Speaker 1: Welcome to this League Uncut in the rule of.
Speaker 2: Twenty four hour NBA News. This is you, Chris Haynes.
Speaker 1: It's time, works time, it's so time. This League uncut
Speaker 1: is underway and on fire. This should be a good one.
Speaker 2: Hey, everyone, welcome in to a very.
Speaker 3: Special pre finals edition of this League Uncut. Chris Haynes
Speaker 3: is on the move, so I'm here, but not solo.
Speaker 3: This is an absolute treat for me, a treat and
Speaker 3: an honor to be joined by truly one of the
Speaker 3: best who has ever done it in our business and
Speaker 3: knows more about the Celtics, the favorites in these NBA
Speaker 3: Finals than anyone I've encountered on press row. I think
Speaker 3: the last time we actually covered something together was at
Speaker 3: the Rio Olympic in twenty sixteen.
Speaker 2: But I am thrilled to be able.
Speaker 3: To connect with him now, the one and only Bob
Speaker 3: Ryan from the Boston Globe. Mister Ryan, an absolute pleasure,
Speaker 3: sir to have you on well.
Speaker 4: Thank you for the flattering introduction.
Speaker 3: And these finals it's so much about the Celtics, obviously.
Speaker 3: I live in Dallas, I'm based in Dallas. I talk
Speaker 3: Mavericks all day. I wanted to get the.
Speaker 2: Full on Boston perspective.
Speaker 3: So just from your seat, I mean, you've seen this
Speaker 3: team and I don't know how many of their twenty
Speaker 3: three finals appearances. Close to all of them, I'm sure,
Speaker 3: but this team in particular, facing so much championship or
Speaker 3: bus talk.
Speaker 2: How do you think they're going to deal with that pressure?
Speaker 5: Well, for the record, my first one I actually went
Speaker 5: to in person was sixty six Red Aurbacks last game,
Speaker 5: Game seven against the Lakers. That's a story in itself,
Speaker 5: and how we got the tickets. Anyway, there is one
Speaker 5: very simple fact, and my opinion their co equal about
Speaker 5: this finals. When the tournament, as Bill Parcells would call
Speaker 5: it started, there were sixteen teams. Fifteen of them. We're
Speaker 5: playing with house money.
Speaker 4: From day one.
Speaker 5: One had the weight of the world on its shoulders.
Speaker 5: That one is the Boston Celtics. This is win or
Speaker 5: bust for them. It's you know what or get off
Speaker 5: the pot for them. And because they have knocked on
Speaker 5: the door now with this or pair for several years
Speaker 5: and they don't have they haven't closed the deal, and
Speaker 5: here they are with really no excuses except what can
Speaker 5: not condition what porzingis will be in having missed thirty
Speaker 5: seven days since he's last played, so.
Speaker 4: We don't know how good he's going to be.
Speaker 5: But they now have their team intact for the first
Speaker 5: time since period one of the first game, and they
Speaker 5: have no excuses.
Speaker 4: They got to win. That's that's their perspective, So that's
Speaker 4: that's it.
Speaker 3: They really haven't been tested because of course the East
Speaker 3: has been absolutely racked by injuries. But my sense is
Speaker 3: they're not going to apologize for that because they have
Speaker 3: this enormous pression. You're going to take a berth in
Speaker 3: the finals anyway it comes. But I really am curious now,
Speaker 3: just as overwhelming favorites, how they are going to cope,
Speaker 3: not only with expectations but obviously the challenges that Doncic
Speaker 3: and Irving present to a defense.
Speaker 5: When when the playoffs started, our number one question with
Speaker 5: the Celtics was how would they fare with score tied
Speaker 5: and two minutes to go against a good team because
Speaker 5: they had just romped through the league and including winning
Speaker 5: three games by fifty points. I said five oho not
Speaker 5: and it's no one that's ever done. And they were
Speaker 5: a little suspect. They lost two games to Denver unless
Speaker 5: minute or so during the season which which gave you know,
Speaker 5: people so well. See Denver knows how to do it
Speaker 5: and they don't yet. Okay, so there's an open question.
Speaker 5: They haven't fosd the deal.
Speaker 4: You're right.
Speaker 5: They they were lucky in that they played Miami without Butler,
Speaker 5: and they played Cleveland without with Mitchell hurt and then
Speaker 5: Haliburton got hurt. So in each series there was somebody missing.
Speaker 5: Now in Cleveland's case, Garland stepped up and made great
Speaker 5: against them. Andy and I got some contributions for people
Speaker 5: as well, Siakam, et cetera. Anyway, they haven't been tested fully,
Speaker 5: but they've done without their Keith component. And that's Forzingis now,
Speaker 5: as far as Dawis is concerned. From our perspective here
Speaker 5: outsiders watching the West in the second half of the season,
Speaker 5: we're focused on the battle at the top with those
Speaker 5: three teams who went up in a tie, as it
Speaker 5: turned out, not to mention the plight of the Warriors,
Speaker 5: the plight of the Suns, and the plight of the Lakers.
Speaker 5: Nobody's paying attention to DAWs at all outside of Dallas.
Speaker 5: And there they go, and they went sixteen on eighteen
Speaker 5: in that run. And then they lose their last two.
Speaker 5: I don't know what happened there, but but but they
Speaker 5: end up great. But off the radar screen completely, no
Speaker 5: one's talking about them. Their fifth seed, right, it was
Speaker 5: about Minnesota case and you know, and Denver, so they had.
Speaker 5: They don't have outside pressure at all, you know, I
Speaker 5: don't know what internal pressure they've created for themselves. They
Speaker 5: deserve to be here. They won fair and square. They
Speaker 5: beat these teams, and those two guys, the two stars,
Speaker 5: the super are playing as well as they can play.
Speaker 5: Irving it's a you know, Irving is coach is a
Speaker 5: juicy subplot, you know, because of the return to Boston
Speaker 5: and all that nonsense. But they've earned it and Nico
Speaker 5: Harrison got a just reward yesterday and then Jason Kidd's
Speaker 5: reputation is being polished up now as a coach.
Speaker 4: And it's all good with Dallas.
Speaker 5: They lose, won't they won't be happy, But the rest
Speaker 5: there's no disgrace involved unless they get swept or something
Speaker 5: not just like that, which I don't think is going
Speaker 5: to happen.
Speaker 3: Yeah, for me, it's really a second half surge kind
Speaker 3: I don't know that we've ever seen anything like it.
Speaker 3: And we always talk about how rare it is to
Speaker 3: make a trade and then win it all. Obviously the
Speaker 3: Clyde Drexler to Houston in ninety five, but the Rockets
Speaker 3: were defending Champs.
Speaker 2: Rashid Wallace to Detroit, No, the one I.
Speaker 5: Always think of. They don't win without him, and that
Speaker 5: was a crucial Yeah.
Speaker 2: And then Marc Gasol to Toronto in twenty nineteen.
Speaker 3: But like for this to come together, the MAVs made
Speaker 3: two trades for it to come together this quickly, the
Speaker 3: sixteen and two run you reference. I mean they were
Speaker 3: twenty eight and twenty three on the morning of the
Speaker 3: trade deadline. You're right, nobody saw any of this coming.
Speaker 3: But of course, now with Kyrie going back to Boston,
Speaker 3: how vitriolic do you think it's going to be? I mean,
Speaker 3: that's one of the questions everybody's asking in the build
Speaker 3: up to Game one.
Speaker 5: I don't think it's going to be as bad as
Speaker 5: the outside will thinks will be. They'll be booze, there's
Speaker 5: no question, I don't think. I don't think they'd be
Speaker 5: throwing tomatoes at him or anything else. There was a
Speaker 5: nice story in the Boston Globe today talking about how
Speaker 5: he's been so well received in Dallas, and he's saying
Speaker 5: kind of the right things, if you will kind of
Speaker 5: explain away a little bit about way he was here
Speaker 5: and what he wasn't said. They were outside circumstances. There
Speaker 5: was a like a death in the family, and there
Speaker 5: was other outside issues that were bothering him. On top
Speaker 5: of whatever basketball is. Shoes still were and that was
Speaker 5: five years ago. Now it's five years ago, So come on,
Speaker 5: A lot lots happened. He's thirty one years old. At
Speaker 5: thirty two, whatever he is, you know, he may have
Speaker 5: abandoned some of his conspiracy theories and he seems to
Speaker 5: be in the best place that he's ever been as
Speaker 5: a professional in his head. You know, he never explained
Speaker 5: why he left Cleveland. That was impetuous and stupid and
Speaker 5: youthful indiscretion. Never explained it. For we knew he wanted
Speaker 5: his own show, but he wouldn't say it. And when
Speaker 5: he was here, I'll tell you I said three things
Speaker 5: about him when he was here. One he's not as
Speaker 5: smart as he thinks he is. Two, this won't be
Speaker 5: his last stop a boy? Was that correct? Three he's
Speaker 5: searching for something in life, but he doesn't know what
Speaker 5: it is. Well, I'm starting to think he may finally
Speaker 5: have found it and got more power to him. Fine, now,
Speaker 5: there's never been a question about his talent, this offensive
Speaker 5: talent he goes to. He's a skill to guard at
Speaker 5: his position as we've ever seen. The Mavericks are getting
Speaker 5: the full benefit of you, of that blossoming if you will,
Speaker 5: So you know, I don't wish him any of your will.
Speaker 4: He seems to be a happy, happier guy and good.
Speaker 5: But yeah, there'll be some the action, but I don't
Speaker 5: think it's going to be the story.
Speaker 3: You reference the nineteen sixty six finals being the first
Speaker 3: you attended. I'm gonna guess that was still as a
Speaker 3: young fan and not already.
Speaker 5: Oh no, I was a junior Boston College. And here's
Speaker 5: the story. They win Game six in LA and tickets
Speaker 5: go on sale for Game seven. In those days, they
Speaker 5: weren't selling out.
Speaker 4: Automatically every night, even in the playoffs.
Speaker 5: They would always get there and you could buy four
Speaker 5: tickets per person, and we sent one of our guys
Speaker 5: in the dorm down to sleep overnight at.
Speaker 4: The Boston Garden with you to how you did it.
Speaker 4: That's how you got tickets.
Speaker 5: You slept overnight in the lobby and you got tickets,
Speaker 5: and so he would get one set of those tickets
Speaker 5: and the other three tickets were a lottery, and I
Speaker 5: won one of the lottery, you know, the dorm lottery
Speaker 5: to get that ticket, which is how I got the
Speaker 5: red hour backs last game.
Speaker 4: So that's how it was.
Speaker 3: How do you plan to consume these finals? Do you
Speaker 3: still go to the home games? Or you just take
Speaker 3: it all in at home?
Speaker 5: That graciously granted me a credential because I retired officially
Speaker 5: at twenty twelve. I haven't covered anything since twenty twelve,
Speaker 5: but I still do podcasts.
Speaker 4: I do stuff.
Speaker 5: I write Sunday every other Sunday anyway, So I'm planning
Speaker 5: on being in present and accounted for on Thursday night
Speaker 5: at the Boston Garden.
Speaker 3: Yes, given your scene it all status, and again I
Speaker 3: mean you you know, I'm not sure how many of
Speaker 3: the listeners, but you know I've certainly studied it to agree.
Speaker 2: I'm sure there's a lot I don't know.
Speaker 3: But of course I got to work for Dave Smith
Speaker 3: in Dallas, and I know he was your former sports
Speaker 3: editor with the Globe, and the way I've always understood
Speaker 3: the stories that the two of you, in essence basically
Speaker 3: created the Sunday Notes page that I love so much.
Speaker 3: When you were still a Celtics beat writer.
Speaker 5: Dave took the boss of BILP sports section and turned
Speaker 5: it into a piece of journalistic art, if you will,
Speaker 5: and emphasis heavily on the notes. I first met my
Speaker 5: first notes column in the summer in nineteen seventy, after
Speaker 5: my first year on.
Speaker 4: The beat in sixty nine to seventy.
Speaker 5: The person who set the bar raised the bar for
Speaker 5: the notes columns was Peter Gammons with baseball period. Peter's
Speaker 5: baseball notes columns were unsurpassed, and I did my very best,
Speaker 5: and we were friends from day one. We started the
Speaker 5: Globe the same day June ten, nineteen sixty eight, this
Speaker 5: summer interns and which used to have an anniversary coming
Speaker 5: up next Monday. But anyway, I did my best to
Speaker 5: match Peter Gammons's expertise in baseball with my basketball. But
Speaker 5: Dave was a tremendous sports editor for the Globe. At
Speaker 5: that point, it was just a Sunday sports editor. He
Speaker 5: later became the sports editor. That Sunday sports page was
Speaker 5: his baby. At the time, and he turned it as
Speaker 5: something that really has never been equaled, frankly.
Speaker 4: In American sports journalism, not the way it was at
Speaker 4: the Globe in those days.
Speaker 3: I still try to do Sunday notes, but it just
Speaker 3: doesn't look quite as pretty on a computer screen as
Speaker 3: it does when it when you have a whole page
Speaker 3: of NBA notes, That one full broadsheet newspaper page with
Speaker 3: nothing but NBA on it is.
Speaker 5: You know, we had in our peak, of course, in
Speaker 5: addition to the four major sports golf, tennis, we had
Speaker 5: the great Bud Collins, the greatest American tennis writer or
Speaker 5: whoever lived Bud Collins writing. We had Jokin Caannon who
Speaker 5: wrote road racing when that was you know, in the
Speaker 5: aftermath the Bill Rogers winning the Marathon at seventy six
Speaker 5: and set off a road racing craze around here. So
Speaker 5: in college college notes as well, all these notes are
Speaker 5: you know, is uh. At the same time those days
Speaker 5: are gone, the big four are still around. You know
Speaker 5: that we still have our notes on football, basketball, hockey,
Speaker 5: and baseball, but but we don't have the notes the
Speaker 5: way we used to have all the others.
Speaker 4: That was that was the golden era, the old the
Speaker 4: eighties were the golden era for a lot.
Speaker 5: Of things, and and and and the NBA particularly and
Speaker 5: certainly journalism.
Speaker 4: It was.
Speaker 3: So Having covered the league for as long as you have,
Speaker 3: I'd love to hear your thoughts on Dancic.
Speaker 2: What strikes you about his game, what you like, what
Speaker 2: you don't like?
Speaker 3: Give me just your view of There's only one don't
Speaker 3: you make of donches to this point, there's only.
Speaker 5: One don't like, and it's what everybody knows. You know,
Speaker 5: stop complaining. You know, the whining thing is, it's tedious,
Speaker 5: it's old. Now you you've been around to stop it,
Speaker 5: you know, come on, just play now. Everything else he's extraordinary,
Speaker 5: and the shot making, the court vision that the remarkable.
Speaker 4: Way that he goes about at his pace.
Speaker 5: I'm going to use a reference that probably will be
Speaker 5: over the head of too many of the younger people.
Speaker 5: He doesn't go at seventy eight, he doesn't go at
Speaker 5: forty five. He goes at thirty three and at third rpm,
Speaker 5: and no one disrupts him. He does his piece, that's
Speaker 5: his pace, and no one can bother him. He goes
Speaker 5: wherever he wants to go, and nobody stops him. He's
Speaker 5: a pleasure to watch. It's all there's to it. And
Speaker 5: then the shot making, I mean obviously is extraordinary. You know,
Speaker 5: he's just he's great, and he and djokitch of you know,
Speaker 5: you have to stink of them in the same vein that.
Speaker 4: Really and they are.
Speaker 5: They're remarkable and you know, the world's ucky to the
Speaker 5: best bowl, world's lucky to have him.
Speaker 3: I mean all season long, when I've talked about the Celtics,
Speaker 3: I mean, look, their regular season resume is ridiculous.
Speaker 2: It's one of the best we've ever seen.
Speaker 3: Okay, they didn't make a run at seventy two or
Speaker 3: seventy three wins, but apart from that, their regular season
Speaker 3: resume has everything. But I have to admit from Afar
Speaker 3: from fifteen hundred miles away, and I haven't seen them
Speaker 3: as much as you, but I still don't fully trust them.
Speaker 3: Maybe it is the crunch time failings that you stick
Speaker 3: with me, but like I haven't fully shaken the skepticism.
Speaker 3: And this is the series that they're going to have
Speaker 3: to do it and can do it once and for all.
Speaker 3: But Tatum and Brown as a duo, just where do
Speaker 3: they kind of fall in terms of the Celtics pantheon
Speaker 3: and how they're viewed locally.
Speaker 5: Well, one of the problems when you come along in
Speaker 5: Boston is that you're now bucking the history.
Speaker 4: You're now being thrusted into the history.
Speaker 5: Of course, we've had some duos, of course, starting out
Speaker 5: with Kuzi and Russell, and later Cowans and Hablet check
Speaker 5: shall we say, and of course Bird and the Kale.
Speaker 4: But Parish makes.
Speaker 5: Three, you know, yeah, and now the latest one of
Speaker 5: course when the championship was Garnett and Pierson down grenad
Speaker 5: and Pierce.
Speaker 4: They're making their mark there.
Speaker 5: They needed they need a ring that fully enter into
Speaker 5: the discussion. But both you know, but the Tatum, particularly
Speaker 5: his hors historical ranking. You know, we've got you know,
Speaker 5: our Rushmore all Time five kind of thing going, and
Speaker 5: and he's knocking on the door to get included in
Speaker 5: that all time five thing.
Speaker 4: It's no doubt.
Speaker 5: Uh, they're they're not the same player, They're different, you know,
Speaker 5: he and Brown. I think they've become very complamentary. That's
Speaker 5: what a E as well as I. And it's it's
Speaker 5: a power. It's a formidable duo. And they can go
Speaker 5: out and get you sixty and they've done it. You know,
Speaker 5: more than one stif each had thirty point games. Tatum
Speaker 5: has made himself into a pretty damn good defender. Brown
Speaker 5: originally that was his calling card, and he's back playing
Speaker 5: the way he used he once played defense. Uh, the
Speaker 5: big problem with Brown has been ball handling and turnovers
Speaker 5: and bad judgment and drimming into crowds.
Speaker 4: And he doesn't go to his left particularly well even now.
Speaker 4: But boy does he go to his right strong. And
Speaker 4: he's a great finisher and his three point shooting has
Speaker 4: gotten better in the current NBA.
Speaker 5: They're in the discussion is the best duo and sixty
Speaker 5: four wins is certainly a testament to that. And you're right,
Speaker 5: your skepticism is warranted. That's still the story here until
Speaker 5: they do it. You know, the people are not fully
Speaker 5: buying into their any historical greatness or anything like that
Speaker 5: until they win a championship. Until they and you have
Speaker 5: to figure somewhere along the way, you're going to have
Speaker 5: to do it in the finals by winning a close game.
Speaker 4: You're not going to win four games by twenty.
Speaker 5: That final exam. It's a final exam, and we'll see
Speaker 5: how they they pass.
Speaker 4: It's past fail.
Speaker 3: Well, every guy in this team can shoot the three ball,
Speaker 3: and that's something Dallas hasn't seen. Oklahoma City and Minnesota,
Speaker 3: their last two playoff opponents, definitely had limitations when it
Speaker 3: came to stretching the floor, and Dallas exploited that this
Speaker 3: is going to be a completely different situation.
Speaker 2: But just I think I know the answer.
Speaker 3: But I want to ask you a team that shoots
Speaker 3: from deep as much as these Celtics, what is that
Speaker 3: viewing experience like for you?
Speaker 5: You're talking to someone who is who believes that the
Speaker 5: three point shot is the worst thing that happen in
Speaker 5: basketball in my lifetime, and it has distorted the game
Speaker 5: at every level and now is unfortunately, it's become the
Speaker 5: currency of the game. So you know, it's a live
Speaker 5: by it, die by it circumstance some nights. And this
Speaker 5: is why I get so frustrated. And this is where
Speaker 5: Perzingis now can fit in in a way that they
Speaker 5: have not had in the past. They've got an option
Speaker 5: now than a seven foot three guy who actually does
Speaker 5: know his way around basket as well as being able
Speaker 5: to shoot the three. But he gives you an option
Speaker 5: that you don't have to rank up another three.
Speaker 4: It worries me.
Speaker 5: I mean, you know there are highly dependent on it
Speaker 5: and yet are good at it. They had a game
Speaker 5: this year which all starting five at at least three each,
Speaker 5: and to come off the bench with two three point
Speaker 5: shooters Richard and Hauser. Now, Sam Hauser has been in
Speaker 5: a slump. He had a very good year, but he's
Speaker 5: had a bad he's had a bad playoffs so far
Speaker 5: shooting and well the time off, you know, has he
Speaker 5: been able to get a shot back in this ten days?
Speaker 5: It'll be between their last game and Thursday night. But
Speaker 5: right A Horford shoots threes. They all shoot threes, You're right,
Speaker 5: and back where both of them do, White and Holiday
Speaker 5: and of course Tatum and Brown. Yeah, it's the three shot.
Speaker 5: Point shots are everywhere. But that's the tricky thing for
Speaker 5: any team that is it. Do you will you accept
Speaker 5: oh it's not our knight and go try to win
Speaker 5: another way? You know that that's been a question here.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then Porzingis.
Speaker 3: And when Porzingis was in Dallas, I was amazed, obviously
Speaker 3: having covered pretty much every dribble of Novitzky's career, and
Speaker 3: you know, he really is the one who to me,
Speaker 3: revolutionized the game. In terms of making it acceptable and
Speaker 3: even desired for the seven foot or to step out
Speaker 3: and shoot the three.
Speaker 2: But porzingis I mean he range. He shoots it with such.
Speaker 3: Ease, five seven, ten feet farther away than the line sometimes,
Speaker 3: I mean he just makes it look so easy.
Speaker 5: He shoots it from Caitlyn Clarkland, which we used to
Speaker 5: call curry Land but now it's Clarkland. My mouth drops
Speaker 5: open sometimes when I say I'm going he's not going
Speaker 5: to it? Yeah he is, He's got I'm serious. Yeah,
Speaker 5: you're absolutely right, that is at seven to three. That
Speaker 5: the range of factor is not just his foot's on
Speaker 5: the line. Boy, I know you're right, he's three and
Speaker 5: four feet behind that line.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's it's a phenomenon.
Speaker 5: It's it's the new world, you know. And look at
Speaker 5: when Beyana. You know he's going to he's the next one.
Speaker 5: He shoots them from from down there. And I'll tell
Speaker 5: you he had a tremendous year. And right from the
Speaker 5: beginning he was impactful, and he was impactful in defense
Speaker 5: as well. And he passes better than I had no
Speaker 5: idea whether he's had any court vision.
Speaker 4: At all, Well, he does. And he had a really
Speaker 4: outstanding year.
Speaker 5: But the number one thing has been, you know, keep
Speaker 5: him on the floor. It's always been the case, and
Speaker 5: and they weren't able to do it so far in
Speaker 5: the playoffs. And now here he is and we'll see
Speaker 5: how far he goes.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, his playoff resume is so limited as
Speaker 2: it is.
Speaker 3: And now, like you said, you know, he's missed nearly
Speaker 3: forty days and has to come back and play a
Speaker 3: key role in the series. I mean, it's as much
Speaker 3: a key variable as anything in this series.
Speaker 5: But a good thing about having him back against this
Speaker 5: team is with those two young aerial artists centers there,
Speaker 5: Gafford and Lively, you know, we know the nature of
Speaker 5: their game, we know how they play, we know the
Speaker 5: things that they bring to the table for Dallas and
Speaker 5: absent him, they're not too big. But with him and there,
Speaker 5: you know, there's a possible you know, antidote to the
Speaker 5: antics of Messrs Gafford and Lively.
Speaker 4: But I mean, I think Lively is going to be
Speaker 4: a really good player.
Speaker 2: Now that's going to turn out he's the god's end
Speaker 2: of their So.
Speaker 4: That's going to turn out to be a hell of
Speaker 4: a pick. And you know, I mean Gafford is that
Speaker 4: think he does what he does.
Speaker 5: He's not going to bro out in this game, but lively,
Speaker 5: I think he really got something nice there.
Speaker 3: Well, as you mentioned, you're still writing every other Sunday
Speaker 3: in the Globe and you remain must read to this day.
Speaker 3: And I wanted to ask you because I know you
Speaker 3: wrote a piece about Bill Walton, someone we both dearly
Speaker 3: loved being around. I know you got to cover him.
Speaker 3: I didn't get to cover him as a player. I
Speaker 3: only got to know him in his broadcasting incarnation. But
Speaker 3: I would love to hear a reflection or two just
Speaker 3: about Bill, because I think he's just one of the truly,
Speaker 3: truly unique and enduring characters that this league has ever seen.
Speaker 4: Yeah, there was nobody like him.
Speaker 5: He occupied a specific niche first of all, as a player,
Speaker 5: he was a human clinic as a five man, all
Speaker 5: that nobody occupies today because the center position has been
Speaker 5: devalued and changed. But in the old days, when we
Speaker 5: played real basketball, before the three point hostile takeover of
Speaker 5: the sport, you know, this guy showed you how to
Speaker 5: play a position as well as anyone who's ever played it.
Speaker 5: Health was his issue, of course, and you know in
Speaker 5: fourteen seasons. He missed three full seasons and his final
Speaker 5: season only played ten games because of injury. So his
Speaker 5: career doesn't stack up the way with the great players, but.
Speaker 4: His short term does, and at his best.
Speaker 5: He was as good as has ever been at both
Speaker 5: ends of the floor, bust, rebounding, and of course the
Speaker 5: best passing center until Jokich now who is challenging him
Speaker 5: for that historical honor and no one else. Those are
Speaker 5: the two, So let's stop the discussion right there. So
Speaker 5: it's either one of those two or the best passing
Speaker 5: center ever. As a guy, Bill was just the most enthusiastic.
Speaker 5: He was enthusiastic about everything. When he got into something,
Speaker 5: you get into something, you know. You could start with
Speaker 5: the grateful dead thing, you know. I mean that is
Speaker 5: well documented. I have been to his house to see
Speaker 5: the collection of grateful dead instrument that he has in
Speaker 5: his first floor of his house, among many other incredible
Speaker 5: collection of things he has in this he had in
Speaker 5: his house. But the dead thing was when he got
Speaker 5: into them. He got into them, you know, and you
Speaker 5: know we all know that. But he was just an
Speaker 5: enthusiastic person. And this is from a guy you know,
Speaker 5: and you know everyone who knows him.
Speaker 4: Though.
Speaker 5: He was famous for ending communications and ending phone conversations
Speaker 5: by saying, I'm the luckiest.
Speaker 4: Man in the world.
Speaker 5: This is a guy who at one point had such
Speaker 5: debilitating back pain that he considered suicide. And at one point,
Speaker 5: this goes back about twenty some years ago before he
Speaker 5: finally got picked up and got some fusion and got
Speaker 5: his back straightened out to a where he could refunction.
Speaker 4: But that this is a guy. So here's a guy
Speaker 4: who had a near.
Speaker 5: Death experience who's telling us he's the luckiest man in
Speaker 5: the world, and he believed it.
Speaker 4: There's no replacing Bill Walton. He was especially even.
Speaker 2: Being Yeah, no question, I mean I got to know him.
Speaker 3: I was My first job covering the league was as
Speaker 3: a Clippers beat writer. He was a Clippers announcer, and
Speaker 3: very soon into my beat writing life, he would call
Speaker 3: me and ask me for reflections, information, rumblings, and I'm
Speaker 3: sitting there thinking every time, I was so what can
Speaker 3: I tell Bill Walton in the basketball He made you
Speaker 3: feel like the most important person.
Speaker 5: He gues and so many people, I mean the breadth
Speaker 5: of reaction, you know, the people, so many people that
Speaker 5: he would make feel where you're, you know, your best
Speaker 5: if not your best friend, you're in their inner.
Speaker 4: Circle, you know. I mean, he God knows how many
Speaker 4: hundreds of people with that that came away with that
Speaker 4: takeaway from him.
Speaker 3: Last thing before I let you go here, there's about
Speaker 3: twenty five more things I want to ask you about.
Speaker 2: But I did want to ask about this.
Speaker 3: One because I heard you tell this story once and
Speaker 3: I just I had to ask about it again.
Speaker 2: I think it was the seventy six finals.
Speaker 3: You said you covered it and Paul Westfall by that
Speaker 3: point was a son now and just covering that finals
Speaker 3: after covering him previously. Just if you could walk me
Speaker 3: through the seventy six finals.
Speaker 5: The whole thing was that at that point Tommy Heinsen
Speaker 5: and I were having a bit of a of a
Speaker 5: journal of a professional falling out, shall we say, And
Speaker 5: after the first game of the series, I wrote a
Speaker 5: column and he came in and was fuming about the
Speaker 5: column and saying that I that people could get their
Speaker 5: game plan by buying the paper and it was not
Speaker 5: not so It's ridiculous.
Speaker 4: He was.
Speaker 5: He just was over the top of it. So when
Speaker 5: we got the Phoenix for games three, and four. Rather
Speaker 5: than the state at the hotel with everybody else, I
Speaker 5: stayed at west falls house and we went back for
Speaker 5: a game six.
Speaker 4: I stayed at west Fall's house.
Speaker 5: So this has got to be the first and only
Speaker 5: time that the primary journalistic, uh you know, person of
Speaker 5: covering a team stayed at the home of the best
Speaker 5: player of the other team. And but I gotta tell
Speaker 5: you quick my favorite anecdote that comes out of that.
Speaker 4: So Paul had a pool.
Speaker 5: Swimming pool, and of course we we have a time
Speaker 5: difference in my you know, I have that right quickly
Speaker 5: to get back to Boston.
Speaker 4: So I'd be done writing about three or four o'clock
Speaker 4: in the afternoon.
Speaker 5: At Phoenix time, and I'd go to the pool with
Speaker 5: Paul and his neighbor, Alvin Adams lived down the street,
Speaker 5: and somebody else came. And there was another guy who
Speaker 5: would come and he had nowhere else to go, something
Speaker 5: to do, hung out at the pool. And he was
Speaker 5: the guy who was the thirteenth man on the twelve
Speaker 5: man roster. He was the son who got left out,
Speaker 5: some guy named Riley. So yeah, thattt Riley was just
Speaker 5: very happy to have a chance to hang out of
Speaker 5: Paul west Fall's pool too, So it was a very
Speaker 5: social series.
Speaker 4: But that's what I say now.
Speaker 5: The longest and the short of it is that I
Speaker 5: got off the beat that year and I didn't have
Speaker 5: to be around Tom Heinsen for but we we vounded
Speaker 5: each other at a testimonial dinner for his old roommate,
Speaker 5: Jim Blusketof, and I was there and he was there,
Speaker 5: and I want to him with the bar and I said, well,
Speaker 5: it's spoiled your evening if I say hello.
Speaker 4: And he said now.
Speaker 5: And that was the beginning of forty two years of
Speaker 5: we were friends, no problem.
Speaker 4: It was over. No longer the day to day and
Speaker 4: it was over.
Speaker 5: So with all that all came out of the seventy six,
Speaker 5: the seventy six series against Phoenix.
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm trying to picture it.
Speaker 3: I've now heard you tell the story twice, but I
Speaker 3: still can't really imagine hanging out with Westy and Ryles
Speaker 3: like that during the finals.
Speaker 5: But Riles, Yeah, Ryles, that was he was, you know,
Speaker 5: he was the guy left off the roster and yeah
Speaker 5: he got you know, his path to becoming pat Riley
Speaker 5: and he worked a carpenter or something at one point
Speaker 5: and then of course he was chick. He then became
Speaker 5: Chick Hern's you know guy, his color man, not the
Speaker 5: chick ever needed one or made much use of one.
Speaker 5: And then eventually he was assistant coach and West had
Speaker 5: got fired and he got the job, and and and
Speaker 5: the rest is, they say, is great NBA history. Pat
Speaker 5: Riley becomes the great.
Speaker 3: Guru, another one of a kind of personality in this league,
Speaker 3: as are you, sir, and I am so grateful that
Speaker 3: we were able to connect and do this. I won't
Speaker 3: be at Game one or Game two, but I hope
Speaker 3: I make it to five or seven so I can
Speaker 3: see you in person, shake your hand and thank you
Speaker 3: for doing this. Fantastic to get your perspective on these Celtics.
Speaker 4: Entirely welcome.
Speaker 2: There he goes the Hall of Famer Bob Ryan.
Speaker 3: That will do it for this edition of This League, Uncut.
Speaker 2: Chris and I will.
Speaker 3: Be back together again very soon for another episode. As always,
Speaker 3: please follow rate review the show, stay tuned.
Speaker 2: We'll do it again very very soon.
Speaker 1: And that'll do it for us. See you next time.
Speaker 2: This League uncutage and iHeartRadio production.
Speaker 1: Chris Hanes and Mark Stein
Speaker 4: Defict