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Speaker 1: This program features the individual opinions of the hosts, guests,

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Speaker 1: and callers, and not necessarily those of the producer, the station,

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Speaker 1: its affiliates, or sponsors. This is True Crime Tonight.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to True Crime Tonight on iHeartRadio. We're talking true

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Speaker 2: crime all the time. It's Wednesday, July second, and it

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Speaker 2: has been a wild day in the Courtroomstiddy is not

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Speaker 2: getting out on bail after all major developments, bombshells in

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Speaker 2: that case. And Brian Coberger, he was accused of murdering

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Speaker 2: for beautiful Idaho college students, has been in court today,

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Speaker 2: a packed courthouse. In fact, he's officially guilty and that

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Speaker 2: is his play. I'm Stephanie Leidecker and I head u

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Speaker 2: KT Studios where we make true crime podcasts and documentaries.

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Speaker 2: This is one of those days that it's impossible to

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Speaker 2: decide where to begin. I think it's emotional beyond measure.

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Speaker 2: The Brian Coburger case will start there. You know, we

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Speaker 2: have been following this one so closely our podcast The

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Speaker 2: Idaho Massacre, two seasons of that, so we've been at

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Speaker 2: this since day one.

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Speaker 3: On this case.

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Speaker 2: Courtney Armstrong here is the voice of it and our

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Speaker 2: Peacock documentary The Idaho Student Murders is dropping tomorrow. That

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Speaker 2: really unpacks kind of how we got here, and we

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Speaker 2: were not expecting him to plead guilty. For all of

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Speaker 2: these years he said he's so innocent and really seemingly

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Speaker 2: overnight on a random Monday, we get the news that

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Speaker 2: he's changing his vote, and all the families were in

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Speaker 2: the courtroom today. It was packed, it was emotional, and

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Speaker 2: seeing him standing there basically emotionless was paralyzing. I think

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Speaker 2: we all felt sick. You know how I did.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that is for sure.

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Speaker 4: I think sick. I think staggered is the word I

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Speaker 4: keep using. It's just that is how I feel. Brian Colberger,

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Speaker 4: as you as you alleged, I was going to say,

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Speaker 4: Brian Coolberger did change his plea two and a half

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Speaker 4: years that he was not guilty, and today in court

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Speaker 4: he changed his plea to guilty of the four murders

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Speaker 4: of the Idaho College students, and the judge accepted that plea.

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Speaker 3: Brian Coberger.

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Speaker 4: This crime happened back in November twenty twenty two and

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Speaker 4: the victims were Madison Mogan, Xana Kernodle, Kaylee Gonsalvez, and

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Speaker 4: Ethan Chapin for young college students living in a house.

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Speaker 4: Brian Coberger cannot file an appeal and also this plea

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Speaker 4: avoids the death penalty and the judge a big part

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Speaker 4: of today's court appearance was for the judge to make

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Speaker 4: sure that Brian Coberger, the formally accused and now guilty,

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Speaker 4: that he understood all of the charges against him that

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Speaker 4: he was agreeing to. And we have a clip you'll

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Speaker 4: hear of the Judge Hitler and Brian Coberger.

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Speaker 5: Let me ask you, did you on November thirteenth, twenty

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Speaker 5: twenty two we entered the residents at one one two

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Speaker 5: two King Road in Moscow, Idaho, with the intent to

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Speaker 5: commit the fallony crime of murder?

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Speaker 6: Yes?

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Speaker 5: Did you on November thirteenth, twenty twenty two in Leaytah County,

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Speaker 5: State of Idaho, kill and murder Madison Mogan a human being?

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Speaker 6: Yes?

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Speaker 5: And did you do that willfully, unlawfully, deliberately, and with

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Speaker 5: premeditation and malis a forethought?

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Speaker 6: Yes?

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Speaker 5: Did you, honor about that same date in Moscow, Idaho,

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Speaker 5: kill and murder Kaylee Gonzalez a human being?

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Speaker 6: Yes?

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Speaker 5: And did you do that willfully, unlawfully, deliberately, and with

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Speaker 5: premeditation and malicica forethought?

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Speaker 6: Yes?

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Speaker 5: And did you, on that same date in Moscow, Idaho,

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Speaker 5: kill and murder Xana Cernodle pardon me, a human being?

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Speaker 6: Yes?

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Speaker 5: And did you do that willfully, unlawfully deliberately, with premeditation

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Speaker 5: and malice of forethought?

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Speaker 6: Yes?

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Speaker 7: And then on or.

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Speaker 5: About November thirteenth, twenty twenty two again in Leaytok County, Idaho,

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Speaker 5: did you kill and murder ethan shape and a human being?

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Speaker 6: Yes?

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Speaker 5: Did you do that willfully and lawfully deliberately, with premeditation

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Speaker 5: and malice of forethought?

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Speaker 6: Yes.

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Speaker 3: It's hard to hear that. Again.

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Speaker 2: We've heard this so many times today, and it gut

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Speaker 2: punches us each time. What a gutless reaction, What a

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Speaker 2: gutless man, him sitting in a chair, his back to

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Speaker 2: all of the people's lives he's ruined. Is not okay?

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Speaker 2: This is a young man, by the way, There was

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Speaker 2: this whole he was studying this. We've talked about this,

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Speaker 2: probably to nauseum. At this point I thought something was

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Speaker 2: very interesting today that I hadn't heard before. Just how

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Speaker 2: meticulous he cleaned out that car. Imagine he murdered four people,

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Speaker 2: then he left. He must have been drenched in blood.

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Speaker 2: It was a massive overkill. The walls were bleeding in

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Speaker 2: this offcut, off campus house. He gets in his white

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Speaker 2: Alantra and dips and vanishes into the night.

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Speaker 3: The fact is his car was meticulous, and he was

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Speaker 3: cleaning it with his little gloves over the holidays.

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Speaker 2: We knew that, but even the prosecution said it was

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Speaker 2: pretty astounding that when they got to that vehicle that

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Speaker 2: he clearly had driven right after the murders, it was pristine,

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Speaker 2: like there was none of the gunk that you would

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Speaker 2: any of us have from just even our diet coke

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Speaker 2: kind of spilling off in our cars. It's he studied

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Speaker 2: this crime scene investigation and cleanup. That was a course

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Speaker 2: he studied. So he's been studying this, he applied it,

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Speaker 2: and now he's just going to sit in jail kind

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Speaker 2: of prison, I should say, And I hope it's miserable.

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Speaker 4: I believe the prosecution said that the car looked like

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Speaker 4: the inside was almost entirely taken apart, and I further

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Speaker 4: believe he said that when they found the car literally

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Speaker 4: had cleaning supplies right next to it, So it was.

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Speaker 8: Well and we know from a lot of the documents

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Speaker 8: that were released that they saw like as they were

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Speaker 8: like basically, I'm going to say the police, but I'm

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Speaker 8: sure there were some sort of federal agents involved to

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Speaker 8: state police all this. That when they were surveilling him,

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Speaker 8: they saw him in the kitchen and going to the

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Speaker 8: garage and then back to the kitchen and the garage.

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Speaker 3: And the assumption made and reading those.

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Speaker 8: Documents was that he was cleaning out the car the

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Speaker 8: night he was arrested actually.

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Speaker 4: And when they were surveiling him also he was sitting

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Speaker 4: there with gloves on his hands.

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Speaker 3: Right, going going through garbage.

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Speaker 4: That was one thing I do remember that at least

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Speaker 4: at some point of being surveilled, body.

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Speaker 3: Right, embody moved.

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Speaker 8: And I'm here with Stephanie Leidaker and Courtney Armstrong and

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Speaker 8: we are getting into the change of plea to guilty

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Speaker 8: of Brian Coberger in the Idaho College murders hearing. If

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Speaker 8: you want to weigh in, how do you feel about this?

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Speaker 8: How do you feel about this plea? Give us a

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Speaker 8: call at eighty to eight thirty one Crime and you know,

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Speaker 8: or use the talkbacks on the iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 3: Hap.

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Speaker 8: I just feel so numb still, Like I just yeah,

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Speaker 8: you know, and you know he parallel that with all

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Speaker 8: the emotions that the family must be feeling. Like even

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Speaker 8: even Brian Coberger's mom and dad, who were president at

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Speaker 8: the hearing today, for the first time since all of

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Speaker 8: this started, they finally came face to face with the victims' families. Right,

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Speaker 8: that must have been difficult for them.

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Speaker 2: I can't even imagine. I talk about a tough spot

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Speaker 2: to be. And you know, we've always heard that they

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Speaker 2: were very loving. You know, something we were talking about

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Speaker 2: earlier today here in the studio and body of your perspective,

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Speaker 2: and this was really interesting. The dad, so Michael Coburger,

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Speaker 2: by all accounts, really has done everything for his son.

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Speaker 2: You know, Courtney and I we've all body you two,

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Speaker 2: We've interviewed so many people in and around the family.

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Speaker 2: He was, you know, working at the school as a janitor,

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Speaker 2: you know, paid to put his son through school. Very

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Speaker 2: hard working parents. We know we knew a few details

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Speaker 2: about dad, right, one that allegedly I guess this is

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Speaker 2: not alleged anymore. Let's take the glove. So after the

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Speaker 2: murders and before the bodies were discovered, this maniac calls home.

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Speaker 2: He has you know, three reported phone calls. We think

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Speaker 2: it was too Dad in the early morning. It would

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Speaker 2: have been like nine am or so six fifteen his time,

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Speaker 2: maybe nine am, I think Eastern time in Pennsylvania.

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Speaker 3: So what was that phone call like? Right?

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Speaker 2: We also know that Dad flew to Idaho and then

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Speaker 2: drove that white Lantra home for the holidays. That was

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Speaker 2: a very infamous ride home because they were pulled over

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Speaker 2: two times. To talk about that emotional regulation to have

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Speaker 2: that happen. Then we also know that you know, Dad

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Speaker 2: was in contact with him. He loves him very very much.

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Speaker 2: Kaylee Gonzalvez his dad. That's a victim of Kaylee Stephen Gonzalvez.

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Speaker 2: He said that he was He seemed kind of fired

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Speaker 2: up about this outside the courthouse today too, that he

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Speaker 2: knew the phone records, and he knows when mister Coburger,

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Speaker 2: Michael Coburger, when he decided to fly to drive his

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Speaker 2: son home, that it was a spontaneous decision, not a

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Speaker 2: long planned one as originally stated. And I think the

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Speaker 2: implication is that Dad knew that there was trouble in

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Speaker 2: Paradise and was maybe harboring this information for the last

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Speaker 2: two and a half years. We do not know this

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Speaker 2: to be true, but that is the implication and that

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Speaker 2: hit me kind of hard too.

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Speaker 8: Yeah, that's you know, speculation alert, right, this is speculation.

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Speaker 8: We've been talking about this for a while about you

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Speaker 8: know that did the family have some kind of suspicion

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Speaker 8: did the sister? I kind of think it was a

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Speaker 8: sister because she did not she was the only family

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Speaker 8: member that didn't attend the extradition hearing, and I kind

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Speaker 8: of opined that she, you know, the knife was ordered

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Speaker 8: on the Amazon family account that was used to murder

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Speaker 8: these four beautiful souls. And was she, you know, on

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Speaker 8: the seventh of December when the bolo went out for

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Speaker 8: the WHITEI Lantra, was she putting things together in her mind?

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Speaker 8: Calls Dad, Dad, I think something might be up with Brian.

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Speaker 3: You know, I don't know. I don't know what the

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Speaker 3: popitation sends.

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Speaker 8: And was he like, everything's fine, Brian's coming home, everything's fine.

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Speaker 8: Don't know, Dad, I think something, you know, did she

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Speaker 8: convince him? And did he buy a last minute ticket

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Speaker 8: to Seattle? Now it's interesting that he flew to Seattle

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Speaker 8: because it's so much more expensive to flat to Spokane

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Speaker 8: last minute and Steve Gonsalves is saying, this morning, I

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Speaker 8: know when you booked your flight? He made How would

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Speaker 8: he know? Reporters asked him. The Nevers asked him, what

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Speaker 8: do you have to say to Brian Coberger's family, and

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Speaker 8: he said, I don't have anything to say to them

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Speaker 8: except I know when you booked your flight. He you know,

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Speaker 8: I'm paraphrasing I know when you booked your flight, And

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Speaker 8: I'm the hairs of my because we've been talking about this,

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Speaker 8: you know, it's all spopulation, and I'm like, oh my god,

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Speaker 8: is this am my confirmation byaseeing myself at this point,

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Speaker 8: like am I you know? Am I wanting that to

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Speaker 8: be true? I don't know, but it was definitely interesting.

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Speaker 8: And I don't know how he would know that. I

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Speaker 8: know that they had their own private vestigator. They've actually

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Speaker 8: had many in that things have come in tip wise

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Speaker 8: to them. It could be they're being hoaxed, because that

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Speaker 8: does happen. People lie all the time.

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Speaker 4: But just praying on victim's family members and giving them.

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Speaker 3: Of course, of course that's intense.

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Speaker 2: So just to play that thought along, because again it's

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Speaker 2: it's a tough one and a tough spot to even imagine,

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Speaker 2: so dad, you're The implication from Kaylee Gonzalvez is, you know,

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Speaker 2: incredible father Stephen Gonzalveez, is that Brian Coberger's father had

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Speaker 2: an inkling and that maybe that's why he.

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Speaker 3: Got on a flight and the last SITH flight, a last.

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Speaker 2: Minute flight to drive home, which was like a random

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Speaker 2: road trip, and they took the longest way.

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Speaker 3: Possible, the weirdest way. Right.

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Speaker 2: We have that, you know, very infamous bodycam footage of

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Speaker 2: Brian Cober being pulled over twice, twice back to back

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Speaker 2: by two separate law enforcement entities.

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Speaker 3: What are the odds, you know, certainly, what are the odds?

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Speaker 4: Well that you know, Jarrett Farantino had said, well, you know,

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Speaker 4: yes that he thought from the beginning Coburger was guilty,

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Speaker 4: and he said otherwise, he's the unluckiest man in the universe.

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Speaker 3: That was just you are bad luck those two. That

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Speaker 3: was divine? Was it record?

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Speaker 4: According to what the FBI said, they were not in

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Speaker 4: contact with on the ground, and the stops were from

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Speaker 4: two different agencies. One was the Sheriff's We break this

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Speaker 4: down in the Idaho Masacre podcast, which actually but.

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Speaker 8: We only had body cam footage from one we only

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Speaker 8: have body cam footage from one of those stops.

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Speaker 3: Is there a reason for that?

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Speaker 8: Listen, my brain is going one hundred miles an hour

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Speaker 8: all the time about Wait, what does that imply?

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Speaker 3: So I want to know more?

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Speaker 2: Wait, because we always thought he was being pulled over

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Speaker 2: because the police were in a coordinated effort to be

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Speaker 2: able to see his hand on the wheel to see if.

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Speaker 8: There were scratches. We're going to find out. Veteran trial

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Speaker 8: attorney Jarrett Farantino rejoins us to discuss the Coburger hearing,

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Speaker 8: and I don't forget. Give us a call at eight

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Speaker 8: eight thirty one Crime with your thoughts on any of

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Speaker 8: tonight's stories.

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Speaker 3: How do you feel.

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Speaker 8: About this plea? What has it done to you? Give

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Speaker 8: us a call, Dick, Great Air, True Crime.

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Speaker 2: Tonight, Diddy, the verdict is in and he is not

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Speaker 2: going home tonight.

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Speaker 3: Much more on that to come.

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Speaker 2: And also an explosive day in the hearing of Brian

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Speaker 2: Coberger where he has officially changed his plea to guilty

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Speaker 2: on all four counts in the Idaho student college murders.

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Speaker 3: It's unbelievable.

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Speaker 2: We have Jarrett Farantino, who also appears in our documentary

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Speaker 2: that's going to be dropping on Peacock the Idaho student murders,

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Speaker 2: and he's going to be weighing in sort of on

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Speaker 2: just the bigness of this and how unexpected it is.

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Speaker 3: So Jarrett, welcome, good evening. How are you They're so good?

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Speaker 3: How are you holding up? I know you've had a foot

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Speaker 3: day as well.

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Speaker 6: It's been a long day. Today is a day that

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Speaker 6: will not be easily forgotten in the crime world and

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Speaker 6: the justice world. That's for sure.

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Speaker 4: No sleep for you, So, Jared, the verdicts are all in.

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Speaker 4: Did he was found guilty of the two lesser charges

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Speaker 4: of transportational prostitution and not guilty of the three more

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Speaker 4: serious charges, including the racketeering. Talk to us about what

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Speaker 4: that means.

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Speaker 6: Well, what it means is he is no longer facing

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Speaker 6: life in prison. He's more likely facing a sentence of

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Speaker 6: probably five years with the two of these cases taken together,

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Speaker 6: which is why he's celebrating. He was staring down the

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Speaker 6: barrel of forever behind bars, and he learned today that

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Speaker 6: three of those counts, of the five that carried the

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Speaker 6: stiffest sentence of life are off the table. He's been acquitted.

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Speaker 2: It's pretty unbelievable. Not the best day for women in America.

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Speaker 2: It's been kind of hard to swallow. But look, they

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Speaker 2: didn't improve the racketeering. They didn't improve the racketeering.

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Speaker 3: Jack.

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Speaker 2: Do you think five years is realistic? I was pretty

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Speaker 2: confident that he was going to walk tonight.

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Speaker 6: Well, I think here's what I don't think has been addressed.

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Speaker 6: To the extents, all of the behavior that was put

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Speaker 6: before the judge can be considered when the judge composed

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Speaker 6: a sentence. So it's this is a judge who's refused

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Speaker 6: to let him out on bail, who sat by and

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Speaker 6: watched that video and heard all of the horrible things

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Speaker 6: that did. He really didn't deny doing. He denied being

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Speaker 6: guilty of a federal offense. So the judge can consider

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Speaker 6: all of that conduct as an enhancement, which may likely

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Speaker 6: put him in a situation where he's going to end

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Speaker 6: up doing potentially like a five year sense. And I'm

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Speaker 6: only saying that conceptually. It maybe four. So I think

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Speaker 6: when you look at the enhancements and the fact that

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Speaker 6: he did not plead guilty, he took a trial, he

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Speaker 6: is looking at at a minimum, if it's fifteen to

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Speaker 6: twenty one months on one count with a zero prior

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Speaker 6: record score, and.

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Speaker 8: They won't do time served or anything like that.

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Speaker 6: Oh he'll get he'll get credit for the time he's

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Speaker 6: been in. But at time serve sentences he walks out

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Speaker 6: that very day. I don't see that happening, just with

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Speaker 6: all that's before the judge.

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Speaker 3: Wow, Wow, unbelievable. It's funny.

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Speaker 2: He did seem pretty excited, and you think about it,

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Speaker 2: five years is no you know, walk in the park.

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Speaker 2: That's still a very stiff sentence for a normal person.

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Speaker 2: I guess we're just all struggling. I guess, you know,

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Speaker 2: we all have heard that there was this letter written

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Speaker 2: by Cassie Ventura, his ex girlfriend, who you know, delivered

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Speaker 2: her baby very soon after testifying against him. She was

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Speaker 2: the first victim we've seen that, you know, terrible footage

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Speaker 2: on CNN where he was beating her as she was

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Speaker 2: trying to get away in an elevator, and that she

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Speaker 2: felt terribly scared if he had been released on bail.

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Speaker 2: You know, some of our contacts suggested that if it

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Speaker 2: wasn't Diddy and just a regular average drow off the

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Speaker 2: street who had been charged and found guilty of similar charges,

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Speaker 2: may have walked with time served, but look, he does

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Speaker 2: seem like he has a violent tendency, and I feel

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Speaker 2: worried for the victims who did face him, or anybody

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Speaker 2: frankly who testified against him.

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Speaker 3: I mean, that's really scary stuff. It is.

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Speaker 8: And to your point, Cassie Ventura's a representatives wrote a

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Speaker 8: letter to the judge asking for bail to be denied

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Speaker 8: because she, you know, while through her representatives, said in

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Speaker 8: the letter that she's concerned for the people that testify

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Speaker 8: that you know, Diddy could be dangerous, could be well

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Speaker 8: that's what she says.

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Speaker 3: Well, I mean it's.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, like we know he is. I think that's that

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Speaker 2: part has been slightly proven. So I do feel relieved

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Speaker 2: that the judge, you know, took that into consideration. Do

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Speaker 2: you think that was maybe the thing that moved the

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Speaker 2: needle in terms of him not getting out tonight, Jared.

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Speaker 6: Well, that's certainly a big factor, the fact that there

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Speaker 6: are people legitimately afraid of him. But again, the fact

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Speaker 6: that the judge may sentence him ultimately to a jail sentence,

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Speaker 6: the judge would keep him in to earn time only

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Speaker 6: to bring him back make much sense to let him

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Speaker 6: out now, Cassie Sear and James Spear. That is it's legitimate.

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Speaker 6: Look at what they were, Look what they were subjected

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Speaker 6: to at his hand. One thing we said the other

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Speaker 6: night was they've already testified. You know, if Diddy gets out,

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Speaker 6: you would hope somebody who's been given another chance that

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Speaker 6: life would not go after the witnesses in their case.

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Speaker 6: You know, he'd be on the other side of the

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Speaker 6: planet if he could, away from them. But that doesn't

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Speaker 6: mean they don't have every right to be afraid. I

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Speaker 6: get that.

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Speaker 8: We are True Crime tonight on iHeartRadio, I Am Body

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Speaker 8: Move in here with Courtney Armstrong and Stephanie Leidecker and

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Speaker 8: veteran trial attorney Jarrett Farantino discussing the Diddy broots.

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Speaker 3: Do you agree with the outcome?

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Speaker 8: Give us a call at eight eight thirty one Crime

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Speaker 8: or use the iHeartRadio app and hit the little microphone

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Speaker 8: and give us a little talk back and we will

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Speaker 8: play it on the air. Jarrett, what can you explain

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Speaker 8: for everyone, including myself, what the Man Act is, because

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Speaker 8: that's the only thing he's been he's been found guilty of, right.

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Speaker 6: What should the man act? The Man Act is the

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Speaker 6: transportation across state lines of an individual for a commercial

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Speaker 6: sex act. That's what it is and why it becomes

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Speaker 6: a federal client. It's because you're involving interstate travel. That's

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Speaker 6: really the connecting piece that allows for the federal government

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Speaker 6: to bring a charge under the man.

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Speaker 8: That's what it is, and that's the only thing he's

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Speaker 8: been found guilty of, right, the Man Act violation. Basically,

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Speaker 8: he's guilty of violating that federal law.

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Speaker 6: And it's closely related to the other charge, which was

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Speaker 6: the trafficking charge. But if you will remember, the trafficking

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Speaker 6: charge required that additional very serious element of coercion, fraud, threats,

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Speaker 6: and that's where that's where the disconnect was with the

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Speaker 6: jury and the prosecution's case. Here's you know, when you

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Speaker 6: have a case where the defense comes in and their

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Speaker 6: defense is essentially this, we agree with everything the prosecution said.

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Speaker 6: Our client did those things, but that doesn't make him

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Speaker 6: guilty of a federal offense. That's a powerful defense. It

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Speaker 6: takes the wind out of the sales of the prosecution.

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Speaker 6: And what happens here is they say, yes, he did

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Speaker 6: these things, but also these were at times consensual. The

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Speaker 6: defense is saying at all times were consensual acts. That

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Speaker 6: is where the reasonable doubt came in in this case.

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Speaker 6: I think when it came time for the jury to deliberate,

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Speaker 6: clearly that was the issue they had with that particular charge.

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Speaker 4: But just a question, and maybe I just personally can't

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Speaker 4: get past it, Jarrett. But having seen the jury saw

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Speaker 4: the video of Cassie being beaten, how is that not

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Speaker 4: force or coercion?

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Speaker 6: In my mind it is how they see it as

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Speaker 6: not force or coercion, and Filio did a good job

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Speaker 6: of falling on that sort. He says, Look, this is

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Speaker 6: domestic violence. They're in a fight after what was a

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Speaker 6: consensual act. That's not threat or coercion because at that

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Speaker 6: point you're gelling the two the game. Is it a

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Speaker 6: consensual act where there was a physical assault afterwards? Or

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Speaker 6: was it trafficking and a physical assault? The jury didn't

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Speaker 6: see it that way. I agree with you. I mean

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Speaker 6: my thought on that I thought Diddy was going to

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Speaker 6: be convicted of those four underlying charges. I was surprised,

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Speaker 6: and look, I said, you see that, Leo, you can't

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Speaker 6: unsee it. But the jury in their mind didn't make

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Speaker 6: that connection.

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Speaker 2: And as recently as yesterday Obviously they were at a

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Speaker 2: bit of a deadlock, right The jury was saying that

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Speaker 2: they were not going to be able to kind of

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Speaker 2: come to an agreement at this point, and you know,

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Speaker 2: the judge was like, well, you're going to have to

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Speaker 2: go back in there and keep sorting through it. I'm

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Speaker 2: just curious in your experience what happens in these hours.

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Speaker 2: You know, in one night's time, it goes from you know,

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Speaker 2: life behind bars in a federal prison. And I've learned that,

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Speaker 2: you know, federal trials have a pretty high success rate

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Speaker 2: in terms of convictions. What happens to turn that around?

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Speaker 2: Is it just hours and hours and hours happens.

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Speaker 6: You know, there's no perfect formula. Time is certainly a

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Speaker 6: component of it. That's a really good point. But and

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Speaker 6: they're not concerning themselves with the sentence. They're not thinking

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Speaker 6: about life sentence versus five years or ten years. They're

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Speaker 6: thinking about the elements of the crime. Rico charge was

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Speaker 6: the most complicated instruction where they hung up on a predicate,

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Speaker 6: where they hung up on whether or not there was

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Speaker 6: an organization. And the right thing for the judge to

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Speaker 6: do at that point is say, hey, we've all been

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Speaker 6: here for seven weeks. We understand, you believe it has

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Speaker 6: go back and try harder, and oftentimes they come back

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Speaker 6: and the decision is made, and that's what happened here.

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Speaker 6: Oftentimes they end up hopelessly deadlock, and they remain deadlock,

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00:22:39,480 --> 00:22:41,560
Speaker 6: and when they come back to the jury they say, judge,

437
00:22:41,880 --> 00:22:43,320
Speaker 6: you know, we're not getting where. They come back to

438
00:22:43,359 --> 00:22:45,680
Speaker 6: the judge they say, hey, we're not getting any further here.

439
00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:48,240
Speaker 8: And do you think there's any scenario in which the

440
00:22:49,040 --> 00:22:52,679
Speaker 8: federal government maybe overcharge him and maybe should have not

441
00:22:52,760 --> 00:22:54,480
Speaker 8: done rico and done something else.

442
00:22:54,960 --> 00:22:58,119
Speaker 6: Yes, I think that we talked. We have all talked

443
00:22:58,320 --> 00:23:01,119
Speaker 6: a great length about the mafia traditional use of the

444
00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:05,800
Speaker 6: rico charge. Right, it's knowing that, knowing how it fit

445
00:23:05,920 --> 00:23:09,320
Speaker 6: pretty squarely in the world of organized crime and street gangs.

446
00:23:09,920 --> 00:23:14,639
Speaker 6: To do that charge over the life of Ditty was

447
00:23:14,840 --> 00:23:17,480
Speaker 6: a bit of a stretch, and it was a bridge

448
00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:21,040
Speaker 6: too far for that jury. They overreached, And when you overreached,

449
00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:25,040
Speaker 6: lose credibility because then things start to crumble and the

450
00:23:25,080 --> 00:23:27,560
Speaker 6: rest of your case is impacted because when you shoot

451
00:23:27,560 --> 00:23:29,640
Speaker 6: for the stars, that's what happened. I think they did

452
00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:31,120
Speaker 6: overcharge something that.

453
00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:33,800
Speaker 2: I always noticed in some of these bigger cases. There

454
00:23:33,920 --> 00:23:38,200
Speaker 2: becomes this numbness that happens after your brain absorbs too

455
00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:41,640
Speaker 2: much toxic information. You know, if you're on a jury,

456
00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:44,800
Speaker 2: and you know, when Cassie Ventura took the stands, it

457
00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:47,399
Speaker 2: was draw it was jaw dropping, right. We all couldn't

458
00:23:47,400 --> 00:23:49,560
Speaker 2: believe what we were hearing in this abuse. And we've

459
00:23:49,560 --> 00:23:52,600
Speaker 2: seen the video and then and then now you add

460
00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:56,000
Speaker 2: weeks and weeks. It's almost like our human brains can't

461
00:23:56,040 --> 00:23:58,240
Speaker 2: tolerate that much information.

462
00:23:58,400 --> 00:23:59,880
Speaker 3: We get fatigued a little bit.

463
00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:03,600
Speaker 2: Is there anything now in retrospect as a trial attorney?

464
00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:05,520
Speaker 2: I know you've done so many huge cases and we're

465
00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:08,359
Speaker 2: so grateful to have you to talk to about this again.

466
00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:11,400
Speaker 2: Not any no judgment on the prosecution. I think they

467
00:24:11,400 --> 00:24:14,600
Speaker 2: did a great job. Is there anything just retrospectively that

468
00:24:14,760 --> 00:24:17,440
Speaker 2: you would do differently if you were in their seat?

469
00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:21,240
Speaker 6: Yes, I would have worked harder to define the organization.

470
00:24:21,480 --> 00:24:24,520
Speaker 6: I would have had more there. I would have had

471
00:24:25,119 --> 00:24:29,240
Speaker 6: additional witnesses just setting forth you're looking for. You have

472
00:24:29,359 --> 00:24:32,000
Speaker 6: to prove that organization exists as much as you have

473
00:24:32,119 --> 00:24:37,159
Speaker 6: to prove trafficking existed or prostitution existed. And it seemed

474
00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:40,560
Speaker 6: to me an afterthought, it was text messages, it was receipts,

475
00:24:40,720 --> 00:24:44,200
Speaker 6: but it wasn't one particular witness that don't think about

476
00:24:44,200 --> 00:24:48,040
Speaker 6: the mafia trials. They have these chains of command and

477
00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:52,240
Speaker 6: these family trees, and you have soldiers, and they talked

478
00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:54,840
Speaker 6: about those things. But I didn't see it. I didn't

479
00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:57,560
Speaker 6: feel that organization. If you're going to charge it, you've

480
00:24:57,560 --> 00:24:58,280
Speaker 6: got to prove it.

481
00:24:58,640 --> 00:24:59,680
Speaker 3: You're right, You're right.

482
00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:02,199
Speaker 8: Well, coming up next, we're going to be continuing the

483
00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:06,440
Speaker 8: discussion of Ditty's shocking bail hearing and verdict with Jarrett Farantino,

484
00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:09,560
Speaker 8: and later more on Brian Coberger's guilty plea in the

485
00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:12,680
Speaker 8: Idaho college murders, and don't forget to give us a

486
00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:15,199
Speaker 8: call at eight eight eight thirty one Crime with your

487
00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:18,639
Speaker 8: thoughts on any of tonight's stories. Sticker here True Crime Tonight,

488
00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:20,680
Speaker 8: where we're talking true crime all the time.

489
00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:33,879
Speaker 2: If you haven't been watching the news. Diddy is not

490
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:36,440
Speaker 2: going home tonight. He is not allowed to go home

491
00:25:36,480 --> 00:25:40,119
Speaker 2: on bail and the verdict is in. We're unpacking that

492
00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:44,159
Speaker 2: with Jarrett Farantino and also Brian Coberger, the accused in

493
00:25:44,280 --> 00:25:47,880
Speaker 2: the Idaho college murders. If you haven't been following that

494
00:25:47,960 --> 00:25:51,560
Speaker 2: Brian Coberger was accused and had been pleading not guilty

495
00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:54,600
Speaker 2: to all four counts in the Idaho student murders, and

496
00:25:54,760 --> 00:25:58,760
Speaker 2: today was in court at a hearing and has officially

497
00:25:58,840 --> 00:26:03,040
Speaker 2: said he is guilty and it was impossible to witness

498
00:26:03,200 --> 00:26:06,520
Speaker 2: and to watch. It's been breaking news all day. We'll

499
00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:09,359
Speaker 2: be uncovering more on that case as well, but we

500
00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:11,480
Speaker 2: really want to hear from you, so please join the

501
00:26:11,480 --> 00:26:15,280
Speaker 2: conversation eight eight eight three to one Crime. I'm Stephanie.

502
00:26:15,480 --> 00:26:18,480
Speaker 2: This is Courtney and Body. We are here together and

503
00:26:18,520 --> 00:26:20,760
Speaker 2: we have a caller on the line. Yeah, yeah, welcome.

504
00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:21,560
Speaker 2: What's your question?

505
00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:27,280
Speaker 9: Yes, my question is is there any possibility that Brian

506
00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:31,960
Speaker 9: Coleberger could now be charged federally since he crossed state lines?

507
00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:37,480
Speaker 9: And follow up with that on the clear deal, I

508
00:26:37,560 --> 00:26:40,520
Speaker 9: thought that it said life without the possibility of parole,

509
00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:42,320
Speaker 9: but the judge always said alive.

510
00:26:43,200 --> 00:26:47,520
Speaker 2: That's a very interesting point and attached I hadn't even considered,

511
00:26:47,560 --> 00:26:49,960
Speaker 2: certainly the latter point. I don't think he can be

512
00:26:50,080 --> 00:26:53,919
Speaker 2: charged federally, although the state lines is a very unique

513
00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:54,679
Speaker 2: interesting point.

514
00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:55,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't think.

515
00:26:56,040 --> 00:26:58,200
Speaker 8: I don't think because he crossed straight lines, they would

516
00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:02,440
Speaker 8: charge him federally since he's already admitted guilt to you know,

517
00:27:02,640 --> 00:27:05,959
Speaker 8: the state charges, and I don't. I don't know what

518
00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:11,359
Speaker 8: benefit that would have for you know, anyone really, but

519
00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:13,960
Speaker 8: it is interesting. It is an interesting thought. And I

520
00:27:14,040 --> 00:27:16,359
Speaker 8: know that when all this first happened in the true

521
00:27:16,359 --> 00:27:18,879
Speaker 8: crime community, we were all kind of speculating, you know,

522
00:27:19,240 --> 00:27:21,280
Speaker 8: why hasn't he been charged federally? And I don't have

523
00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:23,440
Speaker 8: the answer to that, because he did cross state lines

524
00:27:23,440 --> 00:27:27,680
Speaker 8: from Washington where he lives in Pullman, Washington, and right across,

525
00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:30,920
Speaker 8: you know, if it's like a five minute drive is Moscow, Idaho.

526
00:27:31,040 --> 00:27:33,800
Speaker 8: So he does technically cross state lines. But I don't

527
00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:36,080
Speaker 8: think he can be charged federally. We could ask heare

528
00:27:36,080 --> 00:27:37,200
Speaker 8: at Farantino.

529
00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:39,360
Speaker 2: Such a good point, what do you think? What's your

530
00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:42,560
Speaker 2: what was your interpretation of the hearing today?

531
00:27:43,200 --> 00:27:46,840
Speaker 6: I did watch the whole line and it was incredible.

532
00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:50,080
Speaker 6: I mean it was incredible after watching nine hundred days

533
00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:52,440
Speaker 6: of nine hundred and sixty two days, I think it's

534
00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:55,560
Speaker 6: been since the murders and watched Brian Kolberger since he

535
00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:59,440
Speaker 6: emerged on the scene deny his involvement, fight tooth and nail,

536
00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:03,240
Speaker 6: to stand in that courtroom and admit he did this.

537
00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:05,359
Speaker 6: I mean that was jarring.

538
00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:08,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, what is cicico? What is sicico in?

539
00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:08,920
Speaker 9: Jared?

540
00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:11,320
Speaker 2: You probably don't even know this, but the documentary The

541
00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:14,919
Speaker 2: Idaho Student Murders on Peacock that you're so wonderful in

542
00:28:15,119 --> 00:28:18,640
Speaker 2: that'll be dropping at three am in the morning because

543
00:28:19,320 --> 00:28:22,000
Speaker 2: these new developments have really shaken things up.

544
00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:25,160
Speaker 3: So we hope you all tune in. Thank you, Fret,

545
00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:25,840
Speaker 3: Thank you for your call.

546
00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:28,960
Speaker 4: Yeah yeah, And then we actually have another caller, Jack

547
00:28:29,240 --> 00:28:30,040
Speaker 4: on the line.

548
00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:33,640
Speaker 3: Hello, Hi, Jack, what's your question? Welcome?

549
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:37,520
Speaker 6: Hi. So I'm wondering with all the not guilty verdicts.

550
00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:40,000
Speaker 10: We've obviously seen all the proof of him beating up Cassie,

551
00:28:40,040 --> 00:28:43,160
Speaker 10: We've seen Kay Cutty's testimony about having this car blown up,

552
00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:45,520
Speaker 10: We've seen Kanye West at the trial. What do you

553
00:28:45,560 --> 00:28:47,920
Speaker 10: think this overall said about the power dynamics of the

554
00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:50,920
Speaker 10: entertainment industry and the fact is he's able to possibly

555
00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:53,040
Speaker 10: be getting away with this just because of the fact

556
00:28:53,080 --> 00:28:54,840
Speaker 10: that he has all that money and influence over the

557
00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:55,600
Speaker 10: music industry.

558
00:28:56,160 --> 00:28:58,080
Speaker 3: I love this question, Jack, question.

559
00:28:58,520 --> 00:29:01,240
Speaker 4: I'm actually looking I had been and you know, scrubbing

560
00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 4: around where we've all been just voraciously gathering information as

561
00:29:04,840 --> 00:29:06,680
Speaker 4: much as we can, and I have a couple of

562
00:29:06,720 --> 00:29:10,080
Speaker 4: things that people in the industry have put out. Kesha

563
00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:13,120
Speaker 4: shared this on X She said, Cassie.

564
00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:14,320
Speaker 3: I believe you, I love you.

565
00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:17,920
Speaker 4: Your strength is a beacon for every survivor. And then

566
00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:21,680
Speaker 4: Fitty sent made his own post about Ditty, and I'm

567
00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:23,360
Speaker 4: not sure if he was mocking him. It was a

568
00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:27,960
Speaker 4: little confusing, said did he beat the Fed's hand clap?

569
00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:31,600
Speaker 4: Hand clap, handclap? That boy a bad man beat the rico.

570
00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:35,240
Speaker 4: So I actually can't even tell if it's supportive or

571
00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:35,840
Speaker 4: a mocking.

572
00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:40,680
Speaker 2: Well, remember it's comic, a long complicated relationship because he

573
00:29:40,920 --> 00:29:45,440
Speaker 2: is fifty Cent also was doing a documentary about Ditty

574
00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:48,000
Speaker 2: and it was said to be really explosive and that

575
00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:50,360
Speaker 2: he was lining up all of the biggest names in

576
00:29:50,400 --> 00:29:53,560
Speaker 2: the industry and Jack. You'll remember, we've heard all of

577
00:29:53,600 --> 00:29:56,719
Speaker 2: these hip hop moguls were going to come down and

578
00:29:56,800 --> 00:29:59,680
Speaker 2: be sent away. And you know, there hasn't been a

579
00:29:59,720 --> 00:30:02,720
Speaker 2: single celebrity other than Kanye rolling in for ten minutes,

580
00:30:03,080 --> 00:30:05,720
Speaker 2: and we see one of his sons, Christian, was promoting

581
00:30:05,760 --> 00:30:09,200
Speaker 2: his new song that he's made with Kanye dropping today

582
00:30:09,400 --> 00:30:12,640
Speaker 2: love and I don't know, it just seems like Diddy's

583
00:30:12,640 --> 00:30:15,000
Speaker 2: getting away with it, and it's a real cue to

584
00:30:15,080 --> 00:30:17,840
Speaker 2: the hip hop industry or just in general that it's

585
00:30:17,880 --> 00:30:18,560
Speaker 2: okay to.

586
00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:21,080
Speaker 8: Look at christ the hell out of people. Chris Brown,

587
00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:24,360
Speaker 8: you remember he? You know, there were pictures of beautiful

588
00:30:24,440 --> 00:30:29,160
Speaker 8: Rihanna and her gorgeous face just demolished by Chris Brown.

589
00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:33,440
Speaker 8: And he's living life in yeah, life like nothing happened,

590
00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:36,240
Speaker 8: you know? Is it because these people are in the

591
00:30:36,280 --> 00:30:39,480
Speaker 8: music industry, this is happening? Like Jack is asking, are

592
00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:42,440
Speaker 8: they so powerful? Are they too big to fail? I

593
00:30:42,440 --> 00:30:45,080
Speaker 8: guess yes is the answer. I guess, you know, Jack,

594
00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:47,800
Speaker 8: we actually don't know the actual answer. But to me,

595
00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:50,560
Speaker 8: just as an outsider looking in, yeah, it seems like

596
00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:54,400
Speaker 8: it's open territory to beat up who you want, and

597
00:30:54,480 --> 00:30:57,480
Speaker 8: as long as you have money and guns and power, you'll.

598
00:30:57,280 --> 00:31:00,160
Speaker 3: Probably get away with it. Thank you, Jack for your call.

599
00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:02,720
Speaker 4: We actually have one more caller on the line. We

600
00:31:02,800 --> 00:31:03,560
Speaker 4: have Meredith.

601
00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:09,440
Speaker 11: Hi, Meredith, I had a question about the Brian Koburger case. Yes, yeah,

602
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:14,000
Speaker 11: I was wondering if the prosecution was in touch with

603
00:31:14,040 --> 00:31:17,360
Speaker 11: the victims' families before they went ahead and allowed for

604
00:31:17,440 --> 00:31:18,680
Speaker 11: the plea deal to take place.

605
00:31:19,560 --> 00:31:20,560
Speaker 3: This is a good question.

606
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:24,719
Speaker 8: Yes they were informed, they weren't. But here's the thing.

607
00:31:24,760 --> 00:31:28,680
Speaker 8: They were informed Sunday night in an email. They they

608
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:31,480
Speaker 8: apparently they had a meeting on Friday, just the one

609
00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:34,440
Speaker 8: that just passed, and they floated the idea that there,

610
00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:36,280
Speaker 8: you know, how would you feel about a plea deal?

611
00:31:36,680 --> 00:31:41,040
Speaker 8: And each family probably gave, you know, an answer, and

612
00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:44,120
Speaker 8: then on Sunday, according to Steve Gunsalvus, the father of

613
00:31:44,160 --> 00:31:47,520
Speaker 8: Kaylee Gunsalvas, who is a victim in this case. According

614
00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:51,000
Speaker 8: to Steve, they got an email Sunday with a letter

615
00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:55,080
Speaker 8: attached saying that they were going to accept the plea deal.

616
00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:59,840
Speaker 8: So they were informed, but you know, they don't really

617
00:32:00,120 --> 00:32:02,560
Speaker 8: have to. You know, I hate to. I'm not trying

618
00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:05,800
Speaker 8: to be mean or blunt or you know, cross or whatever,

619
00:32:05,840 --> 00:32:09,000
Speaker 8: but they don't really have to. They don't have to

620
00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:11,040
Speaker 8: do what the family wants.

621
00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:15,520
Speaker 2: Or take them into consideration necessarily. And they're representing the state.

622
00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:18,280
Speaker 8: Right, they're representing that, they're representing us, the public.

623
00:32:18,520 --> 00:32:21,800
Speaker 2: I gotta tell you, it's very divided to answer that further.

624
00:32:22,120 --> 00:32:25,720
Speaker 2: You know, the Mogan family, the Gonzalvez family, they all

625
00:32:25,760 --> 00:32:28,760
Speaker 2: came up together those you know, as you know the victims,

626
00:32:28,840 --> 00:32:32,520
Speaker 2: Madison Mogan and Kaylee Gonzalvez were childhood friends. They were

627
00:32:32,560 --> 00:32:35,040
Speaker 2: so super tight. The families were very tight. They're a

628
00:32:35,080 --> 00:32:40,720
Speaker 2: little divided on this right now. Ethan Chapin's mother and family. Frankly,

629
00:32:41,040 --> 00:32:43,680
Speaker 2: he was a triplet. They've been very you know, kind

630
00:32:43,680 --> 00:32:46,600
Speaker 2: of at peace with this next step it appears. And

631
00:32:46,920 --> 00:32:49,160
Speaker 2: you know Xana Kernodle's family, I mean, look at they

632
00:32:49,240 --> 00:32:52,600
Speaker 2: all have varying opinions. So I guess, no matter how

633
00:32:52,640 --> 00:32:56,360
Speaker 2: you slice it, even if the prosecution did spend more

634
00:32:56,400 --> 00:33:00,320
Speaker 2: time with them individually, one would hope they would they

635
00:33:00,640 --> 00:33:03,280
Speaker 2: might not have gotten to a unanimous decision one way

636
00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:06,560
Speaker 2: or the other. And you're curious what your answer on

637
00:33:06,600 --> 00:33:07,040
Speaker 2: that would be.

638
00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:10,320
Speaker 11: Oh, okay, I mean I would think, well, first of all,

639
00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:13,400
Speaker 11: if they're not going to if they're not obligated to

640
00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:16,360
Speaker 11: take that into consideration, you know, they're not going to

641
00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 11: get any answers to where the murder weapon currently is

642
00:33:21,080 --> 00:33:26,320
Speaker 11: and why these four individuals. So not only are they

643
00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:28,960
Speaker 11: going against some of the family's wishes, but they're not

644
00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:31,200
Speaker 11: getting any answers to any of the questions that I

645
00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:33,640
Speaker 11: think right most people would want to.

646
00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:37,320
Speaker 8: Know, and that's infuriating exactly. That is infuriating to me.

647
00:33:37,760 --> 00:33:39,480
Speaker 2: Couldn't agree more like, how does he not have to

648
00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:41,560
Speaker 2: stand up and face the music and turn around and

649
00:33:41,600 --> 00:33:45,120
Speaker 2: stare the families in the face whose lives he's destroyed.

650
00:33:45,360 --> 00:33:46,960
Speaker 3: He just looked like he was sitting there like a

651
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:51,520
Speaker 3: cool cucumber. Thank you very much for your question. Ak Meredith.

652
00:33:51,680 --> 00:33:53,760
Speaker 3: This is true crime tonight. I'm Courtney Armstrong.

653
00:33:53,800 --> 00:33:57,120
Speaker 4: I'm here with Body Move and Stephanie Leidecker, and we

654
00:33:57,280 --> 00:34:02,120
Speaker 4: have Jarrett Farentino, prosecutor extra naire, who is helping us

655
00:34:02,200 --> 00:34:06,760
Speaker 4: break down both Diddy and Coburger. So please continue joining

656
00:34:06,760 --> 00:34:10,640
Speaker 4: the conversation. Eighty eight three to one crime Jared, I

657
00:34:10,680 --> 00:34:14,640
Speaker 4: actually wanted to go back quickly to the first of

658
00:34:14,680 --> 00:34:18,560
Speaker 4: those three calls. Is there any in any instance that

659
00:34:18,600 --> 00:34:21,680
Speaker 4: Brian Coburger would be or could be charged federally?

660
00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:24,480
Speaker 6: There has to be a federal nexus. Now, if he

661
00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:26,799
Speaker 6: kidnapped one of the victims and took them across state

662
00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:30,800
Speaker 6: lines and the clime was continuing clearly, then the FBI

663
00:34:31,239 --> 00:34:33,759
Speaker 6: would have jurisdics to bring a case like they assisted

664
00:34:33,760 --> 00:34:39,520
Speaker 6: in this investigation. But typically murder is a state climb. Now,

665
00:34:39,560 --> 00:34:43,799
Speaker 6: if it was motivated by race, if it was a

666
00:34:43,920 --> 00:34:46,479
Speaker 6: terrorist act, those are the kind of things that bring

667
00:34:46,600 --> 00:34:49,399
Speaker 6: the arm of the federal government and their charges in.

668
00:34:49,920 --> 00:34:53,760
Speaker 6: This was more akin to a state prosecution. And remember

669
00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:56,800
Speaker 6: state carries life, so that the sentence is as severe

670
00:34:57,160 --> 00:35:00,279
Speaker 6: as it is in the federal system. So really, when

671
00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:03,239
Speaker 6: you see a killing like this, the crime for the

672
00:35:03,239 --> 00:35:06,760
Speaker 6: most part was contained in Idaho, it could be brought

673
00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:08,040
Speaker 6: exclusively in Idaho.

674
00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:11,560
Speaker 4: Would just to follow up on that, I think I

675
00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:14,680
Speaker 4: know the answer, But yes, everything appeared to happen in Idaho.

676
00:35:15,239 --> 00:35:18,920
Speaker 4: Let's make believe that the murder weapon was dropped in

677
00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:21,080
Speaker 4: Washington on his way home.

678
00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:24,480
Speaker 6: That has no bearing, correct, No, No, I mean the

679
00:35:25,280 --> 00:35:29,560
Speaker 6: grab him into the crime was in Idaho. So that

680
00:35:29,600 --> 00:35:33,000
Speaker 6: wouldn't necessarily bring the Feds in. Just because a piece

681
00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:36,400
Speaker 6: of evidence was in another state or a defendant fled

682
00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:39,160
Speaker 6: to another state, that alone wouldn't make it happen. There

683
00:35:39,239 --> 00:35:41,880
Speaker 6: has to be like that criminal nexus to a federal charge.

684
00:35:42,120 --> 00:35:44,360
Speaker 6: Was it an act of terror, was it kidnapping? Was

685
00:35:44,360 --> 00:35:47,680
Speaker 6: there an interstate drug ring going on? Things of that

686
00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:50,080
Speaker 6: nature more typically bring the Feds in.

687
00:35:50,480 --> 00:35:53,200
Speaker 2: That makes sense, Jared, I've never had the opportunity to

688
00:35:53,239 --> 00:35:57,279
Speaker 2: ask you, despite you being in the documentary, did you always.

689
00:35:57,000 --> 00:36:00,719
Speaker 6: Think he was guilty one thousand percent the unlucky I

690
00:36:00,840 --> 00:36:02,920
Speaker 6: say yes, I say it in the documentary, or the

691
00:36:03,000 --> 00:36:05,239
Speaker 6: unlucky I don't want to ruin it, or the unluckiest

692
00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:07,680
Speaker 6: guy in the world, because it was the other guy

693
00:36:07,719 --> 00:36:10,960
Speaker 6: with his car, his phone number, his DNA, his bushy eyebrows,

694
00:36:11,200 --> 00:36:13,920
Speaker 6: his weirdness. That's what I always thought.

695
00:36:14,520 --> 00:36:17,680
Speaker 2: You put it that way, Yeah, no, I know it

696
00:36:17,680 --> 00:36:20,040
Speaker 2: does seem pretty obvious in retrospect. And how about the

697
00:36:20,040 --> 00:36:21,880
Speaker 2: fact that he was so unemotional. What do you make

698
00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:22,120
Speaker 2: of that?

699
00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:25,200
Speaker 6: Well, I think that it goes hand in hand with

700
00:36:25,239 --> 00:36:28,279
Speaker 6: the weirdo that he's been his whole life. I hate,

701
00:36:28,320 --> 00:36:30,560
Speaker 6: you know, not to be derogatory, but that's what he is.

702
00:36:30,600 --> 00:36:32,279
Speaker 3: Come on, I mean, I think we can take the

703
00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:33,120
Speaker 3: gloves off now.

704
00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:35,680
Speaker 2: We might have been a little bit more careful when

705
00:36:35,680 --> 00:36:37,680
Speaker 2: we were doing the documentary and you sat down for

706
00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:38,720
Speaker 2: that interview.

707
00:36:38,280 --> 00:36:39,080
Speaker 3: Because we didn't know.

708
00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:42,920
Speaker 2: But now this man has confessed. Yes, he's a weirdo,

709
00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:44,400
Speaker 2: he's horrible.

710
00:36:44,320 --> 00:36:48,720
Speaker 4: And a murderer. Listen, it's an intense day. We have Diddy,

711
00:36:49,040 --> 00:36:53,560
Speaker 4: we have coburger, and we have you, so please join

712
00:36:53,640 --> 00:36:55,360
Speaker 4: us eight at eight three one crime.

713
00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:58,880
Speaker 2: We're all a little exhausted from it, so emotionally, I

714
00:36:58,920 --> 00:37:01,799
Speaker 2: feel like we all need a a teeny time out.

715
00:37:02,120 --> 00:37:04,360
Speaker 2: I don't know what to say, but and we have

716
00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:06,640
Speaker 2: a talk back, so we can go to that right now.

717
00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:11,840
Speaker 12: I this is Kim, and I just want to say

718
00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:16,640
Speaker 12: that this whole verdict being in on Ditty as of

719
00:37:16,719 --> 00:37:20,120
Speaker 12: right now, we don't know anything specific yet, but I

720
00:37:20,680 --> 00:37:23,880
Speaker 12: believe that this is the beginning of the end. Regardless

721
00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:26,960
Speaker 12: of what happens with him today. I think cases are

722
00:37:27,000 --> 00:37:30,640
Speaker 12: just going to keep coming out and this is the downfall.

723
00:37:31,280 --> 00:37:33,120
Speaker 3: Oh so you mean so yeah?

724
00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:36,560
Speaker 2: Like So that's an interesting point that because regardless of

725
00:37:36,640 --> 00:37:39,080
Speaker 2: how today went, which I think was probably a real

726
00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:42,360
Speaker 2: win for Ditty, despite my feelings of thinking he's a

727
00:37:42,400 --> 00:37:45,239
Speaker 2: complete animal, the way he's treated women and the fact

728
00:37:45,239 --> 00:37:47,120
Speaker 2: that he's going to get away with it is is

729
00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:50,080
Speaker 2: just sickening, frankly, But that's true because he does have

730
00:37:50,120 --> 00:37:53,799
Speaker 2: about fifty civil lawsuits against him at this point, so

731
00:37:54,360 --> 00:37:56,920
Speaker 2: trouble is not over. And as of right now, you

732
00:37:56,960 --> 00:37:59,799
Speaker 2: know the next step of this, which is sentencing. He's

733
00:38:00,280 --> 00:38:03,640
Speaker 2: up to twenty years likely very unlikely, Jared, you have said,

734
00:38:03,719 --> 00:38:09,080
Speaker 2: you know five maybe even that I hope happens. Look

735
00:38:09,400 --> 00:38:12,880
Speaker 2: is this could go a lot of different ways, I suppose, Jared,

736
00:38:12,920 --> 00:38:15,200
Speaker 2: Do you think that is true? Is this just now

737
00:38:15,600 --> 00:38:18,680
Speaker 2: going to be the beginning of lots more problems for Diddy?

738
00:38:18,920 --> 00:38:23,120
Speaker 2: Or is this guy just gonna pay his way out

739
00:38:23,160 --> 00:38:23,640
Speaker 2: of everything?

740
00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:26,879
Speaker 6: Well, you know, it's hard to say. I think there

741
00:38:26,920 --> 00:38:29,120
Speaker 6: are people that want to put him under oath and

742
00:38:29,239 --> 00:38:32,040
Speaker 6: ask him questions in those civil lawsuits. So he's going

743
00:38:32,120 --> 00:38:35,400
Speaker 6: to have some tough days ahead, and a lot of

744
00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:37,280
Speaker 6: those days are going to be inside of a courtroom.

745
00:38:37,400 --> 00:38:41,360
Speaker 6: So this isn't Look at the Bill Cosby case. Cosby

746
00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:44,520
Speaker 6: was facing civil lawsuits, goes into a jail cell, gets

747
00:38:44,600 --> 00:38:47,600
Speaker 6: out only to face the music in civil courts. So

748
00:38:48,400 --> 00:38:52,720
Speaker 6: it's very much like that situation. So Diddy's life got

749
00:38:52,960 --> 00:38:57,680
Speaker 6: really really complicated after the Cassie lawsuit came out. He

750
00:38:57,760 --> 00:39:00,960
Speaker 6: was criminally charged and then just a parade of civil

751
00:39:01,040 --> 00:39:04,640
Speaker 6: lawsuits hit him. So he's even in his freedom, his

752
00:39:05,080 --> 00:39:07,040
Speaker 6: entire fortune is a risk as well.

753
00:39:07,200 --> 00:39:10,440
Speaker 4: Oh, I have a question, what do you think are

754
00:39:10,480 --> 00:39:15,440
Speaker 4: you aware of the suit against his son justin which

755
00:39:15,560 --> 00:39:18,480
Speaker 4: did he is also brought into the civil suit alleging

756
00:39:19,280 --> 00:39:21,160
Speaker 4: gang rape and other things.

757
00:39:22,120 --> 00:39:26,600
Speaker 6: Yes, I mean, I'm familiar with the allegations. I haven't

758
00:39:26,640 --> 00:39:29,400
Speaker 6: reviewed the complaint, but I'm certainly aware that that suit

759
00:39:29,480 --> 00:39:29,880
Speaker 6: was brought.

760
00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:34,800
Speaker 4: What do you think of the timing?

761
00:39:36,680 --> 00:39:39,279
Speaker 6: So the timing of these things is always significant, and

762
00:39:39,280 --> 00:39:43,600
Speaker 6: you wonder why was there a group of people trying

763
00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:46,360
Speaker 6: to resolve this before they brought the suit, because sometimes

764
00:39:46,360 --> 00:39:48,919
Speaker 6: that happens too. It's hard to know if you don't

765
00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:51,879
Speaker 6: know exactly what was going on behind the scenes. But

766
00:39:51,960 --> 00:39:54,800
Speaker 6: to hear that this case has come out when it did,

767
00:39:55,440 --> 00:39:57,800
Speaker 6: it's curious to me, there's no doubt. But timing is

768
00:39:57,840 --> 00:39:59,920
Speaker 6: important to being a claim that's going to get this

769
00:40:00,040 --> 00:40:00,960
Speaker 6: kind of attention too.

770
00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:03,359
Speaker 2: How does he have so much money too? Is there

771
00:40:03,480 --> 00:40:06,440
Speaker 2: that much money in being a music mogul?

772
00:40:06,520 --> 00:40:06,880
Speaker 3: I mean the.

773
00:40:07,400 --> 00:40:10,880
Speaker 2: Level of cash at his disposal is also something. I

774
00:40:10,920 --> 00:40:12,240
Speaker 2: just have had a hard time rapping.

775
00:40:12,080 --> 00:40:16,279
Speaker 4: Sixty million a year from Sarak. Whether that's changed, I'm

776
00:40:16,320 --> 00:40:18,160
Speaker 4: not sure, but that was Line.

777
00:40:18,040 --> 00:40:20,719
Speaker 2: Didn't make the vodka himself. Listen, we're going to be

778
00:40:20,760 --> 00:40:23,480
Speaker 2: right back, please, Jarrett, thank you. We're going to be

779
00:40:23,520 --> 00:40:26,240
Speaker 2: with us for the next hour. This is true crime tonight,

780
00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:40,880
Speaker 2: we're talking true crime all the time. Our documentary drops

781
00:40:40,880 --> 00:40:44,120
Speaker 2: tomorrow on Peacock and I really hope you'll watch and

782
00:40:44,239 --> 00:40:47,040
Speaker 2: please listen to the podcast on iHeartRadio called the Idaho

783
00:40:47,120 --> 00:40:50,360
Speaker 2: Massacre Really a shocking day in the courtroom, we're going

784
00:40:50,440 --> 00:40:53,880
Speaker 2: to be joined by Jarrett Farentino yet again. He's an

785
00:40:53,960 --> 00:40:57,239
Speaker 2: esteem trial attorney and also appears in the documentary, and

786
00:40:57,280 --> 00:41:00,239
Speaker 2: he'll be breaking down both cases for us. This is

787
00:41:00,239 --> 00:41:02,919
Speaker 2: one of those days that it's impossible to decide where

788
00:41:02,920 --> 00:41:06,680
Speaker 2: to begin. I think it's emotional beyond measure. The Brian

789
00:41:06,719 --> 00:41:09,320
Speaker 2: Coburger case will start there. Body, do you want to

790
00:41:09,360 --> 00:41:11,200
Speaker 2: fill us in on what this day has been like.

791
00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:15,280
Speaker 8: Well, it's been a rollercoaster, you know, just as somebody

792
00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:17,840
Speaker 8: that's been covering it for the last two and a

793
00:41:17,880 --> 00:41:20,520
Speaker 8: half years. I'm sure as Courtney and yourself can attest to.

794
00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:24,440
Speaker 8: It's been emotional for us. And so I mean, putting

795
00:41:24,440 --> 00:41:27,319
Speaker 8: myself in the position of somebody that's a family member,

796
00:41:27,360 --> 00:41:30,640
Speaker 8: I can't even fathom how it's been for them. Right,

797
00:41:32,080 --> 00:41:36,000
Speaker 8: And today he stood in court and said he was

798
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:40,120
Speaker 8: guilty of all four murders with intent He entered that

799
00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:45,640
Speaker 8: home with intent to kill and you know, I'm still

800
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:48,200
Speaker 8: kind of trying to catch my breath a little bit, right.

801
00:41:50,320 --> 00:41:54,000
Speaker 8: We know, on Sunday there was a well, I'm sorry,

802
00:41:54,800 --> 00:41:59,800
Speaker 8: the defense approached the prosecution with asking that saying that

803
00:41:59,840 --> 00:42:02,400
Speaker 8: they were ready for a plea deal. On Sunday it

804
00:42:02,520 --> 00:42:05,120
Speaker 8: was offered to the defense from the prosecution.

805
00:42:05,320 --> 00:42:06,040
Speaker 3: They accepted.

806
00:42:06,719 --> 00:42:10,480
Speaker 8: On Monday, we were all informed the public, and Wednesday

807
00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:16,120
Speaker 8: today it happened. He changed his plea from not guilty

808
00:42:16,239 --> 00:42:21,160
Speaker 8: to guilty and basically said he entered that home with intent.

809
00:42:21,680 --> 00:42:25,279
Speaker 8: And the prosecutor, Bill Thompson, this is just a very

810
00:42:25,280 --> 00:42:28,719
Speaker 8: short overview of what happened. Prosecutor Bill Thompson stood up

811
00:42:28,880 --> 00:42:33,240
Speaker 8: and read through pretty much things we kind of already knew,

812
00:42:33,520 --> 00:42:38,439
Speaker 8: you know, through basic reasoning and things that we knew

813
00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:41,280
Speaker 8: from the PCA, the probable cause Affidavid that was released

814
00:42:41,280 --> 00:42:43,640
Speaker 8: in this case. And you know, as he ready he

815
00:42:43,680 --> 00:42:46,480
Speaker 8: got a little choked up. It was a little as

816
00:42:46,480 --> 00:42:50,239
Speaker 8: he said, the victims' names right, choked up. But yeah,

817
00:42:50,239 --> 00:42:52,560
Speaker 8: that's what happened today. And you know what, you know,

818
00:42:52,600 --> 00:42:55,360
Speaker 8: what's uh, we saw all the families. They weren't allowed

819
00:42:55,360 --> 00:43:00,000
Speaker 8: to be pictured in court, but we did. We did

820
00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:03,480
Speaker 8: i'd see them enter. Steve Consolvus, the father of victim

821
00:43:03,600 --> 00:43:08,080
Speaker 8: kay Lee Consolvus, did not go into court. He recognized.

822
00:43:08,080 --> 00:43:10,680
Speaker 8: We talked about this last night. He was very angry

823
00:43:10,760 --> 00:43:15,759
Speaker 8: and unhappy with the plea deal. He wanted basically, in

824
00:43:15,760 --> 00:43:18,680
Speaker 8: his own words, he wanted a jury of his peers

825
00:43:19,360 --> 00:43:24,319
Speaker 8: to rain judgment down upon Brian Coberger, not just one man,

826
00:43:24,440 --> 00:43:27,000
Speaker 8: which he considers, you know, the prosecutor or the judge.

827
00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:29,160
Speaker 8: I'm not really sure. And you know, you have to

828
00:43:29,160 --> 00:43:31,680
Speaker 8: respect his opinion, you know, I certainly can't put myself

829
00:43:31,680 --> 00:43:34,080
Speaker 8: in his his shoes to judge.

830
00:43:33,880 --> 00:43:35,960
Speaker 3: Him for that, you know, by any stretch of the imagination.

831
00:43:36,719 --> 00:43:39,439
Speaker 8: But yeah, the only thing we didn't see, the only

832
00:43:39,440 --> 00:43:42,840
Speaker 8: family we really didn't see was Brian Coberger's family.

833
00:43:43,680 --> 00:43:45,200
Speaker 3: They were there there, they were.

834
00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:48,080
Speaker 8: There for Brian Enton sat behind them, our friend, Brian Nton.

835
00:43:48,760 --> 00:43:50,799
Speaker 8: He sat behind them, and he said that they were

836
00:43:50,840 --> 00:43:53,839
Speaker 8: not crying, but they were, you know, very sad. They

837
00:43:53,840 --> 00:43:55,759
Speaker 8: were very said, and I don't know who was there.

838
00:43:55,840 --> 00:43:57,360
Speaker 8: I don't know which family members.

839
00:43:57,800 --> 00:44:01,719
Speaker 4: I had read one report that said that Brian Coberger's

840
00:44:01,760 --> 00:44:07,040
Speaker 4: mother shuddered at each victim when when Brian stood and

841
00:44:07,080 --> 00:44:10,440
Speaker 4: said Brian Coberger said yes, I murdered, or actually he

842
00:44:10,480 --> 00:44:12,920
Speaker 4: just said yes, but did you murder this victim? And

843
00:44:12,920 --> 00:44:15,400
Speaker 4: that his mother shuddered at each one?

844
00:44:15,600 --> 00:44:18,759
Speaker 2: How could she not a human being? You know, Brian Coberger,

845
00:44:18,840 --> 00:44:21,920
Speaker 2: we've talked about this before. As the youngest of three kids,

846
00:44:21,960 --> 00:44:25,840
Speaker 2: he has two older sisters, one a therapist. His eldest sister,

847
00:44:26,040 --> 00:44:28,320
Speaker 2: you know, was also in a film that has gotten

848
00:44:28,320 --> 00:44:30,200
Speaker 2: a lot of you know press who was an actress

849
00:44:30,239 --> 00:44:32,879
Speaker 2: in like a B level movie many many years ago

850
00:44:33,040 --> 00:44:37,839
Speaker 2: that has, you know, a slasher film type vibe. And

851
00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:40,600
Speaker 2: I can only imagine how this has torn them apart too.

852
00:44:41,120 --> 00:44:44,120
Speaker 2: And Dad, you know, we were all watching this very closely.

853
00:44:44,600 --> 00:44:46,719
Speaker 2: You know, we made the podcast. We've been following this

854
00:44:46,800 --> 00:44:49,560
Speaker 2: all for years and years, and to your point, Body,

855
00:44:49,760 --> 00:44:52,520
Speaker 2: it's hard to imagine what the family members are going through.

856
00:44:52,680 --> 00:44:55,279
Speaker 2: We can't begin too, and our hearts go out to

857
00:44:55,360 --> 00:44:58,399
Speaker 2: all of them. It also has confirmed some of our

858
00:44:58,400 --> 00:45:02,720
Speaker 2: worst nightmares of the time line and that it was premeditated.

859
00:45:03,040 --> 00:45:06,120
Speaker 2: And you know, we couldn't wrap our brains around the

860
00:45:06,200 --> 00:45:10,520
Speaker 2: idea that this PhD student studying criminology could possibly do

861
00:45:10,600 --> 00:45:13,200
Speaker 2: this and pull this off, and to see him standing

862
00:45:13,239 --> 00:45:17,080
Speaker 2: there looking, you know, so well dressed, not in cuffs,

863
00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:19,000
Speaker 2: wearing a lovely button down like he was going to

864
00:45:19,040 --> 00:45:23,120
Speaker 2: a job interview, confessing to the slaughter of four people.

865
00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:25,799
Speaker 2: Is it's really just I think we've all been in

866
00:45:25,920 --> 00:45:28,000
Speaker 2: sort of a fever dream ever since, and I know

867
00:45:28,040 --> 00:45:31,000
Speaker 2: we're not alone in that. Anyone listening probably is feeling

868
00:45:31,040 --> 00:45:31,960
Speaker 2: a bit of that as well.

869
00:45:32,640 --> 00:45:36,799
Speaker 4: That staggered me that he wasn't in shackles or in

870
00:45:36,920 --> 00:45:41,400
Speaker 4: prison garb. All of us on the show were texting

871
00:45:41,440 --> 00:45:44,120
Speaker 4: and tweeting each other while we were watching it, and

872
00:45:44,760 --> 00:45:48,600
Speaker 4: it was just it was unbelievable. But I do believe

873
00:45:48,719 --> 00:45:53,120
Speaker 4: that from every other court appearance forward there probably will

874
00:45:53,160 --> 00:45:53,520
Speaker 4: be few.

875
00:45:53,840 --> 00:45:55,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, there was still be in garb.

876
00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:58,520
Speaker 8: There was a motion a while ago allowing him to

877
00:45:58,640 --> 00:46:01,600
Speaker 8: dress in playing clothes, and that has been rescinded as

878
00:46:01,640 --> 00:46:02,080
Speaker 8: of today.

879
00:46:02,320 --> 00:46:03,279
Speaker 3: So he will this.

880
00:46:03,560 --> 00:46:05,520
Speaker 8: You know, and the judge, you know, at the end

881
00:46:05,560 --> 00:46:09,080
Speaker 8: of everything, the judge asked the prosecutor and the defense,

882
00:46:09,160 --> 00:46:12,759
Speaker 8: is there any reason I shouldn't rescind the non dissemination order,

883
00:46:13,080 --> 00:46:15,319
Speaker 8: which of course is the gag order that's been placed

884
00:46:15,360 --> 00:46:19,520
Speaker 8: on this case. And the prosecution and defense both asked

885
00:46:19,760 --> 00:46:23,680
Speaker 8: the judge to delay that until after sentencing. Yeah, so

886
00:46:24,360 --> 00:46:27,400
Speaker 8: listen on November. I'm sorry, November what I had the

887
00:46:27,719 --> 00:46:29,319
Speaker 8: date of the murders on my head, which is sure

888
00:46:29,320 --> 00:46:33,880
Speaker 8: November thirteenth. Of course, July twenty third will be sentencing,

889
00:46:34,280 --> 00:46:38,440
Speaker 8: and you know, at that point the families and the

890
00:46:38,560 --> 00:46:41,800
Speaker 8: victims will be able to do a victim impact statement

891
00:46:42,040 --> 00:46:46,200
Speaker 8: to Brian directly and to the judge, and Brian will

892
00:46:46,200 --> 00:46:49,520
Speaker 8: have the opportunity for allocution, which is to you know,

893
00:46:49,760 --> 00:46:51,920
Speaker 8: make his own address to the court. I don't know

894
00:46:51,960 --> 00:46:54,279
Speaker 8: that he will.

895
00:46:54,400 --> 00:46:56,400
Speaker 3: He is gutless. He will not know that.

896
00:46:56,480 --> 00:46:59,319
Speaker 2: I guarantee you he will not. He just sat there

897
00:46:59,320 --> 00:47:02,200
Speaker 2: looking smug. Get my humble opinion. He showed no emotion.

898
00:47:02,719 --> 00:47:05,520
Speaker 2: He seemed just like a regular guy who just could

899
00:47:05,560 --> 00:47:09,680
Speaker 2: have honestly been working at a lovely insurance company tomorrow. Instead,

900
00:47:09,760 --> 00:47:11,719
Speaker 2: he has blood on his hands, has tortured his own

901
00:47:11,760 --> 00:47:14,680
Speaker 2: family in terms of putting them through this process, and

902
00:47:14,760 --> 00:47:17,640
Speaker 2: the victims' families now being brought together in one place,

903
00:47:17,920 --> 00:47:19,919
Speaker 2: but the first time in a really long time too.

904
00:47:20,440 --> 00:47:22,320
Speaker 3: They had to schlep all the way.

905
00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:24,719
Speaker 2: From all kinds of places because Brian Coberger needed a

906
00:47:24,800 --> 00:47:27,800
Speaker 2: change of venue and it's you know, harrowing to just

907
00:47:27,840 --> 00:47:29,200
Speaker 2: see him there so nonchalant.

908
00:47:29,560 --> 00:47:29,840
Speaker 3: Yeah.

909
00:47:29,920 --> 00:47:32,920
Speaker 8: Well, hopefully we'll get some answers for the family and

910
00:47:32,960 --> 00:47:36,320
Speaker 8: the victims, you know, of this horrific crime. At the

911
00:47:36,400 --> 00:47:38,799
Speaker 8: end of July. Maybe some things will be unsealed. I

912
00:47:38,800 --> 00:47:43,200
Speaker 8: think we'll get a dribbled rabble of information. Of course,

913
00:47:43,360 --> 00:47:43,840
Speaker 8: I know you're the.

914
00:47:43,920 --> 00:47:47,040
Speaker 2: Voice of the podcast the Idaho Massacre that we make together,

915
00:47:47,360 --> 00:47:50,399
Speaker 2: you know, again following it so closely. I think we've

916
00:47:50,440 --> 00:47:53,160
Speaker 2: always been a little divided about You kind of always

917
00:47:53,239 --> 00:47:56,799
Speaker 2: knew he was guilty as charged, and I think I've

918
00:47:56,800 --> 00:48:00,560
Speaker 2: always been sort of nervous about that, or it felt

919
00:48:00,600 --> 00:48:03,239
Speaker 2: maybe he was being targeted, Not that I knew, maybe

920
00:48:03,239 --> 00:48:05,480
Speaker 2: I just hoped. How was that today for you too,

921
00:48:06,000 --> 00:48:06,959
Speaker 2: to see that go down?

922
00:48:07,480 --> 00:48:10,000
Speaker 4: I mean, you are right, we were on different sides,

923
00:48:10,280 --> 00:48:12,640
Speaker 4: had our own opinions, even though I do like to

924
00:48:12,680 --> 00:48:19,000
Speaker 4: think we made a really balanced both seasons, really balanced portrayal.

925
00:48:19,239 --> 00:48:22,960
Speaker 4: But yeah, from jump this guy, it just everything. There

926
00:48:23,040 --> 00:48:27,840
Speaker 4: was too much evidence that, oh, your DNA happened to

927
00:48:28,000 --> 00:48:33,880
Speaker 4: be there, however microscopic and all of the phone evidence. Anyway,

928
00:48:33,920 --> 00:48:38,279
Speaker 4: we'll break all of that down later, but today it

929
00:48:38,360 --> 00:48:41,280
Speaker 4: was very interesting, one of you had said, just hearing

930
00:48:41,360 --> 00:48:45,000
Speaker 4: bits of information that the judge said, and it all

931
00:48:45,040 --> 00:48:48,600
Speaker 4: did it just lined up like or excuse me that

932
00:48:48,640 --> 00:48:52,520
Speaker 4: the prosecution said with the dates, starting with the pool parties,

933
00:48:52,560 --> 00:48:56,000
Speaker 4: starting with all of that. So listen, we will be

934
00:48:56,040 --> 00:48:57,640
Speaker 4: getting into this, and we'll be getting into this with

935
00:48:57,800 --> 00:49:01,800
Speaker 4: Jarrett Farentino, legal expert later, but right now you're listening

936
00:49:01,800 --> 00:49:02,720
Speaker 4: to True Crime Tonight.

937
00:49:03,080 --> 00:49:04,080
Speaker 3: I'm Courtney Armstrong.

938
00:49:04,120 --> 00:49:06,600
Speaker 4: I'm here with Body Moven, I'm here with Stephanie Leidecker,

939
00:49:07,000 --> 00:49:08,919
Speaker 4: and we're going to take a bit of a right

940
00:49:09,000 --> 00:49:13,239
Speaker 4: turn and go to the other breaking news today about.

941
00:49:13,000 --> 00:49:14,640
Speaker 3: Didty so did.

942
00:49:14,760 --> 00:49:17,759
Speaker 4: He also had his day in court today for the

943
00:49:17,800 --> 00:49:21,239
Speaker 4: final verdict in his case that involved racketeering and sex

944
00:49:21,280 --> 00:49:26,400
Speaker 4: trafficking and transportation to engage in prostitution. And the biggest

945
00:49:26,400 --> 00:49:29,719
Speaker 4: news is that Diddy was denied bail.

946
00:49:29,560 --> 00:49:33,280
Speaker 3: Today so he will not be going home. That was huge.

947
00:49:33,800 --> 00:49:36,520
Speaker 8: Wait a minute, isn't the biggest news today the verdict?

948
00:49:37,040 --> 00:49:40,640
Speaker 4: Yes, you're right, I was happy, you know, the verdict team,

949
00:49:40,760 --> 00:49:42,600
Speaker 4: and then it was hours to wait until he was

950
00:49:42,640 --> 00:49:43,080
Speaker 4: going to leave.

951
00:49:43,200 --> 00:49:47,920
Speaker 3: Yes, okay, here is the verdict. Stop right now. The verdict.

952
00:49:48,000 --> 00:49:50,080
Speaker 3: That is very fair Okay, So the verdict.

953
00:49:50,320 --> 00:49:55,800
Speaker 4: Count one racketeering conspiracy not guilty. Count two sex trafficking

954
00:49:55,800 --> 00:50:01,280
Speaker 4: by force, fraud or coercion regarding Cassie Ventura not guilty.

955
00:50:01,760 --> 00:50:08,400
Speaker 4: Count three transportation do engage in prostitution regarding Cassie Ventura guilty.

956
00:50:08,440 --> 00:50:13,239
Speaker 4: Four sex trafficking by force, fraud or coercion regarding Jane

957
00:50:13,280 --> 00:50:18,799
Speaker 4: Doe not guilty. Final count five transportation to engage in

958
00:50:18,880 --> 00:50:21,560
Speaker 4: prostitution for Jane Doe guilty.

959
00:50:22,000 --> 00:50:24,560
Speaker 2: And certainly, you know, I agree with you that seemed

960
00:50:24,560 --> 00:50:26,960
Speaker 2: the verdict seems like five years ago for some time

961
00:50:27,040 --> 00:50:28,640
Speaker 2: in this particular day.

962
00:50:28,840 --> 00:50:31,080
Speaker 3: You're writing the verdict in the morning, and then.

963
00:50:31,160 --> 00:50:35,000
Speaker 2: The coburger hearing and the family members being there, and

964
00:50:35,040 --> 00:50:37,600
Speaker 2: as following that so closely in it. You know, again,

965
00:50:37,880 --> 00:50:40,239
Speaker 2: these are not relatives of ours, but it's just as

966
00:50:40,320 --> 00:50:42,440
Speaker 2: human beings. It's hard not to get swept away in

967
00:50:42,480 --> 00:50:46,640
Speaker 2: the emotion of it and just the raw guttural grossness

968
00:50:46,760 --> 00:50:48,760
Speaker 2: of it, like this guy's a devil at this point.

969
00:50:48,760 --> 00:50:51,799
Speaker 2: And I don't ever say that, you know, the boogeyman is.

970
00:50:51,760 --> 00:50:56,040
Speaker 8: You don't mean you're very compassionate to everyone, You don't judge,

971
00:50:56,120 --> 00:50:59,320
Speaker 8: you are very so you're but you have a visceral reaction.

972
00:50:59,360 --> 00:51:01,799
Speaker 8: I can see you face. It makes me to say

973
00:51:01,840 --> 00:51:04,920
Speaker 8: Stephanie's face. She's very emotional about this.

974
00:51:05,080 --> 00:51:07,080
Speaker 3: And why wasn't he emotional about this?

975
00:51:07,239 --> 00:51:10,399
Speaker 2: Yeah, like even as he sat there today, just like yeah, yeah,

976
00:51:10,480 --> 00:51:12,280
Speaker 2: it's like did you order orange juice today?

977
00:51:12,400 --> 00:51:15,360
Speaker 3: Yes? Did you order a bacon, egg and cheese sandwich? Yes?

978
00:51:15,719 --> 00:51:18,520
Speaker 2: He answered this questions that this was like did you

979
00:51:18,640 --> 00:51:19,840
Speaker 2: murder a human being?

980
00:51:20,200 --> 00:51:20,799
Speaker 3: Yeah?

981
00:51:20,840 --> 00:51:22,759
Speaker 2: And of course And you can hear his own mom

982
00:51:22,880 --> 00:51:26,640
Speaker 2: gasping behind them. They had to schlep from Pennsylvania. Hits

983
00:51:26,719 --> 00:51:30,440
Speaker 2: such a humiliation for all involved, and man, what a

984
00:51:30,480 --> 00:51:34,560
Speaker 2: good liar. It's just it's unbelievable. And for the students

985
00:51:34,560 --> 00:51:37,799
Speaker 2: that were in his class that was so close, that

986
00:51:37,960 --> 00:51:40,560
Speaker 2: was dangerous. This guy was like out in the wild,

987
00:51:40,840 --> 00:51:43,799
Speaker 2: just you know, roaming around doing things for people. And

988
00:51:44,160 --> 00:51:47,360
Speaker 2: thank god it's over and he is never going to

989
00:51:47,440 --> 00:51:51,200
Speaker 2: be free. And I hope there's some semblance of closure

990
00:51:51,200 --> 00:51:53,319
Speaker 2: for his family. Sorry, quiet an't mean to interrupt her.

991
00:51:53,719 --> 00:51:56,760
Speaker 4: No, listen, we have a lot tonight coming up. Veteran

992
00:51:56,800 --> 00:51:59,959
Speaker 4: trial attorney Jarrett Farantino, he will be joining us. We'll

993
00:52:00,080 --> 00:52:05,319
Speaker 4: be talking about both Diddy and Brian Coburger, and specifically

994
00:52:05,360 --> 00:52:06,800
Speaker 4: in the Idaho murder case.

995
00:52:06,960 --> 00:52:08,960
Speaker 2: We're going to play a clip from the hearing today

996
00:52:09,000 --> 00:52:10,719
Speaker 2: in case you didn't have a chance to see it,

997
00:52:10,800 --> 00:52:14,520
Speaker 2: where Brian Coburger has to sort of face the music

998
00:52:14,680 --> 00:52:18,680
Speaker 2: a little bit, just to set the stage. A packed courthouse.

999
00:52:19,320 --> 00:52:21,960
Speaker 2: All of the family members on both sides of the

1000
00:52:22,040 --> 00:52:27,239
Speaker 2: victims are present. Also, Brian Coberger's mother, father, and his

1001
00:52:27,280 --> 00:52:30,919
Speaker 2: sister is also there. And that's a real rare thing

1002
00:52:31,040 --> 00:52:34,680
Speaker 2: because the trial, if you'll remember, was moved to Boise, Idaho,

1003
00:52:35,200 --> 00:52:37,680
Speaker 2: so it's a distance and they're only finding out about

1004
00:52:37,680 --> 00:52:41,080
Speaker 2: this new information as recently as this weekend, so you

1005
00:52:41,080 --> 00:52:45,399
Speaker 2: could emotion the imagine the emotions were high even amongst us,

1006
00:52:45,560 --> 00:52:48,359
Speaker 2: and I'm sure for anyone who saw that today, it's

1007
00:52:48,440 --> 00:52:50,839
Speaker 2: really hard stuff to watch. We just want to make

1008
00:52:50,880 --> 00:52:52,960
Speaker 2: sure you're up to speed. This is a clip from

1009
00:52:52,960 --> 00:52:57,320
Speaker 2: the hearing, Prosecutor Bill Thompson reading the course of events

1010
00:52:57,400 --> 00:52:58,560
Speaker 2: that deadly night.

1011
00:52:58,840 --> 00:53:01,840
Speaker 7: As the defendant has just admitted and leaded guilty. On

1012
00:53:01,880 --> 00:53:11,120
Speaker 7: November thirteenth, twenty twenty two, excuse me, Miss Coberger entered

1013
00:53:11,160 --> 00:53:13,800
Speaker 7: the residence of eleven twenty two King Roade in Moscow, Idaho.

1014
00:53:14,640 --> 00:53:17,839
Speaker 7: He did that with the intent to kill. We will

1015
00:53:17,840 --> 00:53:20,680
Speaker 7: not represent that he intended to commit all of the

1016
00:53:20,760 --> 00:53:23,719
Speaker 7: murders that he did that night, but we know that

1017
00:53:23,719 --> 00:53:30,640
Speaker 7: that is what resulted, and that he then killed intentionally, willfully, deliberately,

1018
00:53:30,760 --> 00:53:37,520
Speaker 7: with premeditation, and with mouse forethought. Manny Mogan, Kate we Consolfics,

1019
00:53:39,280 --> 00:53:42,480
Speaker 7: Ethan Chapin, and Santa Cree. Thank you.

1020
00:53:43,280 --> 00:53:43,480
Speaker 6: Wow.

1021
00:53:43,520 --> 00:53:45,680
Speaker 8: He got a little emotional there. You can hear his

1022
00:53:45,760 --> 00:53:48,440
Speaker 8: voice crack. Yeah, Now I started to cry. That was

1023
00:53:48,480 --> 00:53:51,959
Speaker 8: hard for him. Well, listen, you know Bill Thompson's been

1024
00:53:52,160 --> 00:53:54,560
Speaker 8: been I mean, he's been involved in this from the beginning.

1025
00:53:54,640 --> 00:53:57,160
Speaker 8: You know, he's from Leytal County. He's the prosecutor of

1026
00:53:57,239 --> 00:53:59,719
Speaker 8: the DA for Leytalk County. He's been on this sin

1027
00:53:59,719 --> 00:54:03,360
Speaker 8: stag one since day one, and it's finally coming to

1028
00:54:03,400 --> 00:54:07,480
Speaker 8: an end. And I'm sure you know, we know that

1029
00:54:07,480 --> 00:54:12,560
Speaker 8: that some of the family members, specifically Xana Cronodle's family

1030
00:54:12,800 --> 00:54:16,440
Speaker 8: and Kaylee gunnsolves this family, two of the victims in

1031
00:54:16,440 --> 00:54:19,520
Speaker 8: this case, are not happy with Bill Thompson right now.

1032
00:54:19,760 --> 00:54:23,799
Speaker 8: Right And aside from that, though, Bill Thompson I think

1033
00:54:23,880 --> 00:54:27,439
Speaker 8: does care about these these these families. I think he does.

1034
00:54:27,480 --> 00:54:30,080
Speaker 8: And I think this is you know, coming to an end.

1035
00:54:30,640 --> 00:54:34,000
Speaker 8: And and even Bill Thompson, I'm sure wanted his day

1036
00:54:34,000 --> 00:54:36,960
Speaker 8: in court, right. This is the case of his life.

1037
00:54:37,320 --> 00:54:39,839
Speaker 8: This is the case of his life, and it's coming

1038
00:54:39,920 --> 00:54:43,200
Speaker 8: to an end. You know, it's coming to an abrupt end.

1039
00:54:43,719 --> 00:54:45,959
Speaker 8: I said something earlier today. What did I say? I said,

1040
00:54:45,960 --> 00:54:48,880
Speaker 8: this is a I can't reme have to remember what

1041
00:54:48,920 --> 00:54:50,799
Speaker 8: I said, but something like this is a whimper to

1042
00:54:50,920 --> 00:54:53,840
Speaker 8: a loud nightmare. This is like I texted it to you, guys,

1043
00:54:53,880 --> 00:54:56,799
Speaker 8: This is like a whimper to a loud nightmare. You're

1044
00:54:56,840 --> 00:54:59,319
Speaker 8: getting choked up right now. You're getting choked up too.

1045
00:54:59,560 --> 00:55:00,680
Speaker 8: It's it is.

1046
00:55:00,719 --> 00:55:04,200
Speaker 2: You know, we made the podcast the Idaho Massacre several

1047
00:55:04,239 --> 00:55:08,000
Speaker 2: seasons of that. I think really we've always assumed that

1048
00:55:08,280 --> 00:55:10,560
Speaker 2: maybe it was impossible that, or at least I'm speaking

1049
00:55:10,560 --> 00:55:14,040
Speaker 2: for myself, just seemed impossible that this young man who

1050
00:55:14,160 --> 00:55:16,400
Speaker 2: was you know, loved and had a big life ahead

1051
00:55:16,440 --> 00:55:19,399
Speaker 2: of him could do this. You know, he was getting

1052
00:55:19,440 --> 00:55:22,760
Speaker 2: his PhD in criminology. You know he went to class

1053
00:55:22,800 --> 00:55:26,000
Speaker 2: every day. We know he went to class after the murders.

1054
00:55:26,160 --> 00:55:27,879
Speaker 2: None of that really added up to me and if

1055
00:55:27,880 --> 00:55:31,520
Speaker 2: he was such a smarty pants and studying this so closely,

1056
00:55:31,960 --> 00:55:34,600
Speaker 2: he made some really bad judgment calls and it was

1057
00:55:34,680 --> 00:55:38,360
Speaker 2: not the perfect crime. You know, Jarrett, I'm so happy

1058
00:55:38,360 --> 00:55:39,840
Speaker 2: you're here with us. I mean, there's so much of

1059
00:55:39,840 --> 00:55:42,000
Speaker 2: this that we want to unpack. I feel like we

1060
00:55:42,040 --> 00:55:45,080
Speaker 2: need to hold you hostage at this point. I know

1061
00:55:45,200 --> 00:55:47,560
Speaker 2: you're very close to it as well. You know, having

1062
00:55:47,600 --> 00:55:50,960
Speaker 2: yourself been on that side of the equation when you're

1063
00:55:51,160 --> 00:55:54,160
Speaker 2: gearing up for a massive trial, which was in this

1064
00:55:54,200 --> 00:55:56,840
Speaker 2: case going to happen in August now is not that

1065
00:55:56,920 --> 00:55:59,120
Speaker 2: must be emotional too, even as an attorney.

1066
00:56:00,000 --> 00:56:02,200
Speaker 6: It's like hitting a wall. I mean I've been there

1067
00:56:02,200 --> 00:56:05,200
Speaker 6: on the even death penalty cases where they've pled you

1068
00:56:05,320 --> 00:56:09,479
Speaker 6: physically prepare yourself for these, you know, months of your life.

1069
00:56:09,560 --> 00:56:12,200
Speaker 6: You're getting ready to be away from your family, to

1070
00:56:12,280 --> 00:56:16,000
Speaker 6: be completely consumed, and all of a sudden it ends,

1071
00:56:16,160 --> 00:56:20,200
Speaker 6: and all those emotions, everything you were readying yourself for

1072
00:56:20,520 --> 00:56:22,719
Speaker 6: comes with that moment. And I've been over I've been

1073
00:56:22,760 --> 00:56:25,440
Speaker 6: overwhelmed with emotion in court rooms. I'm Italian, I'm an

1074
00:56:25,480 --> 00:56:31,920
Speaker 6: emotional guy. And that's why you, Jarre, because your heart's

1075
00:56:32,000 --> 00:56:33,960
Speaker 6: in it. If you don't care. People used to say, like,

1076
00:56:34,040 --> 00:56:37,080
Speaker 6: keep your emotions out of it. You try that good luck, right.

1077
00:56:37,120 --> 00:56:40,359
Speaker 6: I mean, it's like, you know, and if I don't care,

1078
00:56:40,719 --> 00:56:42,879
Speaker 6: how do I get a jury to care? And that's

1079
00:56:42,880 --> 00:56:45,800
Speaker 6: where Bill Thompson's heart is. That's where he's leading a team.

1080
00:56:46,280 --> 00:56:48,600
Speaker 6: He's been beat up in the press. He's been dealing

1081
00:56:48,600 --> 00:56:51,440
Speaker 6: with these families. He's looking evil in the eye when

1082
00:56:51,480 --> 00:56:54,600
Speaker 6: he goes into that courtroom. He's dealing with an aggressive defense.

1083
00:56:54,880 --> 00:56:59,759
Speaker 6: And today it's end and it's ending. It's just and

1084
00:56:59,800 --> 00:57:02,600
Speaker 6: it's fair, and I think it's ending a good note

1085
00:57:02,640 --> 00:57:05,440
Speaker 6: for him. And he's still dealing with some conflict.

1086
00:57:05,760 --> 00:57:08,040
Speaker 2: I'll say, like all the families there, so many families

1087
00:57:08,080 --> 00:57:10,239
Speaker 2: are out for blood on him now. And look, I

1088
00:57:10,239 --> 00:57:14,040
Speaker 2: would imagine it's such an emotional thing. The grief is unimaginable.

1089
00:57:14,320 --> 00:57:16,960
Speaker 2: That Yeah, if you're a family member, you want to

1090
00:57:17,000 --> 00:57:21,560
Speaker 2: scream and yell and kick the walls and blame somebody somehow.

1091
00:57:21,600 --> 00:57:24,240
Speaker 2: It doesn't matter that they're blaming Brian Coburger because he

1092
00:57:24,280 --> 00:57:27,080
Speaker 2: seems fine. He seems like he's you know, going out

1093
00:57:27,120 --> 00:57:30,280
Speaker 2: for a light lunch. So there may be directing it

1094
00:57:30,320 --> 00:57:33,400
Speaker 2: at the prosecution, you know, it's a tough spots.

1095
00:57:33,640 --> 00:57:36,160
Speaker 6: He doesn't get social cues. Coburger, by the way, even

1096
00:57:36,200 --> 00:57:38,520
Speaker 6: the way he was saying, yes, it's like is this

1097
00:57:38,680 --> 00:57:42,760
Speaker 6: yere tuna sandwiches? Exactly the judge, it's like no, head down,

1098
00:57:42,840 --> 00:57:45,280
Speaker 6: like yes, your honor, Yes, your honor, I did hack

1099
00:57:45,360 --> 00:57:49,320
Speaker 6: these people to death. Like I mean, he's just social

1100
00:57:49,440 --> 00:57:53,760
Speaker 6: his social no social norms. He just that's how he's

1101
00:57:53,800 --> 00:57:56,120
Speaker 6: been described. If you read Howard Bloom's book, which I

1102
00:57:56,160 --> 00:57:58,160
Speaker 6: know you haven't, and you talked to Howard Bloom, yes,

1103
00:57:59,120 --> 00:58:01,960
Speaker 6: he really nils what Coburger was like.

1104
00:58:02,680 --> 00:58:02,880
Speaker 4: Hmm.

1105
00:58:03,160 --> 00:58:06,880
Speaker 2: Also in our documentary that I hope remember, it's important

1106
00:58:06,880 --> 00:58:10,120
Speaker 2: to remember that Brian Koberger was diagnosed with autism, and

1107
00:58:10,640 --> 00:58:12,520
Speaker 2: you know he's level one, which was.

1108
00:58:12,720 --> 00:58:16,600
Speaker 8: Formally known as Aspergers. So he is not going to

1109
00:58:16,640 --> 00:58:19,280
Speaker 8: have the same social norms that we have, you know.

1110
00:58:20,520 --> 00:58:23,680
Speaker 6: And that that may be true, but that's how he

1111
00:58:23,720 --> 00:58:25,800
Speaker 6: appears and it may be as a result of that,

1112
00:58:25,840 --> 00:58:29,760
Speaker 6: but again, he doesn't He couldn't pretend to be somber.

1113
00:58:30,040 --> 00:58:33,160
Speaker 6: He just doesn't get those social cues, and that's part

1114
00:58:33,320 --> 00:58:36,760
Speaker 6: of why people see him in a certain light. I mean,

1115
00:58:36,920 --> 00:58:40,880
Speaker 6: and I've had cases like that too where. But Brian

1116
00:58:40,920 --> 00:58:43,880
Speaker 6: Coberger appreciates what he did. Although he's autistic and he

1117
00:58:43,920 --> 00:58:47,280
Speaker 6: may not read social cues like everyone else, he certainly

1118
00:58:47,280 --> 00:58:49,640
Speaker 6: can appreciate what he did was wrong, violation of the

1119
00:58:49,720 --> 00:58:51,840
Speaker 6: law at all, of course. And I think and I

1120
00:58:51,840 --> 00:58:54,560
Speaker 6: think that's part of what part of what put him

1121
00:58:54,560 --> 00:58:57,000
Speaker 6: in the situation where he couldn't communicate with people, he

1122
00:58:57,040 --> 00:58:59,640
Speaker 6: couldn't convey those verges he may have been feeling.

1123
00:59:00,640 --> 00:59:03,720
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's exactly what we've understood with the people that

1124
00:59:03,760 --> 00:59:05,439
Speaker 4: we've spoken to in and around the case.

1125
00:59:05,600 --> 00:59:06,520
Speaker 3: This is true crime to night.

1126
00:59:06,560 --> 00:59:09,680
Speaker 4: I'm Courtney Armstrong here with Body Move and Stephanie Leidecker

1127
00:59:10,120 --> 00:59:14,000
Speaker 4: and attorney Jarrett Farantino, who is breaking down right now

1128
00:59:14,080 --> 00:59:17,080
Speaker 4: the Coburger case, earlier the Diddy case. We've been bouncing

1129
00:59:17,120 --> 00:59:20,640
Speaker 4: back and forth with all of the big court appearances today.

1130
00:59:21,120 --> 00:59:23,960
Speaker 4: So what do you think what do you think will

1131
00:59:24,000 --> 00:59:28,200
Speaker 4: be the next step? Is there any indication of if Coburger,

1132
00:59:28,240 --> 00:59:30,880
Speaker 4: if there is a deal in place, that Coburger will

1133
00:59:30,960 --> 00:59:35,200
Speaker 4: have to say, here are the exact events of the night,

1134
00:59:35,800 --> 00:59:39,000
Speaker 4: or when would we know if that's a stipulation of

1135
00:59:39,040 --> 00:59:39,600
Speaker 4: the aggreeation.

1136
00:59:40,400 --> 00:59:43,840
Speaker 6: It's very likely not going to happen on that factual

1137
00:59:43,920 --> 00:59:46,640
Speaker 6: basis that was read into the record today had some

1138
00:59:46,760 --> 00:59:50,520
Speaker 6: little additional details, by the way, but that is exactly

1139
00:59:50,640 --> 00:59:54,360
Speaker 6: he's already admitted. That's the facts he's willing to admit to. Really,

1140
00:59:54,400 --> 00:59:56,560
Speaker 6: I think the question is is he going to apologize

1141
00:59:56,560 --> 00:59:58,880
Speaker 6: to the families. He's not going to give you a motive.

1142
00:59:59,080 --> 01:00:03,760
Speaker 6: His motive is he's evil. That's his motive, and there's

1143
01:00:03,920 --> 01:00:06,320
Speaker 6: no motive that would justify what he did. And I

1144
01:00:06,360 --> 01:00:08,400
Speaker 6: know everybody wants to hear it. The reality is there's

1145
01:00:08,600 --> 01:00:10,400
Speaker 6: just sick people in this world.

1146
01:00:10,720 --> 01:00:13,000
Speaker 3: I think he's going to talk to people.

1147
01:00:13,040 --> 01:00:15,200
Speaker 8: I think he is going to talk to people like

1148
01:00:15,360 --> 01:00:18,760
Speaker 8: doctor Katherine Ramslin think people like that. I think he will.

1149
01:00:18,880 --> 01:00:20,439
Speaker 8: I don't think he's going to alente.

1150
01:00:20,280 --> 01:00:23,240
Speaker 6: Down the road. He will, I think. But the best

1151
01:00:23,280 --> 01:00:26,360
Speaker 6: these families can hope for during the sentencing hearing is

1152
01:00:26,400 --> 01:00:29,240
Speaker 6: an acknowledgment and an apology. But I don't know if

1153
01:00:29,240 --> 01:00:30,880
Speaker 6: you're going to get it. I just don't know. With

1154
01:00:31,000 --> 01:00:34,760
Speaker 6: Brian Colberger and his personality, it's very hard to predict.

1155
01:00:36,040 --> 01:00:39,080
Speaker 8: Can you tell everybody what a non dissemination order is?

1156
01:00:39,360 --> 01:00:41,920
Speaker 6: So a non dissemination order is a gag order. So

1157
01:00:42,040 --> 01:00:46,640
Speaker 6: basically that means the court cannot disseminate the motions that

1158
01:00:46,680 --> 01:00:50,760
Speaker 6: have been under seal already to date, the parties still

1159
01:00:50,800 --> 01:00:56,960
Speaker 6: can't communicate with the press about matters that remain under sealed.

1160
01:00:57,040 --> 01:01:00,000
Speaker 6: And they extended that today to beyond the sentencing because

1161
01:01:00,000 --> 01:01:02,840
Speaker 6: because and both sides, the defense agreed with that, and

1162
01:01:02,880 --> 01:01:05,120
Speaker 6: the prosecution asked for it, because they don't want to

1163
01:01:05,160 --> 01:01:07,520
Speaker 6: do anything to put the plea in jeopardy. The plea

1164
01:01:07,720 --> 01:01:11,280
Speaker 6: really ends after the sentencing, so they don't want to

1165
01:01:11,280 --> 01:01:13,760
Speaker 6: do anything that would jeopardize the case in the event

1166
01:01:13,760 --> 01:01:16,880
Speaker 6: they had to put on a trial very very low probability.

1167
01:01:17,080 --> 01:01:20,120
Speaker 6: So that dissemination order says Judge, we're going to continue

1168
01:01:20,160 --> 01:01:23,680
Speaker 6: to respect the secrecy and the seals and the gag

1169
01:01:23,800 --> 01:01:24,560
Speaker 6: order in this case.

1170
01:01:24,840 --> 01:01:27,440
Speaker 3: How long after sentencing do you think that will be lifted.

1171
01:01:27,960 --> 01:01:29,600
Speaker 6: It could be that day, it could be right after

1172
01:01:29,680 --> 01:01:30,720
Speaker 6: sentencing is imposed.

1173
01:01:31,000 --> 01:01:31,440
Speaker 3: Wow.

1174
01:01:31,760 --> 01:01:34,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like, I do find it shocking that he's not

1175
01:01:34,400 --> 01:01:39,440
Speaker 2: being held accountable to actually give some information or some reasoning.

1176
01:01:39,680 --> 01:01:42,760
Speaker 2: You know, again, you're right where we can never understand

1177
01:01:42,800 --> 01:01:46,720
Speaker 2: fully this level of maniac behavior. But maybe that's why

1178
01:01:46,760 --> 01:01:49,160
Speaker 2: we're all so curious about this case, It's like, is

1179
01:01:49,200 --> 01:01:51,360
Speaker 2: somebody born evil? You know?

1180
01:01:51,480 --> 01:01:54,160
Speaker 3: Do they court? You know a body? You have a

1181
01:01:54,160 --> 01:01:55,640
Speaker 3: great quote about this that kind of.

1182
01:01:55,920 --> 01:01:59,360
Speaker 8: Is something are you? I know it's a little something

1183
01:01:59,440 --> 01:02:02,120
Speaker 8: you is evil, something you're born with or something you are?

1184
01:02:02,920 --> 01:02:03,360
Speaker 3: Like is it?

1185
01:02:03,400 --> 01:02:03,600
Speaker 11: Do you?

1186
01:02:04,360 --> 01:02:07,040
Speaker 8: Are you born evil? Is evil something you are or

1187
01:02:07,040 --> 01:02:07,680
Speaker 8: something you do?

1188
01:02:08,040 --> 01:02:12,160
Speaker 6: Basically well, I think Brian Colberger has Brian Colberg has

1189
01:02:12,160 --> 01:02:16,840
Speaker 6: been struggling with these things as far back as anyone's

1190
01:02:16,880 --> 01:02:19,040
Speaker 6: been able to find. You know, his posts and his

1191
01:02:19,240 --> 01:02:22,880
Speaker 6: teenage years and his looty issues, and he's just this

1192
01:02:22,960 --> 01:02:26,280
Speaker 6: guy has had his struggles, There's no doubt. I mean,

1193
01:02:26,320 --> 01:02:29,120
Speaker 6: and he did a crazy thing. It's a crazy thing

1194
01:02:29,160 --> 01:02:32,280
Speaker 6: to do. This is someone who either suffers from an

1195
01:02:32,320 --> 01:02:36,200
Speaker 6: infirmity or a mental health issue. Not insane, Not insane,

1196
01:02:36,200 --> 01:02:39,240
Speaker 6: I'm saying, but this is a crazy situation that he

1197
01:02:39,360 --> 01:02:39,840
Speaker 6: that he's in.

1198
01:02:40,080 --> 01:02:42,440
Speaker 3: You know, he had he has a history of a

1199
01:02:42,520 --> 01:02:43,240
Speaker 3: drug abuse.

1200
01:02:43,360 --> 01:02:46,520
Speaker 8: You know, he has a history of being awkward his

1201
01:02:46,560 --> 01:02:49,160
Speaker 8: whole life. So yeah, he's he's had a he's had

1202
01:02:49,240 --> 01:02:52,240
Speaker 8: he's gone through it. He has had challenges to overcome.

1203
01:02:52,280 --> 01:02:55,200
Speaker 8: And I don't think he I don't think he ever did.

1204
01:02:55,400 --> 01:02:57,880
Speaker 6: And I don't think that's not a violin plane for

1205
01:02:57,960 --> 01:03:01,680
Speaker 6: Colberger question. That's those are the kind of things you

1206
01:03:01,760 --> 01:03:06,000
Speaker 6: see upstream in someone's life where they're struggling in society,

1207
01:03:06,040 --> 01:03:08,320
Speaker 6: and that's what he did. And again it may very

1208
01:03:08,320 --> 01:03:11,880
Speaker 6: well have been his partially his diagnosis and that he's

1209
01:03:11,880 --> 01:03:14,680
Speaker 6: on the spectrum and hiss aspergers, But my god, how

1210
01:03:14,720 --> 01:03:19,000
Speaker 6: many millions of families address those issues and don't have

1211
01:03:19,120 --> 01:03:20,120
Speaker 6: anything my own.

1212
01:03:20,240 --> 01:03:22,000
Speaker 3: My own, that's right.

1213
01:03:22,320 --> 01:03:26,640
Speaker 4: Listen more on Brian Koberger's plea deal, and we'll be

1214
01:03:26,640 --> 01:03:31,000
Speaker 4: getting into the reactions from the victim's family. Thankfully, Jarrett

1215
01:03:31,120 --> 01:03:34,720
Speaker 4: will be joining us, Jarrett Farentino, We'll continue. Don't forget

1216
01:03:34,720 --> 01:03:36,640
Speaker 4: to call us. We want to hear your thoughts. Eight

1217
01:03:36,640 --> 01:03:40,000
Speaker 4: at eight three, One crime, keep it here, True Crime.

1218
01:03:40,000 --> 01:03:54,520
Speaker 2: Tonight, all eyes have been on Ditty watch and the

1219
01:03:54,680 --> 01:03:58,919
Speaker 2: verdict is in not guilty in the Rico charge. He's

1220
01:03:58,920 --> 01:04:01,320
Speaker 2: also not going home to noight. He is not free

1221
01:04:01,320 --> 01:04:03,800
Speaker 2: on bail, but next step still to come in his

1222
01:04:03,880 --> 01:04:08,560
Speaker 2: sentencing hearing. And then Brian Coberger, the boogeyman himself, maybe

1223
01:04:08,560 --> 01:04:11,560
Speaker 2: even the devil himself, who has pled not guilty to

1224
01:04:11,680 --> 01:04:16,640
Speaker 2: the hideous crime of murdering for incredible Idaho college students

1225
01:04:16,720 --> 01:04:20,040
Speaker 2: back in twenty twenty two, has been claiming his innocence

1226
01:04:20,040 --> 01:04:23,560
Speaker 2: the whole time, has now changed his plea officially too

1227
01:04:23,600 --> 01:04:28,000
Speaker 2: guilty to guilty on all counts. And we have Jarrett Farantino,

1228
01:04:28,160 --> 01:04:31,600
Speaker 2: the incredible trial attorney, with us again tonight, with so

1229
01:04:31,800 --> 01:04:34,640
Speaker 2: much to unpack that it's almost as though we're going

1230
01:04:34,680 --> 01:04:36,640
Speaker 2: to need to continue this for multiple nights.

1231
01:04:36,960 --> 01:04:38,200
Speaker 3: We definitely want to hear from you too.

1232
01:04:38,240 --> 01:04:41,960
Speaker 2: Please join the conversation eight eight eight three to one crime,

1233
01:04:42,600 --> 01:04:46,520
Speaker 2: and we also have a talkback to go to.

1234
01:04:48,080 --> 01:04:52,000
Speaker 13: Shouldn't Brian Kohlberger be required to provide some kind of

1235
01:04:52,520 --> 01:04:56,280
Speaker 13: insight that nobody knows about, or evidence or some kind

1236
01:04:56,360 --> 01:05:00,640
Speaker 13: of statement to make sure that there is isn't any

1237
01:05:00,920 --> 01:05:05,360
Speaker 13: sick goes out there doing any false confessions like we

1238
01:05:05,480 --> 01:05:08,120
Speaker 13: know some people have done in the past.

1239
01:05:09,320 --> 01:05:11,160
Speaker 3: That's a good interesting point, Jared.

1240
01:05:11,280 --> 01:05:14,760
Speaker 2: You know you're here as our legal prowess on that one.

1241
01:05:14,880 --> 01:05:17,720
Speaker 2: So I guess the point being is sometimes people do

1242
01:05:18,160 --> 01:05:22,040
Speaker 2: make false confessions. Wacky as that seems, that is a

1243
01:05:22,040 --> 01:05:26,280
Speaker 2: real thing. So is it customary for somebody who's admitting

1244
01:05:26,320 --> 01:05:28,919
Speaker 2: guilt in a crime so large that has so much

1245
01:05:29,360 --> 01:05:32,480
Speaker 2: you know, mystery around it? Do they have to like

1246
01:05:32,680 --> 01:05:35,400
Speaker 2: give a little secret fact that nobody would know if

1247
01:05:35,480 --> 01:05:36,840
Speaker 2: not the killer themselves?

1248
01:05:37,400 --> 01:05:38,640
Speaker 3: Jerreed, do you have an opinion on that?

1249
01:05:39,200 --> 01:05:39,439
Speaker 7: Well?

1250
01:05:40,160 --> 01:05:43,480
Speaker 6: Absolutely, I think that's really blending two concepts. When you're

1251
01:05:43,480 --> 01:05:46,440
Speaker 6: doing an investigation, you're looking for individuals who may not

1252
01:05:46,760 --> 01:05:49,880
Speaker 6: may have information that was not made public, as like

1253
01:05:50,040 --> 01:05:53,160
Speaker 6: in this shit of their guilt. What that question was

1254
01:05:53,160 --> 01:05:57,040
Speaker 6: was basically, shouldn't Coldberger give us a detail that no

1255
01:05:57,080 --> 01:06:01,680
Speaker 6: one else knew? Yes, he's not required to. What's required

1256
01:06:01,840 --> 01:06:06,440
Speaker 6: is the state show the evidence. They have a factual

1257
01:06:06,600 --> 01:06:10,880
Speaker 6: basis that supports that Brian Colberger is their guy, and

1258
01:06:11,280 --> 01:06:14,400
Speaker 6: Brian Kolberger under oath is to say, I don't dispute

1259
01:06:14,440 --> 01:06:16,720
Speaker 6: those facts. And what did they do by doing that?

1260
01:06:16,920 --> 01:06:20,040
Speaker 6: They gave it the timeline today They said it's Colburger's DNA,

1261
01:06:20,360 --> 01:06:24,240
Speaker 6: his phone, his car, The time adds up all of

1262
01:06:24,280 --> 01:06:28,000
Speaker 6: his comings and goings in November. All of that, that

1263
01:06:28,080 --> 01:06:31,600
Speaker 6: factual basis gives you Colburger, which avoids the very risk

1264
01:06:31,640 --> 01:06:35,040
Speaker 6: the caller was asking about, which is false confessions. It's

1265
01:06:35,080 --> 01:06:37,360
Speaker 6: called corpus DELECTI like if I came in and said

1266
01:06:37,480 --> 01:06:40,320
Speaker 6: I killed JFK, for example, Is that true?

1267
01:06:40,520 --> 01:06:42,840
Speaker 3: I didn't know that. That's a very interesting fact.

1268
01:06:42,880 --> 01:06:45,640
Speaker 2: That makes a lot of sense, though, because some things

1269
01:06:45,680 --> 01:06:48,240
Speaker 2: are reported in the news or leaks in the press,

1270
01:06:48,280 --> 01:06:48,760
Speaker 2: et cetera.

1271
01:06:49,160 --> 01:06:50,800
Speaker 3: Something we all have to be very careful of.

1272
01:06:51,120 --> 01:06:53,240
Speaker 2: So you could read that and then go to the

1273
01:06:53,280 --> 01:06:55,320
Speaker 2: police station the next day and say, yeah, I was

1274
01:06:55,480 --> 01:06:58,240
Speaker 2: you know this, this and this, and that's where they're

1275
01:06:58,280 --> 01:07:01,480
Speaker 2: getting their information for the confession. That's a story for

1276
01:07:01,520 --> 01:07:04,600
Speaker 2: a different day, and we should unpack that follow the confessions.

1277
01:07:04,720 --> 01:07:09,000
Speaker 3: What the I'm sure? Why am I not surprised by that?

1278
01:07:09,200 --> 01:07:10,680
Speaker 4: I know everything?

1279
01:07:11,520 --> 01:07:13,040
Speaker 3: I have a question for you.

1280
01:07:13,840 --> 01:07:17,200
Speaker 4: In the plea deal, Coberger states that all for all

1281
01:07:17,320 --> 01:07:19,920
Speaker 4: four of the murders were first degree. A lot of

1282
01:07:20,000 --> 01:07:23,680
Speaker 4: people have surmised that Ethan Chapin, who did not live

1283
01:07:23,840 --> 01:07:26,920
Speaker 4: in the house but was there with his girlfriend, was

1284
01:07:27,720 --> 01:07:31,560
Speaker 4: collateral damage. Does that have any bearing? Yeah, explain that

1285
01:07:31,600 --> 01:07:32,200
Speaker 4: to us.

1286
01:07:32,600 --> 01:07:35,080
Speaker 6: So the question would be, how could that be an

1287
01:07:35,120 --> 01:07:38,080
Speaker 6: intentional killing if he didn't have the intention to kill

1288
01:07:38,320 --> 01:07:40,720
Speaker 6: Ethan when he walked in the door. Is that that's

1289
01:07:40,760 --> 01:07:44,880
Speaker 6: the question? Carect The answer is, you can formulate the

1290
01:07:45,000 --> 01:07:48,840
Speaker 6: intent to kill sufficient to commit first degree murder. In

1291
01:07:48,880 --> 01:07:51,600
Speaker 6: a fraction of a second. And the second he drew

1292
01:07:51,640 --> 01:07:54,720
Speaker 6: that night and stuck it into Ethan repeatedly. He was

1293
01:07:54,760 --> 01:07:57,560
Speaker 6: intending on killing him in that moment. And that's the law.

1294
01:07:57,760 --> 01:08:00,680
Speaker 6: You know. It doesn't have to necessarily be lying in

1295
01:08:00,760 --> 01:08:04,800
Speaker 6: wait or a pre planned thing. Premeditation can be the

1296
01:08:04,840 --> 01:08:05,520
Speaker 6: blink of an eye.

1297
01:08:06,000 --> 01:08:06,440
Speaker 3: Wow.

1298
01:08:06,760 --> 01:08:10,360
Speaker 8: So, Jared, you you've you're a former prosecutor, You've prosecuted

1299
01:08:10,720 --> 01:08:15,640
Speaker 8: many cases. You've prosecuted death penalty cases. Right, you you're

1300
01:08:15,720 --> 01:08:19,400
Speaker 8: negotiating a plea deal. Right, put your mind, you're Bill Thompson.

1301
01:08:19,720 --> 01:08:23,840
Speaker 8: Can you make demands in a plea deal? Like you're

1302
01:08:23,840 --> 01:08:25,400
Speaker 8: going to tell us where the knife is? Can you

1303
01:08:25,479 --> 01:08:26,960
Speaker 8: do those things? As a prosecutor?

1304
01:08:27,479 --> 01:08:30,880
Speaker 6: You could certainly ask because you have leverage at that point,

1305
01:08:30,960 --> 01:08:34,639
Speaker 6: and it's a deal, it's a plea bargain and remember bargain.

1306
01:08:34,960 --> 01:08:38,719
Speaker 3: And remember, Jared, the defense approached the prosecution, right.

1307
01:08:38,720 --> 01:08:42,040
Speaker 6: So I would you know initially in those conversations you say,

1308
01:08:42,040 --> 01:08:44,160
Speaker 6: I have no interest in talking to Colberger unless he

1309
01:08:44,200 --> 01:08:46,800
Speaker 6: tells us why or where the knife is. Although there

1310
01:08:46,840 --> 01:08:48,599
Speaker 6: was a clue where the knife was today and we'll

1311
01:08:48,600 --> 01:08:51,080
Speaker 6: talk about that too if you want to. But but

1312
01:08:51,120 --> 01:08:54,719
Speaker 6: the key is you have leverage before the plea is entered.

1313
01:08:54,920 --> 01:08:57,840
Speaker 6: You have leverage with your discretion to even agree to

1314
01:08:57,880 --> 01:09:00,559
Speaker 6: the plea, and you say these are my terms. Now,

1315
01:09:00,680 --> 01:09:03,400
Speaker 6: if the defendant doesn't agree to do that, can you

1316
01:09:03,479 --> 01:09:06,120
Speaker 6: still move forward on the plea. Yes, that doesn't mean

1317
01:09:06,120 --> 01:09:08,760
Speaker 6: you don't try to get answers to those questions, and

1318
01:09:08,800 --> 01:09:11,280
Speaker 6: the whole deal doesn't blow up if you don't get

1319
01:09:11,320 --> 01:09:12,479
Speaker 6: those questions answered.

1320
01:09:12,760 --> 01:09:15,320
Speaker 2: Interesting, I do want to hear about your little sneaky

1321
01:09:15,320 --> 01:09:18,920
Speaker 2: detail about that you're not getting any information away.

1322
01:09:19,200 --> 01:09:23,599
Speaker 6: But yeah, so if you if I was listening very

1323
01:09:23,600 --> 01:09:26,160
Speaker 6: carefully to what Bill Thompson was saying, and he talked

1324
01:09:26,160 --> 01:09:29,920
Speaker 6: about that, Colberger traveled thirty miles south to a seaport

1325
01:09:30,000 --> 01:09:35,120
Speaker 6: village from Pullman, where he described large bodies of moving

1326
01:09:35,240 --> 01:09:38,880
Speaker 6: water in that neighborhood in that area. Why, that's a

1327
01:09:38,920 --> 01:09:40,400
Speaker 6: perfect spot to throw a knife.

1328
01:09:40,640 --> 01:09:43,320
Speaker 8: I don't think he threw it in ther Why because

1329
01:09:43,320 --> 01:09:44,439
Speaker 8: he searched for a sheath on.

1330
01:09:44,360 --> 01:09:47,520
Speaker 6: The fifteenth, but his sheath was missed on the thirteenth.

1331
01:09:47,640 --> 01:09:49,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, he knew that he didn't have a sheath.

1332
01:09:49,479 --> 01:09:52,719
Speaker 6: Why, oh, saying he still had the knife, but still.

1333
01:09:52,720 --> 01:09:55,120
Speaker 8: A knife on the fifteenth I think I could be wrong.

1334
01:09:55,200 --> 01:09:57,160
Speaker 8: Jared like, listen, I'm an idiot, So don't listen to me.

1335
01:09:57,280 --> 01:10:01,759
Speaker 3: You are not an idiot. You know, a fat body

1336
01:10:01,840 --> 01:10:03,600
Speaker 3: move in. I'm just saying I'm not.

1337
01:10:04,640 --> 01:10:07,280
Speaker 6: Thompson really made a point to say he did a

1338
01:10:07,360 --> 01:10:11,080
Speaker 6: large moving body of water far away to dump something. Right,

1339
01:10:11,800 --> 01:10:14,120
Speaker 6: But that's a great point. He was shopping for a

1340
01:10:14,160 --> 01:10:18,840
Speaker 6: replacement sheath, yep, a good point on the fifteenth.

1341
01:10:18,479 --> 01:10:20,000
Speaker 8: And he don't look for a sheet unless you have

1342
01:10:20,040 --> 01:10:23,040
Speaker 8: a knife, right, Like he knows he doesn't have the sheath.

1343
01:10:23,080 --> 01:10:24,720
Speaker 8: He's like, oh my god, oh my god, oh my god,

1344
01:10:24,720 --> 01:10:27,200
Speaker 8: oh my god, I need to buy a sheath.

1345
01:10:27,479 --> 01:10:29,439
Speaker 2: Well wait, I just want to play this out because

1346
01:10:29,439 --> 01:10:32,200
Speaker 2: maybe I'm just slow right now and not tracking that.

1347
01:10:32,439 --> 01:10:36,479
Speaker 2: So again he commits this murder. He gets in his car,

1348
01:10:36,640 --> 01:10:39,519
Speaker 2: he realizes that he has the knife in his hands,

1349
01:10:39,520 --> 01:10:42,080
Speaker 2: but he forgot the sheath, which is a little covering

1350
01:10:42,120 --> 01:10:43,800
Speaker 2: if you're not familiar with knives the way.

1351
01:10:44,200 --> 01:10:45,920
Speaker 3: I wasn't familiar with what that was.

1352
01:10:46,320 --> 01:10:48,640
Speaker 2: So now you're like, oh my goodness, I left the

1353
01:10:48,640 --> 01:10:49,960
Speaker 2: sheath at the crime scene.

1354
01:10:50,000 --> 01:10:50,920
Speaker 3: What am I going to do?

1355
01:10:51,479 --> 01:10:53,880
Speaker 2: You dip you get rid of the knife in some

1356
01:10:53,960 --> 01:10:56,519
Speaker 2: body of water. You still want to find the sheath,

1357
01:10:56,640 --> 01:10:59,440
Speaker 2: right or no, what I guess I can use myself.

1358
01:10:59,680 --> 01:11:02,280
Speaker 3: And that's from the dateline leak, so it might not

1359
01:11:02,320 --> 01:11:03,160
Speaker 3: even be true.

1360
01:11:04,880 --> 01:11:08,080
Speaker 6: For the sheep. They said that today. Oh okay, that today,

1361
01:11:08,120 --> 01:11:10,760
Speaker 6: So he was definitely bout. That's the other thing. Bill

1362
01:11:10,760 --> 01:11:13,720
Speaker 6: Thompson acknowledged facts that have been in the public but

1363
01:11:13,840 --> 01:11:16,800
Speaker 6: never really embraced by him or his office, one of

1364
01:11:16,840 --> 01:11:21,000
Speaker 6: which was Coberger was shopping. It's confusing sometimes when you

1365
01:11:21,160 --> 01:11:25,000
Speaker 6: know this information, but then Bill Thompson acknowledges it today.

1366
01:11:25,800 --> 01:11:30,000
Speaker 6: He basically said Colberger was on his computer shopping for

1367
01:11:30,040 --> 01:11:33,920
Speaker 6: a replacement knife or sheath, right, and he tried to

1368
01:11:33,960 --> 01:11:36,839
Speaker 6: delete his purchase history as well on the Amazon account.

1369
01:11:37,120 --> 01:11:37,320
Speaker 5: Right.

1370
01:11:37,560 --> 01:11:40,519
Speaker 4: She tried and failed. You're listening's True Crimes tonight. I'm

1371
01:11:40,560 --> 01:11:43,720
Speaker 4: Courtney Armstrong here with Stephanie Leidecker and Body Moven and

1372
01:11:43,840 --> 01:11:48,559
Speaker 4: attorney Jarrett Farantino. We are discussing Brian Coberger is guilty.

1373
01:11:48,680 --> 01:11:51,599
Speaker 4: Ply let us know your thoughts eight at eight three

1374
01:11:51,720 --> 01:11:56,439
Speaker 4: one crime. One more follow up Jarrett on sort of

1375
01:11:56,520 --> 01:12:00,960
Speaker 4: what you can or might try and demand does the prosecution.

1376
01:12:01,640 --> 01:12:04,400
Speaker 4: I'm hung up on this because another case we don't

1377
01:12:04,439 --> 01:12:06,439
Speaker 4: even need to go into the details, but it's something

1378
01:12:06,479 --> 01:12:08,760
Speaker 4: Stephanie and I followed for years. It was a it's

1379
01:12:08,800 --> 01:12:12,320
Speaker 4: called the piked in Massacre is the podcast, but all

1380
01:12:12,400 --> 01:12:15,439
Speaker 4: for there were four people who were charged. It was

1381
01:12:15,479 --> 01:12:18,479
Speaker 4: going to be death sentence trials, and then one of

1382
01:12:18,520 --> 01:12:21,559
Speaker 4: them pled out and death sentence was taken off the

1383
01:12:21,600 --> 01:12:25,599
Speaker 4: table for all four members if the first person who

1384
01:12:25,640 --> 01:12:29,240
Speaker 4: did the plea testified to the satisfaction of the state,

1385
01:12:29,840 --> 01:12:32,960
Speaker 4: and with that they gave all of the information, the

1386
01:12:33,000 --> 01:12:38,040
Speaker 4: timeline of everything that happened, where where the weapons were kept,

1387
01:12:38,080 --> 01:12:40,799
Speaker 4: which was in this case in concrete on the bottom

1388
01:12:40,840 --> 01:12:45,240
Speaker 4: of a pond. So that was a big ask that

1389
01:12:45,320 --> 01:12:47,880
Speaker 4: came through. Is that common or uncommon?

1390
01:12:48,320 --> 01:12:51,240
Speaker 6: Well, you know, it's a case by case thing. It

1391
01:12:51,280 --> 01:12:56,320
Speaker 6: depends what a particular prosecution needs from defendant. In that case,

1392
01:12:56,360 --> 01:12:59,439
Speaker 6: you have multiple defendants. Once you get a crack in

1393
01:12:59,520 --> 01:13:03,439
Speaker 6: that can inspiracy and you have one of them singing

1394
01:13:03,560 --> 01:13:06,760
Speaker 6: on the others, death can come off the table at

1395
01:13:06,760 --> 01:13:09,360
Speaker 6: that point and you move forward. Death in that point

1396
01:13:09,720 --> 01:13:12,760
Speaker 6: in that case is used as leverage and as a

1397
01:13:12,800 --> 01:13:15,920
Speaker 6: way to put pressure on defendants, which prosecutors don't always

1398
01:13:15,960 --> 01:13:16,639
Speaker 6: admit to that.

1399
01:13:16,560 --> 01:13:21,080
Speaker 2: But they did do that, of course I wouldn't really. Yeah,

1400
01:13:21,360 --> 01:13:24,160
Speaker 2: oh yeah, we also had heard. We talked about this

1401
01:13:24,200 --> 01:13:27,760
Speaker 2: in an earlier segment. You know that the dad right

1402
01:13:27,800 --> 01:13:31,360
Speaker 2: there was that infamous road trip, and Kaylee Gonzalvez is

1403
01:13:31,520 --> 01:13:35,559
Speaker 2: father Steve Gonzalvez, who's obviously such a you know, he's

1404
01:13:35,600 --> 01:13:38,240
Speaker 2: suffering so deeply. They all are, all of the victims'

1405
01:13:38,240 --> 01:13:41,760
Speaker 2: families and you know, Captain obvious our hearts, so go

1406
01:13:41,880 --> 01:13:47,000
Speaker 2: out to all of them. What an incredibly exhausting, disgusting

1407
01:13:47,120 --> 01:13:48,280
Speaker 2: day they have had.

1408
01:13:48,880 --> 01:13:49,080
Speaker 3: You know.

1409
01:13:49,120 --> 01:13:51,880
Speaker 2: He kind of made mention of the idea that Brian

1410
01:13:51,920 --> 01:13:56,240
Speaker 2: Coburger's father booked his ticket to pick up Brian after

1411
01:13:56,280 --> 01:13:59,120
Speaker 2: the murders to return home in the way Alantra for

1412
01:13:59,160 --> 01:14:03,360
Speaker 2: the holidays to Pennsylvania, where he was later arrested.

1413
01:14:03,600 --> 01:14:04,679
Speaker 3: Did you make anything of.

1414
01:14:04,560 --> 01:14:07,960
Speaker 6: That, Well, I was surprised to hear it. I was

1415
01:14:08,160 --> 01:14:11,640
Speaker 6: always suspicious of that trip that Michael Coberger took in

1416
01:14:11,720 --> 01:14:14,519
Speaker 6: the timing of that trip, but as you all know,

1417
01:14:15,000 --> 01:14:19,240
Speaker 6: the RB was he had pre purchased that ticket some

1418
01:14:19,360 --> 01:14:22,599
Speaker 6: time ago and was planning on making that cross country trip.

1419
01:14:22,800 --> 01:14:24,680
Speaker 6: So that was the first time I heard it. If

1420
01:14:24,720 --> 01:14:28,680
Speaker 6: that's true, he's calling Michael. He's telling Michael Coberger, I

1421
01:14:28,720 --> 01:14:32,639
Speaker 6: know you're a liar, and you know I'm looking into

1422
01:14:32,800 --> 01:14:36,280
Speaker 6: what you've already reported. So he's a group of investigators

1423
01:14:36,280 --> 01:14:38,920
Speaker 6: working with him, mister Gonsolves. So I'm sure they found

1424
01:14:38,960 --> 01:14:39,320
Speaker 6: that out.

1425
01:14:39,760 --> 01:14:42,080
Speaker 8: Jared, why do you think why do you think Brian

1426
01:14:42,120 --> 01:14:43,000
Speaker 8: went back that morning?

1427
01:14:43,560 --> 01:14:46,040
Speaker 6: You know, killers go back to the scene of the crime.

1428
01:14:46,200 --> 01:14:48,439
Speaker 6: It's just the thing. I mean. Was he going back

1429
01:14:48,479 --> 01:14:51,240
Speaker 6: to see if there was any attention on the property yet?

1430
01:14:51,400 --> 01:14:54,639
Speaker 6: Was he curious? Was he looking to fulfill some kind

1431
01:14:54,680 --> 01:14:57,439
Speaker 6: of a sick fantasy to see the you know, the

1432
01:14:57,439 --> 01:15:00,680
Speaker 6: criminal investigation that was falling out as a result of

1433
01:15:00,720 --> 01:15:03,160
Speaker 6: his crime. Who knows, but he was, you know, he

1434
01:15:03,240 --> 01:15:05,960
Speaker 6: went back and a lot of times just to see

1435
01:15:06,000 --> 01:15:09,280
Speaker 6: the chaos and the breakage that remains from what he did.

1436
01:15:09,760 --> 01:15:11,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's right.

1437
01:15:11,240 --> 01:15:14,680
Speaker 4: Oh my goodness. Well listen, Jarrett Farantino. We want to

1438
01:15:14,720 --> 01:15:17,519
Speaker 4: thank you so very much for being here tonight. You

1439
01:15:17,600 --> 01:15:20,960
Speaker 4: make these really intense and complicated cases just a lot

1440
01:15:21,000 --> 01:15:24,840
Speaker 4: more clear and yes, digestible, you know, the information. You

1441
01:15:24,920 --> 01:15:27,640
Speaker 4: really help present it in an understandable way. All of

1442
01:15:27,680 --> 01:15:30,280
Speaker 4: us at True Crime Tonight really appreciate and thank you

1443
01:15:30,439 --> 01:15:32,639
Speaker 4: for that. If you love Jared as much as we do,

1444
01:15:32,720 --> 01:15:36,080
Speaker 4: and you should, you can find him on the YouTube

1445
01:15:36,120 --> 01:15:38,840
Speaker 4: series Primetime Crime, where he is a co host, and

1446
01:15:39,080 --> 01:15:41,840
Speaker 4: as a host of the podcast True Grand Boss. And

1447
01:15:42,120 --> 01:15:46,440
Speaker 4: also he is appearing in the Idaho Student Murders on Peacock,

1448
01:15:46,680 --> 01:15:49,320
Speaker 4: which is dropping tonight at three am.

1449
01:15:49,520 --> 01:15:52,320
Speaker 2: Hopefully we all get a little rest, yourselves included. I'm

1450
01:15:52,360 --> 01:15:56,120
Speaker 2: sure anyone who has watched any television today has seen

1451
01:15:56,160 --> 01:15:58,840
Speaker 2: some of these trials and it's kind of triggering and

1452
01:15:59,000 --> 01:16:03,639
Speaker 2: a little heroin and a little emotionally disregulating. So again,

1453
01:16:03,680 --> 01:16:06,000
Speaker 2: we've been so grateful that you've been with us tonight,

1454
01:16:06,080 --> 01:16:08,080
Speaker 2: so we can all huddle up and this night has

1455
01:16:08,120 --> 01:16:10,519
Speaker 2: flown by What do you guys think?

1456
01:16:10,760 --> 01:16:11,040
Speaker 6: Did He?

1457
01:16:11,520 --> 01:16:15,920
Speaker 3: I'm just worn out. I feel I can't get over

1458
01:16:15,960 --> 01:16:16,240
Speaker 3: that now.

1459
01:16:16,560 --> 01:16:18,400
Speaker 8: I just feel very numb to everything right now.

1460
01:16:18,400 --> 01:16:19,639
Speaker 3: And it's it's.

1461
01:16:19,439 --> 01:16:22,160
Speaker 8: Not about me, right, this is not about me. I

1462
01:16:22,240 --> 01:16:25,280
Speaker 8: just feel there's a lot of emotion. You know, you've

1463
01:16:25,320 --> 01:16:29,160
Speaker 8: got with Coberger. You know, specifically, you've got Cassie who's

1464
01:16:29,400 --> 01:16:32,599
Speaker 8: terrified now that did He might be getting out on bail,

1465
01:16:33,200 --> 01:16:34,720
Speaker 8: you know, and you know.

1466
01:16:34,680 --> 01:16:37,320
Speaker 3: It's just it's just an emotional day. You know it's

1467
01:16:37,360 --> 01:16:41,240
Speaker 3: been hard, it has, but we do have a talk back.

1468
01:16:41,320 --> 01:16:42,160
Speaker 3: So let's see.

1469
01:16:42,439 --> 01:16:44,800
Speaker 4: Let's see what this person has to say about did

1470
01:16:44,840 --> 01:16:45,599
Speaker 4: he hi?

1471
01:16:45,640 --> 01:16:49,599
Speaker 14: It's Cynthia from Canada callings to the Diddy case. If

1472
01:16:49,640 --> 01:16:53,120
Speaker 14: he's acquitted on some of the charges, the prosecution can

1473
01:16:53,360 --> 01:16:56,880
Speaker 14: appeal that decision if they believe there's errors in law.

1474
01:16:56,960 --> 01:16:59,760
Speaker 14: Otherwise they don't have a leg to stand on. I

1475
01:17:00,080 --> 01:17:02,400
Speaker 14: have to wonder why he has his children in the courtroom.

1476
01:17:02,560 --> 01:17:02,960
Speaker 3: I thank you.

1477
01:17:03,040 --> 01:17:06,960
Speaker 14: Given the content of the trial, it seems a little

1478
01:17:07,000 --> 01:17:09,920
Speaker 14: coursive to me, but you know that's just my opinion

1479
01:17:10,000 --> 01:17:12,720
Speaker 14: from being an outsider. Thanks have good night.

1480
01:17:13,120 --> 01:17:15,080
Speaker 3: You were in our heads. You know what.

1481
01:17:15,280 --> 01:17:18,679
Speaker 2: Likely only a real bad boy right would allow his

1482
01:17:18,800 --> 01:17:21,639
Speaker 2: daughters and family to sit behind him, knowing full well

1483
01:17:21,680 --> 01:17:24,360
Speaker 2: that the information they were going to hear could harm

1484
01:17:24,400 --> 01:17:29,080
Speaker 2: them and scar them traumatically forever, especially as young daughters.

1485
01:17:29,360 --> 01:17:32,000
Speaker 2: And he was doing it selfishly, so he looked like

1486
01:17:32,240 --> 01:17:35,839
Speaker 2: a loving father who was supported by his loving family.

1487
01:17:36,160 --> 01:17:40,880
Speaker 4: I think it's a choice. The theatrics were repugnant to me.

1488
01:17:41,280 --> 01:17:43,240
Speaker 3: Nice coaty armstrong, Yeah.

1489
01:17:43,360 --> 01:17:48,799
Speaker 4: I mean sitting there with a Bible, sitting there positive thinking.

1490
01:17:48,920 --> 01:17:52,679
Speaker 4: I mean everything's a prop in his world, including his children,

1491
01:17:52,880 --> 01:17:53,400
Speaker 4: is my thought.

1492
01:17:53,520 --> 01:17:55,839
Speaker 3: And they were there to make him.

1493
01:17:55,760 --> 01:17:59,800
Speaker 4: Look like an older gentleman instead of, you know, the

1494
01:17:59,800 --> 01:18:02,759
Speaker 4: guy who did all the felonious activity that he did.

1495
01:18:02,800 --> 01:18:05,280
Speaker 8: And you know he why I read and I looked

1496
01:18:05,280 --> 01:18:08,360
Speaker 8: at the courthouse sketches when they read the verdict. Did

1497
01:18:08,360 --> 01:18:11,839
Speaker 8: he drop to his knees and just like praying and yeah,

1498
01:18:11,880 --> 01:18:14,400
Speaker 8: I'll give you, like you said, the theatrics were spare me,

1499
01:18:14,760 --> 01:18:18,720
Speaker 8: spare me. I kind of think he knew. But yesterday

1500
01:18:18,760 --> 01:18:22,160
Speaker 8: they said he was very despondent, right like, oh, he

1501
01:18:22,320 --> 01:18:25,360
Speaker 8: was just you know, over over emotional, But today he

1502
01:18:25,520 --> 01:18:28,640
Speaker 8: was just apparently very grateful and praying and dropping to

1503
01:18:28,680 --> 01:18:29,479
Speaker 8: his knees and whatnot.

1504
01:18:29,680 --> 01:18:31,960
Speaker 3: And what will he do from here? Rights? Those what

1505
01:18:32,040 --> 01:18:33,200
Speaker 3: are those prayers equal?

1506
01:18:33,400 --> 01:18:35,280
Speaker 2: Is this going to be a bad boy turned good

1507
01:18:35,600 --> 01:18:38,080
Speaker 2: and we're going to see a change in his ways?

1508
01:18:38,200 --> 01:18:40,759
Speaker 2: Or is the revenge tort just about to begin?

1509
01:18:41,240 --> 01:18:45,519
Speaker 4: Oh gosh, I don't know, it'll be it'll be very interesting.

1510
01:18:45,560 --> 01:18:49,080
Speaker 4: But my real hope is that the judge, and of

1511
01:18:49,080 --> 01:18:52,439
Speaker 4: course the sentencing is only there are parameters, sure, but

1512
01:18:52,760 --> 01:18:55,960
Speaker 4: I hope he you know, hits the the further the

1513
01:18:56,080 --> 01:18:59,479
Speaker 4: uppest levels of them, and if any indication by some

1514
01:18:59,560 --> 01:19:03,320
Speaker 4: of the stuff, the judge said, using the defense's words

1515
01:19:03,360 --> 01:19:06,439
Speaker 4: against him, he's like, listen, you said, he's a guy

1516
01:19:06,479 --> 01:19:11,040
Speaker 4: who's beaten people, that he's been dangerous, and so I

1517
01:19:11,120 --> 01:19:13,400
Speaker 4: don't know, fingers crossed, he gets a big sentence.

1518
01:19:13,479 --> 01:19:15,000
Speaker 3: That's the only thing I can wish.

1519
01:19:15,280 --> 01:19:18,719
Speaker 2: And just for victims out there, I mean again, if

1520
01:19:18,760 --> 01:19:23,080
Speaker 2: you you know, if you've suffered at the hands of anyone,

1521
01:19:23,840 --> 01:19:26,040
Speaker 2: you know, we're kind of all in this together, it

1522
01:19:26,120 --> 01:19:29,759
Speaker 2: is not okay. And for Cassie Ventura and Jane Doe

1523
01:19:29,840 --> 01:19:33,639
Speaker 2: and any of his victims personally, I throw in my support.

1524
01:19:33,800 --> 01:19:35,639
Speaker 2: Took a lot of courage to put yourself out there.

1525
01:19:35,720 --> 01:19:39,160
Speaker 2: We will be following, of course, more of this tomorrow.

1526
01:19:39,240 --> 01:19:42,920
Speaker 2: So thank you for an incredible night, guys, for talking

1527
01:19:42,920 --> 01:19:46,080
Speaker 2: through some of this scary stuff. We'll be back tomorrow.

1528
01:19:46,200 --> 01:19:49,280
Speaker 2: This is true crime tonight, talking true crime all the time.

1529
01:19:49,600 --> 01:19:52,200
Speaker 3: Good night, good night.

1530
01:20:00,920 --> 01:20:01,320
Speaker 1: Yes