Speaker 1: Hey there, everybody. Welcome to this episode of Amy and TJ. TJ.
Speaker 1: Holmes here sing alongside my partner Amy Robot. We have
Speaker 1: been giving a close close eye on this Didty trial.
Speaker 1: We are now in week two, the first the second
Speaker 1: full week of testimony in the trial. We saw yesterday
Speaker 1: on Monday. Three people Robes are on the stand. A
Speaker 1: former member of Danity Kine, a former best friend of
Speaker 1: Cassie Ventura, and a former assistant to Sean Diddy Combs.
Speaker 1: I'll ask you this first, what in all the testimony
Speaker 1: from the previous day just jumped out at you, you
Speaker 1: know what.
Speaker 2: It might be an unexpected answer, because I know we
Speaker 2: got so many bombshells from both Dawn and Carrie, but
Speaker 2: I actually felt something deeply when I heard from David James,
Speaker 2: that was Sean Diddy Combe's former assistant, and he was
Speaker 2: being asked about the culture, about what he witnessed, what
Speaker 2: he saw and what he over and he talked in
Speaker 2: one moment during his testimony about overhearing Ditty talking about
Speaker 2: the two main women in his life, Kim Porter, who
Speaker 2: was the mother of his children, and Cassie Ventura, who
Speaker 2: at the time was his girlfriend and someone asked him, Hey,
Speaker 2: how's Kim, how's Cassie, And according to David James testimony,
Speaker 2: he said that Ditty said, Kim, Kim's my queen.
Speaker 1: She's good Cassie.
Speaker 2: I got her just where I want her. She's young,
Speaker 2: and she's mouldable and she'll do what I say. I mean,
Speaker 2: I'm paraphrasing, but paraphrasing, But that broke my heart, just
Speaker 2: to see how he cared about Cassie, which to me
Speaker 2: meant very little. He was there to manipulate her. He
Speaker 2: was there, according to David James testimony, to get what
Speaker 2: he wanted from her. But this was not something that
Speaker 2: someone who loves someone would say. I got her just
Speaker 2: where I want her. I was listening to that. I
Speaker 2: was actually so listening to that while I was running
Speaker 2: as I was hearing a recap of the testimony, and
Speaker 2: I actually it took my breath away. It just made
Speaker 2: me feel so much sadness for Cassie because here she was,
Speaker 2: according to her, loving him, doing his bidding, doing anything
Speaker 2: the unthinkable, even doing things physically to her body that
Speaker 2: she says she didn't want to do, from drugs to
Speaker 2: NonStop sex to putting her physical and mental health completely
Speaker 2: on the line for this man that she adored and loved,
Speaker 2: and that is what he said about her to someone
Speaker 2: behind her back, and it just for me was a
Speaker 2: powerful moment to hear his level of disregard for her.
Speaker 1: And they started up on to start the week Monday.
Speaker 1: Don Richard, a lot of people might know that name
Speaker 1: from Danny Kane. She does have a lawsuit, a civil
Speaker 1: lawsuit against Diddy right now. But she started her testimony
Speaker 1: on Friday. She was the first one up after Cassie Ventura.
Speaker 1: Cassie finally wrapped on Friday and Don continued on Monday. Now,
Speaker 1: she was able to corroborate some some of the stories
Speaker 1: of violence. She was able to tell stories of actually
Speaker 1: seeing a couple of scenes, one in particular having to
Speaker 1: do with a frying pan and eggs that went at
Speaker 1: Cassie's head that she said did he attack her? So
Speaker 1: they were able to corroborate a lot of that. However,
Speaker 1: there's a lot of questions about her stories and frankly,
Speaker 1: if they line up, if they match up, there's a
Speaker 1: lot of questions and look in cross examination, they did
Speaker 1: their job and she seemed to have different stories of
Speaker 1: different recollections. I think that's going to she will not
Speaker 1: be remembered as a slam dunk witness for the prosecution.
Speaker 2: It's interesting that the prosecution chose to put her up
Speaker 2: on the stand. As you pointed out, she has a lawsuit.
Speaker 2: She filed a lawsuit against Sean Dittycombs, and so she
Speaker 2: has a lot of these allegations already in writing legal
Speaker 2: writing so that they can be referenced and cross reference
Speaker 2: and re examined. And so one of the big headlines
Speaker 2: that she had in her lawsuit was bringing in other celebrities,
Speaker 2: which of course is going to make even bigger headlines,
Speaker 2: people like Neo and Usher saying that they were there
Speaker 2: at a restaurant, and in her lawsuit, in her civil lawsuit,
Speaker 2: she claims they saw Sean Detecombe's punch Cassie Ventura at
Speaker 2: a restaurant in the stomach, as she had when she
Speaker 2: got up on the stand under cross examination, she backtracked
Speaker 2: and said, well, I don't know if they saw it.
Speaker 2: That's a big deal, and that's huge because to make
Speaker 2: that claim in a lawsuit and then to get on
Speaker 2: the stand at a criminal trial and say maybe they
Speaker 2: didn't see it, I'm not sure what they saw or
Speaker 2: what they didn't say. That's a huge, huge discredit to
Speaker 2: her and her testimony.
Speaker 1: And this is tough, and everybody should be reminded to
Speaker 1: be careful with these things and be careful before you
Speaker 1: just retweet something or put something out there. You have
Speaker 1: two folks, you got Usher and Neo. Look, we actually
Speaker 1: don't know, but it's being reported or the sentiment is
Speaker 1: out there that these two guys saw a woman being
Speaker 1: physically abused and did nothing. That's the storyline based on
Speaker 1: things coming out of this trial that, like you just said,
Speaker 1: she now backtracked. Well, they were there, but I don't
Speaker 1: know if they actually saw it. That's a much different thing.
Speaker 1: And that lends to the credibility now of this witness,
Speaker 1: maybe in her civil suit in addition to this criminal case.
Speaker 1: So that was one that certainly got a big headline.
Speaker 1: But the other one Robes was about the sunglasses.
Speaker 2: Right, So she claimed that because they knew that Cassie
Speaker 2: had been punched in the eye and had a black eye,
Speaker 2: that in solidarity with her, they all decided to wear
Speaker 2: sunglasses with her so she wouldn't stand out. And so
Speaker 2: she spoke of seeing the injuries seeing the black eye,
Speaker 2: and that certainly backed up and corroborated what we heard
Speaker 2: from Cassie where she had to change her dresses, change
Speaker 2: her makeup, where sunglasses to try and hide bruises and
Speaker 2: injuries that she says she received from Diddy.
Speaker 1: And they did actually use a photo in court. She
Speaker 1: uses one as an exhibit showing Don Rochard and Cassie
Speaker 1: somewhere out in public they all had dark sunglasses on.
Speaker 1: And look, that is pretty damning evidence. It looks backs
Speaker 1: up that particular claim. But I think it's being an
Speaker 1: I'm not the legal expert. I can only tell you
Speaker 1: what legally folks are saying. She just wasn't a great prosecution.
Speaker 2: With this right. She had some things that certainly helped
Speaker 2: out the testimony or corroberate the testimony of Ventur, but
Speaker 2: she also did a lot of things, unfortunately with her inconsistencies,
Speaker 2: to do damage to the credibility of what she was saying. Therefore,
Speaker 2: it is I am curious as to why the prosecution
Speaker 2: chose to put her on the stand knowing what they knew.
Speaker 2: I mean, they do these look, they go through they
Speaker 2: go through the testimony, they go through possible cross examination
Speaker 2: with their witnesses so that they're prepared to not discredit
Speaker 2: what they just testified. So I am just curious how
Speaker 2: that was lost and how the prosecution missed that possible
Speaker 2: maybe not?
Speaker 1: Was the line a good lawyer, you never asked a
Speaker 1: question you don't already know the answer to, right, So
Speaker 1: they shouldn't have been surprised by anything that she actually
Speaker 1: stand in court.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and where Dawn was perhaps who knows how you
Speaker 2: would describe if it hurt the prosecution's case, if it
Speaker 2: helped it, or if it was perhaps even neutral. I
Speaker 2: think by all accounts, when people read and heard what
Speaker 2: Carrie Morgan, who was the best friend of Cassie Ventura,
Speaker 2: had to say on the stand, she certainly helped the
Speaker 2: prosecution's case. This was a woman who from the beginning
Speaker 2: said she didn't want to be there, someone who would
Speaker 2: cut off all ties with Cassie and with Sean Dittycombs
Speaker 2: after she personally says she experienced physical harm. She personally
Speaker 2: says the Ditty assaulted her, choked her, and then boomeranged
Speaker 2: and threw a coat hanger, a wooden coat hanger, so
Speaker 2: hard at her head that she actually says she got
Speaker 2: a concussion. It was at that point that she said
Speaker 2: sea By never want to be a part of this
Speaker 2: and pulled away. Cassie ended up, according to Carrie Morgan,
Speaker 2: offering her through Ditty, thirty thousand dollars and an NDA
Speaker 2: to sign for it all to go away, and she
Speaker 2: says she took it and she's never spoken to them since.
Speaker 2: But she certainly saw a lot before all that went on,
Speaker 2: and she testified to it in court.
Speaker 1: This was I asked you at the top of the
Speaker 1: when we started this episode, what stood out to you,
Speaker 1: and this young lady, Carrie Morgan is the one that
Speaker 1: stood out to me. Yes, she doesn't have a civil lawsuit,
Speaker 1: but she in her testimonies made clear she didn't even
Speaker 1: want to be there. Oh when she said, I'm only
Speaker 1: here because I got subpoena and where's the line and
Speaker 1: I'm going to find it? You all bear with hi.
Speaker 1: I'm looking through my note here. But she said I
Speaker 1: have moved on with my life away from all these
Speaker 1: people and the problems. There is a consistent theme that's
Speaker 1: emerging in doing deeper dives into this story where there
Speaker 1: were so many people looking for a way out, like
Speaker 1: so many people wanted to escape some environment of some kind,
Speaker 1: and some got away and never wanted to look back.
Speaker 1: Others got away and still dealing with scars and have
Speaker 1: lawsuits whatever, and all that's fine, But this young lady
Speaker 1: came off in a particular way in that line, in particular,
Speaker 1: like I don't want anything to do with these people,
Speaker 1: and I'm only here because you all are requiring me
Speaker 1: to do so.
Speaker 2: And you know, to know that she was best friends
Speaker 2: with Cassie for seventeen.
Speaker 1: Years and did it immediately.
Speaker 2: And now they don't speak, but what she did speak
Speaker 2: to and what she did see there were, oh my goodness,
Speaker 2: this scene she was describing after some sort of violent
Speaker 2: altercation would take place where she said, did he assaulted Ventura,
Speaker 2: That Ventur would be running away from him, and that
Speaker 2: they would be hiding for what she said seemed like
Speaker 2: hours to get away from him. And yet every time
Speaker 2: she saw her friend Cassie go back to him ultimately
Speaker 2: when things had calmed down, when things had settled down.
Speaker 2: But imagine hiding from the man you say you love
Speaker 2: for hours because you're so afraid for your life. That
Speaker 2: is what she described, if.
Speaker 1: She described I mean, this was.
Speaker 2: The the.
Speaker 1: She was there. She saw Cassie the night of the
Speaker 1: hotel incident. The video we've all seen. This is another look.
Speaker 1: This girl gets some chilling testimony. This young lady did.
Speaker 1: But she said she saw Cassie that night after Diddy
Speaker 1: had assaulted her in the hallway. And this is not
Speaker 1: one we can question you.
Speaker 2: We don't have to say alleged.
Speaker 1: This is not alleged. We saw her beat her up,
Speaker 1: and I saw him beat her up in the hallway,
Speaker 1: said this witness. Cary Morgan said she was with Cassie
Speaker 1: later that night. They were at home and Diddy came.
Speaker 1: That was the same night of the attack Diddy Kane
Speaker 1: and was banging on the door with a hammer violently, Yes,
Speaker 1: trying to get in. While this was going, Carrie Morgan
Speaker 1: tested that she was out of her She didn't know
Speaker 1: what to do. I guess she was freaking out. She said.
Speaker 1: Cassie sat on the couch quietly and did not move.
Speaker 1: She testified that she didn't think she cared Cassie cared
Speaker 1: if Diddy came in and killed her or not.
Speaker 2: Yes, that was so chilling. And she started calling around
Speaker 2: to the different you know folks within Ditty's in her
Speaker 2: circle to try and handle it. Not the police, not
Speaker 2: anyone else.
Speaker 1: No, nobody called the police.
Speaker 2: But eventually someone did. She doesn't know who did, because
Speaker 2: she said a little while ago, yes, a little while later,
Speaker 2: excuse me. Police did show up and Cassie refused to
Speaker 2: press charges, to give a statement, to say what happened,
Speaker 2: and so that was the end of it. This was
Speaker 2: also chilling. Morgan said that when she met Ventura all
Speaker 2: those years ago, that she was such a confident young woman,
Speaker 2: that she was a very confident women woman. But over
Speaker 2: the course of their friendship all the way up to
Speaker 2: twenty eighteen, she completely lost her confidence. And she said
Speaker 2: she heard Sean Ditty Calmbs criticize Cassie's appearance, how she behaved,
Speaker 2: who she talked to. She said he controlled everything, and
Speaker 2: she said including Ventura's job, her car, her apartment. He
Speaker 2: controlled everything. She says, she would have lost all of
Speaker 2: her livelihood, and she would have lost her friends, and
Speaker 2: that was also her circle, her circle of support. Even
Speaker 2: everything would have been gone had she left Diddy. Just
Speaker 2: to give the perspective of where Cassie Ventura was and
Speaker 2: how she found herself literally stuck.
Speaker 1: Again, I have commended people who have come out of
Speaker 1: been talking during this trial, not just folks on the
Speaker 1: witness stand, but folks we have talked to in covering this,
Speaker 1: and again I'm saying a theme has come out. We've
Speaker 1: been talking to Auberry O'Day, who was also a member
Speaker 1: of Danny Kane, and to hear her talk about she's
Speaker 1: been trying to get out of this for twenty years
Speaker 1: and she sometimes she doesn't even recognize who she is.
Speaker 1: Those stories, and we've talked to other people who are
Speaker 1: claimed to be victims who have been in that circle.
Speaker 1: They all seem like different individuals from before they ever
Speaker 1: got involved with Diddy.
Speaker 2: They seem I think traumatized is even not powerful powerful
Speaker 2: enough of a word. They seem like they've lost a
Speaker 2: part of themselves. They don't even know who they are
Speaker 2: anymore after having experience what they say they've experienced. You
Speaker 2: know something else that's really important from a legal perspective,
Speaker 2: something that Carrie Morgan was able to testify to. She
Speaker 2: said that when she witnessed extreme physical violence she claims
Speaker 2: between Combs and Ventor, Combs assaulting Ventura on two different occasions.
Speaker 2: She said, on those two occasions, Combs was not intoxicated
Speaker 2: and he was not high during those times, and that
Speaker 2: is something that the defense is going to lean on.
Speaker 2: We expect that Sean Diddy Combs isn't as responsible for
Speaker 2: what may or may not have happened because he was
Speaker 2: so messed up. He was so high, he was so
Speaker 2: hopped up on drugs that he didn't even know what
Speaker 2: he was doing. Carrie Morgan said, nahh on what I saw,
Speaker 2: on the moments and the incidents that eye witnessed, he
Speaker 2: was stone cold, sober.
Speaker 1: And look, there was an incident that Cassie described last
Speaker 1: week in which she said she had to take Diddy
Speaker 1: to the hospital he overdosed on something. So the defense
Speaker 1: is trying to I don't know how much it helped.
Speaker 1: This was an addict who was behaving this way. This
Speaker 1: wasn't a man in his right mind. Who knows if
Speaker 1: that plays with the jury. But Carrie's testimony was we
Speaker 1: called it bombshell after bombshell with Cassie, Carrie lended alt.
Speaker 1: She lent a lot of credibility.
Speaker 2: Yeah, especially, like you said, knowing that she didn't want
Speaker 2: to be there, knowing that she's never filed a lawsuit,
Speaker 2: and knowing that she's never spoken about it before now
Speaker 2: until she was compelled to buy law.
Speaker 1: So today, as we said, as we're recording, it's a
Speaker 1: Tuesday here May the twentieth, and the prosecution resumed questioning
Speaker 1: a particular witness, David James, was a former assistant to Colmbs.
Speaker 1: He started yesterday, but his testimony continues today, so we'll
Speaker 1: see how that goes. The last thing here at Robes
Speaker 1: I want to address with you is something that I
Speaker 1: hadn't thought about and never would have thought about, as
Speaker 1: we go back to Don Richard and optics matter, and
Speaker 1: it was pointed out to us a little while ago
Speaker 1: how she showed up in court yesterday to testify. Now,
Speaker 1: I wouldn't have thought that much about what she was wearing.
Speaker 1: But we were talking to Aubrey O day, we were
Speaker 1: talking to other folks who were a part of this,
Speaker 1: and said, did you see she had on a suit
Speaker 1: or some blazer that it was bedazzled, had diamonds in
Speaker 1: the collar or something they were describing, and they said
Speaker 1: that sent a message.
Speaker 2: That she was performing, that she wanted to be there.
Speaker 2: This is someone who does have a lawsuit, a civil
Speaker 2: lawsuit against City Diddy, who is seeking money and she
Speaker 2: walked into court ready for a show, and it was
Speaker 2: something you know, you are told or at least your
Speaker 2: you were at least given some sort of indication as
Speaker 2: to what would be appropriate, how the jury is going
Speaker 2: to view you, based on how you're dress, based on
Speaker 2: how you present yourself. So to come in in a
Speaker 2: three piece suit with been dazzled with diamonds all over,
Speaker 2: that is a message that a lot of people have
Speaker 2: interpreted as her having her moment, her having her moment
Speaker 2: once again in the spotlight, her taking the time to perform,
Speaker 2: and then with all of the pointed out inconsistencies in
Speaker 2: her story, it just wasn't a lot of people say,
Speaker 2: a good look for a witness in a criminal trial
Speaker 2: with the charges that are being thrown around, It just
Speaker 2: didn't fly.
Speaker 1: Folks thought that sent a clear message about what she
Speaker 1: wants the attention to be on and that she has
Speaker 1: an ulterior motive in being there. She has a lawsuit,
Speaker 1: potential book or other ways to profit from this. I
Speaker 1: don't want to. I would never ever in looking at
Speaker 1: her that would that have crossed my mind, and I
Speaker 1: obviously sold the pictures of her over the last several days.
Speaker 1: Wouldn't crossed my mind, but it just lets you know
Speaker 1: the just the intense scrutiny on everything that's happened in
Speaker 1: this trial and just how interested so many people are
Speaker 1: into it. So we again we appreciate you listening, and
Speaker 1: you all have let us know that you want us
Speaker 1: to keep doing these because you are listening. So we
Speaker 1: will continue to update you about this trial and look
Speaker 1: kind of pluck out. Like we said, Robes, we cover
Speaker 1: this every day and you have to go to so
Speaker 1: many outlets to put it all together to kind of
Speaker 1: get a good view of what happened in court, and
Speaker 1: so we're trying to do that for FUM.
Speaker 2: Yeah, hoping to give you all a recap so you're
Speaker 2: up on the very latest. This trial is expected to
Speaker 2: go for at least another six weeks, so we'll be
Speaker 2: talking to you plenty. But thank you for joining us today.
Speaker 2: We hope we have a great Tuesday every day.