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Speaker 1: Toe with Mando. All right, welcome to tonight. You're at
Speaker 1: the volume heavy Friday. Everybody.
Speaker 2: Hope all of you guys had a great We got
Speaker 2: a jam pack show for you tonight. We're gonna be
Speaker 2: starting with the Boston Celtics, who really beat up the
Speaker 2: Philadelphia seventy six ers last night. I want to zoom
Speaker 2: in on there versatility. After that, the Milwaukee Bucks came
Speaker 2: back from down thirteen in the fourth quarter to the
Speaker 2: LA Clippers last night. Kyle Kuzma was amazing on defense.
Speaker 2: Giannis looked incredible before sitting out the rest of the game.
Speaker 2: On his minutes restriction. We really want to dive into
Speaker 2: Kyle Kuzma in the force multiplier that he can be
Speaker 2: for that group. Then in our third segment, we're going
Speaker 2: to talk some Lakers who got a big win against
Speaker 2: the Blazers to get back on track. Last night, Lebron
Speaker 2: James drops forty points. I want to zoom in on
Speaker 2: the concept of their defense, the number one defense in
Speaker 2: the league since January fifteenth, a seventeen games sample. I
Speaker 2: want to just zoom into that and what it means
Speaker 2: for the Lakers and what it means specifically within the
Speaker 2: context of Luca. And then, lastly, like we always do
Speaker 2: on Fridays, our mail bag questions. Remember, if you guys
Speaker 2: want to get mailbag questions, drop them in our YouTube comments.
Speaker 2: Just put mail bag with the call in, write your
Speaker 2: question and we'll get to it on Fridays throughout the
Speaker 2: rest of the season. You guys have the Joe before
Speaker 2: we get started. Subscribe to the Hoops Tonight YouTube channel
Speaker 2: so you don't miss any more of our videos. Follow
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Speaker 2: We leave a rating and a review on that front.
Speaker 2: We also have brand new social media feeds, Twitter, Instagram,
Speaker 2: and Facebook. Make sure you guys follow us there for
Speaker 2: more content throughout the season. And last but not least,
Speaker 2: like I mentioned off the top, keep dropping mailback questions
Speaker 2: and those YouTube comments for our Friday mail bags throughout
Speaker 2: the rest of the year. All right, let's talk some basketball.
Speaker 2: So the Celtics beat the shit out of the Sixers
Speaker 2: last night, really controlled that one from start to finish.
Speaker 2: And the Sixers with MBD, with Maxi, with Paul George
Speaker 2: all healthy in the lineup, who continue to look extremely mediocre.
Speaker 2: We talked about that last week, so I'm not going
Speaker 2: to get into that today. But what fascinated me was
Speaker 2: the way that Boston dominated that game. This is a
Speaker 2: team that only averages thirty three ball screens per game.
Speaker 2: It's bottom ten in the league. Several reasons for that.
Speaker 2: Part of that is a lot of their perimeter players
Speaker 2: are similar size and style, so you'll see a lot
Speaker 2: of switching against the Boston Celtics. They also have pick
Speaker 2: and pop bigs in one of the easiest ways to
Speaker 2: confront a pick and pop, which is always open in
Speaker 2: a traditional coverage, is to switch. And the Celtics also,
Speaker 2: just in terms of their talent level, they're a team
Speaker 2: that has a lot of guys that can punish mismatches,
Speaker 2: so they're more or less a mismatch hunting type of offense.
Speaker 2: But last night they ran forty two ball screens against
Speaker 2: the Philadelphia seventy six ers, and I thought there was
Speaker 2: a very specific reason why Philly has a severe roster weakness,
Speaker 2: specifically at the center position in terms of footspeed, the
Speaker 2: ability to cover ground and change direction on the perimeter.
Speaker 2: Whether it's Embiid who's been brutally bad as of late
Speaker 2: on the perimeter, or Quashanyabuseli or Andre Drummond, whoever it is,
Speaker 2: they're just extremely slow.
Speaker 1: Footed at that position.
Speaker 2: So Boston specifically for that matchup, changed the way they
Speaker 2: played and start guarded spamming ball screens instead of hunting
Speaker 2: smaller perimeter players. And by the way, they had smaller
Speaker 2: players that they could attack. Right, there's Tyrese Maxey out
Speaker 2: there that you can consistently look to hunt. There are smaller,
Speaker 2: skinnier players, but they just went the route of trying
Speaker 2: to hunt the Philly Bigs in space, and it was
Speaker 2: barbecue chicken over and over and over again. Embiid would
Speaker 2: either be way too far back in his drop coverage.
Speaker 2: That's a weird thing with Embiid, Like I don't know
Speaker 2: if it's like a Nick Nurse mixing up coverages thing,
Speaker 2: or if he just decides possession by possession, whether or
Speaker 2: not he feels like getting up to the level. But
Speaker 2: sometimes he's way far back in a drop and guys
Speaker 2: are hitting pull of jumpers over the top. Sometimes he's
Speaker 2: running up to the level, but they'll just pop Horford
Speaker 2: to poor Zingis out to the three point line, or
Speaker 2: they'll just attack Joel Embiid in space or a big
Speaker 2: one Inbiad's been really struggling with is rejected screens.
Speaker 1: Where like guys will get ready to go.
Speaker 2: Off a bass and Embiid will over commit to one
Speaker 2: side of the screen and so then when the ball
Speaker 2: handler crosses back over away from the screen, it's just
Speaker 2: all this daylight going downhill.
Speaker 1: In the first half, when the.
Speaker 2: Celtics scored seventy two points, they got one point five
Speaker 2: to five points per ball screen.
Speaker 1: That's insane.
Speaker 2: In twenty two reps in the first half over one
Speaker 2: and a half points per possession, including passes in ball screens.
Speaker 2: Just an insane level of efficiency, and the Sixers really
Speaker 2: got ran off the floor. And it got me thinking
Speaker 2: about this concept of versatility. In order to win the title,
Speaker 2: you have to win four completely different playoff series against
Speaker 2: four completely different teams, right, Like you might face a
Speaker 2: dominant rim protector and more of a traditional scheme in
Speaker 2: one round. Think about a team like Milwaukee. Milwaukee's gonna
Speaker 2: present a challenge We're going to talk about them later,
Speaker 2: where they got Giannis and Kyle Kuzma flying around in
Speaker 2: helpside and Brooks just sitting under the rim waiting for everybody.
Speaker 2: It's a specific type of challenge, right, But then you
Speaker 2: might face a team that does a lot more switching
Speaker 2: in a different round. Think about a team like the
Speaker 2: Miami Heat, who with all of their big, rangy athletes,
Speaker 2: especially now that Wigans is in the picture, they can
Speaker 2: switch a lot of action. Dam Adebayo one of the
Speaker 2: best bigs in the league at switching ball screens right.
Speaker 2: Cleveland this year has done a lot of switching because
Speaker 2: Jared Allen can guard on the perimeter. Evan Mobley can
Speaker 2: guard on the perimeter. It's a very different type of
Speaker 2: challenge going against the Cleveland Cavaliers right, and then on
Speaker 2: the other end of the floor, like the East has
Speaker 2: a lot of elite guards right, guys like Jalen Brunson,
Speaker 2: Damian Lillard, Donovan Mitchell, and Darius Garland with the Calves.
Speaker 2: But then you'll also face these teams that have more
Speaker 2: dynamic like big wings right teams like the Pistons with
Speaker 2: Kay Cunningham or Jannison Tenakumpo, who was just bludgeoning the
Speaker 2: Clippers last night, or Pascal si Yakum, who's been one
Speaker 2: of the more efficient matchup attackers in the league this year.
Speaker 2: Pala Bancaro when he's healthy and in rhythm, Franz Wagner
Speaker 2: when he's healthy in rhythm. Even looking at the center position, again,
Speaker 2: the Sixers aren't a threat this year, but on any
Speaker 2: given season, you could run into an issue where it's like, oh,
Speaker 2: what if you have to face some combination of one
Speaker 2: or two of Jokic, Anthony Davis or Joe el Embiid right, Alprin, Shanegon,
Speaker 2: the Victor wembin Yama types of the league I say types,
Speaker 2: he's the one and only of his kind.
Speaker 1: But you get the point.
Speaker 2: These like big unicorn bigs that can cause problems.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: You might face speed in one round and size in
Speaker 2: the next. A team that tests your ability to defensive
Speaker 2: rebound like the Detroit Pistons, are a team that tries
Speaker 2: to run you off the floor in transition, like the
Speaker 2: Indiana Pacers.
Speaker 1: Contrary to what Draymond Green.
Speaker 2: Says and so many of our former NBA players that
Speaker 2: are content to shit on the league, there are a
Speaker 2: bunch of teams in the NBA who play different styles.
Speaker 2: There's a lot of uniqueness as you go from team
Speaker 2: to team around the league. The ability to survive those
Speaker 2: wild shifts in style from round to round is a
Speaker 2: big part of what makes an NBA champion. Sometimes you're
Speaker 2: just so strong with your base setup that no team's
Speaker 2: able to match it. That happens from time to time.
Speaker 2: The team I look at as an example of that
Speaker 2: is the Denver Nuggets in twenty twenty three. They had
Speaker 2: slight variations, right. They would have stretches of games or
Speaker 2: specific matchups where they'd bring Jokic up to the level,
Speaker 2: and then they'd have other matchups where they'd sit Jokic
Speaker 2: deeper in a drop and offer less low man help
Speaker 2: from Aaron Gordon. But for the most part, it was
Speaker 2: traditional coverages and on offense, they just run the same
Speaker 2: thing just about every single time. There were some differences,
Speaker 2: like the Miami Heat series, it's like, oh, we're gonna
Speaker 2: spam Aaron Gordon post ups, right, Like, there are a
Speaker 2: handful of different things that they would do differently, but
Speaker 2: that team it was more like just we have this
Speaker 2: completely unsolvable problem that is Nikola Jokic, and good luck
Speaker 2: solving it. But there are different types of champions over
Speaker 2: the year where it comes down more to versatility, the
Speaker 2: Bucks being able to play Giannis at center or at
Speaker 2: the four, the Lakers being able to play Anthony Davis
Speaker 2: at center or at the four. Teams playing through heavy
Speaker 2: ballscreen attack one night, switching towards more of a post
Speaker 2: up style attack a different night. There's a lot of
Speaker 2: versatility in the champions as we look back through NBA history,
Speaker 2: and that's what I like about this Celtics team. There
Speaker 2: are a lot of teams out there that struggle against
Speaker 2: switching defenses, but that will thrive against traditional ball screen coverages.
Speaker 1: We're gonna talk Lakers later.
Speaker 2: Luca will help them with their switching, but Lebron and
Speaker 2: Austin have a vulnerability to ball pressure and switching. But
Speaker 2: then you look at them in the first half against Portland,
Speaker 2: when Donovan Klingen and Robert Williams are sitting in drop
Speaker 2: coverages all game, Lebron and Austin are picking them apart
Speaker 2: right like they thrive on baked in dribble penetration. But
Speaker 2: when you force them to do it over and over
Speaker 2: and over again against the set defender in front, they
Speaker 2: can have some problems. Right, the Celtics are very well
Speaker 2: equipped to handle both. They have a reputation for being
Speaker 2: one of the best switch attacking defenses in the offenses
Speaker 2: in the league, not just because Jason Tatum can attack
Speaker 2: smaller players, not just because Jalen Brown can attack smaller players,
Speaker 2: not just because they can pick on bigs in space,
Speaker 2: but also because of their spacing, also because of their
Speaker 2: ability to use seals like you'll see Jason Tatum screen
Speaker 2: for Derek White, but screen the backside of the defender
Speaker 2: and create that little passing angle over the top and
Speaker 2: Derek White floats it to him. Suddenly you have a
Speaker 2: four on three. They do a lot of work attacking
Speaker 2: switching successfully. But then, as we saw last night, you
Speaker 2: go up against a drop coverage team, a team that's
Speaker 2: running a lot more traditional coverage is either the big
Speaker 2: at the level or sitting back in a drop in
Speaker 2: that sort of situation, if you don't score the basketball
Speaker 2: in those ball screens, if you don't score the basketball
Speaker 2: with the big popping, then you allow Embiid to park
Speaker 2: his ass underneath the basket. And when Embiid has parked
Speaker 2: underneath the basket, he can be a problem. And there
Speaker 2: are a lot of teams that struggle against those kinds
Speaker 2: of coverages.
Speaker 1: Right. The Celtics literally just.
Speaker 2: Change the way they play and annihilated the Sixers, picking
Speaker 2: on their bigs in those traditional coverages.
Speaker 1: There are a lot.
Speaker 2: Of teams out there have a base defensive scheme that works,
Speaker 2: but it doesn't work against other teams.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: Famous example of this is the Jazz in twenty twenty one.
Speaker 2: You could sit Rudy Gobaar underneath the basket. Everything's great,
Speaker 2: you start spacing them out with five out spacing. Suddenly
Speaker 2: it's like ooh, like Donovan Mitchell struggling to guard the ball,
Speaker 2: Mike Conley's struggling to guard the ball, boy on mcdonovitch
Speaker 2: is struggling to guard the ball, and Go Bear's not.
Speaker 1: There to clean things up.
Speaker 2: And a Clippers team just without Kawhi Leonard just completely
Speaker 2: picks apart a Utah Jazz defense that dominant throughout the
Speaker 2: entire regular season. I'm a little worried about that with
Speaker 2: the Lakers this year. We're gonna talk about it in
Speaker 2: a little bit. I'm concerned about them being able to
Speaker 2: handle certain matchups with their defense, even though their base
Speaker 2: scheme has been defending well and I expect to continue
Speaker 2: to defend well. Right, how do you have defensive versatility?
Speaker 1: Well?
Speaker 2: Can you match teams with size? Yeah, the Celtics can.
Speaker 2: They can play two big looks with Horford and Porzingis
Speaker 2: on the floor. Can the Celtics go small and switch everything.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: They had looks last year with Horford at center where
Speaker 2: they did a lot of damage to teams just by
Speaker 2: doing a lot of switching. They have bigs that can
Speaker 2: guard on the perimeter. They have perimeter players that can
Speaker 2: guard bigs. That was the big thing that unlocked the
Speaker 2: Celtics defensive scheme in the postseason last year was We're
Speaker 2: gonna put Jason Tatum on the opponent's center, and we're
Speaker 2: gonna put Jalen Brown on the opponent's best perimeter player,
Speaker 2: and we're just gonna switch ball screens. And now all
Speaker 2: of a sudden, your pick and roll attack doesn't work.
Speaker 2: And oh, by the way, where's porzingis at. He's guarding
Speaker 2: your weakest above the break three point shooter and just
Speaker 2: waiting for everybody at the rim, just making a complete
Speaker 2: mess of things. That's the versatility that Boston has on
Speaker 2: the defensive end of the floor. Drew Holliday, you spent
Speaker 2: a bunch of time guarding Joel Embiid last night.
Speaker 1: One of my.
Speaker 2: Biggest issues with the way that the game of basketball
Speaker 2: is analyzed around the league is we hyper focus on
Speaker 2: what a team's net rating is, or how good their
Speaker 2: offense is in a large sample, or how good their
Speaker 2: defense is in a large sample. And I don't want
Speaker 2: to sit here and pretend like there aren't value in
Speaker 2: those things. There are, and I think they're important in
Speaker 2: terms of indicators of a team's level of commitment on
Speaker 2: the night and night out process of the regular season.
Speaker 2: If you're serious basketball team. You need to be winning
Speaker 2: your games by a lot of points, and it needs
Speaker 2: to manifest in something like net rating, right, Like, if
Speaker 2: you're not dominating in those areas, then you're probably just
Speaker 2: not sharp enough in general to get where you want
Speaker 2: to go. But once you get into a playoff series,
Speaker 2: those metrics don't mean shit. It becomes can you score
Speaker 2: against this particular team? Can you get stops against this
Speaker 2: particular team. I was watching Giannis last night. He was
Speaker 2: showcasing this like ridiculous spin move, we're going to talk
Speaker 2: about it here in a little bit, and like two
Speaker 2: to one, like fadeaways over the top. Was just bludgeoning
Speaker 2: the Clippers in the paint in that early fourth quarter stretch,
Speaker 2: which really sparked the run. And it doesn't really matter
Speaker 2: how good your defense is if you can't guard Giannis.
Speaker 2: That's what I'm concerned about with the Lakers with the Nuggets,
Speaker 2: right it doesn't really matter if they're switching scheme, can
Speaker 2: bend but not break and get a lot of stops,
Speaker 2: if like Nikole Jokic can just get a layup every
Speaker 2: single time he wants. That's why we have to look
Speaker 2: at this deeper than just reading net ratings and reading
Speaker 2: the standings to tell us who the best playoff threats are.
Speaker 2: The Celtics have great metrics too, top five in both
Speaker 2: offense and defense. Right now, they're sixth in defensive rebounding.
Speaker 2: But they also have the ability to shape shift from
Speaker 2: matchup to matchup, and that's what makes them such a
Speaker 2: difficult team to contend with. Thought, it's really interesting the
Speaker 2: way they just spam ball screens to beat the Sixers
Speaker 2: last night, when that's not really their play style on
Speaker 2: most nights.
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Speaker 2: on a Clippers Bucks. So the Bucks were trailing at
Speaker 2: thirteen in the early fourth quarter and Yannis just completely
Speaker 2: takes over the game. They try to get some stops
Speaker 2: by running a two three zone with Jericho Simms in
Speaker 2: the middle of the floor, and Clippers got a couple
Speaker 2: of buckets out it, but it didn't a nice job
Speaker 2: of just kind of stagnating and changing the flow of
Speaker 2: the game. And on the other end of the floor,
Speaker 2: Giannis was just torching Ben Simmons, torching Nicholas Patom just
Speaker 2: he was using his spin move over and over again
Speaker 2: last night disguised it really well too. He had a
Speaker 2: fun one against Nick Patom where he catches the ball
Speaker 2: on the left kind of like elbow extended area there
Speaker 2: in the middle of the of that left side of
Speaker 2: the floor, and he's facing up in the Clippers are
Speaker 2: basically zoned up on him, so they're in both driving lanes.
Speaker 2: Kawhi Leonards kind of doing the little defensive three second
Speaker 2: dance where he's hopping in and out of the key
Speaker 2: trying to make sure that he's ready to rotate. They're
Speaker 2: rotating on the high side and Giannis just kind of
Speaker 2: waits for as second to kind of read the floor,
Speaker 2: and then he does a beautiful job of disguising a
Speaker 2: post up, making it look like he was about to
Speaker 2: go kind of into a traditional slowdown post up where
Speaker 2: he turns his back into that high hesitation dribble and
Speaker 2: then just immediately spun off of it, like disguised it
Speaker 2: like he was.
Speaker 1: Going to go for a slow, methodical post up and.
Speaker 2: Then just immediately spun off of it, went right around
Speaker 2: Nick patom Kawhi had no chance, he was not even
Speaker 2: close to being there in time. He's right at the basket.
Speaker 2: It just reminds everybody that, like when you're dealing with
Speaker 2: one of those true upper tier guys. This is one
Speaker 2: of the reasons why I've been excited about Luka Doncic
Speaker 2: when it comes to the Lakers. Right there are a
Speaker 2: handful of guys in the league, Nikola Jokic, Shay Gildess,
Speaker 2: Alexander Jannis, and Tennekumpo, Luka Doncic. I think Jason Tatum
Speaker 2: has kind of entered into this group where it's like
Speaker 2: there's really nothing you can do. There's no player that
Speaker 2: stops them, there's no scheme that stops them. They are
Speaker 2: world beaters, and when you have one of those guys,
Speaker 2: you present a problem to the opponent that becomes.
Speaker 1: Very difficult to solve.
Speaker 2: So one of the big things that we've underrated when
Speaker 2: we've talked about the Bucks Andry years, where we think
Speaker 2: about them as a broken roster. And look, here's the thing.
Speaker 2: They're not the best roster in the league. We all
Speaker 2: know that, but there's an important context to their last
Speaker 2: two playoff exits. Yiannis didn't play. When Yannis played, even
Speaker 2: on a limited Bucks roster in twenty twenty two because
Speaker 2: of the Chris Middleton injury, it was just Drew Holliday,
Speaker 2: a bunch of role players in Giannis, and he still
Speaker 2: pushed the Celtics to seven games because guess what, when
Speaker 2: you get into a playoff series, it's over and over
Speaker 2: and over and over again that he's coming downhill at you.
Speaker 2: And I remember early in that series it's like Horford
Speaker 2: would wall him up, you know, like you'd you'd have
Speaker 2: guys sliding their feet and absorbing contact. Grant Williams played
Speaker 2: some good minutes on Giannis in that series, but then
Speaker 2: what happened after, like the tenth, fifteenth, twentieth, twenty fifth
Speaker 2: time that he comes at you, he starts to just
Speaker 2: get through you, and there's literally nothing you can do
Speaker 2: about it. And he pushed that series to seven games
Speaker 2: when it had no business going to seven games. And
Speaker 2: that's where the optimism comes.
Speaker 1: That's what.
Speaker 2: Have the Bucks looked mediocre at times this year? Yeah,
Speaker 2: you shouldn't write off Jannis. Have the Nuggets looked mediocre
Speaker 2: at times at times this year? Yeah, you shouldn't right
Speaker 2: off Jokic. Have the Lakers looked like they have some
Speaker 2: obvious roster flaws with their new build, especially at the
Speaker 2: center position. Yeah, but you probably shouldn't write off Luka,
Speaker 2: Doncic and Lebron James playing the way that he's playing.
Speaker 2: And as I was watching that last night, it just
Speaker 2: goes to show you, like Giannis is kind of flying
Speaker 2: under the radar this year because of all the excitement
Speaker 2: around Shay, all the excitement around Jokic, He's still one
Speaker 2: of those guys, one of those guys that presents a
Speaker 2: truly unsolvable problem for opponents. When Yanna sat out of
Speaker 2: the game, though something really interesting happened, he kind of
Speaker 2: goes out of the game in that mid fourth quarter
Speaker 2: stretch on a minute's restriction, obviously coming back from his injury,
Speaker 2: and the Bucks won the game with defense and everybody
Speaker 2: was guarded. Dame had a really nice steal where they
Speaker 2: were running a ball screen with Zubach and Harden, and
Speaker 2: Harden threw a bounce pass to Zubatch on the roll
Speaker 2: and Dame dug down off of a mere coffee and
Speaker 2: got a steal that ended up leading to a runout
Speaker 2: and one for Kyle Kuzma. Brook Lopez blocked Kawhi at
Speaker 2: the rim because Kuzma flattened out the drive. I talk
Speaker 2: a lot about flattening out drives. When you flatten out drives,
Speaker 2: it gives your helpers more time to rotate, and when
Speaker 2: Brook has time to kind of read things on the
Speaker 2: back line, he can be devastating there. He had another
Speaker 2: block on another sweeping drive across the middle of the florid.
Speaker 1: He had three blocks in the fourth quarter.
Speaker 2: Kyle Kuzma took a charge, tagging if he can Zubatch
Speaker 2: on a roll they were guarding aj Green, Stonewall, Kawhi
Speaker 2: Leonard a few times. Kyle Kuzma had multiple stops on
Speaker 2: the ball against Kawhi Leonard and James Harden either them
Speaker 2: into bad shots. He forced James Harden into a three
Speaker 2: out of the right corner that was like a foot
Speaker 2: and a half over the back of the rim. He's
Speaker 2: stonewalled Kawhi Leonard into passing the basketball because he's got
Speaker 2: the length to bother that pull up jump shot. Kusma
Speaker 2: looks like a Swiss army knife. I've seen him take charges.
Speaker 2: I've seen him battle embiad in the post, in front
Speaker 2: the posts. I've seen him guard guards. I've seen him
Speaker 2: guard wings. He's grabbing its on a defensive rebounds. He
Speaker 2: is a force multiplier for this defense. And I was
Speaker 2: especially excited to see him in the context of playing
Speaker 2: alongside Giannis, because again, that's what makes this work when
Speaker 2: you're talking about when you're talking about traditional switching schemes,
Speaker 2: it becomes about how many good defenders do you have
Speaker 2: on the floor.
Speaker 1: But when it comes to these more.
Speaker 2: Traditional pick and roll schemes where you have Brooke waiting
Speaker 2: at the basket, where you have Brooke coming up to
Speaker 2: the level, sometimes it becomes more off ball defense. It
Speaker 2: becomes more about how athletic are you on the back line,
Speaker 2: how well can you protect the rim and disrupt things
Speaker 2: when the ball gets past brook Lopez against types of
Speaker 2: players that are gonna pull him out to the level
Speaker 2: and like, yes, Chris Middleton brought a lot of ball
Speaker 2: handling to this team, which, by the way, like Kyle
Speaker 2: Kuzma's done some of that. He had a big one
Speaker 2: of the biggest clutch plays in this game.
Speaker 1: It's one four, one oh four.
Speaker 2: Kuzma attacks downhill with the ball, forces Zubats to switch
Speaker 2: on him, swings a skip Passatorian Prince Amir Coffee ends
Speaker 2: up switched on brook Lopez because Kyle Kuzma got downhill
Speaker 2: so hard he forced Zubats to switch. Got brook a
Speaker 2: one on one in the post against a mere Coffee.
Speaker 2: He just bullied him right under the basket for an
Speaker 2: and one. They ended up leading the rest of the
Speaker 2: game from that point. You know, I'd already loved the
Speaker 2: early returns from the Kyle Kuzma trade. He made it
Speaker 2: immediately clear within the first few games that he was
Speaker 2: playing on playing winning basketball. Now, adding Gianis to this
Speaker 2: mix gives this team crazy potential and I have my
Speaker 2: eye on them as a team that could potentially jump
Speaker 2: considerably higher up my contender rankings after I see them
Speaker 2: with Giannis and Cuz together more. It's a physicality thing.
Speaker 2: It's a size thing. It's a protecting the rim and
Speaker 2: rebounding thing. It's a maybe you just can't handle Jannis
Speaker 2: on Tanacumpo on the other end of the floor kind
Speaker 2: of thing that makes me so excited about them in
Speaker 2: the big picture. And then Dame, I mean like Dame,
Speaker 2: we Dame when he was in the first round last
Speaker 2: year with Chris Middleton had to carry such a massive
Speaker 2: offensive load within the context of this sort of build.
Speaker 2: When they get to the postseason, when Giannis is playing
Speaker 2: the way he's playing, when you have this type of defense,
Speaker 2: Dame is a really dangerous second option. Has this remarkable
Speaker 2: ability to get to the foul line on three point shots.
Speaker 2: He drew two fouls on three point shots in the
Speaker 2: fourth quarter, hit another big step back three off the
Speaker 2: left wing, just manufacturing points. That is another force multiplier
Speaker 2: within the context of what this team is capable of
Speaker 2: on the offensive end of the floor. All Right, moving
Speaker 2: on the Lakers Blazers. This game looks so similar to
Speaker 2: me to the set of games that we saw between
Speaker 2: when Ad got hurt in the Sixers game and when
Speaker 2: Luca joined the team, think about like that when they
Speaker 2: beat the Knicks, like in the Clippers, in that kind
Speaker 2: of phase of the of the season. The Lakers defense
Speaker 2: has just been so good lately. Again, they're number one
Speaker 2: in the entire NBA in defensive ratings since January fifteenth.
Speaker 2: That's a seventeen game sample, or roughly twenty one percent
Speaker 2: of the season. Oh well, Anthony Davis was in there
Speaker 2: for some of those games. You're right, he was in
Speaker 2: there for seven of those games. In the ten games
Speaker 2: since they are second in defensive rating. Now, we'll get
Speaker 2: deeper into what that means later, because like, do I
Speaker 2: think they're a top tier defense in this league. No,
Speaker 2: But the point is they are guarding to the effect
Speaker 2: that they're guarding better than everyone in the NBA.
Speaker 1: Over the course of the last six weeks.
Speaker 2: Or so, they've just done a much much better job
Speaker 2: of executing JJ Redicks one through five switching scheme. We'll
Speaker 2: talk about that when we get into their defense. And
Speaker 2: then on offense, Lebron and Austin have just been in
Speaker 2: such a great group. There have been clunky moments, especially
Speaker 2: as Luca has been in the picture. And they're trying
Speaker 2: to work that new partnership out. But Lebron in this
Speaker 2: thirteen and four stretch twenty seven points, eight rebounds, nine
Speaker 2: assists on sixty three percent true shooting. That is MVP
Speaker 2: level production from a forty year old in a winning
Speaker 2: context with massive games against good teams. Austin reeves in
Speaker 2: this thirteen and four stretch twenty one points, four rebounds,
Speaker 2: seven assists, sixty three percent true shooting. That's insane. Forty
Speaker 2: eight points, twelve rebounds and sixteen assists on sixty three
Speaker 2: percent true shooting from Lebron and Austin over this seventeen
Speaker 2: game span, this game kind of had an interesting flow,
Speaker 2: and that's how it also kind of mimicked some of
Speaker 2: these other games recently when AD's been out but Luca's
Speaker 2: also been out, where like they start the game, there's
Speaker 2: a lot of ball pressure. That's like the book on
Speaker 2: the Lakers. You want a ball pressure Austin and Lebron
Speaker 2: and try to wear them out. That's, by the way,
Speaker 2: one of the big reasons why I think Luca is
Speaker 2: so important to this team. He is impervious to that
Speaker 2: sort of thing. But in the early part of this game,
Speaker 2: it's a lot of ball pressure. But the Blazers were
Speaker 2: running a lot of drop coverage with Donovan Klingon and
Speaker 2: Robert Williams, where they're either they're coming up but they're
Speaker 2: not that high up at the level, but they're sitting
Speaker 2: back waiting for the ball handler coming off of the screen,
Speaker 2: and Lebron and Austin just absolutely torched it getting all the.
Speaker 1: Way to the rim.
Speaker 2: Lebron in particular, had some really impressive finishes in traffic
Speaker 2: through Klingon. Lebron, by the way, in this seventeen game span,
Speaker 2: is shooting eighty two percent in the restricted area, So
Speaker 2: how's that for the old man. He's one of only
Speaker 2: six players in the league in that span that's making
Speaker 2: at least three point five shots in the restricted area
Speaker 2: on at least eighty percent, and it's all centers. And
Speaker 2: then Lebron the short to mid range shot making. Both
Speaker 2: Austin and Lebron were great with that. And then again,
Speaker 2: when you show a willingness to either attack downhill or
Speaker 2: to score and pick and roll, something happens with the
Speaker 2: screen defender.
Speaker 1: The ball.
Speaker 2: Screen defender starts to engage the ball handler more as
Speaker 2: soon as you start to engage the ball handler more.
Speaker 2: That's when the roleman gets open. Jackson As and Trey
Speaker 2: Jamison at fifteen points in this game, a lot of
Speaker 2: spoon fed baskets right around the rim off of action
Speaker 2: that Austin and Lebron were running. But again, every team
Speaker 2: has a game plan for the Lakers. Lots of ball pressure,
Speaker 2: you wear them down, and then usually over the course
Speaker 2: of the game there's more switching and then more aggressive
Speaker 2: ball coverages where the bigs coming up to the level.
Speaker 2: And what ends up happening is Lebron and Austin start
Speaker 2: to get tired, and when they get tired, they get sloppy,
Speaker 2: particularly as passers. Those two guys finished with seventeen turnovers.
Speaker 2: The team finished with a season twenty four turnovers, and
Speaker 2: so many of them were like pick sixes. And this
Speaker 2: is the weird part about that game. Lebron and Austin
Speaker 2: were brilliant, but they both undercut a lot of their
Speaker 2: success with these really sloppy turnovers that literally led to
Speaker 2: run out layups and dunks. Again, they had thirty one
Speaker 2: points off of turnovers in this game. The Blazers did
Speaker 2: Denny Avdia in particular, it was amazing in this game,
Speaker 2: did a ton of damage in those like kind of
Speaker 2: runout like six pick six type of types of sequences,
Speaker 2: but that allowed the Blazers to kind of slowly and
Speaker 2: methodically work their way back into the game. But Lebron James,
Speaker 2: once again, just like he did against the Hornets the
Speaker 2: night before, goes absolutely bizarre in the early fourth quarter
Speaker 2: shift hitting threes against Jeremy Grant, who was going underneath picks,
Speaker 2: and Lebron's just shooting the ball too well these days
Speaker 2: for you to go under picks. He made Jeremy Grant
Speaker 2: pay with two threes that way, hit another one of
Speaker 2: those drop covered shots against Donovan Klingen like god Jeremy
Speaker 2: Grant in jail, and then hit like a little like
Speaker 2: twelve along the left lane line. He hit this crazy
Speaker 2: driving floater onto Monty Camarrow was a really impressive defensive
Speaker 2: player all season, but was doing a lot of damage
Speaker 2: to the Lakers last night. Hit this driving floater on
Speaker 2: to moniy Amara. All of a sudden, the Lakers are
Speaker 2: up by nine, But then the rest of the way
Speaker 2: the Blazers just double team Lebron and there were a
Speaker 2: couple more ugly turnovers, a couple more runouts and kept
Speaker 2: things kind of close. But when you double team Lebron,
Speaker 2: he's just gonna pick you apart. They got good looks
Speaker 2: down the stretch. Austin Reeves hit a big three on
Speaker 2: the right wing off of a Lebron double that more
Speaker 2: or less kind of like ice to the game, so
Speaker 2: to speak. And then Austin Reeves a couple of big stops,
Speaker 2: got to stop on Scoot Henderson driving off of the
Speaker 2: left wing. Got another stop in the post against Jeremy Grant.
Speaker 2: I've been telling everybody forever, like Austin will have his
Speaker 2: bad games where he looks bad on defense, especially like
Speaker 2: random regular season games against mediocre teams. But when len
Speaker 2: when Austin needs to guard, he guards. Austin slides his feet,
Speaker 2: he absorbs contact. He's excellent at attacking the basketball. Both
Speaker 2: of those stops against Scoot Henderson and Jeremy Grant just
Speaker 2: attacked the basketball. He got screw Henderson up high, he
Speaker 2: got Jeremy Grant down low. Austin can guard, and he
Speaker 2: got a couple of huge stops down the stretch of
Speaker 2: that game. Before we get into the Lakers defense, I
Speaker 2: just want to shout out a couple of Blazers. I
Speaker 2: was really impressed with Smani Kamara. Again, he is just
Speaker 2: a really unique combination of like size and strength but
Speaker 2: also long arms in lots of mobility.
Speaker 1: Latterly he had five steals in this game.
Speaker 2: Was causing a lot of problems Danny Avdia not just
Speaker 2: the transition runouts off of steels, but he brings a
Speaker 2: good amount of downhill force. He had this off foot
Speaker 2: dunk against Lebron, driving a close out off the top
Speaker 2: of the key where he literally made Lebron look like
Speaker 2: he was stuck in the mud. And Lebron's been guarding
Speaker 2: for a couple of months now, it's not as easy
Speaker 2: to do as you might think, and he just he
Speaker 2: counters that downhill force with a nice jump shot. It
Speaker 2: can be someone in consistent. He's better off the dribble
Speaker 2: than he is off the catch. That means he's kind
Speaker 2: of like a rhythm player. Makes me think like in
Speaker 2: the big picture, he's kind of more of a second
Speaker 2: side creator, a guy who should run more action. Robert Williams,
Speaker 2: his length and mobility was a problem all night. They
Speaker 2: had two blocks and two steals. The Blazers are fun.
Speaker 2: They have a nice group of useful role players. It's
Speaker 2: just Anthony Simons and Jeremy Grant leave a lot to
Speaker 2: be desired as ball handlers. They would four for twenty
Speaker 2: five from the field and that's just really hard to
Speaker 2: overcome for anybody. But I want to focus on the
Speaker 2: Lakers defense for a bit again. They're number one in
Speaker 2: defensive ratings since January fifteenth, a large chunk of the
Speaker 2: season here where they've been playing great defense. They've really
Speaker 2: settled into a base scheme that works for them. They
Speaker 2: either switch everything or switch almost everything depending on the matchup.
Speaker 2: So like last night, for instance, they're not worried about
Speaker 2: getting picked apart in ball screens by Portland. Their ball
Speaker 2: handlers aren't good enough at scoring or playmaking to do that,
Speaker 2: so they had Dorianfhinney Smith some of their perimterive players
Speaker 2: gave Vincent chasing over the top of screens while clinging
Speaker 2: in Robert Williams role, and it allowed them to make
Speaker 2: stay attached to their pull up shooters in bait Shade
Speaker 2: and Sharp and bait Anfernie Simon's into these like tough
Speaker 2: rear view contested pull up threes coming off of screens,
Speaker 2: and it worked. It baited them into a bunch of them.
Speaker 2: They took seventeen pull up jumpers last night, made six
Speaker 2: of them. But then you'll see in other matchups where
Speaker 2: they're more concerned about ball screens, they'll switch with their
Speaker 2: fives as well. And then they do they switch everything
Speaker 2: when they go to their small ball groups right when
Speaker 2: there's no center on the floor. But their switching scheme
Speaker 2: has worked so so much better in the last couple
Speaker 2: of months because the Lakers are actually doing the things
Speaker 2: that they need to do to make that scheme work.
Speaker 2: To JJ's credit, even when those guys weren't executing it,
Speaker 2: he stuck with it. He believed in it, and now
Speaker 2: he's reaping the rewards. We've talked about this on the
Speaker 2: show before, but there are several key things that you
Speaker 2: need to do in order for a switching scheme to work. First,
Speaker 2: you need your off ball defenders to be prepared to
Speaker 2: jump out immediately when there is a screen to avoid
Speaker 2: that interchange gap. We talked about that yesterday with Miles Bridges.
Speaker 2: You got to switch right away. You can have a
Speaker 2: gap between the switch because that's when a decent player
Speaker 2: can rise up and knock down a jump shot. There's
Speaker 2: an example early in the game where you can see
Speaker 2: there's a couple of Portland screeners up at the top
Speaker 2: of the key. The Lakers players are glued up on
Speaker 2: the backside ready to jump out whenever that screen comes,
Speaker 2: so that that interchange gap isn't there. Secondly, you need
Speaker 2: your weaker defenders to battle. If you're switching, they're gonna go, Hey,
Speaker 2: let's attack Austin Reeves. Hey, let's attack Luka doncich Austin.
Speaker 2: You got to compete in those situations. Austin last night
Speaker 2: huge stops down the stretch against Scoot Henderson against Jeremy Grant. Third,
Speaker 2: you need to shrink the floor around them by gapping
Speaker 2: driving lanes. You'll see possessions where the Lakers have two
Speaker 2: guys on either side of the ball arms out in
Speaker 2: the driving lane close enough where they feel like they
Speaker 2: can close out, shrinking the floor. The Scoot Henderson drive
Speaker 2: against Austin Reeves, if you look, there's a Laker on
Speaker 2: either side of Austin in the gap, making it like
Speaker 2: a narrow lane for Scoot Henderson to try to drive through,
Speaker 2: and so he doesn't really try to go around Austin.
Speaker 2: He tries to go through Austin, and Austin takes one
Speaker 2: good slide to the left, absorbs that contact and attacks
Speaker 2: the basketball and ties Scoot Henderson up. If you don't
Speaker 2: have those gaps there, excuse me. If you don't have
Speaker 2: those defenders gapping there and they're out of the way,
Speaker 2: you have a wider lane. That is what allows Scoot
Speaker 2: Henderson to really get to mixing Austin up. And once
Speaker 2: he starts mixing Austin up, that's where he has more
Speaker 2: of a speed advantage that he can take advantage of.
Speaker 2: Right fourth, you need to have a plan for dribble penetration.
Speaker 2: Which way if I'm gonna get beat off the dribble,
Speaker 2: which way do I want to funnel the guy where
Speaker 2: I have more help.
Speaker 1: There's a big.
Speaker 2: Stop late in this game that Lebron James had on
Speaker 2: Anthony Simon's And here's the thing. Simon's is faster than Lebron,
Speaker 2: especially at age forty right, So like Lebron is probably
Speaker 2: going to give up at least some dribble penetration on
Speaker 2: that play. Now, his job again is to flatten out
Speaker 2: the drive, and he did. But watch that play, Lebron,
Speaker 2: he knows Ruy Hatchramura is gapping from the left side
Speaker 2: off of Jeremy Grant, and he knows Austin Reeves is
Speaker 2: sitting right.
Speaker 1: At the left block or the right block, excuse me.
Speaker 2: So with Austin on the right block and Ruey gapping
Speaker 2: off of that right corner, Lebron knows my best help
Speaker 2: is if I funnel him towards the sideline. So if
Speaker 2: you look at Lebron, look at his stance. His right
Speaker 2: foot is high, his left foot is back. He's in
Speaker 2: position to slide with Anthony Simons, but he is forcing
Speaker 2: him towards his right hand.
Speaker 1: So what happens.
Speaker 2: Lebron knows the drive is going right, the drive happens
Speaker 2: to the right, Lebron slides with him. Both him and
Speaker 2: Austin end up attacking the basketball and they forced it
Speaker 2: out of bounce. That's a plan that's gonna be big
Speaker 2: when you have Luca. When Luca's in this picture and
Speaker 2: he does start getting attacked, you need to have a
Speaker 2: plan for what he's going to do. That doesn't mean
Speaker 2: Luca allows dribble penetration. I heard that a lot from
Speaker 2: Mavericks fans, like, Oh, Luca's job was to let guys drive.
Speaker 1: Past him into rim protection. No, it's not.
Speaker 2: Your job is to contain the ball as best as
Speaker 2: you can. But in the absence of the ability to
Speaker 2: actually literally contain the ball, you need to force him
Speaker 2: in one direction where you have a plan to handle it.
Speaker 2: And then fifth, you have to gang rebound. When you switch,
Speaker 2: you're likely going to have smaller players battling bigs underneath
Speaker 2: the rim. You have to come flying in from the
Speaker 2: perimeter to help that smaller player in those situations.
Speaker 1: They've been doing a good job of that.
Speaker 2: In the ten games since Anthony Davis left the team,
Speaker 2: they are thirteenth in defensive rebounding. That's not bad at
Speaker 2: all for a team that's been playing a lot of
Speaker 2: small ball over that stretch. Now, the question is how
Speaker 2: good is this defense really, especially in the context of
Speaker 2: Luka Doncic. To be clear, even without Luca on the floor,
Speaker 2: even if we just remove Luca from the equation, this
Speaker 2: is obviously not a number one level defense. A lot
Speaker 2: of this is February basketball. There have been good wins
Speaker 2: in there, so they've played really good defense against some
Speaker 2: good teams. They defended the Clippers really well. They defended
Speaker 2: the Knicks really well. They defended the Pacers well, but
Speaker 2: a lot of bad offenses were in there too. Games
Speaker 2: against Utah, games against Charlotte, games against Portland, games against Washington,
Speaker 2: those are gonna The Warriors offense has struggled a lot
Speaker 2: this year. Those are games that are gonna influence your
Speaker 2: defensive rating a certain amount. Right, you add thirty plus
Speaker 2: minutes of Luka Doncic into the picture, and yeah, your
Speaker 2: defensive talent goes down a level. So I don't think
Speaker 2: this is gonna be some top five dominant defense. I'm
Speaker 2: not here today saying Lakers number one defense are gonna
Speaker 2: say number one defense, They're gonna win with defense. I
Speaker 2: don't think that's gonna be the case. But they don't
Speaker 2: need to be that type of dominant defense. This team
Speaker 2: absolutely needs to be a dominant top two or top
Speaker 2: three level offense. And I do think that's a real
Speaker 2: possibility for them with the talent level that they have
Speaker 2: on that end of the floor. With Lebron playing at
Speaker 2: the level he's playing at, with Luca playing at the
Speaker 2: level he's capable of playing at, they can present an
Speaker 2: unsolvable problem to teams. But if they're a top two
Speaker 2: or top three level offense. They don't need to be
Speaker 2: a dominant defense, they just need to be good enough.
Speaker 2: I've talked about this a lot in the context of
Speaker 2: like Denver in twenty twenty three, somewhere in that like
Speaker 2: ten to fifteen range of defense is good enough when
Speaker 2: you have peak unguardability on the offensive end of the
Speaker 2: flour And I absolutely think the Lakers can get to
Speaker 2: that point. I think the Lakers can be a slightly
Speaker 2: above average defense with Luca in the picture. They've been
Speaker 2: getting too many stops now for a while, Like I'm
Speaker 2: seeing so many people just writing the Lakers defense off
Speaker 2: and who knows, maybe Luca gets in the pick sure
Speaker 2: and they actually can't guard. Maybe everything falls apart, but
Speaker 2: it's all conjecture at this point. There's too many good
Speaker 2: defenders in the lineup. We talked about how Austin's a
Speaker 2: better defender than people think. Gabe's a good defender, Drian
Speaker 2: Phinney Smith's a good defender. Lebron for months now has
Speaker 2: been a good defender. Jared Vanderbilt when he's right, is
Speaker 2: a great defender. They have good defenders in this lineup.
Speaker 2: They're gonna get some stops I absolutely think they can
Speaker 2: get into that slightly above average range of defense. I
Speaker 2: like the switching scheme as like a way for them
Speaker 2: to essentially they bend but not break, shut down screening
Speaker 2: actions try to bait teams into running a lot of
Speaker 2: inefficient ISOs and post ups, giving up some points but
Speaker 2: keeping teams in check enough for their offense to be
Speaker 2: a differentiator. My worry center around specific matchups like I've
Speaker 2: been talking about, like we talked about earlier with Boston,
Speaker 2: and the realities of playoff series. Like I do, worry
Speaker 2: about Boston truly spacing them out to where they can't gap,
Speaker 2: to where they can't help and it becomes a problem.
Speaker 2: I can see a team like Denver where it's like
Speaker 2: they just can't keep Jokic off of the offensive glass,
Speaker 2: and even if they double team him and force teams
Speaker 2: into misses, he just waddles his way underneath the basket
Speaker 2: and starts shoving guys off and gets offensive rebounds and putbacks.
Speaker 2: I can see that being a problem, But I think
Speaker 2: in the big picture, they're gonna get a lot more
Speaker 2: stops than people think. I don't view them as a
Speaker 2: top tier contender, even if they're at their peak simply
Speaker 2: because of the fact that they're gonna have severe matchup weaknesses.
Speaker 2: But if they get their defense into that slightly above
Speaker 2: average range and they get their offense where they're capable
Speaker 2: of at the top tier in this league, I absolutely
Speaker 2: think they can enter into that second tier in the
Speaker 2: league with teams like Denver, with teams like Cleveland, I
Speaker 2: absolutely think that's in their potential. All right, let's get
Speaker 2: into our mail bag. First question, Hey, Jason up from Brazilla.
Speaker 2: Loved the show. I've learned a lot from me last
Speaker 2: two years, and I usually agree with most of your takes.
Speaker 2: I'm always impressed by your knowledge of the game and
Speaker 2: how well you break the plays down and analyze them.
Speaker 2: Luca is my favorite player since Alan Iverson, and I've
Speaker 2: learned to appreciate Lebron, which was hard at first because
Speaker 2: I'm an MJ guy. However, I don't see a world
Speaker 2: where the Lakers will be able to take the beating
Speaker 2: and win multiple playoff series without a reliable center.
Speaker 1: It's just too much to ask.
Speaker 2: Luca has really disappointed me as a defender recently, and
Speaker 2: has shown some decline in his lateral movement to the
Speaker 2: point of becoming a liability at the point of attack,
Speaker 2: even though he's an okay post defender and a good rebounder.
Speaker 2: I can easily see teams like Minnesota, Denver, Golden State
Speaker 2: and others putting Luca and Austin in ball screens and
Speaker 2: attacking them without any rim protection in the back line.
Speaker 2: To make up for it. What kind of scheme can
Speaker 2: they use to avoid being put in rotation all the time?
Speaker 2: I used to hate the Lakers, but now I find
Speaker 2: myself rooting for them because of Luca. I just want
Speaker 2: to have some hope that they won't be embarrassed in
Speaker 2: a playoff series for their lack of defense. Again, it's
Speaker 2: a bend but not break kind of concept. I like
Speaker 2: the idea of switching within the context of this roster,
Speaker 2: and again, it's not about letting Austin and Luca get
Speaker 2: run through a million ball screens. You don't want them
Speaker 2: running through screens. You want them switching. And then when
Speaker 2: they end up on the ball, there are things you
Speaker 2: can do, like you can scram guys out of mismatches.
Speaker 2: That was something they tried to do against Charlotte. They
Speaker 2: just botched a rotation at the back. You can gap
Speaker 2: and shrink those driving lanes and make it so it's
Speaker 2: harder for them to attack. You can tell them to
Speaker 2: play off and try to bait the guy they're guarding
Speaker 2: into taking pull up jump shots. And if they're playing
Speaker 2: off and there's guys in the gaps, it's like, are
Speaker 2: you going to drive into three bodies or are you
Speaker 2: going to take.
Speaker 1: A pull up three? Right?
Speaker 2: And maybe if you bait an opponent into taking a
Speaker 2: bunch of pull up jump shots while your offense is
Speaker 2: executing the crap out of them on the other end
Speaker 2: of the floor, that can go a long way towards
Speaker 2: that base scheme type of that base type of scheme working.
Speaker 2: I'm not worried about the center position really outside of
Speaker 2: the Yokic matchup, and even then, like Jokic used to
Speaker 2: eat Anthony Davis up, so like, I don't see how
Speaker 2: that really makes much of a difference within the context
Speaker 2: of Lebron in Luca. It's vertical spacing really that you
Speaker 2: need from that position, and Jackson does a good job
Speaker 2: of that. I think Jackson's been really good since the
Speaker 2: Anthony Davis trade. What you hit on, which I am
Speaker 2: actually worried about is the ability to take a beating
Speaker 2: like you talked about. I do think they can double
Speaker 2: and rotate and get a certain amount of stops against
Speaker 2: Nicole Jokic. I do think that they can switch and
Speaker 2: contain and get a certain amount of stops against other teams.
Speaker 2: But the question is can they do it over and
Speaker 2: over and over again for two weeks against a team
Speaker 2: like Denver, for four playoff rounds against a bunch of
Speaker 2: different kinds of teams. And they do have a thin rotation.
Speaker 2: They have like seven guys that I really trust, right,
Speaker 2: it's like Lebron, Luca Austin, Dorian Phinney Smith, Ruy Gabe
Speaker 2: and who.
Speaker 1: Am I missing? And Vando?
Speaker 2: Right, and then like even Vando, it's a question mark
Speaker 2: Jackson Hayes, there's some question marks there, right, So, like
Speaker 2: you get an injury there, Dorian Phinney Smith goes down,
Speaker 2: that's catastrophic. You can't overcome that, Jackson and Hayes goes down.
Speaker 2: Now you're playing Jared Vanderbilt or Alex lann or Christian
Speaker 2: KloCo or Trey Jemison at the center, that's not something
Speaker 2: you can overcome. Like there are a few guys now
Speaker 2: in their lineup that are like absolutely vitally important in
Speaker 2: terms of if they get injured, you're in big trouble.
Speaker 2: And so that's where my major concerns lie is, like
Speaker 2: I worry about Jokics just wearing them down over a
Speaker 2: playoff series and just destroying them on the offensive glass.
Speaker 2: I worry about them getting spaced out by teams like Boston,
Speaker 2: and then I worry about them breaking down. If you're
Speaker 2: gonna play small ball, you need guys like Lebron to
Speaker 2: rebound really well. That's just really exhausting for him to
Speaker 2: have to do a lot. Feels like Tatum has been
Speaker 2: shooting the ball a lot better this year, but he's
Speaker 2: still only shooting thirty six percent from three as he
Speaker 2: takes a lot of tough pull ups that drags his
Speaker 2: efficiency down. I've seen arguments that even so is tough
Speaker 2: pull up is still critical to opening up room for
Speaker 2: the whole offense. Do you agree with that view on
Speaker 2: a shot diet, Yes, he he has hurt his efficiency
Speaker 2: by taking a lot of really tough shots, but there's
Speaker 2: two things that's helped overcome it in my opinion. First
Speaker 2: of all, he's shooting better off the dribble. He's up
Speaker 2: over a point per shot off the dribble. That's the
Speaker 2: key one. It's becoming a situation, especially in ISO, where
Speaker 2: like it used to be, it's like, oh, just bait
Speaker 2: Tatum and to take in a tough step back and
Speaker 2: he'll probably miss most of them. And like, now that's
Speaker 2: a battle he's winning more often than not. I think
Speaker 2: that will especially become valuable when he gets into the
Speaker 2: postseason and late clock shot making increases in value exponentially
Speaker 2: compared to the regular season's That's why we call him
Speaker 2: playoff shots.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: The second piece of it with Tatum is just his
Speaker 2: overall command of games. He has gotten so good at
Speaker 2: identifying the flow of each game, what each game actually
Speaker 2: like demands from Tatum in any specific situation, and adapting
Speaker 2: his skill set to fit whatever that demand is. And
Speaker 2: that's why, like again, it goes back to what we
Speaker 2: were talking about earlier in terms of evaluating teams based
Speaker 2: on ratings, I don't necessarily look get the box score
Speaker 2: as an indicator of how good Jason Tatum is at basketball.
Speaker 2: He's been a twenty five, ten and five guy for
Speaker 2: as long as we can remember. It's about the impact,
Speaker 2: It's about how he does it. Within the context of
Speaker 2: each individual basketball game, Jason, why doesn't Tatum get more
Speaker 2: love as a future face of the league. Not that
Speaker 2: the conversation really matters much anyway, but he never gets
Speaker 2: brought up. American grown, twenty six year old champion, top
Speaker 2: five guy whose jersey sales have been top three to
Speaker 2: five and is quite polarizing, just seems like he doesn't
Speaker 2: get any love compared to other guys. Not sure if
Speaker 2: it's an anti Celtics bias or what the national media's
Speaker 2: reason is. Love the show would love your insight. I
Speaker 2: straight up cannot even begin to care or ever be
Speaker 2: concerned with who the face of the NBA is. It
Speaker 2: hasn't meant anything in my entire time that I've been
Speaker 2: a fan of this game. I've never even felt like
Speaker 2: there was a single face of the NBA. Even through
Speaker 2: the Lebron era, it felt like Lebron and Kobe, then
Speaker 2: Lebron and KD, then Lebron and Steph like it.
Speaker 1: It never felt to me.
Speaker 2: The marketability of the stars of the league is a
Speaker 2: big picture concept that centers around the entire.
Speaker 1: Set of stars. Then how marketable all of them are? Now?
Speaker 2: I do think that there's a conversation to be had
Speaker 2: about the fact that that there just aren't as many
Speaker 2: very popular young American players as years past. And some
Speaker 2: of that has been Zion not taking care of his body.
Speaker 2: Some of that has been John Morant and his off
Speaker 2: court antics getting himself into trouble, and you're right, they're
Speaker 2: like the Ant and Tatum kind of seem like the
Speaker 2: only two guys in a lot of ways. Tatum the
Speaker 2: reason why he doesn't get as much buzz in terms
Speaker 2: of his personality is he's got a very muted personality.
Speaker 2: Jason Tatum is a pretty chill guy who doesn't talk
Speaker 2: a ton of shit, who doesn't act super you know,
Speaker 2: he's not very performative in the media. He kind of
Speaker 2: just takes care of business and goes home, and so like, yeah,
Speaker 2: Jason Tatum doesn't have the sort of like big picture
Speaker 2: reputation that some of these other players have, but that
Speaker 2: has more to do with him than anything to do
Speaker 2: with the league.
Speaker 1: And frankly, he shouldn't care. I don't care. I don't
Speaker 1: talk to many people who care.
Speaker 2: It's one of those things that I see it on ESPN,
Speaker 2: I see it on Twitter people arguing about it occasionally,
Speaker 2: but like, I can't think of any reason why we
Speaker 2: even waste time talking about who the face of the
Speaker 2: league is.
Speaker 1: It doesn't mean anything to me to be.
Speaker 2: Frank, Hey, I love the content you put out and
Speaker 2: the breakdown you do on the game of basketball. Just
Speaker 2: a question about regular season dominance and whether it's an
Speaker 2: overall plus or not. As a Thunder fan, I believe
Speaker 2: they are clearly the best team in the league this year.
Speaker 2: The Celtics have proven it in the playoffs, but clearly
Speaker 2: don't care about the regular season as much. I've heard
Speaker 2: you talk about how attacking the regular season every day
Speaker 2: and building up good habits is a strong indicator for
Speaker 2: a contender. So I question why you see the Thunder
Speaker 2: with ten losses in a dominant regular season as inflated
Speaker 2: and why the Celtics with sixteen losses and disinterested as
Speaker 2: title favorites. Clearly, the Thunder are building the foundation of
Speaker 2: good habits and have done it while significantly injured, so
Speaker 2: I believe they deserve the top spot in the contender rankings.
Speaker 2: What you consider to be the Celtics being disinterested is
Speaker 2: top five in offense top five and defense sixth and
Speaker 2: defensive rebounding, so like the way I look at Boston
Speaker 2: is a very good regular season team that has punted
Speaker 2: some games, but in the aggregate has been really fucking good.
Speaker 2: Still in the concept of the regular season. In the
Speaker 2: context of the regular season, I should say, and then,
Speaker 2: as I talked about in that opening segment involving the Celtics,
Speaker 2: I look at everything within the context of matchup to matchup.
Speaker 2: How versatile is a team, how capable are they of
Speaker 2: winning four playoff rounds? To me, the regular season performance
Speaker 2: is more of just like a mandatory minimum. If you're
Speaker 2: not one of the top ten records in the NBA,
Speaker 2: if you're not consistently every single night providing a certain
Speaker 2: baseline average performance on either end of the floor that's
Speaker 2: keeping you sharp as a basketball team, I'm pretty much
Speaker 2: going to disqualify you as a contender in a lot
Speaker 2: of ways in terms of being a serious contender. But
Speaker 2: once you're in that group, to me, now it's like
Speaker 2: you kind of have to parse out things because guess.
Speaker 1: What I talked about this the other day.
Speaker 2: Every single player in the core eight rotation for the
Speaker 2: Thunder is twenty six or younger. You look at the
Speaker 2: core rotation for the Celtics, and it's a lot of
Speaker 2: older guys. Jason Tatum's twenty six, A lot of the
Speaker 2: other guys are older. They've got guys in their thirties.
Speaker 2: They're not going to be as athletically engaged night in
Speaker 2: night out as Oklahoma City is going to be. You
Speaker 2: get into a series, Let's pretend it's the NBA Finals.
Speaker 2: Do you think the fact that the Thunder played harder
Speaker 2: in December and January is going to matter to the
Speaker 2: Boston Celtics when they're in TD and they're playing super
Speaker 2: hard because they have an opportunity to win the trophy. Now,
Speaker 2: all of a sudden, it comes down to parsing out
Speaker 2: the details I still get concerned about, and we're going
Speaker 2: to talk about this, I might as well skip ahead
Speaker 2: to it if I can find the question, the one
Speaker 2: about Okay. See here it is, Hey, Jason, love the
Speaker 2: show and you're the truth when it comes to Hoops
Speaker 2: break down. You spoke on how Okac's defense is the
Speaker 2: ultimate calling card and them having a rating way above
Speaker 2: everyone else is in the league. It reminds me of
Speaker 2: the same discourse around the Celtics in twenty twenty two
Speaker 2: when they went to the finals. What similarities do you
Speaker 2: notice between the Celtics and twenty twenty two and the
Speaker 2: OKCE defense. Now Celtics unfortunately lost in the finals, but
Speaker 2: as the defensive rating a full indicator that OKAC will
Speaker 2: get to the finals this year. And would you take
Speaker 2: the Seas twenty twenty two defense or the OKCE defense
Speaker 2: this year as the best defense as you've seen in
Speaker 2: the current era. They are similar in a lot of ways, right,
Speaker 2: because like that Seas team with Robert Williams had like
Speaker 2: a rim protection version, but then with Horford at center,
Speaker 2: they had like more of a switching type of version.
Speaker 2: Same sort of thing with the Thunder They have these
Speaker 2: small groups where they're doing a ton of switching, but
Speaker 2: then they also have the ability to use chet at
Speaker 2: the basket. Right, There's like a kind of similar vibe there.
Speaker 2: Both teams won games with their defense, but had issues
Speaker 2: from times from time to time on the offensive ended
Speaker 2: FOURD which we'll get to in a minute. I think
Speaker 2: I would personally take the C's defense just because they
Speaker 2: were bigger on the perimeter. Oklahoma City has a lot
Speaker 2: of guys in the like six four, six five range.
Speaker 2: The Celtics were putting out lineups where you would have
Speaker 2: you know, Derek White and Marcus Smart, but you'd have
Speaker 2: Jason Tatum, you'd have Jalen Brown in addition.
Speaker 1: To their bigs on the floor.
Speaker 2: So they just had a little bit more size, a
Speaker 2: little bit more strength that I think presented teams with
Speaker 2: more problems on the defensive end of the four. Now
Speaker 2: as far as okay, seeing their specific calling card, the
Speaker 2: thing that I think they do that revolutionizes the game
Speaker 2: in their own way is aggression. Aggression in rotation. When
Speaker 2: you are aggressive on the ball, when you're trapping balls,
Speaker 2: when you're gapping and overhelping and really throwing a lot
Speaker 2: of resources in the direction of the ball, you create
Speaker 2: week side two on ones, meaning situations where you have
Speaker 2: a shooter in the corner, shooter on the wing with
Speaker 2: one guy there, and the thunder are just so good
Speaker 2: at quickly disengaging from their aggressive coverage and recovering out
Speaker 2: to the perimeter. That's like their main thing that they
Speaker 2: do extremely well. But the offensive side of the floor,
Speaker 2: it's very similar to what we saw with Boston over
Speaker 2: the years in the sense that like if you remember
Speaker 2: in that game, if you guys remember in that game
Speaker 2: against or that series against the Bucks in twenty twenty two,
Speaker 2: they repeatedly time and time again kept challenging brook Lopez
Speaker 2: right at the rim instead of taking easy kickout passes.
Speaker 2: When I look back at the Mavericks series last year,
Speaker 2: same sort of thing, Jalen Williams in particular, doing a
Speaker 2: lot of like trying to finish through Daniel Gafford or
Speaker 2: Derek Lively at the basket, and it's just that's a
Speaker 2: really low percentage shot. You need to be making those
Speaker 2: extra kickout passes. There is a thing that happened with
Speaker 2: the Celtics where they learned between twenty twenty two and
Speaker 2: twenty twenty four to be more deliberate with their shot selection,
Speaker 2: to get the great shot instead of the good shot,
Speaker 2: and that is what pushed them over the top. And
Speaker 2: I still maintain that's the main barrier between the Thunder
Speaker 2: and where they want to get and where they are now.
Speaker 2: It's that offensive process piece. Inevitably, they're going to run
Speaker 2: into some great defense that makes them super uncomfortable and
Speaker 2: they're going to have to really break a defense down.
Speaker 2: This is actually a perfect tee up into our second
Speaker 2: to last question. We have two more what happened to
Speaker 2: all the concerns that everyone, including you, had of the
Speaker 2: Celtics when it comes to offensive execution against an elite defense.
Speaker 2: They had no real opposition in the East.
Speaker 1: Last year.
Speaker 2: Dallas was their best match about West because of how
Speaker 2: bad Luca was defensively, basically granting them an assured advantage
Speaker 2: every possession. Did everyone already forget the last five years
Speaker 2: of basketball? I've seen way too many occasions where Tatum
Speaker 2: and Brown just settled for contested jumpers when things get tight. Also,
Speaker 2: similar to your concerns for Yokid shooting last year, are
Speaker 2: you not concerned about Brown?
Speaker 1: In Holiday?
Speaker 2: They're shooting thirty two and thirty three three percent from three.
Speaker 2: That's a legitimate concern. The Celtics aren't shooting particularly well.
Speaker 2: Those guys are gonna have to shoot better if they
Speaker 2: want to have more margin for error when they get
Speaker 2: to the postseason. I think that's legitimate. However, Jason Tatum's
Speaker 2: twenty six years old. When you say, like, oh, the
Speaker 2: last five years of basketball, you want to you want
Speaker 2: us to factor in Tatum when he was twenty one
Speaker 2: when we're talking about what they can do. I think
Speaker 2: there's this misconception that when I talk about any concept,
Speaker 2: whether it's boxing out, containing the ball, making good decisions,
Speaker 2: running back in transition defense, that it means you do
Speaker 2: it every single time. Every team, even the Thunder, even
Speaker 2: the Celtics, even the Cavs, will make bad decisions on offense,
Speaker 2: miss box outs, not get back in transition defense, just
Speaker 2: in general, make execution errs. Everyone makes executioners. It's about
Speaker 2: a ratio. How frequently are you making those executioners. Yes,
Speaker 2: Tatum still takes bad shots. Yes, Jalen Brown still takes
Speaker 2: bad shots. Yes, the Celtics have stretches where their offense
Speaker 2: looks bad, It is much fewer and much further between
Speaker 2: than it used to be, And I'd actually argue the
Speaker 2: Celtics have been particularly great this year at identifying when
Speaker 2: they're losing control of things and re centering themselves on
Speaker 2: offense and making those execution Making those better decisions on
Speaker 2: offense that get them back on track. Kind of felt
Speaker 2: like the opposite in years past, where they would play
Speaker 2: good basketball and then they would lose sight of it,
Speaker 2: and especially when things got hard, they would revert to
Speaker 2: bad habits.
Speaker 1: It feels like the.
Speaker 2: Opposite of that now I'm not saying I don't think
Speaker 2: the Celtics are impervious. I think they could lose in
Speaker 2: the East. I think they could lose in the West.
Speaker 2: I'm not sitting here and viewing them as like the
Speaker 2: twenty seventeen Warriors or anything like that, but I think
Speaker 2: they deserve more credit for their offensive development over the
Speaker 2: course of the last few years. All right, last question, Hey, Jason,
Speaker 2: love the show. Thank you for taking time to help
Speaker 2: educate us that didn't play basketball at high level. It's
Speaker 2: great to get your perspective, and it's only fitting my
Speaker 2: question is best suited for a player like yourself? When
Speaker 2: I'm watching Luca the last few games with LA, doesn't
Speaker 2: look like he's just playing bad basketball, looks like he's
Speaker 2: broken mentally. It's crazy, as fans were programmed to be
Speaker 2: upset with players when they leave their teams, but when
Speaker 2: organizations trade players, it's just business. Because of this, I
Speaker 2: don't think most people realize how big of an impact
Speaker 2: this has on an athlete. Watching Luca has bad play
Speaker 2: the last few games has seems psychological. Doesn't look like
Speaker 2: he's even having fun, and I don't think he's going
Speaker 2: to play any meaningful basketball again until he rediscovers his
Speaker 2: love for the game. To be clear, I don't think
Speaker 2: this will be a prolonged thing. I do think he'll
Speaker 2: get back on track. But I'm curious if you, as
Speaker 2: a player, could take us through your thoughts. Do you
Speaker 2: agree with me or do you think his poor play
Speaker 2: is more of a lack of team chemistry. Thanks again,
Speaker 2: love the show. I'm not gonna see here and pretend
Speaker 2: like I don't think Luca's mentality or his mental state
Speaker 2: with all of this chaos over the course of the
Speaker 2: last few weeks isn't affecting him. Of course, it's affecting him.
Speaker 2: I just think it's affecting him more when he's off
Speaker 2: the court. You know, basketball is for guys like this too,
Speaker 2: like they love the game so much. I would argue
Speaker 2: that for a guy like Luca, this is when he's
Speaker 2: having the most fun. It's one of those things where
Speaker 2: it's like when you're going back to a different house
Speaker 2: than you're, a different apartment than you usually go back to,
Speaker 2: and friends that you had in your old home are
Speaker 2: not there anymore, and you're building new friendships, but everything's
Speaker 2: still kind of in a fledgling stage. Like I'm sure,
Speaker 2: he has a lot of moments where he's struggling a
Speaker 2: bit outside of the Lakers facility, but basketball is the
Speaker 2: happy place for most of these guys. I think it's
Speaker 2: mostly chemistry. One of the things that made things hard
Speaker 2: for Luca is the Lakers played awesome in the stretch
Speaker 2: before he showed up. After the trade. He like sat
Speaker 2: there and watched as Lebron and Austin played awesome and
Speaker 2: beat good teams. Luca has come into a situation with
Speaker 2: a team playing great. Hell, he just sat out last
Speaker 2: night and they played great again. So like it's one
Speaker 2: of those things for Luca where I think he's reading
Speaker 2: the situation and he's trying really hard not to step
Speaker 2: on everyone's toes. That's the natural thing that happens every
Speaker 2: time you add a high volume ball handler to a
Speaker 2: team that already had ball handling. Everyone's gonna start looking
Speaker 2: at each other and it's like, is it your turn?
Speaker 2: Is it my turn? I really could feel that at
Speaker 2: the tail end of the Charlotte game, where it's like
Speaker 2: Lucas in a.
Speaker 1: Terrible rhythm and is playing poorly.
Speaker 2: Lebron clearly has it going, so like Lucas like trying
Speaker 2: to feed Lebron more because Lebron's got it going, but
Speaker 2: at the same time, like like the Lakers need Luca
Speaker 2: to get going in order to get to where they
Speaker 2: want to go. That stuff is all going to take time,
Speaker 2: and it all what will end up happening is different
Speaker 2: phases of the game will take on different feels. They
Speaker 2: will come out the gates. My guess is early on
Speaker 2: in games with the starters, they'll start leaning on Luca more.
Speaker 2: But then as different guys check in and out of
Speaker 2: the lineup, different guys will become more aggressive. Lebron will
Speaker 2: check out in the mid the first quarter, Austin will
Speaker 2: start to be more aggressive, right, Luca will check out,
Speaker 2: Lebron will come in for the late first quarter group
Speaker 2: that's when Lebron will really turn it on. We've seen
Speaker 2: a lot in recent weeks how in the early fourth
Speaker 2: quarter Lebron is like, this is my time to like
Speaker 2: really just fire every bullet I've gotten my gun to
Speaker 2: get us as much of a lead as I can
Speaker 2: so that Luca can come in and close the deal.
Speaker 1: There will be flows to these.
Speaker 2: Games and you feel it out like there will be
Speaker 2: games where it's like, hey, Lou Dort's on Luca.
Speaker 1: He's doing a good job.
Speaker 2: Lebron's got Jalen Williams, like, we should probably play through
Speaker 2: Lebron more. There will be other games where it's like
Speaker 2: they've got guys for Luca for Austin, but they don't
Speaker 2: have guys for Luca and Lebron or vice versa, and
Speaker 2: they're gonna kind of jerry rig it from game to game.
Speaker 2: But right now, it's a lot of you can tell
Speaker 2: it's a couple of different things. Lucas obviously very big
Speaker 2: and out of shape. That's gonna take time. Luca's jump
Speaker 2: shot is completely broke right now. That won't be the
Speaker 2: case in the big picture. He's gonna get it going.
Speaker 2: He's shooting a lot of really flat jump shots that
Speaker 2: are either way off the back room or way short,
Speaker 2: like that's just his jumper's way off. That's going to
Speaker 2: take time to figure out. He's out of rhythm as well,
Speaker 2: but he's also trying to figure out those chemistry things.
Speaker 2: It's going to take time. It's interesting as I look
Speaker 2: at the Lakers, even with the ugly basketball that they've
Speaker 2: played with Lucas so far, I've already seen enough to
Speaker 2: know that I think they're gonna be a great offense.
Speaker 2: I'm just not worried about that at all whatsoever. As
Speaker 2: soon as Luca gets it going, I think they're going
Speaker 2: to take off on offense. The questions are going to
Speaker 2: be centered around whether or not they can get enough
Speaker 2: stops in particular matchups to win multiple playoff rounds.
Speaker 1: All right, guys, that is all I have for today.
Speaker 2: As always, as sincerely appreciate you guys for supporting me
Speaker 2: and supporting the show. We're gonna be taking this weekend off.
Speaker 2: We'll be back on Monday.
Speaker 1: We will see you guys. Then the volume