1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:02,400 Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to another episode of the Markmas Show 2 00:00:02,400 --> 00:00:05,240 Speaker 1: where we talk about the decentralized revolution the world is 3 00:00:05,240 --> 00:00:08,480 Speaker 1: going through. We're talking about bitcoin, We're talking about cryptocurrencies. 4 00:00:09,039 --> 00:00:10,760 Speaker 1: I'm trying to keep you up to date on how 5 00:00:10,800 --> 00:00:12,960 Speaker 1: this world is changing, looking at it through the lens 6 00:00:13,000 --> 00:00:16,400 Speaker 1: of politics, looking at through the lens of finance, and 7 00:00:16,440 --> 00:00:20,360 Speaker 1: of course technology, as those three come together on a 8 00:00:20,440 --> 00:00:26,640 Speaker 1: collision course. Now politics, finance and technology. Of course politics 9 00:00:26,680 --> 00:00:29,440 Speaker 1: and finance go together. You know, the old days of 10 00:00:29,520 --> 00:00:32,680 Speaker 1: you of being a financial analyst means how I would 11 00:00:32,720 --> 00:00:36,199 Speaker 1: look at data like economic data, I would look at 12 00:00:37,000 --> 00:00:42,400 Speaker 1: financial numbers. Unfortunately, today it's mostly politically driven. We're all 13 00:00:42,400 --> 00:00:45,360 Speaker 1: trying to guess what the Federal Reserve, what Jerome Powell 14 00:00:45,440 --> 00:00:48,400 Speaker 1: is going to do, what's in his head, and it's 15 00:00:48,440 --> 00:00:51,720 Speaker 1: mostly politically motivated. There's mid terms coming up. What will 16 00:00:51,760 --> 00:00:53,800 Speaker 1: they do before the mid terms? Are you know which 17 00:00:53,800 --> 00:00:56,520 Speaker 1: president are they going for? Uh? And then even even 18 00:00:56,520 --> 00:00:58,640 Speaker 1: when we get into the more of the financial system, 19 00:00:58,680 --> 00:01:01,920 Speaker 1: like the SEC secure these Exchange Commission being headed by 20 00:01:02,000 --> 00:01:06,000 Speaker 1: someone named Gary Gensler and his decisions are very politically motivated. 21 00:01:06,040 --> 00:01:07,840 Speaker 1: So we have to look at the political side to 22 00:01:07,920 --> 00:01:10,360 Speaker 1: understand what's going on there, so then we can understand 23 00:01:10,360 --> 00:01:12,160 Speaker 1: what effects that will have on the financial system. And 24 00:01:12,200 --> 00:01:15,480 Speaker 1: of course UM technology is what changes everything, and so 25 00:01:15,480 --> 00:01:17,240 Speaker 1: that's kind of where we're at today. We're looking at 26 00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:20,399 Speaker 1: the head of that and there's big news because the 27 00:01:20,440 --> 00:01:25,480 Speaker 1: head of the SEC just made a big decision this week. 28 00:01:25,480 --> 00:01:27,399 Speaker 1: As a matter of fact, there was two really big 29 00:01:27,440 --> 00:01:30,759 Speaker 1: things that the head of the SEC said this week. 30 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:36,080 Speaker 1: The SEC um you know, it's a small or a 31 00:01:36,160 --> 00:01:41,040 Speaker 1: small ish organization inside the government, but if you're an investor, uh, 32 00:01:41,120 --> 00:01:43,920 Speaker 1: if you're involved in money and finance, and they're very 33 00:01:44,040 --> 00:01:48,600 Speaker 1: very powerful, very big organization. And so the SEC Securities 34 00:01:48,640 --> 00:01:54,240 Speaker 1: Exchange Commission are basically there to keep you safe, supposedly, 35 00:01:54,880 --> 00:01:57,160 Speaker 1: so everything they do is trying to keep you safe. 36 00:01:57,360 --> 00:02:00,040 Speaker 1: They're trying to prevent companies from scamming you and it 37 00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:03,720 Speaker 1: been you off and things like that. UM but of 38 00:02:03,760 --> 00:02:06,880 Speaker 1: course it doesn't really work out that way. So, for example, 39 00:02:07,000 --> 00:02:11,040 Speaker 1: the SEC puts rules into place like accredited investor laws 40 00:02:11,080 --> 00:02:14,960 Speaker 1: for example, So an accredited investor means that in order 41 00:02:15,000 --> 00:02:18,320 Speaker 1: to get into like the really really good deals, like 42 00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:21,480 Speaker 1: the private money deals where you can make huge returns 43 00:02:21,480 --> 00:02:23,720 Speaker 1: on your money, In order to get into those types 44 00:02:23,760 --> 00:02:25,320 Speaker 1: of deals, you have to be what's known as an 45 00:02:25,440 --> 00:02:29,000 Speaker 1: accredited investor, and that means that you have to make 46 00:02:29,120 --> 00:02:31,680 Speaker 1: over a certain amount of income. Um, you have to 47 00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:34,320 Speaker 1: have an over a certain amount of assets, which means 48 00:02:34,320 --> 00:02:37,000 Speaker 1: you basically are in like the top, I don't know 49 00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:42,880 Speaker 1: one percent of of of people in the United States 50 00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:48,000 Speaker 1: when it comes to income. Let's see what the updated 51 00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:57,320 Speaker 1: accredited investment numbers are here. Requirements for credit investors. Okay, 52 00:02:57,320 --> 00:03:00,600 Speaker 1: I must have an annual income exceeding two hundred dollars 53 00:03:01,160 --> 00:03:04,640 Speaker 1: or three thousand for joint income for the last two years, 54 00:03:05,160 --> 00:03:07,800 Speaker 1: with the expectation of earning the same or higher income 55 00:03:07,840 --> 00:03:10,200 Speaker 1: in the current year. So you have to make at 56 00:03:10,280 --> 00:03:12,560 Speaker 1: least two hundred thousand or three hundred thousand jointly and 57 00:03:12,639 --> 00:03:15,200 Speaker 1: be making more. You could also be considering a credit 58 00:03:15,200 --> 00:03:19,040 Speaker 1: investor if you have a net worth exceeding one million, 59 00:03:19,720 --> 00:03:24,200 Speaker 1: either individually or jointly with their spouse. UM, but I 60 00:03:24,240 --> 00:03:29,000 Speaker 1: believe that cannot include your private residence. So you have 61 00:03:29,040 --> 00:03:30,480 Speaker 1: to have a million dollars of assets. So that's so 62 00:03:30,520 --> 00:03:32,959 Speaker 1: your credit investor. So you can't get into the very 63 00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:35,520 Speaker 1: best deals, the really really good deals. The private deals, 64 00:03:35,560 --> 00:03:37,520 Speaker 1: the ones that make a lot of money unless you're 65 00:03:37,520 --> 00:03:40,240 Speaker 1: a credit investor. Now what happens is because of that, 66 00:03:40,360 --> 00:03:43,320 Speaker 1: it keeps the average person out. And then the insiders, 67 00:03:43,440 --> 00:03:46,200 Speaker 1: the rich people, they get into all those early round deals, 68 00:03:46,440 --> 00:03:49,560 Speaker 1: they get into venture capital, they get early round steaks 69 00:03:49,640 --> 00:03:53,640 Speaker 1: into the Tesla's and the facebooks and the ubers. And 70 00:03:53,680 --> 00:03:57,240 Speaker 1: then when the company runs for a decade and it 71 00:03:57,280 --> 00:04:01,000 Speaker 1: goes public. As soon as it goes public, then the 72 00:04:01,080 --> 00:04:04,480 Speaker 1: average person can go buy that stock. And then what happens, Well, 73 00:04:04,480 --> 00:04:07,400 Speaker 1: those vcs that got in really early, they dump it 74 00:04:07,480 --> 00:04:10,520 Speaker 1: on you. So typically once uh I p O s 75 00:04:10,640 --> 00:04:13,640 Speaker 1: happened um in national public offerings and the stock goes 76 00:04:13,760 --> 00:04:16,720 Speaker 1: public where the average person, the non acredit investor can 77 00:04:16,720 --> 00:04:19,720 Speaker 1: get it, well, they get dumped on and the price 78 00:04:19,720 --> 00:04:23,599 Speaker 1: typically goes down. So good job SEC protecting everybody. Um, 79 00:04:23,760 --> 00:04:26,800 Speaker 1: do we have a applause? I think we have an applause? There. 80 00:04:27,480 --> 00:04:31,000 Speaker 1: Let's see here. I'm not good with my sound effects, 81 00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:33,080 Speaker 1: will try to get better at it. There we go. 82 00:04:33,080 --> 00:04:35,640 Speaker 1: Good job, SEC, Good job. I appreciate all the work 83 00:04:35,640 --> 00:04:41,200 Speaker 1: that you've done protecting all those non acredit investors. So, um, 84 00:04:41,240 --> 00:04:43,440 Speaker 1: you know, like I've said, many times before. Of course, 85 00:04:43,480 --> 00:04:46,839 Speaker 1: those non acredit investors, they're they're not smart enough to 86 00:04:46,920 --> 00:04:49,000 Speaker 1: manage their own money. Never mind they made it, but 87 00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:50,760 Speaker 1: they're not smart enough to manage it. But there is 88 00:04:50,800 --> 00:04:55,000 Speaker 1: no protections on buying lottery tickets, are going gambling a casino, um. 89 00:04:55,040 --> 00:04:57,400 Speaker 1: But anyway, back to the SEC, that's what they're to protect. 90 00:04:57,400 --> 00:05:00,680 Speaker 1: And so the SEC wants to protect us from ourselves, 91 00:05:01,000 --> 00:05:03,360 Speaker 1: and we've been waiting on them to do a lot 92 00:05:03,400 --> 00:05:07,520 Speaker 1: of regulations on what they consider cryptocurrencies and how we 93 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:12,119 Speaker 1: regular cryptocurrencies. Now. Gary Gensler, he took over the SEC, 94 00:05:12,560 --> 00:05:14,120 Speaker 1: I don't know, maybe the last year or two. I 95 00:05:14,120 --> 00:05:17,080 Speaker 1: forget exactly when he came in, and everybody in the 96 00:05:17,080 --> 00:05:20,560 Speaker 1: crypto space was pretty hopeful of having Gary Ginser come 97 00:05:20,560 --> 00:05:24,560 Speaker 1: in because Gary gains Are understands bitcoin and cryptocurrencies very well. 98 00:05:24,600 --> 00:05:29,760 Speaker 1: As a matter of fact, Gensler taught courses on bitcoin 99 00:05:30,120 --> 00:05:32,840 Speaker 1: at m I T. If you're not familiar with the 100 00:05:32,880 --> 00:05:36,239 Speaker 1: m I T. It's one of the most prestigious schools 101 00:05:36,240 --> 00:05:38,680 Speaker 1: when it comes to science and technology. So he's at 102 00:05:38,720 --> 00:05:41,480 Speaker 1: the most prestigious school for science and technology and he's 103 00:05:41,520 --> 00:05:45,800 Speaker 1: teaching classes on bitcoin like he gets it very very well, 104 00:05:45,839 --> 00:05:48,000 Speaker 1: he's a proponent of it. He was Why was he 105 00:05:48,040 --> 00:05:50,400 Speaker 1: teaching people about it because he wanted them to know. 106 00:05:50,720 --> 00:05:53,080 Speaker 1: He wanted to advance it. So he got it, and 107 00:05:53,120 --> 00:05:56,000 Speaker 1: we thought that'd be really good. But of course he 108 00:05:56,120 --> 00:05:59,720 Speaker 1: hasn't been so good. Maybe for more political reasons. We 109 00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:03,640 Speaker 1: can talk about that. But um, this week seces Gary 110 00:06:03,680 --> 00:06:10,480 Speaker 1: Ginsler reiterated that bitcoin alone is a commodity. What does 111 00:06:10,480 --> 00:06:15,720 Speaker 1: that mean, Well, most cryptocurrencies are what they consider an 112 00:06:15,839 --> 00:06:22,200 Speaker 1: unregistered or an unlicensed security. Now, companies that create unlicensed 113 00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:25,560 Speaker 1: securities or sell unlicensed securities, or people that talk about 114 00:06:25,640 --> 00:06:28,720 Speaker 1: buying unlicensed or unregistered securities could get in a lot 115 00:06:28,720 --> 00:06:30,440 Speaker 1: of trouble. As a matter of fact, we've seen many 116 00:06:30,520 --> 00:06:35,520 Speaker 1: celebrities actually get in trouble with fines and lawsuits for 117 00:06:35,640 --> 00:06:39,120 Speaker 1: talking about cryptocurrencies. They're getting paid to promote them, the 118 00:06:39,160 --> 00:06:42,760 Speaker 1: Paris Hilton's or the a cons um they get paid 119 00:06:42,800 --> 00:06:45,440 Speaker 1: to promote it, talk about it publicly, but it's an 120 00:06:45,520 --> 00:06:48,880 Speaker 1: unregistered security and they've gotten in trouble for it. And 121 00:06:48,920 --> 00:06:51,800 Speaker 1: so a lot of talk has been what what's unregistered securities? 122 00:06:51,839 --> 00:06:54,440 Speaker 1: What's not? But that your U S Securities and Exchange 123 00:06:54,440 --> 00:06:58,240 Speaker 1: Commissioner Gary Ginsler has reiterated his claim that bitcoin is 124 00:06:58,360 --> 00:07:04,000 Speaker 1: a commodity. Um some quote some like bitcoin and that's 125 00:07:04,040 --> 00:07:07,320 Speaker 1: the only one, Jim, I'm going to say, because I'm 126 00:07:07,360 --> 00:07:10,560 Speaker 1: not going to talk about any of these tokens that 127 00:07:10,640 --> 00:07:14,800 Speaker 1: my predecessors and others have said are a commodity, Gainsler 128 00:07:15,280 --> 00:07:21,120 Speaker 1: said an interview with CNBC's Jim Kramer on Monday. Some 129 00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:24,480 Speaker 1: like bitcoin and that's the only one. That's what he said. 130 00:07:24,720 --> 00:07:29,120 Speaker 1: Now again, Uh, this is a departure from his predecessors 131 00:07:29,280 --> 00:07:32,400 Speaker 1: and his unwillingness to define Ethereum as the same way. 132 00:07:32,440 --> 00:07:35,520 Speaker 1: So his predecessor said the theorium maybe he said for 133 00:07:35,600 --> 00:07:39,160 Speaker 1: sure it was a security, but it could have converted 134 00:07:39,280 --> 00:07:42,600 Speaker 1: into a commodity, is what they said before. Um, But 135 00:07:42,680 --> 00:07:46,440 Speaker 1: now Gainsler's like, nope, Um, I'm the only one that 136 00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:49,040 Speaker 1: I see it is that he says. Uh. He said 137 00:07:49,080 --> 00:07:52,800 Speaker 1: crypto financial assets have the key attributes of a security, 138 00:07:52,880 --> 00:07:57,200 Speaker 1: he said recently, noting there's always almost a centralized entity 139 00:07:57,320 --> 00:08:01,800 Speaker 1: that directs projects and stands to profit the most. That 140 00:08:01,920 --> 00:08:04,640 Speaker 1: was certainly the case when the Ethereum blockchain fit first 141 00:08:04,680 --> 00:08:08,360 Speaker 1: burst onto the scene with an initial coin offering. A 142 00:08:08,400 --> 00:08:11,520 Speaker 1: motley crew of builders and investors and institutions such as 143 00:08:11,560 --> 00:08:18,800 Speaker 1: the Ethereum Foundation. So but then in sec director um 144 00:08:18,920 --> 00:08:22,679 Speaker 1: set Ethereum might be able to have reached the level 145 00:08:22,680 --> 00:08:27,320 Speaker 1: of a commodity, but Gary Ginsler doesn't think so, which 146 00:08:27,360 --> 00:08:30,160 Speaker 1: is pretty interesting. Um. Now this goes back to what 147 00:08:30,280 --> 00:08:34,680 Speaker 1: I've been saying, which is, um, the real revolution. There's 148 00:08:34,679 --> 00:08:38,600 Speaker 1: a technological revolution happening here today, and most people are 149 00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:41,200 Speaker 1: completely blind to it because of cryptocurrency are blocking that. 150 00:08:41,240 --> 00:08:43,679 Speaker 1: But there's a real revolution happy today. The real revolution 151 00:08:43,960 --> 00:08:48,720 Speaker 1: is d centralization. That's the real revolution here. Now, per 152 00:08:48,760 --> 00:08:52,760 Speaker 1: the words of the SEC right here, it says that 153 00:08:54,960 --> 00:08:58,960 Speaker 1: says crypto financial assets are security. Um, they're always almost 154 00:08:58,960 --> 00:09:01,240 Speaker 1: a centralizing see that REX projects and stands to profit, 155 00:09:01,520 --> 00:09:05,640 Speaker 1: so they're not decentralized. The revolution is decentralization. Most cryptoists 156 00:09:05,679 --> 00:09:08,240 Speaker 1: aren't anything but bitcoin. That's Gary Gunzo's word, is not mine. 157 00:09:08,320 --> 00:09:10,640 Speaker 1: I got a lot more to cover, including a really 158 00:09:10,679 --> 00:09:13,079 Speaker 1: big ruling that they made this week and it fired 159 00:09:13,120 --> 00:09:16,160 Speaker 1: off a lawsuit. We're gonna see massive fireworks happening. You 160 00:09:16,160 --> 00:09:17,560 Speaker 1: don't want to miss what I'm about to talk about. 161 00:09:17,559 --> 00:09:19,959 Speaker 1: In a second. You're listening to the Markma show. UM 162 00:09:20,000 --> 00:09:22,280 Speaker 1: talking about bitcoin and cryptocurrencies. I'll be back with more 163 00:09:22,280 --> 00:09:25,160 Speaker 1: in a minute. Don't go away, all right, Welcome back. 164 00:09:25,360 --> 00:09:27,840 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Markma Show. We're talking about the 165 00:09:27,960 --> 00:09:33,040 Speaker 1: decentralized revolution that's happening bitcoin, cryptocurrencies, the way the world 166 00:09:33,120 --> 00:09:35,720 Speaker 1: is changing, politics, finance, all of that. Now. I call 167 00:09:35,760 --> 00:09:41,600 Speaker 1: it the decentralized revolution because that's the revolution from from 168 00:09:41,600 --> 00:09:43,680 Speaker 1: many standpoints. On a two and a fifty year time frame, 169 00:09:43,720 --> 00:09:48,000 Speaker 1: a pendulum swings back in the world, swings to centralization 170 00:09:48,160 --> 00:09:52,839 Speaker 1: or globalization, and we're peeking out right now, and then 171 00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:56,760 Speaker 1: the pendulum swings back the other way to decentralization. At 172 00:09:56,760 --> 00:10:00,319 Speaker 1: the very same time, we have a technological revolution that's 173 00:10:00,320 --> 00:10:02,680 Speaker 1: happening on a fifty year time frame. And the technology 174 00:10:02,720 --> 00:10:05,000 Speaker 1: revolution that's happening right now is giving us a new 175 00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:09,640 Speaker 1: technology that gives us decentralization. That is the revolution. Now, 176 00:10:10,840 --> 00:10:12,839 Speaker 1: that's why I called this. What we talked about is 177 00:10:12,880 --> 00:10:14,760 Speaker 1: the decentralized revolution. Talking about the way the world is 178 00:10:14,800 --> 00:10:18,720 Speaker 1: decentralizing from a political standpoint, from a geopolitical standpoint, from 179 00:10:18,720 --> 00:10:21,240 Speaker 1: an energy commodity standpoint, and of course it's all being 180 00:10:21,360 --> 00:10:24,400 Speaker 1: led by the changing of the money. Now I make 181 00:10:24,440 --> 00:10:26,840 Speaker 1: that point to tell you that that's the revolution. And 182 00:10:26,960 --> 00:10:31,640 Speaker 1: Gary Gensler, the head of the SEC basically said as much, UM, 183 00:10:31,679 --> 00:10:36,679 Speaker 1: saying that only bitcoin is a commodity. All the rest 184 00:10:36,760 --> 00:10:41,640 Speaker 1: appeared to be some sort of security because of the centralization. 185 00:10:41,720 --> 00:10:45,680 Speaker 1: There's always, in his words, almost always a centralized entity 186 00:10:45,720 --> 00:10:48,319 Speaker 1: that directs projects and stands to profit the most. Um. 187 00:10:48,360 --> 00:10:51,760 Speaker 1: It was it's the case with ethereum. Um blah blah blah. 188 00:10:52,040 --> 00:10:54,160 Speaker 1: I'm not going to read all that again, um O. 189 00:10:54,320 --> 00:10:56,920 Speaker 1: G bitcoin er Jamison Lob for instance, made distinction recently 190 00:10:56,920 --> 00:11:01,319 Speaker 1: saying most cryptos are decentralized in name only or dinos. 191 00:11:02,360 --> 00:11:04,840 Speaker 1: I hadn't heard that term before, dinos, but I like it. 192 00:11:04,880 --> 00:11:08,920 Speaker 1: Shout out to Jamison Lop and likely Unregistered Securities micro 193 00:11:09,000 --> 00:11:13,480 Speaker 1: Strategy CEO Michael Sailor called for cryptos quote parade of 194 00:11:13,760 --> 00:11:18,160 Speaker 1: horrible to be stamped out by regulators now, um. Shout 195 00:11:18,160 --> 00:11:22,760 Speaker 1: out to Michael Sailor. UM. I don't necessarily agree with them. 196 00:11:22,800 --> 00:11:25,280 Speaker 1: You know, I'm not a big fan of regulations. Let 197 00:11:25,320 --> 00:11:27,240 Speaker 1: people do what they want, in my opinion, but they 198 00:11:27,280 --> 00:11:30,520 Speaker 1: should know what they're doing. Now. There is something about 199 00:11:30,760 --> 00:11:35,160 Speaker 1: a fraud, so if or a scam, if I were 200 00:11:35,200 --> 00:11:36,920 Speaker 1: to say that I was going to sell you one thing, 201 00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:39,160 Speaker 1: but I delivered you something else. That would be fraud 202 00:11:39,200 --> 00:11:41,480 Speaker 1: or that would be a scam, and there there are 203 00:11:41,600 --> 00:11:44,320 Speaker 1: laws against that. And so if I were to sell 204 00:11:44,360 --> 00:11:46,120 Speaker 1: you a token and tell you that it was a 205 00:11:46,200 --> 00:11:50,720 Speaker 1: decentralized protocol but it wasn't, that would be a fraud 206 00:11:50,800 --> 00:11:56,040 Speaker 1: or a scam, and so that should be illegal, and uh, 207 00:11:56,240 --> 00:11:58,800 Speaker 1: you know, for them to be stamped out by regulators, 208 00:11:58,800 --> 00:12:00,960 Speaker 1: I suppose the regular I should say, hey, you guys 209 00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:04,560 Speaker 1: are actively purpetating frauds and scams. You're selling things that 210 00:12:04,600 --> 00:12:07,440 Speaker 1: you promise are something but they're not UM. So I 211 00:12:07,440 --> 00:12:10,440 Speaker 1: suppose there could be something there for that UM. In 212 00:12:10,440 --> 00:12:12,880 Speaker 1: Sailor's world, the government stamp up approval of stepping stone 213 00:12:12,920 --> 00:12:17,880 Speaker 1: towards Bitcoin being embraces a Treasury reserve asset UM. But 214 00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:19,760 Speaker 1: that's not the big news that I want to talk about. 215 00:12:19,840 --> 00:12:22,960 Speaker 1: The big news that I want to talk about is 216 00:12:23,280 --> 00:12:27,240 Speaker 1: uh gray scale. Now. You might have heard of gray 217 00:12:27,280 --> 00:12:29,280 Speaker 1: scale before. If you haven't, you certainly are going to 218 00:12:29,360 --> 00:12:33,120 Speaker 1: hear about it now because gray scale gray scale was 219 00:12:33,200 --> 00:12:36,800 Speaker 1: like really the first way that allowed people to buy 220 00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:40,400 Speaker 1: bitcoin UM through like a four oh one K or 221 00:12:40,440 --> 00:12:42,199 Speaker 1: a mutual fund or if you're like a big fund. 222 00:12:42,240 --> 00:12:43,600 Speaker 1: It was the first way you could buy it through 223 00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:46,920 Speaker 1: a financial product as opposed to buying it directly. Now 224 00:12:46,920 --> 00:12:48,920 Speaker 1: why would you need that? Well, the average person, you 225 00:12:48,920 --> 00:12:51,040 Speaker 1: and I wouldn't. But if you had money in an 226 00:12:51,080 --> 00:12:52,840 Speaker 1: I RA A or in a four oh one K, 227 00:12:54,840 --> 00:12:56,959 Speaker 1: or if you ran some sort of a fund, then 228 00:12:57,000 --> 00:13:00,160 Speaker 1: you're not able to go buy bitcoin, all right, not 229 00:13:00,200 --> 00:13:02,560 Speaker 1: a security. And so they created a fund like an 230 00:13:02,559 --> 00:13:03,960 Speaker 1: e t F, not an e t F and we're 231 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:06,679 Speaker 1: gonna talk about that, but similar to that that allows 232 00:13:07,280 --> 00:13:09,280 Speaker 1: you to buy it through those those types of vehicles. 233 00:13:09,400 --> 00:13:10,960 Speaker 1: So it was the it was the first way to 234 00:13:10,960 --> 00:13:14,679 Speaker 1: get ahold of bitcoin that way. Now they haven't. It's 235 00:13:14,720 --> 00:13:16,880 Speaker 1: not an e t F and that's the crux of 236 00:13:16,920 --> 00:13:18,920 Speaker 1: the matter that we're gonna talk about today. But um, 237 00:13:19,120 --> 00:13:25,080 Speaker 1: gray Scale created something else UM not a not a 238 00:13:25,240 --> 00:13:28,560 Speaker 1: E t F UM, but but but something like that, 239 00:13:28,840 --> 00:13:31,760 Speaker 1: UM that that allowed people to get access to it. 240 00:13:32,520 --> 00:13:34,920 Speaker 1: But of course gray Scale and a lot of other 241 00:13:34,960 --> 00:13:38,160 Speaker 1: people want to create a bitcoin e t F and 242 00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:42,880 Speaker 1: exchange traded fund. Gray Scale is more like a close 243 00:13:42,960 --> 00:13:44,720 Speaker 1: end fund. And I'll explain to you what the difference 244 00:13:44,760 --> 00:13:49,920 Speaker 1: is But so, um, Gary Ginsler at the SEC has 245 00:13:49,960 --> 00:13:54,600 Speaker 1: been approving bitcoin e t fs, but they're not the 246 00:13:54,679 --> 00:13:56,040 Speaker 1: right type of e t f s. What do I 247 00:13:56,040 --> 00:13:59,280 Speaker 1: mean by that? So? Um, you have an e t 248 00:13:59,440 --> 00:14:02,480 Speaker 1: F that's cash settled, or futures that are cash settled, 249 00:14:02,559 --> 00:14:04,800 Speaker 1: or an e t F that tracks the price of 250 00:14:04,840 --> 00:14:08,160 Speaker 1: the asset, and then you have one that's physical that 251 00:14:08,280 --> 00:14:13,600 Speaker 1: actually holds the asset. One allows you to basically bet 252 00:14:13,679 --> 00:14:16,120 Speaker 1: on the price going up or down, and one actually 253 00:14:16,200 --> 00:14:18,439 Speaker 1: holds the asset to go up or down. Now, for me, 254 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:23,880 Speaker 1: I don't believe in all this manipulation and all this 255 00:14:24,040 --> 00:14:26,840 Speaker 1: leverage and all this other garbage out there. I think 256 00:14:27,040 --> 00:14:29,600 Speaker 1: the laws of supply and demand, if all these funds 257 00:14:29,600 --> 00:14:32,440 Speaker 1: bought bitcoin, they would take the supply off the market, 258 00:14:32,440 --> 00:14:34,720 Speaker 1: it would increase the demand, and it would push the 259 00:14:34,760 --> 00:14:37,280 Speaker 1: price up. But when you create these e t f 260 00:14:37,360 --> 00:14:40,080 Speaker 1: that allow people to just basically gamble on the price 261 00:14:40,560 --> 00:14:42,920 Speaker 1: instead of putting the money into bitcoin and buying bitcoin, 262 00:14:43,280 --> 00:14:45,960 Speaker 1: now they're just gambling on the price of bitcoin. So 263 00:14:46,040 --> 00:14:48,480 Speaker 1: Gary Ginsler seems to think that's okay. He seems to 264 00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:52,080 Speaker 1: have approved several of those, but he won't approve a 265 00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:59,760 Speaker 1: physical e t F why. I don't really know. Um. 266 00:14:59,800 --> 00:15:02,200 Speaker 1: I guess I could speculate, but I don't want to 267 00:15:02,200 --> 00:15:05,040 Speaker 1: do that right now. I'm not really sure why he doesn't, 268 00:15:05,040 --> 00:15:07,840 Speaker 1: but UM, he certainly gets bitcoin, and I don't know 269 00:15:07,840 --> 00:15:10,040 Speaker 1: why he would do that. So anyway, gray Scale, I'm 270 00:15:10,040 --> 00:15:12,840 Speaker 1: gonna talk about gray Scale. UM, what this close in 271 00:15:12,880 --> 00:15:15,760 Speaker 1: fund means. Why it's in a massive discount to physical bitcoin. 272 00:15:17,040 --> 00:15:18,480 Speaker 1: We can look at it, maybe you should buy it 273 00:15:18,600 --> 00:15:21,080 Speaker 1: or not, um at a discount like it is right now. 274 00:15:21,120 --> 00:15:23,880 Speaker 1: But they want to convert their clothes in fund into 275 00:15:23,960 --> 00:15:26,360 Speaker 1: an e t F, which is an exchange traded fund. 276 00:15:28,320 --> 00:15:30,120 Speaker 1: I think would be best for them if they did that. 277 00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:31,840 Speaker 1: I think would be best for all their shareholders if 278 00:15:31,840 --> 00:15:33,160 Speaker 1: they did that. I think it'd be best for the 279 00:15:33,200 --> 00:15:35,720 Speaker 1: marketplace if they did that. Um. And so they want 280 00:15:35,720 --> 00:15:39,840 Speaker 1: to do that, and uh. The SEC rejected gray Scales 281 00:15:39,880 --> 00:15:43,400 Speaker 1: application to convert its gray Scale Bitcoin trust to an 282 00:15:43,400 --> 00:15:48,960 Speaker 1: exchange traded fund this week, and so in response to 283 00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:51,960 Speaker 1: that Gray Scale Investments file, they lawsuit against the U 284 00:15:52,080 --> 00:15:56,040 Speaker 1: S Securities and Exchange Commission an hour after the regulatory 285 00:15:56,080 --> 00:15:58,600 Speaker 1: agency rejected its application. So there was already word on 286 00:15:58,600 --> 00:16:01,360 Speaker 1: the street that Gray Scale was pretty ready to file lawsuit. 287 00:16:01,440 --> 00:16:05,160 Speaker 1: They were already kind of preparing to get a denied application, 288 00:16:06,520 --> 00:16:08,520 Speaker 1: and so as soon as it was done, it stays here. 289 00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:13,400 Speaker 1: An hour afterwards they had filed the lawsuit application. Um 290 00:16:13,480 --> 00:16:17,040 Speaker 1: they the SEC rejected a citing concerns about the market manipulation, 291 00:16:17,480 --> 00:16:20,160 Speaker 1: the role of tether and the broader bitcoin ecosystem, and 292 00:16:20,200 --> 00:16:23,320 Speaker 1: they lack of surveillance sharing agreement between regulated market of 293 00:16:23,320 --> 00:16:32,360 Speaker 1: significant size. So they're concerned about market manipulation. What do 294 00:16:32,680 --> 00:16:38,320 Speaker 1: futures and ETFs that don't even own the asset do. 295 00:16:39,800 --> 00:16:43,240 Speaker 1: The only thing they do is manipulate the price. So 296 00:16:43,400 --> 00:16:47,600 Speaker 1: instead of buying the asset and leveraging it to short it, 297 00:16:48,400 --> 00:16:50,240 Speaker 1: now I can just bet against it. It's called like 298 00:16:50,400 --> 00:16:52,120 Speaker 1: naked shorting. I don't even have to own the asset. 299 00:16:52,680 --> 00:16:55,640 Speaker 1: I can just bet that it goes down. Those are 300 00:16:55,760 --> 00:16:59,600 Speaker 1: used to manipulate the prices. Look at gold, we don't 301 00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:04,000 Speaker 1: really know and somewhere between three to five hundred paper 302 00:17:04,080 --> 00:17:09,240 Speaker 1: ounces fake ounces for everyone, real physical ounce, and all 303 00:17:09,359 --> 00:17:13,840 Speaker 1: that fake paper gold is used to manipulate the price 304 00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:16,000 Speaker 1: of bitcoin down. So Gary Ginsler says, hey, we're not 305 00:17:16,040 --> 00:17:18,000 Speaker 1: going to prove the physical because it could be used 306 00:17:18,040 --> 00:17:20,600 Speaker 1: for market manipulation. No, no, no, no no, it's the 307 00:17:20,720 --> 00:17:23,159 Speaker 1: fake ones that create the market manipulation. I think everybody 308 00:17:23,160 --> 00:17:27,399 Speaker 1: already knows that. So anyway, that's why he exposed it, 309 00:17:27,560 --> 00:17:30,200 Speaker 1: or I should say, rejected it, and gray Scale is 310 00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:32,560 Speaker 1: gonna sue. Let's take a look at what the Gray 311 00:17:32,640 --> 00:17:36,560 Speaker 1: Scale trust is, why it's so severely undervalued you can 312 00:17:36,600 --> 00:17:40,760 Speaker 1: buy bitcoin, had a huge discount in their fund. We're 313 00:17:40,760 --> 00:17:42,359 Speaker 1: gonna look at that, look at the fees involved, look 314 00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:43,920 Speaker 1: at the chance of you get into your full money 315 00:17:43,960 --> 00:17:45,400 Speaker 1: out of it, and so much more. In a minute. 316 00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:47,560 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Market Mo Show. We're talking about 317 00:17:48,840 --> 00:17:52,680 Speaker 1: the decentralized revolution, talking about bitcoin, cryptocurrencies and the way 318 00:17:52,760 --> 00:17:55,400 Speaker 1: the world is changing in front of our very eyes 319 00:17:55,440 --> 00:17:59,119 Speaker 1: through business, politics, finance, and technology. So I got a 320 00:17:59,160 --> 00:18:02,440 Speaker 1: lot more to cover with the g BTC bitcoin trust, 321 00:18:02,600 --> 00:18:05,040 Speaker 1: the discount and more when I come back in a minute. 322 00:18:05,160 --> 00:18:07,320 Speaker 1: So don't go away, all right, welcome back. You are 323 00:18:07,359 --> 00:18:11,040 Speaker 1: listening to the Markmas Show. We're talking about the decentralized revolution. 324 00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:14,639 Speaker 1: We're talking about the world changing through a lot of 325 00:18:14,760 --> 00:18:18,320 Speaker 1: crazy things. It's it's interesting as as the world change 326 00:18:18,359 --> 00:18:24,520 Speaker 1: has this pendulum swings back, we get the volatility, and 327 00:18:24,560 --> 00:18:26,320 Speaker 1: I think that's the best way to explain what we're 328 00:18:26,400 --> 00:18:29,000 Speaker 1: what we're witnessing. And so we're talking about, uh, specifically, 329 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:32,240 Speaker 1: we're talking about the SEC Securities Exchange Commission. The head, 330 00:18:32,280 --> 00:18:35,840 Speaker 1: Gary Ginsler, he knows bitcoin very well. He said this 331 00:18:35,920 --> 00:18:38,400 Speaker 1: week on Jim Kramer that bitcoin is the only commodity 332 00:18:38,440 --> 00:18:41,000 Speaker 1: the rest our securities. But then he went around and 333 00:18:41,160 --> 00:18:46,679 Speaker 1: denied the request of Gray Scale Bitcoin Trust to convert 334 00:18:46,800 --> 00:18:50,679 Speaker 1: that trust into an e t F. So I want 335 00:18:50,720 --> 00:18:54,160 Speaker 1: to talk about that now. If you missed the first 336 00:18:54,200 --> 00:18:56,719 Speaker 1: part of this and you're just tuning in, no worries, Uh, 337 00:18:56,960 --> 00:18:58,800 Speaker 1: just don't let it happen again, of course, and the 338 00:18:58,880 --> 00:19:00,720 Speaker 1: way you can do that is pull out your phone 339 00:19:00,800 --> 00:19:02,280 Speaker 1: right now. But a reminder for this date, at this time, 340 00:19:02,320 --> 00:19:03,840 Speaker 1: this channel. Make sure you're with me each every week. 341 00:19:04,240 --> 00:19:05,720 Speaker 1: And if you did miss it, don't worry about it. 342 00:19:05,760 --> 00:19:08,560 Speaker 1: I got you covered. You can just search Mark Moss 343 00:19:09,400 --> 00:19:13,560 Speaker 1: podcast and you can catch me over there. Now back 344 00:19:13,640 --> 00:19:18,320 Speaker 1: to what happened, Like I said, the SEC rejecting this um, 345 00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:25,840 Speaker 1: he said that Gary gains SEC said that he wanted, uh, 346 00:19:26,359 --> 00:19:30,560 Speaker 1: he wants to protect us because he wants to make 347 00:19:30,560 --> 00:19:33,280 Speaker 1: sure there's better protection, so there's no market manipulation going on. 348 00:19:34,359 --> 00:19:36,400 Speaker 1: But the market manipulation, as I was making the case, 349 00:19:36,600 --> 00:19:39,480 Speaker 1: is brought on by people betting against the price without 350 00:19:39,520 --> 00:19:45,320 Speaker 1: actually buying the asset itself. Allah Gold. Let's break into 351 00:19:45,359 --> 00:19:48,119 Speaker 1: this a little bit now, GBTC Gray scales Bitcoin Trust 352 00:19:49,080 --> 00:19:52,560 Speaker 1: it trade that a discount to nav in a VY. 353 00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:54,760 Speaker 1: What does that mean in a v's is a net 354 00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:59,000 Speaker 1: asset valuation, So that means that the assets that they hold, 355 00:19:59,119 --> 00:20:02,160 Speaker 1: So that means that you could buy the Bitcoin trust 356 00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:07,320 Speaker 1: for less then the assets that it's holding on its books. Now, 357 00:20:07,480 --> 00:20:10,960 Speaker 1: why would you be able to buy a fund for 358 00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:14,680 Speaker 1: less than their net asset valuation. We're gonna take a 359 00:20:14,720 --> 00:20:17,760 Speaker 1: look at that. But what they're trying to do is 360 00:20:18,160 --> 00:20:22,320 Speaker 1: convert this trust into an e t F, which would 361 00:20:22,359 --> 00:20:25,480 Speaker 1: then really solve the problem. So it's trading at a 362 00:20:25,520 --> 00:20:28,040 Speaker 1: discount because there's some problems. We're gonna dig into those problems, 363 00:20:28,240 --> 00:20:29,720 Speaker 1: and if they could convert it to this e t F, 364 00:20:29,800 --> 00:20:33,520 Speaker 1: it would solve the problem of this discount. Why it's 365 00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:37,440 Speaker 1: trading for less than its market value? Now, like I 366 00:20:37,520 --> 00:20:39,520 Speaker 1: was saying before, it's an e t F as an 367 00:20:39,560 --> 00:20:42,960 Speaker 1: exchange trade fund, grad scale operates as a close in fund, 368 00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:46,040 Speaker 1: and what that means is the new shares can't be 369 00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:50,480 Speaker 1: created and redeemed um in line with fluctuating demand. All right, 370 00:20:50,520 --> 00:20:51,760 Speaker 1: that's how an e t F functions. So an e 371 00:20:51,840 --> 00:20:55,320 Speaker 1: t F, basically every dollar in would go to buy 372 00:20:55,359 --> 00:20:57,280 Speaker 1: more bitcoin, and when you take a dollar out, they 373 00:20:57,280 --> 00:21:00,160 Speaker 1: sell it a dollar bitcoin. But a close in fund 374 00:21:00,200 --> 00:21:02,680 Speaker 1: doesn't work that way. They don't buy and sell bitcoin 375 00:21:02,840 --> 00:21:05,320 Speaker 1: in line with the demand um and the e t 376 00:21:05,480 --> 00:21:09,040 Speaker 1: F they call that a redemption mechanism, and that's how 377 00:21:09,080 --> 00:21:12,800 Speaker 1: you reconcile the difference between the NAB net asset valuation 378 00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:16,160 Speaker 1: and what the market value is. And basically, like I said, 379 00:21:16,160 --> 00:21:18,240 Speaker 1: that prevents shares of the e t F from trading 380 00:21:18,359 --> 00:21:21,359 Speaker 1: at a discount, so it keeps the shares um in 381 00:21:21,560 --> 00:21:24,680 Speaker 1: line with the price at all times. But like I said, 382 00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:26,840 Speaker 1: the gray scale bitcoin trust is way down. As a 383 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:29,480 Speaker 1: matter of fact, you can buy it almost a thirty 384 00:21:29,640 --> 00:21:35,320 Speaker 1: percent discount to their net asset valuation, which sounds like 385 00:21:35,359 --> 00:21:39,520 Speaker 1: a bargain. And I know some very well known and 386 00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:45,000 Speaker 1: respected investors that are buying at this discount. I'm not 387 00:21:45,960 --> 00:21:47,880 Speaker 1: should you, Well, I don't know. Let's take a look 388 00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:50,119 Speaker 1: at that, so it says this occurs because bitcoin was 389 00:21:50,160 --> 00:21:53,399 Speaker 1: added to the fund as new investors demanded GBTC. As 390 00:21:53,480 --> 00:21:57,680 Speaker 1: demand waned and g BTC was sold, Bitcoin was locked 391 00:21:57,720 --> 00:21:59,720 Speaker 1: in the fund, but it wasn't sold at the same 392 00:22:00,480 --> 00:22:03,960 Speaker 1: as demand wane, causing shares to trade lower than the 393 00:22:04,119 --> 00:22:09,200 Speaker 1: net asset value of the trust. And what they're trying 394 00:22:09,240 --> 00:22:11,359 Speaker 1: to do is that they can convert the trust into 395 00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:14,760 Speaker 1: the e t F. It would close the discount and 396 00:22:14,840 --> 00:22:18,080 Speaker 1: then allow the bitcoin to track the bitcoin price, and 397 00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:20,280 Speaker 1: for the investors that are there would be a really 398 00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:22,760 Speaker 1: good thing because then the investors would be able to 399 00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:25,879 Speaker 1: get the appreciation of their holdings equal to the size 400 00:22:25,880 --> 00:22:28,760 Speaker 1: of the discount, which means they would make a thirty 401 00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:32,320 Speaker 1: percent spread. Sounds pretty good. That's why people were buying it, 402 00:22:33,040 --> 00:22:35,560 Speaker 1: hoping that it would get approved and that it would 403 00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:39,680 Speaker 1: get revalued and they would automatically make that thirty percent. Now, 404 00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:45,600 Speaker 1: I would imagine the the the odd hads, the betting 405 00:22:45,640 --> 00:22:47,760 Speaker 1: odds of it getting approved were probably pretty slim in 406 00:22:47,800 --> 00:22:50,120 Speaker 1: my opinion. Anyway, I didn't expect it to happen because 407 00:22:50,119 --> 00:22:53,800 Speaker 1: of course Gary Ginsler has denied every single one so far, 408 00:22:54,560 --> 00:22:57,400 Speaker 1: and I don't see that happening anytime soon. Now, part 409 00:22:57,440 --> 00:23:01,639 Speaker 1: of the problem with the Gray Scale Bitcoin Trust is 410 00:23:01,680 --> 00:23:05,640 Speaker 1: that it's expensive. So what happens is that they automatically 411 00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:08,480 Speaker 1: sell two percent of the fund every year as as 412 00:23:08,560 --> 00:23:11,440 Speaker 1: their fee. So like a lot of funds, you have 413 00:23:11,560 --> 00:23:14,280 Speaker 1: to pay a maintenance fee, so you're so basically for 414 00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:18,040 Speaker 1: the amount of money you buy, they take two percent 415 00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:21,359 Speaker 1: of your money every year to manage this fund for you. 416 00:23:21,560 --> 00:23:24,800 Speaker 1: Now that's um right now, it's about thirty five bitcoin 417 00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:28,680 Speaker 1: a day and they have almost six hundred and fifty 418 00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:32,600 Speaker 1: thousand bitcoin, which is a massive number, which means that 419 00:23:32,880 --> 00:23:36,240 Speaker 1: Gray Scale Bitcoin Trust holds about three per cent of 420 00:23:36,440 --> 00:23:39,480 Speaker 1: all the bitcoin supply, which is pretty amazing. And that's 421 00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:42,320 Speaker 1: in there. Another term, it's a u M, which stands 422 00:23:42,359 --> 00:23:48,760 Speaker 1: for assets under management. Now there's other ways to buy 423 00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:53,160 Speaker 1: bitcoin and ETFs, like I said, but they're not physically 424 00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:56,240 Speaker 1: held bitcoin. So one is the pro shares Bitcoin ETF 425 00:23:57,000 --> 00:24:00,359 Speaker 1: and they hold they hold the futures the bit in future, 426 00:24:00,359 --> 00:24:03,040 Speaker 1: so again's just betting on the direction and they charge 427 00:24:03,080 --> 00:24:05,560 Speaker 1: a much lower fee. So that's something that you want 428 00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:07,119 Speaker 1: to look at when you're looking at these types of 429 00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:09,280 Speaker 1: e t s. They all have different fees. They have 430 00:24:09,359 --> 00:24:13,000 Speaker 1: different schedules, they recalculate, and it's that small print that 431 00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:15,000 Speaker 1: can really get you if you don't know what you're 432 00:24:15,200 --> 00:24:18,119 Speaker 1: what you're getting into. But Gray Scale, so so the 433 00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:20,920 Speaker 1: pro schars bitcoinit you have, holds the futures. They're just 434 00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:25,200 Speaker 1: holding bets, that's it. But Gray Scale actually holds bitcoin, 435 00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:27,760 Speaker 1: which is good, which is why they wanted to convert 436 00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:29,600 Speaker 1: into a physically hell because they already have the bitcoin. 437 00:24:29,720 --> 00:24:35,119 Speaker 1: They have six fifty bitcoin um a u m ass 438 00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:38,720 Speaker 1: under management. But what we can see when you look 439 00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:42,280 Speaker 1: at their when you when you look at who owns 440 00:24:42,880 --> 00:24:47,000 Speaker 1: all the GBTC, we can see that the largest holder 441 00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:52,439 Speaker 1: of g BTC is Three Arrows Capital. Now, if you've 442 00:24:52,480 --> 00:24:55,320 Speaker 1: been tuned into the other segments of the show, I've 443 00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:57,760 Speaker 1: been talking about Three Arrows Capital three E C, three 444 00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:00,720 Speaker 1: A C and how they're caught up in what I'm 445 00:25:00,720 --> 00:25:04,280 Speaker 1: calling the Great Unwind. So Tera Luna went down and 446 00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:06,680 Speaker 1: it starts dragging everyone else down with it. Then we 447 00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:10,159 Speaker 1: saw Celsius go down. Now we're seeing Three Arrows Capital 448 00:25:10,240 --> 00:25:13,440 Speaker 1: going down, et cetera. And Three Arrows Capital which just 449 00:25:13,720 --> 00:25:16,359 Speaker 1: got just missed their payments, so they just got marked 450 00:25:16,800 --> 00:25:20,520 Speaker 1: um in solvent. They're being liquidated. They're the largest holder 451 00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:26,320 Speaker 1: of bitcoin inside the GBTC trust and that's the problem 452 00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:30,440 Speaker 1: because as they're being liquidated, people need to get access 453 00:25:30,480 --> 00:25:33,840 Speaker 1: to those assets, but those assets are held inside the 454 00:25:33,960 --> 00:25:37,159 Speaker 1: trust and the trust isn't liquid. It's a big problem. 455 00:25:37,680 --> 00:25:43,240 Speaker 1: They hold about thirty eight million shares equated to five 456 00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:48,879 Speaker 1: thirty million dollars, or seventy five times the average daily 457 00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:53,320 Speaker 1: traded volume of seven million dollars in GBTC, So that's 458 00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:56,399 Speaker 1: seventy five times the average dated daily traded volume. So 459 00:25:56,880 --> 00:26:00,240 Speaker 1: that means it's not liquid. How do you get five 460 00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:04,480 Speaker 1: million dollars out of something that only trades seven million 461 00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:07,560 Speaker 1: in a day And the answer is you don't, not 462 00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:10,719 Speaker 1: very fast anyway. Now, the problem is is that Three 463 00:26:10,760 --> 00:26:14,560 Speaker 1: Arrows Capital was ordered to liquidate all the remaining assets 464 00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:16,840 Speaker 1: they're being liquidated and they can't meet the margin requirements 465 00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:20,359 Speaker 1: they're being called. They were ordered by a cord in 466 00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:23,359 Speaker 1: the British for an islands um to liquidate all the 467 00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:26,360 Speaker 1: remaining assets totally an over a billion dollars, which is good, 468 00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:29,920 Speaker 1: but the problem is that the gray scale Bitcoin Trust 469 00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:33,440 Speaker 1: isn't liquid enough for Three Arrows Capital. Three a C 470 00:26:33,600 --> 00:26:37,960 Speaker 1: to dump all its holdings. Um. Now they could try, 471 00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:41,200 Speaker 1: it's not gonna go very good because it's not liquid enough. 472 00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:45,240 Speaker 1: And if they did, that would lower the price of 473 00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:47,880 Speaker 1: the of the of the trust and then it would 474 00:26:48,359 --> 00:26:55,439 Speaker 1: cause the gap to grow even wider. So what's going 475 00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:59,240 Speaker 1: to happen. Well, I'll talk about that and more. Talk 476 00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:02,480 Speaker 1: about that pations of this e t F conversion. Uh, 477 00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:04,240 Speaker 1: talk about some things that you need to know if 478 00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:07,600 Speaker 1: you're a holder of the trust or if you're considering 479 00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:09,800 Speaker 1: being a holder of the test trust. And then we'll 480 00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:12,200 Speaker 1: look back a little bit more about the lawsuit that's 481 00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:14,639 Speaker 1: going to happen if you the trust and the SEC. 482 00:27:15,440 --> 00:27:17,080 Speaker 1: I'm gonna cover all that more in a minute. You're 483 00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:18,879 Speaker 1: listening to the Mark Moas Show. We're talking about the 484 00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:23,440 Speaker 1: decentralized revolution, talking about bitcoin, cryptocurrencies and the way the 485 00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:25,680 Speaker 1: world's changing right before our very eyes. I got a 486 00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:27,480 Speaker 1: lot more to cover when I come back in a minute, 487 00:27:27,920 --> 00:27:30,000 Speaker 1: So don't go away, all right, Welcome back. You are 488 00:27:30,040 --> 00:27:33,400 Speaker 1: listening to the markmas Show. We're talking about the decentralized revolution, 489 00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:37,479 Speaker 1: talking about bitcoin and cryptocurrencies, talking about the financial system, 490 00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:41,280 Speaker 1: the markets, you know, all those things that really matter 491 00:27:41,320 --> 00:27:44,360 Speaker 1: to your life. I was talking about specifically, we're talking 492 00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:47,159 Speaker 1: about bitcoin. We're talking about this gray scale Bitcoin trust, 493 00:27:47,880 --> 00:27:50,160 Speaker 1: talking about how the head of the sec, Gary Ginsler, 494 00:27:50,359 --> 00:27:54,480 Speaker 1: denied their application to convert the trust into an e 495 00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:57,040 Speaker 1: t F. We broke down what that means, what the 496 00:27:57,119 --> 00:27:58,760 Speaker 1: e t F is, what the trust is, how it works, 497 00:27:58,840 --> 00:28:01,000 Speaker 1: what the discounts are, what NAVY is, what a u 498 00:28:01,160 --> 00:28:03,320 Speaker 1: M is. If you missed any of that, I feel 499 00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:05,440 Speaker 1: bad for you, but don't worry. You can go listen 500 00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:07,520 Speaker 1: to it on the Mark Moss podcast. Just google that 501 00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:11,199 Speaker 1: UM or just search on your favorite podcast player. Now. 502 00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:15,280 Speaker 1: I was talking about before the break, how the problem 503 00:28:15,440 --> 00:28:18,480 Speaker 1: is is that UM, this great unwind, all these funds 504 00:28:18,560 --> 00:28:21,400 Speaker 1: domino into each other, are creating this problem, and how 505 00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:26,359 Speaker 1: UM the b v I British Virgin Islands UM ordered 506 00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:29,920 Speaker 1: throughous capital to liquidate all the remaining assets. The problem 507 00:28:30,040 --> 00:28:33,520 Speaker 1: is they have about five million dollars worth of UM 508 00:28:33,800 --> 00:28:37,720 Speaker 1: assets or bitcoin on the trust, but the trust only 509 00:28:37,840 --> 00:28:40,000 Speaker 1: seven million dollars a day. It's not it's not a 510 00:28:40,040 --> 00:28:41,800 Speaker 1: good problem. It's not a good problem to have. And 511 00:28:41,920 --> 00:28:44,280 Speaker 1: what happens is if they forced that liquidation to happen, 512 00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:47,920 Speaker 1: it's gonna push GBTC, the grace coalpic coin trust further 513 00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:53,280 Speaker 1: down and widen out the spreads, which isn't good. So 514 00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:57,440 Speaker 1: in the coming you know whatever, several weeks looking forward, 515 00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:02,160 Speaker 1: as they start liquid a it's remaining gray scale bitcoin trust, 516 00:29:03,120 --> 00:29:08,000 Speaker 1: I think we're going to see the um the gap widen. 517 00:29:08,120 --> 00:29:10,440 Speaker 1: I mean, there's just no other way right um there's 518 00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:12,960 Speaker 1: just not a liquid enough market for that to happen, 519 00:29:13,320 --> 00:29:15,120 Speaker 1: and so I think we're going to continue to see 520 00:29:15,120 --> 00:29:16,880 Speaker 1: that nav play out now. Like I said, I have 521 00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:19,880 Speaker 1: known a few well known investors who have been buying 522 00:29:19,960 --> 00:29:23,200 Speaker 1: into this hoping that the spread would go the other way, 523 00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:26,120 Speaker 1: but it looks like the spread is probably going to 524 00:29:26,160 --> 00:29:29,360 Speaker 1: continue to widen at this point now. Like I said, 525 00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:31,960 Speaker 1: if they could have converted the trust into an e 526 00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:34,880 Speaker 1: t F, it would eliminate that discount and everybody would 527 00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:38,200 Speaker 1: have made money, which would have been great, but it's 528 00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:40,920 Speaker 1: just not happening right now now. If you're a holder 529 00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:44,240 Speaker 1: of of of the trust GBTC, a couple of things 530 00:29:44,280 --> 00:29:48,080 Speaker 1: you just know. One, you can't convert your GBTC into 531 00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:51,560 Speaker 1: bitcoin directly, so that means you can't self custody it now. 532 00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:53,240 Speaker 1: Part of the reason why I don't think we need 533 00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:55,720 Speaker 1: a physical bitcoin trust is because I don't need a 534 00:29:55,760 --> 00:29:58,080 Speaker 1: trust to buy or an e t F to buy bitcoin. 535 00:29:58,160 --> 00:30:00,040 Speaker 1: I can just buy bitcoin myself. That's part of the 536 00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:02,280 Speaker 1: whole revolution here. I can buy the asset, I can 537 00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:05,040 Speaker 1: custody of my own in my hardware wallet. I don't 538 00:30:05,160 --> 00:30:09,200 Speaker 1: need someone to hold it for me. Now, futures and 539 00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:12,560 Speaker 1: ETFs were created as a way to buy or have 540 00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:15,680 Speaker 1: access to assets that I can't hold. So, for example, 541 00:30:15,840 --> 00:30:19,040 Speaker 1: futures were started by farmers, and they're trying to hedge 542 00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:21,800 Speaker 1: their crop. Hey, I'm growing this corn or this weed 543 00:30:21,880 --> 00:30:24,640 Speaker 1: or whatever it is, and what if what if, you know, 544 00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:27,000 Speaker 1: hurricane comes or some sort of drought comes and I 545 00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:29,080 Speaker 1: lose all my crop. So what I'll do is I'll 546 00:30:29,160 --> 00:30:32,280 Speaker 1: sell it on the futures market today, and that way, 547 00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:37,040 Speaker 1: if whatever happens, I'm hedged. Right. Also, as an investor, 548 00:30:37,960 --> 00:30:41,760 Speaker 1: how do I invest into wheat or corn or oil? 549 00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:44,400 Speaker 1: I don't I don't have giant oil tankers, And so 550 00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:47,000 Speaker 1: I could invest into it by helping these farmers with 551 00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:50,280 Speaker 1: these producers offset by using some sort of a fund 552 00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:52,880 Speaker 1: and e t F. So that's good. Even gold, I 553 00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:54,720 Speaker 1: mean gold is pretty easy to custody. But if I'm buying, 554 00:30:54,840 --> 00:30:57,400 Speaker 1: you know, millions of dollars or hundreds of millions of 555 00:30:57,400 --> 00:30:59,680 Speaker 1: dollars of gold, it's not easy to custody that amount. 556 00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:01,360 Speaker 1: And so, and I can buy it through some sort 557 00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:03,440 Speaker 1: of an E t F or something like that. But 558 00:31:03,520 --> 00:31:07,560 Speaker 1: Bitcoin is different. Bitcoin is very easy to hold. I 559 00:31:07,600 --> 00:31:10,120 Speaker 1: don't need anyone to secure it for me. It's digital. 560 00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:12,200 Speaker 1: All I need to know is my password. That's it. 561 00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:14,600 Speaker 1: And I can hold a dollar of bitcoin or a 562 00:31:14,720 --> 00:31:17,600 Speaker 1: hundred billion dollars of bitcoin with just one password, and 563 00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:21,040 Speaker 1: so we don't need futures, we don't need some sort 564 00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:23,120 Speaker 1: of a fun to do that like we do with wheat, 565 00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:28,239 Speaker 1: corn oil, et cetera. So anyway, you can't custody your 566 00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:32,560 Speaker 1: g BTC as you would with with bitcoin directly, which 567 00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:36,640 Speaker 1: then creates counterparty risk. That means now I have to 568 00:31:36,720 --> 00:31:40,080 Speaker 1: trust gray Scale to hold that for me, and I 569 00:31:40,120 --> 00:31:42,200 Speaker 1: don't know what that risk is. It could be very small, 570 00:31:42,280 --> 00:31:44,120 Speaker 1: but it's still risk that I have to add in there. 571 00:31:44,680 --> 00:31:49,080 Speaker 1: Um And in case of gray Scale going and solvent Um, 572 00:31:49,120 --> 00:31:50,719 Speaker 1: if they were to go bell YEP, I could potentially 573 00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:53,040 Speaker 1: lose it. So I've talked about this great unwind, and 574 00:31:53,160 --> 00:31:55,560 Speaker 1: we saw that the dominoes are fall into bigger and 575 00:31:55,600 --> 00:31:59,840 Speaker 1: bigger people. And now it's at Genesis door. And Genesis 576 00:32:00,200 --> 00:32:03,480 Speaker 1: is owned by the same company d c G that 577 00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:08,240 Speaker 1: also owns the Great Scale Bitcoin Trust. Now, I'm not 578 00:32:08,360 --> 00:32:10,960 Speaker 1: trying to say that there's a panic or or danger 579 00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:14,720 Speaker 1: going on here, but if something were to happen, it 580 00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:18,240 Speaker 1: creates that counterparty risk. Now, if you do own the 581 00:32:18,360 --> 00:32:23,600 Speaker 1: trust and you're you know, upside down, your upside down, Um, 582 00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:28,000 Speaker 1: you know I wouldn't panic. Um, you can probably continue 583 00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:31,800 Speaker 1: to hold on. I think, um, I think you know 584 00:32:31,840 --> 00:32:33,840 Speaker 1: they're gonna keep They're in a lawsuit right now, they're 585 00:32:33,840 --> 00:32:35,240 Speaker 1: going to try to get this e t F through. 586 00:32:35,680 --> 00:32:37,200 Speaker 1: If they get that e t F through and maybe 587 00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:38,960 Speaker 1: takes another year, maybe it takes two years, but they 588 00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:44,120 Speaker 1: could close that gap up. Now if you uh, you know, 589 00:32:44,360 --> 00:32:45,920 Speaker 1: like I said, if you're if you're hoping to buy 590 00:32:45,960 --> 00:32:48,080 Speaker 1: it at a discount, maybe it goes down. Maybe maybe 591 00:32:48,120 --> 00:32:51,440 Speaker 1: we see three arrows capital liquid eate push that price 592 00:32:51,560 --> 00:32:54,200 Speaker 1: down to that gap widens. Maybe you buy it at 593 00:32:54,200 --> 00:32:58,960 Speaker 1: a thirty forty fifty percent discount, and you can afford 594 00:32:59,000 --> 00:33:01,000 Speaker 1: to wait two years or years and see if this 595 00:33:01,240 --> 00:33:02,840 Speaker 1: gets closed up, maybe it could be a good deal. 596 00:33:03,600 --> 00:33:06,040 Speaker 1: Those are ways to look at it. Now back to 597 00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:10,520 Speaker 1: the sec Gary Ginsler, uh man, I mean he gets 598 00:33:10,600 --> 00:33:12,960 Speaker 1: this right, he gets bitcoin, he taught it at M 599 00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:16,520 Speaker 1: I t again, I don't I don't really want to speculate, 600 00:33:16,560 --> 00:33:19,240 Speaker 1: but I just don't know why he's rejecting all these 601 00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:24,200 Speaker 1: spots or physical et fs when he's approving the derivatives 602 00:33:24,240 --> 00:33:26,320 Speaker 1: ones when he says that he wants he doesn't want 603 00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:29,760 Speaker 1: to prove the spot because of potential manipulation. But it's 604 00:33:29,800 --> 00:33:33,600 Speaker 1: the derivatives that cause all the manipulation. I just don't 605 00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:36,760 Speaker 1: understand that. But like I said, Gray scal was already 606 00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:42,000 Speaker 1: they were already anticipating this being denied, and so they 607 00:33:42,080 --> 00:33:44,840 Speaker 1: already had a lawsuit prepared and ready to go. So 608 00:33:45,080 --> 00:33:48,400 Speaker 1: immediately Gray Scout followed the lawsuit. But I don't expect 609 00:33:48,480 --> 00:33:52,720 Speaker 1: this to happen anytime soon. Um. They're suing an inept 610 00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:56,760 Speaker 1: and incompetent government, um, And it could take years. I mean, 611 00:33:56,840 --> 00:33:59,320 Speaker 1: we could see a year or two before we see 612 00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:04,480 Speaker 1: anything come out of this, probably you know, most likely 613 00:34:06,280 --> 00:34:09,120 Speaker 1: or something like that we see. UM, So don't hold 614 00:34:09,160 --> 00:34:11,880 Speaker 1: your breath. But if you bought bitcoin. Let's say that 615 00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:13,920 Speaker 1: Let's say that three rows capital has to liquidate. Let's 616 00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:15,560 Speaker 1: say it forces that spread to be wider. Right now, 617 00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:22,040 Speaker 1: it's you buy it, you wait two years UM, and 618 00:34:22,120 --> 00:34:25,359 Speaker 1: then by then, hopefully bitcoins back to a higher price. 619 00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:28,680 Speaker 1: We're having having having any cycle at that time. So 620 00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:32,359 Speaker 1: let's say bitcoins a it goes up to fifty UM. 621 00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:35,160 Speaker 1: So bitcoin has doubled, they're tripled in value, and you 622 00:34:35,239 --> 00:34:37,600 Speaker 1: get to close the gap. At the same time, it 623 00:34:37,680 --> 00:34:40,279 Speaker 1: could turbo charge your investments. Um. You just have to 624 00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:42,719 Speaker 1: decide if that's a risk you want to take and 625 00:34:42,760 --> 00:34:47,440 Speaker 1: if you're okay waiting that time frame for it. But um, 626 00:34:47,480 --> 00:34:48,920 Speaker 1: the other thing is, not only is it gonna take 627 00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:50,680 Speaker 1: a lot of time, it's also going to cost a 628 00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:54,120 Speaker 1: lot of money. The gray skial is gonna have to 629 00:34:54,160 --> 00:34:55,279 Speaker 1: spend a lot of time. But it's also going to 630 00:34:55,320 --> 00:34:57,600 Speaker 1: spend a lot of money on it. And even if 631 00:34:57,680 --> 00:35:00,480 Speaker 1: they do sue, sue the sec they go through this 632 00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:02,759 Speaker 1: for a couple of years and they spend all the money, 633 00:35:03,320 --> 00:35:06,160 Speaker 1: the chance of winning is probably slim to none. Well, 634 00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:08,080 Speaker 1: I don't want to say none, but I'd say it's slim. 635 00:35:09,040 --> 00:35:11,880 Speaker 1: Suing the government probably doesn't have a very high probability 636 00:35:11,920 --> 00:35:14,520 Speaker 1: of winning. I know and I know a few people 637 00:35:14,520 --> 00:35:17,360 Speaker 1: who have actually had to defend themselves from the SEC 638 00:35:19,160 --> 00:35:22,239 Speaker 1: and uh, you don't win, you don't win. As a 639 00:35:22,239 --> 00:35:25,279 Speaker 1: matter of fact. Um, somebody an associate that I knew 640 00:35:25,280 --> 00:35:27,480 Speaker 1: before I worked with in the past, they were under 641 00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:31,640 Speaker 1: SEC lawsuits and they were told in the back office like, hey, 642 00:35:32,200 --> 00:35:36,279 Speaker 1: we don't lose, so just give us something and we'll 643 00:35:36,400 --> 00:35:39,160 Speaker 1: we'll we'll end this. So um, the chance of them 644 00:35:39,200 --> 00:35:42,400 Speaker 1: winning is probably very slim, but it could happen. But 645 00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:45,239 Speaker 1: like I said, there's been I want to say, at 646 00:35:45,360 --> 00:35:49,719 Speaker 1: least five, if not six or seven or eight, at 647 00:35:49,760 --> 00:35:52,160 Speaker 1: least five I know e t s that have been 648 00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:56,640 Speaker 1: denied by the SEC so far. And we'll see what happens. 649 00:35:56,719 --> 00:35:58,239 Speaker 1: I don't know if it's going to get approved or not. 650 00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:01,560 Speaker 1: But that all part of being an investor. You get 651 00:36:01,640 --> 00:36:04,120 Speaker 1: to understand the situation. As I've explained to you. You 652 00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:06,840 Speaker 1: can understand what the risks and rewards are, the time frames, 653 00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:08,800 Speaker 1: and then you can decide if that makes sense for 654 00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:10,600 Speaker 1: you or not. And I'd love to hear what you 655 00:36:10,719 --> 00:36:12,160 Speaker 1: have to say, so hit me up on social media 656 00:36:12,560 --> 00:36:15,200 Speaker 1: at the number one Mark Moss just at one Mark Moss. 657 00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:18,440 Speaker 1: You can find me on Instagram, on Twitter, let me 658 00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:21,319 Speaker 1: know what you think. I'd love to hear it. And uh, 659 00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:23,319 Speaker 1: if you just tune in, you listen to the Mark 660 00:36:23,360 --> 00:36:28,240 Speaker 1: Moa show talking about the Decentralized Revolution, talking about bitcoin, 661 00:36:28,360 --> 00:36:31,200 Speaker 1: talking about cryptocurrency, is talking about through the lens of politics, finance, 662 00:36:31,239 --> 00:36:34,440 Speaker 1: and technology, so you can have a better sense, you 663 00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:37,680 Speaker 1: can have more context to what the heck is going 664 00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:40,000 Speaker 1: on in the world today. Hopefully that makes sense to 665 00:36:40,080 --> 00:36:42,560 Speaker 1: Hopefully I'm making it easy to understand. Make sure to 666 00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:44,760 Speaker 1: tune in with me each and every week on this channel. 667 00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:48,719 Speaker 1: Check out my new website at one Mark Moss name 668 00:36:48,719 --> 00:36:51,880 Speaker 1: as my social media handles. And if you missed any 669 00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:54,279 Speaker 1: of this, you can catch it on the I Heart 670 00:36:54,360 --> 00:36:56,600 Speaker 1: podcast network. Just go to your podcast player in search 671 00:36:56,680 --> 00:36:59,120 Speaker 1: Mark Moss podcast. And that's what I got for you today, right, 672 00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:00,600 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening. What's your next time?