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Speaker 1: is the Patriots Catch twenty two podcasts with Evan Lazar
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Speaker 2: That I agree with, And this is the only part
Speaker 2: of your take that I agree with that I find
Speaker 2: interesting A little bit.
Speaker 4: He said that about like three or four things.
Speaker 2: But okay, you kept saying that. I kept saying that
Speaker 2: I find this interesting, and I actually went back and
Speaker 2: listened to, which I don't often do, but I did
Speaker 2: to that part because I felt myself doing that radio
Speaker 2: and I absolutely said, like four times about four different
Speaker 2: things that I was claiming, wasn't an interesting somebody?
Speaker 4: Somebody's going to be watching some North Carolina football next
Speaker 4: year come the.
Speaker 2: Fall, to be fair, to be fair, like it's Bill Belichick,
Speaker 2: like where you were, I work for the Patriots. Like
Speaker 2: obviously it's obvious that I would be interested in Bill.
Speaker 4: That was the whole take. That was it.
Speaker 2: It's Bill Belichick's putting a team on the field. How
Speaker 2: was that not interesting?
Speaker 4: That was the take? Yeah, but that that's me, Like
Speaker 4: I'm talking about like I think like some Patriots Dick
Speaker 4: and Larry, you.
Speaker 2: Know, Like I'm not talking about me like I'm the
Speaker 2: target audience for anything. Bill Belichick is a.
Speaker 4: Is an NFL exclusive fan in Boston, anywhere anywhere besides
Speaker 4: New England gonna watch maybe not. I think Patriots fans
Speaker 4: are going to be interested because it is Bill Belichick. Yeah,
Speaker 4: I mean that that's valid. That's Veld. That's the whole thing.
Speaker 2: No, you did, you were gushing a little bit about
Speaker 2: college football. All right, calm down, bother I do that.
Speaker 4: That is it has gone right up Felger's tail by.
Speaker 2: That that has made my week, just constantly ripping you
Speaker 2: and calling you barthy.
Speaker 4: And all of it. He calls me Barty one where
Speaker 4: it is fantastic.
Speaker 2: Hey, Patriots fans, if you want to see Toyota's Toyota's right,
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Speaker 2: go to buy a Toyota dot.
Speaker 4: Com you didn't do at that time. It's Toyota.
Speaker 2: It's Toyota's official website for deals for the official vehicle
Speaker 2: of the New England Patriots, Toyota. Let's go places.
Speaker 4: When does Jordan Love get his Toyota deal? I didn't
Speaker 4: know about this, so I'll pull up the numbers for you.
Speaker 4: Do the second read a drink easy to enjoy it,
Speaker 4: but like the official beer sponsor of the New England Patriots,
Speaker 4: just just save it for a little Okay. I do
Speaker 4: want to talk some Patriots and then we can get
Speaker 4: into the well. I was trying to line it up
Speaker 4: with the read. I'm trying to help the sponsor. Yeah, okay,
Speaker 4: what do you got? So Jordan Love during Toyota thon,
Speaker 4: So this it's a what's it called? It's an anomaly? Yeah,
Speaker 4: I'm trying to find the actual distribution of the numbers.
Speaker 4: Jordan Love in his career is like night and day,
Speaker 4: a different quarterback during Toyota thon.
Speaker 2: Okay, but isn't that just lining up with He's better
Speaker 2: late in the year, late in the year, and the
Speaker 2: Packers are starting to roll Like that's well.
Speaker 4: It's not just this year, it's career. So Jordan Love
Speaker 4: touchdown interception ratio not during Toyota than for his career, Okay,
Speaker 4: twenty nine and twenty five, twenty nine touchdowns, twenty nine picks. Okay,
Speaker 4: Jordan Love and thirty two hundred yards Jordan Love during
Speaker 4: Toyota than which is fewer games, Yeah, thirty two hundred yards,
Speaker 4: twenty six touchdowns, only two picks.
Speaker 2: He's an MVP of the league when it's Toyota than like, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4: Jordan this year during Toyota than sixty nine completion percentage,
Speaker 4: He's averaging about ten yards per attempt, eleven hundred yards
Speaker 4: and five games, eight touchdowns, one pick, one hundred and
Speaker 4: twenty passer rating.
Speaker 2: A little bit of Jordan Love and Drake May I know,
Speaker 2: we're like we make like seventeen different comparisons. I feel
Speaker 2: like for Drake made. It's Josh Allen. It's justin Herbert
Speaker 2: like I could see a little bit of Jordan Love
Speaker 2: in there as well.
Speaker 4: But I want to we need to figure out what
Speaker 4: Dan would Drake May's like Jordan Love is Toyota tha On?
Speaker 4: Hopefully it's not super summer for Drake May. That doesn't
Speaker 4: help us at all. What are the other ones? Isn't
Speaker 4: it like Trucktober or something that doesn't really help either?
Speaker 4: He'd like, well, if you put him together, because trust
Speaker 4: something in January?
Speaker 2: Maybe you know something.
Speaker 4: December Toyota Thon ends. The last Sunday of the regular season.
Speaker 4: Is the last Sunday during Toyota Than. Okay, so Toyota
Speaker 4: Than does not include the playoffs. Okay yet? Okay, Yeah,
Speaker 4: maybe he gets a deal with Toyota and he gets
Speaker 4: him to push that. But I love it.
Speaker 2: All right, Let's get back to the task at hand
Speaker 2: and talk a little bit about the Patriots. I understand
Speaker 2: that this has been this has been a week, this
Speaker 2: has been this has been a week coming off this
Speaker 2: Cardinals game, and I understand a lot of the criticisms
Speaker 2: for the Patriots and for the Patriots coaching staff.
Speaker 4: But as you can imagine Alex. The one thing that
Speaker 4: that kind of.
Speaker 2: Just just bothers me a little bit about the discourse
Speaker 2: around Drodmeo right now is how much focus there is
Speaker 2: on press conferences like that. That piece of it to
Speaker 2: me really just kind of like, uh, it misses the
Speaker 2: mark a little bit.
Speaker 4: And and.
Speaker 2: I want to preface that by saying, like, this is
Speaker 2: not excuse making for draw because I'm about to tell
Speaker 2: you how I really feel, right but like I just
Speaker 2: when I watch and listen and hear and read people
Speaker 2: that are going over at all of his press conferences
Speaker 2: and all this kind of stuff and being super critical
Speaker 2: of things that he says are the things that he
Speaker 2: that he or whatever, I just truly feel that it
Speaker 2: is like low hanging fruit, Like it's we don't want
Speaker 2: to actually talk about the actual football of what's going
Speaker 2: on with the Patriots. But did you hear what he
Speaker 2: said about the press conference at the press conference after
Speaker 2: the game, right Like it's that sort of thing, and uh,
Speaker 2: as a show that's all about the actual weeds and
Speaker 2: the x's and o's, it just I want to talk
Speaker 2: about that stuff because my biggest issues with the Patriots
Speaker 2: right now is what's going on tape. It has nothing
Speaker 2: to do with what's going on at press conferences, right,
Speaker 2: And one of the things you know with press conferences,
Speaker 2: to Dan Campbell got dragged like he got absolutely killed
Speaker 2: for the kneecaps thing. Yeah, if you had I when
Speaker 2: I saw that introductory press conference by Dan Campbell and
Speaker 2: he did the kneecaps thing the bit, right, I thought
Speaker 2: for sure that guy was gonna fail. Like you know me,
Speaker 2: I was like, oh, get this hard O at before that,
Speaker 2: I thought for sure he was going to fail at
Speaker 2: that press conference. If you asked me that day, do
Speaker 2: I think Campbell's gonna be a good head coach?
Speaker 4: I would tell you no.
Speaker 2: I would also say the same thing about Bill, Like Bill,
Speaker 2: the way he conducted himself at press conferences was criticized
Speaker 2: for twenty five years, and then to go even to
Speaker 2: in game stuff in game coaching, like Andy Reid was
Speaker 2: dragged for game management for it for fifteen years until
Speaker 2: he got Patrick Mahomes and he just didn't matter, right.
Speaker 2: And plus now the Chiefs are great late in games,
Speaker 2: like they're probably the best team in the league in
Speaker 2: close games in the fourth quarter. My point by bringing
Speaker 2: up all those guys and I know that those are
Speaker 2: all the rosy you know, success stories of bad first
Speaker 2: year turn it around sort of thing. But my point
Speaker 2: of bringing up all those guys is that I feel
Speaker 2: like those elements of head coaching do get better. Like,
Speaker 2: if you're a good coach, I think you learn how
Speaker 2: to time management. I think you learn press conference etiquette.
Speaker 2: I think you learn all of these CEO type elements
Speaker 2: of being a head coach. And I would be more
Speaker 2: than willing to take on those growing pains with Gerrod
Speaker 2: Mayo in this coaching staff when it comes to all
Speaker 2: that kind of stuff. If I thought that the team
Speaker 2: was coached well on Sundays and I just don't feel
Speaker 2: like I am seeing enough of that, Sure you can
Speaker 2: jump in. I have some more stuff I want to
Speaker 2: unpack from there, but no, I'll just I'll.
Speaker 4: Echo something Felger said this week, like I don't I
Speaker 4: care more about So the comment was that you said
Speaker 4: that not me, right, Yeah, was in regards to essentially
Speaker 4: not being able to pick up a yard on third
Speaker 4: and one, fourth and one, a crucial point in the game. Right,
Speaker 4: I care a lot more that they didn't pick up
Speaker 4: the yard. Yeah, Then the way Gerard Mayo addressed it.
Speaker 4: It's it's just a winning cures all thing. Yeah, Like,
Speaker 4: look at Joe Mizula. Joe Mizula says weird stuff in
Speaker 4: press conferences all the time. He said yesterday he doesn't
Speaker 4: watch the NBA. Yeah, but the team's a wagon and
Speaker 4: we just kind of laugh about it.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: So now, obviously Joe Missoula is it's it's not to
Speaker 4: compare Joe Mazula girod Mayo. Joe Mizula has built all
Speaker 4: ready in a short time a very impressive resume. But
Speaker 4: the point being, at the end of the day, they're
Speaker 4: losing football games, and everything becomes more frustrating when you're
Speaker 4: you're losing. And I'm with you. That's not to say
Speaker 4: he there aren't things to clean up in the press conference.
Speaker 4: There certainly are. If he's giving you know, the ninety
Speaker 4: eight Michael Jordan of press conference, right, the seven Tom
Speaker 4: Brady of press conferences, and they still ninety six Jordan,
Speaker 4: thank you, you know, the the you know, two thousand
Speaker 4: Ken Griffe Junior press conferences. Yea, and they're still only
Speaker 4: winning three games a year. I really won't care, Like
Speaker 4: that doesn't mean anything to me. Win the games and
Speaker 4: I'm with you, like, if you want to talk about
Speaker 4: what's being said at the press conference is like, I
Speaker 4: get it, it's a I understand why it's a story.
Speaker 4: I'm not faulting anybody from talking for talking about it.
Speaker 4: Mean too. I guess my point is more in especially
Speaker 4: on this show, what we do. How about the questions
Speaker 4: that are being asked that are leading to these answers, Right,
Speaker 4: what's going wrong on the field, Because if you start
Speaker 4: fixing some of that, if you can pick up they
Speaker 4: had two chances to gain one yard convincingly and I
Speaker 4: still think there was a bad spot on the third down,
Speaker 4: but they had two chances to pick up one yard
Speaker 4: convincingly and couldn't do it. You pick up that yard,
Speaker 4: the question never happens. So fix what's happening on the field,
Speaker 4: and I think the rest takes care of itself. I
Speaker 4: don't think, well, he needs to be better in press conferences.
Speaker 4: Could he be better? Yeah, I'm not saying he couldn't.
Speaker 4: It doesn't do anything if the product on the field
Speaker 4: doesn't change.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I just think that not a lot of people
Speaker 2: want to have the conversations of like, what's going actually
Speaker 2: wrong with the defense and the offensive line and the
Speaker 2: play calling. And that's what I want to unpack because
Speaker 2: I don't want to talk about press conferences. When we
Speaker 2: came off of the Colts game, I didn't want to
Speaker 2: talk about did he manage the game correctly?
Speaker 4: And now that's in game stuff. This is where you
Speaker 4: lose me that football coaching. But it matters, but you
Speaker 4: don't want to talk about it because it's not nerd stuff.
Speaker 2: But it will get My point is that I would
Speaker 2: allow some grace for him to improve in that area
Speaker 2: if I thought that he if I thought that defensively,
Speaker 2: they were putting out a good product every single week.
Speaker 2: And the reason why I bring that up is because
Speaker 2: you know all the coaches that you hate that I
Speaker 2: love Kyle Shanahan, those types of guys like no matter
Speaker 2: what happens with Shanahan, who also tends to be a
Speaker 2: little bit snarky at press conferences.
Speaker 4: To remember when they asked hibout, Jimmy Garoppolo is like
Speaker 4: will he be on the team next week? And Shanahan
Speaker 4: was like, I don't know if anybody will be alive
Speaker 4: this week?
Speaker 2: Right, yeah, Like he's also a little weird. Hey, it's
Speaker 2: a stress environment, has a little Missoula in him, Kyle Shanahan.
Speaker 4: But except for the winning championships part. Okay, I saw
Speaker 4: that coming out. I said it was wrong.
Speaker 2: So here's the thing though, Like Kyle Shanahan brings one
Speaker 2: of the best schemes on the offensive side of the
Speaker 2: ball to the game every single Sunday, right like he
Speaker 2: That's that's the trade off, right, The trade off is, Yeah,
Speaker 2: you might get some quirky press conferences. Yeah, you might
Speaker 2: get you know, you people like you. The time management,
Speaker 2: you know, the clock management, not running the ball late
Speaker 2: in games to milk the clock like that stuff's gonna
Speaker 2: drive everybody crazy. But every single week, the forty nine
Speaker 2: ers and Kyle Shanahan have a chance to win the
Speaker 2: game because his scheme is is fantastic.
Speaker 4: They have a chance to do it, and they do
Speaker 4: it about half the time. I would argue that the
Speaker 4: management thing plays into that too. Though. Look at a
Speaker 4: guy like Mike Tomlin, who he has his intricacies in prescommens.
Speaker 4: Remember a couple of weeks ago, he wouldn't call Lamar
Speaker 4: Jackson Lamar. He gets saying mister Jackson, I guess kind
Speaker 4: of a weird thing. Yeah, you know, every week Mike
Speaker 4: Tomlin's team is going to come out prepared right sound.
Speaker 4: It's not about the scheme. The scheme's good, but like, yeah,
Speaker 4: play sound fundamental football and he's going to do his part.
Speaker 4: And that's not a joke about him nearly tripping to
Speaker 4: Kobe Ford down the sideline. I don't remember the last
Speaker 4: time I was watching the Steelers and go for it
Speaker 4: or kick decision or time out usage your clock management,
Speaker 4: Like Mike Tomlins as buttoned up as anybody in that regard. Yeah,
Speaker 4: so the game management thing can apply to that too. Again,
Speaker 4: it's just if the product on the field is better one,
Speaker 4: you're not going to be in a position to have
Speaker 4: some of these because some of the questions he gets asked,
Speaker 4: and this is true for just any coach that's losing.
Speaker 4: You're gonna get questions that are difficult to answer because
Speaker 4: at the end of the day, as a coach, you
Speaker 4: don't want to put down your own team, you don't
Speaker 4: want to put down yourself, et cetera, et cetera. But
Speaker 4: if you're losing, you're losing and somebody has to be
Speaker 4: at fault. You can't just go out there and awe
Speaker 4: shucks it. So and That's where some of these answers
Speaker 4: come from. That's where some of these bad answers come from.
Speaker 4: There are certain questions. This isn't just a Mayo thing.
Speaker 4: This is just how it works where certain questions there
Speaker 4: is no good answer. You want to create a situation
Speaker 4: where you don't have those kinds of questions. Win football games.
Speaker 4: Win games, that's how you fix it. Yeah, So looking
Speaker 4: at the football, I want to start.
Speaker 2: I want to start defense actually, and this is the
Speaker 2: side of the ball that troubles me the most because
Speaker 2: this is supposed to be Girod Mayo's side of the ball, right,
Speaker 2: Like when the Houston Texans hired Demico Ryans, there were
Speaker 2: questions about whether or not he was going to get
Speaker 2: the oc higher right, He's going to get the offense right,
Speaker 2: the quarterback right, and all those kinds of things. They've
Speaker 2: done a nice job on that side of the ball
Speaker 2: with Stroud and and Bobby's look, but going into it
Speaker 2: there are questions. There were never questions about the Texans
Speaker 2: defense because that was Demiko Ryans's specialty. Same thing with Patriots.
Speaker 2: The Patriots and Girod Mayo, and when I look at
Speaker 2: them statistically on defense, it is alarming how much they
Speaker 2: have just fallen off a cliff on that side of
Speaker 2: the ball.
Speaker 4: I mean, you could argue between the two units, what's
Speaker 4: been the better unit this year, offense or defense?
Speaker 2: I would say the offense certainly more promising. Like, you know,
Speaker 2: I don't know if it's statistically any better.
Speaker 4: I think it is.
Speaker 2: It might be slightly, but your little metric they're better,
Speaker 2: I don't think so. Oh maybe by EPs.
Speaker 4: I saw that this week. That's what other ada. I
Speaker 4: didn't know which one of you were going on. Oh yeah,
Speaker 4: the same thing to me.
Speaker 2: So they're defensively right now, the you know, the number
Speaker 2: everybody throws out there is their thirtieth and d v
Speaker 2: A defensively, they were ninth last year, right like that
Speaker 2: that's always it. But you know, I wrote down some
Speaker 2: of their other numbers for the show today. I mean
Speaker 2: they're thirty first in past DVOA. They're defensively, Yeah, they're
Speaker 2: twenty fourth on third down defensively, they're twenty third in
Speaker 2: the red zone defensively, like this is just the red zone.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but when you look.
Speaker 2: At defensive coaching, I always look at past defense, third down,
Speaker 2: red zone, like I think those are the three biggest things,
Speaker 2: uh that you need to be good on defense, and
Speaker 2: they're bottom of the league and all three. And the
Speaker 2: big thing that I look at with this defense right
Speaker 2: now is a combination. I think it's It's one. They
Speaker 2: don't play fundamentally sound defense anymore.
Speaker 4: They don't.
Speaker 2: They don't play blocks well, they don't take angles well,
Speaker 2: they don't tackle well, they don't you know, they're mechanics
Speaker 2: up front, Like there's questions about fits and things like that,
Speaker 2: like our guys in the right gap apps or guys
Speaker 2: in the right spots? Are they getting into the right
Speaker 2: alignment's pre snap is something that Jabriel Peppers spoke about
Speaker 2: after the game on Sunday that he didn't feel like
Speaker 2: they did that often enough, consistently enough.
Speaker 4: I mean, they're on.
Speaker 2: The goal line and there's just nobody in gaps right,
Speaker 2: James Connors just walking in for touchdowns. I get it's
Speaker 2: the goal line, Like you're probably not gonna stop him anyways,
Speaker 2: but it would least be nice to make him go
Speaker 2: through somebody right to get into the end zone.
Speaker 4: So you see a.
Speaker 2: Lot of stuff that I would label controllable, Like I
Speaker 2: think all these things assignments being in the right gaps,
Speaker 2: you know, being a fundamentally sound like you can can
Speaker 2: even if you don't have great roster talent, like you
Speaker 2: can control your own house right, Like you can control
Speaker 2: those things. And a lot of the time, especially on
Speaker 2: the defensive side of the ball, I feel like you
Speaker 2: can overachieve on defense by just being structurally sound, like
Speaker 2: just having eleven guys playing the right defense, playing the
Speaker 2: right gaps tackle well, like you can get away with
Speaker 2: the fact that you don't have, you know, the eighty
Speaker 2: five bears of talent on the defensive side of the
Speaker 2: ball if you're doing those types of things. And the
Speaker 2: Patriots defense right now just isn't doing those types of things.
Speaker 2: And I think Girod Meyos spread really thin as a
Speaker 2: first time head coach and that his imprint hasn't necessarily
Speaker 2: been on this defense as much as he expected. I
Speaker 2: think DeMarcus Covington, it was a pretty big promotion for
Speaker 2: DeMarcus Covington, and I think we were all excited about
Speaker 2: his prospects as a coach moving forward. But I think
Speaker 2: you're seeing just what happens when you put two guys
Speaker 2: in a position that are both green, right, like that
Speaker 2: bald weren't totally ready for the job yet, And I
Speaker 2: don't know where they go on that side of the football,
Speaker 2: because what they did against Arizona on Sunday was way
Speaker 2: too simplistic, Like the Cardinals just undressed them with little
Speaker 2: motions and things like that.
Speaker 4: The entire time.
Speaker 2: It wasn't like the ram style of motion where they
Speaker 2: were motioning at the snap to create space in the defense.
Speaker 2: They were using coverage indicators, like they're just motioning a
Speaker 2: guy across. If somebody went with him, it was man
Speaker 2: to man. If they didn't, it was zone, and Kyler
Speaker 2: just had answers right no matter which the coverage was,
Speaker 2: and he was just seeing it pre snap all right
Speaker 2: there in man to man. I have Trey McBride on
Speaker 2: del Pettis, that's a matchup that we're gonna win, and
Speaker 2: I'm gonna hit him for twenty nine yards on third down.
Speaker 2: Like those types of things just consistently happened in this
Speaker 2: game where they were just they were just beat And
Speaker 2: I just I don't know if it's simple as get
Speaker 2: everybody back next year that was supposed to be here,
Speaker 2: you know, get one hundred percent of Christian Barmore, get
Speaker 2: one hundred percent of Jabriel Pepper's, Kyle Duggar Jwan Bentley,
Speaker 2: Like I can get that.
Speaker 4: Pass rusher to replace Matthew Judah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like I can hear that argument, Like if you
Speaker 2: want to use the I want to call it injury excuse,
Speaker 2: but injury excuse for the defense or availability excuse. Like
Speaker 2: I can hear that argument and say that Water will
Speaker 2: find its level next season. But what concerns me the most,
Speaker 2: and this is really on both sides of the ball,
Speaker 2: but since we're starting with the defense, there's just a
Speaker 2: lack of creativity when it comes to scheme to try
Speaker 2: to do anything that gets the offense on its heels.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and what's troubling about that is just to play
Speaker 4: it off the offense. The Patriots offense. We talked about
Speaker 4: the Patriots offense also being maybe a little more simplified,
Speaker 4: and we'll talk about this later in the show. Alex
Speaker 4: Van Pelt actually had an interesting comment on this today,
Speaker 4: but it almost sort of makes sense for the offense
Speaker 4: to be simplified. Maybe not to this extent, but you
Speaker 4: have a rookie quarterback, you have a line that is
Speaker 4: not remotely consistent, like you kind of they can't go
Speaker 4: right to a five.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Right, on defense, you have veterans, you have guys that
Speaker 4: have been here, You have players at key positions that,
Speaker 4: in theory allow you to complicate things more. Talking about
Speaker 4: a guy like Christian Gonzalez, right, yeah, so I can
Speaker 4: understand why the offense might be things. I can understand
Speaker 4: why the offense might be a little more simplified, right right.
Speaker 4: The defense, they brought everybody back they should have been starting.
Speaker 4: And we've done this the last few years with the defense.
Speaker 4: I've talked this up where you bring everybody back, you
Speaker 4: don't really have to do a day one install in
Speaker 4: the spring because everybody's on page. Everybody's on that page
Speaker 4: from last year. There should be more levels to this defense.
Speaker 4: I get they've lost guys due to injuries, but even
Speaker 4: a lot of the backups are guys that were here
Speaker 4: last year. Yeah, so yeah, it's a good point by you.
Speaker 4: I just think how simple the defense is right now,
Speaker 4: and then you get to the execution on top of that.
Speaker 4: The simplification is supposed to help the execution. It's not,
Speaker 4: but how simple it is right now is kind of
Speaker 4: eye opening.
Speaker 2: Every single team when they come into a game against
Speaker 2: the Patriots. They are not schematically challenged, Like they don't
Speaker 2: get put in binds by the Patriots right now, and
Speaker 2: either side of the ball where oh, like they're doing
Speaker 2: something that's really innovative or really creative that we have it,
Speaker 2: we're gonna have to have a plan against, like we're
Speaker 2: gonna have to have a plan against the Blitz package,
Speaker 2: or a plan against some sort of wrinkle on the
Speaker 2: defensive side of the football, like you might see what
Speaker 2: Mike McDonald or Brian Floores, or like one of these
Speaker 2: coaches that do dial things up.
Speaker 4: I mentioned Demiko.
Speaker 2: Ryans earlier in the show, Like those guys are constantly
Speaker 2: challenging the opposing offense schematically, and I don't see that
Speaker 2: with this defense right now. I see them being very
Speaker 2: vanilla and very easy to decipher. And that puts you
Speaker 2: in a position where your players just kind of have
Speaker 2: to make plays. And Christian Gonzalez is sort of the
Speaker 2: only guy in that secondary that truly is capable of
Speaker 2: down in and down out making plays on the ball,
Speaker 2: and so it really puts you in a tough position.
Speaker 2: And the other thing that I wanted to bring up
Speaker 2: defensively that we can move over to the offense is
Speaker 2: they've always been a two gapping system. Like I think
Speaker 2: they're always going to be a two gaping system. I
Speaker 2: understand why. I understand that it has its advantages and
Speaker 2: things like that. But in order to be a great
Speaker 2: two gaping team, the Mike linebacker needs to be a sledgehammer,
Speaker 2: Like he just needs to be a Jwan Bentley, a
Speaker 2: Dante high Tower and Roberts I brought him up the
Speaker 2: other day even like going back aways to Ted Johnson, right,
Speaker 2: like you always had somebody in the middle of the
Speaker 2: defense that could take a guard on and put that
Speaker 2: guy on his heels, right and now, is nothing against
Speaker 2: their their linebackers, Johnny Devii, Christian Ellison, Taki, those guys
Speaker 2: just aren't that.
Speaker 4: They're not that kind of player. That's not who they are,
Speaker 4: the coverish linebackers, right, so well Tavia's played that role
Speaker 4: at times this year, but overall sorry yeah yeah.
Speaker 2: So the biggest thing though, is that when they have
Speaker 2: a guy like that, the biggest reason why that is
Speaker 2: is so key to the defense is that it compresses space. Right, Like,
Speaker 2: all you're doing is you're bottling up the runner. Like
Speaker 2: there's a lot of times if you go, And we
Speaker 2: watched Jawan Bentley that he doesn't actually make the tackle,
Speaker 2: but he's compressing the space and he's blowing up the
Speaker 2: blocking scheme so that somebody else can come in and
Speaker 2: make the tackle, right, or multiple people can come in
Speaker 2: and make the tackle. So what's happening a lot of
Speaker 2: the time. And I thought the uh the fifty three
Speaker 2: yarder by James Connor was a great example of this.
Speaker 2: You know, they have the polar coming across. Marcus Jones
Speaker 2: is like the nickel on that side of the field.
Speaker 2: He does his best, but like he's five eight one
Speaker 2: eighties play to make right, so he he tries his
Speaker 2: best to hold up the polar. But Jabriel Peppers is
Speaker 2: put in a spot where there's just a lot of
Speaker 2: room for James Connor to make a cut right, Like
Speaker 2: there's just not anybody compressing the space so that he
Speaker 2: can just take him on straight on. Like James Connor
Speaker 2: essentially has a two way go like he could go,
Speaker 2: he could have gotten around him both ways. And so
Speaker 2: now if you're Jabriel Peppers, you're just kind of sitting
Speaker 2: there like waiting for him to declare, and it's just
Speaker 2: really difficult to then make that stop and make that play.
Speaker 2: So I look at a lot of the things that
Speaker 2: are happening from a run defense standpoint as like, okay,
Speaker 2: well you're your front mechanics might need to change, Like
Speaker 2: you can't be a two gapping defense if you don't
Speaker 2: have the horses to go out there and be an
Speaker 2: effective two gaping defense. Now, on that particular play, they
Speaker 2: did try to run like a little bit of a stunt,
Speaker 2: like to get a little bit more penetration. But like,
Speaker 2: in general, I just think it's really difficult to play
Speaker 2: a two gapping defense without a really really good, hard
Speaker 2: hitting mike linebacker, like even like guys like freaking terrez Hall,
Speaker 2: like who was like on the team in twenty twenty,
Speaker 2: Like he wasn't a great player, but he could he
Speaker 2: could take on a guard.
Speaker 4: That was the one thing I like teres Hall because
Speaker 4: it was the one thing he did. He lowered the hammer,
Speaker 4: by the way, he was here last year.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I remember that. I liked terres Hall too, And
Speaker 2: and that was the main reason is like you saw
Speaker 2: the role that he could play in the defense. Was
Speaker 2: he like prime ray Lewis? No, but you saw a role. Okay,
Speaker 2: this is what he does for this defense. So I
Speaker 2: just wonder when it comes to like tweaks and things
Speaker 2: like that on the defense side of the ball, if
Speaker 2: there was ever or is ever a consideration that two
Speaker 2: gapping would these this personnel, Like even looking at defensive
Speaker 2: end now they have Barmore back now, but like, is
Speaker 2: Daniel a Qualley like a true two gapping defensive end. No,
Speaker 2: he'd like he would be much better suited if you
Speaker 2: let him get into a gap and get up the
Speaker 2: field a little bit. So I know I'm picking on
Speaker 2: you know, a lot of schematic stuff with the defense,
Speaker 2: but I just I understand that people have this overarching
Speaker 2: thing a lot of you know, we get a lot
Speaker 2: of calls and emails being like, look at the talent
Speaker 2: on the roster right.
Speaker 4: Well, I guess I was talking to somebody about this earlier,
Speaker 4: Like for all the criticism of the coaching, and I'm
Speaker 4: not saying that it's not warranted. Yeah, Like, don't we
Speaker 4: talked a lot at the beginning of the year about
Speaker 4: the roster and the shape it's in. Yeah, And I
Speaker 4: understand that you know, that's been talked about and that's
Speaker 4: more of an offseason topic and all that and change. Yeah,
Speaker 4: over the last few weeks. So I just like the
Speaker 4: coaching stuff shouldn't overshadow the talent on the roster. I said,
Speaker 4: it's not fair to talk about defensively.
Speaker 2: I truly believe that they are not the thirtieth worst
Speaker 2: defense in the league on paper.
Speaker 4: That's fair. I truly believe that. Now. Do I think
Speaker 4: that they're an elite defense on paper?
Speaker 2: No?
Speaker 4: No, And were they ever going to be? Probably not.
Speaker 2: Maybe if they had everybody healthy and running at one
Speaker 2: hundred percent, they could have been, you know, an average
Speaker 2: to above average defense like they were last year, right Like,
Speaker 2: I think that that's realistic in terms of their talent
Speaker 2: on the roster. Now, they're probably middling at best in
Speaker 2: terms of talent, but they're not thirtieth and they have
Speaker 2: a number one corner. They have a young player in
Speaker 2: Keon White that can get after quarterbacks on third down.
Speaker 2: They have guys that I always like that are those
Speaker 2: hard hat lunch paale guys, godshow whys to buy, you know,
Speaker 2: dugger peppers like these guys have been around and played
Speaker 2: a lot of football in the NFL, and they've done
Speaker 2: it a lot better than what we've seen them do
Speaker 2: it this year. So that's the troubling thing for me.
Speaker 2: On defense, I just don't know where you go with
Speaker 2: that if it's not going to be Jirod fixing it, right, Like,
Speaker 2: if it's not going to be Girod fixing it, like
Speaker 2: I've heard a lot of well, why don't they just
Speaker 2: get the Ben mcado a defense?
Speaker 4: Well, isn't that supposed to be? Yeah, we talked about
Speaker 4: this last week, right, you.
Speaker 2: Know, so you're in a tough spot in there on defense.
Speaker 2: Moving over to the offense, there's a lot of things
Speaker 2: that were said today at Alex Van Pelt's press conference.
Speaker 2: I think a lot of them are relatable to what
Speaker 2: I was going to say anyways. But on the offensive
Speaker 2: side of the ball, I really just felt like it's
Speaker 2: kind of a double whammy here in terms of this
Speaker 2: game against Arizona. One, I don't think they were very
Speaker 2: well prepared for this game against the Cardinals. It was
Speaker 2: a it was a different opponent. They don't play a
Speaker 2: ton you know. It's one of those weird, like you know,
Speaker 2: other conference, like every four years type of games, right, Yeah,
Speaker 2: And I think that they got caught off guard by
Speaker 2: a few things that Arizona did.
Speaker 4: The number one thing. Arizona is one of these teams.
Speaker 2: You know, we talked about the Colts being sort of
Speaker 2: a do what you do defense, and we talked about
Speaker 2: the Bills really being that, Like the Bills are really
Speaker 2: a pretty straightforward defense too. The Cardinals, especially up front,
Speaker 2: they change a lot with their fronts, right like they
Speaker 2: have they run a lot of different varieties of different fronts,
Speaker 2: and they are constantly like shifting the line like right
Speaker 2: before the snap, and they like they do a lot
Speaker 2: of things. And you know, some of it with guys
Speaker 2: like Vederian Low, like he just didn't block the guy right, Like,
Speaker 2: I get that, but a lot of it, you know,
Speaker 2: there was a lot of times in this game, at
Speaker 2: least three or four times where Vederian Low was just
Speaker 2: like blocking air, like he was just blocking an open gap.
Speaker 4: And I'm thinking to myself, like, how is this happening?
Speaker 5: Right?
Speaker 2: Like, how are these things happening? And they're talking to
Speaker 2: some of the linemen. It sounded like they were a
Speaker 2: little bit off with like their points and stuff like
Speaker 2: that of Okay, you know we're gonna have you're gonna
Speaker 2: have this gap. Well, what happens when they shift and
Speaker 2: there's nobody in that gap right, you know. Now, now
Speaker 2: who am I blocking? You know?
Speaker 4: And now a lot of that happened.
Speaker 2: And the other name that came up was budh They
Speaker 2: had a tough time declaring what Buddha Baker was when
Speaker 2: he was in the box. Is he a safety? Is
Speaker 2: he a linebacker? Is he on the tight end? Is
Speaker 2: he blitzing?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 6: Like?
Speaker 4: What is right? What is he? And these are the types.
Speaker 2: Of things that you go into a game and you know,
Speaker 2: the center comes to the line of scrimmage and the
Speaker 2: center calls out the front four down, three down, right,
Speaker 2: like they call out the front even odd and then
Speaker 2: they have rules of like this is how we're treating
Speaker 2: these players, right, So these are the linemen have you know,
Speaker 2: five guys that they can block? So these are the
Speaker 2: five guys the linemen are responsible for. If this guy comes,
Speaker 2: if that guy comes, it's on the quarterback, it's on
Speaker 2: you know, the back and bit blitz pick up, like
Speaker 2: you have different rules. I thought in this game, what
Speaker 2: they really struggled with was that sort of coordination of
Speaker 2: what are we calling this? What are we declaring Buddha Baker?
Speaker 2: You know, how are we setting the mic? If this
Speaker 2: is the way that they're tilted, like those types of things.
Speaker 2: And again I go back to what I said to
Speaker 2: before about controllables, like that's a controllable right, Like that
Speaker 2: is not oh Vederian low Whift trying to block Brandon Browning.
Speaker 2: That is a controllable aspect of the game. That even
Speaker 2: if you have a plan going into the game and
Speaker 2: it's a bad plan, if you're all on the same page,
Speaker 2: then it might still work.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 2: That's that's really how a lot of these things go down,
Speaker 2: Like it could in hindsight, you could look back on
Speaker 2: that and be like, I don't know how it worked,
Speaker 2: like that was kind of an awful plan, but we
Speaker 2: got away with it because everybody was on the same
Speaker 2: page and everybody was doing the same thing. In this game,
Speaker 2: there was way too much of confusion upfront from the
Speaker 2: offensive line. They don't have the talent to get away
Speaker 2: with that, Like they're not talented enough in that group
Speaker 2: to have mental mistakes and lapses and bad snaps and
Speaker 2: things like that. So that was a big, big problem
Speaker 2: in this game. And the other thing that I would
Speaker 2: I would point to, I do not believe they expected
Speaker 2: Arizona to play as much man coverage early on in
Speaker 2: the game, as they did. The Cardinals play a lot
Speaker 2: of zone. They're one of the more zone heavy teams.
Speaker 2: They bucked that trend this week by playing a lot
Speaker 2: of man to man early in the game. They were
Speaker 2: fifty percent man on in the first quarter in this
Speaker 2: game was Arizona. They played a lot more zone as
Speaker 2: the game wore on because the score, you know, they
Speaker 2: they were just kind of keeping things in front of them.
Speaker 2: But they came out and they played man to man,
Speaker 2: and the Patriots got fooled by a lot of their
Speaker 2: man to man coverages into running things that weren't going
Speaker 2: to work into that defense. The Brady thing right like, are.
Speaker 4: You snapping the ball in effective play against that defense?
Speaker 4: Answer to the test, you're right.
Speaker 2: So they you know, big one to me, you know,
Speaker 2: just breaking down the whole opening drive. I've heard a
Speaker 2: lot that they moved the ball on the opening drive.
Speaker 2: If you actually go and watch the opening drive, it
Speaker 2: was a mess, and they moved the ball because they
Speaker 2: had some things go their way within that mess. Very
Speaker 2: first play of the game is at eleven yard completion
Speaker 2: the Hunter Henry. Their spacings off on the on the
Speaker 2: route combination Jalen Polk doesn't clear out. Actually had Austin
Speaker 2: Hooper for a bigger play if the spacing had been correct.
Speaker 2: They have bad spacing on that play. The next play
Speaker 2: they gained sixteen yards on a little swing screen to
Speaker 2: ramondre Stevenson. Ben Brown rolls the snap to Drake May
Speaker 2: and he just gets the playoff on the screen to Remandre.
Speaker 2: Then you have a holding call on third and five.
Speaker 2: And then the third and ten that they got off
Speaker 2: Drake checked into a screen when he shouldn't have checked
Speaker 2: into a screen, right, So like even then it was
Speaker 2: like watching it back, I was like, well I should
Speaker 2: have seen this coming, Like, yes, they got some yards
Speaker 2: out of the first drive, but they really were not
Speaker 2: buttoned up from the get go.
Speaker 4: No, they weren't. It was it was all over the place.
Speaker 4: To go back to something you said about Buddha Baker
Speaker 4: that stood out to me because they talked about during
Speaker 4: the week, Like, Buddha Baker is a guy we need
Speaker 4: to be aware of. They use him differently. They use
Speaker 4: him as a linebacker, they use him as a safety,
Speaker 4: they use him as a corner. We need to know
Speaker 4: where he is, identify him right. Things like that and
Speaker 4: that that wasn't there on the offensive line two it
Speaker 4: looked discombobulated. Ye, to your point, I just think there
Speaker 4: were too many guys, and I there were the talent
Speaker 4: gap was there, right, Darian Logan's blown by a couple
Speaker 4: of times on those two short yarded situations. Lade Robinson
Speaker 4: get stood up. But I think what you see is
Speaker 4: guys try to overcompensate for that, and that's where some
Speaker 4: of the I don't know that I'd call it freelancing,
Speaker 4: but like me different page, Yeah, it comes from.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, you look at I always I hate
Speaker 2: to bring up like all like the Yester Years all
Speaker 2: the time, but like with Scarnekia, how many linemen did
Speaker 2: Scarnekia take? You know that we were like who and
Speaker 2: then all? But it worked because at least they were
Speaker 2: in the right spot. Five guys right, and so even
Speaker 2: if they didn't have great talent at a spot or two,
Speaker 2: they were able to get by because they were so
Speaker 2: well prepared going into the games. And that is very
Speaker 2: noticeable in this film. I'm not saying it's every single week,
Speaker 2: but in this film it was very noticeable that they
Speaker 2: don't play the Cardinals a lot. And I don't think
Speaker 2: that they were fully prepared. I also think if you
Speaker 2: watch the Cardinals against certain teams, you know, they play
Speaker 2: bad teams differently than they play good teams, So the
Speaker 2: numbers are kind of skewed because you know, against good teams,
Speaker 2: they might be a little bit less aggressive than they
Speaker 2: are against bad teams. The other thing I wanted to
Speaker 2: bring up offensively and kind of segue a little bit
Speaker 2: into what Alex van Pelt said today at his press conference,
Speaker 2: which I thought was like one of the most interesting
Speaker 2: press conferences of the year.
Speaker 4: There's a lot to unpack them. We learned like it
Speaker 4: was in terms of being educational, it was good. It
Speaker 4: was I think I received it more positively than you did. Maybe.
Speaker 2: I like Alex van Pelt at press conferences. I think
Speaker 2: he does a nice job. I think he's he's professional
Speaker 2: like and you can clearly tell that that you know,
Speaker 2: he's been experienced at this. The one thing though, that
Speaker 2: I can't let go, and it's bigger to me than
Speaker 2: just the third and fourth and one, like that's sort
Speaker 2: of the microcosm of it, but it's bigger to me
Speaker 2: than that, And really, you know, I always kind of
Speaker 2: felt this way, but It really hit me hard watching
Speaker 2: the Bills offense this week a little bit and studying
Speaker 2: the Bills on film the way that Joe Brady leverages
Speaker 2: all of Josh Allen's talent, like his mobility, his arm talent,
Speaker 2: but especially his mobility into their scheme to threaten defenses
Speaker 2: and to manipulate defenses and create space in the defense
Speaker 2: and all this kind of stuff and numbers advantages for
Speaker 2: the offense, like those types of things that all it
Speaker 2: is is just like Josh Allen needs to be accounted for,
Speaker 2: right Like it's not even something that's like so revolutionary,
Speaker 2: Like they're doing a lot of the same stuff that
Speaker 2: they did, you know, Brady did at LSU in twenty nineteen.
Speaker 2: Right Like, this isn't like super revolutionary, but every single
Speaker 2: play that they call for, Josh Allen has some sort
Speaker 2: of way of leveraging his ability against the defense, right
Speaker 2: Like it's some sort of threat. You know, they run
Speaker 2: that tackle trap play all the time where they pull
Speaker 2: the backside tackle and then they have an option. Right
Speaker 2: he's reading the front side is the end crash? Does
Speaker 2: the end stay? Sometimes they'll put a bubble screen attached
Speaker 2: to it too, so we can throw it out there,
Speaker 2: and then they obviously have the run to James Cook
Speaker 2: on the inside. All those things they're doing is accounting
Speaker 2: for numbers, and so what you see with Buffalo's offense
Speaker 2: is their hat on the hat in the running game constantly, right,
Speaker 2: Like they just have the numbers to the run side
Speaker 2: of the play. For James Cook. When you watch the
Speaker 2: forty one yard touchdown that he had against the Detroit Lions,
Speaker 2: he walks into the end zone because they literally just
Speaker 2: have a dude for every dude that's on the Detroit
Speaker 2: Lions that's to that side of the field. Besides, the
Speaker 2: deep safety in the middle of the field is the
Speaker 2: one guy that James Cook has to make miss. But
Speaker 2: once he's moving full speed at you know, ten, twelve,
Speaker 2: fifteen yards down the field, it becomes pretty easy for
Speaker 2: a talented back like him to make the free safety
Speaker 2: miss in the middle of the So you have these
Speaker 2: advantages that Allen's mobility has in the offense, you know,
Speaker 2: moving the pocket right, like even from under center, like
Speaker 2: having boots and having nakeds and things like that, like
Speaker 2: all of these things that they've built into this scheme.
Speaker 2: And then you watch the Patriots and they just don't
Speaker 2: do any of those kinds of things with Drake May.
Speaker 2: And they don't use Drake May's full you know, assembly
Speaker 2: of powers right Like it's it's like they, you know,
Speaker 2: use a superhero comparison, Like they don't use all of
Speaker 2: his of his superpowers at their disposal. They don't leverage
Speaker 2: these things against the defense. He's their best playmaker on offense.
Speaker 2: He's the best thing they got going for him, and
Speaker 2: they're they're not They're asking him to play to like
Speaker 2: seventy five percent of his strains by not running him.
Speaker 2: So today with Dallas Vanpeld he had a lot to
Speaker 2: say about this sort of thing. I think the biggest
Speaker 2: thing to me was that he mentioned earlier on in
Speaker 2: his press conference that there they want to have a
Speaker 2: conservative effort, uh concerted effort, I should say, of getting
Speaker 2: Drake May through these last three games healthy. And the
Speaker 2: natural fall up for me was, if you guys were
Speaker 2: eleven and three instead of three and eleven, would you
Speaker 2: be running him in these situations?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 2: And his answer was yes. So that tells me that
Speaker 2: the Patriots are basically telling us that they have gone
Speaker 2: out of their way to or in the order to
Speaker 2: protect Drake May from injury to not run the offense
Speaker 2: at its full boat right and to and to take
Speaker 2: some of these quarterback runs off the table until they're
Speaker 2: more competitive as a team. But my only like sort
Speaker 2: of uh, you know, clapback at that is, how do
Speaker 2: you expect to be a competitive team if your quarterback
Speaker 2: is being held back?
Speaker 4: Right? Like?
Speaker 2: How that that's what makes the Bills the Bills, Like,
Speaker 2: that's what makes them unstoppable. That's what makes the Baltimore
Speaker 2: Ravens stoppable, you know. So that's what makes Jayden Daniels
Speaker 2: and the Commander is a playoff team.
Speaker 4: It's funny you use those three examples because the Bills
Speaker 4: have had trouble getting over the hump in part because
Speaker 4: Josh Allen is so banged up at the end of
Speaker 4: every year. The Ravens have had trouble getting over the
Speaker 4: hump because Lamar is not Lamar come the playoffs because
Speaker 4: he's taken such a beating. The Commanders have fallen off
Speaker 4: ever since Shane Daniels suffered that rib injury. So I
Speaker 4: think you kind of get your answer there is to
Speaker 4: why they're worried about it. That's a fair point because
Speaker 4: they and Van Pelt like he almost sounded shell shock
Speaker 4: today when he's talking about, yeah, I know what comes
Speaker 4: with the quarterback run game. I remember losing the quarterback
Speaker 4: for the year in Cleveland and you look at now, Look,
Speaker 4: I think Mahomes is fine. But in theory, you look
Speaker 4: with the Chiefs are going through Mahomes right now, things
Speaker 4: like that. So I've talked about this. I don't think
Speaker 4: the answer to how much you run the quarterback who
Speaker 4: can be a factor in the run game is zero.
Speaker 4: I think you just take some of the risk that
Speaker 4: comes with him getting hurt because of what that can
Speaker 4: add to your offense. On not running him right now,
Speaker 4: you know, I think it's glass half full, glass half empty.
Speaker 4: When you look at Van Pelt's approach on one hand,
Speaker 4: and this goes back to conversations we had. It's very
Speaker 4: similar the conversations we had about when to start Drake
Speaker 4: may right, And you know, is he going to help
Speaker 4: you win more games right now in the immediate yes,
Speaker 4: But is that ultimately what's best for the organization. You
Speaker 4: could argue glass half empty. I don't care what the
Speaker 4: record is. Win games. That's your job. Go out there,
Speaker 4: do everything you can win every single game. On the schedule.
Speaker 4: You could look at it glass half fall and say
Speaker 4: Van Pelt, you know, where's his job security at? And
Speaker 4: he's still so I think not running Drake May right now.
Speaker 4: Now they could have worked in a quarterback steak last week,
Speaker 4: but as a whole, I think not running Drake May
Speaker 4: right now makes sense. We know he can do it.
Speaker 4: It's not the kind of thing that you're necessarily going
Speaker 4: to get better with that better at with reps. I
Speaker 4: think it's just an instinct thing. Every run is different.
Speaker 4: You can you know he can work on that in practice,
Speaker 4: that's not something where he needs to do in games
Speaker 4: a lot to get I also don't know how much
Speaker 4: better he needs to get at it. He's a pretty
Speaker 4: dang good runner when he takes off on a scramble,
Speaker 4: right Yeah. Sure, some things with the Reid option and
Speaker 4: seeing that better, but again you can simulate that in practice.
Speaker 4: I get wanting him to get through the year healthy.
Speaker 4: I've said this since the beginning. The worst thing that
Speaker 4: could happen is he suffers some kind of long term
Speaker 4: injury and loses development time early in his career. So,
Speaker 4: you know, Van Pelt, with his job potentially online doing
Speaker 4: what's best for the kid and along with that doing
Speaker 4: what's best for the organization. Big picture. You look at
Speaker 4: and you say, that's a guy that's a leader, that's
Speaker 4: a guy that has the team over himself. Yeah. So again,
Speaker 4: you can approach it both ways, and maybe there's some
Speaker 4: truth to both of them. But it was a really
Speaker 4: good question by you, and I think it kind of
Speaker 4: shows you where they're at right now. And Drake even
Speaker 4: talked about it this week, and John Mayo talked about
Speaker 4: it this week. These last three games are about development.
Speaker 4: These last three games are about who's gonna go out,
Speaker 4: Who's gonna be a part of this team moving forward.
Speaker 4: We know the roster's going to change this offseason. Who
Speaker 4: is You know you have guys from guys like Drake May,
Speaker 4: Christian Zalez down to the bottom of the roster who
Speaker 4: are trying to show what they can do for next year.
Speaker 4: Drake May gets hurt, it blows a lot of things up. Yeah,
Speaker 4: so I thought it. He didn't need to admit that.
Speaker 4: He certainly didn't need to admit it, could have lied,
Speaker 4: could have talked around it. If he talks around it,
Speaker 4: we kind of know what's going on. But I can't
Speaker 4: help but at least in part commend him for it
Speaker 4: because again, his job, we don't know, his job might
Speaker 4: be on the line, and he's still doing what's best
Speaker 4: for Drake may So I like that take.
Speaker 2: I agree with you that that's commendable by Alex van Pelt,
Speaker 2: that he could go into this and I think, you know,
Speaker 2: just to use another rookie quarterback. I think the Commanders
Speaker 2: did this. I think the Commanders came out and they
Speaker 2: unleashed Jaden Daniels right now. They installed basically a college
Speaker 2: offense with a college you know, coordinator and longtime head
Speaker 2: coach in Cliff Kingsbury, and they ran LSU's offense at
Speaker 2: the NFL level and it was gangbusters for the first
Speaker 2: like six weeks of the season, and to your point,
Speaker 2: he gets hurt and it hasn't been as good right now.
Speaker 2: The biggest thing that I would just say and reverse
Speaker 2: to that though, is like my concern is that we
Speaker 2: don't necessarily know the schematic chops of Alex van Pelt
Speaker 2: in terms of designing that kind of options if they
Speaker 2: haven't put it on film.
Speaker 4: That's where it gets in this weird conversation talking about
Speaker 4: Alex man Pelt for the future, because if you want
Speaker 4: to defend him and defend his job, you can sit
Speaker 4: here and say, we know he's good at player development.
Speaker 4: We know he's good at that part of it. There
Speaker 4: is more, like, if he's holding back the quarterback runs,
Speaker 4: what else he holding back? Maybe there's other things. Maybe
Speaker 4: it's not about Drake May's health, but maybe there's some things.
Speaker 4: And it's like we're three and eleven.
Speaker 2: I have this, but I'd rather save it and not
Speaker 2: put it on tape and come out next year week
Speaker 2: one with it and go gangbusters.
Speaker 4: Right, here's why. Or you could say, all right, he's
Speaker 4: holding back the quarterback runs saying that to save his job.
Speaker 4: How much is how much more really is there? Why
Speaker 4: wouldn't he be doing it?
Speaker 2: Yeah, sorry to interrupt. Here's where I'm at with that. Yeah,
Speaker 2: because this is where it comes in with like, because
Speaker 2: I think this is an interesting conversation, right, Like we
Speaker 2: don't actually know the answer to that question of how
Speaker 2: much is he holding back versus not? No, we can
Speaker 2: only speculate, but I would say that comment opens the
Speaker 2: door to the possibility that he's holding more back, right, so,
Speaker 2: or sorry to cut you off again, how much is
Speaker 2: he holding back because we don't have the offensive line
Speaker 2: to run this, we don't have the wide receivers to
Speaker 2: run this, et cetera. Right, So here, here's where I
Speaker 2: would go if I am Drod Mayo in this whole regime.
Speaker 2: Right now, here was where I would go with Van
Speaker 2: Pelt in January, when the season is over, I would
Speaker 2: say to Alex van Pelt, Okay, show me the actual stuff, right,
Speaker 2: you know, give me a presentation of what you actually
Speaker 2: want to run or actually are capable or could run
Speaker 2: in terms of quarterback runs in particular, or just movement right,
Speaker 2: like moving the pocket right, running the quarterback, all the
Speaker 2: things that we could do, uh to I know you
Speaker 2: you're gonna hate to basically bills like this offense, right,
Speaker 2: like you really want to be the bills like that,
Speaker 2: that's what you want to do.
Speaker 4: Cutting down the turnovers. But yeah, and we know Van
Speaker 4: Pelt is not okay with the turnovers, unlike the nerds
Speaker 4: who have excused them. Okay, he doesn't turn the ball
Speaker 4: over as much anymore because they made it a point
Speaker 4: of emphasis. So back to back weeks, get to the
Speaker 4: place we'll get to the interceptions.
Speaker 2: But so basically, give me a presentation, give me a
Speaker 2: power point on this is what we're actually gonna run.
Speaker 2: And because if I'm Gerrod Mayo and Elliot Wolf, I'm
Speaker 2: saying to Alex Van Pelt, well, we're gonna get the
Speaker 2: personnel right now. I understand that people hear me say
Speaker 2: that and are like, well, what confidence do you have. Well,
Speaker 2: if they're not gonna get the personnel, it doesn't matter
Speaker 2: what they call, right, So let's just operate on the
Speaker 2: on the prism that they are actually gonna do their
Speaker 2: jobs and they're gonna be They're gonna get the personnel.
Speaker 2: We're gonna get the personnel. We don't want you to
Speaker 2: worry about that right now in season. You gotta worry
Speaker 2: about the fact that you're left tackles and right tackles
Speaker 2: deficient and all that stuff.
Speaker 4: But we're gonna get you tackled. That's done.
Speaker 2: We're gonna get your receivers, Like, just tell us what
Speaker 2: you have cooking in the lab and if you like
Speaker 2: what he says, then great, then then you're good.
Speaker 4: You're golden.
Speaker 2: Yeah, if you don't like what he says, you have
Speaker 2: two choices. One is obviously to move on. The other
Speaker 2: choice is sending him and this happens all the time,
Speaker 2: and coaching sending him to some like college program and
Speaker 2: you're probably better at picking a program than me, honestly,
Speaker 2: uh for like a week or two just to learn
Speaker 2: their quarterback run package, right, Like, just teach me your
Speaker 2: quarterback run package and have Van Pelt then come back
Speaker 2: with a different a new chapter to his play.
Speaker 4: What right think about? And maybe this wouldn't this wouldn't
Speaker 4: have to be instead of that, But what about having
Speaker 4: like a run game coordinator a pass game coordinator?
Speaker 2: Adding yeah, or that's another option too, right, is like
Speaker 2: hiring somebody from the outside who specializes in like spread
Speaker 2: offense and that kind of stuff, and is going to
Speaker 2: install that along with Alex van Pelt. I forget who
Speaker 2: I was listening to on the radio the other day,
Speaker 2: so I'm sorry that I can't credit this person, but
Speaker 2: they said that this is what Andy Reid did in
Speaker 2: Kansas City. It might have been Burt, it might have
Speaker 2: been Albert Breer that he hired Brad Childress to come
Speaker 2: in and essentially be his spread game coordinator and take
Speaker 2: the Chiefs West Coast offense and turn it into a
Speaker 2: modern West Coast offense, right and install all these rbos
Speaker 2: and motions and things like that into the offense. So
Speaker 2: that's a path for you too. And then when we
Speaker 2: come back in here for OTAs and you come back
Speaker 2: in here for training camp next season and next spring
Speaker 2: and summer, that's when you start drilling all these things, right, Like,
Speaker 2: that's when you really start to hone in on running
Speaker 2: these things, so that when you get to September, you've
Speaker 2: drilled it for six weeks and you guys know what
Speaker 2: you're doing, you know, in terms of these types of things.
Speaker 2: That would be my big thing with Van Pelt now
Speaker 2: is all right, we got through the season.
Speaker 4: We knew it wasn't gonna be pretty. It wasn't pretty,
Speaker 4: But what's next? Like what's two point zero of this?
Speaker 4: Seems to say they maybe aren't already doing some of
Speaker 4: that stuff. At practice, Van Pelts talked about like there
Speaker 4: are things on the play sheet he's not calming. Yeah,
Speaker 4: so maybe this has already started. Yeah, I'll give you
Speaker 4: the school. By the way, you're not gonna like this,
Speaker 4: but I'll give you the school that you do that with. Okay,
Speaker 4: it's army.
Speaker 2: I honestly don't hate it.
Speaker 4: Bryson Daily is like a big physical. Now he's not
Speaker 4: six ' five like Drake, Yeah, but he's six foot
Speaker 4: he's listened to twenty. I think he's bigger than that.
Speaker 4: I think he's probably closer to two thirty yea. And
Speaker 4: it's a lot of that, like you want to Josh
Speaker 4: Allen kind of runs where it's not you know, you
Speaker 4: look at how Lamar runs, you look at how Jane
Speaker 4: Daniels runs. They're running to the outside, they're using more speed,
Speaker 4: they're trying to get to the perimeter. Josh Allen is
Speaker 4: and they'll run him to the outside too, but they're
Speaker 4: not afraid to put him between the tackles and have
Speaker 4: him truck somebody. That's kind of how bryceon Daly and
Speaker 4: Army's offense were.
Speaker 2: Yes, so they run a lot of inverted Verer in Buffalo,
Speaker 2: so like, well that's Army. Yeah, So like inverted meaning
Speaker 2: that the inside run is actually the quarterback and not
Speaker 2: the running back. The running back is the one that's
Speaker 2: trying to get the corner, and the quarterback is the
Speaker 2: one that's trying to get the middle of the wall.
Speaker 4: And actually you get the perfect marriage of it because
Speaker 4: you know who Armies head coaches, Todd Bonkin's brother, Todd
Speaker 4: Monkets Jeff Monkett. Yeah, so you get and and him
Speaker 4: and his brother obviously discussed these things right there, kind
Speaker 4: of a similar philosophy. So you have that Jeff Monkin
Speaker 4: kind of influence, that Ravens influence. But you also they
Speaker 4: built it around Brendan Daly is a more physical, bruising runner.
Speaker 4: He's not gonna run around guy, He's gonna run over guys.
Speaker 4: He was I think the fifth or sixth leading rusher
Speaker 4: in college football this year, not among quarterbacks, just overall.
Speaker 4: That's the That's the school i'd try to emulate. Yeah, look,
Speaker 4: I just the seventh in the nation. He ran for
Speaker 4: fifteen hundred yards in twelve games.
Speaker 2: I am willing to be open to the fact that
Speaker 2: Alex van Pelt might still be capable of doing this
Speaker 2: himself without having to change coordinators. And I gotta be
Speaker 2: honest with you, like, you know how much I love
Speaker 2: Josh McDaniels. I think Josh McDaniels is a great coordinator,
Speaker 2: not a great head coach, but a great coordinator and
Speaker 2: a great play caller. But it does concern me to
Speaker 2: change playbooks on Drake May from year one to year two.
Speaker 2: He's more talented than Mac Jones. He's a better quarterback
Speaker 2: than Mac Jones. But we just did this, like we
Speaker 2: just changed coordinators on a rookie quarterback that had a
Speaker 2: promising rookie season and went to somebody different, and it
Speaker 2: just went off the rails like three years ago, right,
Speaker 2: not even And I just I'm very wary of that.
Speaker 2: It's not the reason you keep Alex van Pelt like,
Speaker 2: it's not. The number one reason is continuity. I don't
Speaker 2: think that's what it is. But I do think it
Speaker 2: has to play a factor in where you go on offense.
Speaker 2: And I do believe that if it's Gerd Mayo that
Speaker 2: he wants to run a West Coast system, I don't
Speaker 2: think he wants to necessarily go back to the to
Speaker 2: the Earnhard Perkins offense, Like I don't think he necessarily
Speaker 2: wants to do that. So look, I I'm open to
Speaker 2: the fact that it could be Ox van pel that
Speaker 2: that does this and does this pivot. But in order
Speaker 2: for me to be open to that, I would I would.
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm not going to They're not gonna I'm
Speaker 2: not going to be in on the meeting shocker, But
Speaker 2: like you have to have a presentation, you have to
Speaker 2: have to sit down, and I wouldn't even.
Speaker 4: Wait till the end of the year. I think that
Speaker 4: would start probably now, and maybe you start doing some
Speaker 4: of that stuff at practice to kind of see what
Speaker 4: it looks like. So you know, you know your point
Speaker 4: about that. If they were to have that meeting, it's
Speaker 4: not just okay, what are your will get you the player?
Speaker 4: What are your plans? It's what are your plans so
Speaker 4: we know which players to get right that fit into that?
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, I mean I think they have some of
Speaker 2: the guys already that oh yeah, that would fit into it.
Speaker 2: Maybe maybe not so much on the line because they
Speaker 2: have a lot of work to do there. But I
Speaker 2: actually really feel like Pop Douglas is like a useful
Speaker 2: player and that sort of thing. You know, I watch
Speaker 2: how the Bills, I use Khalil Shakir Uh and killers.
Speaker 2: Here's a little thicker, like it's a little bigger than
Speaker 2: Pop Douglas, But like in general, you know, they run
Speaker 2: a lot of orbit right with the motion coming behind
Speaker 2: the quarterback and things like that.
Speaker 4: George last week, Yeah, Cardinals.
Speaker 2: Yeah, like they use a lot of that orbit motion
Speaker 2: or satellite motion where he goes behind the quarterback. And
Speaker 2: what I really like about what the Bills will do
Speaker 2: is they'll they'll use the motion man to run a
Speaker 2: play action fake to the motion right, so they're gonna
Speaker 2: fake the sweep, the you know, the Jets sweep or whatever,
Speaker 2: and then that allows that frees up the running back
Speaker 2: to like get into the pattern instantly. So they ran
Speaker 2: like an orbit motion behind Josh Allen against Detroit and
Speaker 2: then they ran the back and on a wheel right
Speaker 2: from the place that the motion was coming from right,
Speaker 2: so that space just opens up and then they get
Speaker 2: man to man coverage and it's just a running back
Speaker 2: on a linebacker with like twenty five yards of space
Speaker 2: to work with, and it was a bomb. So you
Speaker 2: look at these types of things that Buffalo does. That's
Speaker 2: that's just what the Patriots offense is missing, and that
Speaker 2: you know people that are not it's like me that
Speaker 2: are studying Bills tape this week, Like when you watch
Speaker 2: the game on Sunday, you'll see it. Like you'll see
Speaker 2: when they get down on the goal line that they're
Speaker 2: running bash and they're running counter and they're running trap
Speaker 2: and they're running all these things with Alan that allow
Speaker 2: him to just walk into the end zone sometimes untouched
Speaker 2: for touchdowns like last week. You know, the Red Seas
Speaker 2: just parted and he just waltzed in for a touchdown
Speaker 2: from like three or four yards out. The Patriots need
Speaker 2: to get that stuff in the playbook next year, like
Speaker 2: it needs to be in the playbook next year. That's
Speaker 2: how you get competitive. I get it now. But that's
Speaker 2: how you get competitive on that side of the ball.
Speaker 2: So that's that's your coaching autopsy. Did you do three up,
Speaker 2: three down? Are you prepared?
Speaker 4: I am all right? Did we agree that we're retiring
Speaker 4: Christian ZoZ just saying he's good? Okay?
Speaker 2: So I have two up and four down because of
Speaker 2: you know that kind of game. That's what you get
Speaker 2: from me. So I'll just start because we both just
Speaker 2: said it. I had Christianzalees is the number one.
Speaker 4: I think he's just like he just counts it like
Speaker 4: we did with bar Moore last ye he's number one up.
Speaker 2: I still want to talk about it because there's not
Speaker 2: a whole lot of positives to talk about it right now.
Speaker 2: This to me was one of his best games as
Speaker 2: a pro. Now, Marvin Harrison Junior is maybe not the
Speaker 2: instant franchise number one receiver that we thought he was gonna.
Speaker 4: I wouldn't say we there because some people some people
Speaker 4: it said he was very good, but he was not
Speaker 4: going to instantly step in and fix everything. You did
Speaker 4: say that the way many thought you did say that.
Speaker 2: Now. I also had him and Malik Davers really close.
Speaker 2: By the end of the process.
Speaker 4: Has been good. I think he's just limited in that offense.
Speaker 2: So Christian Gonzales against Marvin Harrison Junior. I didn't write
Speaker 2: down routes. I think it was twenty two routes across
Speaker 2: from him in coverage, five targets, one catch, twenty three
Speaker 2: yards and it is a pick play. Didn't play it great,
Speaker 2: to be fair.
Speaker 4: I'm surprised more teams haven't done that to Gonzalez this year,
Speaker 4: and I think you're gonna start to see it more now.
Speaker 2: So he's usually pretty good at navigating it. On this one,
Speaker 2: I think he was in inside the slot. I think
Speaker 2: that sort of took him by surprise that they ran
Speaker 2: it that way. So he had PFF had him with
Speaker 2: two PBUs technically, I know the the box score after
Speaker 2: the game, I want to say had had three one
Speaker 2: of them now, but PFF tracks what they call forced
Speaker 2: in completions, which isn't necessarily that they get a hand
Speaker 2: in there to deflect the pass, but it's more just
Speaker 2: like such tight coverage that like there's no way the
Speaker 2: pass was going to be completed sort of thing. So
Speaker 2: they had four of those for him on five targets.
Speaker 2: So all the other targets that he had, he was
Speaker 2: just he had him in jail. I mean, he was
Speaker 2: just strapped in on Marvin Harrison Junior. This is one
Speaker 2: of those tapes that when you're Christian Gonzalez, who I
Speaker 2: talked to you this week, I have a post about
Speaker 2: it tomorrow. If you want to make the case that
Speaker 2: Christian Gonzalez is like an All Pro, a Pro Bowl
Speaker 2: caliber player this year, that this is this is the
Speaker 2: film that you show, Yeah, you know this was This
Speaker 2: was a league cornerback play by him on side. Yeah.
Speaker 4: I mean, I don't have much to add to that,
Speaker 4: just playing incredibly high level right now. I think, you know,
Speaker 4: the team's records probably hurting him in terms of some
Speaker 4: of that league recognition stuff, Pro Bowl, All Pro. But
Speaker 4: can you name five better corners in the NFL right now?
Speaker 7: No?
Speaker 2: I mean sir Tan's having a great year.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Uh, Stingley's having a great year. I would say that
Speaker 2: you're a third right, like you're you're you have an
Speaker 2: argument that Christian Gonzalez has been at worst the third
Speaker 2: best corners.
Speaker 4: By the way, this show had Stingley oversaw us that
Speaker 4: it did it did, did it did very proud. I
Speaker 4: was like annoyed by that one. It really goes to
Speaker 4: show and this is the last thing I promised have
Speaker 4: to move.
Speaker 2: But we've talked about this before, and I know Stefan
Speaker 2: Gilmore once he got into like a little bit cocky
Speaker 2: defensive player of the Year mode, which I loved.
Speaker 4: I love that version of Stefan Gilmore. Uh.
Speaker 2: He came out and said it like there's zone corners
Speaker 2: and there's man corners, like some of us, like Christian Gonzalez,
Speaker 2: like Stefan Gilmore, like Derek Stingley, Like we try right
Speaker 2: and we're gonna go with you all over the field,
Speaker 2: whether you're in the slot, whether you're left, you know,
Speaker 2: to the left of the quarterback, to the right of
Speaker 2: the quarterback.
Speaker 4: Like we're going with you everywhere.
Speaker 2: Then there's corners like Sauce Gardner that had just taken
Speaker 2: a deep third of the field and cover three all
Speaker 2: game long. And when you have a great pass rush,
Speaker 2: you all of a sudden you look great, right like
Speaker 2: you look fantastic. Oh wow, you know I easier job
Speaker 2: is an easier job.
Speaker 4: I've said this to you off there. I don't know
Speaker 4: that I've brought this take on the year before that
Speaker 4: Seattle three defense. Yes, is two corners with the Shanahan
Speaker 4: offenses to quarterbacks. Yeah, it takes a lot off their plate.
Speaker 4: It makes it very paint by number for them. It
Speaker 4: puts the emphasis some players in other positions.
Speaker 2: Yeah, good one. Who's your number two?
Speaker 4: My number two?
Speaker 8: Up?
Speaker 4: I had four because I didn't know if we were
Speaker 4: if I didn't remember if were tired Christian Azalz or not. Yeah,
Speaker 4: Drake May Yeah. I thought for what this game was,
Speaker 4: and they were obviously very conservative. Was that because the
Speaker 4: offensive line was struggling and they wanted to protect him?
Speaker 4: Was it just general conservativeness? Is probably some of both?
Speaker 4: For what this game was, he handled himself well. A
Speaker 4: couple bad snaps avoided disaster there. I thought, I know
Speaker 4: it's in garbage time. The throw to Kendrick Bourne's a
Speaker 4: really good throw. Your arm doesn't know how much times
Speaker 4: on the clock or what the scoreboard is Mechanically, physically,
Speaker 4: it's an impressive throw. Same with the play to Pop
Speaker 4: Douglas and he he turned the ball over, but that
Speaker 4: it hit the receiver in both hands. Yeah, like second,
Speaker 4: he didn't put the ball on Harm's way for a
Speaker 4: second straight game. He did have a spray, which we
Speaker 4: hadn't seen from him in a few weeks. Yeah, but
Speaker 4: it wasn't a dangerous throw. Was he just he missed it.
Speaker 4: It wasn't near anybody. You hope the sprays don't add up,
Speaker 4: you know, It's just all right. It came back, move
Speaker 4: on from it. But I thought for what this game was,
Speaker 4: this was a game where Drake may probably should have
Speaker 4: had a much worse game than he did, just given
Speaker 4: everything surrounding him, And yet he was solid.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So the reason why I didn't have him as
Speaker 2: an up isn't it because I didn't consider all the
Speaker 2: same things.
Speaker 4: They just asked so little of him in this game.
Speaker 2: And this is another thing about you know, I didn't
Speaker 2: bring this up with the whole rant about the offense,
Speaker 2: but this is my initial take after the game. So
Speaker 2: I didn't want to repeat myself too much. They just
Speaker 2: came out of this game. This was Patricia esk like
Speaker 2: in terms of like screen screen draw draw, right, Like,
Speaker 2: they just didn't put anything on his plate. And that,
Speaker 2: to me was really frustrating because for one and the
Speaker 2: boss says this all the time, Fred says, don't coddle him, right,
Speaker 2: like you did that with mac Jones. And it worked
Speaker 2: for one year, and then the more that was put
Speaker 2: on mac Jones's shoulders, the worst that it got, Like
Speaker 2: you have to see what you're capable of at this level.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't know if it was coddling so much
Speaker 4: as protecting, especially in the wake of Van Pelt's comments today. Yeah,
Speaker 4: you look at the way that offensive line played early, right,
Speaker 4: I wonder if they saw that and said, yeah, we
Speaker 4: can't five step drops, No, those are off the play sheet. Rollouts, no,
Speaker 4: those are off the play sheet. Like I wonder if
Speaker 4: they just looked at it and said, we got to
Speaker 4: make sure he makes it through this game. The offense,
Speaker 4: like sometimes starting pitcher in baseball gets up there in
Speaker 4: the first inning, hangs a curveball and maybe it's a
Speaker 4: good pitch, but hangs his curveball and catcher looks at
Speaker 4: it and says, doesn't have the curveball today. We're throwing
Speaker 4: more fastballs, We're throwing more change ups. I wonder if
Speaker 4: they just went out there saw it. Offensive line doesn't
Speaker 4: have it today. We can't put the kid in in danger.
Speaker 4: Ear I hear that.
Speaker 2: But when you go into halftime and his average aery
Speaker 2: yards per target is negative point eight, like you're below zero. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and everything is near the line of scrimmage. They really
Speaker 2: didn't even remotely touch on opening up this offense until
Speaker 2: midway through the I'm.
Speaker 4: Not necessarily defending it. Like if they if the goal
Speaker 4: was to protect him, I get it, but they overdid it. Yeah,
Speaker 4: I'm just saying, I wonder if that's what happened. I
Speaker 4: wonder if it was so much protecting Drake. May the
Speaker 4: rookie putting too much on his plate just for his
Speaker 4: physically protecting him with the blocking.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm be in. Look, he grated out well again,
Speaker 2: but a lot of his plus players came late in
Speaker 2: this game. You know, some people would say, in garbage
Speaker 2: time of this game, Uh, the interception, I put it
Speaker 2: on Booty. But I also think he was late to
Speaker 2: the d cut a little bit because of the pressure.
Speaker 2: You know, that's one of those that it's probably more
Speaker 2: on Ben Brown getting beat and Booty dropping the pass,
Speaker 2: and it is on Drake. But I've seen him throw
Speaker 2: that ball sooner and better and like more on time,
Speaker 2: I guess is the better way to put it in
Speaker 2: the past, you know, like the ones to Kendrick Bourne
Speaker 2: against the Colts were just perfectly time, perfectly fit.
Speaker 4: Overlords at PFF said it wasn't a turnover worthy play.
Speaker 2: It's not a turnover worthy play, just like in my
Speaker 2: mind the Hunter Henry one on the goal line wasn't
Speaker 2: a turnover worthy play.
Speaker 4: But could it have been? Could have been better? Yeah, right,
Speaker 4: but it shouldn't. That throw shouldn't lead to a turnover. No,
Speaker 4: that's why it's not a turnover worthy play.
Speaker 2: Now. I just it goes back to the quarterback run
Speaker 2: thing for me as well. Like they they just they
Speaker 2: did not ask him to do a whole.
Speaker 4: Lot in this game.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And in my mind when I'm watching it, when
Speaker 2: I was about it right after the game, I'm like,
Speaker 2: he's not Bailey's appy, like right, Like you know, he's
Speaker 2: very talented. Like I don't understand why we're bottling up
Speaker 2: him up here, and then all of a sudden, you
Speaker 2: get it, Arizona starts playing some softer coverages. It's garbage time,
Speaker 2: whatever you want to call it. But like to your
Speaker 2: point that the goball to Kendrick Bourne in the fourth quarter,
Speaker 2: that's man to man right, Like, that's not they're not
Speaker 2: backing off there. They're playing press man across the board
Speaker 2: and he just throws a dime to Kendrick Bourne. Like,
Speaker 2: if you do that in the first quarter instead of
Speaker 2: the fourth quarter, and that play doesn't take forever, that's
Speaker 2: not like he doesn't need four seconds to like get
Speaker 2: that throw off. But if you do that early in
Speaker 2: the game, then some of the short game stuff that
Speaker 2: they were trying to do now it almost makes the
Speaker 2: defense like respected a little right, Like you know, now
Speaker 2: maybe some of those swings and the screens and the
Speaker 2: flats and things like that, Like maybe that stuff like
Speaker 2: works out. You know, the little sticks that they like
Speaker 2: to run to the tight ends that the Cardinals will
Speaker 2: we're all over. Well, if you run a little stick
Speaker 2: nod right where he acts like he's gonna sit, and
Speaker 2: then he goes up the field, up the seam and
Speaker 2: he hits him early on in the game. Well, now,
Speaker 2: maybe they don't sit all over those throws underneath anymore.
Speaker 2: Those are the types of things that I just feel
Speaker 2: like they could have done better. Anyways, I digress my
Speaker 2: my second up in this game.
Speaker 4: You want some interesting breaking news here? Sure, the Jets
Speaker 4: have interviewed Senior Bowl executive director Jim Nagy for their
Speaker 4: GM job. Oh interesting? What do you think that?
Speaker 2: I like Jim Nagy? I really have enjoyed all my
Speaker 2: conversations that I've had with him. I think he's a
Speaker 2: bright football mind. I think it would behoove him to
Speaker 2: not have to gas up every single player that goes
Speaker 2: to Mobile, right, you know, I think that would that
Speaker 2: would help.
Speaker 4: He's very good.
Speaker 2: At putting together teams and understanding the landscape of college.
Speaker 2: So from that aspect, if you're just looking to be
Speaker 2: truly like a draft and developed team, it's a it's
Speaker 2: a good person to interview.
Speaker 4: Yeah, is he gonna use MAGN ratings? So that's the question. No,
Speaker 4: he is not. You saw that, right, did I can't.
Speaker 4: I don't. I'm choosing to believe that that story wasn't real.
Speaker 4: Next time people say who cares about the men ratings?
Speaker 4: Woody Johnson is a really great apparently really great. Apparently
Speaker 4: he cares.
Speaker 2: Number two up number two Antonio Gibson. Okay, I thought
Speaker 2: Antonio Gibson both running backs. Yeah, I thought Antonio Gibson
Speaker 2: was fantastic in this game. Continues to just pound the
Speaker 2: table for more and more opportunities. He had eleven forced
Speaker 2: miss tackles in this game.
Speaker 4: And he had more yards after contact than he had totally.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so he had forty four after contact as a runner,
Speaker 2: and then he had thirty three yards after the catch
Speaker 2: in the passing game. So he had seventy seven yards
Speaker 2: that he basically.
Speaker 4: He did on his own, did on his own. Yeah. No,
Speaker 4: he's good. Stevenson too. So the Patriots backs finished with
Speaker 4: one hundred and sixteen yards or sorry, no, that's with
Speaker 4: Drake may I'm not gonna do the math in my head.
Speaker 4: They they had how many did Drake may Drake may hae?
Speaker 4: None after contact? So the Patriots running backs finished with
Speaker 4: one hundred and two yards in this game. Ninety eight
Speaker 4: of those yards were after contact.
Speaker 9: Yeah.
Speaker 4: This you know, it was like early in the season
Speaker 4: against the Bengals where the running game worked. It wasn't
Speaker 4: because of the offensive line. It was those guys creating
Speaker 4: and good for them. And I thought, I think Ramondre Stevenson,
Speaker 4: after a rough stretch there in the middle of the year,
Speaker 4: continues to kind of get back into form. Here Gibson
Speaker 4: should have a bigger role. And you see as Gibson
Speaker 4: gets a bigger role, Ramondre Stevenson looks a little bit fresher.
Speaker 4: I wonder if those two things.
Speaker 2: They outside the by which I think did remind of
Speaker 2: the buy.
Speaker 4: But just as a hole for the last few weeks.
Speaker 4: So I thought both running backs ran hard, ran well.
Speaker 4: That was encouraging to see, especially like in theory. Obviously
Speaker 4: they're out of it now, but like these are probably
Speaker 4: gonna be their top two backs again next year, just
Speaker 4: based on contracts. Yeah, that kind of running. They're in Arizona,
Speaker 4: they're indoors. You get up here in the cold late
Speaker 4: in the year, you start running like that, you're gonna
Speaker 4: create some really big plays. Yeah.
Speaker 2: So that the one play at the end of the
Speaker 2: game by Gibson where he catches the ball that's a
Speaker 2: little behind him with one hand, then breaks like three
Speaker 2: tackles and goes for a pretty big and it's.
Speaker 4: Also with that those numbers, by the way, or without
Speaker 4: the one that was brought back on the Leaden Robinson.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that's that was a big time play
Speaker 2: on that catch at the end of the game by
Speaker 2: Antonio Gibson.
Speaker 4: All right, anybody else? Yeah, I have one more Christian Ellis.
Speaker 4: I know it was a rough game for the defense
Speaker 4: as a whole, but he comes up. He tackles Kyler
Speaker 4: Murray in space on a third down. That's a really
Speaker 4: good tackle. Had another good tackle early on on the
Speaker 4: big James Connor run where Brill Peppers gets beat. You
Speaker 4: watch Christan Ellis on that. He comes almost all the
Speaker 4: way across the field to chase him down and make
Speaker 4: that tackle. Busted his ass. If not, that's a touchdown. Yeah,
Speaker 4: And I hate, I hate to give an up on
Speaker 4: a play that was a what fifty six yard run?
Speaker 4: And it was kind of just that kind of game.
Speaker 4: But this where this team is at record wise, this
Speaker 4: time of year, who's still trying, who's still giving it?
Speaker 4: There all? Christan Nellis played with great motor in this game.
Speaker 4: He made a couple of plays when nobody else on
Speaker 4: defense really did you talk about what's the playing down
Speaker 4: the road? How many of these guys are still going
Speaker 4: to be here. I don't think Christian Ellis is your
Speaker 4: starting linebacker. I think you need to find somebody with
Speaker 4: a more athletic skill set to play next to Juwan
Speaker 4: Bentley as a depth guy who's also gonna play on
Speaker 4: special teams and be kind of a spark plug. I'd
Speaker 4: like to see Christian Ellis on the team next year.
Speaker 4: I think he continues to prove that he belongs and
Speaker 4: should have a role. I don't know what that role is.
Speaker 4: It's probably not as big as it is this year,
Speaker 4: but I don't think it's nothing either. Yeah.
Speaker 2: No, I think it's a great point. I actually think
Speaker 2: you know, came away from this with the same thing
Speaker 2: with Christianallis, Like, if you can get him into a
Speaker 2: specialized role, you know, a third down, passing down situation
Speaker 2: type of role. Yeah, Like, I think he could be
Speaker 2: an effective player for you down the road. He's not
Speaker 2: a first and second down linebacker in this defense. We
Speaker 2: just talked about the whole Bentley, you know, sledge hammer,
Speaker 2: that whole thing. That's not his game. But yeah, absolutely,
Speaker 2: I think that he could play in this defense in
Speaker 2: the future. All right, to the downs, yep, I have
Speaker 2: four I have it could have been probably eight under
Speaker 2: ten number one Vederian Low Vderian Low number one by
Speaker 2: far h sack, three hurries, four run stuffs he was
Speaker 2: responsible for in this game, including uh, the the third
Speaker 2: and one it was a third and one and fourth
Speaker 2: and one, whichever one it was, it was one of
Speaker 2: those was his fault.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I forget which one. I just come back to.
Speaker 2: With Viderian Low, you know he's gonna miss blocks, you
Speaker 2: know that he's gonna struggle at times because he's just
Speaker 2: limited talent wise. It really really gets off the reels
Speaker 2: for him when he's not locked in mentally, Like if
Speaker 2: he's not doing everything correctly all the time consistently, then
Speaker 2: he now he's a real problem.
Speaker 4: He doesn't really just have an okay game. No, like
Speaker 4: he either oh hey, Vaderian Low played well today, kind
Speaker 4: of played above it or like it was bad. You
Speaker 4: don't just see him sort of play alright.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So like the sack that he gave up, he
Speaker 2: just doesn't get out of his stance and gets.
Speaker 4: Blown by him with three blowbys, two of them are
Speaker 4: on ye in the game.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then the four run stuffs was just as
Speaker 2: big of a problem in this game, I thought than
Speaker 2: the pressures too.
Speaker 4: So look they it is what it is. And you
Speaker 4: hope that next year.
Speaker 2: No, no disrespective Darien Low, but you hope next year
Speaker 2: you have a better left tackle that's starting these games.
Speaker 4: But it's he played, so he's on the list. This
Speaker 4: is why no half measures at that position. Yeah, this
Speaker 4: is why I say I had him as well. I
Speaker 4: also just go to my second also on the offensive line,
Speaker 4: Ben Brown. Yeah. I gave the take last week that
Speaker 4: I would leave Ben Brown in for the sake of
Speaker 4: continuity with Drake May You gave the same tabe something
Speaker 4: like that. Apparently a bunch of people thought that was
Speaker 4: me saying Ben Brown was an All Pro and should
Speaker 4: never be removed from the lineup. That was not the case.
Speaker 2: And look, if you can't get the ball back to
Speaker 2: the quarterback, everything else beyond there doesn't really matter. And
Speaker 2: he didn't have a great game blocking either, But I
Speaker 2: mainly look at the two bad snaps. Was good for
Speaker 2: a couple of months, but you got to get the
Speaker 2: ball back to the quarterback. Nothing else matters if you
Speaker 2: can't do that. Yeah, the dribbles back to the quarterback
Speaker 2: were tough. I mean that he was my number two
Speaker 2: down too. Those were the two snaps were tough, and
Speaker 2: they came at tough spots to like just you know,
Speaker 2: opening drive, you're trying to get going. And then another
Speaker 2: one of them I was a third down, Yeah, put
Speaker 2: him in a bat third down spot. So like you
Speaker 2: had just two big spots for them too early on
Speaker 2: in the game. And then he also allowed three hurries
Speaker 2: in this game and was probably his worst game from
Speaker 2: a blocking standpoint. In pass protection too, he had some
Speaker 2: really uncharacteristically ugly reps in pass pro in this game,
Speaker 2: including on the interception where he just gets completely whipped
Speaker 2: the line of scrimmage and that caused the whole play
Speaker 2: to kind of be late. And you know, Drake made
Speaker 2: a throw a little bit off his back foot, and
Speaker 2: like all this kind of stuff. So it was a
Speaker 2: chain reaction from the get go that the center gets
Speaker 2: beat on the pressure and then all the other things
Speaker 2: happened in CONSEQUENTI because of that, if that play to
Speaker 2: Booty hits on time when he comes out of his break,
Speaker 2: it's a nice completion.
Speaker 4: It's there.
Speaker 2: But all these types of things contribute. So Ben Brown,
Speaker 2: number two down, I mean, look, it opens the door
Speaker 2: for Cole Strange. Absolutely, I still feel like it's a
Speaker 2: little unfair to Cole Strange to put him in an
Speaker 2: NFL game at center without any training camp, preseason, any
Speaker 2: sort of real work in there at a more live setting,
Speaker 2: Like you're not really practicing live this late in the season.
Speaker 2: So I still kind of err on the side that
Speaker 2: that might be a next season project with Cole Strange.
Speaker 2: But I definitely think that you have to at least
Speaker 2: I would at least have him active for the game
Speaker 2: on Sunday. Yeap, Who's next?
Speaker 4: My third one was Alex man Peltt. We already covered that, Yeah,
Speaker 4: just they went to shell. I get that there were limitations,
Speaker 4: but unable to pick up. Like when you're when you
Speaker 4: can't get one yard on two plays and you essentially
Speaker 4: run the same play back to back, it's not good. Yeah,
Speaker 4: not good, not good? All right. So my last two
Speaker 4: are on defense. Kyle Duggart probably should have somebody from defense,
Speaker 4: I'll say the safeties. Dugger and Peppers.
Speaker 2: Yeah play so yeah, I didn't think Pepper's played well either,
Speaker 2: But Kyle Dugger again just just not good enough, you know,
Speaker 2: just lost in zone coverage. A couple of times over
Speaker 2: the middle of the field. There was a third down
Speaker 2: where they dropped out of a pressure into zone and
Speaker 2: Trey McBride just crossed in front of his face for
Speaker 2: an uncontested third down conversion was third and six, and
Speaker 2: Dugger let Trey McBride go untouched for the first seven
Speaker 2: yards of his route, and so it was just too easy.
Speaker 2: The two miss tackles, you know, in the open field,
Speaker 2: were really really rough. Obviously, he's like the last line
Speaker 2: of defense on both plays, the doors screen and then
Speaker 2: the James Connor run, and he's got a chance to
Speaker 2: at least limit the damage. And you know, talking over
Speaker 2: the years with Devin mccordy, I remember that was always
Speaker 2: the biggest thing as being the last line of defense.
Speaker 2: It's already a big game, right like, if it's getting
Speaker 2: to you, if the ball is getting to you, it's
Speaker 2: already a big gain. But at least you can make
Speaker 2: it a twenty yard game instead of a fifty three
Speaker 2: yard game right now, it really helps out your defense.
Speaker 2: So Kyle Dugger, again I would say this about Kyle Dugger.
Speaker 2: I almost didn't have him on here because something is
Speaker 2: going on with Kyle duggery ankle mental. I don't know
Speaker 2: what it is, but they have to get him right,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean. And maybe the offseason does that,
Speaker 2: you know, it's a reset and get away from football
Speaker 2: for a little bit. But Kyle duger Is just has
Speaker 2: not been good enough for weeks now. It's just every
Speaker 2: single week. Do you have anybody else? So my last
Speaker 2: one on defense was Jolanie Tovai, who, again, like do
Speaker 2: I necessarily blame him for being in these positions? Like no,
Speaker 2: it's probably more of like a roster issue or a
Speaker 2: talent issue or a coaching issue. But he's got two
Speaker 2: plays to make on third down where he makes contact
Speaker 2: with the runner with the receiver short of the line
Speaker 2: to gain and he whiffs on both of them right
Speaker 2: Like he had an opportunity early on in this game
Speaker 2: to stop James Connor on down and Connor brooke the
Speaker 2: tackle and got the first down. They just need him
Speaker 2: to be able to make those plays. You know, it's
Speaker 2: one or two plays. It's not a big deal in
Speaker 2: terms of volume in this game for Julani to vie,
Speaker 2: but I just thought those were two backbreaking third downs
Speaker 2: that that cost the defense. So I had to have
Speaker 2: some defensive guys on there. Let's open it up. And
Speaker 2: I know people have been waiting, so we appreciate it.
Speaker 2: And we got, as you can expect, Alex the entire
Speaker 2: email inboxes, draft and off season topics.
Speaker 4: So we'll get into that.
Speaker 2: And first, Bridgeton's official tire, Bridge Stone official tire, The
Speaker 2: Newngland Patriots is proud. The partner was Sullivan Tire, New
Speaker 2: England's headquarters for quality Bridgetone tires. Visit Sullivantire dot com
Speaker 2: to find a location near you. All right, let's get
Speaker 2: to the phones. Patty is an aguam.
Speaker 4: What's up? Patty? Hey? How you doing.
Speaker 3: Pretty good? Hey listen, I don't know. I don't know
Speaker 3: if you're gonna have a show next week, but if
Speaker 3: you don't, I just wanted to stay the holidays, happy hanak, gentlemen,
Speaker 3: and I wanted to throw up a couple of hYP
Speaker 3: well just one hypothetical really well. Two, First off, will
Speaker 3: Campbell if his arms measure out, I want him. I
Speaker 3: don't care where they take him take them. Three, I
Speaker 3: don't give a you know, a flying f you know.
Speaker 3: The other thing is if the other idea that I
Speaker 3: had and Alex, I know this, this kind of drives
Speaker 3: you crazy, but but hear me out. Let's say that
Speaker 3: they do thank Higgins, or they're able to trade for
Speaker 3: DK Metcalf, you know, they get we get that big
Speaker 3: Stud X receiver, would you be opposed to maybe moving
Speaker 3: down the board a little bit, taking Luther Burden, who
Speaker 3: I know both of you guys love, and taking a
Speaker 3: guy like Connorley and this are like moving up to
Speaker 3: take Connory possibly at the end of the first or
Speaker 3: second I kind of I think, like Paulus said, I
Speaker 3: don't know if either of you guys have said this,
Speaker 3: but like I think we need two wide receivers, and
Speaker 3: I think we need two studs. And I think if
Speaker 3: we get that big X, you know that outside X
Speaker 3: and Evan you know I said this on PU today.
Speaker 3: I'm not really a believer in to Mario. I think
Speaker 3: we need something better in that slat and I would
Speaker 3: love to you know, we just we kind of need
Speaker 3: an overhaul at at those first two wide receiver positions,
Speaker 3: and I want to get your guys thoughts on that.
Speaker 3: I'll take it out there.
Speaker 2: Thanks, Patty, appreciate it.
Speaker 7: So I.
Speaker 2: I guess I agree to an extent with what he's
Speaker 2: saying about Pop Douglas, Like, Pop Douglas cannot be your
Speaker 2: number one receiver, right right, He probably can't be necessarily
Speaker 2: even your number two receiver on a good team, But
Speaker 2: he is a very useful slot and gadget player.
Speaker 4: If I have T Higgins and Luther Burden getting more
Speaker 4: attention coverage, suddenly Pop Douglas going to look like a
Speaker 4: much better player. Yeah, Like, I don't think that.
Speaker 2: I believe that there's a role for Pop Douglas as
Speaker 2: like a top three receiver in an offense if you
Speaker 2: build the room correctly.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 2: So, look, I love loser Burden. I see where he's
Speaker 2: coming from. That Higgins and Burden together coming here. That
Speaker 2: pairing makes a lot of sense.
Speaker 4: I'm for it.
Speaker 2: I still am weary of the fact that you're not
Speaker 2: drafting a tackle probably until the thirties, maybe the twenties,
Speaker 2: like that, if you trade back in, I think we're
Speaker 2: both a little bit concerned about so doing that.
Speaker 4: But if you get the right guy, I know Patty's
Speaker 4: talking about it. You know that take annoys me. It's
Speaker 4: more than Josh Simmons. Think nothing against him personally, but
Speaker 4: not the guy coming off a significant knee injury, Like,
Speaker 4: that's specifically what bothers me. If they really like Arianta
Speaker 4: Rasii or they really like Josh Connery, who are probably
Speaker 4: gonna go at the highest in the mid twenties, right,
Speaker 4: and you swing that, I could be sold on that, Like, okay,
Speaker 4: that that makes some sense. You've got to really believe
Speaker 4: that either of those guys can be a Day one starter,
Speaker 4: but you could swing me on that. It's what specifically
Speaker 4: bugs me is either Josh Simmons or when you start
Speaker 4: talking about like Cameron Williams or Emery Jones, because those
Speaker 4: guys are right tackles, and I know that there's been
Speaker 4: some success moving guys from side to side this year,
Speaker 4: but it's another if that you have to deal with.
Speaker 4: Can you just draft a player that's a good player
Speaker 4: at that position, that is ready to play that position,
Speaker 4: not that has to rehab, not that has to learn
Speaker 4: a new position. Just a guy that is a left
Speaker 4: tackle that you believe can be a good left tackle, period,
Speaker 4: full stop. No position changes, no injuries, no, none of that.
Speaker 4: That's the hold up. If you want to sell me
Speaker 4: on the best path as T Higgins or DK Metcalf
Speaker 4: the outside X and then we're gonna move down to
Speaker 4: get Burden and use part of what we got moving
Speaker 4: down to move back up to get Erstrie or Connory.
Speaker 4: I don't know that it's what I would do, but
Speaker 4: i'd give a good grade for that. I would say
Speaker 4: that that's a pretty solid haul for it's a pretty
Speaker 4: I would say the positions are addressed.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I love the idea in theory, and I agree
Speaker 2: that I would agree that it would be addressed right
Speaker 2: like they would. I feel like they would have attacked
Speaker 2: it if that's what they are I have done. I
Speaker 2: do think it's a little bit fantasy football. And I
Speaker 2: don't mean to pick on Patty, but it's just like
Speaker 2: that's a really difficult like Adam to split right, Like, Yeah,
Speaker 2: you've got to really wail that.
Speaker 4: You gotta really want to say this too. And I
Speaker 4: know nobody wants to hear this. Hate to be the
Speaker 4: bear of bad news. I won't get my hopes of
Speaker 4: POLTYE Higgins fam a Patriots fan. Did you see what
Speaker 4: he did in terms of his agency? Yeah, I did.
Speaker 4: He jamar chase his agent. I understand that's a pretty
Speaker 4: clear message, but I'm still I'm still not totally sold.
Speaker 2: That he doesn't hit free agency.
Speaker 4: I know you had.
Speaker 2: You know, Taylor Kyles and I have gone back and
Speaker 2: forth off the air about this a lot. I just
Speaker 2: for him to not hit free agency now after everything
Speaker 2: that's happened in Cincinnati. He's gonna make so much money
Speaker 2: on the open market. Yeah, but they would really have
Speaker 2: to blow him out of the water because like at
Speaker 2: this point, he's he's months away from being a free agent.
Speaker 2: You know, like it'd be different if he was still
Speaker 2: under team control for like another year or something like that.
Speaker 2: But at this point, like you've made it this far.
Speaker 2: So unless they come at you with like thirty plus
Speaker 2: million a year, and then I just I still think
Speaker 2: he goes to market.
Speaker 4: Joe Joe Burrow says what he says after that game.
Speaker 2: Well, they're clear the Burrow and and a little bit
Speaker 2: Chase too, are clearly lobbying to keep them like that
Speaker 2: that I think.
Speaker 4: That the Bengals would be I wouldn't piss those guys
Speaker 4: off from the Bengals, I'd be But if were the
Speaker 4: bengalsose guys.
Speaker 2: If you're the Bengals and you you obviously you know,
Speaker 2: extend Jamar Chase and get that done. Like, aren't you
Speaker 2: one of those teams if you're Cincinnati, where like you
Speaker 2: could probably draft a receiver that has a similar skill
Speaker 2: set and you're good enough offensively with those two guys that, like,
Speaker 2: it's not the Patriots that.
Speaker 4: Also their needs are on defense. That's if you pay those.
Speaker 4: If you get that, you know the offense is set,
Speaker 4: like the offensive line. They just used the first round
Speaker 4: pick on a tackle. Right, it's okay, we're gonna pay
Speaker 4: t Higgins and Padro mar Chase. Maybe you don't have
Speaker 4: a lot of money left, but all the money you
Speaker 4: have left and all of your draft resources now are defense. Defense. Defense. Right,
Speaker 4: You're gonna get maybe not Abdua Carter, they're not gonna
Speaker 4: pick that high, but you get maybe like a James
Speaker 4: Pierce right or a Chiha Campbell in the first round.
Speaker 4: You get that edge rusher you go, you get one
Speaker 4: of or they probably go corner first because it's not
Speaker 4: a good corner draft, and you get one of those
Speaker 4: day two edge guys, one of the Ohio state guys.
Speaker 4: You keep them in state. Right, you can address it's
Speaker 4: a it's a good linebacker draft, like you can this offseason.
Speaker 4: You can attack defense without spending a lot of for
Speaker 4: any team, you can attack defense without spending a lot
Speaker 4: of money. So that's what they need to attack. They
Speaker 4: can pay T Higgins and still think do what they
Speaker 4: need to do this offseason.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a good point. I just think it's two
Speaker 2: full of the bank.
Speaker 4: We call Tracks and ask him, Yeah, right, tell Trags
Speaker 4: call in, give us the Bengals offseason plan.
Speaker 2: It's two full to me with T Higgins still, though,
Speaker 2: one is you have to at least account for the
Speaker 2: Bengals of it all. Yeah, And the fact that it's
Speaker 2: a smaller market team and now they're about to give
Speaker 2: out what like a billion dollars in contracts to like
Speaker 2: three guys. Essentially it's gonna be less than that, but
Speaker 2: like I'm exaggerating a little bit. So you have to
Speaker 2: think about, Okay, we're you know, we're the Cincinnati Bengals,
Speaker 2: and we're like about to give out five hundred million
Speaker 2: dollars in contracts to three guys, right.
Speaker 4: And that that's matters, Like Toy, it does matter. I'm
Speaker 4: gonna own the franchise, right, How many guys are they paying?
Speaker 4: They don't have a ton of big contracts coming after that.
Speaker 4: It's gonna be a few years. You look at their
Speaker 4: drafts the last few years, there aren't. I mean, there's
Speaker 4: some decent players, but Okay, even if form Marius Mims,
Speaker 4: who was tackling drafted last year, if he picks out,
Speaker 4: you're not giving that contract for another five years. If
Speaker 4: you take the first year option. By then you're not
Speaker 4: signing Chase and Higgins the five year deals. Right, those
Speaker 4: guys are off the pall in. Chase is gonna get Chase,
Speaker 4: but not both of them. Chase is gonna get thirty
Speaker 4: five million a year, right, But I'm saying they don't
Speaker 4: really have burs paid. It's those two guys. A lot
Speaker 4: of the rest of theirs is either transactional or just
Speaker 4: really young and not doing for new contract for the
Speaker 4: next few years.
Speaker 2: All I'm saying is is I just know that that
Speaker 2: team is not it's not the Dallas Cowboys there.
Speaker 4: Well, the Cowboys are too. They're not printing money, is
Speaker 4: my point over there? You don't really have a Los
Speaker 4: Angeles Dodgers in the Uh.
Speaker 2: The other thing I would say about this with the Bengals,
Speaker 2: I do think that there's an argument and maybe I
Speaker 2: would be dead wrong and it would set them back,
Speaker 2: and we could you know, I would allow for that
Speaker 2: to be right. But I do think that there's an
Speaker 2: argument that they have the infrastructure to just keep on
Speaker 2: doing what they always do in Cincinnati, which is just
Speaker 2: draft and develop, right, and so like is there I
Speaker 2: just I don't.
Speaker 4: Know if they're not going to agitate Joe Burrow, I guess.
Speaker 2: But like if you draft Joe Burrow, if you pay
Speaker 2: Jamar Chase and you draft Joe Burrow like a day
Speaker 2: two wide receiver that's in the similar mold as too, you're.
Speaker 4: Talking about letting them both go.
Speaker 2: No, no, no, absolutely not if you're signing Jamar Chase
Speaker 2: and you're drafting a Day two receiver that you feel like, hey,
Speaker 2: they I mean, Jamar Chase didn't really need development. So
Speaker 2: I'm not gonna give them too much credit for that one.
Speaker 2: But like they seem like a team that Yoshiva's t Higgins,
Speaker 2: Like these guys are making plays.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you're kind of pitching aj Brown trailing Burks right
Speaker 4: now a little bit really because you have Chase. They
Speaker 4: didn't have another guy. But you're you're kind of taking
Speaker 4: the mystery.
Speaker 2: Blocks, Okay, but you're you're pitching that with Joe Burrow
Speaker 2: and Jamar Chase. You're not picking that with Ryan Tannehill, right, Like,
Speaker 2: It's a different infrastructure. And I just think that good
Speaker 2: teams tend to spread the money around, right, you know,
Speaker 2: and like tend to take like more of like the
Speaker 2: Kansas City approach, where we have the quarterback that's gonna
Speaker 2: make everybody better. So that's just my argument that the
Speaker 2: Bengals might not blow t Higgins out of the water
Speaker 2: with the contract offer that makes it so he doesn't
Speaker 2: go to market. Well, I just think the messaging out
Speaker 2: of there right now is pretty strong. I agree, but
Speaker 2: I'm not closing the door. All right, all right, Reggie
Speaker 2: is in Peabody. What's up, Reggie?
Speaker 7: Hey, guys, I'm just I'm curious. I understand all the
Speaker 7: conversation about the rosters, talent and everything like that. I'm
Speaker 7: just thinking back on twenty twenty, when, you know, with
Speaker 7: the Cam Newton year, when we won seven games, which
Speaker 7: might end up being the amount of games we've probably
Speaker 7: went over the last two years. I'm curious how you
Speaker 7: see from a you know, from each position group, how
Speaker 7: this this roster today compared to the twenty twenty I
Speaker 7: remember excuse me. That was the year we had Nikio,
Speaker 7: Harry de mere Bird, a young Jacobi Meyers. I'd say
Speaker 7: our wide receivers were better, are better now.
Speaker 10: Than they were then. Our offensive line, I mean we
Speaker 10: had Joe Toney that year, Justin Haran Isaiah Win, which
Speaker 10: was an issue at left tackle. I mean Dalton Kincaid
Speaker 10: and and and Devin Asiassi. I'd say our tight ends
Speaker 10: are much better now. I'm curious to see, like, position
Speaker 10: group I, position group, you feel this roster today from
Speaker 10: here to how we did it in twenty twenty.
Speaker 7: Thank you guys.
Speaker 2: Thanks Gregy, Dalton Keene, I think is what he meant there.
Speaker 2: It's tough because they had all the opt outs in
Speaker 2: twenty twenty.
Speaker 4: Twenty twenty might is one of Belichick's finest works, just
Speaker 4: getting that team to seven wins. I also think it's
Speaker 4: tough to use that year as a comparison for anything
Speaker 4: because there were so many added variables, and I think
Speaker 4: just Belichick's experience and his ability to create a routine
Speaker 4: in a pattern like factor in a year where so
Speaker 4: much was weird. Yeah, the militaristic approach played so well. Yeah,
Speaker 4: not that I don't not that I think it ever
Speaker 4: played poorly, but twenty twenty is kind of its own
Speaker 4: thing because of all the external I know the question
Speaker 4: about the roster talent, but I'm with you, we can
Speaker 4: do the exertion. Brian Hoyer, Cam Newton, Jared Stidham, First,
Speaker 4: Drake Madjeor, Kobe Brissett, Joe Milton.
Speaker 2: Well, it's definitely, you know, Drake is definitely the best
Speaker 2: quarterback out of that group from where Cam was at
Speaker 2: that point of his career. But I just think the
Speaker 2: biggest thing to me when I look at that team
Speaker 2: is that offensively, that team had an identity right like
Speaker 2: that that team could run the ball. Yeah, they could
Speaker 2: run the football, and they used the quarterback and they
Speaker 2: could really run the ball. And to mcdaniels's credit, he
Speaker 2: designed an offense around Cam Newton on the fly, which
Speaker 2: I thought was really impressive, and they had a really
Speaker 2: I know, you know, he brings up Isaiah Win and
Speaker 2: stuff like that, But that line, especially on the interior,
Speaker 2: was Tony Andrews Mason. Like that was a really really
Speaker 2: solid offensive line in the middle of that group, and
Speaker 2: they were able to run the football all basically all
Speaker 2: season long, even when Cam started to decay as a thrower.
Speaker 2: They were still able to run the ball. So as
Speaker 2: much as I would say that, you could probably say
Speaker 2: that the talent might be a little bit better in
Speaker 2: some spots this year than it was in twenty twenty.
Speaker 2: That twenty twenty team was playing together in a lot
Speaker 2: of ways, you know, and they they had identities on
Speaker 2: both sides of the football that this team doesn't have.
Speaker 2: So I don't know, you know, I probably would say
Speaker 2: the twenty twenty team was was was better because they
Speaker 2: were better, Like, they won more games, right, Like, they
Speaker 2: they were more competitive, even if like we could sit
Speaker 2: here and say Hunter Henry is a better tight end
Speaker 2: than Devin Ossi Ossi. And was it Ben Watson right,
Speaker 2: the corpse of Ben Watson?
Speaker 4: Oh, it was. It was the rookies, it was.
Speaker 2: It wasn't Ben Watson on that team.
Speaker 4: No, he didn't come back until I think the next year.
Speaker 4: I thought he came back in twenty he came back. No,
Speaker 4: because I remember talking to the locker room. We weren't
Speaker 4: in the locker room that year. He might not have
Speaker 4: been back. No, he was back the year before because
Speaker 4: he came back with Brady. So did he come back
Speaker 4: the year he came back nineteen Yeah, yeah, when when
Speaker 4: Gronk retired late, they brought him back. Okay, I got
Speaker 4: my years mixed up, but yeah, I look, I don't
Speaker 4: know how you can sit here and say that the
Speaker 4: twenty twenty team was worse when they won three more games,
Speaker 4: four more games than this feam is going to Brad
Speaker 4: Is in Ohio. What's up, Brad?
Speaker 5: OHI Gods good, Mary Christmas is so yeah, well.
Speaker 6: Thank you.
Speaker 5: I just wanted to make a couple observations and suggestions
Speaker 5: and see you guys take on these. So we know
Speaker 5: that we haven't been able to run the ball. And
Speaker 5: I know I've asked you this before, Evan, I think
Speaker 5: both of you. We haven't been able to run the
Speaker 5: ball continually throughout this whole year. We can't even get
Speaker 5: a yard when we need to. And how were we
Speaker 5: last year in regards to where we're ranked now in
Speaker 5: regards in regards to that same type of running when
Speaker 5: City Style actually played on the team and actually was
Speaker 5: on the line, not lined up as a fullback. Which
Speaker 5: leads me to say we should draft in Breteston of
Speaker 5: Michigan if that's what we need, a player like that.
Speaker 5: But can you can you correlate that for me? Evan
Speaker 5: and two of you kind of give me where we're
Speaker 5: at now compared to where we was when City fell.
Speaker 5: I knew could block and get a yard at the
Speaker 5: goal line. He's flattened Cameron Hayward and now he can't
Speaker 5: block at all.
Speaker 8: I'm confused. So and then I know McCary page from
Speaker 8: a free stafety of Michigan Coaston Ludlin a tight end.
Speaker 8: The tight end from Penn State and the tight end
Speaker 8: from Bowling Green are players that I think are really
Speaker 8: going to be a better bit or a better player
Speaker 8: than the wide.
Speaker 5: Receivers that are available in the draft. And they're like
Speaker 5: second round picks, I think. So what do you think
Speaker 5: about that too, in regards to a tight end, the
Speaker 5: young tight end to fit in with Drake for the future.
Speaker 4: So thank you, thanks Brad, thanks for the call.
Speaker 2: So to the first point about the full back and
Speaker 2: like all that kind of stuff, I didn't really get
Speaker 2: what he was saying about City, So I guess just
Speaker 2: just that.
Speaker 4: They were able to run the all the said. He's
Speaker 4: sow in the lineup last year, I think, and now
Speaker 4: he's not in the lineup, So would putting him and
Speaker 4: help them run the ball. Got it so think I.
Speaker 2: Would say that they have struggled to run the ball
Speaker 2: for three years now, like going back to twenty twenty
Speaker 2: two with Matt Patricia. Their last really good run year
Speaker 2: in my mind was twenty one with McDaniels. Now, there's
Speaker 2: an argument to be made there about full backs, right,
Speaker 2: like McDaniel's used the full back as we all know,
Speaker 2: and they don't.
Speaker 4: Use a full back now.
Speaker 2: They really pivoted away from the full back in Patricia's
Speaker 2: year in twenty two. But McDaniel's also just a really
Speaker 2: good run game coordinator, always has been, was really good
Speaker 2: in Vegas, like that was the one thing with Josh
Speaker 2: Jacobs that they were actually good at on offense and
Speaker 2: Vegas was running the football. Josh Jacobs won the rushing title,
Speaker 2: right McDaniels first season as the coach Chare So I
Speaker 2: give a lot of that credit to McDaniels. I think
Speaker 2: he's a really good schemer in the run game and
Speaker 2: does a nice job there.
Speaker 4: Yeah, twenty twenty two rushing leader.
Speaker 2: The City SO thing is interesting. I would say the
Speaker 2: City So thing is interesting because it doesn't feel like
Speaker 2: this regime identifies with City, so as their draft pick
Speaker 2: and Scott Peters wasn't here, Alex Van Pelt wasn't here,
Speaker 2: it definitely feels like they are trying to make their
Speaker 2: guy work in Leiden Robinson instead, and for better or worse, right, Like,
Speaker 2: I don't have the answer to that question. I think
Speaker 2: they're both similar players. Frankly, I think that they're both
Speaker 2: physical downhill blockers. I think they both struggle in pass protection,
Speaker 2: and I think they're both decent at moving the line
Speaker 2: of scrimmage in the run game. So the fact that
Speaker 2: they like Leyden Robinson a little bit more than City,
Speaker 2: so I think it's kind of a coin toss. Like,
Speaker 2: I think it's kind of, you know, a picker flavor.
Speaker 4: By the way, Trags years must have been burning. He
Speaker 4: just tweeted this out just now, this quote from Jamar Chase.
Speaker 4: I just talking about Rocky Arsenow, the agent.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: I just told him we're stuck together for life. Now
Speaker 4: we're locked in for life. Now there's a possible chance
Speaker 4: both of a sign with the Bengals long term possible. Well,
Speaker 4: I asked Trags. Trags thinks it's happening.
Speaker 2: Okay, Well, Trags know better than me. I'm just if
Speaker 2: I'm t Higgins, I'm going to market. That's all I'm saying.
Speaker 4: Well, both both can be true, both can be true.
Speaker 2: The second point, what was the second point?
Speaker 4: And I forgot he just listed a bunch of guys
Speaker 4: in the draft.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, the whole tight end thing. We've talked a
Speaker 2: little bit about the tight end thing, like I think
Speaker 2: it could have. I think Drake likes throwing a tight ends.
Speaker 2: I think that's clear.
Speaker 4: You want to get the pipeline ready. You want the
Speaker 4: next guy Hunter. Henry's gonna have two years left on
Speaker 4: his deal. It's really one concrete year. He's older now.
Speaker 4: You want to get and tight ends generally take longer
Speaker 4: to develop than the average position. I'm all for getting
Speaker 4: the next guy in the building and getting going. And
Speaker 4: you know he replaces Austin Hooper is your second tight
Speaker 4: end next year, and then the year two he takes over,
Speaker 4: Loveland and Warren are going to be first round picks. Yeah.
Speaker 4: I would not invest that heavily in that position, especially
Speaker 4: with how deep this draft is. At tight end, you're
Speaker 4: gonna get a ton of good project players. So we
Speaker 4: mentioned Harold Fannin from Bowling Green Yeah, he's gonna be
Speaker 4: an interesting one because he's the first consensus or he's
Speaker 4: the first All American in the history of bowling Green.
Speaker 4: But he's coming from the MAC. You got to evaluate
Speaker 4: that thing. I like Mason Taylor from LSU. I like
Speaker 4: Gunner Helm from Texas. Bunch of Day three guys. Mitchell
Speaker 4: Evans is my player to watch for Notre Dame in
Speaker 4: the college football playoff. Yeah, he's old school. You want
Speaker 4: like an old school tight end who is big, blocks
Speaker 4: his ass off, wins with physicality at the short and intermediate.
Speaker 4: That's Mitchell Evans. We'll see you know, Oscar del Terrence Ferguson.
Speaker 4: There's a bunch of there's a bunch of tight ends
Speaker 4: in this draft, like they'll they'll find somebody. Colston Lovin's
Speaker 4: a good player, Tyler Warren's a good player. I don't
Speaker 4: think they need to use a first round pick on
Speaker 4: a tight end right now.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's definitely something that I don't necessarily see
Speaker 2: as like a pressing enough need to use a first
Speaker 2: round pick, Like if they were getting a guy that
Speaker 2: they thought was gonna truly be like the number one
Speaker 2: weapon in their offense. It's like a Travis Kelce Rob
Speaker 2: Gronkowski like level tight end, then that would be a
Speaker 2: different story. I don't maybe Warren, Like I think Jacob
Speaker 2: Warren is really talented Tyler.
Speaker 4: Why do they think Jacob because he was a tight
Speaker 4: end here for like a minute, Jacob Warren. Yeah, he
Speaker 4: was out of Tennessee. He was the Tennessee guy that
Speaker 4: came with the Bay.
Speaker 2: I had a reason Tyler Warren. I could see maybe
Speaker 2: him being like uh in that upper echellent you know. Like,
Speaker 2: I guess what I'm getting at is like, if there's
Speaker 2: a Rock Bowers in this draft, then I maybe would
Speaker 2: think a little bit differently because now you're thinking, Okay,
Speaker 2: we're gonna build the offense.
Speaker 4: Around this guy. I don't know that Tyler Warren is
Speaker 4: that guy. I don't think so either. And even if
Speaker 4: he is, like so, I guess the counter would be
Speaker 4: we talked about it earlier, right, do you trade down
Speaker 4: and then trade up and receiver tackle? If enough teams
Speaker 4: are scared off by Will Campbell but you believe he's
Speaker 4: a tackle, do you trade down slightly, move back up
Speaker 4: and take time Warren instead of maybe Meg Buca like
Speaker 4: a receiver late first round pass Catcher. Yeah, it's possible.
Speaker 2: I could hear it, and that would probably be how
Speaker 2: that would have to happen. Like I said, I Drake
Speaker 2: definitely likes throwing a tight end.
Speaker 4: Yeah. No, I want them to draft a tight end
Speaker 4: with the upside. I want them to get a guy
Speaker 4: in the building. But when you look at some of
Speaker 4: these guys, like again, I like Gunnerhelm, Yeah, he has
Speaker 4: tight end one upside, He's just not nearly as polished
Speaker 4: as Tyler Warrens. And they can afford to have a
Speaker 4: guy who's not gonna be ready year one because ideal
Speaker 4: he's gonna be playing behind Hunter Henry to start.
Speaker 2: So let me ask you this because you know I
Speaker 2: like this guy, and so I have to bring it
Speaker 2: up and obvious connection here. You know what what happened
Speaker 2: to Bryson as a bit like why is because he
Speaker 2: was somebody that was considered maybe a top fifty, top
Speaker 2: one hundred guy. Am I Bronk like last year?
Speaker 5: Yeah?
Speaker 8: He was.
Speaker 4: He's from North Carolina, he played with Drake Manah, he
Speaker 4: was a top one fifty guy. He missed some time
Speaker 4: he was hurt.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: I would also say their offense must have stunk without
Speaker 4: so well, it's not just without Drake. Max Johnson in
Speaker 4: who is a transfer from Texas A and M who
Speaker 4: they brought in to replace him, snapped his leg in
Speaker 4: the first game, and then Jacobe Criswell got banged up
Speaker 4: at times. They had a whole quarterback carousel thingo. By
Speaker 4: the way, Max Johnson, he's his son of Brad Johnson,
Speaker 4: total Belichick quarterback. I would not like from the outside
Speaker 4: looking in, I would not be surprised off his Bill's
Speaker 4: quarterback this year. Like if he was in the draft
Speaker 4: and Bill was here, I would be saying, the Patriot's
Speaker 4: gonna draft Max Johnson. But you know he got banged up.
Speaker 4: The quarterback play wasn't good. He's one of these guys,
Speaker 4: you know how I love to talk about this. How
Speaker 4: do you view like how much of a recency bias
Speaker 4: is there for teams watching him? Are you looking at
Speaker 4: twenty twenty three? Are you only looking at him in
Speaker 4: twenty twenty four? If you look at him in twenty
Speaker 4: twenty three, he's a high Day three pick with upset.
Speaker 4: The other thing is like he can't he doesn't block.
Speaker 4: He's a receiver and maybe he develops into a blocker eventually.
Speaker 4: Like Hunter Henry did, but he is a pass catching
Speaker 4: tight end. So we have some breaking Patriots news, okay,
Speaker 4: and it's not positive breaking Patriots needs. So Christian Barmore
Speaker 4: has been shut down for the season.
Speaker 2: He had a I'll just read the statement out loud
Speaker 2: because I don't want to mince words here. The Newland
Speaker 2: Patriots are placing defensive linemen Christian Barmore on the reserve
Speaker 2: non football illness list after he experienced some reoccurring symptoms
Speaker 2: that required further evaluation. We appreciate everything Christian did to
Speaker 2: return to the team this season, but our top priority
Speaker 2: is Christian's health and well being. We know that he
Speaker 2: will continue to receive tremendous care. You want to ensure
Speaker 2: that he gets the time he needs to come back
Speaker 2: stronger than ever. So my feelings on this are first
Speaker 2: and foremost. Obviously, you know, thoughts are with Christian Barmore
Speaker 2: and hope everything is okay. From that standpoint, I thought
Speaker 2: that watching him play since he came back from this
Speaker 2: issue was tough at times, and he just wasn't himself.
Speaker 2: He was clearly a shell of himself, as it would
Speaker 2: be totally expected given the circumstances at.
Speaker 4: Three and eleven.
Speaker 2: If he's starting to feel something that's not right, this
Speaker 2: is absolutely the right move for him in the in
Speaker 2: the organization. Long term, he needs to get healthy, which
Speaker 2: I hope he does, and then he needs a full
Speaker 2: off season to get his body back to where it
Speaker 2: was before this all happened. That's this is obviously tough news, though.
Speaker 2: I feel for him because I know he worked really
Speaker 2: hard to get back.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and look good thing that they caught whatever this
Speaker 4: reoccurrence is right, and that he didn't go out there
Speaker 4: and play on it and risk getting hurt further. You
Speaker 4: hope he can be back next year with this kind
Speaker 4: of thing. You always wonder about the long term mature
Speaker 4: of his career, But yeah, thoughts with him and hopefully
Speaker 4: he can you know, get done when he needs to
Speaker 4: get done as quick as possible. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Look, I love watching Christian Barmore play. There was nothing
Speaker 2: more that that guy needed to do this year.
Speaker 4: Like, yeah, we were talking about that in practice today.
Speaker 4: Like the fact that he got back on the field,
Speaker 4: and I'm sure mentally as much as anything was huge
Speaker 4: for him to just climb past that and now it's
Speaker 4: just he's gotta do it again.
Speaker 2: Yeah, man, I mean, look, that was a big one.
Speaker 2: You know you we talked about this, I think another time.
Speaker 2: But like these guys that they signed or extended in
Speaker 2: the off season that they were really expecting to be
Speaker 2: kind of like foundational elements.
Speaker 4: Of this team.
Speaker 2: Barmore, Dugger, Pepper's Remandre on Wenu. A lot of these
Speaker 2: guys were either hurt, had you know, extenuating circumstances off
Speaker 2: the field, and they just didn't They didn't answer the
Speaker 2: buck in a lot of different ways. And it's not
Speaker 2: Barmore's fault, right that this is a rare blood condition
Speaker 2: is not his fault. But the point being that, you know,
Speaker 2: when you sign these guys and you count on these
Speaker 2: guys to have that go by the wayside is really
Speaker 2: a big reason why they are where they are. Like
Speaker 2: if they had twenty twenty three, Christian Barmore twenty twenty three,
Speaker 2: Jabriel Pepper's twenty twenty three Juwan Bentley, do I think
Speaker 2: that they would be five ten wins better and in
Speaker 2: the playoffs? Like, No, of course not, but they would
Speaker 2: be a better team on defense for sure with those guys.
Speaker 4: Absolutely.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So a tough one for the Patriots there with
Speaker 2: Christian Barmore. But I'd like to reiterate I actually think
Speaker 2: this is in some ways what's best for the player anyways.
Speaker 2: Like I just I think having him roll out there
Speaker 2: just wasn't right anyway. And he even said when he
Speaker 2: first came back like he wasn't in football shape. I
Speaker 2: wouldn't be surprised. It's just like mental just getting him
Speaker 2: back on the field. So he got that Yeah, you know,
Speaker 2: got over that hump. All right, So let's get back
Speaker 2: to the last couple of emails here after that. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it's kind of depressing.
Speaker 4: I'll just bounce back. I was gonna say on Bryson,
Speaker 4: don't don't sleep on Bryson as but as a draft pick,
Speaker 4: just watch him. I know you don't always do this.
Speaker 4: Just watch him in twenty twenty three.
Speaker 2: No, I watched him in twenty twenty three with Drake
Speaker 2: all right, yeah already have watched Yeah, and look like
Speaker 2: he's to me, is one of those players that can
Speaker 2: get up to and as I like like Henter Henry
Speaker 2: a lot, I like Austin Hooper a lot, but they're
Speaker 2: not necessarily like explosive like field stretching tight ends, right
Speaker 2: that can do those sort of things Drake May rifle
Speaker 2: and throws up the scene to Bryce Nesbit was like
Speaker 2: a regular thing at North Carolina over the last two years,
Speaker 2: and you just see statistically Nesbit's like production with Drake
Speaker 2: versus this year without him there, it just fell off
Speaker 2: a cliff so like he was like five hundred yards
Speaker 2: roughly I think in twenty two and twenty three with
Speaker 2: Drake May at North Carolina, which in college is really
Speaker 2: good tight end production. Yeah, you know, you don't normally
Speaker 2: see a big receiving production from tight end. So if
Speaker 2: you can get him in like the fifth or the
Speaker 2: sixth round because he had a down year, like even
Speaker 2: more reason to do it. Already has the connection with Drake.
Speaker 2: You know, I'm sure Drake would love it, like I'm
Speaker 2: sure he would Loby for it. I don't think they
Speaker 2: need a running back this high. So I don't think
Speaker 2: Amrio and Hampton is really in their conversations too much
Speaker 2: because you know, he's gonna be probably top fifty.
Speaker 4: Yeah, uh draft pick.
Speaker 2: But uh, bryceon Sbitt seems like he would be a
Speaker 2: realistic target for the Patriots.
Speaker 4: And uh so, I couldn't remember the injury he broke
Speaker 4: his wrist in November, so you figure he'll be bad.
Speaker 4: He should be good off of wrist injury. You feel
Speaker 4: like he should be good. He'll probably be a Senior
Speaker 4: Bowl guy, would be or at least a Shrine Bowl guy. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 4: it might might be. It'd be fun to see him
Speaker 4: not listed for either right now, but he'd be a
Speaker 4: kind of guy that would would be good.
Speaker 9: There.
Speaker 2: Okay, a couple more things that I want to get
Speaker 2: to before we wrap it up. Got some emails, obviously,
Speaker 2: get in some calls about Travis Hunter. He just won
Speaker 2: the Heisman Trophy. This is topical obviously, coming off the
Speaker 2: weekend and him winning the Heisman.
Speaker 4: I just want to speech.
Speaker 2: I just want to say, like, I love the kid,
Speaker 2: like a great kids. I love the guy like I
Speaker 2: think he's a football nerd.
Speaker 4: I think he alone. Who said it? Girlfriend? I thought
Speaker 4: you meant me. I was like, no, no, no, no no,
Speaker 4: it's like this whole thing on the internet that his
Speaker 4: girlfriend didn't stand up with the ceremony.
Speaker 2: Jeez, Okay, people need to touch grass.
Speaker 4: Uh So I just like him. No, he's got absolutely
Speaker 4: the right mentality.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I feel like he's uh you know, from
Speaker 2: everything that you hear out of Colorado about him, like
Speaker 2: he's like a film junkie.
Speaker 4: Like this guy doesn't listen to music because he's just
Speaker 4: watched you. He's you. He doesn't love music, he doesn't
Speaker 4: love it, go out, he doesn't do any like it.
Speaker 4: I think people obviously Deon Satra is a big personality, outgoing.
Speaker 4: He's very out there in the public things like that,
Speaker 4: and I think people just obscribe subscribed that to Travis Hunter,
Speaker 4: there was this story where like he like he doesn't
Speaker 4: go to parties, doesn't listen to music, doesn't go out,
Speaker 4: like he watches film and he plays video games. That's
Speaker 4: all he does.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's all he does. I think Drake's kind of
Speaker 2: the same way. I think he's kind of the same
Speaker 2: plosit of the two of us. Yeah, watch his film,
Speaker 2: plays video Yeah right, So therefore I think both of
Speaker 2: them together would would really know.
Speaker 4: They do seem like get along. It does seem like
Speaker 4: you would be repairing. Yeah, I was. It was a
Speaker 4: good speech.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was a great speech. I think there will
Speaker 2: be a continue we are going to do, uh you know,
Speaker 2: five months or whatever it is. On is he a
Speaker 2: wide receiver? Is a corner? Can he play both ways?
Speaker 2: This that the other thing Jay Glazer had to report.
Speaker 2: I believe it was a Sunday morning during Fox's pregame
Speaker 2: that he pulled some NFL gms and a lot of
Speaker 2: the gms think he's a corner in the league. And
Speaker 2: Jay Glazer even reported that he doesn't think that he's
Speaker 2: gonna play a ton of receiver at all. You know,
Speaker 2: it would probably just be mostly corner for a lot
Speaker 2: of teams. I still leave the door open to him
Speaker 2: playing receiver, one because I think he has great receiver film,
Speaker 2: and two because I think he might want to play receiver.
Speaker 2: So I'm still gonna leave the door open to that.
Speaker 2: But the more that we get closer, you know, the
Speaker 2: more that information that comes out about it, it does
Speaker 2: feel like the NFL views him as a corner on
Speaker 2: the whole.
Speaker 4: I've said this, he is a better corner than receiver.
Speaker 4: Agree is not a good receiver, but he's a corner.
Speaker 2: So David, you know, emails in and I think we've
Speaker 2: said similar things about this before. And you know, he
Speaker 2: just said about Travis Hunter that he's a luxury item.
Speaker 2: You know that that he's you know, Patriots drafting Hunter
Speaker 2: is like buying a Ferrari for a home that's in foreclosure.
Speaker 2: And we've used these types of analogies before. I hear
Speaker 2: that in a lot of ways. I know everybody is
Speaker 2: sort of like big on the offensive line, and I
Speaker 2: am too. It's a it's the number one need on
Speaker 2: the team. Left tackle is the number one need on
Speaker 2: the team. But I still come back to my best
Speaker 2: player available thing. I still want them to take the
Speaker 2: best player available at a position of need. That that's
Speaker 2: always what we have advocated for. It's not, oh, we
Speaker 2: have this guard or this running back Alex rated, you know,
Speaker 2: higher than Will Campbell.
Speaker 4: We're not doing that.
Speaker 2: But between receiver, tackle, edge, rusher, don't reach right. I
Speaker 2: don't reach to to try to fill a hole. I
Speaker 2: feel like that's why bad teams stay bad. So if
Speaker 2: you view view Travis Hunter as a corner, it's a
Speaker 2: premium position. So I would at least could get behind that,
Speaker 2: and obviously Gonzo and Travis Hunter would probably be pretty dominant.
Speaker 4: But it's not.
Speaker 2: It doesn't exactly fit the big you know, best player
Speaker 2: at position need if.
Speaker 4: He's not playing receiver, I'm not interested. That's just where
Speaker 4: for the reasons you just said. Yeah, and if if
Speaker 4: the league really views him as a corner. Any teams,
Speaker 4: if you highly as a corner, if he's on the board,
Speaker 4: you're gonna it's not gonna be like a quarterback, but
Speaker 4: you're gonna get a ton of value for that pick
Speaker 4: if you move down.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I I agree with you. I I honestly uh
Speaker 2: am also tempted a little. I kind of attempted by
Speaker 2: Abdul Carter.
Speaker 4: I'm not gonna lie like and Hunter is a better player,
Speaker 4: but like pound for pound, Carter makes more sense to
Speaker 4: me than Hunter does.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a position of need. It's a premium position
Speaker 2: pass rusher off the edge right now. When you just
Speaker 2: look at their their their pass rush statists, whether it's
Speaker 2: pressure rate, win rate, whatever, like they're down near the
Speaker 2: bottom of the league and all of it. They don't
Speaker 2: pressure the quarterback. And when I look at the cornerback room,
Speaker 2: I actually think that their corners are decent, Like Christianzalez
Speaker 2: is great, and then you you kind of have a
Speaker 2: hierarchy there, Like I think Marcus Jones is a very
Speaker 2: capable slot corner. We still are talking about the outside
Speaker 2: cornerback position and that being a little bit of a maid.
Speaker 4: Carlton Davis one year, twelve million dollars solved. Don't need
Speaker 4: a superstar over there.
Speaker 2: No, And I definitely am still of the mind that
Speaker 2: I think Alex Austen might be able to do it. Yeah,
Speaker 2: And so you have between those guys, you know, the
Speaker 2: Jones is Christian goan Zalez, Alex Austin Jonathan Jones is
Speaker 2: a free agent. But if he comes back, I think
Speaker 2: that's a decent cornerback round.
Speaker 4: I really do all their other issues you can get
Speaker 4: by with that putting resource into that room. You're talking
Speaker 4: about a room going from maybe good to great. Yeah,
Speaker 4: obviously Gonzalez is great, but like he's around them, Yeah,
Speaker 4: when there's other positions that you need a pump serious
Speaker 4: assets into just to get them a good Yeah.
Speaker 2: It just feels to me like if you get the
Speaker 2: safety play that you're expecting back from Duggar and Peppers,
Speaker 2: you get those guys back to the level that you're
Speaker 2: used to, and you keep this cornerback room in tack,
Speaker 2: which is pretty good, I believe, then if you add
Speaker 2: to the pass rush, like that's the bigger need, right, Like,
Speaker 2: that's clearly the bigger I don't remember.
Speaker 4: If I said this on this show last week. But
Speaker 4: I've said it somewhere like if you have Gonzales right,
Speaker 4: and we talk a lot about it, right, well, how
Speaker 4: do you maximize Drake May on offense? And what pick,
Speaker 4: what additions, what's signing? Maximize Drake May because he's your stud,
Speaker 4: that's you're building round on that side of the ball.
Speaker 4: We can do the same exercise with Christian Zalez. How
Speaker 4: do you maximize Christian Zalez? And the one knock on
Speaker 4: Christian Zalez right now, and I think it's overblown. I
Speaker 4: would call it more of an observation than a knock
Speaker 4: is that the on ball production isn't tremendous, right, Yeah,
Speaker 4: he had a couple of pass breakups last week, but
Speaker 4: he's not getting interceptions. He's not gonna got two PEPs
Speaker 4: this year. Yeah, But because nobody's thrown at him and
Speaker 4: these quarterbacks have time to adjust, he's also playing trail man.
Speaker 2: So like this is a big thing I think to
Speaker 2: with the zone man corner thing, Like when you have
Speaker 2: zone eyes, you have eyes in the backfield, so you
Speaker 2: have that ability to jump the football, right, like you
Speaker 2: have the ability to see the quarterback throw the football,
Speaker 2: have it leave his hand and then ballhawk and trace
Speaker 2: the ball corners. Like you know what made Stefan Gilmour's
Speaker 2: Defensive Player of the Year season so ridiculous was how
Speaker 2: many picks he had playing man to man the whole season.
Speaker 4: So like that, that's a really difficult to do. Part
Speaker 4: of that was and to my point, how do you
Speaker 4: maximize Gonzales. It's not putting another corner on the other side.
Speaker 4: It's getting another pass rusher, because with Gilmore you to
Speaker 4: pass rush, and a lot of quarterbacks when you pressure them,
Speaker 4: their first instinct is just gonna be I know my
Speaker 4: top receivers over here. I'm throwing it like I need
Speaker 4: to get rid of this ball. I'm gonna get crushed. Buddy,
Speaker 4: go make a play. And that's when you know it's
Speaker 4: the pick and the Super Bowl. Yeah, picking super Bowl
Speaker 4: fifty three where it's van Ney, right, is it van Neuy? Yeah,
Speaker 4: run a blitzer. They run a zero blitz and Steph
Speaker 4: Gilmore gets to turn around and catch it like a
Speaker 4: center fielder. Yeah, that's how you maximize Gonzalez. It's not
Speaker 4: putting another corner on the other side, it's getting a
Speaker 4: pass rusher that's gonna speed these quarterbacks up and force
Speaker 4: more bad throws to his side.
Speaker 2: Agreed, I think their their secondary is good enough. I
Speaker 2: think your secondary would be is is good enough if
Speaker 2: they had a legit passage.
Speaker 4: I'd like to see them add another boundary, physical, bigger
Speaker 4: corner just to kind of compete with Alex Austin for
Speaker 4: that second job. But that you that does not need
Speaker 4: to be a first round pick. All right, We'll take
Speaker 4: one more call and then we're gonna wrap it up.
Speaker 4: Jay is in Atlanta.
Speaker 2: What's up Jay?
Speaker 6: Hey, guys, Thanks for taking a call there. Hey, guys
Speaker 6: going to I want to ask about Daveon Williams a TCU.
Speaker 6: And secondly, from my second question, I want to ask,
Speaker 6: I know in the first round probably gonna be tackled
Speaker 6: by receiver or second round probably whichever we don't get
Speaker 6: the first for those two thirds, what do you think
Speaker 6: would be the best option for us to pick?
Speaker 4: Thanks, Jane, appreciate the call. D you know I'm not
Speaker 4: deep enough to know. Yeah, so I haven't done a
Speaker 4: ton on saveing on Williams. I I some of the
Speaker 4: people who get in really deep really like him TCU
Speaker 4: wide receiver, So you're gonna have to get over the helmet.
Speaker 2: Now big gon dots in two point outs. What I'm hearing, Well,
Speaker 2: I've seen more like Quinn Johnson. That one's bad too,
Speaker 2: both of them.
Speaker 4: Much better athlete, much more explosive. He's quicker, he's not
Speaker 4: a straight line athlete. He hasn't played a ton. He's
Speaker 4: very raw. I got to pull up the exact number
Speaker 4: of games he's played. But he's a he's a full projection.
Speaker 4: So this is a guy that's you know, six four,
Speaker 4: six five, two twenty out. But well, he's like an
Speaker 4: early day three pick.
Speaker 2: Okay, like any but to me, and I'm sorry to
Speaker 2: cut you off, but any receiver that we're handing this
Speaker 2: coaching staff that is a project or is raw or
Speaker 2: anything like that. Until I build some confidence with the
Speaker 2: fact that they can develop at that position, I'm out.
Speaker 4: I would call him as a prospect. Now we know
Speaker 4: how this turned out. As a prospect, I would call
Speaker 4: him a little Javon Baker ish. And that's not being
Speaker 4: super familiar, but like, you're drafting a guy who's big,
Speaker 4: who you're gonna throw the ball down the field to. Yeah,
Speaker 4: if he's the only receiver they walk away with, No,
Speaker 4: if you're telling me that they got Luther Burden and
Speaker 4: this is maybe doubling up them trying again to find
Speaker 4: an X. Okay, yeah, I guess I could see that.
Speaker 4: It wouldn't be my favorite thing, but I could see it.
Speaker 4: I will to the second point, those two thirds trade
Speaker 4: one trade one, move up, move up in the second,
Speaker 4: move up from the second to the first. This is
Speaker 4: the same mistake they did last year. They had those
Speaker 4: two fourths, they were in position to move up. Instead
Speaker 4: they moved down for Jalen Polk. They take Kanen Wallason
Speaker 4: and they use them on Landen Robinson and Jaymon Baker.
Speaker 4: Use those picks move up. So I'm open to anything
Speaker 4: in terms of moving up like that. I'm all for that.
Speaker 2: I also wonder if one of those third round picks
Speaker 2: can be traded for a veteran player like I still
Speaker 2: will bang the table for that all.
Speaker 4: Day, every single or for a veteran player like I.
Speaker 2: Just I keep coming back to the fact that, look,
Speaker 2: if you can't draft well, then you might as well
Speaker 2: just start trading picks for guys that you know, you
Speaker 2: know can play in the league, right like in the
Speaker 2: way that this has gone throughout the NFL, Like trading picks,
Speaker 2: like the value of the veteran players is going down.
Speaker 2: I would say, like you can start to get some
Speaker 2: real talent for those players for those picks. So look,
Speaker 2: if you're you're wary of like certain blind spots that
Speaker 2: you have from an evaluation standpoint, or you don't love
Speaker 2: the draft, or whatever the case may be, trade it, like,
Speaker 2: trade it for a veteran player.
Speaker 4: Here do you want, We'll just do this live. You
Speaker 4: want to save? We both trust the Draft Network. They
Speaker 4: do a good job. Yeah. So here's what the Draft
Speaker 4: Network has on Savion Williams. Since I wasn't fully prepared. Okay,
Speaker 4: uh six fo Okay, here's the summary. Save on Williams
Speaker 4: offers NFL teams a diverse and unique skills set at
Speaker 4: the wide receiver position. Has a rare combination of size, explosiveness,
Speaker 4: and quickness to create explosive plays. Strengths, diverse release package,
Speaker 4: explosive great short area quickness, position, versatile playmaker ability to
Speaker 4: create explosive plays. Oh concerns yeah, TCU raw route runner
Speaker 4: concentration drops. So this was written before the season. Lack
Speaker 4: of production. I'll give you his production this year. It's
Speaker 4: all career highs sixty catches, six hundred eleven yards, six touchdowns.
Speaker 4: He also ran the ball fifty one times for three
Speaker 4: hundred yards and six touchdown.
Speaker 2: Okay, so I love the big playability, right, that's what
Speaker 2: you're looking for. It does sound a little Javon Baker ish, right,
Speaker 2: like splash play guy.
Speaker 4: The running thing is interesting. I saw run the ball.
Speaker 2: I don't love the football. I don't love the conference.
Speaker 2: I don't I've had this conversation with a lot of people.
Speaker 4: At this point. It's Big twelve, right.
Speaker 2: So my biggest concern with drafting out of those conferences,
Speaker 2: drafting guys like Ted McMillan from Arizona, drafting a guy
Speaker 2: from TCU. None of the teams that they play on
Speaker 2: a consistent play basis play NFL defense.
Speaker 4: Like.
Speaker 2: None of those teams are playing Manton Man at a
Speaker 2: high level. None of those teams are playing any sort
Speaker 2: of NFL style press right Like.
Speaker 4: I'm not saying they never do it.
Speaker 2: I'm just saying it's not their major And so a
Speaker 2: lot of the time when you watch the film of
Speaker 2: these guys, they're just running into pockets of space against
Speaker 2: zone coverage and just catching balls over the middle of
Speaker 2: the field against like linebackers and safeties or whatever, you know,
Speaker 2: catching throws underneath like off coverage or bail technique or whatever,
Speaker 2: and so much.
Speaker 4: You know, it's hard.
Speaker 2: It's hard to like find that translate to the league, right, like, oh,
Speaker 2: this is a this is an NFL rep. Like, you know,
Speaker 2: he's getting pressed, he gets off pressed, he wins the route,
Speaker 2: he wins the route on time, like he's not hanging
Speaker 2: out forever on the line of scrimmage. It's really hard
Speaker 2: to find that, especially in those types of conferences, you know,
Speaker 2: the Big twelve, the old Pac twelve. Like those teams
Speaker 2: it's all three cover three, it's all quarters, it's all
Speaker 2: soft zonne like that. That's to worry something to me
Speaker 2: with those teams.
Speaker 4: So this is interesting because again I one of the
Speaker 4: few guys that, like I wasn't ready on and I'm
Speaker 4: looking at some of the comps here. So he started
Speaker 4: playing wildcat quarterback and running back late in the year.
Speaker 4: That's where all those carries came from. Jim, and it's
Speaker 4: Jim Naggy. Jim Nagy's comp is cord Aero Patterson at
Speaker 4: that size. If he's I mean fifty one times, we
Speaker 4: do like Cordero. Yeah, all right, I'm gonna I'm gonna
Speaker 4: try to watch them. Maybe you do your job, I know,
Speaker 4: if you like to say to me, maybe he's my
Speaker 4: recency biased guy. Uh next weeks week because my recency
Speaker 4: bias guy. This week? Do you have one?
Speaker 1: I do?
Speaker 4: I'll go really quick, Okay, I kind of like Isaiah Bond.
Speaker 4: Of course you do. He's fast, Like he's only fast.
Speaker 2: He's fast.
Speaker 4: So we're doing takwan again.
Speaker 2: I'm not letting you say that. I'm not letting what's
Speaker 2: the difference because Texas. That's the difference.
Speaker 4: Baylor is in Texas.
Speaker 2: Okay, but it's not Texas. All right, like you asked me,
Speaker 2: We're gonna relate this. Then I have one more thing
Speaker 2: that I really want to bring up. I know I
Speaker 2: do this every show. You asked me, who are the
Speaker 2: players in the college football playoff that could or like
Speaker 2: gain the most Okay, there's some obvious ones at the
Speaker 2: top of the draft, Abdull Carter connorly, you know, like
Speaker 2: guys like that that. You know, if they have instellar
Speaker 2: college football playoffs, they're gonna help their stock. To me,
Speaker 2: you know, Isaiah Bond's gonna see some real coverage now, right,
Speaker 2: Like he's gonna see Yeah, so they're gonna see some
Speaker 2: you know, one thing that boy Dabo can do his
Speaker 2: coach DB's like, that's the one thing that he's good at.
Speaker 4: Yeah, So Brett Vannable's a hell of a coach. So
Speaker 4: let's see, let's see what he does. You know, I
Speaker 4: I love the speed. I love the speed. I love
Speaker 4: the else. I love the separation ability to speed. What else?
Speaker 4: But to me, I just like, you know, I think
Speaker 4: the skill set translates, like I think he's gonna what
Speaker 4: is the skill set beside speed? Speed? So we're doing
Speaker 4: taekwon again. Drake needs somebody that that can win a
Speaker 4: go ball, That's all I'm saying. It sounds like Samuel
Speaker 4: Williams pretty fast too has changed direction. So mine, I'm
Speaker 4: fascinated by this guy. I still don't know how I
Speaker 4: feel about him as a patriot. Elijah Roberts from SMU. Yeah, so, yeah,
Speaker 4: you've been talking to me about this guy for We
Speaker 4: had one conversation with No. No, it's been days. So
Speaker 4: every almost everywhere he's listed at two ninety five ESPN
Speaker 4: has him been two seventy eight six four to seventy
Speaker 4: eight everywhere else. I bet two ninety five. He's among
Speaker 4: the nation's leaders and pressures like he gets after the quarterback.
Speaker 4: I'm like thinking, Okay, defensive end, he's like standing up,
Speaker 4: he's playing out side linebacker and at least two hundred
Speaker 4: and eighty five and ninety pounds getting after the quarter
Speaker 4: But he's not built like Keon White. Keon White doesn't
Speaker 4: like Elijah Roberts, looks like a defensive end, like he
Speaker 4: looks like a three four end, but he's standing up
Speaker 4: and chasing down running backs in the backfield and pursuing.
Speaker 2: You're literally describing ke White.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I guess, I don't know.
Speaker 2: I'm not saying that's as a bad thing is a
Speaker 2: good football Well, okay, so here's the other weird.
Speaker 4: I guess this is like Kean White. You'd think a
Speaker 4: big physical guy, right, wins with power. You can't defend
Speaker 4: the run. Ke On This is Mike confidence confidence Byron Coward.
Speaker 4: This is just he's not as exposed as ke On
Speaker 4: White is. All right, all right, fin, I'll give you
Speaker 4: another one. No, Michael Michael Kamara from Indiana second in
Speaker 4: the nation and pressures you've time six one, two, sixty.
Speaker 4: What do you do with him? Like undersized edge rusher.
Speaker 2: But undersized the length thinking to be an issue. Yeah,
Speaker 2: he's kind of like remember Mo Kamara last year, you
Speaker 2: liked him. I don't think they're re lated.
Speaker 4: I did like him. Okay, last thing? Who's college football payoff?
Speaker 2: No?
Speaker 10: Not that.
Speaker 2: So this is Todd emailing in and full disclosure. I'm
Speaker 2: sitting at a at a bar in Arizona on Saturday,
Speaker 2: and I sit down and there's a one of those
Speaker 2: things that called what they put on the table that's
Speaker 2: like an advertisement, like you know, like the little packard.
Speaker 4: The little placard.
Speaker 2: Sure at the table and I'm sit down and this
Speaker 2: guy that Todd emails in is on the placard and
Speaker 2: he's standing there with this big plate with this like
Speaker 2: giant hamburger on it.
Speaker 4: And I texted the picture to Barth instantly because it's
Speaker 4: the scatter Burger. Baby. It's Cam Scataboo, Welcome to Scatibo,
Speaker 4: Welcome to the NFL, Welcome to the nil Era. Yeah
Speaker 4: so Cam scattered, No, I couldn't get it had so
Speaker 4: much dairy in it, you know that. But Cam Scataboo
Speaker 4: is has a placard with his face on it, and
Speaker 4: he's standing there at the burger and it's the scatter
Speaker 4: Burger right next to Arizona State, and uh, the emailer asked,
Speaker 4: you know, if you're sitting there in the fourth round
Speaker 4: and Scataboo is there, are you taking him? There's gonna
Speaker 4: be better backs there than him at that point. But
Speaker 4: I'm not a post. Come on, you love it.
Speaker 7: I do.
Speaker 4: I love every running back in this draft. This is
Speaker 4: an insane running back. Love him. I like a lot
Speaker 4: of these backs. I'll take Kyle m Mike Alstott. Know
Speaker 4: you in that game and I said, I'm getting carried
Speaker 4: away here. Rockett Sanders will be on the board at
Speaker 4: that point. Film Maffa will be on the board at
Speaker 4: that point. I like Cam Scataboo. I think he's not
Speaker 4: he's His contact balance might be second to Jenty in
Speaker 4: this draft. Like he does not the first tackler never
Speaker 4: brings him down. Oh it's in the big twelve. We'll
Speaker 4: see him in the playoff. We'll see what it looks like.
Speaker 4: But he's also a capable receiver. He's not James White.
Speaker 4: He's a capable receiver. He's a good pass blocker, and
Speaker 4: they run some wildcat quarterback stuff with him. Not saying
Speaker 4: that I would do that here, but like, if you
Speaker 4: want to start doing some of that weird gadget stuff
Speaker 4: with Drake May, He's gonna be a good guy to
Speaker 4: have in the backfield with him. He fits the mold
Speaker 4: of this running back they have of like a guy
Speaker 4: who can do a little bit of everything. We see
Speaker 4: it with Antonio Gibson. We obviously know with Ramandre Stevenson
Speaker 4: he fits that mold. He'd be another good piece. I
Speaker 4: like him. I wouldn't be upset if they draft him.
Speaker 4: I think just he doesn't have that elite level athleticism.
Speaker 4: He's also a little bit older. That caps the ceiling.
Speaker 4: He has more carries on him. So that's why if
Speaker 4: we're talking about the fourth round, there might be some
Speaker 4: other guys I'd look at, But if they got him
Speaker 4: in like the sixth, I'd be a great pick and
Speaker 4: it would mean they address some other things a little
Speaker 4: higher up in the draft. Oregon wins. It's gonna be Oregon.
Speaker 4: My preseason pick was Ohio States, Like I'm sticking with
Speaker 4: that out of default, but Ryan Day or Ohio State
Speaker 4: is the best roster in the tournament. Ohio State is
Speaker 4: the most talent in the tournament. I don't know if
Speaker 4: they can overcome Ryan Day and their quarterbacks. Thinks. I
Speaker 4: think some of that's the coaching. He's so much worse
Speaker 4: now than he was at Kansas State. Quarterbacks bad. I
Speaker 4: think Debt Oregon has the better coach by far. How
Speaker 4: do you feel about him making the NFL jump? I
Speaker 4: been getting that question.
Speaker 2: I was gonna say that if I if I was
Speaker 2: Dan Lanning, if I was an NFL team that had
Speaker 2: an opening this offseason, one of my calls would be
Speaker 2: throwing a bag at Dan Lanning. I think he's just
Speaker 2: a great coach, so, you know, great defensive mind, great motivator.
Speaker 2: Since two thousand, you know, there's only two coaches that
Speaker 2: have had their first their first NFL job as a
Speaker 2: head job coming from college with a record over five.
Speaker 4: Hundred Jim Harbaugh. Harbaugh and Bill O'Brien. Oh and they're
Speaker 4: just like like I. As a rule of thumb, primary
Speaker 4: college coaches do not have success in the NFL January.
Speaker 4: I generally believe that I would rather hire somebody with
Speaker 4: NFL experience of any NFL team. That being said, if
Speaker 4: anybody right now is making the jump from the college
Speaker 4: to the pros. It's Dan Lanner. So Dan Lanning really quickly.
Speaker 2: It reminds me a little bit of like the defense's
Speaker 2: version of Sean McVay, Like where like he has the
Speaker 2: he has a great schemer on the d defensive side
Speaker 2: of the ball, that's an elite trade, but he.
Speaker 4: Can also get away from this Mickey mouse offense he's running.
Speaker 4: But he also kind of has that motivator and that
Speaker 4: like sort of like leader called the college Dan Campbell.
Speaker 2: I don't, yeah, but I think that he's smarter than
Speaker 2: Dan Campbell well in terms of that like leadership leader.
Speaker 4: Right, That's why I went to I feel like McVeigh
Speaker 4: is like both mcvagh has that too. No, there's definitely
Speaker 4: there's definitely some Evan there. Andy's in the Nick Saban
Speaker 4: Kirby smart trade. Yeah, good coach. I Dan Lanning to
Speaker 4: me is the best coach in college football right now.
Speaker 4: I don't think it's close. You can have Lane, you
Speaker 4: can have Sark, you can have Kirby, and I know
Speaker 4: some of those guys have rings. Kirby's a legend. Kirby's
Speaker 4: a legend. I think Dan Lanning's the best coach in
Speaker 4: college footballer Kirby. Kirby's good. Yeah, how much control does
Speaker 4: he have in his program? Kirby's stamp? How much control
Speaker 4: does he Kirby's stamp. Kirby's a great coach. I'm not
Speaker 4: saying he's not a great coach. If I could pick
Speaker 4: any coach in college football right now to start a
Speaker 4: program with, it's Dan Lanning.
Speaker 2: All right, we can finally wrap. Now you got all
Speaker 2: your college football takes. I have more, but yeah, you got.
Speaker 4: You're done doing Taekwon Thornton again. Oh God, don't know
Speaker 4: he's better than Taekwon. Why you haven't told me why?
Speaker 4: I don't have a good reason.
Speaker 2: I just think I test he's better. So he's faster, No,
Speaker 2: he's just like he's not as like, he's not as
Speaker 2: as as frail. I think he weighs like one hundred
Speaker 2: and sixty pounds, all right.
Speaker 4: And I like, isay you bought this? Come on, we
Speaker 4: gotta go, all right, just next week we will have
Speaker 4: a show.
Speaker 2: We're gonna be doing our same time usual time on Thursday,
Speaker 2: barring your scheduling and stuff like that for the team,
Speaker 2: but we will have a show next week, so we'll
Speaker 2: see you guys, uh next Thursday. We'll keep you updated
Speaker 2: on the time if we have to move it around,
Speaker 2: but we will have a show during the holidays, so
Speaker 2: we'll see you guys then.
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