WEBVTT - How Suicide Bombers Work 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:02.840 Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. 0:00:03.160 --> 0:00:07.560 It's ready. Are you welcome to stuff you should know 0:00:08.160 --> 0:00:16.400 from house Stuff Works dot com? Hey, and welcome to 0:00:16.440 --> 0:00:19.040 the podcast. I'm Josh Clark with me as always as 0:00:19.160 --> 0:00:23.400 Charles W. Chuck Bryant looking as spry as ever. Have 0:00:23.440 --> 0:00:27.720 you ever seen Bad Santa? Yeah? Remember the kid? He's like, 0:00:27.800 --> 0:00:30.200 you're granny? Is she spry? And it is. He's putting 0:00:30.240 --> 0:00:32.040 on a ski mask and they come in the door 0:00:32.120 --> 0:00:35.040 and he goes, Granny, are you spry? Really? Yeah? And 0:00:35.120 --> 0:00:37.640 she's like, I'll make you some sandwiches. Now you're looking 0:00:37.720 --> 0:00:40.040 very sprited it. Chuck, you've done something that you've never 0:00:40.080 --> 0:00:42.479 done in me before. What man? What's going You literally 0:00:42.840 --> 0:00:45.280 put a video on your laptop and just turned it 0:00:45.320 --> 0:00:48.199 around and then started the podcast. And I'm waiting to 0:00:48.200 --> 0:00:49.800 see what happens because I think it might have something 0:00:49.880 --> 0:00:52.479 to do with the podcast. Did you see it? Did 0:00:52.560 --> 0:00:55.360 it happen? It happened. It's pretty awesome and and it 0:00:55.400 --> 0:00:57.320 has nothing to do with what we're podcasting, does it. 0:00:57.680 --> 0:00:59.680 I just wanted you to see it. Putty General Interest. 0:01:00.200 --> 0:01:02.360 I will be putting that on the Facebook page okay, 0:01:02.360 --> 0:01:06.000 because ain't no party like our Facebook pages party. Yeah, 0:01:06.040 --> 0:01:09.520 you're into people getting flung off of things. Apparently I'm 0:01:09.600 --> 0:01:12.040 in a little a little bit of that mood right now. Yeah, 0:01:12.080 --> 0:01:15.840 how how are you doing? I'm great? Well good. We 0:01:16.200 --> 0:01:18.160 should probably tone it down a little bit because this 0:01:18.240 --> 0:01:21.760 is a grim, grim subject we're about to talk about. Yeah. 0:01:21.800 --> 0:01:24.200 That was the first minute, was about all the fun 0:01:24.240 --> 0:01:27.080 we're gonna have here. Yeah, so chuck, Um, I got 0:01:27.080 --> 0:01:30.720 an intro for you. I was, um jogging you mean? 0:01:30.720 --> 0:01:33.160 And I were jogging on tread mills, as is our 0:01:33.240 --> 0:01:36.560 want usually, and um, I prefer tread mills because I 0:01:36.560 --> 0:01:38.759 can watch TV while I do and just totally forget 0:01:38.800 --> 0:01:41.360 that I'm running. Right, the guy kills me, but it 0:01:41.400 --> 0:01:43.959 works so well. Like I'm up to like five miles 0:01:43.959 --> 0:01:46.600 each time, right, you know what's soubring though I try 0:01:46.600 --> 0:01:49.120 to run a single mile on pavement, I don't need to. 0:01:49.440 --> 0:01:54.120 There's no TVs on pavement, you know, much different. During 0:01:54.120 --> 0:01:59.960 one of these ventures, UM, I was watching CNN and um, 0:02:00.160 --> 0:02:04.080 this weird It was Wolf Blitzer and this weird segment 0:02:04.160 --> 0:02:08.320 came on where one of wolf Blitzer's journalists was in 0:02:08.400 --> 0:02:13.080 Libya meeting with the family of a man who had 0:02:13.160 --> 0:02:17.040 blown himself up in a car full of explosives to 0:02:17.840 --> 0:02:22.440 um gain entry for Libyan rebel fighters into this city. 0:02:22.520 --> 0:02:25.839 It's very disputed city. I can't remember which one. And 0:02:26.000 --> 0:02:29.240 the guy was sitting down with the family, the two 0:02:29.360 --> 0:02:33.480 daughters and the wife, who were grieving but holding a 0:02:33.520 --> 0:02:36.119 picture of the man talked to his best friend, who 0:02:36.120 --> 0:02:39.519 picked up the pieces of the guy and I realized 0:02:39.520 --> 0:02:41.160 that it took me a minute, but it was dawning 0:02:41.160 --> 0:02:47.200 on me that this is exactly what say um Afghani 0:02:47.360 --> 0:02:52.760 or Talibani um State Television would do with one of 0:02:52.800 --> 0:02:57.200 their suicide bombers. It was just like the embargo on 0:02:57.360 --> 0:03:01.560 discussed over suicide bombing as a general rule was lifted 0:03:01.880 --> 0:03:06.120 because someone CNN was rooting for blew himself up and 0:03:06.160 --> 0:03:09.160 suddenly it was okay. But I mean, like step for step, 0:03:09.200 --> 0:03:12.480 it was like a celebration of this man's heroism for 0:03:12.520 --> 0:03:15.880 blowing himself up. And I just thought it was really nuts. 0:03:16.120 --> 0:03:21.280 And I guess it's probably as unobjective as I should 0:03:21.280 --> 0:03:24.720 be throughout this podcast, but it struck me as really, 0:03:24.720 --> 0:03:27.200 really strange. I wrote a blog post on it called 0:03:27.280 --> 0:03:32.000 um CNN oddly celebrates suicide bombers hero or remember like that. 0:03:32.520 --> 0:03:34.320 But it was just so weird, And there's in the 0:03:34.320 --> 0:03:37.040 blog post there's video. Somebody found it and posted it. 0:03:37.280 --> 0:03:39.280 So there's a video of this weird segment that just 0:03:39.320 --> 0:03:43.920 sticks out like a sore thumb. And um, I guess that. 0:03:44.160 --> 0:03:47.480 What I learned is that my personal opinion is suicide 0:03:47.520 --> 0:03:50.760 bombing is wrong no matter what side is doing it. 0:03:51.240 --> 0:03:53.040 I think I would agree with that. All right. So 0:03:53.720 --> 0:03:57.480 this is a relatively new thing, right, suicide bombing it's 0:03:57.560 --> 0:04:03.080 new because there bombs are fairly new, right, Yeah, But 0:04:03.200 --> 0:04:06.440 it's far far more ancient than that. It is the 0:04:06.520 --> 0:04:09.080 concept of killing yourself or dying in the name of 0:04:09.120 --> 0:04:11.400 religion is pretty ancient. Oh yeah, you want to go 0:04:11.440 --> 0:04:14.360 all the way back to martyrdom in general, might as well. Okay, 0:04:14.440 --> 0:04:17.440 start at the beginning. Martyrdom is what we're talking about, obviously, 0:04:17.480 --> 0:04:21.120 when you talk about suicide bombing, it's forsaking your own 0:04:21.160 --> 0:04:25.119 life for a higher cause, for a principle, for your faith, 0:04:25.800 --> 0:04:30.440 anything that is not for your direct like earthly benefit, 0:04:30.600 --> 0:04:34.200 but maybe benefit later on to elevate your cause, but 0:04:34.279 --> 0:04:37.400 benefits for you in the afterlife. And so generally that's 0:04:37.440 --> 0:04:43.320 what we suspect make suicide bombers tick. That's what is martyrdom. 0:04:43.400 --> 0:04:46.040 And it's because although it is like a very deep 0:04:46.279 --> 0:04:52.240 there's a deep religious afiliation between martyrdom and um suicide 0:04:52.720 --> 0:04:56.839 like this suicide bombing. It doesn't necessarily have to be religious. 0:04:56.839 --> 0:04:59.440 It can be sure your side, your cause, like the 0:04:59.600 --> 0:05:02.719 forty one year old oil worker who is Libyan Um 0:05:02.920 --> 0:05:06.120 was for the rebel faction. It had nothing to do 0:05:06.240 --> 0:05:10.520 with religion. He was just willing to die for his cause, 0:05:10.920 --> 0:05:13.640 as all suicide bombers are. Religion kicks it up a 0:05:13.720 --> 0:05:15.920 little notch though so well. The and the reason why 0:05:16.040 --> 0:05:18.160 is because it's so ingretened. The two are so entangled 0:05:18.200 --> 0:05:23.080 from such an ancient place, right like our lamb who 0:05:23.120 --> 0:05:27.360 did this article? Who did this? He wrote it? Um 0:05:27.720 --> 0:05:33.200 he he he traces martyrdom back to um the second 0:05:33.240 --> 0:05:39.119 or third century BC. Right. What with King Nebuchadnezzar. Yeah, yeah, 0:05:39.160 --> 0:05:43.040 the famous story in uh in Bible history, the Book 0:05:43.040 --> 0:05:47.240 of Daniel. We all know King Nebuchadnezzar gave as the 0:05:47.279 --> 0:05:51.159 best boys called them, shad rack mishak the bed nig. Yeah. 0:05:51.200 --> 0:05:54.400 I can't, I can't see this three names together without 0:05:54.440 --> 0:05:58.159 thinking about that too. Well, these boys were three Jewish guys. 0:05:59.080 --> 0:06:01.279 That's probably why they called themselves at in the song, 0:06:01.839 --> 0:06:04.360 and they in the in the Bible story, he never 0:06:04.440 --> 0:06:05.960 cand as gave him the choice, you can renounce your 0:06:06.000 --> 0:06:09.760 Jewish faith or you can burn alive. And they said, 0:06:09.800 --> 0:06:12.240 you know what, we're the Beastie boys and we don't 0:06:12.279 --> 0:06:15.680 give in to anybody, and so we're gonna not renounce 0:06:15.680 --> 0:06:18.960 our faith. They were thrown into the fiery furnace and 0:06:19.279 --> 0:06:23.520 they lived, which the lesson there was an early lesson 0:06:23.520 --> 0:06:25.719 in martyrdom, which was, hey, you know what, God's gonna 0:06:25.800 --> 0:06:28.720 protect those who die in his name. Doesn't it make 0:06:28.720 --> 0:06:30.520 you wonder? Like, don't you don't you tend to think 0:06:30.560 --> 0:06:36.799 that in stories like that? Somewhere eons ago, something happened, 0:06:37.600 --> 0:06:42.440 possibly with these three people. What happened and eventually got 0:06:42.680 --> 0:06:45.600 translated into they were thrown into this furnace and they 0:06:45.680 --> 0:06:49.240 walked out unscathed, like did somebody like lose their grip 0:06:49.320 --> 0:06:52.000 on them? And they skirted across like a camp fire, 0:06:52.279 --> 0:06:54.880 you know, and like their robes didn't catch and everybody 0:06:54.960 --> 0:06:56.960 was like, oh my god, you know, and and then 0:06:57.240 --> 0:06:59.920 it just to just to make it more easily died 0:07:00.080 --> 0:07:03.440 juestable for the masses. It was transformed into this larger thing. 0:07:03.960 --> 0:07:08.040 My feeling when it comes to parables like this, where uh, 0:07:08.080 --> 0:07:11.520 to me, it's obvious that someone wasn't unscathed and a 0:07:11.600 --> 0:07:16.280 burning fire was that maybe someone was burned like they 0:07:16.280 --> 0:07:19.040 were being tortured and saying renounced religion, being burned with 0:07:19.080 --> 0:07:22.520 like fiery torches or something, and they refused and refused, 0:07:22.920 --> 0:07:25.200 and they couldn't be broken, and so they were set free. 0:07:25.640 --> 0:07:29.280 And that becomes a parable in the way of something 0:07:29.360 --> 0:07:32.680 miraculous like this. That makes that makes sense. It's good analysis. 0:07:32.840 --> 0:07:36.320 I probably get killed for that, But the point is, Um. 0:07:37.880 --> 0:07:40.800 The the idea was that if that God's God's got 0:07:40.800 --> 0:07:43.120 your back, if you're willing to die for him, right, yes, 0:07:43.160 --> 0:07:49.160 But that eventually transformed into what we what people still 0:07:49.240 --> 0:07:53.360 believe today that toil on this planet leads to bounty 0:07:53.520 --> 0:07:57.240 in the next life. The Big three. I'll believe that, 0:07:57.840 --> 0:08:01.400 and you can trace that back to the early the 0:08:01.480 --> 0:08:05.120 early Church, early Jewish faith, early Christian faith, and the 0:08:05.200 --> 0:08:11.040 early Muslim faith. UM, and martyrdom goes back just as 0:08:11.040 --> 0:08:13.400 far and comes from the same tree. The idea that 0:08:13.440 --> 0:08:18.680 if you sacrifice yourself, you're going to gain reward after this. 0:08:18.760 --> 0:08:21.880 So what's a few minutes of pain for a lifetime 0:08:21.920 --> 0:08:26.200 of happiness and pleasure? Yeah? Right, Well, and the non 0:08:26.240 --> 0:08:30.440 suicide version, where you're actually killing other people in the 0:08:30.520 --> 0:08:33.760 name of your God goes back to maybe not the 0:08:33.800 --> 0:08:37.000 first time, but one good example Robert Use was in 0:08:37.880 --> 0:08:41.800 d rather than surrendering to the Roman authorities, a rebel 0:08:41.840 --> 0:08:46.920 group basically killed their own themselves and every last man 0:08:46.960 --> 0:08:51.160 and woman. This one I think was probably literal, Yeah, probably, 0:08:51.200 --> 0:08:55.000 so does like do you think about how that would 0:08:55.000 --> 0:08:59.280 be treated today though? Yeah, like the authorities are coming 0:08:59.840 --> 0:09:04.480 and you kill every man, woman and child inside and 0:09:04.720 --> 0:09:09.840 sounds like a standoff at at Waco or something. Um. So, 0:09:10.600 --> 0:09:13.080 but your your point is, I think the larger point 0:09:13.160 --> 0:09:16.199 is is that people were willing to kill themselves, kill 0:09:16.280 --> 0:09:22.000 those close to them, um, and kill others eventually and 0:09:22.800 --> 0:09:25.920 in the name of God, and expected some sort of 0:09:25.960 --> 0:09:28.160 reward for it. So you were talking about the rise 0:09:28.200 --> 0:09:31.720 of Islam, right, So it was a D six ten 0:09:31.720 --> 0:09:35.640 when the prophet Muhammad received his first vision right and 0:09:35.800 --> 0:09:41.880 basically was set about going forth to found um Islam, 0:09:41.920 --> 0:09:45.959 and within fourteen years, uh, he had amassed something of 0:09:45.960 --> 0:09:49.840 of an army and was taking on other people in 0:09:49.840 --> 0:09:53.520 in the in the area. Right. It was pretty successful 0:09:53.559 --> 0:09:56.440 at it, Right, So what I gained from this, And 0:09:56.480 --> 0:09:58.640 I'm certainly not a scholar in Islam at all. I'm 0:09:58.640 --> 0:10:04.160 not a scholar in any religion. It um the Islam 0:10:04.240 --> 0:10:09.920 came out of a place of strife and battle, and 0:10:10.000 --> 0:10:15.520 so thustly this concept of jihad came about fairly early on. Yeah, 0:10:15.559 --> 0:10:18.040 there's two two parts to jihad. If you've never you've 0:10:18.040 --> 0:10:20.400 heard that word a lot used, probably for the second part, 0:10:20.480 --> 0:10:23.960 which was a righteous battle in the physical world. But 0:10:24.040 --> 0:10:27.040 the first part of jihad means it's an inward struggle 0:10:27.040 --> 0:10:30.200 of the soul uh in Arabic. So it's a two 0:10:30.240 --> 0:10:35.480 pronged thing there in the Kuran, basically vindicated defense and 0:10:35.559 --> 0:10:39.960 compact in the name of protecting the faithful as well 0:10:40.000 --> 0:10:43.520 as retaliation. So it's traced back to the Koran as 0:10:43.559 --> 0:10:46.920 far as probably the birth of the notion of something 0:10:46.960 --> 0:10:49.360 like a suicide bombing, even though it certainly doesn't say 0:10:49.360 --> 0:10:54.280 that anything about that anywhere in the Kuran. So jihad 0:10:54.360 --> 0:10:57.480 played a big role in the Crusades, which was the 0:10:57.600 --> 0:11:01.880 Christian version of the Holy War right um, and that 0:11:02.000 --> 0:11:07.040 was taking it to the Muslim's doorstep, basically invading the 0:11:07.080 --> 0:11:10.800 Middle East. Right, Europeans invading the Middle East. It was 0:11:10.840 --> 0:11:16.800 the Crusades UM. And so from these conflicts UM, during 0:11:16.880 --> 0:11:21.600 the the Dark Ages, the Medieval ages UM, the Crusades uh, 0:11:21.600 --> 0:11:25.200 and after the birth of Islam UM, this this idea 0:11:25.440 --> 0:11:28.840 of taking a single person and going and doing as 0:11:28.920 --> 0:11:32.200 much damage as you possibly could came about. So do 0:11:32.240 --> 0:11:35.880 you remember in the Sniper podcast we talked about sniper's 0:11:35.920 --> 0:11:42.520 being considered militarily forced multipliers. So are suicide assassins. And 0:11:42.640 --> 0:11:46.400 the term assassin actually comes out of this era and 0:11:46.600 --> 0:11:53.280 from the Middle East. UM, from the word hashishan Persian word, Uh, 0:11:53.360 --> 0:11:56.439 the name of a radical Shiite sect. Didn't know that, Yeah, 0:11:56.480 --> 0:12:01.559 So hashish An assassin are one of the same Hashian 0:12:02.280 --> 0:12:08.040 Hashihan assassin. Right the the you may recognize the word 0:12:08.080 --> 0:12:14.079 hashish as a type of pot residue. So if if 0:12:14.120 --> 0:12:16.640 you find it odd that the word hashish pops up, 0:12:16.840 --> 0:12:23.280 um be advised that the sect, the Hashihan um smoked 0:12:23.480 --> 0:12:28.200 hash as part of their religious ritual. Yeah. They were 0:12:28.240 --> 0:12:30.840 also the ones though who would go out and Um. 0:12:30.880 --> 0:12:36.239 There they were tasked with um killing like public officials 0:12:36.280 --> 0:12:41.120 in very public places to basically terrorize the population. Like 0:12:41.520 --> 0:12:44.600 like if you kill somebody like that, you cut someone's 0:12:44.600 --> 0:12:47.760 head off in a crowded square, you're gonna die. But 0:12:48.120 --> 0:12:50.280 the leaders had just got cut off in front of me, 0:12:50.520 --> 0:12:53.200 and now I'm really freaked out. It was the first 0:12:53.280 --> 0:12:56.840 early versions, ancient versions that would later become suicide bombings. 0:12:57.480 --> 0:13:00.520 But that sect was wiped out by Mongol in twelve 0:13:00.520 --> 0:13:03.320 fifty seven, and there was kind of a break on 0:13:03.360 --> 0:13:05.960 this activity for a while as far as world history goes. 0:13:06.000 --> 0:13:08.920 And then you get to World War Two and the 0:13:09.040 --> 0:13:16.400 Japanese Kamakazi pilots who are most essentially suicide bombers except 0:13:16.400 --> 0:13:21.120 by way of a plane. Yeah, through the Bushido code. Yeah, 0:13:21.160 --> 0:13:23.760 But usually think suicide bombing is someone on foot, but 0:13:23.840 --> 0:13:26.319 it can really, you know, you can do. There's been boats, 0:13:26.320 --> 0:13:30.160 there's been cars and trucks, humans walking, and then obviously 0:13:30.200 --> 0:13:34.960 planes flying into aircraft carriers. Really a male cart filled 0:13:35.000 --> 0:13:39.400 with explosives, you're gonna get the same. You're a suicide bomber. Well, 0:13:39.480 --> 0:13:43.199 Robert Lamb puts the first modern suicide attack in Lebanon 0:13:43.240 --> 0:13:47.640 in nine during War between civil war between Christian and 0:13:47.800 --> 0:13:51.960 Muslim militants, and there was a loan suicide bomber Shiite 0:13:53.000 --> 0:13:56.800 hit in Iraqi embassy in Beirut, and the US entered 0:13:56.800 --> 0:14:00.720 the conflict the next year, and so a side bomber 0:14:00.800 --> 0:14:03.880 drove into the U. S embassy I remember that, actually, 0:14:03.960 --> 0:14:06.800 killing sixty three people. Yeah, that was in April, and 0:14:06.880 --> 0:14:09.000 most folks say this is like the beginning of the 0:14:09.040 --> 0:14:13.480 modern suicide mission, right. And then in October two truck 0:14:13.600 --> 0:14:16.720 bombs drove into the marine barracks in Beirut and killed 0:14:16.760 --> 0:14:21.200 two people French and American I think two D forty 0:14:21.240 --> 0:14:24.040 one Marines. So, like you said, that's the birth of 0:14:24.040 --> 0:14:27.520 the modern suicide bomber. And unfortunately it's just basically been 0:14:27.520 --> 0:14:31.240 gaining momentum ever since. This whole concept of I'm going 0:14:31.280 --> 0:14:33.560 to strap a bunch of explosions to myself and walk 0:14:33.600 --> 0:14:36.360 into a crowd and blow myself up and kill as 0:14:36.400 --> 0:14:39.840 many other people as I possibly can. Yeah, let's poke 0:14:39.880 --> 0:14:42.320 around inside the mind because people have been curious what 0:14:42.400 --> 0:14:46.240 kind of person does this um? Because obviously, if you 0:14:46.280 --> 0:14:49.240 look at UM just from a straight physical standpoint, they 0:14:49.280 --> 0:14:52.160 did find between the ages of eighteen and twenty four 0:14:52.280 --> 0:14:55.160 is your average age of a suicide bomber. Apparently Israel 0:14:55.240 --> 0:14:57.880 conducted studies in the late nineties to figure out what 0:14:57.920 --> 0:15:01.520 they you know, who sus eye bombers were, right. So, 0:15:01.640 --> 0:15:03.840 so the sense of despondency and teens is playing a 0:15:03.840 --> 0:15:08.080 part here. The whole world is against them teens. How 0:15:08.120 --> 0:15:11.880 many teens feel that way? I know I did, uh, 0:15:11.920 --> 0:15:14.520 and it's no different in other countries. UM combine these 0:15:14.560 --> 0:15:19.960 feelings with tyranny. You're oppressed, you're angry. Uh. And then 0:15:20.000 --> 0:15:22.720 the final center here is usually and I think they 0:15:22.760 --> 0:15:26.120 even have a study that there's some sort of personal 0:15:26.200 --> 0:15:30.040 loss attached to the person that ends up being picked 0:15:30.120 --> 0:15:33.040 to carry out the mission. Right, their parents were killed 0:15:33.280 --> 0:15:38.240 or wounded or put in prison. Yeah, yeah, I'll do it. Yeah. 0:15:38.240 --> 0:15:40.040 It wasn't a study, but it said it is readlarly 0:15:40.040 --> 0:15:44.240 psychiatrist UM sifted through the lives is how Robert put it. 0:15:44.280 --> 0:15:47.760 And they did discover and almost all cases connections to 0:15:47.840 --> 0:15:50.560 like slain their wounded family members or friends. And for 0:15:50.600 --> 0:15:55.160 the most part they were males. But as times worn on, women, children, 0:15:55.520 --> 0:16:00.360 older people have UM all joined the echelons of UM 0:16:00.440 --> 0:16:04.880 suicide bombers, right, they're usually very poor. Yeah, um, there was. 0:16:05.000 --> 0:16:08.320 Did you hear about the woman from UM I guess 0:16:08.320 --> 0:16:12.960 she was a chechen extremist in um Moscow on New 0:16:13.040 --> 0:16:16.720 Year's Eve. She had a suicide belt and was getting 0:16:16.720 --> 0:16:19.320 ready to walk out into Red Square to blow herself 0:16:19.400 --> 0:16:21.680 up and take just tons of people with her, and 0:16:21.720 --> 0:16:24.360 she decided it didn't match her purse. She didn't make 0:16:24.400 --> 0:16:27.920 it out of the apartment because she got a spam 0:16:27.960 --> 0:16:32.920 text from her cell phone provider saying Happy New Year, 0:16:33.600 --> 0:16:37.800 and it blew her up really, you know, in her room. Yeah, 0:16:37.800 --> 0:16:41.680 in her apartment. She didn't have her cell phone off, 0:16:42.320 --> 0:16:47.120 which apparently is standard procedure. Like she they went out 0:16:47.160 --> 0:16:50.160 and bought a cell phone just for that purpose. The 0:16:50.240 --> 0:16:53.240 provider sent a spam text to everybody, because you know, 0:16:53.560 --> 0:16:56.640 cellphone providers have been thinking, like, we're providing service to 0:16:56.680 --> 0:16:58.400 somebody who's going to blow up a bunch of people 0:16:58.400 --> 0:17:00.280 as a terrorist, the same we want to tell don't 0:17:00.280 --> 0:17:03.200 happy New here exactly. Wow, I didn't hear about that. 0:17:03.280 --> 0:17:07.800 It's true. So uh. One other common trait is that 0:17:07.840 --> 0:17:09.960 they obviously are willing to die for their cause, but 0:17:10.040 --> 0:17:14.320 they are also willing to kill for their cause. UM 0:17:14.600 --> 0:17:18.440 most terrorists don't have, you know, they have no empathy 0:17:18.480 --> 0:17:22.000 for the suffering of other people. And it helps that, uh, 0:17:22.000 --> 0:17:24.280 in the case of US versus them, that the them 0:17:24.359 --> 0:17:27.720 is very very different from themselves, which is certainly the 0:17:27.720 --> 0:17:30.840 case with the Middle East and the United States. It 0:17:30.880 --> 0:17:32.679 couldn't be any more different as far as countries go, 0:17:33.080 --> 0:17:35.960 and people go, yeah, yeah, there's definitely a whole sentiment 0:17:36.000 --> 0:17:44.880 that UM occupation and invasion fans the flames of suicide bombing. Well, yeah, 0:17:44.920 --> 0:17:47.600 because that you see your you see Americans as an 0:17:47.600 --> 0:17:51.840 invader and an occupier and a savage and a nonbeliever, 0:17:51.920 --> 0:17:54.480 which is a big part that that part about jihad 0:17:54.840 --> 0:17:59.200 in the Koran says basically like this is what happens 0:17:59.240 --> 0:18:02.199 to nonbeliever. This is what you do to nonbelievers. To 0:18:02.280 --> 0:18:05.320 an extent, Robert points out that if suicide bombers were 0:18:05.400 --> 0:18:08.480 left just completely alone, they might want to back out 0:18:08.560 --> 0:18:11.320 or think twice. So that's why they surround them toward 0:18:11.400 --> 0:18:15.800 go time with the social network of supporters to say, 0:18:15.880 --> 0:18:18.000 you know, you're doing the right thing. They isolate you 0:18:18.040 --> 0:18:23.000 from your family and friends and UM show you videos 0:18:23.080 --> 0:18:26.840 martyrdom videos to reinforce that what you're doing is you know, 0:18:26.960 --> 0:18:29.679 you make a martyrdom video, you make your own saying 0:18:29.760 --> 0:18:31.920 like I'm about to blow a bunch of people up 0:18:31.960 --> 0:18:34.320 and I can't wait to get to the afterlife. And 0:18:34.359 --> 0:18:37.600 I'm like a true UM believer. You're right, I read 0:18:37.640 --> 0:18:41.520 that wrong and um and so that that is it's 0:18:41.560 --> 0:18:44.400 not only inspiring, it's also like, you can't back out 0:18:44.480 --> 0:18:47.320 now you've made your video, like you you this is 0:18:47.359 --> 0:18:49.879 your point of no return. Well, because yeah, that'd be 0:18:50.000 --> 0:18:53.560 probably even more shameful. But I think people, you know, 0:18:53.600 --> 0:18:56.840 that survival instinct is very strong. So there's these people 0:18:56.880 --> 0:18:59.520 that are handling them. Usually one of them will go 0:19:00.080 --> 0:19:04.560 with the suicide bomber to the target area and we'll 0:19:04.600 --> 0:19:10.560 basically keep them encouraged and um on on track and um, 0:19:10.760 --> 0:19:14.040 I imagine will blow them up if they decide that 0:19:14.080 --> 0:19:16.520 they want to back out. Yeah, well, and beyond that, 0:19:16.600 --> 0:19:21.439 sometimes it's planned that way. Sometimes the the assistant is 0:19:22.320 --> 0:19:26.320 has the detonator to prevent any kind of backout. I 0:19:26.359 --> 0:19:30.320 think that there's probably a backup detonator, Yeah you think, yeah, Okay, 0:19:30.600 --> 0:19:34.280 that's my suspicion. So we're talking about the nuts and 0:19:34.280 --> 0:19:35.720 bolts of it all A sudden then let's go ahead. 0:19:35.760 --> 0:19:38.720 And with that you mean the shrapnel. Yeah, suicide bomber, 0:19:38.760 --> 0:19:42.400 it's not a very elaborate, expensive operation that costs about 0:19:42.400 --> 0:19:45.520 a hundred and fifty bucks probably worth of explosives and 0:19:45.720 --> 0:19:48.880 one human life willing to do so. And you've got 0:19:48.880 --> 0:19:51.360 yourself a suicide bomber, whether it's a duffel bag full 0:19:51.400 --> 0:19:55.960 of stuff or something you strap on your chest. Uh. 0:19:56.080 --> 0:19:58.560 Like you said, they've used trucks and boats. Well, deffel 0:19:58.600 --> 0:20:01.240 bags are um apparently out a vogue because you will 0:20:01.240 --> 0:20:03.120 get shot in the head if you look like you 0:20:03.240 --> 0:20:06.639 are dropping remotely Middle Eastern and you have a duffel 0:20:06.640 --> 0:20:09.560 bag at least if you're in London in two thousand 0:20:09.640 --> 0:20:14.080 five in your Brazilian right. Yeah. Um, but you were 0:20:14.119 --> 0:20:18.240 saying this, it's just one person with a duffel bag 0:20:18.400 --> 0:20:24.000 or a vest or a belt. And uh, the the 0:20:24.080 --> 0:20:28.640 attack of um a suicide bomber is threefold, right. One, 0:20:28.720 --> 0:20:32.560 it kills a bunch of people, so it's terroristic. Two, 0:20:32.760 --> 0:20:34.679 it draws a lot of attention to this cause that 0:20:34.880 --> 0:20:38.000 at least one person is willing to die for. And 0:20:38.040 --> 0:20:41.600 then three it's it's a force multiplier because it has 0:20:41.640 --> 0:20:44.240 like a huge effect on morale in the psyche of 0:20:44.280 --> 0:20:47.880 the population. But it can also go the other way. 0:20:48.080 --> 0:20:51.680 Um has pointed out with World War Two, Um, it 0:20:51.760 --> 0:20:54.280 can either Like it's happened both ways in America because 0:20:54.280 --> 0:20:57.560 when two forty one Marines were killed in the truck 0:20:57.600 --> 0:21:03.679 bombing in nineteen eight for UH, President Reagan said in 0:21:03.840 --> 0:21:06.960 his in his memoir that that had a big deal 0:21:07.640 --> 0:21:11.040 with his pulling out of that region. Like he was like, 0:21:11.080 --> 0:21:14.159 now you know what, forget that these people are willing 0:21:14.160 --> 0:21:16.080 to do this. I'm getting my guys out of there. 0:21:16.480 --> 0:21:18.439 Or in the case of World War Two with the Japanese, 0:21:19.240 --> 0:21:21.640 let's drop two bombs on their country that they won't 0:21:21.640 --> 0:21:24.360 be able to recover from because they're willing to fly 0:21:24.440 --> 0:21:27.679 their planes into our aircraft carrier. You know, that's not 0:21:27.680 --> 0:21:30.240 how the Japanese tell it. How they tell They tell 0:21:30.280 --> 0:21:32.399 it like they were starting to make moves that they 0:21:32.440 --> 0:21:35.480 were willing to surrender, and the Americans had so much 0:21:35.520 --> 0:21:39.840 money invested in this research that they basically needed and 0:21:39.880 --> 0:21:43.399 wanted to see what happened. It certainly doesn't surprise me. 0:21:43.400 --> 0:21:45.880 There are two versions of that story. That's the way 0:21:45.920 --> 0:21:52.639 history works. So Chuck, yes, Um, what I guess what 0:21:52.720 --> 0:21:54.800 are these things made up? You said you can fill 0:21:54.800 --> 0:21:57.280 a truck belt all this stuff, what is it? Well, 0:21:57.320 --> 0:22:01.240 it varies, of course between what your resources are. I 0:22:01.280 --> 0:22:04.040 think in the early days they would just re jigger 0:22:04.320 --> 0:22:08.320 land mines and I use those. But now it's everything 0:22:08.320 --> 0:22:12.000 from T and T too, something called t a TP 0:22:12.840 --> 0:22:18.359 triacetone triper oxide and then other plastic explosives stuff. They 0:22:18.400 --> 0:22:20.560 can do a lot of damage. And they found too 0:22:20.600 --> 0:22:25.879 that uh, the more people around the suicide bomber the better. 0:22:26.040 --> 0:22:29.680 Obviously not for those people close in proximity, but if 0:22:29.720 --> 0:22:31.960 you hear that there's a suicide bomber suspect and all 0:22:32.000 --> 0:22:35.399 of a sudden the crowd disperses, it's gonna have a 0:22:35.480 --> 0:22:38.720 blast zone that's much greater and cover a much more 0:22:38.760 --> 0:22:42.520 area because the thick, massive people around that person create 0:22:42.560 --> 0:22:47.480 basically a human shield, which is pretty serious stuff. And uh, 0:22:47.520 --> 0:22:50.360 in London two thousand five, you want to I've talked 0:22:50.359 --> 0:22:53.159 about that. Remember, Oh is that when you meant by 0:22:53.200 --> 0:22:54.480 shot in the head. Yeah, he got shot in the 0:22:54.480 --> 0:22:57.760 head seven times. And he's not a suicide bomber. No, 0:22:57.840 --> 0:23:01.680 he's just some guy from Brazil the staken identity. Yeah, 0:23:01.720 --> 0:23:04.800 that was a pretty jumpy time, if I remember correctly, Yes, 0:23:04.880 --> 0:23:09.840 it was you got anything else? M m oh. I 0:23:09.880 --> 0:23:13.800 thought the very end had a very interesting um. The 0:23:13.920 --> 0:23:18.480 thing that Israeli settlers were trying was they proposed burying 0:23:18.800 --> 0:23:23.680 suicide bombers in pig skin body bags as a way 0:23:23.720 --> 0:23:28.200 of discouraging suicide bombers from because I guess if they think, 0:23:28.200 --> 0:23:30.960 if I'm gonna be buried in pigskin, that's not the 0:23:31.000 --> 0:23:35.240 afterlife that I'm that I'm looking for. But the problem is, 0:23:35.240 --> 0:23:37.159 and Robert does a good job pointing, that's how I 0:23:37.200 --> 0:23:45.640 think when you the suicide bombing is capable of dehumanizing 0:23:45.680 --> 0:23:49.359 on both levels, right, that would have not only um, 0:23:49.400 --> 0:23:55.040 I guess, to dehumanize the suicide bomber, but it dehumanized 0:23:55.080 --> 0:23:59.240 the Israelis Right. So part of the the whole um 0:23:59.240 --> 0:24:03.440 feedback machanism for suicide bombings is that one side doesn't 0:24:03.440 --> 0:24:06.359 see the other's human any longer. Right, you're willing to 0:24:06.400 --> 0:24:10.200 die for your cause, so you're crazy or um, you 0:24:10.240 --> 0:24:13.639 are worth dying to kill because I don't see you 0:24:13.680 --> 0:24:17.000 as a person any longer, and so that that would 0:24:17.000 --> 0:24:20.800 have been counterproductive. I'm sure, good job. This is a 0:24:20.800 --> 0:24:25.080 tough one. Yeah it was. I'm glad we got through it. Man. Okay, yeah, 0:24:25.560 --> 0:24:28.480 it's a tough topic. I hope we explained like how 0:24:28.480 --> 0:24:32.040 it works in the history and was it good? Maybe 0:24:32.080 --> 0:24:34.520