1 00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:09,680 Speaker 1: You're listening to I Choose Me with Jenny Garland. Hi, everyone, 2 00:00:09,760 --> 00:00:12,959 Speaker 1: welcome to I Choose Me. This podcast is all about 3 00:00:12,960 --> 00:00:16,200 Speaker 1: the choices we make and where they lead us. My 4 00:00:16,280 --> 00:00:20,759 Speaker 1: guest today grew up in Galveston, Texas, where she was 5 00:00:21,040 --> 00:00:25,600 Speaker 1: the youngest of seven children. She became a salon owner, 6 00:00:26,200 --> 00:00:31,920 Speaker 1: a fashion designer, and the mother of two female musical powerhouses, 7 00:00:32,720 --> 00:00:36,159 Speaker 1: and in recent years she launched the hair care brand 8 00:00:36,720 --> 00:00:41,760 Speaker 1: Sacred with one of her daughters. Her incredible memoir, Matriarch, 9 00:00:42,040 --> 00:00:46,120 Speaker 1: is out now and it is so interesting to hear 10 00:00:46,200 --> 00:00:50,560 Speaker 1: her story. Through this book, she weaves not only the 11 00:00:50,640 --> 00:00:54,600 Speaker 1: history of her own family, but historical moments that shaped 12 00:00:54,720 --> 00:00:58,960 Speaker 1: the woman she became. I cannot wait to talk with 13 00:00:59,000 --> 00:01:02,840 Speaker 1: her all about it. Please welcome Ms. Tina Knowles to 14 00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:07,720 Speaker 1: the podcast. Well hello, Beyaure, it is such an honor 15 00:01:07,720 --> 00:01:12,280 Speaker 1: to have you here. Your book is so beautifully written. 16 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:13,600 Speaker 2: Well, thank you. 17 00:01:14,240 --> 00:01:17,840 Speaker 1: I mean the way you intertwined your own history and 18 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:21,680 Speaker 1: your life journey with the experiences you had growing up 19 00:01:21,760 --> 00:01:24,920 Speaker 1: during the civil rights movement, as well as sharing the 20 00:01:25,000 --> 00:01:26,920 Speaker 1: racism you and your family are endured and all the 21 00:01:27,000 --> 00:01:30,360 Speaker 1: hardships that you all overcame. You painted such a vivid 22 00:01:30,400 --> 00:01:33,360 Speaker 1: picture for me as a reader, and it was truly 23 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:34,759 Speaker 1: an honor to read it. 24 00:01:35,319 --> 00:01:37,120 Speaker 2: Thank you so much. 25 00:01:37,240 --> 00:01:39,720 Speaker 1: I mean it. One of the things that I loved 26 00:01:40,160 --> 00:01:44,440 Speaker 1: about your memoir was being able to take a look 27 00:01:44,520 --> 00:01:47,440 Speaker 1: into your past, your parents' past, your aunts, and your 28 00:01:47,520 --> 00:01:53,360 Speaker 1: uncle's really sharing so much about the family that made 29 00:01:53,400 --> 00:01:57,400 Speaker 1: you who you are. It was very interesting to me. 30 00:01:57,480 --> 00:02:01,440 Speaker 1: I have to be honest, being the youngest child, I 31 00:02:01,440 --> 00:02:03,920 Speaker 1: feel like you learned so much by observing your older 32 00:02:03,960 --> 00:02:08,639 Speaker 1: sisters and your brother's life choices. But you were kind 33 00:02:08,639 --> 00:02:12,880 Speaker 1: of your own thing. You were a tenacious little girl 34 00:02:13,320 --> 00:02:17,120 Speaker 1: and so beautifully curious. You had a strength in you 35 00:02:17,160 --> 00:02:22,600 Speaker 1: from the very beginning, which I identified with. You describe a 36 00:02:22,639 --> 00:02:27,359 Speaker 1: defining moment with the mean nuns at your school when 37 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:30,760 Speaker 1: you stood up for yourself and you said, I belong 38 00:02:31,040 --> 00:02:32,320 Speaker 1: wherever I want to be. 39 00:02:33,720 --> 00:02:33,919 Speaker 2: That. 40 00:02:34,360 --> 00:02:36,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, that made me get the goosies. To have that 41 00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:38,880 Speaker 1: kind of confidence in that voice at such a young 42 00:02:38,919 --> 00:02:41,760 Speaker 1: age like that. Do you think that you got that 43 00:02:42,040 --> 00:02:44,880 Speaker 1: from your mom and the women before her in your life, 44 00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:46,639 Speaker 1: or do you really feel like you learned so much 45 00:02:46,639 --> 00:02:48,280 Speaker 1: of that from your siblings. 46 00:02:49,040 --> 00:02:52,560 Speaker 2: I think that for me, honestly, my mother was not 47 00:02:53,200 --> 00:02:58,600 Speaker 2: the most outspoken person. But but I know that I 48 00:02:58,680 --> 00:03:03,960 Speaker 2: have that lineage because of both of my great grandmothers 49 00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:07,720 Speaker 2: were slaves, but they managed to keep their family together 50 00:03:07,880 --> 00:03:11,399 Speaker 2: and a time when you know, families were totally separated. 51 00:03:12,040 --> 00:03:14,760 Speaker 2: And so although I never got to meet them or 52 00:03:14,800 --> 00:03:17,919 Speaker 2: talk to them or whatever, I would imagine that that 53 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:23,119 Speaker 2: fighting spirit was there, just passed down from generation to generation. 54 00:03:23,480 --> 00:03:28,079 Speaker 2: And that the other thing that I've often thought, because sometimes, 55 00:03:28,120 --> 00:03:30,960 Speaker 2: you know, I talked to people about my history with 56 00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:34,000 Speaker 2: the nuns and how I stood up to them as 57 00:03:34,120 --> 00:03:36,080 Speaker 2: much as I could be in a five year old 58 00:03:36,120 --> 00:03:40,280 Speaker 2: and not really being greatly protected by my mother because 59 00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:42,119 Speaker 2: she was I just felt like she was a little 60 00:03:42,160 --> 00:03:45,920 Speaker 2: brainwashed by the Catholic religion. And I also was born 61 00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:49,680 Speaker 2: to forty four year old parents, and talking to my siblings, 62 00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:52,160 Speaker 2: They're like, you got away with murder. I think that 63 00:03:52,360 --> 00:03:54,720 Speaker 2: was tired. They were trying my mama. 64 00:03:55,520 --> 00:03:58,120 Speaker 1: That's so true with the baby of a family. They 65 00:03:58,160 --> 00:03:59,200 Speaker 1: get away with so much. 66 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:03,200 Speaker 2: I would talk back all the time, and you know, 67 00:04:03,400 --> 00:04:05,680 Speaker 2: I was like, that's how I got the name badass 68 00:04:05,720 --> 00:04:09,240 Speaker 2: teen to b because older people. I was having a 69 00:04:09,240 --> 00:04:11,840 Speaker 2: conversation with my friend Holly pet and she was saying, 70 00:04:11,880 --> 00:04:14,040 Speaker 2: you know, when I was a kid, no adults like me. 71 00:04:14,440 --> 00:04:16,680 Speaker 2: I was like, that's an understatement for me. They would 72 00:04:16,720 --> 00:04:19,360 Speaker 2: be like that little teeny has got the smartest mouth. 73 00:04:19,839 --> 00:04:22,560 Speaker 2: But thank God for that because it gave me the 74 00:04:22,600 --> 00:04:25,800 Speaker 2: ability to fight these nuns and for them not to 75 00:04:25,880 --> 00:04:29,440 Speaker 2: kill my spirit, because they told me constantly, you have 76 00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:32,800 Speaker 2: an evil spirit, and we're going to take that spirit down. 77 00:04:32,839 --> 00:04:35,679 Speaker 2: We're gonna you know, like they were helping me because 78 00:04:35,720 --> 00:04:38,280 Speaker 2: I was like, you know, evil or whatever, and I 79 00:04:38,320 --> 00:04:40,400 Speaker 2: was only five years old. I didn't even know what 80 00:04:40,440 --> 00:04:43,279 Speaker 2: they were talking about. But I did know that when 81 00:04:43,279 --> 00:04:45,520 Speaker 2: they told me these other things about me, that I 82 00:04:45,560 --> 00:04:48,520 Speaker 2: had to fight them. And it's prepared me for my 83 00:04:48,560 --> 00:04:52,200 Speaker 2: whole life because I've been fighting my whole life fighting. 84 00:04:52,200 --> 00:04:54,159 Speaker 2: I'm seventy one years old and I still have to 85 00:04:54,160 --> 00:04:57,680 Speaker 2: fight all the time for respect sometimes, you know. 86 00:04:57,839 --> 00:05:01,000 Speaker 1: Yep, yep. I can definitely relate. While you were writing 87 00:05:01,040 --> 00:05:03,960 Speaker 1: this book, did you let your daughters read anything early 88 00:05:04,040 --> 00:05:06,599 Speaker 1: on so you could get their feedback? Well? 89 00:05:06,680 --> 00:05:10,920 Speaker 2: I didn't, But what I did do is I gathered 90 00:05:10,960 --> 00:05:14,479 Speaker 2: together all of their parts and I sent them to 91 00:05:14,560 --> 00:05:18,479 Speaker 2: them to listen to on voice and actually the guy 92 00:05:19,000 --> 00:05:22,680 Speaker 2: Kevin O'Leary, who became like family to me, who helped 93 00:05:22,680 --> 00:05:24,880 Speaker 2: me write the book. He did all the fact checking 94 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:29,280 Speaker 2: and you know the things that good writers do. He 95 00:05:31,000 --> 00:05:32,920 Speaker 2: did it in his voice, and I sent it to 96 00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:35,799 Speaker 2: them and they were able to tell me if they approved, 97 00:05:35,839 --> 00:05:37,599 Speaker 2: and if they didn't approve. I wouldn't have put it 98 00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:41,600 Speaker 2: in a book because I verified, like always terrified to 99 00:05:41,640 --> 00:05:45,200 Speaker 2: write a book and to tell somebody else's story. I 100 00:05:45,279 --> 00:05:48,000 Speaker 2: don't want to do that, you know, have their story 101 00:05:48,040 --> 00:05:51,240 Speaker 2: to tell themselves, especially when my kids, because there's been 102 00:05:51,240 --> 00:05:56,440 Speaker 2: so many crazy mrs and craziness that's been out there, 103 00:05:56,520 --> 00:05:59,440 Speaker 2: you know, really wanted them to approve. 104 00:06:00,400 --> 00:06:03,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, I can imagine. I'm a mother of three daughters too, 105 00:06:04,120 --> 00:06:08,560 Speaker 1: and I value my position as a mother more than 106 00:06:08,640 --> 00:06:11,360 Speaker 1: any accomplishment I think I've ever had or will have. 107 00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:12,640 Speaker 2: Absolutely. 108 00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:16,479 Speaker 1: Yeah, what do you think the biggest blessing is when 109 00:06:16,480 --> 00:06:18,160 Speaker 1: it comes to having daughters? 110 00:06:18,560 --> 00:06:22,080 Speaker 2: Oh? God, it's the best. I mean, you get to 111 00:06:22,800 --> 00:06:27,560 Speaker 2: watch them grow and learn, and they teach you things 112 00:06:27,600 --> 00:06:31,159 Speaker 2: every day. I'm sure you're teaching you things every day, 113 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:35,719 Speaker 2: and you get to kind of get a you know, 114 00:06:35,880 --> 00:06:38,520 Speaker 2: just all the things that you know as a kid 115 00:06:38,640 --> 00:06:42,880 Speaker 2: and growing up that affected you. Adversely, you get to 116 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:46,760 Speaker 2: not do those things to your daughters. How amazing is that? 117 00:06:46,880 --> 00:06:46,960 Speaker 1: So? 118 00:06:47,800 --> 00:06:52,720 Speaker 2: I think, you know, they teach me things every day. 119 00:06:52,760 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 2: I'm learning things from my daughters, always has as they 120 00:06:55,520 --> 00:06:58,600 Speaker 2: were kids. They taught me so much too, So I 121 00:06:58,680 --> 00:07:01,200 Speaker 2: just think it's the best if in the world. Too. 122 00:07:01,520 --> 00:07:03,440 Speaker 2: I thought I wanted a boy, but I'm just so 123 00:07:03,520 --> 00:07:05,760 Speaker 2: happy that God blessed me with those girls. 124 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:07,919 Speaker 1: You know what, I thought I was going to have 125 00:07:07,960 --> 00:07:11,480 Speaker 1: three boys really from when I was a little girl, 126 00:07:11,560 --> 00:07:16,480 Speaker 1: and I turned out having three girls, and I'm so grateful. 127 00:07:17,040 --> 00:07:18,400 Speaker 1: I don't know what I would do with a boy. 128 00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:19,960 Speaker 2: I know same, you. 129 00:07:21,520 --> 00:07:25,160 Speaker 1: Have grandsons, sons more than grandsons. 130 00:07:25,200 --> 00:07:30,760 Speaker 2: I had grandsons and one of them is twenty and 131 00:07:30,800 --> 00:07:33,160 Speaker 2: he is a joy to have around. He actually I 132 00:07:33,200 --> 00:07:35,440 Speaker 2: got the pleasure of he's been living with me for 133 00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:39,280 Speaker 2: the last couple of years. Nice, and you know, it's 134 00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:41,680 Speaker 2: been new for me because, like you said, I don't 135 00:07:41,760 --> 00:07:46,120 Speaker 2: really I haven't been around boys that much. And even 136 00:07:46,160 --> 00:07:48,240 Speaker 2: from when he was a little kid, I kept him 137 00:07:48,280 --> 00:07:52,000 Speaker 2: a lot, and it was totally different with a boy. 138 00:07:52,520 --> 00:07:57,320 Speaker 2: I didn't know what I was doing. I imagine it's 139 00:07:57,440 --> 00:08:02,720 Speaker 2: joyful as well. But I'm glad I gave me girls didoh. 140 00:08:03,000 --> 00:08:06,640 Speaker 1: I loved in your book how you acknowledge that you 141 00:08:06,720 --> 00:08:10,160 Speaker 1: didn't want the lounge to be overshadowed by Beyonce's music 142 00:08:10,200 --> 00:08:12,680 Speaker 1: career when it was first starting out. And I think 143 00:08:13,160 --> 00:08:16,360 Speaker 1: that that feeling is universal for moms, and I can 144 00:08:16,400 --> 00:08:19,720 Speaker 1: really relate to that, not only as a mom, but 145 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:24,160 Speaker 1: also as a daughter who broke into fame and had 146 00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:29,040 Speaker 1: my own feelings about overshadowing my sisters. How did you 147 00:08:29,120 --> 00:08:32,800 Speaker 1: manage that and how do you make all of your 148 00:08:32,880 --> 00:08:35,800 Speaker 1: kids feel equally loved and equally supported. 149 00:08:36,760 --> 00:08:38,760 Speaker 2: I think the first thing is that you have to 150 00:08:38,840 --> 00:08:42,520 Speaker 2: see the differences in them. My kids are so you know, 151 00:08:42,559 --> 00:08:45,240 Speaker 2: I claim Kelly Rowland as my daughter as well, and 152 00:08:46,760 --> 00:08:49,640 Speaker 2: you know, all three of them couldn't have been more different. 153 00:08:50,480 --> 00:08:55,000 Speaker 2: And I think looking at each kid as an individual 154 00:08:55,200 --> 00:08:57,680 Speaker 2: and not just lumping them because you know, I'm the 155 00:08:57,800 --> 00:09:02,680 Speaker 2: youngest of seven. Sister had eight children. So I remember 156 00:09:02,760 --> 00:09:06,600 Speaker 2: my sister spending group time with her kids. You know, 157 00:09:06,720 --> 00:09:11,480 Speaker 2: she used to call them Lena, Denise, Tommy, Rnney she 158 00:09:11,720 --> 00:09:13,439 Speaker 2: you know, she had so many kids she would call 159 00:09:13,480 --> 00:09:18,000 Speaker 2: them all the names. Oh you know who I mean. 160 00:09:18,200 --> 00:09:21,080 Speaker 2: And my mom used to get so upset about that, 161 00:09:21,200 --> 00:09:23,640 Speaker 2: and she would say, you can't do that. Your kids 162 00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:26,360 Speaker 2: are individuals and you have to look at them as 163 00:09:26,400 --> 00:09:29,120 Speaker 2: different kids. Don't ever do that. And she was like, yeah, 164 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:31,960 Speaker 2: that's because you don't have all these kids fair steps. 165 00:09:32,440 --> 00:09:35,520 Speaker 2: But I learned that very early to look at my 166 00:09:35,640 --> 00:09:40,199 Speaker 2: kids as individuals and not to you know, Beyonce was 167 00:09:40,240 --> 00:09:42,360 Speaker 2: like this little superstar and by the time she was 168 00:09:42,559 --> 00:09:46,240 Speaker 2: eight or nine years old performing everywhere, and Solange was 169 00:09:46,640 --> 00:09:50,520 Speaker 2: came along and was just as talented, but she didn't 170 00:09:50,559 --> 00:09:53,840 Speaker 2: have that experience, and so I didn't want that. I 171 00:09:53,880 --> 00:09:58,640 Speaker 2: started seeing Beyonce being irritated by her and not being 172 00:09:58,679 --> 00:10:01,440 Speaker 2: so nice to her little sister her because she had 173 00:10:01,559 --> 00:10:04,040 Speaker 2: this group around her and other friends and they would 174 00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:07,280 Speaker 2: all say be quiet Solange, and Solange would be trying 175 00:10:07,280 --> 00:10:10,480 Speaker 2: to boss everybody around and teach them the choreography and 176 00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:12,520 Speaker 2: make up steps, and they were like, you are sick, 177 00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:16,319 Speaker 2: sit down and be quiet, and Beyonce was not all 178 00:10:16,360 --> 00:10:19,080 Speaker 2: of a sudden, not defending her. So it scared me. 179 00:10:19,160 --> 00:10:21,920 Speaker 2: So I got them in therapy really early on so 180 00:10:21,960 --> 00:10:24,120 Speaker 2: that they could learn. Beyonce could be learned to be 181 00:10:24,760 --> 00:10:28,160 Speaker 2: sensitive to what her sister was going through and for 182 00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:32,040 Speaker 2: Solange to be respectful of her big sister, and you know, 183 00:10:32,080 --> 00:10:35,840 Speaker 2: they've been close every since. I was terrified of there 184 00:10:35,880 --> 00:10:39,880 Speaker 2: being a divide with them close. Yeah definitely. 185 00:10:40,160 --> 00:10:42,560 Speaker 1: I mean you said you put the girls in therapy 186 00:10:42,600 --> 00:10:45,680 Speaker 1: at one point. I'm a huge advocate for mental health 187 00:10:45,840 --> 00:10:49,760 Speaker 1: and therapy, so I commend you for that, especially back 188 00:10:50,080 --> 00:10:52,800 Speaker 1: then during a time when it wasn't that widely accepted. 189 00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:57,200 Speaker 2: No, and my family was not very happy about it. 190 00:10:57,240 --> 00:11:00,520 Speaker 2: They kept saying, you are crazy, you know, so weird 191 00:11:00,600 --> 00:11:03,720 Speaker 2: and why are you doing this? And even my husband 192 00:11:03,760 --> 00:11:08,360 Speaker 2: didn't complain about it, but he didn't really I don't 193 00:11:08,400 --> 00:11:10,320 Speaker 2: think he really believed in it. So I just said, 194 00:11:10,320 --> 00:11:12,160 Speaker 2: I'm going to do it myself. I don't need a 195 00:11:12,200 --> 00:11:14,400 Speaker 2: team of people to do this. I'm going to find 196 00:11:14,400 --> 00:11:16,680 Speaker 2: a therapist and I'm gonna get my kids in therapy. 197 00:11:17,080 --> 00:11:19,319 Speaker 2: And it was the best move I could have ever made. 198 00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:23,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely, because what's so important to me is that 199 00:11:23,240 --> 00:11:25,480 Speaker 1: when I'm gone, that they have each other and they're 200 00:11:25,520 --> 00:11:27,240 Speaker 1: not just sisters, but they're friends. 201 00:11:27,440 --> 00:11:29,439 Speaker 2: You know, how old are your girls? 202 00:11:29,640 --> 00:11:32,320 Speaker 1: My oldest is twenty seven. I have a twenty two 203 00:11:32,360 --> 00:11:32,839 Speaker 1: year old and. 204 00:11:32,800 --> 00:11:34,720 Speaker 2: A twenty year old oven yourself girl. 205 00:11:35,200 --> 00:11:37,880 Speaker 1: Hah good, I love that. Thank you. 206 00:11:38,160 --> 00:11:42,640 Speaker 2: How old is the youngest? Eighteen eighteen? Why you got 207 00:11:42,679 --> 00:11:43,439 Speaker 2: grown girls? 208 00:11:43,640 --> 00:11:48,360 Speaker 1: I do? I'm almost free. How did you see though, 209 00:11:48,800 --> 00:11:52,560 Speaker 1: your girl's benefit from having therapy at such a young age, 210 00:11:52,600 --> 00:11:55,719 Speaker 1: because I definitely had some times when my girls were 211 00:11:55,720 --> 00:11:56,400 Speaker 1: in therapy too. 212 00:11:57,200 --> 00:12:01,880 Speaker 2: Yeah. I saw the benefit immediately. With all of a sudden, 213 00:12:01,880 --> 00:12:06,480 Speaker 2: Beyonce understood her that her little sister, what she was 214 00:12:06,520 --> 00:12:11,760 Speaker 2: going through. She just became so much more protective and 215 00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:15,120 Speaker 2: sensitive because that's how they were. She was so happy 216 00:12:15,120 --> 00:12:17,400 Speaker 2: to have a little sister, and she was such a 217 00:12:17,400 --> 00:12:20,440 Speaker 2: great big sister. And then around ten, when she got 218 00:12:20,480 --> 00:12:22,800 Speaker 2: in the singing group, it was like, you know, a 219 00:12:22,840 --> 00:12:25,960 Speaker 2: five year old taking your stuff and coming in and 220 00:12:26,000 --> 00:12:30,600 Speaker 2: butting in and tagging along, and it made her more sensitive. 221 00:12:30,600 --> 00:12:35,120 Speaker 2: And as she became more sensitive to Solange, Solange felt 222 00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:38,360 Speaker 2: like she didn't have to do so much to get 223 00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:41,920 Speaker 2: her attention, and they just got to be close and 224 00:12:41,960 --> 00:12:45,080 Speaker 2: protective of each other and they still are today. So 225 00:12:45,679 --> 00:12:46,200 Speaker 2: it worked. 226 00:12:47,440 --> 00:12:57,280 Speaker 1: I'm so happy that you did that. Honestly, before reading 227 00:12:57,280 --> 00:12:59,240 Speaker 1: your book, I knew that you had had a successful 228 00:12:59,280 --> 00:13:03,640 Speaker 1: career in fashion industry. You were known for making such beautiful, 229 00:13:03,720 --> 00:13:08,120 Speaker 1: gorgeous outfits for Destiny's Child and then your fashion line, 230 00:13:08,240 --> 00:13:11,199 Speaker 1: House of Darien. But I didn't know that being a 231 00:13:11,240 --> 00:13:13,520 Speaker 1: seamstress ran so deeply in your family. 232 00:13:13,920 --> 00:13:18,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, from generations after generations. You know, everyone in my family, 233 00:13:18,800 --> 00:13:23,240 Speaker 2: both my sisters sewed that could really sew, and it's 234 00:13:23,559 --> 00:13:26,680 Speaker 2: it's our legacy and it's the thing that I think 235 00:13:28,720 --> 00:13:31,880 Speaker 2: kept us from you know, I grew up really poor, 236 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:35,120 Speaker 2: but when you have a skill like sewing or doing 237 00:13:35,200 --> 00:13:37,600 Speaker 2: hair or something like that, you never broke. That's what 238 00:13:37,760 --> 00:13:40,400 Speaker 2: my mama's philosophy was, and it was very true, because 239 00:13:40,440 --> 00:13:41,880 Speaker 2: you can always make money. 240 00:13:42,280 --> 00:13:45,440 Speaker 1: So true. And I think sewing is sort of a 241 00:13:45,720 --> 00:13:48,640 Speaker 1: dying art. I know, my mom taught me how to 242 00:13:48,640 --> 00:13:51,840 Speaker 1: make pies, and I taught my daughters how to make pies, 243 00:13:52,280 --> 00:13:54,400 Speaker 1: and I feel like nobody knows how to make pies anymore. 244 00:13:54,400 --> 00:13:56,120 Speaker 1: And it's kind of the same. I know how to sew, 245 00:13:56,160 --> 00:13:57,760 Speaker 1: and I've taught my daughters how to sew, but I 246 00:13:57,760 --> 00:13:59,640 Speaker 1: don't feel like other people know how to sew anymore. 247 00:14:00,640 --> 00:14:03,760 Speaker 2: And you know, it's funny because even with stylist, I 248 00:14:03,800 --> 00:14:06,079 Speaker 2: was a stylist, but I also was a seamstress, so 249 00:14:06,240 --> 00:14:08,719 Speaker 2: I know the construction of clothes. I know how they're 250 00:14:08,760 --> 00:14:13,440 Speaker 2: supposed to fit. And I was always surprised that I 251 00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:15,599 Speaker 2: would get stylist and they wouldn't even know how to 252 00:14:15,640 --> 00:14:16,320 Speaker 2: put him in. 253 00:14:17,000 --> 00:14:20,440 Speaker 1: No, they pin it. They barely know how to pin things. Sometimes. 254 00:14:20,720 --> 00:14:24,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, I like double stick, but it's only there for 255 00:14:24,920 --> 00:14:25,440 Speaker 2: so long. 256 00:14:25,720 --> 00:14:29,640 Speaker 1: No, it doesn't work forever. Choosing to share your life 257 00:14:29,800 --> 00:14:34,720 Speaker 1: with the world is a very brave decision. I'm curious 258 00:14:34,840 --> 00:14:39,280 Speaker 1: as you were going back through the moments of your life, 259 00:14:39,600 --> 00:14:43,400 Speaker 1: what were the things that were harder for you to 260 00:14:43,640 --> 00:14:45,200 Speaker 1: relive than others. 261 00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:54,160 Speaker 2: The pain of losing my mom, my dad, my best 262 00:14:54,240 --> 00:14:59,080 Speaker 2: friend Johnny. Those are hard, you know. I just finished 263 00:14:59,400 --> 00:15:03,320 Speaker 2: I did that the audio book. Yeah, and I tell 264 00:15:03,360 --> 00:15:05,840 Speaker 2: you that there was so many tears. I'm like, Tina, 265 00:15:05,960 --> 00:15:08,440 Speaker 2: you've read this book, I don't know how many times, 266 00:15:08,480 --> 00:15:12,200 Speaker 2: and you're still crying. You know. Those were the hardest 267 00:15:12,600 --> 00:15:17,359 Speaker 2: things to talk about and to talk about that experience 268 00:15:17,800 --> 00:15:22,640 Speaker 2: and not feel so sad and so empty. When it 269 00:15:22,720 --> 00:15:25,440 Speaker 2: came to just losing the people that I love, it 270 00:15:25,560 --> 00:15:27,080 Speaker 2: definitely was the hardest part. 271 00:15:28,200 --> 00:15:31,680 Speaker 1: I know that reading the audio version of the book 272 00:15:31,800 --> 00:15:36,360 Speaker 1: can bring up so much. How many days did you 273 00:15:36,400 --> 00:15:37,680 Speaker 1: take to do your recording. 274 00:15:38,560 --> 00:15:41,520 Speaker 2: I think it took me like three weeks, but not 275 00:15:41,720 --> 00:15:44,480 Speaker 2: every day all day. Some days were long, some was shorter, 276 00:15:44,600 --> 00:15:47,280 Speaker 2: and some days got so emotional for me that I 277 00:15:47,320 --> 00:15:50,880 Speaker 2: had to stop, you know, because I'm like, they don't 278 00:15:50,880 --> 00:15:53,520 Speaker 2: want you to have the emotion in the book. They're like, Okay, 279 00:15:53,640 --> 00:15:57,080 Speaker 2: blow your nose and you know, clear your throat and 280 00:15:57,200 --> 00:16:01,280 Speaker 2: drink something. So they don't really want you to have 281 00:16:01,320 --> 00:16:05,200 Speaker 2: that voice of emotion. But I actually wanted my book 282 00:16:05,240 --> 00:16:07,840 Speaker 2: to have that would have been okay with me. 283 00:16:08,200 --> 00:16:11,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, I would think so. I mean, because I feel 284 00:16:11,720 --> 00:16:14,000 Speaker 1: you mentioned the loss of your mom and your dad 285 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:16,720 Speaker 1: and Johnny. I feel like I know them because you 286 00:16:16,800 --> 00:16:18,160 Speaker 1: wrote about them so vividly. 287 00:16:18,960 --> 00:16:21,320 Speaker 2: That's a that's a that's a real compliment. 288 00:16:21,640 --> 00:16:25,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, I do. Were there was there ever a point 289 00:16:25,520 --> 00:16:28,840 Speaker 1: when you were writing the book that you thought, oh, 290 00:16:28,880 --> 00:16:31,120 Speaker 1: this is too much. I'm not I'm not sure that 291 00:16:31,160 --> 00:16:33,280 Speaker 1: being this open with the world is a good idea. 292 00:16:33,440 --> 00:16:36,480 Speaker 2: All the time. And another thing is this book had 293 00:16:36,520 --> 00:16:39,880 Speaker 2: a thousand pages, and they were like, Lucina, you gotta 294 00:16:40,160 --> 00:16:43,320 Speaker 2: make this book five. Nobody's gonna read a thousand page book, 295 00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:46,000 Speaker 2: And so I had to go in and take a lot. 296 00:16:46,040 --> 00:16:48,160 Speaker 2: And it's so much that I had to take out 297 00:16:48,200 --> 00:16:52,520 Speaker 2: that I thought was so great, But a lot of 298 00:16:52,600 --> 00:16:57,240 Speaker 2: things I was I was relieved to take them out 299 00:16:57,280 --> 00:17:00,440 Speaker 2: because this is scary. This is like a baby, you know, 300 00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:05,720 Speaker 2: I know that, you know some people are you know 301 00:17:05,720 --> 00:17:10,080 Speaker 2: they're going to use things to try to tear you apart. 302 00:17:10,280 --> 00:17:12,800 Speaker 2: You know, it's just the nature of the beast. And 303 00:17:12,880 --> 00:17:16,359 Speaker 2: it's very scary for me. And I'm being such a 304 00:17:16,359 --> 00:17:19,879 Speaker 2: private person and from a private family. This is a lot. 305 00:17:20,840 --> 00:17:22,919 Speaker 1: A lot is a lot. It is a lot. I mean, 306 00:17:22,960 --> 00:17:26,000 Speaker 1: you were really open in the book. You talk about 307 00:17:26,000 --> 00:17:29,479 Speaker 1: the ups and the downs of your first marriage and 308 00:17:29,520 --> 00:17:35,000 Speaker 1: how you chose to not be dependent on him. I 309 00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:38,760 Speaker 1: think Beyonce was already born and you were pregnant with Solange, 310 00:17:38,880 --> 00:17:42,159 Speaker 1: and you had that moment when you said to yourself, 311 00:17:43,119 --> 00:17:44,520 Speaker 1: You'll have to be your own boss. 312 00:17:45,520 --> 00:17:53,679 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, because I knew that I was not cut out. Two. 313 00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:58,280 Speaker 2: I don't know how to say this without sounding ob noxious, 314 00:17:58,359 --> 00:18:03,320 Speaker 2: but like I knew I couldn't go and worked for 315 00:18:03,400 --> 00:18:05,320 Speaker 2: somebody at that time in my life. It was too 316 00:18:05,400 --> 00:18:07,879 Speaker 2: much going on and I had to be in charge 317 00:18:07,920 --> 00:18:11,679 Speaker 2: of my life. I was so out of charge with 318 00:18:11,800 --> 00:18:14,399 Speaker 2: everything else that I had to be in charge of 319 00:18:14,440 --> 00:18:19,320 Speaker 2: my destiny, you know, in my job, and I knew 320 00:18:19,680 --> 00:18:22,560 Speaker 2: I wanted to have a hair salon, but I couldn't 321 00:18:22,600 --> 00:18:25,080 Speaker 2: go work for somebody else first, and I didn't. I 322 00:18:25,119 --> 00:18:29,120 Speaker 2: went straight into my own salon, which I wouldn't suggest 323 00:18:29,359 --> 00:18:32,879 Speaker 2: to anybody else. But it worked for me. It worked 324 00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:36,040 Speaker 2: for me because when I was in beauty school, I 325 00:18:36,119 --> 00:18:39,480 Speaker 2: already built my clientele. I had been planning and planning, 326 00:18:39,520 --> 00:18:43,080 Speaker 2: and I had a great plan and it worked. But 327 00:18:43,160 --> 00:18:45,120 Speaker 2: it doesn't work for everybody. 328 00:18:45,320 --> 00:18:48,639 Speaker 1: Right, Do you feel like you got lucky in some respects? 329 00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:54,280 Speaker 2: I was blessed that God opened up a door for 330 00:18:54,400 --> 00:18:58,200 Speaker 2: me and he made it all work smooth, because when 331 00:18:58,240 --> 00:18:59,879 Speaker 2: I told the story in the book, I was like, 332 00:19:00,720 --> 00:19:03,280 Speaker 2: you had a lot of nerves, Like you had a 333 00:19:03,320 --> 00:19:05,679 Speaker 2: lot of nerve to go open the salon and you 334 00:19:05,760 --> 00:19:09,520 Speaker 2: didn't have like you didn't have enough clientele. You didn't 335 00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:13,840 Speaker 2: have you had never worked for another salon, and you 336 00:19:13,880 --> 00:19:16,800 Speaker 2: had the audacity to say, I'm not going to work 337 00:19:16,800 --> 00:19:19,080 Speaker 2: for anybody else. I'm gonna open my own business. And 338 00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:19,800 Speaker 2: it worked. 339 00:19:20,640 --> 00:19:24,200 Speaker 1: It did work, Missina. This is crazy because my mom 340 00:19:24,800 --> 00:19:28,480 Speaker 1: when I was younger, a little girl growing up in Illinois. 341 00:19:29,200 --> 00:19:33,000 Speaker 1: She had a very similar sounding path to you in 342 00:19:33,040 --> 00:19:35,760 Speaker 1: the respect that she knew she needed to take control 343 00:19:35,840 --> 00:19:38,360 Speaker 1: of her life and she opened up a hair salon 344 00:19:38,680 --> 00:19:41,240 Speaker 1: just like you. 345 00:19:41,240 --> 00:19:42,040 Speaker 2: You're kidding me. 346 00:19:42,480 --> 00:19:45,159 Speaker 1: No, it's just all coming back to me as a 347 00:19:45,160 --> 00:19:47,200 Speaker 1: little girl. I would go to work with her in 348 00:19:47,280 --> 00:19:50,359 Speaker 1: her salon. It was called Cobets that was in a 349 00:19:50,480 --> 00:19:54,040 Speaker 1: very small town in rural Illinois, and I would go 350 00:19:54,080 --> 00:19:56,520 Speaker 1: and just play with all the brushes and paint my 351 00:19:56,640 --> 00:19:58,600 Speaker 1: nails all the way up to my wrists, you know, 352 00:19:58,680 --> 00:20:01,960 Speaker 1: and play with every thing in there. It was such 353 00:20:02,000 --> 00:20:03,280 Speaker 1: a cool way to grow up. 354 00:20:04,040 --> 00:20:06,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, it is. I mean, my kids have great memories 355 00:20:06,760 --> 00:20:09,479 Speaker 2: of that. Not only you know that part of it, 356 00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:14,520 Speaker 2: but like I'm sure you remember the camaraderie that was 357 00:20:14,720 --> 00:20:18,360 Speaker 2: the salon, because that's been such a you know, anytime 358 00:20:18,400 --> 00:20:22,639 Speaker 2: they interview my kids, they'll talk about that time in 359 00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:25,520 Speaker 2: that salon and how empowering it was to them to 360 00:20:25,560 --> 00:20:29,200 Speaker 2: see these professional women from all walks of life and 361 00:20:30,160 --> 00:20:33,400 Speaker 2: just them getting along. And it took away all of 362 00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:40,199 Speaker 2: that competitiveness that some girls have that they can't trust 363 00:20:40,240 --> 00:20:45,719 Speaker 2: other women, and you can trust the most if you 364 00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:51,920 Speaker 2: you know, but they didn't. They don't experience competing. My girls, 365 00:20:51,960 --> 00:20:56,720 Speaker 2: they compete with themselves, and that's because they saw that 366 00:20:56,840 --> 00:20:59,879 Speaker 2: camaraderie in that salon. So I wouldn't trade it for 367 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:01,960 Speaker 2: anything in the world. I think it's a great way 368 00:21:02,000 --> 00:21:03,600 Speaker 2: for kids to grow up seeing that. 369 00:21:04,760 --> 00:21:07,119 Speaker 1: Yes, you talked also about that in your book. It 370 00:21:07,200 --> 00:21:10,360 Speaker 1: just reminded me you talked about when they I think 371 00:21:10,400 --> 00:21:12,760 Speaker 1: it was Beyonce if I'm not mistaken. She was doing 372 00:21:13,200 --> 00:21:18,560 Speaker 1: a pageant and you told her to not be competitive 373 00:21:18,600 --> 00:21:21,440 Speaker 1: with other girls, to only compete with herself. 374 00:21:21,760 --> 00:21:24,359 Speaker 2: Because I mean, you're going to waste all your energy 375 00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:29,919 Speaker 2: on someone else and being jealous to them or trying 376 00:21:29,920 --> 00:21:33,240 Speaker 2: to be them, and not spend that time focusing on 377 00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:36,280 Speaker 2: getting better at what you do. It's the truth. I 378 00:21:36,280 --> 00:21:39,199 Speaker 2: mean I live by that every day, like I just 379 00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:41,840 Speaker 2: want everybody to win. It just helps me to win, 380 00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:44,040 Speaker 2: absolutely absolute. 381 00:21:44,119 --> 00:21:47,879 Speaker 1: Back to what we were talking about before about in 382 00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:51,240 Speaker 1: your marriage, knowing that you needed to take control. I 383 00:21:51,359 --> 00:21:54,640 Speaker 1: just that is such a powerful message to women listening 384 00:21:55,200 --> 00:21:58,800 Speaker 1: to this today, knowing your worth when you're not being 385 00:21:58,880 --> 00:22:01,040 Speaker 1: valued in a relationship. Why do you think it's so 386 00:22:01,119 --> 00:22:06,840 Speaker 1: important for women to retain independence in a relationship or 387 00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:07,960 Speaker 1: in a marriage. 388 00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:11,760 Speaker 2: Well, I think it's important because in those five years 389 00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:16,359 Speaker 2: that I was not putting down being a housewife of 390 00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:21,159 Speaker 2: being you know, a mother, but I lost touch with 391 00:22:21,680 --> 00:22:25,040 Speaker 2: so much of myself. Like when you have a kid 392 00:22:25,080 --> 00:22:28,399 Speaker 2: and that's your life and that's your best friend, you know, 393 00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:34,440 Speaker 2: your vocabulary shrinks you. You know, your life is different. 394 00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:37,000 Speaker 2: I wouldn't go a lot of places because I didn't 395 00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:40,640 Speaker 2: want to leave my daughter with anyone, and b'sed out 396 00:22:40,680 --> 00:22:44,720 Speaker 2: on so much of the outside world. That's a part 397 00:22:44,800 --> 00:22:48,560 Speaker 2: of it. But also just for me, which is a 398 00:22:48,600 --> 00:22:53,720 Speaker 2: tricky situation because even though I got myself together financially, 399 00:22:53,800 --> 00:22:56,320 Speaker 2: and I never have been in a position since that 400 00:22:56,440 --> 00:22:59,119 Speaker 2: day to depend on a man to take care of me. 401 00:23:00,840 --> 00:23:03,760 Speaker 2: I've never been in that position ever again since then. 402 00:23:04,200 --> 00:23:06,639 Speaker 2: But what I didn't do is have the courage to leave. 403 00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:10,240 Speaker 2: So once he got better and we went to counseling 404 00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:13,400 Speaker 2: and our relationship got better, I was like, Oh, this 405 00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:17,480 Speaker 2: is gonna work, you know. So I didn't do so 406 00:23:17,560 --> 00:23:19,679 Speaker 2: good with that lesson. I kind of went back and 407 00:23:19,720 --> 00:23:22,760 Speaker 2: forth with that one. But what I did know is 408 00:23:22,800 --> 00:23:27,560 Speaker 2: that you have to have your own life and I've 409 00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:31,040 Speaker 2: always had my life. I've always had my priorities out 410 00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:35,040 Speaker 2: since that time. I've always had girlfriends that surround me, 411 00:23:36,280 --> 00:23:39,520 Speaker 2: and you know, nothing can come between us. And once 412 00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:43,720 Speaker 2: you got your crew, then you know you got all 413 00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:45,240 Speaker 2: the power in the world. You can do anything. 414 00:23:45,600 --> 00:23:49,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's support net so important. Like you said, it 415 00:23:49,800 --> 00:23:52,960 Speaker 1: took you many years to leave your first marriage. 416 00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:58,160 Speaker 2: Many years, thirty three years, thirty three years. Yeah, all 417 00:23:58,200 --> 00:24:02,160 Speaker 2: of that time was not bad time. There were long 418 00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:06,680 Speaker 2: periods of great times. And that's how you know I 419 00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:09,520 Speaker 2: was able to stay for that long because it you know, 420 00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:12,479 Speaker 2: it wasn't all bad and he would protect them. I 421 00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:15,800 Speaker 2: had never been protected in my life, really protected the 422 00:24:15,840 --> 00:24:18,680 Speaker 2: way I was protected in that And sometimes you kind 423 00:24:18,680 --> 00:24:23,000 Speaker 2: of confused that with and there was always love there. 424 00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:27,239 Speaker 2: It wasn't about love. It was just about you know, 425 00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:32,439 Speaker 2: whatever created that situation where you know, my husband just 426 00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:33,920 Speaker 2: had a problem with infidelity. 427 00:24:35,000 --> 00:24:38,159 Speaker 1: Yeah, it took you that many years to leave your marriage. 428 00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:41,440 Speaker 1: What advice would you give to women listening right now 429 00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:45,199 Speaker 1: who are contemplating leaving a marriage. 430 00:24:45,400 --> 00:24:47,879 Speaker 2: Well, I think you should do all you can to 431 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:53,000 Speaker 2: work through it. But you know, I don't believe at 432 00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:55,520 Speaker 2: this point in my life at seventy one. It took 433 00:24:55,560 --> 00:24:59,680 Speaker 2: me a long time to come to the conclusion that 434 00:24:59,800 --> 00:25:04,720 Speaker 2: if you are not happy, that for whatever reason, you're 435 00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:09,359 Speaker 2: staying for me right now in my life is not enough. 436 00:25:09,800 --> 00:25:13,880 Speaker 2: What I realized after I got a divorce was that 437 00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:17,399 Speaker 2: I never would stay in a marriage that wasn't fulfilling me, 438 00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:25,000 Speaker 2: and that I wasn't a top priorady in I wouldn't be, 439 00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:28,160 Speaker 2: you know, staying a marriage that was unhappy or unfulfilled. 440 00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:31,879 Speaker 2: And but you know, I got a lot of nerves 441 00:25:31,920 --> 00:25:35,960 Speaker 2: saying that, because when I made this observation, I was 442 00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:40,280 Speaker 2: sixty years old. And so I did get remarried, and 443 00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:44,439 Speaker 2: you know, for a time it was great. I married 444 00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:47,040 Speaker 2: one of my really good friends and it was great. 445 00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:51,520 Speaker 2: But when I felt like it wasn't good for me 446 00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:55,240 Speaker 2: and it wasn't ever going to be what I need 447 00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:58,320 Speaker 2: for me, it didn't take me long to make the 448 00:25:58,400 --> 00:26:01,720 Speaker 2: decision to get out of it. And my reaction to 449 00:26:01,800 --> 00:26:05,639 Speaker 2: it was very, very different from the first time. The 450 00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:08,959 Speaker 2: first time, I was like so sad, and so you know, 451 00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:13,879 Speaker 2: this time, you know, I just got out there and 452 00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:17,560 Speaker 2: lived my life, and I feel like I'm not only 453 00:26:17,560 --> 00:26:22,000 Speaker 2: did I survive, but I thrived. I'm thriving. 454 00:26:22,119 --> 00:26:23,440 Speaker 1: Now you are thriving. 455 00:26:23,640 --> 00:26:26,400 Speaker 2: I had that. I'm seventy. By the time I got 456 00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:28,720 Speaker 2: that message, I was like sixty nine years old. 457 00:26:28,920 --> 00:26:30,360 Speaker 1: I know, but you got it. 458 00:26:30,400 --> 00:26:34,119 Speaker 2: That's all the matters that are late than never, right exactly. 459 00:26:34,960 --> 00:26:37,959 Speaker 1: I mean, I think you know, I've certainly experienced as 460 00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:40,760 Speaker 1: I've turned fifty and have gone in my fifties. Here 461 00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:46,360 Speaker 1: there's such a different mindset, and I cannot wait for 462 00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:51,119 Speaker 1: my sixties and my seventies because the significant difference I 463 00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:54,159 Speaker 1: notice in myself. I'm so proud of it, like I 464 00:26:54,200 --> 00:26:55,520 Speaker 1: feel like I've grown so much. 465 00:26:56,880 --> 00:27:01,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's a great example for your daughters, right, Yeah, 466 00:27:01,640 --> 00:27:02,560 Speaker 2: for sure. 467 00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:05,360 Speaker 1: And just at the right time too, because when they 468 00:27:05,359 --> 00:27:09,240 Speaker 1: were littler, they didn't even understand what I was going through, 469 00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:12,960 Speaker 1: or the work that it took, or the pain that 470 00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:15,320 Speaker 1: was exchanged. You know, they didn't see any of that, 471 00:27:15,400 --> 00:27:18,920 Speaker 1: or at least I tried to show them, yes exactly. 472 00:27:19,800 --> 00:27:23,800 Speaker 1: But now as young adults, they really see like my 473 00:27:23,960 --> 00:27:27,960 Speaker 1: work ethic differently, they see the things that I've made priorities, 474 00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:31,800 Speaker 1: and I think that it lands so differently on them now. 475 00:27:32,400 --> 00:27:35,280 Speaker 2: Sure they are very proud of you. 476 00:27:35,480 --> 00:27:42,000 Speaker 1: Yes, and I'm sure yours are very proud of you too. 477 00:27:44,840 --> 00:27:47,679 Speaker 1: One of the last chapters in your book is called 478 00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:53,159 Speaker 1: Choosing Me. Obviously I love that, and you talk about 479 00:27:53,760 --> 00:27:56,040 Speaker 1: your decision to leave your second marriage. You say in 480 00:27:56,080 --> 00:27:59,119 Speaker 1: the book, as you were sort of alluding to before, 481 00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:02,399 Speaker 1: if I stayed in this relationship, I would never feel 482 00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:07,119 Speaker 1: whole loved, cherished and respected and seen. Nothing else in 483 00:28:07,119 --> 00:28:10,359 Speaker 1: the marriage matters if you are not first priority with 484 00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:13,639 Speaker 1: each other. There was also the pressure of being an 485 00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:17,800 Speaker 1: example for so many people who hoped to find a 486 00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:21,679 Speaker 1: second chance at love. But I had to choose, and 487 00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:22,840 Speaker 1: I chose me. 488 00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:28,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, because you know, you stay sometimes in situations because 489 00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:30,840 Speaker 2: especially when you're in a public guy like this, it's 490 00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:33,520 Speaker 2: a lot of pressure on you. Because I can't tell 491 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:35,639 Speaker 2: you how many times people told me, oh my god, 492 00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:38,960 Speaker 2: you were my hope, you know, because they were over 493 00:28:39,280 --> 00:28:41,800 Speaker 2: sixty and they just felt like they could find love. 494 00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:45,800 Speaker 2: And my ex was you know, I've known him for 495 00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:49,560 Speaker 2: forty years, his sister was my best friend, and that 496 00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:52,800 Speaker 2: he's a great guy. It's just that together we were 497 00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:56,240 Speaker 2: not suited for each other. Well after a time, we 498 00:28:56,400 --> 00:28:59,200 Speaker 2: just didn't bring out the best in each other. And 499 00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:02,400 Speaker 2: I think that if you don't bring out the best 500 00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:05,000 Speaker 2: in each other, then you you know, it's no reason 501 00:29:05,040 --> 00:29:05,760 Speaker 2: to stay together. 502 00:29:08,240 --> 00:29:12,120 Speaker 1: I mean, I've been divorced twice. I know it's not easy. 503 00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:16,960 Speaker 1: It's not easy, especially in the public eye. Looking back. Now, 504 00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:22,440 Speaker 1: how has your life been positively impacted by you choosing yourself? 505 00:29:23,600 --> 00:29:28,560 Speaker 2: Well, it's positive because I focus on you know, because 506 00:29:28,560 --> 00:29:32,280 Speaker 2: I'm surrounded by love every day. I'm surrounded by people 507 00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:34,600 Speaker 2: that are when I walk into a room, they get 508 00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:42,920 Speaker 2: excited and happy. That's choosing me. I'm choosing myself over 509 00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:47,840 Speaker 2: someone else. And I'm choosing my happiness and my fulfillment. 510 00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:50,800 Speaker 2: And you know, why shouldn't you walk into a room 511 00:29:50,840 --> 00:29:53,760 Speaker 2: at seventy one years old and somebody is happy to 512 00:29:53,800 --> 00:29:58,360 Speaker 2: see you? Oh yeah, and that when when they talk 513 00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:00,200 Speaker 2: to me and I talk to them, that we bring 514 00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:03,640 Speaker 2: out the very best in each other. Like that's a choice. 515 00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:09,360 Speaker 1: Absolutely, you allow it in and you receive it and 516 00:30:09,400 --> 00:30:10,720 Speaker 1: then it just projects. 517 00:30:11,280 --> 00:30:12,000 Speaker 2: Absolutely. 518 00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:14,720 Speaker 1: How do you feel about love today? Do you think 519 00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:16,960 Speaker 1: you want to find it again? 520 00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:20,440 Speaker 2: I would love to find love again. I'm a hopeless 521 00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:27,280 Speaker 2: romantic love But again, I want to make sure that 522 00:30:27,440 --> 00:30:29,880 Speaker 2: if I don't find it, I know I will be 523 00:30:30,120 --> 00:30:32,280 Speaker 2: just fine's. And you know, I say in the book 524 00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:35,320 Speaker 2: that that's unfortunate that I had to be sixty nine, 525 00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:38,400 Speaker 2: seventy years old before I realized that I am enough 526 00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:43,080 Speaker 2: by myself, that I have so many people that love me. 527 00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:46,800 Speaker 2: It doesn't have to be a man. You know. I'm 528 00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:51,120 Speaker 2: so loved by so many people, and I love myself, 529 00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:55,400 Speaker 2: you know, for the I think I've always had a 530 00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:58,320 Speaker 2: love for myself, but was our first already know, but 531 00:30:58,440 --> 00:31:02,200 Speaker 2: I am at least at the top of my priorities, 532 00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:05,680 Speaker 2: you know, where I wasn't before. I was like way 533 00:31:05,720 --> 00:31:07,120 Speaker 2: down the list, right. 534 00:31:07,560 --> 00:31:10,080 Speaker 1: What do you say to people who when we talk 535 00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:13,880 Speaker 1: about choosing ourselves, I hear sometimes that maybe that's selfish, 536 00:31:14,560 --> 00:31:19,479 Speaker 1: or you know, you're not thinking for your family anymore. 537 00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:20,640 Speaker 1: What do you say to those people? 538 00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:25,560 Speaker 2: I say that my kids are forty three and forty 539 00:31:25,600 --> 00:31:31,800 Speaker 2: four and thirty seven, and they are grown and got 540 00:31:31,840 --> 00:31:38,480 Speaker 2: their own lives, and I don't feel selfish at all. 541 00:31:39,280 --> 00:31:42,400 Speaker 2: I give so much to so many people. There's no 542 00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:45,520 Speaker 2: way I would consider myself selfish. So I don't care 543 00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:48,400 Speaker 2: whether you know about that hoy that says that doesn't 544 00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:48,720 Speaker 2: know me. 545 00:31:50,320 --> 00:31:52,040 Speaker 1: Matter, No, they don't even matter. 546 00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:52,880 Speaker 2: Yeah. 547 00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:55,120 Speaker 1: I think it's so interesting too what you said earlier 548 00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:58,680 Speaker 1: about when you were a mom, a young mom, and 549 00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:02,520 Speaker 1: how you felt like you lost yourself. I think that's 550 00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:04,840 Speaker 1: just like the way it is for the mom. 551 00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:07,920 Speaker 2: It is because think about it. You wake up every 552 00:32:08,000 --> 00:32:11,680 Speaker 2: day and what's your first priority? Your kids got gotta 553 00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:14,480 Speaker 2: bathe them, You gotta you know, if they go get 554 00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:16,800 Speaker 2: a little boo boo on them, they act like it's 555 00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:20,120 Speaker 2: the end of the world, and you gotta, oh my god, 556 00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:24,200 Speaker 2: you know what. It takes all of your energy and 557 00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:26,480 Speaker 2: you know, and it's the best thing in the world. 558 00:32:26,840 --> 00:32:31,800 Speaker 2: It's beautiful. But also you are not your first priority, 559 00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:36,520 Speaker 2: and you don't know, you don't have Like I didn't 560 00:32:36,520 --> 00:32:38,920 Speaker 2: have a road map of what to do and what 561 00:32:39,120 --> 00:32:42,080 Speaker 2: not to do. So what I chose to do was 562 00:32:42,320 --> 00:32:47,120 Speaker 2: everything she wanted to do. Whatever about me, are taking 563 00:32:47,160 --> 00:32:49,920 Speaker 2: care of me or to go take that day and 564 00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:53,440 Speaker 2: have a massage and get a facial and do those things. 565 00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:58,959 Speaker 2: That wasn't even an objective for me and all of 566 00:32:59,000 --> 00:33:00,960 Speaker 2: my focus and all all of my life. And that's 567 00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:05,800 Speaker 2: not a bad thing, but it's also not the greatest 568 00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:08,440 Speaker 2: thing for you either, because if I had it to 569 00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:10,680 Speaker 2: do all over again, I would have asked for help 570 00:33:10,800 --> 00:33:14,000 Speaker 2: from other people, people that I trusted with my kid, 571 00:33:14,080 --> 00:33:16,840 Speaker 2: because I didn't trust anybody. You know, it's a funny 572 00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:20,040 Speaker 2: story in there about me asking my sister to keep 573 00:33:20,600 --> 00:33:23,440 Speaker 2: telling my sister that I'm gonna let her keep Beyonce. 574 00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:25,760 Speaker 2: Why I go on this trip for a couple of days. 575 00:33:25,760 --> 00:33:31,200 Speaker 2: Excuse really, you know hard baby? And my husband says 576 00:33:31,200 --> 00:33:33,480 Speaker 2: to me, come go to the South padre Islan, you 577 00:33:33,480 --> 00:33:35,640 Speaker 2: can be on the beach. You need who looks so tired? 578 00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:37,040 Speaker 2: You need two days? And I was like, well, I 579 00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:39,760 Speaker 2: got to take the baby, and he said no, no, no, no, 580 00:33:39,800 --> 00:33:41,720 Speaker 2: that's the idea is for you to get some rest 581 00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:44,200 Speaker 2: and really sleep. And so I called my sister and 582 00:33:44,240 --> 00:33:47,760 Speaker 2: I'm like, hi, I got a surprise for you. I'm 583 00:33:47,800 --> 00:33:50,320 Speaker 2: gonna let you keep my baby. And my sister was like, 584 00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:54,560 Speaker 2: let me keep your baby. Will I keep your baby? 585 00:33:54,560 --> 00:33:56,680 Speaker 2: And I'm like, no, I'm gonna let you keep her, 586 00:33:57,080 --> 00:34:00,520 Speaker 2: and you know, she was like, girls, ain't doing me 587 00:34:00,640 --> 00:34:03,480 Speaker 2: no favor. And so then I called my oldest sister 588 00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:06,760 Speaker 2: and I said, I can't stand her. Sometimes. I thought 589 00:34:06,800 --> 00:34:08,759 Speaker 2: I was gonna let her keep my baby, and sheep 590 00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:11,960 Speaker 2: said I don't care about keeping your baby. And my 591 00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:14,359 Speaker 2: sister started laughing and she's like, teenie, this is your 592 00:34:14,400 --> 00:34:17,920 Speaker 2: first baby. It is not a privilege and honor to 593 00:34:18,000 --> 00:34:20,760 Speaker 2: keep your baby. That baby is just the baby. Everybody 594 00:34:20,800 --> 00:34:24,080 Speaker 2: got a bunch of kids like that baby ain't nothing special. 595 00:34:24,080 --> 00:34:28,239 Speaker 2: And I was like what. I was like, goodbye, that's 596 00:34:28,320 --> 00:34:30,799 Speaker 2: your first baby, that's right. But I went down the 597 00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:33,719 Speaker 2: line until I found somebody who just thought of it 598 00:34:33,760 --> 00:34:36,239 Speaker 2: as a big honor to and they probably didn't, but 599 00:34:36,280 --> 00:34:39,880 Speaker 2: they humored me. You know, you think that your baby 600 00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:45,320 Speaker 2: is the you know, that's like a world shattering event, 601 00:34:45,600 --> 00:34:49,320 Speaker 2: and that's what you do is you put everything into 602 00:34:49,400 --> 00:34:52,839 Speaker 2: it and you don't give yourself much. So I just 603 00:34:52,880 --> 00:34:56,520 Speaker 2: think with new mothers, they got a better handle these days. 604 00:34:56,600 --> 00:35:01,160 Speaker 2: They will take that baby and them to somebody that 605 00:35:01,200 --> 00:35:05,439 Speaker 2: they trust and go and take care of themselves. That 606 00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:09,640 Speaker 2: you don't just read little children's books every day, that 607 00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:11,759 Speaker 2: you take the time to read a novel or go 608 00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:15,040 Speaker 2: to a movie and talk to an adult, right, you know, 609 00:35:15,120 --> 00:35:23,160 Speaker 2: your vocabulary doesn't evolve around my little pony. So true. 610 00:35:23,719 --> 00:35:26,520 Speaker 1: I mean, if anything, young moms take it from us 611 00:35:26,600 --> 00:35:31,040 Speaker 1: who lost ourselves completely, gave ourselves completely to our children. 612 00:35:31,719 --> 00:35:34,800 Speaker 1: I mean I felt like for all of my twenties, 613 00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:38,080 Speaker 1: all of my thirties, I was a mom first and foremost, 614 00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:41,680 Speaker 1: and I loved it. But you're right, like, if I 615 00:35:41,719 --> 00:35:44,040 Speaker 1: could have done it again, I probably would have taken 616 00:35:44,120 --> 00:35:47,600 Speaker 1: some more time for myself. I would have felt more 617 00:35:47,760 --> 00:35:50,840 Speaker 1: comfortable leaving them with other people who I knew loved them, 618 00:35:51,320 --> 00:35:53,000 Speaker 1: and I would have focused a little bit more on 619 00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:56,920 Speaker 1: making myself whole because I probably would have been a 620 00:35:56,920 --> 00:35:57,520 Speaker 1: better mom. 621 00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:05,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, absolutely, a a better wife, better wife now 622 00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:08,040 Speaker 2: because you're not you can't be your very I remember 623 00:36:08,360 --> 00:36:12,279 Speaker 2: just you know, my children always taken you know, I 624 00:36:12,280 --> 00:36:14,359 Speaker 2: don't care what was going on with my husband. If 625 00:36:14,400 --> 00:36:16,920 Speaker 2: my kids had a little bobo, I was just all 626 00:36:17,080 --> 00:36:20,000 Speaker 2: on it and not paying any attention. So it's a 627 00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:21,879 Speaker 2: one of the things I would have done differently in 628 00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:23,440 Speaker 2: that space as well. 629 00:36:24,200 --> 00:36:27,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's so interesting to look back on my marriage 630 00:36:27,960 --> 00:36:32,640 Speaker 1: to my girl's dad and see those moments where I 631 00:36:33,239 --> 00:36:37,200 Speaker 1: should could have should have been more attentive to his 632 00:36:37,360 --> 00:36:41,000 Speaker 1: needs and to our relationship, and maybe things would have 633 00:36:41,080 --> 00:36:42,040 Speaker 1: ended up differently. 634 00:36:42,880 --> 00:36:43,120 Speaker 2: True. 635 00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:48,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, now I know that being a mom and a 636 00:36:48,080 --> 00:36:53,200 Speaker 1: grandmother also means being a protector and time and time again, 637 00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:58,160 Speaker 1: people have come for your family. How do you continue 638 00:36:58,200 --> 00:37:02,319 Speaker 1: to protect your family when the entire world knows who 639 00:37:02,360 --> 00:37:06,080 Speaker 1: you are, they think they know who you are? How 640 00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:10,200 Speaker 1: do you protect your grandchildren who are born into this life. 641 00:37:10,800 --> 00:37:12,839 Speaker 2: I just do the best I can do. But what 642 00:37:12,920 --> 00:37:15,760 Speaker 2: I have come to realize is that I can only 643 00:37:15,800 --> 00:37:19,279 Speaker 2: protect them so much and that I don't make it 644 00:37:19,440 --> 00:37:22,920 Speaker 2: my responsibility as much as I used to, like anytime 645 00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:25,680 Speaker 2: somebody said something that was untrue by my kids. You know, 646 00:37:26,480 --> 00:37:28,320 Speaker 2: the first I'm a mama bear and I'm going to 647 00:37:28,400 --> 00:37:30,120 Speaker 2: go for you and I want the truth to be 648 00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:33,480 Speaker 2: out there. And you know, it's not always best for 649 00:37:33,560 --> 00:37:36,359 Speaker 2: my kids. The outcome is not always best for them. 650 00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:42,799 Speaker 2: So I have really tried to work hard on just 651 00:37:44,600 --> 00:37:50,240 Speaker 2: controlling the things that I can, and that is blocking 652 00:37:50,280 --> 00:37:53,360 Speaker 2: out as much of the negativity as I can for 653 00:37:53,560 --> 00:37:56,040 Speaker 2: as long as I can, because sometimes I can control it. 654 00:37:56,120 --> 00:37:59,960 Speaker 2: My fingers just scope I'm on that you know post, 655 00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:02,560 Speaker 2: in that post to let somebody have it because they're lying, 656 00:38:02,640 --> 00:38:07,120 Speaker 2: because you know, I understand that we're public figures and 657 00:38:07,160 --> 00:38:10,600 Speaker 2: it comes along with the territory. I had an interview 658 00:38:12,120 --> 00:38:15,640 Speaker 2: and the lady on there asked me something very inappropriate, 659 00:38:15,680 --> 00:38:18,279 Speaker 2: and I asked her, why would you do that? You 660 00:38:18,280 --> 00:38:20,719 Speaker 2: know why we've had such a nice conversation. Why would 661 00:38:20,719 --> 00:38:22,800 Speaker 2: you do that? And she said, because you're a public 662 00:38:22,840 --> 00:38:24,600 Speaker 2: figure and I could ask you whatever I want to 663 00:38:24,640 --> 00:38:28,880 Speaker 2: ask you. So basically the thought process is that because 664 00:38:28,920 --> 00:38:33,919 Speaker 2: you have you're a public figure, that the sky's the limit. 665 00:38:33,960 --> 00:38:36,839 Speaker 2: I could just ask you anything, and you just got 666 00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:39,759 Speaker 2: to put up with my crap. And you know that's 667 00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:41,719 Speaker 2: not true, I mean, and I said to her, I 668 00:38:41,760 --> 00:38:44,399 Speaker 2: took the time to I had time that day, as 669 00:38:44,440 --> 00:38:47,920 Speaker 2: they say, And I said, I'm a human being, and 670 00:38:48,480 --> 00:38:51,000 Speaker 2: how would you feel if I asked you that question 671 00:38:51,080 --> 00:38:54,160 Speaker 2: that you just asked me? And she said, well, I said, 672 00:38:54,160 --> 00:38:57,640 Speaker 2: because you're a public figure too, you know you're interviewing me, 673 00:38:58,280 --> 00:39:00,839 Speaker 2: So how would you feel if I did that to you? 674 00:39:00,920 --> 00:39:04,600 Speaker 2: And I think that she thought about it and she apologized. 675 00:39:04,640 --> 00:39:07,720 Speaker 2: And you know, that's all we can do is try 676 00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:11,480 Speaker 2: to educate people on the fact that we are human 677 00:39:11,520 --> 00:39:15,480 Speaker 2: beings and that my grandchildren especially, I'm ready to fight, yeah, 678 00:39:15,520 --> 00:39:18,800 Speaker 2: because they has to be in this, you know, yeah, exactly, 679 00:39:20,280 --> 00:39:22,560 Speaker 2: So I think kids should be off limits. But I 680 00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:23,879 Speaker 2: just do the best I can do. 681 00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:30,279 Speaker 1: Well, this book will undoubtedly leave a legacy for your grandchildren. 682 00:39:31,200 --> 00:39:35,400 Speaker 1: What is one lesson you hope your grandkids take away 683 00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:38,040 Speaker 1: from you or this book? Even? 684 00:39:39,200 --> 00:39:44,840 Speaker 2: I think a couple of things. One is that to 685 00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:48,080 Speaker 2: treat people the way you want to be treated that 686 00:39:48,239 --> 00:39:50,680 Speaker 2: is just as easy to be kind. You know. That's 687 00:39:50,960 --> 00:39:54,239 Speaker 2: really really key with me. And then I think the 688 00:39:54,400 --> 00:39:58,200 Speaker 2: second thing is that when it's all said and done, 689 00:39:58,920 --> 00:40:02,760 Speaker 2: if you have your family, the rest of that don't matter. 690 00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:06,040 Speaker 2: You know. I feel, honestly it sounds like a cliche, 691 00:40:06,120 --> 00:40:11,080 Speaker 2: but if I lost every single monetary thing that I 692 00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:15,560 Speaker 2: have in my life, if I have my family, my crew, 693 00:40:16,040 --> 00:40:16,880 Speaker 2: I'm gonna be fine. 694 00:40:17,160 --> 00:40:17,880 Speaker 1: You'll be fine. 695 00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:20,560 Speaker 2: I can get through it. And that's just the truth. 696 00:40:21,960 --> 00:40:24,480 Speaker 1: That's a sign of a good family and a good 697 00:40:24,520 --> 00:40:29,680 Speaker 1: mama right there. Okay, I really think that this book 698 00:40:29,760 --> 00:40:32,120 Speaker 1: needs to be a movie. Who was gonna play you? 699 00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:36,600 Speaker 2: I love this young actress. Her name is Andre Day. 700 00:40:37,080 --> 00:40:39,799 Speaker 2: I don't know. There's something in her that's a quiet 701 00:40:40,680 --> 00:40:44,280 Speaker 2: storm or just somebody that I feel is so strong, 702 00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:46,960 Speaker 2: but they don't have to always be the center of attention. 703 00:40:47,239 --> 00:40:49,560 Speaker 2: And I don't know, it's just so much about her 704 00:40:49,600 --> 00:40:52,759 Speaker 2: that resonates with me. And who I am and who 705 00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:55,400 Speaker 2: I was at her age, and so I would love for, 706 00:40:55,560 --> 00:40:56,840 Speaker 2: you know, for her to play me. 707 00:40:58,000 --> 00:41:00,479 Speaker 1: I'm sure she would love it too, I know if. 708 00:41:00,360 --> 00:41:04,440 Speaker 2: You're familiar with her, but she played Billie Holiday. Yes, 709 00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:09,160 Speaker 2: she killed that. She's wonderful beautiful too. 710 00:41:09,440 --> 00:41:09,800 Speaker 1: Wow. 711 00:41:10,760 --> 00:41:12,920 Speaker 2: Well, you know we always pick somebody cute. 712 00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:18,480 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, come on, they have to represent before I 713 00:41:18,640 --> 00:41:22,160 Speaker 1: let you go, Miss Tina Knowles, what was your last 714 00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:23,280 Speaker 1: I choose me moment? 715 00:41:25,640 --> 00:41:30,960 Speaker 2: Probably doing this book, you know, putting this book out, 716 00:41:30,960 --> 00:41:35,400 Speaker 2: because all along making the decision to do this book 717 00:41:35,719 --> 00:41:40,560 Speaker 2: was definitely I choose me moment because I'm still you know, 718 00:41:40,880 --> 00:41:46,560 Speaker 2: I mean, it's scary. Yeah, And it was hard this book. 719 00:41:46,640 --> 00:41:51,279 Speaker 2: Writing this book was really hard emotionally. I had to 720 00:41:51,320 --> 00:41:54,319 Speaker 2: relive a lot of stuff that you know, was very 721 00:41:54,320 --> 00:42:00,560 Speaker 2: painful for me. And so I think and I kept saying, Oh, 722 00:42:00,640 --> 00:42:03,360 Speaker 2: everybody's gonna be mad at me. You know, the Catholic 723 00:42:03,440 --> 00:42:05,880 Speaker 2: Church is going to be mad at me, the hospital 724 00:42:05,960 --> 00:42:07,520 Speaker 2: is gonna be mad at me. My kids are gonna 725 00:42:07,520 --> 00:42:10,239 Speaker 2: be mad at me. You know, my exes are going 726 00:42:10,320 --> 00:42:13,160 Speaker 2: to be mad at me. And at the end, I said, 727 00:42:13,239 --> 00:42:16,879 Speaker 2: this is my story, and I'm choosing me. 728 00:42:19,160 --> 00:42:22,879 Speaker 1: Yeah, I got goose bumps again. I'm so excited for 729 00:42:22,960 --> 00:42:26,719 Speaker 1: everybody to read this beautiful book. If nothing else, just 730 00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:29,640 Speaker 1: have it on your shelf. Your cover is so gorgeous. 731 00:42:30,040 --> 00:42:32,440 Speaker 2: You thank you so much, I mean, next level. 732 00:42:33,320 --> 00:42:36,520 Speaker 1: Thank you so I wish you all the best and 733 00:42:36,840 --> 00:42:38,920 Speaker 1: such an honor to have you on the show. Thank you. 734 00:42:39,239 --> 00:42:42,440 Speaker 2: It's an honor to talk to you too. And I 735 00:42:42,520 --> 00:42:46,080 Speaker 2: really enjoyed this conversation. I'm so glad it was great. 736 00:42:46,360 --> 00:42:48,040 Speaker 1: Good Okay, I'm so glad. 737 00:42:48,840 --> 00:42:51,759 Speaker 2: Thank you, good luck, thank you 738 00:42:52,360 --> 00:42:54,160 Speaker 1: Thank you, Bye bye.