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Speaker 1: they changed the formula and it did not go over
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Speaker 1: cool Rush for yourself. Well, we got a stinker in
Speaker 1: Game seven at Okay see which I kind of had
Speaker 1: a vibe. In fact, I'm surprised it went seven Gordon's injury.
Speaker 1: Even in the winning games, I felt like Jokich was
Speaker 1: just running out of gas. Jamal Murray provided very little.
Speaker 1: Jason timp hoops and yeah, I felt like, you know,
Speaker 1: they played their ass off early. But you know, from
Speaker 1: Caruso on Jokic to Murray's absence, I mean, Cason Wallace
Speaker 1: is hitting the shot just like Okay, it's not going
Speaker 1: to be their day. I think I will say this.
Speaker 1: I mean, Oklahoma's today was favored. I think we both
Speaker 1: liked him. I thought it would be a really good series.
Speaker 1: It was. I do think you kind of have to
Speaker 1: sort of I mean, Christian Brown played a lot better.
Speaker 1: I think you do have to examine Jamal Murray. I
Speaker 1: just think in too many big games, he has injuries
Speaker 1: in too many big games. Jason, I just don't I
Speaker 1: just don't feel like I'm getting he was never hyper
Speaker 1: athletic anyway. I don't know. I think I think it's
Speaker 1: time to shuffle the deck. I think I would if
Speaker 1: it was me, I would keep Gordon Brown for his energy.
Speaker 1: I would keep you know, Jokic obviously, I'd move anything else.
Speaker 1: I'd take any call. How far off am I?
Speaker 2: Well, I think that there's certainly going to be a
Speaker 2: pivot coming. I think that Michael Porter Junior is the
Speaker 2: kind of player that I think they'll be almost certainly
Speaker 2: looking to move. They used to need him desperately as
Speaker 2: a weak side spacer in the context of Aaron Gordon
Speaker 2: as a non shooter, but now with Aaron Gordon really
Speaker 2: coming together as just a super well rounded, versatile role
Speaker 2: player on both ends of the floor, I think they
Speaker 2: can actually look to target more of a defensive minded
Speaker 2: wing at that position instead of a guy like Michael
Speaker 2: Porter Junior is more of a shooter. I would stick
Speaker 2: with Jamal because I think there's a lot of value
Speaker 2: specifically with the continuity with him in that matchup. This
Speaker 2: is a guy who's played two man game with jokicch
Speaker 2: for over a half decade, and he just has such
Speaker 2: a flow with him. I think there's a conversation to
Speaker 2: be had with Jamal as a parties to his conditioning,
Speaker 2: and it's routine now that he comes into camp out
Speaker 2: of shape and he basically plays his way into shape,
Speaker 2: and then suddenly right before the All Star break, he
Speaker 2: kind of kind of starts to come together, and then
Speaker 2: he'll look good in the playoffs, just not as consistently
Speaker 2: good as he can be. I mean, Colin as bad
Speaker 2: as he was tonight, he was absolutely brilliant in Game six. Yeah,
Speaker 2: but it's one of those things where I think internally
Speaker 2: they're gonna need more out of Jamal. But I certainly
Speaker 2: think of pivot's coming. I think the pivot's gonna center
Speaker 2: around a Michael Porter junior trade. That's the kind of
Speaker 2: piece that they need to upgrade. I think Jamal, I
Speaker 2: think Christian Brown, I think Aaron Gordon, I think Nicole Jokic.
Speaker 2: I think that's a championship four. I just think they
Speaker 2: need someone more along the lines of like a Herb
Speaker 2: Jones Jaden McDaniels type at the three than they need
Speaker 2: a Michael Porter junior. They need to anchor this group
Speaker 2: with defense. They need to give themselves more athleticism and pop.
Speaker 2: You could feel the difference in the athleticism in this
Speaker 2: especially in Game seven tonight or today, like they're in
Speaker 2: that beginning of the game. Is so funny on the broadcast,
Speaker 2: they show all the difference in experience all those Nuggets
Speaker 2: have played in like twenty game seven's combined, and there's
Speaker 2: like three on the OKC side, and they start the
Speaker 2: game and Denver goes up twenty one to ten, and
Speaker 2: it literally feels like a classic young guy Game seven.
Speaker 2: But then right at the end of the first quarter,
Speaker 2: Alex Cruso checks in. They's really up their ball pressure
Speaker 2: and manned at the wheels come off. It completely came
Speaker 2: off from there and they just were never able to
Speaker 2: regain control. And even Jokics to your point, especially in
Speaker 2: that late second quarter run that okay See went on
Speaker 2: right before the half, he just looked physically overwhelmed by
Speaker 2: how physical their guards are.
Speaker 1: Yeah. No, I mean it was like a fourteen to
Speaker 1: two run and they were getting up the floor. And
Speaker 1: I think, I think I've said this before. I think
Speaker 1: the first round should be five games. I think it
Speaker 1: was that's what it was in MJ's era, and I
Speaker 1: think the pace is faster. I think the athletes are
Speaker 1: bigger and stronger. I don't like the NFL going to
Speaker 1: eighteen games eventually. I just I think we should. I
Speaker 1: don't the doesn't do it for me because I think
Speaker 1: athletes now are their training year round. You ask more
Speaker 1: bodies breakdown. But I think, you know, I think we're
Speaker 1: going to end up. You know, we're ending up with
Speaker 1: really good coaching staffs with OKC, Minnesota, Indiana, and the Knicks.
Speaker 1: That's what we're ending up with. And I think I
Speaker 1: think we're ending up with I mean, between Halliburton and
Speaker 1: Jalen Brunson and SGA and you know, I mean Ant Obviously,
Speaker 1: I feel like the Eastern Conference feels much different than
Speaker 1: the Western Conference. In the Western Conference, I just love
Speaker 1: the construct of the rosters. I mean, if you look
Speaker 1: at Minnesota, it should not be this good. Rudy Gobert's
Speaker 1: an offensive hole at times, Conley's six years past his prime,
Speaker 1: Ant is a superstar, a developing superstar. Julius Randall was
Speaker 1: never a good playoff performer and struggled the first month
Speaker 1: or two with the t Wolves. But I see this roster.
Speaker 1: I see the athleticism, I see the size great GM
Speaker 1: came from Denver, and I see a staff that just
Speaker 1: gets everything out of its players, that like coaches them hard.
Speaker 1: It's like almost like Spolstra coaches them hard, has no
Speaker 1: problem barking. But I feel like I'm getting every player's
Speaker 1: best game. And with Oklahoma City, like Sam Presty, I
Speaker 1: feel again, I just think there's just so much energy
Speaker 1: and so many guys that can do high end rotational players.
Speaker 1: So in the West you can touch on this. I
Speaker 1: just think I think it's really good coaching. Obviously two
Speaker 1: of the top four or five stars in ant SJA,
Speaker 1: but I think it's really good coaching, really good GMing,
Speaker 1: really nice rosters with a variety of options to throw
Speaker 1: at teams, big energy, youth, and it just there's so
Speaker 1: many levers for both coaches to pull.
Speaker 2: In the West, Yeah, it's you know, depth is the
Speaker 2: recurring theme that I see for in the sense that
Speaker 2: the Pacers have three, four or five guys that they
Speaker 2: lean on in substantial rolls off the bench. Same with
Speaker 2: Oklahoma City, same with Minnesota. You're getting nasried Dante DiVincenzo, Nikhil,
Speaker 2: Alexander Walker. These teams just have wave after wave of talent.
Speaker 2: And even with the Knicks, like the Knicks don't have
Speaker 2: the depth in terms of like playing an eight or
Speaker 2: nine man rotation, but Mitchell Robinson is like a legit
Speaker 2: sixth starter for them, and so was duce McBride. I
Speaker 2: think duce McBride's a very good backup guard, and so
Speaker 2: I think that's part of it. Having like a rock
Speaker 2: solid seven that you can count on, I think makes
Speaker 2: a big deal. I mean, to your point, Colin. Literally
Speaker 2: we got into the start of the second quarter and
Speaker 2: David adelman inexplicably leaves Jokic and Murray off the court
Speaker 2: at the same time, and we got to see a
Speaker 2: little bit of Denver's bench there for a minute. It
Speaker 2: wasn't pretty, And so I think depth is a significant
Speaker 2: part of it. There is an interesting trend Colin, towards
Speaker 2: offense and late playoff success. Two years ago. Denver is
Speaker 2: the first team that's not a defending champion that was
Speaker 2: not a top ten defense to win the title. Last year,
Speaker 2: we had three top five or three top ten offenses
Speaker 2: to top ten defenses. This year, all four teams in
Speaker 2: the final four our top ten offenses, but only Oklahoma
Speaker 2: City and Minnesota are top ten defenses, which I find
Speaker 2: really fascinating. The offensive side of the floor is becoming
Speaker 2: more important as the coaching stabs and the defensive schematics
Speaker 2: have made it so that groups like that Denver group
Speaker 2: can actually defend pretty well when they're engaged in they're
Speaker 2: playing hard, and so what's really becoming important is do
Speaker 2: you have the scoring talent to actually put the ball
Speaker 2: in the basket in these tight competitive environments.
Speaker 1: You know, it's interesting, there's a real change in the league,
Speaker 1: and I think it's one Adam Silver, the commissioner, wanted.
Speaker 1: I don't think it's a coincidence that Halliburton and Brunson
Speaker 1: are high iq EQ floor generals. You know, five years ago,
Speaker 1: it was let's get three really good players together, and
Speaker 1: I think Adam Silver looked at that and just thought,
Speaker 1: that's that's not what we want here. Like that's just
Speaker 1: eliminating half to sixty to seventy percent of the teams,
Speaker 1: and you're getting the basketball that Adam Silver wanted, physical
Speaker 1: playoff basketball, no dynasties with multiple aprons. You know, you
Speaker 1: can't have a stacked roster. Even Boston they cheated the
Speaker 1: code a little bit for a year and then they
Speaker 1: looked really old this year. Like once we move off
Speaker 1: bry Porzingis or a Horford or a Drew Holliday, Boston's
Speaker 1: going to face what everybody else does, right with new ownership.
Speaker 1: So I think it's it's what the league wanted. And
Speaker 1: I got to tell you what I really like about it.
Speaker 1: I love point you know, nothing against Wings, MJ and Kobe,
Speaker 1: but I like point guard driven basketball. I love smart
Speaker 1: point guard player. I always loved Chris Paul where everybody
Speaker 1: gets touches. I went golfing this morning, very early in
Speaker 1: Burbs and Chicago, and we started talking about Jalen Brunson,
Speaker 1: and we were all sports fans, and we were all like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I watched them at Villanova. I didn't see that. I
Speaker 1: watched them at Dallas. I didn't see that. But I
Speaker 1: think you know, you know how you and I had
Speaker 1: talked about certain players when the league went three heavy
Speaker 1: guys like Dwight Howard or Tristan Thompson, It's like, man,
Speaker 1: you can't have them on the floor. It's almost like
Speaker 1: Adam Silver has moved basketball into Brunson and Halliburton, which
Speaker 1: is it's not you're not gonna have the You're gonna
Speaker 1: have these rosters that aren't all star studied. Their they're
Speaker 1: rotational players, their role players, so intelligence everybody getting touches,
Speaker 1: pacing becomes huge. Like I look at Brunson now and
Speaker 1: I'm like, I feel like the league's kind of built
Speaker 1: for him. In Halliburton, it is. It's twenty eight points
Speaker 1: isn't necessary. It's it's when you can when you don't
Speaker 1: have a top heavy roster, Jason and you actually have
Speaker 1: seven guys that can play eight guys and you get
Speaker 1: them all touches. I don't know. I just I watch
Speaker 1: the league and I don't feel like the Knicks and
Speaker 1: the Pacers are outliers. I'm like, no, like they're They're
Speaker 1: my favorite two teams right now in the league to watch.
Speaker 2: I think you're absolutely onto something here, Colin. I think
Speaker 2: what we're seeing is offensive minded stars that are able
Speaker 2: to create advantages, and then these deep rosters of talent
Speaker 2: living off of that advantage. Essentially, Like as the game
Speaker 2: has modernized, there's a lot of really similar jobs on offense.
Speaker 2: Like a backdoor cut is a backdoor cut, regardless of
Speaker 2: what type of athlete you are. If you're attacking a
Speaker 2: close out, it's the same for the Pacers as it
Speaker 2: is for the Knicks, as it is for the Nuggets.
Speaker 2: If you're making reads in a four on three, slipping
Speaker 2: out of a ball screen because they put two on
Speaker 2: Brunson or they put two on Halliburton, it's the same
Speaker 2: reads in Golden State as it is in Indiana, as
Speaker 2: it is in New York. And so what happens is
Speaker 2: you can as a GM accumulate these types of talent,
Speaker 2: these two way players that can attack closeouts, make reads,
Speaker 2: play defense, you know, all that kind of stuff. And
Speaker 2: all it becomes is do you have a guy, a
Speaker 2: singular force that can constantly bring you to the ball
Speaker 2: or make the right reads to generate that first close
Speaker 2: out and then from there. It's a flow sport. It's
Speaker 2: all about the aggregate talent on the floor capitalizing on
Speaker 2: that advantage. But Tyrese Halliburn is succeeding because he's one
Speaker 2: of the best advantage creators in basketball. Brunson does it
Speaker 2: a little bit more of a lean towards scoring, but
Speaker 2: I mean keep an eye on this series. In this
Speaker 2: matchup in particular, the Pacers have been able to hold
Speaker 2: Brunson scoring down a little bit by constantly putting two
Speaker 2: on the ball. This will be a series where we're
Speaker 2: going to see a lot of Siaka or excuse me,
Speaker 2: og And Andobi and Mikhale Bridges and Josh Hart looking
Speaker 2: to make plays. It is a very interesting directional change
Speaker 2: for the league in this offensive theme that we're talking about.
Speaker 2: This is why guys like Luca are so valuable. This
Speaker 2: is why guys like Nikole Jokic are so valuable. When
Speaker 2: you have somebody that's like gott to throw multiple pieces
Speaker 2: at this guy all of a sudden, they're these really
Speaker 2: achievable roles appear for role players, and those are the
Speaker 2: kinds of guys that good gms are picking up all
Speaker 2: over the league. To Sam Presty's credit, he's got like
Speaker 2: eight of these dudes that can defend multiple positions, knock
Speaker 2: down a catch and shoot three, drive a close out,
Speaker 2: make a read or grab a rebound, and so as
Speaker 2: a result, they just they just come flying in. It's like, good, oh,
Speaker 2: good job, you finish the j dub in dort pace.
Speaker 2: Here comes case On Wallace and Alex Crusoe for your
Speaker 2: next shift. Have fun with that. They might actually be
Speaker 2: better at it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I I and I like it. I mean I
Speaker 1: don't think, you know, I think the league would do
Speaker 1: better if it's okay s well. Actually, Aunt Edwards probably
Speaker 1: Aunt against the Knicks would be really good to have
Speaker 1: Aunt go for forty two in the garden. You know
Speaker 1: it's fans Ola was root for the home team. So
Speaker 1: in the Knicks win, you know the fans are going
Speaker 1: to say, we told you so. I think a really
Speaker 1: fascinating team, though, is the one that long. We see
Speaker 1: this a lot in the NBA, the end of dynasties.
Speaker 1: That's not the case because the Celtics were never a dynasty.
Speaker 1: But I do feel like I felt when Denver won,
Speaker 1: I thought, oh, here come the Spurs, and then they weren't.
Speaker 1: And then I thought when the Celtics went, I thought
Speaker 1: it was gonna be like a three year run, and
Speaker 1: then they weren't. And next year obviously without Tatum. Tatum
Speaker 1: is fine if he misses four games, two games. When
Speaker 1: he misses the season, you can just it's just a
Speaker 1: different ball game because Jalen Brown can be a little
Speaker 1: hot and cold offensively. You know, Boston, and again, there's
Speaker 1: so many smart front offices in the NBA. We all
Speaker 1: we both kind of agree they're going to get rid
Speaker 1: of some kind of expensive older guys. Do you think
Speaker 1: do you think they'll go big game hunting in Boston.
Speaker 2: I don't think they'll go big game hunting right away.
Speaker 2: I think it's got to be more of a big picture,
Speaker 2: two year kind of window. To make this sort of
Speaker 2: transition because like, essentially you could take all next year,
Speaker 2: you own your own draft pick, so like you could
Speaker 2: be bad and that could lead into more talent coming
Speaker 2: in through the draft. There's the ability to offload like
Speaker 2: older role players in hopes of bringing back younger role players,
Speaker 2: So like flip a Drew Holliday to a team that
Speaker 2: needs a better player right away. Like for instance, like
Speaker 2: I would be calling Dallas and I would see what
Speaker 2: I could get for Drew Holliday, Like, Okay, we need
Speaker 2: a center, So they've got Daniel Gafford in PJ. Washington,
Speaker 2: They Cooper Flag is literally going to be playing the
Speaker 2: forward next to Anthony Davis, next to Derek Lively. Maybe
Speaker 2: we can turn Drew Holliday into PJ. Washington and Daniel Gafford.
Speaker 2: Now I got a four and a five that could
Speaker 2: both start in this league that are twenty six years
Speaker 2: old instead of thirty four years old like Drew Holliday is.
Speaker 2: I think I think those are the kinds of moves
Speaker 2: they'll be looking to make, and then it's essentially going
Speaker 2: to be just asset accumulation in hopes of being able
Speaker 2: to pivot around Jason Tatum in that following season. But
Speaker 2: this is the challenge, Colin. I mean, the Raptors win,
Speaker 2: they lose Kawhi than they end up losing the next season. Right,
Speaker 2: the Lakers win, but then Anthony Davis and Lebron get hurt.
Speaker 2: They make a tweak. They can't repeat the Bucks. They
Speaker 2: don't pay PJ. Tucker. Chris Middleton gets hurt. They can't
Speaker 2: repeat the Warriors that Jordan Poole and Andrew Wiggins both
Speaker 2: fall back to what they're normally like. The the Nuggets.
Speaker 2: They can't pay Bruce Brown and they can't pay Contavious
Speaker 2: Colbo Pope. Suddenly they are second tier contender the Celtics.
Speaker 2: These windows look long, but okay, c is gonna have
Speaker 2: to pay all these guys, right, And it's only a
Speaker 2: matter of time before suddenly it's Shay and j Dubb
Speaker 2: and some lesser level talent around them, and all of
Speaker 2: a sudden, it's going to be a harder game.
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Speaker 1: And now for our next segment, Whiskey Business. Yes, Whiskey
Speaker 1: Business brought to you by Green River Whiskey, the official
Speaker 1: whiskey of the Colin Coward Podcast. You know, here's something else,
Speaker 1: and this is another shift which I think is great
Speaker 1: for basketball. I think with the nil more players will
Speaker 1: stay an extra year in college or go to college,
Speaker 1: So I do think when they enter the league they're
Speaker 1: more ready to play. I mean, we've had a lot
Speaker 1: of Jalen Greens over the last ten years. Like guys
Speaker 1: that are talented, but you just see in three years,
Speaker 1: you know, like get some polish. But if you play,
Speaker 1: you know, for Bill self or Hurley for even one
Speaker 1: year and maybe two, I'm not saying you're a Villanova guy,
Speaker 1: but you're ready to play in the league. And I
Speaker 1: do think the growth and explosion of NIL money actually
Speaker 1: helps the NBA. I think Adam Silver's always known there's
Speaker 1: you know, it's a little bit of a liability. First
Speaker 1: of all, you want more tape on a player, so
Speaker 1: fewer players are busts. Like NFL gms have such an advantage.
Speaker 1: They got three and four years of tape. And you're
Speaker 1: kind of guessing because college basketball coaches often control of
Speaker 1: the offense. You're like, is he a good decision maker?
Speaker 1: What am I getting? But you're going to get a
Speaker 1: couple of years of tape, so you have a better evaluation,
Speaker 1: and I think you're going to get more mature players.
Speaker 1: They're just more refined because I think college coaching and
Speaker 1: the college environment. We talked about this March madness, you know,
Speaker 1: conference championships, those are intense NBA feeling like environments. So
Speaker 1: I actually think basketball is in a really good place.
Speaker 1: I think, you know, baseball right now is so lobsided,
Speaker 1: you know where it's just like Dodgers are throwing out
Speaker 1: like eight all star level players. They're going through massive
Speaker 1: injuries and it doesn't matter. But I think asketball is
Speaker 1: in a really good place. And I think, you know,
Speaker 1: I think if when you start looking at the market,
Speaker 1: I don't think markets have the levers they used to like.
Speaker 1: I like watching okay See play. I'm fine with it,
Speaker 1: and I'm I've been kind of market sensitive in my
Speaker 1: life as a broadcaster, always kind of looked for the bigger,
Speaker 1: more interesting markets. But I don't know. I like watching Indiana.
Speaker 1: I like okay See. I don't have a problem with
Speaker 1: so I'm you know, I think the league would you know,
Speaker 1: we all know if New York faced Aunt, it would
Speaker 1: probably be the win. I will say this part of
Speaker 1: me thinks Minnesota. I you know, they always say styles
Speaker 1: make fights, Like I've gone to a lot of boxing
Speaker 1: matches and I have to watch two rounds to get
Speaker 1: really comfortable. I'm not sure. I don't have strong senses
Speaker 1: on the series. I like the experience of Minnesota and
Speaker 1: the coaching staff. I think Oklahoma City should win but
Speaker 1: I'm not sure. And I I think India is better
Speaker 1: than the Necks. I just I just think they have
Speaker 1: more depth. I think they again they I think, let's
Speaker 1: talk about that. I think Indiana and Carlisle has more
Speaker 1: lineups to throw at you. He's got a little more dexterity.
Speaker 1: That's that's my interpretation. You.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they are. They have like six different dudes that
Speaker 2: could go for twenty plus points on any given night,
Speaker 2: and they are. They play with such pace and they
Speaker 2: play with such energy. The reason why I like the
Speaker 2: matchup with the Pacers versus the Knicks. They the Pacers
Speaker 2: don't have a single player in this postseason Colin that's
Speaker 2: averaging over thirty five minutes per game.
Speaker 4: Wow.
Speaker 2: On the Knicks, Michale Bridges and Ojan Andobi are both
Speaker 2: averaging over forty. Yeah, all five starters are over thirty
Speaker 2: five minutes per game. They lean on a whole lot
Speaker 2: of the heavy minutes for their core five guys. What
Speaker 2: the Pacers do, as you've seen so many times already
Speaker 2: in this postseason, is you got them. You got them.
Speaker 2: You're up thirteen, you're up fourteen, and you feel, you
Speaker 2: feel like you're in good shape. But the problem is
Speaker 2: is like they make one layup and then they pick
Speaker 2: you up full court again, and then they do it again,
Speaker 2: and they do it again, and every time you turn
Speaker 2: it over, they run it down your throat again, and
Speaker 2: they play with so much pace and so much energy,
Speaker 2: and they literally never let go of the rope in
Speaker 2: the Knicks. As we've seen a ton of times in
Speaker 2: the Piston series and even in the Celtics series, they
Speaker 2: can have really sloppy nights where they get undisciplined, and
Speaker 2: I think they'll pay the price against Indiana in this
Speaker 2: matchup with that. Also, like to your point, I think
Speaker 2: the Pacers are just playing really good basketball right now.
Speaker 2: They're peeking at the tail end of the season. They've
Speaker 2: been playing like this for the last couple months. Really,
Speaker 2: They've been really cooking at this level. Tyrese Haliburton is
Speaker 2: playing every bit as well as Jalen Brunson, just in
Speaker 2: a different way because he's all like a Steve Nash
Speaker 2: than he is a legit on ball scoring guard. Siakam
Speaker 2: has a lot of similarities to og and Andobi. Aaron
Speaker 2: Nee Smith is literally averaging fifteen points a game in
Speaker 2: this postseason, and he's knocking every three down off the game.
Speaker 2: He shoot over fifty percent on open threes in this
Speaker 2: postseason run. Andrew Nemhart is just a playoff gamer who
Speaker 2: can do a little bit of everything. Miles Turner is
Speaker 2: shooting like forty five percent on threes in this postseason
Speaker 2: like they are just everyone's playing super well. They go
Speaker 2: like eight nine deep. They never stop coming at you.
Speaker 2: I have a feeling this is the last thing I'll
Speaker 2: say about it. It kind of reminds me Colling of the
Speaker 2: of the Golden State Warriors back in the day, where
Speaker 2: they play such a unique style that there's like this
Speaker 2: shocking off phase at the beginning of each series where
Speaker 2: it's like you're used to playing a certain type of
Speaker 2: team and then all of a sudden, here come the
Speaker 2: Warriors and they're running Stephan Clay through a million screens
Speaker 2: and it's just bizarre, and they catch you off guard
Speaker 2: and they go up two zero in the series, and
Speaker 2: all of a sudden, you're fighting upstream. The Pacers jumped
Speaker 2: the Calves in Game one and that was I know,
Speaker 2: get Garland didn't play. That's a good Calves team that
Speaker 2: was at home. They got punched in the mouth by
Speaker 2: the Pacers because they just they were not ready for
Speaker 2: the way they play, and the same thing happened to
Speaker 2: the Bucks in the first round. So like, I look
Speaker 2: at it as a kind of series where Indiana probably
Speaker 2: steals game one and then New York is fighting upstream
Speaker 2: against a deeper team that never stops play playing hard,
Speaker 2: that never plays their main guys big minutes, and I
Speaker 2: just think it's going to be too much for them
Speaker 2: to overcome. I do think the Knicks have a chance,
Speaker 2: but I would make the Pacers a decent favorite.
Speaker 1: Well. I think my take is if the games are
Speaker 1: close late, I love New York shot making ability. I
Speaker 1: think they're really good. I think they I think they're
Speaker 1: very physical, they're well coached, they make shots that are
Speaker 1: totally unselfish. But it's Brunson's team. I think if you
Speaker 1: told me there were three, you know, three twelve point
Speaker 1: games in the series, I'd take Indiana. Indiana can wear
Speaker 1: you out, and but I think those I think of
Speaker 1: the entire playoffs, if I had one kind of Wow,
Speaker 1: it was Jalen Brunson and the Knick shot making in
Speaker 1: multiple games against the Celtics, a good defensive team like wow,
Speaker 1: and it really, Jason. It really made me look at
Speaker 1: the Knicks differently from through a different prism. I really
Speaker 1: felt all year, go get you, honest, get Durant. You
Speaker 1: need a big piece, And I'm like, no, not really,
Speaker 1: I think you need a piece. I don't think it's
Speaker 1: a huge piece. I thought I thought Bridges, Oh, Gee's
Speaker 1: just big and physical. And again the league now has
Speaker 1: said we're gonna let guys like, oh, the league's stylistically
Speaker 1: is playing right into what the Knicks do. I think
Speaker 1: they need. I think they need. You know, can't doesn't
Speaker 1: defend Mitchell Robinson, you don't trust offensively. I feel like
Speaker 1: if you could morph and get you could get Listen,
Speaker 1: didn't we talk.
Speaker 2: About Harstein College like they should have just made some
Speaker 2: sort of salary dumping trade with Julius if that's what
Speaker 2: they were going to do, and just pick up Hartenstein
Speaker 2: because he would literally be perfect as per few way
Speaker 2: for this team.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, he is. That's exactly right.
Speaker 4: But I I I don't look at the Knicks as
Speaker 4: needing a big swing. And a credit to the front office,
Speaker 4: the executive suite, which was impatient for years, the Knicks
Speaker 4: have made like McHale, Bridges I like the move, and
Speaker 4: then halfway through the season, I'm like, that's a lot
Speaker 4: of first for mcale Bridges, and then you watch in
Speaker 4: the playoffs, You're like, a shit, now this works. He's
Speaker 4: a really really good player and and he fits their culture.
Speaker 2: So yeah, they the Knicks. It came together in the
Speaker 2: right way for them late in the season. It started
Speaker 2: with a couple of different things, and mostly it comes
Speaker 2: down to me the conversation we were having earlier, which
Speaker 2: is all season long. When I watched the Knicks, I'm like,
Speaker 2: why are they bad on defense? They've got three really
Speaker 2: good They've got three really good defenders on the floor
Speaker 2: all season and like, and by the way, like McHale
Speaker 2: Bridges wasn't very good on defense this season. You know,
Speaker 2: Brunson and kat were abysmal most of the season on defense.
Speaker 2: In this postseason, McHale has turned into one of the
Speaker 2: better point of attack guys in the league. Ognobi's literally
Speaker 2: been flying around like prime Kawhi making plays, and Jalen
Speaker 2: Brunson outside of Game five against Boston, has been very
Speaker 2: good defensively in this playoff run. So what's happening is
Speaker 2: they're leveraging a higher level out of themselves defensively, and
Speaker 2: they've been a great offense all year long, and so
Speaker 2: it's really coming together in that way. I just worry.
Speaker 2: To me, I just think the Pacers are a little
Speaker 2: bit better. I just think they're a little bit better
Speaker 2: on defense, they have a better rim protector, they're a
Speaker 2: little bit better on offense, they're a little bit deeper.
Speaker 2: That to me, is what it comes down to.
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Speaker 1: That's why the t Wolves beat the Lakers. And I
Speaker 1: mean that's really it. That's why the t Wolves beat
Speaker 1: the Warriors. That I mean, if you say, well, they're deeper,
Speaker 1: that's why OKC beat Denver. I mean the depth thing.
Speaker 1: When you allow this level of physicality, it wears players
Speaker 1: out even and I think I think you're seeing that depth.
Speaker 1: Really in my entire life, there was always two things
Speaker 1: that were true about the playoffs. It was more physical
Speaker 1: and depth was overrated. You know, you play eight, you
Speaker 1: trust seven, and it was like, oh no, it's more
Speaker 1: physical and depth has been huge. I don't remember a year,
Speaker 1: but we all know veterans tend to be kids, that's
Speaker 1: kind of a given. But I don't remember a year
Speaker 1: to me where it was like one of the first
Speaker 1: punches is well they just have they have more levers.
Speaker 1: And I think Indiana and ok C probably should win
Speaker 1: this series because I never I mean when Denver won
Speaker 1: the title, we didn't think I mean they had KCP
Speaker 1: or Bruce Brown, we didn't. We didn't think depth, right,
Speaker 1: Yokich at the time was a poor defender. We didn't
Speaker 1: think about. We just thoughtless't they have the best player
Speaker 1: they've got. They were hitting on all cylinders, They had
Speaker 1: enough good guys off the bench. Depth matters, and I
Speaker 1: don't remember ever in my life being this big of
Speaker 1: a factor in the playoffs. Maybe I'm wrong.
Speaker 2: I think I think the physicality plays a big role.
Speaker 2: I think you're right. I think I think that the
Speaker 2: depth is giving you the ability to withstand physicality. I mean, right, ultimately,
Speaker 2: like Denver, Denver blew this series in Game four and
Speaker 2: Game five, when they had fourth quarter leads and all
Speaker 2: their stars looked exhausted down the stretch, while the thunder
Speaker 2: Stars looked fresh and they were able to make plays.
Speaker 2: The younger, more athletic, deeper team just came on strong
Speaker 2: late in the game. I think the second thing that
Speaker 2: the physicality has done, which has actually been pretty interesting,
Speaker 2: is do you remember colling over the previous few years,
Speaker 2: how we just had so many blowouts where like it
Speaker 2: just felt like teams would go back and forth, like
Speaker 2: blowing each other out. And I think one of the
Speaker 2: things that the increased physicality has done is it's made
Speaker 2: it really difficult to shoot threes because everyone's legs are cooked,
Speaker 2: and like even in this game seven, you see like no,
Speaker 2: no one's stepping. Like there's a whole lot of games
Speaker 2: where teams are shooting twenty percent from three and it's
Speaker 2: just a blood bath. And I think that's dragging the
Speaker 2: games down into like everything's finishing. Every You're looking at
Speaker 2: the clock and it's ninety three to ninety five with
Speaker 2: eight minutes left, and it's causing for a lot of
Speaker 2: great games.
Speaker 1: This is a great point because and I think you're
Speaker 1: right on, because I was talking about this the other
Speaker 1: day as we were preparing for a show. I'm like, man,
Speaker 1: just there's a lot of bad three point shooting nights.
Speaker 1: And I couldn't quite pinpoint it. But again, I think
Speaker 1: when you get into push push basketball and it's just
Speaker 1: leaning on each other, teams are tired and it brings
Speaker 1: the offense down, and I think that's a great point.
Speaker 1: In fact, what it also creates is when you're not
Speaker 1: hitting threes, you tend to you realize that the coaching
Speaker 1: staff knows it. Longer the series goes, you start shooting fewer.
Speaker 1: One of the things I never liked about three point
Speaker 1: shots is it's not you can box out all you want.
Speaker 1: The rebounds are long and weird and you can't. And
Speaker 1: so you can have great position. But when you're playing
Speaker 1: a more you know, a more physical game inside the arc,
Speaker 1: you run like traditional fast breaks, you get you know,
Speaker 1: a four foot carem, you get it the outlet. So
Speaker 1: the aesthetic of the fast break like, okay, see did
Speaker 1: it about six seven times over a five minute stretch. Oh,
Speaker 1: it looked like old playoff. It looked like old college,
Speaker 1: high school, old seventies NBA fast break. Here's the point card.
Speaker 1: Two guys in the wind wings fill in a guy's
Speaker 1: backpedaling finished with dunks. Three point shooting is so weird
Speaker 1: to me. I don't like the idea of you miss
Speaker 1: and a ball Karam's twenty feet out to the corner.
Speaker 1: It stops play. You come back up. I think, I
Speaker 1: really do. This is a cliche, but it looks it's
Speaker 1: giving me a little bit of a college feel and
Speaker 1: a little bit of an old NBA feel. And I've
Speaker 1: said this for years. I like the layered basketball more
Speaker 1: than three point shooting basketball. And I think your point's
Speaker 1: great is that the more you know, the unintended benefit.
Speaker 1: I don't know if they thought about this, but the
Speaker 1: more physicality, the lousier three point shooting, and the less
Speaker 1: you scheme up three point shooting, you're scheming up baskets.
Speaker 1: It feels like to me.
Speaker 2: No, absolutely, I think I think in general it's a
Speaker 2: better version of what old basketball looked like. It's physical,
Speaker 2: it's ugly, but you have the impressive skill level that
Speaker 2: we have in the modern NBA, and so it's kind
Speaker 2: of given us the best of both worlds. But I'm
Speaker 2: super excited for OKAC Minnesota. I'm with you in the
Speaker 2: sense that I have almost no feel for it, because
Speaker 2: Minnesota was a team that was much better than their
Speaker 2: regular season looked. If you talk to any Timberwolves fan
Speaker 2: all season, they were like, we just weren't playing as
Speaker 2: hard on defense as we did last year. Minnesota's a
Speaker 2: little bit. Minnesota has some more veteran guys than you'd think,
Speaker 2: Like Yalius is a VET, Rudy Gobert's a VET, Mike
Speaker 2: Conley's a vet. Like they're they're They've got some guys
Speaker 2: that have been around for a little while, and so
Speaker 2: they just kind of took it easy through the season.
Speaker 2: Oklahoma City everybody not named Crusoe, and their rotation is
Speaker 2: twenty six or younger. They've just been going crazy all
Speaker 2: eighty two games. And so they're two. There are two
Speaker 2: teams that I think, Okay, So He's probably not as
Speaker 2: good as they looked in the season. Minnesota is better
Speaker 2: than they looked in the regular season. Two great defenses,
Speaker 2: both anchored by both rim protection with Chet and Rudy Gobert,
Speaker 2: and two big looks with Nazried as well as Isaiah Hartenstein,
Speaker 2: elite on ball guard with size that can shoot over
Speaker 2: the top like Anton Shay. Just which one of them
Speaker 2: makes more jumpers over the top huge part of this
Speaker 2: series because guess what, there's not going to be a
Speaker 2: lot at the rim for either team in the series.
Speaker 2: Role player shooting you. We just watched Lou Dort and
Speaker 2: Cason Wallace and now Cruzo take a bunch of threes.
Speaker 2: It's going to be Jaden McDaniels, It's going to be
Speaker 2: Julius Randall, Nikhil, Alexander Walker, Dante DiVincenzo. I do think
Speaker 2: there's a real like veteran experience advantage from Minnesota, but
Speaker 2: Oklahoma City also has home court advantage, and they're probably
Speaker 2: just a little bit deeper, a little bit faster. So
Speaker 2: it's it's that's gonna be a fun one, Colin, and
Speaker 2: what like if we had to have the new guard
Speaker 2: for a playoff quarter final four? These are pretty interesting series.
Speaker 2: The Nicks and Pacers kind of hate each other. They've
Speaker 2: played each other in the playoffs before. Shaver's ant is
Speaker 2: literally the battle of the two best guards in the league.
Speaker 2: Right now, I think this is gonna be an entertaining
Speaker 2: quarter our semi final.
Speaker 1: All right, Jason timp hoops tonight a little shorter version
Speaker 1: as we get ready for the conference finals, I'm I'm
Speaker 1: just gonna watch the I'm gonna take Indiana and OKAC
Speaker 1: just because of depth and the coaching options. I don't
Speaker 1: feel great conviction. I feel I feel I think this
Speaker 1: is Ant's moment. Aunt's knocked a lot of good guys
Speaker 1: out of the playoffs. I mean, you start looking the
Speaker 1: last two years, ANT has knocked a lot of legends
Speaker 1: out of the playoffs. But it's not just an SGA thing.
Speaker 1: When you're watching them annihilate Denver in transition and in
Speaker 1: the paint, I'm like, Jesus, it's just a it's ten player,
Speaker 1: I mean ten rotation. That's just unheard of.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think I leaned slightly towards Minnesota right now.
Speaker 2: I think the thing I keep coming down to is
Speaker 2: Jay Dubb. And again, I'm gonna watch a bunch of
Speaker 2: film and I'll make my pick when I do my
Speaker 2: series preview tomorrow morning. But Jay Dub was super inconsistent
Speaker 2: in the series. Julius Randall's been fantastic in this postseason run. Geez,
Speaker 2: I even think I trust I think I trust nas
Speaker 2: Reed more to score the ball than Chet In terms
Speaker 2: of over the top seating and stuff. I think I
Speaker 2: trust Minnesota's experience. I'm leaning just slightly that way at
Speaker 2: this point in time.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Randall's been a revelation in and and I think
Speaker 1: it was funny. I talked to Chris Finch off the
Speaker 1: air about him. I said, well, what do you make
Speaker 1: of this? He's like, he'll get there. He's not there yet.
Speaker 1: This was like three months ago. He's like, he's gonna
Speaker 1: get there, but we're asking him to do other stuff.
Speaker 1: He's become a much better distributor. I mean, his assist
Speaker 1: numbers are up, so it's like, and he's hitting three
Speaker 1: point shots. So yeah, it's funny. Two nicks, the shot
Speaker 1: making of Jalen Brunson and really a revelation in Julius
Speaker 1: Randall are my two sort of wow. I could remember
Speaker 1: when Julius Randall was a Laker. It was becoming a
Speaker 1: three ball league, and I can remember going to a
Speaker 1: Laker game saying, God, this guy's just a bit. He's
Speaker 1: a house like this guy is his body. He's like
Speaker 1: a thirty eight year old man, and thinking to myself,
Speaker 1: and I remember the Lakers were cool on him because
Speaker 1: he didn't shoot threes. And I'm like, yeah, but I'm
Speaker 1: getting like eighteen and eight. He defends. He's always got
Speaker 1: a smile on his face. Like I'm like, god, if
Speaker 1: he's not an NBA player, Like, what is the league?
Speaker 1: Remember when they said Zach Edy wouldn't fit and You're like, no, no,
Speaker 1: Zach Eat. He's fine in the NBA. Like I remember
Speaker 1: going to a Laker game watching him and thinking, dude,
Speaker 1: he's you know, he's just really consist His energy is great,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, just like he's just he
Speaker 1: wasn't a pretty player. He was really old school. So
Speaker 1: I always love when a guy's coachable and coaches coach hard.
Speaker 1: I think Minnesota's done that with a couple of players,
Speaker 1: Like they coach hard and the players are like they
Speaker 1: digest it, they consume it, and it's I don't know,
Speaker 1: I think that. You know, when Kevin Durant and Kyrie
Speaker 1: Irving said we don't need a coach, I'm like, guys, really,
Speaker 1: come on, give me a break. Like the great players
Speaker 1: all want great coaching. Come on. Yeah.
Speaker 2: The Julius Ryandol piece too. He's just so physically imposing,
Speaker 2: like he's a much better athlete than he gets credit for.
Speaker 2: I mean, I know, I know Lebron was forty, but
Speaker 2: he kind of kicked Lebron's butt athletically in that series
Speaker 2: a few times, and like he ultimately that's to me
Speaker 2: what makes him a good playoff player. I thought his
Speaker 2: playoff struggles originally were a little overblown because he was
Speaker 2: just injured. He was like either playing through an injury
Speaker 2: or had just returned from an injury and was clearly
Speaker 2: out of rhythm. He had a long runway this year
Speaker 2: and was playing great right when he like he was
Speaker 2: playing great when he got to the postseason. And he's
Speaker 2: a decent passer who legitimately can battle for position and
Speaker 2: make little short I'm shots in the lane that is
Speaker 2: going to help an NBA team in the playoffs. It's
Speaker 2: like he has a skill set that's kind of built
Speaker 2: for this environment. And I actually think he's defended really
Speaker 2: well in this postseason. And the one guy that I
Speaker 2: was really worried about him defensively with Steph Curry, and
Speaker 2: he got out of that matchup because of an injury,
Speaker 2: so it worked out pretty fine for him.
Speaker 1: First time in NBA history, we will have seven different
Speaker 1: champions in a seven year stretch, and I'm here for it.
Speaker 1: Jason Timp hoops tonight as Olas.
Speaker 2: Thanks Buddy, Good to see you, Colin, See you next week.
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