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Speaker 1: Welcome to Jay dot M, a production of I Heart

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Speaker 1: Radio Microphone check one to what is this? Welcome to

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Speaker 1: Jay dot the Podcast. I'm here with Layah st Clair. Hello, people,

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Speaker 1: and agent great and dance. Yes, the five nine assassin

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Speaker 1: with the rough neck business. Wait, I'm like, I think

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Speaker 1: I cut lay off. What are you gonna say? Book? No,

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Speaker 1: I'm just saying, what's up? Book, that's all over you. Okay,

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Speaker 1: just just make it sure, work, just make it sure.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to cut you off lying. I want no,

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Speaker 1: I want no smoke with you. Well a little bit.

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Speaker 1: We haven't done it and so out. Sorry, it's crazy.

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Speaker 1: I really can't wait to see y'all in person, though,

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Speaker 1: I'm happy to see you right in this moment, but

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Speaker 1: I feel that it's time. Okay, we've been on the zoom.

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Speaker 1: It's time to see one another. I'm going to warn you.

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Speaker 1: I think I warned you before, but I'm warning you now.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to bite you. I'll take a bite. I'm

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Speaker 1: going to bruise. Yeah. It's too much love we have had.

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Speaker 1: We have shared too many thoughts and feelings together. Damn zoom.

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Speaker 1: That's right now, You're gonna get bit you, Finna get it. Okay,

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Speaker 1: you're about to get it. I'm mark because you know,

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Speaker 1: this thing is like it's gonna be there for the

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Speaker 1: next two weeks. It's gonna go for red to black

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Speaker 1: and purple. One. Oh my god, I got a new bruise.

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Speaker 1: Like it's fading now, but I got a new bruise.

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Speaker 1: I was like, what did I though, that's that light

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Speaker 1: skinned thing, that problem when you come from. When did

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Speaker 1: this happen? I don't even know. I don't understand y'all's

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Speaker 1: skin problems. But I know that because I'm looking at

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Speaker 1: this Zoe and I you're you're a fair carmely I'm

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Speaker 1: a carmely color. I just said. But I had a mother.

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Speaker 1: I had a mother who was was quite light, and

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Speaker 1: she had issues with that too. She would literally have

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Speaker 1: a bruise and we'd be like, mom, what did you do?

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Speaker 1: She's like, I just I get these bruises living. I

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Speaker 1: don't know what. I don't know why this happens to me.

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Speaker 1: But I'd be like, mone, that's terrible. That thing is perfect.

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Speaker 1: You hit something, she said, I did. I don't know what,

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Speaker 1: and I do not remember. But and of course, growing

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Speaker 1: up because I had like skinned mama as pf okay,

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Speaker 1: I was not one of those. Yes, we had we

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Speaker 1: put on something block. That's what my mother had to

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Speaker 1: have it on or she would peel so a lot

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Speaker 1: of it in the eighties and nineties, like yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: my mother, my mother did. My mother did. The first

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Speaker 1: time you saw a black person burn, that ship blew

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Speaker 1: my mind, Like I saw a black girl bubble and

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Speaker 1: I was like, I don't even know because the doc

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Speaker 1: a dumb chick baby or on to get a better

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Speaker 1: more than I was like yes, like sis, You're like,

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Speaker 1: sister Melanin is not like completely yes, it's not. It

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Speaker 1: does it, it's not. But I didn't know that. I

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Speaker 1: didn't know. I got sunburned on my chest one time

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Speaker 1: and it completely like it changed the color of my

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Speaker 1: chest like forever. I had no idea. I was like,

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Speaker 1: why is my chest hurting it? I had no idea.

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Speaker 1: I didn't know, not for nothing, but the increase of

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Speaker 1: the ozone layer become missing. Black people are more endangered

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Speaker 1: than ever and they have no idea that. Yeah, it's crazy. Yeah, Actually,

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Speaker 1: I will tell you that I didn't have my first

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Speaker 1: experience burning in the past five years where I had

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Speaker 1: my shoulders, and I was like, oh wait, this is painful.

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Speaker 1: What is this um that hurts? I know, White people

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Speaker 1: said somewhere laughing at us, like what the funk? How

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Speaker 1: Like how y'all didn't know that the sun burns because

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Speaker 1: it's whatever did before. And that's how you know that

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Speaker 1: the sun is getting stronger and the ozone layers getting weaker.

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Speaker 1: That's how you know because all these years, all these

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Speaker 1: years in the sun just turning different colors like crazy,

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Speaker 1: all some long. I remember some green one time because

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Speaker 1: like a like a army green, because they had so

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Speaker 1: much chlorine in the water. And we had gone to

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Speaker 1: a family reunion and I swim. I swear with my

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Speaker 1: cousins all day until the sun went down, and even

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Speaker 1: after that, sometimes to three o'clock in the morning, we

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Speaker 1: were swimming. I took that bathe in camp Off, Yes,

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Speaker 1: bathe and cap. I took my baby and I had

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Speaker 1: a line right here from being in the sun. Just

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Speaker 1: you remember that you got to do that. Well. I

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Speaker 1: never had a swim cap. My mother would just braid

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Speaker 1: our hair, but I always wanted to. I always thought

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Speaker 1: that any it ain't never worked. Caps. Moms loved them

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Speaker 1: a little bit more and when you put it on

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Speaker 1: a hurt. It hurt, and then you'd be mad because

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Speaker 1: you were to do all that pain to put it on,

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Speaker 1: and then your hair still wet. It's like still wet.

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Speaker 1: You ain't missed nothing. Changing colors like that, you know,

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Speaker 1: changing to some green person because of the chlorine in

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Speaker 1: the water, Like deep that's on the skin. Yeah, that's

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Speaker 1: so good. It was like a you know, Motel six,

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Speaker 1: one of them drinks, so they had that. They probably

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Speaker 1: had bleaching. What I feel like when we were little

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Speaker 1: and we grew up, you know, in the eighties, you

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Speaker 1: know what I'm saying. And I think about like black

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Speaker 1: women and what black folks period and how we talk

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Speaker 1: about color is the most interesting situation. It's like if

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Speaker 1: you talk to old people, they got certain ways of

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Speaker 1: saying things and talking about things, and talk to our generation.

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Speaker 1: I remember that. You know. My husband always says, I

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Speaker 1: don't know when the light skinned boys went out of style.

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Speaker 1: He was like, but when I was young, that used

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Speaker 1: to be like a cool thing, and now it is not.

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Speaker 1: And I think to myself, when we were little, we

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Speaker 1: had such a terrible view of our skin tone and color.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I mean it was just awful, And for

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Speaker 1: me and for everybody on this call, you know, and

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Speaker 1: having a conversation about colorism is really a deep thing

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Speaker 1: because it's like none of us really had to experience

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Speaker 1: what it was like on the other side of that

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Speaker 1: for real, for real, like to really be young in

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Speaker 1: the eighties and have to sit there and have people

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Speaker 1: talk about your skin color in such a negative and

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Speaker 1: derogatory way. Black people go through such ways that it's

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Speaker 1: not even just uh, it's not even exclusively to dark

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Speaker 1: skinned folks, and it's not even exclusively to life to

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Speaker 1: skinning folks. It depends on the decade. I feel like

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Speaker 1: it also depends on the way your family looks, because

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Speaker 1: because when I was growing up, I definitely thought I

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Speaker 1: was darker than I am because all my family member

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Speaker 1: they was lighter, and my dad was really dark. And

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Speaker 1: so for me, my grandmother said would say, you know,

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Speaker 1: your father's handsome, and he's so black, you know, so

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Speaker 1: these things that was normal for people to say, you know,

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Speaker 1: for and so in my mind, I'm thinking, oh, I'm

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Speaker 1: dark because I'm darker than all y'all, and that's my dad,

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Speaker 1: you know, and I'm closer to his color that I

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Speaker 1: thought than I was to my mom. It does depend

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Speaker 1: on the environment, what was said to you and what

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Speaker 1: were the thoughts around those things. Maybe even also to

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Speaker 1: like what part of the country you lived in that too,

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Speaker 1: But it also has to do with with the time,

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Speaker 1: Like like life said that, you know in the fifties,

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Speaker 1: Oh honey, you needed to be fried by died ladies

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Speaker 1: decide you need to have that that hair popping, you know,

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Speaker 1: you had to get pressed baby, and the lighter you were,

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Speaker 1: the prettier you were period, That's how That's how it was.

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Speaker 1: And if you were on television, you know, you had

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Speaker 1: to be a maide. There was really nothing else for

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Speaker 1: you to do. I made a mammy, you know, something

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Speaker 1: of along those lines, and nanny that was nothing else.

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Speaker 1: When was the first time you saw a brown skin person,

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Speaker 1: like truly brown on television? Do you remember that? Okay?

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Speaker 1: And then here is the night I'm sorry that just

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Speaker 1: popped in my head. Yeah yeah, well Sydney Portier was

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Speaker 1: it was brown. I for my earliest recollection of black

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Speaker 1: people on television would happy like cartoons? Oh god, the

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Speaker 1: Tom Jerry of it all. Yeah, I think I probably

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Speaker 1: my first I think black people that I oh no, no,

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Speaker 1: Sesame Street. That was the first black person. Gordon, Yes, Gordon,

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Speaker 1: who is dead still around, Yeah, Mr Gordon. I think

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Speaker 1: it was the late night television. Um, you know, trying

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Speaker 1: to think because you know TV used to go off.

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Speaker 1: TV used to go off. I will tell you with

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Speaker 1: something special about Woopy Goberg when on TV for sure,

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Speaker 1: for sure? Yeah. Yeah. And she was the lead a

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Speaker 1: Beauty Jumping Jack. She was the lead that that is,

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Speaker 1: you know, until Ghosts until but she rocked that. She

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Speaker 1: rocked that. Yeah. Yeah, she's the star of that movie. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but she was the first of her I feel like

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Speaker 1: that had that look that it was okay, mixed the hair,

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Speaker 1: but I still don't even think it be. It's like,

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Speaker 1: it's interesting the representation part, right, people get we get

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Speaker 1: the representation, and that feels good. But on the playground,

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Speaker 1: it's still if you dark you African booty snatcher, it's

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Speaker 1: still if you light skin, it's still if you light skin,

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Speaker 1: you think you you think you better than everybody, or

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Speaker 1: you might end up getting beat up or something just

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Speaker 1: showing up light skin. I mean in real life, in

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Speaker 1: the way that we we interact with each other, you know,

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Speaker 1: or I want to marry this type of person so

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Speaker 1: I can have pretty babies, oh my god, or you

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Speaker 1: got that good hair? Or you know, are you real

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Speaker 1: pretty for a dark skinned girl? Or you know what

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Speaker 1: I mean like And these are things that really, in

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Speaker 1: my opinion, we still dog whistle these things to this day.

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Speaker 1: People may not say those exact words anymore, but it's like,

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Speaker 1: come on, we even down to like the natural hair

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Speaker 1: movement where it's like when you see a lot of

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Speaker 1: the models for natural hair, they got a certain kind

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Speaker 1: of natural hair. That curl pattern is the number one,

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Speaker 1: not the four right, that's the number one. It's not

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Speaker 1: a number four. It's a four y that needs me

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Speaker 1: a strong for seed. We're just start That's funny. I

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Speaker 1: think as of this year, we are just starting to

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Speaker 1: see women in commercials but a little bit of force,

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Speaker 1: a little bit, and typically those women are paired with

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Speaker 1: white men. God, come on with your truth, jail, and

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Speaker 1: nobody got time for listen. I to be to be

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Speaker 1: light skinned, and I'm telling you that this is that's

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Speaker 1: new for me. I just I didn't even believe it.

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Speaker 1: I didn't believe it. This is this is new to me.

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Speaker 1: I just found out I'm light skinned. Damn. Like even now,

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Speaker 1: to say it out loud, it's just like jagging me up,

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Speaker 1: because but what's wrong with this? Because there's I'm not

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Speaker 1: saying that there's anything wrong with it. I'm saying I

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Speaker 1: really didn't know. I don't know. How could you be

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Speaker 1: that delusional? I look at myself. I washed my face

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Speaker 1: every day, you know what I mean. I get in

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Speaker 1: the shower, I see myself. But I just never thunk

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Speaker 1: it just a little bit more diluted than you did before.

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Speaker 1: Something is missing, something that's missing. I just didn't know.

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Speaker 1: I don't know because all of my well i'll say

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Speaker 1: most of my really close girlfriends are brown. Yeah you know,

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Speaker 1: I got I got one light skinned homie. You know

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Speaker 1: that's been around for more than than ten fifteen years.

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Speaker 1: But don't you find color and black folks so interesting?

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Speaker 1: I think it's interesting when people see a person and

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Speaker 1: they see their parents and they're like, it's no way

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Speaker 1: that that child came from these two people, not knowing

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Speaker 1: that like this child, they may be dark and their

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Speaker 1: child may be light, but they had a like parent here,

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Speaker 1: and you know, just the way, yeah, the way the

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Speaker 1: whole thing works. Yeah, I've had a couple of friends

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Speaker 1: that have been accute, not accused, but you know you

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Speaker 1: must be mixed. Oh yeah, what are you mixed with?

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Speaker 1: What do you mixed with? Black and black? Black and black?

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Speaker 1: Black and black? But then also too, there's always this

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Speaker 1: assumption that light skin also means you know, like we

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Speaker 1: talked about the hair thing, were just like, I know,

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Speaker 1: light skinned people will foresee hair, you know what I'm saying. Like,

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Speaker 1: it's like black people have just as all these different

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Speaker 1: combinations of the ways that we look that and we

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Speaker 1: had to discuss it. But you know, we've been moved around,

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Speaker 1: We've been moved around, mixed, added all of these different things.

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Speaker 1: We have so much variety to the way that we look,

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Speaker 1: you know, what we consider to be black or look black,

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Speaker 1: or be black, all of the all those things start

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Speaker 1: to come into questions and really like, and we're talking

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Speaker 1: about the DNA tests. You know, I had a good

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Speaker 1: girlfriend who her test came back. She's like European mad

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Speaker 1: as hell, she's mad as hell, but she black black girl.

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Speaker 1: And you know, once you get into those type of percentages,

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Speaker 1: you could you can look at yourself as being quote

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Speaker 1: unquote bi racial. At that point, you feel me then

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Speaker 1: there's some people who just identifies black, you know, identify

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Speaker 1: or I'm black, and and that you might look at

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Speaker 1: them in their face and their face is so light

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Speaker 1: that you wouldn't necessarily immediately say, oh, that person is

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Speaker 1: is black. You know what I'm saying is so I

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Speaker 1: just think we we we have to be able to

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Speaker 1: get to this point where we really embrace all of

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Speaker 1: the ways that we can look at all the ways

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Speaker 1: that our beauty looks, because I don't think that we

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Speaker 1: even keyed into how much diversity there really really is.

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Speaker 1: It's not we still always talk in terms of light

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Speaker 1: skin and dark skin. You've got light skinned people, You've

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Speaker 1: got dark skinned people. Because really, Jill, I can see

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Speaker 1: how I mean, I'm gonna give you a little bit

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Speaker 1: of a break on this. I can see how you

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Speaker 1: could have been a little thrown by being called light

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Speaker 1: skinned because maybe you felt I'm just brown. I'm just

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Speaker 1: like you know, I'm I'm the brown girl trying to

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Speaker 1: look at her. I'm looking at her skin. To me,

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Speaker 1: I'm just trying to get You're a good friend. That's

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Speaker 1: what you're doing being a good friend. I'm telling you,

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Speaker 1: how could I how could I not know that sounds

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Speaker 1: so nuts even to me, But I just never really

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Speaker 1: I thought about it. I didn't, I didn't think about it.

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Speaker 1: I was just brown. What was the illest thing somebody

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Speaker 1: said to you about your skin tone or about skin

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Speaker 1: tone to you that sticks out to your mind? Well,

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Speaker 1: as of late, my family is busting on me for

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Speaker 1: being light skinned, you know, with with this newfound and

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Speaker 1: I'll say new because you know, the television hasn't been

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Speaker 1: representing properly in my opinion, in every sitcom, you know,

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Speaker 1: the husband is is some kind of brown skin and

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Speaker 1: the wife is some kind of light skinned with one

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Speaker 1: seed curls, you know, like seriously, no, right, like every

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Speaker 1: think of them. Let's go. It was. It's interesting, they're

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Speaker 1: trying to make a little change. You just made me

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Speaker 1: think of what, Yeah, of the new Gossip Girl with

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Speaker 1: with like with Kevin Hart and that beautiful woman I

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Speaker 1: don't know her name who was also in them. You know,

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Speaker 1: it's having lapide and young girl as a lead. You know,

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Speaker 1: seeing brown skinned women being loved is it's like a

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Speaker 1: whole new concept, you know. And when when the new

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Speaker 1: I'm Viv came, I was mad, right, how dare you?

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Speaker 1: How could you do that. She can't even be brown,

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Speaker 1: like I'm viv We loved mass well read, but it

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Speaker 1: was all hot. We was all a little bit filth,

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Speaker 1: a little betrayed by that boment, Like, yeah, crazy, because

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Speaker 1: we know vivis brown. She made them brown babies. You

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Speaker 1: know she got one light skinned daughter, but her stand

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Speaker 1: is brown and her daughter is brown. So how are

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Speaker 1: you gonna were all the way in fantasy? I love it,

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Speaker 1: But no, she's only saying, she only saying will all

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Speaker 1: of us thinking, even everything, None of us understood where

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Speaker 1: Denise and Sandra came from. None, we all wonder why

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Speaker 1: they were so light. I'm telling about what you didn't wanted. Yes,

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Speaker 1: did y'all not come on? No? No, no, no, no,

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Speaker 1: no no never the grandfather or grandmother, the grandfather mother? Yes?

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Speaker 1: And and um yes, the Huxtable. What's his name? I

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Speaker 1: keep wanting to say Bill, But Joe it was Joe

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Speaker 1: Williams was Claire's daddy, And um no, that and close

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Speaker 1: father was Brad. I was light, Yes, yes, Russell, Russell

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Speaker 1: Russell wasn't as a light as he was. Like we

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Speaker 1: let that go. It's okay, y'all, We let because all

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Speaker 1: the way down to Rudy and it was like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: you're doing a color for Sindough, right, we do that.

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Speaker 1: We have a color spectrum in our family. Yeah, you

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Speaker 1: have a friend who's who's twin sisters. One is light,

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Speaker 1: one is dark, Pierre for nothing. My father is one

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Speaker 1: of nine and my grandmother was as dark as his

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Speaker 1: background we're looking at. But he is lighter than jail,

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Speaker 1: you know. So it's kind of like that's why I

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Speaker 1: was saying earlier about the beauty and black and what

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Speaker 1: we can make. And people are so even we get

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Speaker 1: confused as to what we can do. Right, you gotta

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Speaker 1: give it to the one who do it, you know

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Speaker 1: what I'm meaning, like so many flowers in the garden.

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Speaker 1: So I think even when you talk about TV, right,

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Speaker 1: And we had this conversation with my daughter was talking

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Speaker 1: about movies that she was looking forward to, and like

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Speaker 1: people who are casting for these movies that she's looking

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Speaker 1: forward to. So there are several movies that are coming

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Speaker 1: out that are in the works and she's just like,

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Speaker 1: if they cast that person and who with light skinning

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Speaker 1: curly here, I'm gonna lose my mind. And so it

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Speaker 1: caused this conversation in my household about colorism. And it's

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Speaker 1: my thirteen year old who was talking about it, and

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Speaker 1: she tried to explain to my husband. She was like,

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Speaker 1: you know, Dad, the problem is that, you know, not

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Speaker 1: that people don't see beauty, she said, but there's so

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Speaker 1: many dog whistles. Basically, when they do cast our skinned

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Speaker 1: women's people, they cast him in these ways that make

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Speaker 1: them look aggressive, angry or you know. And it's gotten

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Speaker 1: better over the years, but it's like and he he laughed,

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Speaker 1: and he said, you know what, it's funny because they

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Speaker 1: talk negatively to men about being quote unquote light skin.

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Speaker 1: They're not looked at as manly. He was like, whereas

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Speaker 1: when people talk a dark skinned man is always presented

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Speaker 1: as a really strong character. And the game in the Jam,

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Speaker 1: remember that it was like light skins out right, or

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Speaker 1: or even New Jack City, because I always tease Christopher Woden,

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Speaker 1: you know, and about that whole you know, the the

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Speaker 1: juxtaposition between him and him and Snipes and so you know,

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Speaker 1: and we were talking about that and see my daughter, right,

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Speaker 1: and my daughter broke it down. She said, the reason

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Speaker 1: why that is, dad, is because it all goes back

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Speaker 1: to black women. She's like, light skinned black women are

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Speaker 1: considered more feminine, more so off, more beautiful, she was like,

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Speaker 1: and you know, in the world of television and media,

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Speaker 1: she was like, and so when you have a light

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Speaker 1: skinned man, his features are considered softer, more feminine. So

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Speaker 1: she was like, so this is why this happens, and

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Speaker 1: how how light skinned men get um, you know, portrayed

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Speaker 1: as being softer and being not as strong, she said.

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Speaker 1: But think about how that looks for women, she says,

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Speaker 1: So when dark skinned women are presented in media, and

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Speaker 1: she then they're they're presented as more masculine, less feminine,

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Speaker 1: she said, And this plays itself out in the real

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Speaker 1: world in a very real way. So you get dark

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Speaker 1: skinned girls who are punished more in school, you get

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Speaker 1: dark skinned girls who are considered more aggressive, you get

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Speaker 1: she said. So this is really important why we have

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Speaker 1: to be clear on the way these messages are sent

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Speaker 1: to us about our skin color. And she was like,

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Speaker 1: in media, and my husband's mind was blown. He was

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Speaker 1: just like, Oh, won't they do it those I know

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Speaker 1: one of the actresses, and she's probably excited about that.

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Speaker 1: I know, I was excited about to see her, was

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Speaker 1: Dominique fishback seeing her and uh Judas and the the

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Speaker 1: black Besidah, and that they had the love and the

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Speaker 1: respect and the banter, the intelligence. That was a really

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Speaker 1: lovely way. I mean. And and that's a girl who

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Speaker 1: looks like your girl. She looks like you and she myself,

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Speaker 1: she's beautiful. Yeah, yeah, I love that. That was that

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Speaker 1: was on point. That was the point when he was talking.

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Speaker 1: I was like, okay, yeah, I feel like she beat

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Speaker 1: but no, this is only the one of the twins.

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Speaker 1: We'll be back after the break. Let's think about this.

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Speaker 1: Most of the successful black men that you know, oh

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Speaker 1: here we go, their wives are typically light skin Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Only Denzel, Thank you, Denzel, thank you, saying well, sam

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Speaker 1: thank you, saying well, thank you, thank you, Samuel. Look,

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Speaker 1: I mean, I feel like I'm I'm a trader on

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Speaker 1: my team because I have I do. I feel like

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Speaker 1: I'm a trader on my team. I'm finding out I'm

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Speaker 1: light skinning, and I'm like, oh man, wow, I've always

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Speaker 1: had an affinity to brown skinned women. Those are the

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Speaker 1: ones that I seek out at at the party. Those

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Speaker 1: are the ones that I ended up hanging out with

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Speaker 1: that realize because I wanted to be that. So I

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Speaker 1: was you know, you know, attracted to those kinds of

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Speaker 1: friends because they were they were brown. I never considered

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Speaker 1: it until I looked at my best friend, you know, uh,

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Speaker 1: And I looked at you know, the girls that I

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Speaker 1: will hang out in high school or whatever, and I'm like, oh, snap,

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Speaker 1: you know it has been well. I mean, like I said, man,

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Speaker 1: my girlfriends, my cousins will be like, you know, they

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Speaker 1: walk in the room, ain't nobody said a word to

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Speaker 1: him like, oh, she's stuck up. So this is the

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Speaker 1: eighties and nineties when we're growing up, so you you

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Speaker 1: probably definitely internalized some of that, thinking I have a

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Speaker 1: better chance of making a friend with a girl who's

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Speaker 1: not light skinned because she's gonna think she better than me,

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Speaker 1: or she's gonna be stuck up, or she's people were

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Speaker 1: thinking Jill was thinking that she was better than them

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Speaker 1: because she was a shot sitting around like why y'all

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Speaker 1: don't like me? Exactly? I don't understand what's happening here.

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00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:45,399
Speaker 1: I don't like and you think you belt tea what

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Speaker 1: you mean? Yeah, I don't understand this. And and the

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Speaker 1: conversations that grown up has had about babies. How about

404
00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:59,720
Speaker 1: that look at the ears they don't know how doctor,

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Speaker 1: they're gonna how it donna get Yeah, but that wasn't

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Speaker 1: necessarily like yeah, not like that. It's a bad thing.

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Speaker 1: It's just like you you can see how dark you know.

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Speaker 1: Not We're not bad, it's just our obsession with it

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Speaker 1: with color. Why why is this even a conversation. Let

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Speaker 1: me tell you something. You give me a fat five

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Speaker 1: brown skinned baby, I'm done. I'm in for the day.

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Speaker 1: Allow you, sweet wonderful thing. I don't know, I haven't

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Speaker 1: offinate fix Listen. It's real, it's real. I have an

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Speaker 1: affinity to to brown skinned babies and brown skinned people.

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Speaker 1: I just do. I don't want to tell you. And

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Speaker 1: my my dude is light skinned with freckles, is he?

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Speaker 1: I know it's a shock to me too, and some

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Speaker 1: of the most I hate to say this, but you

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Speaker 1: know what about the other the other theory too, about

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Speaker 1: how light skin folks sometimes how the biggest mouth, which

421
00:25:00,760 --> 00:25:03,520
Speaker 1: is why sometimes some of our biggest I need to

422
00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:06,640
Speaker 1: throw the questionnaires in the game. Do y'all think it's

423
00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:09,280
Speaker 1: a little bit of survivor's guilt? I hate to say,

424
00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:12,080
Speaker 1: this is a little bit of the house privilege, where

425
00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:14,520
Speaker 1: you feel like you cane a little bit more empowered

426
00:25:14,560 --> 00:25:18,920
Speaker 1: than the thing. I just never thought about it, and

427
00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:23,560
Speaker 1: I never thought about my skin color. I didn't think

428
00:25:23,560 --> 00:25:25,840
Speaker 1: about it. But you've definitely seeing other people. I mean,

429
00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:28,359
Speaker 1: you're looking at the people around you thinking, I mean,

430
00:25:28,400 --> 00:25:31,679
Speaker 1: you gotta I mean, haven't thoughts about that though, like

431
00:25:31,760 --> 00:25:34,360
Speaker 1: how it played out in front of you? Though, yeah,

432
00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:37,879
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, Yes, for sure. Mostly I

433
00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:41,960
Speaker 1: thought about who was pretty and why, you know, who

434
00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:46,879
Speaker 1: was handsome and why, because even it was to me,

435
00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:49,679
Speaker 1: I wasn't. Look. I was in North Philly, and I'm like,

436
00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:53,840
Speaker 1: we all broke, we all here, we're all trying to survive.

437
00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:56,720
Speaker 1: I ain't worried about color because we're all black open here,

438
00:25:57,200 --> 00:25:58,760
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. I just didn't. It didn't

439
00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:02,200
Speaker 1: occur to me when you got in the world about

440
00:26:02,359 --> 00:26:07,240
Speaker 1: color like it is either we're black, we're black, we're

441
00:26:07,240 --> 00:26:12,240
Speaker 1: everybody here black. But I'm telling you, I noticed when

442
00:26:12,280 --> 00:26:15,480
Speaker 1: my mother worked. My mother works the secretarial pool for

443
00:26:15,560 --> 00:26:18,879
Speaker 1: many many years, like an administrative assistant. She worked in

444
00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:21,320
Speaker 1: a several law firms, and back in the eighties, y'all

445
00:26:21,400 --> 00:26:25,000
Speaker 1: remember how you know, cubicle situation and everybody big area

446
00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:27,760
Speaker 1: where the cubicles are and you know the offices are

447
00:26:27,800 --> 00:26:31,520
Speaker 1: behind it, and real a d story. You walk in

448
00:26:32,080 --> 00:26:36,439
Speaker 1: the receptionists is light skin, right first person. All of

449
00:26:36,440 --> 00:26:41,720
Speaker 1: the people whose cubicles are closest to the front, light skin,

450
00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:46,600
Speaker 1: you walk further to the back, dark skin. It's like

451
00:26:46,800 --> 00:26:49,679
Speaker 1: everywhere I turned as a kid, I saw colorism, and

452
00:26:49,760 --> 00:26:52,840
Speaker 1: even now DC it couldn't have no choice because it

453
00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:55,920
Speaker 1: was a class thing too at some point, a class thing,

454
00:26:56,119 --> 00:26:59,480
Speaker 1: a color thing. And even still you gotta figure as well,

455
00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:03,840
Speaker 1: like I'm gonna earlier, like instances of education for us

456
00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:06,960
Speaker 1: as black folks happened to the kids who were the

457
00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:10,720
Speaker 1: black children of slave masters. They were the ones that

458
00:27:10,760 --> 00:27:12,879
Speaker 1: were taught to read those they were the ones that

459
00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:14,960
Speaker 1: had that went back to what I was saying whispering

460
00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:16,919
Speaker 1: to you that I didn't never a little comfortable, I

461
00:27:16,960 --> 00:27:21,199
Speaker 1: was gonna say when we talked about revolutionaries and activists

462
00:27:21,200 --> 00:27:22,920
Speaker 1: and things of that nature, especially we talked about the

463
00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:28,120
Speaker 1: past and a lot of them, see, you know, from education, Alice,

464
00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:30,840
Speaker 1: you know you know what I'm saying. Just it seems

465
00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:34,080
Speaker 1: like would that be one of the reasons that you know,

466
00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:36,560
Speaker 1: I feel a little bit more empowered, a little bit

467
00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:40,560
Speaker 1: more free and maybe because more generational education and wealth

468
00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:45,680
Speaker 1: to access. Yeah, access, because I mean if you look

469
00:27:45,680 --> 00:27:48,159
Speaker 1: at the early colleges and stuff like that, obviously you

470
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:51,919
Speaker 1: know there's the infamous paperbag test. There's all those different

471
00:27:51,920 --> 00:27:56,280
Speaker 1: things that happened, you know amongst the educated elite blacks.

472
00:27:56,880 --> 00:27:59,159
Speaker 1: W WE DWO boys talked about it a lot. He's like,

473
00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:01,960
Speaker 1: you know, yes, around black folks it matters that I'm

474
00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:05,399
Speaker 1: light skinned, but around white folks, I'm just black, don't matter,

475
00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:09,640
Speaker 1: you know, always dealing with that, you know, that situation

476
00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:13,199
Speaker 1: in terms of y'all just started like this, this this

477
00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:16,280
Speaker 1: growing headache in my head from thinking about how hard

478
00:28:16,400 --> 00:28:21,360
Speaker 1: others have fought to keep us separated and hate ourselves.

479
00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:25,040
Speaker 1: Like this ship is ill and it's and it's it's

480
00:28:25,080 --> 00:28:28,280
Speaker 1: so contagious that it's gotten to the continent and they

481
00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:35,400
Speaker 1: are like bleaching, there's cad. I am. It is very serious.

482
00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:38,600
Speaker 1: Even sometimes when I see, like I follow a lot

483
00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:41,040
Speaker 1: of makeup pages, even though I don't do makeup. I'm

484
00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:45,040
Speaker 1: terrible at it, but I follow the pages. And eventually,

485
00:28:45,040 --> 00:28:46,840
Speaker 1: when you follow a lot of makeup pages, you'll get

486
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:49,400
Speaker 1: to some pages where it's a lot of where women

487
00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:51,880
Speaker 1: on the continent, and what you notice in terms of

488
00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:55,600
Speaker 1: the makeup style is a lot of heavy foundation. A

489
00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:59,720
Speaker 1: lot of times it's very light. Yes, it's like it's

490
00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:04,440
Speaker 1: a little which is the the whole ashy song? You know,

491
00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:08,640
Speaker 1: you can't be classy if you make up ashy. You

492
00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:16,440
Speaker 1: know that's a that's a thing. I'm come getting under

493
00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:18,680
Speaker 1: the I'm I'm on my way under the table. It's

494
00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:21,480
Speaker 1: it's a whole song. It's like big on take top,

495
00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:25,400
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. I'm sorry to choke poof

496
00:29:25,560 --> 00:29:32,080
Speaker 1: be Gone. You make them too strong? That's the lyrics

497
00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:36,520
Speaker 1: to song, Yes, be Gone make them too strong? You

498
00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:39,160
Speaker 1: make them too strong. That's the those of the lyrics.

499
00:29:39,440 --> 00:29:43,280
Speaker 1: You can't be classy if you make up ashy. Like listen,

500
00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:48,080
Speaker 1: shout out to Rihanna right now for creating colors that

501
00:29:48,280 --> 00:29:54,240
Speaker 1: actually worked with all of our skin tones. Yeah, for long,

502
00:29:55,520 --> 00:29:59,200
Speaker 1: you know, there would be that ashy color, particularly with

503
00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:02,120
Speaker 1: brown skin women. And now at this point it's like

504
00:30:02,160 --> 00:30:05,920
Speaker 1: it's a choice. You're you're you know, trying to be lighter.

505
00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:08,760
Speaker 1: I noticed when some people do my makeup that they'll

506
00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:11,760
Speaker 1: make me lighter. And I'm like no, no, no, no, no, no,

507
00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:15,480
Speaker 1: that's not what I want. Don't do that to me.

508
00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:20,160
Speaker 1: I'm not Let's talk about Instagram filters and I'm just

509
00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:23,560
Speaker 1: here to be a black woman in the ball. Okay,

510
00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:26,960
Speaker 1: I'm here for that. I didn't I don't this the

511
00:30:27,040 --> 00:30:30,200
Speaker 1: other stuff. Listen, they'll shoot me just like they shoot you.

512
00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:34,360
Speaker 1: Please believe it. But yeah, let's I've told let's talk

513
00:30:34,400 --> 00:30:38,360
Speaker 1: about filters on social media. That's a big deal. Girls,

514
00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:41,800
Speaker 1: all across black, white, whatever, they will use a filter,

515
00:30:42,760 --> 00:30:45,440
Speaker 1: do you know. I'm guilty, but we all have used

516
00:30:45,440 --> 00:30:48,880
Speaker 1: a filter. But let's discuss how that filter immediately makes

517
00:30:48,920 --> 00:30:51,440
Speaker 1: you lighter. You're about to make me open my ship.

518
00:30:51,480 --> 00:30:57,120
Speaker 1: I'm like those filters. Yes, those filters make you lighter.

519
00:30:57,400 --> 00:30:59,200
Speaker 1: I don't want to be lighter. I don't know what

520
00:30:59,280 --> 00:31:02,800
Speaker 1: she's talking about. Hold on, lord, I gotta. I don't

521
00:31:02,920 --> 00:31:04,880
Speaker 1: mean you just to teach me about the filters on

522
00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:08,280
Speaker 1: the things. Okay, Well, maybe it just it provides a

523
00:31:08,320 --> 00:31:11,440
Speaker 1: glow on the cheekbones and the t zone, you know,

524
00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:17,840
Speaker 1: So that with me, filters on Instagram, Instagram, on Snapchat

525
00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:20,640
Speaker 1: and all that, when they put on you can feel,

526
00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:24,960
Speaker 1: you can feel right here, and you can feelter a

527
00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:27,680
Speaker 1: picture on your regular phone. That's that's an option. If

528
00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:29,680
Speaker 1: you take a photo, you can alter the phone me

529
00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:34,280
Speaker 1: after you take a photo. Yeah, like video, and I

530
00:31:34,320 --> 00:31:38,040
Speaker 1: don't here, I don't know how well. I'm not trying to.

531
00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:41,440
Speaker 1: I'm just I'm not trying to look lighter. Listen. I

532
00:31:41,560 --> 00:31:45,400
Speaker 1: had such appreciation, such an appreciation for my grandmother in

533
00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:47,760
Speaker 1: her skin tone. I thought that was the prettiest thing

534
00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:51,320
Speaker 1: I ever saw in my life every day, every day,

535
00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:53,520
Speaker 1: and I didn't want to. I didn't think outside that

536
00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:56,600
Speaker 1: I could be anything other than what she was period.

537
00:31:57,480 --> 00:32:01,160
Speaker 1: And then you know, I knew for me to like

538
00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:05,320
Speaker 1: it irked me when somebody at school, like when I

539
00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:07,840
Speaker 1: was a kids, when somebody in school did not see

540
00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:11,040
Speaker 1: the brown skin beautiful girl, when they didn't see her,

541
00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:15,760
Speaker 1: that irked me. I'm like that that's pretty, but automatically,

542
00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:17,760
Speaker 1: if you were light skinned with long hair, you were

543
00:32:17,800 --> 00:32:21,080
Speaker 1: already you know, you were beautiful, just automatically. And I

544
00:32:21,080 --> 00:32:26,040
Speaker 1: was like, not so much, yeah much, not so much.

545
00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:29,760
Speaker 1: You know, I don't see it, but that I could see.

546
00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:32,600
Speaker 1: I could always see brown. So you never played with

547
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:36,080
Speaker 1: the towel on your head. You know, it was a shirt.

548
00:32:36,680 --> 00:32:42,200
Speaker 1: It's a shirt, mom, was a shirt, yeah, mom, shirt, Mom, yeah,

549
00:32:42,840 --> 00:32:45,760
Speaker 1: cross in the fan, Yeah I was. I was Susie

550
00:32:45,800 --> 00:32:48,960
Speaker 1: from Soul trained um with her, the lady with the

551
00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:53,000
Speaker 1: long long hair, Yeah, the Asian lady with Sometimes I

552
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:55,040
Speaker 1: would put like a little a little scrunch you on

553
00:32:55,080 --> 00:33:02,440
Speaker 1: it too, fancy scrunchy design, because being a black girl

554
00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:07,000
Speaker 1: is vicious. It is a hard situation to be a

555
00:33:07,040 --> 00:33:10,080
Speaker 1: black girl and to look at your skin and your

556
00:33:10,120 --> 00:33:13,840
Speaker 1: hair and actually in your gut and your conscious and

557
00:33:13,880 --> 00:33:16,840
Speaker 1: your subconscious feel that it is beautiful and it is

558
00:33:16,880 --> 00:33:20,120
Speaker 1: the most beautiful and and I just can't sit here

559
00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:22,840
Speaker 1: and pretend that, even though things have gotten better, that

560
00:33:22,840 --> 00:33:24,880
Speaker 1: that wasn't a huge part of my growing up. It

561
00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:29,080
Speaker 1: just was. My mother said, I don't know, did you

562
00:33:29,120 --> 00:33:31,200
Speaker 1: get the I ain't buying you know, white dolls. Oh no,

563
00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:33,160
Speaker 1: we weren't allowed to have like we were not allowed.

564
00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:37,520
Speaker 1: I was not allowed to have white dogs. Yeah we know.

565
00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:40,920
Speaker 1: My barbie wasn't black. I had a Barbie. Oh no,

566
00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:43,120
Speaker 1: the my child, my cabbage passed dolls. I mean I

567
00:33:43,120 --> 00:33:46,760
Speaker 1: had dark skin, and cabbage passed dogs to me too.

568
00:33:46,880 --> 00:33:53,840
Speaker 1: My mother was bad. What I told you. I borrowed

569
00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:57,680
Speaker 1: my girlfriend's cabbage friends down all the babysit and take

570
00:33:57,760 --> 00:34:02,560
Speaker 1: it back. She had a carriage and everything. It was great,

571
00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:06,720
Speaker 1: it was it was enough for me. I didn't have

572
00:34:06,800 --> 00:34:10,520
Speaker 1: the cabbage patch am. I just had. I just had

573
00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:13,839
Speaker 1: and some clothes, clothes, you know, I needed. I needed

574
00:34:13,880 --> 00:34:21,000
Speaker 1: clothes for me. It's why what? And I enjoyed my

575
00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:23,760
Speaker 1: life And now you can buy the Cabbage Patch Company

576
00:34:23,880 --> 00:34:26,279
Speaker 1: if I want to, if I want to, if I

577
00:34:26,320 --> 00:34:29,319
Speaker 1: want to. Growing in the guard and sorry, I just

578
00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:35,520
Speaker 1: thought about the sock. It was rough. I strove, if

579
00:34:35,560 --> 00:34:38,799
Speaker 1: that's the right word. I just never wanted to be

580
00:34:39,120 --> 00:34:44,440
Speaker 1: one of those girls. They urged my soul were getting

581
00:34:44,480 --> 00:34:47,080
Speaker 1: to it. They I never wanted to beat that. They

582
00:34:47,160 --> 00:34:52,360
Speaker 1: bothered me so round, thinking that you're so cute because

583
00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:56,080
Speaker 1: you light skinned with hair. That just urged me, like

584
00:34:56,800 --> 00:35:00,000
Speaker 1: are you funny? Are you cool? Do you have a personality?

585
00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:03,160
Speaker 1: The do you know? What are you into? You know,

586
00:35:03,239 --> 00:35:05,480
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, you know, this girl walks in

587
00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:11,200
Speaker 1: and everybody's like, oh she she So the anxiety being

588
00:35:11,320 --> 00:35:15,479
Speaker 1: viewed that way, yes, the anxiety you felt from being

589
00:35:15,560 --> 00:35:18,640
Speaker 1: viewed as a light skam girl and how people thought

590
00:35:18,680 --> 00:35:21,720
Speaker 1: that that what that meant made you go so hard

591
00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:27,080
Speaker 1: in the opposite direction that girl. But wait, so I

592
00:35:27,080 --> 00:35:29,120
Speaker 1: gotta even deeper question because I know Jill. A lot

593
00:35:29,120 --> 00:35:31,920
Speaker 1: of times people confuse this video girl for you, and

594
00:35:32,080 --> 00:35:34,120
Speaker 1: she that's who she is, That is the perception of her.

595
00:35:34,160 --> 00:35:35,920
Speaker 1: Is that why you get mad when people ask are

596
00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:38,200
Speaker 1: you the girl in the Glamorous Life video? Because the

597
00:35:38,719 --> 00:35:40,560
Speaker 1: way that she's prose in the video, she is the

598
00:35:40,640 --> 00:35:42,480
Speaker 1: light skinned girl that don't want to talk to nobody,

599
00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:45,000
Speaker 1: and she stuck up into I'm sorry, I just went

600
00:35:45,040 --> 00:35:46,919
Speaker 1: real deep, but I was just cious, well that that's

601
00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:51,120
Speaker 1: a character that you know, I don't I don't care for. Yeah, okay,

602
00:35:51,239 --> 00:35:54,239
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get it. I know I asked, But I've

603
00:35:54,280 --> 00:35:57,319
Speaker 1: always been in that, you know what I mean. So

604
00:35:57,400 --> 00:36:01,120
Speaker 1: there's times when like even Hazel Rochelle is I don't

605
00:36:01,120 --> 00:36:03,919
Speaker 1: know if it's because she's life, you know, because she's

606
00:36:03,960 --> 00:36:07,920
Speaker 1: you know, a singer or successful or whatever. You know,

607
00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:11,839
Speaker 1: she's got an air about her that irks me. But nonetheless,

608
00:36:11,960 --> 00:36:15,120
Speaker 1: that's that's not my job played your character. It's my

609
00:36:15,200 --> 00:36:18,719
Speaker 1: job to play the character, you know. So yeah, even that,

610
00:36:18,960 --> 00:36:22,680
Speaker 1: like I just never on a new platform. I'm just

611
00:36:22,680 --> 00:36:25,400
Speaker 1: saying I just wanted to shout that out was another platform,

612
00:36:25,600 --> 00:36:28,120
Speaker 1: you very much, and we just got picked up for

613
00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:35,839
Speaker 1: a third season. Yes, I mean yeah on two TV shows.

614
00:36:35,560 --> 00:36:41,640
Speaker 1: That a time girl that way. She works hard for

615
00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:44,000
Speaker 1: her money, so you've got to treat her right. Come

616
00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:48,520
Speaker 1: more on, somebody, Lord, let me manifest multiple streams of income. Listen,

617
00:36:48,920 --> 00:36:52,560
Speaker 1: come on, come on, Lord. We come to you as

618
00:36:52,640 --> 00:36:56,080
Speaker 1: humbly as we know how, and we asked that you

619
00:36:56,239 --> 00:36:59,279
Speaker 1: put multiple streams of income into the pockets. So these

620
00:36:59,320 --> 00:37:02,400
Speaker 1: here black in man, just because we like skin, not

621
00:37:02,560 --> 00:37:06,080
Speaker 1: just because not just because we like skin? Can we

622
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:10,920
Speaker 1: get it for the brown and the browner and the brown?

623
00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:16,680
Speaker 1: I will play an angel or devil. Lord, thank you

624
00:37:17,840 --> 00:37:23,960
Speaker 1: to the table. I quit you all day. You can't

625
00:37:24,120 --> 00:37:32,880
Speaker 1: quick you can you can't quit me. I'm I'm in here.

626
00:37:33,960 --> 00:37:36,879
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, we're twenty years and a't ain't nobody going nowhere.

627
00:37:36,880 --> 00:37:43,719
Speaker 1: Were twenty nowhere. I ain't going nowhere. We're gonna take

628
00:37:43,719 --> 00:37:56,200
Speaker 1: a quick break and then we'll be right back. Oh

629
00:37:56,239 --> 00:37:58,640
Speaker 1: my god, I really feel like you just figured me out.

630
00:37:59,440 --> 00:38:02,239
Speaker 1: Do you figured that I never really put together like

631
00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:07,240
Speaker 1: your business animosity? Because I don't. I never wanted somebody

632
00:38:07,280 --> 00:38:10,920
Speaker 1: to judge me based on what they thought you know,

633
00:38:11,080 --> 00:38:14,920
Speaker 1: I don't like that. I don't like boxes. I hate them.

634
00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:19,000
Speaker 1: I hate them. See if you want to sometimes a

635
00:38:19,120 --> 00:38:21,799
Speaker 1: motherfucker if I have to be you know what I'm saying, Like,

636
00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:25,200
Speaker 1: there's differ I think that's all three of us, don't

637
00:38:25,200 --> 00:38:28,160
Speaker 1: We don't want to like like that box. Because that's the

638
00:38:28,320 --> 00:38:34,240
Speaker 1: thing that's the problem with colorism. It's boxes. You're automatically

639
00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:36,680
Speaker 1: this or that. If you're if you have if you're

640
00:38:36,840 --> 00:38:40,080
Speaker 1: a brown skin girl with natural hair, you automatically smell

641
00:38:40,200 --> 00:38:43,239
Speaker 1: like shade butter. You might not use that. You might

642
00:38:43,360 --> 00:38:49,600
Speaker 1: use something completely different, you might not. Yeah, but let

643
00:38:49,600 --> 00:38:52,400
Speaker 1: me just say that all being a sister who was

644
00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:54,560
Speaker 1: a little in the middle a cormel if you will,

645
00:38:55,960 --> 00:38:58,400
Speaker 1: that's when it all boils down to. That's what all

646
00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:00,759
Speaker 1: boils down to. The hair. See, that's what you can't

647
00:39:00,760 --> 00:39:02,920
Speaker 1: talk about colorism. What iout talking about the hair because

648
00:39:02,920 --> 00:39:05,960
Speaker 1: you said something right there. Because for me, if I

649
00:39:06,000 --> 00:39:11,560
Speaker 1: wear my hair natural, it's hay queen. You know what

650
00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:14,399
Speaker 1: I mean. You wear your hair straight. You don't get that.

651
00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:18,080
Speaker 1: But let me say this, and and and the conversation

652
00:39:18,120 --> 00:39:19,920
Speaker 1: of the day, A lot of conversation of the day

653
00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:25,040
Speaker 1: is about respectability and we're talking about colorism. But like

654
00:39:25,080 --> 00:39:28,600
Speaker 1: I said, if we extended into stuff like hair in aesthetics, right,

655
00:39:29,080 --> 00:39:31,960
Speaker 1: you started talking about that, that whole idea of you know,

656
00:39:32,000 --> 00:39:35,160
Speaker 1: what is professional, what looks a certain way? And if

657
00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:38,680
Speaker 1: you associate straight curly hair with light skin right at

658
00:39:38,719 --> 00:39:42,480
Speaker 1: some point, but now anybody can have that look, so

659
00:39:42,800 --> 00:39:45,520
Speaker 1: it may not be light skin, but it comes from

660
00:39:45,560 --> 00:39:47,719
Speaker 1: those thinking that thinking of what is you know, what

661
00:39:47,880 --> 00:39:50,720
Speaker 1: is adjacent to white and what that and that being

662
00:39:51,280 --> 00:39:54,120
Speaker 1: you know, more acceptable, that being more beautiful, that being

663
00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:57,840
Speaker 1: beautiful natural wig even though you have your own natural

664
00:39:57,880 --> 00:40:00,680
Speaker 1: foresty going on under here, but you like, I don't

665
00:40:00,680 --> 00:40:08,839
Speaker 1: know if that's gonna be acceptable to see you, right,

666
00:40:09,239 --> 00:40:11,040
Speaker 1: to make it a little bit more acceptable, a little

667
00:40:11,080 --> 00:40:17,200
Speaker 1: bit more quote unquote approachable, more beautiful, and just it

668
00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:21,200
Speaker 1: the hair situation, I think we can't fairly talk about

669
00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:23,360
Speaker 1: this and unless we talk about the hair part too,

670
00:40:23,840 --> 00:40:27,279
Speaker 1: And like I said, the respectability aspect and what is

671
00:40:27,320 --> 00:40:31,000
Speaker 1: the more palatable version of the black woman that people

672
00:40:31,080 --> 00:40:35,840
Speaker 1: can you know, that they feel is representing and doing

673
00:40:35,880 --> 00:40:37,759
Speaker 1: the right thing and being the type of black women

674
00:40:37,840 --> 00:40:40,759
Speaker 1: that we want other people to perceive black women as.

675
00:40:41,200 --> 00:40:43,239
Speaker 1: Because that's where it comes that's where the colorism thing

676
00:40:43,280 --> 00:40:45,480
Speaker 1: came in with my mom's job. It's like, oh, the

677
00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:48,600
Speaker 1: most palatable black woman for us is this light skin

678
00:40:48,640 --> 00:40:51,399
Speaker 1: when we're gonna put her in the front, so it'll

679
00:40:51,440 --> 00:40:54,240
Speaker 1: be really careful about that. It may not be known,

680
00:40:54,760 --> 00:40:59,600
Speaker 1: but at Jet Magazine, Ebony and Jet, there were no

681
00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:03,920
Speaker 1: brown skinned women in the building. Well his wife and

682
00:41:05,080 --> 00:41:08,080
Speaker 1: in the building the well, if they were there, they

683
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:10,400
Speaker 1: were cooking. No, I wasn't saying. I was saying that

684
00:41:10,440 --> 00:41:19,080
Speaker 1: he when I visited Ebony and Jet that the headquarters

685
00:41:19,120 --> 00:41:21,160
Speaker 1: in Chicago, I think it's gone and they are dark

686
00:41:21,200 --> 00:41:23,120
Speaker 1: in the kitchen. No, Jill, you find it's it's interesting

687
00:41:23,160 --> 00:41:24,719
Speaker 1: that you said, because I visited too, and they are

688
00:41:25,080 --> 00:41:27,359
Speaker 1: it was. It was no brown skinned women at all.

689
00:41:27,640 --> 00:41:30,799
Speaker 1: And I remember saying that to Mr Johnson, like, you know,

690
00:41:31,040 --> 00:41:34,080
Speaker 1: it's it's so nice to be here. Is there. We

691
00:41:34,080 --> 00:41:36,799
Speaker 1: we took the whole tour of the entire building. I

692
00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:40,560
Speaker 1: was like, there, it's beautiful brown skin women. You say that,

693
00:41:40,880 --> 00:41:45,120
Speaker 1: I did what he saying. He was like, yeah, but

694
00:41:45,280 --> 00:41:47,880
Speaker 1: I didn't see them in the fashion fare room. And

695
00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:50,480
Speaker 1: then I asked the sister and I was like, are

696
00:41:50,520 --> 00:41:54,560
Speaker 1: there any brown scanned women? She said, no, oh, they

697
00:41:54,160 --> 00:41:59,200
Speaker 1: that white supremacy show. I just man, it is a

698
00:41:59,239 --> 00:42:03,879
Speaker 1: powerful dry I mean, and can I say Angel that

699
00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:05,960
Speaker 1: that term has been used a lot more lately. I

700
00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:09,160
Speaker 1: mean in our news, in my real house, Real Housewives

701
00:42:09,160 --> 00:42:12,200
Speaker 1: of Beverly. No, I'm sorry of New York. Shout out

702
00:42:12,239 --> 00:42:18,040
Speaker 1: to Ebony Kay Williams. We're starting to understand the granddaddy

703
00:42:18,040 --> 00:42:20,719
Speaker 1: of it all. But think about it when we get

704
00:42:20,800 --> 00:42:25,360
Speaker 1: dressed up to go somewhere, and I am absolutely wholeheartedly

705
00:42:25,360 --> 00:42:28,640
Speaker 1: guilty of this. There is a wig involved, you know,

706
00:42:28,680 --> 00:42:31,440
Speaker 1: there is some kind of hair involved, whether it is

707
00:42:31,760 --> 00:42:37,000
Speaker 1: you know, I prefer to have some braids or you know,

708
00:42:37,160 --> 00:42:40,359
Speaker 1: some some bolocks or not even those, but you know,

709
00:42:40,920 --> 00:42:43,200
Speaker 1: there's so many different kinds of braids. I prefer that

710
00:42:43,360 --> 00:42:46,840
Speaker 1: to have that. But I also enjoy, you know, wearing

711
00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:52,239
Speaker 1: my wigs too. Now the gag that I cannot do

712
00:42:52,280 --> 00:42:55,560
Speaker 1: a straight wig, I can't do. I can't. It has

713
00:42:55,600 --> 00:42:59,120
Speaker 1: to look like black girl hair. Now, I've seen that

714
00:42:59,120 --> 00:43:00,480
Speaker 1: that's not saying in the nation, and why I wanted

715
00:43:00,480 --> 00:43:02,359
Speaker 1: to appreciate it. It It was like a nice little kink

716
00:43:02,360 --> 00:43:05,000
Speaker 1: in the curl. It has to be, you know, whether

717
00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:08,399
Speaker 1: and I got a lot of flak for that. They

718
00:43:08,400 --> 00:43:11,160
Speaker 1: were like, why you got up? Oh yeah, why she

719
00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:13,520
Speaker 1: got on that hat, you know, which is what I

720
00:43:13,560 --> 00:43:16,920
Speaker 1: call wigs anyway, hairts because it ain't my hair. It's

721
00:43:16,960 --> 00:43:20,920
Speaker 1: a hat for my purpose, you know. In The Winner,

722
00:43:21,040 --> 00:43:24,720
Speaker 1: I wear a scullet. You know what I'm saying. Decision

723
00:43:24,760 --> 00:43:27,080
Speaker 1: What was the decision process though, Jill and wearing the

724
00:43:27,120 --> 00:43:29,719
Speaker 1: wig versus your real hair, like your hair, and like,

725
00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:33,640
Speaker 1: what was the why? I'm just curious. Up number one,

726
00:43:34,440 --> 00:43:37,120
Speaker 1: I got a lot of damage in my hair from

727
00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:39,399
Speaker 1: the other TV show that I was shooting. We did

728
00:43:39,400 --> 00:43:42,440
Speaker 1: a lot of cooling back, a lot of pulling back

729
00:43:42,960 --> 00:43:45,000
Speaker 1: because I didn't want heat in my hair, so we

730
00:43:45,080 --> 00:43:48,480
Speaker 1: pulled her. And by the time I got to Nationwide,

731
00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:51,319
Speaker 1: I was like, I don't know, I don't, I don't,

732
00:43:51,440 --> 00:43:53,920
Speaker 1: I don't, can't pull nothing else back. I'm trying to

733
00:43:53,920 --> 00:43:57,960
Speaker 1: hold on the Mommy said just right, yeah, yeah, we're not.

734
00:43:58,000 --> 00:44:01,799
Speaker 1: We're not gonna do this. In site, I probably would

735
00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:05,200
Speaker 1: award different one, but you know, it was what it

736
00:44:05,280 --> 00:44:08,400
Speaker 1: was at the time, and I liked it, and honestly,

737
00:44:08,440 --> 00:44:11,400
Speaker 1: it kind of reminded me. Damn, it reminded me of

738
00:44:12,000 --> 00:44:20,799
Speaker 1: Blair from that's what Blair actually didn't have some good

739
00:44:21,360 --> 00:44:28,120
Speaker 1: reminded me of, you know, I mean, like a good style,

740
00:44:28,239 --> 00:44:31,120
Speaker 1: like she had that bouncy that thing was. It was

741
00:44:32,719 --> 00:44:35,799
Speaker 1: a lot of hair, you know, and that's all the

742
00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:37,839
Speaker 1: Facts of Life girls. Yeah, she was the one. Yeah,

743
00:44:37,880 --> 00:44:40,560
Speaker 1: she had you know, I could easily say, oh no,

744
00:44:40,719 --> 00:44:43,600
Speaker 1: Natalie's hair was always popping to please believe it, y'all

745
00:44:43,600 --> 00:44:49,480
Speaker 1: just did. We didn't talk about it. Natalie always whoever

746
00:44:49,560 --> 00:44:52,399
Speaker 1: was the stylist on that show. Actually, let's just talk

747
00:44:52,440 --> 00:44:56,799
Speaker 1: about it because even to whose hair was always looking good.

748
00:44:57,120 --> 00:44:59,800
Speaker 1: But yeah, whoever was doing hair on the Facts of

749
00:45:00,239 --> 00:45:03,480
Speaker 1: really had their life together. The garret ship was always tight.

750
00:45:03,840 --> 00:45:07,279
Speaker 1: Everybody was tight. Everybody was tight on that show, everybody.

751
00:45:07,560 --> 00:45:09,560
Speaker 1: I think the thing about wigs is wigs don't bother

752
00:45:09,600 --> 00:45:11,480
Speaker 1: me in terms of Black women, Like, whatever we decide

753
00:45:11,520 --> 00:45:13,759
Speaker 1: to do with our hair, I'm just talking about our

754
00:45:13,760 --> 00:45:17,080
Speaker 1: politics about hair, like just you know, obviously black women

755
00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:19,960
Speaker 1: can do whatever they want. But it's like, even down

756
00:45:19,960 --> 00:45:22,920
Speaker 1: to the edges conversation, it's just like taming your edges

757
00:45:23,239 --> 00:45:25,920
Speaker 1: because that even that has come up recently. It's like,

758
00:45:26,120 --> 00:45:30,520
Speaker 1: why does everybody's edges have to be tamed. Tell you

759
00:45:30,560 --> 00:45:32,680
Speaker 1: don't understand my way to have it. My edges are

760
00:45:32,760 --> 00:45:38,960
Speaker 1: not tamed wild because a black, a black woman angel

761
00:45:39,000 --> 00:45:42,960
Speaker 1: should not have tamed edges, and he doesn't. My life,

762
00:45:43,080 --> 00:45:45,239
Speaker 1: it's been a it's been a struggle from having boyfriends

763
00:45:45,239 --> 00:45:47,719
Speaker 1: to suggest, like you you're gonna wy, don't you just

764
00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:49,759
Speaker 1: carry a brush, which I've had. I've had at least

765
00:45:49,800 --> 00:45:52,400
Speaker 1: two boyfriends suggest that I carry a brush with me,

766
00:45:53,080 --> 00:45:56,600
Speaker 1: and but so yeah, and so for us who can't,

767
00:45:56,600 --> 00:46:01,040
Speaker 1: because yeah, because I can do, that's jail and that's cool.

768
00:46:01,040 --> 00:46:04,120
Speaker 1: But if you sweat should change. And so sometimes I

769
00:46:04,160 --> 00:46:05,680
Speaker 1: just don't feel like going through the motion. That's an

770
00:46:05,680 --> 00:46:11,680
Speaker 1: extra ten minutes or you're getting ready, and I just

771
00:46:11,719 --> 00:46:14,680
Speaker 1: got a full on headache from that memory. I'm sorry.

772
00:46:14,920 --> 00:46:17,960
Speaker 1: It's no, No, it's okay, because somebody is getting the

773
00:46:18,080 --> 00:46:22,960
Speaker 1: as swift retrospectively. And but it's a big The edge

774
00:46:23,000 --> 00:46:25,200
Speaker 1: thing is a big deal, and especially now that girls

775
00:46:25,239 --> 00:46:27,600
Speaker 1: can really play it down like there's some edge and

776
00:46:27,719 --> 00:46:30,920
Speaker 1: B and I say this to the stylist that I

777
00:46:31,040 --> 00:46:34,080
Speaker 1: work with, hair stylists that I work with for for film,

778
00:46:34,320 --> 00:46:39,000
Speaker 1: like I I don't want baby here. There ain't no

779
00:46:39,080 --> 00:46:42,880
Speaker 1: baby here on my whole body. I'm a grown ass woman.

780
00:46:44,520 --> 00:46:47,880
Speaker 1: I got grown here. I don't have baby here, and

781
00:46:47,880 --> 00:46:50,040
Speaker 1: I'll be trying to make those curls. It's so hard.

782
00:46:50,080 --> 00:46:55,239
Speaker 1: It's a squirrels. Is a fight, it still is a

783
00:46:55,320 --> 00:47:03,560
Speaker 1: fight for all of us to be our authentic selves. Now,

784
00:47:03,640 --> 00:47:08,160
Speaker 1: mind you, everybody adds some akoul tramon to their beauty

785
00:47:08,360 --> 00:47:13,280
Speaker 1: because the beauty is still defined by what men like. Still,

786
00:47:14,280 --> 00:47:17,200
Speaker 1: but what white men like, particularly because black men don't

787
00:47:17,200 --> 00:47:20,120
Speaker 1: even know that they are. Your eyes are white men's eyes.

788
00:47:20,600 --> 00:47:23,120
Speaker 1: Like that's the partner sucked me up. It's like, carry

789
00:47:23,160 --> 00:47:25,839
Speaker 1: a brush. I'll beat you with this brush. I'll beat

790
00:47:25,880 --> 00:47:28,600
Speaker 1: you with the brush. How about I'll carry the brush

791
00:47:28,680 --> 00:47:31,279
Speaker 1: to beat you with it? How about that? How about?

792
00:47:31,320 --> 00:47:34,600
Speaker 1: Do you like me or not? Do you like me?

793
00:47:35,080 --> 00:47:37,920
Speaker 1: Do you like your mama? Is the question? Do you like?

794
00:47:38,680 --> 00:47:42,040
Speaker 1: Maybe maybe their mama was, you know, permed and you know,

795
00:47:42,680 --> 00:47:46,960
Speaker 1: getting her hair fried every Sunday. You know, it's just

796
00:47:47,080 --> 00:47:54,200
Speaker 1: about the rest of your We're carrying the stuff from

797
00:47:54,520 --> 00:47:58,680
Speaker 1: the fifties and the forties and the sixties and the seventies.

798
00:47:59,360 --> 00:48:02,000
Speaker 1: We're still we're still carrying this stuff and that we

799
00:48:02,120 --> 00:48:06,200
Speaker 1: didn't start really wearing our hair until the seventies. That's

800
00:48:06,320 --> 00:48:09,760
Speaker 1: that's something, you know, that's somebody's lifetime. And then everything

801
00:48:09,840 --> 00:48:14,879
Speaker 1: about they were scorned. You know, these rebels, these these

802
00:48:15,000 --> 00:48:18,360
Speaker 1: revolutionary saying it in such a negative way. You know,

803
00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:22,480
Speaker 1: we're still we're still fighting to wear our hair to

804
00:48:22,560 --> 00:48:27,759
Speaker 1: work girl. And then there's clearly there's the internal fight.

805
00:48:28,840 --> 00:48:32,960
Speaker 1: That's the fight because I'm I've just been in therapy.

806
00:48:33,160 --> 00:48:35,799
Speaker 1: My god, I don't think it's not about myself. Thank

807
00:48:35,840 --> 00:48:37,960
Speaker 1: you so much. Friends. I just had to tell my

808
00:48:38,040 --> 00:48:39,520
Speaker 1: girlfriend the other day who was scared to take her

809
00:48:39,560 --> 00:48:41,160
Speaker 1: braids out because she got to be seen on her

810
00:48:41,239 --> 00:48:43,880
Speaker 1: zoom and like her real I was like, what do

811
00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:45,440
Speaker 1: you We can't do. We can't be thinking about them

812
00:48:45,520 --> 00:48:48,400
Speaker 1: like that. No more. Like I think about it sometimes

813
00:48:48,440 --> 00:48:51,040
Speaker 1: when I'm watching the makeup tutorials and I see girls

814
00:48:51,160 --> 00:48:58,120
Speaker 1: contour so hard that nose down, that comment is just

815
00:48:58,320 --> 00:49:03,120
Speaker 1: like wow, it's just so many little things that we

816
00:49:03,239 --> 00:49:10,080
Speaker 1: do that kind of keep driving home you're not. Your

817
00:49:10,120 --> 00:49:12,840
Speaker 1: beauty is not. Everybody else is trying to be like

818
00:49:13,040 --> 00:49:15,759
Speaker 1: us all the while. It's crazy. It's like we're trying

819
00:49:15,800 --> 00:49:17,000
Speaker 1: not to be like us, and they're trying to be

820
00:49:17,120 --> 00:49:21,320
Speaker 1: like us, what, Yeah, it's it's a rough one. I

821
00:49:21,440 --> 00:49:24,320
Speaker 1: didn't really give myself a bridge because I don't have

822
00:49:24,480 --> 00:49:26,360
Speaker 1: no bridge. I just got a little I don't know

823
00:49:26,480 --> 00:49:30,480
Speaker 1: what this thing is on my face. You know. They

824
00:49:30,600 --> 00:49:34,160
Speaker 1: used to ask me in elementary school. They used to

825
00:49:34,280 --> 00:49:38,799
Speaker 1: ask me how did I breathe? Because it's that flat

826
00:49:38,920 --> 00:49:42,960
Speaker 1: right here between your little so they'd be like, how

827
00:49:43,120 --> 00:49:49,080
Speaker 1: you how you breathe? As I said, I'm congested right now. Yah, Well,

828
00:49:49,160 --> 00:49:51,360
Speaker 1: I got the opposite. I got my daddy's nose. I

829
00:49:51,400 --> 00:49:55,160
Speaker 1: have a giant nose, and my nostrils are always flaring,

830
00:49:55,320 --> 00:50:00,320
Speaker 1: and so I've always been so for me, the giant

831
00:50:01,120 --> 00:50:03,400
Speaker 1: you're talking, I don't see that. I'm seeing the flare.

832
00:50:03,480 --> 00:50:05,279
Speaker 1: Before that she said that, I was like, I might

833
00:50:05,320 --> 00:50:08,200
Speaker 1: have seen the flare, but that's okay. We must accept

834
00:50:08,239 --> 00:50:11,240
Speaker 1: from your nose to caress one's nose. It's all beautiful.

835
00:50:11,280 --> 00:50:15,239
Speaker 1: It's beautiful, I mean, but we just don't, like I said,

836
00:50:15,280 --> 00:50:17,439
Speaker 1: it's just a little ways. I used to the internalized

837
00:50:17,480 --> 00:50:20,600
Speaker 1: fight about the way, about the way that we look

838
00:50:20,640 --> 00:50:24,840
Speaker 1: at our obsession with that, about our complexions, about our features,

839
00:50:24,960 --> 00:50:29,240
Speaker 1: about our hair, and it's there's a constant fight with everything.

840
00:50:29,360 --> 00:50:32,839
Speaker 1: And so to me, again, if we don't really look

841
00:50:32,920 --> 00:50:34,960
Speaker 1: at that and pay attention to it, then we don't

842
00:50:34,960 --> 00:50:37,759
Speaker 1: realize is how much we heavily police ourselves as black women.

843
00:50:37,800 --> 00:50:40,000
Speaker 1: Before you even think about how we're thinking or what

844
00:50:40,160 --> 00:50:44,600
Speaker 1: we do. We're policing the way we look. We're policing eggs,

845
00:50:44,960 --> 00:50:48,080
Speaker 1: you know, just just how we present in the room,

846
00:50:48,680 --> 00:50:51,279
Speaker 1: from the from the hair to the features to want

847
00:50:51,320 --> 00:50:53,560
Speaker 1: to make sure we're heard and not just looked at.

848
00:50:53,600 --> 00:50:55,520
Speaker 1: That's right, It's like we're trying to be heard. I

849
00:50:55,560 --> 00:50:57,960
Speaker 1: don't want to be distracted because you don't know what

850
00:50:58,080 --> 00:51:00,359
Speaker 1: this is and you want to touch this, and uh,

851
00:51:01,400 --> 00:51:06,040
Speaker 1: it's just like the it amazes me what, you know,

852
00:51:07,040 --> 00:51:11,839
Speaker 1: how much we have to think about every single thing

853
00:51:12,360 --> 00:51:15,880
Speaker 1: and how we're being watched all of the time, critiqued

854
00:51:16,360 --> 00:51:19,360
Speaker 1: all of the time. There is this little meme on

855
00:51:19,480 --> 00:51:24,120
Speaker 1: TikTok that was going around and the sound said black

856
00:51:24,200 --> 00:51:28,000
Speaker 1: people are never lonely because there's always a white person

857
00:51:28,040 --> 00:51:31,040
Speaker 1: all up in our business. And it's like and what

858
00:51:31,200 --> 00:51:34,200
Speaker 1: it did was show black people chilling doing nothing and

859
00:51:34,360 --> 00:51:37,280
Speaker 1: then focusing on a white person somewhere in the background

860
00:51:37,480 --> 00:51:42,319
Speaker 1: staring at them. And it's the funniest thing. But it's

861
00:51:42,440 --> 00:51:47,279
Speaker 1: like profound because that it makes you think about that

862
00:51:47,480 --> 00:51:52,279
Speaker 1: term the white gaze and how we are obsessed with

863
00:51:52,400 --> 00:52:02,200
Speaker 1: the white gaze, Honie, that white gaze, baby, baby, and

864
00:52:02,280 --> 00:52:04,120
Speaker 1: you got to be pushing back at that on a

865
00:52:04,239 --> 00:52:09,960
Speaker 1: consistent basis, on a consistent basis. It's one thing we

866
00:52:10,080 --> 00:52:14,920
Speaker 1: did not always go win. You're always you're not. You're not.

867
00:52:15,520 --> 00:52:19,479
Speaker 1: You're not you're not because you've been You've been living

868
00:52:19,560 --> 00:52:23,439
Speaker 1: with it and perpetuating it longer than you've been pushing back. Yeah,

869
00:52:24,320 --> 00:52:28,160
Speaker 1: you know, so you're better at perpetuating it than you

870
00:52:28,280 --> 00:52:32,719
Speaker 1: are at not so pushing. So so that thing. You've

871
00:52:32,719 --> 00:52:34,440
Speaker 1: been living with that thing a long time, and it's

872
00:52:34,480 --> 00:52:39,840
Speaker 1: generational in the past. Now listen, I remember perming my

873
00:52:40,000 --> 00:52:43,239
Speaker 1: hair because I had I had purmed my hair for

874
00:52:43,360 --> 00:52:45,480
Speaker 1: the most part of my life because my hair my

875
00:52:45,560 --> 00:52:49,320
Speaker 1: cousin was a hairstylist, and you know, when she was

876
00:52:49,760 --> 00:52:52,680
Speaker 1: in school, I was a guinea pig, so I had

877
00:52:52,719 --> 00:52:54,719
Speaker 1: all the styles. I had to jerry girl, I had

878
00:52:54,760 --> 00:52:59,759
Speaker 1: to snap back, I had, I had the lop sided diagonal,

879
00:53:00,280 --> 00:53:02,480
Speaker 1: I had it all. She she she hooked me up

880
00:53:02,520 --> 00:53:05,319
Speaker 1: on a constant basis, shout out to day. But when

881
00:53:05,960 --> 00:53:09,320
Speaker 1: after I shaved my head in college because I was like,

882
00:53:10,239 --> 00:53:15,120
Speaker 1: I don't want this, I don't I don't want this.

883
00:53:17,719 --> 00:53:20,040
Speaker 1: And that's when my grandmother came in the house with

884
00:53:20,160 --> 00:53:23,200
Speaker 1: my hair cropped, and my grandmother told me to get

885
00:53:23,239 --> 00:53:26,640
Speaker 1: out of her sight. I was not ready for that.

886
00:53:28,080 --> 00:53:30,279
Speaker 1: I was not ready for that. And I also was

887
00:53:30,360 --> 00:53:32,920
Speaker 1: not ready years later when I purned my hair because

888
00:53:32,960 --> 00:53:34,920
Speaker 1: I felt like and I just felt like and all

889
00:53:34,960 --> 00:53:39,400
Speaker 1: of a sudden, I was so fine, Oh she we

890
00:53:39,440 --> 00:53:44,000
Speaker 1: gotta allow space for and for that either that bothered me,

891
00:53:44,160 --> 00:53:48,600
Speaker 1: it made me feelable. Yeah, but that's when grandmother's I mean, yeah,

892
00:53:48,600 --> 00:53:53,400
Speaker 1: I understand that that, but now you understand, like our

893
00:53:53,440 --> 00:53:55,759
Speaker 1: grandmother's a whole human beings from a certain time, and

894
00:53:55,800 --> 00:53:59,279
Speaker 1: we're told about their beauty as well. Oh yeah, I

895
00:53:59,320 --> 00:54:01,520
Speaker 1: mean think But but it's the feeling how it makes

896
00:54:01,560 --> 00:54:04,279
Speaker 1: you feel in that moment when you when you're when

897
00:54:04,320 --> 00:54:06,719
Speaker 1: you're getting in touch with your authentic self at that

898
00:54:06,800 --> 00:54:10,480
Speaker 1: time in your life, and and your elder is rejecting

899
00:54:10,560 --> 00:54:13,239
Speaker 1: that even even though you know you know why, you

900
00:54:13,320 --> 00:54:17,399
Speaker 1: know why, but this is a feeling. But it makes

901
00:54:17,440 --> 00:54:19,480
Speaker 1: me sad, honestly when I see it happening now in

902
00:54:19,560 --> 00:54:21,520
Speaker 1: the world to our to our girls and our women

903
00:54:22,040 --> 00:54:24,520
Speaker 1: when they are just trying to get in touch with

904
00:54:24,600 --> 00:54:28,759
Speaker 1: whoever their authentic self is and they get told, no,

905
00:54:29,040 --> 00:54:32,600
Speaker 1: that's not professional, No that's not this. No you're not

906
00:54:32,719 --> 00:54:35,000
Speaker 1: a queen if you look like that. No you're not

907
00:54:35,120 --> 00:54:38,120
Speaker 1: so and so. No you don't look neat, No you

908
00:54:38,160 --> 00:54:41,360
Speaker 1: don't look you know. It's like I get really that

909
00:54:41,480 --> 00:54:44,560
Speaker 1: hurts me because, like I said, as black women were

910
00:54:44,600 --> 00:54:48,520
Speaker 1: being watched and judged and critiqued so much, if you

911
00:54:48,680 --> 00:54:52,360
Speaker 1: can find that moment where you say I don't want this,

912
00:54:52,840 --> 00:54:54,400
Speaker 1: and then you get in touch with something that you

913
00:54:54,520 --> 00:54:57,560
Speaker 1: do want, you can look and you can look at

914
00:54:57,600 --> 00:55:01,879
Speaker 1: yourself and say yes, so you know what I mean, Yeah,

915
00:55:01,920 --> 00:55:03,640
Speaker 1: I think I think I think you should be able

916
00:55:03,680 --> 00:55:05,440
Speaker 1: to do that. I think you're able to do that

917
00:55:05,560 --> 00:55:09,360
Speaker 1: and go with that, go with that feeling it. You

918
00:55:09,440 --> 00:55:12,880
Speaker 1: can't change your skin tones. It is. And I tell you,

919
00:55:13,120 --> 00:55:16,239
Speaker 1: if you feel like you can't be appreciated, or if

920
00:55:16,280 --> 00:55:19,239
Speaker 1: you choose to wear your hair the way you wear it,

921
00:55:19,600 --> 00:55:22,839
Speaker 1: if you choose to appreciate your skin, and I hope

922
00:55:22,880 --> 00:55:26,640
Speaker 1: you do. You know, whatever uh complexion you are brown

923
00:55:26,760 --> 00:55:30,799
Speaker 1: skin sister, and you feel like, you know, you say

924
00:55:30,880 --> 00:55:35,640
Speaker 1: whatever complexion and go brown skin, sister, I'm brown, I know.

925
00:55:36,080 --> 00:55:41,480
Speaker 1: But just and if you if you black, you brown somehow, baby, Okay,

926
00:55:41,560 --> 00:55:43,160
Speaker 1: I got you, all right. So you're saying a general

927
00:55:43,239 --> 00:55:47,960
Speaker 1: browns I'm talking about brown skin girl, no matter how girl,

928
00:55:48,400 --> 00:55:50,840
Speaker 1: I'm talking about brown skinned women. And I mean and

929
00:55:50,920 --> 00:55:54,000
Speaker 1: I don't mean specifically brown, I mean black women of

930
00:55:54,600 --> 00:55:59,520
Speaker 1: all different shades. Real rap, that's what I mean. If

931
00:55:59,600 --> 00:56:02,160
Speaker 1: you feel like you can't be appreciated for all your

932
00:56:02,320 --> 00:56:08,680
Speaker 1: shine and glory, Honeycota Italy. Okay, this girl, just now.

933
00:56:09,520 --> 00:56:11,520
Speaker 1: Look then, my mama was in a sin. I see

934
00:56:11,560 --> 00:56:13,520
Speaker 1: your white women and they didn't see them, watch women.

935
00:56:13,560 --> 00:56:16,000
Speaker 1: All they saw was but listen, but listen more, but listen.

936
00:56:16,400 --> 00:56:20,000
Speaker 1: Listen where am I also in Jamaica? Also in Jamaica,

937
00:56:20,360 --> 00:56:25,080
Speaker 1: Got sore? Where you're appreciated, got darn it? Yes, come

938
00:56:25,120 --> 00:56:36,200
Speaker 1: on and shake her shimmy, yeah yeah yeah. Just this

939
00:56:36,440 --> 00:56:38,960
Speaker 1: for your ego boost to know that this is this

940
00:56:39,120 --> 00:56:42,719
Speaker 1: is a clouded vision of you, and even maybe your

941
00:56:42,800 --> 00:56:46,440
Speaker 1: vision is clouded too. Show to those women that are

942
00:56:46,480 --> 00:56:48,680
Speaker 1: brought it to lightlight. I mean, I know it's controversial,

943
00:56:48,719 --> 00:56:50,600
Speaker 1: but even Tessa Thompson, who was like, I am so

944
00:56:50,760 --> 00:56:53,919
Speaker 1: conscious of my life skating privilege in this situation. Wow,

945
00:56:54,680 --> 00:56:57,359
Speaker 1: it's a thing. Yeah, I haven't reached that place yet.

946
00:56:57,400 --> 00:56:59,239
Speaker 1: I just found out. I was like skinning, I'm sorry

947
00:57:00,000 --> 00:57:03,200
Speaker 1: a few months for me and I'm I'm like, well,

948
00:57:03,200 --> 00:57:05,000
Speaker 1: you're a different kind because you're still in light scan

949
00:57:05,080 --> 00:57:11,759
Speaker 1: but you're still nappy too. So sometimes it's a little

950
00:57:11,840 --> 00:57:16,520
Speaker 1: different in my life. It's it's really interesting to be

951
00:57:16,640 --> 00:57:20,440
Speaker 1: in Tennessee with with natural hair out here. Yeah, the

952
00:57:20,560 --> 00:57:27,160
Speaker 1: response is different. I get called girl often. I hit

953
00:57:27,240 --> 00:57:30,520
Speaker 1: him on when I was in Nashville, white man. I

954
00:57:30,680 --> 00:57:35,240
Speaker 1: was like, wait, white man, I never had I been

955
00:57:35,280 --> 00:57:37,120
Speaker 1: a girl in a very, very long time. But I

956
00:57:37,200 --> 00:57:41,880
Speaker 1: appreciate your compliment. Now get me whatever I'm asking for.

957
00:57:42,080 --> 00:57:44,040
Speaker 1: Thank you so much. Good one. You ain't here them.

958
00:57:44,040 --> 00:57:48,240
Speaker 1: I don't know he's talking, Tom, but I'm doing don't

959
00:57:48,240 --> 00:57:52,120
Speaker 1: do things differently. I'm not trying to. I'm trying to

960
00:57:52,240 --> 00:57:54,400
Speaker 1: not trying to fight you. I'm trying to educate you. Baby,

961
00:57:54,440 --> 00:57:59,480
Speaker 1: I'm I'm not a girl. On that note, thank you

962
00:57:59,600 --> 00:58:06,959
Speaker 1: so much for listening to Jay dot L today. Thank

963
00:58:07,000 --> 00:58:12,400
Speaker 1: you so much. We enjoy having these conversations. We're always

964
00:58:12,840 --> 00:58:20,160
Speaker 1: like laughing and crying and uplifted and changed, changed just

965
00:58:20,360 --> 00:58:29,560
Speaker 1: a little bit. I like that. I appreciate that. How

966
00:58:29,720 --> 00:58:39,840
Speaker 1: do you eat an elephant? One by it time? Hey?

967
00:58:39,880 --> 00:58:43,280
Speaker 1: Hey everyone, it's producer Eaves here again at the end

968
00:58:43,320 --> 00:58:46,600
Speaker 1: of the episode. And what Asia mentioned about the social

969
00:58:46,640 --> 00:58:50,160
Speaker 1: media filters making skin look lighter. That is an issue

970
00:58:50,240 --> 00:58:52,960
Speaker 1: that people have raised. Of course, there are the overall

971
00:58:53,040 --> 00:58:57,240
Speaker 1: problems of how filters affect self image, confidence, esteem, and

972
00:58:57,440 --> 00:59:01,040
Speaker 1: our perception of beauty standards. But skin tone is one

973
00:59:01,080 --> 00:59:04,560
Speaker 1: thing that is still super relevant and a problem, and

974
00:59:04,640 --> 00:59:07,880
Speaker 1: it goes way back with light skin biases embedded and

975
00:59:07,960 --> 00:59:12,160
Speaker 1: photography and filters since their early days, and it goes

976
00:59:12,280 --> 00:59:17,560
Speaker 1: even beyond skin tone and into Eurocentric beauty standards in general. Yep,

977
00:59:17,800 --> 00:59:20,880
Speaker 1: the trance of white supremacy is strong. I'll drop a

978
00:59:20,960 --> 00:59:42,200
Speaker 1: few lengths about it and about colorism in the episode description. Hi,

979
00:59:42,680 --> 00:59:45,040
Speaker 1: if you have comments on something you said in this

980
00:59:45,200 --> 00:59:49,560
Speaker 1: episode called eight six six, Hey Jill, if you want

981
00:59:49,560 --> 00:59:52,680
Speaker 1: to add to this conversation, that's eight six six four

982
00:59:52,800 --> 00:59:56,080
Speaker 1: three nine five four five five. Don't forget to tell

983
00:59:56,160 --> 00:59:58,960
Speaker 1: us your name and the episode you're referring to you

984
00:59:59,160 --> 01:00:03,320
Speaker 1: might yeah hear your message on a future episode. Thank

985
01:00:03,360 --> 01:00:06,560
Speaker 1: you for listening to Jill Scott presents j dot il

986
01:00:06,760 --> 01:00:10,560
Speaker 1: the Podcast. This podcast is hosted by Jill Scott, Laia

987
01:00:10,680 --> 01:00:15,040
Speaker 1: st Clair and Aga Graden Danceler. It's executive producers are

988
01:00:15,120 --> 01:00:19,000
Speaker 1: Jill Scott, Shawn g and Brian Calhoun's produced by Laya

989
01:00:19,120 --> 01:00:22,520
Speaker 1: st Clair and me Eves Jeff Cope. The editing and

990
01:00:22,600 --> 01:00:25,960
Speaker 1: sound design for this episode we're done by Christina Larenger.

991
01:00:31,000 --> 01:00:34,400
Speaker 1: J dot Ill is a production of I heart Radio.

992
01:00:34,840 --> 01:00:38,080
Speaker 1: For more podcast from I heart Radio, visit the I

993
01:00:38,280 --> 01:00:42,600
Speaker 1: heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to

994
01:00:42,720 --> 01:00:43,800
Speaker 1: your favorite shows