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Speaker 1: And at the same time, you know, like I got

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Speaker 1: to love everything about ourselves. This is not the goal.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it'd be cute, but like in the perfect world,

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Speaker 1: but like we we are all imperfect, but it's what

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Speaker 1: we do with it. Hey there, and welcome back to

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Speaker 1: You Need Therapy Podcast. I am the host, Catherine, you

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Speaker 1: can call me Cat, and I am I'm so excited

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Speaker 1: you're here. I haven't given a shout out to Alex,

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Speaker 1: who has creating my intra music had a really long time,

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Speaker 1: so I wanted to definitely do that before we get

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Speaker 1: started here. So Alex, thank you so much again for

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Speaker 1: our special intro music that you made just for us.

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Speaker 1: You can follow Alex at at booth Tunes on Instagram.

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Speaker 1: That's b O O t H t U and E S.

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Speaker 1: I am so grateful and excited to share a new

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Speaker 1: episode with y'all today, one that it's also very important

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Speaker 1: and is its topic that I could talk about every

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Speaker 1: single episode, but I'm not going to do that. Um.

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Speaker 1: The topic is body image. I have my friend and colleague,

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Speaker 1: which is like such a weird word to use describing her,

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Speaker 1: but I guess she is Crystal. She owns and founded

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Speaker 1: Horizon Nutrition Counseling, which is actually housed in the same

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Speaker 1: little cute building slash house um that my practice is

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Speaker 1: on Music Row, And so I see her every day,

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Speaker 1: talk to her almost when I talked to her, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: every day, And she's been just a great asset for

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Speaker 1: me in my whole journey of learning about eating disorders

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Speaker 1: and getting into the work. I've known her ever since

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Speaker 1: I started. Crystal is literally the best I feel like

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Speaker 1: I already said that, especially if you live here in

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Speaker 1: Nashville too, So if you are looking for a dietitian,

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Speaker 1: you need to find find her as soon as possible.

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Speaker 1: Any she's so smart. I tell her all the time.

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Speaker 1: She's genius. She's relatable, and she's very real, and I

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Speaker 1: think this episode really highlighted all of that. I'm pumped

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Speaker 1: for you guys to get to hear from her and

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Speaker 1: one day. I also want to add that she's a

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Speaker 1: registered dietitian. She's also a certified eating disorder registered dietitian,

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Speaker 1: which is a pretty big deal and it takes a

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Speaker 1: lot to get that certification. And so you know, when

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Speaker 1: you go to see Crystal and you're struggling with these

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Speaker 1: kinds of things, or if you talk to her, if

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Speaker 1: you hear what she's saying, she's not making things up.

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Speaker 1: She has gone above and beyond to get the trainings

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Speaker 1: and certifications to be able to talk about this stuff

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Speaker 1: with confidence and expertise. Now, before I get us into

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Speaker 1: that conversation, I do want to put out there the

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Speaker 1: disclaimer that this podcast is not actual therapy. I am

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Speaker 1: coming to y'all as Cat the human who happens to

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Speaker 1: be a therapist, but I'm not giving new therapy on

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Speaker 1: this podcast. And I want this podcast to be a

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Speaker 1: kickstarter that gets thinking and moving into your into your

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Speaker 1: own healing that hopefully you engage in with a professional

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Speaker 1: throughout that through this experience. If you are able to

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Speaker 1: do that to help widen um the experience you're having,

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Speaker 1: and if you're already doing your own therapy, this can

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Speaker 1: just be an addition. But this right here is not

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Speaker 1: actual therapy, and I cannot give you actual therapy on

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Speaker 1: Instagram or any of that. So I just want to

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Speaker 1: put that out there. But you can use this information

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Speaker 1: as a way to get into your own therapy. Also

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Speaker 1: side note, most licensed professionals can only practice in states

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Speaker 1: which they're licensed. So for example, I'm licensed. I'm a

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Speaker 1: licensed therapist in Tennessee. That means that I can only

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Speaker 1: work with clients who live in Tennessee. The same goes

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Speaker 1: for Crystal when it comes to medical nutrition counseling. So

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Speaker 1: if you love her and you want to work with her,

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Speaker 1: please reach out to her. She's amazing, But do know

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Speaker 1: that she can only work with people doing medical nutritional

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Speaker 1: counseling who live and reside in Tennessee. And I think

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Speaker 1: that's where it gets. It's a little wishywashing and Greg,

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Speaker 1: especially with the whole idea of coaching and what their

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Speaker 1: guidelines and rules are. But when you have a license,

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Speaker 1: it's something that is highly regulated on purpose. There's a

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Speaker 1: reason that what we're doing is regulated because we don't

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Speaker 1: want and the people out like licensing boards are there

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Speaker 1: to protect people, and so if there are strict rules

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Speaker 1: and regulations around them, it's probably because the stuff that

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Speaker 1: we do serious and we can't just be out there

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Speaker 1: throwing stuff every which way because every state has a

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Speaker 1: different licensing board. So I do want to put that

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Speaker 1: out there. I know a lot of people have reached

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Speaker 1: out to me, and I can only work with people

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Speaker 1: who live in Tennessee. I'm sure that there are people

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Speaker 1: out there that would kind of ignore those guidelines. I

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Speaker 1: am not one of those. I really do not want

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Speaker 1: to do something that would harm somebody else, and so

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Speaker 1: I listen to the rules as much as I can. Oh.

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Speaker 1: I also want to say, Crystal does mention in this

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Speaker 1: conversation all professionals are not created equal, and that is

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Speaker 1: so true. If you're someone who is struggling with body

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Speaker 1: image or eating disorder behaviors, I suggest you find a professional,

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Speaker 1: whether it's a dietitian or therapist that's trained in those areas,

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Speaker 1: which goes into what I was saying before about Crystal

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Speaker 1: is a certified disorder registered dietitian. Sadly, anyone can say

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Speaker 1: they work with anything, So do your homework before taking

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Speaker 1: an information from just whoever you find on the internet. Now,

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Speaker 1: enough of that, let's get into this conversation with Crystal.

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Speaker 1: I can't control then, my boy, because when I talk

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Speaker 1: about stuff, I get really heated and my voice Why

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Speaker 1: why are you yelling? Because Okay, where did you grow up? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I grew up on the coast North Carolina on a

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Speaker 1: really small island called Oak Island. Do you know where

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Speaker 1: the outer do you just like, of course, you know,

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Speaker 1: yes I do. Did I ever tell you that I

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Speaker 1: grew up going there every summer? No, we had a

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Speaker 1: house and duck it's six hours from where I'm from,

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Speaker 1: so that's not Yeah, I never actually thought we had

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Speaker 1: a connection anyway, but it actually just got hit by

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Speaker 1: the hurricane a couple of days ago. And um, yeah,

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Speaker 1: but that's where I grew up. It was really a

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Speaker 1: cool place to be in beach life. So you grew

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Speaker 1: up in North Carolina and you went to school and

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Speaker 1: MT s U. So tell me about how you made

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Speaker 1: that choice. MTC is a great school and it's very random.

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Speaker 1: It's super random. No one leaves North Carolina thinking like

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Speaker 1: I'm going to go to Mt s U. Okay. Also

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Speaker 1: MT SU is a great schools. They went for like

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Speaker 1: something specific. Again, they have all of this, Okay, But

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Speaker 1: the way I got to Nashville and m T s

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Speaker 1: U had all started when I was fourteen, start living

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Speaker 1: just uh and there was just some family trauma that

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Speaker 1: happened and out of that I got into a sticky

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Speaker 1: relationship that lasted until I was Oh. Um, and so anyway,

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Speaker 1: he was a musician and wanted to move to Nashville,

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Speaker 1: and I actually got married to him when I was eighteen,

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Speaker 1: and I did not get married at eighteen. I did

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Speaker 1: not know that. Yeah, well it was out of you know,

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Speaker 1: that relationship was out of this trauma and trauma bondings

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Speaker 1: when I learned later. I don't know that I've explained that.

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Speaker 1: Do you want to explain what trauma bonding is? No,

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Speaker 1: I'm not the therapists here. You know what it is.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's a trauma. No you, I can't

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Speaker 1: say it right, Okay. A trauma bond is when you

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Speaker 1: create a relationship or bond with somebody while you're moving

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Speaker 1: through a traumatic experience. It can be good and bad.

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Speaker 1: So if you get a serious element like cancer or something,

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Speaker 1: and you're married and your husband goes to all of

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Speaker 1: your appointments with you, and you move through that process

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Speaker 1: and it brings you closer, you can create a healthy

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Speaker 1: trauma bond, like you are bonded that person. They helped

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Speaker 1: move you through that experience. If your husband is healthy,

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Speaker 1: that's okay. A trauma bond can also happen in a

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Speaker 1: negative way, which is like that whole idea of Stockholm syndrome,

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Speaker 1: like when the people come become in love with their captors.

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Speaker 1: It's because they are going through trauma and the people

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Speaker 1: that are closest to them, that's who you're going to

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Speaker 1: pull in for like safety and connection. And so they're

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Speaker 1: connected to these people and as they're surviving their trauma,

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Speaker 1: they think it is all you know, really fucks with

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Speaker 1: your head. So you're saying, I trauma bonded with this

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Speaker 1: person and it it might not be that he was

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Speaker 1: the right person for me, but he was there and

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Speaker 1: available and gave me the things that I needed to

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Speaker 1: survive while I was experiencing this unrest or eruption in

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Speaker 1: my family system or wherever your trauma happened. That was

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Speaker 1: beautifully said, thank you. You can find me at three

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Speaker 1: Courts Therapy dot com. Yes, so, um so, he moved

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Speaker 1: to Nashville, and I did my first year of college

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Speaker 1: in North Carolina. And then when we got married, I

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Speaker 1: graduated high school. I was seventeen. That's why that happened,

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Speaker 1: not because I'm super smart, but but because I just

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Speaker 1: started school at an earlier age. And then yeah, and

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Speaker 1: then we got married, I moved here, and then I

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Speaker 1: needed to finish married before you moved. Yeah, and then

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Speaker 1: I moved here like right after the wedding. And that

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Speaker 1: was trauma of itself because I moved from a tiny

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Speaker 1: little island to Nashville, and I was like, what is

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Speaker 1: an interstate? You know? My first time driving on an

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Speaker 1: interstate was on my way to college. I was eighteen.

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Speaker 1: I accidentally got on the Interstate one on the way

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Speaker 1: to my doctor's office, and I panicked. I thought I

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Speaker 1: was turning on like a side street and I was

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Speaker 1: ended up on the interstate and I called my mom

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Speaker 1: and I was like, oh, I understay. I don't know

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Speaker 1: what to do. My mom was like, get off it off.

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Speaker 1: That's like that clueless. Do you remember when like the inderstate?

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Speaker 1: That's exactly what I'm pictured. It's not great. Okay, So

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Speaker 1: what was your process of I'm eighteen and I'm married

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Speaker 1: and now I'm going to go to college. Did the

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Speaker 1: people around you were they like, oh, you're married? What

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Speaker 1: was that? Yeah? There was? I felt um embarrassed. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: Like I didn't like to tell like the adults around me,

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Speaker 1: Like when I got into a church and stuff, when

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Speaker 1: people were asking, you know I was I felt embarrassed

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Speaker 1: because people the next thing they would say is oh,

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Speaker 1: you know, or like look really, So it wasn't like

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Speaker 1: an exciting thing for you, Like it wasn't because I

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Speaker 1: think part of me knew like this probably isn't a

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Speaker 1: great idea, and my mom, like everyone was against it,

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Speaker 1: and your family was, yeah, for sure. I mean, I

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Speaker 1: don't know what there's some my family anyway, it was

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Speaker 1: just very like this is a terrible decision. And because

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Speaker 1: they saw like our whole relations So I was fourteen,

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Speaker 1: you know, I had a raging eating disorder at the

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Speaker 1: time and two and so that wasn't you know everything,

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Speaker 1: and then moving ten eleven hours from my family and

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Speaker 1: not knowing anyone's scary. And at the same time, I'm

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Speaker 1: really thankful for it because I wouldn't be who I

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Speaker 1: am today. Yeah, that's one of those things where it's

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Speaker 1: like I'm grateful for my life. I'm grateful for what

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Speaker 1: I have, and I'm really pissed. Maybe pissed I might

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Speaker 1: be putting feelings on you. I wouldn't choose to find

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Speaker 1: all of these things that way, but it did help

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Speaker 1: me find those things. That makes sense. That's how I

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Speaker 1: feel about some of my stuff. I'm like it ended

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Speaker 1: up good in the end, but I wish we could

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Speaker 1: have gotten here different road. Yeah, I guess. And my

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Speaker 1: ex husband, you know, he the idea of like we

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Speaker 1: were meant to be together. You know, we say that

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Speaker 1: it was like forever, and it's like, I think maybe

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Speaker 1: we were meant to be together. He did get me

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Speaker 1: through like this really hard time, and that doesn't mean

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Speaker 1: like we were meant to be together forever, you know.

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Speaker 1: All right, Okay, so you went to MT s U

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Speaker 1: and then what were you thinking you were going to do? Um?

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Speaker 1: I didn't know, so I actually and I entered and

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Speaker 1: it was my sophomore year at that point, um undecided.

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Speaker 1: And then because I didn't know what I was doing,

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Speaker 1: I ended up, you know, well, my husband's and the

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Speaker 1: you know, in music, so like maybe I'll go into music,

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Speaker 1: which I hated, and I got out and I was

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Speaker 1: failing the classes and so forth. It was very boring.

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Speaker 1: Had I had no interest in it at all. I

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Speaker 1: like music, but I'm not in the music business and

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Speaker 1: that my brain just does work that way. So that

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Speaker 1: was a waste of going through that process. And then

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Speaker 1: also very active in an eating disorder. So it was

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Speaker 1: just kind of those things were like confirming how terrible

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Speaker 1: of a person I was, and I was a failure

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Speaker 1: and not smart and all those things. And so then

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Speaker 1: I met this lady at a pool at our apartment complex,

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Speaker 1: mind you, and was telling her the story of like

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Speaker 1: I don't know what I'm doing with my life, and

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Speaker 1: she was like, you know what you should do? I

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Speaker 1: got it be a dental hygienist. And I was like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: except I have dental trauma and I actually can't even

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Speaker 1: get myself to walk into a dentist, like, let alone

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Speaker 1: touch people's teeth, Like I can't even acknowledge my own

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Speaker 1: Like why would this be a great idea? Except I

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Speaker 1: was like maybe so, and it was just like what

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Speaker 1: she did, you know? And everyone should do that? So

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Speaker 1: I was like, yeah, you know, I'll try that. So

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Speaker 1: then I um changed my may major to that, and

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Speaker 1: I thought it was like a I didn't know you

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Speaker 1: had to go to get an undergrad degree to do that.

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Speaker 1: I thought it was like a program you did. I

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Speaker 1: changed my major to pre dental oh um, and I

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Speaker 1: wish right. This is the example of when you literally

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Speaker 1: have no idea who you are right well for sure

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Speaker 1: for sure, and yeah, I was like every day it

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Speaker 1: was like why am I here? What am I doing? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it was tough, so that didn't work out. But one

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Speaker 1: of the classes that was required for that major was

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Speaker 1: a basic nutrition class. And I went to that class

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Speaker 1: the first day and it was like they active and

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Speaker 1: you're eating disorder super active, which was which looked like

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Speaker 1: what behavior wife, restricting, binging, purging through, vomiting, laxatives, had

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Speaker 1: all the so we call this everything. Yes, everything. I

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Speaker 1: was very sick. I got ahold of adderall. I had

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Speaker 1: a little dealer on campus. Did you know that it

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Speaker 1: was bad? I knew it was God? I was getting

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Speaker 1: bad and I knew I was super miserable. Did anybody

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Speaker 1: know I had a little dealer on campus? Did you

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Speaker 1: know that it was bad? I knew it was God.

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Speaker 1: I was getting bad and I knew I was super miserable.

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Speaker 1: Did anybody know? No, because I didn't know anyone in

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Speaker 1: your husband and he was just like why are you

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Speaker 1: taking laxatives? And and then was like die your hair blonde.

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Speaker 1: I was like he added to the fact that you

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Speaker 1: needed to do these things. Yes, to maintain image for sure, right,

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Speaker 1: because he like hair. I'll show you some pictures. It

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Speaker 1: was pretty very dark brown hair of being this is

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Speaker 1: my natural cut and you know, like you have a

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Speaker 1: really pretty colored brown. People dye their hair at that right,

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Speaker 1: they should like I should have no, No, I should

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Speaker 1: like that I had had I had normal where you

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Speaker 1: shouldn't have. I mean shooting on like again to paint

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Speaker 1: a picture. What I'm hearing is there, You're this super

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Speaker 1: young person whose brain hasn't fully developed yet, who's gone

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Speaker 1: through this whole experience of life and relationships have changed

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Speaker 1: as I knew them and kind of blew up when

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Speaker 1: I was a teen preteen, I find this person to

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Speaker 1: help me feel okay, and I feel okay if he's

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Speaker 1: okay with me. So now you're maintaining your image, so

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Speaker 1: he's okay with you. And that came in a form

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Speaker 1: of an eating disorder. Probably I'm just doing like how

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Speaker 1: you dressed and presented yourself and spoken. Yeah, but I

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Speaker 1: was also a mute, like I was almost like you.

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Speaker 1: I never spoke and when I did, you could barely

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Speaker 1: hear me. And it was all like a lot of

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Speaker 1: things happened like growing up and stuff where I I

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Speaker 1: really thought like I was dumb, Like I was a

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Speaker 1: really dumb person, and if I spoke, people would hear

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Speaker 1: that I was really dumb, so like I didn't speak

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Speaker 1: and in my ex was would speak for me, so

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Speaker 1: like I didn't, hadn't. It was a whole thing. So yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it was. There's a lot. Do you want to do?

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Speaker 1: You need the therapy? Do you want? Okay, I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: be my chair back. But you what I'm thinking in

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Speaker 1: my head because when I met you, you were married.

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Speaker 1: I met you two and thirteen, which is why no,

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Speaker 1: I did twelve. I don't know, it just not an

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Speaker 1: important I think it was thirteen. And I remember so

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Speaker 1: we were working in a men's program. You only worked

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Speaker 1: with men at that time, men's program of a treatment

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Speaker 1: ner and I was an intern. And you know when

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Speaker 1: you're like you're younger, you think everybody's like so much

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Speaker 1: older in wires than you. I remember after it was

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Speaker 1: after a staffing, which is when like the whole treatment

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Speaker 1: team would come together, and we talked about cases, and

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Speaker 1: I think my supervisor, I don't think she was frustrated

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Speaker 1: with me, but I think she just was like, you

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Speaker 1: need to speak up more, because to me, she would say,

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Speaker 1: and afterwards you said, you need to find your inner bitch.

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Speaker 1: You start being more of a bit. And I was

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Speaker 1: like I can't do that because but what's funny is

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Speaker 1: I couldn't do that because in my story, I had

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Speaker 1: a lot of people when I was younger say that

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Speaker 1: I was a bit and say that I was mean,

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Speaker 1: but I wasn't. I don't believe I was mean. I

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Speaker 1: think I was like really insecure. I might have come

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Speaker 1: off as mean, but people would even say, like I've

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Speaker 1: resting bitch face, and they're like, I don't even look welcoming.

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Speaker 1: And I never wanted to give that after I went

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Speaker 1: to college and never wanted that reputation. I wanted to

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Speaker 1: be the nice one and like the welcoming one and

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Speaker 1: the forgiving one and sweet one. So when you were like,

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Speaker 1: you need to be a bit, I was like, no,

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Speaker 1: because in my story, when you're a bit, people don't

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Speaker 1: like you and they don't want to be a part

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Speaker 1: of you. And anyway, it's that's important. What's important is

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Speaker 1: that is such a stark to what you were so before,

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Speaker 1: like you did not you needed to find your name, bit.

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Speaker 1: But so you were just like, I'll do what you

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Speaker 1: say because I think really low of me. Yeah yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: you went you change your major and you went to

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Speaker 1: a nutrition class. That's where we got off. Yes, yes,

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Speaker 1: So I went into this class and as soon as

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Speaker 1: the teacher started talking, I was like it was like

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Speaker 1: this beam of light came down and was like this

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Speaker 1: is what you're doing there, And it was like this

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Speaker 1: whole like meant to be like in my body, like

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Speaker 1: I felt something like click, this is what you're supposed

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Speaker 1: to do. And it never occurred to me to do

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Speaker 1: like go into nutrition, even when I was going through

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Speaker 1: like therapy as a child, you know, when I was

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Speaker 1: in my eating disorder as a teenager, and and like

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Speaker 1: I never put it together like that I could do that,

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Speaker 1: or what a dietitian was, like I thought they were

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Speaker 1: like the person talking to me about nutrition as a

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Speaker 1: teenager was like a nurse or somebody in the medical profession.

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Speaker 1: I didn't realize this was a profession, you know. So

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Speaker 1: I just I didn't put it together. And so that

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Speaker 1: day I went to the dean and was like changed

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Speaker 1: my major to nutrition. And then that semester I also

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Speaker 1: got news that I was failing out of college and

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Speaker 1: that I was going to be suspended for a whole year,

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Speaker 1: And so, did you have an inclination and that was happening? No,

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Speaker 1: And I'll tell you why. I'm okay. I always like,

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Speaker 1: I always think I'm failing anyway. But at that point,

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Speaker 1: my eating disorder was so bad I never went to class,

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Speaker 1: and I did in my mind, I was going to class,

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Speaker 1: and so if you don't go, you you fail. You

365
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Speaker 1: don't know what's happening. When you take a test, you

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Speaker 1: fail it, you know. But in my mind I was like, yeah, well, dull,

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Speaker 1: because you're dumb, Like this is all evidence that, yes,

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Speaker 1: that you knew your entire life that like you are

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Speaker 1: not smart and you're not going to be anything, and

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Speaker 1: why are you here? And so to me it was

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Speaker 1: just kind of like, well, yeah, I mean I expected

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Speaker 1: this because why wouldn't it happen? And so I went

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Speaker 1: to one of the professors and I was like I

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Speaker 1: don't understand, you know, like why am I failing? And

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Speaker 1: she was like where are you? Like you're not in class,

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Speaker 1: like what are you doing when it's class time? And

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Speaker 1: I was like, what do you mean? Where I was

378
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Speaker 1: was empt Su has a beautiful gym. So when I

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Speaker 1: would go to school, because I had I commuted like

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Speaker 1: a forty five minute drive there, um, I would go

381
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Speaker 1: to the gym. It was two stories. They had classes

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Speaker 1: all day. There was just you know, there's a cardioid

383
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Speaker 1: like everything, and so I would be there for six

384
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Speaker 1: to seven hours a day. I was passing out all machines.

385
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Speaker 1: I started eating half of a peanut butter and jelly

386
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Speaker 1: sandwich in the shower stall because I didn't want anyone

387
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Speaker 1: to see me eating. And then I would go back

388
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Speaker 1: out because I was passing out, and they told me

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Speaker 1: I couldn't come back. And so the gym told you came, yeah,

390
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Speaker 1: until like I had some sort of doctor thing. And

391
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Speaker 1: so what I started to do is I learned everyone's schedule,

392
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Speaker 1: and then because it's two stories, I would spend half

393
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Speaker 1: the day like upstairs, like I would take a class

394
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Speaker 1: and like go walk around the track and then take

395
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Speaker 1: another class, and then I'd go downstairs and do some

396
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Speaker 1: like weights, and then i'd go back up to the

397
00:23:06,800 --> 00:23:10,320
Speaker 1: cardio like I had a whole thing. And then I

398
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Speaker 1: would go to the um like cafeteria where they had

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Speaker 1: a buffet and I had like a meal plan so

400
00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:22,080
Speaker 1: I could just go eat whenever. And I would go

401
00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:27,280
Speaker 1: in there at the end of breakfast and I would

402
00:23:27,320 --> 00:23:30,679
Speaker 1: stay in there to the start of lunch, and I

403
00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:36,000
Speaker 1: basically like would binge on like the buffet. So anyway,

404
00:23:36,520 --> 00:23:40,280
Speaker 1: once that kind of was brought to my attention, when

405
00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:45,200
Speaker 1: I took that year off, I got some help and

406
00:23:46,040 --> 00:23:47,960
Speaker 1: um I took a couple like online classes at the

407
00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:52,359
Speaker 1: community college and and then was able to start my

408
00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:58,800
Speaker 1: nutrition degree in the summer of two thousand seven. And

409
00:23:58,840 --> 00:24:05,840
Speaker 1: then once I started that, I had straight a's killing

410
00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:08,560
Speaker 1: it because and it was like it was back on.

411
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Speaker 1: But like I found like my calling in life, like

412
00:24:11,040 --> 00:24:15,360
Speaker 1: my passion, and I loved it so much. So yeah,

413
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Speaker 1: that's how it happened. How that happened. I wonder there's

414
00:24:18,560 --> 00:24:20,040
Speaker 1: a part of it. It's like, were you attracted to

415
00:24:20,080 --> 00:24:22,880
Speaker 1: the idea of being a dietitian out of your eating disorder?

416
00:24:24,000 --> 00:24:27,800
Speaker 1: It never it never clicked to me. It didn't. And

417
00:24:28,160 --> 00:24:31,439
Speaker 1: even in my internship I did my internship at Vanderbilt,

418
00:24:31,800 --> 00:24:35,800
Speaker 1: someone from the treat like from the treatment center came

419
00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:38,520
Speaker 1: and like talked about eating disorder treatment and I was like,

420
00:24:38,520 --> 00:24:43,119
Speaker 1: I would never do. And then my first job was

421
00:24:43,240 --> 00:24:47,399
Speaker 1: working at the street and it was just like it

422
00:24:47,480 --> 00:24:50,560
Speaker 1: was it was meant to be, Like it was like Crystal,

423
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Speaker 1: You're gonna have to take a back seat because you

424
00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:55,960
Speaker 1: will ruin everything. Let's just let me take you on

425
00:24:56,000 --> 00:24:58,680
Speaker 1: this ride, because I will get you to where your

426
00:24:59,280 --> 00:25:04,119
Speaker 1: hopes and dreams. When you started going to school and

427
00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:07,160
Speaker 1: started actually enjoying what you were learning and being aware,

428
00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:12,359
Speaker 1: what did that do to one your sense of identity

429
00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:15,800
Speaker 1: but also your relationship? And I'm actually realizing I'm smart.

430
00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:20,720
Speaker 1: I didn't realize I was smart until working at the

431
00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:25,719
Speaker 1: ranch for about a year, when I gained like confidence

432
00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:30,160
Speaker 1: and what I was when I knew any client could

433
00:25:30,200 --> 00:25:32,000
Speaker 1: walk in the door and I would have some idea

434
00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:34,280
Speaker 1: of how to help them in some sort of way.

435
00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:37,439
Speaker 1: And when I figured out like I don't have to

436
00:25:38,160 --> 00:25:40,400
Speaker 1: like I have it in my brain, like this knowledge

437
00:25:40,400 --> 00:25:45,199
Speaker 1: that I can actually share without reading in it and

438
00:25:45,240 --> 00:25:47,520
Speaker 1: then like having a meltdown because I can't retain it,

439
00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:51,760
Speaker 1: you know, and that kind of stuff. And once I

440
00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:55,760
Speaker 1: did that, I noticed like people was respecting me. People

441
00:25:55,920 --> 00:25:59,040
Speaker 1: would ask me to like yeah, and like people were

442
00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:02,439
Speaker 1: asking me to do speek king engagements and stuff. I

443
00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:05,919
Speaker 1: just became more and more confident. And then I learned

444
00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:10,159
Speaker 1: so much from the therapists about trauma bond and about

445
00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:16,240
Speaker 1: narcissism and gaslighting and relationship addiction, like all of these things,

446
00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:19,000
Speaker 1: and I was like, oh my gosh. And at the

447
00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:22,080
Speaker 1: same time, my relationship while I was there was horrible

448
00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:25,159
Speaker 1: and I didn't I really I was never wanted to

449
00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:29,679
Speaker 1: go home. Yeah, So because my everybody knew that you

450
00:26:29,760 --> 00:26:33,320
Speaker 1: like worked a lot, I didn't know everyone knew that.

451
00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:36,120
Speaker 1: I guess not everybody. I probably talked to like five

452
00:26:36,160 --> 00:26:38,880
Speaker 1: people there. But but but it was more like you're obsessed

453
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:41,240
Speaker 1: with working, as in like passion. I didn't know that

454
00:26:41,280 --> 00:26:43,800
Speaker 1: behind the scene story of that, like why you worked

455
00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:47,080
Speaker 1: so much. I imagine it's part because I'm finding this

456
00:26:47,119 --> 00:26:49,800
Speaker 1: thing that actually makes me feel good about myself, and

457
00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:52,159
Speaker 1: that mas me not want to go home because I

458
00:26:52,200 --> 00:26:57,240
Speaker 1: don't get to have that spence. Okay, so you start

459
00:26:57,280 --> 00:26:59,960
Speaker 1: working at the ranch. You didn't know you want to

460
00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:02,080
Speaker 1: work on eating disorders. You went there more as like

461
00:27:02,119 --> 00:27:04,360
Speaker 1: a dietitian, and then you worked, you started working with

462
00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:07,560
Speaker 1: you didn't disorders. How that happened. I started working there

463
00:27:07,840 --> 00:27:15,000
Speaker 1: as uh, exercise specialist and dietitian, working in the more

464
00:27:15,119 --> 00:27:20,800
Speaker 1: like addiction realm and not necessarily working in the eating

465
00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:23,640
Speaker 1: disorder because you weren't. Yeah, you never did the eating

466
00:27:23,640 --> 00:27:27,760
Speaker 1: disorder program, right, Um, But we had men that came

467
00:27:27,800 --> 00:27:30,399
Speaker 1: in with it, for sure. I want you to tell

468
00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:34,439
Speaker 1: me about and you can put your personal spin on this.

469
00:27:34,600 --> 00:27:36,399
Speaker 1: You can talk about it personally and what that meant,

470
00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:41,119
Speaker 1: but also what makes you now passionate about the eating

471
00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:43,960
Speaker 1: disorder work and the body image work. I see you

472
00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:48,040
Speaker 1: as like an expert. Do you see yourself as an expert? Yes?

473
00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:52,000
Speaker 1: Is that hard for you to say? And what's the

474
00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:56,439
Speaker 1: What courses do you teach at lipscumb I teach in

475
00:27:56,440 --> 00:28:02,439
Speaker 1: the graduate program eating disorders, the counseling. It's counseling, and

476
00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:05,480
Speaker 1: I have a class on eating disorders they do. Yeah,

477
00:28:05,520 --> 00:28:09,360
Speaker 1: I've been teaching there. I didn't know that was graduate.

478
00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:16,200
Speaker 1: Oh my god, Okay, that is so cool. Vanderbilt did

479
00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:20,000
Speaker 1: not have that. Well. I created it because so I

480
00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:24,639
Speaker 1: did my master's at Lipscomb and the director, one of

481
00:28:24,640 --> 00:28:28,280
Speaker 1: my professors, became the director and I while I was

482
00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:31,680
Speaker 1: working at the ranch, I you know, I had a

483
00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:35,919
Speaker 1: wealth of knowledge and experience, and I reached out to her.

484
00:28:35,960 --> 00:28:37,959
Speaker 1: It was like, you know, I'd love to teach if

485
00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:41,080
Speaker 1: there's ever an opportunity. And she was like, well, what

486
00:28:41,120 --> 00:28:44,120
Speaker 1: would you teach? And I was like, well, you know,

487
00:28:44,640 --> 00:28:48,360
Speaker 1: as far as I know, there's not any really universities

488
00:28:48,400 --> 00:28:50,320
Speaker 1: around here that teach eating disorders. And this is a

489
00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:55,000
Speaker 1: huge deal for people in the counseling program in the

490
00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:58,600
Speaker 1: nutrition and exercise science programs. At that point, they didn't

491
00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:01,120
Speaker 1: have pharmacy or anything yet it but I was just like,

492
00:29:01,160 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 1: this is something that people need to not just know exists,

493
00:29:04,840 --> 00:29:08,160
Speaker 1: but like need to know about. Yeah, and like treatment

494
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:11,520
Speaker 1: and all that and so um. It's so because it's

495
00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:14,560
Speaker 1: so hard to miss because eating disorders can look like health,

496
00:29:14,760 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 1: I think a lot. Right. The one of the very

497
00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:20,360
Speaker 1: first things I say in the very first class is

498
00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:23,960
Speaker 1: that eating disorders looks like everyone. And I say that

499
00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:26,440
Speaker 1: because I know there's probably going to be people in

500
00:29:26,440 --> 00:29:29,800
Speaker 1: the class with eating disorders, and so I say that

501
00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:32,840
Speaker 1: because I also talk about like we're gonna we're gonna

502
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:36,600
Speaker 1: talk about some things that could bring up personal stuff,

503
00:29:36,960 --> 00:29:39,520
Speaker 1: and I need to know if you don't feel safe,

504
00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:43,080
Speaker 1: if you know, if you need support, please come talk

505
00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:45,880
Speaker 1: to me after class. And you know, and that has

506
00:29:45,920 --> 00:29:48,960
Speaker 1: happened many times. And uh, and one of the things

507
00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:53,080
Speaker 1: the very first assignment they get is for them to

508
00:29:53,120 --> 00:29:56,600
Speaker 1: write a paper on their nutrition philosophy and how it

509
00:29:56,680 --> 00:30:00,160
Speaker 1: has evolved over the course of their lifespan because as

510
00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:02,760
Speaker 1: it gives me an idea of what's in the class,

511
00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:08,360
Speaker 1: but it gives them the opportunity to actually put it

512
00:30:08,360 --> 00:30:11,000
Speaker 1: on paper, because a lot of times no one's ever

513
00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:13,080
Speaker 1: asked them to do that. And then as they're writing

514
00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:16,160
Speaker 1: there like oh wow, like this is actually really hard

515
00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:20,840
Speaker 1: for me to acknowledge, and you know, and this is

516
00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:23,560
Speaker 1: what I want out of this class. And what I

517
00:30:23,600 --> 00:30:26,440
Speaker 1: also tell them is that this class is not eating

518
00:30:26,480 --> 00:30:30,600
Speaker 1: a sort of treatment for you, because that's just oh

519
00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:34,200
Speaker 1: my god, that makes me. I can't this is me

520
00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:36,800
Speaker 1: holding myself accountable. I can't take something else on that

521
00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:39,600
Speaker 1: makes me want to like reach out to Vanderbilt and

522
00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:42,600
Speaker 1: be like you need this, yeah, because it really should

523
00:30:42,600 --> 00:30:44,600
Speaker 1: be something that's taught to people who are going to

524
00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:48,000
Speaker 1: go out. They have an addictions class, but they don't

525
00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:51,560
Speaker 1: have how would you frame like your food philosophy or

526
00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:57,280
Speaker 1: your philosophy of treating any client? Really, you know, we

527
00:30:57,400 --> 00:31:00,720
Speaker 1: legalize all foods, all foods fit. Okay. That makes me

528
00:31:00,760 --> 00:31:10,200
Speaker 1: feel really comfortable with me sending half my clients to you. Okay,

529
00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:15,640
Speaker 1: So I want to know something that became really evident

530
00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:19,400
Speaker 1: to you as somebody who did not have training on

531
00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:22,720
Speaker 1: body image work before that, you probably got some while

532
00:31:22,720 --> 00:31:27,400
Speaker 1: you're there because going into that stuff. This is what

533
00:31:27,440 --> 00:31:30,240
Speaker 1: a lot of people think is body image work is

534
00:31:30,640 --> 00:31:35,000
Speaker 1: learning how to love what your body looks like and

535
00:31:35,160 --> 00:31:38,800
Speaker 1: changing your opinions of what your body looks like. It's

536
00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:40,920
Speaker 1: kind of what I think people come into it thinking,

537
00:31:41,280 --> 00:31:44,040
Speaker 1: when it is a much bigger thing than that. And

538
00:31:44,120 --> 00:31:46,680
Speaker 1: I do not think body image work can be scaled

539
00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:49,719
Speaker 1: down to learning how to love what your body looks like.

540
00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:51,880
Speaker 1: I don't think that's what the point is. I mean

541
00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:53,720
Speaker 1: a lot of people think that's the point, and that's

542
00:31:53,720 --> 00:31:56,360
Speaker 1: why it seems like almost impossible. I think a lot

543
00:31:56,400 --> 00:31:59,160
Speaker 1: of people teach it that that that is the point,

544
00:31:59,560 --> 00:32:03,280
Speaker 1: especially on social media platforms. There's a lot of very

545
00:32:03,320 --> 00:32:08,400
Speaker 1: positive accounts, but they um bolster body image work and

546
00:32:08,440 --> 00:32:11,400
Speaker 1: the positive body image movement as learning to love what

547
00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:14,280
Speaker 1: everything looks like, when that might not be saying that's

548
00:32:14,320 --> 00:32:17,840
Speaker 1: possible or it feel like it's possible. So I want

549
00:32:17,880 --> 00:32:21,080
Speaker 1: to know what your process and what you learned about

550
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:25,120
Speaker 1: body image work throughout your career because it might have

551
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:29,080
Speaker 1: shifted and what it means to you now. Yeah, we

552
00:32:29,280 --> 00:32:33,200
Speaker 1: had incredible training and mentors at the rent so valuable,

553
00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:36,840
Speaker 1: especially early in your profession when you're learning. You want

554
00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:39,400
Speaker 1: to learn the right stuff, you know. I when I

555
00:32:39,440 --> 00:32:43,479
Speaker 1: was an intern, I worked through the summer because I

556
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:45,360
Speaker 1: was like, I can't get enough of this. That's why

557
00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:47,760
Speaker 1: I worked all the time. I genuinely loved being it

558
00:32:47,840 --> 00:32:52,479
Speaker 1: was like a family. Yeah. What I really learned first

559
00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:57,640
Speaker 1: was that body image is such a brain game. Like

560
00:32:57,720 --> 00:33:01,600
Speaker 1: it really is in the way that I look at it,

561
00:33:01,600 --> 00:33:05,560
Speaker 1: it's so tied into like your nervous system and the

562
00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:08,280
Speaker 1: way I kind of describe it is we can see

563
00:33:08,400 --> 00:33:10,920
Speaker 1: a poisonous snake on the ground, in our nervous system

564
00:33:11,000 --> 00:33:14,000
Speaker 1: reacts with like oh my god, danger, danger or fight

565
00:33:14,080 --> 00:33:17,080
Speaker 1: or flight. And that's kind of what we can perceive

566
00:33:17,120 --> 00:33:19,800
Speaker 1: our body as, like this thing that's like terrifying. We

567
00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:23,160
Speaker 1: can't look at it and we can't even begin to

568
00:33:23,160 --> 00:33:27,400
Speaker 1: touch it because your brain is like that is going

569
00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:36,240
Speaker 1: to kill you. Why are you about to touch or

570
00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:38,720
Speaker 1: touching like a hot stove. I'm asking you to put

571
00:33:38,720 --> 00:33:40,720
Speaker 1: your hand on a hot stove and keep it there.

572
00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:43,720
Speaker 1: You know, your brain and nervous system will not allow

573
00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:46,840
Speaker 1: that to happen. You know, you know what is it's

574
00:33:46,840 --> 00:33:50,280
Speaker 1: speaking of trauma bonds is a lot of us through

575
00:33:50,280 --> 00:33:53,360
Speaker 1: our experience of our eating disorder. We talk a lot

576
00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:56,239
Speaker 1: about like how eating disorders become like friends almost, but

577
00:33:56,360 --> 00:34:00,959
Speaker 1: you become trauma bonded to the eating disorder. Yes, and

578
00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:04,560
Speaker 1: so because it's at some point it has saved you,

579
00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:07,120
Speaker 1: you know, and then it becomes it's like, okay, well

580
00:34:07,120 --> 00:34:09,279
Speaker 1: now you're ruining my life and trauma bond into the

581
00:34:09,320 --> 00:34:11,840
Speaker 1: negative body image because if you get rid of the

582
00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:13,759
Speaker 1: negative body image, that eating is sort of might not

583
00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:17,239
Speaker 1: be as important to you. Once you understand that, you

584
00:34:17,280 --> 00:34:20,680
Speaker 1: understand what the brain is doing, it's like, okay, now

585
00:34:20,719 --> 00:34:24,200
Speaker 1: we have all of these tools and strategies to work

586
00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:29,880
Speaker 1: with it and to to increase cellular density in areas

587
00:34:29,920 --> 00:34:33,920
Speaker 1: that are really low. Get that means, so, like, you know,

588
00:34:33,960 --> 00:34:36,440
Speaker 1: the brain is not a muscle, but if you imagine

589
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:39,200
Speaker 1: it as a muscle when you're doing like bicep curls,

590
00:34:39,960 --> 00:34:42,919
Speaker 1: the more you exercise that muscle, it's going to get

591
00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:47,440
Speaker 1: stronger and it could get bigger. And because it increases

592
00:34:47,520 --> 00:34:51,640
Speaker 1: the cells, right, cellular density, So then the more cellular

593
00:34:51,680 --> 00:34:55,640
Speaker 1: density you have, the more blood flow and more capillaries

594
00:34:55,680 --> 00:35:00,320
Speaker 1: that have to grow to fuel those cells, which is

595
00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:04,560
Speaker 1: more oxygen, more nutrients so that it thrives. And so

596
00:35:04,719 --> 00:35:08,240
Speaker 1: when we don't use those parts of the brain based

597
00:35:08,280 --> 00:35:11,920
Speaker 1: on like different traumas or whatever it is, the cellular

598
00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:13,839
Speaker 1: density can go down. And that's why you can get

599
00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:17,960
Speaker 1: so stuck in in these parts of you know, like

600
00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:23,480
Speaker 1: the negative body image. And so the therapeutic strategies you

601
00:35:23,719 --> 00:35:27,760
Speaker 1: used is to really focus on increasing that cellular density.

602
00:35:28,080 --> 00:35:32,160
Speaker 1: And it's so hard because it's like you're you're poking

603
00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:35,759
Speaker 1: up a fifty pound dumbbell and you've never picked up

604
00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:39,120
Speaker 1: but yeah, yeah, and it's like that's hard and it hurts,

605
00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:41,520
Speaker 1: and you don't want to do it, you know. And

606
00:35:41,560 --> 00:35:45,400
Speaker 1: so and that's what this what's what working on body

607
00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:48,920
Speaker 1: images like too and eating disorder behaviors. Yeah, and you

608
00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:53,200
Speaker 1: and I were having a conversation and our very cute

609
00:35:53,239 --> 00:35:58,120
Speaker 1: office the other day about body image, and I was

610
00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:01,440
Speaker 1: talking about this one part of us that understands this

611
00:36:01,560 --> 00:36:05,280
Speaker 1: logic of yeah, I get that, I get what you're saying, Catherine.

612
00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:07,799
Speaker 1: That makes sense to me, and I know you're right.

613
00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:11,080
Speaker 1: But then there's this belief system, which is a more

614
00:36:11,120 --> 00:36:16,279
Speaker 1: emotional side of you that can't grab onto that, and

615
00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:19,359
Speaker 1: that emotional side is attached to the nervous system, which

616
00:36:19,400 --> 00:36:23,000
Speaker 1: is attached to how you respond to trauma and how

617
00:36:23,120 --> 00:36:25,839
Speaker 1: you have been carried and cared for it, and how

618
00:36:25,880 --> 00:36:29,000
Speaker 1: you've survived your trauma and your experiences. And when I

619
00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:31,800
Speaker 1: say trauma, I mean everything from these big T traumas

620
00:36:31,880 --> 00:36:36,560
Speaker 1: again to this emotional little T type traumas. And there

621
00:36:36,640 --> 00:36:40,680
Speaker 1: is this block in between the logic and the emotion,

622
00:36:41,480 --> 00:36:45,360
Speaker 1: and there it almost is like the emotional brain is

623
00:36:45,400 --> 00:36:49,160
Speaker 1: like pushing that block, and it's like pushing the logic

624
00:36:49,239 --> 00:36:52,759
Speaker 1: farther and farther and farther away. And what do you

625
00:36:52,760 --> 00:36:54,680
Speaker 1: remember what you said to me after that? Is this

626
00:36:54,719 --> 00:36:57,520
Speaker 1: when we were talking about that's called the Alli centric

627
00:36:57,560 --> 00:37:03,280
Speaker 1: block theory. Yes, yes, that was a concept that Dr

628
00:37:03,440 --> 00:37:08,000
Speaker 1: Ralph Carson presented. He was brilliant and I loved I

629
00:37:08,040 --> 00:37:11,920
Speaker 1: saw I became this like it was like obsessed like

630
00:37:11,960 --> 00:37:14,120
Speaker 1: with everything he said. And I think in one year

631
00:37:14,200 --> 00:37:16,879
Speaker 1: I saw him speak like six or sometimes it's like

632
00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:24,200
Speaker 1: it's like how I am with Britney Spears, Okay, I

633
00:37:24,239 --> 00:37:30,680
Speaker 1: fellow her on Instagram? So um. But yeah, he introduced

634
00:37:30,719 --> 00:37:34,720
Speaker 1: that concept of the Alice centric block theory. It's really

635
00:37:35,040 --> 00:37:38,440
Speaker 1: when we think of things being burned into our memory,

636
00:37:38,760 --> 00:37:43,200
Speaker 1: where you can recall the exact feeling, what you were wearing,

637
00:37:43,840 --> 00:37:46,560
Speaker 1: what part of the story you were in, what like

638
00:37:46,680 --> 00:37:50,640
Speaker 1: every single detail even though it was decades ago, and

639
00:37:50,840 --> 00:37:53,080
Speaker 1: it and it brings you back. And that can look

640
00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:56,120
Speaker 1: like you when if you were bullied as a child,

641
00:37:56,360 --> 00:38:03,040
Speaker 1: if for your size, and that trauma gets burned into

642
00:38:03,239 --> 00:38:06,719
Speaker 1: your memory to where you live and behave in your

643
00:38:06,760 --> 00:38:08,960
Speaker 1: body like you were the eight year old kid that

644
00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:14,040
Speaker 1: was bullied, or any time some something gets challenged, you know,

645
00:38:14,120 --> 00:38:17,120
Speaker 1: someone makes a comment about something, you all of a

646
00:38:17,160 --> 00:38:20,840
Speaker 1: sudden dropped back into this eight year old and start

647
00:38:20,880 --> 00:38:25,440
Speaker 1: behaving like that saying that. It almost is like, oh

648
00:38:25,480 --> 00:38:28,799
Speaker 1: my god, this makes sense now because I think a

649
00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:31,880
Speaker 1: lot of people get frustrated when they're like Katherine, I

650
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:35,319
Speaker 1: know that you're right, Like I truly know that you're right.

651
00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:39,719
Speaker 1: I cannot feel that in me, and I know that

652
00:38:39,840 --> 00:38:42,640
Speaker 1: is right for every other person when we're just talking

653
00:38:42,719 --> 00:38:45,000
Speaker 1: for if we're just sticking with body image stuff, because

654
00:38:45,040 --> 00:38:47,239
Speaker 1: this can be applied to anything, but that kind of

655
00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:49,000
Speaker 1: I know that you're right, and I know when I

656
00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:52,520
Speaker 1: say these things, I don't totally make sense, Like I know,

657
00:38:52,600 --> 00:38:55,839
Speaker 1: nothing makes sense. And that's where there's this CBT, which

658
00:38:55,880 --> 00:38:58,960
Speaker 1: is like so helpful and it really helps with logic,

659
00:38:59,200 --> 00:39:02,680
Speaker 1: but it does not completely help with the emotional part

660
00:39:02,800 --> 00:39:07,799
Speaker 1: of changing. And so what we do is it's you

661
00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:12,000
Speaker 1: have to experience something new. You have to experience your

662
00:39:12,040 --> 00:39:19,319
Speaker 1: body differently, over and over again until your brain it's

663
00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:22,440
Speaker 1: not just a decision you can make like that logic.

664
00:39:22,560 --> 00:39:28,080
Speaker 1: It's not rational, it's emotional, and the emotions can be

665
00:39:28,280 --> 00:39:34,200
Speaker 1: soothed with that. That exposure to what is so stimulating.

666
00:39:34,360 --> 00:39:37,560
Speaker 1: And that's why I like when I use the snake analogy,

667
00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:41,719
Speaker 1: because that's poisonous snake that you're so terrified of. It's

668
00:39:41,760 --> 00:39:48,600
Speaker 1: actually a garden host, right, It's a completely harmless inanimate

669
00:39:48,680 --> 00:39:54,480
Speaker 1: object like food, right, and our bodies, but we perceive

670
00:39:54,640 --> 00:39:58,080
Speaker 1: it as something different, as something that is a threat

671
00:39:58,600 --> 00:40:00,359
Speaker 1: and we have to get out. We have to get

672
00:40:00,360 --> 00:40:02,680
Speaker 1: out of our bodies, and we do that with our

673
00:40:02,680 --> 00:40:06,120
Speaker 1: eating disorders and that like everything I got, I have

674
00:40:06,440 --> 00:40:15,319
Speaker 1: goose bumps. I get so excited. We were the same

675
00:40:15,920 --> 00:40:19,040
Speaker 1: because I find myself like even on here, like I'll

676
00:40:19,040 --> 00:40:22,360
Speaker 1: listen back and I'm like Katherine was happening, But it's like,

677
00:40:22,440 --> 00:40:25,600
Speaker 1: when you find something like this that makes so much sense,

678
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:28,880
Speaker 1: you want to share this information with everybody, and you

679
00:40:28,880 --> 00:40:32,200
Speaker 1: want to like almost hammer into everybody's brains. And the

680
00:40:32,239 --> 00:40:34,600
Speaker 1: thing about this is we can't. So even hearing this,

681
00:40:34,680 --> 00:40:37,120
Speaker 1: people are gonna like, oh my god, yes, but it

682
00:40:37,280 --> 00:40:39,480
Speaker 1: is not going to click for you in your stuff

683
00:40:39,560 --> 00:40:42,439
Speaker 1: until you experience a new experience. You need to pick

684
00:40:42,520 --> 00:40:45,600
Speaker 1: up the snake and realize that it's a garden. And

685
00:40:45,680 --> 00:40:48,719
Speaker 1: we actually talked about this a couple of weeks ago,

686
00:40:48,719 --> 00:40:50,279
Speaker 1: because we did talk about trauma and the body and

687
00:40:50,280 --> 00:40:54,840
Speaker 1: how they're connected. But you made this point that I

688
00:40:54,880 --> 00:40:58,440
Speaker 1: want to highlight that is really pertinant to just body images.

689
00:40:58,600 --> 00:41:02,680
Speaker 1: That's why when you are and you're eating disorder or

690
00:41:02,680 --> 00:41:05,200
Speaker 1: in recovery, like you might find a pair of like

691
00:41:05,280 --> 00:41:07,400
Speaker 1: hold up a pair of shorts and be like, there's

692
00:41:07,480 --> 00:41:11,920
Speaker 1: no way I can fit into these and then they're

693
00:41:11,920 --> 00:41:14,920
Speaker 1: way too big for you kind of thing. It's because

694
00:41:14,960 --> 00:41:19,959
Speaker 1: you are experiencing your body not as what it actually is,

695
00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:23,799
Speaker 1: but what it felt like x y Z, even if

696
00:41:24,080 --> 00:41:26,279
Speaker 1: even if you were even if you could have still

697
00:41:26,320 --> 00:41:30,600
Speaker 1: fit in those pants or shorts back when you're remembering

698
00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:33,960
Speaker 1: this experience, I know for me, I'll speak for me.

699
00:41:34,000 --> 00:41:36,680
Speaker 1: This is a great example. This is a little bit

700
00:41:36,719 --> 00:41:39,960
Speaker 1: my trauma. I mentioned this in one of the earliest episodes.

701
00:41:40,000 --> 00:41:43,440
Speaker 1: But so when I was in fifth grade, I was

702
00:41:43,480 --> 00:41:45,799
Speaker 1: on the playground and I had been like bullied by

703
00:41:45,800 --> 00:41:48,040
Speaker 1: like a group of girls for a little bit of time.

704
00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:50,640
Speaker 1: But I don't have any other stark memories of them

705
00:41:50,640 --> 00:41:54,600
Speaker 1: saying things except this one is burned plane, kickball, Hunter's

706
00:41:54,600 --> 00:41:59,200
Speaker 1: that Bend Elementary and Franklin, Tennessee. My teacher was Mr. Plunk.

707
00:41:59,280 --> 00:42:04,600
Speaker 1: He was the coolest teach. Anyway, I'm playing giggle and um,

708
00:42:04,640 --> 00:42:06,680
Speaker 1: a girl, one of the girls that was in the

709
00:42:06,880 --> 00:42:10,000
Speaker 1: cool crowd that didn't like me, who were my friends

710
00:42:10,040 --> 00:42:14,040
Speaker 1: the year before, yelled like in front of everybody, like, hey,

711
00:42:14,160 --> 00:42:17,080
Speaker 1: Katherine Defata, maybe you should think about drinking a slim

712
00:42:17,160 --> 00:42:21,880
Speaker 1: fast and not so many milkshakes. I was probably like

713
00:42:21,960 --> 00:42:28,839
Speaker 1: nine ten, and I just remember, I mean, so much

714
00:42:28,840 --> 00:42:31,560
Speaker 1: stuff happened after that, and it's just sad, sad to

715
00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:34,640
Speaker 1: me that I spent half of my life thinking that

716
00:42:34,719 --> 00:42:39,239
Speaker 1: I wasn't cute. But that is that one of those

717
00:42:39,239 --> 00:42:43,040
Speaker 1: experiences that she this girl told me that about myself.

718
00:42:43,160 --> 00:42:45,600
Speaker 1: I believed it. I mean, it was connected to some

719
00:42:45,640 --> 00:42:50,759
Speaker 1: other things that happened too, but I didn't wouldn't have

720
00:42:50,800 --> 00:42:54,160
Speaker 1: thought that, even if I could fit in that outfit

721
00:42:54,280 --> 00:42:57,120
Speaker 1: or whatever, I wouldn't have thought that. Like I literally

722
00:42:57,320 --> 00:42:59,880
Speaker 1: saw myself differently than what I looked like. I remember

723
00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:03,040
Speaker 1: looking at my kneecaps I played soccer, do you know,

724
00:43:03,080 --> 00:43:04,799
Speaker 1: even like your soccer shorts and then your knee cap

725
00:43:04,840 --> 00:43:07,080
Speaker 1: and then you'd like the high of the baby. There's

726
00:43:07,080 --> 00:43:12,320
Speaker 1: a baby, so only really like part of your thigh

727
00:43:12,360 --> 00:43:14,719
Speaker 1: and your knee cap shows. And I remember comparing my

728
00:43:14,800 --> 00:43:17,279
Speaker 1: knee caps to everybody else's kneecps at the soccer on

729
00:43:17,320 --> 00:43:20,640
Speaker 1: the soccer field. So tying that back to the original

730
00:43:20,680 --> 00:43:23,680
Speaker 1: content of that is we all, not all, but a

731
00:43:23,680 --> 00:43:26,120
Speaker 1: lot of us have those experiences of like, I don't

732
00:43:26,200 --> 00:43:29,400
Speaker 1: understand why I thought that about myself when I wasn't,

733
00:43:30,160 --> 00:43:32,320
Speaker 1: And I don't know why I think I logically, I

734
00:43:32,360 --> 00:43:35,160
Speaker 1: don't know why I think this about myself even though

735
00:43:35,200 --> 00:43:38,000
Speaker 1: I'm not. And it's and that, but as a child,

736
00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:43,840
Speaker 1: your brain is the prefrontal cortext is nowhere near developed

737
00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:48,520
Speaker 1: enough for you to rationalize, Hey, kids are jerks. They're

738
00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:52,320
Speaker 1: fucking jerks, you know, they suck and they say stupid

739
00:43:52,320 --> 00:43:56,640
Speaker 1: shit that traumatizees the rest of our lives because we

740
00:43:56,760 --> 00:44:00,399
Speaker 1: cannot in that moment rationalize that Hey, may be they

741
00:44:00,560 --> 00:44:04,440
Speaker 1: those kids over their bullies because they have a home

742
00:44:04,520 --> 00:44:07,480
Speaker 1: life that makes them unhappy and they're taking it out

743
00:44:07,480 --> 00:44:10,000
Speaker 1: on me. They don't a lot of adults don't have

744
00:44:10,080 --> 00:44:15,240
Speaker 1: that insight. But but that is what that is why

745
00:44:15,680 --> 00:44:18,840
Speaker 1: those little things carry with us. And if we don't

746
00:44:19,040 --> 00:44:23,040
Speaker 1: do something to get out of that before our brain

747
00:44:23,200 --> 00:44:26,160
Speaker 1: really solidifies, then that is what we live in. That

748
00:44:26,320 --> 00:44:30,319
Speaker 1: is our truth and how we behave. And that's what

749
00:44:30,840 --> 00:44:34,120
Speaker 1: that alic centric lock is. It's that it's those things

750
00:44:34,160 --> 00:44:37,719
Speaker 1: are locked and they're not transition to long term memory

751
00:44:37,760 --> 00:44:40,440
Speaker 1: because they stay in our short term like this is

752
00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:44,239
Speaker 1: what's happening, and when your body changes where instead of

753
00:44:44,320 --> 00:44:46,920
Speaker 1: that's what happened, it's and this this is happening now

754
00:44:47,040 --> 00:44:50,160
Speaker 1: versus long term memory. That is like this is still truth,

755
00:44:50,640 --> 00:44:52,399
Speaker 1: and this is how I'm going to behave with it.

756
00:44:52,719 --> 00:44:57,440
Speaker 1: I've had um triathletes and iron men who believe that

757
00:44:57,560 --> 00:45:02,680
Speaker 1: they do that sport be because they have this strong

758
00:45:02,800 --> 00:45:07,160
Speaker 1: belief that if I'm in a larger body or have

759
00:45:07,320 --> 00:45:11,600
Speaker 1: body fat at all that I am unlovable and it's

760
00:45:11,640 --> 00:45:18,080
Speaker 1: because of traumatic bullying that they experienced that made them

761
00:45:18,080 --> 00:45:20,880
Speaker 1: believe that, and so they behave in that way. But

762
00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:23,560
Speaker 1: they even though they can look in the mirror and

763
00:45:23,680 --> 00:45:28,320
Speaker 1: see that they are very lean, they have all this ability,

764
00:45:28,480 --> 00:45:34,520
Speaker 1: physical ability, they still are acting like the little kid

765
00:45:35,880 --> 00:45:39,560
Speaker 1: that was bullied. And that's the driver. And so it's

766
00:45:39,600 --> 00:45:44,640
Speaker 1: that new experience over and over again that like you're

767
00:45:44,680 --> 00:45:48,399
Speaker 1: you're a triathlete, you're actually running away, Like that's what

768
00:45:48,480 --> 00:45:51,120
Speaker 1: this is about. You're running away from that little kid

769
00:45:52,040 --> 00:45:55,719
Speaker 1: versus getting the getting the going towards the little kid

770
00:45:55,760 --> 00:45:58,239
Speaker 1: and telling him there's actually nothing wrong with him. Right.

771
00:45:58,760 --> 00:46:00,680
Speaker 1: The more you do that behave you're the more you're

772
00:46:00,680 --> 00:46:05,160
Speaker 1: solidifying what we're trying to yes fight. So the more

773
00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:07,600
Speaker 1: we act in our eating disorder, the more we act

774
00:46:07,640 --> 00:46:10,240
Speaker 1: in those behaviors, the more we are sending the message

775
00:46:10,280 --> 00:46:14,160
Speaker 1: to ourselves that those people who I logically know are

776
00:46:14,200 --> 00:46:17,680
Speaker 1: wrong or are acting out of their own stuff, are right.

777
00:46:18,800 --> 00:46:21,879
Speaker 1: And it's going to be really painful. Like right, there's

778
00:46:21,880 --> 00:46:23,360
Speaker 1: this period of time where it's like I just have

779
00:46:23,440 --> 00:46:26,359
Speaker 1: to trust Cat that you're telling the truth, or trust

780
00:46:26,440 --> 00:46:29,360
Speaker 1: Crystal that like this is gonna work. You have to

781
00:46:29,400 --> 00:46:33,280
Speaker 1: go through this process of not acting as that kid

782
00:46:33,400 --> 00:46:36,880
Speaker 1: who believes those things in order for new stuff to

783
00:46:36,960 --> 00:46:41,160
Speaker 1: be able to come about. Because if that person, the

784
00:46:41,200 --> 00:46:45,000
Speaker 1: tray athlete, let's say they stopped running away from that

785
00:46:45,120 --> 00:46:47,920
Speaker 1: kid and actually was like, Hey, I'm gonna love you

786
00:46:47,960 --> 00:46:49,520
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna care for you and there's nothing wrong

787
00:46:49,560 --> 00:46:51,400
Speaker 1: with you, they would lose the need to be a

788
00:46:51,440 --> 00:46:56,279
Speaker 1: triathlete if it wasn't there like professional career, yes, right,

789
00:46:56,920 --> 00:46:59,560
Speaker 1: just like our eating disorders, you know, like I don't

790
00:46:59,680 --> 00:47:03,040
Speaker 1: I don't need this, yeah, and you're working for me

791
00:47:03,080 --> 00:47:05,560
Speaker 1: anymore so, and and I don't know if you have this.

792
00:47:05,719 --> 00:47:09,560
Speaker 1: When I would look at myself in the mirror in

793
00:47:09,600 --> 00:47:14,319
Speaker 1: my eating disorder, I was so always so distraught, Like

794
00:47:14,680 --> 00:47:16,839
Speaker 1: you would not find me running in a sports bra.

795
00:47:17,040 --> 00:47:21,160
Speaker 1: I remember, like when tight leggings became a thing. Before

796
00:47:21,200 --> 00:47:24,000
Speaker 1: it was like more baggy sweatpants and stuff like that

797
00:47:24,040 --> 00:47:26,200
Speaker 1: at the gym and like big baggy like Nike shorts.

798
00:47:26,239 --> 00:47:28,799
Speaker 1: But when tight leggings became a thing, I was like,

799
00:47:28,960 --> 00:47:32,600
Speaker 1: I can't wear those. And now I'm who knows how

800
00:47:32,719 --> 00:47:35,120
Speaker 1: much different my weight is because I don't weigh myself

801
00:47:35,480 --> 00:47:37,880
Speaker 1: and I will run in a sports bar, work out

802
00:47:37,880 --> 00:47:40,279
Speaker 1: in sports were all day long. But it's because I'm

803
00:47:40,280 --> 00:47:42,960
Speaker 1: not looking at myself like that girl in the playground

804
00:47:43,040 --> 00:47:46,840
Speaker 1: who is being made fun of, I'm looking at myself.

805
00:47:46,880 --> 00:47:49,279
Speaker 1: I'm essentially looking at that girl in the playground and saying,

806
00:47:49,280 --> 00:47:51,160
Speaker 1: there's nothing wrong with you. Actually, I think that like

807
00:47:51,280 --> 00:47:53,919
Speaker 1: she's upset about who knows what's going with her dad?

808
00:47:54,000 --> 00:48:02,400
Speaker 1: You know what I mean? Right? No, no, nogs, It

809
00:48:02,480 --> 00:48:04,680
Speaker 1: wasn't it was It was years. I mean I would

810
00:48:04,719 --> 00:48:07,160
Speaker 1: say it was like at least five years of like, okay,

811
00:48:07,600 --> 00:48:11,000
Speaker 1: little steps, I'm gonna but it started with I'm gonna

812
00:48:11,160 --> 00:48:14,359
Speaker 1: I'm gonna try to stop leaning into that stuff. So

813
00:48:14,440 --> 00:48:16,520
Speaker 1: every time I have an urge to take care of

814
00:48:17,480 --> 00:48:20,160
Speaker 1: my negative body image or sense of self through one

815
00:48:20,160 --> 00:48:22,920
Speaker 1: of these behaviors, I'm going to see what happens when

816
00:48:22,960 --> 00:48:26,600
Speaker 1: I don't. Or I'm gonna say something nice to myself,

817
00:48:27,400 --> 00:48:29,799
Speaker 1: or I'm going to say something that somebody in my

818
00:48:29,880 --> 00:48:31,640
Speaker 1: life now who loves me, I'm gonna say something that

819
00:48:31,680 --> 00:48:35,120
Speaker 1: they would say to me rather than that. In your

820
00:48:35,200 --> 00:48:38,680
Speaker 1: work and recovery, how did your body image become affective?

821
00:48:38,760 --> 00:48:41,040
Speaker 1: Because it's like you're not learning any of you might

822
00:48:41,080 --> 00:48:43,279
Speaker 1: have gone through the motions but not even learned them,

823
00:48:43,400 --> 00:48:45,600
Speaker 1: or it could have been like I'm going to do

824
00:48:45,680 --> 00:48:49,040
Speaker 1: these things and not really know what's going on. I'm

825
00:48:49,080 --> 00:48:52,120
Speaker 1: not doing the behaviors anymore, but am I evaluating what's

826
00:48:52,120 --> 00:48:54,759
Speaker 1: happening in my body, in my mind and my sense

827
00:48:54,800 --> 00:48:59,560
Speaker 1: of self. Um, when I was getting help with my

828
00:48:59,640 --> 00:49:02,920
Speaker 1: eating sort of we it was all behavior. It was

829
00:49:02,960 --> 00:49:06,600
Speaker 1: all yes, it was all eating disorder and behaviors and

830
00:49:07,040 --> 00:49:09,800
Speaker 1: like who I am the way I am sort of stuff,

831
00:49:09,840 --> 00:49:14,520
Speaker 1: So it wasn't about body image. And then when I

832
00:49:14,560 --> 00:49:19,080
Speaker 1: got when I was pregnant with my first um child

833
00:49:19,120 --> 00:49:24,919
Speaker 1: who is almost nine now, that I was like, um,

834
00:49:25,120 --> 00:49:28,560
Speaker 1: once I had her, my body like changed. And that

835
00:49:28,719 --> 00:49:31,520
Speaker 1: was at that point I had been in you know,

836
00:49:31,560 --> 00:49:33,799
Speaker 1: like a good recovery for a couple of years, and

837
00:49:34,320 --> 00:49:36,360
Speaker 1: I was like, oh my god, like what am I

838
00:49:36,400 --> 00:49:42,040
Speaker 1: gonna do? Especially being a dietitian, Like I mean, there

839
00:49:42,160 --> 00:49:43,960
Speaker 1: is this pressure of like you have to have this,

840
00:49:44,360 --> 00:49:46,640
Speaker 1: you have to look a certain way, and it was like,

841
00:49:46,680 --> 00:49:48,359
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, no one's gonna listen to me if

842
00:49:48,400 --> 00:49:52,000
Speaker 1: I look like this, you know, and it's just like,

843
00:49:52,080 --> 00:49:54,920
Speaker 1: oh my god, I have to do something. I didn't

844
00:49:54,960 --> 00:49:58,200
Speaker 1: really get a sense of body image at all or

845
00:49:58,280 --> 00:50:02,240
Speaker 1: even the term until I started working at the ranch.

846
00:50:02,360 --> 00:50:07,399
Speaker 1: And honestly, I my brain changed while I was there

847
00:50:08,040 --> 00:50:14,840
Speaker 1: because I said things over and over and over until

848
00:50:15,080 --> 00:50:18,520
Speaker 1: I absolutely believe them, you know, because my brain was

849
00:50:18,560 --> 00:50:22,799
Speaker 1: like yes, and I had evidence to also show that,

850
00:50:22,840 --> 00:50:26,440
Speaker 1: like what I'm saying is actually turning into fact, you know,

851
00:50:26,560 --> 00:50:29,719
Speaker 1: it's not. And that's what has has helped me. And

852
00:50:29,760 --> 00:50:32,760
Speaker 1: then just kind of using my own skills and knowledge

853
00:50:32,800 --> 00:50:37,040
Speaker 1: and applying it to that being around really positive people

854
00:50:37,080 --> 00:50:42,160
Speaker 1: like you, Catherine, you know, and just seeing like other

855
00:50:42,200 --> 00:50:45,320
Speaker 1: people practice the same things and at the same time

856
00:50:46,320 --> 00:50:48,799
Speaker 1: have day you know, like you don't have to love

857
00:50:48,840 --> 00:50:52,759
Speaker 1: everything about ourselves. That's not that's not that this is

858
00:50:52,760 --> 00:50:55,719
Speaker 1: not the goal. I mean it'd be cute, but like,

859
00:50:56,440 --> 00:50:59,440
Speaker 1: but like what in the perfect world, But like we

860
00:50:59,440 --> 00:51:02,480
Speaker 1: we are all imperfect, and so that's what we do

861
00:51:02,560 --> 00:51:04,840
Speaker 1: with it, you know, what we do with our anxiety,

862
00:51:05,719 --> 00:51:08,120
Speaker 1: you know, And that how we've worked on that snake

863
00:51:08,239 --> 00:51:10,520
Speaker 1: becoming this garden house that we're now like wrapped up

864
00:51:10,520 --> 00:51:12,600
Speaker 1: in and rolling around with it because we know it's

865
00:51:12,600 --> 00:51:20,040
Speaker 1: our friend. It does nothing, so yeah, like it's My

866
00:51:20,120 --> 00:51:26,160
Speaker 1: work took many, many years because I didn't have the

867
00:51:26,200 --> 00:51:29,359
Speaker 1: people around me to say, like you need to go

868
00:51:29,480 --> 00:51:32,279
Speaker 1: like impatient treatment, like you need I didn't have the

869
00:51:32,320 --> 00:51:36,400
Speaker 1: professionals around me to say, like body image is a

870
00:51:36,480 --> 00:51:39,080
Speaker 1: thing like your this is what body image is, and

871
00:51:39,120 --> 00:51:41,400
Speaker 1: this is what negative body images, and this is what

872
00:51:41,520 --> 00:51:43,719
Speaker 1: can cause all these things. It was more of like

873
00:51:43,760 --> 00:51:46,520
Speaker 1: here's all, yes, you have this trauma, and then you know,

874
00:51:46,560 --> 00:51:48,680
Speaker 1: this is why you're doing these things. Let's fix the behavior.

875
00:51:48,760 --> 00:51:51,920
Speaker 1: But there was never this like discussion about like and

876
00:51:52,000 --> 00:51:54,960
Speaker 1: by the way, I can't look at myself in the mirror.

877
00:51:56,080 --> 00:51:59,560
Speaker 1: And then after having children and just to have an

878
00:51:59,560 --> 00:52:02,799
Speaker 1: eight week gold strapped to me right now, you know,

879
00:52:02,840 --> 00:52:05,960
Speaker 1: like after having babies, like every time I've had a kid,

880
00:52:06,000 --> 00:52:09,160
Speaker 1: like my body has changed, and like what my brain

881
00:52:09,400 --> 00:52:15,120
Speaker 1: is doing to process this new body, you know, is hard,

882
00:52:15,239 --> 00:52:18,560
Speaker 1: and like I'm you know, we use skills and I

883
00:52:18,600 --> 00:52:21,279
Speaker 1: talk about it, and I think being surrounded by it

884
00:52:21,320 --> 00:52:25,080
Speaker 1: is important because the more you're surrounded by the opposite message,

885
00:52:25,120 --> 00:52:26,879
Speaker 1: the more you're going to believe that. So the more

886
00:52:26,920 --> 00:52:32,160
Speaker 1: you surround yourself with these like fitness influencers and these

887
00:52:32,239 --> 00:52:36,400
Speaker 1: like god knows what kind of dieticians or like health

888
00:52:36,440 --> 00:52:39,080
Speaker 1: coaches and people that are The more you surround yourself

889
00:52:39,120 --> 00:52:40,399
Speaker 1: with that kind of stuff and the more your brain

890
00:52:40,400 --> 00:52:42,719
Speaker 1: and takes that message, the more you're going to think

891
00:52:42,760 --> 00:52:44,759
Speaker 1: it's true. The more you surround yourself with people who

892
00:52:44,760 --> 00:52:48,560
Speaker 1: are doing the actual work and showing up and caring

893
00:52:48,600 --> 00:52:51,200
Speaker 1: for the actual you, the more you're going to believe

894
00:52:51,239 --> 00:52:53,799
Speaker 1: that part. Right, What would you say to somebody who's like,

895
00:52:54,120 --> 00:52:57,960
Speaker 1: I don't want to to learn to love a body

896
00:52:58,000 --> 00:53:01,040
Speaker 1: if it doesn't look the way I wanted to look. Now,

897
00:53:01,600 --> 00:53:04,200
Speaker 1: I guess when I hear that, I think of, like, wow,

898
00:53:04,239 --> 00:53:08,120
Speaker 1: we really future trip too, like way down the road,

899
00:53:08,280 --> 00:53:11,359
Speaker 1: when like, let's just what about today, Like what can

900
00:53:11,400 --> 00:53:14,319
Speaker 1: we do today? Because what you and I have just

901
00:53:14,400 --> 00:53:17,520
Speaker 1: said was we've gotten our body image where it is

902
00:53:17,560 --> 00:53:23,760
Speaker 1: today over years, you know, and the idea of going

903
00:53:23,920 --> 00:53:29,440
Speaker 1: from like total hatred for our ourselves and our bodies

904
00:53:29,520 --> 00:53:35,080
Speaker 1: to self love like no, hell no, you know. And

905
00:53:35,160 --> 00:53:38,440
Speaker 1: so it's, yeah, that sounds like I don't want to

906
00:53:38,440 --> 00:53:40,439
Speaker 1: do that either. That sounds terrible like that I don't

907
00:53:40,440 --> 00:53:42,960
Speaker 1: want to be on that trip, you know, because and

908
00:53:43,520 --> 00:53:45,440
Speaker 1: I don't know if you have this in you, but

909
00:53:45,680 --> 00:53:50,040
Speaker 1: looking back, I would never have signed up for that.

910
00:53:50,840 --> 00:53:53,960
Speaker 1: But now it doesn't matter to me, Like the stuff

911
00:53:54,040 --> 00:53:57,600
Speaker 1: that mattered to me doesn't matter to me anymore because

912
00:53:57,640 --> 00:53:59,520
Speaker 1: of the work I've done in the relationships I've built.

913
00:54:00,160 --> 00:54:04,000
Speaker 1: I didn't have those five years ago, so it didn't

914
00:54:04,040 --> 00:54:07,400
Speaker 1: it couldn't register in my brain because I had not

915
00:54:07,520 --> 00:54:10,520
Speaker 1: experienced the fact that my body does not matter as

916
00:54:10,600 --> 00:54:13,160
Speaker 1: much as I think it does, if that makes sense.

917
00:54:13,360 --> 00:54:16,319
Speaker 1: So when you say, like, how about right now, let's

918
00:54:16,320 --> 00:54:19,080
Speaker 1: not go there? And who says we need to be there?

919
00:54:19,640 --> 00:54:22,200
Speaker 1: Who told you that that we have to do that

920
00:54:23,000 --> 00:54:27,399
Speaker 1: is there? Where did you read that society saying that?

921
00:54:28,280 --> 00:54:31,520
Speaker 1: Did a professional say that? Not? You know, and we've

922
00:54:31,520 --> 00:54:34,160
Speaker 1: talked about this, but not all professionals are created equal,

923
00:54:34,920 --> 00:54:38,279
Speaker 1: you know, they're just not, I mean, right like any

924
00:54:39,239 --> 00:54:43,799
Speaker 1: doctors nor you know, anybody is you know. But it's

925
00:54:43,840 --> 00:54:47,719
Speaker 1: about what is authentic for you. And right now, the

926
00:54:47,760 --> 00:54:52,080
Speaker 1: idea of you loving yourself doesn't feel authentic because to

927
00:54:52,280 --> 00:54:56,440
Speaker 1: goesier to sixty, that's just not realistic. So like, how

928
00:54:56,480 --> 00:55:01,000
Speaker 1: about today, knowing that we get one bo we can't

929
00:55:01,000 --> 00:55:04,319
Speaker 1: trade it up, So like, how can we maybe just

930
00:55:04,680 --> 00:55:08,600
Speaker 1: tolerate it right now or just acknowledge that it is

931
00:55:08,640 --> 00:55:12,080
Speaker 1: connected to us, and let's do something for it today. Yeah,

932
00:55:12,239 --> 00:55:15,840
Speaker 1: and that speaks to like the body positive movement is great,

933
00:55:16,320 --> 00:55:20,000
Speaker 1: but you don't have to be have body positivity. It's

934
00:55:20,040 --> 00:55:23,239
Speaker 1: also okay to maybe where you're going as neutral and

935
00:55:23,320 --> 00:55:28,399
Speaker 1: as long as it's not causing behaviors to harm it further. Right, Right,

936
00:55:28,440 --> 00:55:30,680
Speaker 1: when I say like do something nice, I mean like,

937
00:55:30,880 --> 00:55:35,040
Speaker 1: let's maybe have a meal, you know, let's maybe not

938
00:55:35,160 --> 00:55:39,279
Speaker 1: starve it. Let's maybe not self harm today. Like that's

939
00:55:39,280 --> 00:55:42,280
Speaker 1: all I'm asking. And it's the repetitive nature of doing

940
00:55:42,360 --> 00:55:48,359
Speaker 1: one kind of thing that's experiencing your body in a

941
00:55:48,360 --> 00:55:51,600
Speaker 1: new way today, I'm gonna experience it with a meal

942
00:55:52,320 --> 00:55:56,000
Speaker 1: and there and what does that feel like? And it

943
00:55:56,040 --> 00:55:59,680
Speaker 1: connects you And that's where that connection to mind and

944
00:55:59,719 --> 00:56:03,839
Speaker 1: body is where it all starts. But it's that's the

945
00:56:03,920 --> 00:56:08,800
Speaker 1: snake connecting to your body. Like that is me asking

946
00:56:08,920 --> 00:56:13,800
Speaker 1: you to stand in the same room as a poisonous

947
00:56:13,840 --> 00:56:17,480
Speaker 1: snake and not move. That's where we start. Or me

948
00:56:17,600 --> 00:56:19,600
Speaker 1: telling you in the parking lot, hey there's a copper

949
00:56:19,600 --> 00:56:22,000
Speaker 1: head in the in the house, you know, good luck,

950
00:56:23,840 --> 00:56:26,200
Speaker 1: just just walk in there. I'm not gonna tell you

951
00:56:26,200 --> 00:56:31,640
Speaker 1: where I'm not going in there. No, my god, that's

952
00:56:31,640 --> 00:56:34,520
Speaker 1: why I'm in the parking lot, you know. But yeah,

953
00:56:34,600 --> 00:56:37,840
Speaker 1: it's like that's tear. I know when I say and

954
00:56:37,840 --> 00:56:42,320
Speaker 1: when I'm asking someone to connect to their body by

955
00:56:42,520 --> 00:56:48,160
Speaker 1: eating something or getting in the shower with the lights on,

956
00:56:49,360 --> 00:56:53,080
Speaker 1: I know what I'm asking and it's not easy. And

957
00:56:53,120 --> 00:56:55,040
Speaker 1: that's why you don't say you have to do this

958
00:56:55,160 --> 00:56:58,440
Speaker 1: perfectly every day and I'm expecting you to change overnight.

959
00:56:58,520 --> 00:57:03,480
Speaker 1: It's like we're gonna try thing right. One thing, that's it.

960
00:57:03,920 --> 00:57:05,880
Speaker 1: It's like I couldn't get into the shower without the

961
00:57:05,960 --> 00:57:08,719
Speaker 1: lights on today, But did you think about it? I

962
00:57:08,760 --> 00:57:12,879
Speaker 1: did amazing because you never thought about it before, or

963
00:57:12,920 --> 00:57:16,000
Speaker 1: if you did, it was a hell no. But today

964
00:57:16,120 --> 00:57:20,160
Speaker 1: you you thought about it that I could do that,

965
00:57:20,640 --> 00:57:27,520
Speaker 1: but I'm not, and that's great progress, not perfection. Always

966
00:57:27,560 --> 00:57:30,200
Speaker 1: got you thinking. Okay, So Crystal and I actually have

967
00:57:30,280 --> 00:57:34,360
Speaker 1: to go do a call because we actually work together sometimes,

968
00:57:34,440 --> 00:57:37,200
Speaker 1: So we're going to wrap this episode up. We'll most

969
00:57:37,240 --> 00:57:41,439
Speaker 1: likely definitely have her back because she literally is next

970
00:57:41,480 --> 00:57:44,280
Speaker 1: to me every single day and we have so much

971
00:57:44,280 --> 00:57:46,640
Speaker 1: more we can cover on this. So I want to

972
00:57:46,680 --> 00:57:49,439
Speaker 1: say thank you, and if you guys have questions about

973
00:57:49,480 --> 00:57:52,120
Speaker 1: what we talked about or follow up, you can send

974
00:57:52,120 --> 00:57:56,880
Speaker 1: them into my Instagram. You Need Therapy Podcast. Thanks for

975
00:57:56,920 --> 00:57:58,920
Speaker 1: having me. You're welcome