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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace on Sirius XM Triumph Channel

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Speaker 1: one thirty two. It's a sketch of the man they

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Speaker 1: say is responsible for the murder of Abby Williams and

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Speaker 1: Libby German. The reason they even have the sketch in

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Speaker 1: the first places because people have come forward with tips

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Speaker 1: and information. You interview all those people and you come

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Speaker 1: up with common themes on hair, facial hair, eyes, skin tone, clothing.

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Speaker 1: Police described the man as a white male between five

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Speaker 1: six and five ten waye from a hundred and eighty

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Speaker 1: to two pounds, with reddish brown hair. We're still getting

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Speaker 1: anywhere from five to ten tips today. We're still getting emails.

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Speaker 1: So this case is not dried up. It's not a

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Speaker 1: cold case. This this case is still very active. Two

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Speaker 1: little girls go for a walk, They go for a

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Speaker 1: hike together one afternoon. They've been best friends for years

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Speaker 1: in a small, small all community like the one I

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Speaker 1: grew up in, where as far as you can see,

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Speaker 1: there's soybeans and tall pine trees, no crime. Right that evening,

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Speaker 1: around dinner time, the red bells of alarm start going

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Speaker 1: off in everybody's head. When the two girls don't come home.

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Speaker 1: I'm talking, of course, about the two little girls out

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Speaker 1: of Delphi, the little girls who actually took pictures of

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Speaker 1: each other as they walked across a trestle bridge. They

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Speaker 1: were never seen alive again. I'm talking about Liberty German

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Speaker 1: and Abigail Williams in Delphi, Indiana. The last known photo

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Speaker 1: of them that places them in the location of their

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Speaker 1: kidnap and murder was taken by them. You know how Twains,

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Speaker 1: especially tween girls, love to selfie and post it. One

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Speaker 1: took a picture of the other walking across that trestle bridge.

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Speaker 1: That was the last knowledge of the two of them

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Speaker 1: being alive. I Nancy Grace, this is crime stories, and

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Speaker 1: in the last hours, more developments unfold in the search

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Speaker 1: for the killer of these two little girls in the

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Speaker 1: middle of a town where I don't even know if

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Speaker 1: they've had an homicide in the last ten years Delphi.

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Speaker 1: Joining me is Crack, reporter for The Daily Mail at

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Speaker 1: daily Mail dot com. Shaun Walsh also with me federal

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Speaker 1: trial lawyer defense attorney Richard Herman, currently practicing out of Vegas,

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Speaker 1: but practices all across the country, kind of like a

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Speaker 1: hired gun. I want to go first to you, Sean

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Speaker 1: we now have a composite, and I see where some

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Speaker 1: of this is coming from, uh, in a composite that

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Speaker 1: was released on your website dailymail dot com as ours

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Speaker 1: as well crime Online. I see where they're getting some

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Speaker 1: of this, Sean, because the hat they've got him in

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Speaker 1: kind of like, um, a newsboy's hat. You can see

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Speaker 1: that it looks brown to me. And the photo I've

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Speaker 1: always said I thought, but I couldn't confirm from the

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Speaker 1: naked eye that he had at least a mustache and

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Speaker 1: a beard or a beard. But the way you guys

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Speaker 1: have we see in the composite, it's kind of like,

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Speaker 1: I don't know what you call that. It's sort of mustache,

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Speaker 1: kind of goes down the side either side of your

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Speaker 1: lips and kind of turns into a little a little uh,

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Speaker 1: almost like a goatee. And he's wearing in the picture

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Speaker 1: it looks to me like a double sweatshirt, like a

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Speaker 1: a jacket, possibly over a sweatshirt. Sean Walsh, dailymail dot com.

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Speaker 1: Tell me the latest into search for the killer of

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Speaker 1: Liberty and Abigail Nancy. Look, we received this composite of

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Speaker 1: the soft picked in the case. I mean, we haven't

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Speaker 1: heard anything since February when we got that grainy image

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Speaker 1: of this person that was captured on the girls social media.

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Speaker 1: And what it looks like to your description is the

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Speaker 1: man has a goatee, he was wearing a cap, He

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Speaker 1: has bushy hair, and it looks like he has on

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Speaker 1: some sort of hoodie. Police aren't giving any more details though,

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Speaker 1: they're not saying who the witness was that saw the man.

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Speaker 1: They're keeping that all confidential. They're just saying that, Sean,

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Speaker 1: I gotta back you up just a moment, because you're

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Speaker 1: you're giving me so much factual evidence that we're just hearing.

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Speaker 1: It is like drinking out of a fire hydrant. It's

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Speaker 1: too much, too fast. First of all, you said the

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Speaker 1: composite came from witnesses. What witness number one? Who could

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Speaker 1: it be? Number two? You stated the photo taken by

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Speaker 1: the girls of this guy on the very same bridge

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Speaker 1: where they're taking pictures of each other during their hike,

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Speaker 1: very innocently strolling along, they're taking pictures. This photo of

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Speaker 1: this guy was taken by one of the murdered girls.

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Speaker 1: And I'm talking about twins, these two little girls. I mean, uh,

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Speaker 1: they're precious. They're just a couple of years older than

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Speaker 1: my little girl, my little Lucy, and my twin John David.

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Speaker 1: So let's go back to witness, Shaun. Watch you say, witness,

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Speaker 1: can you elaborate on that at all? So, the Carroll

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Speaker 1: County Sheriff said the witness saw the man walking near Delphi,

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Speaker 1: about sixty miles northwest of Indianapolis, but only recently met

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Speaker 1: with an FBI sketch artist to provide the facial details

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Speaker 1: for the rendering that was released. Now they're not saying

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Speaker 1: where the witness saw the unidentified man, but they're saying

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Speaker 1: around the time the girls were killed, and that matches up.

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Speaker 1: Let me go to you, Richard Harmon. Now I know

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Speaker 1: you're thinking of a million ways to shoot down this witness,

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Speaker 1: to shoot down this composite. One thing is the delay

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Speaker 1: in time, all right? That the problem if it's true

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Speaker 1: that police are just show are just getting the composite

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Speaker 1: sketch from the witness. Depending on who the witness is

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Speaker 1: and where they were, they could have been influenced by

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Speaker 1: the picture. I mean, there's a million ways if this

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Speaker 1: ever goes to trial, that a trial lawyer, a defense

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Speaker 1: lawyer like yourself, a good one, can attack the composite drawing.

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Speaker 1: You understand, yeah, Nascy, if this case came to your

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Speaker 1: desk as a prosecutor, you'd lose in your mind. By now.

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Speaker 1: This happened in February, the girls went missing, and the

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Speaker 1: next day they were found dead. I don't even believe

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Speaker 1: they have a witness, or a credible witness. I think

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Speaker 1: they may have used some filtering technology on the grainy

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Speaker 1: picture to try to get it a little better. But

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Speaker 1: you know, law enforcement, it looks to me like they

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Speaker 1: are totally lost on this case. They have nothing. You said,

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Speaker 1: they may not have had a double murder in ten years.

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Speaker 1: I don't think they're ready for this. I don't think

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Speaker 1: they can handle it. How do they not have more

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Speaker 1: by now it's almost August. Is killing took place in February.

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Speaker 1: You would think that they would have more developments, more leads,

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Speaker 1: and provide more information to the public instead of keeping

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Speaker 1: it tight to the vest. I think it's tight to

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Speaker 1: the vest because they are lost. They have nothing here now, Richard,

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Speaker 1: everything you're saying, everything you're saying, I'm not arguing with you.

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Speaker 1: I'm taking a different slant on it, though. Sean walts

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Speaker 1: with me. Richard Herman with me, Sean, let's analyze what

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Speaker 1: Richard said. And I can't argue that he's wrong, But

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Speaker 1: but what he's saying what has happened here may be

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Speaker 1: very understandable. What's we know all the facts. The girls

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Speaker 1: were out there by themselves. We don't know of any

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Speaker 1: other witnesses for all I know, is taken this long

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Speaker 1: for police to develop a witness. And no, I do

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Speaker 1: not believe that the police have used some kind of

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Speaker 1: filter and made up a witness. I don't believe that

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Speaker 1: at all. I think that somewhere somebody saw this guy

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Speaker 1: walking in or walking out of the park and didn't

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Speaker 1: put two and two together, or Sean Walsh daily Mail

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Speaker 1: dot Com. They may have seen him somewhere else and said, WHOA,

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Speaker 1: that looks like the guy in that picture. I mean,

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Speaker 1: it could be a myriad of possibilities as to why

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Speaker 1: we're just getting this sketch. So instead of attacking police

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Speaker 1: for just finding the witness or just releasing the sketch,

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Speaker 1: maybe we can figure out what happened all right. I

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Speaker 1: don't think they're lying, Shaun Walsh. I think there is

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Speaker 1: a witness to this guy. Don't know where or wind though.

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Speaker 1: Nancy I agree, And look, if you look at it

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Speaker 1: this way, this isn't like two kids that went missing

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Speaker 1: on the streets in New York or Dallas or Atlanta,

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Speaker 1: where their security cameras everywhere. They were on a hiking

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Speaker 1: trail where our security cameras a police only have to

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Speaker 1: work with what they got from the girls cell phones. Now,

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Speaker 1: in doing that, I believe that there is a witness

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Speaker 1: that they were able to match up because if you remember,

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Speaker 1: the cell phone image was very very grainy, it wasn't

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Speaker 1: a clear image, it didn't show the person's face. And

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Speaker 1: this composite that their release is very very detailed. It

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Speaker 1: depicts a white man with a prominent nose and goatee

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Speaker 1: who's wearing a cap and what appears to be a

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Speaker 1: hooded sweater. Police said the suspect has reddish brown hair.

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Speaker 1: He stands between five ft six and five ft seven

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Speaker 1: and weighs between one hundred and eight and two hundred

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Speaker 1: and twenty pounds. Now, police have asked the public to

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Speaker 1: examine the image, particularly the man's facial features, and contact

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Speaker 1: them with any information they might have. So police didn't

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Speaker 1: know who this was and that they were making this up,

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Speaker 1: they wouldn't be telling people to really examine the facial features,

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Speaker 1: because clearly the witness gave them a great description of

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Speaker 1: who this person potentially is. And the way you work

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Speaker 1: with a schedule artist. I mean, I don't know if

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Speaker 1: you've done that, Sean Walherman Privy too, I have, and

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Speaker 1: you know, Richard Harmon, it reminds me of the case

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Speaker 1: I tried, one of the last ones I tried before

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Speaker 1: I left prosecuting, went to Court TV to launch my

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Speaker 1: show with Johnny Cochrane. God Rest his soul, and it

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Speaker 1: was a killer, of course, and as it turned out,

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Speaker 1: the Jane Doe we never could identify his last murder victim,

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Speaker 1: but amazingly a sketch artist, a lady sketch artist, who

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Speaker 1: tried her best to recreate the face from the remains.

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Speaker 1: It's very difficult, and I didn't put a whole lot

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Speaker 1: of stock into it, not because of her talent, but

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Speaker 1: because there wasn't much less left of her. But then

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Speaker 1: guess who I found, Richard Harmon, the killer's ex girlfriend.

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Speaker 1: I got the sketch artist to draw a picture of

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Speaker 1: the girls of the killer's ex girlfriend, and in closing

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Speaker 1: arguments I held it up to the jury and said,

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Speaker 1: who would have killed this woman other than the man

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Speaker 1: that was spurned by this woman? And they were all

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Speaker 1: most identical. It was incredible. And when you look at

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Speaker 1: this sketch that Seawan Walts from Daily Mail is talking about,

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Speaker 1: it's very detailed. And Richard, when you sit there with

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Speaker 1: a sketch artist and you watch them they're working with

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Speaker 1: the witness and they'll say, oh, no, the nose needs

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Speaker 1: to be wider. No, the nose needs to be thinner,

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Speaker 1: the eyes need to be more hooded, the eyebrows, this,

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Speaker 1: the beard, this, the and they really get it as

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Speaker 1: close as possible to the witnesses, recollection what they are seeing,

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Speaker 1: what the witnesses seeing in their mind's eye. It's really

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Speaker 1: incredible to watch, Richard, and the sketch artists are brilliant. However, Nancy,

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Speaker 1: if they had this witness, oh here you go, why

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Speaker 1: didn't it come out in February or March or April?

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Speaker 1: You think law enforcement would put this sketch off as

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Speaker 1: quickly as possible. Five months go by, and now for

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Speaker 1: the first time we see a sketch of someone who

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Speaker 1: they claim if the person I mean, I would have

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Speaker 1: a field day. Of course, accombination on this witness. Five

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Speaker 1: months go by, and what were the other factors? And

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Speaker 1: you know what I would say, if I were the judge,

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Speaker 1: if I got the right objection, of course I'd say,

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Speaker 1: um sustained repetitive. Here it is with Richard Herman, second verse,

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Speaker 1: same as the first. Yes, I know it's been several months,

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Speaker 1: but if you listen to what Carol County Sheriff Toby

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Speaker 1: Lazimie said, he said he cannot discuss where the witness

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Speaker 1: saw this man who authorities now considered to be the

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Speaker 1: only suspect, the main suspect and the murders of fourteen

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Speaker 1: year old Liberty at thirteen year old Abigail. He said,

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Speaker 1: the witness saw the man around the time the girls

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Speaker 1: were killed. Now that's vague, but to me, that would

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Speaker 1: mean Seawan was coming on or leaving that bridge or

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Speaker 1: in that area, you know, an hour or two before

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Speaker 1: or an hour or two after Sean. Well. Authorities there

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Speaker 1: saying Nancy that the witness who saw the suspect was

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Speaker 1: close enough to him to say that he did not

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Speaker 1: have blue eyes, but was certain was uncertain his eye color.

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Speaker 1: And they're also saying that the what's happened here is

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Speaker 1: is they believe fear has played a part that the

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Speaker 1: person may not have come forward sooner with the description

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Speaker 1: because of fear. You've got to remember, this person that

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Speaker 1: they're seeking has alleged has actually murdered two young girls.

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Speaker 1: So we're not dealing with an innocent party here. We're

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Speaker 1: dealing with someone who is capable of murder. Next question,

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Speaker 1: do we have any idea whether he raped them or

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Speaker 1: assault to them sexually in any way, because if there

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Speaker 1: is DNA, that's a whole different can of worms. Because

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Speaker 1: if they've got DNA, certainly they've compared it to the

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Speaker 1: DNA database. Right. Certainly they've called on aphis and codas

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Speaker 1: for fingerprints, wouldn't you think, Sean, if there are any

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Speaker 1: to be had? Absolutely, But interestingly, in this case, authorities

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Speaker 1: aren't giving away any details around the nature of the

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Speaker 1: crime other than these two young girls were murdered, So

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Speaker 1: we don't know what the perpetrator did to them. All

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Speaker 1: we know is sadly that these two young girls. Think

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Speaker 1: about it, Sean, use that noggain, Come on, he said

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Speaker 1: on the bridge. Why else would he abduct them and

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Speaker 1: murder them if not for some type of a sex

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Speaker 1: assault and another thing. Hold on, Sean, give rich a

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Speaker 1: term of this information. Of course, he'll, he'll will, We'll

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Speaker 1: give the information. You'll turn it into bullets to shoot

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Speaker 1: it right back at us. But remember one of the

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Speaker 1: girls with a cell phone actually recorded the perhaps the

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Speaker 1: killer's voice as well, Sean, which is going to make

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Speaker 1: it a lot easier when this goes to trial and

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Speaker 1: they're looking for a positive identification to say that this

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Speaker 1: was the person who was there on that trail and

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Speaker 1: who murdered those two girls. So Richard Herman if and

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Speaker 1: when they arrest somebody, there's no way that he can

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Speaker 1: refuse to be part of a lineup, refuse to give

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Speaker 1: a voice identification sample. He cannot refuse pursuant to a warrant,

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Speaker 1: of course, the search warrant to give a DNA sample,

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Speaker 1: which is really just you know, a vocal swab from

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Speaker 1: his mouth. He cannot refuse that. He has to do

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Speaker 1: it if there's a legitimate warrant. So what do you

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Speaker 1: think about that, Herman, I say that you're right, he

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Speaker 1: has to do that. And hopefully they got DNA. They

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Speaker 1: had to have gotten d NA off these girls, and

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Speaker 1: this way, when they get the swab of the people

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Speaker 1: they believed may have been involved in this. Hopefully it

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Speaker 1: will match up. It's hard for me to believe that

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Speaker 1: this is a one shot deal for this particular assailant.

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Speaker 1: You know, you gotta believe maybe this has been done before,

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Speaker 1: not in the system, didn't come up with the DNA

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Speaker 1: that they did get at the scene. You know, the

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Speaker 1: risk of getting the wrong person pulled in arrested on

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Speaker 1: this case, I think it's high when you see the

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Speaker 1: sketch five months after the incident took place, what happened.

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Speaker 1: I don't believe the person was afraid because this person murders.

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Speaker 1: I don't believe that if someone saw a murder or

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Speaker 1: saw someone the duck people, they're gonna call the police

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Speaker 1: or they're gonna call Nancy Grace. Those are one of

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Speaker 1: the two first calls you make. Well, unless there's some

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Speaker 1: reason they don't want anything to do with the police.

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Speaker 1: But if it's a vagrant, but if it's somebody that

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Speaker 1: was committing a crime. What if it's somebody out there

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Speaker 1: having having a joint and they just don't want to

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Speaker 1: get involved. Hold on one eight four four four five

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Speaker 1: nine five seven eight six eight four four four, five, nine,

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Speaker 1: five seven eight six eight four four four, five nine,

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Speaker 1: five seven eight six. That's the toll free number for

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Speaker 1: anyone that has information on these two terrific murders. To me,

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Speaker 1: this um, this sketch is a big breakthrough because it's

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Speaker 1: incredibly detailed. Question. Uh, let me throw to either one

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Speaker 1: of you guys the cell phone, the cell phone that

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Speaker 1: was recording to the very end. I think one of

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Speaker 1: the little girls had in her pocket and she was

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Speaker 1: audio recording him, and the purps said, quote down the heill.

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Speaker 1: I'm wondering, did what did he touch other than the

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Speaker 1: girls themselves? How were they murdered? Where they strangled? Is

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Speaker 1: their touch DNA? Did he shoot them? What about the caliber?

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Speaker 1: Have they done a ballistic search to compare it to

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Speaker 1: other guns? Did he use a knife? If so, is

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Speaker 1: their DNA? Did he molest them? Is their DNA from that?

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Speaker 1: I mean, there's so many forensic questions. Let me ask

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Speaker 1: you this, Sean Walsh, why are they keeping all this secret?

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Speaker 1: I mean, what's the That's what puzzles us. I mean,

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Speaker 1: you think they would be out there on the front

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Speaker 1: front foot each day and every day since that crime,

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Speaker 1: giving as much information as they can so that the

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Speaker 1: public can come forward and someone can say I know

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Speaker 1: who did this, it was this person, and police can

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Speaker 1: make an arrest. We've got to remember the sketch is

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Speaker 1: the first new information released by authorities about the suspects

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Speaker 1: of late February. All they distributed before were the two

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Speaker 1: grainy images of a man walking along an old railroad

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Speaker 1: bridge the girls had visited while hiking. They also released

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Speaker 1: the audio to your point of the mail saying down

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Speaker 1: the hill and this evidence was recorded on Liberty Germans

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Speaker 1: cell phone. Now police have hailed her as a hero

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Speaker 1: for recording this potentially crucial evidence, but it still remains

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Speaker 1: what else happened there? And you know, by releasing that

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Speaker 1: information maybe someone else out there will know more and

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Speaker 1: can come forward and identify this person so police can

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Speaker 1: make an arrest. What do you make of the Hopefully

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Speaker 1: the recording the suspicion it off so they can get

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Speaker 1: a voice example are also so between that and d

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Speaker 1: n A they'll get the right person. Not a sketch

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Speaker 1: released five months after the incident, where credibility. You know what,

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Speaker 1: I would love, really love to shoot you down in court,

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Speaker 1: but that's just not gonna happen. Just gonna have to

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Speaker 1: do it right here on my new home. Serious x em.

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Speaker 1: I'm proud to be there here and fight with your

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Speaker 1: Richard Herman. Oxygen the new network for crying. My name

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Speaker 1: is Kelly Sigler. I was a prosecutor for over twenty

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Speaker 1: years from the creator of Law and Order, comes to

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Speaker 1: hit true crime series called Justice. There are so many

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Speaker 1: cold cases out there that still need to be solved.

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Speaker 1: Every Saturday followed Kelly is she takes real cases from

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Speaker 1: cold to close. But you will always see un called

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Speaker 1: Justice is real to get the guilty person put away.

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Speaker 1: There's not a better feeding in the whole world if

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Speaker 1: you're a law enforcement Cold Justice returns to July eight

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Speaker 1: seven Central and Oxygen the new network for crime. And

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Speaker 1: now we are heading for um Delphi to Hollywood. Okay,

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Speaker 1: what a difference. Let me tell you. I learned all

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Speaker 1: about Hollywood when I was out there doing my stint

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Speaker 1: on Dancing with the Stars. Oh my stars. I would

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Speaker 1: um practice eight to ten hours a day and come

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Speaker 1: home and my feet would actually be bleeding, and the

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Speaker 1: twins that my husband would be there and they go, oh,

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Speaker 1: let's go, and I'd fall asleep in my clothes with

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Speaker 1: the shoes still on. Be so tired. But I can

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Speaker 1: tell you this about Hollywood. Everybody's perfect. All the women

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Speaker 1: are tall with extensions all up down their back, and

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Speaker 1: they're all skinny, and I mean, I've never seen anything

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Speaker 1: like it. They also spend a lot of money out there.

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Speaker 1: I know that stereotypical, which is wrong. I know that,

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Speaker 1: but I mean the number of um imported cars, the mansions,

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Speaker 1: the uh let me just say, Cement Ponds, Richard Herman.

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Speaker 1: Now I'm not gonna throw that to Shaun Walsh because

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Speaker 1: he's Australian, but um, I mean they live high on

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Speaker 1: the hog. Let me just tell you in Hollywood, and

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Speaker 1: it's come back to bite spice girl mailb in the neck.

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Speaker 1: Can you at least back me up on this. The

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Speaker 1: lifestyles in Hollywood, Perman right, The lifestyles in Hollywood are

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Speaker 1: off the charts, and it's really hard for the normal

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Speaker 1: person to understand and appreciate how they go about their

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Speaker 1: daily living. And when you go into a matrimonial proceeding

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Speaker 1: and the judge has to take into account the style

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Speaker 1: with which the parties are living and then based an

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Speaker 1: award on that, it can blow your mind and we

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Speaker 1: look at Melby here. Okay, I don't know what you

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Speaker 1: just said. You're talking lawyer talk. Okay, we're not in court, Richard.

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Speaker 1: You're not in front of a federal judge spouting out

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Speaker 1: legal terms. All right, let's get right down to it.

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Speaker 1: Sean Sewan, wah day meil dot com Meilby. That's scary

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Speaker 1: spice right, And isn't she like a judge on what's

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Speaker 1: the show? She's got talent? Shed love that? Yes, yes,

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Speaker 1: the twins are like crazy about that ship. Maylb number

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Speaker 1: one married a guy named Stephen Belafanti. All right, so

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Speaker 1: I thought for sure this is Harry Belafanti, the great

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Speaker 1: musician's son. Oh no, oh no, this guy is a

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Speaker 1: total poser. He took the last name Bella Fanti. Okay,

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Speaker 1: why would he do that unless he wanted people to

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Speaker 1: think he was related to Harry BELAFONTI can you tell

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Speaker 1: me that, Shawn watch? Can we just start with that.

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Speaker 1: In addition to him asking for what a hundred thousand

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Speaker 1: dollars a month from Melby? He needs to go get

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Speaker 1: a job, Sewan, He really needs to get a job.

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Speaker 1: I mean, this is the guy whose real name is

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Speaker 1: Steven Stansbury. I mean relation to Harry Belafonte at all. Um,

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Speaker 1: he says he's a Hollywood producer and a director, and

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Speaker 1: but he's in a very interesting past. I mean, this

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Speaker 1: is someone who actually has a history of abuse allegations

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Speaker 1: and two thousand and three was found guilty of assault.

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Speaker 1: Said that for a moment, it satellite something somebody who

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Speaker 1: put on a dating website. I've got an interesting past.

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Speaker 1: But what you mean by that is bad stuff, right,

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Speaker 1: the bad stuff. I mean, this is a guy was

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Speaker 1: very interesting past, as I said, And I tell you

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Speaker 1: he was charged back in two thousands three and found

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Speaker 1: guilty of abusing an ex girlfriend who was the mother

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Speaker 1: of one of his children. Um, and he completed a

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Speaker 1: one year going too fast, I'm soaking this in like

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Speaker 1: a sponge. Now, what did you say about mail Be's husband, Well,

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Speaker 1: what in two thousand and three he was found guilty

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Speaker 1: of spousal abuse when he abused, when he abused the

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Speaker 1: mother of his child. What happened from there was he

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Speaker 1: had to go and complete a spousal abuse pro program

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Speaker 1: for a year. And Malbe is now saying you I

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Speaker 1: didn't like him. I knew I did not like him.

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Speaker 1: I mean he mel was granted a temporary restraining order

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Speaker 1: against her ex on April three, after accusing him of

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Speaker 1: physically and emotionally abusing her. She says that she was

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Speaker 1: in fearful her he was talking about Bellefonte a break.

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Speaker 1: Let me break this down, all right, you're telling me

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Speaker 1: he was already convicted of abusing his last I guess

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Speaker 1: girlfriend slash wife, the mother of his other child. Is

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Speaker 1: that what you told me? That correct? In two thousand

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Speaker 1: and three? And I wonder if Melby knew this when

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Speaker 1: she hooked up with this guy. She knew? Okay, right there?

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Speaker 1: Richard Harmon, Why where does he get the nerve to

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Speaker 1: go in front of a judge and ask for all

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Speaker 1: this money? What did he ask for? A hundred thousand

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Speaker 1: dollars a month? But he asked me, yeah, he told

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Speaker 1: the judge. We live a high, high cotton lifestyle here, judge,

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Speaker 1: And I'm used to this. And after his wife working

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Speaker 1: her fingers to the bone, well, she blew a multimillion

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Speaker 1: pound fortune over the last ten years. And he needs

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Speaker 1: money at least now temporarily for food, housing and other issues.

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Speaker 1: So the judge awarded him forty thousand other issues. I'm

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Speaker 1: looking at a picture of him right now, Richard Harmon.

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Speaker 1: He looks like a fine, healthy young man to me.

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Speaker 1: He's walking along, smiling for the cameras. And there's mail Base.

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Speaker 1: She's got a big band aid on her face. I

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Speaker 1: wonder where that's from anyway. But why can't he go

427
00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:48,960
Speaker 1: get a job, well he why can't he support himself?

428
00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:50,760
Speaker 1: Why does he have to mooch off his wife? I

429
00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:53,320
Speaker 1: think he was acting as her manager, and I think

430
00:25:53,359 --> 00:25:56,480
Speaker 1: they had a sorted history there with the nanny, the

431
00:25:56,600 --> 00:26:01,040
Speaker 1: three of them and aliment. I think I'm losing memory.

432
00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:08,320
Speaker 1: Wait a minute, you're giving me this pain. Wait a minute, manager,

433
00:26:08,760 --> 00:26:16,480
Speaker 1: Wait a minute, her manager managing her? Checking nobody likes

434
00:26:16,520 --> 00:26:20,000
Speaker 1: what is he managing? No good? Look at the extraordinary here.

435
00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:23,560
Speaker 1: The two of them are spending fifty one thousand dollars

436
00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:27,240
Speaker 1: a month on average. Now, let's just put this into context, Nancy,

437
00:26:27,520 --> 00:26:32,960
Speaker 1: the US median household income household income is fifty five thousand,

438
00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:37,560
Speaker 1: seven hundred and seventy five dollars per year, and those

439
00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:41,800
Speaker 1: two are spending fifty one thousand dollars per month, and

440
00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:44,080
Speaker 1: they're not even able to pay their tax bills. The

441
00:26:44,200 --> 00:26:47,440
Speaker 1: judge slabbed that they still owe tax money from last year.

442
00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:49,879
Speaker 1: The judges like, what is going on with you? Can

443
00:26:49,920 --> 00:26:55,240
Speaker 1: somebody tell me what they're spending their money on. If

444
00:26:55,240 --> 00:26:59,520
Speaker 1: he's her manager, why isn't he paying the taxman? You

445
00:26:59,560 --> 00:27:03,600
Speaker 1: know when the woman does this, it's okay, but well

446
00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:09,040
Speaker 1: he needs to manage the accountant. Don't even start that.

447
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:12,680
Speaker 1: Don't start that with me. Don't even try the whole

448
00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:17,199
Speaker 1: reverse discriminations. She's working her rear end off. Did you know?

449
00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:19,280
Speaker 1: Not only is she on Let's see what did you

450
00:27:19,320 --> 00:27:23,360
Speaker 1: tell me? America's got talent in the U S? Is that?

451
00:27:23,560 --> 00:27:26,240
Speaker 1: But she's on the X factor or has been on

452
00:27:26,280 --> 00:27:30,160
Speaker 1: the X Factor in Britain. She's doing that too. This

453
00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:33,359
Speaker 1: woman's got two jobs and flying back and forth trying

454
00:27:33,359 --> 00:27:37,400
Speaker 1: to support this poser bellafante my rear end What did

455
00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:40,280
Speaker 1: you say his name is? Was this real woman Stansbury?

456
00:27:40,400 --> 00:27:42,760
Speaker 1: I think that's what we should call him, Steven stans

457
00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:47,119
Speaker 1: It's like all the Rockefellers now, I like saying Bellafantie.

458
00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:52,280
Speaker 1: Like the amount of money that these people say they

459
00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:54,280
Speaker 1: need is ludicrous, Rod, Can I take you through a

460
00:27:54,359 --> 00:27:57,040
Speaker 1: shopping list of what they spend their money on each

461
00:27:57,080 --> 00:28:02,399
Speaker 1: monthy do oka Melby clames she needs twenty thousand dollars

462
00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:07,280
Speaker 1: a month in childcare, five thousand a month in groceries

463
00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:13,800
Speaker 1: and household supplies. She needs another She starts familiar with me.

464
00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:20,120
Speaker 1: I can win my crop part. Okay, some lessons. You've

465
00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:23,760
Speaker 1: seen my right part, Sean wash. You know I mean business.

466
00:28:24,720 --> 00:28:27,359
Speaker 1: Remember I think I have a photo of you putting

467
00:28:27,400 --> 00:28:33,320
Speaker 1: my head in your crop pot. Yeah, we did not

468
00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:35,480
Speaker 1: serve that for dinner. I can tell you that much.

469
00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:40,560
Speaker 1: Go ahead. They have they spend. She spends four thousand,

470
00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:43,680
Speaker 1: four hundred nine dollars a month on eating out and

471
00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:46,520
Speaker 1: one thousand, three hundred and thirteen dollars a month on

472
00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:51,080
Speaker 1: movie shows, theme parks, etcetera. Now the court said they

473
00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:54,080
Speaker 1: do not find these expenses credible or reasonable. But then

474
00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:58,840
Speaker 1: he has his own expenses. He contends he needs two thousand,

475
00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:03,240
Speaker 1: three hundred per month groceries and household supplies, seven hundred

476
00:29:03,280 --> 00:29:07,160
Speaker 1: and fifty dollars for telephone, cell phone, and email. Clearly

477
00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:10,360
Speaker 1: he doesn't know how to bundle his phone, internet and

478
00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:13,880
Speaker 1: cell phones. And then he needs another two thousand a

479
00:29:13,920 --> 00:29:17,960
Speaker 1: month for clothing, and then he needs three thousands for entertainment,

480
00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:22,200
Speaker 1: gifts and vacation. Now, I doubt the average American family

481
00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:26,520
Speaker 1: spends three thousand dollars a year on entertainment, gifts and vacations,

482
00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:29,760
Speaker 1: let alone per month. Now. The court said they also

483
00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:33,680
Speaker 1: don't find his expenses credible or reasonable. So the judge

484
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:35,760
Speaker 1: called out both of them. Let me just tell y'all something.

485
00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:39,120
Speaker 1: The other night, I have been taking care of the

486
00:29:39,200 --> 00:29:43,200
Speaker 1: twins all day. I have been working at a book deadline.

487
00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:45,520
Speaker 1: I was trying to work on a project for a

488
00:29:45,560 --> 00:29:50,000
Speaker 1: Hallmark movie. Was working like a maniac. And at the

489
00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:54,160
Speaker 1: same time, I cooked dinner. And then David. He's still alive.

490
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:59,320
Speaker 1: I haven't killed him yet. He comes walking in cool

491
00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:01,960
Speaker 1: bree He's all still like dressed up from the time

492
00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:05,000
Speaker 1: when he left that morning. He goes, hey, let's go

493
00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:09,640
Speaker 1: out tonight. I just wanted to just slap him right

494
00:30:09,880 --> 00:30:11,800
Speaker 1: in the face. Of course, I didn't do it because

495
00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:14,400
Speaker 1: I'm against violence, but my little hand was just tangling.

496
00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:17,600
Speaker 1: I'm like, we are not going out and spending a

497
00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:21,360
Speaker 1: hundred and fifty dollars on something I don't really even

498
00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:24,080
Speaker 1: know what they put in it. We are eating from

499
00:30:24,440 --> 00:30:30,160
Speaker 1: the pot. Okay would have been an advertiser in the

500
00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:36,680
Speaker 1: Bella Fonte mel Brown out, O how she put up

501
00:30:36,680 --> 00:30:39,360
Speaker 1: with him this long? I don't know? Okay, so where

502
00:30:39,400 --> 00:30:43,680
Speaker 1: does it stand right now? What's happening? He wants like

503
00:30:43,880 --> 00:30:47,760
Speaker 1: a hundred grand a month or some crazy, crazy number,

504
00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:53,040
Speaker 1: and the judge gives him what it's extraordinary. Um. The

505
00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:56,000
Speaker 1: judge said that he didn't understand why both parties don't

506
00:30:56,040 --> 00:30:59,160
Speaker 1: reduce their monthly expenses by living in their former marital

507
00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:01,920
Speaker 1: home in West Hollywood. Now that would be perfect for

508
00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:05,440
Speaker 1: both of them. Wait, neither one or living in the home.

509
00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:10,040
Speaker 1: They're both just going to rentals. But that's a crime.

510
00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:13,880
Speaker 1: That's the interesting part though. The court ordered that Melby

511
00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:17,640
Speaker 1: pay him forty thou dollars a month um, and it's

512
00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:21,640
Speaker 1: to be backdated to mate Wolves, where she also has

513
00:31:21,680 --> 00:31:24,040
Speaker 1: to pay one hundred thousand dollars in legal fees for

514
00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:28,720
Speaker 1: him and forty dollars in forensic accounting fees. And she's

515
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:31,080
Speaker 1: turned around and she said, no, I'm sorry. I really

516
00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:35,360
Speaker 1: shouldn't have to pay someone who I'm accusing of domestic abuse.

517
00:31:35,480 --> 00:31:38,000
Speaker 1: But the judges said, this is temporary for the moment

518
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:43,440
Speaker 1: you have to pay. Hold on, hold on. There's just

519
00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:47,960
Speaker 1: so much does not always go to the swiftest. Wait

520
00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:52,280
Speaker 1: a minute, what won't slow it down? I like Melby's argument.

521
00:31:52,320 --> 00:31:54,400
Speaker 1: Did you hear that rich or she tells the judge,

522
00:31:54,960 --> 00:31:59,240
Speaker 1: I don't think it's right that an abuse victim has

523
00:31:59,280 --> 00:32:05,080
Speaker 1: to pay a the beater, the perpetrator, right. I think

524
00:32:05,120 --> 00:32:07,320
Speaker 1: she's right. Why should she have to pay a guy

525
00:32:07,640 --> 00:32:11,840
Speaker 1: forty grant a month that has beaten her? According to her, Well,

526
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:21,360
Speaker 1: that's kind of irrelevant for these Unfortunately, that's irrelevant. There's

527
00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:24,840
Speaker 1: a hundred and seventy five thousand dollars met that she

528
00:32:24,960 --> 00:32:27,800
Speaker 1: has that subject to the award. For him, he gave

529
00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:33,600
Speaker 1: temporarily alimony for forty thousand dollars a month. Temporary. They're

530
00:32:33,640 --> 00:32:35,880
Speaker 1: going to be back in court. And the lesson here,

531
00:32:36,320 --> 00:32:39,160
Speaker 1: whether you're rich and famous or your poor, the lesson

532
00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:43,760
Speaker 1: here is settle these matrimonial cases. Do not litigate them.

533
00:32:44,040 --> 00:32:46,600
Speaker 1: Does the lawyers make a bundle on them? And in

534
00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:49,560
Speaker 1: the end of the day, you know you're gonna get crushed.

535
00:32:49,720 --> 00:32:53,040
Speaker 1: You've got to settle these things early on, upfront, and

536
00:32:53,080 --> 00:32:55,040
Speaker 1: they're gonna they're gonna see the hard way. Everybody, Do

537
00:32:55,080 --> 00:32:59,400
Speaker 1: you know what you just heard? You heard what high,

538
00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:04,200
Speaker 1: high priced clients pay Richard Herman through the nose to do.

539
00:33:04,760 --> 00:33:09,080
Speaker 1: He completely ignored my question and he started talking about

540
00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:13,040
Speaker 1: something else, very earnestly. It totally had the ring of truth.

541
00:33:13,080 --> 00:33:15,880
Speaker 1: In fact, what he said was true, and you walk

542
00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:19,080
Speaker 1: away going, yeah, Richard Herman was right, Richard Herman, that

543
00:33:19,160 --> 00:33:23,080
Speaker 1: is totally not what I even asked you. So the

544
00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:28,000
Speaker 1: judge basically is telling this couple to limit. He's got

545
00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:33,080
Speaker 1: to limit himself to forty dollars a month. Okay. They

546
00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:38,640
Speaker 1: also are accusing each other of running off and hiding money.

547
00:33:39,120 --> 00:33:41,040
Speaker 1: What are the claims? Do we know what the claims

548
00:33:41,120 --> 00:33:44,719
Speaker 1: are on that sean, they're just saying that both of

549
00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:47,960
Speaker 1: them are claiming that either party has run off with

550
00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:52,240
Speaker 1: joint property that's worth anywhere from the hundreds of thousands

551
00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:55,600
Speaker 1: to the millions of dollars. So there's a lot at

552
00:33:55,640 --> 00:33:58,680
Speaker 1: stake here. It's not just the expenses, it's the property,

553
00:33:58,760 --> 00:34:02,160
Speaker 1: it's future earnings because remember he claims his career is

554
00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:04,480
Speaker 1: as her manager, so he wants a piece of that

555
00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:09,239
Speaker 1: Melby Pie forever is her Man as much as he

556
00:34:09,239 --> 00:34:11,160
Speaker 1: can get. I laughed because when I was going through

557
00:34:11,160 --> 00:34:13,160
Speaker 1: this with my watch tonight, she said, you do this

558
00:34:13,239 --> 00:34:15,800
Speaker 1: to me and I can assure you I'll have everything,

559
00:34:15,800 --> 00:34:18,759
Speaker 1: and you'll be supporting yourself by playing the clarinet at

560
00:34:18,840 --> 00:34:23,239
Speaker 1: Union Square? Do you think you make any man from

561
00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:26,879
Speaker 1: law school? All I know is you remember from law

562
00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:32,400
Speaker 1: school California's community property, state, community property, right down the middle,

563
00:34:33,080 --> 00:34:36,440
Speaker 1: everything right, don't rub it in? And they stayed married

564
00:34:36,520 --> 00:34:38,960
Speaker 1: just long enough for time really kick in? Haven't they

565
00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:46,080
Speaker 1: been married ten years? So the judge is blasting Melby

566
00:34:46,280 --> 00:34:52,080
Speaker 1: and the husband, Steven Standsbury slash Bellefonte, for exorbitant spending.

567
00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:54,600
Speaker 1: Where do all the children land in this? How many

568
00:34:54,719 --> 00:34:57,280
Speaker 1: children do they have together? They have one child together,

569
00:34:57,440 --> 00:35:00,399
Speaker 1: and then she has two other children were of two

570
00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:04,399
Speaker 1: other men. And he has another daughter with the ex

571
00:35:04,440 --> 00:35:08,520
Speaker 1: girlfriend that he was guilty of assaulting, assaulting back in

572
00:35:08,560 --> 00:35:11,400
Speaker 1: two thousand and three, the ring of that found guilty.

573
00:35:11,640 --> 00:35:15,000
Speaker 1: You know, she really should have just stayed with Eddie Murphy.

574
00:35:15,640 --> 00:35:20,600
Speaker 1: That's a whole other story. I mean, what's wrong with

575
00:35:20,719 --> 00:35:27,160
Speaker 1: Eddie Murphy's good looking, he's funny, he's smarty. Yeah, he

576
00:35:27,200 --> 00:35:29,799
Speaker 1: did denied fraternity. Yet that you kind of ruined it

577
00:35:29,840 --> 00:35:32,600
Speaker 1: for me there, Sean, Thanks, you just ruined the whole

578
00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:34,960
Speaker 1: scenario I have the leg out of my head. So

579
00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:37,520
Speaker 1: where does it go from here? Do you know? Do

580
00:35:37,600 --> 00:35:40,839
Speaker 1: we know? After this? Let's hope both parties get into

581
00:35:40,840 --> 00:35:44,719
Speaker 1: a room with a very set of smart attorneys who

582
00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:48,520
Speaker 1: encouraged them both to settle and walk away from each other.

583
00:35:48,600 --> 00:35:51,960
Speaker 1: Adding shot, Richard Herman, you're not doing crock pots and Nancy,

584
00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:55,719
Speaker 1: this is big bucks lifestyle, the rich things. That's how

585
00:35:55,760 --> 00:35:58,040
Speaker 1: these divorces go. That's all you can say. That's how

586
00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:01,520
Speaker 1: these divorces go. That's it, that's how they go. He's

587
00:36:01,520 --> 00:36:03,839
Speaker 1: going to get every dollar. Reason right now. Listen, if

588
00:36:03,840 --> 00:36:05,799
Speaker 1: I were your client, that's all you had to tell me.

589
00:36:05,880 --> 00:36:11,840
Speaker 1: I demand that you. That's how these divorces go. Huh No,

590
00:36:12,440 --> 00:36:17,520
Speaker 1: you know what. I am just you know, a felony prosecutor.

591
00:36:17,880 --> 00:36:22,000
Speaker 1: But I would so get down and dirty on this.

592
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:27,279
Speaker 1: I would find out every single thing Bellafante has been

593
00:36:27,400 --> 00:36:31,080
Speaker 1: up to. It goes both ways. But you know, actually

594
00:36:31,160 --> 00:36:35,440
Speaker 1: maybe not now that I'm thinking about it, because you

595
00:36:35,480 --> 00:36:38,040
Speaker 1: know what, she's too busy workie, she's on national TV

596
00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:41,440
Speaker 1: trying to hold down two jobs. I doubt she's got

597
00:36:41,440 --> 00:36:44,000
Speaker 1: a whole lot of time for let me just say gallivanting.

598
00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:47,040
Speaker 1: She's too busy trying to support this husband of hers

599
00:36:47,080 --> 00:36:50,200
Speaker 1: with his fake name. I've got to ask you guys

600
00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:57,120
Speaker 1: about another case. It's about a woman who shoots her

601
00:36:57,160 --> 00:37:03,160
Speaker 1: boyfriend dead, shoots him in the head and says as

602
00:37:03,160 --> 00:37:09,200
Speaker 1: a defense, he asked me to. Okay, Richard, I've never

603
00:37:09,239 --> 00:37:13,400
Speaker 1: heard that defense used before. Actually, a similar defense was

604
00:37:13,600 --> 00:37:18,759
Speaker 1: used and assisted suicide and assisted suicide case with Cavorkian

605
00:37:19,080 --> 00:37:21,319
Speaker 1: that was a long time ago. That's the only time

606
00:37:21,360 --> 00:37:25,200
Speaker 1: I've ever heard that defense used and is completely different

607
00:37:25,200 --> 00:37:30,000
Speaker 1: from this case. The girlfriend shoots her boyfriend in the head,

608
00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:33,560
Speaker 1: in the forehead, and her defense, she tells police, well

609
00:37:33,600 --> 00:37:36,920
Speaker 1: he asked me to is that what happened? What do

610
00:37:37,000 --> 00:37:39,080
Speaker 1: you know about that defense? Have you ever heard it before?

611
00:37:39,520 --> 00:37:42,160
Speaker 1: In those mercy killing pipe cases where people are dying

612
00:37:42,200 --> 00:37:45,840
Speaker 1: to cancer, are they terminal illness? And and in this

613
00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:49,120
Speaker 1: particular case, Nancy, you you have an intentional killing. I

614
00:37:49,160 --> 00:37:53,239
Speaker 1: mean she took at and hit him point blank in

615
00:37:53,280 --> 00:37:56,239
Speaker 1: the head, so you have she intended to do that.

616
00:37:56,360 --> 00:37:59,480
Speaker 1: You have the intentional killing for murder. Here, the question

617
00:37:59,600 --> 00:38:03,400
Speaker 1: is how is the mitigation? And you know it was

618
00:38:03,480 --> 00:38:06,080
Speaker 1: he under such a strain, in such a stress that

619
00:38:06,120 --> 00:38:08,719
Speaker 1: he thought his life was over and and he wanted her.

620
00:38:08,880 --> 00:38:11,120
Speaker 1: He didn't have the strength, the courage or do it himself,

621
00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:13,560
Speaker 1: so he went to the next closest person in his

622
00:38:13,640 --> 00:38:16,280
Speaker 1: life is so called wife. He called her his wife

623
00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:18,640
Speaker 1: and asked her to do it. And you know, they're

624
00:38:18,640 --> 00:38:21,600
Speaker 1: going to parade in his social media where he's gloom

625
00:38:21,640 --> 00:38:23,840
Speaker 1: and doom. It's the end of the world. Friends of

626
00:38:23,880 --> 00:38:26,200
Speaker 1: his are going to come in and say that, Uh.

627
00:38:26,520 --> 00:38:28,840
Speaker 1: You know, he was just so distraught and he couldn't

628
00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:31,400
Speaker 1: get by. Each day he speared he was being bullied

629
00:38:31,440 --> 00:38:34,320
Speaker 1: online and this cult was just taking over his life,

630
00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:37,399
Speaker 1: and he was miserable. And he's a thirty two year

631
00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:40,200
Speaker 1: old man. How is he being bullied online? You know,

632
00:38:40,560 --> 00:38:43,239
Speaker 1: wait a minute, Sean Walls deal email dot com. He's

633
00:38:43,239 --> 00:38:45,400
Speaker 1: a thirty two year old man, how is he being bullied?

634
00:38:46,120 --> 00:38:49,239
Speaker 1: Interesting this case, this is a good looking young American

635
00:38:49,320 --> 00:38:52,440
Speaker 1: couple who seemed to have everything they could like when

636
00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:54,719
Speaker 1: you look at the photos on that Facebook account. But

637
00:38:55,000 --> 00:38:57,280
Speaker 1: here he is online and he's claiming that an alleged

638
00:38:57,320 --> 00:39:00,880
Speaker 1: cult leader by the name of Sherry Schreiner was abusing

639
00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:04,520
Speaker 1: him on mine. She frequently rails online against fake news

640
00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:07,600
Speaker 1: and lip tard's and the Democratic Party. I'm quoting her now.

641
00:39:08,200 --> 00:39:13,280
Speaker 1: And his girlfriend has told friends that she was abusing

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00:39:13,280 --> 00:39:15,880
Speaker 1: her boyfriend online and he'd had enough of it. He

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00:39:15,880 --> 00:39:18,440
Speaker 1: wanted to escape from it, and so she is claiming

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00:39:18,520 --> 00:39:22,000
Speaker 1: that he asked her to kill him, which she did.

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00:39:22,239 --> 00:39:24,600
Speaker 1: Let me understand that she, the girlfriend, is the one

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00:39:24,680 --> 00:39:28,960
Speaker 1: bullying him online. No no, no, no, no, no, Okay,

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00:39:29,239 --> 00:39:31,719
Speaker 1: that doesn't make any sense to me at all. The

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00:39:31,800 --> 00:39:36,200
Speaker 1: cult leader leader, Yeah, the cult leader a woman by

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00:39:36,239 --> 00:39:40,200
Speaker 1: the name of Sherry Shriner, and she is often online

650
00:39:40,360 --> 00:39:44,040
Speaker 1: railing against fake news and the Democratic Party. And she

651
00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:47,920
Speaker 1: was saying that nasty thinks about him online and he

652
00:39:48,080 --> 00:39:50,040
Speaker 1: had enough of it, and so he went to his

653
00:39:50,080 --> 00:39:53,520
Speaker 1: girlfriend allegedly this is what the girlfriend claims, and said,

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00:39:53,640 --> 00:39:56,279
Speaker 1: please end this. I want you to end this for

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00:39:56,480 --> 00:40:00,719
Speaker 1: me by killing me. And so she took gun and

656
00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:03,040
Speaker 1: shot him in the fuehead and killed him. Okay, that's

657
00:40:03,080 --> 00:40:06,239
Speaker 1: not gonna fly. Apparently he had been a member of

658
00:40:06,280 --> 00:40:08,799
Speaker 1: his cult. Nancy what he had been a member of

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00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:10,960
Speaker 1: the cult, and then they threw him He had been

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00:40:10,960 --> 00:40:13,560
Speaker 1: a member of the cult, and then they threw him

661
00:40:13,640 --> 00:40:17,399
Speaker 1: out and his girlfriend. So even neither one of them

662
00:40:17,400 --> 00:40:20,000
Speaker 1: appeared to be playing with a full deck here. But look,

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00:40:20,120 --> 00:40:22,840
Speaker 1: I don't know the diminished capacity aspect of this. I

664
00:40:22,880 --> 00:40:25,960
Speaker 1: know we've talked so many cases about that, but you

665
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:28,600
Speaker 1: know there is some mitigation here, and it will be

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00:40:28,640 --> 00:40:31,560
Speaker 1: a whole side show in court to see what kind

667
00:40:31,560 --> 00:40:33,960
Speaker 1: of state of mind he was in. And you know

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00:40:34,280 --> 00:40:38,080
Speaker 1: it's only to mitigation what this brings. He asked me,

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00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:44,080
Speaker 1: pretty sure, I know the B S when I smell

670
00:40:44,120 --> 00:40:46,839
Speaker 1: at the B. Sameter is going off like mad right now,

671
00:40:47,239 --> 00:40:51,080
Speaker 1: because it doesn't matter or if some other woman was

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00:40:51,200 --> 00:40:56,680
Speaker 1: bullying him online. Uh, because somebody says, just shoot me now,

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00:40:57,120 --> 00:41:00,799
Speaker 1: I mean, that's not a defense. That is not a

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00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:05,680
Speaker 1: defense in our jurisprudence system. He asked me to. Oh,

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00:41:07,400 --> 00:41:11,920
Speaker 1: it goes to mitigation that sentences. There's no just stuttered.

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00:41:12,440 --> 00:41:15,560
Speaker 1: I am so happy I heard that he went up.

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00:41:16,560 --> 00:41:20,759
Speaker 1: You had to think for just one moment. Okay, now

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00:41:21,120 --> 00:41:23,120
Speaker 1: you know that's not a defense under the law, he

679
00:41:23,239 --> 00:41:26,000
Speaker 1: asked me to. It doesn't matter if she was in

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00:41:26,080 --> 00:41:28,840
Speaker 1: a cult, if he had been in a cult, they're

681
00:41:28,840 --> 00:41:32,680
Speaker 1: not involved in this. She shot him in the head,

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00:41:32,920 --> 00:41:37,359
Speaker 1: and she confessed when asked by police. She said, he

683
00:41:37,400 --> 00:41:41,840
Speaker 1: asked me too, that's not a defense, Richard. No, he

684
00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:45,160
Speaker 1: asked me to because he was so distraught. He could

685
00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:46,960
Speaker 1: not get up go on with his life. He was

686
00:41:47,080 --> 00:41:51,160
Speaker 1: absolutely miserable. He was hadn't putting on social media. It's

687
00:41:51,200 --> 00:41:54,680
Speaker 1: the end of the world. Prepare yourselves, it's over. The

688
00:41:54,719 --> 00:41:57,440
Speaker 1: man was just falling apart, and in order to put

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00:41:57,520 --> 00:42:00,200
Speaker 1: him out of his misery, he asked her. He begged her,

690
00:42:00,480 --> 00:42:03,239
Speaker 1: please take me out of my misery. Please do this.

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00:42:04,000 --> 00:42:06,799
Speaker 1: It's like the mercy killing cases, Nancy. That's how it's

692
00:42:06,840 --> 00:42:09,600
Speaker 1: goes to mitigation. The cult leaders come out now and

693
00:42:09,640 --> 00:42:13,040
Speaker 1: she's been releasing messages on social media where she says

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00:42:13,560 --> 00:42:16,640
Speaker 1: I warned him that she was a super soldier who

695
00:42:16,640 --> 00:42:19,440
Speaker 1: would kill him and move on. I mean, there's so

696
00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:22,160
Speaker 1: many degrees are crazy here, Nancy. I can't even outline

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00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:25,080
Speaker 1: them all. And she says, Look, they're trying to spin

698
00:42:25,200 --> 00:42:29,600
Speaker 1: this that I'm responsible for his death. It was he

699
00:42:29,680 --> 00:42:35,240
Speaker 1: thought it was a religious group, it's but it's it's Look, Nancy,

700
00:42:35,320 --> 00:42:37,600
Speaker 1: it's a crazy cult. That's all I can say. There's

701
00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:39,399
Speaker 1: so many different things wrong with this when you read

702
00:42:39,440 --> 00:42:41,680
Speaker 1: into it. I mean, there's no there's no is it

703
00:42:41,760 --> 00:42:44,480
Speaker 1: a doomsday call? It's a doomsday cold. But there's so

704
00:42:44,480 --> 00:42:46,800
Speaker 1: many other things that they're railing on about. They really

705
00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:49,760
Speaker 1: don't have a strategic set of key messages. So Richard Hermon,

706
00:42:49,840 --> 00:42:52,040
Speaker 1: what they were. What she really need is for you.

707
00:42:52,560 --> 00:42:55,480
Speaker 1: It's like lawyer to come in and convince the jury

708
00:42:55,480 --> 00:42:59,120
Speaker 1: that this was a mercy killing. Sean. Please make a

709
00:42:59,160 --> 00:43:02,320
Speaker 1: note of this. I'm never going to ask somebody please

710
00:43:02,400 --> 00:43:05,440
Speaker 1: just shoot me. Okay, that's not going to happen, So

711
00:43:05,640 --> 00:43:10,000
Speaker 1: don't let my husband jump up and argue that one day. Now,

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00:43:10,040 --> 00:43:13,760
Speaker 1: you've got it right here on Serious Nancy Grace Crime Stories.

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Speaker 1: Signing off, goodbye friend,