1 00:00:02,160 --> 00:00:03,320 Speaker 1: Heart originals. 2 00:00:03,440 --> 00:00:05,640 Speaker 2: This is an iHeart original. 3 00:00:08,480 --> 00:00:11,719 Speaker 3: Isaac Newton had put dozens of people in the dock 4 00:00:11,960 --> 00:00:16,520 Speaker 3: the defendant stand, but now he was sitting there himself. 5 00:00:17,680 --> 00:00:22,400 Speaker 3: Metaphorically speaking, he was accused of trying to frame an innocent, 6 00:00:23,160 --> 00:00:26,479 Speaker 3: law abiding man, a man who'd long been on the 7 00:00:26,520 --> 00:00:29,960 Speaker 3: side of justice and the new Monarchy, who'd stood as 8 00:00:30,080 --> 00:00:35,120 Speaker 3: witness against confirmed Jacobite traders, who'd been so helpful with 9 00:00:35,200 --> 00:00:39,199 Speaker 3: the Bank of England's fraudulent notes, A man who'd blown 10 00:00:39,280 --> 00:00:42,800 Speaker 3: the whistle on the minse corruption, but was now being 11 00:00:42,920 --> 00:00:46,800 Speaker 3: repaid for that bravery with stints and Newgate jail and 12 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:56,279 Speaker 3: worse death threats. That, at least was the case that 13 00:00:56,360 --> 00:01:03,040 Speaker 3: William Challoner had cooked up against doctor Isaac Newton. In 14 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:07,160 Speaker 3: late October of sixteen ninety seven, Newton's case against Challoner 15 00:01:07,360 --> 00:01:09,839 Speaker 3: was dismissed before it could even come to trial. 16 00:01:10,200 --> 00:01:11,199 Speaker 2: But Challner had. 17 00:01:11,040 --> 00:01:15,600 Speaker 3: Already spent seven weeks in filthy Newgate. He felt he 18 00:01:15,680 --> 00:01:20,040 Speaker 3: was entitled to something, an acknowledgment that he'd been wronged, 19 00:01:20,440 --> 00:01:25,320 Speaker 3: maybe even some compensation. In February sixteen ninety eight, Challener 20 00:01:25,360 --> 00:01:28,800 Speaker 3: took his case to the Court of Public Opinion. He 21 00:01:28,840 --> 00:01:31,319 Speaker 3: wrote a letter to Parliament a letter that he also 22 00:01:31,440 --> 00:01:33,520 Speaker 3: had made into pamphlets for public distribution. 23 00:01:33,959 --> 00:01:37,720 Speaker 4: Your petitioner did, in the last sessions of Parliament discover 24 00:01:37,920 --> 00:01:41,080 Speaker 4: several abuses committed in the Mint, and showed by what 25 00:01:41,280 --> 00:01:45,039 Speaker 4: methods false money was coined. Then some of the Mint 26 00:01:45,080 --> 00:01:49,040 Speaker 4: threatened to prosecute me and take away my life before 27 00:01:49,080 --> 00:01:53,240 Speaker 4: the next session of Parliament, telling me that this Honorable 28 00:01:53,480 --> 00:01:56,440 Speaker 4: House had no power to meddle with the affairs of 29 00:01:56,480 --> 00:02:00,680 Speaker 4: the Mint. This committee promised your Petitioner that I should 30 00:02:00,680 --> 00:02:04,760 Speaker 4: suffer no damage for these discoveries about the Mint. Yet 31 00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:08,600 Speaker 4: they committed me to Newgate and kept me in irons 32 00:02:08,680 --> 00:02:12,680 Speaker 4: for seven weeks, alleging that I had abused a Mint 33 00:02:12,760 --> 00:02:17,120 Speaker 4: in Parliament, and they did falsely and illegally prefer a 34 00:02:17,160 --> 00:02:21,320 Speaker 4: bill of indictment against me, but could bring no evidence. 35 00:02:23,400 --> 00:02:26,960 Speaker 4: I am utterly ruined by my endeavors to serve the 36 00:02:27,040 --> 00:02:31,840 Speaker 4: King and Kingdom, and by my discoveries against the Mint. 37 00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:36,440 Speaker 4: To this Honorable House, I most humbly plead that this 38 00:02:36,600 --> 00:02:41,760 Speaker 4: Honorable House will consider my great sufferings and ruined condition 39 00:02:42,280 --> 00:02:47,040 Speaker 4: as being incapable of providing for myself and family by 40 00:02:47,080 --> 00:02:50,880 Speaker 4: what I intended for the service of the public, and 41 00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:55,600 Speaker 4: grant me such redress as shall seem best in your honors, 42 00:02:56,200 --> 00:03:02,320 Speaker 4: great wisdom and justice. 43 00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:08,400 Speaker 3: Challoner's accusations meant yet another investigation. This time it was 44 00:03:08,480 --> 00:03:12,000 Speaker 3: Warden Isaac Newton at the center of it. Newton was 45 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:15,520 Speaker 3: forced to defend himself to a committee of senior government officials. 46 00:03:16,040 --> 00:03:19,600 Speaker 5: Mister Challoner before a committee of the last Sessions of Parliament, 47 00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:24,080 Speaker 5: labored to accuse and vilify the Mint, and prove himself 48 00:03:24,320 --> 00:03:28,320 Speaker 5: a more skillful coiner than they, that he might be 49 00:03:28,480 --> 00:03:33,560 Speaker 5: made their supervisor, and then supply Thomas Holloway with tools 50 00:03:33,600 --> 00:03:36,800 Speaker 5: out of the tower to counter it his own milled money, 51 00:03:37,000 --> 00:03:41,880 Speaker 5: which he then concealed from that honorable committee, boastink secretly 52 00:03:42,120 --> 00:03:44,920 Speaker 5: that he would fund the Parliament as he had done 53 00:03:44,960 --> 00:03:46,440 Speaker 5: the King and back before. 54 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:50,080 Speaker 3: Challoner was a liar and a counterfeiter, and it was 55 00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:53,800 Speaker 3: for that, and not quote offending the Mint, that he 56 00:03:53,880 --> 00:03:54,920 Speaker 3: was being prosecuted. 57 00:03:55,840 --> 00:03:59,640 Speaker 5: If therefore he be ruined, it's by his endeavoring not 58 00:03:59,720 --> 00:04:01,920 Speaker 5: to say of the King and Government as he pretends, 59 00:04:02,120 --> 00:04:05,400 Speaker 5: but to coin false money. And if he would but 60 00:04:05,640 --> 00:04:09,080 Speaker 5: let the money and government alone and return to his 61 00:04:09,560 --> 00:04:13,760 Speaker 5: trade of japanning, he is not so far ruined that 62 00:04:13,840 --> 00:04:16,120 Speaker 5: he may still live as well as he did seven 63 00:04:16,240 --> 00:04:19,800 Speaker 5: years ago when he left off that trade and raised 64 00:04:19,880 --> 00:04:21,200 Speaker 5: himself by coining. 65 00:04:22,480 --> 00:04:26,200 Speaker 3: The committee believed Newton, it was, after all, stacked with 66 00:04:26,279 --> 00:04:28,400 Speaker 3: a few of his maids, to be honest, and they 67 00:04:28,440 --> 00:04:30,000 Speaker 3: dismissed Shalloner. 68 00:04:30,279 --> 00:04:32,520 Speaker 2: But Newton was pissed. 69 00:04:33,279 --> 00:04:36,080 Speaker 3: Newton is not a man to suffer insult lightly, and 70 00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:39,760 Speaker 3: he most certainly felt insulted. And if we know anything 71 00:04:39,920 --> 00:04:43,400 Speaker 3: about Newton, it's that he does not forgive and forget 72 00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:50,400 Speaker 3: at all. For iHeartRadio, I'm Linda Rodriguez, McRobbie, and this 73 00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:56,520 Speaker 3: is Newton's Law and I Heeart Original podcast episode seven, 74 00:04:57,440 --> 00:05:01,919 Speaker 3: Funny Money. 75 00:05:00,160 --> 00:05:00,719 Speaker 6: It's more. 76 00:05:02,680 --> 00:05:07,919 Speaker 7: You are making you. 77 00:05:41,800 --> 00:05:44,159 Speaker 2: Act one the Malt tickets. 78 00:05:46,120 --> 00:05:50,000 Speaker 3: Jallaner's attempt to publicly discredit Isaac Newton and the Mint 79 00:05:50,400 --> 00:05:53,080 Speaker 3: it was more or less a hail Mary. He had 80 00:05:53,120 --> 00:05:55,119 Speaker 3: to know that they weren't giving out fistfuls of cash 81 00:05:55,160 --> 00:05:58,440 Speaker 3: for wrongful imprisonment. That wasn't a thing back then. But 82 00:05:58,560 --> 00:05:59,680 Speaker 3: he was desperate. 83 00:06:00,600 --> 00:06:02,839 Speaker 2: When Challeener had gotten out of Newgate in the autumn 84 00:06:02,839 --> 00:06:05,159 Speaker 2: of sixteen ninety seven, he was broke. 85 00:06:06,040 --> 00:06:07,960 Speaker 3: While he'd been in Newgate, he not only had to 86 00:06:07,960 --> 00:06:10,640 Speaker 3: pay off the witnesses who would have testified against him 87 00:06:10,720 --> 00:06:13,640 Speaker 3: and get Holloway and his family plus made out of 88 00:06:13,640 --> 00:06:17,640 Speaker 3: the country, but he also had to pay for everyday expenses, 89 00:06:17,720 --> 00:06:21,839 Speaker 3: food and bedding. Newgate wardens also charged for every visitor 90 00:06:21,880 --> 00:06:25,240 Speaker 3: who came in. So yeah, Challeener had spent pretty much 91 00:06:25,320 --> 00:06:27,440 Speaker 3: every penny he had to keep afloat. 92 00:06:28,200 --> 00:06:29,880 Speaker 2: Challener needed money. 93 00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:34,760 Speaker 3: Big time, and as a lifelong career criminal, he really 94 00:06:34,760 --> 00:06:39,880 Speaker 3: only knew a few ways of getting it. Challener first 95 00:06:39,920 --> 00:06:43,400 Speaker 3: tried his hand at making some crude coins shillings over 96 00:06:43,440 --> 00:06:44,200 Speaker 3: the fire. 97 00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:44,680 Speaker 2: In his flat. 98 00:06:45,200 --> 00:06:47,679 Speaker 3: He was living in a rented room above a pub 99 00:06:47,880 --> 00:06:52,160 Speaker 3: near Covent Garden, which was then a noisy, formerly posh 100 00:06:52,480 --> 00:06:56,080 Speaker 3: market district that was home to gambling dens and brothels. 101 00:06:56,360 --> 00:06:59,280 Speaker 3: That big fancy house in nice Bridge that was long 102 00:06:59,279 --> 00:07:01,520 Speaker 3: gone probably sold all of his silver plates and his 103 00:07:01,600 --> 00:07:04,920 Speaker 3: gents clothing by now too, But not even as mates 104 00:07:04,920 --> 00:07:07,920 Speaker 3: would try to pass his poorly made coins into the market. 105 00:07:08,200 --> 00:07:13,440 Speaker 3: So Challener did some thinking making coins. Making good coins 106 00:07:13,520 --> 00:07:16,720 Speaker 3: at the quality he had been producing took raw materials. 107 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:21,280 Speaker 3: It took well money to make money, even when your 108 00:07:21,280 --> 00:07:25,080 Speaker 3: scam is literally making money. But then Challoner remembered the 109 00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:30,520 Speaker 3: success that he'd had with those banknotes. By now, counterfeiting 110 00:07:30,560 --> 00:07:32,560 Speaker 3: Bank of England notes had been bumped up to a 111 00:07:32,600 --> 00:07:36,160 Speaker 3: treasonous offence, meaning you could hang for it. So trying 112 00:07:36,200 --> 00:07:39,720 Speaker 3: that again was probably not a good idea. But there 113 00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:45,200 Speaker 3: was another monetary innovation happening, and this one was tailor 114 00:07:45,680 --> 00:07:51,760 Speaker 3: made for Challeener, largely because it was bonkers and utterly chaotic. Okay, 115 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:56,520 Speaker 3: so bear with me. Thomas Neil, you may remember as 116 00:07:56,560 --> 00:07:58,160 Speaker 3: the feckless master of the mint. 117 00:07:58,360 --> 00:08:01,960 Speaker 6: This recoinage is not work well atol. It must be 118 00:08:02,000 --> 00:08:02,960 Speaker 6: somebody else's vault. 119 00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:05,400 Speaker 3: He was a man who never turned down a chance 120 00:08:05,440 --> 00:08:09,120 Speaker 3: to gamble with someone else's money. In sixteen ninety four, 121 00:08:09,400 --> 00:08:11,720 Speaker 3: Neil set up a lottery to bring in some revenue 122 00:08:11,720 --> 00:08:15,160 Speaker 3: for the government, called and this was a real thing, 123 00:08:15,200 --> 00:08:18,280 Speaker 3: even though it sounds like a scratch off ticket, the 124 00:08:18,400 --> 00:08:23,120 Speaker 3: Million Adventure. Each ten pound ticket had a chance of 125 00:08:23,160 --> 00:08:26,440 Speaker 3: winning up to one thousand pounds, but when it came 126 00:08:26,520 --> 00:08:33,960 Speaker 3: time to pay the winners, the treasury couldn't oops. So 127 00:08:34,040 --> 00:08:38,240 Speaker 3: that worked out terribly, So terribly in fact, that Neil 128 00:08:38,280 --> 00:08:42,400 Speaker 3: thought let's try it again, probably because he personally made 129 00:08:42,400 --> 00:08:44,880 Speaker 3: a bunch of money out of the adventure, Let's be honest. 130 00:08:45,280 --> 00:08:49,080 Speaker 3: In sixteen ninety seven, with angry adventure ticket holders still 131 00:08:49,160 --> 00:08:53,320 Speaker 3: waiting to be paid, Neil set up the Malt lottery. 132 00:08:53,920 --> 00:08:57,120 Speaker 2: And the Treasury led him seriously. 133 00:08:57,640 --> 00:08:59,640 Speaker 3: Who thought it was a good idea to let Neil 134 00:08:59,720 --> 00:09:04,600 Speaker 3: do literally anything at this point? But the Malt lottery 135 00:09:04,840 --> 00:09:09,120 Speaker 3: was even weirder than the million Adventure. Here's Tom Levinson, 136 00:09:09,240 --> 00:09:11,520 Speaker 3: author of Newton and the Counterfeiter, to explain. 137 00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:15,079 Speaker 8: It was several things at once. First of all, it 138 00:09:15,320 --> 00:09:20,280 Speaker 8: was basically an annuity product. People would buy it and 139 00:09:20,320 --> 00:09:23,040 Speaker 8: they would be promised a given rate of interest for 140 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:25,160 Speaker 8: some number of years. They wouldn't get their principle back, 141 00:09:25,200 --> 00:09:28,040 Speaker 8: but they'd get this return for a long time. And 142 00:09:28,720 --> 00:09:31,480 Speaker 8: that interest payment was a secured payment, and it was 143 00:09:31,480 --> 00:09:35,640 Speaker 8: secured on a specific source of revenue tax on malt, 144 00:09:35,679 --> 00:09:38,760 Speaker 8: which is effectively a tax on beer. So that's, you know, 145 00:09:39,040 --> 00:09:41,960 Speaker 8: in the English context, that's a pretty secure revenue stream. 146 00:09:43,679 --> 00:09:47,480 Speaker 8: It was also an actual, just plane ordinary lottery ticket. 147 00:09:48,800 --> 00:09:51,319 Speaker 8: Every one of these small lottery tickets that were sold 148 00:09:51,440 --> 00:09:55,760 Speaker 8: carried entry into a drawing for significant cash prizes, think 149 00:09:55,840 --> 00:09:58,520 Speaker 8: up to one thousand pounds. I think one thousand pounds 150 00:09:58,600 --> 00:10:02,280 Speaker 8: is Newton's annual salary as warden to the Mint was 151 00:10:02,280 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 8: four hundred quid, so one thousand pounds is a lot 152 00:10:04,760 --> 00:10:05,200 Speaker 8: of money. 153 00:10:06,160 --> 00:10:09,160 Speaker 3: The Treasury issued one hundred and forty thousand of these 154 00:10:09,200 --> 00:10:13,120 Speaker 3: ten pound malt lottery tickets. Just as with the adventure tickets, 155 00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:16,360 Speaker 3: people group together to purchase shares in them, So again 156 00:10:16,640 --> 00:10:19,360 Speaker 3: there's a bit of an equity market going something that 157 00:10:19,360 --> 00:10:22,160 Speaker 3: had already been a part of the cultural landscape for 158 00:10:22,240 --> 00:10:23,000 Speaker 3: decades now. 159 00:10:23,360 --> 00:10:24,480 Speaker 2: So the mall lottery. 160 00:10:24,160 --> 00:10:27,680 Speaker 3: Tickets were like a long term savings bond, and they 161 00:10:27,720 --> 00:10:31,520 Speaker 3: were also a gambling instrument. But the mall lottery tickets 162 00:10:31,520 --> 00:10:35,760 Speaker 3: had an extra feature, one that was pretty unusual. 163 00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:39,200 Speaker 8: There was a third thing that they could do. It 164 00:10:39,240 --> 00:10:42,440 Speaker 8: turned out that this particular lottery did not sell very well, 165 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:45,560 Speaker 8: so in order to try and get as much use 166 00:10:45,679 --> 00:10:48,520 Speaker 8: out of having decided to issue these things. Problem is 167 00:10:48,559 --> 00:10:51,160 Speaker 8: that these could be legal tender, or at least if 168 00:10:51,200 --> 00:10:54,520 Speaker 8: not legal tender precisely, they could be treated as money. 169 00:10:54,920 --> 00:10:59,080 Speaker 8: So for captive audiences like you know, sailors in the 170 00:10:59,120 --> 00:11:03,560 Speaker 8: Royal Navy, those guys were paid in lottery tickets. All 171 00:11:03,600 --> 00:11:05,280 Speaker 8: of a sudden you have this one piece of paper 172 00:11:05,320 --> 00:11:08,880 Speaker 8: that is at least three things at once. It's paper money, 173 00:11:09,559 --> 00:11:12,880 Speaker 8: it's a gambling device, it's a completely speculative device, and 174 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:13,920 Speaker 8: it's a stream of income. 175 00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:17,120 Speaker 3: And it was a kind of continuation of the Bank 176 00:11:17,160 --> 00:11:20,679 Speaker 3: of England's running cash notes, just on a much much 177 00:11:20,920 --> 00:11:23,959 Speaker 3: larger scale. The Bank of England notes were issued in 178 00:11:24,000 --> 00:11:26,960 Speaker 3: one hundred pounds denominations, huge amount of money for a 179 00:11:27,000 --> 00:11:27,680 Speaker 3: lot of people. 180 00:11:28,679 --> 00:11:30,240 Speaker 2: But the Malt tickets were. 181 00:11:30,120 --> 00:11:32,880 Speaker 3: Only ten pounds, and there were potentially going to be 182 00:11:32,920 --> 00:11:34,880 Speaker 3: a lot more of them in circulation. 183 00:11:35,440 --> 00:11:37,440 Speaker 8: And you know what was great about this is as money, 184 00:11:37,679 --> 00:11:40,640 Speaker 8: they had a face value ten pounds. You knew what 185 00:11:40,679 --> 00:11:42,880 Speaker 8: you were getting when you got one, or if you 186 00:11:42,920 --> 00:11:45,480 Speaker 8: were a challenger, if you made one. 187 00:11:46,920 --> 00:11:50,040 Speaker 3: Challener cotton down pretty quickly. That the best thing about 188 00:11:50,040 --> 00:11:52,320 Speaker 3: this Malt lottery was that it was going to be 189 00:11:52,480 --> 00:11:55,400 Speaker 3: so so easy to exploit. 190 00:11:56,400 --> 00:12:00,280 Speaker 8: The Great Battle between Isaac Newton and William Challoner Ross 191 00:12:00,320 --> 00:12:03,480 Speaker 8: sixteen ninety six and sixteen ninety seven. By the end 192 00:12:03,520 --> 00:12:07,320 Speaker 8: of it, Challenger was really quite in desperate stakes. But 193 00:12:07,440 --> 00:12:10,720 Speaker 8: Challoner had one more great scheme in him. 194 00:12:11,400 --> 00:12:16,360 Speaker 3: The problem was again money, though setting up a counterfeit 195 00:12:16,400 --> 00:12:20,079 Speaker 3: lottery ticket operation was certainly less costly than trying to 196 00:12:20,080 --> 00:12:23,560 Speaker 3: set up a fake mint. It still took supplies, the 197 00:12:23,640 --> 00:12:28,360 Speaker 3: right paper, copper for creating the engraved plates, special ink. 198 00:12:29,120 --> 00:12:32,880 Speaker 3: He needed a backer, someone who'd helped finance this operation 199 00:12:33,160 --> 00:12:36,800 Speaker 3: for a cut of the profits. Challenger tapped into his 200 00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:40,720 Speaker 3: dwindling network of contacts. He didn't have many people left 201 00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:43,720 Speaker 3: who weren't in jail, or who he hadn't double crossed, 202 00:12:43,840 --> 00:12:46,560 Speaker 3: or who hadn't tried to double cross him. He came 203 00:12:46,640 --> 00:12:51,160 Speaker 3: up with a man called Thomas Carter. Carter was a 204 00:12:51,240 --> 00:12:53,880 Speaker 3: mate from Challoner's early days as a coiner back during 205 00:12:53,920 --> 00:12:58,160 Speaker 3: his first successful run in sixteen ninety two. In June 206 00:12:58,200 --> 00:13:03,560 Speaker 3: sixteen ninety eight, asked Carter to procure him a malt ticket. 207 00:13:03,840 --> 00:13:07,760 Speaker 7: Procure me one of those so called malt tickets. 208 00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:11,120 Speaker 6: With what money, sir, I have but one chilling. 209 00:13:11,559 --> 00:13:13,400 Speaker 2: Again, these weren't cheap. 210 00:13:13,760 --> 00:13:16,440 Speaker 3: Ten pounds was more than a skilled tradesman earned in 211 00:13:16,480 --> 00:13:17,439 Speaker 3: three months of work. 212 00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:18,839 Speaker 2: So Carter was. 213 00:13:18,800 --> 00:13:21,360 Speaker 3: Going to have to find someone who had enough capital 214 00:13:21,480 --> 00:13:22,640 Speaker 3: to fund the scheme. 215 00:13:23,920 --> 00:13:27,080 Speaker 7: Perhaps you can find a man of adequate means who 216 00:13:27,160 --> 00:13:32,760 Speaker 7: desires to increase his fortune. Well, I suppose, But whatever 217 00:13:32,800 --> 00:13:35,160 Speaker 7: you do keep my nime out of it. 218 00:13:36,720 --> 00:13:40,000 Speaker 3: Carter came up with a man called David Davis, which 219 00:13:40,080 --> 00:13:43,080 Speaker 3: sounds like a made up name, but not more so 220 00:13:43,160 --> 00:13:46,080 Speaker 3: than the unlucky Daniel Decoiner, who in sixteen eighty four 221 00:13:46,160 --> 00:13:52,040 Speaker 3: was executed for coining. Carter met Davis on Piccadilly, then 222 00:13:52,160 --> 00:13:54,240 Speaker 3: a major thoroughfare through Westminster. 223 00:13:55,600 --> 00:13:59,040 Speaker 9: Please do explain this secretive and most urgent business. 224 00:14:00,240 --> 00:14:04,440 Speaker 6: I am acquainted with a man which could engrave very 225 00:14:04,480 --> 00:14:08,520 Speaker 6: dexterously and had a strong inclination to grave a plate 226 00:14:08,640 --> 00:14:12,760 Speaker 6: for malt tickets. The copper is not yet bought, and 227 00:14:12,840 --> 00:14:14,760 Speaker 6: for my own part I have not been master of 228 00:14:14,760 --> 00:14:19,200 Speaker 6: one shilling this month, and my friend is very indigent. Besides, 229 00:14:19,280 --> 00:14:22,400 Speaker 6: this business requires a good stock for lodgings, provisions and 230 00:14:22,440 --> 00:14:26,600 Speaker 6: other necessities to complete the work. You are not to 231 00:14:26,640 --> 00:14:29,240 Speaker 6: see my workman all shall he be concerned with you. 232 00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:33,080 Speaker 6: But if you confide in me, the work shall go 233 00:14:33,160 --> 00:14:34,360 Speaker 6: on with all speed. 234 00:14:35,720 --> 00:14:38,840 Speaker 9: Suppose that your friend, after a great deal of money 235 00:14:38,960 --> 00:14:43,280 Speaker 9: is laid out and expended, cannot perform the plate. It's 236 00:14:43,320 --> 00:14:46,760 Speaker 9: a very curious thing, and no person that I ever 237 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:49,840 Speaker 9: heard of did understands taking the reverse of a fine 238 00:14:49,880 --> 00:14:50,920 Speaker 9: bill upon copper. 239 00:14:52,360 --> 00:14:57,880 Speaker 6: Besides, Challoner ask no questions, Bud. If you knew who 240 00:14:57,920 --> 00:15:01,680 Speaker 6: my friend was, now he was as great a master 241 00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:02,520 Speaker 6: as Challoner. 242 00:15:06,040 --> 00:15:11,200 Speaker 3: Davis agreed to back the enterprise. He provided three legitimate 243 00:15:11,240 --> 00:15:13,760 Speaker 3: malt tickets and a bit of working money to Carter, 244 00:15:14,280 --> 00:15:18,400 Speaker 3: who then passed them on to Challoner. It took Challoner 245 00:15:18,520 --> 00:15:21,600 Speaker 3: the better part of two weeks to engrave the copper plates, 246 00:15:21,960 --> 00:15:26,440 Speaker 3: laboriously etching the ticket in reverse, hunched over a tabletop 247 00:15:26,480 --> 00:15:29,080 Speaker 3: in his rented lodgings above the Golden Lion in. 248 00:15:29,080 --> 00:15:30,920 Speaker 2: Wilde Street near kevent Garden. 249 00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:34,720 Speaker 3: Carter kept Davis in the loop, updating him on progress 250 00:15:34,840 --> 00:15:38,840 Speaker 3: almost daily. When the plates were ready, Chaloner did a 251 00:15:38,840 --> 00:15:42,840 Speaker 3: test run. Six score that's one hundred and twenty malt 252 00:15:42,840 --> 00:15:47,200 Speaker 3: lottery tickets, so finely wrought as to be indistinguishable from 253 00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:51,320 Speaker 3: the real thing. Challoner and Carter sold Davis about one 254 00:15:51,360 --> 00:15:56,520 Speaker 3: hundred tickets, the first of many more they promised. Challoner 255 00:15:56,640 --> 00:16:01,440 Speaker 3: stood to make hundreds, if not thousands, of pounds off 256 00:16:01,480 --> 00:16:04,880 Speaker 3: the scheme. It was like printing money, because it was 257 00:16:05,120 --> 00:16:20,840 Speaker 3: printing money. Easypasy lemon squeeze at two the silver tungued man. 258 00:16:22,080 --> 00:16:24,920 Speaker 3: By the time Davis was handed that big stack of 259 00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:28,440 Speaker 3: mat lottery tickets. He was sure that Challoner was the 260 00:16:28,520 --> 00:16:33,720 Speaker 3: man who'd engraved the plate. But David Davis had a secret, 261 00:16:34,280 --> 00:16:39,760 Speaker 3: a big one. Davis was an undercover agent, and he 262 00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:45,600 Speaker 3: was after Challoner, but he wasn't working for Newton. He 263 00:16:45,720 --> 00:16:49,040 Speaker 3: was working for the Secretary of State, James Vernon. The 264 00:16:49,080 --> 00:16:52,440 Speaker 3: Secretary of State was a cabinet ministerial position, but it 265 00:16:52,600 --> 00:16:55,400 Speaker 3: was just at this moment shifting from being like an 266 00:16:55,480 --> 00:16:59,680 Speaker 3: actual secretary to dealing with bigger domestic and civil issues. 267 00:17:00,520 --> 00:17:03,640 Speaker 3: When Davis made that deal with Carter, it was Vernon's money, 268 00:17:03,760 --> 00:17:06,720 Speaker 3: the State's money, that he paid him with, And when 269 00:17:06,760 --> 00:17:10,040 Speaker 3: Carter brought him news that the plates were finished, Davis 270 00:17:10,119 --> 00:17:11,880 Speaker 3: went straight back to Vernon. 271 00:17:13,640 --> 00:17:17,159 Speaker 9: I addressed myself to the right Honorable Secretary Vernon, and 272 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:20,639 Speaker 9: did acquaintum that a malt ticket plate was counterfeited, and 273 00:17:20,680 --> 00:17:24,200 Speaker 9: that to prevent the distributions of several false tickets, there 274 00:17:24,240 --> 00:17:27,840 Speaker 9: was a necessity to secure some that were done and 275 00:17:27,880 --> 00:17:30,760 Speaker 9: to subsist the persons that had done them till I 276 00:17:30,800 --> 00:17:34,639 Speaker 9: could obtain the advantage of seizing Challoner and of securing 277 00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:35,159 Speaker 9: the plate. 278 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:38,920 Speaker 3: Davis and Vernon worked out the next part of their 279 00:17:38,960 --> 00:17:40,639 Speaker 3: plan to catch Challenge. 280 00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:43,399 Speaker 9: I returned to Carter, telling him I had a friend 281 00:17:43,480 --> 00:17:46,520 Speaker 9: that would take two thousand pounds worth of false tickets, 282 00:17:46,840 --> 00:17:49,600 Speaker 9: desiring him to let me have all the counterfeits that 283 00:17:49,640 --> 00:17:52,720 Speaker 9: were taken off the plate, upon which Carter gave me 284 00:17:52,840 --> 00:17:58,000 Speaker 9: a considerable parcel. Having thus secured all which I understood 285 00:17:58,160 --> 00:17:59,400 Speaker 9: were printed. 286 00:18:00,240 --> 00:18:03,200 Speaker 3: Davis and Vernon believed that they had the situation contained. 287 00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:06,439 Speaker 3: They believed that they had all the fake tickets that 288 00:18:06,480 --> 00:18:10,840 Speaker 3: had been printed. Davis's next job was to find those plates, 289 00:18:11,480 --> 00:18:14,280 Speaker 3: but Davis couldn't get a straight answer about where the 290 00:18:14,320 --> 00:18:19,440 Speaker 3: plates were. He proposed that the engraver, actually Challener, print 291 00:18:19,560 --> 00:18:21,880 Speaker 3: as many tickets as the plates could handle, and then 292 00:18:21,960 --> 00:18:24,160 Speaker 3: break the plate in two so that no one could 293 00:18:24,200 --> 00:18:28,639 Speaker 3: copy his work. Challener didn't know, obviously that Davis wanted 294 00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:32,440 Speaker 3: to use the broken plates as evidence against him, but 295 00:18:32,520 --> 00:18:36,680 Speaker 3: Carter kept putting him off, and Vernon was getting pissed. 296 00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:42,240 Speaker 9: The right Honorable Secretary Vernon seemed very much dissatisfied at 297 00:18:42,240 --> 00:18:45,200 Speaker 9: these delays, which I hoped to bring to a period 298 00:18:45,320 --> 00:18:46,000 Speaker 9: every day. 299 00:18:47,080 --> 00:18:51,320 Speaker 3: And here's where things start to get really complicated. As 300 00:18:51,359 --> 00:18:54,199 Speaker 3: it turns out what was keeping Challeener from printing those 301 00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:59,920 Speaker 3: last tickets was that he was being pursued by Elizabeth Halla. 302 00:19:01,560 --> 00:19:06,400 Speaker 3: That's right, Thomas Holloway's wife and the gang's former utterer. 303 00:19:07,320 --> 00:19:10,399 Speaker 3: Hell hath no fury like a woman shorted out of 304 00:19:10,400 --> 00:19:16,200 Speaker 3: her fair share. When Challoner bribed her husband to light 305 00:19:16,240 --> 00:19:19,800 Speaker 3: out for Scotland. He'd stiffed them, didn't give them what 306 00:19:19,880 --> 00:19:24,199 Speaker 3: he promised. Elizabeth, back from Scotland, was now using what 307 00:19:24,359 --> 00:19:27,520 Speaker 3: she knew to threaten Challoner. She'd turn him over to 308 00:19:27,560 --> 00:19:29,960 Speaker 3: the warden of the Royal Mint if he didn't pay up. 309 00:19:30,960 --> 00:19:34,639 Speaker 3: So Davis waited and waited, and Vernon got more irritated, 310 00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:38,040 Speaker 3: and the whole thing was starting to look like an 311 00:19:38,119 --> 00:19:42,240 Speaker 3: expensive mess, thousands of pounds lost and nothing to show 312 00:19:42,280 --> 00:19:44,280 Speaker 3: for it except some bits of colorful paper. 313 00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:47,800 Speaker 6: At this rate, the nation may be imposed upon. While 314 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:48,800 Speaker 6: you're talking to. 315 00:19:48,840 --> 00:19:51,800 Speaker 9: Me, I will either find Challoner a printing with the 316 00:19:51,840 --> 00:19:54,639 Speaker 9: plates in a week's time, or otherwise it will be 317 00:19:54,680 --> 00:19:55,760 Speaker 9: in your honest discretion. 318 00:19:56,560 --> 00:20:00,119 Speaker 3: Carter then had more bad news for Davis, because, as 319 00:20:00,200 --> 00:20:03,040 Speaker 3: of the heat Elizabeth was applying, Challoner had stashed the 320 00:20:03,040 --> 00:20:05,480 Speaker 3: plates with a lady friend, a midwife by the name 321 00:20:05,480 --> 00:20:09,199 Speaker 3: of Samson from over Clare Market Way, near Drooling, and 322 00:20:09,359 --> 00:20:12,760 Speaker 3: she'd gone into the country, no idea when she'd be back. 323 00:20:14,280 --> 00:20:18,040 Speaker 3: Things got worse for Davis. He learned that Carter had 324 00:20:18,080 --> 00:20:21,240 Speaker 3: sold some of the fake tickets to someone other than him, 325 00:20:21,440 --> 00:20:24,520 Speaker 3: meaning that there were fake lottery tickets out in the streets, 326 00:20:25,080 --> 00:20:28,440 Speaker 3: precisely the situation that the Secretary of State was trying 327 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:32,879 Speaker 3: to avoid. Vernon had had enough. He told Davis to 328 00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:36,400 Speaker 3: arrest Carter, and then Blates or no Plates put out 329 00:20:36,400 --> 00:20:40,639 Speaker 3: a reward for the capture of William Challoner, fifty pounds 330 00:20:40,680 --> 00:20:46,920 Speaker 3: of real, actual money. In October sixteen ninety eight, Challoner 331 00:20:47,040 --> 00:20:53,840 Speaker 3: was arrested again and again remanded to Newgate Jail. Disappointingly, 332 00:20:54,119 --> 00:20:57,720 Speaker 3: there was no dramatic scene in the Lord's Justices. 333 00:20:58,119 --> 00:21:01,720 Speaker 2: Isaac Newton didn't get to yell arrest that man down 334 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:02,160 Speaker 2: a hall. 335 00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:05,920 Speaker 3: In fact, we don't even know how Challoner was found, 336 00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:08,560 Speaker 3: just that a thief taker called Robert Morris became fifty 337 00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:10,040 Speaker 3: pounds richer for bringing him in. 338 00:21:13,359 --> 00:21:14,840 Speaker 2: But at no point. 339 00:21:14,640 --> 00:21:17,520 Speaker 3: During the search for William Challoner did anyone in the 340 00:21:17,560 --> 00:21:21,640 Speaker 3: Secretary of State's office communicate with the mint. I mean, 341 00:21:22,160 --> 00:21:25,679 Speaker 3: why would they This isn't modern policing we're talking about. Technically, 342 00:21:25,880 --> 00:21:29,240 Speaker 3: Challenger's arrest was Secretary of State James Vernon's big catch 343 00:21:29,720 --> 00:21:33,280 Speaker 3: that made Challener his problem. Moreover, the crime of counterfeiting 344 00:21:33,280 --> 00:21:37,679 Speaker 3: the mat lottery tickets was an actuality, not a mint problem, 345 00:21:37,760 --> 00:21:42,440 Speaker 3: because it wasn't coin whose problem, wasn't whoa that was 346 00:21:42,480 --> 00:21:43,160 Speaker 3: an open question. 347 00:21:47,400 --> 00:21:50,880 Speaker 2: Isaac Newton, however, was ready and eager. 348 00:21:50,600 --> 00:21:54,720 Speaker 3: To make it his problem once he found out about 349 00:21:54,840 --> 00:21:55,639 Speaker 3: Challenger's arrest. 350 00:21:55,760 --> 00:21:58,760 Speaker 2: That is, we don't know how he found out. 351 00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:01,320 Speaker 3: It was either through his own agents or through his 352 00:22:01,359 --> 00:22:04,640 Speaker 3: other contacts, but we do know that he was not 353 00:22:04,760 --> 00:22:07,040 Speaker 3: going to let William Challoner wriggle off. 354 00:22:06,920 --> 00:22:08,359 Speaker 2: The hook this time. 355 00:22:13,920 --> 00:22:18,000 Speaker 3: Act three, the case against mister William Challoner. 356 00:22:19,520 --> 00:22:22,560 Speaker 8: The defeat in that first court case really stung Newton. 357 00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:25,680 Speaker 3: That's Tom Levinson, author of Newton and the Counterfeiter. 358 00:22:25,840 --> 00:22:28,720 Speaker 8: From the point that Challeoner gets off that first time, 359 00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:33,639 Speaker 8: Newton really spends a lot of effort tracking Challenger's movements, 360 00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:38,360 Speaker 8: trying to identify the different schemes he's in, trying to 361 00:22:38,359 --> 00:22:40,040 Speaker 8: put the bite on his associates. 362 00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:44,119 Speaker 3: Newton convinced Vernon to let him be the one to 363 00:22:44,160 --> 00:22:46,200 Speaker 3: prosecute Challoner once again. 364 00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:48,440 Speaker 2: However, the evidence was thin. 365 00:22:49,240 --> 00:22:51,600 Speaker 3: Challoner had been smart to ditch the plates when he did, 366 00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:54,119 Speaker 3: and when he was arrested, he didn't have any of 367 00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:57,639 Speaker 3: the counterfeit tickets on him. The best evidence that Newton 368 00:22:57,760 --> 00:23:01,800 Speaker 3: had was Carter's testimony. Carter, who was one of the 369 00:23:01,840 --> 00:23:06,080 Speaker 3: gang who'd actually been caught passing the counterfeit notes. Newton 370 00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:09,639 Speaker 3: realized that while the plates remained at large, convincing a 371 00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:13,760 Speaker 3: jury that Challeener was guilty of that specific crime was 372 00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:16,119 Speaker 3: going to be much more difficult than convincing a jury 373 00:23:16,119 --> 00:23:18,879 Speaker 3: that Challeener was guilty of a whole bunch of counterfeiting 374 00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:19,720 Speaker 3: related crimes. 375 00:23:20,200 --> 00:23:23,880 Speaker 10: But the prosecution, they're the agent who would to devise 376 00:23:23,960 --> 00:23:25,120 Speaker 10: what the charge would be. 377 00:23:25,320 --> 00:23:27,359 Speaker 3: That's legal historian Harry Potter. 378 00:23:27,600 --> 00:23:30,399 Speaker 10: What was neaded to a Javid conviction was to present 379 00:23:30,600 --> 00:23:32,000 Speaker 10: everages of guilt. 380 00:23:32,280 --> 00:23:33,440 Speaker 2: What Newton needed. 381 00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:37,000 Speaker 3: What he was looking for was evidence in the form 382 00:23:37,119 --> 00:23:40,719 Speaker 3: of eyewitnesses, people who would be willing to swear before 383 00:23:40,760 --> 00:23:44,960 Speaker 3: the jury and judge that they saw Challenger counterfeiting. 384 00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:48,800 Speaker 10: Some of the rules of law were not yet established, 385 00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:51,359 Speaker 10: so we didn't really have a presumption. 386 00:23:50,960 --> 00:23:55,120 Speaker 3: Of innuss by modern standards, the evidence of eyewitnesses who 387 00:23:55,160 --> 00:24:00,000 Speaker 3: maybe saw something in the distant past would likely be contestable. 388 00:24:00,880 --> 00:24:03,359 Speaker 3: But this is the late seventeenth century, so as. 389 00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:07,680 Speaker 10: Long as the jury were convinced that they were sufficient 390 00:24:07,680 --> 00:24:09,800 Speaker 10: debutence to convict, they would do so. 391 00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:16,120 Speaker 3: Newton decided to just find as many people as possible 392 00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:20,520 Speaker 3: willing to testify that they had seen Challoner doing something anything, 393 00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:24,520 Speaker 3: at some point, So he started in on everyone who'd 394 00:24:24,560 --> 00:24:26,520 Speaker 3: ever been associated with Challoner. 395 00:24:26,800 --> 00:24:31,040 Speaker 1: Oh, Missus Matthews's maid Mary Ball. In June or July 396 00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:35,640 Speaker 1: last mister Challoner and mister Davis came to my mistress's lodgings, 397 00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:38,800 Speaker 1: and mister Challoner locked himself in a room upstairs. 398 00:24:39,480 --> 00:24:43,480 Speaker 2: Or I was curious, so well through the keol I. 399 00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:45,840 Speaker 1: Saw mister Challoner sitting with his back to me and 400 00:24:45,880 --> 00:24:49,280 Speaker 1: his face towards the window. As he turned his head aside, 401 00:24:49,359 --> 00:24:52,440 Speaker 1: I could save something very bright lying before him, which 402 00:24:52,920 --> 00:24:56,199 Speaker 1: looked like a plate. I am satisfied it was a 403 00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:59,560 Speaker 1: copper plate. It looked like a thing that was scratched. 404 00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:02,960 Speaker 1: Newton seemed to hit upon a good seam of evidence. 405 00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:07,080 Speaker 1: Ask the wives, ask the servants, ask the people on 406 00:25:07,160 --> 00:25:10,280 Speaker 1: the edges of the operation the people who'd have been involved, 407 00:25:10,760 --> 00:25:13,880 Speaker 1: but not so directly that their participation couldn't be pardoned. 408 00:25:13,920 --> 00:25:15,959 Speaker 2: In exchange for information. 409 00:25:16,160 --> 00:25:19,840 Speaker 3: Ask people named Catherine, evidently because he had like three 410 00:25:19,880 --> 00:25:20,240 Speaker 3: of those. 411 00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:22,480 Speaker 11: I saw that he was making bills, and I told 412 00:25:22,560 --> 00:25:24,240 Speaker 11: him he would come to be hanged for it as 413 00:25:24,280 --> 00:25:24,840 Speaker 11: price was. 414 00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:28,040 Speaker 1: Gave me some of those shillings and said they were dangerous, 415 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:30,040 Speaker 1: or else you could make them as well as they 416 00:25:30,040 --> 00:25:32,199 Speaker 1: were in the tower. He told me that he was 417 00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:34,480 Speaker 1: to make a one hundred pounds in Dutch money for 418 00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:37,680 Speaker 1: a merchant, and for that purpose he borrowed a room 419 00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:39,000 Speaker 1: off of me to work in. 420 00:25:39,480 --> 00:25:42,880 Speaker 11: I saw Will Challoner often coined French pistoles with stamps 421 00:25:42,920 --> 00:25:43,439 Speaker 11: and a hammer. 422 00:25:43,720 --> 00:25:45,000 Speaker 2: His brother in law Gravina. 423 00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:47,600 Speaker 11: He said that Will used to make the silver blanks 424 00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:48,960 Speaker 11: they used for Guineas. 425 00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:51,920 Speaker 2: Newton was relentless. 426 00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:55,400 Speaker 3: The same fixation that had him sleeping in his kitchen 427 00:25:55,480 --> 00:25:58,960 Speaker 3: lab in Cambridge had him pulling in witness after witness 428 00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:03,119 Speaker 3: in the hopes of men enough damning testimony to finally 429 00:26:03,359 --> 00:26:04,440 Speaker 3: sink Chaloner. 430 00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:10,199 Speaker 11: I keep the subject constantly before me till the first 431 00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:15,119 Speaker 11: dawnings opened slowly, little by little into the full and 432 00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:16,120 Speaker 11: clear light. 433 00:26:17,119 --> 00:26:20,000 Speaker 3: In one ten day stretch in February sixteen ninety nine, 434 00:26:20,119 --> 00:26:23,560 Speaker 3: he took a deposition every single day. It was probably 435 00:26:23,600 --> 00:26:25,960 Speaker 3: more than that, but Newton later had many of his 436 00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:31,000 Speaker 3: depositions burned. The more Newton dug, the more he uncovered 437 00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:35,000 Speaker 3: people like blacksmith Nathaniel Peck, who bought some fake coins 438 00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:39,280 Speaker 3: off of Chaloner back when he'd been calling himself Chandler Chandler. 439 00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:42,400 Speaker 6: Hath several times owned to me that he made those 440 00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:46,600 Speaker 6: pistoles himself. He used to boast how well they were done, 441 00:26:46,800 --> 00:26:48,919 Speaker 6: and that they were better than ever were made, and 442 00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:53,000 Speaker 6: no man in England could do the like besides himself. 443 00:26:53,280 --> 00:26:56,520 Speaker 2: Or Humphrey Hanwell. Thomas Carter's meat from prison. 444 00:26:56,960 --> 00:27:01,040 Speaker 9: I saw Challoner coin French pistols in line in shape, 445 00:27:01,080 --> 00:27:02,920 Speaker 9: saw it with a hammer in stamps. 446 00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:06,119 Speaker 3: John Abbott, who might have solved the mystery of the 447 00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:09,479 Speaker 3: missing tower dies. Challoner, it seems, had gotten them from 448 00:27:09,520 --> 00:27:10,960 Speaker 3: a man inside the mint. 449 00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:17,159 Speaker 6: William Challoner, now prisoner in Newgate, showed me three or 450 00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:19,600 Speaker 6: four blank stamps for guineas. 451 00:27:19,760 --> 00:27:22,199 Speaker 9: Which he said he could get to be struck with 452 00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:23,240 Speaker 9: the tower dies. 453 00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:28,600 Speaker 3: And then there were the Holloways. Thomas Holloway had once 454 00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:32,080 Speaker 3: been Chaloner's right hand man, his protege in the art 455 00:27:32,080 --> 00:27:35,359 Speaker 3: of coining, but that was before Challoner had swindled him 456 00:27:35,359 --> 00:27:36,480 Speaker 3: in that Scotland deal. 457 00:27:37,080 --> 00:27:39,960 Speaker 9: I heard Challoner own that hey struck some of them 458 00:27:40,119 --> 00:27:43,560 Speaker 9: and boast his workmanship, and have seen the guinea dies 459 00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:44,840 Speaker 9: in Challoner's hands. 460 00:27:45,359 --> 00:27:49,359 Speaker 3: His wife Elizabeth, told Newton that she'd seen Challoner making 461 00:27:49,440 --> 00:27:52,880 Speaker 3: fake guineas and pistols down in Egham just a year before, 462 00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:56,639 Speaker 3: and that he definitely bought her husband off. During his 463 00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:58,680 Speaker 3: last day in Newgate, Michael. 464 00:27:58,359 --> 00:28:01,800 Speaker 1: Gillingham came to the set tom Ali to the baltantn 465 00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:05,680 Speaker 1: Inn in Fleet Street and said Challona, who was then 466 00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:09,720 Speaker 1: a prisonery Newgate, had sent him to tell him Challona 467 00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:13,159 Speaker 1: would give Thomas twenty quid if he would not appear 468 00:28:13,280 --> 00:28:17,639 Speaker 1: as a witness against him in the following sessions. 469 00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:21,480 Speaker 3: The portrait of Chalner that emerged from the testimony of 470 00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:26,640 Speaker 3: the witnesses arrayed against him was damning. He routinely boasted 471 00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:29,520 Speaker 3: of his own skill in counterfeiting. He had a recipe 472 00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:32,520 Speaker 3: for a water that could erase the printing on any bill. 473 00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:35,920 Speaker 3: He threatened people who got in his way. He once 474 00:28:36,040 --> 00:28:38,240 Speaker 3: locked a woman in a room and refused to let 475 00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:40,400 Speaker 3: her out until she gilded the number of guineas he 476 00:28:40,520 --> 00:28:43,640 Speaker 3: told her to. He bribed others to get out of jail, 477 00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:48,800 Speaker 3: informed on anyone he could, and he most definitely absolutely 478 00:28:49,320 --> 00:28:55,880 Speaker 3: had been seen counterfeiting a lot, just not the Mault tickets. 479 00:28:56,240 --> 00:28:59,520 Speaker 2: But it didn't matter. All that testimony added up to 480 00:28:59,640 --> 00:29:00,560 Speaker 2: one thing. 481 00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:06,840 Speaker 3: Newton had a case, and this time, as sure as 482 00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:11,520 Speaker 3: that apple rotten or not always falls to the earth, he. 483 00:29:11,800 --> 00:29:14,680 Speaker 2: Was going to get that conviction. 484 00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:22,320 Speaker 3: Coming up on the final episode of Newton's Law. 485 00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:25,760 Speaker 6: When he arrived there, he made very light of the matter, 486 00:29:26,160 --> 00:29:29,280 Speaker 6: bragging he had a trick left yet. But when he 487 00:29:29,280 --> 00:29:32,760 Speaker 6: heard how many witnesses came in against him, he began 488 00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:33,920 Speaker 6: to droop. 489 00:29:35,040 --> 00:29:39,760 Speaker 9: All you that in the condemned hold do lie, prepare you, 490 00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:43,320 Speaker 9: but tomorrow you shall die. 491 00:29:45,080 --> 00:29:48,440 Speaker 3: Newton's Law is a production of iHeartRadio. It's written and 492 00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:52,120 Speaker 3: hosted by me Linda Rodriguez McRobbie. Our senior producer is 493 00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:56,160 Speaker 3: Ryan Murdoch. Our producer is Emily Meronoff. Our executive producer 494 00:29:56,240 --> 00:30:00,360 Speaker 3: is Jason English. Original music by Elise McCoy, with editing 495 00:30:00,400 --> 00:30:04,280 Speaker 3: help from Mary Do Sound design and mixing by Jeremy Thal, 496 00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:08,720 Speaker 3: Research and fact checking by Me and Jocelyn Sears. Voice 497 00:30:08,760 --> 00:30:12,600 Speaker 3: acting by Keith Fleming, Mark McDonald, Robert Jack, Paul Tinto, 498 00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:17,080 Speaker 3: Emma Fulkins and Ruthie Stevens. Special thanks to Tom Levinson 499 00:30:17,120 --> 00:30:21,800 Speaker 3: and Harry Potter. Special thanks to Mangesh Hatikudur and Finaflet Studios. 500 00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:26,040 Speaker 3: Our show logo is designed by Lucy Quintania. Thanks so 501 00:30:26,120 --> 00:30:26,880 Speaker 3: much for listening. 502 00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:38,000 Speaker 9: It's a very curious thing.