1 00:00:02,520 --> 00:00:10,119 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. You're listening to the 2 00:00:10,119 --> 00:00:13,880 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch us live weekdays at 3 00:00:13,920 --> 00:00:17,120 Speaker 1: noon and five pm Eastern on Apple Coarcklay and Android 4 00:00:17,160 --> 00:00:20,560 Speaker 1: Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. Listen on demand wherever 5 00:00:20,600 --> 00:00:25,040 Speaker 1: you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube. 6 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:29,960 Speaker 2: We plunge further into a government shutdown with huge questions 7 00:00:30,080 --> 00:00:31,640 Speaker 2: about how we get out of one. 8 00:00:32,200 --> 00:00:34,559 Speaker 3: I'll let you know there were already no votes. 9 00:00:34,360 --> 00:00:37,159 Speaker 2: As expected on the Democratic version of the Continuing Resolution. 10 00:00:37,280 --> 00:00:39,520 Speaker 2: The House has already done that now for I believe 11 00:00:39,520 --> 00:00:41,880 Speaker 2: the sixth time today, and we're watching voting now, I 12 00:00:41,880 --> 00:00:44,440 Speaker 2: should say the Senate watching voting now on the Senate 13 00:00:44,440 --> 00:00:45,920 Speaker 2: floor on the Republican cr. 14 00:00:46,360 --> 00:00:48,199 Speaker 3: This is the one that did pass the House and 15 00:00:48,320 --> 00:00:50,400 Speaker 3: is expected to fail again. Here. 16 00:00:50,479 --> 00:00:52,320 Speaker 2: Thanks for being with us on the Wednesday edition of 17 00:00:52,360 --> 00:00:55,760 Speaker 2: Balance of Power on Bloomberg TV and radio. Of course, 18 00:00:55,800 --> 00:00:58,440 Speaker 2: it's a different mathematical equation in the Senate where you 19 00:00:58,520 --> 00:01:02,320 Speaker 2: need sixty votes, something that I discussed with Republican Senator 20 00:01:02,360 --> 00:01:03,680 Speaker 2: James Langford of Oklahoma. 21 00:01:03,760 --> 00:01:04,280 Speaker 4: Let's listen. 22 00:01:04,360 --> 00:01:06,600 Speaker 5: The challenge that we have is we don't have sixty votes. 23 00:01:06,640 --> 00:01:09,080 Speaker 5: We're not even close to that. So the alternative then 24 00:01:09,200 --> 00:01:11,360 Speaker 5: is to just keep the government closed down forever. That 25 00:01:11,360 --> 00:01:14,920 Speaker 5: doesn't help us either. We've got to actually have conversations 26 00:01:14,920 --> 00:01:17,679 Speaker 5: where Republicans Democrats who disagree on a lot of things 27 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:19,920 Speaker 5: figure out how we can get sixty votes in the 28 00:01:19,959 --> 00:01:22,759 Speaker 5: Senate to agree to something, and then to be able to. 29 00:01:22,680 --> 00:01:26,880 Speaker 2: Move conversations with Republicans and Democrats cats and dogs living 30 00:01:26,880 --> 00:01:30,880 Speaker 2: together that will actually occur this hour on this program. 31 00:01:30,880 --> 00:01:33,600 Speaker 2: Will be joined in a moment by Republican Congressman Jason Smith, 32 00:01:33,720 --> 00:01:35,920 Speaker 2: a key figure in this debate, as he shares the 33 00:01:35,959 --> 00:01:39,560 Speaker 2: important House Ways and Means Committee. As I mentioned as well, 34 00:01:39,600 --> 00:01:43,440 Speaker 2: Congresswoman Melanie Stansbury of New Mexico will join us with 35 00:01:43,520 --> 00:01:45,440 Speaker 2: the Democratic view. But we want to start at the 36 00:01:45,440 --> 00:01:48,560 Speaker 2: White House here because of course President Trump is so 37 00:01:48,680 --> 00:01:51,000 Speaker 2: important when it comes to messaging and direction for the 38 00:01:51,080 --> 00:01:55,240 Speaker 2: leadership on Capitol Hill. And Bloomberg's Washington correspondent Tyler Kendall's 39 00:01:55,280 --> 00:01:56,960 Speaker 2: on the North lawn right now on a rainy day 40 00:01:57,000 --> 00:01:57,840 Speaker 2: here in the Capitol. 41 00:01:57,880 --> 00:02:00,320 Speaker 3: Tyler, what's going on, Joe? 42 00:02:00,360 --> 00:02:03,080 Speaker 6: Well, it's so far a relatively quiet day here at 43 00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:05,480 Speaker 6: the White House. We haven't really heard much from officials 44 00:02:05,480 --> 00:02:07,920 Speaker 6: in the way when it comes to any sort of 45 00:02:08,000 --> 00:02:10,920 Speaker 6: progress on reopening the government. But we have heard from 46 00:02:10,960 --> 00:02:14,840 Speaker 6: House Speaker Mike Johnson, asked directly after President Trump yesterday 47 00:02:14,880 --> 00:02:18,280 Speaker 6: commented on the potential that federal workers might not get 48 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:21,480 Speaker 6: their back pay, House Speaker Mike Johnson, saying that his 49 00:02:21,560 --> 00:02:24,360 Speaker 6: interpretation of the law is that they are entitled to 50 00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:26,960 Speaker 6: that pay, saying that they shouldn't face financial consequences just 51 00:02:27,000 --> 00:02:30,320 Speaker 6: because there is a shutdown. Of course, this comes after reports, 52 00:02:30,320 --> 00:02:32,640 Speaker 6: including our own here at Bloomberg News, that the OMB 53 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:35,799 Speaker 6: has drafted a memo that says that federal workers are 54 00:02:35,840 --> 00:02:41,320 Speaker 6: not guaranteed to compensation once the federal government reopens. President 55 00:02:41,360 --> 00:02:45,320 Speaker 6: Trump was asked directly about this yesterday, and it's interesting 56 00:02:45,360 --> 00:02:47,600 Speaker 6: to see here because it does appear that the OMB 57 00:02:47,760 --> 00:02:49,920 Speaker 6: might be taking aim at this twenty nineteen law that 58 00:02:49,960 --> 00:02:53,960 Speaker 6: was actually signed by President Trump, essentially guaranteeing that there 59 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:54,480 Speaker 6: would be. 60 00:02:54,360 --> 00:02:55,000 Speaker 7: This back pay. 61 00:02:55,320 --> 00:02:58,160 Speaker 6: The OMB now saying that it needs to be explicitly 62 00:02:58,240 --> 00:03:01,560 Speaker 6: appropriated by Congress. Joe. We're already starting to see potential 63 00:03:01,600 --> 00:03:05,920 Speaker 6: solutions here. We heard from Republican Senator Susan Collins yesterday, 64 00:03:05,919 --> 00:03:08,840 Speaker 6: who was floating a potential backup option where maybe there 65 00:03:08,880 --> 00:03:12,560 Speaker 6: could be a measure tied to the shut down bill 66 00:03:12,600 --> 00:03:15,440 Speaker 6: that would eventually reopen the government. The thing is that 67 00:03:15,480 --> 00:03:18,560 Speaker 6: measure isn't currently in this clean cr that we're seeing 68 00:03:18,639 --> 00:03:21,360 Speaker 6: them currently vote on as we speak, and at this 69 00:03:21,440 --> 00:03:23,320 Speaker 6: point it would have to be added. But we know 70 00:03:23,480 --> 00:03:25,560 Speaker 6: that at the moment we are just going through the 71 00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:28,519 Speaker 6: same process over and over again, voting Joe on this 72 00:03:28,680 --> 00:03:31,120 Speaker 6: same clean stop gap measure that would fund the government 73 00:03:31,200 --> 00:03:32,480 Speaker 6: until November twenty first. 74 00:03:33,000 --> 00:03:35,520 Speaker 2: Starting to feel a groundhog day, Tyler, I'm looking at 75 00:03:35,520 --> 00:03:38,720 Speaker 2: the president's schedule, By the way, nothing public until a 76 00:03:38,720 --> 00:03:41,680 Speaker 2: couple of hours from now. He's participating in an event 77 00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:45,840 Speaker 2: not geared toward the shutdown or trade as we frequently see. 78 00:03:45,840 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 2: But it'll round table in the State dining room on antifa. 79 00:03:50,040 --> 00:03:52,640 Speaker 2: Do we know anything about what's going to happen and 80 00:03:52,680 --> 00:03:53,480 Speaker 2: how this will work? 81 00:03:54,440 --> 00:03:54,680 Speaker 8: Well. 82 00:03:54,680 --> 00:03:57,440 Speaker 6: We are expecting them to welcome US reporters in the 83 00:03:57,440 --> 00:04:00,280 Speaker 6: White House pool today in to that room. There are 84 00:04:00,320 --> 00:04:05,440 Speaker 6: reports that independent journalists will also be there to discuss antifa. 85 00:04:05,560 --> 00:04:09,120 Speaker 6: We know that President Trump had moved to formally designate 86 00:04:09,200 --> 00:04:11,880 Speaker 6: in TIFA, which is a loose collective of far left 87 00:04:11,920 --> 00:04:15,440 Speaker 6: militant groups as an official terrorist organization, but there have 88 00:04:15,520 --> 00:04:19,120 Speaker 6: been questions since that executive order on exactly how this 89 00:04:19,160 --> 00:04:22,240 Speaker 6: would work. Federal law allows for international groups to be 90 00:04:22,360 --> 00:04:26,200 Speaker 6: labeled as foreign terrorist organizations, but we haven't seen how 91 00:04:26,240 --> 00:04:29,080 Speaker 6: this would be enacted for this domestic group and how 92 00:04:29,200 --> 00:04:31,560 Speaker 6: broad ranging it would be, so potentially there could be 93 00:04:31,600 --> 00:04:33,760 Speaker 6: some sort of details there. But it does come as 94 00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:38,640 Speaker 6: President Trump, of course, widens escalates his rhetoric against mayors 95 00:04:38,640 --> 00:04:41,880 Speaker 6: and democratic cities, democratic governors around the country, as we've 96 00:04:41,920 --> 00:04:44,760 Speaker 6: seen national Guard troops invoked, and I would expect some 97 00:04:44,839 --> 00:04:48,560 Speaker 6: common themes surrounding the president's moves there to emerge today 98 00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:49,240 Speaker 6: when we. 99 00:04:49,240 --> 00:04:50,240 Speaker 3: Enter that room. 100 00:04:50,960 --> 00:04:52,760 Speaker 2: All right, Tyler, it's always a good day in Washington. 101 00:04:52,760 --> 00:04:54,440 Speaker 2: What Tyler, Candle's in the pool, she's live at the 102 00:04:54,440 --> 00:04:56,440 Speaker 2: White House. We'll have more a little bit later on 103 00:04:56,480 --> 00:05:01,480 Speaker 2: as we approach that event at three pm. Tyler mentioned backpay, 104 00:05:01,520 --> 00:05:03,440 Speaker 2: this has been a big question in Washington, or maybe 105 00:05:03,440 --> 00:05:06,360 Speaker 2: it's not so much a question any longer. Speaker Mike Johnson, 106 00:05:06,360 --> 00:05:07,880 Speaker 2: who's going to join us on the late edition of 107 00:05:07,920 --> 00:05:09,680 Speaker 2: Balance of Power today, seemed to put this to bed 108 00:05:09,680 --> 00:05:10,200 Speaker 2: a bit earlier. 109 00:05:10,240 --> 00:05:12,440 Speaker 3: Let's listen to what he said. That's my position. 110 00:05:12,520 --> 00:05:15,440 Speaker 9: I think they should be they should not be subjected 111 00:05:15,480 --> 00:05:19,240 Speaker 9: to harm and financial dire straits because Chuck Shumer wants 112 00:05:19,279 --> 00:05:22,760 Speaker 9: to play political games with regard to paying the troops. 113 00:05:23,120 --> 00:05:25,760 Speaker 9: I want everybody to listen to me very carefully. Hakim 114 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:29,000 Speaker 9: Jefferys and the House Democrats, as leaders police said so well, 115 00:05:29,279 --> 00:05:31,600 Speaker 9: are clamoring to get back here and have another vote 116 00:05:31,600 --> 00:05:33,120 Speaker 9: because some of them want to get on record and 117 00:05:33,120 --> 00:05:34,280 Speaker 9: say they're for paying the troops. 118 00:05:34,480 --> 00:05:37,320 Speaker 3: We already had that vote. It's called the CR. 119 00:05:37,800 --> 00:05:39,960 Speaker 2: It's called the CR, he said, and that CR is 120 00:05:39,960 --> 00:05:41,760 Speaker 2: getting a vote as we speak in the Senate. It 121 00:05:41,800 --> 00:05:44,920 Speaker 2: is likely to fail, but these are really important matters, 122 00:05:44,920 --> 00:05:46,600 Speaker 2: and of course we know the tenth is the next 123 00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:51,360 Speaker 2: pace cycle for federal workers, including the staffers of members 124 00:05:51,400 --> 00:05:54,120 Speaker 2: of Congress, and then the fifteenth is the paycheck date 125 00:05:54,200 --> 00:05:57,840 Speaker 2: for the military. We're joined now by Congressman Jason Smith, 126 00:05:57,880 --> 00:06:00,880 Speaker 2: the Republican, of course, chair of the House Ways Means Committee, 127 00:06:01,120 --> 00:06:03,760 Speaker 2: who's watching all of this from the other side in 128 00:06:03,839 --> 00:06:06,000 Speaker 2: his chamber, and mister Chairman, I want to welcome you 129 00:06:06,040 --> 00:06:09,559 Speaker 2: back to Bloomberg TV and Radio. Before we get into 130 00:06:09,600 --> 00:06:11,960 Speaker 2: all the politics around this. Are you with the speaker 131 00:06:12,560 --> 00:06:14,400 Speaker 2: on back pay for federal workers? 132 00:06:16,279 --> 00:06:20,560 Speaker 10: So, without a doubt, back pay for federal workers who 133 00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:24,320 Speaker 10: have not been furloughed who have been working should absolutely 134 00:06:24,360 --> 00:06:28,159 Speaker 10: be be paid. There's no question about that. Where the 135 00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:31,760 Speaker 10: discussion is is for individuals who have been furloughed who 136 00:06:31,800 --> 00:06:34,839 Speaker 10: are not working during the shutdown. That is where the 137 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:37,200 Speaker 10: big debate is. 138 00:06:37,200 --> 00:06:40,880 Speaker 2: Isn't that covered by law, mister chairman, or are you 139 00:06:40,960 --> 00:06:44,479 Speaker 2: referring to those workers who were furloughed before things shut down, 140 00:06:44,520 --> 00:06:48,320 Speaker 2: because that's seven hundred and fifty thousand people right now, correct. 141 00:06:49,800 --> 00:06:54,960 Speaker 10: So I don't know the exact number, but what has 142 00:06:55,040 --> 00:07:00,039 Speaker 10: been considered an essential employee and what has been considered. 143 00:07:04,520 --> 00:07:06,520 Speaker 2: Looks like we may be having trouble with the connection, 144 00:07:08,760 --> 00:07:10,680 Speaker 2: mister chairman, if you can hear me, we might need 145 00:07:10,680 --> 00:07:15,960 Speaker 2: to reconnect with Jason Smith because the technology gods may 146 00:07:15,960 --> 00:07:18,040 Speaker 2: not be playing. This is something that we've talked about, 147 00:07:18,040 --> 00:07:22,080 Speaker 2: of course, since this came up yesterday at the White House, 148 00:07:22,120 --> 00:07:24,560 Speaker 2: and the law that's on the books going back some years. 149 00:07:24,680 --> 00:07:26,600 Speaker 2: We've talked about this a couple of times now. The 150 00:07:26,600 --> 00:07:30,440 Speaker 2: Government Employee Fair Treatment Act of twenty nineteen, which the 151 00:07:30,480 --> 00:07:34,600 Speaker 2: President did sign during the record long shutdown thirty five 152 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:39,000 Speaker 2: days GEFTA. They call it widely interpreted as ensuring that 153 00:07:39,080 --> 00:07:44,320 Speaker 2: furloughed workers automatically are compensated when shutdowns end and they 154 00:07:44,360 --> 00:07:47,400 Speaker 2: are in fact reinstated in their jobs. There's a question 155 00:07:47,440 --> 00:07:50,520 Speaker 2: about whether that law will be interpreted the same way 156 00:07:51,040 --> 00:07:54,559 Speaker 2: by this administration. The Office of Management and Budget says 157 00:07:55,120 --> 00:08:00,880 Speaker 2: GEFTA has been deficient, having been amended after its passage 158 00:08:00,960 --> 00:08:03,560 Speaker 2: nine days later on the twenty fifth of January in 159 00:08:03,600 --> 00:08:07,520 Speaker 2: twenty nineteen. And I think that we've reconnected with Congressman 160 00:08:07,600 --> 00:08:11,000 Speaker 2: Jason Smith. I'm sorry for the interruption, mister Chairman. I 161 00:08:11,040 --> 00:08:13,720 Speaker 2: was just talking about the Government Employee Fair Treatment Act 162 00:08:13,720 --> 00:08:16,960 Speaker 2: of twenty nineteen, which is the law that is of 163 00:08:17,000 --> 00:08:21,120 Speaker 2: course at hand here, which the President signed in his 164 00:08:21,200 --> 00:08:23,880 Speaker 2: first term. It doesn't sure that furloughed workers are made 165 00:08:23,920 --> 00:08:26,440 Speaker 2: whole following the end of a shutdown. Should we be 166 00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:27,720 Speaker 2: looking at this law differently? 167 00:08:29,320 --> 00:08:31,440 Speaker 10: I think what we need to be looking at we 168 00:08:31,440 --> 00:08:34,319 Speaker 10: shouldn't even have to discuss this law at hand. 169 00:08:34,880 --> 00:08:36,840 Speaker 3: The Democrats need to open up government. 170 00:08:36,920 --> 00:08:39,160 Speaker 10: They're on the sixth vote right now in the United 171 00:08:39,200 --> 00:08:42,880 Speaker 10: States Senate, blocking just a Continuation of funding. We're just 172 00:08:42,920 --> 00:08:47,360 Speaker 10: trying to fund government as it was on September thirtieth today. 173 00:08:47,679 --> 00:08:49,600 Speaker 10: If they just open it up, there would be no 174 00:08:49,720 --> 00:08:53,240 Speaker 10: question about who's getting paid. All federal employees would get paid. 175 00:08:53,440 --> 00:08:57,160 Speaker 10: Do your job, do something that you did six months ago. 176 00:08:57,400 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 10: This bill is exactly the same to what they passed 177 00:09:00,280 --> 00:09:03,079 Speaker 10: in March of this year, but they're only holding it 178 00:09:03,160 --> 00:09:08,720 Speaker 10: hostage right now because of the unrelated, unrelated policy objectives. 179 00:09:08,840 --> 00:09:13,080 Speaker 10: They don't oppose anything within this twenty four page Continuing 180 00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:17,920 Speaker 10: Resolution of funding. They want things outside of the bill. 181 00:09:18,160 --> 00:09:20,319 Speaker 10: That is why they're voting. Note they're not voting against 182 00:09:20,360 --> 00:09:24,280 Speaker 10: what's in it and who's affected. The one point three 183 00:09:24,559 --> 00:09:28,640 Speaker 10: million military personnel a week from today that will not 184 00:09:28,760 --> 00:09:33,000 Speaker 10: have a paycheck these This is absolutely unappropriate. 185 00:09:34,160 --> 00:09:37,000 Speaker 2: Do you have the same approach then to military paychecks. 186 00:09:37,040 --> 00:09:39,400 Speaker 2: There's been a question, I'm sure you've discussed it with 187 00:09:39,440 --> 00:09:41,360 Speaker 2: your colleagues about whether there should be a separate piece 188 00:09:41,400 --> 00:09:44,319 Speaker 2: of legislation to make sure that the military is paid, 189 00:09:44,360 --> 00:09:46,640 Speaker 2: maybe using one hundred and fifty billion dollars in the 190 00:09:46,640 --> 00:09:47,520 Speaker 2: big beautiful bill. 191 00:09:47,600 --> 00:09:50,280 Speaker 3: The Speaker clearly doesn't like that idea. How about you? 192 00:09:51,480 --> 00:09:54,199 Speaker 3: The Speaker is exactly right. We've already done our job. 193 00:09:54,559 --> 00:09:58,200 Speaker 10: We funded government more than three weeks ago, paying all 194 00:09:58,240 --> 00:10:01,959 Speaker 10: military personnel. The democra have always supported this in the past, 195 00:10:01,960 --> 00:10:04,640 Speaker 10: but once again they're playing political games with people's future 196 00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:09,600 Speaker 10: and people's livelihoods. They need to stop obstructing the sixty 197 00:10:09,800 --> 00:10:13,480 Speaker 10: vote filibuster over the United States Senate. They need to 198 00:10:13,600 --> 00:10:18,240 Speaker 10: break that right now if it means delivering paychecks for 199 00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:22,640 Speaker 10: military and to open up government. It is unacceptable that 200 00:10:22,760 --> 00:10:27,440 Speaker 10: Chuck Schumer and Democrats can hold hostage the economy, they 201 00:10:27,440 --> 00:10:28,920 Speaker 10: can hold hostage the government. 202 00:10:30,480 --> 00:10:33,200 Speaker 2: You hear all the same arguments that I do, mister Chairman, 203 00:10:34,120 --> 00:10:38,320 Speaker 2: specifically when it comes to not necessarily impoundment, but the 204 00:10:38,360 --> 00:10:42,040 Speaker 2: extension of Obamacare subsidies, and I realize that you're framing 205 00:10:42,080 --> 00:10:45,000 Speaker 2: that as an unrelated issue. Democrats say, hey, we've had 206 00:10:45,080 --> 00:10:47,760 Speaker 2: two recisions packages so far and letters are going out 207 00:10:47,800 --> 00:10:50,080 Speaker 2: with rising premiums. If we don't deal with this now, 208 00:10:50,480 --> 00:10:52,960 Speaker 2: we're going to miss the deadline at the end of 209 00:10:52,960 --> 00:10:53,320 Speaker 2: the year. 210 00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:54,280 Speaker 3: What's your response. 211 00:10:55,720 --> 00:10:59,040 Speaker 10: Premiums have gone up eighty percent in the last ten 212 00:10:59,160 --> 00:11:03,480 Speaker 10: years in Obamacare exchanges. Premiums have continued to go up 213 00:11:03,520 --> 00:11:06,400 Speaker 10: because it's been a complete failure. What they've done with 214 00:11:06,440 --> 00:11:11,240 Speaker 10: these subsidies only increases the incentive for insurance companies to 215 00:11:11,400 --> 00:11:14,240 Speaker 10: raise premiums, which is the wrong thing. Can we get 216 00:11:14,280 --> 00:11:18,360 Speaker 10: together and have a good discussion about access to healthcare? 217 00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:23,880 Speaker 10: We absolutely should. I represent an area that rural health 218 00:11:23,920 --> 00:11:28,000 Speaker 10: care is in dire need. But guess what one of 219 00:11:28,040 --> 00:11:32,280 Speaker 10: the demands that the Democrats have within let's reopen government 220 00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:35,760 Speaker 10: for twenty eight days is by cutting fifty billion dollars 221 00:11:36,040 --> 00:11:40,040 Speaker 10: for rural health care. That is unacceptable. So let's have 222 00:11:40,120 --> 00:11:42,960 Speaker 10: a real discussion. But those premium tax credits, they don't 223 00:11:43,000 --> 00:11:47,360 Speaker 10: expire till December thirty first, and the only reason why 224 00:11:47,400 --> 00:11:51,520 Speaker 10: they expire is because the Democrats made them temporary and 225 00:11:51,600 --> 00:11:54,520 Speaker 10: not permanent in the Inflation Reduction Act. 226 00:11:55,120 --> 00:11:56,280 Speaker 3: Well should they expire? 227 00:11:56,360 --> 00:11:58,280 Speaker 2: I know that you have members of your conference who 228 00:11:58,280 --> 00:12:00,720 Speaker 2: say these were COVID era subsidy and they have no 229 00:12:00,800 --> 00:12:01,440 Speaker 2: purpose now. 230 00:12:02,679 --> 00:12:06,079 Speaker 10: They should not be extended as they are because of 231 00:12:06,080 --> 00:12:08,880 Speaker 10: a married couple making more than six hundred thousand dollars 232 00:12:08,960 --> 00:12:13,599 Speaker 10: a year are being subsidized for this. That's completely unacceptable. 233 00:12:13,840 --> 00:12:16,640 Speaker 10: We have to look at what will bring down the 234 00:12:16,679 --> 00:12:21,040 Speaker 10: cost of premiums, what will provide more access to healthcare. 235 00:12:21,320 --> 00:12:23,920 Speaker 10: This is what needs to be in the discussion, and 236 00:12:24,080 --> 00:12:27,960 Speaker 10: let's try to do some transformational healthcare policy that delivers 237 00:12:28,000 --> 00:12:31,520 Speaker 10: for all Americans, not just twenty four million Americans, because 238 00:12:31,520 --> 00:12:35,480 Speaker 10: that's what's on the exchanges. There's three hundred and forty 239 00:12:35,520 --> 00:12:38,760 Speaker 10: seven million Americans. One hundred and seventy four million are 240 00:12:38,800 --> 00:12:42,440 Speaker 10: employee healthcare insurance, and we're not even discussing that with 241 00:12:42,600 --> 00:12:45,559 Speaker 10: all of these premium tax credits. Seventy eight million people 242 00:12:45,559 --> 00:12:48,640 Speaker 10: are on Medicare, eighty two million are Medicaid. That's not 243 00:12:48,679 --> 00:12:51,960 Speaker 10: even being discussed by those those folks on premium tax credits. 244 00:12:51,960 --> 00:12:54,760 Speaker 10: So we're only talking about twenty four million people when 245 00:12:54,800 --> 00:12:56,880 Speaker 10: they talk about those premium tax credits. 246 00:12:57,600 --> 00:12:59,880 Speaker 2: Well, you've got a pretty unique view as chair of 247 00:13:00,280 --> 00:13:03,040 Speaker 2: the House Ways and Means Committee and outside of the 248 00:13:03,080 --> 00:13:04,679 Speaker 2: blame game. And I know there's a lot of noise 249 00:13:04,679 --> 00:13:07,720 Speaker 2: and politics here, and you're effective at making your case, 250 00:13:08,320 --> 00:13:12,240 Speaker 2: mister chairman, outside of who's that fault? How much longer 251 00:13:12,240 --> 00:13:14,440 Speaker 2: do you think this goes? Do we the President said 252 00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:16,559 Speaker 2: four or five days we might start to talk about 253 00:13:16,600 --> 00:13:17,800 Speaker 2: real mass layoffs. 254 00:13:17,840 --> 00:13:20,760 Speaker 3: Is that when the government reopens, you. 255 00:13:20,720 --> 00:13:24,040 Speaker 10: Know it's disturbing the there's no winners here. The people 256 00:13:24,040 --> 00:13:29,200 Speaker 10: that's losing, as the American the American public. I said 257 00:13:29,200 --> 00:13:31,880 Speaker 10: at the very beginning, if the Democrats force the shutdown, 258 00:13:32,160 --> 00:13:35,640 Speaker 10: it will probably be longer than the prior shutdown, which 259 00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:40,320 Speaker 10: was thirty five days, because the Democrats will have to 260 00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:43,440 Speaker 10: vote for the bill that they have continued to vote 261 00:13:43,480 --> 00:13:46,920 Speaker 10: against now six times over in the United States Senate, 262 00:13:46,960 --> 00:13:50,479 Speaker 10: and the same bill the Chuck Schumer and the Democrats 263 00:13:50,559 --> 00:13:54,559 Speaker 10: voted for in March. Nancy Pelosi has been on record 264 00:13:54,640 --> 00:13:57,680 Speaker 10: numerous times saying, you should never shut down government for 265 00:13:57,880 --> 00:14:03,800 Speaker 10: policy issues. Fund government. Let's follow through with those actions. 266 00:14:04,960 --> 00:14:07,400 Speaker 2: It's looking, by the way, like the House passed continuing 267 00:14:07,440 --> 00:14:10,439 Speaker 2: resolution that we're discussing here, the Republican version that we're 268 00:14:10,440 --> 00:14:13,880 Speaker 2: discussing with the chairman is on the precipice of failure 269 00:14:14,360 --> 00:14:16,719 Speaker 2: in the Senate. And with that said, mister Chairman, we 270 00:14:16,760 --> 00:14:19,440 Speaker 2: could go through this ten, twenty thirty more times. To 271 00:14:19,480 --> 00:14:21,600 Speaker 2: your point, who knows how long we're going to be closed. 272 00:14:21,840 --> 00:14:23,920 Speaker 2: We've got November twenty one as an end date on 273 00:14:23,960 --> 00:14:26,080 Speaker 2: this cr Is that going to need to be extended? 274 00:14:26,120 --> 00:14:29,480 Speaker 2: Because my goodness, this goes another couple of weeks. It's 275 00:14:29,520 --> 00:14:31,520 Speaker 2: going to be a pretty short continuing resolution. 276 00:14:33,040 --> 00:14:35,960 Speaker 10: Well, the Democrat CR that they wanted was only twenty 277 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:39,080 Speaker 10: eight days with the additional one point four trillion dollars 278 00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:43,320 Speaker 10: worth of spending, including providing health insurance for illegals and 279 00:14:43,360 --> 00:14:46,400 Speaker 10: taking away fifty billion dollars of real health care. That 280 00:14:46,600 --> 00:14:50,360 Speaker 10: was their alternative. We have to just open up government. 281 00:14:50,560 --> 00:14:53,760 Speaker 10: Now there's a CR that has passed the House. It's 282 00:14:53,840 --> 00:14:56,600 Speaker 10: over in the Senate. They're on the sixth vote. The 283 00:14:56,680 --> 00:14:59,400 Speaker 10: only reason why it's not passed in the Senate is 284 00:14:59,480 --> 00:15:04,120 Speaker 10: because of a procedure vote where the Democrats are filibustering. 285 00:15:04,600 --> 00:15:08,640 Speaker 3: Let them vote on the bill. Stop the filibuster. Just 286 00:15:08,840 --> 00:15:10,480 Speaker 3: let them vote on the bill. If they do that, 287 00:15:10,840 --> 00:15:11,880 Speaker 3: we'll be able to pass it. 288 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:15,240 Speaker 2: You think we should do the filibuster like we used 289 00:15:15,240 --> 00:15:17,640 Speaker 2: to in the old days, like actually have to get 290 00:15:17,720 --> 00:15:21,520 Speaker 2: up there and filibuster and keep talking until you can't. 291 00:15:21,760 --> 00:15:25,200 Speaker 10: I think people have to earn their stripes, and they 292 00:15:25,320 --> 00:15:30,360 Speaker 10: absolutely should have to actually filibuster, be talking at the 293 00:15:30,440 --> 00:15:34,040 Speaker 10: microphone instead of just like okay, if there's not sixty votes, 294 00:15:34,400 --> 00:15:35,800 Speaker 10: it's not filibuster proof. 295 00:15:36,200 --> 00:15:42,920 Speaker 11: That's crazy. Force their hand. Well, that goes both ways. Congressman, 296 00:15:42,960 --> 00:15:44,560 Speaker 11: I guess that's something you won't have to worry about 297 00:15:44,560 --> 00:15:46,160 Speaker 11: in the House. But I'm glad that you could join 298 00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:48,560 Speaker 11: us today, mister Chairman, thank you for the insights. As always, 299 00:15:48,560 --> 00:15:50,120 Speaker 11: as I mentioned, he's the deep in this, he's in 300 00:15:50,160 --> 00:15:52,320 Speaker 11: the center of it as chair of the House Ways 301 00:15:52,320 --> 00:15:55,240 Speaker 11: and Means Committee. Congressman Jason Smith just one of the 302 00:15:55,320 --> 00:15:57,480 Speaker 11: voices that we're going to be hearing today, the decision 303 00:15:57,520 --> 00:15:59,920 Speaker 11: makers who are trying to make their way through the 304 00:16:00,280 --> 00:16:02,240 Speaker 11: leading all the way to the Speaker of the House himself. 305 00:16:02,280 --> 00:16:04,200 Speaker 11: He's going to join us in the five o'clock edition, 306 00:16:04,240 --> 00:16:06,800 Speaker 11: the late edition of Balance of Power here on Bloomberg 307 00:16:06,840 --> 00:16:10,440 Speaker 11: TV and Radio, with his view on things, having stayed 308 00:16:10,440 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 11: in Washington at this point while many of his members 309 00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:16,880 Speaker 11: have gone home. They'll be back next week, presumably, but 310 00:16:17,040 --> 00:16:20,400 Speaker 11: do join us around five twenty pm Eastern when we 311 00:16:20,480 --> 00:16:22,760 Speaker 11: talk with the Speaker. Later this hour, we'll talk with 312 00:16:22,800 --> 00:16:26,960 Speaker 11: a Democrat in Melanie Stansbury, the congresswoman from New Mexico's 313 00:16:27,040 --> 00:16:29,480 Speaker 11: first District, who knows what it's like to have troops 314 00:16:29,480 --> 00:16:32,960 Speaker 11: deployed in a town in her state. We'll have more 315 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:35,520 Speaker 11: on that coming up right here on Bloomberg TV and Radio. 316 00:16:35,800 --> 00:16:37,960 Speaker 11: Stay with us on Balance of Power. We'll have much 317 00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:39,200 Speaker 11: more coming up after this. 318 00:16:44,560 --> 00:16:48,040 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch 319 00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:51,080 Speaker 1: us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on 320 00:16:51,240 --> 00:16:54,520 Speaker 1: Apple Coarckley and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. 321 00:16:54,680 --> 00:16:57,920 Speaker 1: Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch 322 00:16:58,000 --> 00:16:59,880 Speaker 1: us live on YouTube. 323 00:17:00,640 --> 00:17:03,320 Speaker 2: Here in Washington, there's not only a lot of talk 324 00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:05,359 Speaker 2: about a government shutdown, and we can tell you that 325 00:17:05,400 --> 00:17:08,679 Speaker 2: the continuing resolutions for votes today in the Senate appear 326 00:17:09,480 --> 00:17:12,399 Speaker 2: to already have failed. There were not enough votes for 327 00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:15,200 Speaker 2: the Democratic version. They're just wrapping things on the Republican 328 00:17:15,320 --> 00:17:18,119 Speaker 2: version now. So we carry on to a ninth day tomorrow, 329 00:17:18,600 --> 00:17:20,720 Speaker 2: and we will be talking later on the late edition 330 00:17:20,760 --> 00:17:22,520 Speaker 2: of Balance of Power with the Speaker of the House, 331 00:17:22,560 --> 00:17:23,280 Speaker 2: Mike Johnson. 332 00:17:23,840 --> 00:17:29,200 Speaker 3: Starts at five pm Eastern time. The US Northern Command 333 00:17:29,600 --> 00:17:34,119 Speaker 3: says the troops will be mobilized for sixty days in Chicago. 334 00:17:34,840 --> 00:17:38,159 Speaker 3: This started last night, according to the President's borders are 335 00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:40,840 Speaker 3: Tom Homan on Fox News a moment ago. National guards 336 00:17:40,840 --> 00:17:43,720 Speaker 3: started working last night. Of course, they've been a few 337 00:17:43,720 --> 00:17:47,360 Speaker 3: miles outside of the city more like fifty miles in Ellwood. 338 00:17:47,400 --> 00:17:50,919 Speaker 2: As a matter of fact, the Chicago Tribune reporting and 339 00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:53,560 Speaker 2: the New York Times for that matter, troops, about five 340 00:17:53,640 --> 00:17:58,439 Speaker 2: hundred of them spotted carrying riot shields at Ellwood, a 341 00:17:58,440 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 2: combination of five hundred troops from Illinois and Texas. The 342 00:18:01,680 --> 00:18:04,000 Speaker 2: question is when we see them rolling down the streets 343 00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:07,520 Speaker 2: in downtown Chicago, if that is going to happen, And 344 00:18:07,600 --> 00:18:10,200 Speaker 2: it's where we start our conversation with our political panel today. 345 00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:14,080 Speaker 2: Bloomberg Politics contributors Jeanie Shanzano and Rick Davis are with 346 00:18:14,200 --> 00:18:17,560 Speaker 2: US Genius Democracy visiting fellow at Harvard Kennedy School's Ash Center. 347 00:18:17,640 --> 00:18:21,679 Speaker 2: Rick partner at Stone Court Capital, our Republican strategist. It 348 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:23,919 Speaker 2: does feel a little bit different this time, Rick. This 349 00:18:24,040 --> 00:18:27,080 Speaker 2: is the third city, of course, following Washington, d C. 350 00:18:27,359 --> 00:18:32,040 Speaker 2: Where we live, and Los Angeles. The mission here is 351 00:18:32,280 --> 00:18:37,080 Speaker 2: a bit more broad. Simply there to protect ICE activities 352 00:18:37,119 --> 00:18:39,960 Speaker 2: and ICE law enforcement, is what we've heard from the administration. 353 00:18:40,400 --> 00:18:44,320 Speaker 3: Are we going to see troops in downtown Chicago? Sure? 354 00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:48,080 Speaker 7: And this is not too dissimilar to the rationale they 355 00:18:48,200 --> 00:18:51,560 Speaker 7: used when deploying troops in Los Angeles. They were there 356 00:18:51,600 --> 00:18:58,080 Speaker 7: to protect federal assets, buildings, things like that, So they're 357 00:18:58,160 --> 00:19:03,160 Speaker 7: keeping within sort of an interesting normality of bounds when 358 00:19:03,160 --> 00:19:07,000 Speaker 7: it comes to what they're being told to do. But 359 00:19:07,119 --> 00:19:08,760 Speaker 7: of course, you know, I don't think you have to 360 00:19:09,200 --> 00:19:11,560 Speaker 7: look very far to find a lot of criticisms whether 361 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:15,240 Speaker 7: or not this is anything that would be considered normal 362 00:19:15,320 --> 00:19:19,199 Speaker 7: in its execution of law enforcement. There are lots of 363 00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:23,520 Speaker 7: federal law enforcement agencies that could be brought to bear, 364 00:19:23,600 --> 00:19:27,560 Speaker 7: as they were in the District of Columbia to Chicago 365 00:19:27,600 --> 00:19:30,960 Speaker 7: to assist them, and I don't think the governor or 366 00:19:30,960 --> 00:19:34,680 Speaker 7: the mayor would be opposed to that. But the deployment 367 00:19:34,720 --> 00:19:41,760 Speaker 7: of US troops in domestic cities across America to do 368 00:19:41,840 --> 00:19:44,320 Speaker 7: something they're not trained to do, which is law enforcement, 369 00:19:44,760 --> 00:19:48,080 Speaker 7: is I think stressing a lot of people out as 370 00:19:48,119 --> 00:19:48,720 Speaker 7: well it should. 371 00:19:50,520 --> 00:19:53,280 Speaker 2: Maybe it's not a surprise, Junie, but city and state 372 00:19:53,320 --> 00:19:57,160 Speaker 2: officials have not heard from the administration, have been largely 373 00:19:57,240 --> 00:19:59,719 Speaker 2: kept in the dark on all of this. Mayor Brandon 374 00:19:59,760 --> 00:20:02,840 Speaker 2: Johnhnson says, they have not communicated with me. And you 375 00:20:02,880 --> 00:20:05,320 Speaker 2: know what the President has to say about JB. Pritzker. 376 00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:06,880 Speaker 3: He talks about him just about every day. 377 00:20:06,880 --> 00:20:09,720 Speaker 2: Although there is one point I could mention on truth 378 00:20:09,800 --> 00:20:13,560 Speaker 2: social the President kind of reached out, writing, Chicago mayor 379 00:20:13,600 --> 00:20:16,560 Speaker 2: should be in jail for failing to protect ice officers. 380 00:20:16,800 --> 00:20:20,679 Speaker 2: Governor Pritzker also, should these two men prepare to be arrested? 381 00:20:20,760 --> 00:20:23,000 Speaker 3: Jeanie Yeah. 382 00:20:23,200 --> 00:20:26,800 Speaker 4: I mean, we're so used of his comments and things 383 00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:29,439 Speaker 4: he says, we sort of brust them off. I know, 384 00:20:29,600 --> 00:20:32,560 Speaker 4: I do. You know, nothing surprises us anymore, but the 385 00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:35,719 Speaker 4: idea that the President of the United States is calling 386 00:20:35,760 --> 00:20:38,000 Speaker 4: for the jailing of the mayor of one of the 387 00:20:38,040 --> 00:20:40,840 Speaker 4: biggest and most important cities in the country and the 388 00:20:40,880 --> 00:20:45,560 Speaker 4: governor of the same state. It's utterly astonishing. And both 389 00:20:45,680 --> 00:20:50,720 Speaker 4: Johnson and Pritzker did respond, and noteworthy Johnson said, it's 390 00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:53,399 Speaker 4: not the first time that Trump has tried to have 391 00:20:53,480 --> 00:20:57,760 Speaker 4: a black man unjustly arrested, of course, a reference to 392 00:20:58,280 --> 00:21:01,320 Speaker 4: what Donald Trump did when he before he entered politics 393 00:21:01,320 --> 00:21:05,040 Speaker 4: in New York City. You know. So you have that 394 00:21:05,160 --> 00:21:10,000 Speaker 4: kind of statement by the president, no communication, and then 395 00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:12,800 Speaker 4: you have the National Guard in to protect the Ice 396 00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:17,240 Speaker 4: troops who are using things like black Hawk helicopters to 397 00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:22,400 Speaker 4: descend on five story buildings and pull people out, including children, 398 00:21:22,840 --> 00:21:25,560 Speaker 4: in the middle of the night, and then are films 399 00:21:25,640 --> 00:21:29,760 Speaker 4: saying things like, well, after those children, you know, it 400 00:21:29,840 --> 00:21:34,040 Speaker 4: is a horrific situation there. And it is not horrific 401 00:21:34,200 --> 00:21:37,280 Speaker 4: because there is crime in Chicago, but that they need 402 00:21:37,320 --> 00:21:38,359 Speaker 4: to be there for the crime. 403 00:21:38,720 --> 00:21:40,800 Speaker 3: It is of their own making. 404 00:21:40,920 --> 00:21:43,399 Speaker 4: And that is what Johnson, and that's what Kritzker, and 405 00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:46,720 Speaker 4: that's quite frankly what the judge out in Portland said. 406 00:21:46,800 --> 00:21:49,480 Speaker 4: You are untethered from reality. If you think you need 407 00:21:49,520 --> 00:21:53,800 Speaker 4: this kind of show of force to address peaceful protests 408 00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:56,040 Speaker 4: that have been going on, you can go in and 409 00:21:56,080 --> 00:22:00,800 Speaker 4: get illegal immigrants, members of gangs without using military black 410 00:22:00,840 --> 00:22:04,440 Speaker 4: crowk helicopters and people in masks to pull residents out 411 00:22:04,440 --> 00:22:05,680 Speaker 4: of their where they're living. 412 00:22:06,800 --> 00:22:10,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, well, the legal side of this is pretty compelling, 413 00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:13,120 Speaker 2: and whatever might come next here could be interesting, Rick. 414 00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:17,760 Speaker 2: The US District Judge April Perry in Chicago had given 415 00:22:17,800 --> 00:22:20,720 Speaker 2: the administration until tomorrow. There's a hearing on Thursday to 416 00:22:20,800 --> 00:22:23,440 Speaker 2: rule on the state's request for a temporary restraining order, 417 00:22:23,440 --> 00:22:27,720 Speaker 2: and that judge had kind of suggested the administration wait 418 00:22:27,840 --> 00:22:31,040 Speaker 2: until Thursday to start rolling out the troops. Does this 419 00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:35,160 Speaker 2: mobilization make the administration's case more difficult? 420 00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:38,960 Speaker 7: To make sure I mean, you know, just by even 421 00:22:39,040 --> 00:22:43,639 Speaker 7: moving these Texas troops to Elwood is putting pressure on 422 00:22:43,680 --> 00:22:47,760 Speaker 7: the legal system to test their resolve on ruling against them. 423 00:22:47,760 --> 00:22:49,840 Speaker 7: And of course, you know this won't stop at this 424 00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:52,560 Speaker 7: district level. If the administration doesn't get what they want 425 00:22:52,680 --> 00:22:54,639 Speaker 7: or the governor doesn't get what he wants, they're going 426 00:22:54,680 --> 00:23:00,399 Speaker 7: to appeel this. So this first skirmish has been really 427 00:23:00,440 --> 00:23:03,760 Speaker 7: a replica of other things that this administration has done 428 00:23:03,760 --> 00:23:06,480 Speaker 7: where they want to press the legal case, they want 429 00:23:06,520 --> 00:23:11,600 Speaker 7: to challenge the courts to limit their power. They believe in, 430 00:23:12,680 --> 00:23:15,399 Speaker 7: you know, the executive power and what it is able 431 00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:18,120 Speaker 7: to do in these cases, and they're willing to take 432 00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:19,200 Speaker 7: it to the courts. 433 00:23:18,840 --> 00:23:19,199 Speaker 11: To do that. 434 00:23:19,359 --> 00:23:22,520 Speaker 7: So so, yes, they are executing a strategy to put 435 00:23:22,560 --> 00:23:25,640 Speaker 7: a lot of pressure on the court to rule against them, 436 00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:27,879 Speaker 7: at which point in time they'll pivot and do it 437 00:23:27,920 --> 00:23:30,520 Speaker 7: all over again until at which point it gets to 438 00:23:30,560 --> 00:23:34,399 Speaker 7: the Supreme Court, where they've had pretty good support for 439 00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:37,240 Speaker 7: the things that they've done in the past, almost winning 440 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:40,400 Speaker 7: every case. So I think this is all just part 441 00:23:40,440 --> 00:23:44,119 Speaker 7: of a kind of policy. Uh, if you want to 442 00:23:44,160 --> 00:23:48,440 Speaker 7: call it that, that may not be giving it enough priority, 443 00:23:48,560 --> 00:23:51,920 Speaker 7: But this has been the policy of this administration. Any 444 00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:54,399 Speaker 7: city in the country is going to be subject to this, 445 00:23:55,640 --> 00:23:58,080 Speaker 7: you know, for any any kind of reasons. If there's 446 00:23:58,119 --> 00:24:01,280 Speaker 7: a protest, if there's a governor that says something that 447 00:24:01,359 --> 00:24:05,119 Speaker 7: Donald Trump doesn't like, if there's a sanctuary city that 448 00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:07,680 Speaker 7: is pushing back on ICE agents. All these things could 449 00:24:07,680 --> 00:24:12,040 Speaker 7: tip this kind of thing into other jurisdictions around the country. 450 00:24:13,080 --> 00:24:14,880 Speaker 2: Well, the courts are also going to decide the fate 451 00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:17,640 Speaker 2: of James Comy, and I have to ask you about 452 00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:21,040 Speaker 2: the former FBI director entering a not guilty plea see 453 00:24:21,160 --> 00:24:27,320 Speaker 2: US charges today in Alexandria, Virginia. Pretty remarkable genie charges 454 00:24:27,359 --> 00:24:30,720 Speaker 2: that he lied to lawmakers and obstructed a congressional proceeding. 455 00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:36,359 Speaker 2: His lawyer says that the charges will be dismissed, but 456 00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:39,000 Speaker 2: we do have a trial set for January fifth. 457 00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:39,880 Speaker 3: Will he get that far? 458 00:24:41,520 --> 00:24:43,760 Speaker 4: You know, I don't know. I've heard some people in 459 00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:47,200 Speaker 4: the legal community say that's a trial on January fifth 460 00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:50,239 Speaker 4: is sort of a place marker. We probably won't see it, 461 00:24:51,080 --> 00:24:53,600 Speaker 4: and of course if the charges are dismissed, we will not. 462 00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:57,160 Speaker 4: But you know, I think what is so stunning about 463 00:24:57,200 --> 00:25:01,080 Speaker 4: both of these stories. Both the Comy story and the 464 00:25:01,200 --> 00:25:04,880 Speaker 4: raids going on and the nationalization of national guards into 465 00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:09,040 Speaker 4: other states. Is the deadly silence on the part of 466 00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:13,440 Speaker 4: members of the Republican Party. You know, we have heard 467 00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:19,240 Speaker 4: almost nothing from anybody in the Republican Party. As a judge, 468 00:25:19,280 --> 00:25:22,040 Speaker 4: a Republican comes out and says, this is a violation 469 00:25:22,160 --> 00:25:24,920 Speaker 4: of the Tenth Amendment to send these troops in that 470 00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:28,320 Speaker 4: used to be Republicans who believed that nothing. And then 471 00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:32,560 Speaker 4: on Komi, you know, he is charged with a lying 472 00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:36,800 Speaker 4: obstruction of justice. He is pleaded not guilty. They couldn't 473 00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:40,720 Speaker 4: even get prosecutors in Virginia to prosecute the case, so 474 00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:43,760 Speaker 4: they had to bring in two prosecutors from down South 475 00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:48,359 Speaker 4: to take these charges on. And nothing from members of 476 00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:51,560 Speaker 4: the Republican Party to say, wait a minute, this is 477 00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:54,200 Speaker 4: not the way we do business in the United States, 478 00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:59,200 Speaker 4: where justice, at least theoretically Joe should be blind and 479 00:25:59,280 --> 00:26:03,760 Speaker 4: not subject to so much politicking. And that's obviously what 480 00:26:03,800 --> 00:26:07,320 Speaker 4: we're seeing. The President himself has said that many times publicly. 481 00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:13,320 Speaker 2: No purp walk today for mister Comy in Virginia, though, Rick, 482 00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:15,960 Speaker 2: many folks are looking this as yet another precedent setting 483 00:26:15,960 --> 00:26:18,480 Speaker 2: moments another through the looking glass moment when you see 484 00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:22,639 Speaker 2: the former FBI director hauled into court only days after 485 00:26:22,640 --> 00:26:25,880 Speaker 2: the President went to truth Social to urge his attorney 486 00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:28,440 Speaker 2: general to make it happen. How are you feeling about 487 00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:28,919 Speaker 2: this today? 488 00:26:30,280 --> 00:26:33,000 Speaker 7: Yeah, And there's no questions, another sort of shattering glass 489 00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:38,000 Speaker 7: of the judicial institutions of America. And and and look, 490 00:26:38,040 --> 00:26:40,080 Speaker 7: I mean, everybody's got a right point here in the 491 00:26:40,160 --> 00:26:43,879 Speaker 7: sense that that that you know, I think the judge 492 00:26:43,920 --> 00:26:45,320 Speaker 7: is going to look at this and say, you know, 493 00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:46,879 Speaker 7: is this malicious prosecution? 494 00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:48,880 Speaker 3: Wow? Joe, just what you said. 495 00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:51,760 Speaker 7: The President actually ordered it to be done a couple 496 00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:55,359 Speaker 7: of days before the term ran out on the on 497 00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:56,520 Speaker 7: the violations. 498 00:26:57,400 --> 00:26:59,520 Speaker 3: They then had to, as. 499 00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:03,800 Speaker 7: Janie said, scramble around because nobody in the Southern District 500 00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:06,600 Speaker 7: who was charged with this prosecution was willing to. 501 00:27:06,560 --> 00:27:07,399 Speaker 3: Take it to court. 502 00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:10,919 Speaker 7: I mean, like that tells you a lot about the 503 00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:14,480 Speaker 7: legal systems pushback. And yet they were able to get 504 00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:16,480 Speaker 7: a couple of people from North Carolina to come up. 505 00:27:16,680 --> 00:27:20,359 Speaker 3: Literally with a day's notice. So this judge will likely 506 00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:21,600 Speaker 3: treat this badly. 507 00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:24,719 Speaker 7: I can't imagine a scenario where this gets much of 508 00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:29,080 Speaker 7: a hearing other than this is malicious prosecution and we 509 00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:31,800 Speaker 7: aren't going to stand for that in the judicial system. 510 00:27:32,200 --> 00:27:34,720 Speaker 7: Then the onus is on the Trump administration. How far 511 00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:36,879 Speaker 7: do you want to go to try and really make 512 00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:40,960 Speaker 7: a case here or was this just to embarrass mister 513 00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:44,959 Speaker 7: Komi and accomplish that, and so move on. There are 514 00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:48,959 Speaker 7: others who are in a similar situation who are fighting prosecution, 515 00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:50,800 Speaker 7: and I think there are a lot of people in 516 00:27:50,920 --> 00:27:53,760 Speaker 7: Washington and elsewhere who worry about this kind of thing 517 00:27:53,800 --> 00:27:57,080 Speaker 7: coming to their doorstep. And so it is a difficult 518 00:27:57,240 --> 00:27:58,280 Speaker 7: environment right now. 519 00:27:59,480 --> 00:28:01,560 Speaker 3: What it's time to be in politics. 520 00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:04,280 Speaker 2: With the help of our great panel Bloomberg Politics contributors 521 00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:07,040 Speaker 2: Genie Shanzano and Rick Davis, thank you both for the insights. 522 00:28:07,680 --> 00:28:10,000 Speaker 2: As always, stay with us on Balance of Power. I'm 523 00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:13,360 Speaker 2: Joe Matthew and Washington. This is Bloomberg. Stay with us 524 00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:15,640 Speaker 2: on Balance of Power. We'll have much more coming up 525 00:28:15,680 --> 00:28:16,120 Speaker 2: after this. 526 00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:23,960 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch 527 00:28:24,040 --> 00:28:27,080 Speaker 1: us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on 528 00:28:27,200 --> 00:28:30,440 Speaker 1: Apple Cockway and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app. 529 00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:33,479 Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 530 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:38,040 Speaker 1: flagship New York station. Just say Alexa played Bloomberg eleven thirty. 531 00:28:39,440 --> 00:28:42,000 Speaker 1: Politics at Hand in Washington. It's day eight of the 532 00:28:42,040 --> 00:28:45,200 Speaker 1: government shutdown. I can now tell you there will be 533 00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:49,920 Speaker 1: a ninth as both continuing resolutions have failed again in 534 00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:52,360 Speaker 1: the Senate. This has taken place just since we've come 535 00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:54,720 Speaker 1: on the air at noon, and only moments ago we 536 00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:56,880 Speaker 1: realized the votes were not there for the Republican Sea 537 00:28:56,920 --> 00:28:59,680 Speaker 1: are to pass. It did pass the House, not so 538 00:28:59,800 --> 00:29:03,280 Speaker 1: much in the Senate, where, of course, the conversation lies 539 00:29:04,280 --> 00:29:07,000 Speaker 1: before we spend some time with the Democratic congresswoman from 540 00:29:07,040 --> 00:29:09,640 Speaker 1: New Mexico. We've been looking forward to this conversation with 541 00:29:09,720 --> 00:29:12,640 Speaker 1: Melanie Stansbury. She'll be with us live from Capitol Hill, 542 00:29:12,680 --> 00:29:14,640 Speaker 1: reminding you that yes, there are members of the House 543 00:29:14,720 --> 00:29:17,880 Speaker 1: in town, as we saw earlier when Jason Smith joined us, 544 00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:21,120 Speaker 1: and spend some time with Senator James Langford, a Republican 545 00:29:21,160 --> 00:29:23,000 Speaker 1: from Oklahoma who knows what it's like to try to 546 00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:25,920 Speaker 1: strike a deal, remembering the bipartisan deal he struck on 547 00:29:25,960 --> 00:29:30,120 Speaker 1: the border last year, which was summarily canned by then 548 00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:36,040 Speaker 1: candidate Donald Trump. The idea of Republicans and Democrats working together, 549 00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:42,040 Speaker 1: for instance, to extend Obamacare subsidies feels like a foreign language, 550 00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:46,280 Speaker 1: a foreign concept right now in the nation's capital. With 551 00:29:46,320 --> 00:29:49,000 Speaker 1: some exceptions, Langford maybe one of them. Here's what he said. 552 00:29:49,040 --> 00:29:52,960 Speaker 5: We've got to actually have conversations where Republicans Democrats who 553 00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:55,000 Speaker 5: disagree on a lot of things, figure out how we 554 00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:58,000 Speaker 5: can get sixty votes in the Senate to agree to 555 00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:00,600 Speaker 5: something and then to be able to move. It's whit surprising. 556 00:30:00,920 --> 00:30:04,800 Speaker 5: During the Biden administration all four septembers, we had a 557 00:30:04,840 --> 00:30:07,400 Speaker 5: continuing resolution during this time period as well, kept the 558 00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:11,360 Speaker 5: government open while we continued negotiation. That was not an issue. 559 00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:14,360 Speaker 5: But when President Trump comes, Democrats are now saying we're 560 00:30:14,400 --> 00:30:17,040 Speaker 5: just going to shut the government down, not negotiate. 561 00:30:17,400 --> 00:30:20,320 Speaker 3: That doesn't help us well, Senator Langford. 562 00:30:20,320 --> 00:30:22,520 Speaker 2: Whether it's now or when the government reopens, they'll have 563 00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:25,400 Speaker 2: to be a negotiation at some point. The President indicated 564 00:30:25,440 --> 00:30:28,920 Speaker 2: yesterday that talks with Democrats or underway, at least on 565 00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:32,760 Speaker 2: an informal level on extending Obamacare subsidies with maybe some 566 00:30:32,880 --> 00:30:36,960 Speaker 2: new guardrails around it. You know a lot about making deals, Senator, 567 00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:38,800 Speaker 2: and we watched you put I think four to six 568 00:30:38,840 --> 00:30:42,600 Speaker 2: months of your life into a very important bipartisan deal 569 00:30:42,640 --> 00:30:45,640 Speaker 2: on the border that the president then turned away from. 570 00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:48,800 Speaker 2: This was last year, of course, before he was in office. 571 00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:51,480 Speaker 2: Candidate Donald Trump affected the outcome there. And I know 572 00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:53,600 Speaker 2: you don't need me to tell you what would be 573 00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:56,400 Speaker 2: different this time. Would you lead a gang to help 574 00:30:56,480 --> 00:30:59,720 Speaker 2: negotiate something on healthcare or would you have advice for 575 00:30:59,760 --> 00:31:01,640 Speaker 2: others who are well? 576 00:31:01,640 --> 00:31:04,120 Speaker 5: I would say, first and foremost, we got to the president, 577 00:31:04,320 --> 00:31:06,880 Speaker 5: the House, and the Senate all in the same page 578 00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:08,400 Speaker 5: to be able to work through that. At that time, 579 00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:10,600 Speaker 5: I was trying to be able to navigate a situation 580 00:31:10,680 --> 00:31:13,400 Speaker 5: where I had a Democrat president and I had a 581 00:31:13,560 --> 00:31:16,360 Speaker 5: Republican House and a Democrat Senate, and trying to be 582 00:31:16,400 --> 00:31:18,280 Speaker 5: able to figure out how do we actually solve this 583 00:31:18,840 --> 00:31:22,880 Speaker 5: transigent issue of open borders with a president that did 584 00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:25,480 Speaker 5: not want to close the borders. So it's a very 585 00:31:25,480 --> 00:31:27,600 Speaker 5: different issue at this point now that we have a 586 00:31:27,600 --> 00:31:29,320 Speaker 5: president that does want to be able to solve this, 587 00:31:29,600 --> 00:31:31,080 Speaker 5: the problem with the budget, we have a House and 588 00:31:31,160 --> 00:31:32,680 Speaker 5: Senate that do want to be able to solve this. 589 00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:34,320 Speaker 5: We've got to be able to figure out how to 590 00:31:34,320 --> 00:31:35,040 Speaker 5: be able to navigate it. 591 00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:35,200 Speaker 6: Now. 592 00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:37,800 Speaker 5: There are a couple of things on the Obamacare subsidies, 593 00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:40,280 Speaker 5: the Obamacare subsey is the base level are not of 594 00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:43,440 Speaker 5: the argument? These are plus ups that were done during COVID, 595 00:31:43,760 --> 00:31:45,520 Speaker 5: And this is one of my love my Democrat colleagues 596 00:31:45,520 --> 00:31:48,200 Speaker 5: are trying to conflate. Is not the base subsidies being 597 00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:51,440 Speaker 5: talked about. This was the temporary plus ups for COVID 598 00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:53,720 Speaker 5: that they're trying to say they now want to make permanent. 599 00:31:53,920 --> 00:31:55,600 Speaker 5: That's a very different issue. 600 00:31:56,200 --> 00:31:57,960 Speaker 2: Well, you're right to point that out, and we've tried 601 00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:00,000 Speaker 2: to make that delineation when we talk about it is 602 00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:03,560 Speaker 2: wealth Senator. So that begs another question. Should they be 603 00:32:03,680 --> 00:32:06,480 Speaker 2: sunset altogether? We're not in a pandemic right now? Do 604 00:32:06,520 --> 00:32:09,000 Speaker 2: you fade this out after a year? Because Democrats want 605 00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:10,040 Speaker 2: a permanent extension? 606 00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:11,200 Speaker 6: Right? 607 00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:14,360 Speaker 5: Democrats actually put that in during the Inflation Reduction Act. 608 00:32:14,600 --> 00:32:17,840 Speaker 5: They said this was temporary for health emergency, and we're 609 00:32:17,880 --> 00:32:19,960 Speaker 5: sun setting it at the end of twenty twenty five. 610 00:32:20,040 --> 00:32:22,880 Speaker 5: So it already has a sunset. It was set there 611 00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:25,840 Speaker 5: by Democrats when they said this is only for the 612 00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:29,600 Speaker 5: pandemic time period, and now they're saying, just kidding, I 613 00:32:29,640 --> 00:32:32,800 Speaker 5: want to be able to make that permanent. That's difficult question, 614 00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:37,600 Speaker 5: is yeah, the Affordable Care Act is either not affordable 615 00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:39,680 Speaker 5: because they continue to need more and more and more 616 00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:43,440 Speaker 5: subsidies on it. Goret drives up everyone's insurance cost. So 617 00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:44,720 Speaker 5: we got to figure this out. It's one of the 618 00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:46,480 Speaker 5: things that the President says he wants to go back 619 00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:49,600 Speaker 5: and look at what is systemically driving up the rates 620 00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:52,080 Speaker 5: this way. We can't just keep pouring more money into 621 00:32:52,080 --> 00:32:53,680 Speaker 5: it over and over and say the way that we 622 00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:56,200 Speaker 5: make it more affordable is more tax subsidies. 623 00:32:56,440 --> 00:32:59,480 Speaker 2: Republican Senator James Langford of Oklahoma talking with us on 624 00:32:59,520 --> 00:33:01,600 Speaker 2: the lated Dish a Balance of Power yesterday, just the 625 00:33:01,840 --> 00:33:04,760 Speaker 2: latest in a series of voices from the Senate from 626 00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:06,520 Speaker 2: both sides of the aisle that we've brought you in 627 00:33:06,520 --> 00:33:08,360 Speaker 2: the past week. And we want to cross back over 628 00:33:08,360 --> 00:33:12,000 Speaker 2: to the House now for a conversation with the congresswoman 629 00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:16,320 Speaker 2: from New Mexico, Melanie Stansbury, the Democrat representing Mexico's first district, 630 00:33:16,880 --> 00:33:19,520 Speaker 2: with us live now on Capitol Hill. Congresswoman, it's great 631 00:33:19,520 --> 00:33:22,120 Speaker 2: to have you on Bloomberg TV and radio. We've made 632 00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:24,040 Speaker 2: the point that the House is out of session, what 633 00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:26,240 Speaker 2: compels you to be in town right now? And should 634 00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:27,560 Speaker 2: all members of the House be here. 635 00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:30,920 Speaker 8: Yeah, well, let me just point out that it's not 636 00:33:31,120 --> 00:33:34,320 Speaker 8: just that the House is not in session. The Speaker 637 00:33:34,520 --> 00:33:37,600 Speaker 8: of the House has shut down the House and is 638 00:33:37,760 --> 00:33:41,760 Speaker 8: refusing to call his own members back to Washington, d c. 639 00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:44,800 Speaker 8: And in fact, Democrats have shown up. Now week two, 640 00:33:45,080 --> 00:33:47,600 Speaker 8: we are here. We are fighting to get a bipartisan 641 00:33:47,640 --> 00:33:51,400 Speaker 8: deal to reopen the government, to address American health care costs, 642 00:33:51,600 --> 00:33:55,040 Speaker 8: and to make sure that our democracy works for all Americans. 643 00:33:55,160 --> 00:33:57,680 Speaker 8: And if Mike Johnson is not going to call us back, 644 00:33:57,760 --> 00:33:59,560 Speaker 8: we are still going to continue to show up for 645 00:33:59,560 --> 00:34:01,800 Speaker 8: the American people, because that is what we do. 646 00:34:02,240 --> 00:34:02,560 Speaker 3: Now. 647 00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:06,320 Speaker 8: I do take a little bit of difference with what 648 00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:08,879 Speaker 8: I just heard from my colleague across the aisle. Here 649 00:34:08,960 --> 00:34:12,640 Speaker 8: in the Senate, we are fighting to make sure that 650 00:34:12,800 --> 00:34:15,960 Speaker 8: Americans healthcare doesn't get jacked up in the coming weeks. 651 00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:19,879 Speaker 8: We're talking about your healthcare premiums going from let's say 652 00:34:19,920 --> 00:34:22,520 Speaker 8: three hundred four hundred dollars a month up to eight 653 00:34:22,600 --> 00:34:25,520 Speaker 8: hundred one thousand dollars a month. This is not just 654 00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:30,080 Speaker 8: some hypothetical about healthcare policy. This is about real costs 655 00:34:30,160 --> 00:34:33,120 Speaker 8: that real Americans are going to feel in the next 656 00:34:33,120 --> 00:34:35,560 Speaker 8: few weeks. If we don't act now. 657 00:34:36,400 --> 00:34:38,319 Speaker 2: Well, you know what Republicans say about this, and we 658 00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:41,560 Speaker 2: just heard from Jason Smith before you joined us that 659 00:34:41,640 --> 00:34:44,919 Speaker 2: this is unrelated to the funding issue, that Democrats don't 660 00:34:44,960 --> 00:34:47,239 Speaker 2: object to anything in the bill, so you should pass 661 00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:50,279 Speaker 2: it and get the Congress reopened to actually have a 662 00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:52,680 Speaker 2: negotiation over Obamacare subsidies. 663 00:34:52,719 --> 00:34:55,080 Speaker 3: How would you respond to him. 664 00:34:54,719 --> 00:34:59,480 Speaker 8: Well, that's absolutely ridiculous because Republicans control the House, the Senate, 665 00:34:59,520 --> 00:35:02,480 Speaker 8: and the way House, and they spent the first nine 666 00:35:02,520 --> 00:35:06,560 Speaker 8: months of this year working on a domestic policy package 667 00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:10,880 Speaker 8: that cut healthcare, the cut food assistants, the cut educational assistance, 668 00:35:11,120 --> 00:35:15,879 Speaker 8: and they gave billionaires multi billion dollar tax breaks permanently 669 00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:20,400 Speaker 8: and slashed benefits for millions of Americans. And so for 670 00:35:20,480 --> 00:35:23,520 Speaker 8: them to claim that you shouldn't use a budgetary process 671 00:35:23,800 --> 00:35:27,279 Speaker 8: to enact policy is the most ludicrous thing I have 672 00:35:27,400 --> 00:35:29,719 Speaker 8: ever heard in my life, because they just spent nine 673 00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:34,000 Speaker 8: months doing that and taking American healthcare away, and now 674 00:35:34,320 --> 00:35:38,520 Speaker 8: they're refusing to fix what they broke. So their arguments 675 00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:41,160 Speaker 8: hold no water. And the fact that the House is 676 00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:44,439 Speaker 8: closed and the Speaker is refusing to bring people back 677 00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:47,480 Speaker 8: to even negotiate, even if they did want to cut 678 00:35:47,480 --> 00:35:50,640 Speaker 8: a deal. They couldn't because the House isn't even here. 679 00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:54,880 Speaker 2: Part of the reason why I wanted to talk with you, Congresswoman, 680 00:35:55,360 --> 00:35:58,120 Speaker 2: is that you're a former OMB staffer in the Office 681 00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:00,520 Speaker 2: of Management and Budget. Has the kings to the castle, 682 00:36:00,800 --> 00:36:02,759 Speaker 2: the keys, I should say to the castle. Right now, 683 00:36:02,760 --> 00:36:07,440 Speaker 2: President Trump is talking about potentially laying off mass numbers 684 00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:10,960 Speaker 2: of furloaed workers. He's also suggesting that some of the 685 00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:15,200 Speaker 2: furloaed workers now who are not receiving paychecks not be 686 00:36:15,320 --> 00:36:18,280 Speaker 2: made whole when they come back to work. I realized 687 00:36:18,320 --> 00:36:20,840 Speaker 2: the Speaker takes issue with that. He believes that federal 688 00:36:20,880 --> 00:36:23,759 Speaker 2: workers should be paid and receive back pay when they 689 00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:27,200 Speaker 2: come back. But as somebody who's been inside the agency 690 00:36:27,239 --> 00:36:29,880 Speaker 2: at OMB talk to us about the decisions that are 691 00:36:29,920 --> 00:36:32,839 Speaker 2: being made right now and how much leeway russ Vote 692 00:36:32,920 --> 00:36:36,120 Speaker 2: has over federal spending, well. 693 00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:38,800 Speaker 8: I think we've seen time and time again this administration 694 00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:41,440 Speaker 8: seems to have very little regard for the law. But 695 00:36:41,480 --> 00:36:45,520 Speaker 8: the law is very clear here. You cannot fire federal 696 00:36:45,560 --> 00:36:49,480 Speaker 8: workers during a shutdown, and we pass legislation in twenty 697 00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:54,040 Speaker 8: nineteen to guarantee back pay for federal workers. So whatever 698 00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:57,239 Speaker 8: the President says, he cannot just make stuff up. The 699 00:36:57,360 --> 00:37:01,040 Speaker 8: law applies, and they cannot withhold pay from federal workers. 700 00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:03,640 Speaker 8: So if you are a federal worker out there listening 701 00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:06,040 Speaker 8: to this, if you receive a riff notice, if you 702 00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:08,319 Speaker 8: receive notice that you're not going to receive back pay, 703 00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:11,399 Speaker 8: that is just untrue. You have rights and the law 704 00:37:11,520 --> 00:37:12,719 Speaker 8: is on your side. 705 00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:16,640 Speaker 2: Congresswoman Stansbury, I want to ask you about a separate matter. 706 00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:20,480 Speaker 2: Is National Guard troops mobilize outside of Chicago. It appears 707 00:37:20,480 --> 00:37:23,120 Speaker 2: that we have a third city now where National Guard 708 00:37:23,160 --> 00:37:26,080 Speaker 2: troops are being deployed by the president. But there's something 709 00:37:26,120 --> 00:37:29,120 Speaker 2: interesting that's been going on in your state. The Washington 710 00:37:29,160 --> 00:37:33,360 Speaker 2: Post reported on this a couple of weeks ago, because 711 00:37:33,360 --> 00:37:35,919 Speaker 2: there are in fact National Guard members who have been 712 00:37:36,120 --> 00:37:38,279 Speaker 2: in the city of Albuquerque now for more than one 713 00:37:38,360 --> 00:37:41,439 Speaker 2: hundred days. The headline on the story this blue state 714 00:37:41,520 --> 00:37:44,960 Speaker 2: governor sent the National Guard to her biggest city. No guns, 715 00:37:45,360 --> 00:37:49,600 Speaker 2: no humvies, no arrests. This deployment looks very different from 716 00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:52,840 Speaker 2: the way President Trump has used soldiers in places like 717 00:37:52,960 --> 00:37:55,840 Speaker 2: DC and Chicago. In fact, you've got guys and gals 718 00:37:55,880 --> 00:37:59,880 Speaker 2: walking around in black polo shirts and khakis, not carrying 719 00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:03,520 Speaker 2: firearms and have actually come to dowse some people in 720 00:38:03,560 --> 00:38:04,239 Speaker 2: the community. 721 00:38:04,440 --> 00:38:06,080 Speaker 3: Some folks have come to rely on them. 722 00:38:06,360 --> 00:38:09,840 Speaker 2: What is your governor, Luhan Grisham doing differently than the 723 00:38:09,880 --> 00:38:11,320 Speaker 2: president and making this work. 724 00:38:12,440 --> 00:38:16,640 Speaker 8: Well, there's a fundamental difference between a governor coordinating with 725 00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:21,280 Speaker 8: local officials and local law enforcement to provide additional support 726 00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:25,400 Speaker 8: and backup where it is wanted and discussed and deployed 727 00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:29,040 Speaker 8: in a safe manner in a community, versus the president 728 00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:33,160 Speaker 8: illegally deploying National Guard to states and cities where it 729 00:38:33,239 --> 00:38:36,279 Speaker 8: is unwanted, where the governors and mayors have said no, 730 00:38:36,760 --> 00:38:39,320 Speaker 8: do not send them, and is trying to use legal 731 00:38:39,360 --> 00:38:43,600 Speaker 8: authorities that frankly don't exist. It's also very clear that 732 00:38:43,680 --> 00:38:46,200 Speaker 8: the President is doing this as a show of force. 733 00:38:46,280 --> 00:38:49,239 Speaker 8: He is trying to scare the American people. He is 734 00:38:49,239 --> 00:38:51,960 Speaker 8: trying to show that he has power and he's going 735 00:38:52,040 --> 00:38:55,880 Speaker 8: to send individuals in with guns to scare the American 736 00:38:55,920 --> 00:38:59,160 Speaker 8: people to back up his policies. But that is not 737 00:38:59,320 --> 00:39:03,680 Speaker 8: the same is a coordinated legal authority under which a 738 00:39:03,760 --> 00:39:08,919 Speaker 8: governor and local authorities use the deployment as a way 739 00:39:09,000 --> 00:39:09,839 Speaker 8: to support. 740 00:39:09,520 --> 00:39:10,520 Speaker 3: Local law enforcement. 741 00:39:11,120 --> 00:39:13,680 Speaker 2: Well, I think it's a fascinating story, because this is 742 00:39:13,719 --> 00:39:16,680 Speaker 2: of course an extremely controversial issue when you factor in 743 00:39:17,920 --> 00:39:21,040 Speaker 2: the matter of posse coomatatis and to see this happening 744 00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:24,040 Speaker 2: in your city with crime and Albuquerque now falling across 745 00:39:24,600 --> 00:39:30,320 Speaker 2: most all categories, this idea in this year, I guess 746 00:39:30,719 --> 00:39:33,720 Speaker 2: it runs against the grain of those criticizing the idea 747 00:39:33,719 --> 00:39:37,279 Speaker 2: of using National Guard troops and speaks to the nuances 748 00:39:37,360 --> 00:39:38,759 Speaker 2: of how we can use them. 749 00:39:38,800 --> 00:39:39,480 Speaker 3: Do you agree? 750 00:39:40,680 --> 00:39:43,600 Speaker 8: No, Because actually the reason why crime is falling in 751 00:39:43,680 --> 00:39:47,560 Speaker 8: Albuquerque is because we have had a sustained investment over 752 00:39:47,600 --> 00:39:51,000 Speaker 8: the last seven years in behavioral health programs and getting 753 00:39:51,040 --> 00:39:54,680 Speaker 8: pentanel off the street, and in community policing, and so 754 00:39:55,200 --> 00:39:59,720 Speaker 8: the ad over the last several weeks of additional support 755 00:39:59,760 --> 00:40:03,880 Speaker 8: for lawlaw enforcement helps to relieve pressure on existing law enforcement, 756 00:40:04,080 --> 00:40:06,759 Speaker 8: but it is not what actually drove crime rates down 757 00:40:06,800 --> 00:40:10,840 Speaker 8: in Albuquerque. What drove crime rates down was actually investing 758 00:40:10,880 --> 00:40:12,680 Speaker 8: in our community and behavioral health. 759 00:40:14,040 --> 00:40:16,120 Speaker 2: Would you like to see these one hundred or so 760 00:40:16,320 --> 00:40:18,600 Speaker 2: troops continue their jobs in Albuquerque? 761 00:40:19,760 --> 00:40:22,600 Speaker 8: What I would like to see is continued investment in 762 00:40:22,640 --> 00:40:25,239 Speaker 8: behavioral health and getting fentanel off the street, because that 763 00:40:25,400 --> 00:40:28,760 Speaker 8: is the number one thing driving crime in most major 764 00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:31,600 Speaker 8: cities in America right now, and we have an addiction 765 00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:34,600 Speaker 8: crisis and we need to be investing in our communities. 766 00:40:35,920 --> 00:40:38,239 Speaker 2: Now, we're talking about National Guard troops, and there's a 767 00:40:38,320 --> 00:40:42,720 Speaker 2: question about military of active duty military troops going without 768 00:40:42,760 --> 00:40:45,960 Speaker 2: pay starting on the fifteenth. Congresswoman, some folks are pushing 769 00:40:45,960 --> 00:40:48,440 Speaker 2: for a standalone piece of legislation to pay them out 770 00:40:48,440 --> 00:40:51,480 Speaker 2: of money from the President's big beautiful bill. We've only 771 00:40:51,520 --> 00:40:53,880 Speaker 2: got about a minute left, Speaker Johnson says, no, we 772 00:40:53,920 --> 00:40:55,640 Speaker 2: already passed a bill to pay the troops. 773 00:40:55,640 --> 00:40:56,120 Speaker 3: How about you. 774 00:40:57,320 --> 00:41:00,640 Speaker 8: I personally think we need to pay our true We're 775 00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:03,720 Speaker 8: here in the Capitol, our Capitol police are not getting paid. 776 00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:07,160 Speaker 8: We need to pay our troops, pay our federal employees, 777 00:41:07,400 --> 00:41:10,640 Speaker 8: and get the government reopen, and that requires Mike Johnson 778 00:41:10,760 --> 00:41:11,800 Speaker 8: reopening the House. 779 00:41:13,239 --> 00:41:15,560 Speaker 2: Well, I appreciate your joining us live from Capitol Hill. 780 00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:19,680 Speaker 2: Congresswoman Melanie Stansbury from New Mexico with us live on 781 00:41:19,719 --> 00:41:22,680 Speaker 2: Bloomberg TV and Radio. A former OMB staffer with a 782 00:41:22,719 --> 00:41:25,439 Speaker 2: sense of exactly how some of these decisions are being 783 00:41:25,480 --> 00:41:28,520 Speaker 2: made on funding agencies and furloughing workers. Of course, this 784 00:41:28,640 --> 00:41:31,359 Speaker 2: being day eight of a government shutdown, and there will 785 00:41:31,360 --> 00:41:33,000 Speaker 2: be a ninth as we told you, if you're just 786 00:41:33,080 --> 00:41:37,680 Speaker 2: joining us, both continuing resolutions, the Republican and Democratic versions, 787 00:41:37,680 --> 00:41:39,080 Speaker 2: have failed again in the Senate. 788 00:41:39,200 --> 00:41:41,640 Speaker 3: Thanks for listening to the Balance of Power podcast. 789 00:41:42,280 --> 00:41:45,400 Speaker 2: Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, 790 00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:48,080 Speaker 2: or wherever you get your podcasts, and you can find 791 00:41:48,120 --> 00:41:51,360 Speaker 2: us live every weekday from Washington, DC at noontime Eastern 792 00:41:51,680 --> 00:41:53,120 Speaker 2: at Bloomberg dot com.