1 00:00:01,480 --> 00:00:07,760 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you should know, a production of iHeartRadio. 2 00:00:11,200 --> 00:00:14,000 Speaker 2: Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh, and there's 3 00:00:14,120 --> 00:00:16,439 Speaker 2: Chuck and Jerry's here too, and this is stuff you 4 00:00:16,440 --> 00:00:18,599 Speaker 2: should know that we're all melting. 5 00:00:18,640 --> 00:00:22,800 Speaker 1: Addition, Yeah, I'm just a migrating fern. 6 00:00:23,680 --> 00:00:25,040 Speaker 2: Oh, that's a good one to be. 7 00:00:25,440 --> 00:00:29,760 Speaker 1: Blowing through of the forest looking for a new home. Sure, 8 00:00:30,160 --> 00:00:30,840 Speaker 1: I'm a spore. 9 00:00:31,120 --> 00:00:32,720 Speaker 2: What happens when you get their spore? 10 00:00:33,640 --> 00:00:36,920 Speaker 1: Well, I'll probably grow into a beautiful new fern because 11 00:00:37,040 --> 00:00:39,000 Speaker 1: ferns are pretty party. 12 00:00:39,280 --> 00:00:42,800 Speaker 2: That's awesome, and I'll bet you'll contribute to society and 13 00:00:42,880 --> 00:00:46,519 Speaker 2: all sorts of beneficial ways that ferns that were already 14 00:00:46,520 --> 00:00:48,000 Speaker 2: there couldn't necessarily do. 15 00:00:48,640 --> 00:00:50,600 Speaker 1: I hope. So there is fern stuff in here, and 16 00:00:51,320 --> 00:00:55,560 Speaker 1: I have a wonderful fern scene at my camp on 17 00:00:55,600 --> 00:00:57,800 Speaker 1: the other side of the feeder creek that goes into 18 00:00:57,800 --> 00:00:59,520 Speaker 1: the main creek. I call it. I even have a son. 19 00:00:59,560 --> 00:01:02,800 Speaker 1: This is fern forest, and it's a forest of ferns. 20 00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:03,560 Speaker 1: Is quite lovely. 21 00:01:03,840 --> 00:01:06,160 Speaker 2: God knows where they're from, because those things can travel 22 00:01:06,240 --> 00:01:07,200 Speaker 2: quite a bit, as we'll see. 23 00:01:07,280 --> 00:01:12,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, they could be from Alabamy easily. 24 00:01:13,480 --> 00:01:16,200 Speaker 2: I'm not kidding. Easily. Man, I've got a stat that's 25 00:01:16,200 --> 00:01:19,160 Speaker 2: gonna blow your mind in a second. Uh oh boy, Actually, 26 00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:20,840 Speaker 2: I'll just bust it out now, you ready? Yeah? 27 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:22,880 Speaker 1: Yeah? How far can a fern travel? 28 00:01:23,040 --> 00:01:26,440 Speaker 2: A fern can travel. The Tasmanian tree fern in particular, 29 00:01:27,200 --> 00:01:31,360 Speaker 2: can send it spores five hundred to eight hundred kilometers. 30 00:01:31,440 --> 00:01:34,800 Speaker 2: It's three hundred to five hundred miles from the mother plant. 31 00:01:35,160 --> 00:01:41,560 Speaker 2: And get this, a single frond a fraud produces more 32 00:01:41,600 --> 00:01:44,440 Speaker 2: than seven hundred and fifty million of those spores. 33 00:01:44,920 --> 00:01:45,440 Speaker 1: Wow. 34 00:01:45,520 --> 00:01:48,280 Speaker 2: So you can understand that ferns, I mean, you find 35 00:01:48,320 --> 00:01:52,920 Speaker 2: ferns everywhere. They're really hardy. They can actually survive cold, 36 00:01:53,080 --> 00:01:56,080 Speaker 2: colder temperatures than you would think. They also thrive in 37 00:01:56,160 --> 00:01:59,400 Speaker 2: the tropics. They're like a really great pioneer plant. They 38 00:01:59,520 --> 00:02:02,800 Speaker 2: usually are among the first large plants that show up 39 00:02:03,320 --> 00:02:07,440 Speaker 2: in a newly cleared part of Earth. Right, this all 40 00:02:07,480 --> 00:02:10,239 Speaker 2: makes sense then, Okay, So what we're talking about then, 41 00:02:10,760 --> 00:02:12,600 Speaker 2: is that those ferns that showed up in this new 42 00:02:12,639 --> 00:02:15,000 Speaker 2: place and said, hey, let's get this, let's get this 43 00:02:15,080 --> 00:02:18,480 Speaker 2: biosphere going again, let's get this biome back into shape 44 00:02:18,600 --> 00:02:23,360 Speaker 2: after this wildfire or something like that. Or there's like 45 00:02:23,400 --> 00:02:25,720 Speaker 2: a stampede because there was a really great ice cream 46 00:02:25,720 --> 00:02:30,600 Speaker 2: truck that drove through one of those two. Those ferns 47 00:02:30,720 --> 00:02:35,400 Speaker 2: have migrated. They came from Tasmania apparently all the way 48 00:02:35,440 --> 00:02:39,320 Speaker 2: to wherever the ice cream truck was. Right now they're there, 49 00:02:39,880 --> 00:02:42,400 Speaker 2: and so they actually moved in that sense, which is 50 00:02:42,440 --> 00:02:46,480 Speaker 2: really surprising because plants are what are known as sessile organisms. 51 00:02:46,520 --> 00:02:50,840 Speaker 2: They don't move from place to place individually as organisms, 52 00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:53,880 Speaker 2: but as a species they can actually move around like inchworms. 53 00:02:54,320 --> 00:02:54,880 Speaker 2: Pretty good. 54 00:02:55,400 --> 00:02:58,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's pretty cool. I didn't really know much about this. 55 00:02:58,440 --> 00:03:02,440 Speaker 1: We're talking about plant migration and the idea, well not idea, 56 00:03:02,520 --> 00:03:07,680 Speaker 1: the very real fact that just like humans and animals 57 00:03:08,320 --> 00:03:13,160 Speaker 1: will go to more hospitable climbs as the climate may 58 00:03:13,240 --> 00:03:16,120 Speaker 1: change or just i don't know, just to seek a 59 00:03:16,160 --> 00:03:19,679 Speaker 1: better place to be, plants and trees and things on 60 00:03:19,919 --> 00:03:20,959 Speaker 1: mass do the same thing. 61 00:03:21,760 --> 00:03:24,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, and there's all sorts of ways that they do 62 00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:28,240 Speaker 2: that too. So they do it by dispersing their seeds 63 00:03:28,400 --> 00:03:31,040 Speaker 2: or their spores in that case, fern spores or single 64 00:03:31,040 --> 00:03:34,639 Speaker 2: cell organisms. They're not like a seed technically, but they 65 00:03:34,680 --> 00:03:37,520 Speaker 2: do the same thing. Right. They show up in a 66 00:03:37,520 --> 00:03:40,000 Speaker 2: place and set up shop and they start rocking out. 67 00:03:41,080 --> 00:03:44,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. And ferns, you know, it depends and 68 00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:47,520 Speaker 1: we'll get all into this stuff. But how fast this 69 00:03:47,640 --> 00:03:52,480 Speaker 1: happens depends on different factors. How far these plants can 70 00:03:52,480 --> 00:03:58,160 Speaker 1: migrate depends on different factors. Why this is happening is 71 00:03:58,640 --> 00:04:02,880 Speaker 1: generally climate change. Yeah, and plants are in trees, and 72 00:04:02,920 --> 00:04:07,880 Speaker 1: things are generally moving north or up in elevation if 73 00:04:07,880 --> 00:04:09,320 Speaker 1: they hit mountains. 74 00:04:09,120 --> 00:04:12,640 Speaker 2: Or south in the southern hemisphere exactly. 75 00:04:13,640 --> 00:04:15,960 Speaker 1: So that's sort of the general pattern. And we mentioned 76 00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:19,040 Speaker 1: ferns because, like you said, those spores can really haul. 77 00:04:19,800 --> 00:04:23,440 Speaker 1: Ferns also mature very quickly, and you know, the wind 78 00:04:23,480 --> 00:04:27,080 Speaker 1: can just that's that's why I got a fern forest 79 00:04:27,120 --> 00:04:28,159 Speaker 1: at my camp probably. 80 00:04:28,279 --> 00:04:30,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, So they check both of the boxes that you 81 00:04:30,880 --> 00:04:34,520 Speaker 2: need to be a fast migrating plant species. They produce 82 00:04:35,279 --> 00:04:38,800 Speaker 2: seeds or spores at a very young age, and their 83 00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:42,800 Speaker 2: seed or spore can travel very far distances, right right, 84 00:04:42,839 --> 00:04:44,960 Speaker 2: so they can move around. And also it doesn't hurt that, 85 00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:48,320 Speaker 2: like I said, ferns are adaptable. Trees and other plants 86 00:04:48,360 --> 00:04:53,040 Speaker 2: still move quite so fast. But they move, especially if 87 00:04:53,040 --> 00:04:55,520 Speaker 2: you look at the fossil record, a lot faster than 88 00:04:55,560 --> 00:04:58,560 Speaker 2: they actually should so if you pay attention to a 89 00:04:58,640 --> 00:05:03,960 Speaker 2: single organism saying oak, Those acorns don't travel terribly far. 90 00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:07,360 Speaker 2: They may get a little further away from the drip 91 00:05:07,440 --> 00:05:09,800 Speaker 2: line if a squirrel happens to bury it somewhere and 92 00:05:09,839 --> 00:05:11,120 Speaker 2: a new oak tree grows. 93 00:05:11,520 --> 00:05:11,839 Speaker 1: Sure. 94 00:05:12,160 --> 00:05:16,880 Speaker 2: I think it was Ander Samberg who described acorns as 95 00:05:17,440 --> 00:05:20,840 Speaker 2: solar powered factories for producing more oak trees. 96 00:05:21,160 --> 00:05:22,880 Speaker 1: Whoaa Andy Samberg said that? 97 00:05:23,000 --> 00:05:29,160 Speaker 2: No, Anders Sandberg. Oh, okay, he's a philosopher at Oxford. 98 00:05:29,960 --> 00:05:30,960 Speaker 1: That makes a lot more sense. 99 00:05:31,040 --> 00:05:35,599 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, Andy Samberg. He ate his lime accidentally in 100 00:05:35,640 --> 00:05:38,080 Speaker 2: his Corona bottle. That's that's what he's got. 101 00:05:38,320 --> 00:05:39,520 Speaker 1: You knew he's married too. 102 00:05:41,200 --> 00:05:45,960 Speaker 2: Patricia Arquette. No Arquette, You've. 103 00:05:45,839 --> 00:05:48,320 Speaker 1: Been guessing Patricia Arkette for a lot of things. Slightly. 104 00:05:48,400 --> 00:05:52,279 Speaker 1: I feel like he's married to Yeah, I feel like 105 00:05:52,360 --> 00:05:53,880 Speaker 1: that's come up before. 106 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:57,159 Speaker 2: Maybe I don't know her name just rolls off the tone. 107 00:05:57,400 --> 00:06:00,320 Speaker 1: I know a big fan of hers. He is married 108 00:06:00,320 --> 00:06:05,360 Speaker 1: to what's her name, Joanna Newsom, the singer and harpist 109 00:06:05,680 --> 00:06:09,000 Speaker 1: oh Neatice. And if you like, if you're into architecture 110 00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:11,520 Speaker 1: and homes, you should seek out I don't know if 111 00:06:11,520 --> 00:06:14,360 Speaker 1: it's architectural digest or something. But someone did a spread 112 00:06:14,360 --> 00:06:17,240 Speaker 1: on their home and it is really something else. 113 00:06:17,480 --> 00:06:21,679 Speaker 2: Okay, so that's Andy Samberg per Yeah. 114 00:06:21,560 --> 00:06:23,880 Speaker 1: That would just checked a quick detour. 115 00:06:24,440 --> 00:06:25,840 Speaker 2: U Wait wait I wasn't done. 116 00:06:26,080 --> 00:06:27,080 Speaker 1: Oh no, good, go ahead. 117 00:06:27,360 --> 00:06:30,360 Speaker 2: So if you look in an individual tree, an oak tree, 118 00:06:30,480 --> 00:06:33,640 Speaker 2: those acorns don't go particularly far away from the tree, 119 00:06:34,160 --> 00:06:36,200 Speaker 2: as the old saying goes, But the fact that they 120 00:06:36,240 --> 00:06:39,600 Speaker 2: do fall away from the tree moons that very slowly 121 00:06:40,040 --> 00:06:42,120 Speaker 2: some of those seedlings are going to grow up a 122 00:06:42,120 --> 00:06:46,040 Speaker 2: little more northward or a little more southward. Then it's 123 00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:49,560 Speaker 2: mother plant, and very very slowly, the whole group of 124 00:06:49,600 --> 00:06:53,120 Speaker 2: oaks can move southward or northward right. 125 00:06:53,400 --> 00:06:56,120 Speaker 1: Over hundreds and thousands and tens of thousands. 126 00:06:55,800 --> 00:06:59,520 Speaker 2: Of years so long. The thing is, if you look 127 00:06:59,640 --> 00:07:04,920 Speaker 2: at the fossil record, they moved way faster than they should. 128 00:07:04,960 --> 00:07:07,200 Speaker 2: And there's actually a paradox that was named by a 129 00:07:07,240 --> 00:07:08,920 Speaker 2: guy named Clement. 130 00:07:08,640 --> 00:07:10,920 Speaker 1: Red right reads paradox. 131 00:07:11,120 --> 00:07:13,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, he's got a great, great title for it. 132 00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:15,559 Speaker 1: Of rapid plant migration. That's the full title. 133 00:07:15,680 --> 00:07:18,280 Speaker 2: It sounds almost like snake oil from the nineteenth century. 134 00:07:18,600 --> 00:07:19,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, it kind of. 135 00:07:21,040 --> 00:07:21,640 Speaker 2: So what is it? 136 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:25,239 Speaker 1: Oh? Okay, I didn't ever seen me up. We're still 137 00:07:25,240 --> 00:07:26,680 Speaker 1: tight after all these years. 138 00:07:26,520 --> 00:07:27,000 Speaker 2: For sure. 139 00:07:27,720 --> 00:07:30,240 Speaker 1: So what he found from the fossil record, like you 140 00:07:30,240 --> 00:07:32,080 Speaker 1: were talking about, and as we'll see that that's one, 141 00:07:32,160 --> 00:07:34,160 Speaker 1: like you know, pretty good way to study this stuff, 142 00:07:34,360 --> 00:07:36,200 Speaker 1: especially pollen fossils. 143 00:07:35,800 --> 00:07:37,600 Speaker 2: Right, yeah, because they're so hardy. 144 00:07:38,200 --> 00:07:40,760 Speaker 1: Yeah. So he saw that trees were migrating a lot 145 00:07:40,840 --> 00:07:44,560 Speaker 1: faster than like the rate that you would think, and 146 00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:48,520 Speaker 1: so he like those oaks I think was one example 147 00:07:48,520 --> 00:07:52,400 Speaker 1: you gave on the British Isles after the last glacial period, 148 00:07:52,640 --> 00:07:55,760 Speaker 1: over a span of like ten thousand years or so, 149 00:07:56,360 --> 00:07:59,720 Speaker 1: they traveled about six hundred miles and it would normally 150 00:07:59,760 --> 00:08:02,800 Speaker 1: take about a million years if the steeds, if the 151 00:08:02,840 --> 00:08:06,000 Speaker 1: seeds were just dispersed in a typical way. But what 152 00:08:06,120 --> 00:08:10,680 Speaker 1: he figured was that what may be happening here is 153 00:08:10,760 --> 00:08:15,040 Speaker 1: like some weird weather event happens that sent things much 154 00:08:15,080 --> 00:08:22,200 Speaker 1: farther than usual, or like some deer or something eats 155 00:08:22,280 --> 00:08:26,520 Speaker 1: something and then poops out something really far away from 156 00:08:26,520 --> 00:08:28,880 Speaker 1: where it started, and so all of a sudden, this 157 00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:31,160 Speaker 1: animal has spread it via their poo poo. 158 00:08:31,480 --> 00:08:36,280 Speaker 2: Right, And this is how like large scale migration happens, 159 00:08:37,080 --> 00:08:40,240 Speaker 2: or I should say, rapid migration over long distances. 160 00:08:39,800 --> 00:08:41,079 Speaker 1: Right right, Yeah, it's the. 161 00:08:41,160 --> 00:08:43,960 Speaker 2: It's the unusual, not just the acorn falling and hitting 162 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:47,160 Speaker 2: the ground. It's not just gravity assisted. It's animal assisted, 163 00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:50,240 Speaker 2: which is called zoochorey, or it's wind assisted, which is 164 00:08:50,280 --> 00:08:54,000 Speaker 2: called a nema corey, or water assisted, which is called hydrochory. 165 00:08:55,040 --> 00:08:59,360 Speaker 2: And that's just the way that some plants dispersed their seeds. 166 00:08:59,679 --> 00:09:02,120 Speaker 2: That's kind of on top of the normal way they 167 00:09:02,120 --> 00:09:04,520 Speaker 2: dispersed it, which is just dropping it from their leaves 168 00:09:04,960 --> 00:09:07,880 Speaker 2: or the spores blowing on the wind, which I guess 169 00:09:08,000 --> 00:09:08,920 Speaker 2: is one type of corey. 170 00:09:09,400 --> 00:09:12,079 Speaker 1: Yeah. So like if a squirrel loaded up its mouthful 171 00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:14,600 Speaker 1: of things m h and somehow found its way into 172 00:09:14,640 --> 00:09:17,840 Speaker 1: your camper, as you said off for Arizona. 173 00:09:17,400 --> 00:09:18,559 Speaker 2: That would be a freak event. 174 00:09:18,679 --> 00:09:23,000 Speaker 1: Sure it probably wouldn't be en mass, but you know, 175 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:24,600 Speaker 1: that's a way a dree coud move. 176 00:09:24,800 --> 00:09:27,600 Speaker 2: All it takes is that one oak to make it 177 00:09:27,640 --> 00:09:31,280 Speaker 2: sure to just survive, and then it starts its own 178 00:09:31,640 --> 00:09:33,880 Speaker 2: new part of the range. 179 00:09:34,280 --> 00:09:37,000 Speaker 1: Yeah. Absolutely, And we al should should point out when 180 00:09:37,920 --> 00:09:40,080 Speaker 1: when was redoing this. This is a while ago, like 181 00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:41,520 Speaker 1: one hundred plus years ago, right. 182 00:09:41,520 --> 00:09:44,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, he was a geologist. I don't know if we said, 183 00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:48,480 Speaker 2: but his reads Paradox of Rapid Plant Migration came out 184 00:09:48,520 --> 00:09:50,760 Speaker 2: in eighteen ninety nine and it was a smash hit. 185 00:09:51,200 --> 00:09:53,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, so people, I mean for at least that long, 186 00:09:54,200 --> 00:09:59,000 Speaker 1: science has been sort of curious about this, this migration 187 00:09:59,080 --> 00:10:01,120 Speaker 1: happening at a rate that they would not expect. 188 00:10:01,320 --> 00:10:05,440 Speaker 2: Right. The thing is is it's really hard when you 189 00:10:05,480 --> 00:10:09,400 Speaker 2: throw in that X factor to calculate how fast and 190 00:10:09,520 --> 00:10:13,720 Speaker 2: actual species can migrate. And there's a few ways that 191 00:10:13,760 --> 00:10:17,200 Speaker 2: you can study that kind of thing. One, as you said, 192 00:10:17,240 --> 00:10:21,320 Speaker 2: is studying the fossil record, which is super helpful, but 193 00:10:21,480 --> 00:10:24,960 Speaker 2: it's not showing you what's going on contemporaneously or within 194 00:10:25,000 --> 00:10:28,280 Speaker 2: the last couple decades. This is ten thousand, a million 195 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:29,720 Speaker 2: years ago something like that, right. 196 00:10:30,400 --> 00:10:32,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, So if you wanted to study something a little 197 00:10:32,920 --> 00:10:37,200 Speaker 1: closer to home timeline wise, you would maybe set up 198 00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:40,880 Speaker 1: what's called a permanent vegetation plot, so you would mark 199 00:10:40,920 --> 00:10:44,360 Speaker 1: off an area and you would go back there, you know, 200 00:10:44,520 --> 00:10:46,679 Speaker 1: every so often, like every six months or every year 201 00:10:46,760 --> 00:10:49,960 Speaker 1: or so, and just sort of chart what's happening. That's 202 00:10:50,040 --> 00:10:52,439 Speaker 1: one really good way. I think they've been doing this 203 00:10:52,520 --> 00:10:56,520 Speaker 1: for about one hundred years since in nineteen twenty, So 204 00:10:56,559 --> 00:10:59,600 Speaker 1: we've got a pretty good data set there. Something else 205 00:10:59,640 --> 00:11:02,959 Speaker 1: you could do is go somewhere, like, let's say you 206 00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:08,280 Speaker 1: dug up some cool scientific journal from a scientist from 207 00:11:08,679 --> 00:11:10,880 Speaker 1: you know, two hundred years ago that went and explored 208 00:11:10,920 --> 00:11:14,160 Speaker 1: some island, and while they may not have like charted 209 00:11:14,200 --> 00:11:17,640 Speaker 1: everything out exactly like you would in today's science, they 210 00:11:17,679 --> 00:11:19,920 Speaker 1: may have a really nice diary about all the plant 211 00:11:19,920 --> 00:11:21,640 Speaker 1: life there and things that they saw there and where 212 00:11:21,640 --> 00:11:23,880 Speaker 1: it might be. And you could go back to that 213 00:11:24,000 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 1: place and it's not quite as tight of a record, 214 00:11:27,440 --> 00:11:28,880 Speaker 1: but you could still get a pretty good idea of 215 00:11:28,920 --> 00:11:29,800 Speaker 1: what's happening. 216 00:11:29,600 --> 00:11:32,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, depending on whose journal you're working from. And back. 217 00:11:32,960 --> 00:11:36,520 Speaker 2: In twenty twelve, a Danish team of scientists followed the 218 00:11:36,600 --> 00:11:40,640 Speaker 2: record left by a nineteenth century geologist named Alexander von 219 00:11:41,080 --> 00:11:44,800 Speaker 2: Humboldt from Germany, who was just an interesting dude in 220 00:11:44,840 --> 00:11:48,640 Speaker 2: and of himself. Yeah, he called coffee concentrated some beams. 221 00:11:48,720 --> 00:11:49,880 Speaker 2: So he's that kind of guy. 222 00:11:50,160 --> 00:11:51,280 Speaker 1: Oh man, that's great. 223 00:11:51,360 --> 00:11:56,080 Speaker 2: They went back to Chimborazo Volcano in Ecuador, which Humboldt 224 00:11:56,080 --> 00:11:59,400 Speaker 2: studied in detail, and not only did he study the 225 00:11:59,480 --> 00:12:02,160 Speaker 2: vegetation there and he classified all sorts of new plants 226 00:12:02,160 --> 00:12:05,200 Speaker 2: that Europeans didn't know about at that point. He also 227 00:12:05,400 --> 00:12:08,560 Speaker 2: noted exactly where they were on the mountain as far 228 00:12:08,640 --> 00:12:09,720 Speaker 2: as the elevation went. 229 00:12:10,040 --> 00:12:11,760 Speaker 1: Super helpful, super helpful. 230 00:12:12,200 --> 00:12:16,640 Speaker 2: So based on this information, the twenty twelve Danes were 231 00:12:16,679 --> 00:12:20,240 Speaker 2: able to go back and recreate his trip, and then 232 00:12:20,280 --> 00:12:23,320 Speaker 2: they were able to note what plants were where, and 233 00:12:23,360 --> 00:12:26,240 Speaker 2: they found that everything, all species, on average, had moved 234 00:12:26,600 --> 00:12:29,360 Speaker 2: up the mountain by about an average of about five 235 00:12:29,440 --> 00:12:34,160 Speaker 2: hundred meters, which is significant. It's like almost a mile, 236 00:12:34,280 --> 00:12:35,680 Speaker 2: it's like eight tenths of a mile. 237 00:12:36,360 --> 00:12:39,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, that's the average. Yeah, there was a lot 238 00:12:39,280 --> 00:12:41,880 Speaker 1: of aeriation within that, but that's that's a long way 239 00:12:42,040 --> 00:12:44,680 Speaker 1: for sure. And what we found out, and I guess 240 00:12:44,840 --> 00:12:47,839 Speaker 1: this comes up a little later, but a plant can 241 00:12:47,920 --> 00:12:53,280 Speaker 1: find more hospitable climbs going up five hundred meters than 242 00:12:53,320 --> 00:12:56,480 Speaker 1: they might by going let's just say north, like ninety 243 00:12:56,480 --> 00:12:59,960 Speaker 1: to one hundred miles. Yes, so like a much quicker 244 00:13:00,520 --> 00:13:03,400 Speaker 1: road to better climbs if you just go up that 245 00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:04,320 Speaker 1: mountain for sure. 246 00:13:04,400 --> 00:13:10,839 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's kind of two ways they move is longitudinally yeah, 247 00:13:10,960 --> 00:13:12,760 Speaker 2: or altitudinally. 248 00:13:13,160 --> 00:13:15,520 Speaker 1: You gotta be in shape though, Oh, for sure, you're 249 00:13:15,520 --> 00:13:19,440 Speaker 1: gonna climb that mountain. Should we take a break? 250 00:13:20,080 --> 00:13:21,640 Speaker 2: I think we should. But just to wrap it up 251 00:13:21,640 --> 00:13:23,440 Speaker 2: real quick, there's a bunch of ways you can study 252 00:13:23,679 --> 00:13:25,720 Speaker 2: the movement of trees. But it's so slow and it 253 00:13:25,760 --> 00:13:28,880 Speaker 2: happens over such long timelines, longer than a human timeline, 254 00:13:29,000 --> 00:13:31,520 Speaker 2: that it's harder to do than you'd think. But we 255 00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:33,440 Speaker 2: still have figured out some ways to do it. 256 00:13:34,280 --> 00:13:36,640 Speaker 1: All Right, we'll be right back and we'll talk about 257 00:13:36,640 --> 00:13:37,960 Speaker 1: all this stuff in more detail. 258 00:13:38,040 --> 00:13:38,559 Speaker 2: Right for this. 259 00:14:00,160 --> 00:14:01,880 Speaker 1: One other way we failed to mention. Probably would have 260 00:14:01,920 --> 00:14:04,480 Speaker 1: been better to just say that before the break, But again, 261 00:14:04,800 --> 00:14:08,840 Speaker 1: still learning after sixteen years. Satellite images is another way 262 00:14:09,160 --> 00:14:13,720 Speaker 1: that you can study on the short term. You know, 263 00:14:13,760 --> 00:14:16,680 Speaker 1: the fossil pollen is much longer, and those plant plots 264 00:14:16,679 --> 00:14:20,720 Speaker 1: and things like that, vegetation plots our shorter term. But 265 00:14:20,800 --> 00:14:22,240 Speaker 1: satellite images can also help. 266 00:14:22,480 --> 00:14:25,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, if you want to catch like a venus fly 267 00:14:25,120 --> 00:14:28,600 Speaker 2: trap and the act of leap frogging over some other planet, 268 00:14:28,880 --> 00:14:31,040 Speaker 2: satellite image is going to help you with that. Fossil 269 00:14:31,120 --> 00:14:32,120 Speaker 2: record won't show you that. 270 00:14:33,120 --> 00:14:36,120 Speaker 1: Here's the thing with all this, though, it's not like 271 00:14:36,160 --> 00:14:38,040 Speaker 1: we're going to talk a lot about climate change because 272 00:14:38,040 --> 00:14:40,040 Speaker 1: that's what's spurring a lot of the movement right now. 273 00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:44,040 Speaker 1: But the Earth's climate has changed a lot over the 274 00:14:44,640 --> 00:14:47,160 Speaker 1: you know, over the years, and this is not some 275 00:14:47,480 --> 00:14:51,080 Speaker 1: new thing. There used to be periods of time where 276 00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:55,240 Speaker 1: the Sahara desert was quite green and there was grasses 277 00:14:55,240 --> 00:14:59,520 Speaker 1: growing there and tropical plants growing there, and elephants roaming 278 00:14:59,520 --> 00:15:03,560 Speaker 1: the Sahara and wildlife living there. And they've learned that 279 00:15:03,600 --> 00:15:06,520 Speaker 1: this is actually one of the things that helped move 280 00:15:06,680 --> 00:15:10,000 Speaker 1: you know, humans around, Like humans could actually migrate through 281 00:15:10,000 --> 00:15:12,960 Speaker 1: the Sahara with much more ease than they could before 282 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:15,560 Speaker 1: during these green Sahara periods. 283 00:15:15,680 --> 00:15:18,840 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's so fascinating that, you know, who knows when 284 00:15:19,200 --> 00:15:21,960 Speaker 2: we would have migrated out of Africa into Europe and 285 00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:25,080 Speaker 2: the ages had the green Sahara not happened. And isn't 286 00:15:25,080 --> 00:15:25,960 Speaker 2: that just nuts? 287 00:15:26,040 --> 00:15:29,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, like hundreds of miles it says here that they 288 00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:31,720 Speaker 1: would find tropical plants growing where they shouldn't be, growing 289 00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:35,880 Speaker 1: alongside you know, the desert stuff that survived. So that 290 00:15:36,040 --> 00:15:38,720 Speaker 1: was this weird sort of mixed up biome for a time. 291 00:15:38,920 --> 00:15:41,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, And the Green Sahara period there were a few 292 00:15:41,120 --> 00:15:43,000 Speaker 2: of them that had been documented, but they figured out 293 00:15:43,040 --> 00:15:46,400 Speaker 2: that they happened about every twenty three thousand years, right, 294 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:48,920 Speaker 2: We're due for one in about twelve thousand years something 295 00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:54,160 Speaker 2: like that. And it's based on the tilt in Earth's axis. 296 00:15:54,480 --> 00:15:56,760 Speaker 2: That's neither here nor there. But the point is is 297 00:15:57,080 --> 00:16:01,440 Speaker 2: during these these periods where this was just a humid 298 00:16:01,840 --> 00:16:06,200 Speaker 2: kind of tropical forest, there was a mixture kind of 299 00:16:06,240 --> 00:16:08,400 Speaker 2: what you touched upon, of different like you said, a 300 00:16:08,480 --> 00:16:13,560 Speaker 2: hybrid biome of stuff that wouldn't necessarily live together under 301 00:16:13,560 --> 00:16:16,920 Speaker 2: normal circumstances, but got along just famously in the couple 302 00:16:16,960 --> 00:16:19,440 Speaker 2: thousand years that the Sahara was green and those plants 303 00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:20,320 Speaker 2: were growing together. 304 00:16:20,880 --> 00:16:22,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's just amazing to think about. 305 00:16:22,720 --> 00:16:25,640 Speaker 2: And then in North America we have another example too. 306 00:16:26,560 --> 00:16:30,400 Speaker 2: After the Laurentide Glacier, which is way up in the 307 00:16:30,520 --> 00:16:33,280 Speaker 2: Arctic right now, used to be down in Indiana and 308 00:16:33,320 --> 00:16:36,720 Speaker 2: northern New Jersey. Yeah, and when it retreated, it took 309 00:16:36,880 --> 00:16:40,080 Speaker 2: everything with it. It took bowlers, it carved out lakes, 310 00:16:40,080 --> 00:16:42,240 Speaker 2: it did all sorts of neat stuff. But what it 311 00:16:42,280 --> 00:16:45,240 Speaker 2: didn't leave behind was vegetation. So it left it was 312 00:16:45,280 --> 00:16:49,120 Speaker 2: like a giant ice cream truck basically. Yeah, it left 313 00:16:49,160 --> 00:16:51,760 Speaker 2: nothing behind, and it was just a great place for 314 00:16:51,840 --> 00:16:54,040 Speaker 2: plants to pioneer and colonie. 315 00:16:54,280 --> 00:16:56,160 Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean that's why you have pine trees in 316 00:16:56,200 --> 00:16:57,160 Speaker 1: New Jersey, right. 317 00:16:57,720 --> 00:17:00,360 Speaker 2: I would think so, yeah, or in the south because 318 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:05,480 Speaker 2: they were too far they were trapped below or yeah, 319 00:17:05,520 --> 00:17:10,720 Speaker 2: below the Laurentide Glacier down in the southeast, even though 320 00:17:10,720 --> 00:17:14,440 Speaker 2: they normally would have been growing in the north, right, 321 00:17:15,200 --> 00:17:18,480 Speaker 2: And as the glacier retreated, the climate changed in that area, 322 00:17:18,520 --> 00:17:20,320 Speaker 2: and so the trees has moved on up. So that's 323 00:17:20,359 --> 00:17:21,920 Speaker 2: an example of migration as well. 324 00:17:22,480 --> 00:17:24,800 Speaker 1: Yeah. Oh wait, I thought they but I thought they 325 00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:27,240 Speaker 1: were It was more hospitable in the south for these trees, 326 00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:31,600 Speaker 1: and that migration sent them north. Yeah, that's what I said, right, 327 00:17:31,840 --> 00:17:36,439 Speaker 1: Oh okay maybe Yeah. The other thing we should talk 328 00:17:36,480 --> 00:17:38,640 Speaker 1: about as far as climate change goes, because, like I said, 329 00:17:38,640 --> 00:17:41,920 Speaker 1: we're going to mention that a lot is the rate 330 00:17:42,000 --> 00:17:45,600 Speaker 1: of change of the climate is increasing, as most people 331 00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:49,200 Speaker 1: agree on, and that is kind of where we are 332 00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:53,000 Speaker 1: now in discussing this is like, is the rate of 333 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:56,840 Speaker 1: climate increasing too fast for the plant migration to catch up, 334 00:17:57,320 --> 00:18:00,720 Speaker 1: or in some cases are the plants migrating ahead of 335 00:18:00,760 --> 00:18:04,040 Speaker 1: that pace? And that's really sort of you know, a 336 00:18:04,080 --> 00:18:06,879 Speaker 1: lot of this episode is about this rate of change. 337 00:18:07,359 --> 00:18:10,119 Speaker 1: In the two hundred years since the beginning of the 338 00:18:10,119 --> 00:18:14,560 Speaker 1: Industrial Age, no coincidence, the temperature of the Earth has 339 00:18:14,680 --> 00:18:19,680 Speaker 1: increased more than one degree. And again, yeah we all 340 00:18:19,720 --> 00:18:21,920 Speaker 1: know now that you know, one degree is like a huge, 341 00:18:22,000 --> 00:18:22,520 Speaker 1: huge deal. 342 00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:24,879 Speaker 2: It's one point eight degrees fahrenheit. 343 00:18:25,520 --> 00:18:29,199 Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, But zero point three seven of that change 344 00:18:29,359 --> 00:18:32,879 Speaker 1: over the past two hundred years has come since twenty eleven. 345 00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:37,840 Speaker 1: So it's people. Have you know, someone has stepped on 346 00:18:37,840 --> 00:18:40,439 Speaker 1: the gas here. Yeah, and it's happening much much faster, 347 00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:44,440 Speaker 1: and seemingly in many cases, fasting faster than these plants 348 00:18:44,480 --> 00:18:45,000 Speaker 1: can catch up. 349 00:18:45,119 --> 00:18:47,440 Speaker 2: Yeah. So plants are used to migrating, like they've been 350 00:18:47,480 --> 00:18:52,120 Speaker 2: migrating through our Earth's history, but these conditions are different. 351 00:18:52,440 --> 00:18:55,440 Speaker 2: It's not like it was before. Even when the Earth 352 00:18:55,560 --> 00:18:58,240 Speaker 2: was heating up after the last Ice Age, I think, 353 00:18:58,320 --> 00:19:00,320 Speaker 2: did you say that it took about an hour average 354 00:19:00,359 --> 00:19:03,960 Speaker 2: of fourteen hundred years to increase by one degree after 355 00:19:03,960 --> 00:19:05,119 Speaker 2: the last glacial period? 356 00:19:05,760 --> 00:19:07,919 Speaker 1: No, No, that was the setup. That would have been 357 00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:08,439 Speaker 1: very helpful. 358 00:19:08,440 --> 00:19:11,960 Speaker 2: Actually, I mean, think about it. So we've achieved one 359 00:19:11,960 --> 00:19:15,160 Speaker 2: degree in two hundred years, and after the last glacial 360 00:19:15,160 --> 00:19:20,600 Speaker 2: period ended the earth heated one degree every fourteen hundred years. 361 00:19:20,840 --> 00:19:22,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's called a rapid increase. 362 00:19:22,359 --> 00:19:24,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, Like you said, somebody's put their foot on the gas, 363 00:19:24,400 --> 00:19:27,520 Speaker 2: and that's somebody is Western industrialized nations, right. 364 00:19:28,119 --> 00:19:28,679 Speaker 1: Yeah. 365 00:19:28,720 --> 00:19:31,119 Speaker 2: So that's one thing that's really kind of putting the 366 00:19:31,720 --> 00:19:36,719 Speaker 2: heat on plants literally is their southernmost ranges or their 367 00:19:36,800 --> 00:19:41,720 Speaker 2: northernmost ranges, depending on what I guess, they're equatorial pointing 368 00:19:42,320 --> 00:19:47,000 Speaker 2: ranges where it's hotter. Those are the ones that are 369 00:19:47,000 --> 00:19:50,639 Speaker 2: really at stake. So are those plants ranges big enough 370 00:19:50,960 --> 00:19:53,000 Speaker 2: that they'll be able to survive that change in climate 371 00:19:53,040 --> 00:19:55,600 Speaker 2: and just keep moving northward or are they going to 372 00:19:56,200 --> 00:20:00,119 Speaker 2: be outpaced by the movement of the climate because the 373 00:20:00,160 --> 00:20:04,040 Speaker 2: climate is racing towards the poles, just like the plants are. 374 00:20:04,160 --> 00:20:05,719 Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, So who's faster. 375 00:20:06,240 --> 00:20:10,160 Speaker 2: Well, it turns out if you talk about New England's trees, 376 00:20:11,160 --> 00:20:13,479 Speaker 2: they move something I think red oaks is what it 377 00:20:13,600 --> 00:20:17,280 Speaker 2: was that this University of Vermont group was studying. They 378 00:20:17,320 --> 00:20:20,119 Speaker 2: move something like a tenth to three tenths of a 379 00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:24,959 Speaker 2: mile a year, right, Yeah. The climate is moving something 380 00:20:25,080 --> 00:20:28,080 Speaker 2: like four to six miles a year. So the climate 381 00:20:28,160 --> 00:20:31,320 Speaker 2: is really kind of showing up as kind of the 382 00:20:31,960 --> 00:20:37,920 Speaker 2: Usain Bolt of this race. And I don't know the 383 00:20:38,320 --> 00:20:40,800 Speaker 2: plants are like me racing Usain Bolt. 384 00:20:41,440 --> 00:20:43,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, that lab group in Vermont, they all have t 385 00:20:43,640 --> 00:20:46,880 Speaker 1: shirts that just say you do the math exactly. It's 386 00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:49,320 Speaker 1: very smarty, but they get their point across for sure. 387 00:20:51,080 --> 00:20:53,359 Speaker 1: There's another example of and you know, we've kind of 388 00:20:53,359 --> 00:20:58,119 Speaker 1: been talking about northern movement, which is generally the pattern, 389 00:20:58,160 --> 00:21:03,080 Speaker 1: but not always. There's a rece Purdue name song Lend Fay. 390 00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:07,000 Speaker 1: I think Fay or Fhi. I don't know Fi. I 391 00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:10,480 Speaker 1: bet it's Fie who studied eighty six species of trees 392 00:21:10,520 --> 00:21:13,560 Speaker 1: in the eastern US over about thirty years from the 393 00:21:13,600 --> 00:21:17,359 Speaker 1: mid eighties to twenty fifteen. And it depends on what 394 00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:22,600 Speaker 1: the tree is. Hardwoods, scarlet oaks, red maples, magnolias are 395 00:21:22,680 --> 00:21:25,720 Speaker 1: moving west at about one and a half kilometers a 396 00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:29,679 Speaker 1: year because the Midwest is becoming more wet and the 397 00:21:29,720 --> 00:21:33,360 Speaker 1: conditions are good for those trees to grow. Soft woods, 398 00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:37,639 Speaker 1: shortleaf pines, red pines, bald cypress. They're actually moving north 399 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:40,480 Speaker 1: about a kilometer of the year, a kilometer a year. 400 00:21:40,400 --> 00:21:40,560 Speaker 2: So. 401 00:21:42,080 --> 00:21:45,400 Speaker 1: Different plants and trees are moving in different directions at 402 00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:46,240 Speaker 1: different rates. 403 00:21:46,400 --> 00:21:51,119 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's very much akin to a neighborhood that's this 404 00:21:51,359 --> 00:21:54,280 Speaker 2: old settled in neighborhood with a bunch of mix of 405 00:21:54,359 --> 00:21:58,680 Speaker 2: people that's being gentrified. It's being pushed out and separated. 406 00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:02,000 Speaker 2: Not everybody, just the whole neighborhood doesn't just move. This 407 00:22:02,040 --> 00:22:05,560 Speaker 2: neighborhood breaks up and goes in different directions. And so 408 00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:09,159 Speaker 2: to ecologists in arborous like this is very concerning because 409 00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:13,160 Speaker 2: for a long time we've looked at groups of plants 410 00:22:13,680 --> 00:22:17,400 Speaker 2: as communities, like some some plants go with other plants, 411 00:22:17,400 --> 00:22:25,119 Speaker 2: like I think was it beach and uh, hickory, where 412 00:22:25,160 --> 00:22:25,480 Speaker 2: is it? 413 00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:29,040 Speaker 1: I don't know. I like hickory, though. 414 00:22:29,040 --> 00:22:31,920 Speaker 2: We can't we can't leave that in there. Oh yeah, hemlocks. 415 00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:34,920 Speaker 2: I knew it was an h. H. Tree. Beach and 416 00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:40,119 Speaker 2: hemlocks go together like peanut butter and chocolate, so to do, 417 00:22:40,280 --> 00:22:42,800 Speaker 2: like firs and spruces. Right, So when you find one 418 00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:44,600 Speaker 2: of these, you usually find the other one. And there's 419 00:22:44,600 --> 00:22:46,600 Speaker 2: also a bunch of other plants that kind of interact, 420 00:22:46,600 --> 00:22:49,080 Speaker 2: and usually some types of animals that hang out in 421 00:22:49,119 --> 00:22:51,320 Speaker 2: those same types of forests. So if you've got the 422 00:22:51,359 --> 00:22:56,080 Speaker 2: hemlocks going north and the beach going west, Who are 423 00:22:56,080 --> 00:22:57,800 Speaker 2: the hemlocks going to mix with and who are the 424 00:22:57,800 --> 00:22:59,800 Speaker 2: beach going to mix with when they start to set 425 00:22:59,840 --> 00:23:03,560 Speaker 2: up these new communities, And that was really troubling to ecologists, 426 00:23:03,760 --> 00:23:09,560 Speaker 2: but I think palinologists, these fossil pollen scientists have said 427 00:23:09,680 --> 00:23:12,640 Speaker 2: it's always been this way. Communities aren't permanent, they're kind 428 00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:15,560 Speaker 2: of instable. They just seem permanent to us because our 429 00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:19,000 Speaker 2: life years there are lifespans on the order of like 430 00:23:19,080 --> 00:23:22,200 Speaker 2: seventy eighty years, right right, This is it's a much 431 00:23:22,240 --> 00:23:26,560 Speaker 2: slower process, but it's a constantly changing turnover, so it's 432 00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:29,440 Speaker 2: not that big of a deal. But again, because of 433 00:23:29,480 --> 00:23:32,920 Speaker 2: the pace of climate change, when these hemlocks get further 434 00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:35,639 Speaker 2: north and the beach get further west, they're going to 435 00:23:35,720 --> 00:23:39,200 Speaker 2: have far less time to develop new connections and networks 436 00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:42,679 Speaker 2: with the new plants that they set up communities with. 437 00:23:43,960 --> 00:23:46,159 Speaker 1: Yeah, and the other thing too, you know earlier when 438 00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:51,920 Speaker 1: I mentioned that a series of trees might move up 439 00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:54,960 Speaker 1: a mountain side because it's a way quicker way to 440 00:23:55,000 --> 00:23:57,719 Speaker 1: get to a more hospitable climate than moving that ninety 441 00:23:57,720 --> 00:24:01,560 Speaker 1: miles north. Yeah, when they and this happens in other 442 00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:04,080 Speaker 1: cases as well, it's not just like up a mountain side. 443 00:24:04,280 --> 00:24:06,280 Speaker 1: But when they get to the place where they're going, 444 00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:10,959 Speaker 1: it may be a better place, may be more hospitable 445 00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:14,719 Speaker 1: climate wise, but other things aren't so great. So if 446 00:24:14,760 --> 00:24:17,320 Speaker 1: you move up that mountain slope, let's say you have 447 00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:21,440 Speaker 1: a shallower soil, and so those trees move up there 448 00:24:21,480 --> 00:24:24,040 Speaker 1: because the climate's better. But then they get there and 449 00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:26,640 Speaker 1: the soil is in as great, so they get squeezed 450 00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:29,280 Speaker 1: into where they can grow, maybe into like a tiny 451 00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:32,639 Speaker 1: little narrow band that's you know, potentially choking off the 452 00:24:32,680 --> 00:24:33,439 Speaker 1: rest of the forest. 453 00:24:33,640 --> 00:24:37,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, I've figured out it's kind of like hiding in 454 00:24:37,040 --> 00:24:39,760 Speaker 2: a closet during a house fire, Like you're going to 455 00:24:39,840 --> 00:24:41,680 Speaker 2: be safe in the short term, but in the long 456 00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:43,960 Speaker 2: term it's not a great strategy. But it's not like 457 00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:46,359 Speaker 2: the trees have any choice. They can't go back down. 458 00:24:46,720 --> 00:24:49,800 Speaker 2: It's too hot there, they can't move further up. There's 459 00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:53,240 Speaker 2: the soils in hospitable, so they're trapped and they're eventually 460 00:24:53,280 --> 00:24:55,480 Speaker 2: going to become a thinner and thinner band until they 461 00:24:55,520 --> 00:24:57,399 Speaker 2: just pop out of existence. 462 00:24:57,960 --> 00:25:00,440 Speaker 1: That's right. And the other thing that can happen when, 463 00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:02,640 Speaker 1: like you said, when they get to a new place, 464 00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:04,439 Speaker 1: and they don't have enough time to make new friends. 465 00:25:05,720 --> 00:25:07,760 Speaker 1: All of a sudden, that can open the window for 466 00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:10,919 Speaker 1: bad friends to show up. Yeah, and all of a sudden, 467 00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:13,880 Speaker 1: invasive species are there, and then you've got a whole 468 00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:14,719 Speaker 1: other set of problems. 469 00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:17,159 Speaker 2: Yeah, the ones that were like leather jackets with the 470 00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:21,360 Speaker 2: little silver studs on their shoulders, those are the ones 471 00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:23,320 Speaker 2: you gotta watch out for. Those plants. 472 00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:27,760 Speaker 1: If this all seems very kind of on too long 473 00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:31,240 Speaker 1: of a timeline for you to care, First of all, 474 00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:33,879 Speaker 1: you probably don't care much about climate change because that's 475 00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:37,639 Speaker 1: the whole name of the game there. Sure, but maple 476 00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:40,120 Speaker 1: syrup is a good example that Livia found Lyvia helped 477 00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:44,200 Speaker 1: u out. She did great job with this. The maple tree. 478 00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:47,280 Speaker 1: Which species is that? The sugar maple is one of 479 00:25:47,280 --> 00:25:49,600 Speaker 1: the two main species that we use to get that 480 00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:50,720 Speaker 1: delicious maple syrup. 481 00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:53,720 Speaker 2: I'm sorry, this isn't a side. Sugar maple are two 482 00:25:53,840 --> 00:25:57,040 Speaker 2: beautiful words that form an even more beautiful. 483 00:25:57,240 --> 00:25:59,119 Speaker 1: You are right on the money, my friend. You know, 484 00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:04,040 Speaker 1: sugar maple. It just sounds nice coming out of my mouth. Yeah. 485 00:26:04,119 --> 00:26:09,320 Speaker 1: They have been migrating north into Canada, and you might say, well, 486 00:26:09,320 --> 00:26:12,320 Speaker 1: that's great Canada is a fine place to live, and 487 00:26:12,359 --> 00:26:14,120 Speaker 1: I'm sure they love their maple serve up there too. 488 00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:18,480 Speaker 1: But in Quebec, the researchers have found that they're not 489 00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:22,600 Speaker 1: gonna go beyond their current range up there because they're 490 00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:25,919 Speaker 1: boreal forests up there. So the soil again, they the 491 00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:27,840 Speaker 1: climate might be better, but then they get up there 492 00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:30,840 Speaker 1: and the soil pH and the microbe content in the 493 00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:33,480 Speaker 1: soil is not what they're used to and not what 494 00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:36,720 Speaker 1: they work well with and grow well with. So they're 495 00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:38,359 Speaker 1: not doing well up there in the forest. 496 00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:42,200 Speaker 2: No, No, And that's it's the exact same position as 497 00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:44,720 Speaker 2: the trees that are trying to go up the mountain 498 00:26:44,760 --> 00:26:48,400 Speaker 2: are running into. Eventually, these trees that are moving into 499 00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:52,000 Speaker 2: the boreal forest areas, they're like they can't go any further, 500 00:26:52,240 --> 00:26:53,600 Speaker 2: Like they're not adapted to that. 501 00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:57,160 Speaker 1: Over a long enough timeline, yeah, maybe. 502 00:26:56,880 --> 00:26:59,320 Speaker 2: Those sugar maples could, like a few of them, could 503 00:26:59,359 --> 00:27:01,840 Speaker 2: land in the border royal forest and end up surviving 504 00:27:01,880 --> 00:27:04,800 Speaker 2: in that kind of soil and then they would be 505 00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:07,240 Speaker 2: adapted for and they'd start reproducing. And then as the 506 00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:10,879 Speaker 2: boreal forest moved closer to the Poles or the Arctic, 507 00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:15,080 Speaker 2: those trees would move where the boreal forest used to be. Right, 508 00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:18,720 Speaker 2: totally not a problem over a long enough time span. Again, 509 00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:22,440 Speaker 2: climate change has so drastically shortened that timespan that there's 510 00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:24,520 Speaker 2: probably not going to be time for this, and those 511 00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:28,000 Speaker 2: sugar maples will just run into that boreal soil and 512 00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:30,679 Speaker 2: just they it'll be like hitting a brick wall for 513 00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:31,480 Speaker 2: their species. 514 00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:35,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, another issue that can happen. And I know this 515 00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:38,200 Speaker 1: all just seems like doomsday stuff, kind of is it? 516 00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:43,440 Speaker 1: Kind of this though, Let's say, like the Amazon episode 517 00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:46,200 Speaker 1: that we talked about, when trees are moving out there, 518 00:27:47,119 --> 00:27:49,240 Speaker 1: they might be replaced by something and it may not 519 00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:52,720 Speaker 1: be an invasive species, but it may just be weeds 520 00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:56,560 Speaker 1: or grasses or something. Those aren't as good at capturing 521 00:27:56,560 --> 00:27:59,399 Speaker 1: carbon as those trees were, So then that accelerates the 522 00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:00,199 Speaker 1: problem even more. 523 00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:03,640 Speaker 2: Right, And then there's another if you want to keep 524 00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:09,640 Speaker 2: talking about these stay scenarios. Those boreal forests, they actually 525 00:28:09,840 --> 00:28:12,359 Speaker 2: are if you look at a map or if you 526 00:28:12,359 --> 00:28:16,320 Speaker 2: look at planet Earth from outer space, they're dark, which 527 00:28:16,359 --> 00:28:20,040 Speaker 2: means that they absorb more sunlight, more heat, more UV radiation. 528 00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:24,720 Speaker 2: Then the polar caps the ice that reflects it back 529 00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:28,080 Speaker 2: into space. So as those boreal forests advance further and 530 00:28:28,119 --> 00:28:31,560 Speaker 2: further north toward the toward the Arctic or the North Pole, 531 00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:34,200 Speaker 2: and there's less and less ice to reflect that there's 532 00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:36,919 Speaker 2: more and more heat for them to trap, which is 533 00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:40,360 Speaker 2: just going to heat the earth that much faster. It's 534 00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:43,200 Speaker 2: a positive feedback loop that's super duper negative. 535 00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:49,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, very negative. Maybe we should cover tropical things moving 536 00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:50,840 Speaker 1: north and then take a break. 537 00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:52,719 Speaker 2: Yeah, because I got some good stuff on that, man, 538 00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:53,560 Speaker 2: I'm super exciting. 539 00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:56,880 Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean it goes both ways. So you can 540 00:28:56,960 --> 00:29:01,200 Speaker 1: have like tropical plants and tropical zones like Florida, where 541 00:29:01,360 --> 00:29:03,200 Speaker 1: you know, the earth is warming, so they can move 542 00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:05,400 Speaker 1: further and further north, and all of a sudden, these 543 00:29:05,440 --> 00:29:08,520 Speaker 1: plants that are native to tropical zones are ending up 544 00:29:08,520 --> 00:29:13,520 Speaker 1: in areas where it's you know, not necessarily a tropical zone. 545 00:29:14,720 --> 00:29:18,360 Speaker 1: I can't remember which zone Atlanta. 546 00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:21,560 Speaker 2: Is, Atlanta's seven B and aight a seven. 547 00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:25,200 Speaker 1: I love that you know that stuff. But the point 548 00:29:25,360 --> 00:29:29,760 Speaker 1: is like these these like kill kill frost that you 549 00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:33,240 Speaker 1: might get that happen to I love that name kill frost, 550 00:29:34,040 --> 00:29:35,920 Speaker 1: Like it'll get really cold and frost over and like 551 00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:38,720 Speaker 1: kill things. Maybe that shouldn't be there if that's happening 552 00:29:38,800 --> 00:29:41,000 Speaker 1: less and less, and there's even less in the way 553 00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:44,280 Speaker 1: of those tropical plants moving northward. 554 00:29:44,280 --> 00:29:48,720 Speaker 2: Right, and so I guess climatologists are expecting that by 555 00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:51,240 Speaker 2: the end of the century, which seems like a long 556 00:29:51,280 --> 00:29:54,320 Speaker 2: way away. But buddy, that's like less than that's like 557 00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:58,280 Speaker 2: eight decades, seventy something years, maybe even seventy seven you 558 00:29:58,280 --> 00:30:02,120 Speaker 2: could say to be exact, But in seventy seven years, 559 00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:09,360 Speaker 2: climatologists expect all of Florida, Alabama, Mississippi, Louisiana, Texas, New Mexico, 560 00:30:09,880 --> 00:30:14,880 Speaker 2: Arizona and California, guessing the southern half to be tropical. 561 00:30:15,280 --> 00:30:18,280 Speaker 2: Those are subtropical. Now, if you want an example of 562 00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:24,680 Speaker 2: what a tropical country is, go to Ecuador, go to Guatemala. 563 00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:28,800 Speaker 2: Those are tropical, and Alabama and Arizona are going to 564 00:30:28,800 --> 00:30:32,080 Speaker 2: be like Guatemala by the end of the century. Yeah, 565 00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:34,200 Speaker 2: that's insane. 566 00:30:34,400 --> 00:30:38,960 Speaker 1: I know, it's really and it's happening. It's not like 567 00:30:39,120 --> 00:30:41,320 Speaker 1: they've shown that it's currently happening. 568 00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:43,560 Speaker 2: Yes, and it's happening because, like you were saying, those 569 00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:47,440 Speaker 2: extreme cold events are becoming rarer and they're becoming warmer. 570 00:30:47,520 --> 00:30:49,600 Speaker 2: So the coldest day of the year is not as 571 00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:50,600 Speaker 2: cold as it used to be. 572 00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:53,680 Speaker 1: In other words, I think the scientific term is kill Frost. 573 00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:56,840 Speaker 2: I love that. That is definitely a band name. 574 00:30:57,520 --> 00:30:59,280 Speaker 1: Oh for sure, Mike. What are they though? 575 00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:01,280 Speaker 2: Oh? I don't know. 576 00:31:01,280 --> 00:31:03,440 Speaker 1: I think it's kind of heavy or something, right. 577 00:31:03,320 --> 00:31:06,800 Speaker 2: I don't know. Remember Destroyer they were great, They didn't 578 00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:09,800 Speaker 2: really destroy They had like kind of like a belying name, 579 00:31:09,840 --> 00:31:10,440 Speaker 2: you know what I mean? 580 00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:13,360 Speaker 1: No, that's true, so it could be like that. I 581 00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:16,440 Speaker 1: think he named the band that for that reason is 582 00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:17,560 Speaker 1: a bit of a tongue in cheek thing. 583 00:31:17,560 --> 00:31:18,840 Speaker 2: Maybe I knew I liked that. 584 00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:22,680 Speaker 1: Kay, yeah, Beharts who we're talking about? 585 00:31:22,800 --> 00:31:26,600 Speaker 2: Not Joy Tony. 586 00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:28,880 Speaker 1: I know it's a Dan I think. 587 00:31:28,800 --> 00:31:30,840 Speaker 2: Right, I don't know. I just know a couple of 588 00:31:30,880 --> 00:31:33,360 Speaker 2: Destroyer songs. I don't have to know the guy's life story, 589 00:31:33,400 --> 00:31:34,480 Speaker 2: do I Well? 590 00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:39,360 Speaker 1: Settle down? No, I wanted to look it up because 591 00:31:39,400 --> 00:31:43,400 Speaker 1: he is. He's also a part time member of maybe 592 00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:47,600 Speaker 1: my favorite all time band, the New Pornographers, like modern band. 593 00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:50,360 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, he's He's on most of their albums, 594 00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:51,800 Speaker 1: but hasn't done the past few. 595 00:31:52,240 --> 00:31:55,640 Speaker 2: Who was the singer for New Pornographers? Was it Nico case. 596 00:31:56,080 --> 00:32:00,520 Speaker 1: Well, she sings and Carl Newman sings, and also the 597 00:32:00,600 --> 00:32:03,959 Speaker 1: great Catherine Calder, who is the stuff you should know listener. 598 00:32:04,040 --> 00:32:06,320 Speaker 2: Oh Nat, oh wow, Yeah, I. 599 00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:07,840 Speaker 1: Found that out and I was like, oh, I got 600 00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:10,000 Speaker 1: to get in touch with her, and I did, and 601 00:32:10,040 --> 00:32:13,560 Speaker 1: now we are email buddies. And on the last New 602 00:32:13,560 --> 00:32:16,560 Speaker 1: Pornographer show in Atlanta, she's kind enough to meet me 603 00:32:16,880 --> 00:32:21,040 Speaker 1: behind the bus, as they say, in the back parking lot, 604 00:32:21,080 --> 00:32:23,040 Speaker 1: and we chatted for a while and she's just wonderful. 605 00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:27,160 Speaker 1: And she also gonna plug her other band because she 606 00:32:27,240 --> 00:32:30,800 Speaker 1: has put out a great album last year with her 607 00:32:30,920 --> 00:32:35,080 Speaker 1: band front person, So get front person. If you like 608 00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:39,880 Speaker 1: CYNTHI goodness and like a beautiful angelic voice, then get 609 00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:40,600 Speaker 1: front person. 610 00:32:41,080 --> 00:32:43,880 Speaker 2: Speaking of CYNTHI goodness, that's so funny you bring that up. 611 00:32:44,120 --> 00:32:47,320 Speaker 2: Just today I discovered an entirely new genre of music 612 00:32:47,400 --> 00:32:49,640 Speaker 2: called dungeon synth. Have you heard of it? 613 00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:50,760 Speaker 1: What? No? 614 00:32:51,160 --> 00:32:56,000 Speaker 2: Okay, okay. It's a really well named genre. But it 615 00:32:56,080 --> 00:33:00,560 Speaker 2: is synth super like cynthy synth, like eighties a synth. 616 00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:01,520 Speaker 1: I love it. 617 00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:04,440 Speaker 2: But the kind of synth that you would find is 618 00:33:04,520 --> 00:33:09,760 Speaker 2: like the score to a seventies hobbit, like cartoon movie, 619 00:33:09,800 --> 00:33:16,480 Speaker 2: animated movie, it's super wizardy and fantasy. It just evokes 620 00:33:16,520 --> 00:33:18,520 Speaker 2: all that stuff. It does such a good job of it. 621 00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:21,120 Speaker 2: But I've only heard one album. I can't remember whose 622 00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:25,560 Speaker 2: it was. But check out Frost. Checkout Dungeon Synth. Yeah, 623 00:33:25,640 --> 00:33:27,480 Speaker 2: Kill Frost is a Dungeon Synth band. 624 00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:31,640 Speaker 1: Nice work, all right, Dungeon Synth and the front Person album. 625 00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:33,360 Speaker 1: Their most recent Parade. 626 00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:36,880 Speaker 2: Is great, very nice. I think it time for a break. 627 00:33:37,280 --> 00:33:39,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, let's take a break. We'll be back with more 628 00:33:39,360 --> 00:33:40,680 Speaker 1: album reviews right after. 629 00:33:40,520 --> 00:34:05,120 Speaker 2: This, So, Chuck. One thing you can say about humans 630 00:34:05,320 --> 00:34:10,279 Speaker 2: is that we are action oriented. Sure, in a lot 631 00:34:10,360 --> 00:34:12,439 Speaker 2: of ways, I will give you that we sit around 632 00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:17,200 Speaker 2: in bicker and complain and moan and undermine one another. 633 00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:21,160 Speaker 2: But when the chips are down, we can invent our 634 00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:24,320 Speaker 2: way out of a lot of problems. And invention doesn't 635 00:34:24,400 --> 00:34:27,759 Speaker 2: have to necessarily mean that we, you know, put some 636 00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:30,480 Speaker 2: metal on metal and made it go on its own. 637 00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:34,920 Speaker 2: It can be something like inventing new areas for species 638 00:34:34,960 --> 00:34:37,840 Speaker 2: that are in danger of being lost to climate change 639 00:34:38,200 --> 00:34:42,399 Speaker 2: to settle and make another part of their range out of. 640 00:34:43,280 --> 00:34:45,560 Speaker 1: Well, sir, it sounds like you were talking about forest 641 00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:47,359 Speaker 1: assisted migration by God. 642 00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:49,440 Speaker 2: I am that's right. 643 00:34:49,320 --> 00:34:52,120 Speaker 1: And that is basically and we'll talk about the good, 644 00:34:52,239 --> 00:34:54,000 Speaker 1: the bad, and the ugly of this. That is human 645 00:34:54,040 --> 00:35:00,080 Speaker 1: being scientists getting involved in the ecosystem and nature and 646 00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:04,080 Speaker 1: spreading seed and sort of getting ahead of the pace 647 00:35:04,920 --> 00:35:07,719 Speaker 1: if the pace isn't where it should be to keep 648 00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:10,080 Speaker 1: up with climate change, saying well, let me give you 649 00:35:10,080 --> 00:35:14,920 Speaker 1: a little little help forward. And this can be kind 650 00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:19,560 Speaker 1: of thorny because it's it's humans, like I said, getting 651 00:35:19,560 --> 00:35:22,399 Speaker 1: involved in the ecosystem in ways that science has long said, 652 00:35:23,160 --> 00:35:25,680 Speaker 1: let nature work it out, and that's the best way 653 00:35:25,680 --> 00:35:27,640 Speaker 1: to do it, because you don't know what can happen 654 00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:28,839 Speaker 1: once you start messing around. 655 00:35:29,000 --> 00:35:32,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, like nature finds a way it does. These guys 656 00:35:32,920 --> 00:35:34,880 Speaker 2: are saying, the people who are in favor of this 657 00:35:35,040 --> 00:35:39,040 Speaker 2: are saying that made sense before July twenty twenty three, 658 00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:44,000 Speaker 2: which is probably the hottest month in Earth's history, at 659 00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:46,920 Speaker 2: least as a kid far as since it cooled basically, 660 00:35:47,719 --> 00:35:51,240 Speaker 2: and that followed the hottest June ever. Right, So they're 661 00:35:51,480 --> 00:35:54,080 Speaker 2: these ecologists that are like, no, we need to take 662 00:35:54,200 --> 00:35:56,960 Speaker 2: much more of an active hand in this, are saying, 663 00:35:57,000 --> 00:35:59,960 Speaker 2: like it's our obligation to do something. Not doing any 664 00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:03,439 Speaker 2: thing is going to be more destructive. It's like saying like, yeah, 665 00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:06,040 Speaker 2: we shouldn't move these people out of this house that's 666 00:36:06,080 --> 00:36:09,200 Speaker 2: being bulldozed over because we don't know what they're gonna 667 00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:11,759 Speaker 2: do in their new neighborhood. So we're just gonna stand 668 00:36:11,800 --> 00:36:15,000 Speaker 2: there and watch them die as the bulldozer crushes them 669 00:36:15,080 --> 00:36:18,560 Speaker 2: inside of their house. That's the that's a pretty good analogy. 670 00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:22,480 Speaker 2: If I do congratulate myself here, it's very much akin 671 00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:24,680 Speaker 2: to that. And so those of colleges have a pretty 672 00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:27,000 Speaker 2: good point, like it's like, yeah, it's not a great, 673 00:36:27,239 --> 00:36:30,680 Speaker 2: perfect solution, but it's way better than doing nothing. 674 00:36:31,600 --> 00:36:33,719 Speaker 1: Yeah. But and they're not they're not doing it willy 675 00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:37,440 Speaker 1: nilly though. They're very aware of the potential pitfalls like 676 00:36:37,960 --> 00:36:40,800 Speaker 1: you know, spreading disease and introducing something to an area 677 00:36:40,840 --> 00:36:43,080 Speaker 1: that could be really bad for other things in that area. 678 00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:46,120 Speaker 1: So they're not just out there, you know, with a 679 00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:50,319 Speaker 1: seed cannon blasting stuff all over the place, like like 680 00:36:50,440 --> 00:36:52,279 Speaker 1: Dolph Lunderin or something wearing. 681 00:36:52,080 --> 00:36:53,240 Speaker 2: Bike coat shorts. 682 00:36:55,719 --> 00:36:59,520 Speaker 1: There's a couple of different kinds though. There's there's forest 683 00:36:59,560 --> 00:37:03,680 Speaker 1: assistance migration. The one that's really sort of thorny is 684 00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:09,640 Speaker 1: assisted range expansion. So like, if you're spreading something within 685 00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:13,759 Speaker 1: the zone where it might still normally grow in like 686 00:37:13,760 --> 00:37:17,080 Speaker 1: two hundred years, that's one thing. If you're moving something 687 00:37:17,120 --> 00:37:19,560 Speaker 1: completely out of that range, like you know, they do 688 00:37:19,600 --> 00:37:22,160 Speaker 1: forecasting and stuff, and they're like, what might this area 689 00:37:22,239 --> 00:37:25,279 Speaker 1: look like one hundred miles from here one hundred years 690 00:37:25,280 --> 00:37:28,239 Speaker 1: from now? If they're moving something completely out of a 691 00:37:28,360 --> 00:37:31,239 Speaker 1: range that it would even potentially grow, that gets way 692 00:37:31,280 --> 00:37:34,520 Speaker 1: way trickier. And I think there's less of that happening. 693 00:37:34,200 --> 00:37:37,480 Speaker 2: Right, yes, for sure, Like, but you hit it on 694 00:37:37,520 --> 00:37:40,440 Speaker 2: the head. They're saying, like, Okay, by twenty one hundred, 695 00:37:40,480 --> 00:37:42,319 Speaker 2: what is this area going to be, Like is it 696 00:37:42,360 --> 00:37:44,719 Speaker 2: going to be like where these red oaks like to 697 00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:47,919 Speaker 2: live now in twenty twenty three? And if so, maybe 698 00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:49,600 Speaker 2: we can give them a head start and hope that 699 00:37:49,680 --> 00:37:54,600 Speaker 2: some of them will survive and adapt and start colonizing there. Right, Yeah, 700 00:37:54,600 --> 00:37:58,720 Speaker 2: it gets even prett clear than assisted range expansion. There's another, 701 00:37:59,160 --> 00:38:04,480 Speaker 2: even more radical one called species rescue or assisted species migration, 702 00:38:04,960 --> 00:38:08,520 Speaker 2: and that is where you take a plant completely out 703 00:38:08,600 --> 00:38:11,600 Speaker 2: of its normal range, out of what you would even 704 00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:13,560 Speaker 2: predict would be its normal range, and just move it 705 00:38:13,600 --> 00:38:17,080 Speaker 2: somewhere it would never be right. This is considered the 706 00:38:17,200 --> 00:38:22,160 Speaker 2: riskiest of the three by ecologists because you can easily 707 00:38:22,200 --> 00:38:26,400 Speaker 2: take something that's totally innocuous and benign under normal circumstances 708 00:38:26,719 --> 00:38:29,560 Speaker 2: and make it into an invasive species when you move it. 709 00:38:30,120 --> 00:38:33,120 Speaker 2: And the critics of this typically point to the Monterey 710 00:38:33,200 --> 00:38:34,520 Speaker 2: Pine as a good example. 711 00:38:34,960 --> 00:38:38,239 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. It's endangered in California. It is native 712 00:38:38,280 --> 00:38:42,879 Speaker 1: to California, but they have introduced it in Australia and 713 00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:45,200 Speaker 1: it's it's well, I don't know about wreaking habit, but 714 00:38:45,520 --> 00:38:49,680 Speaker 1: it's damaging the It's an invasive species in Australia. 715 00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:51,839 Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure. They consider it a weed and where 716 00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:54,040 Speaker 2: they see it, they pluck it. They do not like 717 00:38:54,120 --> 00:38:58,360 Speaker 2: those in New South Wales and Victoria, I believe states. 718 00:38:58,680 --> 00:39:02,200 Speaker 1: Now that's a weed, right, I don't know. 719 00:39:03,800 --> 00:39:06,080 Speaker 2: No, I'm gonna have to agree with you on that. 720 00:39:06,120 --> 00:39:08,520 Speaker 2: I think you just you just came up with a 721 00:39:08,560 --> 00:39:11,759 Speaker 2: brand new type of accent. Frankly, Yeah, can we hear 722 00:39:11,760 --> 00:39:15,360 Speaker 2: it again? No, Okay, I'm just gonna go back and 723 00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:16,000 Speaker 2: replay it. 724 00:39:16,719 --> 00:39:19,920 Speaker 1: You know what's funny though, is I use my the 725 00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:21,600 Speaker 1: lady on my phone that talks to me. What's it 726 00:39:21,640 --> 00:39:25,680 Speaker 1: called on Apple. I guess I don't use Siri, but 727 00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:28,840 Speaker 1: I still have a voice for maps and stuff, and 728 00:39:28,880 --> 00:39:31,800 Speaker 1: I use a I usually go between an Irish woman 729 00:39:31,960 --> 00:39:35,279 Speaker 1: and a Kiwi A New Zealander. Oh yeah, and the 730 00:39:35,360 --> 00:39:38,440 Speaker 1: New Zealander says rye and it always cracks me up. 731 00:39:38,560 --> 00:39:40,200 Speaker 2: That sounds like Matthew McConaughey. 732 00:39:40,760 --> 00:39:44,279 Speaker 1: It does. At the next street, take a rye. 733 00:39:44,520 --> 00:39:46,960 Speaker 2: I gotta hear that. Yeah, I didn't know you could 734 00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:50,440 Speaker 2: do something that. Gee whiz to an Apple iPhone make it. 735 00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:53,200 Speaker 1: Talk out, okay, some some regular old thing I don't do. 736 00:39:53,400 --> 00:39:57,239 Speaker 2: I'd like sounds. Digital sounds are one of those. Like 737 00:39:57,320 --> 00:39:59,320 Speaker 2: I don't have mesophonia, but if I do, it's for 738 00:39:59,360 --> 00:40:02,040 Speaker 2: a digital sound. Like when I get a new computer, 739 00:40:02,120 --> 00:40:04,040 Speaker 2: the first thing I do is turn off all sounds 740 00:40:04,080 --> 00:40:07,719 Speaker 2: on it. Like anything I have to go, Like I 741 00:40:07,760 --> 00:40:10,799 Speaker 2: have to change my text sound every month or so 742 00:40:11,000 --> 00:40:13,600 Speaker 2: because I'll just get like anxiety from it. I can't 743 00:40:13,600 --> 00:40:15,239 Speaker 2: stand text sounds, so I have to come up with 744 00:40:15,280 --> 00:40:17,319 Speaker 2: a new one. I do not like them. 745 00:40:17,840 --> 00:40:20,719 Speaker 1: Do you know what I do is I record? I 746 00:40:20,760 --> 00:40:24,319 Speaker 1: record my own text and phone rings and stuff. Oh yeah, yeah, 747 00:40:24,360 --> 00:40:27,200 Speaker 1: I record my voice like when my phone rings. I 748 00:40:27,239 --> 00:40:29,000 Speaker 1: never had my ringer on, but if it ever does, 749 00:40:29,080 --> 00:40:32,480 Speaker 1: it's me going ring ring, ring, ring thoughts. And if 750 00:40:32,520 --> 00:40:34,480 Speaker 1: I get a text, it's me going text. 751 00:40:34,520 --> 00:40:35,520 Speaker 2: Man, that's great. 752 00:40:36,160 --> 00:40:38,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, I get strange looks, but who cares? 753 00:40:38,239 --> 00:40:39,360 Speaker 2: Can I just use yours? 754 00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:42,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, I'll say to you if you want, thank you? Yeah, 755 00:40:42,760 --> 00:40:45,279 Speaker 1: or you can like you can make one specific for 756 00:40:45,360 --> 00:40:47,879 Speaker 1: you me, which is like maybe just her sweet voice 757 00:40:47,920 --> 00:40:49,719 Speaker 1: saying hello, hello, my love. 758 00:40:49,840 --> 00:40:52,440 Speaker 2: I used to have a ring tone with her singing 759 00:40:52,480 --> 00:40:55,360 Speaker 2: that part from What's Love Got to Do with It? 760 00:40:55,440 --> 00:40:55,520 Speaker 1: That? 761 00:40:55,719 --> 00:40:58,920 Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, but she just kept saying that over and 762 00:40:58,960 --> 00:41:00,000 Speaker 2: over again. It's pretty great. 763 00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:02,200 Speaker 1: Oh, I'd love to hear that. It's also kind of maddening. 764 00:41:02,640 --> 00:41:05,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, no, it never was. Actually, I never got sick 765 00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:06,719 Speaker 2: of that one. I think that says a lot. 766 00:41:07,400 --> 00:41:10,080 Speaker 1: But it's better than deludoo doo. 767 00:41:10,200 --> 00:41:14,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, man, you just stressed me out. Sorry you got 768 00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:15,080 Speaker 2: anything else? 769 00:41:15,880 --> 00:41:18,239 Speaker 1: Uh? Now, I had a joke about your dislike of 770 00:41:18,280 --> 00:41:21,040 Speaker 1: digital sounds, but your love of craft work flies in 771 00:41:21,080 --> 00:41:22,680 Speaker 1: the face of that. But I won't even say it. 772 00:41:22,719 --> 00:41:24,319 Speaker 2: That's more a statement than a joke. 773 00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:26,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, but it is true. 774 00:41:26,640 --> 00:41:30,799 Speaker 2: It's quite accurate. I think that's it. Chuck. 775 00:41:31,440 --> 00:41:33,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, I got nothing else. This is uh, this is 776 00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:35,160 Speaker 1: a good one. Look out, you know, if you're in 777 00:41:36,280 --> 00:41:37,839 Speaker 1: if you're in New Mexico and you see a palm 778 00:41:37,880 --> 00:41:40,000 Speaker 1: tree growing, then watch out. 779 00:41:40,239 --> 00:41:43,319 Speaker 2: That's right. It means that you've gone tropical and you're 780 00:41:43,360 --> 00:41:44,120 Speaker 2: in trouble now. 781 00:41:44,640 --> 00:41:45,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, not in a good way. 782 00:41:45,960 --> 00:41:49,440 Speaker 2: Uh. If you want to know more about plant migration, 783 00:41:49,520 --> 00:41:51,440 Speaker 2: there's a lot of interesting stuff out there on the 784 00:41:51,440 --> 00:41:54,040 Speaker 2: internet to read and go do that and maybe go 785 00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:57,040 Speaker 2: become an ecologist and figure out how to save the planet. 786 00:41:57,120 --> 00:41:58,640 Speaker 1: Please and I agree. 787 00:41:58,680 --> 00:42:01,080 Speaker 2: Since Chuck's had agreed, it's time for a listener mail. 788 00:42:03,719 --> 00:42:06,120 Speaker 1: This is from William Lloyd. We did a shorty on 789 00:42:06,160 --> 00:42:12,919 Speaker 1: the NATO phonetic alphabet, and what we didn't consider was this. 790 00:42:13,880 --> 00:42:16,920 Speaker 1: Hey guys, being a pilot and prior Air Force, I 791 00:42:16,960 --> 00:42:19,080 Speaker 1: was glad that you did one on this topic. It's 792 00:42:19,120 --> 00:42:21,319 Speaker 1: not a correction. You guys did a good job, but 793 00:42:21,920 --> 00:42:24,560 Speaker 1: you missed what I think is the best part the numbers. 794 00:42:25,680 --> 00:42:28,520 Speaker 1: The NATO alphabet is kind of a misnumber because it 795 00:42:28,560 --> 00:42:31,839 Speaker 1: actually also includes number zero through nine. But you can't 796 00:42:31,880 --> 00:42:33,719 Speaker 1: really make a word starting from a number, so it's 797 00:42:33,760 --> 00:42:37,800 Speaker 1: purely pronunciation. Most numbers are the same with a notable 798 00:42:37,800 --> 00:42:43,000 Speaker 1: exception of niner. We use niner instead of nine because 799 00:42:43,160 --> 00:42:46,880 Speaker 1: over garbled radio it sounds like five, but mainly because 800 00:42:47,000 --> 00:42:53,279 Speaker 1: NATO countries speak German nine No in German nice. Three 801 00:42:53,480 --> 00:42:57,319 Speaker 1: is pronounced tree to not be confused with the antiquated 802 00:42:57,360 --> 00:43:03,960 Speaker 1: prefix three. SR. Four is two syllable syllables rhymes with lower, 803 00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:08,279 Speaker 1: so you'd say four sounds kind of funny to differentiate 804 00:43:08,280 --> 00:43:12,520 Speaker 1: it from you know, fo r and five is five 805 00:43:13,280 --> 00:43:16,680 Speaker 1: to keep the word fire distinct in some dialects. Huh, 806 00:43:17,200 --> 00:43:19,160 Speaker 1: all right, this is good stuff. I feel dumb that 807 00:43:19,160 --> 00:43:22,000 Speaker 1: we miss that. That's all interesting, but you're probably thinking, 808 00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:25,160 Speaker 1: does anyone actually say it like that? It depends. Niner 809 00:43:25,280 --> 00:43:28,399 Speaker 1: was pretty universal, plus we think it makes it sound cool, 810 00:43:28,440 --> 00:43:31,560 Speaker 1: which it does. Of course. The rest are much less common, 811 00:43:31,560 --> 00:43:33,759 Speaker 1: but depending where you are in the world and what 812 00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:37,800 Speaker 1: dialects are involved, they're useful from time to time. Signed 813 00:43:38,040 --> 00:43:39,640 Speaker 1: Tailwinds Decker. 814 00:43:40,080 --> 00:43:43,120 Speaker 2: That's awesome and also what a great nickname too. I 815 00:43:43,120 --> 00:43:45,319 Speaker 2: hope that's your nickname and your parents wouldn't actually name 816 00:43:45,320 --> 00:43:47,000 Speaker 2: you tail wings Well. 817 00:43:46,880 --> 00:43:49,279 Speaker 1: No, no, no, Decker is the name Tailwinds was the. 818 00:43:49,920 --> 00:43:52,719 Speaker 2: Oh the sign of yeah. The cheers are the one 819 00:43:52,800 --> 00:43:56,239 Speaker 2: love exactly. So Decker's the first name. 820 00:43:57,840 --> 00:43:59,480 Speaker 1: Well, I don't know it just a Decker Decker maybe 821 00:43:59,520 --> 00:43:59,960 Speaker 1: a call sign. 822 00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:02,960 Speaker 2: Actually, all right, well I love that. Thanks a lot, Decker, 823 00:44:03,120 --> 00:44:07,160 Speaker 2: much appreciated. I say Niner whenever the occasion arises, you know, 824 00:44:07,840 --> 00:44:08,319 Speaker 2: I like that. 825 00:44:08,360 --> 00:44:11,480 Speaker 1: You know, our our good friend, Joe Randazzo, formerly of 826 00:44:11,520 --> 00:44:14,840 Speaker 1: the Onion and at Midnight Fame, our our comedy writer friend. 827 00:44:15,600 --> 00:44:21,920 Speaker 1: He signs his emails yours with a comma Joe Joe Endazzo. 828 00:44:22,080 --> 00:44:23,359 Speaker 2: That's great, that's very well. 829 00:44:23,400 --> 00:44:26,320 Speaker 1: I think yours is. It's very very warn as is Joe. 830 00:44:26,400 --> 00:44:27,759 Speaker 2: Sure, that's perfect for. 831 00:44:27,760 --> 00:44:31,600 Speaker 1: Him and as always high to the kids. Yeah, Joe's kids. 832 00:44:31,600 --> 00:44:32,040 Speaker 1: So listen. 833 00:44:32,120 --> 00:44:35,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, the Randazzos there listening. Family, the flying Randazzos. They're 834 00:44:35,680 --> 00:44:40,239 Speaker 2: trepeze artists. Family, just waiting will happen? They should be Well, 835 00:44:40,400 --> 00:44:42,520 Speaker 2: we'll see a lot's gonna happen by the end of 836 00:44:42,560 --> 00:44:44,400 Speaker 2: the century apparently, so who knows. 837 00:44:44,480 --> 00:44:44,880 Speaker 1: That's right. 838 00:44:45,360 --> 00:44:46,520 Speaker 2: Well, if you want to get in touch with this 839 00:44:46,680 --> 00:44:49,359 Speaker 2: like Decker did and confuse me with your sign off, 840 00:44:50,120 --> 00:44:52,520 Speaker 2: I'd appreciate it. So with Chuck too, he loves that 841 00:44:52,680 --> 00:44:55,480 Speaker 2: kind of thing. You can wrap it up, spend it 842 00:44:55,560 --> 00:44:58,320 Speaker 2: on the bottom and send it off to stuff podcast 843 00:44:58,480 --> 00:44:59,799 Speaker 2: at iHeartRadio dot com. 844 00:45:03,160 --> 00:45:06,000 Speaker 1: Stuff you Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. For 845 00:45:06,120 --> 00:45:10,279 Speaker 1: more podcasts my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 846 00:45:10,440 --> 00:45:12,240 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.