1 00:00:01,920 --> 00:00:07,640 Speaker 1: Do you remember when you first heard about tableau scandal? Oh? Yes, yes, 2 00:00:08,200 --> 00:00:12,120 Speaker 1: And I was like, whoa, what's happening? What's happening with 3 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:17,200 Speaker 1: you know, our minds because I didn't give a time 4 00:00:17,239 --> 00:00:20,960 Speaker 1: about where he graduated from. He was just a good guy. 5 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:24,360 Speaker 1: He was a good rapper, he was a good writer, 6 00:00:24,600 --> 00:00:30,360 Speaker 1: he was a good entertainer. Who cares? Ah where Let's say, like, um, 7 00:00:30,480 --> 00:00:35,400 Speaker 1: do you know where she graduated? You know, nobody cares. 8 00:00:35,560 --> 00:00:39,560 Speaker 1: It's a waste of your precious time. I met j 9 00:00:39,680 --> 00:00:43,479 Speaker 1: Young Park in one of Soul's oldest neighborhoods, Guangamon, on 10 00:00:43,560 --> 00:00:46,200 Speaker 1: this narrow back street that was lying with coffee shops. 11 00:00:47,080 --> 00:00:50,240 Speaker 1: The street itself was pretty noisy, but his friend happens 12 00:00:50,280 --> 00:00:52,360 Speaker 1: to run a yoga studio that wasn't open that day, 13 00:00:52,680 --> 00:00:55,360 Speaker 1: so we went in there to talk. Jean is an 14 00:00:55,440 --> 00:00:58,520 Speaker 1: art curator. He also went to an elite university in Korea, 15 00:00:58,720 --> 00:01:00,400 Speaker 1: so I figured he would be a good person to 16 00:01:00,480 --> 00:01:03,320 Speaker 1: talk to about the obsession with brand names and education. 17 00:01:03,680 --> 00:01:06,240 Speaker 1: But when I asked him about the Tableau scandal, he 18 00:01:06,440 --> 00:01:09,919 Speaker 1: started laughing, which I kind of had to laugh along 19 00:01:09,959 --> 00:01:13,400 Speaker 1: with him because it made me realize again that yeah, 20 00:01:13,800 --> 00:01:16,520 Speaker 1: this is all sort of ridiculous, I mean, being real. 21 00:01:16,920 --> 00:01:21,120 Speaker 1: When I first heard about all this, I kind of thought, wait, what, 22 00:01:21,600 --> 00:01:25,480 Speaker 1: why does anyone care about where a rapper went to college? 23 00:01:25,880 --> 00:01:27,800 Speaker 1: I mean, you're you're you're laughing about this, but and 24 00:01:27,920 --> 00:01:30,839 Speaker 1: I'm we're laughing about this now. But this was completely 25 00:01:30,880 --> 00:01:34,040 Speaker 1: dominating in Korean society. I mean, again, this is hip 26 00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:36,400 Speaker 1: hop we're talking about. Even if you're not a fan 27 00:01:36,440 --> 00:01:38,640 Speaker 1: of the music, you know that in hip hop we 28 00:01:38,760 --> 00:01:43,360 Speaker 1: prized street cred above pretty much everything, and Stanford is 29 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:45,800 Speaker 1: not where you get street cred. That's not to say 30 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:48,920 Speaker 1: rappers don't lie. They do, but it's usually in the 31 00:01:48,960 --> 00:01:51,720 Speaker 1: opposite direction, like saying they're from the hood or they're 32 00:01:51,720 --> 00:01:54,640 Speaker 1: in a gang or something like that. But lying about 33 00:01:54,760 --> 00:01:58,640 Speaker 1: being an elite university graduate that just sounds like hustling 34 00:01:58,680 --> 00:02:01,080 Speaker 1: backwards to me. There there were a lot of really 35 00:02:01,080 --> 00:02:08,600 Speaker 1: angry people. People war and are generally very angry, very 36 00:02:08,720 --> 00:02:13,160 Speaker 1: angry about other people. What do you mean if you 37 00:02:13,600 --> 00:02:18,400 Speaker 1: are a Korean citizen, you would totally understand what I 38 00:02:18,480 --> 00:02:22,640 Speaker 1: have just said. But we are very angry at all times. 39 00:02:23,440 --> 00:02:26,360 Speaker 1: We are angry. We are angry at the president. You know, 40 00:02:26,760 --> 00:02:29,440 Speaker 1: we take out the president because we are angry at 41 00:02:29,440 --> 00:02:33,360 Speaker 1: the president. You know, we are very angry at Japan, 42 00:02:33,480 --> 00:02:38,200 Speaker 1: for example, So we always have to win over Japan. 43 00:02:38,440 --> 00:02:41,959 Speaker 1: It's engraved in our way of thinking for the last 44 00:02:43,200 --> 00:02:46,960 Speaker 1: half a century that we have to be really angry 45 00:02:47,560 --> 00:02:55,959 Speaker 1: to achieve because if we remain without anger, our opportunities, 46 00:02:56,040 --> 00:03:01,200 Speaker 1: our resource, maybe our country or freedom are being taken away. 47 00:03:06,320 --> 00:03:10,600 Speaker 1: It's that anger, that emotion, and even the absurdity of 48 00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:13,440 Speaker 1: the situation. With Tableau that may be interested in all this, 49 00:03:14,120 --> 00:03:17,120 Speaker 1: they maybe want to know more what made an entire 50 00:03:17,240 --> 00:03:20,960 Speaker 1: country gets swept up into this frenzy? What drove it 51 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:25,080 Speaker 1: to the point of criminal charges? With all that smoke? 52 00:03:25,760 --> 00:03:31,120 Speaker 1: Where's the fire and who or what started? But like 53 00:03:31,240 --> 00:03:39,280 Speaker 1: with everything in life, there's a context here, a background history. 54 00:03:40,840 --> 00:03:43,120 Speaker 1: What figs my name? Whatever? I can be drum I 55 00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:46,160 Speaker 1: can I can writing there. My book runs on the 56 00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:58,480 Speaker 1: first past the mark Yeah, a boon box boat from 57 00:03:58,600 --> 00:04:02,840 Speaker 1: Vice and I heart I'm Dexter Thomas. This is authentic 58 00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:14,600 Speaker 1: episode four Hell career. Where was this? I rarely spick 59 00:04:14,680 --> 00:04:18,280 Speaker 1: up rich University. You know I was in because I 60 00:04:18,320 --> 00:04:20,920 Speaker 1: am aware of this issue that when I first sat 61 00:04:20,960 --> 00:04:23,839 Speaker 1: down with j Young, my first thought was and I 62 00:04:23,880 --> 00:04:27,640 Speaker 1: mean this in the most genuine way. I swear this 63 00:04:27,720 --> 00:04:31,960 Speaker 1: dude is just unfairly cool. I mean shoes, his outfit, 64 00:04:32,200 --> 00:04:34,920 Speaker 1: his glasses. He looks like the kind of dude who 65 00:04:34,920 --> 00:04:37,640 Speaker 1: could talk philosophy with you but then also tell you 66 00:04:37,680 --> 00:04:40,600 Speaker 1: a place to get some new kicks. At first, it 67 00:04:40,720 --> 00:04:43,520 Speaker 1: was just small talk. I was asking about himself, and 68 00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:47,440 Speaker 1: everything was fine until I asked him about school. I 69 00:04:47,480 --> 00:04:49,839 Speaker 1: had to actually press him to say where it was 70 00:04:49,880 --> 00:04:52,159 Speaker 1: that he went to college. I mean, I think he 71 00:04:52,160 --> 00:04:55,320 Speaker 1: almost started blushing when I when I say that, you know, 72 00:04:55,360 --> 00:04:59,919 Speaker 1: I graduated from university in Korea, you know, to be specific, 73 00:05:00,080 --> 00:05:04,840 Speaker 1: probably ah, you know, ah, you know, you have a background. 74 00:05:05,480 --> 00:05:07,359 Speaker 1: It's a good school. Kind of yeah, it's a good school. 75 00:05:07,400 --> 00:05:10,040 Speaker 1: But what I don't really want to the fact that 76 00:05:10,120 --> 00:05:17,480 Speaker 1: I graduated from this school with multiple degrees affects people's judgments, 77 00:05:17,920 --> 00:05:22,400 Speaker 1: you know, on me as a person. Interesting. It's very 78 00:05:22,440 --> 00:05:26,560 Speaker 1: ironic because I want to let people know that I 79 00:05:26,600 --> 00:05:31,760 Speaker 1: am really serious into studying and researching different stuff. But 80 00:05:31,800 --> 00:05:34,040 Speaker 1: at the same time, I don't really want to, you know, 81 00:05:34,640 --> 00:05:37,360 Speaker 1: wave the flag that you know I got this thing. 82 00:05:38,240 --> 00:05:43,960 Speaker 1: So it's really twisted desire. The reason I was talking 83 00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:48,200 Speaker 1: to Jayong wasn't really about Tableau specifically. It was because 84 00:05:48,240 --> 00:05:51,200 Speaker 1: of a totally different scandal, something that happened around the 85 00:05:51,240 --> 00:05:53,280 Speaker 1: time Jayong was getting out of school with his own 86 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:56,240 Speaker 1: multiple degrees and breaking into the art world in two 87 00:05:56,240 --> 00:05:59,120 Speaker 1: thousand seven, which was a couple of years before what 88 00:05:59,160 --> 00:06:01,880 Speaker 1: happened with table If you talk to enough people in 89 00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:05,279 Speaker 1: Korea about Tableau, at some point someone will point out 90 00:06:05,279 --> 00:06:07,200 Speaker 1: that it's kind of like what happened with this really 91 00:06:07,200 --> 00:06:11,159 Speaker 1: prestigious art curator named Shin jong A. And when someone 92 00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:14,120 Speaker 1: explained that to me, things not only started to make 93 00:06:14,120 --> 00:06:18,520 Speaker 1: more sense, but it actually made Tableau story a lot scarier. 94 00:06:19,120 --> 00:06:21,800 Speaker 1: I wanted to talk to an expert, somebody who knew 95 00:06:21,800 --> 00:06:25,239 Speaker 1: Shinjunga's story. But when we were looking for someone to interview, 96 00:06:25,640 --> 00:06:27,600 Speaker 1: someone who was in the art world at that time 97 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:30,400 Speaker 1: and could really paint the picture of how devastating her 98 00:06:30,400 --> 00:06:34,719 Speaker 1: story was, almost no one wanted to talk, which is 99 00:06:34,839 --> 00:06:38,560 Speaker 1: weird because this was a national case. It was so 100 00:06:38,640 --> 00:06:41,800 Speaker 1: big that people called it shin Gate, as in shinjong 101 00:06:41,920 --> 00:06:45,600 Speaker 1: A and Gate, because Koreans also used gate from Watergate 102 00:06:45,680 --> 00:06:48,960 Speaker 1: like we do for big scandals. But even though this 103 00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:52,800 Speaker 1: was all public knowledge, nobody seemed to want to talk 104 00:06:52,800 --> 00:06:59,080 Speaker 1: about it. I guess the reason why, especially the arts people, 105 00:06:59,279 --> 00:07:03,400 Speaker 1: is that I don't know, maybe people there's a general 106 00:07:03,960 --> 00:07:09,120 Speaker 1: maybe consensus that we don't talk that ship about ourselves. 107 00:07:09,160 --> 00:07:12,320 Speaker 1: But j Young is kind of a rebel, so he 108 00:07:12,400 --> 00:07:14,960 Speaker 1: was down to give us the context. I think in 109 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:21,120 Speaker 1: the art board people or generally remained silent about it 110 00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:25,240 Speaker 1: because she was a curator at all a prestigious, you know, 111 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:31,440 Speaker 1: private museum, and she was about to curate a section 112 00:07:32,080 --> 00:07:37,520 Speaker 1: of the Contrivinale, which is like a really really important, 113 00:07:38,240 --> 00:07:42,200 Speaker 1: you know position, or anyone. In the early two thousand's, 114 00:07:42,200 --> 00:07:45,120 Speaker 1: Shinjanga was a rising star in the Korean art world. 115 00:07:45,800 --> 00:07:48,560 Speaker 1: She had become the lead curator of an art museum 116 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:51,680 Speaker 1: and soul she was a professor at a local university, 117 00:07:52,240 --> 00:07:54,680 Speaker 1: and she had ties to the office of the then 118 00:07:54,840 --> 00:07:59,160 Speaker 1: Korean president, and only thirty five years old, she had 119 00:07:59,160 --> 00:08:02,480 Speaker 1: been appointed as director of the Kuangju Bien l which 120 00:08:02,600 --> 00:08:05,560 Speaker 1: is one of the most acclaimed art events in Asia. 121 00:08:06,520 --> 00:08:10,240 Speaker 1: Shinjunga wasn't just a success story. She was a role model. 122 00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:15,120 Speaker 1: But then in the summer of two thousand seven, members 123 00:08:15,120 --> 00:08:18,880 Speaker 1: of the board of Reuniversity started questioning her academic record. 124 00:08:19,840 --> 00:08:23,480 Speaker 1: An entire television program was done to investigate her, and 125 00:08:23,520 --> 00:08:26,560 Speaker 1: even though she insisted that her records were true, it 126 00:08:26,640 --> 00:08:30,720 Speaker 1: was revealed that she had fabricated her resume. She had 127 00:08:30,760 --> 00:08:33,559 Speaker 1: been lying about receiving a bachelor's from the University of 128 00:08:33,640 --> 00:08:38,760 Speaker 1: Kansas and a pH d from Yale University. Shinjunga was 129 00:08:38,840 --> 00:08:42,440 Speaker 1: fired from all of her positions, and then she was 130 00:08:42,480 --> 00:08:46,440 Speaker 1: convicted of falsifying records and she ended up serving time 131 00:08:46,440 --> 00:08:50,520 Speaker 1: in prison for that. I asked j Young what he 132 00:08:50,600 --> 00:08:54,439 Speaker 1: thought of that punishment. Ah, that's a complicated issue like 133 00:08:54,679 --> 00:08:57,880 Speaker 1: all the other issues in the Korean society that I 134 00:08:57,920 --> 00:09:02,640 Speaker 1: think was like, um, like a showcase example of you know, 135 00:09:02,760 --> 00:09:05,880 Speaker 1: if you funk with the system, we're gonna punish you. 136 00:09:06,200 --> 00:09:11,280 Speaker 1: Her scandal set off a nationwide wave of allegations, investigations, 137 00:09:11,280 --> 00:09:15,400 Speaker 1: and confessions of diploma fraud, and then a massive crackdown 138 00:09:15,520 --> 00:09:18,959 Speaker 1: on credential forgery. For a while, it seemed like everyone 139 00:09:19,080 --> 00:09:23,400 Speaker 1: was accusing everyone of credential forgery, which seems ridiculous except 140 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:26,040 Speaker 1: that a bunch of those cases ended up being true. 141 00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:32,560 Speaker 1: Hundreds of people were investigated, celebrities, soldiers, government officials, ended 142 00:09:32,600 --> 00:09:36,920 Speaker 1: up confessing to forging their credentials. Even a prominent Buddhist 143 00:09:36,960 --> 00:09:39,920 Speaker 1: monk was exposed for having lied about where he went 144 00:09:39,960 --> 00:09:47,280 Speaker 1: to school. I think that case just fully satisfied people's 145 00:09:47,480 --> 00:09:50,880 Speaker 1: fantasy that people in the art word are like that 146 00:09:52,320 --> 00:09:56,719 Speaker 1: they are either highly educated or trying to post themselves 147 00:09:56,760 --> 00:10:01,240 Speaker 1: as highly educated. I think it happens at not only 148 00:10:01,320 --> 00:10:06,800 Speaker 1: in Korea, but in Korea, maybe the intensity is much 149 00:10:06,880 --> 00:10:12,360 Speaker 1: much higher than you might expect. Shin Junga became a symbol. 150 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:15,840 Speaker 1: She was guilty of lying and was now the poster 151 00:10:15,960 --> 00:10:20,640 Speaker 1: child for fraud. But she also confirms something something that 152 00:10:20,720 --> 00:10:24,840 Speaker 1: people already thought, that the elites are getting over on 153 00:10:24,920 --> 00:10:29,719 Speaker 1: the rest of us, that everything, the entire society, it's 154 00:10:29,760 --> 00:10:33,360 Speaker 1: all rigged, and then all of us we have to work. 155 00:10:33,920 --> 00:10:37,200 Speaker 1: But them, the people with connections, they can do whatever 156 00:10:37,240 --> 00:10:39,760 Speaker 1: they want. They don't even have to earn their degrees. 157 00:10:40,320 --> 00:10:43,920 Speaker 1: This isn't a new idea, and it's not even particularly Korean, 158 00:10:44,760 --> 00:10:47,800 Speaker 1: but there is a particular interpretation of this that's a 159 00:10:47,800 --> 00:10:51,800 Speaker 1: little more prominent in Korean culture, especially recently over the 160 00:10:51,840 --> 00:10:54,640 Speaker 1: past few years. It's almost kind of a meme that's 161 00:10:54,679 --> 00:10:58,800 Speaker 1: caught on among younger people. Hell Korea or hand Korea 162 00:10:59,000 --> 00:11:06,280 Speaker 1: or like people jokingly it's aself, that depreciating term to 163 00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:11,800 Speaker 1: describe one's home country, which is Korea as hell, like 164 00:11:11,880 --> 00:11:15,000 Speaker 1: living in Korea is like living in a hell. I 165 00:11:15,080 --> 00:11:19,520 Speaker 1: agree that Korea is a hellish place to live. To 166 00:11:19,600 --> 00:11:24,040 Speaker 1: be honest, it's a highly competitive and there's a lot 167 00:11:24,040 --> 00:11:28,920 Speaker 1: of social pressure, economic pressure, and so many um brutal 168 00:11:29,280 --> 00:11:33,880 Speaker 1: things happening. It's very misogynistic, I must say, it's not inclusive. 169 00:11:35,440 --> 00:11:40,679 Speaker 1: Sometimes I imagine myself as a being a foreigner in 170 00:11:40,720 --> 00:11:46,120 Speaker 1: this country, and then everything looks so interesting, like so 171 00:11:46,200 --> 00:11:51,760 Speaker 1: funny if I if I was a foreigner, the only 172 00:11:51,880 --> 00:11:55,439 Speaker 1: bad thing is that I'm actually a Korean citizen who's 173 00:11:55,480 --> 00:11:59,559 Speaker 1: living in this is actually I think that's what makes 174 00:12:00,080 --> 00:12:06,760 Speaker 1: Korean very interesting, dynamic place. People say like her duos 175 00:12:06,840 --> 00:12:11,400 Speaker 1: on mhm, which is like hell Korea. I've never liked 176 00:12:11,480 --> 00:12:15,800 Speaker 1: that phrase, um because you know, it singles out Korea 177 00:12:16,120 --> 00:12:20,160 Speaker 1: as a possible hell. You know, it puts it puts 178 00:12:20,360 --> 00:12:25,000 Speaker 1: that word on a on this whole country, which which 179 00:12:25,080 --> 00:12:29,480 Speaker 1: I really detest um because it's not it's not a 180 00:12:29,520 --> 00:12:32,960 Speaker 1: Korean problem. Is it's not a Korea problem. It's a 181 00:12:32,960 --> 00:12:37,720 Speaker 1: it's a modern problem. It's hellish everywhere, right to different 182 00:12:37,720 --> 00:12:41,679 Speaker 1: degrees in different um, you know, but it's hell pretty 183 00:12:41,760 --> 00:12:47,719 Speaker 1: much everywhere. It's there's it's not easy anywhere. But I'm 184 00:12:47,800 --> 00:12:52,520 Speaker 1: just worry of any umbrella terms, especially ones that are 185 00:12:52,600 --> 00:12:57,280 Speaker 1: so damaging to our identities as Korean. On paper, South 186 00:12:57,360 --> 00:13:02,120 Speaker 1: Korea looks like an incredible economic success story, and it is. 187 00:13:02,880 --> 00:13:05,840 Speaker 1: It went from a war torn, impoverished country into a 188 00:13:05,880 --> 00:13:09,480 Speaker 1: global powerhouse in the top ten largest economies in the 189 00:13:09,520 --> 00:13:12,800 Speaker 1: world over the space of a few decades. It was 190 00:13:12,840 --> 00:13:16,160 Speaker 1: only about seven years ago that the Korean War divided 191 00:13:16,200 --> 00:13:19,360 Speaker 1: the country into two halves. That might sound like a 192 00:13:19,400 --> 00:13:22,880 Speaker 1: long time ago from the outside, but in Korea that 193 00:13:22,920 --> 00:13:26,640 Speaker 1: memory is pretty fresh. The war was devastating. Um it's 194 00:13:26,640 --> 00:13:32,760 Speaker 1: an understatement, you know. It tore our country apart. My dad, uh, 195 00:13:33,160 --> 00:13:37,680 Speaker 1: you know, he grew well, he was an orphan, so 196 00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:42,360 Speaker 1: he had a really tough his whole life. Tableau doesn't 197 00:13:42,400 --> 00:13:46,280 Speaker 1: know what happened to his grandparents, His family doesn't talk 198 00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:49,440 Speaker 1: about it. But for him to have gotten to the 199 00:13:49,480 --> 00:13:52,720 Speaker 1: point where we were living in a fairly you know, 200 00:13:52,960 --> 00:13:56,680 Speaker 1: fairly middle class apartment by the time my brother was born, 201 00:13:57,360 --> 00:14:01,520 Speaker 1: and then a little bigger every time until I was born. 202 00:14:01,800 --> 00:14:04,520 Speaker 1: I can only imagine how how hard he hustled and 203 00:14:04,600 --> 00:14:08,280 Speaker 1: how how much he struggled. He had to like take 204 00:14:08,480 --> 00:14:14,440 Speaker 1: leaps to get a couple of steps up. Tablow's father 205 00:14:14,679 --> 00:14:17,320 Speaker 1: is like a lot of immigrant parents just looking for 206 00:14:17,400 --> 00:14:20,480 Speaker 1: something better for their child. That parents definition of better 207 00:14:20,840 --> 00:14:24,280 Speaker 1: is based on their past history, and Tablew's father's history 208 00:14:24,360 --> 00:14:26,960 Speaker 1: is intertwined with the way Korea came to be as 209 00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:29,560 Speaker 1: we know it today. There's no way that I could 210 00:14:29,560 --> 00:14:32,800 Speaker 1: explain the entirety of modern Korean history here, but the 211 00:14:32,840 --> 00:14:34,960 Speaker 1: short version is that there's a lot of things in 212 00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:38,280 Speaker 1: the background. One of those things is how South Korea 213 00:14:38,360 --> 00:14:40,960 Speaker 1: went from a poor, war torn country in the nineteen 214 00:14:41,040 --> 00:14:45,040 Speaker 1: sixties to an economic powerhouse all in the space of 215 00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:49,200 Speaker 1: a few decades. After the war, the Korean government invested 216 00:14:49,240 --> 00:14:53,040 Speaker 1: heavily into educational infrastructure. At the same time, they were 217 00:14:53,040 --> 00:14:57,760 Speaker 1: pumping relief funds and extremely favorable loans into certain businesses 218 00:14:58,040 --> 00:15:01,680 Speaker 1: that would commit to rebuilding the country. The plan worked 219 00:15:01,960 --> 00:15:06,160 Speaker 1: and the economy soared, but Korea also ended up with 220 00:15:06,240 --> 00:15:11,160 Speaker 1: powerful conglomerates run by incredibly rich families. You've definitely heard 221 00:15:11,160 --> 00:15:16,800 Speaker 1: of them, Samsung, Hyundai, l g those sorts. In Korea, 222 00:15:16,920 --> 00:15:21,119 Speaker 1: they call these powerful dynasties chibbles, which basically just translates 223 00:15:21,120 --> 00:15:25,440 Speaker 1: out to the phrase rich families. So when a massive 224 00:15:25,520 --> 00:15:29,440 Speaker 1: financial crisis hit Korea hard in the nineties and jobs 225 00:15:29,480 --> 00:15:33,040 Speaker 1: became scarce, but those rich families seem to be doing 226 00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:38,680 Speaker 1: just fine, it exposed something that people already knew that 227 00:15:38,720 --> 00:15:42,880 Speaker 1: there was an increasingly unfair hierarchy between the halves and 228 00:15:42,920 --> 00:15:46,480 Speaker 1: the have nots, and the only way to guarantee a 229 00:15:46,600 --> 00:15:49,400 Speaker 1: stable life was to get yourself as far up that 230 00:15:49,480 --> 00:15:54,040 Speaker 1: ladder as possible by getting the best educational credential that 231 00:15:54,120 --> 00:16:03,800 Speaker 1: you could. That's the road Tabloo's father went down. He 232 00:16:03,920 --> 00:16:07,720 Speaker 1: studied hard, and he got himself into Soul National University, 233 00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:11,640 Speaker 1: the Harvard of Korea. So Tableau gets why his dad 234 00:16:11,720 --> 00:16:14,280 Speaker 1: pushed him and his siblings so hard to do well 235 00:16:14,320 --> 00:16:18,720 Speaker 1: in school. So he probably felt like the only thing 236 00:16:19,000 --> 00:16:23,120 Speaker 1: that can get his kids further away from whatever he 237 00:16:23,240 --> 00:16:26,400 Speaker 1: was coming from where these professions and I and I 238 00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:34,960 Speaker 1: totally understand the thing is I also knew that I 239 00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:39,560 Speaker 1: wasn't born for that, like I I just I just 240 00:16:39,680 --> 00:16:44,240 Speaker 1: knew that I didn't fit into that picture. And uh, 241 00:16:44,720 --> 00:16:47,280 Speaker 1: for you know, most of my life I felt guilty. 242 00:16:47,520 --> 00:16:52,080 Speaker 1: I actually do even now. Really, yeah, I even now. 243 00:16:52,320 --> 00:16:56,160 Speaker 1: Yeah you feel that. Yeah, I actually still feel it 244 00:16:56,360 --> 00:17:00,640 Speaker 1: every once in a while, like maybe you know, maybe 245 00:17:01,400 --> 00:17:06,040 Speaker 1: rebelling against what they wanted caused all of it. Given 246 00:17:06,080 --> 00:17:09,960 Speaker 1: the deeper context of Korean society, where family and business 247 00:17:10,359 --> 00:17:14,080 Speaker 1: and success of the nation have all been intertwined, it's 248 00:17:14,200 --> 00:17:43,560 Speaker 1: no wonder what happened next. That's after the break, I 249 00:17:43,600 --> 00:17:46,960 Speaker 1: had to go to the hospital for like I think 250 00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:48,720 Speaker 1: it's because of my daughter. I don't know if it 251 00:17:48,760 --> 00:17:50,719 Speaker 1: was because of my daughter or me, but it was 252 00:17:50,960 --> 00:17:55,080 Speaker 1: something for something simple like maybe a cold or but 253 00:17:55,160 --> 00:17:59,160 Speaker 1: it required me to get a shot. While I was there, 254 00:17:59,600 --> 00:18:03,199 Speaker 1: the doctor that was there just kept looking at me 255 00:18:03,280 --> 00:18:07,919 Speaker 1: really weird, right, and and you know, like I'm a 256 00:18:07,920 --> 00:18:13,199 Speaker 1: famous persons in the midst of like extreme controversy, so 257 00:18:13,280 --> 00:18:15,879 Speaker 1: of course he's looking at me weird, That's what I thought. 258 00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:19,600 Speaker 1: And then I it's my turn, and he's like okay, 259 00:18:19,680 --> 00:18:21,880 Speaker 1: like like talking to me and like what do you need? 260 00:18:21,960 --> 00:18:27,200 Speaker 1: And then he stops typing, looks at me and says 261 00:18:27,200 --> 00:18:31,080 Speaker 1: something that sounded like you know, I see you're doing 262 00:18:31,160 --> 00:18:34,160 Speaker 1: better than you should be, then you should be That's 263 00:18:34,200 --> 00:18:39,560 Speaker 1: what it was implied to me. M He was like now, 264 00:18:39,680 --> 00:18:43,760 Speaker 1: which means like you're doing well. And the way he 265 00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:46,479 Speaker 1: looked at me, and the way he said it, and 266 00:18:46,560 --> 00:18:50,679 Speaker 1: like just his fingers like on the keyboard and stuff 267 00:18:51,080 --> 00:18:54,000 Speaker 1: convinced me that, like in that moment, that there's a 268 00:18:54,119 --> 00:18:56,679 Speaker 1: high possibility he's one of them. He's one of the 269 00:18:56,720 --> 00:18:59,240 Speaker 1: touch and you remembers, Yeah, and this guy is about 270 00:18:59,280 --> 00:19:05,080 Speaker 1: to m put a needle in my arm right and 271 00:19:05,160 --> 00:19:11,879 Speaker 1: possibly my daughter's like body as well, into her bloodstream. 272 00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:14,720 Speaker 1: So I had to leave the hospital, like, I just 273 00:19:14,720 --> 00:19:21,320 Speaker 1: just had to leave. In the fall, at the height 274 00:19:21,359 --> 00:19:24,639 Speaker 1: of the scandal, people were following Tableau down the street, 275 00:19:25,000 --> 00:19:27,960 Speaker 1: confronting him in public and making threats over the phone. 276 00:19:28,359 --> 00:19:31,280 Speaker 1: It was impossible for Tableau and his family to leave 277 00:19:31,320 --> 00:19:33,879 Speaker 1: the house. He thought if they left the country for 278 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:36,800 Speaker 1: a while, things would calm down. But when he got 279 00:19:36,840 --> 00:19:41,440 Speaker 1: back that online forum Tajano had only gotten bigger. When 280 00:19:41,440 --> 00:19:45,680 Speaker 1: I got back to Korea, I looked, and I had 281 00:19:46,160 --> 00:19:48,840 Speaker 1: and then I realized that it had now spread to 282 00:19:49,000 --> 00:19:52,760 Speaker 1: my family. I checked the internet and now it had 283 00:19:52,800 --> 00:19:57,480 Speaker 1: become a campaign against my brother, my sister, and my 284 00:19:57,720 --> 00:20:02,439 Speaker 1: mom and dad, and I like, oh my god, and 285 00:20:02,520 --> 00:20:08,760 Speaker 1: not only is persisting, it's gotten like much worse. The 286 00:20:08,840 --> 00:20:13,000 Speaker 1: leader of the Tajano forum, what becomes posted for the 287 00:20:13,040 --> 00:20:17,399 Speaker 1: group to quote make Tableau and his family go crazy. 288 00:20:17,720 --> 00:20:20,399 Speaker 1: He then went on to say, quote, we have to 289 00:20:20,440 --> 00:20:23,080 Speaker 1: beat the ship out of these wild dogs in order 290 00:20:23,119 --> 00:20:26,479 Speaker 1: to taste the truth. This has gone beyond accusations and 291 00:20:26,520 --> 00:20:31,080 Speaker 1: conspiracy theories. They were talking violence. Tableau's mother was getting 292 00:20:31,080 --> 00:20:34,240 Speaker 1: intimidating phone calls at dinner. One night, she got a 293 00:20:34,280 --> 00:20:36,960 Speaker 1: call a man's voice telling her that she was a 294 00:20:37,000 --> 00:20:41,280 Speaker 1: whore and that she and her family should leave Korea. 295 00:20:41,440 --> 00:20:43,920 Speaker 1: And it didn't stop at phone calls. Some of these 296 00:20:43,960 --> 00:20:46,600 Speaker 1: guys dressed up as people working for the government, make 297 00:20:46,720 --> 00:20:50,119 Speaker 1: fake badges and stuff, came to my mom's hair salon 298 00:20:50,800 --> 00:20:54,760 Speaker 1: um trying to investigate her, trying to harass her. Taijano's 299 00:20:54,880 --> 00:20:59,080 Speaker 1: investigation into Tableau has spread to his entire family and 300 00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:03,240 Speaker 1: their credentials. At the time, Tablow's brother was working for 301 00:21:03,280 --> 00:21:06,280 Speaker 1: a large broadcasting channel called e b S, and his 302 00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:09,879 Speaker 1: about profile on the company website incorrectly said that he 303 00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:14,200 Speaker 1: had graduated with his Masters from Columbia University. Tajano looked 304 00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:17,600 Speaker 1: into this and realized that he had only attended the university, 305 00:21:17,880 --> 00:21:21,160 Speaker 1: he never graduated. The thing was this was a mistake 306 00:21:21,280 --> 00:21:25,959 Speaker 1: by EBS, but Tagano latched onto that supposed lie and 307 00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:29,679 Speaker 1: used it as more proof that Tableau's whole family was lying. 308 00:21:30,640 --> 00:21:36,040 Speaker 1: My brother was fired by EBS almost immediately upon uh 309 00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:41,200 Speaker 1: Tajanio claiming that he had also lied about his education. 310 00:21:41,359 --> 00:21:44,320 Speaker 1: It didn't matter that David had never lied, that it 311 00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:48,760 Speaker 1: was a simple company mistake. E b s still fired him. 312 00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:53,080 Speaker 1: The pressure for Tajano was that high. So my wife, 313 00:21:53,160 --> 00:21:57,160 Speaker 1: she was now the wife of a of a fraud 314 00:21:57,840 --> 00:22:03,040 Speaker 1: like immediately upon getting married and having a kid with 315 00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:07,919 Speaker 1: said fraud right, this obviously affects her career as well. 316 00:22:08,280 --> 00:22:13,119 Speaker 1: Tableau's father, Guangbo Lee, also became a target. Tajano was 317 00:22:13,240 --> 00:22:17,760 Speaker 1: sure the Tableous Stanford degree was fake and that suspicion 318 00:22:17,920 --> 00:22:21,440 Speaker 1: had spread to his father. Maybe Tableau's father had helped 319 00:22:21,480 --> 00:22:24,880 Speaker 1: him forge that document. And by the way, his father 320 00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:28,360 Speaker 1: said that he went to Seoul National University, and surely 321 00:22:28,520 --> 00:22:31,680 Speaker 1: the father of a liar must also be a liar himself. 322 00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:37,320 Speaker 1: So they started digging, and they found things things. Tabloo's 323 00:22:37,359 --> 00:22:41,119 Speaker 1: father probably never wanted anyone to see, especially his family. 324 00:22:42,040 --> 00:22:45,119 Speaker 1: He had been hiding something, but it wasn't a credential. 325 00:22:45,560 --> 00:22:48,280 Speaker 1: As a result of what I went through and what 326 00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:53,240 Speaker 1: the internet mob, what they dug up. One of the 327 00:22:53,320 --> 00:22:58,720 Speaker 1: first homes my dad had as an adult was in Korea. 328 00:22:58,800 --> 00:23:04,080 Speaker 1: We call it pun judge. It's literally like these homes 329 00:23:04,119 --> 00:23:08,520 Speaker 1: aren't homes. They have like you know, some people have 330 00:23:08,560 --> 00:23:13,720 Speaker 1: like cardboard. The roof is just something you just place over, 331 00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:18,480 Speaker 1: you know. They have these areas where all the all 332 00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:22,000 Speaker 1: the homes are like that. It's it's really heartbreaking. But 333 00:23:22,960 --> 00:23:27,560 Speaker 1: one of the things they dug up was where my 334 00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:32,080 Speaker 1: dad had lived, and we traced back the address to 335 00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:36,399 Speaker 1: that ear and he was that's where he was living. 336 00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:40,320 Speaker 1: And you found this out because of what happened. Yeah, 337 00:23:40,520 --> 00:23:44,639 Speaker 1: people were going through every whole history everything and uh 338 00:23:44,880 --> 00:23:47,240 Speaker 1: and you didn't know this beforehand. I knew he had 339 00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:51,240 Speaker 1: it tough, but I didn't I realized that I saw, 340 00:23:51,560 --> 00:23:55,760 Speaker 1: like how tough he had it. And for him to 341 00:23:56,200 --> 00:23:59,360 Speaker 1: have gotten to the point where we had an apartment 342 00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:01,800 Speaker 1: by the time I was born, I can only imagine, 343 00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:07,120 Speaker 1: you know, how many sacrifices he probably made right um, like, 344 00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:11,400 Speaker 1: how many of his dreams were if he had any 345 00:24:11,440 --> 00:24:15,919 Speaker 1: at all, like if he even had the time for 346 00:24:15,920 --> 00:24:21,880 Speaker 1: for dreams. But there wasn't really a lot of time 347 00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:25,640 Speaker 1: to talk about that. Years before this, Tablow's father had 348 00:24:25,680 --> 00:24:29,520 Speaker 1: been diagnosed with cancer. It had been treated and everything 349 00:24:29,560 --> 00:24:32,960 Speaker 1: had been fine. But right is all this was happening. 350 00:24:33,400 --> 00:24:37,359 Speaker 1: The cancer came back, and some of Tablo's family blamed 351 00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:41,840 Speaker 1: him when the whole scandal thing happened. Sadly, one of 352 00:24:41,840 --> 00:24:44,280 Speaker 1: the first things they said to me was sort of like, 353 00:24:44,440 --> 00:24:50,160 Speaker 1: and I told you so. Yeah. They they they were 354 00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:54,840 Speaker 1: basically telling me, you know you, your dreams have destroyed 355 00:24:55,320 --> 00:25:01,600 Speaker 1: our family, Your dreams have killed ours. It's weird because 356 00:25:01,680 --> 00:25:05,560 Speaker 1: for Tableau's parents, him going to Stanford was their dream. 357 00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:09,440 Speaker 1: They actually prayed for it, and Tableau fulfilled that dream. 358 00:25:09,480 --> 00:25:12,040 Speaker 1: Tableau never cared about that degree anymore than as a 359 00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:14,480 Speaker 1: tool just to get his parents off his back. The 360 00:25:14,560 --> 00:25:17,239 Speaker 1: degree only really started to have value for him when 361 00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:19,760 Speaker 1: he realized that it could help him toward his dreams 362 00:25:19,960 --> 00:25:23,399 Speaker 1: of becoming a musician. For Tableau, the degree was a 363 00:25:23,480 --> 00:25:27,399 Speaker 1: hurdle and then a tool. For his parents, it was 364 00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:30,680 Speaker 1: a symbol of a better life for their son. But 365 00:25:30,760 --> 00:25:35,480 Speaker 1: ta Jano read that symbol completely differently, because what kind 366 00:25:35,480 --> 00:25:39,520 Speaker 1: of person goes to Stanford, Well, an elite person in 367 00:25:39,640 --> 00:25:43,439 Speaker 1: elites or from rich families, And just like kids from 368 00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:47,159 Speaker 1: rich families suddenly appear on the boards of these big companies. 369 00:25:47,640 --> 00:25:51,320 Speaker 1: It was Tableau prance it around on TV doing something 370 00:25:51,359 --> 00:25:55,440 Speaker 1: that had zero to do with that fancy degree. Tajano 371 00:25:55,560 --> 00:25:59,119 Speaker 1: had a collective mental image of what an elite looked 372 00:25:59,160 --> 00:26:03,840 Speaker 1: like in Tableau fit. The description Hegian Lee from the 373 00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:07,040 Speaker 1: University of Southern California explains this better than I do. 374 00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:11,440 Speaker 1: He claims that he's a Stanford graduate, and Korean's perception 375 00:26:11,480 --> 00:26:14,560 Speaker 1: of a of a person who graduates from Stanford is 376 00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:19,159 Speaker 1: an elite, somebody who should be doing something greater than 377 00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:22,119 Speaker 1: a hip hop artist, somebody who should use their smart 378 00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:26,720 Speaker 1: brains for the betterment of society, Korean society. So his 379 00:26:26,840 --> 00:26:29,760 Speaker 1: career choice was kind of at odds with what people 380 00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:33,960 Speaker 1: expect from an elite. So that's how they defied common sense. 381 00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:37,679 Speaker 1: So he has all these qualities that are considered to 382 00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:41,920 Speaker 1: be a sign a privilege in Korea. Um, and the 383 00:26:41,920 --> 00:26:45,840 Speaker 1: thing is he's using that privilege to evade responsibility as 384 00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:51,280 Speaker 1: a Korean citizen. What I mean the the injustices, the 385 00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:55,679 Speaker 1: systemic just inequality and stuff like this. That you're saying 386 00:26:55,760 --> 00:26:58,560 Speaker 1: that you were sort of resonating with it that the 387 00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:06,000 Speaker 1: TAGO members are rarely against well because they they really are. 388 00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:10,080 Speaker 1: If you take their argument logically and rationally, what they're 389 00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:13,600 Speaker 1: saying is it is not fair that there are elites 390 00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:18,040 Speaker 1: gaming the system. This is Sean Limb Tablo's friend from Stanford, 391 00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:21,320 Speaker 1: and it is not fair that that they're covering for 392 00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:29,280 Speaker 1: each other, lying and allowing people to succeed through cheating 393 00:27:29,920 --> 00:27:34,960 Speaker 1: when we all tried our best to succeed and we failed, 394 00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:40,440 Speaker 1: but we tried our best. Honestly, you can never win 395 00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:45,679 Speaker 1: because they are always being compared to somebody else greater 396 00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:52,360 Speaker 1: than them. That kind of people, you know, used by 397 00:27:52,520 --> 00:28:00,440 Speaker 1: parents like children. What is this? What is this? That's 398 00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:03,960 Speaker 1: our producer Minji Ko. She's trying to explain that there's 399 00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:06,480 Speaker 1: a term for this kind of pressure the Sean is describing. 400 00:28:06,560 --> 00:28:09,880 Speaker 1: So you're referring to I'm China, So that means basically means, 401 00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:17,240 Speaker 1: my oh, my friend's son did this. My friend's daughter 402 00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:19,760 Speaker 1: was able to get an A plus, how come you 403 00:28:19,800 --> 00:28:25,600 Speaker 1: didn't get one? So it sounds so innocent. Actually that 404 00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:31,359 Speaker 1: omtin even in Korean that sounds like cute, but really 405 00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:33,439 Speaker 1: that though those are fighting words. Those are like, you know, 406 00:28:33,600 --> 00:28:37,399 Speaker 1: piercing words. You don't want to hear that. It's like 407 00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:41,560 Speaker 1: keeping up with the Jones is well, yeah, your kids 408 00:28:41,680 --> 00:28:44,520 Speaker 1: junior version or kitty version or how we want to 409 00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:48,600 Speaker 1: say it. Yeah, man, because in Korea, the way that 410 00:28:49,280 --> 00:28:51,560 Speaker 1: it's been set up is that there's only one route 411 00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:55,040 Speaker 1: to success. So even starting with the way that like 412 00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:59,760 Speaker 1: your tests are graded. After every test, I believe they 413 00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:05,880 Speaker 1: post the grades on the wall, right and just at school, Yeah, 414 00:29:06,600 --> 00:29:10,160 Speaker 1: one to the bottom. There's always only number one, number one, 415 00:29:12,160 --> 00:29:14,640 Speaker 1: and there's only one way to get to that number one. 416 00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:19,960 Speaker 1: So from an early age, everyone is just kind of 417 00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:24,160 Speaker 1: indoctrinated into just only one root of success. So yeah, 418 00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:31,080 Speaker 1: it's that whole crabs in a bucket mentality very strong here. Now, 419 00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:34,400 Speaker 1: if you've seen Parasite or Squid Games or any of 420 00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:37,560 Speaker 1: those dystopian films that have caught on in America, you 421 00:29:37,640 --> 00:29:41,080 Speaker 1: might be attempted to think that, man, Korean society is 422 00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:47,120 Speaker 1: so cut throat and dark and sort of but I 423 00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:49,480 Speaker 1: think it's a little more accurate to say that those 424 00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:52,840 Speaker 1: things have caught on in America precisely, because when we 425 00:29:52,880 --> 00:29:56,480 Speaker 1: see the despair and parasite, or the hopelessness and squid game, 426 00:29:57,120 --> 00:29:59,760 Speaker 1: we're seeing a reflection of ourselves and our own s 427 00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:05,640 Speaker 1: id I mean, the mega corporations, the shady government ties. 428 00:30:06,120 --> 00:30:09,560 Speaker 1: We got that here in America, the dark history that 429 00:30:09,760 --> 00:30:13,080 Speaker 1: isn't all that long ago, that still haunts our national conscience. 430 00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:15,960 Speaker 1: Think back to the protests a couple of summers ago. 431 00:30:16,600 --> 00:30:21,200 Speaker 1: We definitely got that. The idea that education is the 432 00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:23,760 Speaker 1: only way to get ahead, yep, and we've got the 433 00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:27,200 Speaker 1: student loans to prove it. There's been some unique factors 434 00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:30,000 Speaker 1: in both countries that have led to both places being 435 00:30:30,040 --> 00:30:33,000 Speaker 1: pretty grim and yet holding out a glimmer of hope 436 00:30:33,120 --> 00:30:37,280 Speaker 1: that feels fair, And just like in America, some Koreans 437 00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:40,000 Speaker 1: have just sort of accepted that as the way things are. 438 00:30:40,840 --> 00:30:46,000 Speaker 1: But some people are really really piste off. And when 439 00:30:46,040 --> 00:30:50,360 Speaker 1: people are piste off, they start looking for answers. So 440 00:30:50,560 --> 00:30:52,880 Speaker 1: when you lay it all out, maybe it goes something 441 00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:57,959 Speaker 1: like this. The Shinjunga scandal had proven what everyone suspected 442 00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:02,280 Speaker 1: all along, the society was unfair and that some people 443 00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:04,840 Speaker 1: were willing to lie their way to the top. But 444 00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:09,280 Speaker 1: now that they knew that what had changed, well nothing. 445 00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:14,840 Speaker 1: One person did go to jail, but society fundamentally hadn't changed. 446 00:31:15,480 --> 00:31:19,800 Speaker 1: Things were still unfair. There was still an elite them 447 00:31:19,840 --> 00:31:25,400 Speaker 1: and a downtrodden us. And the Tajo Tablow definitely didn't 448 00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:28,160 Speaker 1: look like any of us. It looked like another one 449 00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:30,240 Speaker 1: of them. And then when you have like these things 450 00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:35,400 Speaker 1: that lets them release their frustration, you're releasing it at 451 00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:40,320 Speaker 1: the wrong guy. But it didn't matter. The target might 452 00:31:40,320 --> 00:31:44,560 Speaker 1: have been wrong, but the campaign felt right. It felt good. 453 00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:48,840 Speaker 1: Maybe this time, if they could catch Tableau, Korea could 454 00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:53,360 Speaker 1: finish what they'd started with Shin jong A. Soon Korean 455 00:31:53,360 --> 00:31:57,320 Speaker 1: authorities were flooded with calls for justice. People were demanding 456 00:31:57,400 --> 00:32:03,080 Speaker 1: accountability and truth from Blow and it worked. Soon Tableau 457 00:32:03,160 --> 00:32:09,560 Speaker 1: was under investigation by the Korean police. That's next time 458 00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:28,880 Speaker 1: on Authentic. Authentic is a production of Vice Audio and 459 00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:33,040 Speaker 1: I Heeart podcast Network, produced and reported by Stephanie Kayuki, 460 00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:39,000 Speaker 1: Minji Coo, Kate Osborne and myself with Janet Lee, Stephanie Brown, 461 00:32:39,360 --> 00:32:43,360 Speaker 1: and Sam Egan. Sound design and original music composition by 462 00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:47,840 Speaker 1: Kyle Murdock, with additional support from Natasha Jacobs. Our supervising 463 00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:51,960 Speaker 1: producer is Janet Lee, editing from Lacy Roberts, fact checking 464 00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:56,000 Speaker 1: by Minji Ko and Nicole Pasuka. Our executive producer and 465 00:32:56,160 --> 00:33:00,720 Speaker 1: VP Advice Audio is Kate Osbourne from I Heeart Podcast Network. 466 00:33:00,760 --> 00:33:05,880 Speaker 1: Executive producers Nikki E. Tor and Lindsay Hoffman. I'm Dexter Thomas. 467 00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:08,880 Speaker 1: Make sure to subscribe wherever you get your podcast so 468 00:33:08,960 --> 00:33:10,840 Speaker 1: you don't miss an episode, and if you dig it, 469 00:33:11,080 --> 00:33:12,360 Speaker 1: give us a rating and a review.