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Speaker 1: Welcome to had the Money. I'm Joel and I am Matt.

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Speaker 1: Today we're answering your listener questions.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, buddy, it's Monday, which means we've got a docket

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Speaker 2: of listener questions lined up a courtroom today.

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Speaker 1: You're on deck, sir. Is that baseball or is that baseball?

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Speaker 1: It's also the court right now.

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Speaker 2: You're making matter, Joel on deck. I think you take

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Speaker 2: the witness stand in a courtroom. Take the stand, sir.

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Speaker 2: That We've got some great ones today. A listener is

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Speaker 2: wondering if it's worth it to consider alternative investments. Another

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Speaker 2: listener is looking to make the most of profit sharing

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Speaker 2: that his company has been generously granting. And somebody else

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Speaker 2: is wanting to know what the impact of our national

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Speaker 2: debt levels, the impact that that has on how it

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Speaker 2: is that we invest. So we'll kind of yeah, we'll

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Speaker 2: touch on that plus more during today's episode. Yeah. Look,

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Speaker 2: we got a nice, nice variety for folks today. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I think that last question, Matt will pair nicely with

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Speaker 1: your back tattoo of a bald eagle ripping through an

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Speaker 1: American flag.

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Speaker 2: If we only had the sound effect for the red

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Speaker 2: tailed hawk, which is the hawk sound at the beginning

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Speaker 2: of the Colbert Report. Oh yeah, yeah, one of the best.

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Speaker 2: It's not a bald eagle, it's actually bald eagles, And

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Speaker 2: don't sound like that.

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Speaker 1: That was a great show while it lasted. But first, Matt, okay,

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Speaker 1: real quick, we have to announce big news today. Big

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Speaker 1: news a new campaign that we're launching that with our

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Speaker 1: friends over at Daffy. A nice partnership with our friends

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Speaker 1: over at Daffy. We've talked about Daffy before on the

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Speaker 1: show because it's the lowest cost platform for being able

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Speaker 1: to invest dollars that you want to give away and

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Speaker 1: grow your giving. And we're doing a little friendly competition here.

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Speaker 1: You and I are giving away some of our own money.

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Speaker 1: We're matching funds that how to money listeners are able

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Speaker 1: to give away to each of our favorite charities.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right. So basically we're competing to get more

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Speaker 2: listeners to essentially give to MAT's charities as opposed to

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Speaker 2: generously giving to Joel's charities.

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Speaker 1: That's what we don't want. Didn't it sound bad to

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Speaker 1: not root It does? Trying to sounds good here, but

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Speaker 1: we're also all in all this is a good thing.

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Speaker 2: But we Also, I do want folks to be giving

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Speaker 2: specifically to the charities I selected. So the three, I'll

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Speaker 2: go ahead share the ones that I went with, The

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Speaker 2: Against Malaria Foundations, so they provide nets to prevent malaria.

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Speaker 2: Next is Helen Keller International, and they work to provide

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Speaker 2: supplements to prevent vitamin AID deficiency. And then New Incentives

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Speaker 2: and I love this one as well because they're looking

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Speaker 2: to not surprisingly provide cash incentives for families to bring

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Speaker 2: in their children to prevent some very avoidable diseases through

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Speaker 2: childhood vaccines. But yeah, all of these are listed over.

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Speaker 2: Actually I give well, they were highly rated on the

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Speaker 2: effect of altruism scale essentially as far as the dollars

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Speaker 2: that are going to the good that they're able to provide.

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Speaker 2: But you've got some great ones picked out as well.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, So the three charities I picked out that I'm

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Speaker 1: giving three thousand dollars of my own money away towards

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Speaker 1: matching a dollar for dollar whatever you are willing to

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Speaker 1: donate is rip medical debt. Essentially, we know how big

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Speaker 1: of a stay in medical debt is on this country,

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Speaker 1: how it negatively impacts people's finances and their relationships. This

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Speaker 1: is an effort, a nonprofit effort to help people eradicate

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Speaker 1: that debt from their lives. There's also a great organization

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Speaker 1: called the Hope Effect. Actually, Matt one of our former guests,

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Speaker 1: Joshua Becker, started this one. This is an effort to

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Speaker 1: change the way orphans are cared for. I love what

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Speaker 1: they're up to. And then the third nonprofit I want

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Speaker 1: to bring to your attention is one called FIRE, the

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Speaker 1: Foundation for Individual Rights and Expression. They are all about

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Speaker 1: defending free speech in this here country, the United States

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Speaker 1: of America. So yeah, I've.

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Speaker 2: Also given to you. So again, it's hard to against

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Speaker 2: you and your organizations, the ones that you've chosen as well,

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Speaker 2: because they're all also wonderful. But we have made this

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Speaker 2: a friendly competition, and here is the wager. The stakes

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Speaker 2: are that whoever loses actually has to drink a six

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Speaker 2: pack of crappy beer over the course of three weeks

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Speaker 2: while the person across from them in this drink, in

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Speaker 2: this case me, is enjoying something amazing all while you're

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Speaker 2: drinking something that you don't like.

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Speaker 1: So instead of craft beer, we'll be drinking crap beer,

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Speaker 1: or the loser will be So please do go support

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Speaker 1: my charities beer, Joel, that's kind of a fun wager

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Speaker 1: to have. The loser definitely loses. But we're not like

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Speaker 1: having to shave our heads or anything like that. So

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Speaker 1: we will put links though to both my campaign and

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Speaker 1: your campaign right in the show notes. There will also

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Speaker 1: be a link going out in tomorrow's how to Money newsletter,

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Speaker 1: so please do join us in being generous. Daffy is

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Speaker 1: one of the best platforms for doing that, and so

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Speaker 1: this is kind of a fun thing to launch.

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Speaker 2: Yep, that's a great way to give strategically. So speaking

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Speaker 2: of beer, let's introduce the beer that you and I

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Speaker 2: are going to enjoy during this episode. This is called

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Speaker 2: I Choose You Zu. This is another one by Pure Project,

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Speaker 2: donated to the show by Christy, So Christy think you

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Speaker 2: Zu so much?

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Speaker 1: Adorable name for sure. All Right, Matt, let's get to

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Speaker 1: our listener questions. And if you're out there listening and

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Speaker 1: you're like, I've got a money question and I would

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Speaker 1: love love for Matt and Joel to tackle it on

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Speaker 1: an upcoming ask A show, or even if you just ka,

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Speaker 1: like am Mike kind of want them.

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Speaker 2: To talk about it, you can send it into even if.

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Speaker 1: You don't have a burning desire, We'll still take it,

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Speaker 1: and you can submit a voice memo our away with

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Speaker 1: your money question. The simple directions you can be found

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Speaker 1: out how to money dot com, slash ask, or just

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Speaker 1: record your voice memo, send it to us via email

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Speaker 1: and hopefully we'll take it next week, maybe the week after.

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Speaker 1: We'd love to hear from you. But Matt, let's get

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Speaker 1: to the first question for this episode. This one is

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Speaker 1: about a new fund offering from a fintech company.

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Speaker 3: Hey, guys, this is Michael from Cleveland. A few months

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Speaker 3: ago so Far had released their new alternative investments. It's

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Speaker 3: been marketed as investments that were originally only available to

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Speaker 3: or accessible to the ultra rich, that they are now

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Speaker 3: making accessible to everyone. It includes investments such as money

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Speaker 3: market funds, alternative funds across a broad range of categories

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Speaker 3: including commodities, currency alternatives, venture capital, and private credit. There's

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Speaker 3: a lot of different things in there that they offer.

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Speaker 3: And I'm curious if you guys have heard of this,

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Speaker 3: if you guys know anything about it, and what your

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Speaker 3: thoughts are on if it's something that's worth adding to

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Speaker 3: anyone's portfolio. And yeah, thank you guys for all that

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Speaker 3: you do and for any answers you can provide. Love

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Speaker 3: the pod.

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Speaker 2: All right, Michael, thank you so much for reaching out

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Speaker 2: to How to Money. Like Joel was talking about, we

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Speaker 2: love getting listener questions, and.

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Speaker 1: I can't tell if that was a burning desire question

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Speaker 1: or just a mad question, but either way, it's a

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Speaker 1: good one.

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Speaker 2: I think he's got deep down it's a brain desire.

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Speaker 2: But he so he's talking about so Fi, So let's

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Speaker 2: talk about them for a minute, because so Far is

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Speaker 2: this fintech app. It's trying to be this like one

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Speaker 2: stop shop. They're trying to do it all. They started

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Speaker 2: out as a private student loan refinance operation and then

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Speaker 2: they decided to try and be this all encompassing ultimate

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Speaker 2: financial app.

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Speaker 1: Essentially a lot of those fintech apps, Matt had to

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Speaker 1: kind of pivot because of the student on payment pause, right, and.

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Speaker 2: Rates going up doing that anymore, there was just a

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Speaker 2: dearth of people refinancing their student loans, and so Sofi

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Speaker 2: and some of the others had to either like close

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Speaker 2: up shop or kind of change their gagets. And some

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Speaker 2: of them got into well, look so Fi, they got

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Speaker 2: into personal loans, they opened up bank accounts that you

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Speaker 2: can do mortgage loans with them, insurance quotes and more.

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Speaker 2: And so part of that more is also investing with

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Speaker 2: so FI. And we you know, we don't talk about

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Speaker 2: them much, but it's not necessarily because they are a

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Speaker 2: bad actor. I think it's more because there are just

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Speaker 2: more specialized companies out there that we typically refer to

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Speaker 2: when we're talking about investing. We've you've heard us talk

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Speaker 2: about van Guard Fidelity and Charles Schwap a Ton they've

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Speaker 2: been around a lot longer too. Yeah, they've got a

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Speaker 2: longer track record. But that being said, I think if

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Speaker 2: you choose the right products, SOFI can likely be of

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Speaker 2: help in your financial life. I noticed, actually they've got

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Speaker 2: an S and P. It's not it's an ETF but

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Speaker 2: and it loosely tracks the S and P five hundred

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Speaker 2: but SFY and it currently has a zero expense ratio,

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Speaker 2: so not unlike FC Rocks Fidelity.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean those are the only two that I'm

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Speaker 1: personally aware of at this moment. There might be others

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Speaker 1: that have a zero expense ratio, And obviously for so FI,

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Speaker 1: that's a lost leader. They're trying to get you to

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Speaker 1: come in invest in that fund and then do other

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Speaker 1: things where hopefully you can be.

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Speaker 2: A profitable customer to them. But I like how you

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Speaker 2: termed it because I think there is a good chance

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Speaker 2: that that is exactly how it is, because this is

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Speaker 2: literally on sofi's website, But if you dig into the details,

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Speaker 2: their gross expense ratio is actually point one to nine,

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Speaker 2: So there is an expense ratio there, but the current

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Speaker 2: nets expense ratio, so what folks are actually paying is

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Speaker 2: zero and it's offset by like reimbursements, fee waivers, things

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Speaker 2: like that, and so literally they're trying to attract a

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Speaker 2: customer base. How long until they but it ceases to

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Speaker 2: be that thing that could totally change as opposed to

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Speaker 2: having just oh, this fund was literally created to be

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Speaker 2: zero cost. It seems like that's the spy I don't

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Speaker 2: know how you say it, Yeah, the spy EDA for fund.

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Speaker 2: It does seem like that at some point that they're

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Speaker 2: gonna switch it in. It's almost like the introductory period

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Speaker 2: of like with cable, where it's like, hey, for the

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Speaker 2: first year, it's only going to be twenty bucks, thirty bucks,

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Speaker 2: but then if and when they actually raise the price

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Speaker 2: on that, I guess we know what they'll raise it too,

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Speaker 2: most likely zer point one to nine, which is gonna

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Speaker 2: be like five x higher than some of our other favorites. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: it's not egregious, but it's still a lot more than

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Speaker 2: what it is that you can get elsewhere.

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Speaker 1: I think it's just a really important point and that

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Speaker 1: those are the kinds of things that some of these

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Speaker 1: fintech companies do to try to gain market share, to

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Speaker 1: try to gain and acquire customers, and then later on

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Speaker 1: down the road a year or two from now, you're

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Speaker 1: in the door, you're feeling really comfortable. That's when they

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Speaker 1: jack up the feet and you're like, oh man, okay, well,

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Speaker 1: am I gonna really really go through the annoyance of

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Speaker 1: moving to a different investment company?

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Speaker 2: Again? Probably, No, it's not that there's there can't be

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Speaker 2: advantage of that's gaining there because again the three bigs

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Speaker 2: I mentioned earlier, they're not doing a whole lot of innovating.

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Speaker 2: I'll say that right. And so if you are interested

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Speaker 2: in something a little bit different or maybe a better

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Speaker 2: user interphase, like just the different features that are available

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Speaker 2: to you, let's say via an app, you're most likely

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Speaker 2: going to get that with a company like SOFI as

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Speaker 2: opposed to Vanguard. That's true. Yeah, they're like the opposite. No, yeah, opposite.

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Speaker 1: But we've said that in some ways that's actually not

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Speaker 1: a bad thing, right because maybe it prevents you from

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Speaker 1: going in there too often. It's true, being more inclined

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Speaker 1: to trade. I actually kind of like.

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Speaker 2: This innovation needed.

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Speaker 1: Yeah probably not, yeah, exactly, Like innovation on fees has

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Speaker 1: been great, but you know when it comes to innovation

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Speaker 1: on user design, maybe that would incentive out the wrong thing.

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Speaker 1: But Michael is specifically asking about some new funds that

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Speaker 1: so FI is offering. He's not asking about the SFY fund,

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Speaker 1: which if you were like, you've got the answer on that,

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Speaker 1: not too Michael, But you want to know about the

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Speaker 1: alternative investment funds that so FI is offering. These are

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Speaker 1: brand new, and so IF I starting to push them

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Speaker 1: hard and so yeah, essentially, what these funds are doing,

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Speaker 1: they're offering you access to actively managed funds like the

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Speaker 1: one from ARC. Matt, We've talked about that fund, the

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Speaker 1: Kathy Wood He's in a minute. It's kind of one

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Speaker 1: of those superstar in investor people, especially during the pandemic

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Speaker 1: when the ARC fund was soaring like Icarus and truly

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Speaker 1: like Icarus because he kind of fell flat again. But

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Speaker 1: so that's a high profile fund at this point, and

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Speaker 1: that fund invests in asset classes that go beyond the

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Speaker 1: stock market, right, just like Michael mentioned. But the total

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Speaker 1: expense ratio on that fund is over four percent. So

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Speaker 1: you have to be really careful about these products and

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Speaker 1: you have to know the fine prints. There's been a

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Speaker 1: steep rise in general in alternative investment products in recent years.

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Speaker 1: We've talked about that way back in episode four forty six,

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Speaker 1: just kind of the wine, the whiskey, the farmland, the arts,

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Speaker 1: like all these different ways that you can invest your money.

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Speaker 1: Our belief is that a lot of these offerings just

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Speaker 1: needlessly complicate things for most investors.

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Speaker 2: What about wine? Did you say wine? I did say, yeah, wine,

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Speaker 2: whiskey found the Veno vest, Yeah, I like that one

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Speaker 2: because they always sound cool. You're like, oh, yeah, who

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Speaker 2: would want to invest in that as opposed to maybe

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Speaker 2: just spend a couple extra dollars on a nice model

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Speaker 2: it is.

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Speaker 1: I get the appeal because it does sound really interesting.

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Speaker 1: And I will say, like index funds, there's a reason

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Speaker 1: we call it boring because.

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Speaker 2: It true sper boring. It is a.

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Speaker 1: Boring thing to do, and you want to spice it up,

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Speaker 1: but spicing it up oftentimes means higher fees and worse returns.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, so you're kind of mentioning the boring stuff.

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Speaker 2: I think, like the biggest question you need to ask

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Speaker 2: yourself is you need to make sure that you are

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Speaker 2: thoroughly doing the boring stuff right, Like that you are,

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Speaker 2: for the most part investing all your money in the

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Speaker 2: S and P or a total stock market or even

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Speaker 2: a target date fund inside of your tax advantage accounts first,

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Speaker 2: like that is the top priority. And then on top

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Speaker 2: of that, like, are you funneling a healthy percentage of

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Speaker 2: your pay in that direction? And I think if the

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Speaker 2: answer is yes to that, well, then dabbling in some

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Speaker 2: of these alternative investments it's not an awful idea. There

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Speaker 2: are certainly worse things you could do with your money,

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Speaker 2: but if you're thinking about it from fire yours'd be worse.

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Speaker 2: But another question to ask is like, do you actually

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Speaker 2: need this additional exposure to some of these exotic alternatives,

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Speaker 2: to these commodities, to these pre ipo companies. That's another

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Speaker 2: one too, right, Yeah, yeah, if so, well, why is

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Speaker 2: it because it just owns sexy because it was marketed well.

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Speaker 2: Or keep in mind that I'm guessing there are very

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Speaker 2: few SOFI investors who are actually going to beat angel

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Speaker 2: investors like the Mark and Reasons out there, who are

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Speaker 2: basically beating investors to the punch when it comes to

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Speaker 2: the startup investing.

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Speaker 1: I think this is probably going to be the classic

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Speaker 1: example of sloppy seconds. It's going to be the companies

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Speaker 1: that market Intreasons and then like five other companies behind

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Speaker 1: his passed on, and then you're going to get to

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Speaker 1: pre IPO. Look at those companies. My guess is in

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Speaker 1: that hyper competitive investment landscape, the funds that SOFI is offering,

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Speaker 1: you're not competing with the big boys, and I think

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Speaker 1: you could make the case right that it would be

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Speaker 1: worth it to invest in some of these alternative investments

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Speaker 1: if you were truly going to get higher turns net

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Speaker 1: of fees. So even at the feest three percent, but hey,

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Speaker 1: the returns that year or on an average year eighteen percent,

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Speaker 1: whereas the returns in the stock market are ten percent,

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Speaker 1: even though you're paying a very little fee. Hey, no,

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Speaker 1: that makes sense. I think I will go for some

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Speaker 1: of those alternative investments, and so you have to maybe

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Speaker 1: run the numbers two and see what the average return

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Speaker 1: is of some of these alternative investments. And also is

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Speaker 1: past performance going to be indicative of future returns. You've

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Speaker 1: got to make that calculation too. But as I was

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Speaker 1: looking into this, Matt, I was just doing a little

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Speaker 1: research and Acre Trader is they're not a bad company,

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Speaker 1: but they're one of these companies that specializes in allowing

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Speaker 1: people to invest in farmland.

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Speaker 2: And that another great name, it is Acre Traders, and

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Speaker 2: that's to throw their money their way.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I'll invest in apple orchards please, Right, it kind

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Speaker 1: of sounds kind of quite agrarian.

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Speaker 2: I like that wholesome, right.

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Speaker 1: Classic Americana. Well, the typical returns of investing in farmland

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Speaker 1: have been touted as being higher than what you're going

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Speaker 1: to get in the S and P. That is kind

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Speaker 1: of their claim to fame is saying we're going to

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Speaker 1: outpace the S and P. Maybe not out of fees,

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Speaker 1: but at least we think we can do better than

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Speaker 1: the stock market. But I just went to the homepage

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Speaker 1: of their site. They have a graph going back to

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Speaker 1: nineteen ninety one, what's generated the second highest returns on

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Speaker 1: the graph that's on their homepage, the just straight up

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Speaker 1: S and P five hundred, right, and number one number

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Speaker 1: one is actually not farmland the first place. The only

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Speaker 1: asset class that has performed better than just the broad

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Speaker 1: market is rets real estate investment trust, so basically investing

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Speaker 1: in real estate. I think that graph says a lot.

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Speaker 2: Maybe they got the wrong graph on their homepage.

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Speaker 1: Right right about to get fired, right, I'm like, why

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Speaker 1: would you put this here? Because it just makes me

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Speaker 1: think that I should really sell the guys.

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Speaker 2: No, we should be considering these other options.

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Speaker 1: So I don't care how boring investing in the S

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Speaker 1: and P five hundred is, as long as it produces

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Speaker 1: more wealth from me over the alternative choices, right, and so,

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Speaker 1: especially when you factor in the fees that alternative investment

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Speaker 1: funds and some of these companies typically charge, those net

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Speaker 1: returns are inferior to the basic suggestion that we make

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Speaker 1: regularly on the show. I don't see the need and

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Speaker 1: I say need stress need. I don't see the need

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Speaker 1: for anyone to own anything other than a broad mix

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Speaker 1: of stocks if they're in the wealth building phase of

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Speaker 1: their life.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you definitely don't need to you can if you

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Speaker 2: want to, but before that, we'd recommend for you to

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Speaker 2: check out the fees section within the FAQs on the

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Speaker 2: different alternative investing platforms, because not only will the expense

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Speaker 2: ratio be higher on these funds like you're talking about,

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Speaker 2: I'm like, okay, maybe four percent, that's pretty steep, but

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Speaker 2: you could be subject to a front end load fee.

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Speaker 2: So this is where they take a cut of your

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Speaker 2: investment and they pocket it when you buy right.

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Speaker 1: So you're like, I got one hundred K to invest

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Speaker 1: and they're like, cool, now you only have ninety eight

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Speaker 1: from the right moment out.

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Speaker 2: Of the cage. But then you've got back end load

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Speaker 2: fees as well, and that's where they do the same

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Speaker 2: thing when you sell it. And so even if you

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Speaker 2: do you go out, the higher returns, your net return

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Speaker 2: after fees are going to be lower. Plus can I

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Speaker 2: just say that this is like an age old marketing

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Speaker 2: strategy strategy, like where they're telling folks, hey, you now

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Speaker 2: have access is previously only available to the to the

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Speaker 2: ultra witched, ultra rich, to the wealthy. It makes me

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Speaker 2: think of like some different investing newsletters out there where

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Speaker 2: there are these publications that are tone, folks. Oh no,

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Speaker 2: these are the secrets. These are the specific stocks that

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Speaker 2: are going to allow you to grow your net worth

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Speaker 2: like crazy. It's so appealing that now the pores can partake.

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Speaker 2: It's where the elite investment circles, except that it's just marketing.

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Speaker 2: There are dozens of sites that have been touting similar

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Speaker 2: things in recent years. And do you need to Joel

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Speaker 2: Like you're saying no, But if you want to, I

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Speaker 2: think that's totally fine. I see no harm in doing that.

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Speaker 2: And actually I almost see there being a benefit again

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Speaker 2: if you keep that in check to no more than

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Speaker 2: five percent of your overall portfolio. Because if you are

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Speaker 2: asking yourself the question of like, oh yeah, alternative investments,

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Speaker 2: like is that something? If you find yourself drawn to

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Speaker 2: this question, generally speaking, it means you are interested in it,

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Speaker 2: which means that if you dedicate some of your dollars

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Speaker 2: towards investing in alternatives or single stock or crypto things

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Speaker 2: like that, and that allows you to stay on track

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Speaker 2: with the other ninety five percent without fail and you're

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Speaker 2: able to continue to dollar cost average without even thinking

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Speaker 2: about it. Okay, go for it. Like that is the

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Speaker 2: pressure release valve at one hundred percent and said the

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Speaker 2: ability to temper your emotions depending on what the news is,

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Speaker 2: what the market's doing, what folks are talking about in media.

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Speaker 2: I think that that can be a helpful outlook.

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Speaker 1: I just think, Matt, so much of the reason people

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Speaker 1: are often attracted to these things is either because the

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Speaker 1: number is going up or because the marketing is good.

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Speaker 1: And that was the case with the ARC Fund. Most

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Speaker 1: of the money that went into that fund, that a

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Speaker 1: lot of the inflows were essentially right near the top

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Speaker 1: because that's when it was getting all the press. Everyone

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Speaker 1: was like, oh my gosh, this thing's going to the

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Speaker 1: rear and yeah, and it was the igorous moments and

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Speaker 1: then the crash the subsequent underperformance of that fund for

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Speaker 1: many months to come. And the people who run those

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Speaker 1: funds are gonna be happy because they make a pretty

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Speaker 1: penny when you invest in those funds. But you might

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Speaker 1: not be as happy. You might be over complicating things

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Speaker 1: and diminishing your returns over time.

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Speaker 2: That's right, man, But we've got more to get to.

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Speaker 2: We're going to hear from a listener who is interested

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Speaker 2: in hanging his own shingle. He's going to go down

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Speaker 2: the path of entrepreneurship. We've got that and more right

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Speaker 2: after this. All right, Matt, we're back.

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Speaker 1: We've got more questions to get to, including this next

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Speaker 1: one about optimizing your HSA.

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Speaker 4: Hey, guys, this is Derek Miller from Nashville, Tennessee, and

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Speaker 4: I had a question today regarding HSA accounts. Is it

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Speaker 4: better to pay for your medical expenses directly with your

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Speaker 4: HSA account or pay for it with a credit card

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Speaker 4: to earn the two percent cash back when you reimburse

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Speaker 4: yourself with the HSA account money. Thank you guys.

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Speaker 2: All right, Joel sounds like Derek. He wants to know

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Speaker 2: if he should be using his HSA specific debit card

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Speaker 2: or if that's a bad idea. And the reason he

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Speaker 2: didn't mention that but most HSA, most FSA it flexible

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Speaker 2: spending accounts, they now will send you a debit card

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Speaker 2: allowing you to pay for your different expenses. We don't

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Speaker 2: like debit cards in general, Mattlet's be honest. That's true.

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Speaker 2: That's true, but they're tied directly to the accounts and

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Speaker 2: so it makes it easier, of course. But what Derek

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Speaker 2: is asking here is should you use that debit card

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Speaker 2: that they give you and quick answer. If you like

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Speaker 2: rewards and optimizing your finances, probably.

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Speaker 1: Not TLDR no, right, because I guess if there were

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Speaker 1: like an extra you know, a dozen hoops you have

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Speaker 1: to jump through in order to get additional benefits, well,

434
00:20:20,800 --> 00:20:23,159
Speaker 1: then it's probably not worth it, and just use the

435
00:20:23,200 --> 00:20:25,640
Speaker 1: debit card. I guess that they provide you. But the

436
00:20:25,680 --> 00:20:28,359
Speaker 1: better move to make is to not use the debit

437
00:20:28,400 --> 00:20:29,840
Speaker 1: card they send you, but to use your own credit

438
00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:32,280
Speaker 1: card instead. Right, Yeah, And especially when we're talking about

439
00:20:32,320 --> 00:20:35,440
Speaker 1: health expenses, Matt, depending on what you're having done, if

440
00:20:35,480 --> 00:20:37,640
Speaker 1: that can be expensive. I had to at the very

441
00:20:37,640 --> 00:20:40,240
Speaker 1: beginning of this year, Matt, You remember this, I had

442
00:20:40,280 --> 00:20:42,400
Speaker 1: walking pneumonia and I had to go to.

443
00:20:43,240 --> 00:20:45,639
Speaker 2: The urgent care. Is that really what it was? Is

444
00:20:45,640 --> 00:20:46,960
Speaker 2: that what they called? It was? What it was? Yeah,

445
00:20:47,119 --> 00:20:49,040
Speaker 2: I had to get a well I'm not going to

446
00:20:49,119 --> 00:20:51,879
Speaker 2: go into the description, but it was like word, they

447
00:20:51,920 --> 00:20:54,200
Speaker 2: give you a shot, yeah, right in the bump.

448
00:20:54,480 --> 00:20:57,119
Speaker 1: And so two hundred and five bucks later, which is

449
00:20:57,160 --> 00:21:00,240
Speaker 1: like not inconsequential when we're talking about credit card rules words,

450
00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:02,679
Speaker 1: And that's even on the low end. Let's be honest,

451
00:21:02,720 --> 00:21:06,040
Speaker 1: for what you're gonna pay for medical stuff. So much

452
00:21:06,119 --> 00:21:08,280
Speaker 1: the time, and when you use your own credit card,

453
00:21:08,280 --> 00:21:11,680
Speaker 1: you're you're gonna get to earn rewards on those medical expenses. Typically,

454
00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:13,560
Speaker 1: all you have to do, by the way, is submit

455
00:21:13,640 --> 00:21:16,200
Speaker 1: your receipt to your HSA provider in order to get

456
00:21:16,200 --> 00:21:18,760
Speaker 1: those funds then deposited directly into your accounts, not like

457
00:21:18,800 --> 00:21:21,720
Speaker 1: you gotta go through the hassle of baking a phone call,

458
00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:24,000
Speaker 1: getting a check written now to you or something like that. Right,

459
00:21:24,000 --> 00:21:27,840
Speaker 1: it's one extra tiny step. And so for specifically we're

460
00:21:27,840 --> 00:21:30,680
Speaker 1: talking about like four figure expenses, I think it's likely

461
00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:33,320
Speaker 1: worth that tiny bit of extra legwork to pull it off.

462
00:21:33,320 --> 00:21:35,000
Speaker 2: And you're talking about just getting the shot that like

463
00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:38,800
Speaker 2: a broken arm or a bigger dental procedure, if that's

464
00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:40,600
Speaker 2: something that can I break my arm on purpose, Matt,

465
00:21:40,680 --> 00:21:43,880
Speaker 2: just to get more credit card rewards. Right, what did

466
00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:46,000
Speaker 2: I see? I saw something about somebody following for a

467
00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:48,119
Speaker 2: scam where they got their leg This is in some

468
00:21:48,160 --> 00:21:51,280
Speaker 2: other country where they got their legs amputatedfully in order

469
00:21:51,320 --> 00:21:54,360
Speaker 2: to take a dark real quick bro. Yeah, yeah, well

470
00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:56,919
Speaker 2: you said you talk about breaking your arm on purpose.

471
00:21:57,040 --> 00:21:59,119
Speaker 2: I mean it's like, what is it ninety six hours

472
00:21:59,200 --> 00:22:02,640
Speaker 2: or whatever? Oh? Yeah, the James Franco movie. Never saw that. Yeah, anyway,

473
00:22:02,880 --> 00:22:04,520
Speaker 2: I don't want to get off track here, but somebody

474
00:22:04,520 --> 00:22:06,760
Speaker 2: was trying to take advantage of it as an insurance

475
00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:10,240
Speaker 2: scam that they were trying to pull on the insurance company.

476
00:22:10,240 --> 00:22:12,280
Speaker 2: But then the insurance company found out and so they

477
00:22:12,280 --> 00:22:14,720
Speaker 2: actually ended up like going to jail and having to

478
00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:18,879
Speaker 2: pay money on top of the irreversible harm that the

479
00:22:18,920 --> 00:22:23,080
Speaker 2: person inflicted upon themselves. Well that's crazy, that is awful. Yeah, yeah,

480
00:22:23,119 --> 00:22:24,000
Speaker 2: so never do that, folks.

481
00:22:24,160 --> 00:22:26,840
Speaker 1: I'm not sure what new sites you're reading, but that

482
00:22:26,880 --> 00:22:30,040
Speaker 1: would be cheap, not fruital. It makes me question what

483
00:22:30,080 --> 00:22:32,960
Speaker 1: you're into, Okay, And I think on top of that, Matt,

484
00:22:33,240 --> 00:22:36,600
Speaker 1: if we're talking about a really elevated expense in the

485
00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:39,600
Speaker 1: medical space, and granted this is this is to like

486
00:22:39,920 --> 00:22:43,040
Speaker 1: because you have the money in the FSA or the HSA,

487
00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:44,760
Speaker 1: it's not like you're putting it on the credit card

488
00:22:44,800 --> 00:22:46,120
Speaker 1: and then you're not gonna be able to pay it off.

489
00:22:46,160 --> 00:22:48,960
Speaker 1: So well, when we talk about putting stuff on credit cards,

490
00:22:49,800 --> 00:22:51,159
Speaker 1: we always say that you have to be able to

491
00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:53,120
Speaker 1: pay it off on time, and in false that's that's crucial.

492
00:22:53,359 --> 00:22:54,920
Speaker 1: But you've got the money backing you up, So it's

493
00:22:54,920 --> 00:22:56,920
Speaker 1: not like that you're really at risk of that. And

494
00:22:57,359 --> 00:22:59,720
Speaker 1: if you're trying to maximize a welcome offer, trying to

495
00:22:59,800 --> 00:23:02,160
Speaker 1: hit a spending threshold, right then it makes an even

496
00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:04,600
Speaker 1: bigger difference in your ability to clear that hurdle.

497
00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:07,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, all of those small purchases add up, it makes Okay,

498
00:23:07,160 --> 00:23:09,920
Speaker 2: here's a little plug for another credit card, the what's

499
00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:15,879
Speaker 2: the Visa Executive Membership Costco card? Oh? The Chase is it? No?

500
00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:19,159
Speaker 2: City is the City City card? Yeah? I recently finally

501
00:23:19,240 --> 00:23:21,920
Speaker 2: used my reward certificate. Have you got in yours? When

502
00:23:22,080 --> 00:23:23,000
Speaker 2: did y'all become a member?

503
00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:23,280
Speaker 3: Oh?

504
00:23:23,359 --> 00:23:25,480
Speaker 2: Always get it? A few member we get into November. Yeah,

505
00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:29,080
Speaker 2: so okay, we got ours? Yeah, boy, you better believe

506
00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:32,560
Speaker 2: I use that goes almost three hundred bucks to completely

507
00:23:32,880 --> 00:23:36,080
Speaker 2: white like take care of a massive costco run for us.

508
00:23:36,080 --> 00:23:38,679
Speaker 2: But like all, I'm just pointing out that all, like,

509
00:23:38,720 --> 00:23:41,239
Speaker 2: it doesn't have to be some massive expense, like some

510
00:23:41,240 --> 00:23:43,199
Speaker 2: big medical expense that you have coming out. It can

511
00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:45,159
Speaker 2: be all these small things and over time that it

512
00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:47,639
Speaker 2: really does add up and at least a significant benefit.

513
00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:49,080
Speaker 1: It's just like, oh, if you're trying to meet a

514
00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:50,800
Speaker 1: three thousand dollars spend and you have a twelve hundred

515
00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:53,480
Speaker 1: dollars medical bill that you're gonna use FSA funds for anyway,

516
00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:54,800
Speaker 1: we'll funnel it through the as well.

517
00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:57,520
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, but so, Derek, I think it's worth mentioning

518
00:23:57,520 --> 00:24:00,120
Speaker 2: that the best way though, to score the biggest benefits

519
00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:02,240
Speaker 2: of your HSA. Like we're kind of talking about using

520
00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:05,000
Speaker 2: credit cards to maximize the benefits, but let's talk about

521
00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:07,720
Speaker 2: how you can maximize HSA benefits, and that's to leave

522
00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:11,720
Speaker 2: those funds be for years, if not decades. And what

523
00:24:11,760 --> 00:24:14,680
Speaker 2: we mean by this is to invest that money instead

524
00:24:14,760 --> 00:24:17,879
Speaker 2: of just siphoning or funneling that money through your HSA.

525
00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:19,919
Speaker 2: And I know not everyone can do this. A lot

526
00:24:19,960 --> 00:24:21,480
Speaker 2: of some folks out there, they don't have the financial

527
00:24:21,480 --> 00:24:24,840
Speaker 2: wigga room yet at least to allow those funds to

528
00:24:24,920 --> 00:24:26,479
Speaker 2: linger and for you to invest that money. But if

529
00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:28,919
Speaker 2: you can just think of your health saving these account

530
00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:32,080
Speaker 2: as another long term account to help you to invest

531
00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:34,959
Speaker 2: for your future, well, man, I'll tell you what future

532
00:24:35,000 --> 00:24:37,880
Speaker 2: you is going to be very very happy down the line.

533
00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:41,440
Speaker 2: It's the The HSA is the most underrated retirement account

534
00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:44,080
Speaker 2: in existence. A few folks know about how many people

535
00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:47,120
Speaker 2: treat it that way as this long term retirement retirement account,

536
00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:49,600
Speaker 2: and that's how we want you to start thinking about it.

537
00:24:49,680 --> 00:24:52,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we've got an article that will link to

538
00:24:52,040 --> 00:24:54,720
Speaker 1: in the show notes that just details exactly how to

539
00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:58,280
Speaker 1: you use an HSA to maximum effects. I was literally

540
00:24:58,400 --> 00:25:00,440
Speaker 1: texting with my brother in law about that this warning Matt.

541
00:25:00,480 --> 00:25:03,119
Speaker 1: He's like, Hey, so, which fund should I invest in

542
00:25:03,119 --> 00:25:04,159
Speaker 1: inside of my HSA?

543
00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:05,520
Speaker 2: And I'm like, do you.

544
00:25:05,840 --> 00:25:07,959
Speaker 1: Have like Vanguard funds, Fidelity funds, like what you got

545
00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:10,080
Speaker 1: access to? He's like, well, I got this gut VTI

546
00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:12,800
Speaker 1: how about that one. I'm like, yeah, that's a killer,

547
00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:15,359
Speaker 1: low cost fund to guess it. And I'm like, just

548
00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:17,879
Speaker 1: to make sure you're gonna leave those funds invested for

549
00:25:17,920 --> 00:25:19,399
Speaker 1: like a lot of years, right, you don't need the

550
00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:21,560
Speaker 1: money right away. He's gonna do the right thing. He's

551
00:25:21,600 --> 00:25:23,560
Speaker 1: gonna start paying for he's gonna be paying for medical

552
00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:26,960
Speaker 1: expenses out of pocket and gonna leave that money invested

553
00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:31,080
Speaker 1: for future withdrawals because of the extreme tax benefits that

554
00:25:31,160 --> 00:25:33,960
Speaker 1: the HSA provides. So he's brilliant. Appreciate what he's up to.

555
00:25:34,359 --> 00:25:37,080
Speaker 1: And what we're talking about here is the triple tax

556
00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:41,080
Speaker 1: advantage nature. No other retirement account that we know of

557
00:25:41,119 --> 00:25:45,120
Speaker 1: at least has this ability. You're taxed at some point

558
00:25:45,160 --> 00:25:48,280
Speaker 1: in the process on any account that you might invest

559
00:25:48,320 --> 00:25:51,720
Speaker 1: inside of. Right, So for ROTH accounts you pay tax upfront.

560
00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:54,560
Speaker 1: For traditional four oh one K or IRA accounts, you

561
00:25:54,600 --> 00:25:57,360
Speaker 1: pay tax when you withdraw those funds, typically in retirement.

562
00:25:57,440 --> 00:25:57,640
Speaker 2: Right.

563
00:25:57,840 --> 00:26:01,560
Speaker 1: But the HSA is incredible because if you use it correctly,

564
00:26:01,760 --> 00:26:04,560
Speaker 1: you avoid taxes when you contribute. You invest that money

565
00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:06,159
Speaker 1: so it can grow tax free over the years. So

566
00:26:06,359 --> 00:26:08,199
Speaker 1: whatever you put in the beginning becomes a whole lot

567
00:26:08,240 --> 00:26:10,520
Speaker 1: bigger later on down the road, and then you take

568
00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:14,199
Speaker 1: money out of that fund potentially decades further into the

569
00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:17,080
Speaker 1: future without paying any tax either. You just avoid tax

570
00:26:17,080 --> 00:26:19,680
Speaker 1: the whole way around. And even with some of those

571
00:26:19,680 --> 00:26:22,719
Speaker 1: payroll contribution taxes, if you know the ah says through

572
00:26:22,720 --> 00:26:25,479
Speaker 1: your employer, it's a quadruple yeah, tax advantage. It's like

573
00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:28,800
Speaker 1: that one sweet additional benefit. It matters a lot. It's

574
00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:31,920
Speaker 1: it's almost matt like sheltering your money in the Cayman

575
00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:33,920
Speaker 1: Islands or something. I don't really know how that works.

576
00:26:33,920 --> 00:26:35,399
Speaker 1: I know it gets referred to in movies and stuff

577
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:38,040
Speaker 1: like that, but It's just it's this tax benefit that's

578
00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:42,159
Speaker 1: accessible to everyday folks, not just the ultra rich, ultra wealthy.

579
00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:44,840
Speaker 2: You and I we've been running a lot lately, and

580
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:46,840
Speaker 2: as I was thinking, it makes me think about if

581
00:26:46,880 --> 00:26:51,879
Speaker 2: you were to run downhill on a moving sidewalk with

582
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:54,280
Speaker 2: the wind blowing at your back. Yeah, like all of

583
00:26:54,280 --> 00:26:56,280
Speaker 2: those things are going to lead to you running faster

584
00:26:56,560 --> 00:26:59,120
Speaker 2: and then a I don't know, somewhat similar Oh, plus

585
00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:02,359
Speaker 2: the fourth so pleasure I actually might need for people

586
00:27:02,359 --> 00:27:04,240
Speaker 2: to assume that I'm actually running instead of walking with

587
00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:07,960
Speaker 2: your family on the sidelines cheering you. That's the potential

588
00:27:08,320 --> 00:27:10,560
Speaker 2: payroll tax aboidance as well. But like, all of these

589
00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:14,639
Speaker 2: things are leading to your ability to sock away more money,

590
00:27:14,680 --> 00:27:16,760
Speaker 2: to invest that money, and to not have to pay

591
00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:19,399
Speaker 2: tax on it. And I think for how to money listeners,

592
00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:22,520
Speaker 2: if you have the financial margin to contribute meaningful amounts

593
00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:25,199
Speaker 2: of money to your HSA, and you can afford not

594
00:27:25,280 --> 00:27:27,119
Speaker 2: to touch it for quite some time, this account it

595
00:27:27,119 --> 00:27:28,960
Speaker 2: can just be one of the absolute best ones you

596
00:27:29,200 --> 00:27:31,960
Speaker 2: have access to. It's unfortunately one that I've not had

597
00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:34,640
Speaker 2: access to because I've never had a high deductible well,

598
00:27:34,680 --> 00:27:36,439
Speaker 2: I have had a high deductible plan, but that was

599
00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:39,480
Speaker 2: literally decades ago before I knew about the stupid HSA. Yeah,

600
00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:41,200
Speaker 2: I never had access either. It's kind of a bummer.

601
00:27:41,240 --> 00:27:43,040
Speaker 2: And now now that I know about HSA, yeah I

602
00:27:43,040 --> 00:27:45,160
Speaker 2: haven't so said I had a high deductile have money

603
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:47,080
Speaker 2: stocked away in one. But it's just a great account

604
00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:49,560
Speaker 2: for early retirees as well, because you can just withdraw

605
00:27:49,600 --> 00:27:51,280
Speaker 2: those funds at any point in the future as long

606
00:27:51,320 --> 00:27:53,240
Speaker 2: as you stay organized to keep up with those receipts.

607
00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:56,000
Speaker 2: And if you want low fees to boot well, we

608
00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:59,040
Speaker 2: would recommend you check out Lively or Fidelity. They are

609
00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:01,520
Speaker 2: the top two HSA providers out there.

610
00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:03,880
Speaker 1: I love these set. It's great for early retireies because

611
00:28:03,880 --> 00:28:06,199
Speaker 1: I agree. I think it because of how flexible it

612
00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:09,920
Speaker 1: is in nature, because you're not prevented to withdrawing those

613
00:28:09,920 --> 00:28:11,920
Speaker 1: funds after the age of fifty nine and a half.

614
00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:14,240
Speaker 1: No no, no, Let's say you incurred the medical expense

615
00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:16,880
Speaker 1: when you're twenty five and you're like, you find yourself

616
00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:19,520
Speaker 1: at age forty five and you've been investing that money

617
00:28:19,560 --> 00:28:21,440
Speaker 1: for twenty years, Well, now you want to pull those

618
00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:24,240
Speaker 1: funds out. Sure, no harm, no foul, You can still

619
00:28:24,280 --> 00:28:27,320
Speaker 1: guess what because of the medical expense you incurred, it's

620
00:28:27,480 --> 00:28:30,439
Speaker 1: completely tax free. You've still avoided all the tax, but

621
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:33,240
Speaker 1: you pulled it out way before traditional retirement age. So

622
00:28:33,240 --> 00:28:36,560
Speaker 1: I agree the HSA. It just adds extra flexibility. It's beautiful,

623
00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:38,400
Speaker 1: especially for those folks who don't want to work until

624
00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:39,480
Speaker 1: the sixty That's right.

625
00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:42,240
Speaker 2: Man. Let's hear from our next listener though, and he

626
00:28:42,280 --> 00:28:44,480
Speaker 2: wants to know how he can make the most of

627
00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:46,000
Speaker 2: a profit sharing plan.

628
00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:49,560
Speaker 5: Hello, Matt and Joel. This is Carl Higgins from Montana.

629
00:28:50,200 --> 00:28:54,360
Speaker 5: I had a question about profit sharing plans. I've been

630
00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:57,920
Speaker 5: at my job for twenty one years. I currently have

631
00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:04,120
Speaker 5: one hundred and they're thirty thousand in my plan. We

632
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:09,280
Speaker 5: are not allowed to contribute to it. So my question

633
00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:10,920
Speaker 5: is I just wanted to see if you could go

634
00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:15,400
Speaker 5: in depth on profit sharing plans. And it is one

635
00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:19,840
Speaker 5: hundred and thirty a lot after twenty one years, and

636
00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:25,400
Speaker 5: I plan on going to quit here in the next

637
00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:30,560
Speaker 5: few months to pursue my business. So what would I

638
00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:33,440
Speaker 5: need to do with that one hundred and thirty thousand?

639
00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:37,840
Speaker 5: Thanks for all you guys, do appreciate it. Thanks for

640
00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:38,200
Speaker 5: the help.

641
00:29:38,760 --> 00:29:41,520
Speaker 2: Oh Matt, carl starting his own thing. Love that, Yeah,

642
00:29:41,560 --> 00:29:42,040
Speaker 2: I love that.

643
00:29:42,200 --> 00:29:46,920
Speaker 1: I'd love especially since COVID the uptick in the dramatic

644
00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:48,800
Speaker 1: uptick in the number of people who are starting their

645
00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:50,560
Speaker 1: own businesses. I just think that's such a good thing

646
00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:53,160
Speaker 1: for our country. Unfortunately, I don't think it's sustained. There's

647
00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:54,800
Speaker 1: like a massive spike.

648
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:56,560
Speaker 2: Oh really, I thought it was still going. I think

649
00:29:56,600 --> 00:29:58,880
Speaker 2: it's it's declined a little bit. Okay, well, I don't

650
00:29:58,880 --> 00:30:01,400
Speaker 2: know if it's back to pre pan business formation levels,

651
00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:04,560
Speaker 2: but it's definitely not where it was in twenty twenty one.

652
00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:07,600
Speaker 2: The toughest part of going that route typically is being

653
00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:09,719
Speaker 2: able then to afford health insurance on your own right.

654
00:30:09,760 --> 00:30:11,360
Speaker 2: That is one of the reasons that we need some

655
00:30:11,400 --> 00:30:13,800
Speaker 2: sort of health insurance perform in this country because that

656
00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:15,760
Speaker 2: prevents I think a lot of people who would feel

657
00:30:15,760 --> 00:30:19,920
Speaker 2: comfortable starting a business, which is great for the economy,

658
00:30:20,480 --> 00:30:23,440
Speaker 2: that maybe keeps them like a golden handcuff to their employers.

659
00:30:23,440 --> 00:30:24,920
Speaker 2: So I'd love to see something done on that front.

660
00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:27,920
Speaker 2: But I digress, And so big congrats to Carl on

661
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:30,479
Speaker 2: starting his own thing, especially after a couple of decades,

662
00:30:30,520 --> 00:30:31,960
Speaker 2: like boom, You've got the skills you got to know

663
00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:34,400
Speaker 2: how you've been doing something for a while, you probably

664
00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:38,040
Speaker 2: now know a niche that you can inhabit to be

665
00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:40,600
Speaker 2: and make it lucrative. So we're pumped for you, Carl,

666
00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:43,280
Speaker 2: And we don't get many questions on profit sharing plans.

667
00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:47,280
Speaker 2: They're kind of cool though, because employers have the ability

668
00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:51,440
Speaker 2: to compensate you, Carl and your fellow employees when the

669
00:30:51,520 --> 00:30:56,280
Speaker 2: employer has a great year. So if the years particularly fantastic,

670
00:30:56,600 --> 00:30:58,840
Speaker 2: then boom, they're flush with cash. Hey, why don't we

671
00:30:59,120 --> 00:31:00,680
Speaker 2: Why don't we shove a good and maybe it's a

672
00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:02,880
Speaker 2: percentage of the profits or something like that, Why don't

673
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:04,960
Speaker 2: we just funnel that straight to our employees? Hey, we

674
00:31:05,000 --> 00:31:06,800
Speaker 2: all share in the wealth. I love that because I

675
00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:09,200
Speaker 2: think it builds morale as well. I think it's just

676
00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:12,200
Speaker 2: people who work for companies who share the profits end

677
00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:15,280
Speaker 2: up being happier because they feel like it's a shared success. Yeah.

678
00:31:15,320 --> 00:31:18,520
Speaker 1: And then if profits are non existent, well you're probably

679
00:31:18,520 --> 00:31:20,440
Speaker 1: not going to see any money in that account in

680
00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:23,080
Speaker 1: a given year, right, so hey, it was a tough year,

681
00:31:23,280 --> 00:31:27,320
Speaker 1: well the profit sharing account? Yeah, sorry, it's lean. You

682
00:31:27,360 --> 00:31:29,840
Speaker 1: don't get anything, and that makes it hard to predict

683
00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:32,400
Speaker 1: and bank on this being a significant source of revenue

684
00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:34,800
Speaker 1: in retirement. But it's going to be helpful, and like

685
00:31:34,800 --> 00:31:36,680
Speaker 1: I said, I think just the working culture. It's good

686
00:31:36,720 --> 00:31:38,320
Speaker 1: for the working culture of a company and for its

687
00:31:38,320 --> 00:31:40,160
Speaker 1: employees to I think if you have one of these,

688
00:31:40,200 --> 00:31:42,600
Speaker 1: you're likely to stick around longer. And Carl's probably been there,

689
00:31:42,600 --> 00:31:44,880
Speaker 1: what do you say for two decades? That makes sense?

690
00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:47,360
Speaker 2: Twenty one years? Man, Yeah, And so he asked if

691
00:31:47,400 --> 00:31:50,760
Speaker 2: the amount that he has in there is good, and

692
00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:54,200
Speaker 2: the safe answer is, well, it depends because it depends

693
00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:56,560
Speaker 2: on how much you've been making maybe over the course

694
00:31:56,560 --> 00:31:58,280
Speaker 2: of twenty one years. You're like, actually, I would have

695
00:31:58,320 --> 00:32:00,120
Speaker 2: expected there to be a lot more in there. But

696
00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:02,800
Speaker 2: bottom line, that's I mean, you're you're talking over six

697
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:06,360
Speaker 2: figures like this is not chump change. And most companies

698
00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:08,840
Speaker 2: that do offer a profit sharing plan like this, they

699
00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:11,800
Speaker 2: do this on top of offering a tax advantage account

700
00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:13,760
Speaker 2: like a four oh one K, Right, there are typically

701
00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:16,560
Speaker 2: additional dollars on top of a four to one K

702
00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:19,479
Speaker 2: match and so in all likelihood, this is for you

703
00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:21,920
Speaker 2: an additional way that you've been able to save money

704
00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:24,880
Speaker 2: for your future, except that you haven't been doing it.

705
00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:27,920
Speaker 2: Someone else has been doing it. You're a benevolent employer,

706
00:32:28,280 --> 00:32:30,600
Speaker 2: they're the ones doing it for you. And so basically

707
00:32:30,640 --> 00:32:32,320
Speaker 2: I think it's I think it's better than what most

708
00:32:32,360 --> 00:32:35,320
Speaker 2: folks have because many don't have access to a profit

709
00:32:35,320 --> 00:32:37,440
Speaker 2: sharing plan at all. And on top of that, if

710
00:32:37,440 --> 00:32:40,320
Speaker 2: you've been a diligent investor, if you've been investing those

711
00:32:40,360 --> 00:32:43,600
Speaker 2: dollars inside of that account, you've likely accumulated even more

712
00:32:44,040 --> 00:32:47,440
Speaker 2: than the typical person your age. One note is that

713
00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:50,600
Speaker 2: depending on so you and you mentioned this in your

714
00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:52,960
Speaker 2: question too, but you are not able to contribute to this.

715
00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:57,560
Speaker 2: This is an employer provided plan only, which means that

716
00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:01,120
Speaker 2: the investing period could vary greatly, like you can't like

717
00:33:01,160 --> 00:33:03,360
Speaker 2: with a four w K. It's's been there a long time,

718
00:33:03,400 --> 00:33:05,320
Speaker 2: so Mike exactly like he's been there for a long time.

719
00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:08,960
Speaker 1: So unless this is a highly abnormal plan, I'm guessing

720
00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:12,120
Speaker 1: Carl that Sorry, Carl, it's a sixty years if you vested,

721
00:33:12,120 --> 00:33:13,120
Speaker 1: but do double check that.

722
00:33:13,080 --> 00:33:14,680
Speaker 2: You never know. I don't know what kind of company

723
00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:15,920
Speaker 2: or industry you're in.

724
00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:19,040
Speaker 1: So that would be the biggest rug pull it would

725
00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:21,000
Speaker 1: in the history of profit sharing plans.

726
00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:23,120
Speaker 2: But that's one of the differences between like say a

727
00:33:23,120 --> 00:33:26,480
Speaker 2: four and K versus a profit sharing plan. Is with

728
00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:28,800
Speaker 2: a four and K, you're making your own contributions, and

729
00:33:28,840 --> 00:33:31,520
Speaker 2: so those are literally your own dollars that you've contributed whereat,

730
00:33:31,600 --> 00:33:33,880
Speaker 2: but the matching dollars have are subject to that investing

731
00:33:33,880 --> 00:33:36,520
Speaker 2: period too, exactly. Yeah, and so in this case, all

732
00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:38,440
Speaker 2: of the money that's in there has been put there

733
00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:41,440
Speaker 2: by the employer. So more the money more the percentage

734
00:33:41,440 --> 00:33:42,920
Speaker 2: of the money that's in there is subject to the

735
00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:44,479
Speaker 2: rules that you've got to play back.

736
00:33:44,520 --> 00:33:45,920
Speaker 1: I don't know if I've ever heard of a vesting

737
00:33:45,920 --> 00:33:48,560
Speaker 1: period longer than five years. Yeah, Typically it's like three

738
00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:51,080
Speaker 1: to five. Yeah, well, sometimes it's even one year at

739
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:55,080
Speaker 1: eighteen months, which I think is which I appreciate. But like, yeah,

740
00:33:55,120 --> 00:33:57,480
Speaker 1: if it's longer than five do let us know that

741
00:33:57,560 --> 00:34:00,280
Speaker 1: sounds be extreme, that'd be terrible for sure. All Right,

742
00:34:00,320 --> 00:34:02,960
Speaker 1: So what should you do with this money? Well, hopefully

743
00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:05,400
Speaker 1: you don't need access to those funds yet, right. Taking

744
00:34:05,440 --> 00:34:08,480
Speaker 1: the money out would trigger tax consequences because these accounts

745
00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:11,000
Speaker 1: are treated similarly to four one ks and iras. So

746
00:34:11,200 --> 00:34:12,919
Speaker 1: if you're not fifty nine and a half, which Carl

747
00:34:12,920 --> 00:34:16,000
Speaker 1: you son quite young, don't I don't. You don't want

748
00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:18,960
Speaker 1: to tap that fund and start taking money out, so

749
00:34:19,280 --> 00:34:21,279
Speaker 1: it's just best to let that money continue to grow

750
00:34:21,320 --> 00:34:23,640
Speaker 1: for your future. The absolute best thing to do in

751
00:34:23,680 --> 00:34:26,319
Speaker 1: all likelihood is to roll this money over to an

752
00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:30,160
Speaker 1: IRA after you leave employment. So you're going to want

753
00:34:30,200 --> 00:34:32,200
Speaker 1: to do a direct rollover so you don't trigger any

754
00:34:32,200 --> 00:34:34,720
Speaker 1: tax consequences by not doing this in a timely manner.

755
00:34:35,080 --> 00:34:38,640
Speaker 1: And Matt, we talk about this one company, Capitalized, who

756
00:34:38,640 --> 00:34:40,239
Speaker 1: will help you roll over a four to one K

757
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:42,160
Speaker 1: to an IRA, but they'll also help you roll over

758
00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:45,399
Speaker 1: a profit sharing plan to an IRA. So if you're

759
00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:47,480
Speaker 1: like I just don't want to fill out all the

760
00:34:47,480 --> 00:34:49,600
Speaker 1: paperwork and you still have to do a little bit,

761
00:34:49,600 --> 00:34:52,160
Speaker 1: but Capitalize makes it super easy and they do it

762
00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:54,560
Speaker 1: for free. They don't charge you a dime. They get

763
00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:56,799
Speaker 1: paid by the company you're rolling it over to, by

764
00:34:56,840 --> 00:34:59,360
Speaker 1: the brokerage, but they're not even trying to steer you

765
00:34:59,400 --> 00:35:00,960
Speaker 1: towards a partic the broker Did you say, listen, I'm

766
00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:03,560
Speaker 1: moving into Fidelity, I'm moving into Vanguard, I'm moving into Schwab.

767
00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:04,759
Speaker 1: They'll say, cool, let's do it.

768
00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:05,160
Speaker 2: We'll help you.

769
00:35:05,600 --> 00:35:08,360
Speaker 1: And that's what I did for one of Emily's accounts

770
00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:10,920
Speaker 1: with an old employer back in the day. That made

771
00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:14,360
Speaker 1: it super simple. So do it yourself. It's not terribly difficult,

772
00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:17,360
Speaker 1: but let Capitalize help you if you want. But we

773
00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:20,839
Speaker 1: get that money into I would say, your own proprietary IRA,

774
00:35:21,000 --> 00:35:22,840
Speaker 1: so you have more direct control over it.

775
00:35:22,920 --> 00:35:25,880
Speaker 2: That's right, I will say. So the IRS allows you

776
00:35:25,960 --> 00:35:28,120
Speaker 2: to roll money over from a profit sharing plan to

777
00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:31,080
Speaker 2: something like a four to one K or an IRA,

778
00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:34,600
Speaker 2: but that doesn't necessarily mean that your plan administrator allows that.

779
00:35:34,640 --> 00:35:36,640
Speaker 2: And so that's again where the details matters. To just

780
00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:39,600
Speaker 2: make sure that you are checking with either your employer

781
00:35:40,040 --> 00:35:41,960
Speaker 2: or whoever it is that manages that to make sure

782
00:35:41,960 --> 00:35:44,560
Speaker 2: that that is allowed, because he didn't give a ton

783
00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:46,920
Speaker 2: of details, so we actually don't even know. We're assuming

784
00:35:46,960 --> 00:35:49,120
Speaker 2: that he's invested within that account, but it could be

785
00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:51,960
Speaker 2: there as a cash benefit as well, in which case,

786
00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:54,160
Speaker 2: these are all details that you need to dig into, Carl,

787
00:35:54,200 --> 00:35:56,360
Speaker 2: because if that's the case, like there might be and

788
00:35:56,400 --> 00:35:58,839
Speaker 2: they're not allowing you to roll it over, there could

789
00:35:58,880 --> 00:36:01,680
Speaker 2: be that massive tax consequence like Joel was talking about,

790
00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:05,000
Speaker 2: how you want to avoid, but it might be unavoidable.

791
00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:07,040
Speaker 2: And if that were to be the case, then obviously

792
00:36:07,120 --> 00:36:09,480
Speaker 2: you would want to make sure well, first of all,

793
00:36:09,480 --> 00:36:11,280
Speaker 2: I guess that you would have the money set aside

794
00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:14,080
Speaker 2: from that that you're able to pay that tax burden.

795
00:36:14,640 --> 00:36:16,640
Speaker 2: But I would also one hundred percent be reaching out

796
00:36:16,640 --> 00:36:19,799
Speaker 2: to a tax professional to find some unique creative way

797
00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:23,200
Speaker 2: to ensure that you can try to avoid avoid paying that. Yeah,

798
00:36:23,280 --> 00:36:26,000
Speaker 2: because I mean, if we're talking twenty five percent on

799
00:36:26,120 --> 00:36:28,120
Speaker 2: over on six figures here, that's a lot of money

800
00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:31,920
Speaker 2: that I would definitely be paying a flat fee to

801
00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:34,680
Speaker 2: a fiduciary advisor to provide me with some assistant.

802
00:36:34,680 --> 00:36:36,560
Speaker 1: And the best place to play flat fee to a

803
00:36:36,560 --> 00:36:39,439
Speaker 1: fiduciary advisor is hellonectarine dot com. So if you need

804
00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:41,080
Speaker 1: if you need that, that's a great website to find

805
00:36:41,120 --> 00:36:43,480
Speaker 1: somebody one hundred fifty bucks an hour. Easy to understand.

806
00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:46,320
Speaker 1: Our friend Jeremy over a Personal Finance Club started that website.

807
00:36:46,320 --> 00:36:47,160
Speaker 1: It's helped a lot of people.

808
00:36:47,239 --> 00:36:50,000
Speaker 2: I think Personal Finance Club is where I heard that ampte.

809
00:36:50,239 --> 00:36:53,680
Speaker 2: Oh really like story that's so random. It like is

810
00:36:53,719 --> 00:36:57,359
Speaker 2: on Instagram. Okay, it wasn't like something that they wrote

811
00:36:57,400 --> 00:36:59,880
Speaker 2: a story on, but yeah, they do the social media stuff.

812
00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:00,359
Speaker 2: That's true.

813
00:37:00,400 --> 00:37:02,759
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, We've got more to get to on

814
00:37:02,760 --> 00:37:06,760
Speaker 1: this episode, including a question about how our country's national

815
00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:09,200
Speaker 1: debt should impact how we think about investing.

816
00:37:09,200 --> 00:37:19,360
Speaker 2: We'll get to that and more right after this, Hi Buddy,

817
00:37:19,400 --> 00:37:21,520
Speaker 2: to be back. We got more listener questions to get to,

818
00:37:21,800 --> 00:37:25,440
Speaker 2: specifically in the form of the Facebook Question of the

819
00:37:25,440 --> 00:37:28,600
Speaker 2: Week and your favorite listener. We can call it the

820
00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:31,239
Speaker 2: meta money question Anonymous. I was waiting for you to

821
00:37:31,239 --> 00:37:34,759
Speaker 2: make another anonymous joke, but they asked, has had the

822
00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:37,480
Speaker 2: Money ever done an episode on the national debt? Not

823
00:37:37,560 --> 00:37:40,279
Speaker 2: from a political perspective, which I know they avoid and

824
00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:42,400
Speaker 2: I went to as well. But if they advocate for

825
00:37:42,480 --> 00:37:46,840
Speaker 2: nearly on smp slash broad market index funds, what is

826
00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:49,960
Speaker 2: the exposure to a debt driven crash? Are there any

827
00:37:50,000 --> 00:37:55,000
Speaker 2: effective hedging strategies? I'm skeptical of crypto or precious metals,

828
00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:59,279
Speaker 2: but what's the right approach? What's the thing? Joel? Time

829
00:37:59,320 --> 00:37:59,960
Speaker 2: to get political?

830
00:38:00,560 --> 00:38:02,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, No, we're gonna try to avoid the politics here,

831
00:38:02,320 --> 00:38:07,880
Speaker 1: because Joel's all RFK, not true, not true, that's the

832
00:38:07,920 --> 00:38:09,920
Speaker 1: third party. I'm all, is there like a d none

833
00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:13,240
Speaker 1: of the above kind of avoid the either aisle?

834
00:38:13,360 --> 00:38:13,560
Speaker 2: Yeah?

835
00:38:13,600 --> 00:38:17,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, well this is so we're talking to, and we

836
00:38:17,120 --> 00:38:19,399
Speaker 1: have avoided I think the topic in large large part

837
00:38:19,440 --> 00:38:22,440
Speaker 1: because it has a lot of political intonations. But this

838
00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:24,160
Speaker 1: is the perfect way to broach it, I think, and

839
00:38:24,160 --> 00:38:26,360
Speaker 1: it's something that should be on our collective radar and

840
00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:28,000
Speaker 1: in so many ways, Matt. Part of the reason I think,

841
00:38:28,040 --> 00:38:29,760
Speaker 1: actually we can talk about this in a non partisan

842
00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:32,800
Speaker 1: way is because this is a bipartisan screw up. We'll

843
00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:35,080
Speaker 1: post a link to a great interview with an expert

844
00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:38,680
Speaker 1: on national debt. It was done on the recent interview podcast.

845
00:38:39,000 --> 00:38:41,719
Speaker 1: It's a It is a political podcast, which is very political,

846
00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:44,080
Speaker 1: but it's a libertarian podcast, so it's awesome, and the

847
00:38:44,120 --> 00:38:48,160
Speaker 1: libertarians kind of hate everybody in the political space, and

848
00:38:48,239 --> 00:38:51,040
Speaker 1: so yeah, they basically think both parties suck, and so

849
00:38:51,120 --> 00:38:52,919
Speaker 1: that's kind of the approach that they take everything from.

850
00:38:53,560 --> 00:38:55,600
Speaker 1: And the truth is both parties are really bad at

851
00:38:55,640 --> 00:38:57,400
Speaker 1: spending and even the people who kind of make a

852
00:38:57,400 --> 00:38:59,719
Speaker 1: big fuss about not wanting to spend more money or

853
00:39:00,360 --> 00:39:02,640
Speaker 1: politicians who talk about the national debt, which almost nobody

854
00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:03,160
Speaker 1: does anymore.

855
00:39:03,200 --> 00:39:04,359
Speaker 2: I know. That's that's what I was going to say,

856
00:39:04,360 --> 00:39:08,040
Speaker 2: Like who was actually making that argument anymore? Like that, Yeah,

857
00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:10,520
Speaker 2: like we're the tea parties. That's so fifteen years.

858
00:39:10,400 --> 00:39:13,600
Speaker 1: Ago, nobody cares anymore, which is a crying shame. But

859
00:39:13,800 --> 00:39:15,880
Speaker 1: this interview with Brian Reedle, who is the guest, it

860
00:39:15,920 --> 00:39:18,440
Speaker 1: does a great job talking about how how both parties

861
00:39:18,480 --> 00:39:20,440
Speaker 1: have grown the deficit and the debt and how that's

862
00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:22,759
Speaker 1: becoming more of a problem for our financial future. There

863
00:39:22,800 --> 00:39:24,839
Speaker 1: was a also a great article from the Wharton School

864
00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:27,120
Speaker 1: of Business we'll link to in the show notes about

865
00:39:27,239 --> 00:39:30,480
Speaker 1: kind of the taking time momb and not everyone Matt

866
00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:32,359
Speaker 1: feels this way. There are some people who think that

867
00:39:33,239 --> 00:39:36,400
Speaker 1: the US can absorb an unlimited amount of debt as

868
00:39:36,400 --> 00:39:38,160
Speaker 1: a nation, but we're not in a camp. We don't

869
00:39:38,200 --> 00:39:40,319
Speaker 1: necessarily think that a country needs to handle finances like

870
00:39:40,320 --> 00:39:42,280
Speaker 1: a household. But still there.

871
00:39:42,120 --> 00:39:44,200
Speaker 2: Are problems kind of with how we've been handling money

872
00:39:44,239 --> 00:39:47,000
Speaker 2: as a country. Do I think we've become completely completely

873
00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:51,120
Speaker 2: detached from reality here in our country. And I don't

874
00:39:51,120 --> 00:39:53,320
Speaker 2: know what the solution is because I'm all for low taxes,

875
00:39:53,320 --> 00:39:56,720
Speaker 2: but that also has to coincide with some wise spending choices.

876
00:39:57,080 --> 00:39:59,720
Speaker 2: And I would say that neither of us are policy experts.

877
00:39:59,760 --> 00:40:03,200
Speaker 2: Were not smart enough to name the specific agencies or

878
00:40:03,239 --> 00:40:06,120
Speaker 2: specific line items that should be cut, but a lack

879
00:40:06,200 --> 00:40:08,800
Speaker 2: of social Security funding for example, like this is clearly

880
00:40:08,840 --> 00:40:12,200
Speaker 2: an issue, and our elected officials they've just chosen to

881
00:40:12,280 --> 00:40:14,200
Speaker 2: sit on their hands. This is a can that they

882
00:40:14,239 --> 00:40:16,640
Speaker 2: continue to kick down the road and not address until

883
00:40:16,920 --> 00:40:19,319
Speaker 2: I think the problem is going to be imminent and

884
00:40:19,360 --> 00:40:22,200
Speaker 2: hanging over our heads. And what it seems like truly

885
00:40:22,560 --> 00:40:24,440
Speaker 2: like like you were saying that, folks used to care

886
00:40:24,480 --> 00:40:27,040
Speaker 2: about the deficit and spending and the national in debt,

887
00:40:27,080 --> 00:40:29,200
Speaker 2: but nowadays it seems like the party that's in power,

888
00:40:29,239 --> 00:40:32,759
Speaker 2: they're basically they're just looking to spend money in all

889
00:40:32,800 --> 00:40:35,800
Speaker 2: the different ways that supports their policy and their beliefs.

890
00:40:35,800 --> 00:40:36,759
Speaker 2: They start money.

891
00:40:36,560 --> 00:40:39,120
Speaker 1: Instantly salivating because they're at the they're at the helmet,

892
00:40:39,160 --> 00:40:39,640
Speaker 1: the purse strings.

893
00:40:39,719 --> 00:40:42,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, it just it seems like it's it's veering from one.

894
00:40:43,080 --> 00:40:45,480
Speaker 2: It's just like it makes me think of like when

895
00:40:45,480 --> 00:40:48,759
Speaker 2: a trailer on a car is improperly weighted and it

896
00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:51,880
Speaker 2: starts like not a speed wabb but you know what

897
00:40:51,880 --> 00:40:54,920
Speaker 2: I'm saying, Like, and if you continue to cruise down

898
00:40:54,960 --> 00:40:57,920
Speaker 2: the highway, it just continues to get more and more

899
00:40:57,920 --> 00:40:59,960
Speaker 2: extreme and it goes from one side to the other

900
00:41:00,000 --> 00:41:01,960
Speaker 2: before it just completely RECs and I think that that's

901
00:41:02,000 --> 00:41:05,000
Speaker 2: what this listener or this poster is essentially referring to,

902
00:41:05,000 --> 00:41:06,880
Speaker 2: because that's sort of what it feels like. But I

903
00:41:06,920 --> 00:41:10,239
Speaker 2: do think it's going to take some combination of austerity

904
00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:14,680
Speaker 2: plus raising taxes in a palatable way, right, like, in

905
00:41:14,760 --> 00:41:17,640
Speaker 2: a way that folks can kind of get behind, in

906
00:41:17,760 --> 00:41:20,560
Speaker 2: order to start to shrink the nasty deficit and debt

907
00:41:20,680 --> 00:41:21,920
Speaker 2: of the United States over time.

908
00:41:22,000 --> 00:41:25,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, So I think it's a problem, right, And

909
00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:29,600
Speaker 1: I think anybody who's kind of paying attention can see that,

910
00:41:29,719 --> 00:41:33,560
Speaker 1: because you even look at the graph from where it

911
00:41:33,640 --> 00:41:35,440
Speaker 1: was even where our national debts in the eighties and

912
00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:37,880
Speaker 1: nineties and kind of where it stands where it is today,

913
00:41:38,200 --> 00:41:40,760
Speaker 1: it's shocking to see kind of not just the increase,

914
00:41:40,760 --> 00:41:42,880
Speaker 1: but the rate of increase and how it just continues

915
00:41:42,920 --> 00:41:45,560
Speaker 1: to accelerate in recent years. Part of that was kind

916
00:41:45,600 --> 00:41:47,759
Speaker 1: of the exorbitant COVID spending too, right, that was one

917
00:41:47,800 --> 00:41:50,799
Speaker 1: of the things that really juiced the debt and the

918
00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:52,640
Speaker 1: deficit in a couple of those years, and then the

919
00:41:52,640 --> 00:41:55,440
Speaker 1: overall level of debt, and so then how should that

920
00:41:55,520 --> 00:41:57,520
Speaker 1: impact how we invest? That is kind of the heart

921
00:41:57,520 --> 00:41:59,400
Speaker 1: of this question, and so in regards to the one

922
00:41:59,440 --> 00:42:02,120
Speaker 1: hundred percent s and P or total stock market fund

923
00:42:02,160 --> 00:42:05,399
Speaker 1: recommendations we typically give, we'd say this that a lot

924
00:42:05,440 --> 00:42:08,440
Speaker 1: of those companies in those funds have a lot of

925
00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:13,080
Speaker 1: international exposure, and the alternative is that you can go

926
00:42:13,160 --> 00:42:16,759
Speaker 1: out there and invest in ways that offer you even

927
00:42:16,840 --> 00:42:20,239
Speaker 1: more international exposure. I think this is really to each

928
00:42:20,320 --> 00:42:24,160
Speaker 1: their own sort of scenario. As the US goes, though,

929
00:42:24,280 --> 00:42:26,680
Speaker 1: I think so goes the world, we could very well.

930
00:42:26,719 --> 00:42:29,560
Speaker 1: I think we could see international outperforming the US in

931
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:32,640
Speaker 1: the coming decade because of kind of overinflated asset prices

932
00:42:32,640 --> 00:42:34,640
Speaker 1: in our home country. But I'd also say that if

933
00:42:34,680 --> 00:42:39,520
Speaker 1: the US market experiences a crash or a prolonged time

934
00:42:39,560 --> 00:42:42,359
Speaker 1: of difficulty, markets around the world are going to feel

935
00:42:42,400 --> 00:42:44,880
Speaker 1: those tremors too, and it's not like they're going to

936
00:42:44,920 --> 00:42:48,120
Speaker 1: be thriving while we're taking on the chin. So I

937
00:42:48,120 --> 00:42:50,759
Speaker 1: think there are hedging strategies. Having cash is one of

938
00:42:50,760 --> 00:42:51,240
Speaker 1: those things.

939
00:42:51,880 --> 00:42:52,680
Speaker 2: Cash is not.

940
00:42:53,080 --> 00:42:56,440
Speaker 1: Trash, like a lot of people say. It feels like

941
00:42:56,480 --> 00:42:58,680
Speaker 1: trash until it isn't until you need it right And

942
00:42:58,719 --> 00:43:01,000
Speaker 1: then for end of the show, Matt he would say

943
00:43:01,040 --> 00:43:04,520
Speaker 1: that bitcoin is another way to kind of buoy yourself

944
00:43:04,600 --> 00:43:08,719
Speaker 1: against government and overwrought spending. Sure, and so it's hard

945
00:43:08,719 --> 00:43:10,600
Speaker 1: to know whether that's true or not. I think that

946
00:43:10,600 --> 00:43:13,400
Speaker 1: conversation is very was very enlightening for us and hopefully

947
00:43:13,400 --> 00:43:15,719
Speaker 1: for our listeners too. But you could make a good

948
00:43:15,760 --> 00:43:18,040
Speaker 1: case that if we don't make some fiscal policy changes

949
00:43:18,280 --> 00:43:20,680
Speaker 1: that bitcoin becomes an even more attractive holding.

950
00:43:20,800 --> 00:43:22,960
Speaker 2: That's true, yeah, But at the same time, I think

951
00:43:23,000 --> 00:43:25,440
Speaker 2: there are there are going to be like a massive

952
00:43:25,480 --> 00:43:28,320
Speaker 2: subset of folks who will never invest in something like bitcoin,

953
00:43:28,400 --> 00:43:31,120
Speaker 2: Like they want to invest in the hard real companies

954
00:43:31,120 --> 00:43:34,680
Speaker 2: out there that are producing products and services, and where

955
00:43:34,680 --> 00:43:36,600
Speaker 2: are a lot of those companies based, Like there is

956
00:43:36,600 --> 00:43:39,080
Speaker 2: no other country in the in the entire world that

957
00:43:39,800 --> 00:43:43,360
Speaker 2: has as conducive of environment for business formation, like we

958
00:43:43,400 --> 00:43:46,960
Speaker 2: were just talking about business growth and innovation, like these

959
00:43:46,960 --> 00:43:49,000
Speaker 2: are all things that we find here in the United States.

960
00:43:49,320 --> 00:43:51,879
Speaker 2: And when the cut, when our country experiences higher levels

961
00:43:51,920 --> 00:43:54,680
Speaker 2: of debt, I could see And again we're not like

962
00:43:54,800 --> 00:43:58,400
Speaker 2: massive macro econ wonks here. And so that's my preface.

963
00:43:59,239 --> 00:44:01,480
Speaker 2: But what I like it makes me think of the

964
00:44:01,520 --> 00:44:05,560
Speaker 2: impact that high federal national debt can have on currency.

965
00:44:05,560 --> 00:44:08,279
Speaker 2: For instance, when it comes to currency trading versus what

966
00:44:08,320 --> 00:44:11,359
Speaker 2: businesses are doing and the ability that individual companies have

967
00:44:11,400 --> 00:44:13,520
Speaker 2: to be able to create products that folks will invest in.

968
00:44:13,560 --> 00:44:15,839
Speaker 2: And guess what the stock market is composed of a

969
00:44:15,840 --> 00:44:19,000
Speaker 2: bunch of those businesses all together. And so I think

970
00:44:19,040 --> 00:44:22,680
Speaker 2: what you said is so incredibly true about the world

971
00:44:22,719 --> 00:44:26,279
Speaker 2: is so interconnected. It's hard to imagine that anything that

972
00:44:26,360 --> 00:44:29,320
Speaker 2: we as a country would experience would have so negative

973
00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:32,120
Speaker 2: of an impact that it would make it unattractive to

974
00:44:32,200 --> 00:44:34,719
Speaker 2: invest here in the United States as opposed to going

975
00:44:34,719 --> 00:44:36,560
Speaker 2: abroad instead, Like if that were to be the case,

976
00:44:36,560 --> 00:44:38,520
Speaker 2: and I think we've got bigger problems on hand, because

977
00:44:38,520 --> 00:44:41,680
Speaker 2: that would likely mean, oh, maybe we should also be

978
00:44:41,760 --> 00:44:44,480
Speaker 2: moving to other countries as well, because if you're not

979
00:44:44,520 --> 00:44:47,000
Speaker 2: willing to invest your dollars in the United States, are

980
00:44:47,000 --> 00:44:49,279
Speaker 2: you even willing to live here? And that's when the

981
00:44:49,320 --> 00:44:50,839
Speaker 2: preppers come out of the wood work and you start

982
00:44:50,840 --> 00:44:53,759
Speaker 2: thinking like the doom and gloom and start building a

983
00:44:53,800 --> 00:44:55,560
Speaker 2: fortress on in Hawaii. Right.

984
00:44:55,760 --> 00:44:55,920
Speaker 5: Oh.

985
00:44:55,960 --> 00:45:00,160
Speaker 1: I think even the general incompetency of kind of our

986
00:45:00,840 --> 00:45:03,240
Speaker 1: Congress and stuff like that like that, just their inability

987
00:45:03,239 --> 00:45:06,720
Speaker 1: to get anything done, it's actually good news because oftentimes

988
00:45:06,719 --> 00:45:08,520
Speaker 1: when they when they get together like they can't screw

989
00:45:08,520 --> 00:45:10,000
Speaker 1: it up that month, they end up spending a lot

990
00:45:10,000 --> 00:45:13,359
Speaker 1: of money, and I think money that's spent, given where

991
00:45:13,360 --> 00:45:15,640
Speaker 1: we stand on it from a national debt perspective, it's

992
00:45:15,680 --> 00:45:18,120
Speaker 1: actually going to inhibit future US economic growth.

993
00:45:18,200 --> 00:45:20,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, ultimately, I agree. It's just it's what's

994
00:45:20,760 --> 00:45:23,280
Speaker 2: sad is that we are getting used to that as individuals,

995
00:45:23,280 --> 00:45:24,799
Speaker 2: and I think other countries are getting used to that

996
00:45:24,840 --> 00:45:27,279
Speaker 2: as well, and perhaps they're getting more comfortable with their

997
00:45:27,320 --> 00:45:30,040
Speaker 2: debt levels. But I don't think at this point it's

998
00:45:30,120 --> 00:45:32,600
Speaker 2: it changes how I am investing. I guess this is

999
00:45:32,600 --> 00:45:34,160
Speaker 2: what I'm saying. I'm still one hundred Other than my

1000
00:45:34,200 --> 00:45:38,800
Speaker 2: five percent invested in crypto, I'm still one percent. Maybe

1001
00:45:38,840 --> 00:45:39,799
Speaker 2: the SMP all the way.

1002
00:45:39,840 --> 00:45:42,240
Speaker 1: No, I mean, I listened to that recent interview podcast

1003
00:45:42,400 --> 00:45:44,200
Speaker 1: and I got to listen to that one for about

1004
00:45:44,200 --> 00:45:46,799
Speaker 1: forty five minutes while listening to it, But then I

1005
00:45:46,840 --> 00:45:47,960
Speaker 1: was like, what's.

1006
00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:50,479
Speaker 2: The better alternative? What are the alternatives? And there wasn't

1007
00:45:50,480 --> 00:45:52,200
Speaker 2: a better alternative that I could think of, And so

1008
00:45:52,280 --> 00:45:54,520
Speaker 2: I'm still the best case scenario. Right, It's not the

1009
00:45:54,560 --> 00:45:56,360
Speaker 2: best case scenario, it's still the best case. It's the

1010
00:45:56,400 --> 00:45:58,799
Speaker 2: best option that we have available to us. But all right,

1011
00:45:58,880 --> 00:46:01,279
Speaker 2: let's get to that pest option could be better as

1012
00:46:01,280 --> 00:46:03,880
Speaker 2: what we're saying. Yeah, yes, I totally agree. All right,

1013
00:46:03,920 --> 00:46:06,800
Speaker 2: let's take one more. This is an email from listener John.

1014
00:46:07,160 --> 00:46:09,920
Speaker 2: He said, good afternoon. My craft beer equivalent is professional

1015
00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:14,320
Speaker 2: sporting events. My family and I go to several professional football, basketball,

1016
00:46:14,360 --> 00:46:18,200
Speaker 2: and baseball games every year. No UFC, hojob, no, no UFC.

1017
00:46:18,760 --> 00:46:20,360
Speaker 2: I want to pay off my house though, because I

1018
00:46:20,360 --> 00:46:23,200
Speaker 2: hate debt. I was raised that all debt is a

1019
00:46:23,200 --> 00:46:25,319
Speaker 2: bad thing. I know you can use it to your

1020
00:46:25,360 --> 00:46:28,600
Speaker 2: advantage if you use it wisely, but the psychological aspect

1021
00:46:28,719 --> 00:46:31,000
Speaker 2: dwells on me. I currently owe one hundred and twenty

1022
00:46:31,000 --> 00:46:33,320
Speaker 2: five thousand on my home at two and a half percent,

1023
00:46:33,920 --> 00:46:35,960
Speaker 2: and I have ten years left. I've been paying the

1024
00:46:36,000 --> 00:46:38,640
Speaker 2: minimum each month, but I might want to pay it off.

1025
00:46:38,840 --> 00:46:41,040
Speaker 2: Whenever I ask a CPA or anyone else, I just

1026
00:46:41,120 --> 00:46:44,160
Speaker 2: get called dumb. I currently have a two hundred and

1027
00:46:44,160 --> 00:46:47,000
Speaker 2: twenty five thousand in a brokerage account invested in an

1028
00:46:47,080 --> 00:46:49,480
Speaker 2: SMP of five hundred ETF and with the market being

1029
00:46:49,480 --> 00:46:52,080
Speaker 2: at an all time high, why not cash out one

1030
00:46:52,120 --> 00:46:54,120
Speaker 2: hundred and twenty five thousand and pay off my house.

1031
00:46:54,560 --> 00:46:56,319
Speaker 2: My wife and I have no credit card debt. We

1032
00:46:56,360 --> 00:46:58,680
Speaker 2: max out our four one ks and roth IRA's. We

1033
00:46:58,840 --> 00:47:01,440
Speaker 2: put seven fifty a month into a brokerage account, put

1034
00:47:01,440 --> 00:47:03,440
Speaker 2: four thousand a year into each of our kids five

1035
00:47:03,520 --> 00:47:06,319
Speaker 2: twenty nines, no other debt, and we have a year

1036
00:47:06,360 --> 00:47:09,320
Speaker 2: of rainy day funds set aside. What other reasons should

1037
00:47:09,320 --> 00:47:12,360
Speaker 2: I or shouldn't I pay off my house? Tax reasons?

1038
00:47:13,040 --> 00:47:13,799
Speaker 2: What's you think, Joel?

1039
00:47:14,000 --> 00:47:17,240
Speaker 1: Well, there's a lot here, right, And first, I'm glad

1040
00:47:17,280 --> 00:47:20,799
Speaker 1: to note that John's craft bear equivalent, right, that he's

1041
00:47:20,880 --> 00:47:23,080
Speaker 1: figured it out, and that he's spending money accordingly. And

1042
00:47:23,280 --> 00:47:25,080
Speaker 1: I hope ski jumping makes it into the mix because

1043
00:47:25,080 --> 00:47:27,279
Speaker 1: that's a great sport too. That's what my Norwegians are

1044
00:47:27,320 --> 00:47:29,080
Speaker 1: good at. He likes all the sports, that's right, So

1045
00:47:29,320 --> 00:47:31,040
Speaker 1: enjoy those games. And we're not gonna call you dumb

1046
00:47:31,040 --> 00:47:34,480
Speaker 1: because there's no help and that that's just rude. But

1047
00:47:34,880 --> 00:47:37,400
Speaker 1: paying off a mortgage just for peace of mind is

1048
00:47:37,440 --> 00:47:39,520
Speaker 1: a reasonable thing to do, sure, and you have earned

1049
00:47:39,560 --> 00:47:42,080
Speaker 1: that right, like you are taking care of your finances

1050
00:47:42,400 --> 00:47:45,240
Speaker 1: incredibly well, as evidence by the maxing of all those accounts,

1051
00:47:45,400 --> 00:47:48,120
Speaker 1: tossing a lot of money into the taxable brokerage, even

1052
00:47:48,280 --> 00:47:52,720
Speaker 1: funding your kid's educational future. You're doing all the right things,

1053
00:47:53,120 --> 00:47:55,600
Speaker 1: So I guess when it boils down to it, it

1054
00:47:55,640 --> 00:47:58,359
Speaker 1: doesn't matter if it's the most optimized route. You get

1055
00:47:58,400 --> 00:47:59,840
Speaker 1: to do what you want to because you've done all

1056
00:47:59,880 --> 00:48:01,960
Speaker 1: the right thing so far. So if this is what

1057
00:48:02,000 --> 00:48:04,160
Speaker 1: you want on, I'm gonna say I'm gonna sign off

1058
00:48:04,200 --> 00:48:04,759
Speaker 1: and say go for it.

1059
00:48:04,840 --> 00:48:07,360
Speaker 2: Absolutely, it's not what I would do. I would be

1060
00:48:07,400 --> 00:48:10,200
Speaker 2: hanging on to that two and a half percent rate

1061
00:48:10,239 --> 00:48:12,600
Speaker 2: as long as I would. I two would hang on.

1062
00:48:12,680 --> 00:48:14,279
Speaker 2: I would be reaching out to the bank and be like, hey,

1063
00:48:14,280 --> 00:48:17,440
Speaker 2: can I extend this for like another twenty years? Is

1064
00:48:17,480 --> 00:48:19,920
Speaker 2: that possible? But it's not just the two and a

1065
00:48:19,920 --> 00:48:22,920
Speaker 2: half percent rate that I wouldn't pay it off. It's

1066
00:48:22,960 --> 00:48:24,840
Speaker 2: certainly a big part of it. But the other reasons

1067
00:48:24,880 --> 00:48:27,919
Speaker 2: are the potential tax consequences. And what we're talking about

1068
00:48:27,920 --> 00:48:30,239
Speaker 2: here is missing out on being able to deduct some

1069
00:48:30,280 --> 00:48:33,000
Speaker 2: of that home interest on your taxes. It sounds like

1070
00:48:33,040 --> 00:48:34,759
Speaker 2: you're not totally sure if that's something that you've been doing.

1071
00:48:34,840 --> 00:48:38,719
Speaker 2: Look back at your previous year tax returns and do

1072
00:48:38,760 --> 00:48:41,879
Speaker 2: you actually itemize because if so well, that's another reason

1073
00:48:41,920 --> 00:48:44,480
Speaker 2: to keep this debt around. I wouldn't let that one

1074
00:48:44,560 --> 00:48:48,640
Speaker 2: factor alone determine things, but it should be taken into consideration.

1075
00:48:49,280 --> 00:48:52,520
Speaker 2: Given again, your crazy low interest rate, I'd be looking

1076
00:48:52,560 --> 00:48:56,480
Speaker 2: for reasons to bolster the argument to keep that around.

1077
00:48:56,560 --> 00:48:58,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I think you're right, Like, definitely look into that.

1078
00:48:59,000 --> 00:49:00,840
Speaker 1: There is another tax once that you need to be

1079
00:49:00,880 --> 00:49:03,600
Speaker 1: aware of though, that's selling appreciated security. So you mentioned, yeah,

1080
00:49:03,640 --> 00:49:06,200
Speaker 1: markets are up. What if I sell some of that

1081
00:49:06,760 --> 00:49:09,359
Speaker 1: in order to pay off the mortgage debt early. Well,

1082
00:49:09,360 --> 00:49:11,040
Speaker 1: it's not the worst thing in the world because you're

1083
00:49:11,040 --> 00:49:13,839
Speaker 1: going to pay the favorable long term capital gains tax

1084
00:49:13,920 --> 00:49:16,160
Speaker 1: rate of fifteen percent. But it's still tax that needs

1085
00:49:16,200 --> 00:49:18,520
Speaker 1: to be paid. And since we're talking about a really

1086
00:49:18,560 --> 00:49:21,000
Speaker 1: low priority debt, we'd hate to see you incrd that

1087
00:49:21,080 --> 00:49:23,640
Speaker 1: like twenty thousand dollars ish tax bill if you don't

1088
00:49:23,680 --> 00:49:27,160
Speaker 1: need to. So maybe the best way to proceed maybe

1089
00:49:27,160 --> 00:49:29,080
Speaker 1: taking a happy medium approachs That's the way I'm going

1090
00:49:29,120 --> 00:49:32,080
Speaker 1: to suggest here. Instead of taking money out of the

1091
00:49:32,080 --> 00:49:34,920
Speaker 1: taxbile brokerage account, why not just stop contributing to it

1092
00:49:34,960 --> 00:49:37,120
Speaker 1: for the time being, So funnel that seven hundred and

1093
00:49:37,120 --> 00:49:39,440
Speaker 1: fifty bucks a month towards your mortgage. You'll still be

1094
00:49:39,480 --> 00:49:42,480
Speaker 1: investing significantly, but you'll be kind of taking the wise

1095
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:46,320
Speaker 1: old old Testament King route Solomon route. You're splitting the baby.

1096
00:49:46,520 --> 00:49:48,000
Speaker 1: You're not going to pay it off in one fell swoop,

1097
00:49:48,040 --> 00:49:49,960
Speaker 1: but you also get rid of it so much faster.

1098
00:49:50,080 --> 00:49:52,440
Speaker 1: So this is a personal choice, John, and this is

1099
00:49:52,480 --> 00:49:54,319
Speaker 1: really up to you. But just know this is a

1100
00:49:54,360 --> 00:49:58,000
Speaker 1: tax consequence of making this move. And I do think

1101
00:49:58,040 --> 00:50:02,000
Speaker 1: maybe taking this slower but still a more direct route

1102
00:50:02,040 --> 00:50:04,800
Speaker 1: to pay off is going to be the happy medium

1103
00:50:05,000 --> 00:50:08,000
Speaker 1: that makes sense for a tax optimization and a psychology standpoint.

1104
00:50:08,080 --> 00:50:09,840
Speaker 1: You're not getting rid of the mortgage over night, but

1105
00:50:09,880 --> 00:50:11,160
Speaker 1: you're getting rid of it a heck of.

1106
00:50:11,080 --> 00:50:12,719
Speaker 2: A lot quicker. Yeah. Well, I kind of like that

1107
00:50:12,760 --> 00:50:14,520
Speaker 2: you're not getting rid of it overnight. Like I almost

1108
00:50:14,520 --> 00:50:18,240
Speaker 2: see that as like a safety check, Like within this mechanism,

1109
00:50:18,320 --> 00:50:20,440
Speaker 2: it's almost like a governor that keeps things from completely

1110
00:50:20,480 --> 00:50:24,160
Speaker 2: going off the rail. Because I like you having options, John,

1111
00:50:24,200 --> 00:50:28,040
Speaker 2: And if it was me, I think my biggest risk,

1112
00:50:28,239 --> 00:50:30,960
Speaker 2: or my biggest potential regret, would be paying that thing

1113
00:50:31,000 --> 00:50:34,799
Speaker 2: off and possibly regretting it and thinking, Okay, well that's

1114
00:50:34,880 --> 00:50:37,359
Speaker 2: not something I can undo now, as opposed to what

1115
00:50:37,440 --> 00:50:40,120
Speaker 2: Joel is saying, paying a little bit on it. Do

1116
00:50:40,200 --> 00:50:42,920
Speaker 2: that for a year, but then monitor how you feel

1117
00:50:42,920 --> 00:50:46,080
Speaker 2: about those payments that you're making to your mortgage. And

1118
00:50:46,120 --> 00:50:47,799
Speaker 2: if you feel great about that, and you're like, man,

1119
00:50:48,280 --> 00:50:50,839
Speaker 2: we're totally eliminating this mortgage. We're about to own our

1120
00:50:50,920 --> 00:50:53,960
Speaker 2: home free and clear. It's going to feel so good, awesome,

1121
00:50:54,280 --> 00:50:57,040
Speaker 2: keep it up. But let's say after a year you're like,

1122
00:50:58,080 --> 00:50:59,799
Speaker 2: I don't know, maybe I want to do something else

1123
00:51:00,120 --> 00:51:02,520
Speaker 2: with my money. Okay, Well, then you still have the

1124
00:51:02,640 --> 00:51:04,440
Speaker 2: option to hit pause and guess what, You've got nine

1125
00:51:04,440 --> 00:51:07,400
Speaker 2: more years of paying a two and a half interest

1126
00:51:08,120 --> 00:51:10,680
Speaker 2: mortgage and there's an opportunity cost you give up. Yeah,

1127
00:51:10,800 --> 00:51:12,719
Speaker 2: and instead you could fiddle those dollars either to a

1128
00:51:12,719 --> 00:51:15,879
Speaker 2: different investment opportunity that might come along. Maybe you do

1129
00:51:15,960 --> 00:51:18,920
Speaker 2: want to dabble a little bit in some alternative investments,

1130
00:51:19,320 --> 00:51:22,160
Speaker 2: but more than anything to a pool in your backyard. Yes,

1131
00:51:22,480 --> 00:51:24,440
Speaker 2: I think it's important to just hit pause and to

1132
00:51:24,960 --> 00:51:26,960
Speaker 2: think through some of the different things that might move

1133
00:51:27,000 --> 00:51:29,520
Speaker 2: the needle more than having it paid for house. Like

1134
00:51:29,560 --> 00:51:33,200
Speaker 2: you mentioned the professional sports, I'm trying to think like

1135
00:51:33,280 --> 00:51:35,560
Speaker 2: house can you step it up a notch. I don't

1136
00:51:35,560 --> 00:51:37,560
Speaker 2: come to the World Company Atlanta twenty twenty. Yeah, or

1137
00:51:37,640 --> 00:51:40,600
Speaker 2: I was thinking basketball, Like I don't watch basketball, but

1138
00:51:41,040 --> 00:51:43,560
Speaker 2: have you ever sat court side? Because that seems like

1139
00:51:43,600 --> 00:51:45,800
Speaker 2: the coolest thing ever, Like dot, I'm not into basketball,

1140
00:51:45,840 --> 00:51:47,760
Speaker 2: but the ability, like it seems like such a unique

1141
00:51:47,760 --> 00:51:50,400
Speaker 2: experience to be right there. Yeah, and they're playing what

1142
00:51:51,000 --> 00:51:53,000
Speaker 2: feet from you, like they're falling into you, like drinks

1143
00:51:53,040 --> 00:51:54,440
Speaker 2: are getting spilled. Plus you get to hang out with

1144
00:51:54,440 --> 00:51:58,120
Speaker 2: Spike Ley. It does seems so cool. It's but maybe

1145
00:51:58,160 --> 00:52:01,000
Speaker 2: you're like, no, I've got zero interest than doing that

1146
00:52:01,040 --> 00:52:02,799
Speaker 2: and hanging with Spike Lee. Maybe it just means like

1147
00:52:02,800 --> 00:52:05,720
Speaker 2: a vacation, getting away with your family, creating new memories.

1148
00:52:05,800 --> 00:52:07,880
Speaker 2: I don't know what it is for you, John, but

1149
00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:10,680
Speaker 2: I think the ability for you to funnel your dollars

1150
00:52:10,800 --> 00:52:12,680
Speaker 2: to whatever it is that moves the needle the most

1151
00:52:12,680 --> 00:52:14,960
Speaker 2: for you, And maybe in the end you're not looking

1152
00:52:14,960 --> 00:52:17,960
Speaker 2: for anything fancy at all, and truly for you, it

1153
00:52:17,960 --> 00:52:19,400
Speaker 2: would be the peace of mind that you would gain

1154
00:52:19,440 --> 00:52:22,319
Speaker 2: from owning your home outright. Hey, if that's the case,

1155
00:52:22,360 --> 00:52:24,200
Speaker 2: then go for it, man. Yeah, John's in the world

1156
00:52:24,239 --> 00:52:25,920
Speaker 2: is your oyster territory. Yea, right, exactly.

1157
00:52:26,000 --> 00:52:28,200
Speaker 1: It's such a good problem to have and to make

1158
00:52:28,200 --> 00:52:30,880
Speaker 1: a decision like this. It's again if for you, the

1159
00:52:30,880 --> 00:52:34,759
Speaker 1: psychological implication is that severe and it's going to help

1160
00:52:34,760 --> 00:52:37,040
Speaker 1: you sleep better at night, and boy, this will weight

1161
00:52:37,080 --> 00:52:39,080
Speaker 1: off your chest and so bam, this is definitely the

1162
00:52:39,120 --> 00:52:41,600
Speaker 1: best move for you mentally speaking. Go for it, but

1163
00:52:41,800 --> 00:52:44,879
Speaker 1: also don't forget that they're especially given how great you're

1164
00:52:44,920 --> 00:52:47,239
Speaker 1: doing in all those other areas, where like you don't

1165
00:52:47,239 --> 00:52:49,520
Speaker 1: need to invest anymore if you don't want to, you can.

1166
00:52:49,840 --> 00:52:52,440
Speaker 1: You can do a lot of things with these additional dollars,

1167
00:52:52,760 --> 00:52:54,920
Speaker 1: and this is just one of those options.

1168
00:52:55,000 --> 00:52:56,839
Speaker 2: O yah man. All right, let's get back to our

1169
00:52:56,960 --> 00:53:00,560
Speaker 2: beer again. You and I during this episode joined I

1170
00:53:00,680 --> 00:53:03,719
Speaker 2: choose u Zu donated to the show by Christy. What

1171
00:53:03,719 --> 00:53:04,680
Speaker 2: were your thoughts on this one?

1172
00:53:04,840 --> 00:53:07,120
Speaker 1: All right, buddy, this one was interesting. It was light,

1173
00:53:07,200 --> 00:53:09,799
Speaker 1: it was a little bitter, and it had kind of

1174
00:53:09,840 --> 00:53:13,160
Speaker 1: neutral beer vibes, like not like a pilsner, even where

1175
00:53:13,200 --> 00:53:15,760
Speaker 1: if you that's what I typically associate with a light beer.

1176
00:53:16,080 --> 00:53:18,680
Speaker 1: This is so different because it's made with rice, so

1177
00:53:18,719 --> 00:53:21,560
Speaker 1: it's got a different vibe than kind of the traditional

1178
00:53:21,600 --> 00:53:23,520
Speaker 1: real clean US pilsner vibes, you.

1179
00:53:23,440 --> 00:53:26,080
Speaker 2: Know, yeah, yeah, so like it was just in my

1180
00:53:26,120 --> 00:53:28,000
Speaker 2: mind was bright. I guess the maybe some of the

1181
00:53:28,040 --> 00:53:31,640
Speaker 2: citrus freshness from the yuzuo, but it drank really like

1182
00:53:31,800 --> 00:53:34,759
Speaker 2: clean in my opinion. And by the way, this was

1183
00:53:34,800 --> 00:53:37,480
Speaker 2: brewed by Pure Project, and I mentioned last time that

1184
00:53:37,560 --> 00:53:39,880
Speaker 2: was gonna look up what the deal is with Pure Project.

1185
00:53:39,880 --> 00:53:42,920
Speaker 2: They're not I guess not surprisingly, they're into the environment,

1186
00:53:43,000 --> 00:53:46,840
Speaker 2: so that they donate one percent of all not profits

1187
00:53:46,880 --> 00:53:50,840
Speaker 2: but of all sales to environmental nonprofits. That's something that

1188
00:53:50,880 --> 00:53:52,600
Speaker 2: they that they value. So like we talked about at

1189
00:53:52,640 --> 00:53:55,520
Speaker 2: the beginning of the episode, being intentional with your with

1190
00:53:55,560 --> 00:53:58,920
Speaker 2: your giving, but then also their ingredients. They oftentimes try

1191
00:53:58,920 --> 00:54:01,200
Speaker 2: to brew with seasonal ingredients, which means they're brewing with

1192
00:54:01,280 --> 00:54:04,520
Speaker 2: stuff that's typically more local as opposed to sourcing stuff

1193
00:54:04,520 --> 00:54:07,640
Speaker 2: from all over the world and organic ingredients as well.

1194
00:54:07,719 --> 00:54:10,280
Speaker 2: So nice. All that leads to I think a very wholesome,

1195
00:54:10,400 --> 00:54:12,239
Speaker 2: delicious beer. It was great, you know, I got to

1196
00:54:12,320 --> 00:54:14,279
Speaker 2: enjoy it today. Big props to Kristen, thank you for

1197
00:54:14,320 --> 00:54:17,200
Speaker 2: sending us on our way. We really appreciate it. Christy, Sorry, Christy,

1198
00:54:17,560 --> 00:54:20,440
Speaker 2: she forgives you all right, that's going to do it.

1199
00:54:20,440 --> 00:54:22,520
Speaker 1: For this episode, Love links up in the show notes

1200
00:54:22,760 --> 00:54:25,600
Speaker 1: up at how money dot com, including the link to

1201
00:54:25,920 --> 00:54:28,640
Speaker 1: our daffy campaign, so you can help me crush Matt,

1202
00:54:29,200 --> 00:54:32,080
Speaker 1: win the victory and also support great nonprofits in the process.

1203
00:54:32,200 --> 00:54:33,600
Speaker 2: All Right, Well, that's gonna be it for this one body.

1204
00:54:33,680 --> 00:54:36,719
Speaker 2: Until next time. Best Friends Out, Best Friends Out.