1 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:07,280 Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha. I don't welcome to 2 00:00:07,280 --> 00:00:18,640 Speaker 1: stephone Never Told You production of I Heeart Radio. And 3 00:00:18,720 --> 00:00:21,120 Speaker 1: he may have noticed who We have a bit fewer 4 00:00:21,239 --> 00:00:25,200 Speaker 1: classics lately, but that will be changing this as a temporary, 5 00:00:25,360 --> 00:00:28,240 Speaker 1: temporary arrangement because we do have a lot of content. 6 00:00:32,720 --> 00:00:35,720 Speaker 1: But we wanted to bring back another female First we 7 00:00:35,720 --> 00:00:39,080 Speaker 1: did with Eves uh and this one was fascinating as well, 8 00:00:39,280 --> 00:00:42,720 Speaker 1: about the first black woman in the US to receive 9 00:00:42,760 --> 00:00:46,440 Speaker 1: a US federal commission, which is pretty neat. Yes, yes, 10 00:00:46,640 --> 00:00:55,120 Speaker 1: so please enjoy this classic episode. Hey, this is Annie 11 00:00:55,360 --> 00:00:58,160 Speaker 1: and Samantha and welcome to stephone Never Told You production 12 00:00:58,160 --> 00:01:09,880 Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio. Today it is time for another 13 00:01:10,200 --> 00:01:13,440 Speaker 1: edition of Female First. I guess this is the first one. 14 00:01:13,840 --> 00:01:17,320 Speaker 1: Oh yes, it is, yes, which means we are once 15 00:01:17,319 --> 00:01:23,080 Speaker 1: again joined by our friend and colleague Eves. Hello. Hello, Well, 16 00:01:23,160 --> 00:01:25,319 Speaker 1: you know last time you were on here, you did 17 00:01:25,360 --> 00:01:28,280 Speaker 1: a very good review of a horror movie you've seen recently? 18 00:01:28,319 --> 00:01:29,600 Speaker 1: Are there to be a horror movies you want to 19 00:01:29,600 --> 00:01:32,000 Speaker 1: give a short review of here at the Okay, you're 20 00:01:32,040 --> 00:01:33,920 Speaker 1: putting me on the spot right now. Okay, let me 21 00:01:33,920 --> 00:01:36,759 Speaker 1: think if I've seen any recently I'm actually I haven't 22 00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:38,720 Speaker 1: seen any horror movies recently. I've been catching up on 23 00:01:38,800 --> 00:01:41,560 Speaker 1: horror TV. I'm just catching up on Dark. So that's 24 00:01:41,680 --> 00:01:43,600 Speaker 1: that's really what what's been on my mind lately. But 25 00:01:43,760 --> 00:01:47,600 Speaker 1: I'm trying to think if I've seen a bad horror lately. Probably, 26 00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:55,760 Speaker 1: but I can't conjure one on right now. What about you, Samath, 27 00:01:55,800 --> 00:01:59,520 Speaker 1: have you seen any bad? I mean, I'm sure I have, 28 00:01:59,760 --> 00:02:02,640 Speaker 1: like keep rewatching the same ones. I I did find 29 00:02:02,840 --> 00:02:05,720 Speaker 1: that since I have HBO Max now and you know 30 00:02:05,760 --> 00:02:07,640 Speaker 1: the Roccu with this whole thing where you wouldn't have 31 00:02:07,640 --> 00:02:10,520 Speaker 1: the Max part portion but now it's gotten together and 32 00:02:10,680 --> 00:02:15,400 Speaker 1: that thing. I have the Conjuring series, so I've started 33 00:02:15,440 --> 00:02:17,959 Speaker 1: all of it because the last one that's not the 34 00:02:18,040 --> 00:02:20,240 Speaker 1: last one because I don't I guess it said James 35 00:02:20,320 --> 00:02:23,480 Speaker 1: one movie. I don't know if it's a part of 36 00:02:23,480 --> 00:02:25,440 Speaker 1: the series, but for some reason it's linked to it. 37 00:02:25,440 --> 00:02:31,760 Speaker 1: It's like La Larea based on that the folk tale. Yeah, 38 00:02:31,880 --> 00:02:34,520 Speaker 1: so I'm watching that. Well, I'm coming up on that 39 00:02:34,520 --> 00:02:35,760 Speaker 1: because I was like, well, I might as well start 40 00:02:35,760 --> 00:02:37,880 Speaker 1: at the beginning and go through all the Annabells, even 41 00:02:37,919 --> 00:02:40,720 Speaker 1: though some of them are really awful, and then that 42 00:02:40,760 --> 00:02:43,119 Speaker 1: one that's my like finale. Since I've never seen that one, 43 00:02:43,800 --> 00:02:45,840 Speaker 1: I'll tell you about it when I watch it. That 44 00:02:45,919 --> 00:02:48,560 Speaker 1: movie came out, there were two of them by very 45 00:02:48,600 --> 00:02:51,760 Speaker 1: similar names about the same folklore that came out at 46 00:02:51,800 --> 00:02:54,560 Speaker 1: the same time, and I've seen them both and they're 47 00:02:54,639 --> 00:02:59,000 Speaker 1: vastly different, which is interesting. Which one is better? Probably 48 00:02:59,040 --> 00:03:01,920 Speaker 1: not the one you're about to Okay, I think the 49 00:03:01,919 --> 00:03:05,080 Speaker 1: one you're about to watch is like Pope scarier and 50 00:03:05,080 --> 00:03:08,360 Speaker 1: that like more jump scared, yeah, and the other one 51 00:03:08,480 --> 00:03:12,320 Speaker 1: is much more like under your Skin? Is this guy 52 00:03:12,760 --> 00:03:16,960 Speaker 1: losing his mind? Or is there actually like psychological stuff 53 00:03:17,600 --> 00:03:20,520 Speaker 1: if I'm remembering correctly, because yeah, I've also seen a 54 00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:24,119 Speaker 1: lot of horror movies. The Cars of La Lorena, Yeah, yes, 55 00:03:24,440 --> 00:03:26,400 Speaker 1: I just remember it though I have been watching I 56 00:03:26,400 --> 00:03:28,280 Speaker 1: think I told you that I had been watching classic 57 00:03:28,320 --> 00:03:31,359 Speaker 1: horror movies, um lately. One of those. I think last 58 00:03:31,360 --> 00:03:35,200 Speaker 1: time I told you I watched Creature from the Black Lagoon, right, 59 00:03:35,320 --> 00:03:37,960 Speaker 1: But when I watched after that was Invisible Man, so 60 00:03:38,840 --> 00:03:41,280 Speaker 1: and that was a treat like it definitely had its moments. 61 00:03:41,320 --> 00:03:42,840 Speaker 1: I feel like a lot of those that I have 62 00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:47,240 Speaker 1: one liner takeaways that are just very valuable to think about. 63 00:03:47,760 --> 00:03:49,840 Speaker 1: I think that's too old to give, like or not 64 00:03:49,920 --> 00:03:52,840 Speaker 1: silly enough. I'll say to like, you know, give any 65 00:03:52,880 --> 00:03:55,440 Speaker 1: sort of meaningful review that hasn't been done one ninety 66 00:03:55,560 --> 00:03:58,760 Speaker 1: thousand million times before. But I enjoyed it, and like 67 00:03:58,880 --> 00:04:03,119 Speaker 1: it's really fun to of like watch horror that's so 68 00:04:03,120 --> 00:04:06,800 Speaker 1: so so lighthearted by today's standards, even though they're so 69 00:04:06,800 --> 00:04:09,040 Speaker 1: so so problematic in so many ways, like it comes 70 00:04:09,040 --> 00:04:11,920 Speaker 1: to the treatment and depiction of women and black people, 71 00:04:13,320 --> 00:04:17,120 Speaker 1: but like it's also very like, oh wow, we we 72 00:04:17,160 --> 00:04:21,799 Speaker 1: went We went deep into the abyss with half a century. 73 00:04:21,880 --> 00:04:25,800 Speaker 1: We went deep. We went deep. So I feel like 74 00:04:25,839 --> 00:04:28,520 Speaker 1: we need to do a whole thing about bad eighties movies, 75 00:04:29,040 --> 00:04:31,880 Speaker 1: horror movies like the clown movies that they used to 76 00:04:31,880 --> 00:04:34,200 Speaker 1: do all the time, where they just had a person 77 00:04:34,279 --> 00:04:37,240 Speaker 1: dressing up chasing with a high pitched giggle like stuff 78 00:04:37,279 --> 00:04:39,080 Speaker 1: like that, where it's like it seems scary as a 79 00:04:39,160 --> 00:04:41,720 Speaker 1: kid and you grow up going what the Gridlins it's 80 00:04:41,760 --> 00:04:43,920 Speaker 1: a prime example of that, you're like, what the hell 81 00:04:44,160 --> 00:04:50,160 Speaker 1: is this? Or the leprochron movies. We should do we 82 00:04:50,200 --> 00:04:53,000 Speaker 1: should watch that as a as a team mill team 83 00:04:53,080 --> 00:05:00,880 Speaker 1: at Yes, I mean I'm in. I'm in. It'll be 84 00:05:00,960 --> 00:05:03,880 Speaker 1: interesting because some of them you go back and you 85 00:05:03,920 --> 00:05:05,839 Speaker 1: don't realize, like how messed up it was that you 86 00:05:05,839 --> 00:05:11,040 Speaker 1: watched that. Yeah, yeah, I might have talked about this before, 87 00:05:11,080 --> 00:05:12,919 Speaker 1: but yeah, this tigmata was one of the ones I 88 00:05:13,000 --> 00:05:15,160 Speaker 1: saw pretty early on in the theater, and that was like, 89 00:05:15,320 --> 00:05:17,279 Speaker 1: that's pretty intense and not it I think about it 90 00:05:18,000 --> 00:05:22,200 Speaker 1: in my today mind thinking about as a child, haven't 91 00:05:22,200 --> 00:05:31,440 Speaker 1: watched that kind of melancholy looks. You couldn't see the listeners, 92 00:05:31,520 --> 00:05:34,200 Speaker 1: but it was the site of the whole. That pause 93 00:05:34,279 --> 00:05:36,120 Speaker 1: was not an awkward pause. It was definitely a moment 94 00:05:36,160 --> 00:05:41,040 Speaker 1: of reflection of like, ye I saw that may be 95 00:05:41,120 --> 00:05:43,760 Speaker 1: very young too, I don't know. I think that's the 96 00:05:44,600 --> 00:05:48,120 Speaker 1: that one of the troubled lines we walked now when 97 00:05:48,120 --> 00:05:50,080 Speaker 1: you rewatch something that you might have loved as a 98 00:05:50,120 --> 00:05:53,479 Speaker 1: kid or even like not necessarily loved, but watched, and 99 00:05:53,480 --> 00:05:55,200 Speaker 1: then you go back and it's been like, you know, 100 00:05:55,400 --> 00:05:58,920 Speaker 1: fifteen years since you watched it, and you're like, oh god, yeah, 101 00:06:02,400 --> 00:06:06,120 Speaker 1: but anyway, hard pivot. Before we get into this episode, 102 00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:08,839 Speaker 1: I wanted to ask if any of you ever sculpted anything, 103 00:06:09,400 --> 00:06:13,760 Speaker 1: not seriously, nothing that wasn't from like Walmart bock clay, right, 104 00:06:14,360 --> 00:06:16,080 Speaker 1: But I think the best I've done was like a 105 00:06:16,120 --> 00:06:20,440 Speaker 1: pot where you did the coil pot I got. You 106 00:06:20,480 --> 00:06:22,800 Speaker 1: just made it into a coil and rolled it up 107 00:06:22,800 --> 00:06:25,120 Speaker 1: and then you smoothed it out before you put it 108 00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:27,040 Speaker 1: in the kiln. And I remember doing that in like 109 00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:29,200 Speaker 1: the second grade with my art teacher. But that was 110 00:06:29,240 --> 00:06:31,520 Speaker 1: the best I've done. And then you paint it after, 111 00:06:32,120 --> 00:06:34,160 Speaker 1: you know, fired, they're not gonna give you like an 112 00:06:34,160 --> 00:06:39,960 Speaker 1: actual what are those I don't making swirling motion? You know? 113 00:06:40,960 --> 00:06:43,159 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, this is really bad for like ghosts where 114 00:06:43,200 --> 00:06:46,720 Speaker 1: she's doing the whole pottery. Oh the wheel, I don't 115 00:06:46,720 --> 00:06:49,200 Speaker 1: know what. I don't know what it's called. I don't know. 116 00:06:49,360 --> 00:06:52,120 Speaker 1: I'm so glad we're so artistic that we know these things. 117 00:06:52,520 --> 00:06:55,279 Speaker 1: Um So instead of doing that with pottery, which is 118 00:06:55,279 --> 00:06:57,920 Speaker 1: how people typically do it, smoothing it out, we did 119 00:06:58,040 --> 00:07:00,400 Speaker 1: the old school, like you made into a coil, bringing 120 00:07:00,440 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 1: it up into a pot, and then you smoothed it out. 121 00:07:02,400 --> 00:07:04,800 Speaker 1: That's the only thing that the sculpted in my life. 122 00:07:05,200 --> 00:07:10,040 Speaker 1: And it wasn't good and it didn't hold water. That 123 00:07:10,120 --> 00:07:15,760 Speaker 1: was a disappointing ending. But had the experience. Yeah, the 124 00:07:15,800 --> 00:07:19,160 Speaker 1: lowest grade I ever got in in my primary education. 125 00:07:19,160 --> 00:07:22,440 Speaker 1: Heres was an art in high school. My art teacher. 126 00:07:22,560 --> 00:07:25,200 Speaker 1: It was like almost comical how much she hated everything 127 00:07:25,280 --> 00:07:27,280 Speaker 1: I did. And we did have a wheel, so I 128 00:07:27,320 --> 00:07:30,640 Speaker 1: got to use that. But one of the funniest experiences 129 00:07:30,680 --> 00:07:33,160 Speaker 1: I had, and that very dreary class for me, was 130 00:07:34,160 --> 00:07:36,360 Speaker 1: we were sculpting something out of I don't know if 131 00:07:36,400 --> 00:07:38,240 Speaker 1: it was marble, but it looked like marble and it 132 00:07:38,320 --> 00:07:41,400 Speaker 1: was real slow going, and I had chosen to do 133 00:07:41,440 --> 00:07:44,680 Speaker 1: a horse. I don't know why I didn't really like horses. 134 00:07:44,680 --> 00:07:46,120 Speaker 1: I think it's because the ring had just come out 135 00:07:46,120 --> 00:07:48,360 Speaker 1: and I was really into that. That's messed up. But 136 00:07:48,520 --> 00:07:51,360 Speaker 1: it was bad. It was bad. I wish I had 137 00:07:51,400 --> 00:07:53,239 Speaker 1: it and I could show it to you. It's awful. 138 00:07:53,440 --> 00:07:55,120 Speaker 1: But she came up behind me and she's like, oh, 139 00:07:55,240 --> 00:07:57,800 Speaker 1: is that a polar bear? And I paused and I 140 00:07:57,840 --> 00:08:02,160 Speaker 1: looked at it. I was like yes, So I just 141 00:08:02,400 --> 00:08:04,800 Speaker 1: let heally believe that I was trying to sculpt a 142 00:08:04,960 --> 00:08:09,440 Speaker 1: polar bear. End did it still look like a polar bear? Oh? Yeah. 143 00:08:09,800 --> 00:08:12,480 Speaker 1: At that point I changed my whole direction and I 144 00:08:12,520 --> 00:08:14,720 Speaker 1: was like, yes, it's a polar bear. That's the way 145 00:08:14,760 --> 00:08:18,840 Speaker 1: I'm going to come. And that was probably one of 146 00:08:18,840 --> 00:08:21,360 Speaker 1: the higher grades I got. And then I also did like, um, 147 00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:23,600 Speaker 1: I did a colck face, but it was like a 148 00:08:23,680 --> 00:08:26,440 Speaker 1: human It was like the drama tragedy face and it 149 00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:29,280 Speaker 1: was all dramatic. Um I liked it. She did not 150 00:08:29,360 --> 00:08:32,280 Speaker 1: like it. She said it was like too intense or something. 151 00:08:34,600 --> 00:08:37,640 Speaker 1: But anyway, I wasn't good either. It sounds like she 152 00:08:37,760 --> 00:08:42,280 Speaker 1: was limiting your imaginative capabilities to me from an outside 153 00:08:43,200 --> 00:08:47,959 Speaker 1: thank you eaves. She also once like took off no joke, 154 00:08:48,040 --> 00:08:51,840 Speaker 1: like fifteen points because I used Shar Truce, you know, painting, 155 00:08:51,880 --> 00:08:57,760 Speaker 1: and she was like everyone hates star Truce. Wow. Still 156 00:08:57,760 --> 00:09:02,920 Speaker 1: it really didn't like you. Yeah. I suspect it's because 157 00:09:02,960 --> 00:09:08,199 Speaker 1: my older brother really had a bad reputation. Never would 158 00:09:08,200 --> 00:09:10,480 Speaker 1: listen to this, but the teachers would always be like, oh, 159 00:09:10,480 --> 00:09:13,000 Speaker 1: you're related to him, and it was there was just 160 00:09:13,040 --> 00:09:18,080 Speaker 1: like a c But I have no idea. It could 161 00:09:18,080 --> 00:09:22,760 Speaker 1: be she just didn't like shar troops. Anyway, I'm delving 162 00:09:22,800 --> 00:09:26,200 Speaker 1: a lot to my personal issues here today, but we 163 00:09:26,240 --> 00:09:28,760 Speaker 1: are talking about some sculpting and someone who was actually 164 00:09:28,800 --> 00:09:31,880 Speaker 1: really good at it. Who did you bring for us? Today, 165 00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:35,240 Speaker 1: Eves I brought me to vote Warwick Fuller. So there 166 00:09:35,320 --> 00:09:37,200 Speaker 1: is a little bit of a segue between the horror 167 00:09:37,240 --> 00:09:40,520 Speaker 1: conversation we were having earlier as well as the sculpting conversation, 168 00:09:40,559 --> 00:09:42,600 Speaker 1: because she was a sculptor, she was a black woman, 169 00:09:43,160 --> 00:09:46,280 Speaker 1: and she lived in the US and in Europe. But yeah, 170 00:09:46,400 --> 00:09:48,880 Speaker 1: a lot of her work was pretty related to the 171 00:09:48,920 --> 00:09:53,679 Speaker 1: horrors of reality and the visualizations the imagery, and her 172 00:09:53,720 --> 00:09:58,439 Speaker 1: work was just, you know, very visceral, very real, very 173 00:09:58,559 --> 00:10:02,880 Speaker 1: raw and emotional all and expressive in many ways that 174 00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:06,240 Speaker 1: was related to horrors and in tragedies and and things 175 00:10:06,320 --> 00:10:07,960 Speaker 1: like that, even though some of her work was also 176 00:10:08,040 --> 00:10:11,760 Speaker 1: helpful and optimistic and inspiring and positive and uplifting and 177 00:10:11,800 --> 00:10:13,839 Speaker 1: all of those other words that can be counters to 178 00:10:13,960 --> 00:10:17,160 Speaker 1: things like horror. But yeah, so she was the first 179 00:10:17,200 --> 00:10:20,520 Speaker 1: black woman artist to receive a US federal commission. Her 180 00:10:20,520 --> 00:10:23,439 Speaker 1: work is kind of considered a precursor to the Harlem Renaissance. 181 00:10:23,720 --> 00:10:27,360 Speaker 1: She worked in the nineteenth century and in the twentieth century, 182 00:10:27,440 --> 00:10:30,960 Speaker 1: and she had quite a career that spanned over like 183 00:10:31,040 --> 00:10:34,360 Speaker 1: seventy years. So I think there's a lot to talk 184 00:10:34,400 --> 00:10:36,240 Speaker 1: about with her today, and I'm excited to bring her 185 00:10:36,280 --> 00:10:38,640 Speaker 1: to the table. Yeah, this was another person that I 186 00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:41,760 Speaker 1: unfortunately never heard of, and I'm glad you brought her 187 00:10:41,920 --> 00:10:45,480 Speaker 1: to our attention. And I really loved her art and 188 00:10:45,520 --> 00:10:48,000 Speaker 1: I loved the quotes about like people would say the 189 00:10:48,080 --> 00:10:50,120 Speaker 1: horror of her art, and because I am such a 190 00:10:50,160 --> 00:10:54,520 Speaker 1: big horror fan, so I really enjoyed learning more about 191 00:10:54,559 --> 00:10:59,000 Speaker 1: her and I'm excited to share her story with the listeners. Also, 192 00:10:59,120 --> 00:11:01,280 Speaker 1: as I was reading some of her articles, I'd like 193 00:11:01,360 --> 00:11:04,440 Speaker 1: to imagine because she did go back from Paris to 194 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:07,640 Speaker 1: to the US a couple of times, and I'm like, man, 195 00:11:07,760 --> 00:11:10,880 Speaker 1: she for all the bad things. I wonder what it 196 00:11:10,960 --> 00:11:13,680 Speaker 1: was like to live in that time frame, which is 197 00:11:13,800 --> 00:11:16,320 Speaker 1: such a romantic time frame for to be in Paris. 198 00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:18,679 Speaker 1: And again, like I know, we'll talk a little more 199 00:11:18,679 --> 00:11:20,880 Speaker 1: about it, but her coming back to the U s 200 00:11:20,880 --> 00:11:24,199 Speaker 1: seems so sad. Yeah, it did seem sad, But I 201 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:26,280 Speaker 1: think there is also the harsh reality and like you said, well, 202 00:11:26,320 --> 00:11:28,640 Speaker 1: we'll get to a little bit later, but there were 203 00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:30,679 Speaker 1: a lot of black artists who did go to Europe 204 00:11:30,679 --> 00:11:33,120 Speaker 1: in terms of it being like an exit for them 205 00:11:33,160 --> 00:11:35,800 Speaker 1: from the terror of the United States at the time 206 00:11:35,840 --> 00:11:38,320 Speaker 1: and the terrorism in the United States at the time, 207 00:11:38,800 --> 00:11:41,680 Speaker 1: but also there were the realities that like, oh, white 208 00:11:41,679 --> 00:11:45,400 Speaker 1: people still existed, and we're still racist and in Europe, 209 00:11:45,520 --> 00:11:48,400 Speaker 1: and and and not white people as well, you know 210 00:11:48,440 --> 00:11:54,839 Speaker 1: who also harbord prejudices and stereotypes about black people. So 211 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:57,439 Speaker 1: you know, it's not like everything completely went away. And 212 00:11:57,440 --> 00:11:59,960 Speaker 1: and you know, when black artists went into exile, are 213 00:12:00,280 --> 00:12:02,520 Speaker 1: just left the United States to what they would perceive 214 00:12:02,600 --> 00:12:05,640 Speaker 1: was better lives or better abilities to study. Um that 215 00:12:05,720 --> 00:12:08,800 Speaker 1: they didn't have hardships as well, they still did. There 216 00:12:08,880 --> 00:12:13,359 Speaker 1: is like an element of like fantastic nous or mythology 217 00:12:13,440 --> 00:12:15,640 Speaker 1: I think in the black artists going to Europe, Like 218 00:12:15,679 --> 00:12:19,000 Speaker 1: it is very like this person lived in a cabin 219 00:12:19,679 --> 00:12:21,560 Speaker 1: and this is the cabin that they lived in while 220 00:12:21,559 --> 00:12:24,400 Speaker 1: they were in France, and they wrote this novel there. 221 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:26,240 Speaker 1: And that's what I think about those stories a lot 222 00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:29,400 Speaker 1: of times, though I know the realities of why they 223 00:12:29,559 --> 00:12:33,400 Speaker 1: had to go there. In a lot of I like 224 00:12:33,480 --> 00:12:36,960 Speaker 1: that meet up a Warick Fuller's stories as part of 225 00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:41,000 Speaker 1: that lineage people who did kind of go between the 226 00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:45,240 Speaker 1: coasts or the sides of the ocean. Yes, yes, yes, 227 00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:48,920 Speaker 1: well shall we get into her story? Yeah, let's do 228 00:12:49,000 --> 00:12:52,240 Speaker 1: it okay. So she was born in June of eighteen 229 00:12:52,320 --> 00:12:55,920 Speaker 1: seventy seven. Her parents were William Warwick and Emma Warwick. 230 00:12:56,240 --> 00:12:59,600 Speaker 1: He was a barber, she was a hair stylist, and 231 00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:02,480 Speaker 1: that kind of continued throughout the family, so that with 232 00:13:02,520 --> 00:13:04,440 Speaker 1: her siblings, you know, they went back to be beauticians 233 00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:07,280 Speaker 1: and stuff like that, and her brother was also a physician. 234 00:13:07,559 --> 00:13:10,160 Speaker 1: In an article about Vilma J. Hoover and thinking about 235 00:13:10,320 --> 00:13:13,520 Speaker 1: how it was like to live as a child for 236 00:13:13,559 --> 00:13:16,920 Speaker 1: me to Hoover said that she was part of this 237 00:13:16,960 --> 00:13:19,559 Speaker 1: is a quote, part of a special class of blacks 238 00:13:19,800 --> 00:13:22,839 Speaker 1: who were involved in catering in real estate business, which 239 00:13:22,920 --> 00:13:24,560 Speaker 1: is just funny to me for some reason, like the 240 00:13:24,600 --> 00:13:27,959 Speaker 1: phrase special class of blacks. But yes, the idea is 241 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:31,440 Speaker 1: that the family was relatively well off and she lived 242 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:34,560 Speaker 1: and generally sheltered, as Vilma J. Hoover goes on to 243 00:13:34,679 --> 00:13:37,200 Speaker 1: like talk about in this article like lived to generally 244 00:13:37,240 --> 00:13:39,920 Speaker 1: sheltered kind of experienced childhood in which she didn't spend 245 00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:42,440 Speaker 1: a lot of time her mother and the beauty shop 246 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:44,680 Speaker 1: that she had had a lot of upper class white 247 00:13:44,720 --> 00:13:48,960 Speaker 1: clientele even and thinking about that Meta was named after 248 00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:52,400 Speaker 1: one of her mom's clients, the daughter of the former 249 00:13:52,400 --> 00:13:56,439 Speaker 1: Philly mayor Richard vou So. Yeah, she had two older siblings, 250 00:13:56,960 --> 00:14:00,000 Speaker 1: William and Blanche, And like I said, her brother eventually 251 00:14:00,080 --> 00:14:03,360 Speaker 1: became a physician while her sister became a beautician. And 252 00:14:03,400 --> 00:14:06,440 Speaker 1: her parents encouraged an interest in art really early on 253 00:14:06,720 --> 00:14:08,360 Speaker 1: when she was a child. And I think that's a 254 00:14:08,480 --> 00:14:10,360 Speaker 1: through line through a lot of the people we bring, 255 00:14:10,480 --> 00:14:13,520 Speaker 1: like particularly the artists, and sometimes I think we bring 256 00:14:13,520 --> 00:14:15,839 Speaker 1: people who are more science focused as well. If their 257 00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:18,640 Speaker 1: parents were around, had a big hand in the way 258 00:14:18,679 --> 00:14:20,880 Speaker 1: that they inspired their children and encouraged their children to 259 00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:23,800 Speaker 1: participate in that thing that they seemed interested in, and 260 00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:26,080 Speaker 1: that was art for me to vote. Her sister was 261 00:14:26,120 --> 00:14:29,200 Speaker 1: also interested in art, so she got to look to 262 00:14:29,240 --> 00:14:32,480 Speaker 1: her for materials and inspiration as well. And she gained 263 00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:35,000 Speaker 1: a little bit of interest in horror at a young age, 264 00:14:35,120 --> 00:14:37,560 Speaker 1: just like you and I and he saw her brother, 265 00:14:38,040 --> 00:14:40,760 Speaker 1: her brother and grandfather told her horror stories, and she 266 00:14:40,840 --> 00:14:46,320 Speaker 1: went to segregated public schools and she ended up creating 267 00:14:46,320 --> 00:14:50,040 Speaker 1: a wood carving that was in the Three World's Colombian 268 00:14:50,160 --> 00:14:54,720 Speaker 1: Exhibition in Chicago, and from there it is just like 269 00:14:54,760 --> 00:14:58,720 Speaker 1: our art for the rest of our life. She got 270 00:14:59,120 --> 00:15:01,880 Speaker 1: three years scholars up to the Pennsylvania Museum and School 271 00:15:01,880 --> 00:15:05,160 Speaker 1: of Industrial Art, which I will absolutely abbreviate to p 272 00:15:05,320 --> 00:15:07,720 Speaker 1: M s i A or whenever we talk about this 273 00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:11,000 Speaker 1: in the future in this episode for brevity's sake. But yeah, 274 00:15:11,040 --> 00:15:14,160 Speaker 1: so there she could earn a teaching degree, which you know, 275 00:15:14,480 --> 00:15:17,200 Speaker 1: possibly the reason that she could have done that could 276 00:15:17,240 --> 00:15:20,000 Speaker 1: have been to appease her mother. The school was also 277 00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:22,040 Speaker 1: a few blocks from where they lived. They had a 278 00:15:22,080 --> 00:15:25,440 Speaker 1: home on South twelfth Street. Yeah, so she attended p 279 00:15:25,600 --> 00:15:28,640 Speaker 1: M s i A for about three years until seven. 280 00:15:28,760 --> 00:15:30,880 Speaker 1: She studied the boat art style, which was the style 281 00:15:30,920 --> 00:15:33,760 Speaker 1: from France, and while she was at the school, she 282 00:15:33,880 --> 00:15:37,000 Speaker 1: created a bass relief which was composed of thirty seven 283 00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:40,760 Speaker 1: medieval figures that was titled Procession of the Arts and 284 00:15:40,800 --> 00:15:44,080 Speaker 1: Crafts and it was a scholarship requirement, but it also 285 00:15:44,160 --> 00:15:46,880 Speaker 1: won her a sculpture prize at the school. She got 286 00:15:46,880 --> 00:15:48,960 Speaker 1: some prizes over her lifetime. You know, she worked a 287 00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:52,080 Speaker 1: lot with the school, and she really gained this interest 288 00:15:52,160 --> 00:15:56,000 Speaker 1: in sculpture while she was there, specifically over other art forms. 289 00:15:56,280 --> 00:16:00,280 Speaker 1: And I did attend to lecture that Framingham University did, 290 00:16:00,840 --> 00:16:02,840 Speaker 1: and a lot of pictures of her did show up 291 00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:07,600 Speaker 1: in the even as well as ninety nine school catalog, 292 00:16:07,720 --> 00:16:10,680 Speaker 1: so there are pictures of her actually in study like um, 293 00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:14,080 Speaker 1: looking at still lives and and creating her own work 294 00:16:14,120 --> 00:16:16,960 Speaker 1: from there. So it's pretty interesting. If you're actually interested 295 00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:19,600 Speaker 1: in looking at her work itself, you can see a 296 00:16:19,640 --> 00:16:22,000 Speaker 1: lot of that at the dam Fourth Art Museum. Some 297 00:16:22,120 --> 00:16:25,240 Speaker 1: of those images are online as well, and they also 298 00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:27,640 Speaker 1: have a bunch of her materials, like her teacher's certificate 299 00:16:27,680 --> 00:16:30,000 Speaker 1: and diploma, as well as her studies and her process 300 00:16:30,000 --> 00:16:32,120 Speaker 1: pieces if you're interested in learning more about her work 301 00:16:32,160 --> 00:16:34,520 Speaker 1: and just like stuff like kind of feeling like a 302 00:16:34,600 --> 00:16:37,680 Speaker 1: voyeor from the future looking at like what it was 303 00:16:37,720 --> 00:16:40,320 Speaker 1: like in in the classroom where she studied in there, 304 00:16:40,320 --> 00:16:42,200 Speaker 1: and the clothes that they're wearing at the time that 305 00:16:42,280 --> 00:16:44,720 Speaker 1: seems so uncomfortable, Like that's something I always think about. 306 00:16:45,080 --> 00:16:48,240 Speaker 1: I'm like, oh god, I know how comfortable I like 307 00:16:48,320 --> 00:16:50,680 Speaker 1: to be when I'm working. And yeah, So if you 308 00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:53,520 Speaker 1: want to see stuff like that, like that's available for her, fortunately, 309 00:16:53,560 --> 00:16:56,760 Speaker 1: which isn't the case for a lot of people who 310 00:16:57,080 --> 00:16:59,680 Speaker 1: you know, the records aren't like that for everybody. So 311 00:17:00,240 --> 00:17:01,920 Speaker 1: there is stuff that you can still check out from 312 00:17:01,920 --> 00:17:04,960 Speaker 1: her today. But yeah, anyway, continuing with her story, in 313 00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:10,199 Speaker 1: she moved to Paris to study, and in Paris she 314 00:17:10,400 --> 00:17:12,679 Speaker 1: ended up at the American Women's Club. I've seen it 315 00:17:12,680 --> 00:17:15,520 Speaker 1: called the American Girls Club as well. But either way, 316 00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:19,600 Speaker 1: she was refused lodging there because she was black ostensibly, 317 00:17:19,680 --> 00:17:22,520 Speaker 1: and there were Southern women there who would object to 318 00:17:22,560 --> 00:17:24,840 Speaker 1: her being there. Is what they said, there are Southern 319 00:17:24,880 --> 00:17:28,160 Speaker 1: women here who don't want you here, which was yeah, 320 00:17:28,200 --> 00:17:30,840 Speaker 1: it seems like diffusing the blame. But you know, um, 321 00:17:30,920 --> 00:17:33,639 Speaker 1: she was able to get lodging elsewhere though, so you know, 322 00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:36,320 Speaker 1: she ended up staying in Europe. She studied under painter 323 00:17:36,520 --> 00:17:39,240 Speaker 1: and as I always give the disclaimer, my name is French, 324 00:17:39,280 --> 00:17:41,480 Speaker 1: but I am not and I speak no liquid French. 325 00:17:41,840 --> 00:17:45,560 Speaker 1: But Rafael Kalen and Jean Antoony and Carla. While in 326 00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:49,000 Speaker 1: Paris she's studying under them. She also enrolled in the 327 00:17:49,040 --> 00:17:54,600 Speaker 1: Academy Colorossi, and she studied drawing, went to lectures, went 328 00:17:54,640 --> 00:17:57,120 Speaker 1: to museums and did all the things that you expect 329 00:17:58,359 --> 00:18:02,840 Speaker 1: that she would expect people studying art to do. That's fair. 330 00:18:17,440 --> 00:18:20,320 Speaker 1: So she also had support from painter Henry O. Tanner 331 00:18:20,440 --> 00:18:22,720 Speaker 1: and W. E. B. Du Bois while she was in 332 00:18:22,800 --> 00:18:26,760 Speaker 1: France and du Bois um there is like an anecdote 333 00:18:26,800 --> 00:18:29,600 Speaker 1: of du boys talking to her and saying that he 334 00:18:29,640 --> 00:18:32,159 Speaker 1: wanted her to focus on black people in her art 335 00:18:32,240 --> 00:18:35,520 Speaker 1: and really work on depictions of black people because that's 336 00:18:35,520 --> 00:18:37,280 Speaker 1: what he thought was needed and was needed from her 337 00:18:37,320 --> 00:18:39,680 Speaker 1: as an artist. But she didn't want to do that. 338 00:18:39,880 --> 00:18:42,439 Speaker 1: She didn't want to be limited in that way. And 339 00:18:42,880 --> 00:18:46,800 Speaker 1: while she was even though as we'll talk about like 340 00:18:47,720 --> 00:18:51,879 Speaker 1: black life, black culture, black experiences, it is something that 341 00:18:51,920 --> 00:18:55,479 Speaker 1: showed up in her work. But yeah, so she, you know, 342 00:18:55,600 --> 00:18:57,520 Speaker 1: she kind of took that for what it was in 343 00:18:57,640 --> 00:18:59,760 Speaker 1: terms of advice from du Bois. But yeah, so while 344 00:18:59,840 --> 00:19:02,879 Speaker 1: she was in Paris, she was introduced to Augusta Roddon, 345 00:19:03,520 --> 00:19:06,720 Speaker 1: who I think a lot of people know even if 346 00:19:06,760 --> 00:19:10,320 Speaker 1: you aren't super into sculpture. No, his sculpture the thinker. 347 00:19:10,880 --> 00:19:12,919 Speaker 1: This is the guy setting down with his chin on 348 00:19:12,960 --> 00:19:15,880 Speaker 1: his fist. So yeah, so for this introduction, she took 349 00:19:15,920 --> 00:19:18,440 Speaker 1: some of her work with her and she showed him 350 00:19:18,440 --> 00:19:21,320 Speaker 1: her work and photographs of her work, and basically what 351 00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:23,480 Speaker 1: it ended up was like, hmm, like I like you, 352 00:19:23,359 --> 00:19:24,760 Speaker 1: and you know, I think you have a lot of 353 00:19:24,800 --> 00:19:28,440 Speaker 1: talent you have potential. I would like to critique your work, 354 00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:30,399 Speaker 1: even if that means that I have to come to Paris. 355 00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:33,400 Speaker 1: And so he was particularly a fan of her sculpture 356 00:19:33,840 --> 00:19:36,320 Speaker 1: man eating his Heart, which has also been called Secret Sorrow, 357 00:19:36,320 --> 00:19:39,040 Speaker 1: and you can see a picture of that sculpture online too. 358 00:19:39,080 --> 00:19:43,760 Speaker 1: It's also pretty expressive, like not completely figurative in terms 359 00:19:43,800 --> 00:19:45,840 Speaker 1: of you can tell this is really a man eating 360 00:19:45,960 --> 00:19:47,680 Speaker 1: his heart, but you can't tell us a man eating 361 00:19:47,720 --> 00:19:51,280 Speaker 1: his heart. So yes, she would continue to seek advice 362 00:19:51,359 --> 00:19:54,960 Speaker 1: from him for Roddon over the years, and he continued 363 00:19:54,960 --> 00:20:00,119 Speaker 1: to critique and support her work. And as happens when 364 00:20:00,119 --> 00:20:02,760 Speaker 1: you get big ups from big people in the art world, 365 00:20:03,080 --> 00:20:05,840 Speaker 1: her work started to be more noticed as well. So 366 00:20:05,920 --> 00:20:09,040 Speaker 1: she got more attention in France from art critics and 367 00:20:09,160 --> 00:20:12,760 Speaker 1: art circles, and she got more attention internationally as well. 368 00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:15,760 Speaker 1: But yeah, her work was shown in solo exhibits and 369 00:20:15,800 --> 00:20:19,359 Speaker 1: group shows in France, and for instance, her work was 370 00:20:19,400 --> 00:20:23,120 Speaker 1: shown and Samuel Being's large Nouveau gallery, and she had 371 00:20:23,200 --> 00:20:27,160 Speaker 1: begun really moving from this kind of decordive style, from 372 00:20:27,440 --> 00:20:30,919 Speaker 1: the Beaux art style and moving more into an exploring 373 00:20:31,040 --> 00:20:34,760 Speaker 1: human emotion, and her work and expression and suffering and 374 00:20:35,040 --> 00:20:38,879 Speaker 1: in sculpture, and she made that shift to those darker 375 00:20:39,480 --> 00:20:42,960 Speaker 1: pieces that were a lot more expressive. For instance, in 376 00:20:43,080 --> 00:20:46,320 Speaker 1: nineteen o two, she completed a piece called The Wretched, 377 00:20:46,400 --> 00:20:49,760 Speaker 1: which was a bronze portrayal of several people kind of 378 00:20:49,760 --> 00:20:53,800 Speaker 1: writhing and suffering in different ways. It's pretty expressive as well. 379 00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:56,600 Speaker 1: But you can also see that one online if you're interested. 380 00:20:57,160 --> 00:20:59,600 Speaker 1: And for this reason, you know she was working in 381 00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:05,280 Speaker 1: these subjects and thematics that were moving into that horror space. 382 00:21:05,359 --> 00:21:09,480 Speaker 1: People began calling her the sculpture of horrors. Of Her 383 00:21:09,560 --> 00:21:13,440 Speaker 1: success in Paris gained her the attention of people from 384 00:21:13,520 --> 00:21:16,960 Speaker 1: all over the world, including the USA. So after being 385 00:21:17,000 --> 00:21:20,080 Speaker 1: in Paris for three years, she ended up returning to 386 00:21:20,080 --> 00:21:24,440 Speaker 1: Philadelphia in the early nineteen hundreds. She joined the Alumni Association, 387 00:21:25,400 --> 00:21:29,560 Speaker 1: sharing the exhibits committee, and had alumni exhibits at p M. 388 00:21:29,720 --> 00:21:33,879 Speaker 1: S i A. But things weren't that smooth going for 389 00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:35,639 Speaker 1: her when she was in Philadelphia and when she got 390 00:21:35,640 --> 00:21:38,120 Speaker 1: back to the USA in general, It's not like everybody 391 00:21:38,160 --> 00:21:41,480 Speaker 1: didn't welcome her with like this big warm hug. Essentially, 392 00:21:41,960 --> 00:21:45,399 Speaker 1: she did face like difficulties when she came back to 393 00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:47,920 Speaker 1: the US. In terms of people actually supporting her work 394 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:53,760 Speaker 1: and paying her and local art dealers in Philly were 395 00:21:53,760 --> 00:21:56,960 Speaker 1: rejecting her work, as it has been explained supposedly by 396 00:21:57,000 --> 00:21:59,919 Speaker 1: them um that she was a quote unquote domestic artist, 397 00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:02,800 Speaker 1: but likely because of her race. Because you have to 398 00:22:02,840 --> 00:22:05,440 Speaker 1: remember at this time, it's the early nineteen hundreds, and 399 00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:08,720 Speaker 1: she had a studio there and she continued to create, 400 00:22:09,400 --> 00:22:11,919 Speaker 1: and at this time, you know, she was picking up 401 00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:14,760 Speaker 1: a lot more of just being able to live what 402 00:22:15,160 --> 00:22:16,640 Speaker 1: was like for her to live as a black woman 403 00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:19,000 Speaker 1: in the United States at the time. So, in addition 404 00:22:19,040 --> 00:22:21,520 Speaker 1: to all the European influences that she had from living 405 00:22:21,560 --> 00:22:25,119 Speaker 1: overseas and and studying the work of people who you know, 406 00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:29,399 Speaker 1: learned from these masters overseas, Black American life and culture 407 00:22:29,400 --> 00:22:33,040 Speaker 1: started to influence her work as well. So she held 408 00:22:33,119 --> 00:22:37,119 Speaker 1: exhibitions at her studio and continue to contribute to local 409 00:22:37,240 --> 00:22:41,280 Speaker 1: art shows, and in nineteen o seven, she was commissioned 410 00:22:41,280 --> 00:22:44,800 Speaker 1: to sculpt a series of tableau of Black American historical 411 00:22:44,800 --> 00:22:49,440 Speaker 1: events for the James Town Her Centennial exhibition in Norfolk, Virginia. 412 00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:51,719 Speaker 1: I didn't know her centennial was a word until this, 413 00:22:51,880 --> 00:22:53,960 Speaker 1: but I do now. I didn't know it would beyond 414 00:22:54,040 --> 00:23:00,040 Speaker 1: by centennial. Yeah, so that's her first. That's where to 415 00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:02,360 Speaker 1: get to her first. That made her the first Black 416 00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:06,160 Speaker 1: American woman artists to receive the Federal Commission. I'm gonna 417 00:23:06,200 --> 00:23:08,720 Speaker 1: say I'm loving the names of her pieces too, Like 418 00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:14,840 Speaker 1: the Wretched Man eating his own Heart. That sounds like 419 00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:17,520 Speaker 1: poems I would have written. And and I mean this, 420 00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:20,920 Speaker 1: and like it sounds like an insult, but that's the 421 00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:24,440 Speaker 1: kind of thing I was so into. Yeah, in high 422 00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:30,760 Speaker 1: school I would write these poems like the Wretched Doom. Yeah, 423 00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:33,880 Speaker 1: and then they got published in the high school newspaper, 424 00:23:33,880 --> 00:23:37,080 Speaker 1: and it's my great shame, but I must live with it. 425 00:23:37,520 --> 00:23:42,359 Speaker 1: Do you have those two? I do? You must share them? 426 00:23:42,560 --> 00:23:47,000 Speaker 1: And Eves, let me tell you there are drawings of 427 00:23:47,160 --> 00:23:55,720 Speaker 1: like dark butterflies along the edges of these poems that yes, okay, 428 00:23:55,880 --> 00:23:58,080 Speaker 1: I didn't know. Someone else added that to yours just 429 00:23:58,119 --> 00:24:03,760 Speaker 1: to give it a little bit of um But okay, Yeah. 430 00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:05,960 Speaker 1: I love looking at the pictures of the sculptures because 431 00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:08,720 Speaker 1: it's so beautiful and just the detail in the wave. 432 00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:12,359 Speaker 1: She makes everything almost like aquatic in that level of 433 00:24:12,400 --> 00:24:15,560 Speaker 1: like waves and forms of the material on the the 434 00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:19,920 Speaker 1: regident in itself. It looks like a crashing wave of 435 00:24:19,920 --> 00:24:23,479 Speaker 1: people suffering, which is really sad, but it's beautiful and 436 00:24:23,560 --> 00:24:27,320 Speaker 1: detailed at the same time, it meshes so perfectly into 437 00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:30,520 Speaker 1: whatever form it is, and I loved it. I was like, wow, 438 00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:33,600 Speaker 1: I can understand the names makes sense because it makes 439 00:24:33,600 --> 00:24:36,120 Speaker 1: you feel that way, but it's beauty is a whole 440 00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:39,480 Speaker 1: different level of that horror. So it's gorgeous. Her work 441 00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:44,159 Speaker 1: is gorgeous, and it makes me sad that it's not 442 00:24:44,240 --> 00:24:46,400 Speaker 1: more well known. I mean, it is known, but it's 443 00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:48,359 Speaker 1: not well known, and it should be. She should have 444 00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:50,760 Speaker 1: been as big as Rodan in that sense of like, 445 00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:53,320 Speaker 1: this conversation is huge. What she did and what she 446 00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:59,080 Speaker 1: was sculpting was cultural is so gorgeous. It is. Yeah, 447 00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:03,920 Speaker 1: definitely clearly was you know, very practiced and like really 448 00:25:03,920 --> 00:25:08,160 Speaker 1: cared about the art form. And yeah, I agree about 449 00:25:08,200 --> 00:25:11,240 Speaker 1: the titles to like, I really like the titles and 450 00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:15,280 Speaker 1: it's like they betray exactly well of course, their interpretations 451 00:25:15,320 --> 00:25:17,920 Speaker 1: and like many different things you can derive from a 452 00:25:17,960 --> 00:25:19,680 Speaker 1: work of art, but it's like, you know, she wasn't 453 00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:22,160 Speaker 1: cryptic about the titles, is what I'm trying to say. 454 00:25:22,520 --> 00:25:25,680 Speaker 1: She was like, no, this is dark, and you're gonna 455 00:25:25,680 --> 00:25:27,560 Speaker 1: be able to tell that from the title even before 456 00:25:27,560 --> 00:25:31,720 Speaker 1: seeing the work. So yeah, you know, like I said, 457 00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:34,240 Speaker 1: she continued to create art, but she was also focused 458 00:25:34,280 --> 00:25:37,840 Speaker 1: on her family life. She did have children. She eventually 459 00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:41,600 Speaker 1: had children. In nineteen o nine, she married Dr Solomon 460 00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:44,320 Speaker 1: cy Fuller, and he was from Liberia. He was a 461 00:25:44,359 --> 00:25:49,080 Speaker 1: neurologist and worked at a pathology lab as well, and 462 00:25:49,119 --> 00:25:52,480 Speaker 1: they moved into a house and Framingham, Massachusetts, and they 463 00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:57,679 Speaker 1: stayed together for many years. In nineteen ten, her warehouse 464 00:25:57,720 --> 00:26:00,399 Speaker 1: that she had all her tools in her much yereels 465 00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:02,920 Speaker 1: in for all of the work that she had done, 466 00:26:03,160 --> 00:26:05,040 Speaker 1: and while she was in Europe and in the US, 467 00:26:05,680 --> 00:26:08,600 Speaker 1: that caught on fire, and so she lost a lot 468 00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:11,920 Speaker 1: of that stuff, which clearly is like a huge loss 469 00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:14,040 Speaker 1: for her. That's a huge loss for her in terms 470 00:26:14,040 --> 00:26:16,680 Speaker 1: of the physical things that she had and her inspiration. 471 00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:18,920 Speaker 1: You know, just looking at your own legacy, I feel 472 00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:20,919 Speaker 1: like it's so important to you know, she had all 473 00:26:20,920 --> 00:26:22,960 Speaker 1: those things there for her to go back and look 474 00:26:22,960 --> 00:26:25,560 Speaker 1: at for herself but also share with with people in 475 00:26:25,560 --> 00:26:28,160 Speaker 1: the future, but also in terms of her being able 476 00:26:28,200 --> 00:26:30,000 Speaker 1: to make money. So yeah, it was just it was 477 00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:33,080 Speaker 1: a loss for her physically, but I think also in 478 00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:35,879 Speaker 1: a way where it's like it affected her ability to 479 00:26:35,920 --> 00:26:39,359 Speaker 1: continue to work in in her art form. She for 480 00:26:39,400 --> 00:26:42,080 Speaker 1: a few years, she was pretty quiet on the art 481 00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:46,320 Speaker 1: front after that happened, and she already wasn't making a 482 00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:50,080 Speaker 1: lot of money and was struggling on that front. But yeah, 483 00:26:50,119 --> 00:26:54,920 Speaker 1: so that didn't completely eradicate her will to create art though, 484 00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:58,000 Speaker 1: you know, she she didn't stop forever do boys did 485 00:26:58,160 --> 00:27:00,119 Speaker 1: end up asking her to recreate one of her or 486 00:27:00,600 --> 00:27:02,960 Speaker 1: previous works, which was Man eating his Heart, which we 487 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:07,960 Speaker 1: talked about earlier for the fiftieth anniversary celebration for the 488 00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:11,760 Speaker 1: Emancipation Proclamation in New York. She didn't do that, but 489 00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:15,199 Speaker 1: she did instead create an eight foot tall sculpture of 490 00:27:15,320 --> 00:27:19,639 Speaker 1: three figures called Emancipation. So it was casting flashed at 491 00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:22,200 Speaker 1: the time. Now if you see it, it's cast in bronze. Now. 492 00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:26,359 Speaker 1: That was done and I think and is in Harriet 493 00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:29,919 Speaker 1: Tubman Park now. But it depicts people emerging from the 494 00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:32,720 Speaker 1: tree of knowledge and is a departure from the more 495 00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:38,359 Speaker 1: typical symbolism and imagery that surrounded Emancipation at the time, 496 00:27:38,440 --> 00:27:40,720 Speaker 1: like the breaking of the chains, and then like kneeling 497 00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:47,679 Speaker 1: to you know, white white abolitionists, and she, you know, 498 00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:51,400 Speaker 1: continue to kind of create in the realm of social 499 00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:54,679 Speaker 1: issues and of things that were happening around the world, 500 00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:56,600 Speaker 1: like war and things that were happening in the United 501 00:27:56,640 --> 00:28:00,359 Speaker 1: States and in Boston. In nineteen fourteen, she ended up 502 00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:04,480 Speaker 1: showing new works in a public exhibition for the first 503 00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:09,160 Speaker 1: time in several years. So throughout the nineteen tens and 504 00:28:09,240 --> 00:28:12,840 Speaker 1: throughout the nineteen twenties, she did create portraits of friends 505 00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:19,240 Speaker 1: and family and self portraits and continue to do commission works, 506 00:28:19,920 --> 00:28:23,200 Speaker 1: and she responded to a lot of those social issues 507 00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:26,000 Speaker 1: through her work. For instance, she did anti lynching pieces, 508 00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:30,440 Speaker 1: so lynching was still like so rampant at the time 509 00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:33,080 Speaker 1: in the United States during that time period, and she 510 00:28:33,119 --> 00:28:37,080 Speaker 1: did one called Mary Turner a Silent Protest against mob violence, 511 00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:41,760 Speaker 1: which was in response to the just awful, awful, awful, 512 00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:45,880 Speaker 1: truly tragic story of Mary Turner, who was violently murdered 513 00:28:46,400 --> 00:28:49,800 Speaker 1: because she spoke up against her husband's recent lynching. I mean, 514 00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:53,000 Speaker 1: it's hard like that. That stuff is always hard to 515 00:28:53,040 --> 00:28:55,560 Speaker 1: go through, like those stories, even though there are so 516 00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:58,360 Speaker 1: many of them. But she specifically chose this story in 517 00:28:58,400 --> 00:29:01,600 Speaker 1: which to respond to and it's a pretty poignant piece, 518 00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:05,600 Speaker 1: and it's just indicative of the things that she was 519 00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:08,920 Speaker 1: thinking about and the whole like you know, black consciousness 520 00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:11,840 Speaker 1: and and the things that like a lot of people 521 00:29:11,920 --> 00:29:13,560 Speaker 1: were thinking about at the time when it came to 522 00:29:14,240 --> 00:29:18,040 Speaker 1: racism and the interactions between um white and black people 523 00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:19,760 Speaker 1: the United States at the time. So yeah, she was 524 00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:22,480 Speaker 1: also hard focused on those subjects through her art. And 525 00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:27,040 Speaker 1: her work has kind of thought of as a precursor 526 00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:30,160 Speaker 1: to the Harlem Renaissance, work in which she wasn't specifically 527 00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:34,560 Speaker 1: in the city, but she was still creating work during 528 00:29:34,560 --> 00:29:37,400 Speaker 1: that period and she knew what was happening in Harlem Renaissance. 529 00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:43,960 Speaker 1: And I should note here though that not everybody was 530 00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:47,479 Speaker 1: a fan of her work, as to be expected. It's like, 531 00:29:47,560 --> 00:29:50,880 Speaker 1: you know, not everything is everybody's cup of tea. But 532 00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:53,960 Speaker 1: for instance, in his book is the New Negro, Elaine 533 00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:56,320 Speaker 1: Locke called her work, in addition to other people's work, 534 00:29:56,760 --> 00:30:00,360 Speaker 1: has waivered between abstract expression, which was imitating and not 535 00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:05,560 Speaker 1: highly original, and racial expression, which was only experimental. So 536 00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:08,719 Speaker 1: clearly not a glowing review of her work, but he 537 00:30:08,760 --> 00:30:11,400 Speaker 1: did end up praising her work. Ethiopia or what has 538 00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:15,440 Speaker 1: been called Ethiopia Awakening UM, which I think has been 539 00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:19,640 Speaker 1: called her most known, most well known, or most popular 540 00:30:19,680 --> 00:30:22,880 Speaker 1: work UM, and it depicts a black woman emerging from 541 00:30:22,880 --> 00:30:26,160 Speaker 1: this kind of mummy wrap that resembles a piece of 542 00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:28,640 Speaker 1: Egyptian funerary sculpture. If you look at it, you'll kind 543 00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:30,320 Speaker 1: of be able to see the links between the two. 544 00:30:30,920 --> 00:30:34,320 Speaker 1: And I think that that wrap and the emergence from 545 00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:37,920 Speaker 1: it and the royal symbolism around it can depict so 546 00:30:37,960 --> 00:30:41,000 Speaker 1: many things. You know, there have been there's been scholarly 547 00:30:41,040 --> 00:30:44,360 Speaker 1: writing on it, and you know, critics and writers talking 548 00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:46,200 Speaker 1: about what they felt like it represented. But you can 549 00:30:46,200 --> 00:30:47,719 Speaker 1: take from it what you will, But I mean, I 550 00:30:47,720 --> 00:30:49,280 Speaker 1: think things that you can't get from it, or like 551 00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:53,720 Speaker 1: rebirth removing the constraints of the past while also acknowledging 552 00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:55,840 Speaker 1: the past and kind of a nod to the evolution 553 00:30:55,880 --> 00:31:01,040 Speaker 1: of Black Americans. So yeah, go on forever if we 554 00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:03,480 Speaker 1: were to get into all of her like works, because 555 00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:06,200 Speaker 1: there really are a pleasora of them, UM, even though 556 00:31:06,240 --> 00:31:09,160 Speaker 1: some of them were UM lost. But she created a 557 00:31:09,160 --> 00:31:12,479 Speaker 1: bunch of sculptures and continued to create into the nineteen 558 00:31:12,520 --> 00:31:16,080 Speaker 1: thirties and into the nineteen forties, much of that rooted 559 00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:20,560 Speaker 1: in African as well as Black American folk learning culture. Yeah, 560 00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:24,920 Speaker 1: and eventually her husband he he felt ill and and 561 00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:27,160 Speaker 1: she she didn't care for him, but he died in 562 00:31:27,240 --> 00:31:31,800 Speaker 1: nineteen fifty three. She also had tuberculosis and it took 563 00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:35,320 Speaker 1: her a few years to recover from that. But even 564 00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:38,719 Speaker 1: still she didn't recover. She took more commissions, and she 565 00:31:38,800 --> 00:31:43,320 Speaker 1: kept creating works like Crucifixion, which was a response to 566 00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:45,800 Speaker 1: the bombing of the Sixteenth Street Baptist Church in Birming 567 00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:48,040 Speaker 1: Him in nineteen sixty three. I think a lot of 568 00:31:48,040 --> 00:31:49,800 Speaker 1: people know that story as well. Well. I don't want 569 00:31:49,840 --> 00:31:51,920 Speaker 1: to make any assumptions, but that in which for four 570 00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:54,320 Speaker 1: girls died, that was during an era of so much 571 00:31:54,400 --> 00:31:57,520 Speaker 1: racial violence that was happening in the United States. So yeah, 572 00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:01,800 Speaker 1: she died Meta Meta a work. Buller died in in 573 00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:07,160 Speaker 1: Framingham and has been recognized since. Even though she isn't 574 00:32:07,240 --> 00:32:09,960 Speaker 1: someone who is a household name to people who are 575 00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:12,840 Speaker 1: just not our enthusiasts are just kind of more general 576 00:32:12,960 --> 00:32:15,840 Speaker 1: art enthusiasts at all, But she has been recognized in 577 00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:18,320 Speaker 1: certain ways and and her part work is in public 578 00:32:18,320 --> 00:32:21,240 Speaker 1: spaces and also is available to view at museums and 579 00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:23,720 Speaker 1: online still and like I said, we do have pictures 580 00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:27,520 Speaker 1: of her herself, which I think is always a nice edition. Yeah, 581 00:32:27,560 --> 00:32:44,280 Speaker 1: that's the short of her story. I would highly recommend 582 00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:47,240 Speaker 1: any listeners go look up her art because it really 583 00:32:47,320 --> 00:32:50,080 Speaker 1: is gorgeous. I'm I was happy because a lot of 584 00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:53,320 Speaker 1: times when we do these first you're right, there's a 585 00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:56,040 Speaker 1: lack of images. But they were like a lot of 586 00:32:56,120 --> 00:32:59,760 Speaker 1: museums and school websites I found that had them. Uh 587 00:33:00,080 --> 00:33:02,840 Speaker 1: so it's out there and we all recommend you go 588 00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:05,600 Speaker 1: look it up. Her pieces are so gorgeous, but it 589 00:33:05,680 --> 00:33:09,720 Speaker 1: also is so interesting to see her timeline from her 590 00:33:09,800 --> 00:33:13,040 Speaker 1: beginning with her art stuff to that point towards her 591 00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:15,560 Speaker 1: like the end of her life, because how much she 592 00:33:15,680 --> 00:33:19,480 Speaker 1: experienced and how much tragedy there was within obviously the 593 00:33:19,720 --> 00:33:22,400 Speaker 1: black community in the US, but then all around the world, 594 00:33:22,680 --> 00:33:25,560 Speaker 1: and her like actually being able to do it through art, 595 00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:28,760 Speaker 1: to show that timeline through art is phenomenal because between 596 00:33:28,840 --> 00:33:31,240 Speaker 1: that nineteen eighteen lynching, which is so horrific and happened 597 00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:33,840 Speaker 1: actually in the state of Georgia. It is so horrific 598 00:33:33,880 --> 00:33:36,080 Speaker 1: and not talked about enough, and why that was so 599 00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:39,240 Speaker 1: horrific and acknowledging the fact that it was an atrocity 600 00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:42,840 Speaker 1: to coming to the bombings, which is again towards the 601 00:33:42,880 --> 00:33:45,360 Speaker 1: biggest part of the civil rights movement where things were 602 00:33:45,360 --> 00:33:47,720 Speaker 1: happening and people were getting even more angry. Like, it's 603 00:33:47,760 --> 00:33:51,440 Speaker 1: just such an interesting timeline and I would love to 604 00:33:51,480 --> 00:33:53,000 Speaker 1: see like all of it laid out. I need to 605 00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:54,600 Speaker 1: go to the museum. I need to go right now. 606 00:33:54,720 --> 00:33:58,000 Speaker 1: What's the pandemic? But like it's such a gorgeous tell 607 00:33:58,280 --> 00:34:01,600 Speaker 1: of what she was thinking and what she was doing, 608 00:34:01,600 --> 00:34:03,800 Speaker 1: as well as just creating for herself. Like looking at 609 00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:06,920 Speaker 1: her art, like the Etheriopia Awakening that is a beautiful 610 00:34:06,960 --> 00:34:10,480 Speaker 1: piece and very historical for her, but it's celebrating was 611 00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:13,640 Speaker 1: they called it, the Black Pharaohs. That's what they called him. 612 00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:16,200 Speaker 1: And I think that's amazing, Like she's celebrating these cultures 613 00:34:16,200 --> 00:34:19,960 Speaker 1: but then also grieving through her art both of these things, 614 00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:22,239 Speaker 1: and then trying to make a statement at the same time, 615 00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:25,080 Speaker 1: you know, holding her art and her passion within herself. 616 00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:27,960 Speaker 1: It's just like you just see the range of emotions. 617 00:34:27,960 --> 00:34:29,800 Speaker 1: To me, I don't know, maybe I'm just being really 618 00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:32,640 Speaker 1: over the top about it and dramatic about it, as 619 00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:35,680 Speaker 1: per usual, but just the level of what you see 620 00:34:35,840 --> 00:34:38,759 Speaker 1: and just how it arises and being able to see 621 00:34:38,760 --> 00:34:41,000 Speaker 1: that in her art as glorious as well as I 622 00:34:41,000 --> 00:34:43,120 Speaker 1: think it's interesting for her to be keyed as the 623 00:34:43,280 --> 00:34:45,800 Speaker 1: like pre Harlem Renaissance. I don't know much about the 624 00:34:45,800 --> 00:34:48,560 Speaker 1: Harlem Renaissance, and I really should, like I know that 625 00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:50,719 Speaker 1: as like the Jazz era in my head, like and 626 00:34:50,719 --> 00:34:53,120 Speaker 1: and and and it's kind of a different turn to 627 00:34:53,160 --> 00:34:56,080 Speaker 1: see these sculptures and it's also gorgeous to see as 628 00:34:56,080 --> 00:34:58,200 Speaker 1: a part of that as well. Yeah, thank you for 629 00:34:58,200 --> 00:35:00,279 Speaker 1: bringing up that that was in Georgia, because is I 630 00:35:00,280 --> 00:35:02,360 Speaker 1: think that's one of those moments in which, you know, 631 00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:04,320 Speaker 1: sometimes we're like, why are these stories so important for 632 00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:06,080 Speaker 1: us to tell? And why are these people so important 633 00:35:06,080 --> 00:35:07,840 Speaker 1: for us to lift uplift in these times? And I 634 00:35:07,880 --> 00:35:12,040 Speaker 1: think when I find connections like that, like, it becomes 635 00:35:12,120 --> 00:35:14,960 Speaker 1: very visceral to me. Um. I don't think, Samantha, that 636 00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:18,160 Speaker 1: you should apologize for being emotional about art, because like 637 00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:23,080 Speaker 1: one like it's it is expressive, you know, the work 638 00:35:23,120 --> 00:35:26,200 Speaker 1: itself is emotional, but also like you can't help the 639 00:35:26,200 --> 00:35:28,600 Speaker 1: way that you respond to something and if it really 640 00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:30,600 Speaker 1: speaks to you in that way, and that's your natural 641 00:35:30,640 --> 00:35:33,160 Speaker 1: reaction to it, then that's totally understandable. I have cried 642 00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:38,000 Speaker 1: in many a museum and I actually love that, Like 643 00:35:38,040 --> 00:35:40,480 Speaker 1: I missed that, Like I wish that this pandemic was 644 00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:43,040 Speaker 1: over so I can cry in more museums because I 645 00:35:43,080 --> 00:35:45,239 Speaker 1: think it's it's really cool to be able to see 646 00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:47,680 Speaker 1: her work online, but there I do think that there's 647 00:35:47,719 --> 00:35:50,440 Speaker 1: something to be gained from also seeing her work in person, 648 00:35:50,560 --> 00:35:52,839 Speaker 1: and I would love to be able to. Don't think 649 00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:55,920 Speaker 1: I have in the past. Definitely not an exhibition completely 650 00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:59,520 Speaker 1: dedicated to her, but yeah, So I think going back 651 00:35:59,560 --> 00:36:01,919 Speaker 1: to the George of Pieces, where I started my train 652 00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:04,040 Speaker 1: of thoughts starting on this is just that that moment 653 00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:07,320 Speaker 1: of connection is saying like, she didn't live in Georgia, 654 00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:10,000 Speaker 1: but she was thinking about things that were happening in 655 00:36:10,040 --> 00:36:13,360 Speaker 1: Georgia at the time, and she was also highly affected 656 00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:15,839 Speaker 1: by something that was happening on the same, very same 657 00:36:15,880 --> 00:36:19,440 Speaker 1: soil that I'm walking on today and have spent nearly 658 00:36:19,440 --> 00:36:22,600 Speaker 1: the entirety of my life on. So I think that 659 00:36:22,600 --> 00:36:25,120 Speaker 1: that can kind of put things into perspective sometimes, like 660 00:36:25,160 --> 00:36:27,440 Speaker 1: even when a person's story seems like it's such an 661 00:36:27,560 --> 00:36:32,080 Speaker 1: arm's length away from you or that god like another 662 00:36:32,120 --> 00:36:34,880 Speaker 1: story about someone who was responding to like racism of 663 00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:39,560 Speaker 1: the United States in the twentieth century. But everybody's story 664 00:36:39,600 --> 00:36:43,000 Speaker 1: is different. And I think that looking at it from 665 00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:45,839 Speaker 1: her viewpoint and from a viewpoint of sculpture and knowing 666 00:36:45,880 --> 00:36:50,359 Speaker 1: what she was able to do despite the haters, it's 667 00:36:50,560 --> 00:36:55,160 Speaker 1: very valuable, right, agree, there are so many things you think, oh, 668 00:36:55,239 --> 00:36:58,200 Speaker 1: when is that closely and how we need to repair 669 00:36:58,400 --> 00:37:01,279 Speaker 1: what has happened, and then we still have obviously, and 670 00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:07,160 Speaker 1: that's part of the atrocity of what I think this situation. 671 00:37:07,280 --> 00:37:10,359 Speaker 1: Hate lends to that the fact that way back when 672 00:37:10,680 --> 00:37:13,759 Speaker 1: nineteen eighteen, a massacre happened and they just called it 673 00:37:13,760 --> 00:37:16,200 Speaker 1: a lynching, and that is not a big enough word 674 00:37:16,960 --> 00:37:19,960 Speaker 1: for what it was, and it reached her and reached 675 00:37:20,200 --> 00:37:23,120 Speaker 1: the community as a whole country, Like that's just the 676 00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:26,320 Speaker 1: significance of this happening in nineteen eighteen alone, just the 677 00:37:26,880 --> 00:37:29,280 Speaker 1: growth of what that meant and what that was, and 678 00:37:29,320 --> 00:37:32,560 Speaker 1: what that signified for a whole community, for a whole 679 00:37:32,840 --> 00:37:36,279 Speaker 1: race of people within a country. There's nothing we can 680 00:37:36,320 --> 00:37:39,520 Speaker 1: say that's how big of an effect that should have. 681 00:37:39,960 --> 00:37:42,040 Speaker 1: And and the fact that she did this, and the 682 00:37:42,080 --> 00:37:44,640 Speaker 1: fact that she alone, like it wasn't until you brought 683 00:37:44,680 --> 00:37:47,200 Speaker 1: her to us had I ever seen these works? And 684 00:37:47,239 --> 00:37:51,359 Speaker 1: I'm so upset and so angry that it took this long. 685 00:37:51,440 --> 00:37:54,399 Speaker 1: And and I love that the school is it Dan 686 00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:58,879 Speaker 1: Dan Dan for is it art Museum at Framingham? Yeah, 687 00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:01,600 Speaker 1: that the day actually have realized how valuable this is 688 00:38:01,640 --> 00:38:04,239 Speaker 1: and trying to collect the pieces to being donated or 689 00:38:04,280 --> 00:38:07,080 Speaker 1: gifted so they can display and talk about her works, 690 00:38:07,120 --> 00:38:11,200 Speaker 1: like I can't believe that it is. And a woman 691 00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:14,640 Speaker 1: who lived for ninety years doing all of this amazing work. 692 00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:17,279 Speaker 1: We haven't talked about her before today, Like I'm just 693 00:38:17,360 --> 00:38:19,960 Speaker 1: so upset and not knowing, And then her being that 694 00:38:20,200 --> 00:38:22,880 Speaker 1: iconic for a huge movement, whether it was the art 695 00:38:22,920 --> 00:38:24,920 Speaker 1: world or whether it was from the civil rights movement, 696 00:38:25,000 --> 00:38:27,400 Speaker 1: Like why why are we not talking more about what 697 00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:30,160 Speaker 1: she did and what she saw and how it impacted 698 00:38:30,160 --> 00:38:35,279 Speaker 1: her art? But anyway, I'm off my soapbox now we 699 00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:42,719 Speaker 1: like soapbox, Samantha are you? Oh, don't go home now? 700 00:38:42,960 --> 00:38:51,760 Speaker 1: Don't be it? You are? That's right? I forgot? Yeah, 701 00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:54,200 Speaker 1: I mean the power of art And this episode really 702 00:38:54,200 --> 00:39:00,840 Speaker 1: did make me miss museums. Yeah, really did. You'll be 703 00:39:00,920 --> 00:39:04,440 Speaker 1: crashing in a museum again. I hope so soon we 704 00:39:04,480 --> 00:39:09,480 Speaker 1: shall meet again. Is there anything else that we've missed 705 00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:11,880 Speaker 1: before we wrap it up here? I think that is 706 00:39:11,880 --> 00:39:15,920 Speaker 1: it for me? Awesome? Well, where can the good listeners 707 00:39:15,960 --> 00:39:18,920 Speaker 1: find you? As always, you can find me at eastco 708 00:39:19,080 --> 00:39:23,279 Speaker 1: on Twitter. You can find me at not Apologizing on Instagram. 709 00:39:23,320 --> 00:39:26,640 Speaker 1: Also on the podcast This Day and History Class, a 710 00:39:26,719 --> 00:39:29,279 Speaker 1: daily history show about people like you know, meet a 711 00:39:29,360 --> 00:39:31,399 Speaker 1: vote work fuller. Even though we have a specifically covered 712 00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:33,800 Speaker 1: are in the show a lot of other super interesting 713 00:39:33,840 --> 00:39:37,719 Speaker 1: biographies and events that happened that you may want to 714 00:39:37,760 --> 00:39:39,239 Speaker 1: learn about or may want to learn a little bit 715 00:39:39,280 --> 00:39:41,440 Speaker 1: more about. And also the show Unpopular, which is about 716 00:39:41,440 --> 00:39:45,040 Speaker 1: people in history who really booked traditions, booked norms and 717 00:39:45,120 --> 00:39:47,440 Speaker 1: were persecuted for it and how their stories played out 718 00:39:47,480 --> 00:39:52,480 Speaker 1: in the importance of those and that is what I got. 719 00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:57,560 Speaker 1: You can also find Eaves on this very show. Clearly 720 00:39:57,600 --> 00:40:01,600 Speaker 1: I think we've done like, oh yeah, maybe Tanda sees now, Yeah, 721 00:40:02,040 --> 00:40:04,680 Speaker 1: I think it's more. Oh yeah, it's more. Yeah, it's 722 00:40:04,719 --> 00:40:07,560 Speaker 1: not the front door. Have we had a use it's 723 00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:14,840 Speaker 1: been over a year. Yeah, we're gonna have a belated celebration. 724 00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:19,200 Speaker 1: I don't know how I'm actually taking the number right, 725 00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:25,360 Speaker 1: So uh nineteen So okay, so we've done nineteen. At twenty, 726 00:40:25,520 --> 00:40:27,520 Speaker 1: we'll have to do something, okay, I don't know what 727 00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:32,400 Speaker 1: the next episode, yes, yes, yes, everybody, everybody gets a cupcake. 728 00:40:32,480 --> 00:40:38,279 Speaker 1: I don't know. Everybody gets a cupcake. That's how I celebrate. 729 00:40:38,520 --> 00:40:41,120 Speaker 1: I was thinking of silly hats. I don't know, and 730 00:40:41,239 --> 00:40:44,040 Speaker 1: we clearly go in different Oh. I celebrate with fattening 731 00:40:44,040 --> 00:40:46,960 Speaker 1: food directions here. But we guys have to work it out. 732 00:40:47,080 --> 00:40:48,640 Speaker 1: I feel like in one of the very first episodes 733 00:40:48,680 --> 00:40:52,520 Speaker 1: we did use we were talking about getting champagne and cheesecake. 734 00:40:54,200 --> 00:40:56,359 Speaker 1: I don't know, cheesecake was the big cut talk because 735 00:40:56,400 --> 00:41:00,160 Speaker 1: I love cheesecake. Yeah yeah, I'm I'm here for right, 736 00:41:00,200 --> 00:41:02,279 Speaker 1: I like toothcakes. I'm just saying that we had a 737 00:41:02,320 --> 00:41:04,319 Speaker 1: big discussion about cheesecake and how much I love it. 738 00:41:04,560 --> 00:41:11,200 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, Oh well, we can figure this out meantime. Listeners, 739 00:41:11,200 --> 00:41:13,000 Speaker 1: if you would like to contact us, you can our 740 00:41:13,040 --> 00:41:15,640 Speaker 1: emails Stuff Media, mom Stuff I hurt media dot com. 741 00:41:15,920 --> 00:41:18,000 Speaker 1: You can also find us on Twitter at mom Stuff 742 00:41:18,000 --> 00:41:20,200 Speaker 1: podcast or on Instagram at stuff I've Never Told You 743 00:41:20,400 --> 00:41:23,960 Speaker 1: thanks It's always to our super producer Christina. Thank you, China, 744 00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:26,800 Speaker 1: and thanks to you for listening stuff I never told you. 745 00:41:26,840 --> 00:41:29,000 Speaker 1: Protection of I Heart Radio. For more podcasts from My 746 00:41:29,080 --> 00:41:31,240 Speaker 1: Heart Radio, visit That I Hear Adio, app, Apple podcast, 747 00:41:31,320 --> 00:41:32,880 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.