the

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Speaker 1: negativity possibly probably, but as we know from I feel

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Speaker 1: like previous people and just in general how these things work,

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Speaker 1: a lot of those first aren't recognized in a contemporary manner.

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Speaker 1: It's just like the person is doing a thing and

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Speaker 1: then we go back and look at them, sometimes posthumously,

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Speaker 1: you know, way back in the day. Um, but we

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Speaker 1: start to realize, okay, you know this, this happened, and

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Speaker 1: this is part of a long story and a long

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Speaker 1: lineage of people and things that they did, so we

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Speaker 1: kind of situate the first within that history after a

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Speaker 1: lot of the time. Right, that's true. That's a good point.

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Speaker 1: As far as her personal life, she married an ruby

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Speaker 1: businessman who kind of had aspirations in politics, and she

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Speaker 1: married him in nineteen sixty nine. She met him a

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Speaker 1: few years before her and eventually they had three kids together,

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Speaker 1: and he ran for parliament in the early nineteen seventies.

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Speaker 1: His first campaign was unsuccessful, even though she helped him

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Speaker 1: with that, and then later in their story in the

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Speaker 1: early nineteen eighties, they went through this whole divorce suit

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Speaker 1: and he accused her of adultery, and it's also said

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Speaker 1: that he thought that she was too educated and too

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Speaker 1: strong willed and minded and too hard to control, and

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Speaker 1: that was part of the reason that they got a divorce.

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Speaker 1: But it was a pretty contentious situation. Um she ended

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Speaker 1: up going to court, she lost the case, they ended

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Speaker 1: up being divorced. She was even jailed for a short

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Speaker 1: time about three days afterward, because she accused the judge

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Speaker 1: of being incompetent. Whoa And this is also when his

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Speaker 1: last name was spelled with one a m a um

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Speaker 1: t h a I and she changed her name to

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Speaker 1: have two a's because of the whole sitch reuation. You

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Speaker 1: requested that, Yeah, so it was that was you know,

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Speaker 1: later in life, after years of them having been together,

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Speaker 1: they separated before they divorced, but yeah, that was part

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Speaker 1: of their story. Yeah, So in nineteen seventy three, and

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Speaker 1: this is where we get to all of the things.

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Speaker 1: Obviously we're not going to have room to like talk

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Speaker 1: about every single thing that she did because she did

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Speaker 1: so many different things. Um, but in nineteen seventy three

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Speaker 1: she became the director of Nairobi's branch of the National

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Speaker 1: Red Cross. So we see her already in the late

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Speaker 1: sixties early seventies getting into all of her activism, all

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Speaker 1: of her environmental work, and realizing through her research and

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Speaker 1: just her personal life like observation. The thing I really

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Speaker 1: love about her story is like how often we think

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Speaker 1: of how we think of academics in terms of the

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Speaker 1: work that they do, Like they did all this study

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Speaker 1: at these universities, and this is their education, is what

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Speaker 1: influenced them and what made them be able to address

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Speaker 1: issues in a certain way. But observation is also a

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Speaker 1: very important thing in our lives that can drive us

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Speaker 1: to do better things because and I think her story

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Speaker 1: is just a great example of that. Like she talks

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Speaker 1: about how much in her during her childhood and during

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Speaker 1: her life, how she was just noticing what was happening

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Speaker 1: around her, how she was listening to village women tell

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Speaker 1: her what they needed, and that observation is a big

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Speaker 1: part of what drove her to do her environmental work.

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Speaker 1: Realizing that she could connect the things that are actually

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Speaker 1: happening around her and the work that she's interested in doing,

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Speaker 1: and the skills that she does have and the education

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Speaker 1: that she is getting and combining the two, well, those

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Speaker 1: several things together to really create a huge impact. So

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Speaker 1: I really like that about her story. Um. Yeah, So

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Speaker 1: she started moving up in her roles at the university.

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Speaker 1: She became a senior lecturer in the nineteen seventies, and

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Speaker 1: she became the chair of her department, and then she

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Speaker 1: became an assistant professor in nineteen seventy seven. And so

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Speaker 1: her postdoctoral research made her, as I was saying, aware

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Speaker 1: of all the things that was happening in her country,

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Speaker 1: especially in the rural areas, and all the issues that

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Speaker 1: people were facing, whether that had to do with the

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Speaker 1: environment or like personal issues. And we'll we'll get into

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Speaker 1: some of the things that specifically that drove her research

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Speaker 1: that was happening in Kenya at the time. And so

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Speaker 1: later her husband campaign for a seat and in parliament,

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Speaker 1: again in one of this is before they divorced. One

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Speaker 1: thing that he advocated for was finding jobs for the unemployed,

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Speaker 1: and so with that spirit, that energy that was happening,

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Speaker 1: Mattai connected that need to her environmental efforts and then

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Speaker 1: she started this business called envirol Care where she was

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Speaker 1: getting people to plant trees. That business wasn't that successful,

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Speaker 1: but those efforts did lead her to you know, more

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Speaker 1: successful efforts, and the connections that she already had with

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Speaker 1: all these people through the work that she was doing

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Speaker 1: led to her getting the National Council of Women of

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Speaker 1: Kenya to help her launch a tree planting project called

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Speaker 1: Save the Land her on Bay and her Bay is

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Speaker 1: the Swahili word that means all pull together, and that

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Speaker 1: eventually turned into the Green Belt movement, which is one

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Speaker 1: of her, you know, the most well known initiatives. Even

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Speaker 1: though she did a time right, yeah, time, but that's

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Speaker 1: that's a huge organization. She was active in the National

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Speaker 1: Council of Women of Kenya for a really long time

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Speaker 1: from around nine eight seven. While she was serving with them,

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Speaker 1: she started introducing this idea of community based tree planting

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Speaker 1: that she had already introduced through her other work. Much

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Speaker 1: of the population in Africa dependent on what for fuel,

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Speaker 1: but at the time there was a lot of deforestation happening,

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Speaker 1: so as their still is um, but trees were depleted

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Speaker 1: because they were being raised and they weren't being replaced

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Speaker 1: at the same rate UM. So obviously that leads to

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Speaker 1: a lot of different issues, including nutritional deficiencies, poverty because

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Speaker 1: there would be they had to walk a long way

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Speaker 1: to get water to be able to get the fuel. Um,

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Speaker 1: there is desert where there once with trees. The deforestation

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Speaker 1: also caused soil runoff and water pollution, which is obviously

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Speaker 1: important to a person being able to sustain themselves in

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Speaker 1: terms of the food that they eat. And speaking of

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Speaker 1: sustaining themselves, a lot of the children also had to

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Speaker 1: start being fit with processed foods because of this, and

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Speaker 1: livestock didn't have vegetation to eat. And on top of

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Speaker 1: all that, under the colonial period, like British governors, they

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Speaker 1: were planting non native trees instead of indigenous trees. So

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Speaker 1: it just had all these effects on the way that

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Speaker 1: people lived, in their ability to live whole and fruitful lives.

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Speaker 1: So she started getting into all that and realizing how

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Speaker 1: that affected people and specifically women, and she opened an

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Speaker 1: agency that paid impoverished people to plant trees and shrubs.

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Speaker 1: And so she decided to campaign for a seat in

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Speaker 1: parliament that would become open and near in no and

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Speaker 1: to do this she had to resign from the University

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Speaker 1: of Narrobi. That was one condition that she she couldn't

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Speaker 1: be there to be able to run, and so the

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Speaker 1: electoral authorities said that she couldn't run. She was disqualified

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Speaker 1: for running because she hadn't registered to vote, so because

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Speaker 1: of that registration in the last presidential election, because that

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Speaker 1: registration technicality, they kind of pulled her out of that situation.

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Speaker 1: And she obviously took issue with that decision, but she

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Speaker 1: needed up, you know, being disqualified anyway, and wanted to

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Speaker 1: go back to the university because obviously she needs a

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Speaker 1: job u UM and they refused to rehire her or

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Speaker 1: restore her benefits, and they evicted her from university housing

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Speaker 1: since she was no longer there anymore. Oh man m m.

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Speaker 1: That's time. Time. So that's definitely one thread in her story,

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Speaker 1: which is there were she had a lot of opposition,

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Speaker 1: so she did have a lot of supporters and also

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Speaker 1: supported a lot of people through employment and just like

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Speaker 1: you know, personal support, but she had a lot of

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Speaker 1: people who opposed the work that she was doing because

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Speaker 1: she was so pro democracy, the things that she was

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Speaker 1: talking about, the things that she was standing up against,

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Speaker 1: and was viewed as kind of anti government and in

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Speaker 1: that respect, a lot of the press that she got

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Speaker 1: in that the Green Belt movement got in the media

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Speaker 1: that was negative and because of that a lot of

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Speaker 1: people were discouraged from wanting to be associated with the

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Speaker 1: movement because of its you know, reputation. But it was

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Speaker 1: still a successful movement, which we'll get into too. So

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Speaker 1: she poured her energy into that Green Belt movement UM

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Speaker 1: and its main focus was poverty reduction and environmental conservation

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Speaker 1: and focusing on this singular this goal of planting trees,

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Speaker 1: and its goal was to plant trees all across Kenyon

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Speaker 1: to fight erosion and to create firewood for the fuel

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Speaker 1: for people there, and to create jobs for women because

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Speaker 1: women were really instrumental and being the people who planted

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Speaker 1: the trees. And so over the years they planted tens

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Speaker 1: of millions of trees in Africa. Yes, they did this

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Speaker 1: by establishing tons of nurseries that offered free links to

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Speaker 1: people UM and then the communities would plant them and

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Speaker 1: very small amount of small payment was given for every

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Speaker 1: tree that was planted, but they had to make sure

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Speaker 1: that they took care of the tree for three months.

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Speaker 1: That was part of the deal. And even though it's

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Speaker 1: a small amount, that could make a big difference in

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Speaker 1: someone's life. Um, for many of those women who were

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Speaker 1: subsistence farmers that didn't have extra food to give for

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Speaker 1: our to sail, not give that money was some of

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Speaker 1: their only income. Well Man tens of millions and was

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Speaker 1: able to help that many in different ways. That's amazing. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it is, Yeah, and I think that would be really cool.

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Speaker 1: I know we'll probably get to this later, but there's

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Speaker 1: an interview um that when Gary did with um on

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Speaker 1: on Being and she described the power of seeing a

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Speaker 1: tree that you've planted like years and years later just

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Speaker 1: know that you did that, and it's yeah, yeah, the

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Speaker 1: the this tree kind of became the tree itself through

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Speaker 1: all the work that she did, kind of became this

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Speaker 1: movement of like democracy, of like the legacy of so

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Speaker 1: many things through the work that she did. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's a really good point. And all the work through

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Speaker 1: the green belt movement also helped conserve the soil and

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Speaker 1: the ecology of the land and obviously gave thousands of

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Speaker 1: people opportunities for employment, and she worked over time, this

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Speaker 1: became more than just about trees. Obviously it was that

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Speaker 1: from the beginning, but they also started to provide other

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Speaker 1: services besides tree planting. So she worked with the National

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Speaker 1: Council of Women of Kenya to give services like family planning,

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Speaker 1: like nutrition, food security, HIV awareness and leadership skills. So

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Speaker 1: it became this environmental and civic educational program for people

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Speaker 1: and that ended up spreading its ten drils throughout a

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Speaker 1: bunch of countries in Africa and throughout the world as well,

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Speaker 1: and eventually it formerly separated from the National Council of

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Speaker 1: Women of Kenya and she even though Mattai was already

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Speaker 1: so involved in politics, she became more involved in politics

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Speaker 1: over time and protests and activism. And in the nineteen

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Speaker 1: eighty nine she protested the construction of a huge office

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Speaker 1: tower in Uhuru Park in Nairobi. So she started sending

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Speaker 1: out a bunch of letters to all of these people,

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Speaker 1: different government officials, different organizations and Kenya to protest, like

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Speaker 1: just putting the pressure on people to protest. This office

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Speaker 1: tower being built. It was a whole complex thing, and

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Speaker 1: she claimed that the building was expensive and that money

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Speaker 1: should instead be spent on other things because this is

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Speaker 1: going to be a tens of millions of dollar project

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Speaker 1: like poverty, hunger and education. And obviously this project had

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Speaker 1: a bunch of foreign investors. And through all of of

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Speaker 1: the protesting that happened, even though she was getting a

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Speaker 1: lot of black impress once again for her protest and

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Speaker 1: for not being quiet, complacent and all those things that

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Speaker 1: you know, a woman what's supposed to be, she still

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Speaker 1: managed to like that that whole protests managed to be

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Speaker 1: successful and investors ended up pulling out of the whole

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Speaker 1: situation not long after her protesting began, and the skyscraper

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Speaker 1: wasn't built, So that was one thing of the many

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Speaker 1: things that she protested against. And she also opposed the

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Speaker 1: one party state that there was in Kenya at the time.

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Speaker 1: So Matta was also involved in the Forum for the

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Speaker 1: Restoration of Democracy, which was a group that opposed, among

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Speaker 1: other things, This group kind of branched off had groups

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Speaker 1: in different countries, but and Kenya, it was opposed to

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Speaker 1: the leadership of the President Daniel are up More and

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Speaker 1: her opposition earned her the ire of the president, not

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Speaker 1: just through her work with the forum, but also all

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Speaker 1: the other things that she was doing. So going back

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Speaker 1: to that project with the Office Tower, he was really

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Speaker 1: against her speaking up about that too and had a

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Speaker 1: lot of nasty things to say about her for her

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Speaker 1: vocalizations on that issue, and she faced many risks, beatings,

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Speaker 1: and dealings because of the work that she was doing.

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Speaker 1: She advocated for the release of political prisoners, and in

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Speaker 1: she wanted to hunger strike with the group of mothers

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Speaker 1: of political prisoners, and that ended up being successful, even

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Speaker 1: though she and a lot of other people who were

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Speaker 1: involved in the strike. We're beaten by police during the protest,

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Speaker 1: but at the end of that strike, the government did

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Speaker 1: released the majority of the political prisoners. We have a

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Speaker 1: lot more of our discussion with Eaves, but first we

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Speaker 1: have a quick break for a word from our sponsor,

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Speaker 1: and we're back. Thank you sponsor. Let's get back into it.

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Speaker 1: She was also arrested for more of her protests and

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Speaker 1: later charged with spreading rumors that the president was planning

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Speaker 1: to turr and government power over to the military, and

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Speaker 1: so while she was in jail waiting on her charge,

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Speaker 1: she was refused medical treatment. So it's just like it's

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Speaker 1: there was a lot of like fighting happening there. Like

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Speaker 1: there was a lot of conflict and a lot of

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Speaker 1: this kind of fabrication of like issues when it came

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Speaker 1: to the work that she was doing, because she was

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Speaker 1: so vocal and because she was so active um in

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Speaker 1: her environmental causes. She said it that she was running

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Speaker 1: for parliament and for the presidency as part of the

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Speaker 1: Liberal Party of Kenya, and as part of her campaign,

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Speaker 1: she was continuing to say the same things, be about

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Speaker 1: be about what she had always been about, basically be own,

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Speaker 1: seeing the corruption in the government and imagining a society

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Speaker 1: where people really embraced their cultural with spiritual background um

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Speaker 1: as they participated in government. But her candidacy was withdrawn

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Speaker 1: by the party without notifying her until days before the election.

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Speaker 1: That said, she didn't announce her campaign until not long

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Speaker 1: before the election itself, but she ended up not getting

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Speaker 1: that parliamentcy. Wow, they didn't tell her. Just like people

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Speaker 1: are afraid of strong women. This is true of power

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Speaker 1: and obviously the opposition they had to do everything they

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Speaker 1: could to try to undermine her. Yeah, she was determined.

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Speaker 1: Another thing that she did as part of all her

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Speaker 1: work was working on the Jubilee two thousand campaign, which

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Speaker 1: was this global campaign UM. But in her case when

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Speaker 1: she became the co chair of the campaign in Kenya,

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Speaker 1: which she did in UM specifically focusing on the countries

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Speaker 1: in Africa, but the whole campaign was aiming to cancel

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Speaker 1: foreign debt for poor countries by the year two thousand,

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Speaker 1: which is where the number two thousand comes from and

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Speaker 1: the name of the campaign. Yeah, so she wasn't There

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Speaker 1: were a lot of people who were against her, including

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Speaker 1: you know moy and all a bunch of other government

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Speaker 1: officials and just people in general UM who didn't like

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Speaker 1: how she was challenging government and how she was speaking

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Speaker 1: up for all these pro democracy positions and all these

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Speaker 1: activities as she had going on in relation to that.

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Speaker 1: Just some examples. She was hospitalized for a head wound

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Speaker 1: and a concussion that she suffered during uh government arranged attacks.

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Speaker 1: So she was working on this project where she and

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Speaker 1: some supporters were planting trees in the Corea forest which

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Speaker 1: is in Nairobi, and she was protesting against the clearing

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Speaker 1: of the forest for a private development. UM. That's one

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Speaker 1: thing that happened to her. At another point, they forced

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Speaker 1: the Great Belt Movement to mood from its office UM

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Speaker 1: in a government owned building to her home. UM. She

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Speaker 1: when she formed the Tribal Classes Resettlement Volunteer Service in

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Speaker 1: n to help victims of State sectioned political violence in

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Speaker 1: the Red Valley, the government accused her of inciting violence

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Speaker 1: and tried to shut down her organizations meetings by sending

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Speaker 1: and police to disrupt things. Yeah. So those are just

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Speaker 1: some of the things that she was up against. Um,

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Speaker 1: the list could go on, but we won't do that. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it sounds like quite a lot. And she definitely put

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Speaker 1: her She was somebody who put her body on the line.

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Speaker 1: Say she was a powerhouse and everything her obviously in

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Speaker 1: her work and her ethic and and just in her beliefs.

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Speaker 1: She was unmovable. The plant like a tree. Yes, oh,

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Speaker 1: look at that. Actually don't work together. Civil There we go,

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Speaker 1: We got that, America. Yeah, I'm actually surprised there haven't

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Speaker 1: been more tree puns. But I'm glad it's not appropriate.

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Speaker 1: You're saving them for the age, is what you're really doing.

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Speaker 1: And they're all in my head, keeping them to myself

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Speaker 1: for once you're writing it though for later writing them down,

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Speaker 1: So one of her biggest opponents, Boy left office in

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Speaker 1: two thousand two, and that same year her she ran

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Speaker 1: for parliament and was elected with a large majority of

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Speaker 1: the vote. Um. The president ended up appointing her the

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Speaker 1: Minister for Environment, Natural Resources in Wildlife and she served

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Speaker 1: the government and in parliament until two thousand five. And

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Speaker 1: this is um we're getting into the later years of

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Speaker 1: her life at this point, and she was recognized for

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Speaker 1: a lot of her work. She got a lot of

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Speaker 1: honorary degrees and awards, like too many to mention here, um,

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Speaker 1: but a ton of them. But one of the big

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Speaker 1: ones was the Nobel Peace Prize, which she got in

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Speaker 1: two thousand four, and she was the first African woman

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Speaker 1: to get the Nobel Peace Prize and she got it

434
00:27:43,040 --> 00:27:47,959
Speaker 1: for her contribution to sustainable development, democracy and peace. So

435
00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:51,760
Speaker 1: that's that's one of the awards that she got. And

436
00:27:51,800 --> 00:27:57,679
Speaker 1: in her acceptance speech, which UM, it's really interesting, she

437
00:27:57,760 --> 00:28:00,879
Speaker 1: noted how she was influenced by the things that you know,

438
00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:02,800
Speaker 1: as we were talking about earlier, she observed when she

439
00:28:02,880 --> 00:28:05,680
Speaker 1: was a child in Kenya, UM she saw forest being

440
00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:11,080
Speaker 1: cleared and replaced by commercial plantations, and she saw a

441
00:28:11,119 --> 00:28:16,280
Speaker 1: local bio diversity being destroyed. And she also said that

442
00:28:16,359 --> 00:28:19,400
Speaker 1: when she started the green Belt movement, she was really

443
00:28:19,440 --> 00:28:22,560
Speaker 1: responding to the needs that rural women were saying that

444
00:28:22,600 --> 00:28:26,240
Speaker 1: they had, which were specifically the lack of firewood, clean

445
00:28:26,359 --> 00:28:32,920
Speaker 1: drinking water, balanced diets, shelter, and income. And she also

446
00:28:33,040 --> 00:28:35,879
Speaker 1: called out to the fact which is how integral women

447
00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:38,640
Speaker 1: were in the development of the work that she wanted

448
00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:41,200
Speaker 1: to do with the green Belt movement and the work

449
00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:45,000
Speaker 1: that she ended up doing with the movement, and that

450
00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:48,880
Speaker 1: be saying that because they were primary caretakers throughout Africa,

451
00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:51,280
Speaker 1: they was responsible for taking care of the land and

452
00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:54,440
Speaker 1: for taking care of the family, that they were often

453
00:28:54,640 --> 00:29:00,400
Speaker 1: the first ones to become aware of any environ mental

454
00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:03,959
Speaker 1: damage that was happening, even if they didn't recognize how

455
00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:09,840
Speaker 1: one thing was necessarily affecting the other in their personal experience, right, Yeah,

456
00:29:09,920 --> 00:29:12,040
Speaker 1: And she got yeah. So some of the other awards

457
00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:15,200
Speaker 1: that she got were the Goldman Environmental Prize, the French

458
00:29:15,280 --> 00:29:18,200
Speaker 1: Legion of Honor, Japan's Grand Cordon of the Order of

459
00:29:18,200 --> 00:29:22,280
Speaker 1: the Rising sun Um like I said, more honorary degrees.

460
00:29:22,360 --> 00:29:25,200
Speaker 1: She also authored several books. One of them was a

461
00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:28,280
Speaker 1: memoir that was called avowed and another book called The

462
00:29:28,320 --> 00:29:33,280
Speaker 1: Challenge for Africa and other writings. She was named a

463
00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:37,560
Speaker 1: un Messenger of Peace in two thousand nine, and the

464
00:29:37,640 --> 00:29:40,480
Speaker 1: next year, in partnership with the University of Narobi, she

465
00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:44,640
Speaker 1: found at the Wangari Mattai Institute for Peace and Environmental Studies.

466
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:51,800
Speaker 1: And Yeah, so she just continued help not only doing

467
00:29:51,840 --> 00:29:54,640
Speaker 1: her own work and her organization when it came to

468
00:29:54,960 --> 00:29:59,520
Speaker 1: environmental causes, but also participating in like teaching other people

469
00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:02,520
Speaker 1: about those things and making sure that other people learned

470
00:30:02,560 --> 00:30:06,800
Speaker 1: about environmental issues when it came to academics, but just

471
00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:12,920
Speaker 1: general you know, environmental education for people. Um, so you know,

472
00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:16,520
Speaker 1: spreading all of that knowledge around the world. And in

473
00:30:16,640 --> 00:30:20,280
Speaker 1: two thousand eleven she was diagnosed with ovarian cancer and

474
00:30:20,320 --> 00:30:25,440
Speaker 1: she ended up dying that year from complications of the cancer. Yeah,

475
00:30:25,440 --> 00:30:29,000
Speaker 1: but her legacy that was what you know, only so

476
00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:33,240
Speaker 1: long ago. But you know, her legacy is clearly still

477
00:30:34,080 --> 00:30:36,240
Speaker 1: a parent in the world and a parent in Kenya,

478
00:30:36,360 --> 00:30:41,240
Speaker 1: and she's well remembered and fortunately was able to be

479
00:30:41,320 --> 00:30:47,000
Speaker 1: recognized during her lifetime. Yeah. And I think one of

480
00:30:47,040 --> 00:30:50,760
Speaker 1: my favorite things about her and the things that she

481
00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:56,239
Speaker 1: did is there is this awareness of taking care of

482
00:30:56,280 --> 00:30:58,920
Speaker 1: the future, of looking out for future generations. That she

483
00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:02,440
Speaker 1: started all of these things and spread her knowledge to

484
00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:06,560
Speaker 1: make sure that things would continue once she was no

485
00:31:06,640 --> 00:31:10,240
Speaker 1: longer around. And I actually think that's one of the

486
00:31:10,280 --> 00:31:14,120
Speaker 1: biggest problems with humanity is and when it comes to sustainability,

487
00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:17,280
Speaker 1: is we're really bad about doing that. We're really bad

488
00:31:17,320 --> 00:31:21,160
Speaker 1: about thinking about future generations because right now this is

489
00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:23,320
Speaker 1: the easy thing to do, to continue as we are.

490
00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:30,680
Speaker 1: But she made sure that she's left behind these things

491
00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:34,640
Speaker 1: so that hopefully we could continue the work that she

492
00:31:34,800 --> 00:31:39,840
Speaker 1: was doing. Right Yeah, it seems her whole ideas were

493
00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:42,760
Speaker 1: an idea of the big picture. She didn't see as

494
00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:45,200
Speaker 1: a one little thing. It was we're planting trees. As

495
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:48,240
Speaker 1: we're planting trees, but with these things in mind, whether

496
00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:52,120
Speaker 1: it's to provide economic stability for a group of women,

497
00:31:52,240 --> 00:31:54,920
Speaker 1: a group of people who need that assistance right now,

498
00:31:54,960 --> 00:31:57,360
Speaker 1: but we'll do it through this avenue. She had this

499
00:31:57,520 --> 00:32:00,800
Speaker 1: very thoughtful consciousness of how to get things done in

500
00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:05,120
Speaker 1: a multifacet way, which is phenomenal, especially when you think

501
00:32:05,120 --> 00:32:09,720
Speaker 1: of how little that happens today. There's no real conversation

502
00:32:09,800 --> 00:32:12,920
Speaker 1: of what can we do and put it together as

503
00:32:13,560 --> 00:32:16,240
Speaker 1: a blanket, not necessarily a blanket, but at least an

504
00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:18,880
Speaker 1: overhaul of the whole system. And that's what she did,

505
00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:22,720
Speaker 1: which all on her own, which is phenomenal, especially with

506
00:32:22,760 --> 00:32:25,560
Speaker 1: all of the pushback and seeing okay, you go, you

507
00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:28,480
Speaker 1: aren't seeing the bigger picture. You're just angry because I'm

508
00:32:28,520 --> 00:32:30,560
Speaker 1: making a difference and it could be taken away from you,

509
00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:34,080
Speaker 1: whether it's money or your fame or your credibility. But

510
00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:36,160
Speaker 1: this is what it has to be done. That's phenomenal.

511
00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:39,720
Speaker 1: It's a whole different level of thoughtfulness and a whole

512
00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:43,120
Speaker 1: different level of understanding the need for sustainability and the

513
00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:46,400
Speaker 1: need to for growth and the need to continue beyond. Yeah.

514
00:32:46,560 --> 00:32:49,040
Speaker 1: And I think that to the interesting point about what

515
00:32:49,080 --> 00:32:51,680
Speaker 1: she said of her being having this kind of multi

516
00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:53,880
Speaker 1: facinating way in which she worked is that her vision

517
00:32:53,920 --> 00:33:00,720
Speaker 1: was also very singular, um and focused and like she

518
00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:02,880
Speaker 1: was like I have a goal, Um, I know how

519
00:33:02,880 --> 00:33:04,400
Speaker 1: I can get the thing done, and we're gonna get

520
00:33:04,440 --> 00:33:06,400
Speaker 1: it done, and we're going to get it done together.

521
00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:10,360
Speaker 1: And just the way in which she empowered so many people,

522
00:33:10,440 --> 00:33:12,680
Speaker 1: not in not from a position of like I have

523
00:33:13,000 --> 00:33:14,600
Speaker 1: the things, and I have the knowledge, and I have

524
00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:17,920
Speaker 1: the education, I was fortunate enough to go to you know,

525
00:33:18,400 --> 00:33:22,240
Speaker 1: us to study, you know, under this scholarship that was

526
00:33:22,320 --> 00:33:24,760
Speaker 1: funded by the government or anything like that. It was

527
00:33:24,800 --> 00:33:28,600
Speaker 1: just kind of like, I'm not giving these people these things,

528
00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:31,520
Speaker 1: these opportunities because I'm able to do that because she

529
00:33:31,640 --> 00:33:34,400
Speaker 1: isn't she is using her position of power, obviously, But

530
00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:37,200
Speaker 1: it was in such a way that was community lad

531
00:33:37,560 --> 00:33:39,040
Speaker 1: you know, it was in such a way that was

532
00:33:39,120 --> 00:33:44,200
Speaker 1: about the way that people work together, and just it

533
00:33:44,400 --> 00:33:47,320
Speaker 1: being so inspiring the fact that she realized how important

534
00:33:47,360 --> 00:33:49,360
Speaker 1: it was to incorporate all these other things when it

535
00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:53,320
Speaker 1: came to the leadership development and stuff like that, where

536
00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:57,440
Speaker 1: this wasn't just about a person here they are getting

537
00:33:57,480 --> 00:34:02,000
Speaker 1: this many Kenyan sinse to you know, grow a tree.

538
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:07,480
Speaker 1: It was about growing trees and creating a better environment

539
00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:10,360
Speaker 1: and creating a better world, and within that, creating better

540
00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:14,120
Speaker 1: communities that were able to thrive and not just survive,

541
00:34:14,320 --> 00:34:19,760
Speaker 1: and that were connected and that were you know, uh,

542
00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:23,040
Speaker 1: future focus, but also present focus, where in a way

543
00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:25,160
Speaker 1: they were like, this is my community that I have now,

544
00:34:25,560 --> 00:34:28,239
Speaker 1: and I'm working together with them to really in this

545
00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:31,240
Speaker 1: embodied way where my hands are on the soil and

546
00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:34,400
Speaker 1: I'm really contributing to the future of my community. But

547
00:34:34,520 --> 00:34:38,120
Speaker 1: also I'm thinking about our children that are here right now.

548
00:34:38,680 --> 00:34:40,560
Speaker 1: What kind of food am I feeding them? What do

549
00:34:40,640 --> 00:34:44,239
Speaker 1: our traditional diets look like? But also their future, like

550
00:34:44,320 --> 00:34:46,480
Speaker 1: what will the land look like to them? Will they

551
00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:48,600
Speaker 1: be able to respect their land? The children are learning

552
00:34:48,600 --> 00:34:52,640
Speaker 1: to respect the land at the same time. Um, it's

553
00:34:52,719 --> 00:34:55,759
Speaker 1: I just think, Yeah, everything that she was doing was

554
00:34:56,960 --> 00:35:01,759
Speaker 1: so important, but um, just so struck by how many

555
00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:06,160
Speaker 1: different things but still how tight Like her vision was

556
00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:11,120
Speaker 1: right and that's it was very cohesive, very cohesive. Yeah,

557
00:35:11,160 --> 00:35:16,120
Speaker 1: and that's an amazing balancing act to pull up of. Yeah,

558
00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:18,400
Speaker 1: we need to think about the future generations, but we

559
00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:20,000
Speaker 1: also have to think about the president. Like to be

560
00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:27,799
Speaker 1: able to do both, I mean, that's amazing. Yeah. And

561
00:35:27,840 --> 00:35:30,800
Speaker 1: I also really find so many of these women you

562
00:35:30,880 --> 00:35:34,319
Speaker 1: bring to us ease. I find it so impressive that

563
00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:38,879
Speaker 1: we know as women, at least I can speak from

564
00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:41,480
Speaker 1: my own I always have all these doubts. I have

565
00:35:41,560 --> 00:35:44,359
Speaker 1: all these doubts, and a lot of times it keeps

566
00:35:44,400 --> 00:35:47,239
Speaker 1: me from even putting myself forward for things. And that's

567
00:35:47,280 --> 00:35:48,799
Speaker 1: we know, that's why a lot of women don't run

568
00:35:48,880 --> 00:35:51,120
Speaker 1: for office. And it's not to say that the women

569
00:35:51,800 --> 00:35:54,160
Speaker 1: you've brought to us don't have doubts, but they just

570
00:35:54,280 --> 00:35:57,960
Speaker 1: were like, somebody needs to do this. I can do it.

571
00:35:58,360 --> 00:36:00,719
Speaker 1: I'm going to step up. Well. I mean, you and

572
00:36:00,719 --> 00:36:02,840
Speaker 1: I have talked about the times that we get criticisms,

573
00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:04,959
Speaker 1: and that kind of sometimes shust me down. I can't

574
00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:08,320
Speaker 1: imagine the level of lies and criticisms that were thrown

575
00:36:08,360 --> 00:36:12,560
Speaker 1: at her purposely by the most powerful man in that country,

576
00:36:12,600 --> 00:36:15,200
Speaker 1: in that nation at that point. I mean I could not.

577
00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:17,360
Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't know how it would fathom

578
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:20,160
Speaker 1: or even feel under pressure, but to continue forth and

579
00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:22,960
Speaker 1: still keep fighting and still keep fighting, still being told

580
00:36:23,239 --> 00:36:26,360
Speaker 1: you know, you are whatever damaging by those who have

581
00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:28,719
Speaker 1: the loudest voices, but knowing that she can make a

582
00:36:28,719 --> 00:36:32,440
Speaker 1: difference than what she's doing is like, right, it's amazing,

583
00:36:32,600 --> 00:36:35,560
Speaker 1: and it's to look back on it now you're like, oh, wow,

584
00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:37,439
Speaker 1: that's encouraging. But to be in the middle of that,

585
00:36:37,640 --> 00:36:39,719
Speaker 1: I don't know, you know, it's kind of like, oh,

586
00:36:39,760 --> 00:36:43,200
Speaker 1: the fear of failing is already there. But being told

587
00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:47,640
Speaker 1: you're ruining something or you're being your disaster to something,

588
00:36:48,280 --> 00:36:51,560
Speaker 1: what a way to have to fight against that? How

589
00:36:51,600 --> 00:36:53,520
Speaker 1: do you do that? And how was she able to

590
00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:55,880
Speaker 1: do that? And she did though, and finally got what

591
00:36:55,920 --> 00:36:59,600
Speaker 1: she deserved all the accolades as she did earn. But man,

592
00:37:00,160 --> 00:37:04,280
Speaker 1: that road to get there it had to be a long, long,

593
00:37:04,680 --> 00:37:11,359
Speaker 1: very loud. Yeah. Um, it's impressive and inspiring in a

594
00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:15,160
Speaker 1: good way to start the year. The female first. Um,

595
00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:17,200
Speaker 1: is there anything else you want to have you? I

596
00:37:17,200 --> 00:37:22,080
Speaker 1: don't think so. I would highly recommend the interview on

597
00:37:22,080 --> 00:37:26,879
Speaker 1: on being is very beautiful. Yeah, and just anything where

598
00:37:26,920 --> 00:37:32,680
Speaker 1: she's speaking, Yes, highly recommend if you're looking for some

599
00:37:32,680 --> 00:37:37,719
Speaker 1: some inspiration and like a newfound appreciation of trees. Oh

600
00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:41,120
Speaker 1: my gosh. Right, we are also in a city of trees,

601
00:37:41,200 --> 00:37:44,560
Speaker 1: so we are. It's a big if speaking of things

602
00:37:44,600 --> 00:37:47,680
Speaker 1: being topical. Uh. That is a topic of conversation in

603
00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:50,480
Speaker 1: Atlanta where we are right now, which is that we've

604
00:37:50,960 --> 00:37:54,799
Speaker 1: historically been called the city of like the city in

605
00:37:54,840 --> 00:37:57,160
Speaker 1: the forest, and we are known for having a ton

606
00:37:57,239 --> 00:38:00,680
Speaker 1: of trees, which we're not the biggest metropolis in the

607
00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:03,360
Speaker 1: United States and definitely not in the world, but for

608
00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:06,799
Speaker 1: being a city of our solize and stature. We like

609
00:38:06,880 --> 00:38:09,719
Speaker 1: have a lot of forest and a lot of tree

610
00:38:09,719 --> 00:38:12,959
Speaker 1: canopy here, but a lot of that is also being

611
00:38:13,040 --> 00:38:18,240
Speaker 1: raised for private development and gentrification, which are huge things

612
00:38:18,280 --> 00:38:22,279
Speaker 1: that are happening right now in Atlanta. So on a

613
00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:26,600
Speaker 1: micro level, from this macro conversation we're having, all of

614
00:38:26,600 --> 00:38:28,920
Speaker 1: her work is very relevant to things that are happening

615
00:38:28,920 --> 00:38:33,360
Speaker 1: here in metro Atlanta. Absolutely, that's one of my favorite

616
00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:38,959
Speaker 1: parts about Atlanta. So we will continue to see where

617
00:38:39,000 --> 00:38:43,719
Speaker 1: that goes. We have some more to talk about, but

618
00:38:43,840 --> 00:38:46,400
Speaker 1: first we have one more quick break for word from

619
00:38:46,400 --> 00:39:04,000
Speaker 1: our sponsor, and we're back. Thank you sponsor. But in

620
00:39:04,040 --> 00:39:07,680
Speaker 1: the meantime, thank you so much Eaves for for coming

621
00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:10,439
Speaker 1: on as always, thank you for having me. Where can

622
00:39:10,719 --> 00:39:14,320
Speaker 1: the listeners find you on social media? On that is

623
00:39:14,360 --> 00:39:19,080
Speaker 1: on Facebook, Instagram or Twitter. Um, I'm on this same

624
00:39:19,200 --> 00:39:22,200
Speaker 1: History Class, which is a different podcast that was about

625
00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:26,560
Speaker 1: days in history. Um. You can also find me at

626
00:39:26,600 --> 00:39:31,800
Speaker 1: Unpopular on all those same social media platforms. H Yeah,

627
00:39:32,360 --> 00:39:35,480
Speaker 1: our Eaves, Jeff Goo is my name, and do whatever

628
00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:41,000
Speaker 1: you want to do with that information kind of things.

629
00:39:42,360 --> 00:39:47,279
Speaker 1: Good point, but yeah, listeners, you should definitely go check

630
00:39:47,360 --> 00:39:51,120
Speaker 1: both of those out there. Amazing and if you would

631
00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:55,720
Speaker 1: like to contact us you can, yes, um our email

632
00:39:55,840 --> 00:39:58,399
Speaker 1: is stuff Media Mom stuff at iHeart Media dot com.

633
00:39:58,440 --> 00:40:00,720
Speaker 1: You can find us on Twitter at mom Stuff Podcast

634
00:40:00,880 --> 00:40:03,400
Speaker 1: or on Instagram at Stuff I've Never Told You. Thanks

635
00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:07,560
Speaker 1: as always to our super producer Andrew Howard, and thanks

636
00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:10,120
Speaker 1: to you for listening Stuff I've Never Told You. The

637
00:40:10,160 --> 00:40:12,440
Speaker 1: production of I Higher Radios How Stuff works for more

638
00:40:12,440 --> 00:40:15,240
Speaker 1: podcasts from Higher Radio is a Higher Radio app, Apple Podcast,

639
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