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Speaker 1: Kay, Welcome to the Therapy for Black Girls podcast, a

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Speaker 1: weekly conversation about mental health, personal development, and all the

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Speaker 1: small decisions we can make to become the best possible

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Speaker 1: versions of ourselves. I'm your host, Dr Joy hard and Bradford,

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Speaker 1: a licensed psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia. For more information or

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Speaker 1: to find a therapist in your area, visit our website

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Speaker 1: at Therapy for Black Girls dot com. While I hope

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Speaker 1: you love listening to and learning from the podcast, it

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Speaker 1: is not meant to be a substitute for relationship with

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Speaker 1: a licensed mental health professional. Hey, y'all, thanks so much

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Speaker 1: for joining me for session one forty two the Therapy

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Speaker 1: for Black Girls podcasts. We're back this week with another

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Speaker 1: episode inspired by a help Assister Out question submitted by

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Speaker 1: community member. If you're unfamiliar, Help Assister Out is an

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Speaker 1: opportunity for members of our community to submit a question

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Speaker 1: they like others to weigh in on. We post the

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Speaker 1: questions on our social media channels, and the community shares

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Speaker 1: their input. If you have a question that you'd like

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Speaker 1: to submit for a chance to be shared, you can

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Speaker 1: share it at Therapy for Black Girls dot com slash

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Speaker 1: h a s O. So this question in particular read

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Speaker 1: I know that you can heal in the environment that

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Speaker 1: hurt you, but what if the only people you have

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Speaker 1: are the ones that hurt you. A very poignant question, right,

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Speaker 1: and one that many of you wanted feedback about, so

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Speaker 1: of course I had to make an episode about it.

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Speaker 1: And to join me in this conversation for another visit

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Speaker 1: with us is the incredible Melissa Eiffel, who's a licensed

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Speaker 1: clinical social worker in New York. Melissa shares some great

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Speaker 1: information and I can't wait to get into it. But

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Speaker 1: first let's hear a quick word from our sponsor. Do

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Speaker 1: New stories drop every Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. Subscribe to

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Speaker 1: meet Cute and then follow them on Instagram to stay

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Speaker 1: up to date with the latest love stories. As I mentioned,

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Speaker 1: Melissa is a licensed clinical social worker, speaker, wellness coach,

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Speaker 1: and therapist. Her passion is working with women of color

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Speaker 1: to assist them in managing their emotions through critical life transitions,

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Speaker 1: whether dealing with past hurt, a recent breakup, moving to

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Speaker 1: a new state, navigating a new job, or just deciding

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Speaker 1: what you want from life. Melissa believes that your ability

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Speaker 1: to understand what you want and cope with the emotions

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Speaker 1: that arise are critical pieces to assist you in being successful.

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Speaker 1: Utilizing holistic wellness techniques, she's able to bridge the gap

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Speaker 1: between traditional healing practices and clinical understanding to provide effective

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Speaker 1: coping tools and education on how your mind, body, and

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Speaker 1: spirit are impacted by painful experiences. She gets excited when

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Speaker 1: she's able to encourage women to see themselves as whole

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Speaker 1: people and thrive in spite of past trauma. One of

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Speaker 1: her favorite things, the glow Up is in The show

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Speaker 1: up demonstrates her belief that what you do determines the

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Speaker 1: life you have, and you really do get to choose

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Speaker 1: and create the life you desire. Her goal is to

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Speaker 1: help you take your life off autopilot and put you

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Speaker 1: back in the driver's seat towards your dreams. Melissa and

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Speaker 1: I chatted about whether it's possible to heal in an

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Speaker 1: environment that hurt you, what boundaries might look like with

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Speaker 1: someone who's hurt you, the importance of having difficult conversations,

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Speaker 1: and what forgiveness really means when you've been hurt. If

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Speaker 1: you hear something while listening that resonates with you, please

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Speaker 1: share with us on social media using the hashtag tv

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Speaker 1: G in session. Here's our conversation. Thank you so much

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Speaker 1: for being back with us again, Melissa. Yes, I am

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Speaker 1: always always grateful to be with you. Yes. So, you know,

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Speaker 1: if y'all have been following the Therapy for Black Girls

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Speaker 1: social media pages, you know that we have a feature

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Speaker 1: called help a Sister Out. Every now and then there

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Speaker 1: will be a question that is lots of uz, lots

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Speaker 1: of engagement in people requests or we need a full

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Speaker 1: episode on this. So a couple of weeks ago, there

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Speaker 1: was a question about how do you heal in the

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Speaker 1: environment that hurt you and a very poignant question. You know, sisters,

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Speaker 1: I thought engaged beautifully with the question, but I definitely

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Speaker 1: wanted to bring it to the podcast so that we

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Speaker 1: can open it up for a further discussion and talk

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Speaker 1: about like what this might look like in terms of

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Speaker 1: help in therapy. And Melissa, of course, you were the

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Speaker 1: first person I thought of, so I'm very grateful for

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Speaker 1: you to be back with us. Thank you so much. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is a topic that you know, I have to

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Speaker 1: be you know, in full trance family sec that's just

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Speaker 1: myself that dealt have dealt with personally, and that I

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Speaker 1: deal with, you know, with my clients on a consistent basis.

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Speaker 1: You know, we're talking about generational stuff, right, Intergenerational trauma

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Speaker 1: as well plays a role in this, and so it's

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Speaker 1: important for us to understand, you know, who's in our life,

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Speaker 1: the impact that those people have on us, and the

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Speaker 1: roles that we choose to have in those relationships, because

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Speaker 1: I think often what I'm finding with you know, myself

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Speaker 1: and the clients that I work with is that as

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Speaker 1: you mature, right, we tend to assume that we need

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Speaker 1: to have the same roles in relationships with people that

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Speaker 1: we've had a bad and you know that's not always

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Speaker 1: the case. You get to switch it up mm hmmmmmmmm.

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Speaker 1: So talk to me and listen about like how you

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Speaker 1: might even know how to switch it up, right, because

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Speaker 1: I feel like so much of the conversation and of

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Speaker 1: course there does become a point sometimes where the relationship

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Speaker 1: does completely need to be dissolved. But I hear you

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Speaker 1: saying that there may be a way to kind of

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Speaker 1: switch up the roles, change up things a little bit

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Speaker 1: so that you can still engage in relationships without completely

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Speaker 1: dissolving them, for sure. For sure, I think the first

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Speaker 1: thing that's important to think about is to acknowledge that

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Speaker 1: there are different types of abuse. Right. We might be

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Speaker 1: having an experience with someone who we love, but because

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Speaker 1: we define abuse or mistreatment and you know, very specific terms,

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Speaker 1: we don't think of the relationship as being hurtful or

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Speaker 1: abusive or we can't quite figure out why we feel

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Speaker 1: like this person is hurting us because they're not doing

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Speaker 1: the things that we typically would define its. Right. So,

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Speaker 1: abuse can be physical, sexual, it can be emotional, it

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Speaker 1: can be verbal, it can be financial, and it can

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Speaker 1: also be spiritual. And we need to understand that there

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Speaker 1: are different contacts. And you know, what define something is

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Speaker 1: traumatic for you or abusive for you is the impact

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Speaker 1: that it has on you emotionally and or physically. Right, So,

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Speaker 1: you know, hurt and harm does it need to be

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Speaker 1: defined by these very strict categories with regards to the

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Speaker 1: other person's behaviors. You know, we have to give ourselves

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Speaker 1: permission to acknowledge how we feel based on how somebody

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Speaker 1: else is behaving and take the time to sit with

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Speaker 1: that and dissect that. Right, So we always want to

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Speaker 1: give ourselves the opportunity to go inward and to own

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Speaker 1: our own pain as opposed to dismissing it. Mm hmmm,

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Speaker 1: so important, so important, right, because I think when you

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Speaker 1: only think about abuse as like the textbook kinds of things, right,

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Speaker 1: it's really possible to miss a whole lot of things

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Speaker 1: that just don't really feel good to us, yeah, for sure,

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Speaker 1: or that are harmful, right because we you know, we assumed,

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Speaker 1: so we make a lot of assumptions about you know,

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Speaker 1: like who we need to be based on the things

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Speaker 1: that we've been given. Right. So, if you grow up

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Speaker 1: in the household where someone's telling you that you're too

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Speaker 1: emotional or you grow up in the household where someone

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Speaker 1: tells you that you need to show up a certain

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Speaker 1: way and you actually been punished, right, were not falling

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Speaker 1: in line? Then we can assume that there's something wrong

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Speaker 1: with us when we grow up and you know, like

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Speaker 1: in response to that person, we feel hurt right when

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Speaker 1: they speak to us or we are we have this

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Speaker 1: like anxiousness when it comes time to engage with them

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Speaker 1: or to be around them or to ask them questions,

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Speaker 1: and we just assume that we're too sensitive, or we

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Speaker 1: can just assume that that happened a long time ago,

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Speaker 1: we should get over it. But we've never taken the

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Speaker 1: opportunity or had our pain even acknowledged by ourselves or others,

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Speaker 1: and so that can really prevent us from healing. So

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Speaker 1: for sure, so you brought up an important point. I

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Speaker 1: think that we need to kind of touch more on

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Speaker 1: this idea of the pain being acknowledged by ourselves or others.

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Speaker 1: And I'm wondering what that looks like both ways, right, Like,

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Speaker 1: what does it look like for us to acknowledge our

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Speaker 1: pain and what might it look like for somebody else

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Speaker 1: to acknowledge our sing. That's a really good question because

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Speaker 1: we are fiercely protective of people that we love, right,

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Speaker 1: and so there's often this assumption that if somebody has

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Speaker 1: hurt you that you no longer care about them, that

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Speaker 1: you should want to dispel them from your life. And

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Speaker 1: that's not necessarily true. You can love someone and want

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Speaker 1: to hold them accountable for their behavior and acknowledge how

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Speaker 1: you feel at the same time as deciding that the

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Speaker 1: behavior has has hurt you and you may or may

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Speaker 1: not want them in your life. But because what we

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Speaker 1: do often when we feel protective over the month that

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Speaker 1: we love, we don't give ourselves permission to say I

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Speaker 1: love you, or I honor the fact that you make

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Speaker 1: tons of sacrifices for me, but you still hurt me. Right,

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Speaker 1: you know, there were some things that happened that have

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Speaker 1: shifted how I view myself and that have shifted my

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Speaker 1: viewpoint of you know, who I am in this world

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Speaker 1: to other people that cannot be changed or that I

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Speaker 1: am working to change. We have to be able to

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Speaker 1: hold reality within ourselves to say this is hurtful, this

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Speaker 1: is hurtful, and I always often um encourage my clients

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Speaker 1: to start with what it feels like in your body.

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Speaker 1: We are so logical sometimes that we suppress how we

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Speaker 1: actually feel. So if you are around someone, if you

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Speaker 1: have to inter rest with someone, if you just have

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Speaker 1: the thought of someone and you have visceral reactions in

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Speaker 1: your body, you might feel something in the pred of

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Speaker 1: your stumman. You might feel like, all of a sudden,

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Speaker 1: you have X and pains in your points. You may

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Speaker 1: feel as though your head hurt. I would encourage you

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Speaker 1: to pause and to not just assume that you're not

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Speaker 1: feeling well in that moment, but to think about is

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Speaker 1: there an emotion linked to an experience with this person

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Speaker 1: or this place that has caused you some pain, so

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Speaker 1: that you can acknowledge your own individual needs with other people. Right.

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Speaker 1: We often want someone to say to us, I know

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Speaker 1: that I hurt you, but I'm sorry, right, Or I

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Speaker 1: know that this was painful for you and I apologize,

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Speaker 1: or I just know that this was painful for you.

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Speaker 1: What I find oftentimes as an adult is that we

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Speaker 1: are too afraid to have those conversations, and we actually

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Speaker 1: assume that the other person will not give us what

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Speaker 1: we need. And so because we assume that they won't

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Speaker 1: give us what we need, we don't even want to

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Speaker 1: brook the conversation because we're still seeing them as the

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Speaker 1: person that has power over us when we were younger, right,

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Speaker 1: or that have power over us before in a different situation,

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Speaker 1: when in fact that person may have also grown and

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Speaker 1: shifted and changed. They may also be doing their own

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Speaker 1: self work, and so they might have the opportunity to

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Speaker 1: reflect on who they were and be open to a conversation.

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Speaker 1: Because we're still a managining ourselves in those old roles,

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Speaker 1: we don't even want to broach that topic because we

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Speaker 1: feel as though we are opening ourselves up to hurt again.

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Speaker 1: Mm hmmm. And I would imagine that in some cases

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Speaker 1: that's true, Melissa, Right, Like, what if I work up

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Speaker 1: the nerve to have this conversation with somebody and you know,

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Speaker 1: of course, my hope is that they will say they're

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Speaker 1: sorry and you know that they're working on themselves or whatever.

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Speaker 1: But we know a lot of times that is not

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Speaker 1: what happens. Yeah, So, so how do you take care

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Speaker 1: of yourself and what do you do at that point?

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Speaker 1: So you know, I am always good for a plan.

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Speaker 1: So you need to understand who you are and you

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Speaker 1: need to understand what your needs are before you have

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Speaker 1: any type of conversation, you should understand what you're looking

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Speaker 1: for and prepared to not receive it. Right. Be open

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Speaker 1: that in case you do receive it, you have the

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Speaker 1: ability to hear and to understand the person's perspective and

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Speaker 1: to acpect if you choose too. But also be prepared

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Speaker 1: that this person might not be in a position to

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Speaker 1: me I mean, and so then what do I know

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Speaker 1: about me and what I need when I'm hurt? Right?

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Speaker 1: Do I need to take a moment and cry? Do

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Speaker 1: I need to, you know, talk to my girlfriends or

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Speaker 1: my partner? Do I need to pray? Do I need

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Speaker 1: to meditate? Do I need to go to a yoga class?

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Speaker 1: And so, be prepared with whatever your wellness plan is,

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Speaker 1: because in the last episode, previously to me being here,

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Speaker 1: we were talking about always having a wellness plan. Right,

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Speaker 1: be prepared to engage with your wellness plan around what

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Speaker 1: your needs are to take care of yourself if you

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Speaker 1: find that your needs are not being got it Again,

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Speaker 1: going back to their duality, it is important to allow

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Speaker 1: yourself maybe some hopefulness that this conversation could go well,

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Speaker 1: right and that this person might apologize, but to also

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Speaker 1: prepare yourself that if it does not go as planned

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Speaker 1: as they often don't um that you can do something

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Speaker 1: to support yourself and still take care of yourself. Absolutely absolutely,

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Speaker 1: And I think it's important to decide if you want

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Speaker 1: to have a conversation based on what you know about

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Speaker 1: this person. And I'm for sure not suggesting that to

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Speaker 1: heal or to have closure, that you need to have

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Speaker 1: a conversation with this person, because there are some factors

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Speaker 1: that you you want to consider about who this person is,

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Speaker 1: like what type of heart it was before making that decision.

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Speaker 1: But I think that people often discount conversations because we

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Speaker 1: make assumptions, and so it is best if you're thinking

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Speaker 1: about doing it, or you know that you want to

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Speaker 1: choose to do it, that you hold basicituality and that

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Speaker 1: situation for sure. M So another part that kind of

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Speaker 1: came up around this conversation was the idea that some

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Speaker 1: people may feel like they need to still be connected

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Speaker 1: to people who have hurt them or maybe are still

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Speaker 1: actively hurting them because of their stage in life. So

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Speaker 1: I think most often about like, you know, maybe college

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Speaker 1: students who are kind of still financially dependent on the family,

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Speaker 1: or you know, for whatever circumstance, you still living with family,

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Speaker 1: and then there's tension and things going on in the home,

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Speaker 1: but you feel like you kind of have to be

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Speaker 1: connected to these people for survival. Yeah. So I'm constantly

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Speaker 1: asking people to think about the story we sail, we

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Speaker 1: tell ourselves about what our needs are, right, because a

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Speaker 1: lot of times we do things because maybe we feel

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Speaker 1: like it's old to us, or you hurt me so much.

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Speaker 1: At least you could do with to pay for this,

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Speaker 1: or the least you could do with to let me

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Speaker 1: live here. But we have to be prepared to be

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Speaker 1: able to interrogate that story because maybe you don't need

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Speaker 1: to be there, right, Maybe you are telling yourself that

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Speaker 1: you are giving yourself exposure to do something because it's

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Speaker 1: your only choice, and maybe it's not right. What is

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Speaker 1: it about that connection that you really and truly need

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Speaker 1: and sparse that out because maybe you do me money,

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Speaker 1: or maybe you do need to live there, but you

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Speaker 1: need to have dinner at the same people. Right, You

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Speaker 1: need to engage in conversations about certain choices that you

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Speaker 1: choose to make that no will I'll bring you more pain.

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Speaker 1: What are your needs in total? And figure out what

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Speaker 1: needs can be met and what needs can't. What's the

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Speaker 1: cost to benefit analysis of the story that you're telling yourself,

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Speaker 1: and if it's not really worth it, how can you

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Speaker 1: redefine the relationship in a way that actually make sense

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Speaker 1: for you? If it means as well that you need

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Speaker 1: to disconnect, Like what is this costing you? I think

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Speaker 1: the other thing that happens is that people often feel

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Speaker 1: like the isolation and the loneliness that I might feel

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Speaker 1: if I disconnect from these people will be even more

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Speaker 1: unbearable than like staying in this situation, yeah, because sometimes

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Speaker 1: these people aren't all that we know. Yeah, And I

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Speaker 1: think for a lot of people that's the case, right,

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Speaker 1: Like that is all that you know. And so we know,

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Speaker 1: of course, right that even when something feels unhealthy for

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Speaker 1: us or we feel like we want to make some changes,

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Speaker 1: it can still be very very difficult because you have

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Speaker 1: to go give up what is familiar, right, right, And

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Speaker 1: you know, I think this is where the assessment of

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Speaker 1: what your needs are comes into, because maybe you desire

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Speaker 1: to stay connected, but you have an imagination about what

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Speaker 1: that connection has to look like because it is always

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Speaker 1: been right, and so you can stay connected to people,

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Speaker 1: but it doesn't mean that you leave yourself open consistently

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Speaker 1: to the same type of pain, So what is the

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Speaker 1: pain point? Right? If you have a loved one who

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Speaker 1: is constantly speaking down to you, or you feel as

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Speaker 1: though they are hurtful with their words, right, then you

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Speaker 1: might choose to continue to show up on holidays, or

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Speaker 1: you might choose to continue to have phone conversations, but

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Speaker 1: you might limit the frequency. You might limit deservation, you

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Speaker 1: might limit the types of conversations that you have. So

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Speaker 1: absolutely there's some laws, but they're also some ways you

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Speaker 1: can protect ourselves from that laws so that it might

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Speaker 1: not feel as significant. Maybe you have to develop additional

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Speaker 1: support systems for yourself, right, So, um, you might need

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Speaker 1: to get like a stronger friend network, You may need

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Speaker 1: to develop a spiritual community that you feel is supporting.

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Speaker 1: You might need to join some support groups. But there

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Speaker 1: are methods, you know, once you understand what your needs are,

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Speaker 1: there are ways that you can try to build in

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Speaker 1: those supports for yourself and to build a cushion so

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Speaker 1: that the pain and the law doesn't necessarily feel so significant,

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Speaker 1: or you have the opportunity to at least have some

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Speaker 1: of those needs that were met by the other individual.

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Speaker 1: Something else that I think is important to kind of

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Speaker 1: think about related to like building this additional support for

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Speaker 1: yourself oth is to how to do that in a

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Speaker 1: healthy way, right, because I think we gotta be careful

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Speaker 1: to not be so desperate so to speak, to like

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Speaker 1: have some support that we are then just recreating another

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Speaker 1: like unhealthy environment for ourselves that just looks different. Absolutely, absolutely,

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Speaker 1: So you want to pay attention to who you're connecting

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Speaker 1: to because trauma bonds are real, right. You can connect

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Speaker 1: to people because they feel familiar, and what feels familiar

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Speaker 1: is the same sort of pain that you're trying to

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Speaker 1: detach yourself from. So you want to be very aware

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Speaker 1: of who you're invited into your life. But that's why

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Speaker 1: we always start by acknowledging what our needs are and

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Speaker 1: acknowledging our pains, because when we give ourselves the opportunity

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Speaker 1: to be honest, right, it's not just this person, It

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Speaker 1: is something that occurs in the interaction that you have

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Speaker 1: with this person. There's a certain behavior, there's a certain tone,

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Speaker 1: there's a certain emotion that is evoked. When we give

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Speaker 1: ourselves permission to really dissect that and to understand what

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Speaker 1: happens in us as well with these interactions and we

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Speaker 1: can really do the work to define what types of

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Speaker 1: relationships we are looking to connect with so that we

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Speaker 1: can be more conscientious, discerning, vigilant about who we welcome

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Speaker 1: into our life. For sure, about the trauma buns, Melissa,

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Speaker 1: because I think that that is a term that has

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Speaker 1: kind of gotten picked up speed, right, But I don't

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Speaker 1: know that we always know exactly what that means. Can

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Speaker 1: you think about trauma buns? So the way I think

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Speaker 1: of it is that you can connect with people who

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Speaker 1: either have the same or a similar experience as you,

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Speaker 1: or they resonate with you on a visceral level because

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Speaker 1: they like there's something about them that feels familiar, right

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Speaker 1: like we like we hear sometimes people said there's you know,

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Speaker 1: like there was something about them that felt like home

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Speaker 1: right right off the start. What if home is an estate,

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Speaker 1: loving or nurturing place, then yes they can feel like home,

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Speaker 1: but then that's not necessarily the best thing. Or there

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Speaker 1: can be two people who two are more people who

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Speaker 1: are very hurt, who are just looking for something right,

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Speaker 1: who are just looking for some type of connection because

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Speaker 1: they're in pain, And so then you build your relationship

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Speaker 1: and your connection with them around your pain. But then

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Speaker 1: you know what happens if you develop a relationship with healing, right,

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Speaker 1: and so then you shift and you change and the

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Speaker 1: types of pain or the types of things that you

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Speaker 1: used to do that surrounded the pain, the type of communication,

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Speaker 1: like whatever those needs were are no longer there for you,

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Speaker 1: and then that relationship ships. So then what happens to

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Speaker 1: the connection? So we want to develop healthy connections with

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Speaker 1: people that speak to the whole part of ourselves. It's

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Speaker 1: the parts of ourselves that are clearly defined, not rooted

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Speaker 1: in low self esteem, not rooted in trauma and pain,

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Speaker 1: so that we can have a long, laughing, healthy connension

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Speaker 1: and relationship. But it feels like it is important to

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Speaker 1: kind of think more about that, right, because I'm thinking

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Speaker 1: about like, you know, let's say somebody participates in a

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Speaker 1: support group, right for people who maybe have difficulties with

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Speaker 1: their mom or something like that. That that's the kind

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Speaker 1: of situation where yes, you're coming together to support one

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Speaker 1: another in a particular way because you have maybe similar experiences,

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Speaker 1: but that the connection should not be based totally on

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Speaker 1: these experiences with our mom, right, that there needs to

401
00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:44,520
Speaker 1: be something else that makes me feel like we connect

402
00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:48,159
Speaker 1: besides just our experiences with our moms, for sure, And

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Speaker 1: I think that a tell tale sort of way often

404
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Speaker 1: to sort of judge that, Like with with that type

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Speaker 1: of situation, you're spending the whole time talking about the

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Speaker 1: point of pain. Yeah, majority of the time. Right, So

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Speaker 1: if you know, y'all just getting number stone talking about

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00:24:04,320 --> 00:24:06,520
Speaker 1: how your mama's just you know, makes y'all feel sick,

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Speaker 1: and you know that's the only thing that you can

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Speaker 1: connect over, or the conversation always comes back to that.

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Speaker 1: There's some value there, right, Like there's some value in

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Speaker 1: having someone to vent to. But you have to understand

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Speaker 1: the purpose of that relationship because that might not be

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Speaker 1: someone who you're really establishing connection with. And so that

415
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Speaker 1: kind of relationship tends to have a short lifespan and

416
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Speaker 1: then you're going through a whole another period of laws.

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Speaker 1: You know, once that relationship is so, then listen, do

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Speaker 1: you have any other suggestions for like how you can

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Speaker 1: find people who can be additional support for you? So

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Speaker 1: I think often when the people, especially when we're talking

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Speaker 1: about when we've been hurt by family, we it is

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Speaker 1: common for people to not want to be open, right,

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Speaker 1: So we might be a little bit more skeptical about

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Speaker 1: this loving relationships at work or if we go to church,

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Speaker 1: or just with mutual friendship. But I think that if

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Speaker 1: we give ourselves the opportunity to understand what we need

427
00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:12,840
Speaker 1: and what we're looking for, and you always want to

428
00:25:12,840 --> 00:25:17,800
Speaker 1: be conscientious, you can develop really long lasting friendships from

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Speaker 1: work environments, from different social groups in the community. I

430
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Speaker 1: recently joined the book club and I love those women.

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Speaker 1: So you want to be able to engage in things

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Speaker 1: that you love and that you enjoy, things that might

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Speaker 1: be hobbies or just things that just part the interest

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Speaker 1: that you might want to find. And often times if

435
00:25:36,080 --> 00:25:39,080
Speaker 1: you find that you can be open or you can

436
00:25:39,080 --> 00:25:42,320
Speaker 1: give yourself sometimes to develop your connection, that can be

437
00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:45,200
Speaker 1: a healthy way to use to develop relationships. Are there

438
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:48,080
Speaker 1: other things that people should be aware of, like what

439
00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:51,600
Speaker 1: kinds of things might be red flags in terms of

440
00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:54,439
Speaker 1: new connections that they may want to just pay attention to.

441
00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:58,160
Speaker 1: When we're specifically talking about looking for additional support kind

442
00:25:58,160 --> 00:26:02,280
Speaker 1: of in healing outside out of this toxic environment. Cold

443
00:26:02,280 --> 00:26:05,600
Speaker 1: dependence number one. What do you mean? So when we

444
00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:09,240
Speaker 1: talk about cold dependence, we are talking about developing relationships

445
00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:14,840
Speaker 1: with people rooted in either solely our need or solely

446
00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:17,480
Speaker 1: their needs. So a lot of times when we spent

447
00:26:17,640 --> 00:26:21,520
Speaker 1: our lives quite possibly trying to connect with other people,

448
00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:26,240
Speaker 1: especially our loved ones, we may have learned patterns of

449
00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:29,960
Speaker 1: caretaking up others as a way to develop connection. So

450
00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:32,240
Speaker 1: the way that you might make a friend is you

451
00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:34,000
Speaker 1: might talk to somebody and be like, hey, how are

452
00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:36,760
Speaker 1: you going right, and then all of a sudden you

453
00:26:36,920 --> 00:26:39,840
Speaker 1: hear that they need something and you're the first person

454
00:26:39,920 --> 00:26:43,120
Speaker 1: to develop a solution for them. Right. They might need

455
00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:44,840
Speaker 1: a ride to work, and then all of a sudden,

456
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:47,680
Speaker 1: robbing them to work every day, and that's how you're

457
00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:51,280
Speaker 1: developing your relationship. So you always want to be mindful

458
00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:55,960
Speaker 1: of either you're overworking and you're very conscious about meeting

459
00:26:56,000 --> 00:26:59,920
Speaker 1: other people's needs, or you have somebody who was entering

460
00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:02,960
Speaker 1: your life and the only thing that they desire to

461
00:27:03,080 --> 00:27:06,200
Speaker 1: do is to me right. You might feel like that

462
00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:09,359
Speaker 1: person is quote unquote maybe or that they're clinging, or

463
00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:11,760
Speaker 1: you might feel like you're being too clinging. Of course,

464
00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:13,600
Speaker 1: you want to unpack some of that because that can

465
00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:17,680
Speaker 1: be rooted in our own experiences with others. But you

466
00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:20,760
Speaker 1: want to be mindful about the things that you think

467
00:27:20,800 --> 00:27:24,399
Speaker 1: you need to do to develop relationship other then just

468
00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:28,760
Speaker 1: be yourself and allow things to naturally develop over time.

469
00:27:29,119 --> 00:27:31,439
Speaker 1: That may be the part that feels difficult for a

470
00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:34,160
Speaker 1: lot of people, Melissa, like, especially when you're coming from

471
00:27:34,200 --> 00:27:37,040
Speaker 1: an environment that has not been so healthy. It's just

472
00:27:37,080 --> 00:27:40,879
Speaker 1: this idea of like even who you are and whether

473
00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:44,560
Speaker 1: who you are will be enough to be in relationships

474
00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:48,840
Speaker 1: with other people. You just got a whole word. That's

475
00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:52,040
Speaker 1: that is everything right there, right, Because when we're talking about,

476
00:27:52,200 --> 00:27:56,040
Speaker 1: especially if the pain is coming from your family of origin,

477
00:27:56,440 --> 00:27:59,639
Speaker 1: what we're talking about a lot of times is this

478
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:03,960
Speaker 1: idea that you need to go along to get along. Right,

479
00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:08,199
Speaker 1: Likely there are family patterns that have been established about

480
00:28:08,560 --> 00:28:11,600
Speaker 1: who the head of the family is, what they desire

481
00:28:11,720 --> 00:28:14,159
Speaker 1: from you, and then how you need to be to

482
00:28:14,320 --> 00:28:16,840
Speaker 1: be a part of this unit. And if you're in

483
00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:20,960
Speaker 1: a place of individual ation, meaning that you're developing a

484
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:25,640
Speaker 1: concept of yourself that is separate from those expectations, you're

485
00:28:25,680 --> 00:28:29,120
Speaker 1: still developing a concept of yourself that is separate from

486
00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:32,760
Speaker 1: those expectations. So you might not necessarily be sure how

487
00:28:32,880 --> 00:28:36,359
Speaker 1: to show up. You may fall into old patterns. And

488
00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:40,280
Speaker 1: I think the thing here is that's open, right because

489
00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:42,760
Speaker 1: everything that we do is a process. So you might

490
00:28:42,760 --> 00:28:46,560
Speaker 1: find yourself developing friendships and relationships and then be like, oh,

491
00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:48,280
Speaker 1: I want to switch up the pace here because I'm

492
00:28:48,320 --> 00:28:50,120
Speaker 1: realizing that I'm doing this in a way that it's

493
00:28:50,160 --> 00:28:52,720
Speaker 1: not healthy for me. And then you switch up the pace.

494
00:28:53,080 --> 00:28:55,400
Speaker 1: That might mean that there are some shifts in those

495
00:28:55,400 --> 00:28:59,120
Speaker 1: relationships that you're developing, but it will also mean that

496
00:28:59,160 --> 00:29:03,040
Speaker 1: you're developing a healthier self concept of yourself. Right, So

497
00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:08,480
Speaker 1: really giving yourself grace with understandings who are and understanding

498
00:29:08,520 --> 00:29:12,280
Speaker 1: that you do get to create that definition. A lot

499
00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:16,360
Speaker 1: of us have been given these ideas of you know

500
00:29:16,760 --> 00:29:20,360
Speaker 1: how to be, whether it's you need to dress a

501
00:29:20,400 --> 00:29:22,960
Speaker 1: certain way, speak a certain way, have a certain type

502
00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:26,120
Speaker 1: of job, and if you're trying to break out of

503
00:29:26,160 --> 00:29:31,280
Speaker 1: that mold. In addition to identifying your own hurt and

504
00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:35,000
Speaker 1: heal from it, sometimes those people around you aren't necessarily

505
00:29:35,040 --> 00:29:38,160
Speaker 1: supportive and so it does take some time. And I'm

506
00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:41,760
Speaker 1: always gonna recommend that people think they're healing and get

507
00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:44,600
Speaker 1: well trained professionals to be able to support you and

508
00:29:44,680 --> 00:29:47,480
Speaker 1: they're healing, because there's a lot of work and it's

509
00:29:47,560 --> 00:29:50,800
Speaker 1: multilayers work. Yes, and you said something that I want

510
00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:54,640
Speaker 1: to go back to, Melissa, just this idea that none

511
00:29:54,680 --> 00:29:57,600
Speaker 1: of us are perfect in relationships, right, And so especially

512
00:29:57,640 --> 00:30:01,680
Speaker 1: when you in some ways, like new relationships outside of

513
00:30:01,680 --> 00:30:04,440
Speaker 1: an unhealthy one kind of feel like the toddler phase. Right,

514
00:30:04,720 --> 00:30:09,560
Speaker 1: you're trying how to walk. Yeah, so you're bumping your

515
00:30:09,560 --> 00:30:11,760
Speaker 1: head and like not quite sure how to do any

516
00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:15,320
Speaker 1: of that, but that it's okay that when you realize like, Okay,

517
00:30:15,360 --> 00:30:18,000
Speaker 1: I'm going down a path that doesn't feel good for me,

518
00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:20,800
Speaker 1: that it's okay to stop and course correct, right. But

519
00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:23,120
Speaker 1: I think what happens is that we often feel like, Okay,

520
00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:25,600
Speaker 1: I can't take this back, right, like I've gone too

521
00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:29,320
Speaker 1: far down this road, Like I can stop and do

522
00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:34,640
Speaker 1: something different, different, right, and still retaining relationship possibly right,

523
00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:38,040
Speaker 1: Because I think a lot of times, especially if you're

524
00:30:38,080 --> 00:30:42,200
Speaker 1: coming from a pattern a relationship with someone there, if

525
00:30:42,200 --> 00:30:45,760
Speaker 1: you try to shift and change that meant disconnection. You

526
00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:50,200
Speaker 1: automatically assume if I shift and change, that means disconnection.

527
00:30:50,560 --> 00:30:52,760
Speaker 1: And for some of us, what we do is we

528
00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:56,600
Speaker 1: cut those relationships before we even get our give myself

529
00:30:56,640 --> 00:31:00,200
Speaker 1: the opportunity, excuse me to shift and change, right in

530
00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:03,880
Speaker 1: that kind of situation, we're ending it first because we

531
00:31:03,920 --> 00:31:06,840
Speaker 1: don't want to be hurt. We assume that if we

532
00:31:06,960 --> 00:31:09,480
Speaker 1: established boundaries or we change, if the other person will

533
00:31:09,520 --> 00:31:12,560
Speaker 1: not want us anymore. And that is also about how

534
00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:15,920
Speaker 1: we love ourselves. So for sure, you can give yourself

535
00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:19,040
Speaker 1: permission to dit and change and be open to the

536
00:31:19,040 --> 00:31:21,360
Speaker 1: side that the other person may have a response to that,

537
00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:23,760
Speaker 1: But don't assume that the response is going to be

538
00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:25,800
Speaker 1: one if I don't want to because it may not

539
00:31:25,920 --> 00:31:28,760
Speaker 1: be that. Yeah, And I think my experience has been

540
00:31:28,800 --> 00:31:31,800
Speaker 1: that a lot of times relationships get stronger after those

541
00:31:31,880 --> 00:31:37,520
Speaker 1: kinds of conversations. Absolutely, absolutely, because you are giving yourself

542
00:31:37,520 --> 00:31:40,520
Speaker 1: the opportunity to be vulnerable, which you're also giving the

543
00:31:40,560 --> 00:31:44,040
Speaker 1: other person the opportunity to be vulnerable. And because the

544
00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:47,360
Speaker 1: goal isn't just to have a relationship. If to have

545
00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:51,960
Speaker 1: healthy relationships with people, you want to give yourself permission

546
00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:54,760
Speaker 1: to develop that. And if you keep in a cycle

547
00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:58,280
Speaker 1: of hurt and pain, it's very similar to what you

548
00:31:58,360 --> 00:32:01,280
Speaker 1: came out of it, just recreating that in this new thing.

549
00:32:01,520 --> 00:32:06,440
Speaker 1: So we're often so afraid of disconnection that we keep

550
00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:11,800
Speaker 1: ourselves in situations that bring us significant discomfort and hurt

551
00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:16,600
Speaker 1: and perpetuate our own traumas and prevents us from fully

552
00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:20,640
Speaker 1: healing because we have that fear. But that is the

553
00:32:20,720 --> 00:32:23,800
Speaker 1: anxiety telling you that you can't have the things that wanting.

554
00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:27,840
Speaker 1: So you have to give yourself the ability to reimagine

555
00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:30,920
Speaker 1: all of the time who you are, you know, what

556
00:32:31,040 --> 00:32:33,920
Speaker 1: your relationships can look like, and then give yourself the

557
00:32:33,920 --> 00:32:37,520
Speaker 1: permission to do something different for sure. Yeah, and I

558
00:32:37,560 --> 00:32:40,720
Speaker 1: hope that what people here in kind of our conversation

559
00:32:41,160 --> 00:32:45,240
Speaker 1: is that this stuff can take some time, right, especially

560
00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:48,080
Speaker 1: when we're talking about like childhood stuff and things that

561
00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:51,040
Speaker 1: have been with us for years. It will take some

562
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:53,240
Speaker 1: time to kind of figure out how you want to

563
00:32:53,280 --> 00:32:58,200
Speaker 1: do relationships differently, for sure, and trial and error. I

564
00:32:58,400 --> 00:33:01,560
Speaker 1: often have my clients coming they're like, well, like I

565
00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:03,520
Speaker 1: thought it was going good, now I don't feel so

566
00:33:03,600 --> 00:33:05,360
Speaker 1: good now, What am I gonna do? And my back

567
00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:08,560
Speaker 1: to square one? And one thing that we're constantly talking

568
00:33:08,560 --> 00:33:11,200
Speaker 1: about is you're never back to super one because you

569
00:33:11,440 --> 00:33:15,080
Speaker 1: learn some things to apply, some things, you develop somethings,

570
00:33:15,120 --> 00:33:18,280
Speaker 1: you bring out something and so you know, giving yourself

571
00:33:18,320 --> 00:33:20,840
Speaker 1: the opportunity to try and to give out and to

572
00:33:21,040 --> 00:33:23,960
Speaker 1: learn and to do things different, you're never back to

573
00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:28,720
Speaker 1: super one. Even though the pain might feel so right,

574
00:33:28,960 --> 00:33:33,520
Speaker 1: we are leaving ourselves open to situations where we feel hurt,

575
00:33:34,080 --> 00:33:37,160
Speaker 1: and so we often don't want that pain. But that

576
00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:39,640
Speaker 1: pain tells us something. It tells us what's important to what,

577
00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:42,600
Speaker 1: it tells us what we need. And so even though

578
00:33:42,640 --> 00:33:45,440
Speaker 1: we don't want the pain, to encourage people not to

579
00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:48,200
Speaker 1: be afraid of it, if you're going to show up, Yeah,

580
00:33:48,440 --> 00:33:50,720
Speaker 1: and then you know, you had these conversations on the

581
00:33:50,760 --> 00:33:52,880
Speaker 1: podcast and just you know, in the Therapy for Black

582
00:33:52,880 --> 00:33:57,840
Speaker 1: Girls community, just this idea that pain will not like

583
00:33:58,000 --> 00:34:00,840
Speaker 1: overwhelm you, that it's okay for you to, you know,

584
00:34:01,120 --> 00:34:03,800
Speaker 1: figure out some ways to support yourself, like you said,

585
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:06,560
Speaker 1: when painful moments come. So it's not that the pain

586
00:34:06,600 --> 00:34:09,640
Speaker 1: won't be there, it's that you can be enough and

587
00:34:09,719 --> 00:34:12,280
Speaker 1: you can build your support to be able to handle

588
00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:15,960
Speaker 1: and hold you through the painful moment. Yeah, for sure,

589
00:34:16,280 --> 00:34:18,919
Speaker 1: you know. And I think just to piggyback off of that,

590
00:34:19,360 --> 00:34:23,680
Speaker 1: especially when you're living in a situation with someone who

591
00:34:23,840 --> 00:34:27,000
Speaker 1: has hurt you or you feel is hurting you, in

592
00:34:27,040 --> 00:34:30,440
Speaker 1: addition to really having this conversation with yourself about the

593
00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:33,040
Speaker 1: narrative that you need to be there because maybe you do.

594
00:34:33,239 --> 00:34:36,279
Speaker 1: I think all of the hips, can you know, just

595
00:34:36,320 --> 00:34:39,160
Speaker 1: sort of give you this perspective of understanding that there's

596
00:34:39,239 --> 00:34:43,919
Speaker 1: physical protection, but then there's also emotional protection. Right. We're

597
00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:47,319
Speaker 1: constantly needing to put ourselves in a position sometimes to

598
00:34:47,600 --> 00:34:50,920
Speaker 1: figure out how to get through a thing, right because

599
00:34:50,920 --> 00:34:54,120
Speaker 1: we're in the middle of it, And so there is

600
00:34:54,160 --> 00:34:58,080
Speaker 1: an opportunity here for you to think outside of the

601
00:34:58,120 --> 00:35:01,600
Speaker 1: box maybe about how to meet your needs in ways

602
00:35:01,880 --> 00:35:05,359
Speaker 1: that address the full scope of what you need to

603
00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:09,480
Speaker 1: do right now because of whatever situation. You might absolutely

604
00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:12,920
Speaker 1: thank you for that, Melissa. So are there any resources

605
00:35:12,960 --> 00:35:15,880
Speaker 1: that you find yourself recommending related to this topic that

606
00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:17,759
Speaker 1: you think would be helpful for people if they're looking

607
00:35:17,800 --> 00:35:21,879
Speaker 1: for more information or support. I may have recommended this

608
00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:26,160
Speaker 1: book before, but there's a book by Colin Tipping that

609
00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:30,839
Speaker 1: is called Radical Forgiveness, which is about how to understand

610
00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:34,680
Speaker 1: situations that that you know, have to do with hurt

611
00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:39,080
Speaker 1: from from the perspective of forgiving yourself and forgiving others.

612
00:35:39,360 --> 00:35:41,840
Speaker 1: So I think that that's a really good book as well.

613
00:35:42,080 --> 00:35:46,160
Speaker 1: But I just think that engaging in activities that have

614
00:35:46,360 --> 00:35:49,279
Speaker 1: to do with self love a lot of the times

615
00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:53,759
Speaker 1: pain and hurt from people who we love somehow communicate

616
00:35:53,840 --> 00:35:56,600
Speaker 1: to us that we are not worthy. But when you

617
00:35:56,640 --> 00:36:00,800
Speaker 1: really put yourself on the trajectory of engaging in activities

618
00:36:01,160 --> 00:36:06,400
Speaker 1: and honoring yourself and establishing your intuition, you are really

619
00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:10,480
Speaker 1: building yourself worth and yourself identity, and then that will

620
00:36:10,520 --> 00:36:12,799
Speaker 1: give you the permission to engage in some of these

621
00:36:12,840 --> 00:36:17,000
Speaker 1: hard activities and these hard discussions with yourself and others

622
00:36:17,040 --> 00:36:19,919
Speaker 1: with confidence and with love for them and yourself as well.

623
00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:22,680
Speaker 1: I don't think this was a book you suggested before,

624
00:36:22,760 --> 00:36:26,880
Speaker 1: but now that you have suggested it, it it brings

625
00:36:26,880 --> 00:36:29,360
Speaker 1: me to I feel like another question to ask before

626
00:36:29,360 --> 00:36:33,840
Speaker 1: we wrap up, just this idea of forgiveness when somebody

627
00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:39,600
Speaker 1: has hurt you, and what does that even look like? Oh?

628
00:36:39,600 --> 00:36:43,440
Speaker 1: I mean, this might be a whole different, whole different episode,

629
00:36:44,080 --> 00:36:47,560
Speaker 1: but what I will say is this, there's the concept

630
00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:53,480
Speaker 1: that forgiffence has to involve re incasement, m that you

631
00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:56,880
Speaker 1: need to have a quote unquote closure conversation, that you

632
00:36:57,000 --> 00:37:01,839
Speaker 1: need to remain connected to or reconnect to somebody who

633
00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:07,080
Speaker 1: you forgiven. But forgiveness is really about resolution. It's about

634
00:37:07,200 --> 00:37:11,200
Speaker 1: understanding what has happened. It is about understanding what that

635
00:37:11,280 --> 00:37:15,480
Speaker 1: thing has done for you, acknowledging it for yourself, and

636
00:37:15,560 --> 00:37:21,040
Speaker 1: releasing the experience. Right, so I forgive you. It's like, Okay,

637
00:37:21,120 --> 00:37:24,080
Speaker 1: so you did this to me, and this has impacted

638
00:37:24,080 --> 00:37:26,440
Speaker 1: me in the following way, right, and this is an

639
00:37:26,480 --> 00:37:31,680
Speaker 1: internal conversation with yourself, not necessarily a conversation with someone else. Right,

640
00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:35,400
Speaker 1: So you know it has impacted me in the following ways.

641
00:37:35,840 --> 00:37:39,120
Speaker 1: I'm going to choose to heal in the following ways,

642
00:37:39,480 --> 00:37:42,680
Speaker 1: and I'm releasing that experience. So I am no longer

643
00:37:42,760 --> 00:37:46,719
Speaker 1: holding onto the anger. But that does not mean that

644
00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:52,160
Speaker 1: I do not have to instill a boundary right for you,

645
00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:55,160
Speaker 1: for your behavior or for the ways that we will

646
00:37:55,200 --> 00:37:58,960
Speaker 1: interact in the future. And so forgiveness is not a oh,

647
00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:02,480
Speaker 1: you know how great you are all of a sudden moment.

648
00:38:03,120 --> 00:38:07,799
Speaker 1: It is about something that you do internally. Mmm. I

649
00:38:07,840 --> 00:38:09,799
Speaker 1: love that. I love that, And I'm looking forward to

650
00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:11,840
Speaker 1: checking this book out because it definitely sounds like a

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00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:14,839
Speaker 1: good one for me to add to my library. Yes,

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00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:17,720
Speaker 1: for sure it is. Yeah, Well, thank you so much, Melissa.

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00:38:17,800 --> 00:38:20,920
Speaker 1: Please share with us again where people can find you online,

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00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:25,120
Speaker 1: your website as well as your social media handles For sure. So.

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00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:28,960
Speaker 1: My website is Melissa Eiffel dot com. That's Emmazon, Mary

656
00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:33,080
Speaker 1: E l I s s A I s is in France,

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00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:36,759
Speaker 1: I Larry Larry dot com. And my Instagram, which is

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00:38:36,760 --> 00:38:38,120
Speaker 1: where I spend the most of my time. Were not

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00:38:38,200 --> 00:38:39,719
Speaker 1: the most of my time, but most of my time

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00:38:39,880 --> 00:38:44,200
Speaker 1: on social media, It's at Melissa Iffel lcs W. And

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00:38:44,840 --> 00:38:50,840
Speaker 1: I am also now on Twitter, which is Melissa Ifele.

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00:38:51,200 --> 00:38:53,800
Speaker 1: And I have all of those links on my website

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00:38:53,800 --> 00:38:57,680
Speaker 1: if you just want to put me anyway perfect, but

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00:38:57,800 --> 00:38:59,840
Speaker 1: we will definitely include those in the show notes so

665
00:38:59,880 --> 00:39:02,879
Speaker 1: the people can continue this conversation with you. I'm sure

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00:39:02,920 --> 00:39:05,320
Speaker 1: that it will be just as active as the first

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00:39:05,360 --> 00:39:08,080
Speaker 1: question we as, so I'm looking forward to continue in

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00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:11,120
Speaker 1: this conversation with everybody. Thank you so much, Melissa. I

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00:39:11,160 --> 00:39:14,879
Speaker 1: appreciate you. Thank you so much for having me r joy.

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00:39:15,080 --> 00:39:17,279
Speaker 1: It is always a pleasure to have these conversations with

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00:39:17,360 --> 00:39:22,600
Speaker 1: you always. I'm so glad Melissa was able to share

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00:39:22,600 --> 00:39:25,759
Speaker 1: her expertise with us again today. If you missed her

673
00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:29,520
Speaker 1: first two appearances here on the podcast, I strongly encourage

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00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:31,840
Speaker 1: you to check them out. She shared with us in

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00:39:31,880 --> 00:39:35,480
Speaker 1: session nine two about life with a bipolar disorder, and

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00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:38,799
Speaker 1: in session she shared how to show up when you

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00:39:38,880 --> 00:39:41,960
Speaker 1: just want to lay down. I'm including the links to

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00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:44,960
Speaker 1: both of these episodes, as well as the resources she

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00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:47,600
Speaker 1: shared today in the show notes, and you can check

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00:39:47,600 --> 00:39:50,400
Speaker 1: those out at Therapy for Black Girls dot com slash

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00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:54,800
Speaker 1: Session one forty two. Please remember to share this episode

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00:39:54,800 --> 00:39:57,480
Speaker 1: with two people in your circle, and don't forget to

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00:39:57,480 --> 00:40:00,160
Speaker 1: share your takeaways with us either on Twitter or in

684
00:40:00,239 --> 00:40:04,240
Speaker 1: your I G stories using the hashtag TBG in session.

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00:40:05,239 --> 00:40:07,920
Speaker 1: If you're searching for a therapist in your area, be

686
00:40:08,040 --> 00:40:11,040
Speaker 1: sure to check out our therapist directory at Therapy for

687
00:40:11,080 --> 00:40:14,719
Speaker 1: Black Girls dot com slash directory. And if you want

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00:40:14,760 --> 00:40:17,600
Speaker 1: to continue digging into this topic and meet some other

689
00:40:17,680 --> 00:40:20,359
Speaker 1: systems in your area, come on over and join us

690
00:40:20,360 --> 00:40:23,160
Speaker 1: in the Yellow Couch Collective, where we take a deeper

691
00:40:23,200 --> 00:40:26,080
Speaker 1: dive into the topics from the podcast and just about

692
00:40:26,120 --> 00:40:29,359
Speaker 1: everything else. You can join us at Therapy for Black

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00:40:29,360 --> 00:40:33,680
Speaker 1: Girls dot com slash y c C. Thank y'all so

694
00:40:33,760 --> 00:40:36,520
Speaker 1: much for joining me again this week. I look forward

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00:40:36,520 --> 00:40:40,239
Speaker 1: to continuing this conversation with you all real soon. Take

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00:40:40,320 --> 00:40:40,759
Speaker 1: good care,