Speaker 1: Welcome to Checking In with Michelle Williams, a production of
Speaker 1: iHeartRadio and The Black Effect. Have you or someone in
Speaker 1: your life been troubled or struggled with addiction. Have you
Speaker 1: or someone in your life possibly overcome addiction, especially addiction
Speaker 1: that runs in the family, generational trauma and addiction. Well,
Speaker 1: I'm so excited about my next guest, who has gone
Speaker 1: through it all, who has recovered and is thriving. She's
Speaker 1: just not surviving, but she is thriving. And I'm excited
Speaker 1: to welcome award winning filmmaker and the actual person whose
Speaker 1: story was being told. They are joining me right now,
Speaker 1: so stick around. You don't want to miss this. I
Speaker 1: really believe you'll be inspired. Hey, everybody, my next two guests.
Speaker 1: They are a part of an award winning documentary called Jacenta, y'all.
Speaker 1: And I don't even have like that professional rundown of
Speaker 1: our guests is because I saw it. So I get
Speaker 1: to speak to my heart of two amazing people. Jessica
Speaker 1: Earnshaw captured the true journey practically in real time, not
Speaker 1: practically in real time of just sent to hunt. It
Speaker 1: is so vulnerable, y'all have probably heard this before. Super
Speaker 1: raw on Hulu and I had to reach out to them.
Speaker 1: It was probably weird, corny stalker Sandy. I would call
Speaker 1: myself just to thank them for showing this real life journey.
Speaker 1: I don't even want to make a call it a
Speaker 1: story because it's someone's journey. So y'all, please welcome to
Speaker 1: checking in Jessica Earnshaw and just sent to Hunt.
Speaker 2: Thank you, yeah, thank you.
Speaker 1: How y'all doing it good?
Speaker 3: Good good. I'm doing well. I have a good job
Speaker 3: and I'm healthy, so I'm grateful, blessed.
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, so were y'all expecting this to be received
Speaker 1: in the way it has Jessica, the award waning, the
Speaker 1: attention and then the press and what were your thoughts?
Speaker 2: I wasn't sure really what to expect. I mean, I
Speaker 2: was just happy it got on to Hulu, and I
Speaker 2: wasn't expecting it to become a Hulu original. I was
Speaker 2: just blown away by the reception really, I mean, so
Speaker 2: many people seem to have seen it, people really connected
Speaker 2: to Jacinta. I just yeah, it was definitely like I
Speaker 2: really wasn't sure what to expect, so it really was
Speaker 2: beyond my dreams for it.
Speaker 1: Just said to seeing that this is a film about
Speaker 1: it's your story, but when people watch it, they'll realize, oh,
Speaker 1: this is generational, the generational effects of drug abuse. Tell
Speaker 1: me what was going on through your mind? How were
Speaker 1: you approached? Were you like, wait a minute, what the world?
Speaker 3: So I was approached by Jessica in the prison. She
Speaker 3: had met my mom, and my mom told that I
Speaker 3: was in the pods and a little bit about our story.
Speaker 3: At first, it was kind of just pitched as a
Speaker 3: photo essay, going to be something short quick. Then upon release,
Speaker 3: Jessica was like, hey, how about we extend this just
Speaker 3: a little bit further, and then a little bit further.
Speaker 3: It was a couple of years and going through the
Speaker 3: filming process, I you know, thank god that I was
Speaker 3: really unconscious to a lot of it, so I was
Speaker 3: able to be organic and show the truth about the
Speaker 3: struggles and not think too much about in the future
Speaker 3: was society going to judge me? And hindsight, I have
Speaker 3: been able to see people who have had some very
Speaker 3: harsh realities and feelings towards addiction, and people in recovery
Speaker 3: that have opened their hearts and minds to understanding that,
Speaker 3: you know, we are humans and our problem is an addiction.
Speaker 3: It's a symptom from something deeper, and just being able
Speaker 3: to express that on a daily basis to people has
Speaker 3: been the biggest blessing from this film.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Jessica, I think when we were talking a few
Speaker 1: weeks ago, I don't just sent to you or not,
Speaker 1: but I was just saying I was like, Jessica, thank
Speaker 1: you for caring for just Sinta in her family's hearts
Speaker 1: and their souls. Certain documentaries you can see I'm like,
Speaker 1: this is exploited, but there was something that pulls you
Speaker 1: in and makes it was making you root forever. Everybody
Speaker 1: even just sent to I'm even I got involved in
Speaker 1: your daughter as far as her life. She's a grown
Speaker 1: woman practically now right. Yeah, well, oh okay, so she
Speaker 1: thinks she grown.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I know how I.
Speaker 1: Was when I was seventeen. You couldn't tell me nothing,
Speaker 1: you know, and tell my mom would yank me back
Speaker 1: into reality a time or two. And this was like
Speaker 1: you said, y'all, y'all, this this journey was filmed over
Speaker 1: three years, and once you see the documentary, you were like,
Speaker 1: wait a minute, it's keep going. And then you'll see
Speaker 1: one year later, two years later, three years later, and
Speaker 1: you will see the progression and you know you're rooting
Speaker 1: for Jacinta's family, her father, her mother, you know, everybody.
Speaker 1: You're just like because abuse not only terrors the person
Speaker 1: apart that's you know, addicted, but it does so much
Speaker 1: damage to the family and people that are you know,
Speaker 1: how is the family just into.
Speaker 3: Great Kaitlyn, I'm gonna start with the best is a
Speaker 3: senior and just had beautiful and your pictures taken. I
Speaker 3: have to really just you know, I'll give her a
Speaker 3: shout out because she has completely changed life for me
Speaker 3: and herself. She has struggled through school and overcomes some
Speaker 3: like really tough times as a child and as an
Speaker 3: individual that had no mom or dad to go to
Speaker 3: dances or pta meetings. She's working and going to school.
Speaker 3: So Kilan's doing amazing. My dad works, that's his wife. Yeah,
Speaker 3: my mom's doing good. She's she's sober, she's been sober
Speaker 3: for two years. She's been married and has a beautiful home.
Speaker 1: Yeah, go ahead, I love that for mom. Okay, thank you.
Speaker 1: Did she ask your permission before she got married?
Speaker 3: Kind of?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah? Yeah, And I noticed your daughter at the
Speaker 1: age that what age was she when it was being.
Speaker 3: Filmed like eleven and younger.
Speaker 2: I think we actually started at nine. Yeah, we went
Speaker 2: she just turned ten, and we went till almost fourteen.
Speaker 1: Okay. How she was able to articulate her me back then,
Speaker 1: I'm just now learning she connects so much in her
Speaker 1: How she was able to articulate things was so sound,
Speaker 1: very mature. Yeah, you know, and I'm thankful. I'm sure
Speaker 1: you are too, that she was able to at such
Speaker 1: a young age say how she felt.
Speaker 3: Absolutely, and you know, a lot of what Kailan was
Speaker 3: fed to me, fed to Kailin about me was positive.
Speaker 3: So granted, she did give me the benefit of the
Speaker 3: dob and loved me unconditionally. John and Wanda absolutely they
Speaker 3: were a blessing because they just they would explain to
Speaker 3: Kuilan that you know, your mom's not making these races.
Speaker 3: She is a good mom. It's gonna take time, but
Speaker 3: she'll come out of it. So they instilled hope and
Speaker 3: strength and good positive pictures of me.
Speaker 1: So h, that's so good. That's that's truly truly a blessing. Jessica,
Speaker 1: why did you pick your sinta? How did you even.
Speaker 2: But how did this even come about? It?
Speaker 1: Yes?
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I was actually in the prison they were
Speaker 2: incarcerated in working on a totally different project on aging
Speaker 2: in prison, which is a photo essay. And I met
Speaker 2: Rosemary first, just sent his mom through my elderly subject
Speaker 2: and I just spent a lot of time with Rosemary,
Speaker 2: not even filming her, just hanging out with her because
Speaker 2: I was there for like these long, full days. And
Speaker 2: then she told me, but Jasenta, I was thinking originally
Speaker 2: of doing like a photo essay on just these women
Speaker 2: who were incarcerated for these long sentences. I kept here
Speaker 2: stories of this like horrific childhoods and then drug use,
Speaker 2: and I was like, well, it makes sense to me
Speaker 2: that someone would get addicted to drugs when they've had
Speaker 2: such an awful start, you know. So I was going
Speaker 2: to do this feto essay. I asked Jasanta if she
Speaker 2: would do an interview with me with her mother, and
Speaker 2: I was it was just mainly just for captions for
Speaker 2: my photos, and I did it for whatever reason, on video,
Speaker 2: and I had been doing them all just recordings, just
Speaker 2: on like without video before that, so it was just
Speaker 2: kind of a random accident and I just was blown
Speaker 2: away by them. I just knew right away there was
Speaker 2: something just really special. Jasina was finishing her mom's sentences,
Speaker 2: and like, I felt this kind of responsibility that Jacenta
Speaker 2: had in her, like the way that Jasenta like looked
Speaker 2: at her mom, And I was just so curious to understand,
Speaker 2: like how did you send to end up following in
Speaker 2: her mother's footsteps? How did she end up there in
Speaker 2: the prison? And there I knew there was a history
Speaker 2: of it because Rosemary's father had actually been in the
Speaker 2: same prison, So I was like, how does this cycle
Speaker 2: just continue? But really it was just sent to Rosemary
Speaker 2: and specifically Jacenta. I mean, Jasenta's so smart, you know,
Speaker 2: she was Kaylen before she was an adult, you know,
Speaker 2: and I think I just like and when I met Caylen,
Speaker 2: I was like, wow, Like I bet I'm looking into
Speaker 2: the past on Dissenta because of how articulate and smart
Speaker 2: Kaylen is. But yeah, I just kind of fell in
Speaker 2: love with them.
Speaker 3: And that's why I.
Speaker 2: Kept asking Jasena to extend the photo essay into a
Speaker 2: short film into a film, because I just like, I
Speaker 2: had no interest really prior to that on doing a
Speaker 2: film on addiction specifically. It was more of generational trauma
Speaker 2: and how can we pass forward and I just fell
Speaker 2: in love with them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we all are learning and you know, just
Speaker 1: send Um wanted to know too, through counseling and therapy.
Speaker 1: Did you know that trauma can be passed down generation
Speaker 1: to generation.
Speaker 3: I didn't know the extent of it. So they always say,
Speaker 3: I want to say, they always say, and poor families
Speaker 3: like you have to do better or don't drink because
Speaker 3: this pri instead. So I more or less thought it
Speaker 3: was like one of the things they say to kids
Speaker 3: to you know, steer them from trouble. I didn't realize
Speaker 3: that my brain and my nervous system and everything else
Speaker 3: was you know, constructed differently, and the way I would
Speaker 3: react to things and the effects that drugs and alcohol
Speaker 3: would have on me. I had no idea that it
Speaker 3: was going to be a lifetime thing. I thought it
Speaker 3: was just a matter of choices and it was going
Speaker 3: to be fine.
Speaker 1: Honestly, So are you saying you are predisposed?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah yeah. Tell our listeners when you say you're predisposed,
Speaker 1: meaning so, does that mean I've heard it? But does
Speaker 1: that mean if you were to just casual do something
Speaker 1: that would start an addiction? Or was pain a part
Speaker 1: of it?
Speaker 3: So I honestly, I like to say that I was
Speaker 3: predisposed to trauma because that was the first cycle that
Speaker 3: came down was you know, the neglect, the abuse, the
Speaker 3: using while pregnant, So I, you know, I already had
Speaker 3: those things, and then you adding the component of addiction
Speaker 3: and the access to drugs. It just came together as
Speaker 3: a mixture that wasn't healthy. But I don't want people
Speaker 3: to think that if their parents are addicts or their
Speaker 3: grandparents are addicts, that they have to think that anything
Speaker 3: they do is either gonna you know, I'm going to
Speaker 3: be a drug adictor there's ways of preparing yourself and
Speaker 3: understanding what it is that caused that addiction in your family.
Speaker 3: And once you're able to identify those since you now
Speaker 3: know the things that you need to work on within yourself,
Speaker 3: so much like domestic violence and other things that passed down,
Speaker 3: if you make yourself aware of what the root of
Speaker 3: that is, you're able to you know, conquer the storm
Speaker 3: before it even comes.
Speaker 1: Come on, come on.
Speaker 2: Just sent it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just want to say it. By the way,
Speaker 1: thank you for agreeing to do this interview with Checking In.
Speaker 1: And you know, I know everybody can have lots of questions,
Speaker 1: lots of wondering and thank you for just being open.
Speaker 1: Have you watched have you watched the documentary? Yes, I
Speaker 1: mean you know you lived it.
Speaker 3: I think I've watched it one time since it's been
Speaker 3: on Hulu, but I've watched it many of film festivals.
Speaker 3: So we also.
Speaker 2: Watched it a few times in prison. We had a
Speaker 2: couple of pets of parties where just sent us oute
Speaker 2: the film right before we lock picture on it, and
Speaker 2: then we watched it what three or four more times?
Speaker 3: A few yeah?
Speaker 1: Wow, yeah, yeah, I just sent to tell me what
Speaker 1: was going on with the first time you watched it?
Speaker 1: Were you like when eye open when I closed?
Speaker 3: Very much so? And just a lot of things, you know,
Speaker 3: I'm gonna say right off, like, the one thing I'm
Speaker 3: most grateful for in my recovery is a that I
Speaker 3: already had a relationship the Lord before I got sober.
Speaker 3: So B my recovery has been able to be like
Speaker 3: inclusive of like all of my feelings and not focus
Speaker 3: solely on my addiction. I'm able to recovery from, you know,
Speaker 3: being poor. I'm able to recover from being addicted to
Speaker 3: sex trafficking and drugs and wrong people, codependency, so now
Speaker 3: learning all of these things about myself and getting to
Speaker 3: know myself. I was looking at it like, why did
Speaker 3: I Why did I talk like that? Why did why
Speaker 3: did I drive like that?
Speaker 1: There were moments where I'm like, okay, when you say
Speaker 1: you felt like you were unconscious a lot in the film,
Speaker 1: I can't understand due to being, you know, at the moment,
Speaker 1: physically still using you know, and driving to the destination
Speaker 1: just since I promise you. It literally was like I
Speaker 1: could have been watching myself. That's how much you allowed
Speaker 1: Jessica in the way it was filmed, the way it everybody,
Speaker 1: when you watch this film, think of it will make you.
Speaker 1: I've had family members that are in recovery and they
Speaker 1: probably most of the time family members will isolate. They're
Speaker 1: not gonna let you in. They will come out to
Speaker 1: a family gathering when they've all got their makeup on
Speaker 1: or their best outfit. But you let us in when
Speaker 1: it wasn't all that. And I was like, just just
Speaker 1: sent to know how gored she is, thank you, how
Speaker 1: beautiful she is, and I pray I know that you
Speaker 1: have broken the cycle of that trauma and addiction and Jessica,
Speaker 1: you were used as a vessel. Whether you knew it
Speaker 1: or not. I don't know what the end goal was,
Speaker 1: But do Jessica, did you think the end goal would
Speaker 1: be You're gonna be used to help Jacinta and her
Speaker 1: family overcome.
Speaker 2: I don't know. I mean I hoped, And I actually
Speaker 2: said this to Jacenta kind of recently. We were talking
Speaker 2: about did we think this was going to be what
Speaker 2: it became? And I remember feeling like, oh, man, I
Speaker 2: hope Jacenta takes whatever this is and can use it
Speaker 2: to build it into something bigger. And Shasanad even said
Speaker 2: that at one point very early on in prison, and
Speaker 2: I have this old interview with her that I found
Speaker 2: or Jacenta said maybe I can use this to build
Speaker 2: it into something bigger. But I wasn't sure because of
Speaker 2: the level of addiction what it would take for her
Speaker 2: to get beyond that, and so I wasn't sure it
Speaker 2: would be possible or not, because I didn't feel at
Speaker 2: a certain point like there was much of a choice
Speaker 2: in the way Jacinta was using it all like it
Speaker 2: it really hijacked her. But I am I feel like
Speaker 2: that's the biggest success for me in the film is
Speaker 2: just Ja sent To using it the way she did?
Speaker 2: And I do so much of this. I know how
Speaker 2: hard it was for Jasenta to come out of prison
Speaker 2: in twenty twenty and get to where she is now.
Speaker 2: And although I'm sure the film was helpful in some
Speaker 2: opportunities or people or whatever, but I know that that
Speaker 2: was all her because she would not have if she
Speaker 2: didn't want it like she did, and she didn't work
Speaker 2: as hard as she did to get there, it just
Speaker 2: wouldn't have been possible. So yeah, but I'm yeah, I'm
Speaker 2: very It's the biggest reward in this film is seeing
Speaker 2: just sent In killing today and just you know, yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah. We are talking to Jacinta Hunt and Jessica Earnshaw
Speaker 1: of the documentary called Just Sent To Where Jessica in
Speaker 1: twenty twenty one Documentary Director award the Best New Documentary
Speaker 1: Director Award from the Tribeca Festival in twenty twenty Jessica,
Speaker 1: did you ever feel like at what point you were
Speaker 1: being too invasive?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Well, I don't know, I mean I was there
Speaker 2: were moments I was like, oh God, like this is
Speaker 2: a hard moment to be in. But I tried the
Speaker 2: way I dealt with it. Is I just this is
Speaker 2: gonna sound crazy. I just filmed literally everything, Yes, And
Speaker 2: I didn't ever make the choice to pick that camera
Speaker 2: up and turn it on. I just filmed everything, because
Speaker 2: every time I did turn the camera off and turn
Speaker 2: it on, that's when I felt invasive, because then I
Speaker 2: was making this choice to film this thing that was uncomfortable.
Speaker 2: But if I filmed everything, I kind of I was like,
Speaker 2: I'm bearing witness to this and it Ja Senta had
Speaker 2: me around so much that it was kind of like
Speaker 2: I'd seen everything when moments had happened that were more private.
Speaker 2: But I also kind of felt that, and I said
Speaker 2: this to Jacenta also during the filming, is that although
Speaker 2: I was filming all this stuff, I knew I was
Speaker 2: going to be responsible in the edit with what I
Speaker 2: included in the film, and I always retained full control.
Speaker 2: We never I never got sold this film before we
Speaker 2: were done. We always we were trying to find grants
Speaker 2: for it. I partnered with Impact Partners, which allowed me
Speaker 2: to keep final cut on the film so I could
Speaker 2: make those promises the Jacenta and and keep being able
Speaker 2: to keep those promises. You know, So even when I
Speaker 2: was filming the really invasive and stuff. Probably it I
Speaker 2: knew it was gonna I was going to keep.
Speaker 1: That promise to her.
Speaker 2: But also Jasanta, I don't think she ever. You never
Speaker 2: told me to turn that camera.
Speaker 1: I was going to say that once. Did you see
Speaker 1: the face palm of the you know, the hand palm
Speaker 1: into the camera like turn up?
Speaker 2: Well, actually it's in the film. The only time she
Speaker 2: actually asked me to turn it off was right when
Speaker 2: we were on our way for her to use that
Speaker 2: first time where she said you better put the camera down.
Speaker 1: Mm hmmmmmmm. But that was the only time, the only time.
Speaker 1: But it wasn't like often to where it's like, well,
Speaker 1: why did you even agree to film if it's always
Speaker 1: going to be you know, turn the camera just sent
Speaker 1: to you nodded your head yes for you. How did
Speaker 1: it feel invasive on from your perspective? Well, one time,
Speaker 1: by the way, wait a minute, it's film now. You gotta
Speaker 1: won and awards, so you can tell how you really
Speaker 1: feel yourself.
Speaker 3: Well, one time she just asking to put a GPS
Speaker 3: on my car and I absolutely said no. It was
Speaker 3: all let me journalists.
Speaker 2: Well, partly it was because Jasenta would be like, meet
Speaker 2: me at Applebee's at two and I'm like okay. So
Speaker 2: I get there too, and four rolls around and I'm like,
Speaker 2: where are used? And she's like, I want to be
Speaker 2: there in ten minutes, And every ten minutes it was like,
Speaker 2: ok there in ten minutes. So I was like, I
Speaker 2: need to know where you are so I can just
Speaker 2: come to you.
Speaker 1: Now, Jessica, with that being said, did you turn into
Speaker 1: Mama Bear? I got to be like, I know Jacenta
Speaker 1: is allowing us to film her, but we got to
Speaker 1: keep her safe. Well.
Speaker 2: I learned how to use narcane in filming because I
Speaker 2: was worried that Jasenta would overdose with me there. So
Speaker 2: that was something I don't know. Do you remember me
Speaker 2: I was talking about that. I can't. I'm not sure
Speaker 2: if you would remember this just had it, but we
Speaker 2: did talk. I did say I was going to call
Speaker 2: nine one one if you were also if you ever
Speaker 2: if anything happened, and I remember just sent to telling
Speaker 2: me don't you dare one if I and I was like,
Speaker 2: so that was the main thing. It was that, I
Speaker 2: don't know, do you I'm not exactly sure.
Speaker 3: I remember the first time I used in the film
Speaker 3: the same time I said, put the camera down. She
Speaker 3: put it down for like five minutes to go back upstairs,
Speaker 3: and she's like behind the camera and she's like, you
Speaker 3: don't have to do this, you don't have to do this.
Speaker 1: And it helped.
Speaker 3: Because, you know, it really did make me think about
Speaker 3: my thoughts. But the reality of it is is I
Speaker 3: was ready to get my life together. I just didn't
Speaker 3: have anybody to walk me through the process. And every
Speaker 3: time I turned to somebody, it was always there was
Speaker 3: always an ulterior motive or I owed them something. And
Speaker 3: Jessica was really the first person that showed up good
Speaker 3: or bad and never asked me for money, never asked me,
Speaker 3: you know, anything more than questions, you know, and that
Speaker 3: meant a lot to me.
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2: A lot of the filming was there was this kind
Speaker 2: of like interesting like process of like coming to terms
Speaker 2: with each stage of Jacenta's journey. So at the beginning,
Speaker 2: it was supposed to be a film about recovery Jacenta
Speaker 2: going into the sober house.
Speaker 3: It was going to be a short film.
Speaker 2: And then when she used which I actually hadn't expected
Speaker 2: to be around for because I thought it was going
Speaker 2: to be more of like a couple of weeks, a
Speaker 2: couple months. Then it was just kind of like this.
Speaker 2: It was like this really hard balance of like friend
Speaker 2: filmmaker because sent and I had spent a lot of
Speaker 2: time together, and then it was just kind of like
Speaker 2: trying to balance those roles and like also really not
Speaker 2: wanting her to use and like talking like I would
Speaker 2: film everything like hold the I had a little camera,
Speaker 2: I just hold it like this. But I would constantly
Speaker 2: be like trying to convince her not to use, and
Speaker 2: it just it showed me too, like how Jasent to.
Speaker 2: We went through this whole period of time of like
Speaker 2: negotiation almost where I would be like, please don't use,
Speaker 2: call Nancy, blah blah blah. Jasenta would inevitably use. And
Speaker 2: then I felt this kind of and I'm not sure
Speaker 2: if you remember this, Jacenta, but I felt this kind
Speaker 2: of like Jacenta was like it felt like she was
Speaker 2: not wanting to disappoint me. At a certain point, like
Speaker 2: she started saying that she's fine, I'm not using, I'm
Speaker 2: not using, but I knew she was, and I felt like, Okay,
Speaker 2: it's not my job to judge her. It's my job
Speaker 2: to bear witness to her. You know, and wherever we
Speaker 2: are in the journey, even though I want her to
Speaker 2: not use that's not where she's at. So we did
Speaker 2: have a conversation. It's at some point to be like, Okay,
Speaker 2: well you're not in recovery now, let's just kind of
Speaker 2: see where this goes from this point. And then I stopped.
Speaker 2: I made a conscious effort to be like, Okay, I'm
Speaker 2: here to help you find a bed if you want it,
Speaker 2: but I'm no longer gonna this is what I kind
Speaker 2: of told myself, like I'm not gonna like ask her
Speaker 2: and try to convince her to do something, because I
Speaker 2: felt like it was just kind of like I like,
Speaker 2: I don't know what the word is. I'm like kind
Speaker 2: of like making her feel like I'm letting her, she's
Speaker 2: letting me down, and that was not the intention. And
Speaker 2: I'm a visitor in her life, so but yeah, it
Speaker 2: was it was hard to know really where it was
Speaker 2: going for a long time because it was like a
Speaker 2: kind of a huge blessing that she got arrested at
Speaker 2: that point, because I didn't know if it was going
Speaker 2: to be arrest or something worse, and I was I'm
Speaker 2: so glad that she was arrested at the particular point
Speaker 2: that she was at.
Speaker 1: Then, yeah, descend to you are doing remarkable well. Now
Speaker 1: you are a substance abuse counselor, as I see here
Speaker 1: on our discussion it says peer recovery coach manager. Yeah,
Speaker 1: in May in Maine. And I'm watching you as Jessica
Speaker 1: is talking, and I'm wondering, if you don't mind me
Speaker 1: asking you, how does it feel for you to have
Speaker 1: to hear stuff from the past when you are helping
Speaker 1: people recover from their past.
Speaker 3: Honestly, Michelle, I am so at peace with my journey
Speaker 3: and what has happened to me that I'm able to,
Speaker 3: you know, let go on like God. I don't have
Speaker 3: to hold on to those things. If I speak about
Speaker 3: them or hear about them, I hope it has a
Speaker 3: greater cost of the universe. But a lot of my
Speaker 3: focus is on what I did after my addiction and
Speaker 3: the work I did on myself, and it was more
Speaker 3: than just doing the twelve Steps. I didn't choose to
Speaker 3: do the aa NA program. I went faith based, so
Speaker 3: I met a church family and I had a peer
Speaker 3: recovery coach that walked me through the twelve steps on
Speaker 3: a faith based level, and God bless my grandmother. She
Speaker 3: instilled some really amazing faith in me. And I like
Speaker 3: to focus my life on when my addiction stopped and
Speaker 3: I am. You know, I can honestly say that I'm
Speaker 3: I'm an amazing person and if I got to live
Speaker 3: my life over again, I wouldn't change it. I would
Speaker 3: absolutely I love my journey. And I can appreciate my
Speaker 3: mom for being beautiful and amazing and doing the best
Speaker 3: she could, and my father for being an honest man
Speaker 3: and going to work. And I can appreciate the Lord
Speaker 3: and the fact that I was given a different destiny
Speaker 3: than you know, the rest of us.
Speaker 1: Ye yes, yes, yes yes. And almost reading something where
Speaker 1: how it says you locked into the promotion and the community,
Speaker 1: Yeah you were getting from doing this film. Great things happened. Yes.
Speaker 3: So let me tell you a little bit about my job,
Speaker 3: because it's amazing. So it says on here that I'm
Speaker 3: the Peeriacovery Coach Manager. I work at Hometown Health at Newport, Maine,
Speaker 3: and we're a federally qualified health center, which means we
Speaker 3: turn away nobody, which is my favorite part about it.
Speaker 3: We have a really amazing behavioral health team, a recovery team.
Speaker 3: And I'm not sure if you're familiar with this wil
Speaker 3: Farms out of Nashville, but we have been working with
Speaker 3: this will Farm. So I have since coming on to
Speaker 3: Hometown Health as a peer recovery coach manager, I've been
Speaker 3: able to implement a program that is all inclusive, a
Speaker 3: behavioral health group, meetings based m at whatever it is
Speaker 3: that you choose to do. You meet with a pure
Speaker 3: recovery coach. We do case management for you. We also
Speaker 3: are building a residential facility to welcome five women. The facility,
Speaker 3: the women pay no rent. You live there for two years.
Speaker 3: It's a long term facility, will help you with your
Speaker 3: kids school education. We offer employment the day you come in.
Speaker 3: So it's super, super, super amazing. And I just got
Speaker 3: a promotion. So as of November, this will be the
Speaker 3: director of residential services. Just saying, so come on, mm hmm.
Speaker 3: And my boss, thank god, she's amazing. She has had
Speaker 3: she's been personally affected by addiction and it has you know,
Speaker 3: ignited a passion in her and the two of us
Speaker 3: together have just been an amazing team.
Speaker 1: Wow. Can I say you found love too? You don't
Speaker 1: have to go into us. You found love, which is great, y'all.
Speaker 1: She is about to be promoted in November as a
Speaker 1: did y'all hear her say? What all that they're doing?
Speaker 1: And this has happened in three years since you've been
Speaker 1: out and in recovery, would you still say you are
Speaker 1: still in recovery? It's still a journey.
Speaker 3: Yeah, still a journey, always going to be. I just
Speaker 3: I have coping mechanicisms. Now I don't need you know,
Speaker 3: going to drugs isn't my first thought anymore.
Speaker 1: Did you ever think when back in that time, say
Speaker 1: in twenty eighteen, would you ever think I'm going to
Speaker 1: be a director five years from now?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: You saw this, I don't think.
Speaker 3: I mean, you can ask Jessica. Through all of it,
Speaker 3: I nothing made sense to me. I know, I keep
Speaker 3: refacing the Lord. But I have always been like, why
Speaker 3: don't I fit in right? So people I would use
Speaker 3: with be like you're too smart to hang out, Like
Speaker 3: what are you doing? Like you should go do something different?
Speaker 3: And then when I went and hung out with smart people,
Speaker 3: I was in the bathroom using and didn't really fit
Speaker 3: in either. But the entire time I always knew, like,
Speaker 3: God's not going to do this to me like, I'm
Speaker 3: not going to be left here. This isn't going to
Speaker 3: be the end of my story. And if it is,
Speaker 3: then it was meant to be for a greater reason.
Speaker 3: You know, maybe it's saved Kaylin or somebody else. But
Speaker 3: I have believed in myself through and through, regardless if
Speaker 3: I was strung out when heroines sitting in prison, There's
Speaker 3: never been a moment that I didn't think that, you know,
Speaker 3: my life wasn't going to be used for a greater cause.
Speaker 3: My grandmother says to me, or said to make God
Speaker 3: bless her. May not be painless, may not be quick,
Speaker 3: but may God use all messes for good. And I
Speaker 3: can just remember repeating that, repeating that, and like having
Speaker 3: no other choice but to believe in it. And I
Speaker 3: did and until it worked out. And now I you know,
Speaker 3: I believe in my power to help other people. I
Speaker 3: believe in my hopes and dreams. I you know, I'm
Speaker 3: just a very honest person and I live humble. And
Speaker 3: when you go from nothing and on conversations from prison,
Speaker 3: people be like, oh, you know, they're setting bets on
Speaker 3: how long it's going to be before you use again.
Speaker 3: I was a different kind of person, because those things
Speaker 3: didn't ever make me think less of myself. The things
Speaker 3: I've been through, I didn't shame myself. I don't feel
Speaker 3: dirty dirty excuse me? And so yes, you know, short
Speaker 3: answer is I absolutely always believe that what I was
Speaker 3: going through, I was going to make it through, and
Speaker 3: whatever was on the other side was going to be better.
Speaker 3: This is much more than I ever thought it would be.
Speaker 3: But I love my life and I'm too grateful to
Speaker 3: be alive even in the worst conditions to sound myself
Speaker 3: short and believe that, you know, God was going to
Speaker 3: just let me be an attict for the rest of
Speaker 3: my life. I have brains, I have a beautiful child
Speaker 3: and smart, I have goals, and I just always knew
Speaker 3: that was it was there for a reason.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm, Jessica, you're smiling and nod exist you're about
Speaker 1: to say, preach girl, Yes, honey, yes, yes, yeah. Did
Speaker 1: you see and notice the spark and the fight that
Speaker 1: just sent to oh is displaying for sure.
Speaker 2: And I always felt like the spark in the fight
Speaker 2: which she could come out of this, she was going
Speaker 2: to be so successful because she was so good at
Speaker 2: getting you know, I mean, in her life like sprouted
Speaker 2: like getting things that she needed in order to survive.
Speaker 2: And I was like, she's going to be If she
Speaker 2: can turn this around to be a different way, it's
Speaker 2: going to be even bigger. But yeah, the spark for sure.
Speaker 2: And even when we first met, I mean, she was like, Okay, yeah,
Speaker 2: I'll let you do this film, but I have to
Speaker 2: meet Ellen DeGeneres, like as soon as this.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I want everybody. I need Oprah,
Speaker 1: I need the view I need I need everybody to
Speaker 1: see this and do y'all mind if I ask about reform,
Speaker 1: y'all have shared such good positive information. Just sent to
Speaker 1: you are in Maine, yes, the state of Maine, Jessica,
Speaker 1: you are in New York. Just sin to what are
Speaker 1: your thoughts of reform and recovery in the system.
Speaker 3: I feel like Department of Corrections is trying. I think
Speaker 3: there's a lot of work to be done. There's a
Speaker 3: lot of confusion with transgender populations and things like that.
Speaker 3: So as someone of the gay community, I have been
Speaker 3: focusing on and kind of like gender focus, drama and
Speaker 3: form care. I for the past year and a half
Speaker 3: have been going into the prison and training the probation
Speaker 3: officers as well as the correctional officers on motivational interviewing
Speaker 3: honestly like common basic respect, how to approach a woman,
Speaker 3: why a woman reacts differently, And I hope that those
Speaker 3: efforts are rolling out within the walls. But I also
Speaker 3: have a very kind individual, special individual to me incarcerated
Speaker 3: and I was just able to convince my boss, who
Speaker 3: is amazing, to hire them as an executive assistant in
Speaker 3: our organization remotely, so she will be the first female
Speaker 3: to be working for an outside organization and in a
Speaker 3: management level position. She gets normal salary, normal benefits, PTO time.
Speaker 3: She's also because she's incarcerated, is able to cash out
Speaker 3: on our PTO so Christmas she can now have Christmas
Speaker 3: and send gifts home home and provide for her family
Speaker 3: while being in there. And she was my first peer
Speaker 3: coach when I was eighteen when I first went to
Speaker 3: the prison, and never lost contact with me, never stopped calling.
Speaker 3: And I've always said, you know, I'm coming back from
Speaker 3: Miss Darlene, and I might not be able to get
Speaker 3: her out, although we are working on a clemency act
Speaker 3: for her as well. I get to, you know, expose
Speaker 3: people to her and what she's worth and all that
Speaker 3: she has to offer us and organization and community. It's crazy, right,
Speaker 3: these people they commit crimes and their sentence to this time,
Speaker 3: their sentence is being in those walls, is being secluded
Speaker 3: from their family. Their sentence wasn't to be to not
Speaker 3: have a higher education, to not have access to gainful employment,
Speaker 3: to have their records, you know, blackmail them for the
Speaker 3: rest of their lives. And so when reform comes, that's
Speaker 3: kind of where I'm at. I'm trying to, you know,
Speaker 3: drive the bus and let other people see like, hey,
Speaker 3: you know, we're a huge hospital and we appreciate this
Speaker 3: woman and she can provide for us and hopefully build
Speaker 3: that because the gaps and employment and services resources. That's
Speaker 3: kind of more where the efforts need to be, you know,
Speaker 3: being a channeled.
Speaker 1: Let me find that you're gonna run for mayor or something.
Speaker 1: Oh hey, let me find out she's going to be
Speaker 1: the older woman or something. Have y'all been to Capitol
Speaker 1: HILLIAT in Washington, d C. I was gonna say, had
Speaker 1: job been Yes? Yes, okay, awesome, awesome, awesome. Jessica, what
Speaker 1: were your thoughts? Did you have anything you wanted to add?
Speaker 1: You are You're just like a proud mama, like a
Speaker 1: proud or a big sister.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm so happy to be on this call to
Speaker 2: still even like listen to the conversation between you guys. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm just excited that we have a pretty
Speaker 2: strong social impact campaign with the film. So we've been
Speaker 2: sending sending it out to universities. A lot of universities,
Speaker 2: have you are now using it their libraries to teach
Speaker 2: different wide range of courses. I mean, we had a
Speaker 2: screening early on with Harvard Women's Law, which was really fun.
Speaker 2: We have a training guide with the film so people
Speaker 2: can license the film for educational purposes, and we have
Speaker 2: a training guide that was put together by judges and
Speaker 2: various people working together to kind of use the film
Speaker 2: to highlight different issues. Yeah. So I'm just glad that
Speaker 2: people are using it for those for those things, and
Speaker 2: also that Jacenta is such a huge part of that.
Speaker 2: So oftentimes people universities or organizations, like we did an
Speaker 2: event in Bishop, California where Jenta and Kalen both came
Speaker 2: and they were part of a panel and conversation with
Speaker 2: their organization after they saw the film. So it's very
Speaker 2: cool to have just sent to, like travel around talking
Speaker 2: with the film and kind of spreading her message because
Speaker 2: this campaign that we have is all designed behind which
Speaker 2: center was most important to Jacenta.
Speaker 1: Okay, Okay, yeah, Wow. I've heard scripture that says, you know,
Speaker 1: God will make your name great, or your gift will
Speaker 1: make room for you, but not thinking the process, not
Speaker 1: knowing it's gonna take a lot of pain for my
Speaker 1: name to be great. Yes, my gifts will make room
Speaker 1: for me, but not knowing that I will find purpose
Speaker 1: in my pain or I'll I will unearth some giftings
Speaker 1: that will ultimately it says your gifts will make room
Speaker 1: for you and bring you before great men. And thank
Speaker 1: you for even saying just into that you wouldn't change.
Speaker 1: There's nothing you would change about your journey. And I'm
Speaker 1: thankful that just intil you said yes to allowing Jessica
Speaker 1: Earn and Shaw and her team capture your story. It
Speaker 1: is amazing. It was inspirational. If you don't have empathy,
Speaker 1: you gonna have empathy when you're finished watching just sent to.
Speaker 1: It just fills you up in so many ways, And
Speaker 1: I'm thankful for this time to get to look you
Speaker 1: in your eyes, just to and just love on you
Speaker 1: today and just just thank you and Jessica, thank you
Speaker 1: for treating her and her family with so much care
Speaker 1: because we see sometimes the documentaries they don't they turn
Speaker 1: out in their train wrecks, their disasters, you know, for
Speaker 1: the person that the focus is supposed to be on.
Speaker 1: And we are excited for you, just sent to as
Speaker 1: well as you keep moving up. Thank you on this
Speaker 1: journey and path. And if there's anything that I can
Speaker 1: do for y'all in my team, we are we are
Speaker 1: definitely here.
Speaker 3: I'm mentionally one more thing, Yes, darling, I do want
Speaker 3: to mention that Jessica and I are going to be
Speaker 3: launching my GoFundMe. If anybody can please share that I
Speaker 3: have a beautiful vision and I have a beautiful home
Speaker 3: available that I really would like to buy. It's like
Speaker 3: my dream home. I'm actually in it now and just
Speaker 3: thinking about it. Writing my GoFundMe, I was putting like
Speaker 3: all of the things that I wanted in it, and
Speaker 3: somebody happened to reach out to me. And when I
Speaker 3: came and saw, I was like, it's really God's work
Speaker 3: because it's it was exactly what I had, you know,
Speaker 3: dreamed for so if you would don't mind sharing, I'll
Speaker 3: give you to you as soon as we have it.
Speaker 3: It would just mean a lot to just throw it
Speaker 3: up on ig and you know, let the world got it.
Speaker 1: Thank you got it. Because I certainly was going to
Speaker 1: ask what were some of the last thing, because I
Speaker 1: was going to say I've said my last words, just
Speaker 1: empowering the both of you, and if you had any
Speaker 1: upcoming projects and just sent to thank you for sharing
Speaker 1: what you've got upcoming Jessica, any upcoming projects?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean just to quickly say that, Jacinta, could
Speaker 2: you mention what the home is for just because that's
Speaker 2: like the coolest part of the home.
Speaker 3: Well, my dream is to have a home for children
Speaker 3: who parents might be incarcerated or they might have previously
Speaker 3: been incarcerated, and to provide housing to them with the
Speaker 3: suite for mom so if she is incarcerated, there's a
Speaker 3: safe place for them to do furloughs. But the idea,
Speaker 3: the core of it is to teach children how to
Speaker 3: be self sufficient regardless of what our parents go through.
Speaker 3: So I'm hoping to instill all of the skills it
Speaker 3: takes to break the cycle and also be able to
Speaker 3: provide mom with some hope and having a beautiful home
Speaker 3: and beautiful space to come to, even if she's not
Speaker 3: able to provide it, So that would be the basis
Speaker 3: of the home.
Speaker 1: Come on, come on, well, does Kaitlin? Will she be
Speaker 1: working beside you on this or what's her I hope?
Speaker 3: So Kailn she is interested in psychology, so right now
Speaker 3: she's coming to Umane system, So it'll be Kailyn will
Speaker 3: be home and going to school with me, and hopefully
Speaker 3: if she's pursuing her sociology degree. It's absolutely in line
Speaker 3: with what I do and would love to have her.
Speaker 3: I also, Kailyn seventeen, she does not want to work
Speaker 3: with me. She wants to be with her friends. She
Speaker 3: has her own car, she has her own jobs.
Speaker 1: So amazing. Will you talked about teaching self sufficiency and
Speaker 1: independence while at the same time keeping that wishful door open.
Speaker 1: Thank y'all so much for checking in. Everybody, Please when
Speaker 1: you can or I'm imploring you by the end of
Speaker 1: this week, let me know that you have watched Just Centa.
Speaker 1: It is on Hulu. Is it on any other platforms?
Speaker 3: I don't think in the US Disney Plus, but not here.
Speaker 2: Okay, okay, Disney Plus and Canada. It's on Amazon Prime.
Speaker 2: In the UK, it's it's on It's on a platform
Speaker 2: everywhere in the world, but different.
Speaker 1: But different, different platforms. But you can see it wherever
Speaker 1: you are. Just look for it. J A. C.
Speaker 3: I N T A and follow me on IG. Just
Speaker 3: send an impact, just sent to Impact.
Speaker 1: All right, Jessica, you want to shout out your IG as.
Speaker 2: Well, Sure it's Josh dot No. Sorry, just underscore, give
Speaker 2: me my email.
Speaker 1: Listen, both of you ladies. You're welcome to come back
Speaker 1: any time and talk about your projects and what's going on.
Speaker 1: Thank y'all for checking in.
Speaker 3: Thank you, thank you so much.
Speaker 1: Oh listen. Sometimes I can be hard on people that
Speaker 1: I love, and I'll always say there's no excuse, there's
Speaker 1: no excuse. Too many people survive and overcome all kinds
Speaker 1: of things. But Jacinta said something so amazing. She said,
Speaker 1: while I was still addicted to drugs, she said, I
Speaker 1: still believe that I would get through it. I still
Speaker 1: believe that I would recover. And I'm so proud of
Speaker 1: just Santa. She's just I watched the documentary y'all, and
Speaker 1: like I said, I got in touch with them immediately
Speaker 1: because I just had to encourage them. And I'm so
Speaker 1: glad that she could share a little more today and
Speaker 1: give us the good news about what she's going. She
Speaker 1: does have a project that she would love for us
Speaker 1: to support, and I stand behind her. So all right, y'all,
Speaker 1: I really really hope that you enjoyed this episode of
Speaker 1: Checking In with Jacinta and Jessica. All Right, I'll see
Speaker 1: y'all soon, go by. Checking In with Michelle Williams is
Speaker 1: a production of iHeartRadio and The Black Effect. For more
Speaker 1: podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or
Speaker 1: wherever you listen to your favorite shows.