WEBVTT - Our Voice, Our Power 0:00:11.960 --> 0:00:14.800 Good morning, peeps, and welcome to book a f Daily 0:00:14.880 --> 0:00:19.639 with Me your Girl Danielle Moody recording from the Home Bunker, Folks. 0:00:20.200 --> 0:00:23.639 Over the past several weeks, since that piece of shit 0:00:23.880 --> 0:00:29.160 in Selle Elon Musk has taken over Twitter and has basically, 0:00:29.520 --> 0:00:33.240 you know, thrown out the window all of the protections 0:00:33.320 --> 0:00:37.320 that were provided and should be provided by a social 0:00:37.320 --> 0:00:41.720 media platform of its stature and of its importance, we've 0:00:41.720 --> 0:00:47.320 seen a lot of think pieces and critical analysis around 0:00:47.320 --> 0:00:51.920 the importance of the Internet, around the importance of a 0:00:52.680 --> 0:00:57.760 global town square, and the fact that our government, by 0:00:57.840 --> 0:01:02.360 virtue of not understanding really truly how technology works, the 0:01:02.400 --> 0:01:05.919 importance of social media platforms, and just you know, sheer 0:01:06.040 --> 0:01:12.679 ignorance has allowed a maniacal, egomaniac billionaire to take over 0:01:13.120 --> 0:01:15.720 this platform and to do with it whatever he wants. 0:01:16.640 --> 0:01:21.000 Today's guest on wokef bridget Todd, who you may know 0:01:21.200 --> 0:01:25.039 from the podcasts There Are No Girls on the Internet Now, 0:01:25.120 --> 0:01:28.920 has a new podcast, The Internet Hate Machine. Her and 0:01:29.000 --> 0:01:33.840 I get into a conversation about the importance of regulation, 0:01:34.160 --> 0:01:38.640 around the importance of seeing platforms like Twitter as a 0:01:38.720 --> 0:01:44.319 public utility, and the missed opportunities that our government had 0:01:44.480 --> 0:01:48.360 and still has and is still making in regard to 0:01:48.400 --> 0:01:52.400 how they decide to regulate this force. The theme that 0:01:52.480 --> 0:01:55.640 I want folks to understand is that I feel like, 0:01:56.160 --> 0:02:00.480 you know, in the advent of social media, truly right, 0:02:00.600 --> 0:02:04.480 like it taking hold in the early two thousands, Facebook 0:02:04.720 --> 0:02:08.040 being I think the first, if I'm not wrong, outside 0:02:08.040 --> 0:02:12.880 of chat rooms and those things, followed by Twitter, and 0:02:12.919 --> 0:02:17.080 then you know, later on Instagram and TikTok and you 0:02:17.120 --> 0:02:19.640 know all of the other ones that would bubble up 0:02:19.680 --> 0:02:25.160 in between. Twitter has stood alone in terms of the 0:02:25.320 --> 0:02:29.560 power that this platform has had, The power it has 0:02:29.560 --> 0:02:35.080 had for community organizers, the power it has had for activists, 0:02:35.560 --> 0:02:41.480 for potential elected officials, for elected officials, for the presidents 0:02:41.520 --> 0:02:46.480 of the United States. It has been a place in 0:02:46.639 --> 0:02:50.440 real time where you go to find out what is happening, 0:02:50.440 --> 0:02:54.440 not only in this country, but around the world. We 0:02:54.680 --> 0:02:59.840 learned about activations like the Arab Spring that took place 0:03:00.040 --> 0:03:03.160 in the earlier two thousands. We learned about what was 0:03:03.200 --> 0:03:10.440 happening in Ukraine, in Iran, in China. Because of social media, 0:03:10.720 --> 0:03:14.079 journalists have been able You've been able to follow them 0:03:14.120 --> 0:03:17.640 in real time as they're on the ground in crisis 0:03:17.720 --> 0:03:23.960 situations like in Ferguson. You know Ferguson and what happened 0:03:24.000 --> 0:03:28.040 there is a prime example with the murder of Mike 0:03:28.120 --> 0:03:33.240 Brown that had it not been for on the ground 0:03:33.480 --> 0:03:39.280 eye reporters tweeting and people beginning to follow in live 0:03:39.400 --> 0:03:44.920 recording and periscoping what was happening in Ferguson, it would 0:03:44.960 --> 0:03:49.040 have never been picked up by cable news and national 0:03:49.120 --> 0:03:53.000 news outlets. It would have been yet another violent act 0:03:53.280 --> 0:03:56.520 that was contained to the community that it was happening in, 0:03:56.960 --> 0:04:01.240 as opposed to being blown up as a national crisis 0:04:01.280 --> 0:04:06.840 and incident. You look at George Floyd, right and the 0:04:06.880 --> 0:04:14.120 fact that this begat an entire summer of activism because 0:04:15.120 --> 0:04:19.000 of the ability of those on the ground to film 0:04:19.040 --> 0:04:22.120 what was happening and then to be able to send 0:04:22.360 --> 0:04:28.640 those videos out into the universe. Without a robust Twitter, 0:04:29.480 --> 0:04:32.520 we would have never had those activations. And so when 0:04:32.560 --> 0:04:38.000 people say things like, well, Elon Musk is stupid and 0:04:38.080 --> 0:04:41.279 he doesn't know what he's doing, Elon Musk knows exactly 0:04:41.279 --> 0:04:45.640 what the fuck he is doing. He is a white supremist, 0:04:45.839 --> 0:04:51.360 in sell fucking misogynist, patriarchal piece of shit. I wish 0:04:51.440 --> 0:04:56.480 I could form an opinion he took over this platform 0:04:56.560 --> 0:05:03.000 because like the greedy ass billionaire he is, he, much 0:05:03.120 --> 0:05:07.400 like his ilk, do not want the people to organize, 0:05:07.480 --> 0:05:10.400 do not want the people to unite, do not want 0:05:10.440 --> 0:05:14.840 those that have traditionally been marginalized and oppressed to have 0:05:15.120 --> 0:05:20.520 a voice and to develop a community of followers, right, 0:05:20.839 --> 0:05:23.800 Because then you know what that means. It means that 0:05:23.839 --> 0:05:27.440 those that are at the top lose power because the 0:05:27.520 --> 0:05:30.800 power is being taken back by the people. And how 0:05:30.839 --> 0:05:35.680 do you stop activations like we saw in the summer 0:05:35.720 --> 0:05:39.200 of twenty twenty, how do you stop push back against 0:05:39.400 --> 0:05:43.240 fascist regimes like the Republican Party and Donald Trump and 0:05:43.320 --> 0:05:47.400 Maga Dum. You take away the town square, you take 0:05:47.440 --> 0:05:53.880 away a key to their organizing, right. That is what 0:05:53.920 --> 0:05:56.840 Elon Musk has done. And so when you look at 0:05:56.839 --> 0:06:00.279 it through that lens, you recognize that he is being 0:06:00.360 --> 0:06:06.120 incredibly successful. Because when people like myself right and many 0:06:06.160 --> 0:06:09.760 many other people with millions and millions of followers, decide 0:06:09.800 --> 0:06:13.040 that they no longer want to spend time on this platform, 0:06:13.560 --> 0:06:17.680 that they no longer want to deal with the inundation 0:06:18.080 --> 0:06:22.799 of racism and misogyny that is now part of Elon 0:06:22.880 --> 0:06:26.839 Must's free speech plan, then it ceases to be the 0:06:27.040 --> 0:06:31.960 powerful machine that it could be, and then people need 0:06:32.000 --> 0:06:35.680 to disperse and then figure out where they're going to 0:06:35.760 --> 0:06:40.440 go next to unite. That was the point of Elon 0:06:40.560 --> 0:06:44.960 Must's takeover. So my conversation coming up next with bridget 0:06:45.000 --> 0:06:49.560 Todd delves into that and what it is, if anything, 0:06:49.880 --> 0:06:52.880 that the people can do to hold onto their voice 0:06:53.080 --> 0:07:00.400 and their power. That conversation is coming up next, folks, 0:07:00.480 --> 0:07:05.240 I am very excited to bring to Woke. F bridget Todd, 0:07:05.279 --> 0:07:11.720 who is tech guru extraordinaire, is the host of the 0:07:11.840 --> 0:07:16.640 award winning podcast There Are No Girls on the Internet, 0:07:16.840 --> 0:07:20.080 and of the new pod, which my God couldn't have 0:07:20.160 --> 0:07:25.760 dropped at a better time, The Internet Hate Machine. Bridget 0:07:27.000 --> 0:07:32.040 let me just tell you that first, congrats on all 0:07:32.280 --> 0:07:35.960 of the accolades with There Are No Girls on the Internet. 0:07:37.800 --> 0:07:42.200 It has been It's so wonderful when I see black 0:07:42.240 --> 0:07:47.080 women winning in spaces that we don't normally win in 0:07:48.200 --> 0:07:52.600 and creating room and space for conversations about people that 0:07:52.640 --> 0:07:57.880 look like us that exist in this tech space. So 0:07:57.920 --> 0:08:00.240 I just want to say, like, shout out for that. 0:08:02.280 --> 0:08:06.480 But your new pod comes at a time when the 0:08:07.000 --> 0:08:13.600 billionaire troll Elon Musk has taken control over the world's 0:08:13.800 --> 0:08:19.200 town square. And now all of a sudden, it seems 0:08:19.240 --> 0:08:22.240 over the last several weeks that people are like, oh, 0:08:22.400 --> 0:08:26.840 my Twitter actually is important. It isn't just a social 0:08:26.840 --> 0:08:31.320 media you know platform that it is really a source 0:08:31.680 --> 0:08:36.880 for organizing and activism and journalism. So, you know, before 0:08:36.920 --> 0:08:39.120 we dive in, you know, I want to get a 0:08:39.200 --> 0:08:43.199 sense of, you know, why you started this new pod, 0:08:43.640 --> 0:08:47.079 right and is it and was it provoked by the 0:08:47.160 --> 0:08:53.640 impending you know cell that now has actually happened of Twitter. Yeah, 0:08:53.679 --> 0:08:55.440 thank you for having me and that for that world, 0:08:55.480 --> 0:08:59.240 welcome the podcast. So it was already in the work, 0:08:59.559 --> 0:09:02.440 and because I feel like I could sort of see 0:09:02.480 --> 0:09:05.679 the writing on the wall, I was already you know, 0:09:06.080 --> 0:09:08.640 pitching and thinking about some of the concepts that we 0:09:08.800 --> 0:09:12.680 that we discuss on Internet Hate Machine before Elon officially 0:09:12.679 --> 0:09:15.080 bought Twitter. But I could sort of see the ways 0:09:15.080 --> 0:09:19.319 that our social media platforms were primed or takeover in 0:09:19.360 --> 0:09:21.800 some kind of way, you know, whether it's by bad 0:09:21.840 --> 0:09:27.239 actors and like charlatans and extremists, gamifying conversations and hijacking 0:09:27.280 --> 0:09:30.760 conversations about its sensitive topics or topics that people really 0:09:30.800 --> 0:09:32.959 need to have conversation on, Like I could sort of 0:09:33.000 --> 0:09:34.920 see that happening, and I could sort of see the 0:09:34.960 --> 0:09:38.600 ways that these platforms should be designed and set up 0:09:38.600 --> 0:09:40.760 to have folks really be able to come to them, 0:09:40.800 --> 0:09:44.320 to organize, to connect with one one another, have community, 0:09:44.559 --> 0:09:48.280 and that makes them these these spaces that folks do 0:09:48.400 --> 0:09:50.679 want to you know, hijack and disrupt. So I could 0:09:50.720 --> 0:09:52.959 sort of see the writing on the wall even before 0:09:52.960 --> 0:09:56.280 Elon Musk actually bought Twitter, when we were in production 0:09:56.320 --> 0:09:58.920 for the podcast that that deal actually went through. So 0:09:58.920 --> 0:10:01.600 I was like, oh my god, perfect timing for show, 0:10:02.120 --> 0:10:07.600 right right. You know, It's just I think that for 0:10:07.720 --> 0:10:12.000 far too long, the folks have said that, you know, 0:10:12.040 --> 0:10:15.679 Twitter is toxic. Twitter is a toxic space, and you know, 0:10:16.040 --> 0:10:19.840 and and there were there had been moments where major 0:10:19.920 --> 0:10:24.360 things would happen. You profiled one of them, um on 0:10:24.400 --> 0:10:29.840 the Internet hate machine, Leslie Jones, and you you profile 0:10:29.920 --> 0:10:32.600 and and I want to allow you to the space 0:10:32.679 --> 0:10:36.839 to tell the Willkaf audience about exactly that, which I'm 0:10:36.880 --> 0:10:40.720 sure many you know, everyone remembers. But Leslie Jones, you 0:10:40.720 --> 0:10:46.640 know SNL, big huge star comedian had Ghostbusters coming out, 0:10:46.960 --> 0:10:50.480 and she had been one of those people that were 0:10:50.720 --> 0:10:54.400 using Twitter in a way that was enjoyable, right, Like, 0:10:54.480 --> 0:10:57.200 we all wanted to follow her because, you know, her 0:10:57.240 --> 0:11:00.559 commentary was fun and funny, and we felt like we 0:11:00.559 --> 0:11:04.439 were in real lifetime of like an SNL skit, right 0:11:04.480 --> 0:11:07.719 whenever she would cover sporting events or you know, just 0:11:07.800 --> 0:11:10.800 do something fun and it kind of you know, her 0:11:10.840 --> 0:11:14.120 presence at that time reminded us of like the good 0:11:14.240 --> 0:11:18.760 naturedness of what it meant to build social media platforms. 0:11:19.200 --> 0:11:27.080 Then here comes along this motherfucker, Milo, the white supremicist 0:11:28.320 --> 0:11:30.360 I never pronounced his last name, right, and I don't 0:11:30.360 --> 0:11:35.200 ever care about pronouncing his last name right, comes along 0:11:35.640 --> 0:11:40.320 and creates an entire campaign to target her for no 0:11:40.400 --> 0:11:42.760 other reason than the fact that she's black. She's a 0:11:42.760 --> 0:11:47.680 black woman who is famous and wealthy, and you know, 0:11:47.760 --> 0:11:51.560 so I just want you to go into using her 0:11:51.720 --> 0:11:56.400 story as kind of the kind of anchor story as 0:11:56.440 --> 0:12:01.679 to what regular people, regular you know, folks that happened 0:12:01.720 --> 0:12:05.080 to be from marginalized communities have the experience at the 0:12:05.160 --> 0:12:11.560 hands of white supremas, of misogynists, of these horrible trolls. 0:12:12.559 --> 0:12:14.440 I'm so glad that you put it that way. I 0:12:14.480 --> 0:12:17.400 think that so often people hear the story of what 0:12:17.480 --> 0:12:20.280 happened with Leslie Jones on Twitter and say, well, she's 0:12:20.320 --> 0:12:22.680 a big star, she's a celebrity who cares, Like, what 0:12:22.720 --> 0:12:25.200 does this have to do with anything? But that's exactly 0:12:25.240 --> 0:12:27.000 the point that I posited in the episode about her, 0:12:27.040 --> 0:12:29.600 which is that Leslie Jones was someone who was a 0:12:29.600 --> 0:12:32.360 as you said, like a Twitter super user. Everyone loved 0:12:32.400 --> 0:12:35.240 the way that Leslie Jones tweeted. She was got global 0:12:35.520 --> 0:12:39.040 fame for her hilarious live tweeting of the Olympics that year, 0:12:39.280 --> 0:12:43.000 and she was like beloved by Twitter and frankly got 0:12:43.040 --> 0:12:45.720 Twitter a lot of positive attention. Right. And so if 0:12:45.800 --> 0:12:48.800 someone who is this big celebrity, wealthy and also like 0:12:48.840 --> 0:12:51.800 a Twitter super user, who is like beloved by Twitter, 0:12:52.120 --> 0:12:55.079 if they could be harassed and abused in these ways 0:12:55.280 --> 0:12:57.240 and in ways that are criminal. Right. So it wasn't 0:12:57.240 --> 0:13:00.320 just her being you know, people saying mean things to 0:13:00.360 --> 0:13:03.040 her on Twitter. They hacked her website and and and 0:13:03.080 --> 0:13:05.760 put intimate photos of her on her website, which is 0:13:05.920 --> 0:13:08.120 which is a crime, you know. So it's it's these 0:13:08.160 --> 0:13:10.960 ways that are that are go so far beyond people 0:13:11.040 --> 0:13:13.559 saying mean things to her. But if someone is famous 0:13:13.559 --> 0:13:15.920 and well connected as Leslie Jones, that can happen to 0:13:15.960 --> 0:13:18.280 her and people can say, big deal. What does that 0:13:18.320 --> 0:13:19.679 mean for the rest of us? What does that mean 0:13:19.679 --> 0:13:21.800 for all the other black women and girls out there 0:13:21.800 --> 0:13:24.400 who are using social media platforms and are also being 0:13:24.400 --> 0:13:27.240 targeted for this kind of harassment or LGBTQ folks who 0:13:27.280 --> 0:13:29.000 are being targeted for this kind of harassment. And so 0:13:29.160 --> 0:13:31.160 I'm so glad that that's how you put it. I 0:13:31.240 --> 0:13:34.520 also think that the story of Leslie Jones being harassed 0:13:34.600 --> 0:13:38.440 and a targeted harassment campaign by Milo, it actually doesn't 0:13:38.520 --> 0:13:41.360 start with Milo. It starts with Steve Bannon, because Steve 0:13:41.440 --> 0:13:45.040 bann was really one of the first people to identify 0:13:45.640 --> 0:13:50.760 this the powerful force of like disaffected white male gamers 0:13:51.160 --> 0:13:52.960 and say like, oh, this is a force that we 0:13:53.000 --> 0:13:55.760 can really like weaponize. And it was him who really 0:13:55.800 --> 0:13:58.480 empowered Milo at the time, working for Breitbart, his his 0:13:58.559 --> 0:14:02.199 publication to you know, separ had these kinds of attacks, 0:14:02.200 --> 0:14:06.080 and so again like it's so it's it's wild to 0:14:06.120 --> 0:14:09.320 me how how often this gets sort of sidelined as 0:14:09.320 --> 0:14:11.839 a celebrity story when like Steve bannam went on to 0:14:11.840 --> 0:14:14.800 be in the White House, right, So like, obviously this 0:14:14.880 --> 0:14:17.520 is a story that has deeper roots than just something 0:14:17.520 --> 0:14:20.520 bad happening to a celebrity on the internet. Yeah, and 0:14:20.560 --> 0:14:23.080 I think that that's right, And I'm so glad that 0:14:23.160 --> 0:14:27.440 you lifted that up on your episode, because what I 0:14:27.520 --> 0:14:34.040 think is is becomes really problematic is when we're being 0:14:34.280 --> 0:14:39.720 disingenuous about the actual problem. And the problem here isn't 0:14:39.800 --> 0:14:42.520 just you know, a bunch of white guys that are 0:14:42.560 --> 0:14:45.800 sitting behind a computer screen that you know, never go 0:14:45.920 --> 0:14:50.520 outside and are just using their trolling as a way 0:14:50.600 --> 0:14:54.400 to you know, to lift up their masculinity. That this 0:14:54.480 --> 0:14:57.800 is actually tied to a larger political movement that we 0:14:57.880 --> 0:15:01.800 have seen that has been wept an eye. Whereas where Twitter, 0:15:02.280 --> 0:15:05.760 for instance, in particular, of all the platforms, has been 0:15:05.800 --> 0:15:12.240 weaponized um by really fragile white men such as Donald Trump, 0:15:12.400 --> 0:15:16.480 such as Elon Musk m and others who get on 0:15:16.560 --> 0:15:20.240 there are their grievances, stir up their and their inseell 0:15:20.600 --> 0:15:26.880 you know, uh bots to target and to shut down discourse. 0:15:27.000 --> 0:15:28.760 And so one of the questions that I want to 0:15:28.800 --> 0:15:32.680 ask to you is the past couple of weeks that 0:15:32.760 --> 0:15:35.840 I have gone on you know, to your former your 0:15:35.880 --> 0:15:40.200 former outlet to MSNBC and you know, and been and 0:15:40.280 --> 0:15:43.200 we're talking about Elon Musk and they're like, oh, Danielle, 0:15:43.360 --> 0:15:46.800 so you know, he's a spectacular failure and all of 0:15:46.840 --> 0:15:48.920 these things. And I said, what is it that makes 0:15:48.960 --> 0:15:52.360 you all think that he's failing? Right? And so my question, 0:15:52.520 --> 0:15:57.400 my question to you is, you know, as you're watching 0:15:58.080 --> 0:16:02.400 daily the headlines and following the headlines about Twitter, about 0:16:02.440 --> 0:16:06.960 advertisers pulling out, about you know, different attack tweets that 0:16:07.120 --> 0:16:10.200 Musk is putting out targeting you know, whether it's a 0:16:10.440 --> 0:16:16.840 representative Alexandria Cassio Cortez or others, what do you make 0:16:17.080 --> 0:16:21.560 of the narrative that is being spun around what he 0:16:21.760 --> 0:16:25.920 is doing. Yeah, that's such a great question. I think 0:16:25.920 --> 0:16:29.160 that that idea that oh, this must be like can 0:16:29.200 --> 0:16:31.840 you believe this spectacular failure? I do think that that 0:16:32.080 --> 0:16:34.840 in part is rooted in this idea that we need 0:16:34.920 --> 0:16:38.040 to challenge that a white guy who's a billionaire is 0:16:38.040 --> 0:16:42.920 automatically a co genius. Musk is a genius. I also 0:16:42.960 --> 0:16:46.040 think I agree with you. I think that the reason 0:16:46.080 --> 0:16:49.960 why we see Twitter specifically as this battle ground for 0:16:50.040 --> 0:16:51.800 who can have a voice, and who can have power 0:16:52.200 --> 0:16:55.680 is because people who are traditionally marginalized. Twitter is our 0:16:56.160 --> 0:16:59.160 is our domain, like we have been able even we 0:16:59.200 --> 0:17:01.840 have been able to build platforms and voices for ourselves 0:17:01.920 --> 0:17:05.639 using Twitter when other, you know, more traditional outlets and 0:17:06.000 --> 0:17:08.960 places have not always helped us amplify our voices. And 0:17:08.960 --> 0:17:12.399 so I think Elon Musk sees that like, Okay, this 0:17:12.440 --> 0:17:15.520 is a place where black folks, brown folks, women, queer 0:17:15.520 --> 0:17:18.400 folks are able to build up a voice that can 0:17:18.440 --> 0:17:21.520 sometimes even challenge traditional power structures, right things like meet 0:17:21.560 --> 0:17:23.520 to you, where you can start a hashtag and have 0:17:23.640 --> 0:17:28.560 that be something that actually allows for accountability from power structures. 0:17:28.600 --> 0:17:32.280 I think that Elon Musk wants to cozy up with 0:17:32.640 --> 0:17:35.880 extremist right wing types, and part of that as being 0:17:36.200 --> 0:17:41.119 is dismantling Twitter's power that marginalized people can use. And 0:17:41.160 --> 0:17:42.680 so if you chip away at that power, if you 0:17:42.840 --> 0:17:45.080 if you make it a place where you know, the 0:17:45.119 --> 0:17:48.520 kinds of people who are like creating and shapers of 0:17:48.560 --> 0:17:51.119 discourse aren't really there so much, if you make it 0:17:51.119 --> 0:17:52.720 so that like if you do hang out on Twitter, 0:17:52.880 --> 0:17:54.919 your mentions are going to be full of like nazis 0:17:55.000 --> 0:17:57.200 tweeting garbage at you, and this make it a place 0:17:57.240 --> 0:17:59.080 that no one is going to want to hang out. 0:17:59.320 --> 0:18:02.479 I think that is imparcel to how you take away 0:18:02.600 --> 0:18:04.760 some of a platform like Twitter's power. And I think 0:18:04.800 --> 0:18:08.000 it's not surprising that we saw, you know, when Trump 0:18:08.119 --> 0:18:11.000 was deep platformed, the platform that really hurt him the 0:18:11.000 --> 0:18:13.320 hardest was not having Twitter, because I think that Twitter 0:18:13.440 --> 0:18:15.560 is a unique kind of platform where you can really 0:18:15.920 --> 0:18:18.080 get a message out there and get it to travel quickly. 0:18:18.200 --> 0:18:21.119 And I think Elon Musk is trying to tip the 0:18:21.200 --> 0:18:24.600 scales so that more folks on the extremeist side of things, 0:18:24.640 --> 0:18:26.919 on the right wing side of things, have access to 0:18:26.960 --> 0:18:29.480 that power because they're just not as they're just haven't 0:18:29.480 --> 0:18:31.359 been as good at it as we are, I guess. 0:18:31.359 --> 0:18:33.760 And so I think that he is. So when people 0:18:33.800 --> 0:18:36.679 say like, oh, he's really failing, he's really like, you know, 0:18:37.359 --> 0:18:40.439 ruining Twitter, I'm not going to say that's not by design. 0:18:40.600 --> 0:18:42.520 I think that he wants to make it so that 0:18:42.560 --> 0:18:45.080 Twitter is a place where folks like you and I 0:18:45.119 --> 0:18:46.840 aren't gonna want to show up and aren't gonna want 0:18:46.840 --> 0:18:48.639 to be able to build up power and voices on 0:18:48.640 --> 0:18:53.080 a platform do you think that government, though Bridget failed 0:18:53.160 --> 0:18:58.919 here by not making Twitter a public utility? Do you 0:18:59.000 --> 0:19:03.439 think that because we have essentially and I'll be super 0:19:03.480 --> 0:19:08.880 agist and not care optinagarians who don't actually understand how 0:19:08.960 --> 0:19:12.399 social media in a lot of ways works, do you 0:19:12.440 --> 0:19:15.399 think that there has been missed opportunities where they would 0:19:15.440 --> 0:19:19.000 bring in, you know, Mark Zuckerberg and scold him with 0:19:19.040 --> 0:19:22.639 regard to allowing misinformation whether it was about covid or 0:19:22.680 --> 0:19:27.240 the twenty sixteen election, to fester on Facebook and depress 0:19:27.440 --> 0:19:31.040 like democratic voices and ads and campaign ads and what 0:19:31.119 --> 0:19:35.320 have you. They bring them in to chastise them, but 0:19:35.520 --> 0:19:41.440 don't really understand how like how this platform is used. 0:19:41.480 --> 0:19:45.760 So do you think that government and has missed an 0:19:45.760 --> 0:19:50.600 opportunity here? Yes, this is just I mean, this is 0:19:50.640 --> 0:19:53.399 my opinion. So speaking for myself, I do think that 0:19:53.480 --> 0:19:55.639 government has missed an opportunity, and I think it's really 0:19:56.000 --> 0:19:58.280 I think that we're really seeing the impact of that. 0:19:58.400 --> 0:20:02.840 I think that when listen, when your community wants to 0:20:02.840 --> 0:20:06.040 get information out there about an emergency, they don't go 0:20:06.080 --> 0:20:08.159 to Facebook, they don't go to Instagram, they don't go 0:20:08.160 --> 0:20:10.240 in a snapchat, they go to Twitter, Right, so Twitter 0:20:10.320 --> 0:20:12.880 is how most a lot of us get information about 0:20:12.960 --> 0:20:15.480 what's happening in our communities right now. The fact that 0:20:15.680 --> 0:20:18.920 a billionaire could wake up one day and outright by 0:20:19.040 --> 0:20:22.240 that platform essentially on a whim for a laugh, and 0:20:22.920 --> 0:20:24.679 you know, do what he's done to it is a 0:20:24.720 --> 0:20:27.919 real problem. I think that you're exactly right. It pains 0:20:28.000 --> 0:20:31.920 me when I see, you know, people who I know 0:20:32.640 --> 0:20:34.560 did not who are not digital natives, who did not 0:20:34.680 --> 0:20:36.760 grow up on law, who don't know the way that 0:20:36.800 --> 0:20:40.600 the Internet can really impact our real lived experiences, kind 0:20:40.600 --> 0:20:44.760 of dropping the ball when it comes to regulating and 0:20:44.040 --> 0:20:47.840 making sure that these platforms are actually able to be 0:20:48.160 --> 0:20:50.840 the kind of public utilities that we know that is 0:20:50.840 --> 0:20:52.919 the purpose that they serve in our actual lives. The 0:20:52.960 --> 0:20:55.320 fact that the fact that we're having this conversation after 0:20:55.320 --> 0:20:57.520 the fact really does tell me that our elected officials 0:20:57.520 --> 0:21:00.560 have really failed us and dropped the ball. And frankly, 0:21:00.680 --> 0:21:03.560 I don't know if I see it getting better. You know, 0:21:04.160 --> 0:21:07.240 I've the hearings that you were just describing, like I've 0:21:07.280 --> 0:21:11.679 solved some elected official chastising Mark Zuckerberg, and he was like, 0:21:11.720 --> 0:21:14.720 will you commit to ending finn stuff? And Mark Zuckerberg 0:21:14.840 --> 0:21:16.760 was like, what are you talking about? Right? Like, I 0:21:16.760 --> 0:21:18.359 think it's I think it's also a testament to the 0:21:18.400 --> 0:21:21.199 fact that we need younger folks elected officials. We need 0:21:21.240 --> 0:21:23.920 to the ones who aren't younger folks need to have 0:21:24.560 --> 0:21:27.000 more younger folks in their circles that they're actually listening to, 0:21:27.520 --> 0:21:33.040 because we've got people making legislation about technology that frankly, 0:21:33.280 --> 0:21:36.199 I wonder if they truly really understand the impact of 0:21:36.240 --> 0:21:39.320 that technology. No. And I think you know what was 0:21:39.400 --> 0:21:42.639 funny is that during the Obama years, I think that 0:21:42.720 --> 0:21:51.840 people really took for granted how how much Obama understood 0:21:51.920 --> 0:21:54.560 about how the world works, but also how to use, 0:21:54.720 --> 0:21:58.800 how to utilize technology. He created the Chief Technology Officer. 0:21:59.080 --> 0:22:03.040 He courted people from Silicon Valley to come in as 0:22:03.040 --> 0:22:05.960 if it were they were doing their public service right here. 0:22:06.040 --> 0:22:08.879 Don't take that, you know, half a million dollar job 0:22:09.040 --> 0:22:11.600 at Google, come and work for the government for scraps, 0:22:11.640 --> 0:22:14.600 but you're going to be doing something good for America. 0:22:14.640 --> 0:22:19.359 Because he understood that we needed really bright, sharp minds 0:22:19.400 --> 0:22:23.879 to catapult us into the future. And I'm not quite 0:22:23.960 --> 0:22:30.280 sure that that energy that thinking, even with this administration 0:22:30.640 --> 0:22:36.159 being a democratic administration, gets that, and so I wonder 0:22:36.200 --> 0:22:40.440 what you think, bridget are the implications then moving forward, 0:22:40.520 --> 0:22:44.560 when we have billionaires that are legitimately playing monopoly with 0:22:44.680 --> 0:22:48.640 our lives and our voices, and then have a government 0:22:48.720 --> 0:22:52.400 that is ineffectual in their ability to stop that from happening. 0:22:52.760 --> 0:22:55.680 What does this look like down the road? What does 0:22:55.720 --> 0:22:59.359 the internet, this hate machine that it has become, as 0:22:59.800 --> 0:23:03.000 you cleverly have titled your pod, what does it look 0:23:03.080 --> 0:23:06.560 like down the road a couple of years from now? Oh, 0:23:06.760 --> 0:23:09.760 recipe for disaster. Like I hate to put it like that, 0:23:09.800 --> 0:23:13.160 but absolute recipe for disaster. And I think even looking 0:23:13.160 --> 0:23:15.880 at the Biden administration, there are some things that I'll 0:23:15.920 --> 0:23:18.040 say like, oh, good job doing this or that, but 0:23:18.119 --> 0:23:21.199 it's it often feels like too little, too late, like 0:23:21.240 --> 0:23:24.640 we're playing catchup on on issue right that we has 0:23:24.640 --> 0:23:27.840 gotten so far, you know, far afield. And so I 0:23:27.880 --> 0:23:32.840 think unless you have elected officials who truly understand what's 0:23:32.840 --> 0:23:36.080 happening and are already and willing to act in meaningful ways, 0:23:36.240 --> 0:23:40.040 I think it's a recipe for disaster. I really, I think, 0:23:40.280 --> 0:23:42.639 you know, I especially look at like the younger generation, 0:23:43.480 --> 0:23:45.919 so many of them, what it means to show up 0:23:45.960 --> 0:23:48.040 as like an activist or somebody with a voice, or 0:23:48.040 --> 0:23:51.479 somebody who was really civically engaged means showing up online, right, 0:23:51.520 --> 0:23:54.960 And so if our online platforms are not places where 0:23:54.960 --> 0:23:57.800 they can where they can all do that meaningfully and safely, 0:23:57.880 --> 0:23:59.920 where whether you're a black woman or a white man, 0:24:00.000 --> 0:24:02.240 and you can meaningfully show up and like make your 0:24:02.280 --> 0:24:05.320 wayte heard and be civically engaged online. If our platforms 0:24:05.320 --> 0:24:07.760 aren't places where that's possible, what do you think the 0:24:07.800 --> 0:24:10.199 next generation of like elected officials or people who are 0:24:10.440 --> 0:24:12.800 physically engaged is going to look like we're leaving an 0:24:12.880 --> 0:24:16.720 incredibly unequal, unfair playing field for the next generation. And 0:24:16.760 --> 0:24:20.480 I think unless we do something meaningful to change that, 0:24:20.600 --> 0:24:23.360 I don't I'm not. I'm concerned about what it's going 0:24:23.359 --> 0:24:27.000 to look like down the road. What are your hopes then, 0:24:27.080 --> 0:24:32.399 bridget for your new pod and what you hope to 0:24:32.640 --> 0:24:38.840 bring or highlight to your audiences about this really important space, right, 0:24:38.920 --> 0:24:42.320 Like I think that you know, for at the beginning 0:24:42.400 --> 0:24:45.320 the advent of the Internet, it was considered like this 0:24:45.400 --> 0:24:48.600 kind of fun thing, right, you know, chat rooms and 0:24:49.160 --> 0:24:51.960 websites and blogs and all of these, you know, it's 0:24:52.000 --> 0:24:56.320 feeling it literally feels like, you know, little house on 0:24:56.359 --> 0:24:59.600 the Prairie times when you know from how it started 0:24:59.640 --> 0:25:02.960 compare to like where we are right now. But where 0:25:02.960 --> 0:25:06.520 we're headed seems so bleak and stark. And I think 0:25:06.560 --> 0:25:10.520 that you know, you raise such good alarms and questions. 0:25:10.960 --> 0:25:13.680 You know, what are you hoping that people take from 0:25:14.200 --> 0:25:16.760 your pod? Yeah, I'm so glad that you asked. The 0:25:16.760 --> 0:25:20.240 biggest one is probably that the state and the well 0:25:20.280 --> 0:25:22.760 being and the health of our internet is connected to 0:25:22.920 --> 0:25:25.520