1 00:00:08,680 --> 00:00:11,800 Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Saber Production. But iHeartRadio, I'm any race, and. 2 00:00:11,800 --> 00:00:14,080 Speaker 2: I'm more vocal bam, And today we have an episode 3 00:00:14,080 --> 00:00:16,360 Speaker 2: for you about sugar sculpture. 4 00:00:17,160 --> 00:00:20,560 Speaker 1: Indeed, and it is an interesting one. 5 00:00:20,920 --> 00:00:23,640 Speaker 3: Oh it's weird. It's weird. 6 00:00:23,760 --> 00:00:24,400 Speaker 1: Rich people. 7 00:00:24,680 --> 00:00:27,200 Speaker 3: What are you? What are you up to? What were 8 00:00:27,280 --> 00:00:28,440 Speaker 3: you up to in the past. 9 00:00:29,800 --> 00:00:33,600 Speaker 1: We ever get that podcast or money, maybe we'll. 10 00:00:33,520 --> 00:00:41,080 Speaker 2: Know, yeah maybe, I yeah, yeah, this one. 11 00:00:41,400 --> 00:00:41,680 Speaker 1: Okay. 12 00:00:41,720 --> 00:00:45,159 Speaker 2: So so this one I was thinking about because I 13 00:00:45,280 --> 00:00:50,159 Speaker 2: was looking into various kinds of frosting and this is 14 00:00:50,200 --> 00:00:53,640 Speaker 2: a thing that I do occasionally and decide that like 15 00:00:53,840 --> 00:00:57,520 Speaker 2: it's not it's like too scattered or like weird. And 16 00:00:57,600 --> 00:00:59,760 Speaker 2: I was like, well, what about like a Fondan situation? 17 00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:04,600 Speaker 2: And I was like, well not still like the I 18 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:06,479 Speaker 2: haven't been able to find a really good source about 19 00:01:06,520 --> 00:01:09,760 Speaker 2: like the modern history of any of these things. But 20 00:01:09,840 --> 00:01:15,160 Speaker 2: sugar sculpture, Oh yes, there is historical information about that, 21 00:01:15,600 --> 00:01:17,720 Speaker 2: so there is. 22 00:01:18,959 --> 00:01:21,840 Speaker 1: It's one of the things we encounter on these that 23 00:01:21,920 --> 00:01:25,119 Speaker 1: I adore is when I'm like, I don't think I've 24 00:01:25,160 --> 00:01:30,240 Speaker 1: ever heard of this, Oh, here are books researching. Wow, 25 00:01:32,880 --> 00:01:40,200 Speaker 1: I feel like I've seen like chocolate sculptures Okay, we've 26 00:01:40,280 --> 00:01:45,679 Speaker 1: obviously obviously talked about gingerbread houses and things like that. 27 00:01:45,800 --> 00:01:48,720 Speaker 1: I don't know if I've ever seen a sugar sculpture 28 00:01:48,800 --> 00:01:49,440 Speaker 1: in person. 29 00:01:51,320 --> 00:01:54,360 Speaker 2: Maybe maybe the type that looks sort of like blown glass, 30 00:01:55,280 --> 00:01:57,520 Speaker 2: maybe on one of those cruises or on one of 31 00:01:57,560 --> 00:02:03,000 Speaker 2: your Vegas trips or something like that. Certainly I've seen 32 00:02:03,320 --> 00:02:08,079 Speaker 2: some of those types on like pastry competition shows. Uh 33 00:02:08,240 --> 00:02:11,919 Speaker 2: there's always that really bone rattling moment where they make 34 00:02:12,000 --> 00:02:16,880 Speaker 2: the contestants move the piece like like five feet, like 35 00:02:16,919 --> 00:02:19,280 Speaker 2: five feet from one table to another, and it's like. 36 00:02:19,280 --> 00:02:21,480 Speaker 1: Oh, no, it's a horror movie. 37 00:02:21,520 --> 00:02:23,240 Speaker 3: All, oh, it is it is? 38 00:02:24,840 --> 00:02:29,359 Speaker 1: Check. Yeah, I think it's just like I'm sure I've 39 00:02:29,480 --> 00:02:32,360 Speaker 1: encountered it. I'm sure I've seen it, but I didn't 40 00:02:32,400 --> 00:02:35,480 Speaker 1: know it was this whole thing. Okay, I guess. 41 00:02:37,360 --> 00:02:39,200 Speaker 2: To be fair, I didn't realize it was this much 42 00:02:39,200 --> 00:02:42,480 Speaker 2: of a historical thing until we started doing this reading so. 43 00:02:45,120 --> 00:02:49,519 Speaker 1: Well. You can see our sugar episode episodes episode two too. 44 00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:52,239 Speaker 2: I think it was no I love there. Who knows, 45 00:02:53,200 --> 00:02:54,920 Speaker 2: you don't know. I think there was one on nutrition 46 00:02:55,000 --> 00:02:56,320 Speaker 2: in one on like the history stuff. 47 00:02:56,440 --> 00:03:00,799 Speaker 1: Okay, got it? Also edible gold, I would say share 48 00:03:00,800 --> 00:03:04,320 Speaker 1: in this category butterfly, pea flour, if not just for 49 00:03:04,440 --> 00:03:11,519 Speaker 1: like the kind of performance, the coloring of foods, mars apans. 50 00:03:11,600 --> 00:03:14,440 Speaker 2: Oh absolutely, yea, that one ties into this really really close. 51 00:03:15,160 --> 00:03:19,000 Speaker 1: Yes, well, I guess this brings us to our question. 52 00:03:19,480 --> 00:03:26,320 Speaker 1: So sugar sculptures what are they? 53 00:03:26,680 --> 00:03:31,160 Speaker 2: Well, sugar sculptures are works of art made primarily out 54 00:03:31,160 --> 00:03:35,680 Speaker 2: of sugar or sugar derivatives. There are two basic types, 55 00:03:36,040 --> 00:03:38,760 Speaker 2: types where you heat the sugar to melt it and 56 00:03:38,800 --> 00:03:41,160 Speaker 2: then manipulate it as a liquid or like a soft 57 00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:44,800 Speaker 2: solid as it cools, and then the types where you 58 00:03:44,880 --> 00:03:47,960 Speaker 2: mix the sugar with a little bit of other stuff 59 00:03:48,160 --> 00:03:50,880 Speaker 2: to make a sort of dough or paste and then 60 00:03:50,920 --> 00:03:54,520 Speaker 2: manipulate that and dry it out. Either way, you can 61 00:03:54,600 --> 00:03:57,880 Speaker 2: die or paint it, and you'll wind up with a 62 00:03:57,920 --> 00:04:03,120 Speaker 2: hard and probably fragile work of art that's like varyingly edible. 63 00:04:04,080 --> 00:04:08,360 Speaker 2: Like most of it technically you could eat, you might 64 00:04:08,360 --> 00:04:11,200 Speaker 2: not really want to. Uh, It's it's really more decorative. 65 00:04:12,680 --> 00:04:18,360 Speaker 2: It's uh, it's choosing to use something edible and sweet 66 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:22,919 Speaker 2: and with this like deep complicated history of being something 67 00:04:23,040 --> 00:04:29,600 Speaker 2: celebratory to make something pretty and and often not meant 68 00:04:29,600 --> 00:04:33,960 Speaker 2: to be eaten. But often still is like ephemeral as 69 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:37,880 Speaker 2: any other sugary creation. The cook types can be a 70 00:04:37,880 --> 00:04:41,280 Speaker 2: little bit hazardous to make. That's that's fun. Uh you 71 00:04:41,320 --> 00:04:45,400 Speaker 2: could you could argue like that that everything humans do 72 00:04:45,480 --> 00:04:49,039 Speaker 2: with food is both a science and an art. But 73 00:04:49,839 --> 00:04:55,280 Speaker 2: sugar sculpture just really hits on both. It's like a 74 00:04:55,360 --> 00:04:59,080 Speaker 2: it's like the hubris of man, but aesthetic. 75 00:05:00,720 --> 00:05:04,359 Speaker 1: I love it, you know, I love that stuff. And 76 00:05:04,440 --> 00:05:07,240 Speaker 1: we're like, why are we doing this? It's dangerous? 77 00:05:09,360 --> 00:05:11,080 Speaker 3: What you're not going to eat it? 78 00:05:11,440 --> 00:05:15,280 Speaker 1: What what I mean? 79 00:05:15,320 --> 00:05:17,040 Speaker 2: And I didn't mean to put any emphasis on the 80 00:05:17,080 --> 00:05:19,159 Speaker 2: word pretty to mean that that's like a bad thing, 81 00:05:19,200 --> 00:05:22,280 Speaker 2: Like it's nice to make esthetic things like I sure 82 00:05:22,560 --> 00:05:26,720 Speaker 2: that's literally lovely. I cool, you know, but right what 83 00:05:26,760 --> 00:05:29,840 Speaker 2: are we doing? No one knows that think I think 84 00:05:29,839 --> 00:05:32,680 Speaker 2: that's the truth. Oh gosh, that is like the deepest truth. 85 00:05:34,040 --> 00:05:36,200 Speaker 2: Well that got extentsial, all right. 86 00:05:36,480 --> 00:05:37,000 Speaker 1: Uh. 87 00:05:37,080 --> 00:05:40,800 Speaker 2: There are a number of ways of working with sugar 88 00:05:41,120 --> 00:05:44,359 Speaker 2: in order to make it sculptible, because it's just a 89 00:05:44,360 --> 00:05:47,680 Speaker 2: crystalline solid, you know. So you can make a paste 90 00:05:47,760 --> 00:05:52,280 Speaker 2: of sugar and water and then something like sticky and pliable, 91 00:05:52,360 --> 00:05:55,479 Speaker 2: maybe like a plant based gum or resin or a 92 00:05:55,640 --> 00:05:59,120 Speaker 2: gelatin type of thing, and in the right amounts of each, 93 00:05:59,279 --> 00:06:02,760 Speaker 2: you'll wind up with something like playto or modeling clay 94 00:06:03,200 --> 00:06:06,720 Speaker 2: that can be sculpted or molded using a cast or 95 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:09,520 Speaker 2: just your your fingers or other tools. And then when 96 00:06:09,560 --> 00:06:11,880 Speaker 2: it dries and hardens, it will be it'll be like 97 00:06:11,920 --> 00:06:15,600 Speaker 2: opaque white to off white in color, and something like 98 00:06:15,680 --> 00:06:19,520 Speaker 2: neco wafers and texture, and you can make some really 99 00:06:19,839 --> 00:06:23,560 Speaker 2: really detailed pieces with this stuff and color the dough 100 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:26,640 Speaker 2: with all kinds of dyes or painted after it's molded. 101 00:06:27,400 --> 00:06:30,880 Speaker 2: And this is sometimes called plate sugar or pastelage. 102 00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:31,520 Speaker 1: Yeah. 103 00:06:31,880 --> 00:06:35,919 Speaker 2: Yeah, But if we're talking about those like those like 104 00:06:36,000 --> 00:06:41,640 Speaker 2: translucent shiny glass like sugar sculptures, those are made by 105 00:06:41,680 --> 00:06:44,719 Speaker 2: the other method of cooking sugar down into a liquid, 106 00:06:45,320 --> 00:06:48,000 Speaker 2: usually with some water, and then manipulating it the way 107 00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:52,400 Speaker 2: that you would molten glass by pulling, spinning or drizzling 108 00:06:52,640 --> 00:06:58,400 Speaker 2: or blowing it. Okay, so spinning involves throwing off threads 109 00:06:58,440 --> 00:07:01,039 Speaker 2: of hot sugar that are so thin that they cool 110 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:03,479 Speaker 2: in the air and firm up in a sort of nest. 111 00:07:04,160 --> 00:07:06,120 Speaker 2: Or you can kind of like drizzle or fling them 112 00:07:06,520 --> 00:07:09,200 Speaker 2: onto a two or three dimensional surface and let them 113 00:07:09,200 --> 00:07:14,000 Speaker 2: from up there. Pulling will work tiny air bubbles into 114 00:07:14,040 --> 00:07:17,000 Speaker 2: the sugar as you stretch a cooling glob of it 115 00:07:17,080 --> 00:07:19,680 Speaker 2: over and over again in your hands or maybe using 116 00:07:19,680 --> 00:07:23,080 Speaker 2: a hook, and then you can sculpt that into whatever 117 00:07:23,120 --> 00:07:27,200 Speaker 2: shape you like. It'll be semi opaque and very shiny, 118 00:07:27,760 --> 00:07:29,480 Speaker 2: and you can do all kinds of sorts of like 119 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:35,360 Speaker 2: delicate ribbons and petals. This way blowing involves using a 120 00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:39,360 Speaker 2: small air pump and in a blowpipe or a straw 121 00:07:39,520 --> 00:07:42,920 Speaker 2: and just your lungs to manipulate a cooling glob of 122 00:07:42,960 --> 00:07:46,840 Speaker 2: sugar that you've probably already pulled a bit, using air 123 00:07:47,320 --> 00:07:50,400 Speaker 2: and your hands and other tools to sculpt it. And 124 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:54,920 Speaker 2: this can create hollow shapes and like really delicate, organic 125 00:07:54,960 --> 00:08:00,640 Speaker 2: looking shapes. With the invention of food safe castings that 126 00:08:00,680 --> 00:08:03,680 Speaker 2: are made with like flexible stuff like a like silicone, 127 00:08:04,080 --> 00:08:08,440 Speaker 2: you can also pour your molten sugar into a mold 128 00:08:08,720 --> 00:08:10,640 Speaker 2: and then pop it out like a like an ice 129 00:08:10,680 --> 00:08:13,360 Speaker 2: cube when when it's hard and dry in exactly the 130 00:08:13,360 --> 00:08:20,040 Speaker 2: way that an ice cube is not. Yes, and and 131 00:08:20,160 --> 00:08:23,720 Speaker 2: all of these can be further manipulated by applying heat 132 00:08:23,800 --> 00:08:26,960 Speaker 2: from a blowtorch to soften it to to like reshape 133 00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:29,360 Speaker 2: a piece or to weld pieces together. 134 00:08:29,680 --> 00:08:31,160 Speaker 1: Yeah. 135 00:08:31,640 --> 00:08:36,920 Speaker 2: Interestingly, these days a lot of professional grade sugar sculpture 136 00:08:37,440 --> 00:08:45,600 Speaker 2: is actually done with not sugar, So yes, follow along 137 00:08:45,600 --> 00:08:49,360 Speaker 2: with me. Okay, it's still edible, It's it's still a 138 00:08:49,400 --> 00:08:50,359 Speaker 2: sugar derivative. 139 00:08:50,679 --> 00:08:50,920 Speaker 1: Okay. 140 00:08:51,040 --> 00:08:52,360 Speaker 3: So there's this derivative of. 141 00:08:52,320 --> 00:08:57,480 Speaker 2: Sugar called isomalt. That's it's not quite like bizarro sugar, 142 00:08:57,559 --> 00:09:01,360 Speaker 2: but okay, it's it's less sweet tasting than sugar, It 143 00:09:01,360 --> 00:09:05,319 Speaker 2: has fewer calories, it doesn't impact your blood sugar levels 144 00:09:05,360 --> 00:09:08,000 Speaker 2: when you eat it like it doesn't cause insulin to 145 00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:11,240 Speaker 2: be released in your body, and more relevant to our 146 00:09:11,280 --> 00:09:15,480 Speaker 2: purposes today, it's like a white to clear crystal that 147 00:09:15,640 --> 00:09:18,880 Speaker 2: can be melted and shaped in the same ways that 148 00:09:18,920 --> 00:09:24,840 Speaker 2: sugar can, except even better for sculpting. It doesn't glom 149 00:09:24,960 --> 00:09:28,320 Speaker 2: onto water molecules like sugar does, meaning it won't like 150 00:09:28,400 --> 00:09:31,400 Speaker 2: distort or melt as easily, so it will last longer. 151 00:09:31,880 --> 00:09:36,120 Speaker 2: And furthermore, it doesn't caramelize when you cook it, meaning 152 00:09:36,440 --> 00:09:40,320 Speaker 2: that it doesn't discolor during the heating process. Real sugar 153 00:09:40,640 --> 00:09:42,440 Speaker 2: will go a bit yellowish, and if you cook it 154 00:09:42,480 --> 00:09:45,400 Speaker 2: too long, it'll definitely turn that like caramel golden brown 155 00:09:47,040 --> 00:09:49,760 Speaker 2: is is more expensive, but it is like the professional 156 00:09:49,800 --> 00:09:52,640 Speaker 2: standard for any type of sugar sculpture that's made by 157 00:09:52,679 --> 00:09:57,319 Speaker 2: cooking your your sugar. So yeah, all of those, all 158 00:09:57,320 --> 00:10:00,480 Speaker 2: of those pretty translucent pieces that look like glass are 159 00:10:00,520 --> 00:10:01,840 Speaker 2: probably isomol. 160 00:10:04,720 --> 00:10:08,320 Speaker 1: Is malt Son's kind of threatening to me. I feel 161 00:10:08,320 --> 00:10:12,880 Speaker 1: like it's kind of close to iso isopod. 162 00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:18,840 Speaker 2: There you go, yeah, I see, I see you. Goodness, Yes, 163 00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:24,520 Speaker 2: speaking of danger, I will say that, yes, like if 164 00:10:24,520 --> 00:10:26,800 Speaker 2: you try to experiment with any of this at home, 165 00:10:27,160 --> 00:10:30,960 Speaker 2: the paste, the like Plato kind of format, pretty safe. 166 00:10:31,440 --> 00:10:34,280 Speaker 2: It might involve drying a piece in an oven maybe, 167 00:10:34,480 --> 00:10:37,040 Speaker 2: but even that's going to probably be very low temperature. 168 00:10:37,920 --> 00:10:41,000 Speaker 2: If you're working with molten sugar. I've said it before 169 00:10:41,080 --> 00:10:44,160 Speaker 2: and I'll say it again. Molten sugar is edible napalm, 170 00:10:44,200 --> 00:10:46,320 Speaker 2: all right, Like it will stick to you as it 171 00:10:46,400 --> 00:10:51,760 Speaker 2: burns you. It is delicious and terrifying. Just just keep 172 00:10:51,760 --> 00:10:54,720 Speaker 2: that in mind, like, don't be don't be, don't be terrified, 173 00:10:54,880 --> 00:10:57,440 Speaker 2: like unduly it's not coming for you, but you know, 174 00:10:57,480 --> 00:10:59,160 Speaker 2: but but be respectful, be. 175 00:10:59,160 --> 00:11:03,520 Speaker 1: Respectful, okay, respect the molten sugar. 176 00:11:03,640 --> 00:11:05,040 Speaker 3: Respect the molten sugar. 177 00:11:05,160 --> 00:11:09,800 Speaker 1: Always got it. I have to say a lot of 178 00:11:09,800 --> 00:11:13,160 Speaker 1: this stuff you've been describing sounds a little dangerous to me. 179 00:11:13,960 --> 00:11:16,720 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah it is. That's because it is. 180 00:11:17,520 --> 00:11:20,240 Speaker 1: Well perfect, I'm picking up on what you're putting down. 181 00:11:20,280 --> 00:11:23,040 Speaker 1: Then I did. I don't know if you remember, but 182 00:11:23,080 --> 00:11:25,559 Speaker 1: there's an old character in our D and D campaign 183 00:11:25,640 --> 00:11:29,400 Speaker 1: named Ananas. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. She was originally going to 184 00:11:29,440 --> 00:11:30,840 Speaker 1: be the character I was going to play, and then 185 00:11:30,880 --> 00:11:34,440 Speaker 1: I went super dark instead. But oh, okay, fun, yeah, 186 00:11:35,000 --> 00:11:37,920 Speaker 1: yeah you did. She's a chef, and so she was 187 00:11:37,960 --> 00:11:40,640 Speaker 1: going to have a bunch of like you know, obviously 188 00:11:40,720 --> 00:11:42,920 Speaker 1: your frying pan weapon, but a you know, kind of 189 00:11:43,080 --> 00:11:46,960 Speaker 1: you mix ingredients and make a bomb or something. So 190 00:11:47,040 --> 00:11:49,960 Speaker 1: this is kind of it's given me ideas. I'll say, no, 191 00:11:50,440 --> 00:11:53,960 Speaker 1: not my real life, No way, that's that's good, that's good. 192 00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:56,680 Speaker 2: But yeah, I mean it's I mean, you know again, 193 00:11:56,800 --> 00:12:01,760 Speaker 2: like like sugar is like relatively brittle, but but you 194 00:12:01,800 --> 00:12:05,920 Speaker 2: could probably have like a very poky isomal spear kind 195 00:12:05,920 --> 00:12:06,440 Speaker 2: of situation. 196 00:12:06,600 --> 00:12:11,480 Speaker 1: Oh wow, that's like the old you know, the melting 197 00:12:11,679 --> 00:12:18,680 Speaker 1: icicle mind trap riddle. Okay, okay, well what about the 198 00:12:18,800 --> 00:12:22,719 Speaker 1: nutrition of sculptures? 199 00:12:23,640 --> 00:12:31,920 Speaker 2: I it depends. I again, these things are varyingly edible. So, uh, sugar, 200 00:12:32,520 --> 00:12:36,920 Speaker 2: sugar isn't really good for you. It's a eating art 201 00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:37,520 Speaker 2: is a treat. 202 00:12:39,160 --> 00:12:45,440 Speaker 1: Eating art is a treat. Oh okay. It feels like 203 00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:47,400 Speaker 1: one of those things you read and you're like, it's 204 00:12:47,400 --> 00:12:49,320 Speaker 1: supposed to be really deep and I don't get it, 205 00:12:52,679 --> 00:12:54,720 Speaker 1: and you just ponder it as you're trying to sleep 206 00:12:54,760 --> 00:12:59,280 Speaker 1: late at night. Yeah, yeah, you're like, is it is? 207 00:12:59,320 --> 00:13:04,280 Speaker 1: It is a very existential episode, you know it is. Well, 208 00:13:04,559 --> 00:13:06,000 Speaker 1: we do have some numbers for you. 209 00:13:06,240 --> 00:13:12,600 Speaker 2: We do. We do some of these sculptures, particularly I 210 00:13:12,640 --> 00:13:15,560 Speaker 2: was reading about the paste or like Plato kind of type. 211 00:13:16,280 --> 00:13:16,800 Speaker 3: They can be. 212 00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:20,560 Speaker 2: Really sturdy in last decades if they're kept carefully. Just 213 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:22,360 Speaker 2: got to keep them cool and dry, and that's all. 214 00:13:22,840 --> 00:13:25,240 Speaker 2: A historian an artist, Ivan Day says that he has 215 00:13:25,320 --> 00:13:27,480 Speaker 2: kept some for like thirty years in counting. 216 00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:28,439 Speaker 1: Wow. 217 00:13:28,640 --> 00:13:35,560 Speaker 2: Yeah. There are Guinness records for tallest sugar sculpture and 218 00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:41,120 Speaker 2: tallest cooked sugar sculpture made an eleven hours specifically. Okay, 219 00:13:42,160 --> 00:13:45,040 Speaker 2: all right, both were achieved in two thousand and six. 220 00:13:45,720 --> 00:13:48,839 Speaker 2: Food Network was running like a Guinness Records filming event 221 00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:49,920 Speaker 2: at the Mall of America. 222 00:13:50,840 --> 00:13:51,679 Speaker 1: All right, so the. 223 00:13:51,640 --> 00:13:53,480 Speaker 3: Cooked sugar record. 224 00:13:54,840 --> 00:13:58,640 Speaker 2: Achieved was three point nine to one meters tall, that's 225 00:13:58,679 --> 00:14:01,400 Speaker 2: twelve feet ten inches. It was made to look like 226 00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:03,120 Speaker 2: the John Hancock Building in Chicago. 227 00:14:03,559 --> 00:14:04,280 Speaker 1: This was a theme. 228 00:14:05,600 --> 00:14:10,640 Speaker 2: The uncooked statue was four point nine seven meters tall, 229 00:14:10,720 --> 00:14:13,760 Speaker 2: that's like sixteen feet three inches, and it was made 230 00:14:13,760 --> 00:14:15,320 Speaker 2: to look like the Empire State Building. 231 00:14:15,720 --> 00:14:16,800 Speaker 3: Both artists for French. 232 00:14:18,440 --> 00:14:23,720 Speaker 1: Okay, yeah. In Mexico there is an art of sugar sculpting, 233 00:14:23,800 --> 00:14:26,120 Speaker 1: often associated with Dia delos murtos. 234 00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:29,840 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. In some traditions, when you put up your 235 00:14:29,880 --> 00:14:32,440 Speaker 2: shrine or a frienda for a day of the dead, 236 00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:36,480 Speaker 2: some popular decorations that you put on there are molded 237 00:14:36,480 --> 00:14:40,560 Speaker 2: out of sugar paste and then decorated. They're called Alfinique's 238 00:14:41,800 --> 00:14:44,920 Speaker 2: skulls are a popular type, but there are lots of 239 00:14:44,960 --> 00:14:48,440 Speaker 2: other types of figures, and there is a whole festival 240 00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:51,640 Speaker 2: or fair, I guess you would say in Teluca, Mexico 241 00:14:52,040 --> 00:14:54,840 Speaker 2: every year in the month leading up Today of the Dead, 242 00:14:55,120 --> 00:14:57,840 Speaker 2: where like one hundred vendors come out and sell all 243 00:14:57,880 --> 00:15:01,480 Speaker 2: of their sugar sculptures and like other non edible figurines. 244 00:15:03,120 --> 00:15:05,280 Speaker 1: That sounds cool, I bet, listeners, I bet some of 245 00:15:05,320 --> 00:15:07,080 Speaker 1: you have some pictures of this, so I would love that. 246 00:15:07,400 --> 00:15:11,760 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, oh my goodness, any any pictures you have 247 00:15:11,840 --> 00:15:16,520 Speaker 2: of any sugar sculpture related thing again, day Dalis wortheos 248 00:15:16,600 --> 00:15:19,440 Speaker 2: is a whole thing, like totally, totally another episode. We're 249 00:15:19,440 --> 00:15:21,800 Speaker 2: going to touch on it a little bit in the history. 250 00:15:21,400 --> 00:15:27,760 Speaker 1: Though, yes, yes, but definitely keep those pictures coming. And 251 00:15:27,800 --> 00:15:30,240 Speaker 1: we've got a ride of a history for you. 252 00:15:30,640 --> 00:15:34,360 Speaker 2: Heck my heck, and we are going to get into 253 00:15:34,360 --> 00:15:35,920 Speaker 2: that as soon as we get back from a quick break. 254 00:15:35,920 --> 00:15:37,600 Speaker 2: For a word from our sponsors. 255 00:15:45,640 --> 00:15:46,200 Speaker 3: And we're back. 256 00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:50,080 Speaker 1: Thank you, sponsors, Yes, thank you, and again see our 257 00:15:50,120 --> 00:15:58,000 Speaker 1: sugar episodes or episode of mystery remains. Some historians believe 258 00:15:58,040 --> 00:16:01,440 Speaker 1: that sugar art and sugar paint could go back to 259 00:16:01,480 --> 00:16:06,240 Speaker 1: ancient times, perhaps dating back to four thousand BCE and 260 00:16:06,280 --> 00:16:07,800 Speaker 1: Papua New Guinea. 261 00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:12,360 Speaker 2: The origin of sugar sculpture, though, is kind of tied 262 00:16:12,440 --> 00:16:17,800 Speaker 2: up in sugar refinement, and specifically sugar cane refinement, which 263 00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:23,040 Speaker 2: was getting underway in a few areas simultaneously from the 264 00:16:23,080 --> 00:16:25,920 Speaker 2: Middle East through what's now India and China from like 265 00:16:25,960 --> 00:16:31,280 Speaker 2: the six hundreds through the eleven hundred CE, and certainly 266 00:16:31,640 --> 00:16:35,960 Speaker 2: by about the nine hundred CE really pretty pulled sugar 267 00:16:36,040 --> 00:16:39,600 Speaker 2: candies or like medicinal lozenges were being made for rich folks. 268 00:16:41,240 --> 00:16:43,880 Speaker 1: Some of the first sugar sculptures we know of were 269 00:16:43,960 --> 00:16:46,400 Speaker 1: created in the eleventh century in the Middle East by 270 00:16:46,520 --> 00:16:49,760 Speaker 1: artists who would combine sugar, almonds, and water to make 271 00:16:49,800 --> 00:16:53,960 Speaker 1: a multiple paste that could be shaped and baked. The 272 00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:58,600 Speaker 1: well off would sometimes commission these sculptures for banquets and celebrations, 273 00:16:59,040 --> 00:17:01,720 Speaker 1: or to hand out to the poor on feast days 274 00:17:01,840 --> 00:17:07,280 Speaker 1: span yeah, yes, very similar to Marzapan. Over the next 275 00:17:07,320 --> 00:17:10,359 Speaker 1: few centuries, the practice made its way to Europe. Sugar 276 00:17:10,400 --> 00:17:13,199 Speaker 1: sculptures popped up in the French court in the thirteenth 277 00:17:13,200 --> 00:17:18,560 Speaker 1: century and nearby countries soon after that. Europeans called them subtleties. 278 00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:23,760 Speaker 1: Uh huh. From what I understand, a lot of these 279 00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:26,119 Speaker 1: early ones were much smaller than some what we're going 280 00:17:26,160 --> 00:17:26,880 Speaker 1: to talk about later. 281 00:17:26,960 --> 00:17:29,840 Speaker 2: But I'm I feel like I feel like this was ira, 282 00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:31,600 Speaker 2: I feel like this was a joke like that. 283 00:17:31,760 --> 00:17:34,840 Speaker 1: Oh oh for sure, I mean that was. But I 284 00:17:34,880 --> 00:17:37,280 Speaker 1: do think a lot of these early ones were smaller 285 00:17:37,320 --> 00:17:42,680 Speaker 1: than the massive ones that I talk about. Meals at 286 00:17:42,680 --> 00:17:46,520 Speaker 1: the time, weren't necessarily divided up like we sometimes do today, 287 00:17:46,600 --> 00:17:48,280 Speaker 1: like not in the way we might think of it, 288 00:17:48,680 --> 00:17:54,080 Speaker 1: Like dessert course wasn't always exactly exactly, and sugar had 289 00:17:54,119 --> 00:17:58,600 Speaker 1: a lot of medicinal beliefs around it, including as a digestive. 290 00:17:59,200 --> 00:18:01,919 Speaker 1: So because of that, the first course might be a 291 00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:09,160 Speaker 1: sugar sculpture called a warmer. Yeah. I found some conflicting 292 00:18:09,160 --> 00:18:12,920 Speaker 1: information about the history of sugar sculpting in Asia and 293 00:18:12,960 --> 00:18:16,720 Speaker 1: specifically in China. Some sources implied it went back to 294 00:18:16,800 --> 00:18:19,879 Speaker 1: six hundred CE, if not even further back than that. 295 00:18:20,440 --> 00:18:24,399 Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure. By some time in the thirteen to 296 00:18:24,480 --> 00:18:28,720 Speaker 2: sixteen hundreds, a few styles of sugar sculpture were being 297 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:33,960 Speaker 2: developed around China, perhaps first to create decorative pieces for 298 00:18:34,400 --> 00:18:37,760 Speaker 2: royals or other very rich people for like religious ceremonies. 299 00:18:38,920 --> 00:18:42,160 Speaker 2: The two main types I read about were sugar painting 300 00:18:42,440 --> 00:18:45,040 Speaker 2: and sugar blowing. And the blowing is similar to what 301 00:18:45,080 --> 00:18:47,919 Speaker 2: we've talked about, you know, using a small straw to 302 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:51,360 Speaker 2: inflate molten sugar as at cools and further manipulating it 303 00:18:51,040 --> 00:18:56,040 Speaker 2: with your hands or other tools. Sugar painting uses a 304 00:18:56,119 --> 00:18:59,879 Speaker 2: ladle to drizzle molten sugar in a two dimensional design. 305 00:19:00,480 --> 00:19:03,960 Speaker 2: Then you press a stick like a long, thin lollipop 306 00:19:04,080 --> 00:19:07,119 Speaker 2: type stick onto it, and then you use a spatula 307 00:19:07,280 --> 00:19:09,159 Speaker 2: to remove it from the surface, and you have this 308 00:19:10,359 --> 00:19:14,080 Speaker 2: thing on a stick. A number of animals and plants 309 00:19:14,119 --> 00:19:18,560 Speaker 2: and human subjects became traditional and these were typically made 310 00:19:18,560 --> 00:19:22,280 Speaker 2: with with maltose, which dries a sort of golden color 311 00:19:22,440 --> 00:19:24,679 Speaker 2: and was sometimes dyed or painted afterwards. 312 00:19:26,440 --> 00:19:30,720 Speaker 1: But the real heyday of the sugar sculpture in Europe 313 00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:35,639 Speaker 1: was during the Renaissance. Oh Yes, oh Yes. At the time, 314 00:19:35,920 --> 00:19:40,280 Speaker 1: white sugar was a status symbol among wealthy Europeans because 315 00:19:40,280 --> 00:19:44,400 Speaker 1: it was expensive and viewed as pure due to the 316 00:19:44,400 --> 00:19:47,600 Speaker 1: color of it, and it was also viewed as exotic 317 00:19:48,200 --> 00:19:52,080 Speaker 1: because it was imported from the Caribbean and Africa. So 318 00:19:52,160 --> 00:19:56,359 Speaker 1: this means that this sugar was largely the result of 319 00:19:56,400 --> 00:20:03,119 Speaker 1: the labor of enslaved peoples. Since sugar was so rare 320 00:20:03,160 --> 00:20:07,439 Speaker 1: and so expensive in Europe, many wanted to artistically display it. 321 00:20:08,280 --> 00:20:12,920 Speaker 1: During this period, rich folks were hiring confectioners and pastry 322 00:20:13,000 --> 00:20:16,960 Speaker 1: chefs to experiment with desserts, and a lot of that 323 00:20:17,040 --> 00:20:22,919 Speaker 1: experimentation involved art and presentation. Talented chefs knew how to 324 00:20:22,920 --> 00:20:25,200 Speaker 1: work with white sugar paste and use it to make 325 00:20:25,280 --> 00:20:30,119 Speaker 1: these elaborate sculptures. They'd mold this paste, they would shape it, 326 00:20:30,160 --> 00:20:33,639 Speaker 1: they would paint it, sometimes cast it to harden it 327 00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:37,879 Speaker 1: enjoin any pieces that they wanted to join with gas torches. 328 00:20:40,280 --> 00:20:45,280 Speaker 1: Fancy parties would have these sugar sculptures on display in 329 00:20:45,320 --> 00:20:48,760 Speaker 1: the middle of the table to wow and impress their guests. 330 00:20:49,880 --> 00:20:53,879 Speaker 1: I read in some places they were called triumphs, and 331 00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:56,680 Speaker 1: they were quite the site. I know, we have some descriptions, 332 00:20:56,680 --> 00:21:01,000 Speaker 1: but they were quite the site. Some reachings several feet tall, 333 00:21:01,560 --> 00:21:05,480 Speaker 1: some dyed different colors, sometimes gilded with gold leaf. 334 00:21:06,119 --> 00:21:06,919 Speaker 3: Yeah. 335 00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:07,280 Speaker 1: Yeah. 336 00:21:07,320 --> 00:21:11,280 Speaker 2: In English they were called subtleties, and an Italian they 337 00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:15,960 Speaker 2: were sometimes called trionfi or triumphs. I'm not sure where 338 00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:18,880 Speaker 2: my accent just went with that, so I yeah, at 339 00:21:18,880 --> 00:21:19,840 Speaker 2: any rate, triumphs. 340 00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:22,920 Speaker 1: Yes, yes, and this is one of my favorite things. 341 00:21:23,000 --> 00:21:26,280 Speaker 1: So at the end of the party, some hosts would 342 00:21:26,320 --> 00:21:29,600 Speaker 1: encourage their guests to break off pieces of the sculpture 343 00:21:30,119 --> 00:21:34,840 Speaker 1: as a sort of memento or a party favor. Entire 344 00:21:34,920 --> 00:21:38,040 Speaker 1: tables would sometimes be filled with sugar figurines of all kinds. 345 00:21:38,119 --> 00:21:43,240 Speaker 1: Oh yes. Some of the most impressive of these sculptures 346 00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:48,800 Speaker 1: became somewhat famous. The sources of art and literature and 347 00:21:49,240 --> 00:21:54,000 Speaker 1: were quite ambitious in scope. They graced the banquets of 348 00:21:54,040 --> 00:21:58,320 Speaker 1: popes and the weddings and baptisms of royalty. I even 349 00:21:58,520 --> 00:22:01,399 Speaker 1: read they were some times used as the form of 350 00:22:01,440 --> 00:22:06,200 Speaker 1: rebuke or revenge against a guest who was there and there. 351 00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:09,320 Speaker 2: I mean, there was a lot of political meaning and 352 00:22:09,400 --> 00:22:12,800 Speaker 2: subtext kind of baked and pun intended, I guess to 353 00:22:13,160 --> 00:22:15,600 Speaker 2: some of these things. So I wouldn't I would not 354 00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:20,600 Speaker 2: put it past any kind of Renaissance European royal No. 355 00:22:20,920 --> 00:22:27,879 Speaker 1: It is so petty, so petty, and I saw in 356 00:22:27,920 --> 00:22:31,000 Speaker 1: a couple of places. The wedding cake is often referred 357 00:22:31,040 --> 00:22:34,639 Speaker 1: to as a modern day subtlety and as a piece 358 00:22:34,760 --> 00:22:35,600 Speaker 1: of this legacy. 359 00:22:35,920 --> 00:22:42,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, okay. So there are just wild descriptions and 360 00:22:42,080 --> 00:22:45,000 Speaker 2: depictions of some of these things, and some of the 361 00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:50,320 Speaker 2: best known today are because like a really good artist 362 00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:53,040 Speaker 2: happened to attend the banquet and then did a whole 363 00:22:53,119 --> 00:22:57,159 Speaker 2: series of illustrations of what was going on on the 364 00:22:57,240 --> 00:23:01,280 Speaker 2: sugar table. So, for example, there was this banquet in 365 00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:05,520 Speaker 2: Rome in sixteen eighty seven to honor Pope Innocent the eleventh. 366 00:23:07,000 --> 00:23:10,480 Speaker 2: There was an a one hundred foot long table bearing and 367 00:23:10,640 --> 00:23:13,840 Speaker 2: I quote a range of historical figures almost half as 368 00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:16,560 Speaker 2: big as life, made of a kind of sugarpaste, but 369 00:23:16,680 --> 00:23:21,439 Speaker 2: modeled to the utmost skill of a statuary. That's a 370 00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:24,080 Speaker 2: direct quote from someone who was there, from I think 371 00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:28,040 Speaker 2: the artists who drew these guys. So okay, there were 372 00:23:28,040 --> 00:23:33,120 Speaker 2: like mythological figures in these grand chariots that were being 373 00:23:33,240 --> 00:23:37,439 Speaker 2: drawn by like peacocks and lions and hippocamps, and the 374 00:23:37,560 --> 00:23:41,399 Speaker 2: chariots had these waves or maybe like feathers or like 375 00:23:41,480 --> 00:23:45,199 Speaker 2: greenery coming up all around them. There were palm trees 376 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:50,040 Speaker 2: and nymphs representing the virtues. There was a decapitated hydra 377 00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:54,240 Speaker 2: representing the recently crushed Protestant rebellion in England. 378 00:23:55,040 --> 00:23:59,080 Speaker 1: What wow. 379 00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:01,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, this was like at the base of the whole thing, 380 00:24:01,960 --> 00:24:05,119 Speaker 2: and like the Seal of England was about it. It 381 00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:11,480 Speaker 2: is a site to behold. In Russia, in sixteen seventy two, 382 00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:15,879 Speaker 2: there was a banquet for Peter the Great's baptism, and 383 00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:19,359 Speaker 2: their sugar scape included like a lot of birds. This 384 00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:23,240 Speaker 2: was bird heavy. There were eagles, a duck, a swan, 385 00:24:23,359 --> 00:24:26,720 Speaker 2: a dove, a three hundred and fifty pounds sugar parrot, 386 00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:33,639 Speaker 2: whoa There was like a model of the Kremlin that 387 00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:39,119 Speaker 2: had infantry and cavalry and cannons. Some of the pieces 388 00:24:39,119 --> 00:24:42,320 Speaker 2: were flavored with cinnamon and some were colored red with 389 00:24:42,359 --> 00:24:46,800 Speaker 2: a cochineal, which were both incredibly expensive imports in their 390 00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:52,480 Speaker 2: own right at the time. Houfta, there's some that like 391 00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:55,919 Speaker 2: no illustrations exist of, but like this one cook for 392 00:24:55,960 --> 00:25:00,080 Speaker 2: British Royalty in the late sixteen hundred sometime wrote about this, 393 00:25:00,080 --> 00:25:03,960 Speaker 2: this sugar stag. This stag made of sugar that had 394 00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:07,720 Speaker 2: an arrow in its flank and when you took the 395 00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:10,160 Speaker 2: arrow out, it would bleed wine. 396 00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:15,480 Speaker 1: Oh once again, very metal. 397 00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:21,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm like, where was my sugar statuary. 398 00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:26,400 Speaker 1: In Game of Thrones? Yeah, let's write them a letter. 399 00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:30,280 Speaker 2: We had some really good food in there, food depictions 400 00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:33,840 Speaker 2: in there. Anytime I saw I see a pineapple anywhere 401 00:25:33,840 --> 00:25:35,160 Speaker 2: in a movie, I'm really excited. 402 00:25:35,200 --> 00:25:44,040 Speaker 1: Anyway. Yeah, wow, well missed opportunity, that's what we'll say. Okay, 403 00:25:44,040 --> 00:25:48,719 Speaker 1: But as the supply of sugar increased and the price decreased, 404 00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:53,080 Speaker 1: it became more readily available and less of a status 405 00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:58,280 Speaker 1: symbol in the mid eighteenth century, which kind of funnily 406 00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:00,280 Speaker 1: was like, well, then we're not doing this thing more, 407 00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:05,200 Speaker 1: this shift is evident in recipes from the time, indicating 408 00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:09,880 Speaker 1: sugar was accessible by the middle class. So therefore, yeah, 409 00:26:09,920 --> 00:26:14,640 Speaker 1: the appeal of the sugar sculpture faded away in Europe. 410 00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:16,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, or at. 411 00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:20,240 Speaker 2: Least changed, right, because like the grand banquets described above 412 00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:24,399 Speaker 2: were shows of power by by royalty or other like 413 00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:28,040 Speaker 2: heads of state. But by around the same time those 414 00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:32,520 Speaker 2: were going on like normal rich people, not extravagantly rich 415 00:26:32,560 --> 00:26:35,760 Speaker 2: people might have had someone make a sugar sculpture for 416 00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:39,240 Speaker 2: a party, like mostly because it was pretty, not because 417 00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:43,040 Speaker 2: they wanted to have a hydra representing Protestantism being defeated. 418 00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:47,399 Speaker 2: And yeah, by the middle of the seventeen hundreds, like 419 00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:49,280 Speaker 2: you just said, it was something that like any old 420 00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:52,160 Speaker 2: anyone with the kitchen staff might have for a special occasion. 421 00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:56,440 Speaker 2: It never did fade entirely away. Is like a higher 422 00:26:57,160 --> 00:27:02,400 Speaker 2: art forum for example, and Inc. Did a bunch of 423 00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:06,120 Speaker 2: sugar sculpture around the late seventeen to early eighteen hundreds, 424 00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:10,120 Speaker 2: Lots of architectural pieces depicting like classical styles from around 425 00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:14,280 Speaker 2: the world, Greek temples and Chinese pagodas and Middle Eastern pavilions, 426 00:27:14,600 --> 00:27:18,080 Speaker 2: all surrounded by really beautiful landscaping with like rivers and 427 00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:27,040 Speaker 2: rocks and trees and stuff. Meanwhile, the Spanish brought molded 428 00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:31,520 Speaker 2: sugar paste techniques and traditions over to the Americas during colonization, 429 00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:38,080 Speaker 2: and that, alongside some native edible sculpture traditions, eventually developed 430 00:27:38,240 --> 00:27:44,480 Speaker 2: into those day of the Dead Elfin Yike traditions around Mexico. 431 00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:49,760 Speaker 2: Later on, as technology advanced across like the eighteen and 432 00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:55,320 Speaker 2: nineteen hundreds, sculpted sugar in the form of like pulled 433 00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:59,520 Speaker 2: hard candy drops and ribbons and sticks or like candy 434 00:27:59,560 --> 00:28:06,159 Speaker 2: canes all became increasingly cheap and commonplace. And I could not, 435 00:28:06,359 --> 00:28:10,359 Speaker 2: for the life of me find good information on where 436 00:28:10,400 --> 00:28:15,760 Speaker 2: and when cooked sugar sculpture really began or took off 437 00:28:16,320 --> 00:28:21,160 Speaker 2: in Europe and the Americas. But I suspect it had 438 00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:24,520 Speaker 2: to have been after the invention of like more precise 439 00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:28,160 Speaker 2: thermometers and heating elements, that was like right around this time. 440 00:28:29,080 --> 00:28:36,199 Speaker 1: Yeah, that would make sense. That would make sense, all right. 441 00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:40,800 Speaker 1: So in twenty fourteen, artist Kara Walker installed a sugar 442 00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:43,880 Speaker 1: sculpture of a sphinx at the Domino Sugar Factory in 443 00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:46,560 Speaker 1: New York. And this is like a lot of the 444 00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:50,000 Speaker 1: results I was getting when I was searching me. 445 00:28:50,160 --> 00:28:50,360 Speaker 4: Yeah. 446 00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:54,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, because sugar sculpture is still alive and well today. 447 00:28:54,160 --> 00:28:57,120 Speaker 2: Several artists work in it around the world, but this 448 00:28:57,400 --> 00:28:59,480 Speaker 2: was a very landmark piece. 449 00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:05,080 Speaker 1: It was she drew a lot of inspiration from these 450 00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:09,280 Speaker 1: Renaissance sugar sculptures. She told the Guardian quote, I was 451 00:29:09,320 --> 00:29:13,000 Speaker 1: reading this book Sweetness and Power by anthropologist Sidney Mintz, 452 00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:16,440 Speaker 1: and I came across these sugar sculptures called subtleties that 453 00:29:16,520 --> 00:29:19,760 Speaker 1: they had at medieval banquets. Up until that point, I 454 00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:22,760 Speaker 1: had been thinking of finger wagging, doom laden things about 455 00:29:22,800 --> 00:29:26,160 Speaker 1: the history of slavery and sugar and America. I didn't 456 00:29:26,160 --> 00:29:30,400 Speaker 1: take into account what people wanted to look at, and 457 00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:34,960 Speaker 1: then I wanted to include kind of the title piece. 458 00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:39,680 Speaker 1: At the behest of creative time, Kara E. Walker has 459 00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:44,120 Speaker 1: confected a subtlety are the Marvelous Sugar Baby, an homage 460 00:29:44,200 --> 00:29:47,560 Speaker 1: to the unpaid and overworked artisans who have refined our 461 00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:50,400 Speaker 1: sweet taste from the cane fields to the kitchens of 462 00:29:50,440 --> 00:29:53,000 Speaker 1: the New World. On the occasion of the demolition of 463 00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:55,080 Speaker 1: the Domino sugar refining plant. 464 00:29:56,120 --> 00:30:03,880 Speaker 2: Yes, yes, so, okay, she built she built it in 465 00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:08,000 Speaker 2: this abandoned sugar warehouse from the Domino Company in New 466 00:30:08,080 --> 00:30:15,360 Speaker 2: York City. And the piece is this gigantic sphinx. 467 00:30:16,320 --> 00:30:17,360 Speaker 3: It's a it's a. 468 00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:20,440 Speaker 2: It depicts a black woman seated in the style of 469 00:30:20,520 --> 00:30:24,480 Speaker 2: the sphinx, and she has these exaggerated hips and breasts, 470 00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:28,920 Speaker 2: and she's wearing a kerchief tied around her hair. It 471 00:30:29,000 --> 00:30:36,080 Speaker 2: is it's a mammy figure, and it is beautiful and terrible, 472 00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:41,160 Speaker 2: and it is judging the absolute hell out of you. 473 00:30:43,000 --> 00:30:46,280 Speaker 2: And it is rendered in pure white cane sugar. 474 00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:51,160 Speaker 1: Yes, and it's stunning. It was thirty five feet by 475 00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:55,240 Speaker 1: seventy five feet. Walker used nearly four tons of sugar 476 00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:57,680 Speaker 1: donated by Domino to create this work. 477 00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:01,560 Speaker 2: It's not a it's not actually so sugar, but sugar 478 00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:08,400 Speaker 2: coated polystyrene. She also created to to go along with it. 479 00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:15,240 Speaker 2: Within the warehouse, uh fifteen life sized molasses colored candy children. 480 00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:23,320 Speaker 2: They're little black boys carrying baskets modeled after vintage racist 481 00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:27,719 Speaker 2: figurines that depicted enslaved people, as you know, being like 482 00:31:27,760 --> 00:31:30,040 Speaker 2: happy to be working. The whole song of the South, 483 00:31:30,120 --> 00:31:34,600 Speaker 2: sippity doodo kind of kind of noise. And she she 484 00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:39,520 Speaker 2: designed them so that the candy that she used would 485 00:31:39,560 --> 00:31:44,160 Speaker 2: melt slowly in this like non climate controlled exhibit space, 486 00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:48,600 Speaker 2: and pr reported that it looked a lot like blood. 487 00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:53,680 Speaker 1: Yeah. I highly recommend. We're not an art podcast, but 488 00:31:54,640 --> 00:31:58,320 Speaker 1: I highly recommend looking up kind of all of the 489 00:31:58,360 --> 00:32:01,440 Speaker 1: things that is going on in these pieces. 490 00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:08,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, they're very stunning, They're very upsetting. I very much 491 00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:10,240 Speaker 2: recommend taking a look at them. 492 00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:17,640 Speaker 1: Yes, yes, yes, yes. Also in twenty fourteen, a US 493 00:32:17,800 --> 00:32:20,600 Speaker 1: state dinner for the French president at the time involved 494 00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:26,160 Speaker 1: sugar sculpting, complete with eighteen hundred handpulled pedals. 495 00:32:26,680 --> 00:32:31,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, I looked this up because the stark differences 496 00:32:31,600 --> 00:32:36,080 Speaker 2: between Walker's piece and this news item were really amazing. 497 00:32:36,120 --> 00:32:38,040 Speaker 2: I was like, I need to see photographic evidence to 498 00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:41,200 Speaker 2: see what was going on here. So yeah, okay, I've 499 00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:43,720 Speaker 2: only seen one photo, but I am surmising that what 500 00:32:43,800 --> 00:32:47,680 Speaker 2: happens is that the pastry chef Bill Josis Gosh I 501 00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:49,479 Speaker 2: didn't look up how to say his name, that he 502 00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:52,880 Speaker 2: did multiple similar pieces to perhaps go out to like 503 00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:56,520 Speaker 2: each table or each place setting, and so he made 504 00:32:56,560 --> 00:33:00,840 Speaker 2: this cast sugar plate to look like marble like white 505 00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:04,200 Speaker 2: with swirls of orange and gold running through it. And 506 00:33:04,280 --> 00:33:07,560 Speaker 2: it was the serving platter for petit four for like 507 00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:12,000 Speaker 2: small cookies and chocolates, And the plate was further decorated 508 00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:15,840 Speaker 2: with a big red rose with the sugar pulled to 509 00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:19,080 Speaker 2: look like to look like glass, and then a smaller 510 00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:23,760 Speaker 2: deep purple violet or lily maybe with these really delicate 511 00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:24,720 Speaker 2: ruffled petals. 512 00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:28,479 Speaker 1: So it's pretty, it's very pretty. 513 00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:29,120 Speaker 3: Yeah. 514 00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:36,080 Speaker 1: Yeah. The Getty Museum had an exhibit about sugar sculpting 515 00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:37,200 Speaker 1: in fifteen. 516 00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:42,680 Speaker 2: It involved a nine foot long depiction of a Greek temple, 517 00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:48,240 Speaker 2: complete with like statuary and a garden and figurines depicting 518 00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:50,920 Speaker 2: Circe turning a Deceas's men into pigs. 519 00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:52,840 Speaker 3: Yeah. 520 00:33:53,360 --> 00:33:55,640 Speaker 2: It was apparently based on plans for a piece from 521 00:33:55,640 --> 00:33:56,840 Speaker 2: the seventeen hundreds. 522 00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:03,840 Speaker 1: Oh wow, okay, yeah yeah and uh and one last 523 00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:05,760 Speaker 1: note on on Chinese sugar painting. 524 00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:11,280 Speaker 2: Or sugar painting and blowing. They eventually became popular for 525 00:34:11,400 --> 00:34:15,799 Speaker 2: creating like special occasion gifts and then eventually became folk art. 526 00:34:16,080 --> 00:34:20,000 Speaker 2: And I think I think mostly the painting type has 527 00:34:20,080 --> 00:34:24,160 Speaker 2: survived today as like an entertainment and entreat especially for 528 00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:27,360 Speaker 2: kids at like cool weather festivals in some regions. 529 00:34:28,440 --> 00:34:28,960 Speaker 1: Uh. 530 00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:33,120 Speaker 2: For for for blowing figurines for sale. The artists now 531 00:34:33,200 --> 00:34:37,279 Speaker 2: have the kids do the blowing for like sanitary purposes. Also, 532 00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:39,120 Speaker 2: how cool is that? Like you get to watch an 533 00:34:39,200 --> 00:34:41,600 Speaker 2: artist make this really cool, weird thing and then they're like, okay, 534 00:34:41,600 --> 00:34:43,760 Speaker 2: you have to finish it by blowing into this tiny straw. 535 00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:48,840 Speaker 1: That is so cool. Yeah, agreed. 536 00:34:51,800 --> 00:34:54,240 Speaker 2: And if you can't get out to see one of those, 537 00:34:54,400 --> 00:34:57,440 Speaker 2: then I've seen a bunch of flyers actually, Like, like 538 00:34:57,480 --> 00:34:59,080 Speaker 2: while I was doing all of this reading, I saw 539 00:34:59,120 --> 00:35:02,880 Speaker 2: a bunch of flyers for like art and or science 540 00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:07,640 Speaker 2: workshops about sugar sculpture around the United States and elsewhere. 541 00:35:07,760 --> 00:35:10,080 Speaker 2: So yeah, so do do some googling if that kind 542 00:35:10,120 --> 00:35:11,080 Speaker 2: of thing would interest. 543 00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:13,680 Speaker 1: You, absolutely, and then report back. 544 00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:17,319 Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, yes, yes, yes, we. 545 00:35:17,360 --> 00:35:19,440 Speaker 1: Need you, We need. 546 00:35:19,280 --> 00:35:20,480 Speaker 3: You very important. 547 00:35:20,880 --> 00:35:24,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, it is extremely But I think that's what we 548 00:35:24,640 --> 00:35:26,919 Speaker 1: have to say about sugar sculptures for now. 549 00:35:27,400 --> 00:35:28,080 Speaker 3: I think it is. 550 00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:30,759 Speaker 2: We do already have some listener mail for you, though, 551 00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:32,359 Speaker 2: and we are going to get into that as soon 552 00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:34,280 Speaker 2: as we get back from one more quick break forward 553 00:35:34,320 --> 00:35:35,000 Speaker 2: from our sponsor. 554 00:35:43,400 --> 00:35:46,120 Speaker 1: And we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you, And 555 00:35:46,160 --> 00:35:46,680 Speaker 1: we're back. 556 00:35:46,560 --> 00:36:00,720 Speaker 3: With snoo. 557 00:35:57,719 --> 00:35:59,920 Speaker 1: You know, kind of blowing spinning eye. 558 00:36:05,719 --> 00:36:08,160 Speaker 3: And he's here after a very long day already, y'all. 559 00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:16,480 Speaker 1: Soo, it's true, it's true. Oh but I'm thrilled to 560 00:36:16,520 --> 00:36:17,760 Speaker 1: be here. Yeah. 561 00:36:18,040 --> 00:36:19,680 Speaker 3: And you're doing great. You're doing great. 562 00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:21,600 Speaker 1: Thank you, Lauren su Are you? 563 00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:22,160 Speaker 2: Oh? 564 00:36:22,200 --> 00:36:26,920 Speaker 1: Thank you? Yes? All right, all right? Uh so, a 565 00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:31,240 Speaker 1: Vivian wrote on marigals. My first exposure to the practical 566 00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:34,160 Speaker 1: uses of marigolds was way back in elementary school when 567 00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:39,279 Speaker 1: the MMO RPG, or massively multiplayer online role playing game 568 00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:44,279 Speaker 1: RuneScape was still in vogue. Marigolds are the lowest level 569 00:36:44,320 --> 00:36:47,240 Speaker 1: flower that a player can plant with the farming skill. 570 00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:50,960 Speaker 1: If you plant marigolds adjacent to a plot of land 571 00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:54,279 Speaker 1: where you've grumb potatoes, onions, or tomatoes, your crops will 572 00:36:54,280 --> 00:36:58,120 Speaker 1: be protected from disease. Many years later, I decided to 573 00:36:58,200 --> 00:37:01,880 Speaker 1: finally look up if this has basis in reality. Apparently, 574 00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:05,600 Speaker 1: marigolds have indeed been used for generations to repel insects. 575 00:37:06,480 --> 00:37:12,560 Speaker 1: Wiki says they quote often used in companion planting for tomato, eggplant, chili, pepper, tobacco, 576 00:37:12,640 --> 00:37:16,560 Speaker 1: and potato. One website claims that quote they have a 577 00:37:16,600 --> 00:37:20,920 Speaker 1: distinctive smell that repels mosquitoes and other garden pests, including 578 00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:26,239 Speaker 1: squash bugs and tomato worms. Marigolds contain a natural compound 579 00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:31,800 Speaker 1: used in many insect repellents. However, recent research summarized here 580 00:37:31,920 --> 00:37:35,640 Speaker 1: has apparently shown that those claims are overblown. But one 581 00:37:35,680 --> 00:37:39,160 Speaker 1: specific type of marigold has been shown. It seems to 582 00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:44,520 Speaker 1: control proliferation of the parasitic rootknot nematode by secreting alpha 583 00:37:45,120 --> 00:37:49,399 Speaker 1: terse neal uh chair hope I didn't butcher it from 584 00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:53,840 Speaker 1: its roots, which inhibits nematode egg hatching, and this nematode 585 00:37:53,920 --> 00:37:56,840 Speaker 1: is known to attack a number of plants, including the 586 00:37:56,960 --> 00:38:05,200 Speaker 1: tomato props. To the game developer on Star Wars, it's 587 00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:08,600 Speaker 1: fascinating to me how generational the Star Wars fandom is. 588 00:38:09,040 --> 00:38:11,320 Speaker 1: When I first got into Star Wars in middle school, 589 00:38:11,600 --> 00:38:13,880 Speaker 1: this is around the time the Clone Wars TV series 590 00:38:13,920 --> 00:38:17,600 Speaker 1: was coming out, all the adults were bashing on the prequels, 591 00:38:17,600 --> 00:38:19,960 Speaker 1: and I felt quite alone in my love for the prequels. 592 00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:24,000 Speaker 1: As my generation of fans grew up and spread to 593 00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:26,520 Speaker 1: all corners of the Internet, we all realized that there 594 00:38:26,520 --> 00:38:28,920 Speaker 1: were many other fans who grew up with the prequels 595 00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:33,120 Speaker 1: and loved them. Then the sequels came out, and they 596 00:38:33,120 --> 00:38:37,319 Speaker 1: were bashed by many and my generation, and I admittedly 597 00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:40,960 Speaker 1: find much of it difficult to stomach myself. Beautiful cinematography, 598 00:38:41,040 --> 00:38:44,160 Speaker 1: great acting, terrible script, but the sequels seem to be 599 00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:47,520 Speaker 1: plenty popular with the new generation of fans. I guess 600 00:38:47,600 --> 00:38:56,720 Speaker 1: there's just a trilogy for every generation. Yeah. Well, first off, 601 00:38:57,640 --> 00:39:01,920 Speaker 1: I love that you bought a video game fact about 602 00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:09,160 Speaker 1: marigolds and about kind of their scientific property. Yeah, that's amazing. Yeah, 603 00:39:09,640 --> 00:39:16,520 Speaker 1: I didn't even consider that. What's wrong with me? Terrible terrible, 604 00:39:16,600 --> 00:39:21,520 Speaker 1: terrible terrible, And yes, I completely agree with you about 605 00:39:21,840 --> 00:39:24,040 Speaker 1: about Star Wars. I grew up with the prequels as well, 606 00:39:24,520 --> 00:39:28,000 Speaker 1: and I won this sweet backpack Lauren. It was so cool, 607 00:39:28,400 --> 00:39:30,279 Speaker 1: and then I'm so embarrassed to have it. I got 608 00:39:30,360 --> 00:39:33,319 Speaker 1: rid of it, and now I'm like kicking myself for 609 00:39:33,360 --> 00:39:36,400 Speaker 1: it because that backpack was cool and I love backpacks. 610 00:39:36,440 --> 00:39:38,879 Speaker 1: I'm pointing, but you can't see those like backpacks in here. 611 00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:42,720 Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, yeah, I mean. 612 00:39:45,520 --> 00:39:48,520 Speaker 1: It's it's funny to me because it's true. It makes sense. 613 00:39:48,560 --> 00:39:50,480 Speaker 1: We're all nostalgic. I did grow up with the original 614 00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:54,640 Speaker 1: Triloy too, but we are all nostalgic. But I also 615 00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:56,440 Speaker 1: think it's important to keep in mind that, you know, 616 00:39:58,120 --> 00:40:00,320 Speaker 1: it's important for kids. Like when I see people trust 617 00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:03,280 Speaker 1: is ray, it makes me so happy, so. 618 00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:08,120 Speaker 2: Happy, right man, Whenever, whenever a kid is excited about something, 619 00:40:08,160 --> 00:40:10,720 Speaker 2: come on, like, that's great, that's like or whatever. Anyone 620 00:40:10,760 --> 00:40:14,480 Speaker 2: is excited about something, I think that's pretty great. But no, 621 00:40:14,800 --> 00:40:18,480 Speaker 2: getting the experience of going to to Disney and seeing 622 00:40:18,560 --> 00:40:23,280 Speaker 2: tiny children be just excited about seeing you know, like yes, 623 00:40:23,520 --> 00:40:25,920 Speaker 2: padme or whatever as I am, I'm just like, yeah, 624 00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:27,240 Speaker 2: we're sharing this together. 625 00:40:28,080 --> 00:40:30,040 Speaker 1: Absolutely love it. 626 00:40:30,560 --> 00:40:32,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, No, I hated. 627 00:40:32,160 --> 00:40:35,160 Speaker 2: I hated the prequels when they came out. 628 00:40:35,440 --> 00:40:35,839 Speaker 1: I was. 629 00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:37,520 Speaker 2: I was in high school and I was too cool 630 00:40:37,560 --> 00:40:43,640 Speaker 2: for them. But right, but but no, I it's they're fine. 631 00:40:43,880 --> 00:40:44,440 Speaker 1: It's fine. 632 00:40:44,520 --> 00:40:45,720 Speaker 3: It's fine to like things. 633 00:40:47,080 --> 00:40:49,160 Speaker 1: It is it is, And I think it's just important 634 00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:52,839 Speaker 1: to remember, like, you know, for the people who love 635 00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:55,800 Speaker 1: the prequels, like you say, Vivian, you don't hate on 636 00:40:55,840 --> 00:40:58,200 Speaker 1: the sequels because you remember what it was like. You 637 00:40:58,200 --> 00:40:59,640 Speaker 1: can have critiques. 638 00:40:59,200 --> 00:41:02,000 Speaker 2: Oh sure, I'm so oh my goodness, yes. 639 00:41:02,520 --> 00:41:06,120 Speaker 1: But not being like you're you're ridiculous for liking this. 640 00:41:06,280 --> 00:41:07,000 Speaker 1: I miss you. 641 00:41:07,480 --> 00:41:15,960 Speaker 4: Yeah, exactly, exactly, thank you, Tracy wrote on a recent 642 00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:18,520 Speaker 4: trip to Italy, I had the amazing fortune to spend 643 00:41:18,600 --> 00:41:21,560 Speaker 4: time in Florence, the capital of Tuscany, and we went 644 00:41:21,600 --> 00:41:22,960 Speaker 4: a little kinto chi wild. 645 00:41:23,480 --> 00:41:26,239 Speaker 2: Our first encounter was during a lunch. The lady next 646 00:41:26,239 --> 00:41:28,080 Speaker 2: to us was visiting from another part of Italy and 647 00:41:28,120 --> 00:41:30,719 Speaker 2: asked for a regional dessert, and we saw her brought 648 00:41:30,800 --> 00:41:34,480 Speaker 2: a tray of viscatti and a shot glass filled with 649 00:41:34,520 --> 00:41:35,640 Speaker 2: a golden. 650 00:41:35,320 --> 00:41:36,360 Speaker 3: Syrup to dunk. 651 00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:39,640 Speaker 2: Later that day, we were at a wine bar and 652 00:41:39,800 --> 00:41:42,640 Speaker 2: in Liteca, and I said that in a really Spanish 653 00:41:42,680 --> 00:41:45,280 Speaker 2: way anyway, and asked for coffee to go with our dessert. 654 00:41:45,600 --> 00:41:49,440 Speaker 2: Our waitress apologized, saying they only served wine. She returned 655 00:41:49,480 --> 00:41:51,840 Speaker 2: a few minutes later with two eperitif glasses filled with 656 00:41:51,880 --> 00:41:55,239 Speaker 2: the same golden syrup we'd seen earlier that day. She 657 00:41:55,360 --> 00:41:58,600 Speaker 2: explained it was vin Santo Saintly wine, and that in 658 00:41:58,680 --> 00:42:02,160 Speaker 2: Florence we had to try, but she didn't serve any cookies. 659 00:42:02,800 --> 00:42:05,320 Speaker 2: The next day we went to the big central market, 660 00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:09,680 Speaker 2: where I saw several Canucci vendors. I then remembered that's 661 00:42:09,719 --> 00:42:12,840 Speaker 2: what these cookies were called an Italian. So that evening 662 00:42:12,880 --> 00:42:17,440 Speaker 2: after enjoying a giant abisteca of Florentina, we asked for 663 00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:21,759 Speaker 2: Vincanto and Cantucci to finish the meal. My partner was skeptical, 664 00:42:21,840 --> 00:42:25,000 Speaker 2: but took one bite and his mind was blown. He 665 00:42:25,040 --> 00:42:27,959 Speaker 2: then ordered it after every meal we ate the rest 666 00:42:27,960 --> 00:42:30,920 Speaker 2: of our time in Florence. This impressed our waiter at 667 00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:33,320 Speaker 2: one lunch spot we found, and as we were finishing 668 00:42:33,400 --> 00:42:35,880 Speaker 2: our dessert, he brought us a second plate of cookies. 669 00:42:36,239 --> 00:42:38,560 Speaker 2: He explained that when they're fresh from the oven, they're 670 00:42:38,600 --> 00:42:41,120 Speaker 2: more chewy, in which he preferred, and he thought that 671 00:42:41,160 --> 00:42:45,480 Speaker 2: we should try both versions. Vincanto and Cantucci became our 672 00:42:45,520 --> 00:42:48,719 Speaker 2: symbol of Florence, not just as a delicious treat, but 673 00:42:48,760 --> 00:42:51,640 Speaker 2: as a reminder of the amazing hospitality we had there. 674 00:42:52,360 --> 00:42:56,360 Speaker 2: We recently celebrated our anniversary at Monte Verde, an Italian 675 00:42:56,400 --> 00:42:59,759 Speaker 2: inspired restaurant in Chicago, and for dessert we asked for 676 00:42:59,800 --> 00:43:03,600 Speaker 2: Vincezantho and biscotti. For a few small bites. It was 677 00:43:03,640 --> 00:43:08,759 Speaker 2: like being back in Italy. Oh that's lovely, Oh all 678 00:43:08,800 --> 00:43:11,520 Speaker 2: of that is lovely. Oh all of that sounds so good. 679 00:43:11,760 --> 00:43:15,840 Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, yes, yes, always jealous of these trips, 680 00:43:15,920 --> 00:43:19,560 Speaker 1: you listeners take and the food you try, but so 681 00:43:19,560 --> 00:43:23,439 Speaker 1: so grateful that you share it with us. Yes, thank you, Yes, 682 00:43:23,560 --> 00:43:26,799 Speaker 1: we really appreciate it. And gosh, just sounds like a 683 00:43:26,840 --> 00:43:31,680 Speaker 1: lovely trip, Really it does. And I do love the 684 00:43:31,719 --> 00:43:34,960 Speaker 1: passion of like a chef being like you need to try. 685 00:43:34,920 --> 00:43:39,640 Speaker 2: Like hold on both, hold on, holde Yeah, I love it. 686 00:43:41,960 --> 00:43:45,279 Speaker 1: Well. Thanks to both of these listeners for writing in. 687 00:43:45,400 --> 00:43:47,279 Speaker 1: If you would like to write to us, you can 688 00:43:47,400 --> 00:43:49,600 Speaker 1: our email us hello at savorpod dot com. 689 00:43:49,640 --> 00:43:51,040 Speaker 3: We are also on social media. 690 00:43:51,120 --> 00:43:53,839 Speaker 2: You can find us on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram at 691 00:43:53,880 --> 00:43:55,759 Speaker 2: saver pod and we do hope to hear from you. 692 00:43:56,160 --> 00:43:57,879 Speaker 2: Savor is production of iHeartRadio. 693 00:43:58,000 --> 00:43:59,040 Speaker 3: For more podcasts to my. 694 00:43:59,000 --> 00:44:02,520 Speaker 2: Heart Radio, you can the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or 695 00:44:02,560 --> 00:44:05,760 Speaker 2: wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Thanks as always 696 00:44:05,760 --> 00:44:08,640 Speaker 2: to our super producers Dylan Fagan and Andrew Howard. Thanks 697 00:44:08,680 --> 00:44:10,279 Speaker 2: to you for listening, and we hope that lots more 698 00:44:10,280 --> 00:44:19,120 Speaker 2: good things are coming your way.