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Speaker 1: Wait that answer in the morning Breakfast Club, Yep, Charlemagne

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Speaker 1: and God Angela ye Envy had to go for a second.

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Speaker 1: But we have from very special guests here. We have

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Speaker 1: Tanya Lewis Lee and a Marii Maynard from the Aftershock documentary.

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Speaker 1: Good morning, how a y'all? Good morning. What's happening all

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Speaker 1: as well? Things are great, There's a lot of awesome

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Speaker 1: conversation happening, especially you know, specifically with this month being

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Speaker 1: Bipop Mental Health Month. But After Shocking itself is just

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Speaker 1: such a dope film. I'm so excited that it's actually

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Speaker 1: out now in a streaming on Hulu and just talk

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Speaker 1: about it. They examined the maternal mortality rate definitely in America,

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Speaker 1: definitely especially for black women too, And I think this

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Speaker 1: is something we've discussed how that rate is so much

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Speaker 1: higher than white women. Yeah, black women are dying at

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Speaker 1: three to four times the rate of white women from

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Speaker 1: childbirth complications. In New York City, it's eight to twelve

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Speaker 1: times the rate of white women. And it is it

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Speaker 1: is a crisis. It's a national crisis that people haven't

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Speaker 1: been talking about. That's why I directed and produced the

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Speaker 1: film so that we could have a conversation. I'm so

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Speaker 1: grateful to Amari for allowing us to come into his

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Speaker 1: life at a very difficult time and open himself up

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Speaker 1: to the cameras so that everybody can understand what it's

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Speaker 1: like for a family to lose someone from childbirth complications

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Speaker 1: and what it takes for someone to pick themselves up

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Speaker 1: and not only heal for themselves, but also try to

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Speaker 1: heal the community, because that's really what Amar's doing. Man.

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Speaker 1: We've spoken to Dulah's on this show before. We have

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Speaker 1: our good friend late them and I know at one

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Speaker 1: point you guys did get a midwife, right, so can

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Speaker 1: you talk about what that process was like and what

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Speaker 1: you learn when you did get a midwife. So for us,

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Speaker 1: we have a very our family dynamic is very unique

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Speaker 1: in the fact that Shawnee SI's excuse me, Shamani's mom,

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Speaker 1: she's been in the midwife Medwi free community for decades.

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Speaker 1: She's been doing a lot of work specifically around maternal

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Speaker 1: health in the darker side of it. So we knew

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Speaker 1: about the need for a midwife. We knew about the

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Speaker 1: need to have a duela. So for both of our children,

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Speaker 1: we had a midwife and duel at present, and we

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Speaker 1: knew what the warning signs were and what to do,

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Speaker 1: you know, So that in itself was just amazing for us.

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Speaker 1: But the thing is is that a lot of people

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Speaker 1: don't know that they have birthing options and they have

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Speaker 1: people to support. The greatest thing about it, though, is that,

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Speaker 1: you know, once we're in the delivery room once where

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Speaker 1: I'm about to bring this new child into the world,

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Speaker 1: we have people to advocate for you, you know, and

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Speaker 1: those experiences they kind of get very nuanced. And the

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Speaker 1: fact that you know, doctor's nurses, they actually a lot

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Speaker 1: of questions and a lot of things that you're not

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Speaker 1: really processing as a father and as a mother specifically

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Speaker 1: as a mother, you know, So just having those advocates

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Speaker 1: in the rooms, it's a beautiful thing. No. I love

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Speaker 1: the fact that y'all did after shot from perspective of,

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Speaker 1: you know, two men, because that's one of the reasons

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Speaker 1: I got a duela, you know, we went and got

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Speaker 1: laid them because I saw Charles Johnson. Familiar with Charles Johnson.

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Speaker 1: I saw Charles Johnson on CNN back in the day,

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Speaker 1: and I just could not imagine, you know, something like

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Speaker 1: that happening in my second daughter was born because of

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Speaker 1: an emergency c section, Like you were born a month

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Speaker 1: earlier and you know, got rushed to the hospital, did

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Speaker 1: to c section, and that could have went, you know,

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Speaker 1: either way. And it's from that point on, I just

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Speaker 1: had like such an anxiety surrounding child birthday. I never

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Speaker 1: wanted to be in there alone, without having a duela. Well,

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Speaker 1: it's interesting you bring that up, anxiety, because I think

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Speaker 1: that unfortunately in this country and given this crisis, that

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Speaker 1: there is anxiety and fear. And I really think that

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Speaker 1: we need to shift the culture because birthing should be

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Speaker 1: an exciting, empowering time for a woman and for her family,

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Speaker 1: and it should not be anxiety producing. I mean, we've

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Speaker 1: been birthdaying since forever. That's why we're all here. And

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Speaker 1: I think part of the issue is that we have,

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Speaker 1: you know, as technology has advanced, we have moved into

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Speaker 1: more of, as a Helena Grant says in the film,

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Speaker 1: a technocratic, patriarchal model of birthing, which can create some issues.

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Speaker 1: So I liken it to farm to table that that

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Speaker 1: now we've got to come back a little bit back

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Speaker 1: and look at what the midwives did back in the

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Speaker 1: past and and and use a little bit of what

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Speaker 1: they've done and a little bit of the medical technocratic model,

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Speaker 1: but not not the way it is, because that's really

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Speaker 1: what's killing us. We should not be afraid to be

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Speaker 1: giving birth. It should be a powerful time for a woman.

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Speaker 1: Helena Grant also talks about how when a woman is

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Speaker 1: birthing a child, she's not just birthing that child, She's

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Speaker 1: birthing a mother. And so the process of labor, Yes,

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Speaker 1: it can hurt, it can be painful, but you know,

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Speaker 1: we shouldn't be afraid of that either, that that is

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Speaker 1: a process that we go through so that we are

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Speaker 1: powerful mothers. When you go through the process of birthing,

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Speaker 1: you know, you can do anything, you know. So I

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Speaker 1: just I just hope that as we have conversations around

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Speaker 1: the issues of birthing in America, especially with black women,

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Speaker 1: that we're looking for a space to eradicate the fear

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Speaker 1: and find the empowerment part of birthing. I agree with

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Speaker 1: you one hundred percent. It's just so difficult when you

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Speaker 1: go in these hospitals that a majority white drivens, a

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Speaker 1: lot of white nurses, a lot of white doctors. They're

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Speaker 1: not looking at you know, I remember one time for

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Speaker 1: our third child, like they didn't even have any epidurals,

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Speaker 1: like literally in a hospital and they were just like, well,

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Speaker 1: baby's right now, you can just push it out. And

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Speaker 1: I'm like, you know, like, how do you post to

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Speaker 1: react to something like well, yeah, no. And I completely

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Speaker 1: agree with you, And I think a Maori raised the

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Speaker 1: idea of choice and birthing right. I think that I

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Speaker 1: think we can start thinking about the fact that we

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Speaker 1: can we can be consumers here, you know, if we

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Speaker 1: can and find the right situation for you. If you

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Speaker 1: want to birth in a hospital with a doctor, just

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Speaker 1: with the doctor, you can do that. But if you

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Speaker 1: want to bring a dula and into that, that's great too.

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Speaker 1: You could birth in a birthing center with a midwife

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Speaker 1: and adula, maybe without an eperdura, with that in mind

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Speaker 1: that you're going into that process. People can birth at

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Speaker 1: home with a midwife and adula and a doctor on

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Speaker 1: call if that's what makes them feel comfortable. And I

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Speaker 1: really think it's about finding the right environment and the

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Speaker 1: right support around a woman. It should be woman centered

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Speaker 1: and she needs to figure out what she needs around her.

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Speaker 1: Because I agree, like, you don't want to be in

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Speaker 1: a hospital necessarily where there's a bunch of white people

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Speaker 1: looking at you like you're crazy, don't really believe you

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Speaker 1: when you say you're having pain, you're asking for things,

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Speaker 1: and they're you know, discounting you. That that is not

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Speaker 1: the type of environment anyone wants to be giving birth in.

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Speaker 1: And sometimes it feels like, and you point this out too,

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Speaker 1: it's like the midwife or the dula against the doctor

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Speaker 1: and it's not like they're working together in tandem, right,

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Speaker 1: you know, and they should be. I mean, every other

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Speaker 1: industrialize the nation has midwives integrated into women's healthcare so

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Speaker 1: that women interface with the midwife first if there is

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Speaker 1: a problem, because midwives to separate from dulahs. Midwives are

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Speaker 1: conitions that can do just about anything a doctor can

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Speaker 1: except for cut you the obi guinies are surgeons. They

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Speaker 1: are surgeons, we need them, they're important, but they're ready

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Speaker 1: to do surgery. Midwives are there to hang out and

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Speaker 1: take the time, allow your body to do what it's

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Speaker 1: supposed to do. And if they're working together, I think

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Speaker 1: that's the best, the best situation so that if a

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Speaker 1: complication occurs, you've got the doctor right there who is

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Speaker 1: ready to come in but if we're not working together

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Speaker 1: and in tandem, then it becomes a fight between the

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Speaker 1: power who is more powerful, the doctor or the midwife.

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Speaker 1: But we need to figure out how to work together.

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Speaker 1: And even when it comes to c sections, you've spoken

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Speaker 1: about how that's been on the rise. I think like

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Speaker 1: seventy percent more c sections are happening. Why are hospitals

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Speaker 1: so quick to be like, you got to get a

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Speaker 1: C section more money? Yeah, yeah, well that's what it

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Speaker 1: is essentially, um and they so we talk about in

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Speaker 1: the film the rates of C sections about sixty percent, Um,

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Speaker 1: sixty percent of c sections are not needed, you know.

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Speaker 1: So but like Charlemagne just said, Um, it's about fifteen

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Speaker 1: thousand dollars you get for a vaginal birth and it

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Speaker 1: takes about eight to twelve hours right to go through

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Speaker 1: that whole process. But a C section you make doubled

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Speaker 1: the amount of money. It takes about forty five minutes,

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Speaker 1: you know, and it's scheduled, so a doctor, if you

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Speaker 1: want to go game or dinner, you can go do

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Speaker 1: that exactly. And that's what I was just about to say.

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Speaker 1: In the film. It's so ill because like there's a

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Speaker 1: there's a part of it where you know, like the

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Speaker 1: or the nurses and doctors are you know, in the

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Speaker 1: in the you know, the forum, and they're talking about

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Speaker 1: the schedule c sections. But it's not they're not talking

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Speaker 1: about they're not talking to people by about by their name.

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Speaker 1: It's all number x Y two five, seven eight, schedule

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Speaker 1: a C section for this time x y three seventy five.

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Speaker 1: She's you know, got already had a C section, so

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Speaker 1: she needs another. Like so it's it's really it's a

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Speaker 1: really monetized model where it's almost similar to the prison system,

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Speaker 1: where everybody kind of has this serial number, you know,

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Speaker 1: and and that's how people are looked at, not necessarily

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Speaker 1: as people, but as commodities. I think God for information,

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Speaker 1: and I thank God for you know, laid them because

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Speaker 1: like I can still hear the fear in my wife's

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Speaker 1: voice when she had to think about having a C

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Speaker 1: section for the second time, you know that after she

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Speaker 1: had to one for our second child. They told her

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Speaker 1: when she got pregnant again, she's gonna have to have

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Speaker 1: it was already scheduled and everything, And just a random

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Speaker 1: conversation with with Latham and I just asked her and

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Speaker 1: she was like no, she doesn't have to have a

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Speaker 1: C section, And so that's when she first got with Latham,

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Speaker 1: and Latham walks through the process and she ended up

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Speaker 1: having the child. That is really amazing she was able

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Speaker 1: to do that, and like you say, she had the

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Speaker 1: support of someone who was like, hold on a second,

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Speaker 1: we can do this, because without that support, she's being

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Speaker 1: pushed into having that that that C section, which happens

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Speaker 1: to too many women. Now, another thing that you guys

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Speaker 1: discuss is what happens after a woman gives birth. Right,

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Speaker 1: what's going on with going back to the doctor, getting

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Speaker 1: checked up on and Amari? I know for you you

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Speaker 1: feel that that death could have been prevented. Yeah, most definitely,

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Speaker 1: most definitely. Um. Just throughout the entire process, she's Shamani

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Speaker 1: was healthy, she was strong. We tried to have a

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Speaker 1: vback as well, the vaginal birth after C section. Unfortunately

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Speaker 1: it didn't happen. But when we left the hospital, I

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Speaker 1: left with my daughter, let me excuse me, my son

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Speaker 1: and my partner, you know, so I thought everything was fine.

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Speaker 1: And the subsequent days, you know, she was complaining about

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Speaker 1: chess pain, she was complaining and about having shortness of breath.

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Speaker 1: She was claimed, Um, complaining about not being able to walk,

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Speaker 1: you know, and do these certain things. And like I said,

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Speaker 1: you know, our family has been in this maternal space

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Speaker 1: for a while. So her mom was like, this sounds

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Speaker 1: like a pulmonary embolism. You know. We went to the

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Speaker 1: doctor three times within that two week period to go,

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Speaker 1: you know, to go let them know, like this is

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Speaker 1: the problem, these are the issues, this is how she's feeling.

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Speaker 1: And every time he went, because of the fact that

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Speaker 1: Shamani's scheduled visit for her check up was six weeks out,

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Speaker 1: they didn't they didn't look at her. They looked at

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Speaker 1: this the C section that she had, for the cliffs.

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Speaker 1: They talked about we went to have a visit for

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Speaker 1: um Kari and what his needs are. But every time

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Speaker 1: we went out there, we were advocating and advocating and advocating.

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Speaker 1: It was still this thing where it's because of the

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Speaker 1: fact that it's not her schedule time exactly. It's horrible

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Speaker 1: because many of these deaths happened postpartum, many of these

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Speaker 1: deaths and the fact that you know, she had an

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Speaker 1: appointment six weeks out and no, and they're like, oh no,

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Speaker 1: We've got to wait for that six weeks. It's insane,

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Speaker 1: It's insane. You know, women should be checked on a

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Speaker 1: few days after a week after. They should be seen,

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Speaker 1: especially after having major surgery like a C section. And

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Speaker 1: again that's one of those things midwives do. You know,

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Speaker 1: they will come and check you several you know, right

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Speaker 1: after having birth. Six weeks out is way too long,

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Speaker 1: and I think we need a cultural shift in that

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Speaker 1: women should be seen much sooner before that. Now, Tanya,

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Speaker 1: for you, this is I know you've produced before, but

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Speaker 1: this is a directorial debut for you. So what was

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Speaker 1: your passion behind this and how was it for you? Fielming?

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Speaker 1: Because I know emotionally you get attached and I know

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Speaker 1: they were difficult times, you know, because clearly this is

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Speaker 1: not something that's easy. Yeah, you know, I had been

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Speaker 1: working raising awareness about the high rates of infant mortality

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Speaker 1: in the United States. I started that back in two

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Speaker 1: thousand and seven, traveled the country talking about infants. You know,

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Speaker 1: we have the same disparity as in maternal health. Black

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Speaker 1: babies diet three to four times the rate of white

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Speaker 1: babies in this country before their first birthday. I found

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Speaker 1: myself immersed in a world of women's health, really I'm

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Speaker 1: just an advocate because I know how hard it is

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Speaker 1: for us as women, as people in general to access

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Speaker 1: our best healthy lives here in this country. And I

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Speaker 1: believe that health is everything. It's the foundation and basis

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Speaker 1: of everything that we do. And while I was talking,

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Speaker 1: I would go and talk to groups of women, and

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Speaker 1: you know, inevitably someone would tell me about someone who

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Speaker 1: passed away from childbirth complications. And actually the first one

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Speaker 1: that I knew about was a woman named Tatiana odin

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Speaker 1: French because her partner was someone that I had or

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Speaker 1: her husband was someone that I had gone to school with,

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Speaker 1: and he called me and told me about her passing.

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Speaker 1: So had been hearing about all of these deaths and

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Speaker 1: wanted to tell a story about it. I wanted to

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Speaker 1: raise awareness about it so that we can do something.

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Speaker 1: I think if we don't have the conversation about what's happening,

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Speaker 1: we can't fix it. And I really believe that we

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Speaker 1: can make for better birth outcomes. I really believe that,

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Speaker 1: So that's why I wanted to make the film. And

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Speaker 1: when Shannie Annamari put out on social media and invitation

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Speaker 1: for a celebration of Shamani's life along with a conversation

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Speaker 1: with the community about what was happening with black maternal health.

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Speaker 1: We reached out to film and they agreed, and that

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Speaker 1: really began the film that you see as Aftershock, and

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Speaker 1: you know, it was it is hard. It is hard

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Speaker 1: subject matter. And you know, I didn't know Amari, Shawnee

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Speaker 1: and Bruce, and you know, you go in obviously with

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Speaker 1: deep humility, deep empathy and um. But they really wanted

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Speaker 1: to have this conversation, right Uh, and so it became

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Speaker 1: very collaborative. Uh. And it was really about where where

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Speaker 1: they led. We followed. Uh, if you're good with it,

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Speaker 1: I'm good with it. There's something you don't want to do,

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Speaker 1: I'm not doing it. I'm you know, uh and UM,

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Speaker 1: you know, it's just it's been a really wonderful process.

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Speaker 1: It's been amazing getting to know Shamani and Amber through Amari,

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Speaker 1: Shawnee and Bruce. They were beautiful women. It's clear they were.

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Speaker 1: They were beautiful, loving, um, active women, and I just

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Speaker 1: really wanted people to get to know them a little

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Speaker 1: bit and I want people to feel empowered. So UM,

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Speaker 1: you know, you do the best you can to to

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Speaker 1: try to make some change in this this crazy world.

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Speaker 1: Because I really believe we can change these outcomes. How

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Speaker 1: was the press for you making the film? Um? It

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Speaker 1: was it was enlightening. Um. So we did after Shock

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Speaker 1: Hour After Shock event on December nineteen for Shimani's birthday.

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Speaker 1: So this is two months after she passed. So like,

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Speaker 1: during that that two month time frame was the darkest

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Speaker 1: time of my life. Honestly, Um, it was filled with

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Speaker 1: my deepest grief, sadness, just insecurities, Like all these things

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Speaker 1: started coming up and me being able to process it was.

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Speaker 1: It was difficult. But what I started to do was painting.

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Speaker 1: I started at painting. I honestly, I spent two months

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Speaker 1: in my basement painting by myself, trying to figure out

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Speaker 1: this new life that I was gonna have to lead.

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Speaker 1: So when Tanya and Paula came in introduced his film

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Speaker 1: to us, I was like, NA, I'm not doing this,

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Speaker 1: this is this is I'm not at my best exactly.

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Speaker 1: You know what I'm going I'm going through things, you know,

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Speaker 1: going through things I've never been through before. But after

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Speaker 1: having a conversation with Seannee and you know her just

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Speaker 1: kind of identifying what the opportunity was, what the possibilities

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Speaker 1: could be and just the fact that, you know, regardless

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Speaker 1: of where the film went, at least we would have

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Speaker 1: something documented about our family so that our kids could watch,

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Speaker 1: you know. So at that point I was I was

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Speaker 1: on board. I was ready, but you know, it's a documentary,

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Speaker 1: so you just you don't know, you know. So it's like,

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Speaker 1: I don't know what I'm gonna do, I don't know

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Speaker 1: how I'm gonna be. But it really to Poland and

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Speaker 1: this is really the greatness of Paula and Tanya and

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Speaker 1: how they allowed us to be ourselves. They allowed us

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Speaker 1: to process in whatever way that we wanted to process,

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Speaker 1: and like she said, like Tanniya said, they gave us

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Speaker 1: space when we needed it. And at the same time,

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Speaker 1: you know, they knew that we were going to do

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Speaker 1: the work because we are advocates and activists you know

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Speaker 1: at heart, So the work was going to come. But

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Speaker 1: it was really just about how and when emotionally and mentally,

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Speaker 1: you know, how else did you process the trauma of

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Speaker 1: this event other than the painting? Yeah, So thankfully I've

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Speaker 1: got a dope community. Um. So it as soon as

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Speaker 1: she passed, like I had grief counselors. Beautiful when SHALMANI

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Speaker 1: was when you know, she was when she was here,

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Speaker 1: we'd go to a couple of therapy, you know, Solah

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Speaker 1: I was. I was on it. I was on it.

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Speaker 1: I mean not by choice, to be honest. You know,

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Speaker 1: it was something that Shamani was pushing. But you know

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Speaker 1: I went once and it went twice and then obviously

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Speaker 1: after a while I saw the value in it because

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Speaker 1: it just made the relationship great. But after she passed

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Speaker 1: a step, I kept going to the same therapist UM

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Speaker 1: and then like I said, I had family friends coming in,

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Speaker 1: you know, to help out around the house and provide pamps, diapers,

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Speaker 1: you know, all the things that that you would need

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Speaker 1: UM on a on a day to day basis. But

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Speaker 1: in order for me to process my grief, painting was one.

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Speaker 1: But it turned into being this kind of mind, body,

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Speaker 1: spirit training where I was running every day, I was

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Speaker 1: working out, I was painting, I was talking to my therapists,

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Speaker 1: I was talking to family and friends, just different ways

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Speaker 1: to deal with the pain, deal with the grief and

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Speaker 1: process it in a way that was positive. And like

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Speaker 1: that's kind of what I really try to push now,

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Speaker 1: especially to men going through anything, because we all go

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Speaker 1: through our own pain. We all go through our own traumas, right,

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Speaker 1: but it's so important that we speak about it, that

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Speaker 1: we communicate it, and that we you know, we do

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Speaker 1: the things right because it's always and this is an ongoing,

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Speaker 1: never ending process. I'm gonna be going through this for

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Speaker 1: the rest of my life, you know. So it is

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Speaker 1: really making sure that I'm being very intentional about how

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Speaker 1: I want to move my energy and use my energy.

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Speaker 1: And these for me, running, painting, working out, talking, those

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Speaker 1: are the things that works for me. You know, it's

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Speaker 1: different for everybody. But like again, that's what I would

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Speaker 1: push Yeah, when I hit when I hear brothers like

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Speaker 1: you tell your story, brothers like you know, Charles Johns

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Speaker 1: telling this story, I'm just like y'all way stronger than me,

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Speaker 1: because there's no way I don't even know if I

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Speaker 1: could even have that conversation because I don't even know

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Speaker 1: when it would hit me that this actually happened, you

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Speaker 1: know what I mean. And then you see your child

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Speaker 1: every day, every day you're thinking about your queen. I

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Speaker 1: would push it back a little and say that it's

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Speaker 1: I honestly see you don't feel that way. I feel

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Speaker 1: like you whatever you're given is what you're given, right,

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Speaker 1: and you know God doesn't make mistakes, right, we all

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Speaker 1: like and then, like I said earlier, we all have

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Speaker 1: our own griefs, right, minds might be a little bit

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Speaker 1: deeper than than others. But when it all comes down

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Speaker 1: to it, if you're gonna be there for your child,

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Speaker 1: you're gonna be there for yourself, You're gonna be there

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Speaker 1: for your family. You gotta do the work, you know.

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Speaker 1: And it's really that simple. So once you kind of

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Speaker 1: break it down in that in that way, it's it's

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Speaker 1: honestly like, you know, all right, what's next? What I

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Speaker 1: gotta do? You know, it's it's you know, get down

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Speaker 1: and lay down, and you know, you gotta you gotta

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Speaker 1: make things happen, especially you know, just being in New

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Speaker 1: York and especially trying to raise your child like I've got.

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Speaker 1: I've got three children, you know, and they got to eat,

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Speaker 1: they got to learn, they got to do all the

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Speaker 1: things they have to put them in the best position possible.

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Speaker 1: So um again, and this is again, I always big

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Speaker 1: up my community because this isn't something that I could

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Speaker 1: have done by myself. Right, you definitely need people in

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Speaker 1: conjunction and partnerships and to take the kids off your

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Speaker 1: hands in the days where you're just like, yeah, I

398
00:21:34,200 --> 00:21:37,119
Speaker 1: just don't got it today, you know. But um, And

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Speaker 1: that's why I really try to do my best to

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Speaker 1: make sure that I speak to fathers who are going

401
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Speaker 1: through the things that I've gone through, because they don't

402
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Speaker 1: A lot of them just don't have that same support

403
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Speaker 1: system and they just need to know that, you know,

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Speaker 1: even if I'm not necessarily physically there, they can call

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Speaker 1: somebody at the very least and say, Yo, this is

406
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Speaker 1: what I'm going through. I need to emote, you know.

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Speaker 1: So that's that's what we're doing. That's why I respect

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Speaker 1: I respect it coming from you because I know you've

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Speaker 1: allowed yourself to feel Yeah, you're not numbing, you know

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Speaker 1: at all, not at all. But like you and Bruce also,

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Speaker 1: what type of relationship. Yeah, so Bruce is my guy. Man.

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Speaker 1: I love Bruce. I love Bruce Man Bruce he Um.

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Speaker 1: He pushes me in ways that nobody else can because

414
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Speaker 1: of the fact that we've been through the same thing,

415
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Speaker 1: um and and have shared the same experiences and are

416
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Speaker 1: going through this path together, you know. So you know,

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Speaker 1: me and him, me and him, we speak all the time,

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Speaker 1: you know, and I know that, you know, when he's

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Speaker 1: doing his thing in his spaces, he's advocating for me,

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Speaker 1: and I'm doing the same exact thing, you know, because

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Speaker 1: of the fact that you know, he's just he's he's

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Speaker 1: one of those men who, like Charlemagne said, is allowing

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Speaker 1: himselves to feel right. Um, I always say that in

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Speaker 1: your deepest grief you gain your greatest growth, you know. So,

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Speaker 1: and and with Bruce, like, I don't know if I

426
00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:01,159
Speaker 1: could have went through what Bruce went through, you know,

427
00:23:01,240 --> 00:23:05,400
Speaker 1: with with Amber and how the hospitals treated her. Um.

428
00:23:06,040 --> 00:23:09,000
Speaker 1: But again, you know, so I watch him and see

429
00:23:09,040 --> 00:23:11,960
Speaker 1: what he's doing and see how his Savor Rose Foundation

430
00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:14,640
Speaker 1: is just doing awesome things and how he's really servicing

431
00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:18,560
Speaker 1: the community in real ways, you know. And again, you know,

432
00:23:18,600 --> 00:23:20,800
Speaker 1: when you have brothers like that who have that power

433
00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:24,480
Speaker 1: to you know, just shift and do the work you

434
00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:26,639
Speaker 1: know you got. You gotta big up that man, and

435
00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:29,959
Speaker 1: you gotta humble yourself and just let them know that

436
00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:32,320
Speaker 1: they all loved you know. What can you do to

437
00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:35,240
Speaker 1: advocate for yourself? Right? What would you recommend to people?

438
00:23:35,600 --> 00:23:39,560
Speaker 1: If a woman a family are dealing with a complicated childbirth,

439
00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:42,480
Speaker 1: they know something's wrong. The hospital is not being responsive,

440
00:23:42,680 --> 00:23:44,760
Speaker 1: the doctors aren't doing what they're supposed to do. What

441
00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:50,919
Speaker 1: can you do? You can you have options? Felice. So

442
00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:54,280
Speaker 1: in the film, there was a sister name is Felicia.

443
00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:58,879
Speaker 1: She went and had a birth at a birthing center.

444
00:23:59,240 --> 00:24:01,080
Speaker 1: But she was a ray. Yeah, I think thirty four.

445
00:24:03,080 --> 00:24:04,879
Speaker 1: She was at the end, you know, and she was

446
00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:07,919
Speaker 1: going to the doctors, you know, to hospitals during this

447
00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:11,639
Speaker 1: thirty five week time period, but she decided to shift

448
00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:13,720
Speaker 1: because she felt like the need wasn't there. So it's

449
00:24:13,800 --> 00:24:16,359
Speaker 1: never too late, you know, it's never too late. I

450
00:24:16,480 --> 00:24:18,760
Speaker 1: think that you know, to your to your question, I

451
00:24:18,800 --> 00:24:22,600
Speaker 1: think that it's so important that you understand and learn

452
00:24:22,640 --> 00:24:25,720
Speaker 1: what's around you. Right. So, there are places that rate

453
00:24:25,840 --> 00:24:28,360
Speaker 1: hospitals based off of the amount of C sections that

454
00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:31,800
Speaker 1: they provide to their patrons. And as you say that,

455
00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:34,080
Speaker 1: I just shout out to Kimberly Seals All. She's got

456
00:24:34,119 --> 00:24:38,720
Speaker 1: the earth app that is. Yeah, so yeah, Kimberly is

457
00:24:38,760 --> 00:24:42,200
Speaker 1: super dope. Earth app definitely um And for those who

458
00:24:42,240 --> 00:24:44,199
Speaker 1: don't know where earth app is, it's basically like a

459
00:24:44,320 --> 00:24:50,440
Speaker 1: YELP type of UM. Yeah, definitely, yeah, yeah, she's doing

460
00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:52,879
Speaker 1: great work and she's so it is that platform that

461
00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:56,760
Speaker 1: allows you know, people to rate the hospitals, you know,

462
00:24:57,000 --> 00:25:00,159
Speaker 1: rate the doctors, rate the nurses and then those So

463
00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:03,120
Speaker 1: that's what you should be doing exactly. Now, is there

464
00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:06,080
Speaker 1: anything you can do right after everything happened that doctors

465
00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:09,240
Speaker 1: didn't do what they could. This was preventable, right, So

466
00:25:09,320 --> 00:25:11,760
Speaker 1: now what happens after that? Is this something that is

467
00:25:11,800 --> 00:25:17,080
Speaker 1: now practiced? Like what can somebody do afterward? Um? Well,

468
00:25:17,080 --> 00:25:21,280
Speaker 1: can I just say what I think Omari and Bruce

469
00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:25,000
Speaker 1: are doing is amazing. I mean, what I've learned is

470
00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:28,399
Speaker 1: from watching them is like griefus love. It's love for

471
00:25:28,440 --> 00:25:30,920
Speaker 1: the people that have passed. It's love for the people

472
00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:33,960
Speaker 1: who are still here. It's love for community. And what

473
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:38,280
Speaker 1: they are doing is activating a community. They've become activated.

474
00:25:39,160 --> 00:25:42,400
Speaker 1: As Amari says, he is painting, He's painting portraits, paying

475
00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:46,639
Speaker 1: it forward, reaching out to other men, being supportive. Bruce

476
00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:49,120
Speaker 1: is trying to bring a birthing center to the Bronx.

477
00:25:49,600 --> 00:25:52,159
Speaker 1: He's already has the womb bus that is going around

478
00:25:52,160 --> 00:25:58,000
Speaker 1: the Bronx. And so while unfortunately there isn't a lot

479
00:25:58,040 --> 00:26:00,400
Speaker 1: that one can do for those that are gone. There

480
00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:02,199
Speaker 1: are things that people can do for those of us

481
00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:05,120
Speaker 1: who are here. And you know, I see that every

482
00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:08,959
Speaker 1: day and what saver A Rose and Aria is doing.

483
00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:12,119
Speaker 1: But and I think I think all of us have

484
00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:14,240
Speaker 1: a role to play. Quite frankly, I mean, we should

485
00:26:14,240 --> 00:26:16,200
Speaker 1: be paying attention to what Bruce is doing. We should

486
00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:18,560
Speaker 1: be supporting that we need more birthing centers in New

487
00:26:18,640 --> 00:26:21,520
Speaker 1: York City. We should be paying attention to what's going

488
00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:24,600
Speaker 1: on in the midwifree profession. We need more midwise, we

489
00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:28,160
Speaker 1: need more black midwives, we need more black obi ginnies

490
00:26:28,280 --> 00:26:31,880
Speaker 1: we do. We need more black doctors. And we need

491
00:26:31,920 --> 00:26:34,240
Speaker 1: to be having the conversation so that we can all

492
00:26:34,280 --> 00:26:37,640
Speaker 1: figure out how do we make it better for all

493
00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:43,760
Speaker 1: of us because birthing is critically important. Mothers are critically important,

494
00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:47,800
Speaker 1: we are Maternal health and infant health is the marker

495
00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:50,480
Speaker 1: of a health of a nation. And if Black women

496
00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:53,160
Speaker 1: are not doing well, that means we are not doing

497
00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:55,200
Speaker 1: well as an Asian. So we have to figure out

498
00:26:55,240 --> 00:26:59,600
Speaker 1: how to how to fix it. Absolutely, so where do

499
00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:02,240
Speaker 1: they can? You have to shock it after Shock is

500
00:27:02,240 --> 00:27:05,359
Speaker 1: streaming right now on Hulu, and so we hope a

501
00:27:05,359 --> 00:27:07,480
Speaker 1: lot of people go out and check it out. And

502
00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:10,640
Speaker 1: what do y'all hope to What do y'all hope this project? Does?

503
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:14,320
Speaker 1: You know? I hope that the film after Shock, as

504
00:27:14,359 --> 00:27:16,880
Speaker 1: I said, I hope it's a conversation starter. I hope

505
00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:20,439
Speaker 1: people watch it and talk about it. I hope people

506
00:27:20,480 --> 00:27:23,160
Speaker 1: debate it. You know, if if they look at well

507
00:27:23,280 --> 00:27:26,159
Speaker 1: Felicia had an amazing birth and a birthing center, you know,

508
00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:29,000
Speaker 1: talk about how you feel about the idea of birthing

509
00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:32,000
Speaker 1: and a birthing center versus a hospital. Talk about what

510
00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:34,399
Speaker 1: does it mean to have a midwife? Learn more we

511
00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:38,040
Speaker 1: do we cover the history of midwiffery in this country.

512
00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:45,680
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, the obstetric profession really is based

513
00:27:45,800 --> 00:27:50,800
Speaker 1: on taking the economy of midwiffery out of the hands

514
00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:53,680
Speaker 1: of black women, put it in the hands of white

515
00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:58,120
Speaker 1: doctors and hospitals, putting us all into their hands into hospitals,

516
00:27:58,280 --> 00:28:02,400
Speaker 1: and demonizing black midwives. We need to learn about our

517
00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:06,320
Speaker 1: history so that we understand how we got here. Does

518
00:28:06,359 --> 00:28:09,680
Speaker 1: it sharance cover midwives? Insurance does not cover midwives. We

519
00:28:10,600 --> 00:28:12,760
Speaker 1: need laws, and the good news is that there are

520
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:16,040
Speaker 1: laws right now. There's the mom Nabus bills that are

521
00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:19,359
Speaker 1: in Congress right now working their way through. As I said,

522
00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:23,040
Speaker 1: many of these deaths are postpartum, So for women who

523
00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:26,080
Speaker 1: are on Medicaid, we need Medicaid to extend for at

524
00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:29,640
Speaker 1: least a year postpartum. Often women who are on Medicaid

525
00:28:29,640 --> 00:28:32,679
Speaker 1: they get kicked off very soon after delivery. We need

526
00:28:32,760 --> 00:28:36,480
Speaker 1: to keep them on. Midwives and dulas need to get paid,

527
00:28:36,520 --> 00:28:40,320
Speaker 1: they need to be covered as well. So all of that,

528
00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:42,640
Speaker 1: we need to figure out what's going on and vote,

529
00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:46,239
Speaker 1: because voting matters who's in office. We look at right

530
00:28:46,280 --> 00:28:49,120
Speaker 1: now what's happening with the reversal of Roe v. Wade,

531
00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:51,520
Speaker 1: which is going to impact Black women more than it

532
00:28:51,600 --> 00:28:55,240
Speaker 1: does anybody else, certainly when it comes to maternal deaths.

533
00:28:55,400 --> 00:28:58,520
Speaker 1: There's a study that just said maternal death for Black

534
00:28:58,520 --> 00:29:01,280
Speaker 1: women may go up thirty three scent because of the

535
00:29:01,320 --> 00:29:05,640
Speaker 1: Stobs decision. And everybody who voted for Donald Trump twice,

536
00:29:05,760 --> 00:29:09,000
Speaker 1: they're the ones that got us here. So um, we

537
00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:10,600
Speaker 1: do have to vote and we do have to be

538
00:29:10,640 --> 00:29:13,600
Speaker 1: active in our political system too. Speaking of that, can

539
00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:15,680
Speaker 1: you touch on Lean's Law a little bit, because didn't

540
00:29:16,040 --> 00:29:19,560
Speaker 1: just send it pass legislation to improve maternal and reproductive

541
00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:21,840
Speaker 1: health in New York State last year. I'm not sure.

542
00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:26,360
Speaker 1: I'm not familiar with that one, do you know what? Okay,

543
00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:29,120
Speaker 1: But I do like the fact that the documentary does

544
00:29:29,240 --> 00:29:34,400
Speaker 1: offer some optimism and some solutions absolutely to move forward.

545
00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:36,360
Speaker 1: And I do feel like and Amari, thank you so

546
00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 1: much for actually participating in agreeing to do the documentary

547
00:29:40,040 --> 00:29:42,680
Speaker 1: and coming up here to spread the knowledge you know,

548
00:29:42,760 --> 00:29:44,560
Speaker 1: in the word about it and being so strong for

549
00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:47,040
Speaker 1: your family. Yeah, no, no problem, thank you for having us.

550
00:29:47,040 --> 00:29:49,760
Speaker 1: You know, this is this is a moment. It's definitely

551
00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:53,800
Speaker 1: a moment. And I really honestly feel like the film

552
00:29:53,840 --> 00:29:56,680
Speaker 1: came out at a perfect time where people are listening,

553
00:29:56,720 --> 00:30:01,120
Speaker 1: where people are trying to improve what people do understand

554
00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:04,400
Speaker 1: that that we need to have, you know, not just

555
00:30:04,440 --> 00:30:08,120
Speaker 1: a physical connection with people, but also create spiritual connections

556
00:30:08,160 --> 00:30:10,960
Speaker 1: with them as well, you know. And when I say people,

557
00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:13,080
Speaker 1: I'm talking about you know, here on our earth plane,

558
00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:17,560
Speaker 1: but also our ancestors, you know, and um you know,

559
00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:19,320
Speaker 1: so that's what we're here for and that's what we're doing.

560
00:30:19,320 --> 00:30:22,800
Speaker 1: And just again, thank you, you know, um our foundation,

561
00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:26,120
Speaker 1: the ARIA Foundation, you know, the ARIA and it self

562
00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:30,280
Speaker 1: stands for the Advancement of Reproductive Innovation through autistry and healing,

563
00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:33,120
Speaker 1: you know. So what we're doing is we're really trying

564
00:30:33,120 --> 00:30:36,600
Speaker 1: to intentionally create spaces and places and talk about and

565
00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:40,440
Speaker 1: have these conversations where they weren't being had before. Right

566
00:30:40,920 --> 00:30:43,480
Speaker 1: when I go to rallies and do events, you know,

567
00:30:43,520 --> 00:30:44,840
Speaker 1: there are a lot of duelers, There are a lot

568
00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:47,280
Speaker 1: of midwives, there are a lot of nurses, and that's awesome, right,

569
00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:51,360
Speaker 1: But it's so important that we really intentionally try to

570
00:30:51,360 --> 00:30:54,560
Speaker 1: connect with people who don't know, we don't have the information,

571
00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:57,960
Speaker 1: who who are oblivious, or who may not even really

572
00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:00,360
Speaker 1: want to have birth, but it's just so in porrant

573
00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:03,680
Speaker 1: that they know because there are other ways and you

574
00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:05,920
Speaker 1: can advocate, there's other ways that you can help and

575
00:31:05,960 --> 00:31:07,959
Speaker 1: be a part of this, I'm sure. And make sure

576
00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:12,000
Speaker 1: you'll go watch the Aftershock documentary on Hulu. Amari man At,

577
00:31:12,040 --> 00:31:15,240
Speaker 1: Tanya lewis Lee, thank you for joining us this morning.

578
00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:18,160
Speaker 1: Thank you, thank you appreciate it. It's the Breakfast Club