1 00:00:00,360 --> 00:00:02,759 Speaker 1: The True Story of the Fake Zombies is a production 2 00:00:02,840 --> 00:00:13,200 Speaker 1: of iHeart Podcasts, Talk House and never Mind Media. In 3 00:00:13,280 --> 00:00:20,200 Speaker 1: episode one, You Met the Real Zombies. Kings of sixty Psychedelia. 4 00:00:19,920 --> 00:00:23,360 Speaker 1: The band had two big hits in nineteen sixty four 5 00:00:23,480 --> 00:00:27,720 Speaker 1: and sixty five. The first is She's Not There, the 6 00:00:27,760 --> 00:00:30,640 Speaker 1: song You're hearing right Now, a total classic. 7 00:00:30,720 --> 00:00:35,159 Speaker 2: Jusam Sorry, Why. 8 00:00:38,520 --> 00:00:38,600 Speaker 3: So? 9 00:00:38,760 --> 00:00:41,440 Speaker 1: Is this song which came a year later called tell 10 00:00:41,479 --> 00:00:44,960 Speaker 1: Her No, another huge hit that helped define the British 11 00:00:44,960 --> 00:00:45,800 Speaker 1: invasion era. 12 00:00:48,040 --> 00:00:49,320 Speaker 2: No No. 13 00:00:50,360 --> 00:00:52,840 Speaker 1: The Zombies rode the same wave that brought the Beatles 14 00:00:52,840 --> 00:00:56,160 Speaker 1: and the Stones to the United States. American teenagers from 15 00:00:56,200 --> 00:01:03,080 Speaker 1: coast to coast were obsessed with all things English. But 16 00:01:03,160 --> 00:01:06,160 Speaker 1: unlike the Beatles and the Stones, the Zombies didn't stay 17 00:01:06,200 --> 00:01:09,319 Speaker 1: at the top of the charts. The band's early success 18 00:01:09,319 --> 00:01:12,280 Speaker 1: had all but disappeared when out of Nowhere, their now 19 00:01:12,440 --> 00:01:15,000 Speaker 1: iconic song Time of the Season started racing up the 20 00:01:15,080 --> 00:01:17,600 Speaker 1: charts in the United States as the decade came to 21 00:01:17,640 --> 00:01:22,720 Speaker 1: a close this season. While Time of the Season was 22 00:01:22,760 --> 00:01:25,920 Speaker 1: spreading like wildfire over the radio airwaves here in America, 23 00:01:26,600 --> 00:01:29,520 Speaker 1: back in England, the band had no idea they had 24 00:01:29,520 --> 00:01:40,560 Speaker 1: a hit record, yes that could actually happen, pleasure promise ee. 25 00:01:42,800 --> 00:01:45,680 Speaker 4: Overseas and father. 26 00:01:48,080 --> 00:01:49,920 Speaker 1: The fact that a band could have a hit and 27 00:01:50,000 --> 00:01:54,680 Speaker 1: not know it is why we're here. That is why 28 00:01:54,680 --> 00:01:58,480 Speaker 1: we have the Fake Zombies. Four young men from Texas 29 00:01:58,680 --> 00:02:01,840 Speaker 1: who found themselves in Base City, Michigan in nineteen sixty nine, 30 00:02:02,520 --> 00:02:07,120 Speaker 1: hired to impersonate five guys from England. Two of those 31 00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:10,400 Speaker 1: Texas boys would go on to form zz Top, icons 32 00:02:10,440 --> 00:02:15,240 Speaker 1: of American music, but the time Dusty Hill and Frank 33 00:02:15,280 --> 00:02:19,200 Speaker 1: Beard from zz Top spent impersonating British rock Royalty is 34 00:02:19,280 --> 00:02:24,520 Speaker 1: left out of the band's already mysterious origin story. Zz 35 00:02:24,680 --> 00:02:27,880 Speaker 1: Top are masters of the alter ego and creating myths 36 00:02:27,880 --> 00:02:31,960 Speaker 1: and legends. The self described little band from Texas has 37 00:02:32,000 --> 00:02:40,760 Speaker 1: always been hard to pin down. Before creating the larger 38 00:02:40,800 --> 00:02:44,480 Speaker 1: than life personas they'd inhabit in zz Top, Dusty and 39 00:02:44,480 --> 00:02:46,919 Speaker 1: Frank were just looking to hit the road with two 40 00:02:46,960 --> 00:02:51,280 Speaker 1: friends named Mark Ramsey and Sibe short for Seaborn Metter. 41 00:02:53,880 --> 00:02:55,760 Speaker 1: So they went to a little town called Bay City, 42 00:02:55,800 --> 00:03:02,560 Speaker 1: Michigan and became the Zombies. I'm Daniel Ralston. This is 43 00:03:02,560 --> 00:03:13,600 Speaker 1: the true story of the Fake Zombies. Yesterday, loden Stone 44 00:03:13,680 --> 00:03:16,280 Speaker 1: at least a few thousand people read the same sentence 45 00:03:16,320 --> 00:03:19,720 Speaker 1: I did in the Zombies biography. I'm did about a 46 00:03:19,760 --> 00:03:22,800 Speaker 1: group of guys impersonating the band in the United States. 47 00:03:23,280 --> 00:03:25,600 Speaker 1: I'm sure if you even googled it, I can tell 48 00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:29,040 Speaker 1: you from experience that in twenty fifteen, there wasn't much 49 00:03:29,040 --> 00:03:31,560 Speaker 1: to find on the Internet when you searched the Fake Zombies. 50 00:03:32,880 --> 00:03:35,960 Speaker 1: But somewhere around page sixteen of the search results, after 51 00:03:36,000 --> 00:03:38,640 Speaker 1: the tutorials on how to make a homemade zombie costume 52 00:03:38,640 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 1: for Halloween, I found a blog post written by Mark Ramsey, 53 00:03:43,480 --> 00:03:47,640 Speaker 1: rhythm guitarist in the Fake Zombies. That's when this whole 54 00:03:47,680 --> 00:03:51,880 Speaker 1: thing really got going. Despite the completely crazy fact that 55 00:03:51,920 --> 00:03:55,200 Speaker 1: Mark was actually on tour as a fake Zombie, packed 56 00:03:55,200 --> 00:03:58,880 Speaker 1: in the van with Siebe and Frank and Dusty, his 57 00:03:58,960 --> 00:04:02,880 Speaker 1: blog posts mostly folks fused on his guitar collection. The 58 00:04:02,960 --> 00:04:07,000 Speaker 1: details of the tour were almost an afterthought, but there 59 00:04:07,000 --> 00:04:11,520 Speaker 1: were photos faded Kodak images of four young men dressed 60 00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:16,799 Speaker 1: in psychedelic clothes jamming away on their instruments. They look great, 61 00:04:17,279 --> 00:04:19,000 Speaker 1: but they could have been any band out on tour 62 00:04:19,040 --> 00:04:22,000 Speaker 1: in the late sixties, hustling around the country trying to 63 00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:26,520 Speaker 1: become the next big thing. None of the photos in 64 00:04:26,600 --> 00:04:29,279 Speaker 1: Mark's post hinted that these guys were anything but a 65 00:04:29,320 --> 00:04:38,800 Speaker 1: regular garage band from Texas except one. It's the same 66 00:04:38,839 --> 00:04:42,040 Speaker 1: four guys from all the candid photos, but this one 67 00:04:42,480 --> 00:04:46,640 Speaker 1: is a professionally taken promotional photo. In the black and 68 00:04:46,640 --> 00:04:51,040 Speaker 1: white picture, Dusty, Frank, Sibe, and Mark look like a 69 00:04:51,040 --> 00:04:56,239 Speaker 1: real band. Lead guitarist Seed Meta is on the far left, 70 00:04:56,520 --> 00:04:59,880 Speaker 1: looking like an edgier Rod Stewart, blonde rock and roll 71 00:05:00,080 --> 00:05:05,960 Speaker 1: mullet and chiseled cheekbones. Mark Ramsey is on the far right, 72 00:05:06,680 --> 00:05:10,000 Speaker 1: giving the camera a slight smile, half of his face 73 00:05:10,040 --> 00:05:14,600 Speaker 1: covered in shadow. He looks much younger than nineteen, his 74 00:05:14,680 --> 00:05:17,560 Speaker 1: age when the photo was taken. Dusty and Frank are 75 00:05:17,600 --> 00:05:22,000 Speaker 1: in the middle. Dusty's hand is draped over Frank's shoulder 76 00:05:22,360 --> 00:05:25,160 Speaker 1: as the two of them look straight into the lens. 77 00:05:26,839 --> 00:05:30,159 Speaker 1: They're both wearing a variation on a cowboy hat, something 78 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:33,400 Speaker 1: the real zombies would never do, but they're pulling it off. 79 00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:40,719 Speaker 1: Everything about the photo looks normal. Four young guys dressed 80 00:05:40,760 --> 00:05:43,040 Speaker 1: like rock and roll pirates about to conquer the world, 81 00:05:44,279 --> 00:05:46,719 Speaker 1: And if you squint your eyes and imagine yourself as 82 00:05:46,760 --> 00:05:49,640 Speaker 1: a rock and roll fan in nineteen sixty nine. Sure 83 00:05:50,200 --> 00:05:54,800 Speaker 1: they could be the Zombies, but there were five real Zombies, 84 00:05:55,200 --> 00:05:58,120 Speaker 1: not four. That's the first thing wrong with this picture. 85 00:06:00,400 --> 00:06:06,119 Speaker 1: The second. The promo photo is autographed. Strangely, Seve Metter 86 00:06:06,279 --> 00:06:09,479 Speaker 1: and Mark Ramsey signed it with their real names. Frank 87 00:06:09,480 --> 00:06:14,880 Speaker 1: and Dusty are using fake ones de Cruz and Chris Page, respectively. 88 00:06:15,920 --> 00:06:18,159 Speaker 1: It seems like the zz top half of the band 89 00:06:18,279 --> 00:06:24,720 Speaker 1: knew something the other guys didn't. And once you go 90 00:06:24,760 --> 00:06:27,320 Speaker 1: beyond the borders of the photo, this perfect rock and 91 00:06:27,400 --> 00:06:32,720 Speaker 1: roll picture starts. The band's name is printed on the 92 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:36,920 Speaker 1: bottom left in black on a white border. It says 93 00:06:37,440 --> 00:06:42,719 Speaker 1: the Original Zombies, and in the bottom right corner there's 94 00:06:42,760 --> 00:06:45,760 Speaker 1: an address where a radio DJ or adoring fan could 95 00:06:45,760 --> 00:06:50,599 Speaker 1: write to the company that represented the original Zombies. The 96 00:06:50,600 --> 00:06:58,320 Speaker 1: company is called Delta Promotions. We know these four young 97 00:06:58,320 --> 00:07:01,360 Speaker 1: guys in the picture are from Texas, So why does 98 00:07:01,400 --> 00:07:06,760 Speaker 1: the address say Bay City, Michigan. There's only one way 99 00:07:06,800 --> 00:07:11,160 Speaker 1: to find out the answer. After the break, I'm headed 100 00:07:11,160 --> 00:07:15,000 Speaker 1: to Bay City, hoping that it will provide some answers 101 00:07:15,040 --> 00:07:17,840 Speaker 1: to that and all of my other questions about how 102 00:07:18,280 --> 00:07:23,200 Speaker 1: and why the fake Zombies came together. Like why it 103 00:07:23,240 --> 00:07:25,520 Speaker 1: happened in the tiny town one hundred and twenty miles 104 00:07:25,560 --> 00:07:28,880 Speaker 1: north of Detroit and twelve hundred miles north of Dallas. 105 00:07:30,120 --> 00:07:33,080 Speaker 1: Why Bay City. It turns out being in the middle 106 00:07:33,120 --> 00:07:36,400 Speaker 1: of nowhere helps when you're putting together a ban that 107 00:07:36,480 --> 00:07:49,840 Speaker 1: already exists. Bay City, Michigan, is a long way from anything. 108 00:07:50,880 --> 00:07:54,480 Speaker 1: Even now in twenty twenty four, when the world is 109 00:07:54,520 --> 00:07:58,440 Speaker 1: so connected by technology and information, Bay City feels out 110 00:07:58,440 --> 00:08:05,239 Speaker 1: of the way. The closest airport is Saginaw, about twenty 111 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:10,240 Speaker 1: miles south. If the name Bay City sounds familiar, you 112 00:08:10,320 --> 00:08:14,640 Speaker 1: may know it from the band the Bay City Rollers. 113 00:08:16,280 --> 00:08:19,080 Speaker 1: They're not from Bay City or anywhere else in Michigan, though, 114 00:08:19,760 --> 00:08:22,720 Speaker 1: they're not even American. They threw a darted a map 115 00:08:22,760 --> 00:08:25,160 Speaker 1: of the United States and it landed on Bay City, 116 00:08:27,160 --> 00:08:29,600 Speaker 1: and that could have been Base City's musical claim to fame, 117 00:08:30,520 --> 00:08:33,400 Speaker 1: but it isn't. This out of the way little town 118 00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:38,040 Speaker 1: has one big brush with serious music Royalty Madonna was 119 00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:44,840 Speaker 1: born there. In one of Madonna's first big TV interviews 120 00:08:45,080 --> 00:08:48,679 Speaker 1: with Diane Sawyer in nineteen eighty four, she kind of 121 00:08:48,720 --> 00:08:49,760 Speaker 1: trashed her hometown. 122 00:08:49,880 --> 00:08:53,000 Speaker 3: Came from Michigan, where in Michigan. 123 00:08:53,520 --> 00:08:55,080 Speaker 2: Well, I was born in Bay City. 124 00:08:55,200 --> 00:08:55,880 Speaker 5: Bay City. 125 00:08:56,040 --> 00:09:00,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, little town, mm hm, small list, smellytown north in Michigan. 126 00:09:02,320 --> 00:09:04,959 Speaker 1: Madonna's connection to Bay City runs a bit deeper than 127 00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:09,079 Speaker 1: one disparaging SoundBite. She spent a lot of time here 128 00:09:09,080 --> 00:09:13,080 Speaker 1: as a kid at her grandma's house. Like the song goes, 129 00:09:13,840 --> 00:09:17,680 Speaker 1: this used to be her playground. But because she called 130 00:09:17,720 --> 00:09:21,600 Speaker 1: Bay City a little smelly town, its residents never forgave her. 131 00:09:22,760 --> 00:09:25,920 Speaker 1: There's no billboard announcing that this is the birthplace of Madonna, 132 00:09:26,720 --> 00:09:29,880 Speaker 1: no statue of her in downtown Bay City, just a 133 00:09:29,920 --> 00:09:32,480 Speaker 1: two foot by two foot plaque put up in twenty 134 00:09:32,520 --> 00:09:36,400 Speaker 1: seventeen outside the hospital where she was born. It's all 135 00:09:36,440 --> 00:09:46,160 Speaker 1: Bay City would allow. I'm not sure I'll find anything 136 00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:48,880 Speaker 1: new by going to Bay City. It doesn't seem like 137 00:09:48,920 --> 00:09:52,320 Speaker 1: a town that celebrates its heroes. And I'm here looking 138 00:09:52,360 --> 00:09:55,800 Speaker 1: for the people behind Delta Promotions, a music management company 139 00:09:55,800 --> 00:09:59,839 Speaker 1: who did something a little unscrupulous here over fifty years. 140 00:09:59,840 --> 00:10:00,200 Speaker 3: Ag go. 141 00:10:02,080 --> 00:10:06,360 Speaker 1: Bay City is a quiet town, a modest town. But 142 00:10:06,400 --> 00:10:08,520 Speaker 1: if I come up empty in my search, here, at 143 00:10:08,600 --> 00:10:10,400 Speaker 1: least I can say I visited the birthplace of the 144 00:10:10,440 --> 00:10:14,160 Speaker 1: Queen of Pop. So I'm hopping on a plane to 145 00:10:14,200 --> 00:10:17,199 Speaker 1: Detroit and then a much smaller plane to the crotch 146 00:10:17,280 --> 00:10:20,600 Speaker 1: of the thumb of Michigan to see if anyone involved 147 00:10:20,600 --> 00:10:23,600 Speaker 1: with the fake zombies or the Delta promotion scam is 148 00:10:23,600 --> 00:10:27,280 Speaker 1: still alive and willing to talk. In a little smelly 149 00:10:27,320 --> 00:10:44,240 Speaker 1: town called Bay City. 150 00:10:38,559 --> 00:10:41,240 Speaker 5: Ladies and gentlemen, we welcome you to dagonaw in a 151 00:10:41,320 --> 00:10:47,680 Speaker 5: local time in twenty five pm for your safetyandam. 152 00:10:48,520 --> 00:10:51,480 Speaker 1: Is chalk it up to coastal elite bias or just 153 00:10:51,520 --> 00:10:55,480 Speaker 1: plain idiocy, but I'm not really prepared for just how 154 00:10:55,520 --> 00:10:57,439 Speaker 1: out of the way I will be in Bay City. 155 00:10:58,720 --> 00:11:00,800 Speaker 1: When I land at the airport and said iagena on Michigan, 156 00:11:01,360 --> 00:11:04,160 Speaker 1: I noticed my flight is one of three arrivals for 157 00:11:04,240 --> 00:11:08,439 Speaker 1: the entire day. It's the middle of summer twenty twenty three, 158 00:11:08,679 --> 00:11:15,240 Speaker 1: it's hot, and there are thunderstorms rolling in. I'd arranged 159 00:11:15,240 --> 00:11:17,360 Speaker 1: to be driven around Bay City by a local music 160 00:11:17,480 --> 00:11:20,240 Speaker 1: historian for most of my trip, so I didn't bother 161 00:11:20,280 --> 00:11:24,760 Speaker 1: renting a car. Huge mistake. There is no lyft or 162 00:11:24,880 --> 00:11:28,040 Speaker 1: uber here. I end up bribing an airport employee for 163 00:11:28,080 --> 00:11:31,160 Speaker 1: a ride. I get the impression I'm not the first 164 00:11:31,200 --> 00:11:35,800 Speaker 1: stranded passenger he's bailed out. As we motor through the 165 00:11:35,840 --> 00:11:39,720 Speaker 1: Michigan sunset in his pickup truck, passing field after field 166 00:11:39,760 --> 00:11:43,680 Speaker 1: and factory after rundown factory. I feel like I'm going 167 00:11:43,720 --> 00:11:47,160 Speaker 1: back in time, which is exactly where I want to go. 168 00:11:53,840 --> 00:11:55,760 Speaker 1: If this part of Michigan feels cut off from the 169 00:11:55,760 --> 00:11:58,920 Speaker 1: world now, you can imagine how it was more than 170 00:11:58,960 --> 00:12:03,960 Speaker 1: fifty years ago when two guys Bill Kehoe and Jim 171 00:12:03,960 --> 00:12:08,240 Speaker 1: Atherton cooked up the idea for the fake Zombies from 172 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:11,880 Speaker 1: their offices inside their teen nightclub band Canyon on the 173 00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:16,600 Speaker 1: outskirts of town on Tuscola Road. Keyho and Atherton ran 174 00:12:16,679 --> 00:12:21,240 Speaker 1: Delta Promotions, a concert promotion and artist management company specializing 175 00:12:21,240 --> 00:12:24,840 Speaker 1: in acts from in and around Bay City. I promise 176 00:12:24,880 --> 00:12:26,720 Speaker 1: we'll get into the details of how two of the 177 00:12:26,760 --> 00:12:28,920 Speaker 1: guys from zz Top happened to end up in the 178 00:12:28,960 --> 00:12:33,560 Speaker 1: Delta offices more than five decades ago. But first I 179 00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:44,920 Speaker 1: need to see a guy named Gary Ready. 180 00:12:44,920 --> 00:12:48,280 Speaker 3: When you are sir, okay, well this you know there 181 00:12:48,360 --> 00:12:51,440 Speaker 3: wasn't This was such an interesting time in Michigan. 182 00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:55,280 Speaker 1: Without people like Gary Johnson, the history of rock and 183 00:12:55,360 --> 00:13:01,599 Speaker 1: roll would not exist. He's a music obsessive and was 184 00:13:01,640 --> 00:13:04,079 Speaker 1: a teenage rock and roll rebel right here in Bay City, 185 00:13:04,080 --> 00:13:06,880 Speaker 1: back in nineteen sixty nine when the fake zombies assembled, 186 00:13:07,400 --> 00:13:10,520 Speaker 1: and thankfully he's found a place to house the history 187 00:13:10,559 --> 00:13:13,280 Speaker 1: of Michigan music he's lived and breathed for the past 188 00:13:13,400 --> 00:13:18,560 Speaker 1: fifty years. Gary runs a museum on the second floor 189 00:13:18,600 --> 00:13:23,040 Speaker 1: of the Bay City Historical Society. The first floor of 190 00:13:23,040 --> 00:13:27,080 Speaker 1: the building has your typical local museum fodder, displays about 191 00:13:27,120 --> 00:13:31,240 Speaker 1: early settlers and fur trapping. There are multiple displays devoted 192 00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:34,280 Speaker 1: to the logging industry if you really like that sort 193 00:13:34,280 --> 00:13:37,040 Speaker 1: of thing. The Bay City Historical Society is the museum 194 00:13:37,080 --> 00:13:41,079 Speaker 1: for you. If you're ambivalent about logging, like me, it's 195 00:13:41,120 --> 00:13:53,000 Speaker 1: a little dry and would The featured exhibit as I 196 00:13:53,120 --> 00:13:55,520 Speaker 1: entered the lobby is a lovely collection of tea sets 197 00:13:55,520 --> 00:13:59,400 Speaker 1: owned by early Bay City residents. But the second floor, 198 00:14:00,080 --> 00:14:02,040 Speaker 1: Gary's floor is another story. 199 00:14:02,200 --> 00:14:05,439 Speaker 3: Take you through this. This is our newest exhibit right here. 200 00:14:06,280 --> 00:14:10,160 Speaker 1: Here, Gary, Doctor J. Johnson runs the Michigan Rock and 201 00:14:10,280 --> 00:14:11,959 Speaker 1: Roll Legends Museum piece. 202 00:14:12,400 --> 00:14:15,560 Speaker 3: All the Michigan talent that had been growing the last 203 00:14:15,559 --> 00:14:17,960 Speaker 3: three years. This is what a line up. 204 00:14:17,960 --> 00:14:18,240 Speaker 5: This is. 205 00:14:18,320 --> 00:14:19,640 Speaker 3: Junior walks. 206 00:14:19,880 --> 00:14:21,640 Speaker 1: Bay City may not be the kind of town that 207 00:14:21,720 --> 00:14:25,680 Speaker 1: celebrates its musical history, but Gary's enthusiasm for his hometown 208 00:14:25,800 --> 00:14:28,760 Speaker 1: sound more than makes up for that. From the moment 209 00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:30,720 Speaker 1: I met Gary, I knew he was a kindred spirit, 210 00:14:31,600 --> 00:14:34,040 Speaker 1: another person who loves music and the stories behind it 211 00:14:34,080 --> 00:14:34,600 Speaker 1: the way I do. 212 00:14:35,800 --> 00:14:38,240 Speaker 3: But anyways, that was MC five. 213 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:43,680 Speaker 1: This collection of posters, gear and ephemera is the rock 214 00:14:43,680 --> 00:14:46,040 Speaker 1: and roll Hall of Fame for artists born here in Michigan, 215 00:14:46,760 --> 00:14:50,280 Speaker 1: from Motown Legends to the White Stripes and everyone in between. 216 00:14:51,400 --> 00:14:53,600 Speaker 1: Gary just can't legally call it the rock and Roll 217 00:14:53,600 --> 00:14:55,800 Speaker 1: Hall of Fame because the rock and Roll Hall of 218 00:14:55,800 --> 00:14:59,240 Speaker 1: Fame in Cleveland won't let him. Not very rock and 219 00:14:59,360 --> 00:15:03,760 Speaker 1: roll in my opinion. But back to the Michigan version, 220 00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:07,840 Speaker 1: it's a truly impressive collection, and Gary spares no detail 221 00:15:07,840 --> 00:15:11,000 Speaker 1: in celebrating Bay Cities contributions to the musical landscape. 222 00:15:11,120 --> 00:15:15,320 Speaker 3: This is all furniture and carpeting from that State Theater 223 00:15:15,560 --> 00:15:19,120 Speaker 3: original seats. This is one of the old theaters in 224 00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:23,640 Speaker 3: Bay City that burned down, but I love these. 225 00:15:23,320 --> 00:15:26,440 Speaker 1: There's a wall dedicated to the Bay City Rollers on 226 00:15:26,480 --> 00:15:28,280 Speaker 1: the State and the time they were given the key 227 00:15:28,280 --> 00:15:29,240 Speaker 1: to the city when they. 228 00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:33,960 Speaker 3: Were so hot they put their hands in cement and 229 00:15:34,320 --> 00:15:36,600 Speaker 3: autographed each one, so we have. 230 00:15:36,640 --> 00:15:40,520 Speaker 1: That Madonna is well represented. Naturally, A mural sized photo 231 00:15:40,560 --> 00:15:42,080 Speaker 1: of her covers an entire wall. 232 00:15:41,920 --> 00:15:44,680 Speaker 3: Eighteen eighty seven. And he was right in front of 233 00:15:44,680 --> 00:15:47,000 Speaker 3: the stage. He said he had you know, he was 234 00:15:47,040 --> 00:15:49,160 Speaker 3: there for the verse four or five songs. He was 235 00:15:49,200 --> 00:15:52,360 Speaker 3: getting hit by droplets of sweat, you know, from Madonna, 236 00:15:52,400 --> 00:15:54,120 Speaker 3: you know, dancing as she was. 237 00:15:54,280 --> 00:15:56,720 Speaker 1: In fact, Gary's the reason there's any mention of Madonna 238 00:15:56,720 --> 00:15:59,440 Speaker 1: in Bay City at all. He's the one who insisted 239 00:15:59,480 --> 00:16:01,920 Speaker 1: the town up that two by two plaque in her honor. 240 00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:07,440 Speaker 1: There's a tribute to just about every musician Michigan ever produced, 241 00:16:07,760 --> 00:16:13,160 Speaker 1: from Stevie Wonder to Michigan's favorite son, Bob Seeger. I 242 00:16:13,200 --> 00:16:15,480 Speaker 1: don't want to give the impression that this museum is big. 243 00:16:15,800 --> 00:16:19,240 Speaker 1: It's not, but every possible square inch is devoted to 244 00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:21,560 Speaker 1: Michigan's place in the history of rock and roll music. 245 00:16:21,800 --> 00:16:24,840 Speaker 3: Yes, and of course Del Shannon, one of our great 246 00:16:24,880 --> 00:16:28,800 Speaker 3: Michigan artists. There was a little bit of question about 247 00:16:28,840 --> 00:16:29,240 Speaker 3: his death. 248 00:16:29,280 --> 00:16:31,240 Speaker 1: There are parts of Gary's museum that feel like they're 249 00:16:31,240 --> 00:16:35,000 Speaker 1: only for true music obsessives like myself and maybe you all. 250 00:16:34,920 --> 00:16:36,880 Speaker 3: Right, this is the big wall of the Hall of Fame. 251 00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:40,240 Speaker 1: Gary cares about the forgotten figures and lost histories that 252 00:16:40,320 --> 00:16:42,160 Speaker 1: make up the real story of Michigan music. 253 00:16:42,200 --> 00:16:45,240 Speaker 3: You know, different events in Michigan rock and roll history 254 00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:50,080 Speaker 3: from nineteen forty six, when the Fortune Records form and 255 00:16:50,320 --> 00:16:54,280 Speaker 3: right up to when the Frankie Lineman and the Teenagers 256 00:16:54,880 --> 00:16:56,080 Speaker 3: tombstone gat here. 257 00:16:56,520 --> 00:17:04,200 Speaker 1: So anyway, case in point, the Michigan Rock and Roll 258 00:17:04,240 --> 00:17:09,000 Speaker 1: Legends Museum is dominated by one particular landmark, and it's huge, 259 00:17:09,880 --> 00:17:14,080 Speaker 1: about one thousand pounds and made of solid granite. Through 260 00:17:14,119 --> 00:17:17,720 Speaker 1: a series of wild and almost unbelievably strange events, Gary 261 00:17:17,760 --> 00:17:21,000 Speaker 1: came into possession of the tombstone of Frankie Lyman, the 262 00:17:21,040 --> 00:17:25,679 Speaker 1: singer of Frankie Lymon and the Teenagers. Frankie Lyman is 263 00:17:25,680 --> 00:17:29,399 Speaker 1: one of the architects of American music. The story of 264 00:17:29,400 --> 00:17:32,240 Speaker 1: Frankie Lymon's tombstone and how it ended up in Gary's 265 00:17:32,320 --> 00:17:34,720 Speaker 1: museum is such a good one we'll be offering it 266 00:17:34,760 --> 00:17:37,360 Speaker 1: up as a bonus episode. Make sure to check out 267 00:17:37,359 --> 00:17:44,399 Speaker 1: Frankie Lymon's Tombstone Blues available in this podcast feed. I 268 00:17:44,520 --> 00:17:45,960 Speaker 1: know that if I'm going to get to the heart 269 00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:49,000 Speaker 1: of Bay City's connection to the fake zombies. Gary will 270 00:17:49,080 --> 00:17:53,520 Speaker 1: lead me there. When I first found that black and 271 00:17:53,560 --> 00:17:56,679 Speaker 1: white promo shot of the original zombies, I felt like 272 00:17:56,720 --> 00:18:00,800 Speaker 1: I'd stumbled onto something, But I didn't know how that 273 00:18:00,880 --> 00:18:03,920 Speaker 1: Bay City address on the bottom fit into it. Why 274 00:18:03,960 --> 00:18:06,920 Speaker 1: were the Texas Zombies being managed by a company in Michigan. 275 00:18:08,440 --> 00:18:12,240 Speaker 1: Somewhere in his archive of forgotten Michigan musicians, Gary had 276 00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:14,919 Speaker 1: that same black and white photo, the one with the 277 00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:18,000 Speaker 1: cowboy hats. It was the first real connection I found 278 00:18:18,040 --> 00:18:24,560 Speaker 1: between Texas and Bay City. Throughout this whole saga, I've 279 00:18:24,560 --> 00:18:26,680 Speaker 1: gotten close to hearing the real story of the fake 280 00:18:26,760 --> 00:18:29,520 Speaker 1: zombies from the people who lived in There was an 281 00:18:29,560 --> 00:18:32,600 Speaker 1: email from Dusty Hill before he passed away, confirming that 282 00:18:32,600 --> 00:18:37,160 Speaker 1: he was in fact a fake zombie. I traded messages 283 00:18:37,200 --> 00:18:40,320 Speaker 1: in a few phone calls with Mark Ramsey too. He 284 00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:43,359 Speaker 1: told me just enough to write an article about the story, 285 00:18:43,960 --> 00:18:46,560 Speaker 1: But I always knew Mark was holding back, and it's 286 00:18:46,560 --> 00:18:48,119 Speaker 1: one of my great regrets that I never got to 287 00:18:48,160 --> 00:18:50,320 Speaker 1: meet Mark face to face before he passed away in 288 00:18:50,359 --> 00:18:55,040 Speaker 1: twenty seventeen. Seed passed away in nineteen eighty. Now there's 289 00:18:55,080 --> 00:18:58,399 Speaker 1: only one living member of the Texas zombies Frank Beard 290 00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:01,120 Speaker 1: and getting him to talk to me is a dead end. 291 00:19:01,160 --> 00:19:09,760 Speaker 1: So far, through all the setbacks and vanishing history, Gary 292 00:19:09,760 --> 00:19:12,440 Speaker 1: and I never stopped looking for the fake zombies, and 293 00:19:12,560 --> 00:19:15,320 Speaker 1: for the first time in years, we have new leads. 294 00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:22,960 Speaker 1: That's why I'm here in Bay City. Inside the Michigan 295 00:19:23,040 --> 00:19:25,919 Speaker 1: Rock and Roll Legends Museum. There are also tributes to 296 00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:29,800 Speaker 1: bands you've never heard of, artists who released one incredible single, 297 00:19:29,960 --> 00:19:33,600 Speaker 1: field nightclubs for a few years, and then disappeared. If 298 00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:37,120 Speaker 1: not for Gary, their stories, like that of the Texas Zombies, 299 00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:41,520 Speaker 1: would be lost. So I'm hearing Gary's museum going down 300 00:19:41,520 --> 00:19:47,760 Speaker 1: every rabbit hole I can. I've been making phone calls 301 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:51,119 Speaker 1: and sending emails waiting to hear back from leads. Gary 302 00:19:51,119 --> 00:19:54,199 Speaker 1: and I found people who might have been on this 303 00:19:54,320 --> 00:19:59,280 Speaker 1: fake Zombies tour. A road manager, a guitar tech, a 304 00:19:59,359 --> 00:20:09,080 Speaker 1: Delta Promote employee. While I wait for responses, Gary suggests 305 00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:14,040 Speaker 1: I talked to a local historian named Sam Fitzpatrick. Sam 306 00:20:14,119 --> 00:20:16,200 Speaker 1: might not be able to help me find a fake zombie, 307 00:20:17,000 --> 00:20:19,159 Speaker 1: but he might help me understand how the fake zombie 308 00:20:19,200 --> 00:20:21,919 Speaker 1: scheme could only happen in a little, smelly town like 309 00:20:21,960 --> 00:20:26,560 Speaker 1: Bay City. As I leave the second floor of the 310 00:20:26,600 --> 00:20:30,480 Speaker 1: museum and wander through the more traditional exhibits downstairs, I 311 00:20:30,560 --> 00:20:35,800 Speaker 1: noticed something new, an exhibit dedicated to Bay City's other history. 312 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:40,440 Speaker 1: Back when Michigan was still killing it in the logging 313 00:20:40,520 --> 00:20:44,240 Speaker 1: and trapping industries, Bay City was the town where people 314 00:20:44,240 --> 00:20:48,560 Speaker 1: came to let loose. The god fearing members of the 315 00:20:48,600 --> 00:20:51,280 Speaker 1: population even had a nickname for the lawless stretch of 316 00:20:51,320 --> 00:20:56,040 Speaker 1: downtown bay City where the worst transgressions occurred. They called 317 00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:57,120 Speaker 1: it Hell's half Mile. 318 00:20:57,560 --> 00:21:08,560 Speaker 4: Stories of lumberjacks, fight deaths, brawls, police beating people up, prostitution, murder, scandal. 319 00:21:08,760 --> 00:21:10,480 Speaker 1: That's Sam, the local historian. 320 00:21:10,680 --> 00:21:12,520 Speaker 4: Might lose a body part, you might die. 321 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:15,720 Speaker 1: He tells me about Bay City's reputation for debauchery in 322 00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:19,639 Speaker 1: the late nineteenth century, a subject he clearly loves talking about. 323 00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:24,600 Speaker 4: Yes, Yes, yes, and a boom town in the nineteenth 324 00:21:24,600 --> 00:21:27,680 Speaker 4: century that had a lot of wealthy people from the 325 00:21:27,720 --> 00:21:31,760 Speaker 4: lumbering industry. But if you were the everyday working class, 326 00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:35,080 Speaker 4: grinding your teeth person in the sawmills, the shipyards, the 327 00:21:35,119 --> 00:21:39,520 Speaker 4: coal mines, the farms, and the lumberjacks of North coming down. 328 00:21:40,040 --> 00:21:43,480 Speaker 4: So this district was like this all year round. But 329 00:21:43,600 --> 00:21:46,040 Speaker 4: during that spring thaw, it was like the bloody Marty Grass. 330 00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:48,280 Speaker 4: It was like a bloody spring break. 331 00:21:49,119 --> 00:21:50,800 Speaker 1: Bay City was the kind of town where you might 332 00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:53,040 Speaker 1: get your nose chewed off or see a man fight 333 00:21:53,080 --> 00:21:55,800 Speaker 1: a pig. And it wasn't just a few bad apples. 334 00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:58,119 Speaker 1: There were people coming from all corners of the region 335 00:21:58,160 --> 00:22:00,520 Speaker 1: to experience everything Bay City had to offer. 336 00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:05,960 Speaker 4: So, in an already thriving lumbertown with this very salacious district, 337 00:22:06,600 --> 00:22:09,560 Speaker 4: about five thousand extra lumbermen would come down during our 338 00:22:09,600 --> 00:22:12,919 Speaker 4: spring claw in this one small area. They spent all 339 00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:15,600 Speaker 4: their money in about two weeks time. It was just 340 00:22:15,600 --> 00:22:18,399 Speaker 4: a free for all. It was like the Okay Corral 341 00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:18,919 Speaker 4: on Crack. 342 00:22:19,760 --> 00:22:23,320 Speaker 1: Bay City was a wild place, and luckily Sam has 343 00:22:23,359 --> 00:22:23,960 Speaker 1: the details. 344 00:22:24,040 --> 00:22:27,080 Speaker 4: I have another story of people getting body parts showed off. 345 00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:30,280 Speaker 4: Clearly I need to hear that story. There was a 346 00:22:30,280 --> 00:22:32,359 Speaker 4: guy who went to a bar over on Third Street. 347 00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:34,920 Speaker 4: This guy lunched at him when he walked into the 348 00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:37,399 Speaker 4: bar and clamped his teeth onto his nose and bit 349 00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:39,720 Speaker 4: a portion of it off. They saved it by wrapping 350 00:22:39,760 --> 00:22:42,560 Speaker 4: it up at a napkin. There was also another guy 351 00:22:42,640 --> 00:22:44,880 Speaker 4: who has lip fitting off in this fight that took 352 00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:45,560 Speaker 4: a weird. 353 00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:49,600 Speaker 1: Turn, and apparently one of these Bay City saloons was 354 00:22:49,680 --> 00:22:50,720 Speaker 1: running a fight club. 355 00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:54,439 Speaker 4: Supposedly there was a secret sporting room where a drunken 356 00:22:54,520 --> 00:22:56,919 Speaker 4: lumberman would face off in front of crowds of other 357 00:22:57,040 --> 00:23:00,480 Speaker 4: drunken lumbermen, or not just lumberman, but any buddy with 358 00:23:00,560 --> 00:23:03,639 Speaker 4: money and a drink, and they would just place bets 359 00:23:03,720 --> 00:23:07,520 Speaker 4: on guys fighting. And there was a guy there who 360 00:23:07,560 --> 00:23:10,199 Speaker 4: took things to an extreme. He didn't fight people, he 361 00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:13,320 Speaker 4: fought animals. He was called Patty the Pig or Patty 362 00:23:13,359 --> 00:23:16,920 Speaker 4: the Dog. He was an Irish guy, and when he 363 00:23:16,960 --> 00:23:18,920 Speaker 4: would get drunk and for the right price, he would 364 00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:22,320 Speaker 4: get down on all fours dogs, rats, chickens. 365 00:23:22,480 --> 00:23:26,200 Speaker 1: Eventually, the wild West like behavior that defined Bay City 366 00:23:26,640 --> 00:23:29,560 Speaker 1: would give way to modern life, and civility would win out. 367 00:23:30,840 --> 00:23:33,960 Speaker 1: Bars and brothels replaced by department stores and mom and 368 00:23:34,000 --> 00:23:38,560 Speaker 1: pop businesses. Hard drinking, hard living frontiersmen were replaced by 369 00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:42,120 Speaker 1: factory workers with families looking to start a better life. 370 00:23:43,800 --> 00:24:01,600 Speaker 1: So what changed the State of Michigan might have stayed 371 00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:04,200 Speaker 1: a collection of backwoods hovels like Bay City in the 372 00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:08,600 Speaker 1: early twentieth century, but Ford, Chrysler and General motors had 373 00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:10,440 Speaker 1: other plans. Here's Sam again. 374 00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:15,439 Speaker 4: In industrial towns like Bay City, Sagonauflin, and Detroit, you 375 00:24:15,720 --> 00:24:18,760 Speaker 4: had a new emerging culture. You had emerging scenes. 376 00:24:19,280 --> 00:24:22,639 Speaker 1: When the auto industry exploded and Bay City's residents went 377 00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:26,040 Speaker 1: to work in factories making spark plugs and steering columns, 378 00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:29,520 Speaker 1: there was suddenly a lot of money going around. 379 00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:33,879 Speaker 4: A lot of kids were gifted instruments as Christmas gifts 380 00:24:33,880 --> 00:24:36,919 Speaker 4: because of these jobs that people got, these great generous 381 00:24:36,960 --> 00:24:39,600 Speaker 4: paychecks they got from these industrial middle class jobs. 382 00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:42,639 Speaker 1: The stroke of economic good fortune happened to coincide with 383 00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:46,240 Speaker 1: the baby boom. By the nineteen sixties, Bay City and 384 00:24:46,359 --> 00:24:48,640 Speaker 1: hundreds of other towns in Michigan were full of young 385 00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:53,080 Speaker 1: people with well paid parents and nothing to do. Thank god, 386 00:24:53,160 --> 00:24:54,240 Speaker 1: rock and Roll came along. 387 00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:58,160 Speaker 4: A lot of kids growing up were watching at Sullivan Show. 388 00:24:58,280 --> 00:25:02,000 Speaker 4: They were listening to the Beatles. We're listening to all 389 00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:06,280 Speaker 4: the new stuff coming out of motown and got inspired. 390 00:25:06,320 --> 00:25:08,320 Speaker 1: And that's where the history of Bay City and the 391 00:25:08,359 --> 00:25:12,960 Speaker 1: story of the Fake Zombies meet. Before I leave the 392 00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:16,320 Speaker 1: museum and continue my search for answers about Bill Keho, 393 00:25:16,600 --> 00:25:20,880 Speaker 1: Jim Atherton, and Delta Promotions, I ask Samope's at all 394 00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:23,600 Speaker 1: shocked that something like the fake Zombies could go down 395 00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:25,480 Speaker 1: in Bay City, not at. 396 00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:27,800 Speaker 4: All, even in Michigan. If you look at Bay City, 397 00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:31,159 Speaker 4: you're not gonna look twice at a map. The history 398 00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:34,399 Speaker 4: of this town outsizes the size of this town. So 399 00:25:34,520 --> 00:25:37,320 Speaker 4: the small town that is still daring enough to do 400 00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:40,240 Speaker 4: big impressive things, or to try to get away with 401 00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:41,520 Speaker 4: doing big impressive things. 402 00:25:43,040 --> 00:25:46,720 Speaker 1: Bay City a town full of dreamers and schemers looking 403 00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:49,040 Speaker 1: to make a name for themselves any way they could. 404 00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:52,719 Speaker 1: Now here's where the musical history of Bay City starts. 405 00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:57,639 Speaker 1: In nineteen sixty four, five guys would get together in 406 00:25:57,680 --> 00:26:00,240 Speaker 1: the living room recording studio of a small house from 407 00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:02,840 Speaker 1: the center of town and make a new kind of 408 00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:15,800 Speaker 1: history for Bay City. Those screaming teenagers you've seen in 409 00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:18,440 Speaker 1: clips of the Beatles and the Stones on Ed Sullivan, 410 00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:21,240 Speaker 1: they were everywhere in every town. 411 00:26:21,400 --> 00:26:23,160 Speaker 2: I think you're yelling much better this year. 412 00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:28,320 Speaker 1: And the zombies were a part of all that. Because 413 00:26:28,359 --> 00:26:31,119 Speaker 1: Bay City was home to so many music raised teenagers, 414 00:26:31,760 --> 00:26:35,200 Speaker 1: a guy named Bill Kehoe opened his own teen nightclub 415 00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:39,600 Speaker 1: band Canyon, and he immediately drew crowds of teenagers to 416 00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:43,720 Speaker 1: his alcohol free nightclub for young people. Bill Kehoe was 417 00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:46,960 Speaker 1: a pillar of the Bay City community, a local businessman 418 00:26:47,040 --> 00:26:49,760 Speaker 1: in his mid thirties by the time he was managing bands. 419 00:26:51,280 --> 00:26:53,280 Speaker 1: Looking at the old black and white photos of him 420 00:26:53,280 --> 00:26:56,359 Speaker 1: in the local paper on microfiche in the Bay City library, 421 00:26:57,160 --> 00:27:01,160 Speaker 1: he doesn't exactly scream rock and roll impresario. He looked 422 00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:05,080 Speaker 1: more qualified to manage a bank than a band. It 423 00:27:05,119 --> 00:27:08,520 Speaker 1: turns out Keiho, despite his square appearance, had pretty good 424 00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:12,000 Speaker 1: taste in rock and roll bands. That's how he and 425 00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:15,879 Speaker 1: Delta Promotions ended up managing the first Mexican Americans to 426 00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:19,399 Speaker 1: have a number one record in the United States, question 427 00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:30,680 Speaker 1: Mark in the Mysterians. Before I left for Bay City, 428 00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:33,320 Speaker 1: I learned that in addition to managing the Fake Zombies, 429 00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:37,320 Speaker 1: Bill Kehoe briefly managed question Mark in the Mysterians, a 430 00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:39,960 Speaker 1: pioneering band in the world of punk and garage rock. 431 00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:44,560 Speaker 1: If you need punk bonafides, Iggy Pop used to follow 432 00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:47,760 Speaker 1: The Mysterians around as a teenager in Michigan, and Lou 433 00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:49,960 Speaker 1: Reid put ninety six tiers on his list of the 434 00:27:49,960 --> 00:27:54,119 Speaker 1: one hundred best songs ever written. I tell Gary that 435 00:27:54,160 --> 00:27:56,359 Speaker 1: I want to talk to the band's lead singer the 436 00:27:56,440 --> 00:28:01,960 Speaker 1: man they call question Mark. As always, Gary's encouraging, but 437 00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:04,439 Speaker 1: he lets me know it might be a challenge. He 438 00:28:04,560 --> 00:28:05,560 Speaker 1: is absolutely right. 439 00:28:06,520 --> 00:28:08,480 Speaker 3: Oh, he's impossible. 440 00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:14,919 Speaker 1: I was really even wondering if he question Mark the 441 00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:18,960 Speaker 1: guy is a hard man to pin down. First of all, 442 00:28:19,480 --> 00:28:21,919 Speaker 1: finding someone who legally changed their name to a question 443 00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:25,840 Speaker 1: mark presents an obvious challenge. Then there's the fact that 444 00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:29,679 Speaker 1: question Mark is something of a recluse. He lives in 445 00:28:29,760 --> 00:28:33,439 Speaker 1: rural Michigan and keeps to himself. Over the course of 446 00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:36,520 Speaker 1: his sixty year music career, he's been called a genius 447 00:28:37,320 --> 00:28:40,400 Speaker 1: and he's been called a little out there. I finally 448 00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:42,640 Speaker 1: got a hold of question Mark. Is that question Mark here? 449 00:28:43,120 --> 00:28:45,560 Speaker 1: And I can tell you that he is both. I 450 00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:49,680 Speaker 1: ask him about Bill Kehoe and Delta Promotions, but question 451 00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:52,360 Speaker 1: Mark doesn't want to tell me about that. He wants 452 00:28:52,360 --> 00:28:55,320 Speaker 1: to tell me about his past lives and the fact 453 00:28:55,320 --> 00:29:00,920 Speaker 1: that he'll be reborn again on Mars. When I press 454 00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:03,880 Speaker 1: him for any scraps of information on the Bay City scene, 455 00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:06,600 Speaker 1: he suggests I forget about this podcast and make a 456 00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:09,560 Speaker 1: movie about him. He's got a whole pitch, and it 457 00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:16,239 Speaker 1: starts with an image of his mother's womb Hello, I 458 00:29:16,280 --> 00:29:18,600 Speaker 1: am trying to get a hold of question Mark. Over 459 00:29:18,600 --> 00:29:20,239 Speaker 1: the course of the next few weeks. I have a 460 00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:23,760 Speaker 1: lot of telephone conversations with question Mark. I'm making that 461 00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:26,720 Speaker 1: story into this podcast, and he would occasionally reveal a 462 00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:29,760 Speaker 1: tidbit of information about his time with Delta Promotions and 463 00:29:29,800 --> 00:29:32,040 Speaker 1: crossing paths with the fake Zombies. Let me give you 464 00:29:32,040 --> 00:29:35,000 Speaker 1: a call tomorrow. We'll continue the conversation, none of which 465 00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:36,880 Speaker 1: he agreed to let me use for this podcast. 466 00:29:37,440 --> 00:29:39,000 Speaker 3: Will you talk to me up in Michigan. 467 00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:40,520 Speaker 1: I suggest that we meet up when I get to 468 00:29:40,560 --> 00:29:43,720 Speaker 1: Bay City, and he half heartily agrees that sounds amazing, 469 00:29:43,800 --> 00:29:44,960 Speaker 1: but that meeting never happens. 470 00:29:45,120 --> 00:29:46,520 Speaker 4: Talk soon, okay, Bane. 471 00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:51,200 Speaker 1: Question Mark is and will remain a mystery. I'd expect 472 00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:53,320 Speaker 1: nothing less from a man who claims to be from 473 00:29:53,360 --> 00:29:56,120 Speaker 1: outer space and helped invent punk music as we know it. 474 00:29:57,440 --> 00:30:01,160 Speaker 1: Gary was right as usual. It's another end so far. 475 00:30:01,160 --> 00:30:05,560 Speaker 1: At least, question Mark may not want to go on 476 00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:09,240 Speaker 1: the record about Bill Kehoe and Delta Promotions. But incredibly, 477 00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:13,840 Speaker 1: all of question marks bandmates, the Mysterians, are still around too, 478 00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:17,680 Speaker 1: and as luck would have it, one of them lives 479 00:30:17,760 --> 00:30:23,080 Speaker 1: right down the street from Gary's Museum in Bay City. 480 00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:25,280 Speaker 2: Oh you know what, I can't live five minutes from Man. 481 00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:30,120 Speaker 1: When I get to Bay City, I have a chance 482 00:30:30,160 --> 00:30:33,880 Speaker 1: to sit down with Bobby Balderama, guitarist and founding member 483 00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:37,479 Speaker 1: of question Mark and the Mysterians. There's a little bit 484 00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:40,920 Speaker 1: of magic in Bobby's story and some incredible, almost cosmic timing, 485 00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:43,040 Speaker 1: And to be sitting in a room in the Bay 486 00:30:43,080 --> 00:30:47,000 Speaker 1: City Historical Society hearing him tell it feels kind of unbelievable. 487 00:30:48,440 --> 00:30:51,240 Speaker 1: Like a lot of Mexican immigrants in Texas, Bobby's family 488 00:30:51,280 --> 00:30:54,360 Speaker 1: moved to Michigan in search of a better life. There 489 00:30:54,360 --> 00:30:57,600 Speaker 1: were jobs to be found in the manufacturing plants popping 490 00:30:57,640 --> 00:31:01,680 Speaker 1: up throughout the state. The Balderama settled down not too 491 00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:05,280 Speaker 1: far from Bay City. His dad got a job with 492 00:31:05,360 --> 00:31:09,320 Speaker 1: General Motors. Music was the real family business. 493 00:31:10,560 --> 00:31:13,920 Speaker 5: My family were guitar players and accordion players from a 494 00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:17,400 Speaker 5: you know, a Hispanic family. And I had our cousins 495 00:31:17,440 --> 00:31:20,480 Speaker 5: down in Texas and we used to pick cotton. Guy 496 00:31:20,520 --> 00:31:24,040 Speaker 5: had cousins that were really fantastic musicians. 497 00:31:24,080 --> 00:31:24,280 Speaker 2: You know. 498 00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:27,320 Speaker 5: I was influenced by them and my dad he played 499 00:31:27,400 --> 00:31:30,200 Speaker 5: my brother. So it was a family thing, you know. 500 00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:34,120 Speaker 1: Eventually, Bobby decided to try to find people his own 501 00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:34,880 Speaker 1: age to play with. 502 00:31:36,040 --> 00:31:38,960 Speaker 5: And then when I was twelve years old, I decided, 503 00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:41,800 Speaker 5: you know, I wanted to start playing jamming with somebody. 504 00:31:41,840 --> 00:31:42,080 Speaker 3: So me. 505 00:31:42,320 --> 00:31:44,520 Speaker 1: He didn't have to look too far to find that somebody. 506 00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:47,959 Speaker 1: He recruited his nephew, Larry Borgis on bass. 507 00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:51,360 Speaker 5: Me and my nephew Larry started jamming, and then my 508 00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:54,440 Speaker 5: sister said, you know, you guys just started baying, you know, 509 00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:56,720 Speaker 5: and I told Larry, I said, she's right, you know. 510 00:31:57,400 --> 00:32:01,600 Speaker 5: So I started looking for a drummer, you know, and 511 00:32:01,640 --> 00:32:03,880 Speaker 5: we got a drummer was Robert Martinez. 512 00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:08,720 Speaker 1: Bobby, his nephew Larry, and Robert Martinez started playing together. 513 00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:11,560 Speaker 1: It was the early sixties and the boys, still not 514 00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:14,520 Speaker 1: even in their teens, moved away from the Mexican music 515 00:32:14,560 --> 00:32:17,080 Speaker 1: their family played towards the pop music at the time. 516 00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:21,280 Speaker 5: We were learning the Ventures, you know, Duayne Eddie. We 517 00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:25,400 Speaker 5: were doing instrumentals and that was my favorite. I love instrumentals. 518 00:32:25,880 --> 00:32:28,520 Speaker 5: And so we started playing out and people started saying, well, 519 00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:30,840 Speaker 5: who sings in the band, you know, and we go, well, 520 00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:33,320 Speaker 5: we we're an instrumental band. Well, you know, it's starting 521 00:32:33,320 --> 00:32:35,800 Speaker 5: to go out, you know, and when the beatles and 522 00:32:35,800 --> 00:32:39,000 Speaker 5: the rolling singers started coming in, you know. So I 523 00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:41,240 Speaker 5: told the guy, I said, we need a singer. We 524 00:32:41,360 --> 00:32:43,440 Speaker 5: definitely need a singer. I don't want to be a singer. 525 00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:47,040 Speaker 5: I just want to play my guitar. So Robert said, well, 526 00:32:47,040 --> 00:32:47,920 Speaker 5: my brother sings. 527 00:32:48,960 --> 00:32:50,800 Speaker 1: This is where that little bit of magic comes in. 528 00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:54,520 Speaker 1: Robert Martinez. His brother is question Mark. 529 00:32:55,120 --> 00:32:56,240 Speaker 2: I said, what, you bring them over? 530 00:32:56,280 --> 00:32:56,440 Speaker 3: You know. 531 00:32:56,560 --> 00:32:58,400 Speaker 5: She brought them over to the farm, you know, and 532 00:32:58,440 --> 00:33:01,680 Speaker 5: we checked them out, and I was impressed. He was 533 00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:07,520 Speaker 5: definitely a great dancer, amazing dancer. I mean he could 534 00:33:08,200 --> 00:33:10,000 Speaker 5: dance circles around Mick Jaggery. 535 00:33:10,760 --> 00:33:13,160 Speaker 1: In my conversations with question Mark, he told me that 536 00:33:13,200 --> 00:33:16,120 Speaker 1: it was his dancing more than his incredible voice that 537 00:33:16,160 --> 00:33:18,760 Speaker 1: made him a star. Bobby saw it too. 538 00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:22,120 Speaker 5: Question My dances, you know, he kind of danced like 539 00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:24,320 Speaker 5: a girl, you know, I mean his hips and everything 540 00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:26,440 Speaker 5: manages all over the place, you know, and he would 541 00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:29,720 Speaker 5: do the splits and everything. Yeah, he was crazy, man, 542 00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:30,520 Speaker 5: I said, yeah. 543 00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:30,840 Speaker 3: Man. 544 00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:34,920 Speaker 1: With their frontman in place, naturally, the four piece needed 545 00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:35,440 Speaker 1: a band name. 546 00:33:40,560 --> 00:33:44,080 Speaker 2: You are now inside a flying saucer. Our destination the 547 00:33:44,120 --> 00:33:44,720 Speaker 2: planet Earth. 548 00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:46,440 Speaker 1: We are the Mesterian. 549 00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:49,440 Speaker 5: We used to practice on Saturday afternoons and we would 550 00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:53,760 Speaker 5: watch this Japanese show Godzella, you know in the afternoon, 551 00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:56,680 Speaker 5: you know, the horror movies in the afternoon on Saturday afternoon. 552 00:33:57,000 --> 00:33:59,120 Speaker 5: And one day we were watching it and there was these 553 00:33:59,160 --> 00:34:02,800 Speaker 5: aliens they were attacking Earth, you know, and it was 554 00:34:02,840 --> 00:34:04,480 Speaker 5: they were called the Mysterians. 555 00:34:05,640 --> 00:34:08,399 Speaker 1: But the boys, still not old enough to drive, didn't 556 00:34:08,440 --> 00:34:12,040 Speaker 1: stop there. They adopted sci fi alter egos to make 557 00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:16,720 Speaker 1: the Mysterians even more mysterious. Bobby went by the stage 558 00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:21,600 Speaker 1: name X. Robert Martinez on drums was why Larry Borges 559 00:34:21,800 --> 00:34:26,319 Speaker 1: the bassist Z and of course their frontman, question Mark. 560 00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:32,360 Speaker 5: We started playing with question Mark, doing a little small 561 00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:35,640 Speaker 5: event type gigs, not playing bars but teen dancers. 562 00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:38,400 Speaker 1: The sci fi themes shtick worked and the band was 563 00:34:38,400 --> 00:34:41,879 Speaker 1: playing bigger and bigger shows in Michigan, but it wasn't 564 00:34:41,920 --> 00:34:42,560 Speaker 1: for everybody. 565 00:34:43,160 --> 00:34:46,520 Speaker 5: And we were playing down in Adrian, Michigan, and really 566 00:34:46,800 --> 00:34:48,640 Speaker 5: beautiful Mexican girl comes up to me. 567 00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:52,600 Speaker 2: She goes, she goes, you're really cute, you know. She goes, 568 00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:55,440 Speaker 2: what's your name? And I go X. 569 00:34:58,440 --> 00:35:02,480 Speaker 5: She goes what I said X, and she goes, what 570 00:35:02,800 --> 00:35:05,600 Speaker 5: do you mean X, you know. I said that's my name, 571 00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:08,160 Speaker 5: and she looked at me and she goes, you're weird, 572 00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:09,160 Speaker 5: and she walked away. 573 00:35:10,560 --> 00:35:13,440 Speaker 1: But that minor setback didn't stop Bobby or the Mysterians. 574 00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:17,160 Speaker 1: Eventually they became the darlings of the Michigan teen nightclub circuit, 575 00:35:19,360 --> 00:35:21,879 Speaker 1: with the influx of British invasion bands starting to take 576 00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:25,280 Speaker 1: over the years of teenagers. In nineteen sixty four, Bobby 577 00:35:25,320 --> 00:35:26,800 Speaker 1: thought the band needed a bigger sound. 578 00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:30,160 Speaker 5: We kept listening to these English bands, you know, and 579 00:35:30,200 --> 00:35:32,960 Speaker 5: they all had keyboard players, like Dave Clark, five Man 580 00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:36,160 Speaker 5: they had. The guy had a box continental kept telling 581 00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:38,399 Speaker 5: a question. But we need a keyboard player to get 582 00:35:38,400 --> 00:35:41,520 Speaker 5: that full sound, you know. And so my brother told 583 00:35:41,520 --> 00:35:44,239 Speaker 5: me about this kid. He was like thirteen. 584 00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:48,040 Speaker 1: The Mysterians would add the thirteen year old keyboard as 585 00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:52,600 Speaker 1: Frank Rodriguez, and with one simple, unforgettable riff played by 586 00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:55,520 Speaker 1: a guy who probably hadn't even hit puberty yet, they 587 00:35:55,560 --> 00:36:01,360 Speaker 1: would create a rock and roll classic. Bobby and his 588 00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:04,680 Speaker 1: bandmates piled into that living room recording studio inside a 589 00:36:04,719 --> 00:36:07,960 Speaker 1: house in Bay City and recorded ninety six tiers, a 590 00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:10,440 Speaker 1: song that's still played on Oldie's radio and added to 591 00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:14,319 Speaker 1: garage rock playlists today and just to help reinforce that 592 00:36:14,400 --> 00:36:17,880 Speaker 1: punk rock ethos that the Mysterians would help invent. The 593 00:36:17,920 --> 00:36:21,480 Speaker 1: song was originally called sixty nine Tiers, but Bobby was 594 00:36:21,520 --> 00:36:23,760 Speaker 1: too young to really get the innuendo of the title 595 00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:24,280 Speaker 1: at the time. 596 00:36:24,680 --> 00:36:26,320 Speaker 2: He goes, why don't we give it a number? 597 00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:27,160 Speaker 5: You know? 598 00:36:29,239 --> 00:36:31,080 Speaker 2: And I said, what do you mean the number? 599 00:36:31,160 --> 00:36:35,200 Speaker 5: He goes, like, sixty nine tiers. You know, I was 600 00:36:35,239 --> 00:36:39,439 Speaker 5: only fifteen, you know, I kind of knew what it meant, 601 00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:41,319 Speaker 5: but you know, it's one of the kind of things 602 00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:45,120 Speaker 5: you don't want to ask nobody because you feel stupid. 603 00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:47,080 Speaker 3: Everybody should already know. 604 00:36:47,320 --> 00:36:48,320 Speaker 2: Yeah. 605 00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:50,560 Speaker 1: The band pressed five hundred copies of the single and 606 00:36:50,600 --> 00:36:55,399 Speaker 1: hustled it at every radio station in eastern Michigan. Then 607 00:36:55,400 --> 00:36:57,920 Speaker 1: they employed the nineteen sixty four version of a viral 608 00:36:57,960 --> 00:36:58,640 Speaker 1: marketing stunt. 609 00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:00,200 Speaker 2: We talked it. 610 00:37:01,640 --> 00:37:03,880 Speaker 5: The DJ, you know, he told us, you know, I 611 00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:06,720 Speaker 5: kind of like your song, you know, tell your friends 612 00:37:06,760 --> 00:37:10,880 Speaker 5: and send us postcards, calls, you know, request so we 613 00:37:10,880 --> 00:37:13,440 Speaker 5: can keep playing it, you know. And so me and 614 00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:16,640 Speaker 5: question Mirke went out and bought a whole bunch of postcards. 615 00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:19,880 Speaker 5: Back in the sixties, they had these point cards. They 616 00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:23,719 Speaker 5: were like three cent postcards already posted. We filled them out. 617 00:37:23,719 --> 00:37:26,160 Speaker 5: You know, Hi, this is this is Mary. I just 618 00:37:26,200 --> 00:37:29,080 Speaker 5: broke up with my boyfriend, you know, and I'm crying. 619 00:37:29,120 --> 00:37:31,320 Speaker 5: In ninety six Tiers, can you play that song for me? 620 00:37:31,360 --> 00:37:34,480 Speaker 5: You know, we would listen to the radio station. We 621 00:37:34,520 --> 00:37:37,040 Speaker 5: could stop laughing because he would read them all. 622 00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:41,719 Speaker 2: You know, you're like that that's me. Yeah, you know, 623 00:37:42,480 --> 00:37:43,879 Speaker 2: And it kept a song going though. 624 00:37:45,400 --> 00:37:49,160 Speaker 1: Suddenly that manufactured interest in ninety six, Tiers turned into 625 00:37:49,200 --> 00:37:52,479 Speaker 1: real interest. The song was a hit locally in Bay City, 626 00:37:54,200 --> 00:37:57,440 Speaker 1: then it hit Flint. Once the song took over the 627 00:37:57,440 --> 00:38:00,880 Speaker 1: airwaves on Detroit c KLW, question Mark and the Mysterians 628 00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:04,520 Speaker 1: were set loose on the world. Within a year, they 629 00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:08,480 Speaker 1: were on Dick Clark's enormously influential TV show American Bandstand. 630 00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:13,960 Speaker 5: Oh Fridays for Kiers that one has to see you Welcome, 631 00:38:14,200 --> 00:38:14,839 Speaker 5: Where's Home? 632 00:38:15,480 --> 00:38:17,520 Speaker 2: Bagging on michigam? Is that where you all got together? 633 00:38:17,960 --> 00:38:18,160 Speaker 5: Yeah? 634 00:38:18,480 --> 00:38:20,320 Speaker 2: Was I right in saying this is the first record? 635 00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:20,920 Speaker 3: Yes? 636 00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:21,880 Speaker 2: Is that first record? 637 00:38:22,680 --> 00:38:25,960 Speaker 1: And on October twenty ninth, nineteen sixty six, ninety six 638 00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:29,480 Speaker 1: Tiers became the top selling single in America for exactly 639 00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:32,640 Speaker 1: one week. The first all Mexican American band to have 640 00:38:32,680 --> 00:38:36,000 Speaker 1: a number one hit in the United States and who 641 00:38:36,040 --> 00:38:40,000 Speaker 1: replaced Bobby and his bandmates on the charts a group 642 00:38:40,040 --> 00:38:43,920 Speaker 1: of manufactured, good looking white boys called the Monkeys. As 643 00:38:43,960 --> 00:38:47,040 Speaker 1: you'll hear years later, the Monkeys will play a role 644 00:38:47,040 --> 00:38:50,880 Speaker 1: in the end of the Fake Zombies and Delta promotions. 645 00:38:54,880 --> 00:38:56,480 Speaker 1: I wish I could say that question Mark and the 646 00:38:56,560 --> 00:38:58,799 Speaker 1: Mysterians went on to have a dozen more hits and 647 00:38:58,840 --> 00:39:02,960 Speaker 1: Bobby Balderrama a household name. But in nineteen sixty eight, 648 00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:06,040 Speaker 1: question Mark was busted for sniffing glue in a highway 649 00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:10,000 Speaker 1: rest stop with two of his friends. Their manager dropped 650 00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:13,920 Speaker 1: the band, and the record label stopped all promotion. Question 651 00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:16,120 Speaker 1: Mark and the Mysterians would never see that same kind 652 00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:22,120 Speaker 1: of success again. After Bobby takes me through the band's 653 00:39:22,200 --> 00:39:24,480 Speaker 1: rise and fall, I get a chance to ask him 654 00:39:24,480 --> 00:39:27,120 Speaker 1: about his connection to Bill Keho, the manager of the 655 00:39:27,120 --> 00:39:30,719 Speaker 1: Fake Zombies. Quijo is a footnote in the story of 656 00:39:30,719 --> 00:39:33,399 Speaker 1: the Mysterians. He only managed them for a short time 657 00:39:33,440 --> 00:39:36,360 Speaker 1: in nineteen sixty eight and sixty nine. But Bobby is 658 00:39:36,400 --> 00:39:39,080 Speaker 1: the first person I've talked to who actually knew Keho. 659 00:39:40,600 --> 00:39:42,520 Speaker 2: Yeah. You know, he was a real nice guy. 660 00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:46,160 Speaker 5: You know, I got along with him, and he treated 661 00:39:46,320 --> 00:39:48,360 Speaker 5: everybody with respect. 662 00:39:48,440 --> 00:39:49,640 Speaker 2: That's what I see. 663 00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:52,640 Speaker 1: Kiyo may have been a nice guy, but by the 664 00:39:52,680 --> 00:39:55,279 Speaker 1: time he became the band's manager in nineteen sixty eight, 665 00:39:55,719 --> 00:39:58,239 Speaker 1: Bobby was on his way out the door. He was 666 00:39:58,280 --> 00:40:00,480 Speaker 1: ready to move on to non musical persons suits. 667 00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:02,799 Speaker 5: I guess I'm going to go back to school and 668 00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:06,640 Speaker 5: become an electrical engineer and play music on the side. 669 00:40:06,920 --> 00:40:08,680 Speaker 1: The only thing left to do was sort out the 670 00:40:08,680 --> 00:40:10,279 Speaker 1: band's considerable fortune. 671 00:40:10,600 --> 00:40:13,319 Speaker 5: I quit the band question Mark Mysterians and then question 672 00:40:13,360 --> 00:40:15,160 Speaker 5: My Ike got hold of me and he told me 673 00:40:15,239 --> 00:40:17,560 Speaker 5: that he wanted to keep the name going. You know, 674 00:40:17,640 --> 00:40:20,719 Speaker 5: so the question My mistering, so we had signed a 675 00:40:20,760 --> 00:40:24,919 Speaker 5: personal contract between the band members that nobody can fire 676 00:40:25,000 --> 00:40:27,680 Speaker 5: nobody without the majority. 677 00:40:27,880 --> 00:40:30,759 Speaker 1: Question Mark really wanted the band name, and he came 678 00:40:30,800 --> 00:40:33,279 Speaker 1: up with an offer that in nineteen sixty nine was 679 00:40:33,320 --> 00:40:38,399 Speaker 1: pretty outrageous. So the four Mysterians and question Mark met 680 00:40:38,400 --> 00:40:40,200 Speaker 1: at a lawyer's office to hash it out. 681 00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:43,120 Speaker 5: And we had a check over one hundred thousand dollars. 682 00:40:43,120 --> 00:40:46,520 Speaker 5: That was like a last big royality check, and question 683 00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:48,400 Speaker 5: Mike said that we could have it and then he 684 00:40:48,440 --> 00:40:50,680 Speaker 5: would keep the name and we could keep the money. 685 00:40:51,000 --> 00:40:53,319 Speaker 5: I told my lawyer, I said, yeah, I'll take the 686 00:40:53,360 --> 00:40:55,160 Speaker 5: money because I need the money to go to school. 687 00:40:55,880 --> 00:40:57,319 Speaker 5: And I was thinking I was going to get like, 688 00:40:57,760 --> 00:41:00,000 Speaker 5: you know, at least twenty thousand dollars, you know, it was. 689 00:41:00,239 --> 00:41:02,280 Speaker 1: Like and who happened to show up at that meeting 690 00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:05,279 Speaker 1: claiming he was owed a portion of the Mysterians Harder 691 00:41:05,320 --> 00:41:06,000 Speaker 1: and royalties. 692 00:41:06,719 --> 00:41:10,800 Speaker 2: What happened was Bill Kehoe showed up. Bill. 693 00:41:10,840 --> 00:41:13,640 Speaker 5: I'm thinking, how did Bill Keho fit into this? You know, 694 00:41:13,760 --> 00:41:16,279 Speaker 5: he wasn't even there when we started. He wasn't even 695 00:41:16,280 --> 00:41:18,719 Speaker 5: there when we were towards the end. And then but 696 00:41:18,880 --> 00:41:21,120 Speaker 5: question Mark, you know, he signed something with him or 697 00:41:21,200 --> 00:41:22,240 Speaker 5: I don't know what he signed. 698 00:41:23,440 --> 00:41:26,080 Speaker 1: Kejo had only been managing question Mark for about a year, 699 00:41:26,680 --> 00:41:29,240 Speaker 1: but there was a contract, and that one hundred thousand 700 00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:30,960 Speaker 1: dollars check got a lot smaller. 701 00:41:31,360 --> 00:41:34,279 Speaker 2: He came in and he wanted his part. We had 702 00:41:34,320 --> 00:41:35,040 Speaker 2: to give it to him. 703 00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:38,719 Speaker 5: By the time I got mine, and it was four 704 00:41:38,760 --> 00:41:40,439 Speaker 5: thousand dollars. 705 00:41:42,520 --> 00:41:44,840 Speaker 1: Bill Keyho got his share of the Mysterians money and 706 00:41:45,280 --> 00:41:48,799 Speaker 1: moved on to his other musical pursuits. Like sending four 707 00:41:48,800 --> 00:41:51,920 Speaker 1: guys from Texas on the road pretending to be the zombies. 708 00:41:52,680 --> 00:41:55,360 Speaker 5: I remember that, you know, And I remember talking to 709 00:41:55,440 --> 00:41:58,360 Speaker 5: somebody about that, that that Bill o' keel was putting 710 00:41:58,400 --> 00:42:02,279 Speaker 5: something together, the zombies. I said, oh, wow, they're from England, right, 711 00:42:03,080 --> 00:42:07,440 Speaker 5: And he goes, no, he's putting the band together. I said, 712 00:42:07,480 --> 00:42:12,120 Speaker 5: I can't believe that. I was like blown away. I said, 713 00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:14,359 Speaker 5: you know, these guys are not going to get away 714 00:42:14,400 --> 00:42:14,719 Speaker 5: with it. 715 00:42:15,120 --> 00:42:16,840 Speaker 2: The zombies. It too popular. 716 00:42:18,520 --> 00:42:21,399 Speaker 1: That was fifty five years ago, and I feel lucky 717 00:42:21,400 --> 00:42:25,120 Speaker 1: that Bobby still remembers any of this at all. But 718 00:42:25,200 --> 00:42:28,279 Speaker 1: it wasn't just Bill Keho who dreamed up the outrageous 719 00:42:28,280 --> 00:42:31,000 Speaker 1: plan to send the fake zombies on the road. He 720 00:42:31,080 --> 00:42:33,520 Speaker 1: had a partner, a guy who seems to be the 721 00:42:33,520 --> 00:42:36,440 Speaker 1: missing piece between the straight laced Keyho and the young 722 00:42:36,560 --> 00:42:41,160 Speaker 1: hungry bands looking for their big break. Before we say goodbye, 723 00:42:41,840 --> 00:42:45,359 Speaker 1: I asked Bobby if he remembers anything anything at all 724 00:42:46,280 --> 00:42:49,759 Speaker 1: about the other half of Delta Promotions, A guy who, 725 00:42:49,920 --> 00:42:54,000 Speaker 1: unlike Keyho, never shows up in the local paper, a 726 00:42:54,040 --> 00:42:57,279 Speaker 1: guy who seemed to actively avoid the spotlight. And you 727 00:42:57,280 --> 00:42:59,680 Speaker 1: don't remember a Jim Atherton. 728 00:42:59,440 --> 00:43:02,839 Speaker 5: Yeah, you do, Yeah. He was a pretty big guy. 729 00:43:02,880 --> 00:43:08,400 Speaker 5: He wasn't skinny, and he drove a Limo or was 730 00:43:10,160 --> 00:43:13,560 Speaker 5: it a Cadillac, a black Cadillac or and the first 731 00:43:13,800 --> 00:43:18,239 Speaker 5: and paulse I got was mobster. You know. 732 00:43:19,000 --> 00:43:21,120 Speaker 2: One day he asked me to do something for him. 733 00:43:21,160 --> 00:43:25,319 Speaker 5: I say, well, I better do it. Yeah, but I'm 734 00:43:25,320 --> 00:43:27,879 Speaker 5: not gonna say well, you know, I can't say now 735 00:43:27,920 --> 00:43:28,920 Speaker 5: because weed is legal. 736 00:43:29,640 --> 00:43:31,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, he wants me to get him some weed. 737 00:43:33,239 --> 00:43:37,719 Speaker 1: Like keho. Jim Atherton is no longer with us, and 738 00:43:37,800 --> 00:43:40,560 Speaker 1: it seemed like I might never know anything about him. 739 00:43:41,120 --> 00:43:44,239 Speaker 1: Throughout all my time looking for the minds behind Delta Promotions, 740 00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:49,480 Speaker 1: Atherton has been conspicuously absent from the story. But thanks 741 00:43:49,480 --> 00:43:52,239 Speaker 1: to a little bit of that basity magic and the 742 00:43:52,239 --> 00:43:54,800 Speaker 1: help of my friend Gary at the Rock and Roll Museum, 743 00:43:54,960 --> 00:43:57,319 Speaker 1: I learned everything I need to know about the other 744 00:43:57,360 --> 00:44:02,320 Speaker 1: half of the Delta Promotions partnership. I get a phone 745 00:44:02,320 --> 00:44:05,640 Speaker 1: call from Gary. Unbeknownst to him, an old friend of 746 00:44:05,680 --> 00:44:08,799 Speaker 1: his name, Jim Thompson, had a connection to our mystery man, 747 00:44:08,920 --> 00:44:09,640 Speaker 1: Jim Atherton. 748 00:44:10,200 --> 00:44:16,239 Speaker 3: Jim Thompson's wife, Rhea, revealed that she was Jim Atherton's sweetheart. 749 00:44:17,320 --> 00:44:19,799 Speaker 1: On the next episode, of the Fake Zombies. I find 750 00:44:19,800 --> 00:44:22,560 Speaker 1: myself sitting across the dining room table from Jim Atherton's 751 00:44:22,640 --> 00:44:23,360 Speaker 1: high school. 752 00:44:23,080 --> 00:44:25,320 Speaker 2: Sweetheart, Are You Telling Secrets? 753 00:44:27,520 --> 00:44:29,719 Speaker 1: And I finally meet somebody who actually saw the Fake 754 00:44:29,800 --> 00:44:34,759 Speaker 1: Zombies play, and it turns out he had a pretty 755 00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:35,200 Speaker 1: good view. 756 00:44:35,960 --> 00:44:38,560 Speaker 5: I think they're all pretty bad for them. On the 757 00:44:38,640 --> 00:44:41,400 Speaker 5: road up and down the East Coast for three months. 758 00:44:54,480 --> 00:44:57,160 Speaker 1: Through all my travels here from the abandoned halls of 759 00:44:57,239 --> 00:45:00,359 Speaker 1: Band Canyon to the various diners, bars and living rooms 760 00:45:00,360 --> 00:45:03,279 Speaker 1: of Bay City, Gary Johnson has opened doors for me. 761 00:45:05,080 --> 00:45:07,879 Speaker 1: Gary is more than a Bay City local. He's keeping 762 00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:11,200 Speaker 1: the history of music alive. And if you're ever in 763 00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:15,080 Speaker 1: Bay City, swing by the Michigan Music Legends Museum and 764 00:45:15,120 --> 00:45:27,600 Speaker 1: say hello. If you want to get in touch about 765 00:45:27,600 --> 00:45:31,000 Speaker 1: the Fake Zombies, We've set up an email address, Fake 766 00:45:31,120 --> 00:45:35,080 Speaker 1: zombiespod at gmail dot com. This podcast was written by 767 00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:39,640 Speaker 1: Daniel Ralston. Executive produced by Ian Wheeler, Melissa Locker and 768 00:45:39,760 --> 00:45:44,120 Speaker 1: Daniel Ralston. Produced by Anna McClain and Nick Dawson. Score, 769 00:45:44,360 --> 00:45:48,560 Speaker 1: original music and additional audio engineering by Robin Hatch. Additional 770 00:45:48,560 --> 00:45:52,120 Speaker 1: production support from Cooper Malt in Los Angeles. The True 771 00:45:52,160 --> 00:45:55,399 Speaker 1: story of the Fake Zombies is a production of iHeart Podcasts, 772 00:45:55,680 --> 00:45:58,960 Speaker 1: Talk House and never Mind Media. For more podcasts from 773 00:45:59,040 --> 00:46:03,720 Speaker 1: iHeart Podcasts, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever 774 00:46:03,760 --> 00:46:04,799 Speaker 1: you get your podcasts.