1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:03,440 Speaker 1: You may have heard that Japan has a population problem. 2 00:00:03,440 --> 00:00:06,240 Speaker 1: Too many people are getting older and not enough people 3 00:00:06,280 --> 00:00:09,119 Speaker 1: are being born or moving there. But it's not just 4 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,240 Speaker 1: a demographic problem. Many of these people who are dying 5 00:00:12,480 --> 00:00:15,480 Speaker 1: happen to own land, but when they depart this earth, 6 00:00:15,680 --> 00:00:18,040 Speaker 1: no one seems to know what happens to their property. 7 00:00:18,440 --> 00:00:21,200 Speaker 1: In fact, no one knows who owns more than ten 8 00:00:21,320 --> 00:00:26,000 Speaker 1: percent of the nation's landmasks. That's about sixteen thousand square miles, 9 00:00:26,280 --> 00:00:29,560 Speaker 1: the equivalent of the size of Denmark. That creates a 10 00:00:29,600 --> 00:00:41,360 Speaker 1: big economic headwind. You may not have heard about. Welcome 11 00:00:41,400 --> 00:00:45,000 Speaker 1: to Benchmark. I'm Scott landman and economics editor with Bloomberg 12 00:00:45,000 --> 00:00:48,760 Speaker 1: News in Washington, And I'm Daniel Most, economics writer and 13 00:00:49,000 --> 00:00:53,320 Speaker 1: editor at Bloomberg View in New York. So, Dan, you 14 00:00:53,400 --> 00:00:55,960 Speaker 1: lived in Japan for several years and you visit there 15 00:00:56,040 --> 00:00:58,840 Speaker 1: every so often. What can you tell us about the 16 00:00:58,920 --> 00:01:03,120 Speaker 1: demographics there. I would draw a big distinction between the 17 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:08,800 Speaker 1: Tokyo metropolitan area and the rest of Japan. The Tokyo 18 00:01:08,840 --> 00:01:13,240 Speaker 1: metropolitan area is as vibrant as ever. When you get 19 00:01:13,240 --> 00:01:17,400 Speaker 1: into the provinces, you can start to see the demographic crunch, 20 00:01:17,520 --> 00:01:20,880 Speaker 1: and you start to see it in little ways. For example, 21 00:01:21,520 --> 00:01:25,080 Speaker 1: in elevators there are a second set of numbers much 22 00:01:25,200 --> 00:01:28,440 Speaker 1: much lower to the ground, which I assume are for 23 00:01:28,560 --> 00:01:33,000 Speaker 1: old people hunched over. You also see in public bathrooms, 24 00:01:33,000 --> 00:01:36,240 Speaker 1: which by the way, are impeccable, you see a little 25 00:01:36,360 --> 00:01:39,680 Speaker 1: seat wedged into the corner of the wall where you 26 00:01:39,680 --> 00:01:43,800 Speaker 1: can put your baby if you need to use the restroom. 27 00:01:44,280 --> 00:01:47,760 Speaker 1: And sometimes there's a little helpful sign above the exit 28 00:01:48,280 --> 00:01:51,200 Speaker 1: to the restroom saying, don't forget your baby if you 29 00:01:51,240 --> 00:01:53,400 Speaker 1: put it in the thing on the wall. In other words, 30 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:56,680 Speaker 1: these young people are really crucial, or in other words, 31 00:01:56,680 --> 00:01:59,800 Speaker 1: don't forget your person belongings. If you're old and you 32 00:01:59,840 --> 00:02:02,400 Speaker 1: have and to go in there, and maybe don't forget 33 00:02:02,400 --> 00:02:05,320 Speaker 1: your baby reminds you that you have something in there too. 34 00:02:06,200 --> 00:02:12,000 Speaker 1: Did that ever come up to in no, Well, anyway, 35 00:02:12,160 --> 00:02:14,959 Speaker 1: let's bring in our guest, Yoshi Nohara, as a reporter 36 00:02:15,360 --> 00:02:19,639 Speaker 1: covering the Japanese economy in Bloomberg's Tokyo bureau. He recently 37 00:02:19,680 --> 00:02:22,680 Speaker 1: wrote about the issue I mentioned in the introduction for 38 00:02:22,760 --> 00:02:26,760 Speaker 1: the Benchmark website. So we're just rolling in the synergy today. 39 00:02:26,840 --> 00:02:30,160 Speaker 1: He's joining us from Tokyo. Yoshi, thanks so much for 40 00:02:30,160 --> 00:02:34,600 Speaker 1: talking with us on the Benchmark podcast from Tokyo. Glad 41 00:02:34,639 --> 00:02:38,720 Speaker 1: to join this conversation. Thank you so much for inviting 42 00:02:38,760 --> 00:02:42,720 Speaker 1: me for this. Now, Yoshi, before a government panel put 43 00:02:42,760 --> 00:02:46,440 Speaker 1: out a report on this topic, how familiar were you 44 00:02:46,639 --> 00:02:49,519 Speaker 1: with it? You know, we're talking about landowners dying off 45 00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:52,799 Speaker 1: and no one knowing who their property passed to. Well, 46 00:02:52,919 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 1: to be honest to Scott, not magic or a more 47 00:02:55,960 --> 00:03:00,600 Speaker 1: precisely put, I hadn't thought about it at all, and 48 00:03:00,680 --> 00:03:04,480 Speaker 1: that says a lot about this problem. People not paying attention, 49 00:03:04,760 --> 00:03:07,640 Speaker 1: and the problem has gotten this big before most of 50 00:03:07,720 --> 00:03:10,000 Speaker 1: us knew. And can you tell us a little bit 51 00:03:10,040 --> 00:03:13,839 Speaker 1: more about the size and scope and how this happened. Well, 52 00:03:13,880 --> 00:03:17,640 Speaker 1: the size it's an estimate, but it's considered that now 53 00:03:18,320 --> 00:03:23,760 Speaker 1: the there's been a tremendous difficulty trackdown ownership the many 54 00:03:23,840 --> 00:03:28,680 Speaker 1: properties in Japan, which total to equivalent of the size 55 00:03:28,720 --> 00:03:33,600 Speaker 1: of Tushue, which is a pretty big island in Japan. 56 00:03:33,960 --> 00:03:37,920 Speaker 1: And for global audience, it's as big as the nation demark, 57 00:03:38,440 --> 00:03:43,200 Speaker 1: which shows how big this problem is. And there's also 58 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:46,720 Speaker 1: an estimate how big it's expected to be. It's going 59 00:03:46,760 --> 00:03:50,080 Speaker 1: to be as big as Hokaido, which is the second 60 00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:54,119 Speaker 1: biggest island in Japan and Yo. She does this reflect 61 00:03:54,280 --> 00:03:59,960 Speaker 1: idiosyncrasies in Japanese property law or is this a broader 62 00:04:00,200 --> 00:04:05,080 Speaker 1: narrative about what happens when parts of a country hollow 63 00:04:05,120 --> 00:04:10,560 Speaker 1: out and people just die without an influx to support 64 00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:15,200 Speaker 1: the population. Well, I think both. The short answer is 65 00:04:15,720 --> 00:04:19,760 Speaker 1: but for this there's definitely a legal some legal issues. 66 00:04:20,440 --> 00:04:24,159 Speaker 1: But at the same time, when you think about the 67 00:04:24,279 --> 00:04:28,560 Speaker 1: root problem for this is that it comes down to 68 00:04:28,680 --> 00:04:33,679 Speaker 1: this what happens when the property becomes a burden better 69 00:04:33,720 --> 00:04:37,960 Speaker 1: than asset. In other words, you do everything you need 70 00:04:38,000 --> 00:04:42,960 Speaker 1: to do to maintain property when you know that piece 71 00:04:42,960 --> 00:04:48,880 Speaker 1: of property you're inheriting inheriting from your family is worth 72 00:04:49,560 --> 00:04:52,600 Speaker 1: an investment, but you don't want to do anything about 73 00:04:52,680 --> 00:04:55,520 Speaker 1: it if you know that that's just not going to 74 00:04:55,560 --> 00:04:59,800 Speaker 1: be developed or nobody is willing to invest money in it. 75 00:05:00,480 --> 00:05:04,359 Speaker 1: So it's an economic issue. There's a less and less 76 00:05:04,480 --> 00:05:10,720 Speaker 1: incentive to invest in London, especially in regional areas. So 77 00:05:10,760 --> 00:05:13,760 Speaker 1: that's a justis of the issue. So that's why it's 78 00:05:13,800 --> 00:05:19,080 Speaker 1: so hard to grasp the scope of this issue. But 79 00:05:19,320 --> 00:05:23,680 Speaker 1: we do know that it's happening, especially in the rural area. 80 00:05:23,880 --> 00:05:27,640 Speaker 1: So are you saying that they can't even sell this 81 00:05:27,800 --> 00:05:31,320 Speaker 1: land even if it went to its rightful owner or 82 00:05:31,440 --> 00:05:35,440 Speaker 1: was you know, passed down properly, that even the airs 83 00:05:35,560 --> 00:05:38,039 Speaker 1: would not be able to sell it or develop it. 84 00:05:38,120 --> 00:05:41,159 Speaker 1: In a lot of places, well, the question is that 85 00:05:41,200 --> 00:05:44,240 Speaker 1: is what when you think about this, and they think 86 00:05:44,240 --> 00:05:48,960 Speaker 1: about this. So the issue is that it's not that 87 00:05:49,000 --> 00:05:52,920 Speaker 1: the people don't want to sell properties. It's an issue 88 00:05:53,000 --> 00:05:57,839 Speaker 1: that the government or any of that student is having 89 00:05:57,839 --> 00:06:02,159 Speaker 1: a difficulty to track down who owns these properties. So 90 00:06:02,680 --> 00:06:05,279 Speaker 1: even if the government wants to buy a piece of 91 00:06:05,400 --> 00:06:08,320 Speaker 1: lander because they want to create a park or something, 92 00:06:08,880 --> 00:06:13,280 Speaker 1: they can't do so because well they don't know who 93 00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:18,240 Speaker 1: owns the property. And the Japan has the eminent domain, um, 94 00:06:18,320 --> 00:06:21,960 Speaker 1: so the government can use it. But it's just it 95 00:06:22,080 --> 00:06:26,440 Speaker 1: takes more manpower to do that, and it's hard when 96 00:06:26,480 --> 00:06:31,040 Speaker 1: you don't know who owns the property and it takes 97 00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:35,240 Speaker 1: mamper to track down the ownership. And it's an increasing 98 00:06:35,360 --> 00:06:39,440 Speaker 1: button for a lot of municipalities because it's not just 99 00:06:39,560 --> 00:06:44,000 Speaker 1: the residents who are getting old and you know there's 100 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:47,839 Speaker 1: a man a population decline in regional Japan, it's also 101 00:06:47,960 --> 00:06:51,880 Speaker 1: government stuff. But they're being stretched a lot more so, 102 00:06:51,920 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 1: that's why they find it difficult to generate enough manpower 103 00:06:56,120 --> 00:07:01,479 Speaker 1: to track down the ownership and do something about it. Yeah, 104 00:07:01,520 --> 00:07:05,359 Speaker 1: she A powerful political theme in the United States is 105 00:07:05,520 --> 00:07:10,480 Speaker 1: a sense, justified or not, that in rural areas they've 106 00:07:10,520 --> 00:07:14,720 Speaker 1: just been abandoned, and all the intellectual energy and all 107 00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:19,520 Speaker 1: the capital and all the lawmaking expertise is focused on 108 00:07:19,520 --> 00:07:23,360 Speaker 1: the big metropolitan areas and rural areas have just been abandoned. 109 00:07:24,480 --> 00:07:28,920 Speaker 1: Does the phenomenon we're talking about here today underscore a 110 00:07:29,040 --> 00:07:35,040 Speaker 1: similar growing sentiment in politics outside Japan's big cities, Well, 111 00:07:35,040 --> 00:07:40,680 Speaker 1: I would say them speaking of political sentiment, it's a 112 00:07:40,800 --> 00:07:46,600 Speaker 1: fact that Tokyo is getting everything, including people, young people 113 00:07:46,920 --> 00:07:50,400 Speaker 1: in the intellectual knowledge and the businesses, and most of 114 00:07:50,440 --> 00:07:54,520 Speaker 1: the business headquarters are located in Tokyo. But here's an 115 00:07:54,560 --> 00:07:59,840 Speaker 1: issue that in Tokyo, the you know, it's so hard 116 00:08:00,480 --> 00:08:04,360 Speaker 1: to be able to afford kids, which is surprising because 117 00:08:04,720 --> 00:08:09,320 Speaker 1: this is a bustling place. In many cases, including myself, 118 00:08:09,880 --> 00:08:14,200 Speaker 1: young people move from the regions where the bathrade is 119 00:08:14,280 --> 00:08:19,880 Speaker 1: much higher. So there's a podcast pusson that they want 120 00:08:19,960 --> 00:08:24,840 Speaker 1: to stop infra two big cities like Tokyo, and then 121 00:08:25,520 --> 00:08:29,000 Speaker 1: generally some kind of incentive for young people to stay 122 00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:34,000 Speaker 1: in their hometowns so that they can ease this depopulation 123 00:08:34,120 --> 00:08:37,480 Speaker 1: problem we're facing. So I think that's kind of an 124 00:08:37,520 --> 00:08:42,520 Speaker 1: interesting contrast to what you just described about the US. 125 00:08:42,559 --> 00:08:46,560 Speaker 1: But that said, I'm not such that making a much 126 00:08:46,600 --> 00:08:51,640 Speaker 1: progress in Japan because despite many initiatives, all the things 127 00:08:51,679 --> 00:08:55,400 Speaker 1: that post to make us say about, yes, let's do 128 00:08:55,559 --> 00:08:59,680 Speaker 1: something about reasonal hold out so that younger people was 129 00:09:00,840 --> 00:09:03,959 Speaker 1: over there and the stud families, but it's not that 130 00:09:04,360 --> 00:09:10,440 Speaker 1: stopping young people from moving to Tokyo. Well, if you 131 00:09:10,480 --> 00:09:14,559 Speaker 1: go back to original topic, that these land ownership registrations 132 00:09:14,559 --> 00:09:18,800 Speaker 1: are not being updated, if that problem we're somehow solved, 133 00:09:19,400 --> 00:09:22,560 Speaker 1: would that be a way to get young people to 134 00:09:22,640 --> 00:09:25,120 Speaker 1: stay in the regions, if you could update the registrations 135 00:09:25,160 --> 00:09:28,080 Speaker 1: and maybe find a way to start developing the land 136 00:09:28,120 --> 00:09:31,560 Speaker 1: and add more amenities so they're not all concentrated in Tokyo. 137 00:09:32,160 --> 00:09:35,560 Speaker 1: Well that could be, but I guess the once again 138 00:09:35,960 --> 00:09:40,079 Speaker 1: underlying problem here is that the young people come to 139 00:09:40,080 --> 00:09:46,000 Speaker 1: Tokyo because they're looking for opportunities. So many prestigious universities 140 00:09:46,040 --> 00:09:50,160 Speaker 1: are located in Tokyo, and there are far more Korean 141 00:09:50,200 --> 00:09:54,880 Speaker 1: opportunities in Tokyo. So I think that government can these 142 00:09:54,960 --> 00:09:58,120 Speaker 1: regulations and do something about it. But it comes down 143 00:09:58,200 --> 00:10:04,920 Speaker 1: to this point, whether you can create enough economic incentives 144 00:10:04,960 --> 00:10:11,079 Speaker 1: for young people to stay in rural areas because some 145 00:10:11,120 --> 00:10:16,600 Speaker 1: people are sure, including myself, or have memories about their hometowns, 146 00:10:16,600 --> 00:10:22,559 Speaker 1: but they dive because there's not many jobs. It comes 147 00:10:22,600 --> 00:10:29,440 Speaker 1: down to it. So without tackling that economic issue, just 148 00:10:30,679 --> 00:10:35,480 Speaker 1: tinkling the regulations wouldn't too much in my opinion. And 149 00:10:35,559 --> 00:10:38,000 Speaker 1: you know, she what impact is this going to have 150 00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:43,280 Speaker 1: on infrastructure spending in provincial Japan? And I asked the 151 00:10:43,360 --> 00:10:46,560 Speaker 1: question in the context of I always marvel at how 152 00:10:46,600 --> 00:10:51,040 Speaker 1: well maintained, for example, the rail network and rail stations 153 00:10:51,080 --> 00:10:54,720 Speaker 1: are even well outside Tokyo. Then I come back to 154 00:10:54,760 --> 00:10:57,720 Speaker 1: the US, I write, amtrack and I want to kill myself. 155 00:10:58,520 --> 00:11:01,440 Speaker 1: That's exactly what I'm coming found about. And there are 156 00:11:01,480 --> 00:11:06,080 Speaker 1: some signs or remediate reports I hear about a few 157 00:11:06,160 --> 00:11:09,720 Speaker 1: or few of people living in rural areas and train 158 00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:16,040 Speaker 1: lines and being abandoned or not being sustainable economically because 159 00:11:16,120 --> 00:11:19,360 Speaker 1: you don't have enough people. So that's on a concern. 160 00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:23,400 Speaker 1: But I can say then it may not happening as 161 00:11:23,480 --> 00:11:28,800 Speaker 1: first as you expect because just last week, I just 162 00:11:28,880 --> 00:11:32,800 Speaker 1: traveled back to my hometown in western Japan called the 163 00:11:32,840 --> 00:11:37,880 Speaker 1: Yamaguchi Prefecture, and I just took a local train, the 164 00:11:38,160 --> 00:11:42,160 Speaker 1: very same train line that I used to take as 165 00:11:42,160 --> 00:11:46,440 Speaker 1: a high school student, and I was still punctual. It 166 00:11:46,720 --> 00:11:50,120 Speaker 1: came on time and took me and my kids and 167 00:11:50,240 --> 00:11:53,679 Speaker 1: my wife to where we need to go at the 168 00:11:53,760 --> 00:11:57,480 Speaker 1: exact the schedule of the time. So you know, it's 169 00:11:57,520 --> 00:12:03,439 Speaker 1: still your functional. But I can say that it may 170 00:12:03,520 --> 00:12:08,880 Speaker 1: reach to a point that you don't have enough people 171 00:12:09,320 --> 00:12:13,920 Speaker 1: to keep coin like that. So that's a big concern 172 00:12:14,040 --> 00:12:19,559 Speaker 1: that I have, and it may happen in visible way 173 00:12:19,679 --> 00:12:23,600 Speaker 1: before most of us notice, meaning that some of the 174 00:12:24,280 --> 00:12:29,400 Speaker 1: you know, rules may be being abandoned and not being updated, 175 00:12:29,720 --> 00:12:33,080 Speaker 1: and all of a sudden we may realize that after 176 00:12:33,280 --> 00:12:37,640 Speaker 1: some kind of action happened. But definitely it's not something 177 00:12:37,640 --> 00:12:40,440 Speaker 1: that I wanted to see. Japan is very famous for 178 00:12:40,480 --> 00:12:44,080 Speaker 1: the trains running exactly on time, so if that ever 179 00:12:44,559 --> 00:12:47,280 Speaker 1: changed in any way would be definitely something to mark 180 00:12:47,400 --> 00:12:50,720 Speaker 1: in Japanese society. But let me ask about another angle 181 00:12:50,760 --> 00:12:55,840 Speaker 1: to this issue. Japan could solve its population issues pretty 182 00:12:55,880 --> 00:12:59,360 Speaker 1: quickly if it became more open to immigrants, and yet 183 00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:04,600 Speaker 1: it's very famously closed society, and Dan likes to talk 184 00:13:04,640 --> 00:13:07,680 Speaker 1: about how they'd rather put more robots in than get 185 00:13:07,760 --> 00:13:12,760 Speaker 1: workers from abroad. Yoshi, is this going to happen with 186 00:13:13,000 --> 00:13:16,160 Speaker 1: this ever forced the immigration issue open or is that 187 00:13:16,320 --> 00:13:21,520 Speaker 1: just a closed question? Well, the easy answer about robots 188 00:13:21,679 --> 00:13:24,760 Speaker 1: is that there's no doubt that a lot of Japanese 189 00:13:24,760 --> 00:13:29,160 Speaker 1: people have cultural affection with the robots because of animation 190 00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:34,200 Speaker 1: characters such as Astro Boy. But when it comes to immigration, 191 00:13:34,679 --> 00:13:37,600 Speaker 1: that's a tricky question. And I think I have to 192 00:13:37,720 --> 00:13:42,400 Speaker 1: say that I am speaking about this topic as a 193 00:13:42,559 --> 00:13:48,280 Speaker 1: paston who lives in Tokyo where most people are exposed 194 00:13:48,440 --> 00:13:54,280 Speaker 1: to foreign cultures and many visitors from abroad, and most 195 00:13:54,320 --> 00:13:58,600 Speaker 1: of posty makers do talk about immigration, if not on 196 00:13:58,640 --> 00:14:01,559 Speaker 1: the record, but that's not free. They can see the 197 00:14:01,760 --> 00:14:05,920 Speaker 1: potential to easy the Japan's demographic program by bringing in 198 00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:11,160 Speaker 1: more people from abroad, but it's just I would say 199 00:14:11,240 --> 00:14:16,360 Speaker 1: it's a different story for reasons outside the big cities 200 00:14:16,400 --> 00:14:20,240 Speaker 1: like Tokyo, because the people just not used to it 201 00:14:21,200 --> 00:14:25,720 Speaker 1: and they just don't know, and that always brings up 202 00:14:26,160 --> 00:14:32,240 Speaker 1: fear and and that's why it's getting tricky. For policymakers 203 00:14:32,320 --> 00:14:38,040 Speaker 1: to present as a realistic, immediate approach to solve this issue. 204 00:14:38,520 --> 00:14:40,560 Speaker 1: But do you never know? You know, one thing I 205 00:14:40,600 --> 00:14:45,960 Speaker 1: can say is that I was surprised how the many 206 00:14:46,120 --> 00:14:51,520 Speaker 1: choice from abroad its visiting rural areas in Japan these days. 207 00:14:52,320 --> 00:14:56,120 Speaker 1: Back in December, I took a family trip to Easy, 208 00:14:56,160 --> 00:14:58,720 Speaker 1: which is like a couple of hours west of Tokyo, 209 00:14:59,400 --> 00:15:03,720 Speaker 1: and on pretty much every train we hopped on with 210 00:15:03,880 --> 00:15:08,920 Speaker 1: just so many tourists from China or other Asian countries, 211 00:15:09,040 --> 00:15:13,000 Speaker 1: or European countries or the US. So at least to 212 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:16,840 Speaker 1: those people are visiting those places and having some kind 213 00:15:16,880 --> 00:15:21,040 Speaker 1: of interaction with local people, so that may change in 214 00:15:21,080 --> 00:15:27,680 Speaker 1: a gradual's way the people's attitude about having neighbors from 215 00:15:27,720 --> 00:15:30,680 Speaker 1: other countries. You know, you are, suely. The more we 216 00:15:30,760 --> 00:15:34,640 Speaker 1: talk about this issue, and the more one looks at 217 00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:41,280 Speaker 1: news from Japan across economics, politics, culture, it seems like 218 00:15:41,480 --> 00:15:47,120 Speaker 1: the dominant, the overriding factor in pretty much anything happening 219 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:50,440 Speaker 1: in Japan now is demographics and the fact that it 220 00:15:50,520 --> 00:15:53,880 Speaker 1: is simply running out of people. Well, my answer is 221 00:15:53,960 --> 00:15:59,840 Speaker 1: that yes, and I'm surprised at how wider that the 222 00:16:00,000 --> 00:16:06,320 Speaker 1: momographic issue is every time I tackle a story, I 223 00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:12,080 Speaker 1: just realized that it's pretty much behind all the major 224 00:16:12,240 --> 00:16:16,560 Speaker 1: themes that I think are key to the Japanese economy. 225 00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:20,320 Speaker 1: But I wouldn't say that if that means that all 226 00:16:20,360 --> 00:16:27,400 Speaker 1: the negative implications, because there are some discussions going that 227 00:16:27,800 --> 00:16:35,120 Speaker 1: maybe this economic headwind caused by demographic crisis maybe a 228 00:16:35,120 --> 00:16:40,520 Speaker 1: good thing because it can number one, cause companies or 229 00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:45,840 Speaker 1: posty makers to think hard about innovations and try to 230 00:16:45,920 --> 00:16:50,400 Speaker 1: adapt and change, and that can be a model for 231 00:16:50,600 --> 00:16:54,160 Speaker 1: many other nations because this is just not only Japan. 232 00:16:54,640 --> 00:17:00,200 Speaker 1: But I'm sure that Chinese population is getting older and 233 00:17:00,280 --> 00:17:05,199 Speaker 1: the demographic crisis will be much bigger than Japan. So 234 00:17:05,680 --> 00:17:09,840 Speaker 1: if it's coming maybe in in one or two decades later, 235 00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:13,720 Speaker 1: and then I know that the many developed donations having 236 00:17:13,760 --> 00:17:18,560 Speaker 1: this kind of issue. But getting back to you a question, yes, 237 00:17:18,640 --> 00:17:22,600 Speaker 1: I'm surprised. Every time I write about economic stories in Japan, 238 00:17:23,760 --> 00:17:28,719 Speaker 1: most of them have a demographic element as a background. 239 00:17:29,560 --> 00:17:32,400 Speaker 1: All right, Well, it's not the first time we've talked 240 00:17:32,400 --> 00:17:35,080 Speaker 1: about these issues on Benchmark, and probably won't be the 241 00:17:35,200 --> 00:17:38,840 Speaker 1: last either. Yoshi Nohara, thanks so much for joining us today. 242 00:17:39,080 --> 00:17:46,040 Speaker 1: Thank you very much. Benchmark will be back next week. 243 00:17:46,160 --> 00:17:48,440 Speaker 1: Until then, you can find us on the Bloomberg terminal, 244 00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:51,320 Speaker 1: bloomberg dot com, or Bloomberg App, as well as wherever 245 00:17:51,400 --> 00:17:55,920 Speaker 1: you enjoy podcasts, including Apple Podcasts, Overcast, and Stitcher. While 246 00:17:55,920 --> 00:17:58,040 Speaker 1: you're there, please take a minute to rate and review 247 00:17:58,040 --> 00:18:00,399 Speaker 1: the show so more listeners can find us and you 248 00:18:00,440 --> 00:18:02,480 Speaker 1: can let us know what you thought of the show. 249 00:18:02,760 --> 00:18:06,680 Speaker 1: You can follow me on Twitter at at scott Landman Dan, 250 00:18:07,000 --> 00:18:11,639 Speaker 1: you are at Moss Underschool, Ka and Yoshi. Your Twitter 251 00:18:11,720 --> 00:18:16,920 Speaker 1: handle is I'm at at the Wai Nohara lam House, 252 00:18:17,040 --> 00:18:22,160 Speaker 1: fell Y n o h A r p M. Benchmark 253 00:18:22,280 --> 00:18:24,840 Speaker 1: is produced by Tofur Foreheads and the head of Bloomberg 254 00:18:24,880 --> 00:18:28,760 Speaker 1: Podcasts is Francesca Levy. Thanks for listening, See you next time.