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Speaker 1: Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan. There's nothing I don't

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Speaker 1: think colder than being near the sea during the cooler

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Speaker 1: months of the year. The reason I say that is

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Speaker 1: that it's different than being kind of inland, where many

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Speaker 1: times you feel like that you can put on just

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Speaker 1: enough clothing to make you feel more comfortable. But there's

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Speaker 1: something about being near the sea when it's cold out

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Speaker 1: or cool. It's what they refer to as that kind

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Speaker 1: of bone chilling cold. If you live near the sea

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Speaker 1: in the cooler months, you run your heat and you

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Speaker 1: try to make your environment as comfortable as you possibly can.

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Speaker 1: But the thing about being cool by the sea is

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Speaker 1: that it permeates everything. It comes up through the floorboards

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Speaker 1: of the house, it comes through the walls, I think.

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Speaker 1: And in our case that we're going to discuss, we've

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Speaker 1: got two people that were found in peaceful repose, as

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Speaker 1: they say, a married couple that seemingly died side by

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Speaker 1: side and what they thought initially was a carbon monoxide poisoning,

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Speaker 1: but as it turned out, it's something far more sinister

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Speaker 1: than a heater gone bad. I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and

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Speaker 1: this is body Bags. I'm an anglophile, I'll admit it.

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Speaker 1: I love going to Great Britain. I love exploring there.

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Speaker 1: My family has roots all over the British Isles, as

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Speaker 1: many of us do, and it just has a different

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Speaker 1: feel than anywhere else I've really been. And you get

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Speaker 1: that since environmentally day when you're there many times during

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Speaker 1: the year, even in the summertime, particularly in the evenings,

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Speaker 1: you have to put on a sweatshirt, perhaps just to

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Speaker 1: remain comfortable. It's got that feeling in the air, of

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Speaker 1: that coolness. I think that it's because it is an

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Speaker 1: island country. You're surrounded by the sea, the North Atlantic,

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Speaker 1: the North Sea, and so it's a presence that's always there.

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Speaker 1: And certainly I think that it was there in the

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Speaker 1: lives of Stephen Baxter and his wife Carol.

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Speaker 2: It's interesting how we do perceive things. I've never been

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Speaker 2: to where you're talking about, but I'm picturing it from

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Speaker 2: all the movies and pictures and things like that, and

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Speaker 2: so I understand where you're coming from. And as we

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Speaker 2: delve into the story of a wonderful couple, they are

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Speaker 2: Stephen and his wife Carol, the Baxters. He is sixty one,

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Speaker 2: she is sixty four. And the reason we're doing this story.

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Speaker 2: Obviously it is called but in this particular case, it

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Speaker 2: started off one way and win another. The couple have

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Speaker 2: a twenty one year old daughter and she has a son,

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Speaker 2: little toddler. I'm picturing her. The daughter now, Ellie. She

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Speaker 2: comes home and she sees her mom and dad. They're

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Speaker 2: in their recliners. Now in Great Britain, they called them

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Speaker 2: something different, can't remember the actual term, but we call them,

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Speaker 2: you know, lazy boy or recliner or whatever you know.

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Speaker 2: And usually in our case we have like the man

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Speaker 2: has the big leather chair, the woman has the dainty

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Speaker 2: cloth chair. Come into my house, it's reversed. I sit

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Speaker 2: in the dainty cloth chair and my wife sits in

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Speaker 2: the big leathere. And so this couple, they've been married long.

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Speaker 2: They were just relaxing in the recliners and their daughter, Ellie,

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Speaker 2: comes in to check on him, and she goes over

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Speaker 2: to them and she said, hey, y'all, how you do.

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Speaker 2: I don't know how they would say how y'all doing

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Speaker 2: in Great Britain. I don't know the wording, but they

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Speaker 2: weren't doing well at that moment. Imagine coming in, do

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Speaker 2: you expect to see your mom and dad. You've got

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Speaker 2: their grand baby, your child, and they're both sitting in

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Speaker 2: their chairs, but they're dead. As a matter of fact, Joe,

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Speaker 2: it is explained by the daughter that they were sitting

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Speaker 2: there together and were peaceful. There were no signs of

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Speaker 2: a struggle or any pain. She immediately thought, well, it

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Speaker 2: has to be and you mentioned this at the beginning.

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Speaker 2: It's cold Chile and you got to turn the heat on.

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Speaker 2: She thought something went wrong with the heater and it's

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Speaker 2: got to be carbon monoxide poisoning. She immediately opens the

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Speaker 2: doors to let in the breeze. She doesn't want her

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Speaker 2: one year old toddler to get sick. She doesn't want

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Speaker 2: to get sick, assuming it's carbon monoxide. But that's where

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Speaker 2: this case begins, Joe, with a loving couple together in

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Speaker 2: their recliners, peacefully passing away.

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Speaker 1: You're right, and listen when the local officials show up

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Speaker 1: at the scene. And let me paint this a little

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Speaker 1: bit more precisely. This low ca You associate Great Britain

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Speaker 1: as an island country. However, there are little islands that

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Speaker 1: are associated with Great Britain, and this is to the

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Speaker 1: northeast of London, so it's actually sitting north of what

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Speaker 1: would commonly be referred to as the English Channel, right

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Speaker 1: on the southern edge of the North Sea, and it's

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Speaker 1: like a little island. This is the way I pronounce it,

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Speaker 1: Mercy Island. And it's in the county of Essex, so

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Speaker 1: it's northeast of London. It's one of the oldest areas

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Speaker 1: of Great Britain where you think about establishment of early

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Speaker 1: settlements and that sort of thing. People have lived here

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Speaker 1: for a long long time, but this is an area

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Speaker 1: where it's primarily known for people retiring to this area.

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Speaker 1: As matter of fact, the beaches there they have those

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Speaker 1: have you ever seen those? And they're kind of known

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Speaker 1: for this there in this location. Those little changing huts

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Speaker 1: that you see that are like in all of the

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Speaker 1: pastell cult and so they have this and listen, it

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Speaker 1: takes a much bolder man than I to want to

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Speaker 1: go and bathe in those waters, because you're talking about

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Speaker 1: the North Sea. Can you imagine going to the beach

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Speaker 1: there and splashing about. But this is a retirement area.

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Speaker 1: It's quite beautiful. A lot of people seek this area

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Speaker 1: out and so it's always going to be cool about

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Speaker 1: these parts. So when the first responders show up at

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Speaker 1: the scene, their bit of information is coming from the

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Speaker 1: daughter who has discovered her mom and dad deceased, and

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Speaker 1: like you said, you're going to look around for signs

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Speaker 1: of fourth century or struggle. Even at a base level,

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Speaker 1: if you're not a forensics person or police officer, you

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Speaker 1: have questions that pop up in your mind. Mom and

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Speaker 1: dad are dead, but I don't see any blood. I

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Speaker 1: don't see flipped over furniture. I don't see broken glass.

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Speaker 1: All that stuff in your brain that's commonly associated with

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Speaker 1: this sort of thing. You don't see that going on

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Speaker 1: at this point in time.

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Speaker 2: Joe, let me ask you a quick question. When an investigators,

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Speaker 2: law enforcement, medical, when they show up to a scene

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Speaker 2: and they see this, their background information comes from the

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Speaker 2: daughter and she's telling them what she thinks. As an investigator,

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Speaker 2: do you take that with a grant of salt or

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Speaker 2: do you go, Okay, I've got to give this some power.

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Speaker 2: She knows what's going on, she knows how they normally are.

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Speaker 2: This doesn't fit.

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Speaker 1: You have to be very, very careful and measured when

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Speaker 1: you do this, because, first off, as investigators where all skeptics.

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Speaker 1: People are not going to like me saying this, we

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Speaker 1: assume everybody's lying to us. You just developed that kind

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Speaker 1: of callous because you're going to have to prove this

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Speaker 1: to me. You have to check yourself when you're getting

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Speaker 1: incoming information, particularly as it applies to a circumstance like this.

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Speaker 1: And this is what we would refer to as the

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Speaker 1: initial reporter. This initial reporter has given you information, and

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Speaker 1: so you take to some total what you're seeing at

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Speaker 1: the scene, the information that's verbally coming from her and

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Speaker 1: her initial observations, because no one's going to have a

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Speaker 1: clear sense of things in their pristine condition as she

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Speaker 1: would have, you know, because she's listen. One of the

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Speaker 1: things you can validate really quickly, you know, I talked

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Speaker 1: about signs of fourth century and struggle. You go to

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Speaker 1: the door, you go to the windows, and if nothing's

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Speaker 1: knocked out, and you know that she's the daughter, she

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Speaker 1: has access to this. She's going to be the person

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Speaker 1: that has the key to the lock that will turn

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Speaker 1: it open the door. Maybe she calls out to as

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Speaker 1: they say, mom and dad, they're in Great Britain, and

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Speaker 1: they don't respond, And there they are, they're peacefully seated

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Speaker 1: in they're old recliners, they're that position of comfort that

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Speaker 1: they have, and you examine them and you look at them,

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Speaker 1: And I don't mean examine them in the sense of

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Speaker 1: like a clinical sense. I'm talking about a familial sense

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Speaker 1: where you know, because you're so intimately a part of

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Speaker 1: their lives, you know how they look, you know what

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Speaker 1: their natural appearance is, you know what their common response

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Speaker 1: would be to you. Particularly you're standing there with this

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Speaker 1: precious one year old baby. And there's actually quite a

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Speaker 1: poignant image of mister Ms Baxter standing there holding this

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Speaker 1: one year old that was taken immediately Adjason and Dave.

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Speaker 1: Here's the other part to this case. When the daughter

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Speaker 1: showed up on that Sunday morning, it was maybe with

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Speaker 1: a sense of joy, sense of hope. Maybe it was

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Speaker 1: in her mind a moment of celebration, because it wasn't

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Speaker 1: just any other Sunday. It was Easter Sunday. One of

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Speaker 1: the most terrifying days I ever experienced as a medical

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Speaker 1: legal death investigator was the day I was exposed to

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Speaker 1: carbon monoxide. I had been given all clear as myself

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Speaker 1: and to my colleagues, we had a multiple death and

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Speaker 1: event that occurred within a single family residence where we

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Speaker 1: had I don't know the number escapes me, but it

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Speaker 1: was over six people that were dead in this house.

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Speaker 1: And I got out there to the scene to work

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Speaker 1: the case, and the fire department had assured me that

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Speaker 1: the house had been sufficiently ventilated, and as I came

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Speaker 1: to find out a couple hours later, I was laying

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Speaker 1: on a gurney inside of a local emergency room, hooked

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Speaker 1: up to oxygen and having nurses come in and assess

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Speaker 1: me minute by minute to see how I was doing

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Speaker 1: because I had been exposed to carbon monoxide and it's

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Speaker 1: absolutely terrifying and it's something that for most of us

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Speaker 1: you would get an immediate response to, and Dave in

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Speaker 1: this case, that's the bit of information that came in

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Speaker 1: to the local responders. That would have been her first impression,

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Speaker 1: her being the daughter. I think mom and dad may

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Speaker 1: have died as a result of carbon monoxide, and there's

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Speaker 1: just certain things that you look for in those.

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Speaker 2: Cases, so the investigators take that information and begin to investigate.

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Speaker 2: Nothing looks like it was crazy. There was no sign

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Speaker 2: of a fight or anything like that. It really did look,

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Speaker 2: as their daughter said, a peaceful scenario and one that

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Speaker 2: and what is really sad there's a lot sad here.

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Speaker 2: But I thought about how as this case evolved, where

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Speaker 2: the daughter said that when they're passing. In the first

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Speaker 2: days following it, she mentioned several times that even though

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Speaker 2: they were gone, she had that really wonderful, peaceful last

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Speaker 2: look at them lovingly sitting together in their chairs, having

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Speaker 2: a good time as people in their sixties are doing.

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Speaker 2: And I thought how rocked her world must have been

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Speaker 2: when they found out what really happened, because underneath this

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Speaker 2: very serene and peaceful can call it peaceful, serene death,

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Speaker 2: but it looked like that. But investigators have to do

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Speaker 2: their job. So, Joe, what leads you from that? Seems

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Speaker 2: like an obvious answer. You've got the two bodies in

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Speaker 2: front of you, two investigators come in and like take

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Speaker 2: the bodies out of the chairs and start examining there.

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Speaker 2: How do you go about moving somebody in this peaceful

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Speaker 2: state and taking them back to the office or whatever

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Speaker 2: to look at them. I mean, you're not going to

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Speaker 2: do it right there.

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Speaker 1: No, you would do an initial assessment, and those things

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Speaker 1: are going to really and I literally mean visually pop

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Speaker 1: when you think about it. I often tell my students

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Speaker 1: at Jacksonville State I'm teaching death investigation too. Imagine the

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Speaker 1: most brilliantly colored pink lollipop or popsicle piece of candy

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Speaker 1: that you've ever seen. And when you'll see that external

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Speaker 1: manifestation on the body of carbon monoxide uptake in the system,

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Speaker 1: it presents the skin dave, it presents in the face,

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Speaker 1: on the external surfaces end. Even when you get the

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Speaker 1: body into the morgue and you open the body, the

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Speaker 1: internal viscera will have that very pink appearance to it.

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Speaker 1: Even the blood changes color. So it's something that would

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Speaker 1: be quite striking that you would see initially. Now many

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Speaker 1: times you have to be very careful because in a

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Speaker 1: case like this, where you have just the fact that

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Speaker 1: she would mention this gives you an indication. First off,

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Speaker 1: she knows that there's a heat source in the house.

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Speaker 1: Because she's drawn this conclusion. You would have to check

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Speaker 1: that heat source within the house, and you have to

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Speaker 1: do it very carefully because, look, your people, as public

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Speaker 1: servants are going into this environment that could be toxic.

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Speaker 1: So you'll have to check the heat source and see

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Speaker 1: if all of the heating sources are functioning correctly. So

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Speaker 1: that means you have to call the Fire Service out

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Speaker 1: and with the fire Service, they actually have and many

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Speaker 1: of us have these in our homes. You have carbon

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Speaker 1: monoxide detectors just like fire detectors, and they go off

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Speaker 1: when sensing this poisonous gas. The fire service actually has

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Speaker 1: handheld devices that they can walk through home and they

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Speaker 1: can do an immediate assessment in this environment to see

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Speaker 1: if they're getting hits in any of these areas. And

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Speaker 1: I would think from an investigative standpoint, you call the

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Speaker 1: fire service out right, you're standing there and you're talking

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Speaker 1: with local investigators, and these guys walk in, they're wearing

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Speaker 1: respirators and they're checking the environment to see if there

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Speaker 1: is any indication that there's carbonoxide in the environment, and

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Speaker 1: they're not getting hits, and they come back out and

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Speaker 1: they report this to the investigators. The investigators suddenly have

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Speaker 1: to be able to explain that just grab onto this

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Speaker 1: just for a moment. They suddenly have to explain, Okay, well,

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Speaker 1: now we've got no signs of fourth century apparently, no

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Speaker 1: signs of external trauma. We don't have any presentation of

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Speaker 1: those artifacts. That's what we refer to them as on

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Speaker 1: the surface of skin relative to carbon monoxide. With the

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Speaker 1: pink color, and I've got a machine here that's telling

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Speaker 1: me that there's no level of caron monoxide in an

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Speaker 1: environment that's incompatible with life. That investigator has to take

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Speaker 1: all of that in formula and said, well, behind the

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Speaker 1: heck did I get to the point where I've got

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Speaker 1: two people that are sitting side by side deceased, they're dead,

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Speaker 1: And people just don't you hear these stories of people

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Speaker 1: that have been married for a long time. You hear

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Speaker 1: these in the news where you'll have one person that'll

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Speaker 1: pass away peacefully and then a couple of months later

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Speaker 1: claim the other person dies of a broken heart. And

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Speaker 1: that seems to happen many times, that people just give

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Speaker 1: up the will to live. But simultaneous deaths, that's just

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Speaker 1: not something that happens.

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Speaker 2: Dave, I feel so bad for their daughter discovering them

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Speaker 2: in that state. But you mentioned people don't die like that.

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Speaker 2: So you're the investigator. You're coming in showing her the

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Speaker 2: proper amount of respect because you don't want to turn

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Speaker 2: her make it even worse. But at some point she's

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Speaker 2: going to find out it's a lot worse than she thinks.

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Speaker 1: Then, as an investigator, you're thinking in your mind, well,

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Speaker 1: what could be the potential here? Am I looking at

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Speaker 1: a double suicide? Here? Is there any indication around the body,

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Speaker 1: And this is one of the things that you're going

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Speaker 1: to look for. You're going to look for any substances

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Speaker 1: that might be at the scene that would give an

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Speaker 1: indication that this is some kind of non trauma related

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Speaker 1: suicide where you've entered into a pack to take on

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Speaker 1: some kind of substance that is going to be toxic,

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Speaker 1: in other words, incompatible with life, and that you're going

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Speaker 1: to succumb to this. And listen, if you don't get

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Speaker 1: this right at the scene, right at that moment, then

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Speaker 1: you can lose all kinds of evidence. So you're going

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Speaker 1: to go through this house and very very carefully looking

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Speaker 1: for I mean everything from injectables of any kind. You're

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Speaker 1: going to go into the kitchen to see if there's

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Speaker 1: anything that has been mixed up, maybe that is sitting

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Speaker 1: in the sink, something with a white powdery residue. You're

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Speaker 1: going to look through this environment and attempt to determine

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Speaker 1: if in fact that there was that there's something more here,

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Speaker 1: something that doesn't quite come up to snuff, if you will,

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Speaker 1: And it's a moment in time where you have to

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Speaker 1: be able to assess it and make that determination.

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Speaker 2: Then if carbon monoxide doesn't have a smell or anything right.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't. It gives you a pounding headache. I can

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Speaker 1: attest to that, and you'll get external manifestations initially like

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Speaker 1: bloodshot eyes and those sorts of things. And here's just

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Speaker 1: kind of on an a side here. If you are exposed

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Speaker 1: to carbon monoxide, it can still be lethal eight hours

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Speaker 1: after exposure. That's how dangerous it is. It is the

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Speaker 1: most common agent that we see in a gaseous form

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Speaker 1: that people actually succumbed to, and it's used. It is

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Speaker 1: actually used frequently as a means to take one's life.

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Speaker 1: You see it. You know, you hear about people that

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Speaker 1: sit in a car and with the windows rolled down

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Speaker 1: inside of a closed garage. I've actually had a man

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Speaker 1: that used a glass cutter to cut a hole in

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Speaker 1: a window pane of his home and had an old

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Speaker 1: truck parked just outside his window and ran a vent

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Speaker 1: ducked from a dryer. He taped it to the tailpipe

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Speaker 1: and ran it through the window and had this is

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Speaker 1: a very sad case. It just came to mind, had

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Speaker 1: the cremains. That means the remains of his daughter and

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Speaker 1: his wife that had died in a motor vehicle accident

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Speaker 1: years before, laying on the bed next to him, took

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Speaker 1: wet towels and sealed beneath the doors, and after he

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Speaker 1: had turned the truck on outside and just laid down

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Speaker 1: his bed and died. So you do see that as

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Speaker 1: a method for suicide, but it's something that would it

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Speaker 1: would stand out in this environment where you would have

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Speaker 1: perhaps the smell of natural gas in the house, which

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Speaker 1: is quite pungent. Remember, natural gas doesn't normally have a smell.

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Speaker 1: They add this so that you can pick up on

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Speaker 1: the odor of it.

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Speaker 2: I didn't know that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and you can get an odor in the air

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Speaker 1: that gives you an indication that this is danger. It's

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Speaker 1: certainly something that you would you would take notice of,

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Speaker 1: and to this point that didn't come up on the

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Speaker 1: radar of the police. So our big question in the

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Speaker 1: case of the Baxters is what could have possibly led

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Speaker 1: to their deaths. Well, we know that both have underlying

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Speaker 1: physical conditions. They're retired, David. I don't know if you

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Speaker 1: realize this, but first off, it's not cheap to live

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Speaker 1: on this island. And interestingly enough, this couple together apparently

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Speaker 1: had developed a very specific of all things bathmat that

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Speaker 1: they had patented that they had sold and they became

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Speaker 1: quite wealthy off of this. So they were able to

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Speaker 1: live the life of millionaires because they actually were. So

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Speaker 1: you begin to think about this, what could have been

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Speaker 1: going on in their lives that would have brought their

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Speaker 1: lives to an end simultaneously. Is this something where there's

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Speaker 1: depression going on, physical illness, because sometimes that will motivate

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Speaker 1: people to take their own lives, or is it something

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Speaker 1: more sinister? And I think in this case, we've got

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Speaker 1: something that is a bit more sinister, Dave.

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Speaker 2: And that's where as the investigators dig in, and you

347
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Speaker 2: mentioned this that based on the physical things that are

348
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Speaker 2: seen when somebody actually does have carbon monoxide poisoning, the

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Speaker 2: experts were able to pretty much eliminate that within a

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Speaker 2: matter of minutes. I imagine they played up with the

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Speaker 2: daughter for a little while to not crush her because

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Speaker 2: they didn't have an answer. But they didn't have an

353
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Speaker 2: answer as to how they died or why or who,

354
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Speaker 2: but they know it's probably not carbon monoxide. They did

355
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Speaker 2: allow Elliott or their daughter to continue thinking that until

356
00:21:34,000 --> 00:21:36,639
Speaker 2: they actually did have an answer, though. I was looking

357
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Speaker 2: up some things at the end, was reading in one

358
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Speaker 2: of the first stories right after they were found, because

359
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Speaker 2: I wanted to see what did their neighbors think, what

360
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Speaker 2: did the family think. Got a couple in their early

361
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Speaker 2: sixties and they're both gone, and overall it was a

362
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Speaker 2: very much loving tribute to the couple that they died

363
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Speaker 2: together of carbon monoxide poisoning. That's how it was kind

364
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Speaker 2: of reported did the day a day or two after

365
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Speaker 2: their passing. It was only when they actually investigated it

366
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Speaker 2: and the experts got involved that the other story came out.

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Speaker 1: It is quite dark, very very dark. You know, you

368
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Speaker 1: think about, well, what would motivate someone to take these

369
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Speaker 1: people's lives. They were both kind of infirm. Missus Baxter

370
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Speaker 1: actually had in dwelling pneumonia at this particular time. What

371
00:22:25,960 --> 00:22:29,280
Speaker 1: is that, Well, she's got ongoing pneumonia and so it's

372
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Speaker 1: bronchial pneumonia and it's very difficult for her to breathe

373
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Speaker 1: in the first place. And we're talking about breathing here,

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Speaker 1: you know, people were talking, you know, we're throwing around

375
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Speaker 1: this idea of carbon monoxide asshixiation. Well, that's going to

376
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Speaker 1: compromise the respiratory system. Now, mister Baxter actually had a

377
00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:50,639
Speaker 1: condition that's referred to as just cardiomeg which is an

378
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Speaker 1: enlarged heart. And so they're not in the best of health,

379
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Speaker 1: either one of them. So it wouldn't take a lot

380
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Speaker 1: to in their lives, particularly if there was some kind

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Speaker 1: of agent that was applied to them, some kind of

382
00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:09,000
Speaker 1: chemical And in this particular case, you know, they listen.

383
00:23:09,119 --> 00:23:12,080
Speaker 1: When you get to a scene and you're working this thing,

384
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Speaker 1: you have indicators they're there. For instance, if you have

385
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Speaker 1: drug ods. Let's keep it simple. You think about someone

386
00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:21,840
Speaker 1: that's a IV heroin abuser. Well, if the OD at

387
00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:24,119
Speaker 1: the scene, you're going to find what to refer to

388
00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:27,080
Speaker 1: as their works. You'll find a tourniquet, You'll find a spoon.

389
00:23:27,160 --> 00:23:29,720
Speaker 1: Generally the underside of the bowl of the spoon will

390
00:23:29,760 --> 00:23:33,040
Speaker 1: be burned soot on the bottom of it. You'll have

391
00:23:33,320 --> 00:23:37,880
Speaker 1: maybe siline that's there. You'll have cotton swab, and you'll

392
00:23:37,920 --> 00:23:42,480
Speaker 1: have evidence of maybe yellow or white pottery substance, and

393
00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:46,200
Speaker 1: a syringe that they can draw something up through. You'll

394
00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:50,239
Speaker 1: have these definitive things. But listen, you're not going to

395
00:23:50,280 --> 00:23:53,600
Speaker 1: know that the heroine killed somebody until you get toxicology back.

396
00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:57,719
Speaker 1: Talking about this poor daughter, she didn't have answers at

397
00:23:57,720 --> 00:23:59,520
Speaker 1: the time. She was just kind of coming up with

398
00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:03,520
Speaker 1: these ideas is in her mind about what could have happened.

399
00:24:03,560 --> 00:24:08,520
Speaker 1: But boy, when the toxicology came back, were they surprised because,

400
00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:13,920
Speaker 1: as it turns out, both mister and missus Baxter had

401
00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:17,679
Speaker 1: on board fentanyl, of all things day, which is just

402
00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:21,359
Speaker 1: that absolute scourge of society right now. I mean, so

403
00:24:21,400 --> 00:24:25,480
Speaker 1: many people are losing their lives as a result of fentanyl.

404
00:24:25,720 --> 00:24:30,480
Speaker 2: And we've had many stories this year alone about fentanyl.

405
00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:34,040
Speaker 1: This year alone. Yeah, and she also had promethazine in

406
00:24:34,080 --> 00:24:37,880
Speaker 1: her system, which is an agent that generally they give

407
00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:41,840
Speaker 1: it counteract nausea. It has been used as a precursor

408
00:24:42,119 --> 00:24:46,240
Speaker 1: for application of anesthesia. It has that quality where it

409
00:24:46,280 --> 00:24:49,720
Speaker 1: will make you drowsy. So if you take, for instance,

410
00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:54,399
Speaker 1: promethazine and it's combined with certainly with fentanyl, it will

411
00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:58,920
Speaker 1: certainly be enough to push you over the edge into

412
00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:02,399
Speaker 1: that toxic range where it's a non survivable position. And

413
00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:05,679
Speaker 1: it doesn't take a lot of fentanyl to kill someone.

414
00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:09,200
Speaker 1: We've heard for years and years people will have they

415
00:25:09,240 --> 00:25:15,240
Speaker 1: know how powerful morphine is. Morphine is actually derived. It's

416
00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:19,000
Speaker 1: an opiate, and it's a naturally occurring thing. Okay, it's

417
00:25:19,080 --> 00:25:23,400
Speaker 1: not necessarily something that is blended up in a laboratory.

418
00:25:23,720 --> 00:25:29,000
Speaker 1: Fentanyl is actually something that is synthetic. The molecule is

419
00:25:29,040 --> 00:25:34,240
Speaker 1: similar to all other naturally occurring opiates, but this is

420
00:25:34,280 --> 00:25:37,760
Speaker 1: something that is processed that it is created. And fentyl

421
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:41,240
Speaker 1: has a long history of being used as a substance

422
00:25:41,680 --> 00:25:45,439
Speaker 1: in the medical community for pain, and that's kind of

423
00:25:45,440 --> 00:25:48,879
Speaker 1: where it's the wellspring from what this thing comes from.

424
00:25:49,359 --> 00:25:53,800
Speaker 1: But now people are manufacturing it and those that have

425
00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:57,600
Speaker 1: the inclination to want to do harm. It doesn't take

426
00:25:57,800 --> 00:26:01,560
Speaker 1: very much to get this on board. The question is,

427
00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:04,359
Speaker 1: and the question that the police have to ask in

428
00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:08,920
Speaker 1: this particular case, is who has access to these individuals? Well,

429
00:26:09,080 --> 00:26:11,359
Speaker 1: you know, the first thing you have to think about,

430
00:26:11,560 --> 00:26:13,399
Speaker 1: and this is just part of being an investigat You

431
00:26:13,440 --> 00:26:16,000
Speaker 1: have to think about the daughter. Does she have anything

432
00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:19,159
Speaker 1: to gain by doing harm to her parents? Does she

433
00:26:19,280 --> 00:26:23,360
Speaker 1: have the opportunity to do this subject them to this substance. Well,

434
00:26:23,359 --> 00:26:27,600
Speaker 1: apparently they eliminated her pretty quickly. In this particular case.

435
00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:31,680
Speaker 1: As it turns out, they have in fact, at this

436
00:26:31,720 --> 00:26:36,160
Speaker 1: point in time, arrested individuals that the police are now

437
00:26:36,200 --> 00:26:38,760
Speaker 1: saying or responsible for the deaths of the Backs or so.

438
00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:41,400
Speaker 1: As this turns out, this is in fact a homicide

439
00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:44,320
Speaker 1: that was brought about by the use of funnel. The

440
00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:47,200
Speaker 1: question to this point, though, because this case has yet

441
00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:52,240
Speaker 1: to be adjudicated, is how did they get the substance

442
00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:57,960
Speaker 1: into their systems without them knowing about it. To this point,

443
00:26:58,280 --> 00:27:02,240
Speaker 1: three people have been tryed arched. One in particular, Luke

444
00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:05,760
Speaker 1: de Witt, has actually been charged with two counts of

445
00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:10,800
Speaker 1: murder as well as theft. But at this point we're

446
00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:13,560
Speaker 1: still waiting on the trial and the outcome of this case.

447
00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:21,480
Speaker 1: I'm Joseph Scott Morgan and this is Bodybacks