WEBVTT - When a Child Dies...Calling It What It Is | Annie Downs 0:00:00.000 --> 0:00:03.960 It's Kimberly Schlapman from Little Big Town, and she had 0:00:04.000 --> 0:00:07.600 told a story on the episode about after her first 0:00:07.680 --> 0:00:11.440 husband died and laying in his closet. And she's sobbing 0:00:11.440 --> 0:00:13.440 as she's telling us a story, and she says, I've 0:00:13.440 --> 0:00:16.439 never told anybody any of this. And then when I'm 0:00:16.480 --> 0:00:20.360 done recording, I realised I never hit record on her microphone, 0:00:20.400 --> 0:00:23.000 and so we have none of it. And I am 0:00:23.360 --> 0:00:25.759 I'm like laying my hands on the machine. Jesus, I 0:00:25.840 --> 0:00:28.120 need you to do a miracle. Jesus, I need you 0:00:28.200 --> 0:00:29.840 to find a recording I cannot find. 0:00:30.200 --> 0:00:32.000 And it showed up. I mean it showed up for 0:00:32.040 --> 0:00:32.599 our producer. 0:00:32.640 --> 0:00:34.800 But I said to my manager that day, Kelly, Hey, what, 0:00:34.960 --> 0:00:36.960 I was like, I'm never doing a show by myself 0:00:36.960 --> 0:00:39.919 ever again, because I had recorded it myself without an engineer. 0:00:40.200 --> 0:00:41.480 And I was like, that's the last one. 0:00:41.520 --> 0:00:43.120 We never do it without an engineer because I can't 0:00:43.159 --> 0:00:45.159 think of everything and I forget things like hitting the 0:00:45.200 --> 0:00:46.240 guests microphone. 0:00:46.280 --> 0:00:48.880 So and so you got you did get it, though, 0:00:48.960 --> 0:00:51.000 Jesus answered, the Lord. 0:00:50.920 --> 0:00:53.280 The Lord, I am not kidding you, the Lord. 0:00:53.880 --> 0:00:56.480 We're actually recorded. We got that, we're recording, right, now, 0:00:56.760 --> 0:00:59.200 so I think I think this podcast begins with you 0:00:59.280 --> 0:01:00.280 telling that story. 0:01:01.200 --> 0:01:03.680 Bless Kimberly Schlapman's life. You so good to me. 0:01:04.480 --> 0:01:07.960 That's really good. Annie Downs, thank you so much for 0:01:08.520 --> 0:01:09.039 being here. 0:01:10.040 --> 0:01:11.959 IM so glad to see you. Granger, I'm good. 0:01:12.040 --> 0:01:14.039 It's glad to see you too, and I've I've learned 0:01:14.160 --> 0:01:18.200 so much from you and I believe we've actually only 0:01:18.360 --> 0:01:20.880 seen each other once in person. Is that right in Florida? 0:01:21.040 --> 0:01:21.920 Is right in Florida? 0:01:22.080 --> 0:01:22.720 Yeah? I think so. 0:01:23.880 --> 0:01:27.440 It's interesting because in the music world it's not too different. 0:01:27.520 --> 0:01:30.760 You see these artists and usually we would see each 0:01:30.800 --> 0:01:33.399 other at award shows and every once in a while 0:01:33.400 --> 0:01:35.760 we would, you know, wake up and we're in the 0:01:35.760 --> 0:01:38.360 same city and we didn't even know it. And it's 0:01:38.440 --> 0:01:40.840 kind of similar in the Christian speaks. 0:01:40.920 --> 0:01:43.560 What happened. Yeah, I got to the event and I 0:01:43.600 --> 0:01:45.679 was like, Greater Smith is here. I gotta go find him. 0:01:46.160 --> 0:01:48.880 And I like being hot for you, So I was 0:01:48.960 --> 0:01:49.680 really grateful. 0:01:49.720 --> 0:01:51.600 I love I mean the crew that had us, the 0:01:51.680 --> 0:01:54.080 Jay Walker's Worship team, I mean, I just love what 0:01:54.120 --> 0:01:57.000 they're doing for the next generation. So anytime they call, 0:01:57.080 --> 0:01:58.680 it's a yes for me. But then when my friends 0:01:58.680 --> 0:02:00.520 are there. It's it's a double yeah. So I was 0:02:00.520 --> 0:02:01.880 thrilled we were both getting to be there. 0:02:02.000 --> 0:02:06.040 Well, I remember that event because I was I was 0:02:06.080 --> 0:02:09.760 pretty new to doing that, speaking in that kind of space, 0:02:10.240 --> 0:02:14.880 and it was like there was like a band and 0:02:15.040 --> 0:02:17.920 drums and that they were like raving out there, and 0:02:17.960 --> 0:02:20.320 I was backstage and I was like holding, you know, 0:02:20.360 --> 0:02:22.120 my iPad with this message, and I was like, oh, 0:02:22.120 --> 0:02:24.320 they're going to hate me, Like, I don't think I 0:02:24.360 --> 0:02:28.720 have anything of benefit to say. I don't know, I 0:02:28.720 --> 0:02:30.280 don't know what. I don't know what I could possibly 0:02:30.320 --> 0:02:33.440 say after they have just gone through this rave and 0:02:33.440 --> 0:02:35.919 and then I just you, I just had to learn 0:02:36.000 --> 0:02:36.880 that's just how it is. 0:02:37.440 --> 0:02:39.040 That's just how it is. They go that hard and 0:02:39.080 --> 0:02:39.960 then they sit and listen. 0:02:40.320 --> 0:02:41.200 Yeah, and it is. 0:02:41.480 --> 0:02:43.720 Yeah, it's a real joy. 0:02:44.200 --> 0:02:45.560 You know, there are a lot of people like you 0:02:45.600 --> 0:02:48.000 and me and our job who don't get invited to 0:02:48.000 --> 0:02:50.920 speak into the lives of the next generation. And for 0:02:50.960 --> 0:02:53.079 one reason or another, maybe they're unwilling, or maybe that's 0:02:53.120 --> 0:02:55.480 not who they're pursuing right now. Whatever, I am so 0:02:55.560 --> 0:02:59.800 thankful anytime someone says, come talk to teenagers or twenty somethings. 0:02:59.800 --> 0:03:04.240 But because that's that's multiplication of what God's doing on 0:03:04.280 --> 0:03:06.760 the planet and I and I just think the next 0:03:06.760 --> 0:03:08.840 generation's got something special on him and I want to 0:03:08.840 --> 0:03:09.520 be around him as. 0:03:09.440 --> 0:03:09.960 Much as I can. 0:03:10.440 --> 0:03:13.840 So true, that's it's heavy stuff. Getting invited to that 0:03:14.000 --> 0:03:17.120 is heavy because you just go, oh, this matters, not that, 0:03:17.240 --> 0:03:19.000 not that, not all of them, all of them matter. 0:03:19.040 --> 0:03:21.360 But you think about the next generation and you just think, 0:03:21.720 --> 0:03:23.840 you think, well, probably a lot of them are not Christians. 0:03:24.560 --> 0:03:27.040 They came here, they might think they are, or they 0:03:27.040 --> 0:03:30.120 get invited, or they're struggling because they're you know, they 0:03:30.120 --> 0:03:32.480 grew up that way, but now they're wrestling with is 0:03:32.520 --> 0:03:34.040 this Is this how I feel? Or is this how 0:03:34.080 --> 0:03:35.160 my parents feel? 0:03:36.080 --> 0:03:37.320 Yeah? Exactly. 0:03:37.320 --> 0:03:38.920 I did the same thing when I was a sophomore 0:03:38.920 --> 0:03:41.480 in college. I mean, I had a whole semester where 0:03:41.520 --> 0:03:44.440 I was like, why am I doing this? Like no, 0:03:44.680 --> 0:03:47.960 for some reason, my freshman year, I stayed. I stayed, 0:03:48.080 --> 0:03:50.240 I towed the line. And then I got back for 0:03:50.320 --> 0:03:52.840 my sophomore year at University of Georgia and I was like, wait, 0:03:52.920 --> 0:03:54.440 I don't have to go to any of this. 0:03:55.080 --> 0:03:55.800 What am I doing? 0:03:56.240 --> 0:03:58.480 And so I think everybody needs that. I think if 0:03:58.560 --> 0:04:00.720 you grew up in a Christian home, you need kind 0:04:00.720 --> 0:04:06.119 of a season that it's your choice and you make 0:04:06.160 --> 0:04:09.160 that choice. It's also probably pretty scary for the parents, 0:04:09.160 --> 0:04:11.200 and probably a little scary for me. Even at the time. 0:04:11.240 --> 0:04:13.680 I remember having some thoughts of like, no, I have 0:04:13.760 --> 0:04:15.440 to go. I have to go to the campus ministry, 0:04:15.440 --> 0:04:15.840 I have to. 0:04:15.760 --> 0:04:18.600 Go to Yeah, I'm. 0:04:18.240 --> 0:04:20.960 Twenty, I don't have to do this, but I'm grateful 0:04:20.960 --> 0:04:22.600 for it. And now you know, when we're getting to 0:04:22.640 --> 0:04:25.040 be at things like that event we're at, I leave 0:04:25.720 --> 0:04:28.280 so inspired by them. I mean, I feel like I 0:04:28.400 --> 0:04:31.240 take way more than I give at those events because 0:04:31.240 --> 0:04:33.760 I'm so inspired by their faith and their consistency. That's 0:04:33.760 --> 0:04:36.720 what I wish i'd have been more true too in 0:04:36.760 --> 0:04:39.200 my twenties is consistency, and we see that in the 0:04:39.240 --> 0:04:40.559 people who are twenty Now. 0:04:40.920 --> 0:04:44.200 Do you think that is this generation is different than 0:04:44.880 --> 0:04:46.520 you and I are about about the same age. Do 0:04:46.520 --> 0:04:48.600 you think it's forty four, Yeah, I'm forty five. 0:04:48.680 --> 0:04:54.520 You think it's different, I I do. I think there 0:04:54.640 --> 0:04:59.680 is something in the generation behind us that they've been 0:04:59.839 --> 0:05:02.400 they they are native technology, right, so they've had it 0:05:02.400 --> 0:05:06.000 their whole lives. We're the last people who remember what 0:05:06.040 --> 0:05:10.280 it was like to not have technology but then to 0:05:10.360 --> 0:05:13.600 have to interact it with it every day now. So 0:05:13.640 --> 0:05:16.480 I think that is different. I think God's doing something 0:05:16.520 --> 0:05:19.480 different on Earth, and I think part of that is 0:05:19.560 --> 0:05:22.000 because of an next nation, in the next generation. You 0:05:22.040 --> 0:05:24.360 can see it when you follow Jenny Allen or Jonathan 0:05:24.360 --> 0:05:27.960 Pacluda and the revivals they're part of at college campuses, 0:05:29.400 --> 0:05:32.880 and so I do think there's something different about them. 0:05:32.960 --> 0:05:35.080 And I think the opportunity, the fact that the whole 0:05:35.120 --> 0:05:38.719 world has been in their hands for their whole lives. 0:05:39.640 --> 0:05:42.479 They have found the world less attractive than I do. 0:05:43.320 --> 0:05:46.760 And I think I think the ones who know Jesus 0:05:46.839 --> 0:05:50.400 and have experienced Jesus because they've always had the whole 0:05:50.400 --> 0:05:52.040 world right here, and they go, wait, this is so 0:05:52.120 --> 0:05:54.960 much better, Whereas I was like, God, You're great, here's 0:05:55.000 --> 0:05:57.320 my little life, and then I get handed the whole 0:05:57.320 --> 0:05:59.360 world on my phone and I don't have good self 0:05:59.360 --> 0:06:03.159 control right and I don't have better boundaries. And I 0:06:03.200 --> 0:06:05.720 think they're doing it better than we are. More more 0:06:05.760 --> 0:06:07.760 people in their twenties have flip phones, and people in 0:06:07.800 --> 0:06:08.360 their forties. 0:06:09.040 --> 0:06:13.640 M I think you're right. Yeah, I've seen that too. Well, 0:06:14.000 --> 0:06:16.200 that's what I don't think. I've thought about that perspective 0:06:16.240 --> 0:06:18.760 because I usually think. I usually tell Amber, I sound 0:06:18.800 --> 0:06:20.279 like an old guy. Look at Amber, and I go, 0:06:20.680 --> 0:06:23.080 this generation. One day, this is going to be our 0:06:23.120 --> 0:06:26.560 government leadership and we're going to live in these people. 0:06:27.000 --> 0:06:31.760 So I don't know, it's already a little true, right 0:06:31.800 --> 0:06:35.760 because our pastors are our age. How in the world 0:06:36.279 --> 0:06:38.240 is the church run by our peers? 0:06:38.279 --> 0:06:39.000 That's crazy. 0:06:39.480 --> 0:06:43.520 Football coach had NFL coaches, government officials that are our age. 0:06:44.040 --> 0:06:44.840 And then when I. 0:06:44.839 --> 0:06:47.599 See that I'm older than head football coaches, I'm like, 0:06:47.680 --> 0:06:49.359 this is not in world I was prepared for. 0:06:50.400 --> 0:06:51.960 Aren't I the same age as the players? 0:06:52.200 --> 0:06:54.560 Yeah, it used to be players, and then occasionally there's 0:06:54.600 --> 0:06:57.680 one quarterback and one punter that's our age, and then 0:06:57.720 --> 0:07:01.040 now they're younger, and then now it's the the same 0:07:01.120 --> 0:07:05.760 age as the head coaches. That's wild. I remember one 0:07:05.760 --> 0:07:08.120 time at a conference there was a there was a 0:07:08.160 --> 0:07:10.880 videographer and he was from Italy and we were just 0:07:10.920 --> 0:07:14.040 having small talk backstage and he said, what are you 0:07:14.040 --> 0:07:16.440 gonna speak about? And I told him briefly, I said, well, 0:07:16.520 --> 0:07:19.840 you know partly cultural Christianity. You know, I usually hit 0:07:19.880 --> 0:07:23.480 on that. And he was like, what's what's that? And 0:07:23.480 --> 0:07:26.400 I said, you know, like what people think they're a 0:07:26.480 --> 0:07:29.000 Christian and they might have even acknowledged that they're a 0:07:29.040 --> 0:07:31.400 Christian or grew up that way, but but they're not. 0:07:31.440 --> 0:07:34.240 They're not saved. And he was like, tell me more. 0:07:34.280 --> 0:07:36.560 I don't know this. I was like, wait really, And 0:07:36.600 --> 0:07:39.520 I suddenly realized through this conversation that it's it's uniquely 0:07:39.560 --> 0:07:45.200 American because he was like, you're telling me people will 0:07:45.240 --> 0:07:50.440 go to church on a Sunday morning just for social reasons, 0:07:50.480 --> 0:07:54.640 Like yeah, that's we kind of feel convicted. We kind 0:07:54.640 --> 0:07:57.800 of feel guilty if we don't as Americans. And he 0:07:57.920 --> 0:08:00.600 was like, this is not happen in Italy. 0:08:01.800 --> 0:08:02.320 Wow. 0:08:02.920 --> 0:08:05.320 And you know, I live in Nashville, but I live 0:08:05.360 --> 0:08:08.080 part time in New York. And that's true in New 0:08:08.160 --> 0:08:10.840 York too. Grange is when you go to church, everybody 0:08:10.920 --> 0:08:14.080 is there on purpose. No one's showing up because it 0:08:14.120 --> 0:08:19.000 advances their career or advances their social standing, whereas and 0:08:19.120 --> 0:08:21.320 other I mean I've only other lived in the South 0:08:21.440 --> 0:08:24.239 besides that, where that is true, I mean, we knew 0:08:24.240 --> 0:08:26.600 which politicians went to which church when I was growing 0:08:26.640 --> 0:08:29.880 up in my hometown, and that just didn't it just 0:08:29.880 --> 0:08:32.400 didn't the truth anymore. And the truth up here it 0:08:32.400 --> 0:08:34.599 may still be the truth a little bit where you 0:08:34.679 --> 0:08:37.240 and I live. But I actually just had a conversation 0:08:38.160 --> 0:08:42.439 with a pastor for a podcast, and she said, if 0:08:42.480 --> 0:08:47.240 your theology of suffering doesn't work for people in third 0:08:47.280 --> 0:08:51.320 world countries, it's not a good theology of suffering, right, 0:08:51.400 --> 0:08:55.160 And so this idea of like, if it isn't if 0:08:55.200 --> 0:08:57.400 I'm suffering, I'm not married yet, and so if I'm 0:08:57.400 --> 0:09:00.960 thinking that my suffering, my deepest suffering is that I'm unmarried, 0:09:00.960 --> 0:09:04.840 but I have food and clothing and help and friends 0:09:04.920 --> 0:09:07.560 and my faith. I'm not being persecuted. She's kind of like, 0:09:07.679 --> 0:09:10.040 it actually isn't a good theology of suffering. And I 0:09:10.040 --> 0:09:13.560 think the same is true here of like, if your faith, 0:09:13.760 --> 0:09:17.360 like you're saying, if your faith is not if you're 0:09:17.400 --> 0:09:19.920 not getting up and going to church because you're propelled 0:09:20.000 --> 0:09:23.199 to church by by your love of Jesus or in 0:09:23.240 --> 0:09:26.240 your suffering, you are still finding solace in the church, 0:09:26.400 --> 0:09:29.640 Like you don't have to feel like you're the general 0:09:29.640 --> 0:09:32.400 of the army every Sunday But if you're just going 0:09:32.440 --> 0:09:34.560 because it's culturally what you think you're supposed to do. 0:09:35.280 --> 0:09:36.320 There's better for you. 0:09:36.400 --> 0:09:39.400 There's better, there's a better relationship that you don't have today, 0:09:39.400 --> 0:09:40.199 that's available. 0:09:40.760 --> 0:09:44.520 That's amazing and so true. Suffering is a great revealer. 0:09:45.400 --> 0:09:49.200 Suffering is the great tester. It's the fire that, when heated, 0:09:49.240 --> 0:09:52.840 it reveals the strength of the faith, like metal, you know, 0:09:52.920 --> 0:09:54.239 when it's heated by a blacksmith. 0:09:54.920 --> 0:09:55.720 Yeah, that's right. 0:09:55.760 --> 0:09:59.640 And if that suffering doesn't, if my theology of suffering, 0:09:59.679 --> 0:10:01.960 if my like God should give me what I want 0:10:02.040 --> 0:10:04.679 and the fact that he hasn't says something about God. 0:10:05.480 --> 0:10:08.560 If that's not true for children in the Middle East, 0:10:08.640 --> 0:10:12.160 or for women in Afghanistan, or for for starving families 0:10:12.720 --> 0:10:15.560 in other countries and in America, then it's actually not 0:10:15.640 --> 0:10:16.440 a good theology. 0:10:16.480 --> 0:10:17.840 And that's not good theology. 0:10:18.000 --> 0:10:22.040 Yeah, then it's American theology. It's uniquely what you're talking about. 0:10:22.160 --> 0:10:23.920 Yeah, yep, you're exactly right. 0:10:24.040 --> 0:10:25.680 Yeah, you said it. You see, you kind of hinted 0:10:25.679 --> 0:10:27.880 at it earlier the way you grew up in Georgia. 0:10:28.800 --> 0:10:30.640 And I felt that when you said it, because I 0:10:30.640 --> 0:10:33.520 think about when I was in college, I thought I 0:10:33.559 --> 0:10:36.240 got to get the church. Mama would want me in church, 0:10:36.400 --> 0:10:39.880 you know, Like that's that's that's the reason I need 0:10:39.960 --> 0:10:42.520 to have stayed up late last night with my friends 0:10:42.520 --> 0:10:44.480 on the Saturday night. But I should get the church, 0:10:44.880 --> 0:10:48.640 not because God wants me there, not because i'm but 0:10:48.760 --> 0:10:51.280 because Mama would probably be mad at me. 0:10:52.000 --> 0:10:56.400 It's a little tricky, right, because we want people to go, 0:10:56.920 --> 0:10:58.640 Like if you want to go, if you've got a 0:10:58.679 --> 0:11:00.319 reason to be in the room with the whole spirit, 0:11:00.400 --> 0:11:01.760 be in the room with all his spirits, you can 0:11:01.880 --> 0:11:04.960 be under good teaching and under good worship. And so 0:11:04.960 --> 0:11:08.000 so I think at this in the same breath, I 0:11:08.080 --> 0:11:10.040 want to say, I think you did right by yourself 0:11:10.440 --> 0:11:13.520 by going when you didn't want to go. It's just 0:11:13.640 --> 0:11:16.560 this acknowledgment to everyone in the room, like if you're 0:11:16.600 --> 0:11:19.840 not here because you've experienced what it's like to be 0:11:19.960 --> 0:11:22.960 loved by Jesus, then there is more for you, Like 0:11:23.000 --> 0:11:24.679 there's just more for you. And I don't want you 0:11:24.679 --> 0:11:27.240 to come in on Sundays because it advances any part 0:11:27.280 --> 0:11:29.880 of your life. I want you to come on Sundays 0:11:30.200 --> 0:11:33.480 because you're in community with other people and you recognize 0:11:33.480 --> 0:11:35.840 the value of gathering with them because y'all are also 0:11:35.960 --> 0:11:37.360 deeply loved by God. 0:11:37.920 --> 0:11:41.320 Absolutely, I don't really Yeah, the reason you get there, 0:11:41.760 --> 0:11:44.440 it doesn't matter God. God has drawn you for many 0:11:44.480 --> 0:11:46.920 different reasons. It could be the guilt of mama. I 0:11:46.960 --> 0:11:52.240 had a friend who his mother was saved and started 0:11:52.280 --> 0:11:54.720 going to church, and the dad, who was a drug addict, 0:11:54.800 --> 0:11:57.920 would follow her there to make because he thought she 0:11:58.080 --> 0:12:00.880 was seeing a man another man in the church. So 0:12:00.960 --> 0:12:04.120 he was hiding in the bathroom every Sunday, and one 0:12:04.200 --> 0:12:07.600 day in the stall, he heard the gospel through the 0:12:07.679 --> 0:12:12.280 doors and he was saved. So doesn't matter how or 0:12:12.320 --> 0:12:16.720 why you get the church. What what we're saying where 0:12:17.000 --> 0:12:19.559 Instead we're saying, it's like we want to acknowledge a 0:12:19.640 --> 0:12:22.880 check engine light on your dashboard. If you're thinking, if 0:12:22.920 --> 0:12:24.880 you're already here, I want you to think about the 0:12:24.920 --> 0:12:26.720 reason you're here. That's what we're saying. 0:12:27.480 --> 0:12:31.280 That's beautiful, that's leadership. You're a great pastor. We knew it. 0:12:31.679 --> 0:12:37.079 No, No, I am fascinated by your book. Where did 0:12:37.080 --> 0:12:41.960 TJ go? You? You sent me this and you send 0:12:41.960 --> 0:12:45.200 it to me an amber as a friend like you, 0:12:45.920 --> 0:12:47.520 And I say that because it's not like you said, 0:12:47.559 --> 0:12:48.839 I'm going to be on your podcast, I'm going to 0:12:48.880 --> 0:12:53.040 send you this book, so you you genuinely sent this 0:12:53.760 --> 0:12:57.800 as a friend, And I think, what, it's a beautiful book. 0:12:57.840 --> 0:13:03.240 It's illustrated beautifully, children's book, it's easy to read. But 0:13:03.360 --> 0:13:09.680 what strikes me about this book is it is it's 0:13:09.760 --> 0:13:14.760 not universal. For it can be universal for every kind 0:13:14.760 --> 0:13:18.800 of loss, but this is very specific loss, so much 0:13:18.840 --> 0:13:20.760 so that it even has the name on the title 0:13:20.800 --> 0:13:24.160 where did TJ Go? And this is not where? This 0:13:24.280 --> 0:13:27.280 is not where did little brother go? Or where did 0:13:27.320 --> 0:13:32.360 grandpa go? You know, you went in specific and you know, 0:13:32.480 --> 0:13:36.719 writing books similar to songwriting. Sometimes as a songwriter, we 0:13:36.720 --> 0:13:39.720 we could get caught up and worried that, man, that's 0:13:39.760 --> 0:13:41.959 too specific because if I get to I'm going to 0:13:42.000 --> 0:13:46.000 pigeonhole myself. But there's another side of it that it's beautiful, 0:13:46.040 --> 0:13:49.760 that it's so authentic, and so sometimes songs blow up 0:13:49.840 --> 0:13:53.320 because they are very specific and beautiful, and it's the 0:13:53.360 --> 0:13:56.280 same with authoring a book. And I think, did you 0:13:56.920 --> 0:13:59.080 I guess I should first ask did you struggle with 0:13:59.120 --> 0:14:01.080 that thought? Like should you make this more generic? 0:14:02.679 --> 0:14:03.120 Yeah? 0:14:03.160 --> 0:14:06.320 So I'll give you a theology answer and then I'll 0:14:06.320 --> 0:14:10.320 give you our family's answer. The interesting thing since Where 0:14:10.320 --> 0:14:12.920 Did TJ Go? Has come out is multiple people have said, 0:14:12.960 --> 0:14:15.320 will you write where did Grandpa Go? Will you write 0:14:15.320 --> 0:14:17.600 where did my Mom go? Write Where my doll Go? 0:14:18.280 --> 0:14:20.760 And they wanted to be a series, But theologically, I 0:14:20.800 --> 0:14:25.320 can't make promises about where your family is. That aren't children, right, 0:14:25.440 --> 0:14:30.040 And so that feels unfair to write a book and 0:14:30.080 --> 0:14:33.920 make assumptions if I actually believe the Gospel's true. And 0:14:34.800 --> 0:14:37.080 so we are we stuck with where did TJ Go? 0:14:37.200 --> 0:14:41.120 Because I feel very good about talking about heaven and 0:14:41.240 --> 0:14:45.480 conjunction with the loss of children. Yes, and so it 0:14:45.520 --> 0:14:47.400 was really important to me. I mean, I'll tell you 0:14:47.440 --> 0:14:50.040 the truth, grader you you and I recorded an episode 0:14:50.040 --> 0:14:52.000 of my podcast that sounds fun on the one year 0:14:52.000 --> 0:14:55.040 anniversary of the death of TJ, and I sobbed through 0:14:55.040 --> 0:14:59.280 our conversation. But when my nephew passed away right when 0:14:59.320 --> 0:15:02.720 my sister was we knew TJ was sick. He had 0:15:02.720 --> 0:15:06.080 a life limiting diagnosis from about week twelve, and so 0:15:06.160 --> 0:15:09.600 we had the whole pregnancy just about to grieve and 0:15:09.760 --> 0:15:12.400 hope that God would do something different. Well, about two 0:15:12.480 --> 0:15:17.320 weeks before TJ was born. My sister's counselor said, you 0:15:17.360 --> 0:15:20.560 should find a book to read to Sam, my older nephew, 0:15:20.960 --> 0:15:24.000 about the loss of his brother. And so she calls 0:15:24.040 --> 0:15:27.080 me as the author of the family and says, what's 0:15:27.120 --> 0:15:29.560 the book, Like, what does everybody read to their families 0:15:29.560 --> 0:15:32.120 and the loss of a sibling? And so I called 0:15:32.360 --> 0:15:35.760 counselors and pastors and some mom friends of mine who 0:15:35.800 --> 0:15:40.000 were parents that were grieving while they were raising grieving children, 0:15:40.840 --> 0:15:42.040 and nobody had a book. 0:15:42.760 --> 0:15:43.160 Nobody. 0:15:43.200 --> 0:15:46.760 There were a couple of suggestions that were adjacent, but 0:15:46.840 --> 0:15:49.800 none of them were like a gospel story and a 0:15:49.880 --> 0:15:51.920 sentence that I write a couple times in the book 0:15:52.000 --> 0:15:54.200 is there is good news even in sad stories, which 0:15:54.240 --> 0:15:58.960 is the gospel? And so what the reason it's so specific, 0:15:59.000 --> 0:16:01.080 Granger is. I didn't write it to publish it. I 0:16:01.120 --> 0:16:04.880 wrote it for Sam. I thought I was writing a story. 0:16:04.920 --> 0:16:07.240 I don't do cast roles, but I can tell stories, 0:16:07.720 --> 0:16:10.080 and so I thought I was just giving a story 0:16:10.120 --> 0:16:12.960 to my family. When I first wrote it, I wrote 0:16:13.000 --> 0:16:15.680 it into my phone. I was driving from Franklin, Tennessee, 0:16:15.720 --> 0:16:19.800 to Nashville, so twenty five minutes just crying as I'm 0:16:19.840 --> 0:16:22.720 telling myself the story in my phone of what I 0:16:22.760 --> 0:16:26.120 want Sam to know about the loss of his brother, 0:16:26.640 --> 0:16:28.920 and so I wanted to talk about here's what happened, 0:16:29.480 --> 0:16:33.440 Here's what Heaven's heaven is like. And if you're still sad, 0:16:33.480 --> 0:16:36.800 that's okay. You can still be sad after you know 0:16:36.880 --> 0:16:40.280 what Heaven's like. And I got home, I typed it 0:16:40.360 --> 0:16:41.880 up on my computer. I put it on eight and 0:16:41.880 --> 0:16:44.840 a half by eleven. I stole clip art from the Internet, 0:16:44.960 --> 0:16:48.120 and I went to the local print store and I 0:16:48.200 --> 0:16:50.600 printed out two copies and spiral about it. 0:16:50.640 --> 0:16:51.400 Gave one to my. 0:16:51.400 --> 0:16:53.920 Sister and her husband and their family, and one to 0:16:53.960 --> 0:16:56.240 my parents. I thought that was the end of it. 0:16:56.640 --> 0:16:58.840 That's why it's so specific, Granger is that's what I 0:16:59.640 --> 0:17:01.840 thought I was doing, as I thought I was serving 0:17:01.880 --> 0:17:05.960 my nephew Sam in the loss of his little brother, 0:17:06.880 --> 0:17:10.679 and so it never was going to be generic, because 0:17:11.119 --> 0:17:13.439 that wasn't why I wrote it, or initially as my 0:17:13.560 --> 0:17:17.640 sister AFTERTJ ended up living. In the book, he does 0:17:17.680 --> 0:17:19.960 not go home from the hospital. He dies in the hospital. 0:17:20.840 --> 0:17:25.080 The diagnosis that TJ had trisome eighteen. The majority of 0:17:25.200 --> 0:17:28.520 children do not go home from the hospital, so writing 0:17:28.560 --> 0:17:31.000 that before TJ was born, That's what we assumed would happen. 0:17:31.040 --> 0:17:32.640 That's what we wanted to prepare Sam for. 0:17:33.280 --> 0:17:36.680 But through the kindness of God and medical intervention, TJ 0:17:36.920 --> 0:17:40.240 lived fifty six days, so three weeks and I see 0:17:40.280 --> 0:17:43.480 you in five weeks on hospice care and my sister 0:17:43.480 --> 0:17:46.919 and brother in law's house. And so after he died, 0:17:47.200 --> 0:17:49.320 and a few months later, when they started reading where 0:17:49.320 --> 0:17:51.320 did TJ go to? Sam, My sister would call me 0:17:51.320 --> 0:17:53.320 and be like, Hey, the page about the zoo, there's 0:17:53.320 --> 0:17:54.040 too many words. 0:17:54.080 --> 0:17:56.359 Sam's bored. He is already bored. You got it. So 0:17:56.359 --> 0:17:58.880 that's why she's the co authors because she like fixed it. 0:17:58.840 --> 0:18:00.800 All the time, like that. 0:18:00.960 --> 0:18:02.000 Totally, totally. 0:18:02.480 --> 0:18:05.240 And then I said it to my agent and I said, hey, 0:18:05.840 --> 0:18:08.520 a few months ago, when TJ died, we could not 0:18:08.640 --> 0:18:11.080 find the book we needed. Will you see if the 0:18:11.119 --> 0:18:15.280 publisher wants to meet this need for other families, And 0:18:15.920 --> 0:18:18.640 they generously agreed to do a very like you said, 0:18:18.640 --> 0:18:22.880 a very specific, a very niche book that somehow has 0:18:23.080 --> 0:18:26.120 already served thousands and thousands of families in the first month. 0:18:26.760 --> 0:18:31.040 That explains it so well, Like that explains it. It's 0:18:31.080 --> 0:18:32.919 like you said in the music world. It would be like, 0:18:33.160 --> 0:18:36.199 you know, I wrote this song for my wife for 0:18:36.320 --> 0:18:39.200 our wedding day, for our first dance. You know, That's 0:18:39.240 --> 0:18:42.440 why it sounds specific, And that's exactly what you did. 0:18:42.480 --> 0:18:45.720 That's yeah, I just said, no, what else to do? 0:18:45.920 --> 0:18:48.320 I mean you, I have said repeatedly. I think I've 0:18:48.320 --> 0:18:50.160 said this to you, but I've said it behind your back. 0:18:50.240 --> 0:18:50.600 For sure. 0:18:52.200 --> 0:18:57.359 Parents who are who are grieving that are at the 0:18:57.400 --> 0:19:00.639 same time in charge of raising grieving children are the 0:19:00.720 --> 0:19:03.639 highest level off hero to me because y'all have to. 0:19:04.400 --> 0:19:06.480 In my grief of TJ. Because I don't have any 0:19:06.480 --> 0:19:09.000 of my own children and he was my nephew, I 0:19:09.240 --> 0:19:12.080 was grieving alone, and in some ways that's so much easier. 0:19:12.119 --> 0:19:13.520 I could stay in my bed if I wanted to 0:19:13.560 --> 0:19:16.600 stay in my bed, y'all, and my sister and brother 0:19:16.640 --> 0:19:19.199 in lawn so many of our friends listening y'all had 0:19:19.240 --> 0:19:22.439 to wake up every day and feed people I did not, 0:19:23.280 --> 0:19:25.879 And so what y'all do, and so my hope what 0:19:25.960 --> 0:19:29.680