Speaker 1: Hello the Internet, and welcome to season two seventy nine,
Speaker 1: episode four of Jared Ailey's Guys Stay production of iHeartRadio.
Speaker 1: This is a podcast where we take a deep dive
Speaker 1: into America's shared consciousness. And it is Thursday, March sixteenth,
Speaker 1: twenty twenty three parent teacher conference to day at my kids' school.
Speaker 1: So I'm wearing a collared shirt with buttons on it.
Speaker 1: But I keep fiddling with the buttons and I think
Speaker 1: one of them is about to come off. So that's
Speaker 1: where I'm at. That's how comfortable I am being wearing
Speaker 1: a collar. My name is Jack O'Brien aka I wish
Speaker 1: my name was Shadow and not Jack. I love my parents,
Speaker 1: but they are so whack. That is courtesy of Christy Amagucci,
Speaker 1: Maine Shadows of the Night Patar, in reference to the
Speaker 1: fact that the name a person's name shadow came up
Speaker 1: at some point and I mentioned I thought it sounded
Speaker 1: like a cool name and remember or to DJ named
Speaker 1: Shadow Stevens from my childhood in the hopes that someone
Speaker 1: would like write in and be like, you know, you
Speaker 1: kind of look like a shadow. Maybe you should change
Speaker 1: your name to that, you know. The Burner accounts I
Speaker 1: made to make that comment never really caught on, So
Speaker 1: instead we just have this AKA thank you Christy Yamagucci Ma.
Speaker 1: I'm thrilled to be joined by one of the best
Speaker 1: podcast hosts doing it anywhere, my old friend from the
Speaker 1: Crack days, a Jeopardy champion, the host of the wonderful
Speaker 1: podcast secretly incredibly fascinating, which makes him the sif Lord.
Speaker 1: It is Alex Schmad, thank you and aka the bison
Speaker 1: wise one. Okay, I'm butter Nugs on the SIF discord.
Speaker 1: Heard yesterday's shad, but immediately it was like, here's one
Speaker 1: that's so thank you. But and I was remissing not
Speaker 1: saying yesterday, congratulations smiles and her majesty. I'm their wonderful base. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's really nice speer helping him. Yeah, it's wonderful having you.
Speaker 1: I do think siff Lord is gonna stick. It's a
Speaker 1: perfect match for your just dark heart, the dark energy
Speaker 1: that you bring to every room that you actually have.
Speaker 1: I've always felt a real conflict with the whole like
Speaker 1: message and deal of the umpire and Star Wars, but
Speaker 1: then loving brass music great anthm you know, but if
Speaker 1: you like brass you can't pass on that one. Come on,
Speaker 1: and as compared to what the rebels are listening to, jizz,
Speaker 1: isn't that what they called that music? And yes, that's
Speaker 1: capatically what they call it. Yeah, jizz. Come on, guys, Alex.
Speaker 1: We are thrilled, fortunate, blessed to be joined in our
Speaker 1: third seat by an Emmy nominated host who's worked at
Speaker 1: The Onion, The Daily Show, advised the Obama White House.
Speaker 1: He's a New York Times bestselling author, delivered what Brian
Speaker 1: Williams called one of the greatest ted talks of all time.
Speaker 1: Is the creator and host of one of the great
Speaker 1: podcasts of all time, How to Citizen with Baratunde. Please
Speaker 1: welcome the brilliant and talented baratun Day Thirsty, Hello, Jacko, Alex.
Speaker 1: I am most surprised to find out that y'all sold
Speaker 1: cracked together in the past. Um so yeah, good to
Speaker 1: be here. Thank you for having me back, Jack and
Speaker 1: and good to meet you Alex. Way to keep the
Speaker 1: seat warm, yeah, thank you. Yeah, that's right. We demand
Speaker 1: a pulse. No robot hosts here, no no live meat.
Speaker 1: I'm sending in by biometrics every few minutes, just letting
Speaker 1: people now behind the scenes. Yeah, important to let him now.
Speaker 1: I've been really enjoying season four. I loved your interview
Speaker 1: with Adrian Marie Brown. Thank you, Fractals and Sci Fi
Speaker 1: How to Citizen as a podcast that makes you feel
Speaker 1: not worn down by some of the ship that we
Speaker 1: cover in in the news cycle, that's the goal. And
Speaker 1: you were there at the stile. I mean you were,
Speaker 1: You were in the meetings, you were in the room
Speaker 1: where I was, in the damn room where it happened.
Speaker 1: Helped it happen, Jack, That's right. Well, that's why I'm
Speaker 1: so complimentary. I wouldn't be, even though I love the
Speaker 1: show if it if I hadn't been there when it started,
Speaker 1: I would have been jealous and mean and spiteful. I'm
Speaker 1: so glad. Yes, all right, Barry Tunday, we're gonna get
Speaker 1: to know you a little bit better in a moment. First,
Speaker 1: we're gonna tell our listeners a couple of the things
Speaker 1: we're talking about today. Credit Swiss shares plunge. We don't
Speaker 1: usually cover like financial the latest financial happenings, but it
Speaker 1: does seem like there's something happening in the world of finance.
Speaker 1: So we're just going to talk about credit Swiss, the
Speaker 1: Silicon Valley bank, all the turmoil. We we do cover
Speaker 1: a lot of Switzerland news, but not the bankings mainly Swiss. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so you're diversifying your Swiss coverage, which is yes, which
Speaker 1: is that's right? Yeah, Yeah, that's what I've heard. You're
Speaker 1: supposed to diversify. Yeah, like like stocks and stuff. Yeah,
Speaker 1: although everything's sounds from we're gonna talk Netflix is one
Speaker 1: hundred and fifty million dollars. Romcom, which was just canceled,
Speaker 1: was supposed to be a Nancy Myers joint for one
Speaker 1: hundred and fit with a one hundred and fifty million
Speaker 1: dollar budget. That's apparently that was her asking price. Netflix
Speaker 1: wouldn't go, wouldn't budget over one hundred and thirty million,
Speaker 1: and they were like, no deal, which actually makes sense,
Speaker 1: Like there there's a nugget in this story that actually
Speaker 1: makes sense of the astronomical Netflix movie budgets. So we'll
Speaker 1: we'll talk about they're gon We're gonna that makes sense
Speaker 1: all of that plenty more. But first, Baritoonda, what is
Speaker 1: something from your search history? Okay, there's there's too much
Speaker 1: in my search history, and I actually maintain it. I
Speaker 1: don't like being surveiled, but I do like my YouTube
Speaker 1: recommendation feed to be accurate. So, okay, this is the
Speaker 1: penundrum which I find myself and a recent search term
Speaker 1: how to get between the terminals at Dallas Fort Worth
Speaker 1: International Airport. This just came out of a recent traumatic
Speaker 1: incident where I was I barely escaped from Florida. Every
Speaker 1: time I go to that state, it's very difficult to leave,
Speaker 1: and then my mere presence there is actually in violation
Speaker 1: of a lot of the new laws of that Ron
Speaker 1: DeSantis and crew have passed. So I'm a crime in
Speaker 1: Florida and so a fugitive and I try to get
Speaker 1: out and they just try to drag me back in.
Speaker 1: And in this case, I was trapped in another state
Speaker 1: with a wonky governor Dallas because American Airlines decided they're
Speaker 1: just not in the flying business anymore. Yeah, they're in
Speaker 1: the shuffle you around to different broken planes business for
Speaker 1: seventeen straight hours. Yep. Yeah, the options have become limited
Speaker 1: on the flying space. By the way, I just I
Speaker 1: was hoping that your search has you said how to
Speaker 1: I thought you were going to say citizen, Just like,
Speaker 1: what does that mean? I was like, this is very
Speaker 1: late to be googling. It's never okay, it's never too
Speaker 1: late to learn and grow, all right, So don't shame
Speaker 1: knowledge seeking. Yes, that's a good point. Or the full
Speaker 1: searches how to citizen legal in Florida, question mark need
Speaker 1: to know banging on door? What were you doing? And
Speaker 1: just like personal business in Florida or I have no
Speaker 1: personal business in Florida. This was a financial obligation. I
Speaker 1: was there actually making my PBS show America Outdoors. We're
Speaker 1: on our second season and we were filming in Florida
Speaker 1: along the Swanee River. It was a really beautiful time
Speaker 1: if you don't count the food options on the side
Speaker 1: of the road to the fact that Dotler General has
Speaker 1: monopoly on all retail space. But the people, the nature,
Speaker 1: the connection to nature and Florida is underrated. It's really beautiful,
Speaker 1: it really, it really is. I was humbled by my
Speaker 1: time there, honestly. And I was in North Florida where
Speaker 1: I have not spent really much time in my life.
Speaker 1: So it was a voyage of discovery. Yeah, and I
Speaker 1: was ready to come home, you know. Yeah, and Fort
Speaker 1: Worth didn't want to let you. American Airlines at Dallas
Speaker 1: Fort Worth. We cannot just blame the worst airport in
Speaker 1: the country. We must also assign responsibility to the worst airline.
Speaker 1: It's their hub though, right They're like, we want you
Speaker 1: to come here, we want to see, we want you
Speaker 1: to see what we've done with the place. It well,
Speaker 1: it was, it was. It was exacerbated by the fact
Speaker 1: that I've had I had experiencing some hip panes and
Speaker 1: hip injury, and so the size of the airport truly
Speaker 1: becomes like a health hazard. And you know, it's everything's
Speaker 1: bigger in Texas. Like it's not just words people say,
Speaker 1: it's like design principles for worst living. And these these
Speaker 1: folks were just determined to put me through my paces.
Speaker 1: My pace was off. So yeah, the whole enterprise was
Speaker 1: physically an emotionally quite quite painful. I did there were
Speaker 1: moments of light. You know, some people helped me out.
Speaker 1: I had fellow passengers helping carry stuff. I had dudes
Speaker 1: with the cards helping me try to move through that
Speaker 1: airport at times, so all all was not lost. Uh,
Speaker 1: And we started, uh, I guess it would call a
Speaker 1: hate group. Was like we hate American airlines together, and
Speaker 1: so that was it just feels like like the one
Speaker 1: hate group I could support. I definitely don't tend to
Speaker 1: support hate groups, but this one just feels really justified
Speaker 1: by based on evidence, and I'm all about evidence space choices. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: So I hope they're not a sponsor of your show.
Speaker 1: They are, but it's okay they I mean they usually
Speaker 1: give us a pretty wed birth, like an airship should. Yeah.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I feel like everything in Texas is just contingent,
Speaker 1: like designed, contingent on the idea that you have access
Speaker 1: to a pickup truck at all times. I thought I
Speaker 1: was gonna from goal to gate. They're like, well, you're
Speaker 1: gonna want to hoping or pick up? What do you mean?
Speaker 1: You know you don't travel with a pickup It would
Speaker 1: I actually my life would have been easier if I
Speaker 1: had a pickup truck. And like many guns, right, yeah, always,
Speaker 1: And that feels like the Texas way. Yeah. There was
Speaker 1: a moment where I was like, maybe I'm just supposed
Speaker 1: to live here, Maybe I should get a truck and
Speaker 1: like three guns and just sorry, California, we're done. Yeah,
Speaker 1: well this is where I live now. That's always a
Speaker 1: good feeling when you're traveling and your your brain just says,
Speaker 1: maybe this is just where we live now. That was
Speaker 1: because I was like, dude, it was a fifty two
Speaker 1: minute layover became seventeen hours. Yes, like we got the
Speaker 1: free hotel thing happened. Yeah, And but at every turn,
Speaker 1: every turn, something went wrong, something like the hotel I
Speaker 1: went to. I thought I was smart. I made a
Speaker 1: reservation using some credit card points because I was like,
Speaker 1: everybody's gonna be going to the free hotel. I've got points.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna say at the hotel right at the airport,
Speaker 1: because no one thinks of that. And I get there
Speaker 1: and I'm so excited, and I have my reservations on
Speaker 1: the I ben prepared for the backlash, for the resistance,
Speaker 1: for the squashing of myself. It's like, here's my reservation code.
Speaker 1: We're good. And she's like, that's for tomorrow night, and
Speaker 1: I was like, no, no, it's for today, March eleventh.
Speaker 1: Yet today, because of the beauty of time and the
Speaker 1: amount of it that American Airlines wasted, today had become Saturday.
Speaker 1: So I gets to my hotel. We were like two
Speaker 1: fifteen in the morning. I have to get up at
Speaker 1: six to try to make the next light out. We
Speaker 1: get on the plane. It's the third plane we've been on,
Speaker 1: and the crew was like, we got you. We don't
Speaker 1: know what happened with those jokers last night. We got you.
Speaker 1: And we're like, okay, great, yeah, we like high five,
Speaker 1: like we think the war is over, you know, like
Speaker 1: everybody's people are kissing in the aisle. It's great. You know,
Speaker 1: babies are being conceived, and the captain has to come
Speaker 1: on the microphone and he's like, folks, I can't believe
Speaker 1: I have to say this, but something wrong with the plane.
Speaker 1: So we're gonna need everybody to get off. Ye go
Speaker 1: to terminal five miles from here and try again. We
Speaker 1: will get you home. And at this point, babies are
Speaker 1: you know, screaming profanities. Yeah. Yeah, so yeah. Google helped
Speaker 1: a little this helping me understand that airport because the
Speaker 1: last time I was there, I saw a barber shop
Speaker 1: in it, like in the terminal, and I was like, no,
Speaker 1: that's a business for regular life, but if you live there,
Speaker 1: you do need a haircut. That makes sense, Yeah, thrown
Speaker 1: depots in there. I do remember seeing the hotel and
Speaker 1: being like, what, like, I guess I could see, but
Speaker 1: but that is a bad sign that the hotel should
Speaker 1: not be that close, if you shouldn't be like yeah,
Speaker 1: Gate thirty seven A, Gate thirty seven B highatt regency exactly. Yeah, no, no,
Speaker 1: these are not the same choices. It's been bad enough
Speaker 1: for long enough that they built bbcurity. They know, like
Speaker 1: the whole hotel it's approved because yes, yeah, no nail
Speaker 1: clippers in the entire hotel. What is something that you
Speaker 1: think is overrated? I think the the intelligence of venture capitalists,
Speaker 1: alright is greatly overrated and unpopular opinion, very popular on
Speaker 1: this show. But I feel like because you are plugged
Speaker 1: into like the tech world, and I don't know, it
Speaker 1: feels like there is still this I don't know, like
Speaker 1: understanding that if something doesn't have the VC funding, it's
Speaker 1: not like a viable idea in a lot of worlds,
Speaker 1: And just like that, it's I don't know, like, are
Speaker 1: we coming to the end of this just being the
Speaker 1: the prerequisite for getting anything off the ground is just
Speaker 1: massive rounds of like you know, tens of millions of
Speaker 1: dollars of funding. I hope so, I think so. I
Speaker 1: some of my best friends are vcs. By the way,
Speaker 1: this is like vcism but they've had an outside influence
Speaker 1: on some major challenges and failures in our society. Hello,
Speaker 1: second largest bank collapse in US history, And and that
Speaker 1: was led by vcs who are who present themselves as
Speaker 1: these like very rational actors, smarter than everybody else, optimizing efficiency,
Speaker 1: sound decision making. And these fools just freaked the hell
Speaker 1: out and and called and and instigated a bank run
Speaker 1: and and and truly rational behavior. We're like, keep calm,
Speaker 1: carry on, it's gonna be okay. Even though Silicon Valley
Speaker 1: Bank had some issues, it didn't need to go completely
Speaker 1: belly up. It didn't need to like drain the insurance
Speaker 1: fund and end up getting bailed out by by all
Speaker 1: that money. Because people took out forty two billion dollars
Speaker 1: in a single day. That's that's record setting panic. You know,
Speaker 1: you can measure the size of the panic in billions.
Speaker 1: So so these guys, you know, overfund things that don't
Speaker 1: need it. Meanwhile, a lot of the solutions we do
Speaker 1: need and climate in other areas are not funded. Housings
Speaker 1: very underfunded, and their supposed genius is also just a
Speaker 1: byproduct of like zero interest rate policies where money's free, right,
Speaker 1: and so they have to like chase the return somewhere,
Speaker 1: so they throw it into like a high speed burrito
Speaker 1: delivery by drone service and call it innovation. And then
Speaker 1: and then we're supposed to put them in charge of
Speaker 1: like schools and healthcare. Yeah, because to take it all
Speaker 1: over the tax rates too low. You know, like there's
Speaker 1: there's a there's other things to do with that resource
Speaker 1: and other things to do with our adoration than just
Speaker 1: lauded on people who got ucky it hooped each other up. Right,
Speaker 1: It feels like a lot of luck, a lot of
Speaker 1: hooking each other up, and a lot of then retroactively
Speaker 1: turning that into like a great by autobiography about like
Speaker 1: how they did it all against the odds, pulled myself
Speaker 1: up by these golden shoe shrafts. I indhered it from
Speaker 1: my daddy, right, But I don't know just in general,
Speaker 1: like because I this feels like a really good intersection
Speaker 1: of you know what you talk about, which is like,
Speaker 1: you know, maintaining hope, maintaining an active relationship to our democracy.
Speaker 1: Died at the Dallas Fort Worth Internet eleven tenth because
Speaker 1: it was a two day experience. But let's continue with
Speaker 1: your Okay, thank you, Yes, thank you for clarifying the
Speaker 1: But like it just feels like a lot of these
Speaker 1: stories that we're covering day and day out, when it
Speaker 1: comes to climate, when it comes to housing, when it
Speaker 1: comes to even like crime, that like it's all like
Speaker 1: this massive like weather system of people chasing profits that
Speaker 1: we're all just like kind of attached to and like
Speaker 1: nobody really has control over and it's just out there
Speaker 1: doing its thing and people are kind of left to
Speaker 1: make sense of the results. But I don't know, it
Speaker 1: feels sort of out of control, and like it like,
Speaker 1: how do you how do you think about you know,
Speaker 1: impacting change and like actually like having power in a
Speaker 1: society that is like so much driven by like VC
Speaker 1: concerns and profitability and just you know, all of that stuff. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I try to take a deep breath and know that
Speaker 1: you know, some level of this two shall pass. Know
Speaker 1: that we're not totally powerless. That there have been people
Speaker 1: in other places in the world right now and other
Speaker 1: moments in time throughout our history who've had a lot
Speaker 1: less resource than the average you know, us dweller today
Speaker 1: and have multiplied and found more power with others. You know,
Speaker 1: they have done the thing we try to talk about
Speaker 1: on the podcast. They have citizened as a version i'd
Speaker 1: like a legal lawyer thing, but as a like people powered,
Speaker 1: self governing thing. And and so you know, VC's gonna VC,
Speaker 1: and and not all do it in the same way.
Speaker 1: And there are some who recognize, oh, we should be
Speaker 1: investing in the people we've divested from for many generations.
Speaker 1: The returns are probably better because they're literally undervalued assets
Speaker 1: as opposed to chasing the Stanford dropout again and again
Speaker 1: and again. And then I think about and try to
Speaker 1: find other stories. You know this, I feel like we're
Speaker 1: I feel like I'm drowning in a wave of really
Speaker 1: debilitating daily news. Yeah, it's just like everything's busted. It's
Speaker 1: corruption everywhere. The politicians are fighting the wealthier stealing from
Speaker 1: there like it's just bad. It's just bad. And then
Speaker 1: the bats or lab employees are trying to kill us,
Speaker 1: right like congressor's fighting over all of that too, And
Speaker 1: that then that the broader truth, I guess, the deeper true,
Speaker 1: that there's a lot of what we look for and
Speaker 1: what we think we need we already have in pockets.
Speaker 1: And there's there's people experimenting with other ways to be
Speaker 1: so with money, you know, and economic stuff. Like we
Speaker 1: have someone on our show this week, Kate Rayworth, who's
Speaker 1: come up with a whole system called donut economics, which
Speaker 1: is delicious because who doesn't like donuts. I'm already in
Speaker 1: people who hate America. But otherwise, like good humans love doughnuts.
Speaker 1: They're endlessly you know, circular fun. But you know, how
Speaker 1: could we construct like profits aren't bad? Seeking them isn't
Speaker 1: evil or destruct dive until it is, until it's the
Speaker 1: only thing, and it kind of pushes out all other considerations.
Speaker 1: So the donut economics thing says, take an image of
Speaker 1: a donut. There's an outer you know, limit to what
Speaker 1: defines a donut, and an inner limit where there's the
Speaker 1: whole and in between you got tasty goodness. But that
Speaker 1: outer limits earth and like planetary limitations, and we can't
Speaker 1: just grow infinitely past those limitations or that's like cancer risk,
Speaker 1: malignant growth that destroys the host and then the inner
Speaker 1: circles like human dignity. There's just some basic stuff we
Speaker 1: all need, housing, healthcare, food, Yagadi's right, and so we
Speaker 1: each get those things and the latest tesla without the
Speaker 1: mercurial CEO. And then in between, we can play. We
Speaker 1: can have a lot of fun, we can fund things,
Speaker 1: we can be silly, we can have dance parties, we
Speaker 1: can indulge, but respecting boundaries to boundaries. Yeah, and so
Speaker 1: a lot of what is exploding, you know, in the sense,
Speaker 1: especially in economic stuff, is we're just out of balance
Speaker 1: and we've optimized for one particular performance indicator without regard
Speaker 1: to almost anything else, and so we're suffering for it,
Speaker 1: our planet suffering, and our ability to live on the
Speaker 1: ground that stays still under us and doesn't slide away
Speaker 1: or burn up is also at risk too. So there's
Speaker 1: good stories out there, there's other ways to see the
Speaker 1: world and other ways to create that world that we
Speaker 1: want to live in, and so I'm trying to shift
Speaker 1: my attention and focus to those instead of just dwelling
Speaker 1: on the crisis. Yeah, crises, that makes sense. Yeah. I
Speaker 1: also I just like that you also make an outdoors show.
Speaker 1: I would I would think that helps in a separate
Speaker 1: way as well, Like you literally touch grass, like they
Speaker 1: say on the internet, you go and see that the
Speaker 1: manatees are still there, and we haven't lost that yet,
Speaker 1: Alex Yo, So it's not separate at all. It's it's
Speaker 1: literally connected. You know, Jack will remember this from the
Speaker 1: early days of High the Citizen. We have these four
Speaker 1: principles of what it means as a verb. It means
Speaker 1: you participate. It means you best in relationships with yourself
Speaker 1: with others in the planet around you. It means you
Speaker 1: understand power, means you value the collective. But that connection
Speaker 1: with nature, that's that's a part of how we are
Speaker 1: part of any community. And I get to make a
Speaker 1: whole show focused on that, which isn't technically a part
Speaker 1: of the How the Citizen world, but it's part of
Speaker 1: my world, and I think it's you know, it's part
Speaker 1: of ours. And a week ago today, is it a
Speaker 1: week ago to day? Yeah, I was swimming with manatees
Speaker 1: that you're in the water. Yeah, in Florida, in the
Speaker 1: springs on the Swanee River, and we didn't know, like
Speaker 1: we have been hunting is the wrong word? Been searching
Speaker 1: for manatees with this group of sciences would have been
Speaker 1: such a turn. So we were out hunting. Man, we're
Speaker 1: on a manatee hunt. And before we you know, slarter them.
Speaker 1: I swam with some of them. Just might know we were.
Speaker 1: These scientists have made it their mission to protect these beautiful, awkward,
Speaker 1: ginormous creatures, so funny, so graceful, so weird looking, and
Speaker 1: we didn't spot. We spent all the ey kayaked ten
Speaker 1: miles searching for manatees with this biologist. My shoulders are burning,
Speaker 1: and uh, we think, oh, that's a rap. We're having
Speaker 1: lunch and we get a call there's manatees at the springs,
Speaker 1: right across from the lunch spot where we started. So
Speaker 1: they were trolling us. Uh, And we went over and
Speaker 1: showed them what's what and got some great photos and
Speaker 1: they came right up to me, and they're really beautiful
Speaker 1: and majestics. And it's a humbling it's a humbling experience
Speaker 1: to like swim with a sea cow. Ye, it's like funny. Look,
Speaker 1: it's a cartoonish creature and also beautiful and graceful and
Speaker 1: reminding me of our connection. There's a lot more life
Speaker 1: than just ours, truly, a like living cartoon character. Just yeah,
Speaker 1: what was such a fun so great that they exist?
Speaker 1: It is It is a good workfort of people's citizening. Yes,
Speaker 1: you know they should continent in you too. The only
Speaker 1: reason we knew they were there was because there's a
Speaker 1: guy who sits by the springs. He's like a big
Speaker 1: white bearded dude, and he loves the river and he
Speaker 1: loves manatees and he just like he did that. If
Speaker 1: you see something, say something like an he phoned, like
Speaker 1: the manatee team we got. Man, it's like, there's there's
Speaker 1: three of them over here, the company you might want
Speaker 1: to get over here, and uh so that that's they're
Speaker 1: you know, they were part of the community, you know,
Speaker 1: of the people who depend on this river. I think
Speaker 1: that was was beautiful. That is there's also something really
Speaker 1: joyful about and alert to come see manates like he
Speaker 1: will succeed in getting there in time. I feel like,
Speaker 1: I know, but we all get much worse alerts on
Speaker 1: our phone than that. So I yeah, for a moment,
Speaker 1: I was mana tuneday there. All right, let's take a
Speaker 1: quick break, we'll come back. We'll find out what you
Speaker 1: think is under it. We'll be in there and we're back.
Speaker 1: And I loved that American Airlines ad you just ran
Speaker 1: that with. Yeah, so well, you know, they give good haircuts.
Speaker 1: It's mainly an advertisement for the barbershops. Yeah, so it's
Speaker 1: sort of like a speakeasy, you go through the plane
Speaker 1: into the chair. You know that they're trying to build
Speaker 1: their own communities of people, travelers who then become workers
Speaker 1: for What is something that you think is underrated? I
Speaker 1: think the movie The Woman King is rated. I I
Speaker 1: just loved it way more than I expected. I saw
Speaker 1: the poster and I was just confused. I had no
Speaker 1: idea what it was about. I hadn't read anything about it,
Speaker 1: hadn't heard anything about it. And I saw a little
Speaker 1: blurb and went to see it with my wife and
Speaker 1: we were both rocked by this story. And so I
Speaker 1: think every actor in that, but you know, especially the
Speaker 1: women actors and the youngest one and Viola Davis, they
Speaker 1: all just crushed. And there's this beautiful symbolic representation of
Speaker 1: like civil war within you know, an African community, within
Speaker 1: a Black community. I love the honesty of the whole,
Speaker 1: like the way they treated the history of enslavement, you know,
Speaker 1: to the Americas and the participation of African nations and
Speaker 1: selling you know, some of their own people or as
Speaker 1: they saw them, their enemies people, you know, into bondage.
Speaker 1: That's that's like a third rail that a lot of
Speaker 1: folks don't talk about women warriors, you know, we don't
Speaker 1: hear that story. It's it was like a real life Wakonda. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I love Black Panther and I love Wakanda, and
Speaker 1: a fiction is very powerful. But to have like a
Speaker 1: factual ish, you know, representation of a kingdom that truly existed,
Speaker 1: I found to be really really powerful as well. So
Speaker 1: love that movie. Was sad that the campaign of the
Speaker 1: two Leslie thing I seem to have bumped it from
Speaker 1: the slot of positive denominations, and so I wanted to
Speaker 1: give some attention to that. It really felt like a
Speaker 1: shoeing for like a bunch of Oscar attention, let alone
Speaker 1: like just none, which was yeah, frustrated, underrated. People should
Speaker 1: check out The Woman King. Yeah, Gina Prince Biswood who
Speaker 1: made Loving Basketball The Old Guard, which we covered on
Speaker 1: this that I really like The Old Guard by the way. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it was really fun. It also like hit right when
Speaker 1: we were getting into the pandemic and like shut down
Speaker 1: and so we were like, we're just talking about things
Speaker 1: that are streaming on the data side, guys right now.
Speaker 1: And that was a really fun one. But yeah, she
Speaker 1: made The Woman King. It's really really cool. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: appreciate this tip. I'm not in the habit of being
Speaker 1: in theaters again yet. I just haven't gotten going out
Speaker 1: of and so other than everything everywhere all at once,
Speaker 1: which we stream, I've just missed all the new movies lately.
Speaker 1: So that's good enough. Yeah, well, you can still see
Speaker 1: Top Gun Maverick for the next three years. I think
Speaker 1: we're there this contract with the exhibitors, and yeah, you'll
Speaker 1: be alone in the theater by that point. But it's
Speaker 1: some things are beautiful on the big screen. Yeah, you
Speaker 1: don't have to rent the theater anymore. Top Guns saved
Speaker 1: movie theaters at gunpoint. That's very Americans. All Right, it's
Speaker 1: time for our famous segment, stock corner, Jack's stock corner,
Speaker 1: where I talk about all the happenings. There's the famous
Speaker 1: intro sound bit. All right. So, Credit Sweez shares plunged
Speaker 1: yesterday by roughly twenty five percent, which caused other bank
Speaker 1: stocks to fall. This was sparked in part by the
Speaker 1: fact that their largest shareholder, Saudi National Bank, publicly stated
Speaker 1: it wouldn't beef up its investment, and a lot of
Speaker 1: people are framing it as a piece with the recent
Speaker 1: bank failure in the US, and there's some debate, but
Speaker 1: people think that they've actually been that this is something
Speaker 1: that's been ongoing. Maybe there is, like just in the
Speaker 1: sense that these are all humans responding to stimulus and
Speaker 1: one bank failed and they're like, you know, there's panic
Speaker 1: in the air. Maybe it's related in that way. But
Speaker 1: Credit Sueee has been struggling for years following a steady
Speaker 1: stream of customers pulling their money, which has allegedly slowed
Speaker 1: but not stopped according to even their CEO. And like
Speaker 1: the reasons why customers keep pulling money is that they
Speaker 1: are constantly embroiled in scandals, which have included admitting to
Speaker 1: defrauding investors as well as being accused of helping to
Speaker 1: launder money on behalf of the Bulgarian mafia, of all
Speaker 1: the mafias like that. I mean, look, I'm not trying
Speaker 1: to you know, I'm not even gonna say it because
Speaker 1: I don't want to be in the wrong side of anyone.
Speaker 1: I respect bull mafias equally, but just ye, just the
Speaker 1: word the word having Bulgarian mafia throw on top. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and then also serving clients involved in drug trafficking and torture.
Speaker 1: So did they take a hippocritic banking oath where they
Speaker 1: like agree to serve anyone like criminals, mafio, so it's
Speaker 1: like we bank with anybody. It's a yeah, the commitment.
Speaker 1: This also just more countries than I expected, Like why
Speaker 1: why is the Swiss credit sweet bank mainly run by
Speaker 1: a Saudi bank and then also funding the Bulgarian mafia,
Speaker 1: Like like this is a real set of pieces of
Speaker 1: string across a map with pushpins that I did not expect. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it is, It's very true, Alex. Yeah, it's almost like
Speaker 1: some kind of global conspiracy. But I don't know, I
Speaker 1: guess so as we're seeing things like this, and again,
Speaker 1: it just feels like this weather system if you like,
Speaker 1: anytime I see like one of the stock channels, the
Speaker 1: finance channels, it really feels like it's just one big,
Speaker 1: like wet weather channel where they're just like, oh, you know,
Speaker 1: just responding to stimulant. There's like the predictions are you know,
Speaker 1: all over the place, and like, I guess, I'm just wondering,
Speaker 1: do you see the ideas that you cover and you know,
Speaker 1: you guys talked in the Adrian Marie Brown interview about
Speaker 1: fractals and like this idea of like small changes that
Speaker 1: can like kind of move up and like become kind
Speaker 1: of replicate themselves over large swaths of Like people like,
Speaker 1: are you seeing pick up for any of these progressive
Speaker 1: ideas that aren't just purely driven by profit like the
Speaker 1: outside outside of this system, because it does feel like
Speaker 1: there's going to be an opportunity as the these things
Speaker 1: fail more and more in the coming years. Like it
Speaker 1: feels like the economy is not in a great place
Speaker 1: for long term and so no, we we're really um
Speaker 1: as as the finance people would say, we're highly levered, right,
Speaker 1: we are in there. We have a lot of debt,
Speaker 1: and our economy and the US in particular the West
Speaker 1: in general powered by consumption. So which is you know,
Speaker 1: a consumptive addiction, Like we have to keep consumers confidence
Speaker 1: up in consumer spending up. Otherwise the whole game kind
Speaker 1: of falls apart, and it's a confidence game. You know,
Speaker 1: if we our money is not all in the bank, right,
Speaker 1: I'm not trying to stir up shit. That's just like
Speaker 1: a mathematical fact. We never all wanted out at the
Speaker 1: same time. So we can perpetuate stability based on that
Speaker 1: trust and faith in the full credit you know of
Speaker 1: of the governments that backed these banks, but that that
Speaker 1: trust is as eroted. So I am seeing evidence of
Speaker 1: other systems of trust. Let me talk to you about
Speaker 1: cryptocurrency and it's a great opportunity. And so yeah, we've
Speaker 1: got another sponsor lost. Oh boy, I tell you what. No,
Speaker 1: I you know the donut economics thing that I mentioned
Speaker 1: earlier with Kate Rayworth. That's not just like an academic
Speaker 1: out there giving Ted talks about possible ideas. There are cities,
Speaker 1: you know, Barcelona, Amsterdam, cities in the US as well,
Speaker 1: who have started to adopt a view of economics that
Speaker 1: accounts for some of these limits a lower limit and
Speaker 1: an upper limit, and tries to set up new measurements.
Speaker 1: I mean, we have a measurement of inflation, we have
Speaker 1: a measurement of gross domestic product. We have a really
Speaker 1: questionable measurement of employment and unemployment, and those are kind
Speaker 1: of like the levers that we use. And then we
Speaker 1: have a big break and gas pedal on interest rates.
Speaker 1: FED imposes and the president party kind of doesn't matter,
Speaker 1: like the Fed's going to do their thing. And there's
Speaker 1: there's a lot more ways we could calibrate our relationship
Speaker 1: with money and with value, and I even I joke
Speaker 1: a little bit about crypto. But we had an episode
Speaker 1: with this web three community friends with benefits. The mayor
Speaker 1: of that group just talking about how they've set up
Speaker 1: the community not to necessarily like buy and trade the
Speaker 1: coins and like get rich off of membership, which is
Speaker 1: speculation and kind of ponzi ish. Really thinking about a
Speaker 1: membership club and like how you value members how you
Speaker 1: recognize that value, how you would encourage a member to
Speaker 1: bring the cool stuff they want to build to the group.
Speaker 1: You know, it's like I have an idea, I want
Speaker 1: to do it. I'm gonna ue all by myself because
Speaker 1: I don't wan anybody else to get paid off of it.
Speaker 1: Like there's one way to approach it. Or I could
Speaker 1: bring it to the crew, my family. Maybe it's been
Speaker 1: a little club and get help and then we share
Speaker 1: in that it's still versions of capitalism them. I'm not
Speaker 1: promoting a communist way of thinking, though it would be
Speaker 1: interpreted that way by people who fear losing control over
Speaker 1: the current system. But there's other ways to value our
Speaker 1: relationships and to credit people for what they offer and
Speaker 1: our quote unquote economy now doesn't do that very well.
Speaker 1: We had a lot of uncompensated labor by by women
Speaker 1: and by moms and my parents in general. Yeah, you
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying, Jackie, is you should get paid
Speaker 1: for this parent teacher meeting that you're going today. Absolutely,
Speaker 1: that's yeah. I mean I told you, I do the work.
Speaker 1: I bring my own spreadsheet to show them. You have
Speaker 1: a shirt with a collar, you told us, and it's
Speaker 1: not normal for you. So you probably bought a shirt.
Speaker 1: You know how hard it is for me to keep
Speaker 1: this shirt on it. I have so many T shirts
Speaker 1: that are more comfortable than this button. So your cause
Speaker 1: playing responsible, Dad's right and exactly. So, yeah, there's there's
Speaker 1: other ways of of us relating to to the money thing,
Speaker 1: to the economy thing. We had a whole season of
Speaker 1: our podcast on a season two was all about, you
Speaker 1: know how the citizen through the economy. It's like hard
Speaker 1: to show up in citizen when you can't pay to bills,
Speaker 1: and so what are some other ways we can relate
Speaker 1: to that that don't involve like violent revolution. Turns out
Speaker 1: there's a lot of space between violent revolution and what
Speaker 1: we're living through right now. A lot of peaceful possibilities. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's really interesting. And I'm also thinking about all the
Speaker 1: different institutions and models you bring up on how it
Speaker 1: seems like all of them have less support than banks.
Speaker 1: Like the past week or so has really taught me
Speaker 1: that the government is a first responder if a bank
Speaker 1: needs something like they are on the ball, they're sliding
Speaker 1: down the pole of the fire station. They are ready
Speaker 1: to go. Yeah, that's a great observation, a sad truth,
Speaker 1: you know behind it there, you know the way we
Speaker 1: deal with poverty. There's there's a lot of people struggling,
Speaker 1: and a lot of folks are made to feel like
Speaker 1: it's their fault. Yes, it's like, oh, you don't have
Speaker 1: enough to feed your kids, you're a bad mom or
Speaker 1: a bad parent, or maybe you're just living in a
Speaker 1: bad economic situation. Maybe there's no opportunities where you are.
Speaker 1: Maybe the hoops that the government puts you through that
Speaker 1: they didn't put you know, the depositors of Silicon Valley
Speaker 1: Bank through, could be realigned. It's very expensive to be
Speaker 1: poor in this country. The amount of paperwork involved in it.
Speaker 1: You'd need a full time executive assistant just to be
Speaker 1: able to afford being poor. You know, to get all
Speaker 1: the benefits you're allegedly due and and so just giving
Speaker 1: people money in terms of you know, guaranteed income at
Speaker 1: certain levels is something that works. We featured, you know,
Speaker 1: folks who have those kind of programs running as well
Speaker 1: out of Oakland and out of the southeast of the US. Yeah.
Speaker 1: The fact that the US government basically fired the entire
Speaker 1: bureaucracy that is like was built to help you with
Speaker 1: the stuff, like with all the paperwork, with like doing
Speaker 1: your taxes as way hard you're here than anywhere else,
Speaker 1: and just it's like automatic applying. Yeah. Yeah, they said,
Speaker 1: here's what happens. You get paid, and whoever pays you
Speaker 1: has to tell the government. And at the end of
Speaker 1: the year, the government asks you how much did you
Speaker 1: get paid? And you're like, but you already, you're already,
Speaker 1: you're you're literally it's in the cloud, bro, Like it's
Speaker 1: your cloud, like you know, you tell me. And then
Speaker 1: we've created a whole industry of dodging and fudging and
Speaker 1: deducting and accounting for just for most people. It's not required,
Speaker 1: it shouldn't be required, and it's making some people very wealthy. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but it's making most of us, you know, poorer in
Speaker 1: experience and in hard money. Yeah, h R and Block
Speaker 1: are making a killing the rest of us as they
Speaker 1: lobbied against simplification. Yeah, of course, just like the people
Speaker 1: who ran Silicon Valley Bank lobbied against rules that might
Speaker 1: have prevented you know, them from taking these risky positions,
Speaker 1: which you know, stap the confidence in their holdings we keep.
Speaker 1: It's like we're getting I'm gonna I'm gonna expand this positively,
Speaker 1: Jack Alex. We are being given repeat opportunities to learn
Speaker 1: a certain lesson. Yeah, isn't that I've learned the hell
Speaker 1: out of that lesson. I am on board. I need
Speaker 1: some other people to learn that lesson. And I just
Speaker 1: I do feel like as like you know, just reading
Speaker 1: like the tea leaves of the zeitgeist. Like you know,
Speaker 1: you guys talked about on your podcast that like we
Speaker 1: are no longer at the place where we're waiting to
Speaker 1: see the effects of climate change. We are now in
Speaker 1: a world where you are either privileged enough to not
Speaker 1: be like dealing with the effects of climate change every day,
Speaker 1: or you are feeling them, and you're like there there
Speaker 1: is a tension there, there's a tension between like the
Speaker 1: conversations that we're having and the existing order of people
Speaker 1: who are just chasing profit, like the future be damned,
Speaker 1: and like I'm also seeing you know, even though we
Speaker 1: were never huge fans of Elon Musk, like his kind
Speaker 1: of embracing of like these like kind of right wing
Speaker 1: memes and talking points, Like I'm wondering if there's going
Speaker 1: to be more of a like they're going to build
Speaker 1: out a pseudo intellectual like lattice work that like I
Speaker 1: think they already have and I think it's just like
Speaker 1: getting more and more popular, this like right word shift
Speaker 1: of like the people who are in control. Do you
Speaker 1: do you like see all that stuff just being connected
Speaker 1: in some ways, Yeah, there is a connection. And the
Speaker 1: wealthy and white inheritor of South Africa is a perfect
Speaker 1: avacar for this moment. Is he really? Is he really?
Speaker 1: Is that the that infrastructure ideological It shows up in
Speaker 1: a place like Hilldale College, which is very well funded
Speaker 1: and promoting from an academic lens, anti critical race theory,
Speaker 1: anti wokeness. So I guess pro sleepness right for being
Speaker 1: Yeah we are stop woke, stay asleep, Okay, okay, Governor,
Speaker 1: the best American is asleep American. And you know, there's
Speaker 1: a lot of incentive and benefit in the short term
Speaker 1: for folks to try to preserve and protect something that
Speaker 1: only accrues value to a few. Yeah, and if you
Speaker 1: tell the story the right way, the real feeling of
Speaker 1: loss that a lot of us feel, not just liberals
Speaker 1: like concerns, all kinds of people are experiencing a sense
Speaker 1: of dramatic change, dispossession and loss. The story you tell
Speaker 1: to explain it is how most people believe it happened, right,
Speaker 1: And so there's an infrastructure of storytelling to say it's
Speaker 1: a Muslim Mexican from China who is the reason that
Speaker 1: your gas prices are really high right now, the reason
Speaker 1: that you can't afford milk, the reason that things just
Speaker 1: don't feel the way they used to, the reason there's
Speaker 1: more different folks in your neighborhood now, the reason there's
Speaker 1: no Jesus. And this, like the instability with feeling, has
Speaker 1: other explanations, ones I think are much more sound, and
Speaker 1: ones that give us an opportunity to try to find
Speaker 1: stability in all this change. But folks like Elon, you know,
Speaker 1: they are addicted to attention, and that gets attention right now,
Speaker 1: that counter narrative, that transgressive tone and vibe. It's very
Speaker 1: very wealthy people complaining that they don't have a voice. Yeah,
Speaker 1: the guy who social media network, it's like I can't
Speaker 1: be heard. Yeah no, But and he is, you know,
Speaker 1: to someone who is inherited advantage and privilege, anything smacking
Speaker 1: of equality feels like oppression, right, And so this guy,
Speaker 1: he really is an extraordinary avatar for that that psychology,
Speaker 1: that frame of mind which says, I rich, the EO
Speaker 1: of four companies need a fifth or three companies need
Speaker 1: a fourth, And I'm going to buy a vocal platform.
Speaker 1: And even when I sit at top that if everybody
Speaker 1: doesn't see all of my tweets, I'm going to literally
Speaker 1: re engineer it. People are going to get fired, yes,
Speaker 1: and the people who remain are going to stay up
Speaker 1: all night and hack together a solution so that I
Speaker 1: maintain my sense of security and value. Now that the
Speaker 1: real twis is like I identify with that. I don't
Speaker 1: like feeling insecure or less valuable. I just don't have
Speaker 1: the means to impose that in the world, you know,
Speaker 1: in the way that Elon does. And I think it'd
Speaker 1: be a really destructive world if we all chose to
Speaker 1: use our power that way. So his use of power
Speaker 1: like this really is sad. It actually just deepens the
Speaker 1: truth of his insecurity. Like you're so fragile that you
Speaker 1: had to spend billions of dollars, some of your own,
Speaker 1: a lot of other people you had to displace a
Speaker 1: bunch of work or some of whom have medical conditions
Speaker 1: and healthcare needs and visa requirements. Right, you have to
Speaker 1: destroy a ton of economic value because you're so weak
Speaker 1: feeling man, I'm sorry. Yeah, that's actually a really sad
Speaker 1: existence and is nothing to be emulated. There's nothing exciting
Speaker 1: or proud about that. That's actually someone who's deeply hurt, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: so let's give him a hug, you know it's gonna
Speaker 1: be Elon a big hug, and then take his money
Speaker 1: and give it to poor people. Yeah, hug and reach
Speaker 1: into a pocket. Just yes, that's easy, two steps. No,
Speaker 1: I that is so dead on. Like what when we
Speaker 1: were talking about times when news is hard or is
Speaker 1: unpleasant to consume, Like, I feel like a lot of
Speaker 1: news in the past few years has been about like
Speaker 1: deeply sad, unwarped dudes like Elon musk or like, like
Speaker 1: there's no point detailing Donald Trump's ways where he is
Speaker 1: that way, but like he used to call places with
Speaker 1: rumors about what a great guy he is under a
Speaker 1: fake name, you know. I mean, like, that's just it's
Speaker 1: just sad. Even if you agree with everything he's into,
Speaker 1: that is also a bummer about him. That's not good. No,
Speaker 1: I think there is. There are wounded little boys running
Speaker 1: around in man suits, yeah, inflicting their wounds on the world,
Speaker 1: and that that's infuriating And there's a part of me
Speaker 1: that just wants to shame people for that. It's like,
Speaker 1: how dare you? You should know better? Like you have
Speaker 1: resources you can you can buy better help, you know,
Speaker 1: instead of buying Twitter, buy the better health therapy platform
Speaker 1: and work on your ship, you know what I mean. God,
Speaker 1: But um, that's not very compassionate and I don't think
Speaker 1: that actually helps. And I think you know, you've brought
Speaker 1: up Adrian and Rebrown a few times. Jack, I'll appreciate
Speaker 1: that this conversation about fractals that we had wasn't just
Speaker 1: some esoteric chat about you know, artistic patterns in the world,
Speaker 1: but there's there's some mathematical realities that like very small
Speaker 1: level patterns repeat at very large scales, and we can
Speaker 1: see it in this kind of AI looking art, but
Speaker 1: we can also see it in biological structure, and I
Speaker 1: think in behavior. You know, it starts at home. Like
Speaker 1: Trump came from a house, he came from a neighborhood,
Speaker 1: he came from a school. He came from TV shows
Speaker 1: where they were producers and executives who all modeled or
Speaker 1: encouraged or at a minimum allowed this behavior such that
Speaker 1: we all get to experience it at the large scale, right,
Speaker 1: And so the reverse has to be true too, if
Speaker 1: we concede more compassion. You know, these these dudes that
Speaker 1: shoot up these schools and theaters and everything, a lot
Speaker 1: of them are hurting. I heard one interview with this kid,
Speaker 1: and he's not It was a quote he's like he
Speaker 1: was in such depressive pain, and he was like, I
Speaker 1: guess I have to be a school shooter, right right,
Speaker 1: Like it was like a job description that he was
Speaker 1: destined to because of his pained emotional state. And so
Speaker 1: like that's when outcome our guests. I have to be
Speaker 1: mean like Donald Trump. I guess I have to be
Speaker 1: callous like Elon Musk because that's what you do with
Speaker 1: your pain, because we're not educating, you know, ourselves on
Speaker 1: other ways to handle it. So it's it's real ugly
Speaker 1: and nasty, and I want to be super I am
Speaker 1: really frustrated at it, but I'm also like I've felt
Speaker 1: those feelings myself too. Yeah, And I'd be lying if
Speaker 1: I said that, like I'm that different from Elon Muskin.
Speaker 1: We're still both human beings. Yeah. Again, I just don't
Speaker 1: have the wherewithal the resources to act out the way
Speaker 1: he does. And and for many of us, we would
Speaker 1: be met with a different response if we did. Yeah,
Speaker 1: like somebody would smack me down well before I made
Speaker 1: it to the Elon level of the game. Oh no,
Speaker 1: you have different rules. You have different rules. You can't
Speaker 1: do that. Yeah. We talked like all the way back
Speaker 1: on the Cracked podcasts about when Trump was just running
Speaker 1: for president. We were talking about how it seemed like
Speaker 1: this narcissistic personality disorder was the new like cheap code
Speaker 1: for American fame and capitalism. And I think we've seen
Speaker 1: that like that. That's really where the fractals thing makes
Speaker 1: sense to me, is that at a very personal level,
Speaker 1: like you said, thinking about what all the things that
Speaker 1: happened in his life to shape him into that person,
Speaker 1: but then that just getting exploded and turning our entire
Speaker 1: civilization like that, how like the nervous system of our
Speaker 1: nation into like a replica of what what he values
Speaker 1: and what is broken inside of him. But you know,
Speaker 1: we we've definitely seen in other times, like you were
Speaker 1: saying earlier, like we've seen in other time periods the
Speaker 1: opposite that, like people who have great values and great
Speaker 1: courage can then lead entire movements that have very small
Speaker 1: and simple beginnings, so and and and without. You know,
Speaker 1: it doesn't require celebrity or like the scale of millions
Speaker 1: right for us to ex experience that. We can do
Speaker 1: it now, yeah, right, like we can show up. You know,
Speaker 1: there's I had moments in my painful literally painful interaction
Speaker 1: with this airline, with this airport of you know, I
Speaker 1: feel on my inner elon like I didn't pay for this, right,
Speaker 1: this is I don't deserve to be treated like this is.
Speaker 1: This is aft Uba and I deserve and me me
Speaker 1: and and I felt that a lot. And that's not
Speaker 1: like every moment I'm all like zen about it. But
Speaker 1: there are times when I could also look to my
Speaker 1: fellow passengers and we just had to laugh. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: being I was exhausted with the fury, and there was
Speaker 1: another emotion we could tap into and feeling that connection,
Speaker 1: like we're sharing this moment together and seeing people help
Speaker 1: each other, and you know, people like I look like
Speaker 1: I'm very able bodied, and folks had to be paying
Speaker 1: attention to know that I was struggling, and it almost
Speaker 1: brought me to tears to have like someone much older
Speaker 1: than me help me with my and that's just like, man,
Speaker 1: I'm not used to asking for help. Yeah, it makes
Speaker 1: me feel a certain type of dependency or weakness. And
Speaker 1: then but we feel stronger together when we acknowledge that.
Speaker 1: And so like it was a gift to that dude
Speaker 1: to let him help me, And that was his way
Speaker 1: of participating in this moment in a way that maybe
Speaker 1: channeled his rage into something more productive, which is like
Speaker 1: mutual aid instead. So they're you know, Gandhi's great. You
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying, Like Obama on a good day, right,
Speaker 1: you know, Michelle better, But like there's somebody at your kids' school, Jack, Right,
Speaker 1: there's somebody who lives next to you, Alex, Like there's
Speaker 1: somebody maybe in each of our homes who you know,
Speaker 1: is already giving us an opportunity or showing us, you know,
Speaker 1: how to model that energy that we do want to
Speaker 1: see replicated at the larger scale. And if we all
Speaker 1: show up that way, we'll produce, you know, something that's
Speaker 1: the inverse of a of a musk or a trump. Yeah, well,
Speaker 1: so let's let's go. Y's right. And and also with
Speaker 1: all the men we've been talking about, Like our our
Speaker 1: friend Jason Purgeon was posting the other day about the
Speaker 1: idea that men, especially American men, are just kind of
Speaker 1: taught that asking for help in any way makes you
Speaker 1: a burden on other people and is really discuriated, and
Speaker 1: so like it seems to develop a lot of these
Speaker 1: negative figures being male, and also then as the rest
Speaker 1: of us, if we're male, I think it's good to
Speaker 1: be cognizant of that extra barrier we might be carrying
Speaker 1: to doing this kind of thing. Yeah, yeah, we can
Speaker 1: put some of that burden down. It's very uh, it's
Speaker 1: very weak to be unwilling to acknowledge moments of weakness. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: it turns out it's it's yeah, actually turns on itself.
Speaker 1: And so yeah, there's been many men. I'm thinking about
Speaker 1: Creed right now, which I haven't seen yet, but John
Speaker 1: at the Major's Michael B. Jordan, all these you know,
Speaker 1: photos and posters of them embracing have flowers and stuff
Speaker 1: and still being jacked. Right, Like, masculinity is much more
Speaker 1: holistic than um. Then we've been miseducated into believing, and
Speaker 1: especially you know, as a black dude, like we've been
Speaker 1: heaped upon with a lot of ideas of what our
Speaker 1: masculinity and brutality is supposed to be aka the same thing, right,
Speaker 1: But there's every every flavor of man is up against
Speaker 1: some image that isn't realistic. It's it's this hyper real
Speaker 1: and stereotypical and damaging, whether it's like homosexual, heterosexual, whether
Speaker 1: it's softness versus hardness, whether it's yeah, it's intellectual pursuit
Speaker 1: versus physical pursuit, Like manhood is all that. Yeah, we
Speaker 1: just started a movement, yak at us. Manhood is all that.
Speaker 1: I mean. All right, thank you guys both for for
Speaker 1: sharing all that. Let's take a quick break and we'll
Speaker 1: be back to talk about Netflix real quick. We'll be
Speaker 1: right back and we're back I don't know if you
Speaker 1: guys can hear the parent teacher conference means the kids
Speaker 1: are home and they are in the back expressing, expressing themselves.
Speaker 1: I think it might, Um, Alex, I don't hear anything,
Speaker 1: do you. I don't hear anything, though, Yeah, this might.
Speaker 1: This is the moment Jack just admitted that my kids
Speaker 1: aren't real. It's no, it's okay, like you hear them
Speaker 1: in your head and that's cool. He might, he might
Speaker 1: need a little rest, that's right. There's nothing weak about
Speaker 1: admitting that. Jack, Very manly of you. Yeah, so real quick.
Speaker 1: Because we had talked about the fact that there was
Speaker 1: a Netflix one hundred and fifty million dollar rom com
Speaker 1: that was being ordered directed by romantic comedy titan Nancy Myers,
Speaker 1: who directed movies like It's Complicated, The Holiday, The Father
Speaker 1: of the Bride, and the budget just didn't really make
Speaker 1: sense to me, just because I'd never heard of a
Speaker 1: roncom being at that budget. Right, it's not like they
Speaker 1: need a lot of like cgi and cranes. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: going to Budapest, Like, it's not mission impossible. So our
Speaker 1: writer J. M McNabb went and did some research on
Speaker 1: this because, like, whoa whoa can I just pause you
Speaker 1: right there, Jack, You have someone on staff who goes
Speaker 1: in researches that does before we talk about believe it. Okay,
Speaker 1: that is way too responsible. He does a great job
Speaker 1: fascinating any Canadians, so he's not swept up in all
Speaker 1: this bullshit. You know, he's got a great perspective on everything.
Speaker 1: The listeners will be hearing from him in the trending
Speaker 1: episode I think later today or nice. I do like
Speaker 1: imagining Canadian information comes from some pristine spring in the north,
Speaker 1: like some beautiful well. I always thought it was an
Speaker 1: old Canadian information. I always thought it was funny. Canadians
Speaker 1: had like some of the funniest people when it came
Speaker 1: to making observations or you know, creating characters based around
Speaker 1: like things that we thought of as stereotypically like American
Speaker 1: pop culture, and like I think there is like having
Speaker 1: that remove and just being like, well this is absurd
Speaker 1: from from a very young age is probably probably helpful.
Speaker 1: But anyways, he pointed out that you know that while
Speaker 1: the Romcom Ticket to Paradise with George Clooney and Julia
Speaker 1: Roberts cost sixty million dollars, so that's less than half
Speaker 1: of what Netflix was even offered huge names, right. So,
Speaker 1: but the thing that's happening here is in a theatrical movie,
Speaker 1: they can give these movie stars like points on like
Speaker 1: a portion of the profit. So that keeps the budget
Speaker 1: the back end points on the back end maybe, And
Speaker 1: so that's how these budgets stay low, whereas with Netflix
Speaker 1: they do not do that. And so everybody has to
Speaker 1: be paid up front. And that's why these Netflix budgets
Speaker 1: are like so wild, like yeah, so that you have
Speaker 1: to get paid up front all the money you might
Speaker 1: ever make for the life of the film exactly. So
Speaker 1: then what I would love to see from your fancy
Speaker 1: Canadian is, you know, four to sixty million dollars you know,
Speaker 1: upfront fee in the traditional model, Like what's that back
Speaker 1: end at up too? Sure? And for the for the
Speaker 1: kind of like the total payout associated with the lifetime budget,
Speaker 1: if you will. Yeah, and Netflix, the lifetime budget happens
Speaker 1: in a moment in a traditional film, it happens over
Speaker 1: let's say fifteen years maybe, So what's the expected value
Speaker 1: of a fifteen years And let's see if if your
Speaker 1: neighbor to the north can handle I would guess It's
Speaker 1: probably like in the case of Ticket to Paradise, they
Speaker 1: probably were getting each like probably thirty million. On top
Speaker 1: of like, I think that budget probably would have been
Speaker 1: more like, if it was being made for Netflix, would
Speaker 1: have been more like one hundred and one hundred million.
Speaker 1: If only we had a way to know these things, right, Yeah, well, well,
Speaker 1: I mean I'm using the Netflix's proposed budget for this
Speaker 1: Nancy Myers film was one hundred and thirty million, and
Speaker 1: she was like, I need it to be one hundred
Speaker 1: and fifty million, and they were like deals off, So
Speaker 1: they had that number was apparently coming from somewhere on
Speaker 1: their end. Do you think that that Nancy Myers and
Speaker 1: our team regret holding that line. I don't know that.
Speaker 1: Did you think like Netflix might have counted You think, oh,
Speaker 1: they'll counter yeah, and they're like and there's like, no,
Speaker 1: we're good. We actually told you one thirty you meant
Speaker 1: it anyways, good luck at h Yeah. But so a
Speaker 1: lot of people were making wonder if if like this
Speaker 1: story is almost a trailer for this future movie whenever,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, Like this is the origin
Speaker 1: story of this thing like this, it was like the
Speaker 1: movie too amazing for Netflix, and like, now I care
Speaker 1: about I just wanted they should call it watch what
Speaker 1: we did with the extra twenty really good? That's right?
Speaker 1: I mean I would watch that. I'd be like, I'm
Speaker 1: so curious, like how how this how this math sound?
Speaker 1: As a as a VC might say, Yeah, absolutely, it's
Speaker 1: it's the same movie, but iron Man walks through one
Speaker 1: time just really quickly, right, yeah, And they have insane
Speaker 1: music scory, you know, it's like they licensed everything. One
Speaker 1: of the dates takes place on the Helly Carrier from
Speaker 1: the Avengers because Scarlett Johansson was supposed to be in it,
Speaker 1: So it only makes sense, all right, Well, baritone day,
Speaker 1: such a pleasure having you on the Daily's I used
Speaker 1: as always, where can people find you? Follow you, hear
Speaker 1: you all that good stuff? They can find me on
Speaker 1: the internet wherever are found? I am, I am all
Speaker 1: of them. I've made sure. But you know the show
Speaker 1: is how to Citizen. That's the most current accessible thing,
Speaker 1: how to Citizen dot com. And they're obviously listening to
Speaker 1: a great podcast right now. So just flip that dial,
Speaker 1: like the Jen Alpas would say, and tune into the
Speaker 1: how to Citizen jam on that and I write at Puck.
Speaker 1: We didn't talk anything about that, but I do a
Speaker 1: lot of long form writing over there, and I'm really
Speaker 1: having fun exploring topics of artificial intelligence plus racism, which
Speaker 1: sometimes they're in the same article. Who yeah. Otherwise, just
Speaker 1: you know, smile, be grateful for things, and take it
Speaker 1: easy on yourself. The world is hard enough. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1: Is there a work of media that has been allowing
Speaker 1: you to take it easy on yourself? All right? So
Speaker 1: ain't no Mountain high enough? As performed by Marvin Gay
Speaker 1: and Tammy Terrell. This song almost came out of a
Speaker 1: divine inspiration moment. All roads lead back to Dallas Fort
Speaker 1: Worth in an anial airport. Okay, So I'm like storming
Speaker 1: through this airport in pain and anger for the last
Speaker 1: plane change, and I click my little air pod because
Speaker 1: I'm fancy to resume listening to a podcast about the
Speaker 1: history of racism masquerading as concerned for abortion by the
Speaker 1: evangelical base in this country. Really light stuff, perfect for
Speaker 1: the mood I was in there, you go, and and
Speaker 1: my phone was like, you don't need to hear that,
Speaker 1: you need to hear this, And for I don't know
Speaker 1: why this happened, but this song just started playing in
Speaker 1: stereo on my head, and it was like, ain't no
Speaker 1: no mountain high enough, aint no Violet know enough to
Speaker 1: keep me from you? And it was just it was great.
Speaker 1: It was a real mood. Booster reminded me that you know,
Speaker 1: whatever experience we're having, we can shift, you know, the
Speaker 1: experience of it, even a very negative one. And I
Speaker 1: found myself smiling, and I sent my wife the song.
Speaker 1: I was like, I'm going through all this for you,
Speaker 1: but I said I love you, know, and she took
Speaker 1: it with love. Yeah, gotten, if it weren't for you,
Speaker 1: I wouldn't be going through. I didn't say that if
Speaker 1: nothing can keep me from you, even this black hole
Speaker 1: of an airport and this joke of an airline. So
Speaker 1: I recommend that there's a great YouTube video of the
Speaker 1: two of them actually singing it. But you can find
Speaker 1: it on your streamer of choice, whatever you already pay
Speaker 1: for have free access to, and enjoy yourself. There you go,
Speaker 1: Alex Schmidt, what a pleasure of having you as co
Speaker 1: host for these last couple of days. Where can people
Speaker 1: find you? Follow you all that good stuff? Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: been such a joy being here and uh and yeah,
Speaker 1: I Make Secretly incredibly fascinating the podcast with my cost
Speaker 1: Katie Golden of Creature, Feature Fame and other things. Really
Speaker 1: love making that. If you search secretly in your podcast app,
Speaker 1: you'll find it. And I don't think I said yesterday.
Speaker 1: I've been writing a monthly column for one nine hundred
Speaker 1: hotdog dot com, which is a wonderful comedy website if
Speaker 1: you miss how comedy websites used to be. It's a
Speaker 1: really good one. And it has the wackiest name of
Speaker 1: come Across. Yeah. That that's great. I'm definitely checking that out.
Speaker 1: That's yeah, you reminding me of Internet Comedy of Your
Speaker 1: just with that title, so yeah, fantastic. Yeah, it's from
Speaker 1: some of the great comedy writers of Internet of Your
Speaker 1: So that's awesome. Yeah. Oh and media tip, I've really
Speaker 1: been enjoying Gilmore. Girls had never seen it. It's great.
Speaker 1: It's streaming on Netflix under the US. Nice. All right,
Speaker 1: you can find yeah Jack, where can we find you?
Speaker 1: I mean obviously little old me. Yeah, after you can
Speaker 1: find me on Twitter at Jack Underscore O'Brien here twice
Speaker 1: a day over on Miles and Jack Got Matt Boosties
Speaker 1: our weekly NBA podcast, And yeah, I've been enjoying secretly
Speaker 1: incredibly fascinating and how to citizen look at this panderer.
Speaker 1: It's great. Look man, I have a lot of fun
Speaker 1: here with a lot of podcasts, but it's food for
Speaker 1: the soul. Both of them highly it's great. Go check
Speaker 1: them out. You can find us on Twitter at daily
Speaker 1: zeke We're at the Daily Zekeeist on Instagram. We have
Speaker 1: a Facebook fan page and a website, Daily zekeeist dot
Speaker 1: com where we post our episodes and our footnotes where
Speaker 1: we link off to the information that we talked about
Speaker 1: in today's episode, as well as a song that we
Speaker 1: think you might enjoy. Super producer Justin is there a
Speaker 1: song that you think people might enjoy on this Thursday morning. Yeah,
Speaker 1: considering our discussion of capitalism and uncompensate to labor and
Speaker 1: the fucked up tax system running rampant, I thought of
Speaker 1: this song. It has a Peter Gabriel Pink Floyd eighties
Speaker 1: white guy based type of vibe. It sounds like the
Speaker 1: sounds like the opening of a modern day Miami Vice
Speaker 1: and it repeats the line money ain't no good to
Speaker 1: me and it's it's great. So you can check the
Speaker 1: song out it's called Money by Leisure and you can
Speaker 1: find that song in the footnotes foot notes. The Daily
Speaker 1: Zeke is a production by Heart Radio. For more podcast
Speaker 1: from my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast,
Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. That's going
Speaker 1: to do it for us this morning, back this afternoon
Speaker 1: to tell you what's trending, and we'll talk y' all,
Speaker 1: then fight. H m hm