Speaker 1: Hello, Snaffoo fans, or as I like to call you,
Speaker 1: SNAPf fooligans. Come on, that's a cool name, right right.
Speaker 1: I hope you're keeping cool this summer, and as we
Speaker 1: wade through this horrifically sweltering El Nino, I've got something
Speaker 1: even hotter for you, this brand new clip episode curated
Speaker 1: by the Snafoo team and by Snapoo Team. I guess
Speaker 1: I really just mean me putting on different hats and
Speaker 1: using different silly voices with each hat. Now that I
Speaker 1: think about it, is maybe kind of sad. But anyway,
Speaker 1: this summer, to tide you over until our new season arrives,
Speaker 1: we're gonna be releasing a whole series of montage episodes
Speaker 1: tied to a certain theme or just collective nuggets of
Speaker 1: Snaffoo laden wisdom. And to kick things off, I thought
Speaker 1: we might want to begin with a fun romp down
Speaker 1: Memory Lane with a bunch of my guests, who also
Speaker 1: happen to be my wonderful collaborators on film and TV
Speaker 1: project over the years. So if you didn't catch the
Speaker 1: behind the scenes banter before, now is a great time
Speaker 1: to tune in and devour some bite sized morsels about
Speaker 1: what it was like to power around with Angela Keenzi
Speaker 1: and Jennif Fisher when we had downtime between scenes on
Speaker 1: the Office. Or how Mike Sure, one of the Office writers,
Speaker 1: helped conjure the character of Andy Bernard based on one
Speaker 1: of his own acquaintances. Maybe hear a little bit about
Speaker 1: Jake Johnson recalling how when we were shooting the movie Tag,
Speaker 1: Jeremy Rinner literally broke both arms doing a stunt and
Speaker 1: then returned to set to keep filming that same day. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's insane, as he's a superhuman. That's why he's an avenger. Anyways,
Speaker 1: sit back, relax, and enjoy this episode of Snafo insights
Speaker 1: from my castmates and collaborators. Let me ask Abe a
Speaker 1: very I think, very pressing question that all of our
Speaker 1: listeners and viewers are probably wondering right now, which is,
Speaker 1: how much do you miss working with me on a
Speaker 1: daily basis?
Speaker 2: Oh?
Speaker 3: My gosh, I miss the office a lot. I mean
Speaker 3: we spend our days. Our job now is watching the
Speaker 3: show and it always just brings up so many memories
Speaker 3: of working together. And you know how many bloopers there are?
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, there's so many, because we would just laugh
Speaker 3: all day together.
Speaker 1: That's what we did. Ed.
Speaker 4: I just miss I miss being silly with you, Like
Speaker 4: we would get so like I would walk past you
Speaker 4: and we would just make up a new noise like peeling.
Speaker 1: Finding Oh my god. It's like all the stuff off camera,
Speaker 1: the life experience of that whole time period, which was
Speaker 1: just had this kind of larger umbrella feeling of like, wow,
Speaker 1: we're all part of something really great and that's like
Speaker 1: super special. But then we're also having these really mundane,
Speaker 1: lovely moments on the set, just talking about each other's
Speaker 1: lives and families and like, I don't know, just the
Speaker 1: little those little quiet moments are sitting at our trailers
Speaker 1: like waiting for a camera setup or it's like that.
Speaker 1: That's I think something that like fans don't always understand
Speaker 1: is that like our experience of making the show is
Speaker 1: actually this whole tapestry of mundane, small moments of just
Speaker 1: experiencing each other.
Speaker 3: I mean it's an intimacy, yeah, you know, of togetherness,
Speaker 3: of constant togetherness.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: And I think if I could go back and relive
Speaker 3: a moment, like if you know, I got a genie
Speaker 3: in a bottle and I could use a wish it
Speaker 3: would be to go back and shoot a conference room
Speaker 3: scene all day because when we would see those on
Speaker 3: the script or on the call sheet and we would
Speaker 3: be like, oh god, we have been in.
Speaker 1: The conference room. You're going to be a slog day
Speaker 1: all day.
Speaker 3: But those were the days that created the moments you
Speaker 3: were talking about, Ed totally, those little laughs, the shares,
Speaker 3: the sweatiness together, all of it.
Speaker 4: And because we weren't on a huge lot, you know,
Speaker 4: there was no distraction. You know, people didn't walk off
Speaker 4: to a commissary. We were just all in this little bubble,
Speaker 4: this tiny space where we got to be creative together.
Speaker 4: It kind of reminded me a little bit of that
Speaker 4: energy you have in your early days with your improv
Speaker 4: group or your one act play. Because there was no
Speaker 4: one else, there was no shiny object to go off
Speaker 4: and look at. It was just us, Like, yeah, I
Speaker 4: loved it when you would play your banjo and Creed
Speaker 4: would bring in his guitar and we'd hang out in
Speaker 4: the parking lot.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 1: Yeah. And it's funny you bring up those conference room
Speaker 1: scenes because those were particularly special because most of the
Speaker 1: time we're not all together, right, most of the time,
Speaker 1: we're just doing little scenes with like one or two
Speaker 1: other characters, and and that's that's the bulk of our work.
Speaker 1: But then the table read was always a special moment.
Speaker 1: Every Tuesday morning was the table read of next week's
Speaker 1: script and or two weeks. I forget the timing, but
Speaker 1: then it was one week, one week, one week. It
Speaker 1: was less than a week's notice. Yeah, but those are
Speaker 1: the moments. Those and some of those conference room scenes
Speaker 1: were like where everybody's together, like everybody's and those had
Speaker 1: a really special energy, like like a just a little
Speaker 1: buzz to them. And when and like you said, when
Speaker 1: they when they were all day long, that's and they
Speaker 1: get a little dull and they start to slow down.
Speaker 1: Everybody's trying to just hang in there. It's like some
Speaker 1: of the just most human hangout.
Speaker 3: And you had a really unique experience joining the show
Speaker 3: because you actually joined in Stamford, so you didn't start
Speaker 3: off in the dunder Mifflin bullpen of the scrant and
Speaker 3: dunder Mifflin bullpen, and then you came over. What was
Speaker 3: that like for you to kind of like soft launch
Speaker 3: into the show, Like you worked with John, you worked
Speaker 3: with Rashida, you worked with Chip.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well sorry, Jenna, I'll be asking the questions today.
Speaker 1: We were doing No. I love the question. I always
Speaker 1: tell people like that was such a gentle entry for
Speaker 1: us because of exactly what you're saying, Like, you know,
Speaker 1: Rashida and I started at a time when the show
Speaker 1: was hot. It was season three, and you guys had
Speaker 1: already just kind of like created this incredible thing, and
Speaker 1: so we were intimidated but also felt kind of so
Speaker 1: warmly welcomed, both by the writers and and all of you.
Speaker 1: Everyone's energy was so lovely. That's so sweet. It really
Speaker 1: could have gone the other way. I'm sure a lot
Speaker 1: of other shows there's like more it's more cutthroat, or
Speaker 1: it feels more like the new people like let's let
Speaker 1: them they had to prove themselves with I just felt
Speaker 1: so like all of my butterflies and anxiety just washed
Speaker 1: out so quickly because everyone, all of you were so
Speaker 1: lovely right out of the gate, and which is a
Speaker 1: testament to all of you and the vibe that got created.
Speaker 1: It was collaborative.
Speaker 3: It was not competitive totally. There was not like a
Speaker 3: weird like ego competitiveness going on on that set, which
Speaker 3: was so great.
Speaker 4: Absolutely, yeah, it was always you know, we always say
Speaker 4: it was a real creative collaboration. From the writer's room
Speaker 4: to the crew to the cast, we're all working together
Speaker 4: to create a product that we were proud of. And
Speaker 4: I think, I mean, I think you feel that when
Speaker 4: you watch it, and I think that's why people keep
Speaker 4: enjoying it. As you're seeing a group of people having
Speaker 4: a great time.
Speaker 1: There's a warmth there that's real, and I think that
Speaker 1: comes through the camera. Since nineteen fifteen, there have somehow
Speaker 1: been a whopping thirty two broken arrow incidents. This includes
Speaker 1: theft wait wait yeah, raising one, thirty two super dupe nukes,
Speaker 1: super gone, super duper nuukers, thirty two.
Speaker 3: Nuclear weapons. Oi YOI now I know why they call
Speaker 3: it broken arrows, because when you say, you know what,
Speaker 3: we have thirty two broken arrows, you're like, oh, if
Speaker 3: you say we have thirty two lost nuclear weapons?
Speaker 1: Wait stop, what say again? Euphemisms make hard things a
Speaker 1: lot easier. Oh man, yeah, yeah, yeah, thirty two.
Speaker 4: That's why Greg called all of our talking heads candy bags.
Speaker 1: You know, I forgot that.
Speaker 4: He said that he always felt bad giving us pages
Speaker 4: and pages of extra monologues, so he was like, I'll
Speaker 4: name them something fun, so we named them candy bags.
Speaker 1: I loved those. I loved doing those talking heads and
Speaker 1: like coming up with like new rifts and like the
Speaker 1: candy bag alts, like all the different versions of our
Speaker 1: talking heads. Like just it was like getting a window
Speaker 1: into the writer's brains. I just remember loving the math
Speaker 1: of those jokes and like always trying to think about
Speaker 1: how to heighten them, and they'd have to kick me
Speaker 1: out of those talking heads.
Speaker 3: But to your point, naming all the extra work a
Speaker 3: candy bag, it's a trick, definitely made it go down easier.
Speaker 3: And also calling all our screw ups bloopers makes them
Speaker 3: sound fun too, like, oh that was a blooper, Like
Speaker 3: that's just a broken arrow.
Speaker 4: I mean, even the word snaffoo is kind of fun.
Speaker 1: Snaffooo, guys, it's just a snaffoo whoopsie doozy. Today, my
Speaker 1: guest is one of my oldest and dearest comedy pals.
Speaker 1: He's a writing legend. SNL the Office co created Parks
Speaker 1: and rec Brooklyn ninety nine, The Good Place Rutherford Falls,
Speaker 1: and by the way, he directed tons of all those
Speaker 1: episodes as well, And oh don't let me forget out
Speaker 1: of all of us who worked on the office. He
Speaker 1: he was also the best actor. Yeah, he's the one
Speaker 1: who brought the legendary Mos Shrewd into all of our
Speaker 1: hearts and nightmares. Of course, he just got a very
Speaker 1: well deserved star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame, and
Speaker 1: at this point I'm pretty sure NASA might be trying
Speaker 1: to name a planet after him. Please welcome, Mike. Sure, Hello, Mike,
Speaker 1: what a wonderful introduction.
Speaker 6: Thank you, I mean, thank you first of all for
Speaker 6: highlighting my acting, because I think you know that's the
Speaker 6: legacy that I hope to leave this earth with more
Speaker 6: than anything else.
Speaker 1: I don't think you get enough credit for your acting,
Speaker 1: and I don't agree you act enough. I think you
Speaker 1: need to be in more stuff.
Speaker 6: I will take any acting job that requires me to
Speaker 6: a remain mute and be run along the side of
Speaker 6: a car like a dog.
Speaker 1: Let's talk about those for a second, because what went
Speaker 1: into your choices, the choices that you made as an actor,
Speaker 1: was that something that like the writer's room really kind
Speaker 1: of broke down and was like, it'd be really funny
Speaker 1: if he was just sort of spooky and almost like
Speaker 1: a horror movie character just sort of popping up or
Speaker 1: or was that just your own brain sort of chewing
Speaker 1: on it and then showing up to set and being like,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get weird.
Speaker 6: Certainly, the way that Greg Daniels and the writers wrote,
Speaker 6: and I'm putting that in quotes wrote the character of
Speaker 6: Mo's was spooky and weird and just kind of off
Speaker 6: my choices as an actor, I would describe as coming
Speaker 6: from a white hot panic, just pure panic. Just no
Speaker 6: one had told me what to do. I didn't know
Speaker 6: what to do. I'm not an actor, and I just
Speaker 6: did anything. I just did anything that I could think
Speaker 6: of in the moment, and people kept finding it amusing,
Speaker 6: and so I just kept panicking.
Speaker 1: And doing whatever came to mind. I love it. I'm
Speaker 1: glad you enjoyed it. It gifts to all of America.
Speaker 1: So thank you the world, really truly.
Speaker 7: Sure.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm really eager to dig into this snafu with
Speaker 1: you today, but before I do, I just wanted to
Speaker 1: tell you something because I was thinking about You know,
Speaker 1: we've known each other for twenty ish years and we've
Speaker 1: collaborated very closely in many different ways over the years,
Speaker 1: and I've talked about you in publicly in interviews, a
Speaker 1: lot over the years, and I realized there's something that
Speaker 1: I kind of say when your name comes up in
Speaker 1: interviews frequently, but I don't know that if I've ever
Speaker 1: said it directly to you. And I was like, I
Speaker 1: got to tell Mike this. I got to get on
Speaker 1: the record with Mike sure and let you know that
Speaker 1: the character Andy Bernard on the Office never would have
Speaker 1: clicked for me without you. You were such an instrumental
Speaker 1: part of like helping me find his voice and shaping
Speaker 1: who he became, and that whole process, all of our
Speaker 1: fun little huddle ups and just hard laughs and brainstorming
Speaker 1: sessions about who Andy Bernard could be and why Andy
Speaker 1: was funny or what made him funny, And it's just
Speaker 1: like one of my favorite memories of show business. That's
Speaker 1: so kind of you to say. I mean, I will
Speaker 1: say that.
Speaker 6: You know, you join the show in season three and
Speaker 6: the plot was that, you know, Jim had moved to
Speaker 6: a different office, and the office that happened to be
Speaker 6: chosen was in Stanford, Connecticut. And I grew up in
Speaker 6: West Hartford, Connecticut, which is maybe an hour and changed
Speaker 6: north of Stanford, and I just instantly knew Andy. I
Speaker 6: grew up with Andy a lot of Andy's and it
Speaker 6: was a very familiar character to me at the sort
Speaker 6: of preppy like good time Charlie guy who went to
Speaker 6: an ivy League school and just wanted to be liked
Speaker 6: and was was just desperate for for like you know,
Speaker 6: was maybe a little clumsy in the way that he
Speaker 6: went about it, but had a good soul and a
Speaker 6: good heart. And I just remember thinking the combination of
Speaker 6: that character description and you as an actor. I was like, oh,
Speaker 6: I know, I get this, I get this. I know
Speaker 6: exactly who this guy is. And I and I do
Speaker 6: have a lot of as I'm sure you do, specific
Speaker 6: memories of like little moments of like figuring out the
Speaker 6: exact right little mannerism or sort of prepster little little
Speaker 6: turn of phrase or something.
Speaker 8: That he would give.
Speaker 6: There was the episode where you all get drunk in
Speaker 6: the office having to work late at night. Oh yeah,
Speaker 6: and start you start singing an Indogo Girls song of
Speaker 6: Closer to Fine song, and then Jim chimes in and
Speaker 6: you pop up a go tuna like so excited that
Speaker 6: he also knows all the lyrics to Closer to Find.
Speaker 6: I mean, that's that was my childhood. That was exactly
Speaker 6: my child that was around with my friends and listening
Speaker 6: to that album in particular.
Speaker 1: That's really where I think our friendship forged. Like that's
Speaker 1: when I met you, was coming onto the office set
Speaker 1: and just immediately like you were one of one of
Speaker 1: that handful of people that put me at ease immediately,
Speaker 1: and I'm so glad. Yeah, I mean, it's just yeah,
Speaker 1: it's awesome. It was a good time.
Speaker 6: It was a very fun, fun time, and I think
Speaker 6: all of our lives it felt like we were just
Speaker 6: in a very creative world with a bunch of creative
Speaker 6: fun people, and our only job was to figure out
Speaker 6: what was the funniest thing that could have happened in
Speaker 6: any given moment.
Speaker 1: That's exactly our only job was to make each other
Speaker 1: laugh as hard as possible.
Speaker 6: Yeah, and I mean there's no better.
Speaker 1: Job, Mike Sure. That is the story of Tammany Hall
Speaker 1: and Boss Tweed, the biggest, baddest, most corrupt machine New
Speaker 1: York City ever built. Do you have any sort of
Speaker 1: like larger big picture takeaways for me? I was really
Speaker 1: struck by the role that media played in this story,
Speaker 1: and particularly the role of comedy cartoons. It wasn't the
Speaker 1: cops or Congress or even rival politicians who brought down
Speaker 1: Boss tweet. It was journalists and cartoonists.
Speaker 6: I'll say a couple things. Number one is one of
Speaker 6: the best things about this country, this screwed up, messed up, messy,
Speaker 6: complex country that we live in, is that in the
Speaker 6: First Amendment, it says very clearly the government cannot put
Speaker 6: you in jail for or prosecute you in anyway for
Speaker 6: speaking up and saying what you believe. And it also
Speaker 6: says that the media is free. And because of that,
Speaker 6: we have a system by which newspapers in history, and
Speaker 6: television shows and radio programs and other media outlets are
Speaker 6: allowed to point out and make fun of and highlight
Speaker 6: corruption in government. That has always been true. It is
Speaker 6: in theory, i would say, still true today. When I
Speaker 6: worked at Saturday Night Live, which was my first job,
Speaker 6: Jim Downey, who's probably the greatest political satirist, he's the
Speaker 6: Thomas Nast of his day, really wrote the famous debate
Speaker 6: speeches sketches between Bush and Gore in two thousand and
Speaker 6: you know, the famous the first debate sketch involved, you know,
Speaker 6: summarize your campaign one word in al Gore, Daryl Hammond
Speaker 6: as Al Gore said lockbox, and Will Ferrell as George
Speaker 6: Bush said strategiery, and that line stuck to George Bush
Speaker 6: so thoroughly. He did have a lot of malaprops in
Speaker 6: his day. But there's a large number of people who
Speaker 6: believe that he really said that, that he really said
Speaker 6: strategicy at one point, there's a lot of people who
Speaker 6: believe that Sarah Palin said I can see Russia from
Speaker 6: my house, she did it. Tina Fay said that as
Speaker 6: Sarah Palin on SNL, and that that tradition that is
Speaker 6: very much in the Thomas Nast tradition, right, is the
Speaker 6: there's a difference between the way people understand the world
Speaker 6: we live in and the country we live in from
Speaker 6: dry media reports about fraud and corruption everything else, and
Speaker 6: the way that we see it through comedy. And comedy
Speaker 6: is often a more powerful weapon and a more direct
Speaker 6: way to make people understand something about government and corruption
Speaker 6: and fraud and whatever else is going on than actual news.
Speaker 6: And that's while I was thinking of as you were
Speaker 6: telling this story, is is thank goodness that this country
Speaker 6: allows us to do that, because I believe that is
Speaker 6: the most effective way often for people to come to
Speaker 6: understand what their political leaders are doing. That's what Thomas
Speaker 6: an asked did to Boss Tweet, and that's what Jim
Speaker 6: Downey and other folks have done to politicians through SNL
Speaker 6: cold opens over the years.
Speaker 1: Do you think that culturally we actually kind of underestimate
Speaker 1: the power of jokes? Like can humor still land a
Speaker 1: knockout punch? I'm thinking about South Park right now. Yeah,
Speaker 1: is really appears to be puncturing the armor of this
Speaker 1: administration in a very in a startling way.
Speaker 6: I mean, the media landscape in which we currently live
Speaker 6: is so much more fractured. You know, at the time,
Speaker 6: Harper's Weekly was probably the most powerful and an important
Speaker 6: institution in media, and obviously there's you know, there's barely
Speaker 6: newspapers anymore, and now there's barely kind of TV. There's
Speaker 6: no monoculture in TV anymore. We're now in this TikTok
Speaker 6: Instagram Snapchat world where things are very, very fractured. Everybody
Speaker 6: has their own algorithm. So the question to me isn't
Speaker 6: whether humor can be as potent a tool anymore. It's
Speaker 6: whether the delivery mechanisms that we are employing now can
Speaker 6: actually deliver a piece of satire to the world that way,
Speaker 6: or whether people are so siloed off that they'll that,
Speaker 6: you know, people a large majority of the public won't
Speaker 6: ever see the same thing.
Speaker 1: That's my fear. I know exactly what you mean, and
Speaker 1: I feel that sense of sort of fracturing culture that
Speaker 1: you're speaking to. But I still have this feeling, and
Speaker 1: it may start be transitioning into more of a hope
Speaker 1: at this point, but a feeling that truly exceptional work,
Speaker 1: whether it's a South Park episode or you know, a
Speaker 1: particularly keen clip of stand up, like the cream still
Speaker 1: rises to the top, and it does, it can still
Speaker 1: like sort of permeate those I.
Speaker 6: Would hope so, because I think if the story of
Speaker 6: Boss Tweet teaches us anything, it's that, you know, that
Speaker 6: is what is needed in these moments. What's needed is
Speaker 6: a voice of satire and clarity and perspective that can
Speaker 6: cut through and present in a single picture or a
Speaker 6: single comedy sketch or a single joke. What it would
Speaker 6: take a scholar, you know, hours to properly relay a
Speaker 6: picture of a greedy person as a vulture devouring democracy
Speaker 6: is a lot more effective in a single blow, in
Speaker 6: a single coup then you know, a lengthy article or
Speaker 6: a six part series in the New York Times or
Speaker 6: something like that.
Speaker 1: Put in some applause and like, you know, roaring.
Speaker 9: Three to four minutes of heart applause.
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, standing ovation sound effects Jake Johnson's air. Yes,
Speaker 1: we of course became acquainted on the movie Tag, which
Speaker 1: was just a goddamn delight. How fun was that? I mean,
Speaker 1: we had our ups and downs on the production, but
Speaker 1: it was it was a hell of a lot of fun.
Speaker 9: Apart from Renner breaking both his arms during a stunt.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, remember that crazy day in the church.
Speaker 1: Of course, I remember that. Insane Okay, So just for
Speaker 1: the listener, we're doing this scene where Jeremy Renner is
Speaker 1: chasing us and he's on he does that Fred Astaire
Speaker 1: chair move where he's you know where you like stand
Speaker 1: on the back of a chair and then and then
Speaker 1: let it fall down and then you keep going. Only
Speaker 1: the sort of bit was that this was a stack
Speaker 1: of like thirty chairs, so it was like twenty feet tall.
Speaker 1: Yeah it was. He he and he sort of falls down,
Speaker 1: but in a controlled way, off on this stack of
Speaker 1: chairs and then keeps running. But and he was wearing
Speaker 1: a harness to make the fall smooth and not harmful
Speaker 1: to his body. This there was some malfunction. He landed
Speaker 1: on both his arms. Both of his arms broke yes
Speaker 1: and he went to the hospital and was back on
Speaker 1: set that afternoon Shotkans still shooting. Do you remember that?
Speaker 9: And I'll tell you we've talked about this, but there
Speaker 9: are certain things you've said that are not for Jake.
Speaker 9: Breaking your arms and returning to shoot a scene and
Speaker 9: tag not for Jake.
Speaker 1: If I break my arms, not for Jake. I'm hold
Speaker 1: up for a while.
Speaker 9: I'm in a hospital room. I'm expecting visitors. I'm expecting
Speaker 9: a lot of you. Were so brave for doing that.
Speaker 9: I'm not going back to work. And then do you
Speaker 9: remember he has.
Speaker 1: To throw coffee?
Speaker 9: I think at me, yeah, where I run by him
Speaker 9: and he throws, but he had to use his broken arm,
Speaker 9: And I was like, I would like to complain about
Speaker 9: the fact that I need to slide on the ground,
Speaker 9: but I can't do that because he's throwing something.
Speaker 1: If they broke, because he's doing another stunt with broken arms.
Speaker 1: With broken arms, that to me was really wild.
Speaker 9: Do you remember the scene in the church also when
Speaker 9: it was you, me, Hannibil and probably Ham but I'm
Speaker 9: not sure. And Hannibal farted on camera and then got.
Speaker 1: Upset with us when we laughed if he were the
Speaker 1: ones not being professional and said come on man, and
Speaker 1: I said, I can't, you can't. That's impossible to do.
Speaker 1: I do remember that that was that was pure sabotage.
Speaker 1: Oh my god. There were so many hard laughs on
Speaker 1: that set, so many ridiculous experiences, and then this is
Speaker 1: this is like we'll probably cut this because this is
Speaker 1: like some some celebrity whining. But I remember being so
Speaker 1: excited because they're like, hey, we got a jet for
Speaker 1: the whole cast, and we're gonna that's how we're going
Speaker 1: to travel on this press tour. So we're all flying
Speaker 1: together and I'm like, oh, this is great. We get
Speaker 1: private airports, luxury jet. It was like a battered old
Speaker 1: like like a school bus with wings. Literally it was
Speaker 1: like a nineteen seventies like Southwest retired airplane and such
Speaker 1: a piece of jump. It was like, I mean, okay,
Speaker 1: don't cut that at I remember being like, good, oh yeah,
Speaker 1: this is his tag. Just the disappointment. It's like you
Speaker 1: were adding to the to that we're we're at a
Speaker 1: private airport, like this is gonna be so great, it's
Speaker 1: so fun and great, and then we get on and
Speaker 1: it's like, oh, these the seats are torn, like there's
Speaker 1: rats running around in this airplane. It smells like cigarettes,
Speaker 1: like it was a great plane, hadn't been cleaned since
Speaker 1: people smoked on planes. It was a greyhouf. It was
Speaker 1: a great hound airplane as what it was. That's great,
Speaker 1: I do, that's great.
Speaker 8: Hi, how are you.
Speaker 1: I'm awesome. It's so good to see you.
Speaker 8: Yeah, it's really good to see you too.
Speaker 1: We worked together a very long time ago, and you've
Speaker 1: done so many incredible things since then, and I am
Speaker 1: enormously proud of you and proud to know you.
Speaker 8: Thank you. I feel the same way about you. It's
Speaker 8: been half a lifetime since we worked together.
Speaker 1: Yeah, pretty much. When was that you were your daily
Speaker 1: show tenure? I started in two thousand and two and
Speaker 1: went to two thousand and six.
Speaker 8: I was ninety nine to two thousand and three.
Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, so we overlapped about two years maybe, and.
Speaker 8: Two years that we just happened to win a Peabody.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that's right.
Speaker 8: I don't know coincidence. I don't know.
Speaker 1: You tell me, I don't think so that's what That's
Speaker 1: why this this is our first collaboration since then, and
Speaker 1: it's going to win a Peabody. It's like this.
Speaker 8: Actual episode not going to win.
Speaker 1: That's what we do, that's how we do it. So
Speaker 1: we You and I collaborated on a number of segments
Speaker 1: in our Daily Show days, and one of the ones
Speaker 1: I'm most proud of is in fact a Dan Tabirsky segment,
Speaker 1: a delightful little number called Guns for Tots. Explain the
Speaker 1: premise of this, of this segment we did for the
Speaker 1: Daily Show.
Speaker 2: It was this guy who who wanted to make sure
Speaker 2: he was he was what was he doing?
Speaker 1: He was libertarian? Yeah, he was a libertarian.
Speaker 8: Yeah, he was a libertarian guy.
Speaker 2: And he was and he was protesting the existence of
Speaker 2: a law that was trying to keep guns away from kids,
Speaker 2: Like if you had a squirt gun, you had to
Speaker 2: like painted bright pink so it didn't look like a gun,
Speaker 2: so some kid didn't get shot by accident by a cop.
Speaker 8: Yeah, And he was just up in arms.
Speaker 1: He felt like this was government overreach, that the government
Speaker 1: would have the audacity to to interfere with someone's rights
Speaker 1: to arm their children. And this is all true, This
Speaker 1: is real, This is the real stuff that we did
Speaker 1: a satirical about. But the real premise was this guy
Speaker 1: had a very provocative toy drive called Guns for Tots,
Speaker 1: in which he gave toy guns two children in Harlem,
Speaker 1: New York, and we went and covered it and we
Speaker 1: treated him like like like the hero.
Speaker 8: He's a warrior, he was a justice warrior.
Speaker 1: He was a justice warrior.
Speaker 8: He was like making a difference guy.
Speaker 1: I'll never forget. The segment closed with him talking about
Speaker 1: how he wants to he can't wait to buy guns
Speaker 1: for his children, his own children, and we we cut
Speaker 1: to are amazing editor. At the time, Ainer had a
Speaker 1: beautiful little daughter and do you remember this. We filmed
Speaker 1: her playing a with a toy gun that had been
Speaker 1: painted black.
Speaker 8: And looked very real, looks like a gun.
Speaker 1: And it's like this the sweetest, most horrifying juxtaposition of
Speaker 1: a child with what looks like a glock.
Speaker 8: Yeah, it's incredible, it's incredible. It's an amazing visual.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's crazy how long ago that was.
Speaker 7: Honestly, it's the only time I've ever get any validation.
Speaker 7: You just reading off those credits made me feel good.
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh wow, I mean I didn't even mention
Speaker 1: your book. You just had a you just wrote a book.
Speaker 1: I have a book.
Speaker 7: Look, you and I are now authors, We are best
Speaker 7: selling authors.
Speaker 1: Very exciting, it is very exciting. I'm very proud of us.
Speaker 1: I was trying to think back to the origin of
Speaker 1: our friendship, and it just it falls into that huge
Speaker 1: basket of just wonderful people orbiting the UCB Theater in
Speaker 1: New York City around what like nineteen ninety nine, right
Speaker 1: in that area.
Speaker 7: Because you know, it's it's interesting. There are certain people
Speaker 7: that like Jason man Zukus. Obviously we co host this
Speaker 7: podcast together. I know Jason for many years. But Jason
Speaker 7: was not somebody that was invited to my wedding, which
Speaker 7: is a crazy thing because we weren't that close at
Speaker 7: that point in our He's definitely a friend. He didn't
Speaker 7: get that cut. He didn't make that cut.
Speaker 1: I was at your wedding, you were, and the whole
Speaker 1: time I was like, where is Jason? Why this is horrible? Meanwhile,
Speaker 1: Jason gave a toast at my wedding.
Speaker 7: As a matter of fact, It's wild to me that
Speaker 7: I talked to him all the time and he was
Speaker 7: somebody that was not that was just not a close
Speaker 7: friend at that moment.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but you're so right in that. I feel like
Speaker 1: there's so many people from that community that I that
Speaker 1: they somehow like merged with our DNA at that time.
Speaker 1: It's like we we knew each other when we were
Speaker 1: just comedy Larva wriggling around.
Speaker 7: We were performing in an old strip club where sometimes
Speaker 7: you'd be doing a show and people will get up
Speaker 7: and leave and you're like, did I do a bad job?
Speaker 7: Like no, they just thought they were coming to a
Speaker 7: strip club and were very confused for the first forty
Speaker 7: five minutes of the show exactly like this is great,
Speaker 7: but when are they going to take off their clothes?
Speaker 1: I remember there was a basement that you would get
Speaker 1: to through a trap door basically.
Speaker 7: Yeah, and you were the most rookie the wooden staircase
Speaker 7: all time to get down it.
Speaker 1: And you would go down there and it was like
Speaker 1: a grotto from from like sixteenth century Paris, wet brick walls, yes,
Speaker 1: and dirt floor.
Speaker 7: It was a it was a New York City catacomb,
Speaker 7: if you will that's what it was. Oh, I mean
Speaker 7: you would see the craziest stuff and it was only
Speaker 7: one way in and one way out. Wait, somebody was
Speaker 7: giving haircuts down there, well, haircuts down there and on stage. Yeah,
Speaker 7: one of the one of the resident teachers.
Speaker 1: Yeah, a legend, one of the originals.
Speaker 7: No audience, no audience, really crazy. That should have been
Speaker 7: its own show, the Haircuts.
Speaker 1: Weirdly, it would have found an audience too, I'm sure,
Speaker 1: actually more palatable than some of the shows that we
Speaker 1: did experiment with. Well as as one of the OG
Speaker 1: podcasters and one of one of the greats in the
Speaker 1: podcasting is thank you No truly like you've You've got
Speaker 1: such an awesome niche. It's been so cool to see
Speaker 1: you do a lot of shows in the studio, you
Speaker 1: do a lot of shows live on tour. Do you
Speaker 1: have a preference? I think yeah.
Speaker 7: For me, I think there's something really fun about when
Speaker 7: it's just Jason, June and I chatting with each other.
Speaker 7: I think that that's always really a blast and we're
Speaker 7: not playing for laughs. But when we do it in
Speaker 7: front of an audience, it's I like the I like
Speaker 7: the showmanship of it. I like I like getting out
Speaker 7: in front of an audience. I like finding where the
Speaker 7: jokes are, finding what they find funny and kind of
Speaker 7: chasing that because sometimes also it can get almost So
Speaker 7: what I love about the studio is it's so casual
Speaker 7: that sometimes you are just having a conversation and maybe
Speaker 7: that's okay too, but like you forget like oh we
Speaker 7: got to like hit some more jokes or or that
Speaker 7: one thing is funny, like and I didn't even think
Speaker 7: it was that funny. Well, are you ready? I'm thrilled.
Speaker 7: I'm such a fan of Nephew. The book was great.
Speaker 7: I loved the podcast.
Speaker 5: This is very cool to be on with you because
Speaker 5: I was a regular avid watcher of The Daily Show
Speaker 5: for many many years while you were on, and you're
Speaker 5: part of the reason why I wanted to be on
Speaker 5: The Daily Show, admiring your work and John's and Steve
Speaker 5: and Steven and every Sam. It's just, yeah, this is
Speaker 5: very cool.
Speaker 1: So thank you. That is so sweet. Go on.
Speaker 5: Yes, Well, another thing that I specifically like about your performance, yes,
Speaker 5: your everyman likability, your razor.
Speaker 1: Okay, okay, okay, this is all get edited out, but
Speaker 1: I'm loving it. Yeah, so we do have the Daily
Speaker 1: Show in common, it's been I hate to say this,
Speaker 1: I'm but it's been almost twenty years since I worked there.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, it feels insane to me. But you're
Speaker 1: there now and you've been there a bunch of years
Speaker 1: and ten.
Speaker 5: Almost ten, which is just crazy too, So badass.
Speaker 1: You guys are. How was this transition?
Speaker 3: So?
Speaker 1: When I was there, obviously John Stewart was the full
Speaker 1: time host and I was sort of a part of
Speaker 1: a cadre of correspondence and we did focus mostly on
Speaker 1: field segments and then the studio pieces with John. But
Speaker 1: now and that's kind of how you started too write
Speaker 1: with Trevor. Yes, definitely, at a certain point you transitioned
Speaker 1: into also part of this rotating host formula, which I
Speaker 1: just think is so cool and I think it's working
Speaker 1: so well. What was that like? What was that transition? Like? Crazy?
Speaker 5: There was a period of time where we were kind
Speaker 5: of testing out some different ideas and we didn't really
Speaker 5: know what was going to happen and who the host
Speaker 5: was going to be. And then it started to open
Speaker 5: up a little bit and I kind of threw my
Speaker 5: hat in the ring and put my hand up and said, hey,
Speaker 5: put me in Coach, before I could think about it
Speaker 5: too hard and just by some chance that they would
Speaker 5: consider me, and then we this format came about and
Speaker 5: John came back to the show, and yeah, it was
Speaker 5: It was a little terrifying because you know, being a
Speaker 5: being a correspondent, it's not an easy job by any means,
Speaker 5: but you're you are, You're in character, you're so I
Speaker 5: was very accustomed to being on the show as the
Speaker 5: character of the correspondent, and when you're hosting, you're basically yourself.
Speaker 5: So it was a it was a whole other type
Speaker 5: of type of work and like requires practice and giving
Speaker 5: it a shot, and so I didn't really know if
Speaker 5: I could do it. But the team here is so incredible.
Speaker 5: It's a well oiled machine. Everyone had our backs and
Speaker 5: we all support one another, and we've got John who
Speaker 5: could not be a more exceptional leader, and watching him
Speaker 5: every Monday is like a master class. So to get
Speaker 5: to try something new, create and something so exciting, and
Speaker 5: to get to look to him is it's beyond a
Speaker 5: dream come true.
Speaker 1: I think comedians in general, or comedy people are trained
Speaker 1: or it's almost like a like an instinct or a
Speaker 1: reflex to look for snaffoos. Yeah, we're always kind of
Speaker 1: trying to look under the surface at kind of what's
Speaker 1: going wrong, and especially at a place like the Daily Show,
Speaker 1: like you're looking for what's going wrong in order to
Speaker 1: generate satire. I actually found that I loved it and
Speaker 1: it was like very invigorating. I felt like I was
Speaker 1: part of a meaningful satirical voice at the show. But
Speaker 1: it kind of took a toll on me over a
Speaker 1: long period of time, focusing entirely on a little bit
Speaker 1: of the darker side of things. And I wonder if
Speaker 1: you've ever felt that or felt a sense of exasperation. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it can sort of like eat you a little bit,
Speaker 1: that's found.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, well, Ed, I'm dead inside, so I feel
Speaker 5: nothing anymore.
Speaker 8: It is gone.
Speaker 5: I've lost all sense of humanity.
Speaker 1: No, it is.
Speaker 5: It is taxing, It really is, and I think for me,
Speaker 5: I've kind of gone up and down on it. It's
Speaker 5: a bit of an emotional roller coaster, a mental roller coaster,
Speaker 5: because you're right, there's no escaping it. You can't just
Speaker 5: bury your head in the sand and be like, well,
Speaker 5: I'm just going to not pay attention to the news today.
Speaker 5: But I will say I think some kind of action,
Speaker 5: even for us, even if it's just finding the comedy
Speaker 5: in it, even if it's just creative action, it feels
Speaker 5: good to do something and just talk about it, admit
Speaker 5: that it's happening in a room full of people who
Speaker 5: can kind of provide catharsis and support and we can
Speaker 5: talk it out with each other, and then also being
Speaker 5: forced to find the humor in it somewhere. Is it
Speaker 5: really therapy? It is redeeming it really and especially this year.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so the Daily Show is is your therapist? Is
Speaker 1: what you're saying? It totally? Is it totally?
Speaker 8: Is?
Speaker 5: They should be billing me. I'm sure I'll get an
Speaker 5: invoice in the mail. I pay them to do the show.
Speaker 1: Snafu is a production of iHeart Podcasts and Snaffoo Media,
Speaker 1: a partnership between Film Nation Entertainment and Pacific Electric Picture Company.
Speaker 1: Post production and creative support from Good Egg Audio. Our
Speaker 1: executive producers are me Ed Helms, Mike Falbo, Glenn Basner,
Speaker 1: Andy Kim, and Dylan Fagan. This episode was produced by
Speaker 1: Alyssa Martino and Tory Smith. Our managing producer is Carl Nellis.
Speaker 1: Our video editor is Jared Smith. Technical direction and engineering
Speaker 1: from Nick Dooley. Additional story editing from Carl Nellis. Our
Speaker 1: creative executive is Brett Harris. Logo and branding by Matt
Speaker 1: Gosson and the collected Works. Legal review from Dan Welsh,
Speaker 1: Meghan Halson and Caroline Johnson. Special thanks to Isaac Dunham,
Speaker 1: Adam Horn, Lane Kleine and everyone at iHeart Podcasts, but
Speaker 1: especially Will Pearson, Kerrie Lieberman and Nikki Aetor. While I
Speaker 1: have you, don't forget to pick up a copy of
Speaker 1: my book, Snaffoo, The Definitive Guide to History's Greatest screw Ups.
Speaker 1: It's available now from any book retailer. Just go to
Speaker 1: Snaffoo dashbook dot com. Thanks for listening and see you
Speaker 1: next week.