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Speaker 1: I have had sex with a guy who like he came,

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Speaker 1: and I didn't even know he came because he was

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Speaker 1: so dead silent, where you silent silent. There's been so

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Speaker 1: much happening recently, and I've been consuming so much media

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Speaker 1: that I feel like we should slow the brakes today

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Speaker 1: a little bit and just talk about what we've been watching, reading,

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Speaker 1: listening to, you know, really get into like a little

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Speaker 1: a little key um what we're vibing. Yeah, and you know,

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Speaker 1: of course, you know, next time we'll we'll do another

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Speaker 1: deep dive into a more nostalgic cultural object. But today

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Speaker 1: we're you know, talking about what's going on at the moment,

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Speaker 1: because this is like a virgin the show where we

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Speaker 1: give yesterday's pop culture, and I do mean the pop

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Speaker 1: culture from literally yesterday today's takes. I'm Rose, damn you,

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Speaker 1: and I'm fran Toronto. How are you doing? Would you

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Speaker 1: do this weekend? Um? Well, the weekend was great. I

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Speaker 1: just like kind of spent the weekend indoors. I had

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Speaker 1: people over for brunch. We watched ever After, I had people, well,

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Speaker 1: I watched ever After recently too. Did you have fun?

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Speaker 1: It was? It was great? Angelica Huston it's Oh. I

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Speaker 1: thought I thought that she was one of those girls

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Speaker 1: that like she's like, no, it's huston, okay, thank you?

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Speaker 1: Um should we do and have our after episode? I

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Speaker 1: don't maybe a Drew, a Drew Barrymore episode. I honestly

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Speaker 1: think it's a Drew. It's a Drew episode for sure,

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Speaker 1: because ever after it's amazing. But to me, it would

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Speaker 1: have to be a larger discussion about like Cinderella adapt

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Speaker 1: weights or something. You know what would be good though,

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Speaker 1: is a fairy Dale adaptation episode? Yes, because I think

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Speaker 1: there's a lot because then we could do like into

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Speaker 1: the Woods, we could do like I don't know, I

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Speaker 1: think that opens up a lot of things. Actually, even

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Speaker 1: just Cinderella adaptations gives us like Brandy gives us the

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Speaker 1: Cape Blanchet, Cinderella give Okay, well we're gonna work. Well

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Speaker 1: we'll we'll chop it, we'll ChRI it. But anyways, ever

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Speaker 1: after it was great. Angelica Houston was I mean, she

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Speaker 1: was the whole movie. She I forgot how could anyone

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Speaker 1: love a pebble in their shoe? Or when she was like,

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Speaker 1: do not contribute to the silence unless you can improve it,

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Speaker 1: I was like damn amazing actress. I think I really

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Speaker 1: forgot how clever the whole movie is, how good the

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Speaker 1: dialogue is. Um, how Drew really wear some ugly, ugly

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Speaker 1: dresses in that movie? Also some gorgeous dresses. My favorite

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Speaker 1: lasters is My favorite look of hers is when she

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Speaker 1: goes to meet him in the abandoned castle and she's

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Speaker 1: wearing like a like a red velvet number. I did

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Speaker 1: not like all of her dress, says except for the

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Speaker 1: last one. We will agree to degree. Yeah, I was.

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Speaker 1: I was isolated. People disagreed with me. That people that

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Speaker 1: I was viewing with also disagreed with me. But I

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Speaker 1: was just so maybe that means you have bad taste.

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Speaker 1: You know, I actually have great taste. As I've said

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Speaker 1: on the podcast, I've always had a great taste with

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Speaker 1: some with some exceptions. But I was going to tell

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Speaker 1: you just a few So Rose, what have you been

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Speaker 1: like listening to consuming this weekend? Like? Have you just

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Speaker 1: were you? I saw you were in Malibu? Question mark? Yes, Um,

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Speaker 1: I went to the beach yesterday. We went to zooma

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Speaker 1: beach and Malibu. You know, I'm like not really a

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Speaker 1: beach girl. I'm a pool girl like you know, being

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Speaker 1: from Florida. Um, but it was perfect beach day. We

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Speaker 1: drove up there in the morning, We're there for a

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Speaker 1: couple of hours and then like left by three pm,

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Speaker 1: which is, you know, perfect for me. I cannot I

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Speaker 1: cannot go to the beach with people who want to

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Speaker 1: be there literally all day. Yeah, I know, but you

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Speaker 1: are you are a Caucasian and you do need allies

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Speaker 1: in that in that situation. But you know, we had

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Speaker 1: we had a an umbrella, so I was able to

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Speaker 1: be in the shade um an umbrella ella an umbrella

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Speaker 1: la la a a. But I did get some son,

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Speaker 1: do you have more freckles? Now? I do have a

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Speaker 1: lot more freckles. But I also did use some of

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Speaker 1: my weekend to catch up on some you know, cultural things.

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Speaker 1: The big thing is f Y Island ended, and the

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Speaker 1: twists were twisting. The twists were twisting, so spoilers for

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Speaker 1: anyone watching. But f Boy Island ended, and the final

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Speaker 1: twist was that Nikki Glazer revealed to the girls that

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Speaker 1: instead of just either choosing a nice guy and getting

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Speaker 1: to split the money with him, or choosing an f

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Speaker 1: boy and the f boy having the ability to either

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Speaker 1: split the money or take all of it. There was

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Speaker 1: a third option where the women could choose themselves and

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Speaker 1: keep all of them money, which I was gagged. I

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Speaker 1: was screaming, shooting and hollering at a really good twist.

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Speaker 1: I was hoping that they were all going to do it.

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Speaker 1: That's the thing that was. Like, I mean, obviously it's

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Speaker 1: reality TV that's been produced to the instagrae like This

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Speaker 1: Girl is scripted during some parts, But like I I

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Speaker 1: just don't understand anybody that would not choose a hundred

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Speaker 1: thousand dollars, like even after taxes, that so much money, Like,

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Speaker 1: come on us, after taxes is considerably less money, and

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Speaker 1: zero dollars is no money. There's no money. Um so

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Speaker 1: my I've already sent you a voice memo with all

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Speaker 1: of my takes. But like, I think it's infuriating that

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Speaker 1: Ms Mercedes did not take the hundred thousand dollars in dash.

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Speaker 1: That would have been way more satisfying. It would have

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Speaker 1: been up to our predictions. He is such a piece

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Speaker 1: of ship and they're clearly not even going to last

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Speaker 1: very long, so like why even a week? It's a charade,

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Speaker 1: like Mercedes is putting on a charade of being a

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Speaker 1: nice guy, and I hate him. I feel like he

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Speaker 1: realized how bad he looked over over the course of

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Speaker 1: the show and wanted to try to rehabilitate his image

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Speaker 1: at the end. That's the worst part if you are

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Speaker 1: on a reality TV show, Do not do not self analyze,

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Speaker 1: do not self perceive, Like it just makes the whole

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Speaker 1: thing worse. Like no self awareness, you should be a

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Speaker 1: black mirror upon which, um, you know. I wished Louise

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Speaker 1: was my favorite character from beginning to end, and I

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Speaker 1: was kind of thinking she was going to turn out

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Speaker 1: to be the f girl who took the money, but

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Speaker 1: spoiler alert, it was Tamaris was the only one who

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Speaker 1: picked herself and revealed herself to be an F girl,

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Speaker 1: and I honestly, the clues were there all season. Obviously

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Speaker 1: kind of showed she had said many times that she

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Speaker 1: cheated before, she'd lied, before she was a player, that

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Speaker 1: she dumps guys with no emotion like, so I was like,

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Speaker 1: you know, good for her, and I kind of I

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Speaker 1: loved actually the moment where they showed the guy crying

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Speaker 1: and then as soon as he left, she was like,

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Speaker 1: can I get makeup in here? That was so fucking

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Speaker 1: funny because it was like the immediate switch, um from

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Speaker 1: the I mean Tommy Boy, Poor Tommy Boy. Um the

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Speaker 1: like FARTI trombone sounds that put underneath him. Tommy Boy

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Speaker 1: will be fine. But another another incredible season of reality television. Truly,

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Speaker 1: are you a Louise Tamaris or where are we both?

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Speaker 1: To Maris's I'm definitely Tamaris. I think you're more of

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Speaker 1: a Louise. Am I more of Louise Louise. The thing is,

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Speaker 1: I will say at the I I really do cut

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Speaker 1: and run like you're an f girl. I'm not saying

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Speaker 1: you're not a girl, but you also are legitimately Louise.

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Speaker 1: You are looking for love. Also on a trio Max,

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Speaker 1: Harley Quinn came back. You know, friend and I have

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Speaker 1: talked before about how Harley Quinn was one of our

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Speaker 1: favorite shows of last year. It's back in its third

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Speaker 1: season the Pandemic find. Yeah, we have both only watched

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Speaker 1: the first episode, I think. Um. We talked about how

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Speaker 1: we're both kind of saving it for like a Saturday

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Speaker 1: morning cartoon SNAr um, So I just haven't gotten around

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Speaker 1: to watching more of it. But in the first episode

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Speaker 1: is great. It was Harley and Poison Ivy are together.

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Speaker 1: Now they're on like they're going on like an international

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Speaker 1: honeymoon funck fest. It's beautiful. It's the show remains so funny.

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Speaker 1: I laugh out loud all the time it's starting, and

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Speaker 1: it's starting with a kind of more emotional honest, the

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Speaker 1: emotionally honest kind of plot points of like what's not

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Speaker 1: going right in their relationship, the little clues about where

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Speaker 1: their disconnects are, where their miscommunications are, which, like I

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Speaker 1: kind of wish it would start with like the fun stuff,

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Speaker 1: but like you know, the show is very layered, and

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Speaker 1: I really I'm excited to see where it goes. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I can't wait. I have to go in a little

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Speaker 1: rant about another HBO show that is not good? Um,

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Speaker 1: do you watch Westworld? Have you ever watched Westworld? No?

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Speaker 1: I probably you know, as I always say, the next

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Speaker 1: time I have the flu, I will definitely watch the

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Speaker 1: first season, but just the first season. I would never

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Speaker 1: watch more than watch only the first season, because the

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Speaker 1: first season of Westworld was great, It was amazing. Even

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Speaker 1: the second season of West World was had moments of

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Speaker 1: brilliance and was otherwise, like the third season of rest

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Speaker 1: World was rotted. Should have never happened. The fourth season,

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Speaker 1: which is airing now, lured me back in somehow, making

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Speaker 1: me think it would be good again. People were talking

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Speaker 1: about it, and just every week has gotten worse and worse,

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Speaker 1: and I feel like I'm losing my mind triasically. It's

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Speaker 1: basically just like the Matrix now. And the thing that

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Speaker 1: I wanted to bring up is like, obviously I don't

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Speaker 1: want to talk about like the particulars of the show,

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Speaker 1: like it's very it's all very hetty and stupid, and

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Speaker 1: like it's it's it's exactly as yes, it is exactly

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Speaker 1: as dumb as it thinks it's smart, which is infuriating.

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Speaker 1: But one of the things I've noticed is that, especially

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Speaker 1: this season, there is so much suicide depicted on the show.

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Speaker 1: Like the robots are constantly killing themselves. Um, you know,

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Speaker 1: death doesn't death doesn't mean the same thing on the

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Speaker 1: show because people are robots that can be brought back,

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Speaker 1: but also the human characters are killing themselves, and it's

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Speaker 1: at a point where it has become almost like fetishistic,

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Speaker 1: the way that people are constantly killing themselves. And it's

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Speaker 1: just something about it to me, and I'm not usually

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Speaker 1: like the morality Police with with media, Like I'm like,

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Speaker 1: go off, I want to see funked up should happen.

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Speaker 1: But it's just it's just really weird and it actually

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Speaker 1: is making me on comfortable what you yeah, because it's

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Speaker 1: just so indulgent, like it doesn't really it's like for

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Speaker 1: the sake of it, there's no asition to the violence.

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Speaker 1: Yeah there. It really feels like there could have been

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Speaker 1: a better storytelling choice to get kind of the same

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Speaker 1: point across. That's such a bummer. I mean, I honestly

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Speaker 1: getting sucked into a show is the worst. And I

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Speaker 1: really appreciate when people are like just watched the first

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Speaker 1: season because that's the only thing I would do with

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Speaker 1: West World. Honestly, That's what I'm doing with Damages right now,

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Speaker 1: which like I can't discuss well like well for another podcast,

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Speaker 1: Like it's just the reason you need. The main reason

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Speaker 1: I'm still watching West World is like a I do

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Speaker 1: still kind of want to know how it how it ends,

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Speaker 1: and I'm sure it will get canceled after this season.

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Speaker 1: There's no way with all the HBO stuff happening, like

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Speaker 1: with the business things, that this show, which like literally

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Speaker 1: four people are watching, will get renewed. But Also another

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Speaker 1: reason why I watch it is because who weekly do

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Speaker 1: recaps on their on their weekly Patreon episodes and they're

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Speaker 1: really funny, and so I literally watched the episodes just

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Speaker 1: so I have the context to listen to that fun

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Speaker 1: at least, Yes, but funck Westworld. Um So, I have

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Speaker 1: a movie recommendation for you that I really think you

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Speaker 1: should watch. Um so we can discuss a little bit

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Speaker 1: more at length in the future. There's this new movie

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Speaker 1: out called Not Okay. It's on Hulu. It's stars Zoe Deutsch,

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Speaker 1: who's like just one of those girlies, one of the girls. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know, she's I think she's an nepotism baby. And

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Speaker 1: it's about this like a loser photo editor who works

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Speaker 1: at sort of like a vice magazine analog and she

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Speaker 1: really wants to be a writer, and like everyone in

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Speaker 1: her office hates her in sort of a way that's

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Speaker 1: almost like a caricature, Like they're like, you're a fucking loser,

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Speaker 1: even though she's like hot and like is like almost

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Speaker 1: like disgustingly on trend, like she has those like streaks

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Speaker 1: that every girl had less year, the chunky rings, and

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Speaker 1: you know, like so she decides that to seem cool.

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Speaker 1: She's going to fake going on a trip to Paris

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Speaker 1: to a writer's workshop, and while she's supposed to be

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Speaker 1: in Paris, a terrorist attack happens there, so everyone in

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Speaker 1: her life thinks that she was part of the attack,

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Speaker 1: and all of a sudden, she starts getting attention for it,

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Speaker 1: and she realizes that she can use her victimhood as

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Speaker 1: a way to become an influencer, and in doing so,

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Speaker 1: she meets this young high school girl who is a

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Speaker 1: school shooting survivor and becomes friends with her. And it

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Speaker 1: obviously gets very messy and dramatic, but it's really funny.

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Speaker 1: It's really smartly written. I think it has some very

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Speaker 1: interesting things to say about influence our culture. I don't

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Speaker 1: think it's a perfect movie by any means, but what

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Speaker 1: I loved is that she, the protagonist, is a horrible person,

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Speaker 1: and she is it does the movie does have some

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Speaker 1: maybe not sympathy, but empathy for her, and she does not,

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Speaker 1: you know, get any sort of like Redemption arc Um.

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Speaker 1: But it was a really good movie. Um. I think

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Speaker 1: it's a first time filmmaker who wrote and directed it

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Speaker 1: very excited to see what she does next. And I

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Speaker 1: think you would really enjoy it. I'm honestly surprised that

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Speaker 1: that you liked it, because I feel like it's so hard,

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Speaker 1: especially for consumers like us, to to make a good

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Speaker 1: movie that is also a commentary on social media and

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Speaker 1: or influencers. Like that stuff gets really cringe really fast.

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Speaker 1: Like I did not really like Ingrid Goes West all

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Speaker 1: that much, Like I've never seen it. You you know,

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Speaker 1: that has a lot of really redeeming elements to it. Um.

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Speaker 1: I think that, like, you know, more often than not,

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Speaker 1: the people writing about social media or writing about you know,

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Speaker 1: influence or culture whatever that means, are either people that

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Speaker 1: are do not participate in it, and so they're creating

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Speaker 1: these weird caricatures that are like not funny, or they're

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Speaker 1: two inside of it and they think it's way more

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Speaker 1: interesting than it actually is. And I think that, you know,

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Speaker 1: this kind of stuff is like best when it's the punchline, right,

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Speaker 1: And I think this is a really good segue to Bodies, Bodies, Bodies.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if you you watched that, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I saw an early screening of it in June. I

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Speaker 1: finally saw it last week, and I felt, what did

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Speaker 1: you think? Well, you know, I felt like the commentary

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Speaker 1: on just like us as you know, gen Z millennial

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Speaker 1: kind of like influencer types were at times the movie's

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Speaker 1: strongest points and also some of the biggest joke flops.

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Speaker 1: And obviously Rachel Senate was the moment for that, and

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Speaker 1: she she was kind of the movie for me, was

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Speaker 1: the movie. I actually don't think the movie would have

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Speaker 1: worked without her. I totally agree. I thought every I

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Speaker 1: loved everything about the movie. I thought it was actually

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Speaker 1: really thrilling. I thought the twist at the end was

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Speaker 1: somehow I didn't I didn't even I mean like it

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Speaker 1: felt very obvious towards the end, but like at the

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Speaker 1: same time, I didn't predict it, did not see it coming,

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Speaker 1: did not see it coming, and um, but the I

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Speaker 1: think the reason I get to that is like, despite

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Speaker 1: the fact that Rachel, I mean, Rachel was the best

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Speaker 1: I think, the most fun to watch on screen, but

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Speaker 1: all the other performances obviously great, But like Rachel's character

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Speaker 1: specifically is like a kind of meta commentary on a

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Speaker 1: very specific person you'll meet at a party or at

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Speaker 1: a on a group vacation. Like I felt like I

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Speaker 1: knew her. I felt like I knew a lot of

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Speaker 1: the characters, um, and I felt felt like some of

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Speaker 1: the kind of you know jokes that make fun of

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Speaker 1: girls like her were very funny, and then some of

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Speaker 1: them were two on the nose. I also watched, speaking

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Speaker 1: of slashers, I finally watched that They Slash Them movie?

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Speaker 1: Have you have you heard it? For the Virgins? If

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Speaker 1: you don't know, there's this Peacock original that you know.

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Speaker 1: The title is they Them, but it's supposed to be

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Speaker 1: pronounced they slash them, or as Thomas Muster said it

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Speaker 1: should speaking. I was at the at the screening with

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Speaker 1: Thomas Patos and they pronounced it they slash them, and

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Speaker 1: which I think is much better. Um. Here's the thing again,

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Speaker 1: when movies really want to go in on like making

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Speaker 1: commentary about something, sometimes they forget to be a good movie.

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Speaker 1: And I think, you know, to compare something like Bodies,

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Speaker 1: Bodies Bodies, which is extremely queer, to something like They

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Speaker 1: Slash Them, which is also extremely queer, but like also

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Speaker 1: very very trans like it's a much more trans story. Um,

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Speaker 1: I think that you know, they Slash Them suffered under

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Speaker 1: the weight of the things that was trying to say

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Speaker 1: about gender discrimination justice. Um, but ultimately, you know, had

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Speaker 1: some thrills, had some chills, was not really scary unfortunately,

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Speaker 1: but um good jokes are really great. Um singing montage

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Speaker 1: moment that I won't spoil. Do you think I should

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Speaker 1: watch it? Would I like it? I think that if

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Speaker 1: it happens to be something that you're watching with people

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Speaker 1: or if you have absolutely nothing to do, it is

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Speaker 1: something that you would have a lot of thoughts on. Actually,

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Speaker 1: and THEO Germaine, the lead, who's a friend of mine,

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Speaker 1: is so hot and his THEO is really hot, so hot,

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Speaker 1: and his scene partner is Kevin Bacon pretty much the

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Speaker 1: whole movie. And I heard that the movie was originally

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Speaker 1: supposed to be more specifically about gay conversion therapy, and

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Speaker 1: then they were like, no, no, no, two, we got

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Speaker 1: to make a trans So is the trans stuff done well?

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Speaker 1: Like is it interesting? Does it like add to what

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Speaker 1: the movie is trying to say? And like the horror

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Speaker 1: of it, it adds and it also detracts. And this

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Speaker 1: is I'm really glad you asked that question because it's

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Speaker 1: kind of crystallizing everything that we're talking about, Like you

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Speaker 1: telling me that that like they made they were decided

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Speaker 1: to make it more trans is abundantly obvious to me.

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Speaker 1: It is very clearly. I think the trans issues in

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Speaker 1: the in the movie are really wedged in, and there

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Speaker 1: are moments of discrimination against trans people that are inconsistent.

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Speaker 1: So Kevin Bacon is really transphobic to one trans character

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Speaker 1: and then not transphobic to this other trans character, and

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Speaker 1: the logic of that doesn't really make sense. And then

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Speaker 1: also the experiences of gay and lesbian people on the

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Speaker 1: at the camp and trans people at the camp are

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Speaker 1: kind of conflated, and there's no nuance in discussing how

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Speaker 1: those kinds of oppressions are different, and yet it's trying

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Speaker 1: to say something about it. So like for me, it's like,

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Speaker 1: either you need to clarify what you're trying to say,

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Speaker 1: or just like don't even go into it, Like we

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Speaker 1: can just figure it out and you don't have to

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Speaker 1: really give us this ham fisted like commentary on trans

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Speaker 1: identity spoiler alert. At the end, when we find out

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Speaker 1: who the murderer is, there's this moment where you're kind

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Speaker 1: of like the murderer is kind of like on the

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Speaker 1: side of the queer people, and you're like, oh, this

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Speaker 1: murderer is dope, and like is like doing great things

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Speaker 1: for people, but then the cops come and arrest them,

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Speaker 1: and I was like this, how could this be like

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Speaker 1: a queer movie? And yet the climax is resolved with cops,

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Speaker 1: Like that's I know, that's like how all slashers end.

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Speaker 1: But like you couldnot like fabricate any sort of other

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Speaker 1: cinematic invention that would give us a resolution that does

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Speaker 1: not involve cops, Like, it's just a failure of the

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Speaker 1: imagination to me, um for that to be the ending.

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Speaker 1: Another movie I kind of frayed into this weekend was

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Speaker 1: good luck to you, Leo Grant. Have you have you

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Speaker 1: watched this or heard about it at all. I've heard

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Speaker 1: the premise of it, which is it's it's about like

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Speaker 1: an older woman who's never come and hires a sex worker.

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Speaker 1: That's literally the log line. And it's and it's like

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Speaker 1: a COVID movie. So it's just like the two of

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Speaker 1: them in a hotel room the whole time, exactly, And

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Speaker 1: and that is hard. You know, that's a very specific

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Speaker 1: movie to watch. It's like one set. It's basically a play.

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Speaker 1: I'm not gonna lie and that's fine. Um. Emma Thompson

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Speaker 1: does incredible incredible work, like she actually an interview has

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Speaker 1: described that, like the nudity scene that she does, and

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Speaker 1: it is the hardest thing she's ever had to do

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Speaker 1: as an actress, which is saying something because Emma Tompson,

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Speaker 1: because let's talk about let's talk about her listening to

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Speaker 1: Joni Mitchell and love actually, oh my god, the performance

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Speaker 1: of a life. Um, But it was really what was

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Speaker 1: really fascinating is I've been really excited about this movie.

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Speaker 1: I'd heard a lot of things, a lot of really

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Speaker 1: good things about it, and the movie did not really

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Speaker 1: deliver to me on a lot of what it was

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Speaker 1: trying to say about sex workers, because it was really

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Speaker 1: really trying to say something about sex workers. And what

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Speaker 1: was very interesting to me was that I watched it

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Speaker 1: the day after I rewatched Pretty Woman with a bunch

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Speaker 1: of my friends, one of my favorite movies, one of

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Speaker 1: the greatest movies ever written, and yet one of the

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Speaker 1: most offensive depictions of like sex work like we've ever seen,

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Speaker 1: but also that it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter, and also,

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Speaker 1: like you have to think it was the late eighties

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Speaker 1: and just the fact that that movie was made where

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Speaker 1: the main character was a sex worker and like gets

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Speaker 1: a happy ending, and it's just I think it's a

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Speaker 1: pretty radical movie for its time, and it is one

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Speaker 1: of my favorite movies. And the first time I ever did,

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Speaker 1: I mean, you know, quote unquote drag publicly was on Halloween.

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Speaker 1: I was Julia robertson Pretty Woman my freshm my freshman

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Speaker 1: year of college. You have the wigs, you have that

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Speaker 1: bob nasty? Is that nasty bob? They made her wear

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Speaker 1: that bob for so long, like way more of the

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Speaker 1: movie than she needed to wear that bob, and like

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Speaker 1: you forget, like the sex scenes in that movie are

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Speaker 1: actually so The scene on the reno, oh my god,

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Speaker 1: on the piano is so sexy, so well blocked, so

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Speaker 1: well written. Yeah, it's a great movie. Actually, I truly

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Speaker 1: think this. We need to do a Julia Roberts episode.

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Speaker 1: We absolutely do. We'll bring Caleb here and specifically Julia

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Speaker 1: Roberts rom com Queen Earra like nodding Hill. I've never

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Speaker 1: seen Pretty Woman, my best friend's wedding runaway Bride. I've

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Speaker 1: never seen Mr Pizza. I've never seen Mr Pizza either, So, Virgins,

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Speaker 1: if you would like a Julia Roberts episode, let us

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Speaker 1: know um in the comments. Yeah, and to put a

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Speaker 1: pin on like kind of this the pretty woman of

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Speaker 1: it all. It's like, it's so funny, it's an amazing movie,

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Speaker 1: and yet like the conceit of the movie is like

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Speaker 1: a billionaire treats a woman basically like a like a

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Speaker 1: into puppy kind of like you know, weekend toy thing

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Speaker 1: a week a week only three grant for a week

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Speaker 1: air all the money and even with inflation, it still

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Speaker 1: makes no sense, like financial, it makes no financial And

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Speaker 1: you know the movie was originally called three thousand. That's

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Speaker 1: so fucking stupid. I hate that. Um. Anyways, Richard Gere,

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Speaker 1: who is so sexy and it's the only movie where

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Speaker 1: he's sexy, he you know, treats her like says really

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Speaker 1: offensive things to her face frequently, like is honestly a

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Speaker 1: scum of a human being, and like also has like

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Speaker 1: an entire body of work and life that is like

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Speaker 1: gouging people and like like tricking people, which like you know,

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Speaker 1: he gets his little redemption arc at the end, but

426
00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:49,399
Speaker 1: he becomes class conscious, right, he becomes class conscious whatever.

427
00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:51,840
Speaker 1: But I just thought it was so funny that we

428
00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:55,640
Speaker 1: can have this really kind of like this depiction of

429
00:24:55,680 --> 00:24:58,640
Speaker 1: a sex worker where the sex worker kind of has

430
00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:02,560
Speaker 1: a superhuman ability to deal with their clients bullshit because

431
00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:06,679
Speaker 1: they're just grateful, and that that was unfortunately replicated in

432
00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:12,760
Speaker 1: this Emma Thompson movie Um. Emma Thompson plays a really erratic,

433
00:25:13,840 --> 00:25:20,480
Speaker 1: uh dysfunctional woman who is so she is really really

434
00:25:20,520 --> 00:25:24,680
Speaker 1: bad at boundaries with the with um Darryl McCormick. So

435
00:25:24,800 --> 00:25:26,679
Speaker 1: I gotta give it out to Darryl McCormick, who was

436
00:25:27,359 --> 00:25:30,000
Speaker 1: so amazing this movie. They both were so good. But

437
00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:32,639
Speaker 1: like Emma Thompson plays, plays this woman who just repeatedly

438
00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:36,639
Speaker 1: treats him like an object and treats him like ship

439
00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:39,679
Speaker 1: and asks him really offensive questions and says really insulting

440
00:25:39,720 --> 00:25:41,880
Speaker 1: things to his face and he has to just kind

441
00:25:41,880 --> 00:25:44,080
Speaker 1: of deal with it through the whole movie like he does.

442
00:25:44,359 --> 00:25:47,520
Speaker 1: But does the like does the lens of the film

443
00:25:47,720 --> 00:25:51,200
Speaker 1: show that that stuff is bad? Yes, And that's kind

444
00:25:51,240 --> 00:25:55,000
Speaker 1: of the difference. Well, to some extent, the difference is that,

445
00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:57,480
Speaker 1: like and Pretty Woman, they never tell you why any

446
00:25:57,520 --> 00:25:59,800
Speaker 1: of this is like not how to treat a sex worker.

447
00:25:59,880 --> 00:26:03,520
Speaker 1: Right in Um Good Luck to You, Leo Grand the

448
00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:06,399
Speaker 1: movie is trying to demonstrate what to not do with

449
00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:10,960
Speaker 1: sex workers, and also um just has there's a very

450
00:26:11,040 --> 00:26:15,679
Speaker 1: long p s A in the middle about um just

451
00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:17,719
Speaker 1: like why sex worker is ballad and should be like

452
00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:19,600
Speaker 1: a public service and all this different stuff, Like it

453
00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:21,960
Speaker 1: has a lot to say about the validity of sex work,

454
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:23,720
Speaker 1: which is like, fine, if that's what you're trying to

455
00:26:23,760 --> 00:26:26,320
Speaker 1: do with the movie. I don't really enjoy like pedantic

456
00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:29,800
Speaker 1: moments like that. I think it creates limitations around what

457
00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:33,040
Speaker 1: can be a really good story. But it's still had.

458
00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:34,840
Speaker 1: I think it checked all the right boxes of what

459
00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:38,560
Speaker 1: it was trying to say. It's just the um I

460
00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:42,080
Speaker 1: want a story about sex work where we don't have

461
00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:47,400
Speaker 1: this transformative like look at this upstanding hooker and how

462
00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:50,600
Speaker 1: like you know, well behaved they are now, and how

463
00:26:50,640 --> 00:26:53,880
Speaker 1: like nice and saint like they are. It's like, actually,

464
00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:57,360
Speaker 1: like sex workers don't have to be saints, and they

465
00:26:57,400 --> 00:27:02,600
Speaker 1: don't have to be these like like healing like fixers

466
00:27:02,640 --> 00:27:05,119
Speaker 1: that come in and like make you better and they

467
00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:07,399
Speaker 1: have like nothing better to do with their lives. Like

468
00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:11,119
Speaker 1: I felt with both movies they were very disinterested in

469
00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:13,080
Speaker 1: like the inner life of the sex worker, though it's

470
00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:15,960
Speaker 1: much more explored in the Emma Thompson movie because the

471
00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:19,280
Speaker 1: acting is so good, but it's just like, you know, yes,

472
00:27:19,320 --> 00:27:21,879
Speaker 1: like sex workers have to do tons of emotional labor.

473
00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:24,399
Speaker 1: A lot of sex workers have to be therapists for

474
00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:28,080
Speaker 1: their clients sometimes, but just like I want their life too,

475
00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:34,120
Speaker 1: you know. Yeah, I do think that we have almost

476
00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:38,119
Speaker 1: never had a truly good depiction of sex work in

477
00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:42,720
Speaker 1: a piece of mainstream media. And they're both The thing is,

478
00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:46,520
Speaker 1: they're both great movies. Like, Okay, here's the thing. Pretty

479
00:27:46,520 --> 00:27:49,440
Speaker 1: Woman at the end of the day is a male

480
00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:55,119
Speaker 1: fantasy marketed to women, right, Like it is a I

481
00:27:55,480 --> 00:27:58,719
Speaker 1: get to rent a woman for because I'm a billionaire,

482
00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:00,399
Speaker 1: and I take our around on my day. It's in

483
00:28:00,520 --> 00:28:03,560
Speaker 1: my nice car, and she's so obsessed with me, and

484
00:28:03,560 --> 00:28:05,320
Speaker 1: I get to buy all these nice clothes and like

485
00:28:05,359 --> 00:28:08,200
Speaker 1: whatever and like but at the end of the day,

486
00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:12,560
Speaker 1: like she chooses me and because like you know, because

487
00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:15,560
Speaker 1: I fixed her, like she it's a it's a Cinderella story.

488
00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:19,480
Speaker 1: Like it's not it's a rare rom com where I

489
00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:23,000
Speaker 1: don't think it's like it's not kind of aspirational in

490
00:28:23,040 --> 00:28:26,800
Speaker 1: a way because I think the women who it's being

491
00:28:26,800 --> 00:28:29,160
Speaker 1: marketed to at the time or not being like, oh,

492
00:28:29,240 --> 00:28:31,480
Speaker 1: I want to grow up and be a prostitute, and

493
00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:35,000
Speaker 1: like how this happened to me, which is like pumped

494
00:28:35,080 --> 00:28:39,280
Speaker 1: up because like you know, like being sex work is

495
00:28:39,280 --> 00:28:43,000
Speaker 1: not something that you know, should have stigma around it. Yeah,

496
00:28:43,040 --> 00:28:45,200
Speaker 1: I'm not going to watch that movie. Yeah yeah, I

497
00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:47,360
Speaker 1: don't think I don't think you would like it. Um.

498
00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:51,320
Speaker 1: It's really slow and it's very just like dialogue the

499
00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:54,680
Speaker 1: whole time. That's it. Speaking of movies, I don't think

500
00:28:54,680 --> 00:28:59,560
Speaker 1: you would like I finally watched the Netflix Persuasion adaptation. Oh,

501
00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:03,680
Speaker 1: which girls are mad about this. The girls are really

502
00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:09,200
Speaker 1: mad about it. I honestly, I don't think it's okay.

503
00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:12,400
Speaker 1: Here's the thing it maybe if I had finished the book,

504
00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:16,080
Speaker 1: I would feel differently. I started the book um when

505
00:29:16,080 --> 00:29:19,040
Speaker 1: we were when we were on vacation, I was um

506
00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:21,680
Speaker 1: and just kind of dropped it. I got a little bored.

507
00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:23,600
Speaker 1: And maybe if I had read the book and like

508
00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:26,720
Speaker 1: the story was important to me, Um, I would have

509
00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:29,560
Speaker 1: hated it because even just from what I read, it's

510
00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:33,840
Speaker 1: very different. Um. But I you know, like I enjoyed myself.

511
00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:36,160
Speaker 1: I I had it on while I was taking a bath,

512
00:29:36,240 --> 00:29:38,960
Speaker 1: and it was like very It's like you know, it's

513
00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:43,160
Speaker 1: like a cozy, romantic period piece and like, yes, it's

514
00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:47,040
Speaker 1: it's trying to be fleabag so hard and it's literally

515
00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:50,760
Speaker 1: like have you ever bought anything from from Reformation or

516
00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:56,000
Speaker 1: like gotten their emails their emails that you know their

517
00:29:56,040 --> 00:30:00,000
Speaker 1: emails are like your ex boyfriend called or like, um,

518
00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:02,920
Speaker 1: I've seen enough. I've seen enough Hunter Harris tweets to

519
00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:06,640
Speaker 1: know that I cannot let myself be ensnared by a refreation.

520
00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:10,520
Speaker 1: Like it's like if the person who wrote the copy

521
00:30:10,600 --> 00:30:15,640
Speaker 1: for those Reformation emails wrote an adaptation of Treason, that's

522
00:30:15,760 --> 00:30:21,880
Speaker 1: that's this one. Um. So it's it's stupid and bad,

523
00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:27,160
Speaker 1: and I still enjoyed myself and Dakota Johnson. Dakota Johnson

524
00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:30,120
Speaker 1: like shouldn't have been in it, but like was great

525
00:30:30,160 --> 00:30:33,600
Speaker 1: because she's Dacote Johnson. She has zero chemistry with the

526
00:30:33,760 --> 00:30:37,600
Speaker 1: with the lead, even though he's super sexy. Um, there's

527
00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:41,760
Speaker 1: no kind of like outstanding side characters, which is what

528
00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:47,200
Speaker 1: you want in a Jane Austin adaptation. And it's it's

529
00:30:47,200 --> 00:30:50,120
Speaker 1: not good, but I don't think it's quite as evil

530
00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:55,200
Speaker 1: and like you know, like bad for the culture as

531
00:30:55,280 --> 00:30:57,720
Speaker 1: everyone is making it out to be. I've heard that

532
00:30:57,760 --> 00:31:01,160
Speaker 1: the fandom is very pissed about this adaptation. Why why

533
00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:06,360
Speaker 1: are why are Jane Austen stands mad because of the

534
00:31:06,600 --> 00:31:10,200
Speaker 1: sort of like flea bagification of Persuasion, Like it has

535
00:31:10,240 --> 00:31:14,320
Speaker 1: contemporary dialogue, right, it has, it has contemporary dialogue and sensibility.

536
00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:17,880
Speaker 1: There's but I think that's honestly the the part that

537
00:31:17,920 --> 00:31:21,800
Speaker 1: everyone's getting caught up on and is not the real problem. Like, so,

538
00:31:21,880 --> 00:31:25,240
Speaker 1: Persuasion is the story of a woman who was supposed

539
00:31:25,240 --> 00:31:30,120
Speaker 1: to marry a m a naval officer when she was young,

540
00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:33,560
Speaker 1: but her family persuaded her not to because he had

541
00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:36,920
Speaker 1: no money, and so she has regretted it ever since.

542
00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:39,160
Speaker 1: And eight years later he comes back into her life

543
00:31:39,200 --> 00:31:42,200
Speaker 1: and he has like risen in the ranks and has money.

544
00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:46,280
Speaker 1: Now she's still a spinster. And it's the last book

545
00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:51,400
Speaker 1: Jane Austin completed before her death, and it's very sort

546
00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:53,840
Speaker 1: of like melancholic, and it's about a much different kind

547
00:31:53,880 --> 00:31:56,600
Speaker 1: of love than you see in her earlier works. It's

548
00:31:56,600 --> 00:32:00,640
Speaker 1: about a mature love. It's like a bit sadder and

549
00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:03,040
Speaker 1: and Elliott, in what I read of the book is

550
00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:07,240
Speaker 1: like a very you know, like introspective character. She's very quiet,

551
00:32:07,400 --> 00:32:11,320
Speaker 1: and Dakota Johnson in the movie is like it is

552
00:32:11,400 --> 00:32:13,840
Speaker 1: like speaks directly to the camera and says things like

553
00:32:14,360 --> 00:32:17,160
Speaker 1: we were worse than friends were x is, and like

554
00:32:17,200 --> 00:32:20,320
Speaker 1: there's little jokes like she she's like opening a box

555
00:32:20,360 --> 00:32:23,000
Speaker 1: of letters from Wentworth and she's like he made me

556
00:32:23,040 --> 00:32:26,520
Speaker 1: a playlist and it's like literally like a bunch of

557
00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:29,880
Speaker 1: sheet music tied together. So it's stuff like that that

558
00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:32,000
Speaker 1: people are like making a big deal out of when

559
00:32:32,040 --> 00:32:36,360
Speaker 1: actually the real problem is that the an Elliott of

560
00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:38,760
Speaker 1: the film is just not the same character as in

561
00:32:38,800 --> 00:32:41,160
Speaker 1: the book and like does a lot of things that

562
00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:43,160
Speaker 1: the an Elliott in the book would never do. The

563
00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:45,200
Speaker 1: reason that they're brought together back in the book is

564
00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:51,920
Speaker 1: like the the like mishaps and like conventions of the

565
00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:55,600
Speaker 1: genre that put them back together that Jane Austen was

566
00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:59,520
Speaker 1: so good at and not that like you know, and

567
00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:03,200
Speaker 1: Ellie it was this like manic pixie dream girl, um,

568
00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:06,040
Speaker 1: you know. And also it's like the movie is not pretty.

569
00:33:06,120 --> 00:33:12,080
Speaker 1: The costumes are not lush. It's not that it's giving budget,

570
00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:15,120
Speaker 1: it's giving like they try to make it look contemporary,

571
00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:18,560
Speaker 1: Like it wears a lot of like button down shirts

572
00:33:18,600 --> 00:33:21,120
Speaker 1: over a long dress and it's like, no, give me

573
00:33:21,320 --> 00:33:28,640
Speaker 1: sense and sensibility like glamour. That's their family. Their family

574
00:33:28,680 --> 00:33:32,640
Speaker 1: has to move from the country to Bath because they're poor.

575
00:33:33,240 --> 00:33:35,680
Speaker 1: And someone says, like I've heard that if you're a

576
00:33:35,720 --> 00:33:38,200
Speaker 1: ten in London, you're a five in Bath and like

577
00:33:38,520 --> 00:33:42,480
Speaker 1: things like that are like stupid, but they're just they're

578
00:33:42,520 --> 00:33:45,600
Speaker 1: distracting from the problem with it, which is that I

579
00:33:45,640 --> 00:33:49,040
Speaker 1: think this movie just fundamentally doesn't understand what is beloved

580
00:33:49,040 --> 00:33:51,400
Speaker 1: about its source material and like the kind of love

581
00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:56,800
Speaker 1: it's trying to portray. But that being said, I I

582
00:33:56,800 --> 00:34:01,479
Speaker 1: am always looking for that sort of printing period peace

583
00:34:01,600 --> 00:34:06,880
Speaker 1: like cozy Day movie. And it still is that despite

584
00:34:06,920 --> 00:34:12,040
Speaker 1: not being perfect, So you know, watch it for yourself,

585
00:34:12,160 --> 00:34:14,480
Speaker 1: like make up your own mind. It's not the evil,

586
00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:18,960
Speaker 1: evil thing that people are making it out to be. Okay, great,

587
00:34:32,239 --> 00:34:34,760
Speaker 1: even though you didn't finish Persuasion, whether any other goodness.

588
00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:39,160
Speaker 1: He's got into this weekend. Yeah, I'm reading two books

589
00:34:39,239 --> 00:34:42,840
Speaker 1: right now. Um. One I started earlier in the summer

590
00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:45,400
Speaker 1: and just got back into yesterday when I was at

591
00:34:45,400 --> 00:34:48,600
Speaker 1: the beach. It's called book Lovers by Emily Henry, who's

592
00:34:48,680 --> 00:34:52,800
Speaker 1: like a huge romance author. Um it's her latest book.

593
00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:59,279
Speaker 1: It's a It's a book about a literary agent and

594
00:34:59,360 --> 00:35:03,800
Speaker 1: a literary editor who find themselves in the same small

595
00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:07,560
Speaker 1: town and I suppose are going to have a romance.

596
00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:13,200
Speaker 1: And it's really good. Um so far. It just it

597
00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:14,799
Speaker 1: just took me a while to get into it because

598
00:35:14,800 --> 00:35:18,120
Speaker 1: I wasn't really that interested. But the other book that

599
00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:20,160
Speaker 1: I'm reading that I'm very excited about and I'm trying

600
00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:22,080
Speaker 1: to pace myself on because I don't want to get

601
00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:27,040
Speaker 1: through too quickly is Husband's Material by Alexis Hall, who

602
00:35:27,400 --> 00:35:31,160
Speaker 1: is like kind of one of my instant by authors.

603
00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:34,160
Speaker 1: Like anything. They I've talked about a couple of their

604
00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:39,160
Speaker 1: books this year already. Um. They this is a sequel

605
00:35:39,200 --> 00:35:42,920
Speaker 1: to their book Boyfriend Material, which is Boyfriend Material was

606
00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:47,560
Speaker 1: very much like a gay send up of like Bridget

607
00:35:47,600 --> 00:35:51,799
Speaker 1: Jones Diary. Okay, I'm googling right now. Oh, you absolutely

608
00:35:51,840 --> 00:35:55,640
Speaker 1: need to read it. It's super funny. Um. I also

609
00:35:55,800 --> 00:35:58,439
Speaker 1: I listened to the audiobook of it the second time.

610
00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:02,520
Speaker 1: The cover is in mely promising. Yeah, when you see

611
00:36:02,560 --> 00:36:05,680
Speaker 1: a cover like this, it's it's a by hunt, It's

612
00:36:05,719 --> 00:36:08,960
Speaker 1: it's about it's about this guy who's like sort of like, um,

613
00:36:09,320 --> 00:36:11,960
Speaker 1: he's a he's the child of some celebrities, and like

614
00:36:12,120 --> 00:36:14,719
Speaker 1: it's kind of always winding up in the tabloids and

615
00:36:15,280 --> 00:36:17,680
Speaker 1: he has to have a fake boyfriend to like rehabilitate

616
00:36:17,800 --> 00:36:20,000
Speaker 1: his image. But obviously him and the and the boyfriend

617
00:36:20,160 --> 00:36:23,160
Speaker 1: like actually fall in love and wind up together. And

618
00:36:23,280 --> 00:36:26,600
Speaker 1: so in the sequel, everyone around them is getting married,

619
00:36:26,920 --> 00:36:30,600
Speaker 1: and so I think they might get I would assume that,

620
00:36:30,640 --> 00:36:33,879
Speaker 1: since it's called husband material, they get married. It looks

621
00:36:34,280 --> 00:36:38,239
Speaker 1: it looks very British. It is very British, and like

622
00:36:38,280 --> 00:36:40,360
Speaker 1: the British isms are a big part of the humor

623
00:36:40,400 --> 00:36:43,399
Speaker 1: and what I like about it, And yeah, it's really

624
00:36:43,400 --> 00:36:45,560
Speaker 1: good in Alexis Hall. The books of theirs that I've

625
00:36:45,560 --> 00:36:48,759
Speaker 1: talked about this year were, Um, A Lady for a Duke, Yeah,

626
00:36:48,760 --> 00:36:55,680
Speaker 1: which was which is a historical romance with a trans lead,

627
00:36:55,920 --> 00:36:58,560
Speaker 1: and you like them. I did really like it. I

628
00:36:58,560 --> 00:37:01,879
Speaker 1: didn't think it was perfect, um, but I liked it.

629
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:03,600
Speaker 1: And it kind of goes back to what we were

630
00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:08,319
Speaker 1: talking about with them with they slash them, which is

631
00:37:08,360 --> 00:37:12,240
Speaker 1: that even though Alexis Hall has said that they wanted

632
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:14,520
Speaker 1: to write a book about a trans character, where like

633
00:37:14,600 --> 00:37:18,520
Speaker 1: their Transnis was not the main thing with the plot.

634
00:37:19,040 --> 00:37:21,120
Speaker 1: I don't think that's true of the work that they

635
00:37:21,120 --> 00:37:26,120
Speaker 1: actually wrote, and but but to its like, I mean

636
00:37:26,120 --> 00:37:29,759
Speaker 1: that in a positive way, because I want to see

637
00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:34,359
Speaker 1: more stories where people's queerness and like more specifically, their

638
00:37:34,360 --> 00:37:39,440
Speaker 1: trans nous are the plot couldn't happen without them, because

639
00:37:39,480 --> 00:37:42,120
Speaker 1: those are the interesting stories that we haven't seen yet,

640
00:37:42,120 --> 00:37:45,640
Speaker 1: the new stories that we should be telling. I think

641
00:37:45,680 --> 00:37:49,799
Speaker 1: that's really interesting. Yeah, I agree, I mean that's the

642
00:37:49,880 --> 00:37:54,719
Speaker 1: thing is like this this tension between like do I

643
00:37:54,760 --> 00:37:57,080
Speaker 1: tell people how I really feel about a certain issue

644
00:37:57,160 --> 00:37:59,000
Speaker 1: or do I just tell a good story? Or like

645
00:37:59,400 --> 00:38:01,680
Speaker 1: do I have to pick? And like when do I?

646
00:38:01,800 --> 00:38:03,719
Speaker 1: How do? How do I do both? It's like it's

647
00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:09,279
Speaker 1: about the issue I think, like I think identity, and

648
00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:12,439
Speaker 1: and like there's so much inherent in transness that can

649
00:38:12,480 --> 00:38:17,280
Speaker 1: create a really interesting narrative. Like in In a Lady

650
00:38:17,320 --> 00:38:20,560
Speaker 1: for a Duke, the whole plot of the story is

651
00:38:20,600 --> 00:38:24,680
Speaker 1: that this trans woman has this best friend. They went

652
00:38:24,719 --> 00:38:28,840
Speaker 1: to war together, she was injured in action and presumed dead,

653
00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:34,279
Speaker 1: and she used that as as her chance to transition

654
00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:35,920
Speaker 1: and like go away for a couple of years. I

655
00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:39,600
Speaker 1: remember this very Alexis Mead allah ugly and come back

656
00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:42,120
Speaker 1: as a woman, and like, that's what I mean when

657
00:38:42,120 --> 00:38:44,520
Speaker 1: I say it's a plot point that could not happen

658
00:38:44,680 --> 00:38:48,880
Speaker 1: without transness, and it's what creates the whole narrative. And

659
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:52,719
Speaker 1: that is really interesting that that story wouldn't exist if

660
00:38:52,719 --> 00:38:55,520
Speaker 1: it wasn't for her identity, and so that is I'm

661
00:38:55,560 --> 00:38:59,320
Speaker 1: interested in seeing more queer stories like that and in

662
00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:05,040
Speaker 1: creating um but you know more, Stay tuned. But a

663
00:39:05,160 --> 00:39:10,160
Speaker 1: boy from Material definitely recommend Book Lovers is good. I mean,

664
00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:12,800
Speaker 1: I'm sure like everyone's reading it, because like everyone reads

665
00:39:12,840 --> 00:39:16,600
Speaker 1: Emily Henry's books anyway, So I'm not telling anyone anything

666
00:39:16,600 --> 00:39:19,520
Speaker 1: they don't know. And I do now that I've watched

667
00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:23,399
Speaker 1: the movie, I do want to finish Persuasion. I'll get

668
00:39:23,400 --> 00:39:28,080
Speaker 1: around to it eventually. Honestly. Something that's kind of giving

669
00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:33,839
Speaker 1: a little like kind of persuasion made well um Girl

670
00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:38,399
Speaker 1: aesthetic is the new Maggie Rogers album, which for some

671
00:39:38,440 --> 00:39:42,879
Speaker 1: reason drop the same day as Beyonce's I don't know. Well,

672
00:39:42,880 --> 00:39:44,960
Speaker 1: here's the thing I know that they have as a

673
00:39:45,000 --> 00:39:47,480
Speaker 1: music artists. They have nothing to do with each other.

674
00:39:47,800 --> 00:39:50,480
Speaker 1: Their music has no overlap. I get it. I just

675
00:39:50,560 --> 00:39:54,359
Speaker 1: like that can't be like, why would you? I would

676
00:39:54,440 --> 00:39:58,320
Speaker 1: never in a million years drop something that weekend, especially

677
00:39:58,360 --> 00:40:01,759
Speaker 1: if one of your songs is called honey. Oh well,

678
00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:03,960
Speaker 1: what did you did you listen to thee? Yeah? Can

679
00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:08,799
Speaker 1: I admit something to you. I don't love it. I'm

680
00:40:08,880 --> 00:40:10,919
Speaker 1: kind of having I'm kind of having a hard time

681
00:40:10,960 --> 00:40:12,680
Speaker 1: with it. And at first I thought it was just

682
00:40:12,920 --> 00:40:17,160
Speaker 1: that every time I put it on, I found myself

683
00:40:17,160 --> 00:40:20,480
Speaker 1: thinking I could just be listening to Beyonce right now,

684
00:40:20,520 --> 00:40:24,440
Speaker 1: and that was the initial problem with it. And the

685
00:40:24,520 --> 00:40:26,960
Speaker 1: few times that I did listen to it, it was

686
00:40:27,000 --> 00:40:30,000
Speaker 1: always background music while I was writing, or background music

687
00:40:30,040 --> 00:40:33,239
Speaker 1: while I was reading or whatever. And then I said, no, no, no, no,

688
00:40:33,360 --> 00:40:36,040
Speaker 1: I need to sit down and actually listen to it

689
00:40:36,280 --> 00:40:39,920
Speaker 1: with headphones on and really give this album it's chance.

690
00:40:41,000 --> 00:40:44,359
Speaker 1: And it made me realize that I wasn't reaching for

691
00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:49,160
Speaker 1: it because I don't love it. I don't. It's very

692
00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:53,959
Speaker 1: hard to you know, I think with a sophomore album

693
00:40:54,000 --> 00:40:57,680
Speaker 1: when your first album was received, um, you know so

694
00:40:58,000 --> 00:41:03,000
Speaker 1: like so Universe, the Universe slee Positive, Um, that's really

695
00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:07,719
Speaker 1: hard to follow up. I just, um, I don't I

696
00:41:07,760 --> 00:41:09,640
Speaker 1: like some of it. I like a lot of the

697
00:41:09,680 --> 00:41:13,239
Speaker 1: singles that she released I think are good, but it's

698
00:41:13,320 --> 00:41:17,319
Speaker 1: just like not a lot of the songs are really

699
00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:20,319
Speaker 1: kind of grading, and I know that that's a big

700
00:41:20,360 --> 00:41:23,320
Speaker 1: part of what she does. I was I was listening

701
00:41:23,320 --> 00:41:27,720
Speaker 1: to something, oh and a recent episode of Lost Cultures

702
00:41:27,760 --> 00:41:30,759
Speaker 1: does they were talking about her and how you know,

703
00:41:30,800 --> 00:41:33,040
Speaker 1: she originally started off as a folk artist and then

704
00:41:33,120 --> 00:41:35,680
Speaker 1: like once she moved to New York for school, like

705
00:41:35,760 --> 00:41:37,960
Speaker 1: that's when she started like hearing a lot of club

706
00:41:38,080 --> 00:41:40,600
Speaker 1: music and like got really into production and that's why

707
00:41:40,640 --> 00:41:42,960
Speaker 1: her music kind of is the way that it is now.

708
00:41:43,560 --> 00:41:45,319
Speaker 1: And I liked a lot of what she did with

709
00:41:45,360 --> 00:41:50,920
Speaker 1: that on her last album, But on this album, I

710
00:41:50,920 --> 00:41:55,640
Speaker 1: think it's just too it's overproduced and it's really I

711
00:41:55,719 --> 00:41:58,200
Speaker 1: never would have thought about that. Yeah, it's a lot

712
00:41:58,200 --> 00:42:03,880
Speaker 1: of like pots and pants happening, and it's just, um,

713
00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:07,320
Speaker 1: it's challenging to listen to, but not in a way

714
00:42:07,400 --> 00:42:10,719
Speaker 1: that makes me want to kind of rise to the occasion.

715
00:42:10,800 --> 00:42:13,319
Speaker 1: It's challenging to listen to in a way where I

716
00:42:13,360 --> 00:42:15,759
Speaker 1: find myself just like I can only make it through

717
00:42:15,760 --> 00:42:17,480
Speaker 1: like half a song and then I skipped to the

718
00:42:17,480 --> 00:42:20,719
Speaker 1: next one. I just don't really I'm not enjoying it,

719
00:42:21,120 --> 00:42:24,320
Speaker 1: and that's sad because I love her and her last

720
00:42:24,360 --> 00:42:27,759
Speaker 1: album I was obsessed with and still am. I listened

721
00:42:27,760 --> 00:42:30,120
Speaker 1: to it all the time. I have a slightly different

722
00:42:30,120 --> 00:42:34,160
Speaker 1: relationship to Maggie Rogers, but a lot of similar experiences

723
00:42:34,160 --> 00:42:38,400
Speaker 1: of this new album because I so I did not,

724
00:42:38,680 --> 00:42:41,200
Speaker 1: you know, I was. I love Maggie, I love her art.

725
00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:44,000
Speaker 1: I'm not like a Maggie stand per se. I did

726
00:42:44,080 --> 00:42:47,440
Speaker 1: not listen to her first album over and over again

727
00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:49,960
Speaker 1: the way I know a lot of Maggie Rogers heads do,

728
00:42:50,239 --> 00:42:52,600
Speaker 1: Like you know, Joel Can Boosters listening right now, like

729
00:42:52,680 --> 00:42:55,799
Speaker 1: screaming at us being so mad that we're um, you know,

730
00:42:55,880 --> 00:42:58,680
Speaker 1: making critique of his queen. But like, but like she,

731
00:42:58,960 --> 00:43:01,600
Speaker 1: I I think that thing about you know, heard it

732
00:43:01,600 --> 00:43:04,440
Speaker 1: in a past life her last album is that it

733
00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:09,080
Speaker 1: did have a lot more pop orientation, and these songs

734
00:43:09,400 --> 00:43:14,440
Speaker 1: have really amazing hooks, and because Surrender doesn't have, it's

735
00:43:14,520 --> 00:43:17,399
Speaker 1: much more introspective and much more thoughtful. It doesn't have

736
00:43:17,600 --> 00:43:20,480
Speaker 1: the hooks that her last album had, and therefore for

737
00:43:20,520 --> 00:43:25,040
Speaker 1: me was background music. And I think really great background music,

738
00:43:25,120 --> 00:43:28,600
Speaker 1: like music still has that function and like that sounds

739
00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:31,520
Speaker 1: like an insult, but like, I think it's really gorgeous,

740
00:43:31,520 --> 00:43:33,680
Speaker 1: but it doesn't even work from it doesn't even work

741
00:43:33,719 --> 00:43:36,640
Speaker 1: for me is background music because it becomes distracting and

742
00:43:36,680 --> 00:43:39,480
Speaker 1: I'm like, I don't want to skip. Well, listen to

743
00:43:39,520 --> 00:43:42,920
Speaker 1: the song. For me, the song that goes hardest. Shatter

744
00:43:43,320 --> 00:43:46,879
Speaker 1: is the best song. I love Shatter. I love how

745
00:43:46,920 --> 00:43:50,759
Speaker 1: Maggie screams on it. I think it's so cathartic and

746
00:43:50,800 --> 00:43:54,480
Speaker 1: beautiful and one of my favorite songs she's ever written

747
00:43:54,600 --> 00:43:57,200
Speaker 1: or done. Um, But I just like I thought it

748
00:43:57,280 --> 00:44:02,480
Speaker 1: was you know, I've consumed the kind of the media, uh,

749
00:44:02,640 --> 00:44:07,400
Speaker 1: you know, stuff around her enrollment in the Harvard Divinity

750
00:44:07,440 --> 00:44:12,240
Speaker 1: School and how her Coachella performance was a project for

751
00:44:12,280 --> 00:44:17,640
Speaker 1: her Harvard Divinity School, her Harvard Divinity School, like thesis

752
00:44:17,760 --> 00:44:21,279
Speaker 1: or whatever. And I was like, like she says in

753
00:44:21,280 --> 00:44:25,400
Speaker 1: this interview that Coachella, like her Coacheller performance fulfilled a

754
00:44:25,520 --> 00:44:29,960
Speaker 1: requirement on public presonation. She literally filed this performance as

755
00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:33,080
Speaker 1: a part of her the completion of her school. That's

756
00:44:33,080 --> 00:44:38,640
Speaker 1: really that's really cool that I don't see. I mean, okay, cool, yes,

757
00:44:38,719 --> 00:44:42,520
Speaker 1: But also just like I just feel like school is

758
00:44:42,560 --> 00:44:46,319
Speaker 1: like for you, Like it's for your education, not for

759
00:44:46,360 --> 00:44:51,600
Speaker 1: like entertainment value, like when I'm in school, I'm actually

760
00:44:51,600 --> 00:44:53,600
Speaker 1: maybe I'm being a little too hard on her. I

761
00:44:53,640 --> 00:44:57,680
Speaker 1: just feel like I to be that experimental and to

762
00:44:57,800 --> 00:45:01,399
Speaker 1: be so I don't know, I just like don't want

763
00:45:01,440 --> 00:45:03,560
Speaker 1: I just don't want to read your thesis. That's the thing.

764
00:45:03,640 --> 00:45:05,800
Speaker 1: That's what I'm being like kind of an asshole about it,

765
00:45:05,840 --> 00:45:08,600
Speaker 1: because like I at the end of the day don't

766
00:45:08,719 --> 00:45:12,640
Speaker 1: want to read all everything behind it. I just want

767
00:45:12,640 --> 00:45:14,799
Speaker 1: to know if it's a good album or not, and

768
00:45:14,880 --> 00:45:18,480
Speaker 1: if every and honestly, maybe I'm projecting because this is

769
00:45:18,520 --> 00:45:22,759
Speaker 1: something I'm extremely guilty of. I will do tons of research,

770
00:45:22,880 --> 00:45:26,360
Speaker 1: tons of background work, have huge like stories and rationale

771
00:45:26,360 --> 00:45:29,600
Speaker 1: behind projects that I put out or things that I do,

772
00:45:29,760 --> 00:45:31,719
Speaker 1: and like all of that is worth nothing at the

773
00:45:31,800 --> 00:45:33,640
Speaker 1: end of the day if people don't get it, you

774
00:45:33,680 --> 00:45:36,520
Speaker 1: know what I mean, And it doesn't matter how many

775
00:45:36,640 --> 00:45:41,520
Speaker 1: degrees you have or how much um intellect or pedagogy

776
00:45:41,560 --> 00:45:44,680
Speaker 1: you've put into the thing, if it's at the end

777
00:45:44,680 --> 00:45:47,399
Speaker 1: of the day, not something that's good for consumption, even

778
00:45:47,520 --> 00:45:52,439
Speaker 1: something that's experimental and fun to consume. Like I don't know,

779
00:45:52,880 --> 00:45:56,240
Speaker 1: it's then to me just a project and surrender feels

780
00:45:56,280 --> 00:45:59,600
Speaker 1: like a project, not an album, and I'm okay with that,

781
00:45:59,719 --> 00:46:02,799
Speaker 1: Like I want to see Maggie explore, and so I'm

782
00:46:02,800 --> 00:46:05,799
Speaker 1: excited to see what else she does. And she does

783
00:46:05,840 --> 00:46:08,680
Speaker 1: not need to be the artist she was on Harden

784
00:46:08,760 --> 00:46:14,480
Speaker 1: Past Life Forever, but that is the art that I

785
00:46:14,520 --> 00:46:18,279
Speaker 1: would like from her, and I hope maybe with her

786
00:46:18,320 --> 00:46:21,280
Speaker 1: next project she finds her way a little, a little

787
00:46:21,280 --> 00:46:26,359
Speaker 1: further back, not territory, because for the moment, I'm just

788
00:46:26,560 --> 00:46:44,920
Speaker 1: I'm still only listening for Nissance Rose. Other things that

789
00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:49,000
Speaker 1: we listened to this weekend the Queen's remix of Break

790
00:46:49,080 --> 00:46:53,759
Speaker 1: My Soul Girl. I was gagged when when I was

791
00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:56,680
Speaker 1: sent that link before, like before it came out on

792
00:46:56,719 --> 00:46:58,960
Speaker 1: Spotify and then sent it to you, I was like,

793
00:46:59,280 --> 00:47:02,439
Speaker 1: is this a Joe? It felt not real. And then

794
00:47:02,640 --> 00:47:05,480
Speaker 1: I listened to it. I think it's so good. I

795
00:47:05,480 --> 00:47:09,480
Speaker 1: think it's great. I think it's so good. I like

796
00:47:09,840 --> 00:47:16,800
Speaker 1: that it's you know, the cultural context of Madonna's Vogue

797
00:47:17,000 --> 00:47:19,239
Speaker 1: is that, like, as much as we love it and

798
00:47:19,280 --> 00:47:23,120
Speaker 1: as much as it you know, brought vogue to the

799
00:47:23,160 --> 00:47:28,600
Speaker 1: forefront of mainstream culture, it is also extremely appropriative. As

800
00:47:28,800 --> 00:47:31,520
Speaker 1: you know, Madonna has been throughout her career, and I

801
00:47:31,640 --> 00:47:37,840
Speaker 1: do like that in reworking and sampling the song, and

802
00:47:39,239 --> 00:47:45,080
Speaker 1: you know, on a project where she's doing so much

803
00:47:45,520 --> 00:47:50,920
Speaker 1: sampling and you know, reinterpretating of Vogue and House. I

804
00:47:51,000 --> 00:47:54,600
Speaker 1: like that Beyonce places ballroom culture back in its original

805
00:47:54,640 --> 00:47:57,839
Speaker 1: context while using the very thing that was I don't

806
00:47:57,840 --> 00:48:00,560
Speaker 1: want to say weaponized against it, but like the very

807
00:48:00,560 --> 00:48:03,839
Speaker 1: thing that kind of helped break it from that in

808
00:48:03,880 --> 00:48:07,279
Speaker 1: the first place. Um And the way she does that

809
00:48:07,400 --> 00:48:11,399
Speaker 1: is through like I think most specifically at the end,

810
00:48:11,480 --> 00:48:13,560
Speaker 1: when she's doing what Madonna did the original song and

811
00:48:13,600 --> 00:48:16,400
Speaker 1: like naming all these legends, like and when Madonna did it,

812
00:48:16,440 --> 00:48:17,920
Speaker 1: she was like naming all these white women who were

813
00:48:17,920 --> 00:48:20,560
Speaker 1: on the cover of Vogue. When Beyonce does it, she's

814
00:48:20,640 --> 00:48:24,320
Speaker 1: naming all these black female artists and literal Vogue houses

815
00:48:24,800 --> 00:48:27,000
Speaker 1: like and some of them were deep cuts to Like

816
00:48:27,200 --> 00:48:31,879
Speaker 1: when she mentioned House of Ladosia, I was gaming. I

817
00:48:31,920 --> 00:48:35,440
Speaker 1: was gagged. I was gagged for people that don't know

818
00:48:35,760 --> 00:48:40,080
Speaker 1: House of Ladosia is. And they're like an iconic underground

819
00:48:40,080 --> 00:48:43,319
Speaker 1: New York house, very much a part of the Westgate

820
00:48:43,360 --> 00:48:47,960
Speaker 1: scene the early years of bush Wig. It's Julianna Hustable,

821
00:48:48,239 --> 00:48:52,520
Speaker 1: it's Joanna Huxtable collective predominantly, So it's like very it's

822
00:48:52,560 --> 00:48:55,880
Speaker 1: just different. It's so it's such Julianna Hugstable, Michael Magnan,

823
00:48:56,200 --> 00:49:03,600
Speaker 1: Dosha Bailey styles, Neon Christina like true underground New York legends,

824
00:49:03,800 --> 00:49:07,640
Speaker 1: very much involved in like Spectrum used to throw a

825
00:49:07,719 --> 00:49:12,120
Speaker 1: lot of really cool parties and so to hear them

826
00:49:12,120 --> 00:49:16,359
Speaker 1: placed in that context with other legendary houses like House

827
00:49:16,360 --> 00:49:20,800
Speaker 1: of Extravaganza, House of Aubiance. Also my like my girl

828
00:49:21,120 --> 00:49:24,919
Speaker 1: Nita Auvance, who's one half of the Carrie Nation, did

829
00:49:24,960 --> 00:49:27,960
Speaker 1: one of the break My Soul remixes that Beyonce put out.

830
00:49:28,000 --> 00:49:31,600
Speaker 1: It's just like the best remix. It's so it's so

831
00:49:31,719 --> 00:49:39,400
Speaker 1: incredible to see Babarin culture at large be celebrated in

832
00:49:39,440 --> 00:49:41,680
Speaker 1: this way by the biggest artists in the world, in

833
00:49:41,719 --> 00:49:44,920
Speaker 1: a way that is actually like honoring the reality of

834
00:49:44,960 --> 00:49:48,440
Speaker 1: what it is rather than you know, like appropriating it's

835
00:49:49,640 --> 00:49:54,000
Speaker 1: it's style or sound um and doing something entirely different

836
00:49:54,040 --> 00:49:56,719
Speaker 1: with it. It's it's as we said in our our

837
00:49:56,840 --> 00:50:00,800
Speaker 1: Beyonce episode last week, like she's citing her sources and

838
00:50:00,800 --> 00:50:03,960
Speaker 1: and even more than that, she is like she's trying

839
00:50:04,080 --> 00:50:06,120
Speaker 1: as in any way she can to give the girls

840
00:50:06,160 --> 00:50:09,799
Speaker 1: their flowers. You said it all like I I, and

841
00:50:09,840 --> 00:50:12,000
Speaker 1: I honestly didn't even think about it in that way,

842
00:50:12,040 --> 00:50:14,600
Speaker 1: and then thinking about it as a full circle moment

843
00:50:15,080 --> 00:50:19,120
Speaker 1: to kind of rectify the ways that Madonna's Vogue was

844
00:50:19,280 --> 00:50:22,560
Speaker 1: extremely exploitative. Right, Like Madonna did a lot for a

845
00:50:22,560 --> 00:50:25,520
Speaker 1: ballroom culture. Um our friend of the pod, like mikel

846
00:50:25,600 --> 00:50:27,920
Speaker 1: Street has like a lot of work and reporting on

847
00:50:27,960 --> 00:50:29,560
Speaker 1: this if you ever want to check out his stuff,

848
00:50:29,600 --> 00:50:33,640
Speaker 1: But like he um, there's nuance in all of it, right,

849
00:50:33,719 --> 00:50:38,160
Speaker 1: Like Madonna was appropriative and exploitative and like stole culture

850
00:50:38,320 --> 00:50:41,200
Speaker 1: from the most marginalized in the New York scene. But

851
00:50:41,280 --> 00:50:43,760
Speaker 1: at the same time, she brought the House of Ninja

852
00:50:43,880 --> 00:50:46,879
Speaker 1: and other dancers with her on tour. Right she put

853
00:50:46,920 --> 00:50:49,760
Speaker 1: them in the music video. Right, she got an entire

854
00:50:50,280 --> 00:50:53,759
Speaker 1: you know, group of people listening to Vogue to say,

855
00:50:53,800 --> 00:50:57,840
Speaker 1: what's Vogue, what's vogueing, what's ballroom? And that is you

856
00:50:57,880 --> 00:51:01,160
Speaker 1: know big, that's huge, right, Um for Beyonce to put

857
00:51:01,160 --> 00:51:04,520
Speaker 1: it explicitly in context, I think you said it perfectly,

858
00:51:04,600 --> 00:51:08,280
Speaker 1: Like that's so amazing. And also in addition to ladosha

859
00:51:08,400 --> 00:51:10,520
Speaker 1: um a kiki house like House of tell Far a

860
00:51:10,600 --> 00:51:13,080
Speaker 1: very new house, a house that's like fresh on the scene,

861
00:51:13,120 --> 00:51:16,480
Speaker 1: like again another really deep cut. And the list of

862
00:51:16,600 --> 00:51:19,840
Speaker 1: names where it's just like a list of powerful black women.

863
00:51:20,120 --> 00:51:25,920
Speaker 1: And she says Grace Jones twice, like Grace, Grace Jones,

864
00:51:26,560 --> 00:51:29,480
Speaker 1: Grace Jones. Um, she should have said. I mean, maybe

865
00:51:29,520 --> 00:51:32,520
Speaker 1: this is like totally totally fan service, wishful thinking, but

866
00:51:32,560 --> 00:51:34,600
Speaker 1: like I feel like Calice should have been in the

867
00:51:34,640 --> 00:51:37,360
Speaker 1: list of names. Yeah, I don't think that's going to happen,

868
00:51:37,600 --> 00:51:40,239
Speaker 1: but if she removed, I mean, it's just me being

869
00:51:40,280 --> 00:51:42,200
Speaker 1: a fan fan, but like, come on, that would have

870
00:51:42,239 --> 00:51:45,120
Speaker 1: been so iconic because Calice is in that list, you

871
00:51:45,120 --> 00:51:46,719
Speaker 1: know what I mean? She is she is, you know,

872
00:51:46,840 --> 00:51:50,279
Speaker 1: she's I've been listening to so much Calie, to this

873
00:51:50,440 --> 00:51:54,120
Speaker 1: Beyonce stuff is happening. All just made me Acapella is

874
00:51:54,360 --> 00:51:58,839
Speaker 1: it's all of the millennium, um, and that's one good

875
00:51:58,840 --> 00:52:00,840
Speaker 1: thing to come of all this is thought. It reminded

876
00:52:00,840 --> 00:52:02,640
Speaker 1: me how much I love Chalice and I hope that

877
00:52:03,000 --> 00:52:07,160
Speaker 1: my streams are making her money. Similarly, I've been revisiting Chalice,

878
00:52:07,239 --> 00:52:11,040
Speaker 1: but I also have been revisiting Donna Summers Bad Girls,

879
00:52:11,120 --> 00:52:14,319
Speaker 1: which I don't think I've given a through listened through

880
00:52:14,360 --> 00:52:19,120
Speaker 1: since like college, and like the transitions I mean Beyonce,

881
00:52:19,480 --> 00:52:23,680
Speaker 1: I think that's like one of the strongest influences for renaissances,

882
00:52:23,719 --> 00:52:28,080
Speaker 1: Like the transitions on Bad Girls are sublime, like they

883
00:52:28,160 --> 00:52:33,320
Speaker 1: are so next level, and um I I honestly it

884
00:52:33,360 --> 00:52:35,920
Speaker 1: gave me a whole new appreciation for the album as

885
00:52:35,960 --> 00:52:37,920
Speaker 1: a whole, as one of the greatest dance albums to

886
00:52:38,160 --> 00:52:42,480
Speaker 1: have ever been released, and I um I honestly, it

887
00:52:42,560 --> 00:52:45,799
Speaker 1: just made me crave like real disco music right like

888
00:52:46,320 --> 00:52:50,200
Speaker 1: you know in You and I saw tons of like

889
00:52:50,400 --> 00:52:55,319
Speaker 1: disco inspired music, right do I release the album Chromatica

890
00:52:55,440 --> 00:52:57,640
Speaker 1: was supposed to be disco influenced. I thought it was

891
00:52:57,680 --> 00:53:01,120
Speaker 1: just a kylie um see where, which is like an

892
00:53:01,120 --> 00:53:05,840
Speaker 1: amazing album, But like Honey Again, it's more than disco yeah,

893
00:53:05,880 --> 00:53:08,400
Speaker 1: and it's like it's for me. It's like, no, I

894
00:53:08,520 --> 00:53:11,000
Speaker 1: want like if you're going to do a disco album,

895
00:53:11,080 --> 00:53:12,680
Speaker 1: And this is part of why I love A lot

896
00:53:12,719 --> 00:53:14,360
Speaker 1: of the songs are renaissance, Like if you're gonna do

897
00:53:14,400 --> 00:53:18,640
Speaker 1: a disco album, I want a farty ass base, I

898
00:53:18,719 --> 00:53:22,759
Speaker 1: want a gospel choir, I want some clapping sounds like

899
00:53:23,160 --> 00:53:26,200
Speaker 1: I want like the things that make disco disco, Like

900
00:53:26,239 --> 00:53:30,239
Speaker 1: I want full wind and trumpet ensemble, right, okay, Like

901
00:53:30,400 --> 00:53:32,600
Speaker 1: and I feel like, you know, when we get I

902
00:53:32,640 --> 00:53:36,319
Speaker 1: want native new Yorker, yes, native New Yorker, and when

903
00:53:36,320 --> 00:53:38,800
Speaker 1: I get reformed Williams, and like when I get the

904
00:53:38,880 --> 00:53:41,200
Speaker 1: dual leap of stuff, which is like fine, it's just

905
00:53:41,239 --> 00:53:44,560
Speaker 1: like that, it's not disco. It's not disco. It's not

906
00:53:44,640 --> 00:53:47,680
Speaker 1: even really house. I think if anyone like Kylie is

907
00:53:47,719 --> 00:53:50,120
Speaker 1: maybe the girl who really was giving up has always

908
00:53:50,200 --> 00:53:53,720
Speaker 1: given us true disco but like the disco inspired ship.

909
00:53:53,760 --> 00:53:56,120
Speaker 1: It's like I think Renaissance is what I was waiting for,

910
00:53:56,239 --> 00:53:58,520
Speaker 1: you know, and the diet. I don't think Renaissance is

911
00:53:58,560 --> 00:54:03,120
Speaker 1: even disco, Like ren Renaissance is house. Yeah, I think

912
00:54:03,160 --> 00:54:07,560
Speaker 1: that there are three songs that are pretty pretty like

913
00:54:07,680 --> 00:54:11,520
Speaker 1: pretty disco funk disco. Um, but I agree, it's like

914
00:54:11,560 --> 00:54:15,000
Speaker 1: I wanted the full fantasy, the bad girl's fantasy. So

915
00:54:15,120 --> 00:54:18,200
Speaker 1: um wait. So we got a d m at like

916
00:54:18,239 --> 00:54:21,400
Speaker 1: a virgine and that said one of our theories from

917
00:54:21,520 --> 00:54:24,520
Speaker 1: last week, and this person does not want us to

918
00:54:24,520 --> 00:54:26,719
Speaker 1: blow out their spots, so we will keep them anonymous.

919
00:54:27,080 --> 00:54:30,200
Speaker 1: But they said that one of our theories is true

920
00:54:30,280 --> 00:54:33,320
Speaker 1: and that the next two projects are a country album

921
00:54:33,400 --> 00:54:38,759
Speaker 1: and an R and B album. So crowded for that

922
00:54:38,840 --> 00:54:41,200
Speaker 1: country album and do you think they're gonna do you

923
00:54:41,200 --> 00:54:43,279
Speaker 1: think she's going to tap the Chicks again? But the

924
00:54:43,320 --> 00:54:47,400
Speaker 1: other rumors that it's going to be maybe don R

925
00:54:47,440 --> 00:54:49,840
Speaker 1: and B album, but a rock album, and that the

926
00:54:49,880 --> 00:54:53,799
Speaker 1: whole thread of these three albums is that Beyonce is

927
00:54:53,840 --> 00:54:59,080
Speaker 1: taking back music that was traditionally kind of stolen from

928
00:54:59,320 --> 00:55:02,759
Speaker 1: from Black Bowl. So she did it with house, Um,

929
00:55:02,960 --> 00:55:05,120
Speaker 1: she'll do with country and then with rock and roll,

930
00:55:05,200 --> 00:55:08,920
Speaker 1: and like a Beyonce rock album would be major, like

931
00:55:09,239 --> 00:55:12,239
Speaker 1: and I'm thinking like rock, like you know, give me

932
00:55:12,280 --> 00:55:15,920
Speaker 1: like a little Richard sample Tina Turner. It's all about

933
00:55:15,920 --> 00:55:20,239
Speaker 1: Tina Like, um, I mean like like I'm talking, we're

934
00:55:20,280 --> 00:55:24,239
Speaker 1: talking like classic rock and blues, like you know, the

935
00:55:24,320 --> 00:55:28,240
Speaker 1: kind of rock that Elvis appropriated. Yeah eggs, oh gag.

936
00:55:28,440 --> 00:55:31,320
Speaker 1: Well we'll get into that maybe in our VAS episode.

937
00:55:31,560 --> 00:55:37,880
Speaker 1: But like I girl, I really like I saw I

938
00:55:37,880 --> 00:55:39,520
Speaker 1: think I saw that theory on Twitter and I had

939
00:55:39,560 --> 00:55:41,799
Speaker 1: goose bumps, like the idea of giving it back to

940
00:55:41,960 --> 00:55:44,520
Speaker 1: like what like you know, something that was stolen like,

941
00:55:44,680 --> 00:55:47,160
Speaker 1: but I totally agree. I'm much more compelled by Beyonce

942
00:55:47,400 --> 00:55:49,919
Speaker 1: rock album than another R and B album, which would

943
00:55:49,920 --> 00:55:53,920
Speaker 1: also be amazing obviously because it's Beyonce, but like damn,

944
00:55:54,000 --> 00:55:57,319
Speaker 1: the Tina Turner samples would be off the chain. And

945
00:55:57,360 --> 00:56:00,480
Speaker 1: when we think about, you know, Beyonce is a frequent

946
00:56:00,520 --> 00:56:04,080
Speaker 1: collaborator with like Jack White, with like kind of cold

947
00:56:04,120 --> 00:56:06,839
Speaker 1: Play ed Sheer in like pop rock types that she

948
00:56:06,960 --> 00:56:09,480
Speaker 1: takes a lot of influence from, Like I mean, I

949
00:56:09,520 --> 00:56:11,560
Speaker 1: think Beyonce once said that cold Play is like her

950
00:56:11,600 --> 00:56:14,880
Speaker 1: favorite band or something like that, Like I mean, I

951
00:56:14,920 --> 00:56:18,120
Speaker 1: you know, But again, it kind of flexes onto the

952
00:56:18,200 --> 00:56:21,279
Speaker 1: quote unquote basicness of Beyonce that I alluded to last week,

953
00:56:21,280 --> 00:56:23,680
Speaker 1: which is not an insult, it's it's just makes her

954
00:56:23,719 --> 00:56:28,480
Speaker 1: really clean canvas um. But I I feel like just

955
00:56:28,560 --> 00:56:32,920
Speaker 1: looping back to the Madonna of it all, appropriation at large,

956
00:56:33,040 --> 00:56:36,600
Speaker 1: like cultural exploitation at large, is like a massive sin

957
00:56:36,760 --> 00:56:39,239
Speaker 1: of this country that, like to this day is still

958
00:56:39,320 --> 00:56:41,680
Speaker 1: something that we just never reckoned with, Like we are

959
00:56:41,800 --> 00:56:46,040
Speaker 1: constantly stealing from black and brown culture without even realizing it.

960
00:56:46,080 --> 00:56:47,480
Speaker 1: I don't I don't even have to say that. It's

961
00:56:47,520 --> 00:56:50,560
Speaker 1: like so you know, rudimentary and obvious to say, but like,

962
00:56:51,640 --> 00:56:55,560
Speaker 1: I'm just so grateful for what Renaissance is and whatever

963
00:56:55,600 --> 00:56:58,000
Speaker 1: she does next, because you know, last week when we

964
00:56:58,000 --> 00:57:01,800
Speaker 1: were saying, like Beyonce watched Post and then made this album,

965
00:57:01,840 --> 00:57:04,280
Speaker 1: like you know, we were joking, but like, but Beyonce

966
00:57:04,480 --> 00:57:07,239
Speaker 1: literally does love Post. Like she's on the record saying

967
00:57:07,280 --> 00:57:11,960
Speaker 1: that she loves that show, and um for me when

968
00:57:11,960 --> 00:57:14,640
Speaker 1: we're sorting out because the you know, since in the

969
00:57:14,680 --> 00:57:16,720
Speaker 1: week that this album has released, there have been a

970
00:57:16,720 --> 00:57:20,040
Speaker 1: lot of conversations around Renaissance talking about like what is

971
00:57:20,040 --> 00:57:25,440
Speaker 1: the role of appropriation? Is Beyonce appropriating quote unquote queer culture,

972
00:57:25,560 --> 00:57:29,040
Speaker 1: trans culture ballroom? You know, like is this her her

973
00:57:29,560 --> 00:57:32,960
Speaker 1: um territory to trod on? And for me and this

974
00:57:33,040 --> 00:57:36,520
Speaker 1: is just my personal belief. So if people don't believe,

975
00:57:36,600 --> 00:57:38,840
Speaker 1: but people disagree with me, that's totally cute. But like,

976
00:57:39,560 --> 00:57:41,840
Speaker 1: when it comes down to the question of telling a

977
00:57:41,840 --> 00:57:44,640
Speaker 1: story that isn't yours, is the basic way of putting it.

978
00:57:44,960 --> 00:57:46,720
Speaker 1: If you're going to tell a story that isn't yours,

979
00:57:47,080 --> 00:57:51,160
Speaker 1: for me, it's about one clocking the hours on the

980
00:57:51,240 --> 00:57:53,520
Speaker 1: story you want to tell, Right, what are the research

981
00:57:53,640 --> 00:57:55,760
Speaker 1: is what's the research you've done? Who are the sources

982
00:57:55,800 --> 00:57:57,760
Speaker 1: you're citing? And, as we've already laid out in our

983
00:57:57,760 --> 00:58:00,400
Speaker 1: album review, like Beyonce has done all of that. The

984
00:58:00,400 --> 00:58:03,680
Speaker 1: second question is like reckoning with your conviction, Right? Do

985
00:58:03,720 --> 00:58:05,920
Speaker 1: you want to make this because you care about this

986
00:58:05,960 --> 00:58:08,360
Speaker 1: community and you have an investment in it? Or do

987
00:58:08,400 --> 00:58:11,560
Speaker 1: you want to make this because you want to collect

988
00:58:11,640 --> 00:58:16,040
Speaker 1: the cloud of highlighting a marginalized community? Right? And I

989
00:58:16,080 --> 00:58:18,400
Speaker 1: think that Beyonce was very smart to release all this

990
00:58:18,480 --> 00:58:22,560
Speaker 1: Uncle Johnny stuff to show that she has a personal

991
00:58:22,560 --> 00:58:26,200
Speaker 1: stake in this, that this is her life, that you know,

992
00:58:26,400 --> 00:58:29,560
Speaker 1: she grew up with house music and with queer culture

993
00:58:29,800 --> 00:58:32,280
Speaker 1: by way of her uncle. Right. And then the last

994
00:58:32,320 --> 00:58:34,880
Speaker 1: thing is do you stick the landing? Like? Is it

995
00:58:34,960 --> 00:58:38,640
Speaker 1: just good? Is it good art? And it's good art,

996
00:58:37,920 --> 00:58:40,800
Speaker 1: It's good fucking art. And like for me, it's like

997
00:58:40,920 --> 00:58:43,360
Speaker 1: that tree out of Things is like a really great

998
00:58:43,440 --> 00:58:46,600
Speaker 1: rubric for to figure out whether or not your art

999
00:58:46,880 --> 00:58:50,840
Speaker 1: is you know, gonna exploit some people. And I think

1000
00:58:50,880 --> 00:58:54,000
Speaker 1: that for her to say all these iconic houses, all

1001
00:58:54,040 --> 00:58:57,360
Speaker 1: these iconic women's names, to give credit where credit is due,

1002
00:58:57,400 --> 00:59:00,240
Speaker 1: it's just like exactly how you do it? Know what

1003
00:59:00,280 --> 00:59:04,720
Speaker 1: I mean, UM, and I'm so grateful for that. Wow,

1004
00:59:04,760 --> 00:59:08,720
Speaker 1: we really have UM consumed a lot. That was a

1005
00:59:08,760 --> 00:59:12,440
Speaker 1: lot over the past week. Is there anything Is there

1006
00:59:12,440 --> 00:59:16,200
Speaker 1: anything that you're really looking forward to that's coming out

1007
00:59:16,320 --> 00:59:18,760
Speaker 1: or happening in the next couple of weeks that, like

1008
00:59:19,600 --> 00:59:24,560
Speaker 1: the listeners, the Virgins can um consume as well so

1009
00:59:24,640 --> 00:59:27,800
Speaker 1: that they are on the same track as us. There

1010
00:59:27,840 --> 00:59:29,920
Speaker 1: literally is something that I can't think of what it

1011
00:59:29,960 --> 00:59:32,840
Speaker 1: is right now. Do you have an answer to that question? Um? Okay,

1012
00:59:32,920 --> 00:59:36,520
Speaker 1: A couple of things that I'm like, you know, I

1013
00:59:36,680 --> 00:59:39,080
Speaker 1: named the books that I'm reading at the moment. I

1014
00:59:39,120 --> 00:59:41,760
Speaker 1: still think I want to figure out this book club scenar.

1015
00:59:42,040 --> 00:59:44,960
Speaker 1: Like all of our d M s are about people

1016
00:59:44,960 --> 00:59:46,800
Speaker 1: saying they want to do the book club. We've had

1017
00:59:46,800 --> 00:59:49,840
Speaker 1: like multiple people say they want to be our intern.

1018
00:59:50,000 --> 00:59:53,520
Speaker 1: So we will be making it happen. Oh, The Sandman,

1019
00:59:53,840 --> 00:59:56,640
Speaker 1: that's what we want to talk about. Okay, okay, so

1020
00:59:57,240 --> 01:00:03,160
Speaker 1: will I watch it? I'll watch it. I started watching

1021
01:00:03,200 --> 01:00:06,760
Speaker 1: the new Netflix series The Sandman, which is an adaptation

1022
01:00:06,760 --> 01:00:10,160
Speaker 1: of Neil Gaiman's comic book series, which was turned into

1023
01:00:10,200 --> 01:00:13,160
Speaker 1: a series of graphic novels. Um, I'm really trying to

1024
01:00:13,160 --> 01:00:14,560
Speaker 1: take my time on it because I don't want to

1025
01:00:14,560 --> 01:00:17,960
Speaker 1: go through it too quickly. Um, Fran, if you watch it,

1026
01:00:18,000 --> 01:00:20,760
Speaker 1: if you'll watch it, like, I'll save my thoughts about it.

1027
01:00:20,960 --> 01:00:23,440
Speaker 1: And I actually think Fran and I did talk about this,

1028
01:00:23,520 --> 01:00:27,000
Speaker 1: but maybe we should do a Neil Gaiman episode because

1029
01:00:27,200 --> 01:00:30,960
Speaker 1: Neil Gaiman is really important to me. I've like read

1030
01:00:31,040 --> 01:00:35,600
Speaker 1: everything he's ever written, and Fran is like a true virgin,

1031
01:00:35,800 --> 01:00:37,120
Speaker 1: and so I think it would be fun to have

1032
01:00:37,280 --> 01:00:40,440
Speaker 1: them like try out a couple of things and have

1033
01:00:40,520 --> 01:00:43,560
Speaker 1: a conversation about it. Um. But yeah, we can definitely

1034
01:00:43,600 --> 01:00:47,680
Speaker 1: do maybe for our next new segment. Um, once Fran

1035
01:00:47,800 --> 01:00:49,560
Speaker 1: has watched a little bit of The Sandman and I've

1036
01:00:49,560 --> 01:00:52,280
Speaker 1: watched a little bit more, we can talk about it.

1037
01:00:52,360 --> 01:00:56,160
Speaker 1: But it's really good. Um, if anyone out there wants

1038
01:00:56,200 --> 01:00:59,400
Speaker 1: to start watching it, definitely do that. I'm gonna see

1039
01:00:59,400 --> 01:01:03,320
Speaker 1: bullet Train. That's so excited. I'm gonna see bullet Train.

1040
01:01:03,360 --> 01:01:06,040
Speaker 1: Actually might maybe see it later today or like, maybe

1041
01:01:06,160 --> 01:01:07,800
Speaker 1: it's gonna be really hot in Nelly this week, so

1042
01:01:07,840 --> 01:01:09,440
Speaker 1: maybe one day when it's really hot, I'll go to

1043
01:01:09,480 --> 01:01:12,880
Speaker 1: the movies maybe. Um, So we'll probably talk about that

1044
01:01:13,200 --> 01:01:17,240
Speaker 1: next week. I'm definitely excited for Bad Bunny in Bullet Train,

1045
01:01:17,400 --> 01:01:20,240
Speaker 1: Like I'm going to be like wet and that like

1046
01:01:20,640 --> 01:01:31,440
Speaker 1: sucking the r C. It's gonna be gross. Uh yeah.

1047
01:01:31,880 --> 01:01:34,160
Speaker 1: We'll be back next week, um and back to our

1048
01:01:34,240 --> 01:01:38,640
Speaker 1: usual format with a discussion on all things Basilerman, but

1049
01:01:38,720 --> 01:01:40,320
Speaker 1: for real this time, because I know we said that

1050
01:01:40,440 --> 01:01:43,080
Speaker 1: last week. It's just you know, sometimes take a little turn.

1051
01:01:43,560 --> 01:01:46,920
Speaker 1: So now you have an extra week to catch up on,

1052
01:01:47,400 --> 01:01:50,160
Speaker 1: you know, Basilerman's. You can leave us a review on

1053
01:01:50,200 --> 01:01:53,240
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts or Spotify. It actually helps us a lot.

1054
01:01:53,280 --> 01:01:55,360
Speaker 1: It cannot be overstated that if you leave us a review,

1055
01:01:55,440 --> 01:01:57,320
Speaker 1: it is the number one thing or maybe the number

1056
01:01:57,320 --> 01:02:00,080
Speaker 1: two things, aside from sharing with your friends, um, to

1057
01:02:00,200 --> 01:02:03,400
Speaker 1: help our podcasts become so famous. You can find me

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Speaker 1: on social media at friends, squish co anywhere you want,

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Speaker 1: and you can find me at Rose Damn You. You

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Speaker 1: can subscribe to Like a Vision anywhere you listen. This

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Speaker 1: is an I Heart production. Our producer is the Phoebe Unter,

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Speaker 1: with support from Lindsay Hoffman, Julian Weller, Chess Crane Chitch

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Speaker 1: and Nicky Etour. Until next week, See you later, Virgins