Speaker 1: Hey, hey, hey, we're back. We're black. I'm blacker because
Speaker 1: of the sun from Jordan, We're brown and this.
Speaker 2: Hey manr hey, welcome back from your desert goddess vacation.
Speaker 1: We had such a good I had such a good time.
Speaker 1: Like it was so remember I said by BALI was
Speaker 1: like neon. Look, if I had to like give it
Speaker 1: like a color palette, then Jordan was Pastel's. It was
Speaker 1: just a soft like the sand, the pinks, the blues,
Speaker 1: everything was just a soft, soft, soft coloring over the landscape.
Speaker 1: It was just I mean, I got to float in
Speaker 1: the Dead Sea, which is like thirty percent salt water,
Speaker 1: so you get to float because I do not know
Speaker 1: how to fly. I can swimish, but float not me.
Speaker 1: But I got to float. I even did like the
Speaker 1: mud mass because the Dead Sea, the mud is supposed
Speaker 1: to be so full of minerals. If you have sense
Speaker 1: of skin, don't do that. You can't tell it right
Speaker 1: now because I'm extra chocolate. Yo, I am broken out
Speaker 1: like a fourteen year old. Don't do it, don't do it.
Speaker 1: But still very epic.
Speaker 2: I got to remember that the next time I'm in
Speaker 2: the Dead Sea.
Speaker 1: I also got to like get rebaptized in the Jordan River.
Speaker 1: You know, that's where Jesus got baptized.
Speaker 2: So it was really wow, It's like a spiritual yeah.
Speaker 1: I mean I didn't think about it that way, honestly,
Speaker 1: but until we went. I mean, it was certainly odd
Speaker 1: being on the Jordanian side and then seeing literally a
Speaker 1: few feet away the Israeli side. And so in Jordan
Speaker 1: they don't call Israel Israel. They call it occupied Palestine.
Speaker 1: So even just like that energy was like, okay, you know,
Speaker 1: it's like, you know, the history come to life. You
Speaker 1: get to kind of see and see how people think
Speaker 1: and feel, and so that was interesting. I got to
Speaker 1: swim in the Red Sea, which was interesting. It's not
Speaker 1: really red, it's just that the water is so clear
Speaker 1: that there's a lot of red coral. So when the
Speaker 1: sun shines sometimes it reflects back red. We spent the
Speaker 1: night in a Bedouin camp in the desert. I rode
Speaker 1: a camel. I sent Mandy camel pictures.
Speaker 2: I lived for them. I want to post some of them.
Speaker 2: Do I have permission to get amber to do some
Speaker 2: social posts?
Speaker 1: Oh you can't. You can't, cause that a really great picture.
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna lie and then last and not least,
Speaker 1: I got to go to Petra has always been on
Speaker 1: my list, you know, like to So for those of
Speaker 1: you who are not familiar, Petra is like this city
Speaker 1: that has been carved out of a mountain side. So
Speaker 1: it's sandstone rock, which is red, but it has very
Speaker 1: beautiful coloring, like waves of blues and greens into the sandstone.
Speaker 1: So this ancient culture literally thousands of years ago, they
Speaker 1: wanted to protect their city. So on one side seems
Speaker 1: like a mountain if you're an invader, but on the
Speaker 1: other side of the mountain they carved out this beautiful
Speaker 1: city carved so you get like five six story buildings
Speaker 1: that are carved into rock, and it was just so
Speaker 1: epically beautiful. It just it was breathtaking. And so yeah,
Speaker 1: I just had such an amazing, amazing I.
Speaker 3: Went on a tour.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I just it just had such an amazing time.
Speaker 1: It was it's nice to be back home. You know,
Speaker 1: it was only a week, but it was just I'm
Speaker 1: so glad I went. Because Jordan is not one of
Speaker 1: the places that people just say like, oh, I want
Speaker 1: to go to Jordan. So yes, but you had your
Speaker 1: own adventure.
Speaker 2: If you had to miss our big sight or it
Speaker 2: felt like you missed the prom. And I was like, fine,
Speaker 2: if you had to miss the prom, at least it
Speaker 2: was for to be baptized where Jesus was back. Okay,
Speaker 2: you missed the wavies?
Speaker 3: Oh my god.
Speaker 1: No, First of all, you look so fly. I mean
Speaker 1: you had to post the post the pic Mandy was
Speaker 1: wearing yellow and was wearing it, honey, Okay, curls was
Speaker 1: popping face was done.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I went.
Speaker 2: It really felt like prom. It also felt like a
Speaker 2: coming out party that I haven't like for me, just
Speaker 2: emerging from the pandemic, because I have not had a
Speaker 2: night like that. And Husbie came with me, as did
Speaker 2: our producer Tan.
Speaker 3: Yeah, hey Tan, Yeah girl.
Speaker 2: When I tell you so, yesterday was officially like the
Speaker 2: sixth day or seven day mark from the event, and
Speaker 2: I was like, do.
Speaker 3: I get to like do a little tap dance?
Speaker 2: And I didn't get COVID because let me tell we
Speaker 2: were I mean it was a huge event. I mean,
Speaker 2: Meg the Stallion.
Speaker 1: Was there, Drew Barry, how many people do you think about?
Speaker 2: Lots of hundreds of people were there. Everyone had to
Speaker 2: be vaccinated and you had to show proof of vaccination.
Speaker 2: But you know, these COVID rates are going up even
Speaker 2: in New York City. But I I just told myself,
Speaker 2: just pretending you're from the Midwest today, COVID is a
Speaker 2: hoax and we're just gonna like live our lives and
Speaker 2: party OVID.
Speaker 3: Damn we partied.
Speaker 2: First of all, it was so it was so fun
Speaker 2: and I mean, it's I get to Red Brown ambition.
Speaker 2: So and my husband, Oh, shout out to Husby because
Speaker 2: when I was doing the red carpet. First of all,
Speaker 2: for those who didn't see my ig story about this,
Speaker 2: oh my god, I have not worn a heel in
Speaker 2: a solid two three years. I don't know if I
Speaker 2: even wore before I had a baby. But anyway, so
Speaker 2: I had these really cute heels, a whole luke that
Speaker 2: I put together, and the red carpet line was about
Speaker 2: forty minutes long, and there was like down these random,
Speaker 2: like downpours of rain. So we were like huddling under
Speaker 2: these little tents and umbrellas, and I don't know why
Speaker 2: it didn't occur to me to take my heels off
Speaker 2: and just kind of barefoot it until it got.
Speaker 3: To the red cart.
Speaker 2: By the time it was my turn, I realized my
Speaker 2: right foot had fallen asleep, like and I had to
Speaker 2: drag my dead log of a leg car And it
Speaker 2: was so funny. But then in the background I just
Speaker 2: hear I heard the photographers saying and a shout out
Speaker 2: to the one photographer who was like, yeah, sleigh. But
Speaker 2: when I could hear one of them being like, who
Speaker 2: is she? Hush, and I heard Enrique's voice going, that's
Speaker 2: Anty woodruff Santo. She's with brown Ambish.
Speaker 1: You bet it, you bet it? Hive her up? So cute?
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, it was. It was fun.
Speaker 2: And you know everyone I was like brown and yes,
Speaker 2: brown Ambition, Yes, this is our podcast for best business podcast.
Speaker 1: It's amazing.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was so fun.
Speaker 2: We went to the after party.
Speaker 3: I do what you like?
Speaker 1: We don't have the baby.
Speaker 2: We about to No, they went home early. He had
Speaker 2: an early day the next day, so it was me
Speaker 2: and Tanya. Me and Tanya went to went to the
Speaker 2: after party. Questlove was on the what do you say?
Speaker 3: The one? I don't know if they called him that anymore?
Speaker 2: Ill that he played some music for us, and it
Speaker 2: was it was so fun. It was it felt good
Speaker 2: to feel free.
Speaker 3: And then the week of anxiety afterward, like, is that covid?
Speaker 3: Is it the Rona? No, you're just hungover.
Speaker 2: Because you were out so three am. But it was
Speaker 2: it'll you know those moments, I feel like, who knows
Speaker 2: if it'll happen again. So it was fun. I would
Speaker 2: have been so much more fun if you were there.
Speaker 2: But I'm glad we were both on our little adventures exactly.
Speaker 1: It sounds like an amazing time.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and what did you come home to? What's happening
Speaker 2: in this crazy, crazy world that we lived?
Speaker 1: Well, you know, I mean obviously like recession, I've seen
Speaker 1: all these layoffs, and I mean, if y'all know that,
Speaker 1: I had to do my own set of layoffs. We
Speaker 1: were fortunate in that during the height of the pandemic,
Speaker 1: not only did we not have to lay people off,
Speaker 1: we actually gave people raises. If you're not familiar, So
Speaker 1: the main two companies I have are the Budget Lista,
Speaker 1: which is basically the business of Tiffany, so that's like
Speaker 1: me speaking, teaching books, spokesperson work, and then my online school,
Speaker 1: the Literature Academy. And collectively those two companies at their
Speaker 1: peak maybe had twenty to twenty five employees. And well,
Speaker 1: I'm using the words employees loosely, maybe like seventeen employees
Speaker 1: and then the rest contractors. But we treated our contractors
Speaker 1: just as well as we treated our employees. So we
Speaker 1: just considered everybody like you know, family and so so
Speaker 1: during like I said, pandemic, people are losing their jobs,
Speaker 1: not us. Thankfully, we were already like a digital company.
Speaker 1: So we did make some transition shifts to make it
Speaker 1: easier for people to work at home, especially the mo
Speaker 1: We were like, okay, this is when drop office, this
Speaker 1: is when pickups are. We're not going to have meetings
Speaker 1: during those times. Anyone who knows who's worked with me before,
Speaker 1: like we gave we set aside. We had a bonus pool,
Speaker 1: so five percent of our net profit, so profit after expenses,
Speaker 1: we set aside for the team. So during twenty twenty
Speaker 1: we had a huge, like really great strong year, and
Speaker 1: so the average bonus was like five thousand dollars people
Speaker 1: were making some people made five figure bonuses, you know,
Speaker 1: and so you know, things were all good. We've never
Speaker 1: been laid on a payment, you know. We go on
Speaker 1: vacation every year where we pay for everything. We fly
Speaker 1: everybody out, no matter where you live, as long as
Speaker 1: it's in the US, and I really try to create
Speaker 1: like a loving, caring environment because one of my goals
Speaker 1: was not just to serve as many black women and
Speaker 1: brown women externally, but was to also create an amazing
Speaker 1: environment environment internally. And so I think I would say,
Speaker 1: because I'm not just saying that, but that we did
Speaker 1: a good job of that. But I know only because
Speaker 1: we had just done a survey about a year ago,
Speaker 1: like how am I doing as a leader, and across
Speaker 1: the border was like and these are anonymous surveys. So
Speaker 1: I set that up to say that. After Durrell passed away,
Speaker 1: I just I couldn't even pick my head up, you know,
Speaker 1: like it was there were some holes that I realized
Speaker 1: in my own leadership, like I had not thought about
Speaker 1: you know, how you create an estate plan for your
Speaker 1: personal life. I did not have an estate plan for
Speaker 1: the business because you didn't think about that. So what
Speaker 1: happens when I cannot physically be here and do and
Speaker 1: as a result, it kind of went haywire, And so
Speaker 1: I had people making choices on my behalf that were
Speaker 1: not the best choices for like the company. So literally
Speaker 1: Darrell was in the hospital and I had just found
Speaker 1: out that he wasn't probably going to make it, although
Speaker 1: he was his body was physically there. And I had
Speaker 1: to have a team meeting because it was a shit show,
Speaker 1: and I was like, I don't even I can't save both,
Speaker 1: like you know, and it was just so overwhelming, but
Speaker 1: I wanted so I remember, I was like, look, whatever
Speaker 1: decisions haven't made are voided. I don't even know. I
Speaker 1: don't know what's going on, but everything is voided. I
Speaker 1: will not make any choices until this is in November.
Speaker 1: When I said this, I said until after February. I
Speaker 1: promise you everything will stay the same. Because I asked
Speaker 1: the finance at GARCFO, do we have enough money to
Speaker 1: last us until February and she said yes, And I said, fine,
Speaker 1: I won't make any choices until then. Just try not
Speaker 1: to destroy everything, like damn, I just need a moment,
Speaker 1: you know. And it was just so hard, but I
Speaker 1: was like, I can't. I can't be Tiffany the budgetista
Speaker 1: right now, you know. Like, so I made that promise,
Speaker 1: and sure enough, you know, everybody was able to stay.
Speaker 1: But I did say things are going to shift. I
Speaker 1: don't know in what way, because I don't know what
Speaker 1: I'm going to be able to do and to be
Speaker 1: all the way transparent. All this is not good business,
Speaker 1: and please do not do this. But the Literature Academy
Speaker 1: paid me, but I was the lowest paid person on
Speaker 1: like the main team. I only got paid after, like
Speaker 1: I got an owner's draw, after every single thing was paid,
Speaker 1: all the savings was saved, and if there was no
Speaker 1: excess after myself and my business partner did not take
Speaker 1: a draw. You know, I want to say, the literature
Speaker 1: account me paid me like fifty four thousand dollars a year.
Speaker 1: I mean, we had people making well into the six figures.
Speaker 1: So of the lead team, I was making the less
Speaker 1: by a lot, you know, like the less by half.
Speaker 1: But I said that's okay, because when we have a
Speaker 1: really good month and my owner's draw can overcompensate for that,
Speaker 1: and then we don't have a good month, then I
Speaker 1: don't deserve to make anything. And then the BUDGENISA. It
Speaker 1: was worse that with the BUDGETISA, I had not got
Speaker 1: paid any money in I want to say five or
Speaker 1: six years. I'm talking about owner's draw, I'm talking about
Speaker 1: even payroll. It was to the point where my accountant
Speaker 1: was like you're gonna get audited, Tifnany, please auto me
Speaker 1: because having a business that doesn't pay you looks like
Speaker 1: you have some sort of like drug.
Speaker 3: Drug, you know, money.
Speaker 1: But the reason why I didn't take a salary from
Speaker 1: the budgetista, even though the Budgeanisa was Tiffany speaking, Fifany,
Speaker 1: writing books, Tiffany doing spokesperson work like it was literally
Speaker 1: the business of Tiffany, is because I wanted so badly
Speaker 1: to pay my ladies. Well, you know, I know what
Speaker 1: it was like out there, and the truth of the
Speaker 1: matter is, you know, I mean, y'all know me, Amanda,
Speaker 1: We're I'm not a big spender. So with what I
Speaker 1: did have, I learned to invest and save, so I
Speaker 1: was still able to grow wealth despite not taking maybe
Speaker 1: taking one tenth of what maybe a normal CEO would
Speaker 1: have taken from their business. So one business didn't pay
Speaker 1: me at all, even though it was you know me,
Speaker 1: and then the other business pay me significantly less. But
Speaker 1: even through that, I was still able to grow, you know,
Speaker 1: my net worth to seven figures. So that's why I
Speaker 1: never felt I didn't do this to be a martyr.
Speaker 1: I did it because I said, Tiffany, you still have
Speaker 1: more than you ever even imagined, you know, So all
Speaker 1: of that to say, I really tried hard to be
Speaker 1: a really good boss, and then Darrell passes away and
Speaker 1: I just fall apart. I just literally I didn't even
Speaker 1: want to be here. I was just like it was
Speaker 1: the hardest. I mean, I mean, anybody who's lost anybody
Speaker 1: that they're close to, you know. And so after February happened,
Speaker 1: we didn't really have the funds, you know, one the
Speaker 1: budget needs to certainly, I didn't know what the future helped,
Speaker 1: because I was like, I cannot do all that I
Speaker 1: used to work like all the time. I cannot continue
Speaker 1: to work at that pace anymore. So as a result,
Speaker 1: we're not going to make what we used to make,
Speaker 1: you know, in order to support everybody. And then with
Speaker 1: the Literature Academy, you know, I'd stepped down a CEO,
Speaker 1: and I knew that as a result, he was going
Speaker 1: to take Tamras our new CEO, who she was there
Speaker 1: the day I opened the Academy door. Tamra has been there,
Speaker 1: so she's not somebody new, but I knew it was
Speaker 1: going to take her time to get her sea legs
Speaker 1: as a CEO, so we would see a drop in income.
Speaker 1: So as a result, we had to let some folks go,
Speaker 1: you know, and not a little bit like you know,
Speaker 1: probably about half the team. And it wasn't done easily.
Speaker 1: And I was not in a space to have those
Speaker 1: conversations because you know, you have to talk for a while.
Speaker 1: But I said, when I get back from BALI maybe
Speaker 1: I want to be in a space to call everybody,
Speaker 1: which is where I am now. And just to kind
Speaker 1: of come back to the reaction that from some of
Speaker 1: the folks that we've had to let go, it's really
Speaker 1: some of it was kind of nasty. And I was like, folks,
Speaker 1: who you know that, I mean, all the bonuses, the raises,
Speaker 1: and you didn't go buy Sometimes you would get a raise,
Speaker 1: it would be forty percent. We would double your income,
Speaker 1: all of the trips, all of the I mean, I
Speaker 1: don't think I make a good CEO because quite honestly,
Speaker 1: I'm not firm enough. People would would be building their
Speaker 1: own businesses and I would support it. I would help
Speaker 1: that we would use our platform. Things that we would
Speaker 1: charge fifty to one hundred thousand dollars are email, Twitter,
Speaker 1: social media, where we would do this thing called Unicorn
Speaker 1: Spotlight because I called my team the Unicorn Squad, where
Speaker 1: I would place you on all of our platforms and
Speaker 1: promote your business and people would get tens of thousands,
Speaker 1: if not one hundreds of thousand dollars worth of business
Speaker 1: as a result. These are people on my team. So
Speaker 1: all of that, and then to the point where some
Speaker 1: people were growing so much that they weren't even doing
Speaker 1: their job, Like it would be like they're not present anymore,
Speaker 1: you know, even though they were getting like my employees
Speaker 1: by by bye last year or the year before, you know,
Speaker 1: not only did you get your full time salary, we
Speaker 1: also were able to give insurance for when K plan
Speaker 1: a matching program, all of that, and so because my
Speaker 1: husband passes away and I can't dance for you anymore,
Speaker 1: there's this like visceral backlash that makes me say, like
Speaker 1: I don't know, like not I don't regret the doing,
Speaker 1: because I believe that that's the right thing to do,
Speaker 1: but it's just like I see why people don't want
Speaker 1: to do stuff, don't want to do stuff, you know,
Speaker 1: because I'm just like, there's no grace in space for that. Literally,
Speaker 1: there are people on the team I'd never heard from, Mandy.
Speaker 1: There are people like your dog couldn't pass away without
Speaker 1: me sending you flowers, you know, like if you were
Speaker 1: getting married, we would we would get something for your wedding.
Speaker 1: I mean, we would have baby showers for people. And
Speaker 1: there are people who I know I should have fired
Speaker 1: sooner rather than later because they weren't doing the work.
Speaker 1: They weren't in slack, they were so busy working on
Speaker 1: their own businesses. They couldn't be here that like we
Speaker 1: didn't let them go. Conversation after conversation, years of that
Speaker 1: of me like kind of turning the other cheek and saying, well,
Speaker 1: what can we do? Can we work around your schedule?
Speaker 1: And to say like, you know, I'm sorry, but you
Speaker 1: know in order, like I can't. I can't do all
Speaker 1: the things I used to do before that supported everybody.
Speaker 1: It was like I thought we were family, you know,
Speaker 1: like I sacrifice for you, and I'm just like, well
Speaker 1: and I appreciate that, and I sacrifice for you as well.
Speaker 1: I guess it's just like what, I don't know, it's
Speaker 1: just so hard because I'm just like, because I'm trying
Speaker 1: to take grace and space to say, I know how
Speaker 1: hard it must be to lose your job but I'm
Speaker 1: also like, damn, I don't get any grace in space,
Speaker 1: like I'm not out here. I didn't let you go
Speaker 1: because I don't feel like like my husband fucking died,
Speaker 1: Like what does it take? Do I have to die
Speaker 1: for you to be like? Well, now, maybe I can
Speaker 1: understand why Tiffany couldn't keep me, like what does it take? Honestly?
Speaker 1: But you know what it did teach me is that
Speaker 1: the people who that was their reaction. I said, I
Speaker 1: thought maybe maybe I had made a mistake for certain people,
Speaker 1: but I'm like, you know what, I didn't. I didn't
Speaker 1: because if that is how you treat someone who has
Speaker 1: poured into you, and at my lowest and worse moment,
Speaker 1: when I've never not shown up for you, then quite honestly,
Speaker 1: you know you deserve to be gone. There are literally
Speaker 1: people who did not have the skill set, did not
Speaker 1: have the education. We had grown beyond the skills that
Speaker 1: they brought to the table, But we kept them anyway
Speaker 1: and found positions and continue to pay and continue to
Speaker 1: get raises. You know, but you know that's really my fault.
Speaker 1: That's why I said, Tam, it's going to make a
Speaker 1: much better leader than I am as a CEO because
Speaker 1: I I'm too soft, you know, and I you know
Speaker 1: I should have. I thought I was being kind, but
Speaker 1: I wasn't that clear is kind, and I should have
Speaker 1: been clear and stood up for the boundaries that I'm
Speaker 1: now I don't do those things anymore. And you know,
Speaker 1: like I said, it's just like some of that feedback.
Speaker 1: I'm just reading like some of the emails that I've received,
Speaker 1: and I'm just like, Wow, Jrell ain't been dead five months,
Speaker 1: since you've been here for years, taking advantage he had
Speaker 1: been dead five months. And that's how you speak to me.
Speaker 1: These are people literally that I have said so much
Speaker 1: business to and if I go on their websites and stuff,
Speaker 1: guess who's logos on there? As this is who I
Speaker 1: work with. You know what I mean. I'm like you
Speaker 1: still eating off budget? Needs to plate? Okay, So here's
Speaker 1: the thing, Like people have to be careful because it's
Speaker 1: not the same Tiffany as before that you can keep
Speaker 1: my logo because you did work here on your website.
Speaker 1: You can let my name slip from your lips. But
Speaker 1: be careful because if someone comes and says, I'd like
Speaker 1: a recommendation, or do you think that I ought to
Speaker 1: work with them. I'm going to be fully honest about,
Speaker 1: you know, the experience I've had, so feel free to
Speaker 1: use me. But also know that people behind the scenes
Speaker 1: reach out to me to ask, you know, how is
Speaker 1: it working with this person? And I don't believe in like,
Speaker 1: I'm not retaliating in any way if you were great,
Speaker 1: because there are a handful of people that were honestly
Speaker 1: really great and we just had to let them go
Speaker 1: because we just didn't have the bandwidth anymore. There are
Speaker 1: definitely people who are like that who I'm just like, Sis,
Speaker 1: I got you, you know, but there are some people
Speaker 1: that know that they did not show up, you know,
Speaker 1: that they left us high and dry, and then you know,
Speaker 1: they followed it up with nastiness. People who I didn't
Speaker 1: even hear from, who like you know, Jerrell passed away
Speaker 1: and not a peep except for when it was time
Speaker 1: to be like Sis. Unfortunately we don't have that role anymore.
Speaker 1: Well what about my money? I'm like, wow, So I
Speaker 1: don't know, girl, It's just honestly just makes you just
Speaker 1: want to like throw the blanket over your head. I
Speaker 1: know I'm doing a lot of talk to me, but
Speaker 1: I'm just like it just really like I'm not gonna lie.
Speaker 1: It really hurt my feelings and I just was just like, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like what did I do wrong? You know, like
Speaker 1: I don't even know, but yeah, So, I mean, if
Speaker 1: you're listening to this YouTube used to work for me,
Speaker 1: you know, pass hope all as well.
Speaker 3: You're doing a lot of talking. I'm doing a lot
Speaker 3: of listening.
Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you. Man.
Speaker 2: What I'm hearing is, first of all, the fact that
Speaker 2: you contacted them after to reach out, to extend a hand,
Speaker 2: and to check in with them when.
Speaker 3: You were ready. You know, that's a lot.
Speaker 2: That's so much more than many CEOs do. I mean,
Speaker 2: speaking of layoffs right now, I mean we're seeing you know,
Speaker 2: dozens at Netflix for recently laid off Klarna, which is
Speaker 2: like one of those buy now, pay later apps that
Speaker 2: was really huge. Just let seven hundred people, ten percent
Speaker 2: of its global workforce off with a prerecorded video message,
Speaker 2: and I guarantee you they're not going to get a
Speaker 2: call from the CEO to say.
Speaker 3: How you doing.
Speaker 2: It was really compassionate of you to extend that. I
Speaker 2: also want to as a friend, I just want to
Speaker 2: like protect you because I'm like part of me is like,
Speaker 2: don't put yourself like that's really vulnerable at a time
Speaker 2: when I feel like you don't need to be vulnerable
Speaker 2: in that way, like open yourself up to that kind
Speaker 2: of to that kind of reaction, that kind of negativity.
Speaker 2: I'm not surprised that you encountered it, only only because
Speaker 2: you know, humans are humans, and they are grieving and
Speaker 2: they and they haven't had a place to maybe put
Speaker 2: that grief or they don't have.
Speaker 3: You just never know what.
Speaker 2: People's what people's own coping mechanisms are, if they or
Speaker 2: if they even have any, or if they've ever suffered
Speaker 2: a loss like that or dealt with job loss. And
Speaker 2: I think with us, we have a perspective of, you know,
Speaker 2: the greater perspective of there'll be other opportunities. I mean,
Speaker 2: I talked about this when you first initially were so
Speaker 2: candid and honest about you know, the layoff set Literature Academy,
Speaker 2: just about the overall picture that they got to work
Speaker 2: for an incredible company with the black female CEO and
Speaker 2: what a privilege that is, and the you know, and
Speaker 2: like you just laid out, you know, all of those things.
Speaker 2: But sometimes if they're so if they're so steeped in
Speaker 2: that fear of resentment, grief of their.
Speaker 3: Own they can't see all that yet.
Speaker 2: You know. I feel like in a year they'll have
Speaker 2: some clarity, and having been fired and laid off myself,
Speaker 2: I can, like, you know, there's just stuff that they
Speaker 2: need to work on individually that has nothing to do
Speaker 2: with you, and I think, just as a friend, I'm
Speaker 2: just like, no, don't put yourself there, you.
Speaker 1: Know, I just want to, like, you know, because I
Speaker 1: also do want to be better. So I'm just like,
Speaker 1: you know, here's what I probably could have done differently.
Speaker 1: I mean, I couldn't have been in a better emotional
Speaker 1: state because I don't think I could have done about that.
Speaker 1: But maybe, you know, like I'm sure people would have
Speaker 1: wanted me to be the one to lay them on.
Speaker 1: I just was not in that space to like, you know,
Speaker 1: I wasn't like, you know, like it was either Tamera,
Speaker 1: you know, so somebody who they'd known. But it's just
Speaker 1: you know, so I just don't know what I could
Speaker 1: have done differently, because it's just like, do we all
Speaker 1: sink do we just destroy the company? I just you know,
Speaker 1: I just but to your point, everyone is allowed to
Speaker 1: grieve because they're grieving as well, you know, And it's
Speaker 1: not everybody. Honestly, there were people who did a great job,
Speaker 1: and I just felt really bad that we had to
Speaker 1: let them go just because it just wasn't the position
Speaker 1: we had or could afford anymore. So there are certainly
Speaker 1: people who it wasn't anything they did. It was just
Speaker 1: this is where we are now. But yeah, it just like, honestly,
Speaker 1: it just I don't want to be in that position anymore.
Speaker 1: It just made me realize I'd made the right decision
Speaker 1: because it's me Rose and Logan over at Budgetista and
Speaker 1: when I tell you, but also to the lesson, you know,
Speaker 1: this is just for anyone listening. This is like something
Speaker 1: even a lesson that I'm going to be sharing with
Speaker 1: my mentees soon, is that there are some people on
Speaker 1: the team that if I'm being all the way candid,
Speaker 1: I said, no matter what, keep them because they did
Speaker 1: what I call illustrate your Oprah. So I mean, I
Speaker 1: don't know if this is still true, but like let's
Speaker 1: just say Oprah said, you know, hey, Mandy Tiffany, you
Speaker 1: know we for ten thousand dollars. You know, I'm going
Speaker 1: to connect you with all of my business connections. You know,
Speaker 1: I'm going to help you, you know, showcase Mandy your
Speaker 1: new bug, Tiffany, whatever that is. Me and Mandy would
Speaker 1: come up with that ten thousand dollars because Oprah, we
Speaker 1: see her value so clearly that we know that ten
Speaker 1: thousand dollars investment is going to yield way more back.
Speaker 1: And that's why I called illustrating your Oprah, like so
Speaker 1: clearly illustrating how valuable you are. And there are people
Speaker 1: on the team that I was like, I don't know
Speaker 1: what we're going to have you do when it all
Speaker 1: shakes out, but the value you bring is so compellingly
Speaker 1: obvious that I need you to still be here. And
Speaker 1: so it's a lesson in that when you bring excellence
Speaker 1: to the table, a space is always made for you.
Speaker 1: Now here's the thing. Sometimes that company it really doesn't
Speaker 1: have the money, but let's just say you were so amazing.
Speaker 1: I mean, the people I know in this industry, the
Speaker 1: even outside of this industry, A phone call is easily
Speaker 1: made to place you someplace else easily because the value
Speaker 1: you've brought is so strong that either I will find
Speaker 1: the money to keep you or I will find a
Speaker 1: place for you because I know what you bring to
Speaker 1: the table, and there are people who what phone call?
Speaker 1: Why would I make that phone call?
Speaker 3: You know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Like, I don't want people to go through the same
Speaker 1: thing that I went through. And so that also was
Speaker 1: a lesson, is that do you truly bring excellence to
Speaker 1: the table or you just have been like eating luxuriously
Speaker 1: and some people have and I allowed it, if I'm
Speaker 1: being all the way honest, I allowed it. But then
Speaker 1: when the going gets tough, you get to see we
Speaker 1: have to cut the fat, and it's just like, wait me, yes,
Speaker 1: because you didn't bring value to the table in a
Speaker 1: way that will allow me to keep you or in
Speaker 1: a way that allowed me to place you someplace else,
Speaker 1: because I, like I said, I know people who have
Speaker 1: huge businesses, huge platform that are looking for certain talent
Speaker 1: that they're only a handful of people that I'd be like,
Speaker 1: I would send somebody there. So I think that's just
Speaker 1: a lesson too. It's like when I said I came
Speaker 1: back to like all those contracts, you know, I didn't
Speaker 1: know what I was going to come back to. I
Speaker 1: thought maybe the budgetista is done, you know, and everybody
Speaker 1: who wanted to work with me last year. I was like, honestly,
Speaker 1: I don't have it. I don't know what I'm going
Speaker 1: to come back, but I just and ninety five percent
Speaker 1: of them said I'll wait, and they did wait, and
Speaker 1: I was able to extend the contract later and keep
Speaker 1: the business going. And so I think that's a testament
Speaker 1: to illustrating your OPRAH. So for those of you who
Speaker 1: were maybe experiencing job loss, you know, continue to illustrate
Speaker 1: your OPRAH, and a space will be made, if not
Speaker 1: at that company, somebody else. Like look at Mandy. She
Speaker 1: went from like what how do you let me go?
Speaker 1: To how is chicken a game? We're on her own chain? No? Please,
Speaker 1: because one year, don't even do it. Don't let Mandy
Speaker 1: be gave my nether day and one year, girl, Mandy
Speaker 1: is literally six years ahead of seat of schedule. She
Speaker 1: might not see it, but I see it as somebody
Speaker 1: who grew from scratch, like she's going from scratch. She
Speaker 1: is six years ahead of schedule because her Mandy brings
Speaker 1: excellence to the table. She illustrates her value. So clearly,
Speaker 1: look how far ahead she's been able to leap in
Speaker 1: one year. So even if a space is not help
Speaker 1: for you, you'll be able to make a space for yourself.
Speaker 1: And so Mandy can always bank on herself because of
Speaker 1: the excellence that she consistently brings to the table, and
Speaker 1: so nobody can't take that away from you. So I
Speaker 1: you know, if you work for me and I wasn't
Speaker 1: able to keep you and you're excellent, you will find
Speaker 1: someplace else that will be You know, you'll be able
Speaker 1: to say. There's one woman in particular, she's excellent. She
Speaker 1: asked me, could I write her a letter of recommendation.
Speaker 1: I sure did. She already has a new job because
Speaker 1: she was excellent. It's just that that wasn't a role
Speaker 1: that we could fill anymore. So the shady part of
Speaker 1: me wants to be like, so if you haven't heard
Speaker 1: from me, there's a reason for those you have. I'm sorry, Sis.
Speaker 2: I mean also like you're going to be much The
Speaker 2: reality of being in business is that these things happen.
Speaker 2: And I don't think for a second anyone should kid themselves,
Speaker 2: whether I mean even Tiffany. You have this huge heart.
Speaker 2: You want to help everybody. At the end of the day,
Speaker 2: it's a business, and so you made a business decision
Speaker 2: that inconvenienced a lot of people. That happens, and that's why,
Speaker 2: and especially what you're saying now about the people on
Speaker 2: your team that you want to go to bat for
Speaker 2: and help them find their next opportunity. This is why
Speaker 2: as individuals we have to be so laser focused on
Speaker 2: our brand, our professional brand, our skill sets, like you said,
Speaker 2: are excellence and how are we how are we you know, growing?
Speaker 2: How are we developing so that we can be the
Speaker 2: person that people want on their teams that they and
Speaker 2: so you have unlimited opportunities always, And that's why I
Speaker 2: have been able to go into business fearlessly because it's
Speaker 2: like you said, like there is those skills that I
Speaker 2: know I can fall back on and and good good,
Speaker 2: you know, no burned bridges that I can think of.
Speaker 3: Maybe a couple a little.
Speaker 2: Leis it, maybe with dents, maybe they're on like still
Speaker 2: held together popsicle sticks, but they're still a bridge.
Speaker 3: Can get across it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I mean that's just the message. I mean,
Speaker 2: whether you are and also for people who are running
Speaker 2: businesses and making those tough decisions at the end of
Speaker 2: the day, like what you said clear, being clear is kindness?
Speaker 2: Is that I mean that is just and it brings
Speaker 2: me back to like, you know, if you haven't read
Speaker 2: this book called Dared to Lead by Brene Brown, I love, love,
Speaker 2: love all of her messages around leadership and being clear
Speaker 2: is terrifying. And I know we've talked like TIF, you've
Speaker 2: talked about your struggle with having those difficult conversations and
Speaker 2: how you know you're continuing to work on that. But
Speaker 2: this experience, I mean not that I ever want to say.
Speaker 2: Of course, we would all want to rill back a
Speaker 2: million times over versus this, but you know, the growth
Speaker 2: as a business owner, this this this growth that we're
Speaker 2: all getting to witness. You're in the middle of it.
Speaker 2: You're going to be a more so much better, and
Speaker 2: you're open to learn, You're open to saying here's what
Speaker 2: I would do differently, and that I think is what
Speaker 2: separates great leaders. And you may say never again, no
Speaker 2: ceo ever again, but you won't. That's not your last
Speaker 2: great business. I mean, I just come on, you're Tiffany
Speaker 2: like you will create and it'll be better and better
Speaker 2: next time, the next time and next time.
Speaker 1: And I'm just grateful because I honestly I have my
Speaker 1: next therapy appointment with doctor Green tomorrow, So I'm gonna
Speaker 1: share and just be like what Because one of the
Speaker 1: things that doctor Green tries to work on with me
Speaker 1: is how Mike, because I used to always tell I'm
Speaker 1: self aware, she said no, She's like, Tiffany, sometimes we
Speaker 1: think that we're self aware, but we're more self deprecating.
Speaker 1: She's like that true humility is taking up the exact
Speaker 1: amount of space. Tiffany, that not overreaching to arrogance, but
Speaker 1: not undershooting to self deprecation. And I'm like, okay, because
Speaker 1: sometimes we think humility and like, Okay, I'm trying to hump,
Speaker 1: I'm trying to be kind. Means that like we take
Speaker 1: we take a step all the way back, and she's like, no,
Speaker 1: it's taking up the exact amount of space. So in
Speaker 1: this moment, I mean, I know I'm angry or whatever,
Speaker 1: but honestly, really the anger is just spent, is just
Speaker 1: it's just it's really just me. I'm just sad, honestly,
Speaker 1: you know, like I'm sad, and so I just I
Speaker 1: want to get a better framework of like where could
Speaker 1: I have done better? But also what not to pick
Speaker 1: up because I know that I have a tendency to
Speaker 1: be like I should have done this, I should have
Speaker 1: done this. I can understand that, and not to give
Speaker 1: myself my own grace in space to be like, well, yes, yes,
Speaker 1: maybe those things are true.
Speaker 2: You can give yourself the grace you deserve. Don't expect
Speaker 2: everyone else to give it to you. Yes, it's got
Speaker 2: to come from you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I believe so, because you're right. If I'm
Speaker 1: waiting on other people then like I might not ever
Speaker 1: know it.
Speaker 2: It's none of your business what they think about you.
Speaker 2: That's Tabitha Brown in my head all the time. None
Speaker 2: my business. You give yourself that grace because you have
Speaker 2: to know. You have to know who you are at
Speaker 2: your core and your intentions and make peace with that
Speaker 2: and understand that some people will feel however they're going
Speaker 2: to feel about it, but that's not your business. You
Speaker 2: can't change it too. You had too much shit to do,
Speaker 2: you have too much feeling to do.
Speaker 1: I know, I'm just like I do. Doctor Green is
Speaker 1: going to be like really, Tiffany, like I'm like this
Speaker 1: for her, I know, be a good week. I know
Speaker 1: that like with all, like like the grieving exercise that
Speaker 1: we had that that's not what you're putting on your plate,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, I know, but because really what I'm
Speaker 1: saying is I hate that people are mad at me,
Speaker 1: and I don't want them to be upset with me.
Speaker 1: And I feel really bad because I care about them,
Speaker 1: because I do, you know. But yeah, to your point,
Speaker 1: I know, I nobody knows it's going to.
Speaker 3: Piss them off.
Speaker 2: Tif you were always going to piss them off when
Speaker 2: they lost their jobs. There was a not a world
Speaker 2: in which they weren't going to be upset about that,
Speaker 2: you know, And I think that's what it is. It's
Speaker 2: about letting, but it's what needed to be done for
Speaker 2: where you were at that stage in the business.
Speaker 3: Maybe in a.
Speaker 2: Perfect world you would have had a successor or systems
Speaker 2: in place, or more savings or whatever, but that was
Speaker 2: the reality, you know, and you did the best with
Speaker 2: what you could, and often making the best choice for
Speaker 2: ourselves does mean inconveniencing and hurting other people.
Speaker 1: You know, you had the best, Mandy. Honestly, you're like
Speaker 1: such a good friend.
Speaker 3: You are for real, Thanks, Tiff, for real.
Speaker 1: I appreciate that. Yeah, I'm trying to call it every
Speaker 1: damn episode. I do really appreciate that because.
Speaker 2: You showed up what did I say. I don't need,
Speaker 2: I don't expect anything. You showed up.
Speaker 3: You sit and if you want to stare at me
Speaker 3: for an hour, we can do that.
Speaker 1: No, for real, I appreciate that you have no idea
Speaker 1: because I was really just like, dang, Tiffany, you should
Speaker 1: have done more, you could have been better. And it's
Speaker 1: just like the the other part of me was like, Tiffany,
Speaker 1: the hell, Like when do you get to grieve? When
Speaker 1: do you get to not carry everybody's burden like sold
Speaker 1: you were you supposed to keep them for the rest
Speaker 1: of their life when they're ninety years old, Like what
Speaker 1: was the scenario going to be like? And so like, No,
Speaker 1: I just appreciate that, Like I know doctor Green is
Speaker 1: going to read me gently for filth Life girl stop,
Speaker 1: which I don't.
Speaker 2: Want you to be angry either at them, because I
Speaker 2: feel like they're having human reactions. You're at wells freaking humans, right,
Speaker 2: And I love I know I keep talking about bray
Speaker 2: Brene Brown because I'm kind of a basic bitch like that,
Speaker 2: But I love Brene Brown. She has this podcast called
Speaker 2: Dare to Lead, named after her book and her her
Speaker 2: leadership training that she does and this most recent episode
Speaker 2: made me think of you because Brenee Brown is stepping
Speaker 2: down as CEO of her business, Yes, and she talks
Speaker 2: about it, and the things that she was talking about
Speaker 2: reminded me of you, and the compassion that she's having
Speaker 2: for herself and her sister. She's named two co CEOs
Speaker 2: in her place, so it took two CEOs to do what.
Speaker 3: She was doing.
Speaker 2: And yeah, it's it's a recent episode where they talk
Speaker 2: about and what I also love that stuck with me
Speaker 2: from this conversation. So for those of you who don't know,
Speaker 2: Brene Brown has this her TikTok. Her ted talk went
Speaker 2: viral of years ago about vulnerability and shame. So she's
Speaker 2: a social worker who's a shame expert and has taken
Speaker 2: her message around being vulnerable and dealing with shame and
Speaker 2: uses it to create better leadership, braver leadership, more inclusive companies,
Speaker 2: all of that. So she's built this big business with
Speaker 2: you know, dozens of employees and they have facilitators doing
Speaker 2: these trainings around the globe, you know. So it's a
Speaker 2: big company that she's built. And you know, from someone
Speaker 2: who is a social worker, you know, as a preschool teacher,
Speaker 2: I feel like, that's part social worker in a way,
Speaker 2: and she in the show opens up about bringing her
Speaker 2: They bring everyone back to their headquarters for an all
Speaker 2: hands after the pandemic, and she's like, and one of
Speaker 2: the things that I love that she talks about is
Speaker 2: how in her All Hands she specifically said, we need
Speaker 2: to reintroduce ourselves to one another. And none of us
Speaker 2: is the same. We've all we are different. Let's not
Speaker 2: as not business as usual, we are fundamentally different. The pain,
Speaker 2: the grief, the suffering that we've gone through, you know,
Speaker 2: and what do we look like now? And how do
Speaker 2: we show up to work now? And she's taking she
Speaker 2: also announced she's taking a fourteen week sabbatical, like step
Speaker 2: down a ceo, taking fourteen weeks off because that's the
Speaker 2: level of burnout that she's gotten to, and giving her
Speaker 2: employees four weeks paid vacation off this summer as well,
Speaker 2: and just to acknowledge, She's like, this is the bravest
Speaker 2: thing we've ever done, which is to step away. Yeah,
Speaker 2: And anyway, I think that that's that reminded me of
Speaker 2: you too, because I do think that there are CEOs
Speaker 2: out there who get to that or end up there
Speaker 2: and it all feels right, and then you realize, Okay,
Speaker 2: this is actually not what I need or for me,
Speaker 2: And then that inconvenience isn't hurt some people maybe, But
Speaker 2: what's the.
Speaker 1: Alternative, Yeah, to stay here and to like to.
Speaker 3: Drown push yourself into the ground.
Speaker 1: Like yeah, because something that really like helped. It was
Speaker 1: like for me not to be angry with them because
Speaker 1: everyone's everyone is feeling like their feelings are valid. You know,
Speaker 1: it's not. It wasn't. I'm not the only one who
Speaker 1: lost something. They lost something too. You know. There's a
Speaker 1: level of grief that folks who were not at a
Speaker 1: place where I'm assuming they love to work and I
Speaker 1: love the people that they worked with like to lose
Speaker 1: that that is a that is a great loss as well,
Speaker 1: you know, and there's a grieving process for that as well.
Speaker 1: So to leave, I can't ask for grace and space
Speaker 1: and not also extended you know. Yeah, it's like protecting
Speaker 1: your heart too. And I do think it was like
Speaker 1: incredibly generous of you to talk to them and give
Speaker 1: them a space to let go of some of that
Speaker 1: anger if they wanted to. But it's just like so
Speaker 1: what you don't internalize it don't let it stay there
Speaker 1: in you.
Speaker 2: It's almost like not comparting, not like a psychopath. You know,
Speaker 2: you have to you feel things, and plus you're an mpath.
Speaker 2: We've talked about that before, but not letting it sit
Speaker 2: with you on your spirit just kind of like looking
Speaker 2: at it as something that's floating past you. You know,
Speaker 2: this is anger. I understand it. Okay, it's it's gone. Now,
Speaker 2: it's in the world. That's theirs to carry, not me.
Speaker 3: Doctor Green. I set her up for you so she'll
Speaker 3: be ready to go to.
Speaker 1: Doctor Google and then maybe saying she's like that's good.
Speaker 2: Yes, I will send you the podcast episode Dare to Lead.
Speaker 3: By my girl Burne Brown.
Speaker 1: Yes.
Speaker 2: So I'm reading a new book called Burnout's Book. No,
Speaker 2: it's not anything like you think a book called burnout
Speaker 2: would be. Like, it's about our emotions and how it's
Speaker 2: it's like the tools that we can use to actually
Speaker 2: move through an emotion so we don't get to the
Speaker 2: place of burnout. And how burnout especially from people who
Speaker 2: were in like service industries and service like medical professionals
Speaker 2: and teachers and things like that. How sometimes it's because
Speaker 2: the day to day chronic stress of those jobs and
Speaker 2: those and also being a parent. The chronic stress of that,
Speaker 2: how we end up to a place where we're spiraling,
Speaker 2: where not all the self care in the world can
Speaker 2: save us, because it's like the chronic nature of it,
Speaker 2: the day after day after day, and not like sitting
Speaker 2: with and acknowledging those feelings and emotions. So it's really
Speaker 2: a book about emotions and how to like move through
Speaker 2: them so that you don't end up in that space
Speaker 2: of deep burnout where you're just nothing I do is working.
Speaker 2: I'm not being effective, you know. I you know, it's
Speaker 2: a really I'm looking forward to finishing this book.
Speaker 1: But no send me that to because I you know,
Speaker 1: these days I have a lot of time to read
Speaker 1: so and but no, I would love that, because you're right,
Speaker 1: I want to get to a space where like those
Speaker 1: things flow through and I could acknowledge, Like one of
Speaker 1: the things doctor Green always reminds me is two things
Speaker 1: can be true. I can say this is the best
Speaker 1: that I had, but I can also acknowledge it's still
Speaker 1: hurtful on the other side, and that's true as well.
Speaker 1: Just because this is just because my intention was not
Speaker 1: to hurt doesn't mean people didn't feel hurt, you know.
Speaker 1: So it's like two things can be true at one time,
Speaker 1: you know, and so like just acknowledging that, like, okay,
Speaker 1: like people are allowed to feel that. I don't have
Speaker 1: to internalize it, you know, I can say, Okay, yes,
Speaker 1: it would not have been ideal. And obviously I would
Speaker 1: love for Drill to be here and I would continue
Speaker 1: to be the regular tifany I was before, but that's
Speaker 1: not where we are. So no, this was honestly, this
Speaker 1: was because I was debating whether or how much to
Speaker 1: share and how much to be transparent. And you know,
Speaker 1: I'm certain, like I said, like, I know some of
Speaker 1: my current employees and past employees have you know, listened
Speaker 1: to the podcast. But honestly, the truth is is nothing
Speaker 1: that I have not either shared. Well, there are a
Speaker 1: handful of people who I have not called because honestly
Speaker 1: they did nothing, like you know, we needed to fire
Speaker 1: them some time ago. So you know, they were fortunate
Speaker 1: to be able to ride the wave for as long
Speaker 1: as they did, and they know and they they don't know,
Speaker 1: well greing her here for me, you know now. But
Speaker 1: you know, for those people who like, you know, I
Speaker 1: really reached out to because I'm just like, dang, you know,
Speaker 1: I wish things could be different. I you know, it's
Speaker 1: a learning lesson and you're right, maybe one day, but
Speaker 1: for now, child, it's a lot like and I'm hoping
Speaker 1: I'm sharing this and being as transparent because most people
Speaker 1: in business, they will share either their wins or their
Speaker 1: semi losses, not like this. This huge, like I don't
Speaker 1: even want to call it a loss but challenge, And I
Speaker 1: just want this for you to see. This is also
Speaker 1: part of leadership that like, you're not gonna make all
Speaker 1: the right choices. There are gonna be people who are
Speaker 1: gonna be really upset because they're like I was using
Speaker 1: that money to fund my college fund for my kid,
Speaker 1: or you know, it's not I don't take it lightly
Speaker 1: like someone losing that income. And so these are things
Speaker 1: that you're just like, but I don't know what else
Speaker 1: I could have done. But you know, I just want
Speaker 1: you to see that sometimes there is no there is
Speaker 1: no right answer, is just learning and this is what
Speaker 1: part of like entrepreneurship looks like that, like, you know,
Speaker 1: for those who get to a point where they can
Speaker 1: hire people, you know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I love that so much. I'd like to end
Speaker 2: on that note, like to give yourself space to not
Speaker 2: actually have some magical epiphany like it just sucks. Yes,
Speaker 2: everything sucks. Drell's gone up sucks. Yes, you know those
Speaker 2: people lost their jobs.
Speaker 3: That sucks.
Speaker 1: There sucks.
Speaker 3: Yes, and you just need more time to work through it.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but on both sides.
Speaker 2: Yeah, give yourself, give yourself the grace that you know
Speaker 2: you deserve. Okay, okay, my friend, be nice to my
Speaker 2: friend over there. Meditate on that camel.
Speaker 3: You were just right? Did the camels smell bad?
Speaker 1: Did they surprisingly know? Although I've heard that camel's spit
Speaker 1: maybe that's lamas, But I mean I didn't want to
Speaker 1: see them like they're actually pretty like gentle creatures, like,
Speaker 1: but you could tell they.
Speaker 3: Were like once.
Speaker 2: I didn't want to like make you they were less cool.
Speaker 2: But I didn't write a camel. I was at the
Speaker 2: Saint Louis Zoo. That's where I was, and I lied
Speaker 2: to them and told them Rio was two years old,
Speaker 2: and he was not two years old. But it's also
Speaker 2: he passed for two. But it was the things you
Speaker 2: do for your child. I was petrified. Camel they're very
Speaker 2: high up there.
Speaker 1: They very high. They are they are very high on
Speaker 1: and I wrote a donkey, which I would not suggest
Speaker 1: because there's a part of Petro where you get to
Speaker 1: like you can go to what's called the monastery, but
Speaker 1: it's like an hour walk incline upstairs, like or twenty
Speaker 1: minutes on a donkey. I was like, girl, give me
Speaker 1: the twenty minutes on a donkey. I'm only here by
Speaker 1: God's grace because but I mean it was so scary.
Speaker 1: I mean I just was like, donkey, I'm just gonna
Speaker 1: trust that you know the way and you know what
Speaker 1: you're doing it. The way it was bad. The way
Speaker 1: down was worse because you're down the steep incline on
Speaker 1: ancient steps. I was like, I don't know. The donkey
Speaker 1: was like, girl, look if I go down, you go
Speaker 1: down to So I would not suggest it. I should
Speaker 1: have just walked in the hundred degree weather. But yeah,
Speaker 1: that was the donkey. I mean, the camera was That's
Speaker 1: how you know it had to be bad because the
Speaker 1: camera was much easier than a donkey. Yeah, that Moore donkey.
Speaker 1: Donkeys are like, girl, I was not put on here
Speaker 1: to carry your behind up these steps.
Speaker 2: But there though, we deserve a little breaky break, all right,
Speaker 2: let's take a break and we'll be right back with
Speaker 2: boost or break. Yes, all right, we are bag. It's
Speaker 2: time for a boost and break.
Speaker 3: Wait I didn't think. Wait, I didn't. I didn't give
Speaker 3: to her opportunity.
Speaker 1: And now it's time to boost up, break or boost break?
Speaker 1: Are you gonna booth? Are you gonna break? What you're
Speaker 1: gonna do? What you're gonna I don't remember this song ever,
Speaker 1: so you go, you're gonna booth, You're gonna break.
Speaker 3: I'm gonna take a break. It's hard to pick a
Speaker 3: break these days.
Speaker 2: Well, first, I don't think we've had time to acknowledge
Speaker 2: the horrific shooting in Buffalo last weekend, and partially part
Speaker 2: of that is we didn't record a show last week.
Speaker 2: But also I'm speaking of giving yourself grace. I was
Speaker 2: giving myself time to just process. But yeah, that's been
Speaker 2: sitting on my spirit, So my heart goes out to them.
Speaker 2: I did find it healing to get together with my neighborhood.
Speaker 2: We had a little like a candlelight vigil just in
Speaker 2: the middle of our neighborhood, and I did find that
Speaker 2: you know something, because there's there's nothing you can do
Speaker 2: but just love each other and support one another. But
Speaker 2: on top of that, there was some shenanigans in the
Speaker 2: news and a couple of things. I was toggling between,
Speaker 2: should we talk about Walmart's June teenth red velvet flavored
Speaker 2: ice cream or could we talk about Wells Fargo uggin
Speaker 2: proving they are the worst, the worst, the worst.
Speaker 3: There was this.
Speaker 2: Crazy article about in The Times about how people at
Speaker 2: Wells Fargo wistle blower have come out and said that
Speaker 2: they held fake, basically fake interviews with diverse candidates to
Speaker 2: just in case they were ever audited. They were sort
Speaker 2: of worried, oh maybe, oh yeah, yeah. For many open positions,
Speaker 2: employees would interview a quote unquote diverse candidate. This article
Speaker 2: says the bank's term for a woman or a person
Speaker 2: of color, in keeping with an informal policy. And then
Speaker 2: these people noticed that they would be interviewed for a
Speaker 2: job that had already been promised to something to someone else.
Speaker 2: And when this wilso blow or spoke out, shout out
Speaker 2: to mister Bruno, who was fired, and he says that
Speaker 2: Wells Fargo did fired him in retaliation because he was
Speaker 2: going around saying these fake interviews are inappropriate, morally wrong, etc.
Speaker 3: But he wasn't the only one.
Speaker 2: They had like half a dozen former Wells Fargo's Wells
Speaker 2: Fargo employees who verified that this was happening, and what
Speaker 2: a waste of everyone's time this is.
Speaker 1: I'm just like, how can you get any like the
Speaker 1: fact that the City of New York said we're not
Speaker 1: doing no more business with y'all because of these Like
Speaker 1: I just like, is there like literally do you wake
Speaker 1: up and say, how can we be as as terrible
Speaker 1: as possible? How can we be said, hmm, what can
Speaker 1: we do? Like I just honestly, but that's why we
Speaker 1: moved over. We left, you know, the Fargo. And not
Speaker 1: to say that like any other bank is like so great,
Speaker 1: but I'm like, damn, Like you know, big banks are
Speaker 1: not my favorite at all. But you know, once you
Speaker 1: have a certain sized business, it's hard to do like
Speaker 1: the smaller banks, just because there's certain things that you
Speaker 1: just need, you know, and so but yeah, we were
Speaker 1: with them for years and just every time you turn around,
Speaker 1: you're just like the worst of the worst of the
Speaker 1: worst of the worst. Wells Fargo is actually my first
Speaker 1: because before it was Wells Fargo, it was called like
Speaker 1: Jakovia before WAKOVI was called something else, and so I
Speaker 1: was with the bank before the bank, before the bank,
Speaker 1: like it was my first bank account. I forget what
Speaker 1: it was called, like the actual like first whatever the
Speaker 1: bank was called before, and then it became like something
Speaker 1: else and became WACOB, then became Wells Fargo. But I
Speaker 1: was with that bank four banks back. So this was like,
Speaker 1: you know, my very first bank account. And I'm like, sis,
Speaker 1: y'all are just even though I have like twenty thousand
Speaker 1: bank accounts and it took like so long to switch
Speaker 1: everything over. I said, I can't a counts.
Speaker 2: They have just continued to show their ass I just
Speaker 2: don't see how anyone any people of color could bank
Speaker 2: with this place, Like they're the same bank where the
Speaker 2: CEO basically said, we'd love to have more diverse candidates,
Speaker 2: but it's hard to find qualified black candidates.
Speaker 3: Remember from like June tire moony, my god.
Speaker 2: And then last August, they paid eight million dollars to
Speaker 2: settle a Department of Labor claim that it discriminated against
Speaker 2: more than thirty thousand black job applicants for positions. Settled
Speaker 2: a case in twenty seventeen, thirty six million dollars class
Speaker 2: action lawsuit again for not advancing black financial advisors and
Speaker 2: financial advisor trainees at the company.
Speaker 1: Like they're Goulda watched they're gonna just renamed news. They're
Speaker 1: gonna rename themselves.
Speaker 3: Bad news bears.
Speaker 2: They need they need to just burn it down, I guess,
Speaker 2: I mean not literally, but just start from scratch, like
Speaker 2: can we just overhaul everything? But yeah, that got my
Speaker 2: blood going this this this past week, that in Walmart's
Speaker 2: spread velvet freaking flavored juneteen ice cream, because why not
Speaker 2: make a mockery of a holiday week?
Speaker 3: It's too hard to have.
Speaker 2: What I honestly, it could have been worse if they
Speaker 2: had been like watermelon flavored or yes, it was like
Speaker 2: the Juneteenth fried chicken or something like that.
Speaker 3: I know, but god, who I was in marketing.
Speaker 1: That's I just want to put I don't know black
Speaker 1: people there. It's like when like Chevy had the Nova and.
Speaker 2: They were like yeah, no, I don't know. I want
Speaker 2: to think that there weren't, but I don't know.
Speaker 1: It's just maybe they weren't listening because sometimes people are
Speaker 1: like no, people are gonna love it, but well, I
Speaker 1: am going to booze because I'm gonna boost alternative. Well,
Speaker 1: m I don't even know how to say. I'll just
Speaker 1: say this that. So when I went to Jordan, I
Speaker 1: didn't know at first, but like, so my friend Cabrera
Speaker 1: was like, Oh, my friend Marian is going to Jordan.
Speaker 1: Mariyan is a flight attendant. And I was like oh.
Speaker 1: And so, you know, I didn't realize, but the person
Speaker 1: who was who was hosting the trip the tour, he
Speaker 1: himself was a flight attendant. And so ninety percent of
Speaker 1: the people who were on this tour, maybe like twenty
Speaker 1: or so people, maybe like fifteen, they were all flight attendants.
Speaker 1: So ninety percent. There was maybe like just a handful
Speaker 1: of us that weren't like three or four. So they
Speaker 1: all knew each other, you know. I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: they all flew with the United and I was like, okay.
Speaker 1: So it was so interesting how different the conversation is
Speaker 1: with people who travel, you know, it was and it
Speaker 1: just set a tone for me that said that, because
Speaker 1: on the outside, if you didn't know what they did
Speaker 1: for a living, you would have thought, because of the
Speaker 1: type of conversations, that everybody was independently wealthy. Because the
Speaker 1: conversation for ever want something like this, Oh, you know,
Speaker 1: I really want to get you know, braces or something
Speaker 1: like my my veneers or whatever it is. You know what,
Speaker 1: go to my guy in Vietnam. He's amazing. You know,
Speaker 1: I just feel like I'm like I'm getting a little older,
Speaker 1: I'm getting sun spots. Oh, I've got that the best guy.
Speaker 1: He's in India. Literally, people had a skin person in India.
Speaker 1: They're dentists in Vietnam, their doctor in Colombia. So they
Speaker 1: sounded like these independent, very wealthy pash people. And not
Speaker 1: to say that, you know, as frightens you to make
Speaker 1: good money, but you know that's a like a good
Speaker 1: regular person job, you know, And it just had it
Speaker 1: just kind of like a light bulb went on in me.
Speaker 1: Is that oftentimes we say we can't have a certain
Speaker 1: lifestyle because we're because honestly, our thinking is limited. If
Speaker 1: you're someone who's like I would really love to travel
Speaker 1: the world, you honestly don't have to necessarily wait until
Speaker 1: you're this millionaire that there are alternative careers that allow
Speaker 1: you to do that, you know. And so because they
Speaker 1: were telling me, like for example, you know, like maybe
Speaker 1: my flight was like you know, twelve hundred dollars round
Speaker 1: trip to Jordan. But because they're flight attendants and they
Speaker 1: get discounts or sometimes you just pay if you plug
Speaker 1: flights stand by, maybe you just pay taxes. It was
Speaker 1: like under two hundred dollars for them, and so it
Speaker 1: just made it that much more affordable. So it just
Speaker 1: I just think that, you know, so many of us
Speaker 1: get locked into you know, it's almost like first comes love,
Speaker 1: then comes marriage, then comes the baby, the baby carriage,
Speaker 1: and it's like, well, you know you can actually have
Speaker 1: a baby whenever you want, Well, you know you can actually,
Speaker 1: you know, there are so many alternatives to get the
Speaker 1: end desired goal that you're wanting. So I'm hoping that
Speaker 1: I say all that to say for you to just
Speaker 1: expand your mind and ask yourself, what is actually my
Speaker 1: desired outcome? And am I taking a long route because
Speaker 1: maybe there's a shorter route to live that lifestyle that
Speaker 1: I'm saying that I want. Because when I tell you, Mandy,
Speaker 1: like if it took me a couple of days to
Speaker 1: realize they were all flight attendants, because I was like, wow,
Speaker 1: these people are well fade because they were just talking
Speaker 1: about all their trips, like oh, remember that time it
Speaker 1: Kenya girl, I remember this time in Zimbabwe or wherever,
Speaker 1: and I'm just like and then I was like, wait,
Speaker 1: y'all are flight attendant. And then I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: they you know, they fly, you know, not for free,
Speaker 1: but damn near in comparison to what a regular ticket
Speaker 1: would cost. And yeah, So it was just an amazing
Speaker 1: trip to meet those amazing people because they were really
Speaker 1: so awesome, but also to just see life through the
Speaker 1: eyes of people who see the world regularly and who
Speaker 1: understand that there's more than one way to achieve that
Speaker 1: type of lifestyle. So I just encourage people to, like
Speaker 1: I'm gona say, encourage you to be a flight attendant,
Speaker 1: but I'm encouraging you to figure out what your desired
Speaker 1: outcome is and ask yourself, are you taking the long
Speaker 1: route to it? And maybe if there's an easier route,
Speaker 1: well you can enjoy it now you don't have to wait.
Speaker 2: I think you're also just talking about the importance of
Speaker 2: human connection and like actually being around people who have
Speaker 2: who help you see things that are possible that maybe
Speaker 2: you weren't seeing. And it's like putting yourself in other
Speaker 2: people's paths so that you come in contact with those
Speaker 2: types of people. So of course, like putting yourself on
Speaker 2: a trip in Jordan would put you in the path
Speaker 2: of people who were adventurous and willing to try different
Speaker 2: medical treatments in different countries and something like, which is
Speaker 2: all great, but I think for anyone it's like, just
Speaker 2: get out of your comfort zone, go outside your zip code,
Speaker 2: go outside of you know, your immediate circle, because that's
Speaker 2: where it's really just seeing other people, you know, living
Speaker 2: the life that they're leading and being inspired by that
Speaker 2: and like, oh that's possible for me. I feel like
Speaker 2: I'm constantly getting to experience that so often just because
Speaker 2: of the virtue of like the type of work that
Speaker 2: I do and like getting to talk with you and everything,
Speaker 2: and it's really powerful. Hopefully this show itself is like
Speaker 2: one of those small ways people sort of feel like
Speaker 2: they can start to think bigger, you know, and start
Speaker 2: to expect more in a different way. And like you said,
Speaker 2: going from we tell ourselves there's all these rules, but
Speaker 2: it's not like that at all, Like.
Speaker 1: Most of them are stuff in posts rules and your
Speaker 1: real self and plo.
Speaker 3: Yes, like I can't.
Speaker 1: Do that, I gotta do this, do that.
Speaker 2: Yes, I told myself that okay, we'll tell yourself something different.
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, we get so locked up and so like, no,
Speaker 1: it has to be done this way. It's like does that,
Speaker 1: you know, but sometimes you need someone else who's doing
Speaker 1: it differently.
Speaker 2: To Thailand because I keep saying I can just do
Speaker 2: it and Rio can learn tie be fun for real. Well,
Speaker 2: welcome back, Tip and yeah that's the show. We will
Speaker 2: see y'all next week. Don't forget to check in for
Speaker 2: our b a Q and A on Fridays.
Speaker 1: And don't feel feel free to tweet me dm me
Speaker 1: maybe give me a different perspective, because I really do
Speaker 1: enjoy hearing from Brown a Bison folk. I'm just the budget.
Speaker 1: He's done all the all the platforms. So if you're
Speaker 1: just like girl, you was wrong. Girl, you want to
Speaker 1: tweet me, I'm awlad with that. I might black you. No,
Speaker 1: I won't block you, but no, but.
Speaker 3: For inviting more like inviting wrek.
Speaker 1: I know, because you know, because I'm always I'm always
Speaker 1: on a quest to like, how can I do and
Speaker 1: be a better person? Because ultimately I feel like that's
Speaker 1: what we're all called to do, is to like that
Speaker 1: ultimately you are here to be the best person that
Speaker 1: you are capable of being. And so I am committed
Speaker 1: to always to growth, always, you know, to acknowledging challenges
Speaker 1: and then growing and then hopefully showing up better and
Speaker 1: acknowledging some more, and then growing and showing up better.
Speaker 2: So to growing and giving yourself grace.
Speaker 1: Yes, growing and grace that champagne. So y'all, We love y'all.
Speaker 1: If you don't, I mean, hello, this is a great episode.
Speaker 1: If I do say so myself, and I do say
Speaker 1: so myself, share with your friends, runabisonpodcast dot com to
Speaker 1: not just this episode, but all the other episodes. You know,
Speaker 1: I think we're a pretty amazing podcasts and the webbies agree, winners,
Speaker 1: So share a share this, share on this episode or
Speaker 1: at prior episodes, and you know, put it in the
Speaker 1: group chat and you know, this may make a good
Speaker 1: group chat conversation and let us know how that goes.
Speaker 1: So love y'all until next week.
Speaker 2: Bye, Hey, ba fan, We could not do this show
Speaker 2: without your support or the support of our team behind
Speaker 2: the scenes. The Brown Emission podcast is produced by Cumulus
Speaker 2: Podcast Network.
Speaker 3: It's edited by.
Speaker 2: The wonderful Imani Crosby and produced by Tanya Bustos. Dennis
Speaker 2: Stimplinsky is our in house tech guru, and I am
Speaker 2: Bandy Woodard Santos, your co host, and I will see
Speaker 2: y'all next week