WEBVTT - Getting organized without the stress, with Dana K. White

0:00:03.000 --> 0:00:09.240
<v Speaker 1>Welcome to Before Breakfast, a production of iHeartRadio. Good Morning,

0:00:10.080 --> 0:00:15.400
<v Speaker 1>This is Laura. Welcome to the Before Breakfast podcast. Today's

0:00:15.480 --> 0:00:19.079
<v Speaker 1>episode is going to be a longer one part of

0:00:19.079 --> 0:00:22.160
<v Speaker 1>a series where I interview fascinating people about how they

0:00:22.200 --> 0:00:25.080
<v Speaker 1>take their days from great to awesome and their advice

0:00:25.320 --> 0:00:28.480
<v Speaker 1>for the rest of us. So today I am delighted

0:00:28.480 --> 0:00:31.440
<v Speaker 1>to welcome Dana K. White to the program. Dana is

0:00:31.480 --> 0:00:34.880
<v Speaker 1>a decluttering expert, the author of Organizing for the Rest

0:00:34.880 --> 0:00:37.920
<v Speaker 1>of Us, and most recently a book called Jesus Doesn't

0:00:37.920 --> 0:00:42.720
<v Speaker 1>Care About Your Messy House. She's created numerous helpful YouTube videos.

0:00:42.760 --> 0:00:44.360
<v Speaker 1>I know a lot of people you know listening to

0:00:44.440 --> 0:00:47.319
<v Speaker 1>the show have watched for people looking to get their

0:00:47.320 --> 0:00:50.160
<v Speaker 1>homes and lives under control. So Dana, welcome to the show.

0:00:50.200 --> 0:00:51.279
<v Speaker 2>Thanks so much for having me on.

0:00:52.320 --> 0:00:54.840
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, glad to have you. So maybe you could introduce

0:00:54.880 --> 0:00:57.400
<v Speaker 1>yourself to our listeners. What you're up to these days?

0:00:57.720 --> 0:00:59.920
<v Speaker 2>Well, I'm Dana KA White. I always put the K in,

0:01:00.280 --> 0:01:02.400
<v Speaker 2>so we don't, you know, get confused and think you're

0:01:02.400 --> 0:01:05.280
<v Speaker 2>talking to the guy who runs the UFC, because that's

0:01:05.319 --> 0:01:05.679
<v Speaker 2>not me.

0:01:06.000 --> 0:01:10.120
<v Speaker 1>Not talking to him to know, not today, you know, anyotherday.

0:01:10.280 --> 0:01:14.560
<v Speaker 2>So I am a mom of three young adults, so

0:01:14.760 --> 0:01:18.800
<v Speaker 2>I was an empty nester for two days and then

0:01:18.880 --> 0:01:20.520
<v Speaker 2>my one of them said, you know what, I think

0:01:20.520 --> 0:01:22.559
<v Speaker 2>I'm gonna do this semester from home, and I was like.

0:01:22.600 --> 0:01:25.680
<v Speaker 1>Okay, So that was the end of that. Yeah.

0:01:25.760 --> 0:01:27.920
<v Speaker 2>No, I mean, it's it's that phase of life where

0:01:27.920 --> 0:01:32.720
<v Speaker 2>you're just like whatever, anything's great, whatever, you know, And

0:01:33.040 --> 0:01:38.679
<v Speaker 2>I teach people how to declutter even though this is

0:01:38.720 --> 0:01:41.200
<v Speaker 2>the thing that I struggled with my entire life, and

0:01:41.200 --> 0:01:44.080
<v Speaker 2>actually because it's the thing I struggled with my entire life,

0:01:44.160 --> 0:01:47.520
<v Speaker 2>because this does not come naturally to me, So I

0:01:47.560 --> 0:01:50.640
<v Speaker 2>don't teach it out of a place of Wow, I'm

0:01:50.680 --> 0:01:52.240
<v Speaker 2>so good at this, everybody else should be good at

0:01:52.240 --> 0:01:53.960
<v Speaker 2>it too. It's more like, oh, I get how hard

0:01:54.000 --> 0:01:56.960
<v Speaker 2>this is and I've had to figure it out. So

0:01:56.960 --> 0:01:59.960
<v Speaker 2>so it's been more of a journey for absolutely, absolutely

0:02:00.600 --> 0:02:01.240
<v Speaker 2>And how did you?

0:02:01.560 --> 0:02:04.400
<v Speaker 1>So? Then, how does one establish oneself as a decluttering

0:02:04.440 --> 0:02:08.040
<v Speaker 1>expert if this is something that isn't so easy for you?

0:02:08.120 --> 0:02:10.639
<v Speaker 1>I mean, how have you gone about doing that?

0:02:10.720 --> 0:02:12.480
<v Speaker 2>Well? It was not my intention. I will tell you

0:02:12.480 --> 0:02:16.320
<v Speaker 2>that I just wanted to be a writer, and I

0:02:16.400 --> 0:02:20.680
<v Speaker 2>was stopped from doing that because I just had it

0:02:20.680 --> 0:02:21.840
<v Speaker 2>in my head. I was like, I have got to

0:02:21.840 --> 0:02:24.400
<v Speaker 2>get my house under control first. I'm not saying you

0:02:24.400 --> 0:02:26.400
<v Speaker 2>have to have your house under control in order to

0:02:26.400 --> 0:02:28.080
<v Speaker 2>do the thing you want to do, but it was

0:02:28.160 --> 0:02:30.800
<v Speaker 2>stopping me right. Like, I found out what blogs were

0:02:30.800 --> 0:02:33.000
<v Speaker 2>back in two thousand and eight, and I was like,

0:02:33.080 --> 0:02:36.200
<v Speaker 2>that's it. I've got to have one. And I had

0:02:36.240 --> 0:02:38.959
<v Speaker 2>been trying so hard to get my house under control,

0:02:39.280 --> 0:02:43.400
<v Speaker 2>and I was like, I can't take on another thing

0:02:43.760 --> 0:02:45.560
<v Speaker 2>until I get this figured out. And so I didn't

0:02:45.560 --> 0:02:47.960
<v Speaker 2>start my blog for a year and a half, and

0:02:48.040 --> 0:02:52.040
<v Speaker 2>I started it as a practice blog, Like I thought

0:02:52.720 --> 0:02:54.560
<v Speaker 2>that I was going to write about getting my house

0:02:54.600 --> 0:02:57.440
<v Speaker 2>under control as a way to stay focused on that

0:02:57.560 --> 0:02:59.880
<v Speaker 2>and figure it out, and then start writing about things

0:03:00.000 --> 0:03:02.400
<v Speaker 2>I actually felt qualified to write about. Right, So in

0:03:02.480 --> 0:03:05.480
<v Speaker 2>the beginning it was anonymous. I didn't even tell my

0:03:05.560 --> 0:03:07.400
<v Speaker 2>husband what I was doing for like at least a month,

0:03:07.960 --> 0:03:11.519
<v Speaker 2>and I was just trying to figure it out. Had

0:03:11.560 --> 0:03:14.760
<v Speaker 2>no intention of teaching anyone any of this stuff. Like actually,

0:03:15.000 --> 0:03:16.560
<v Speaker 2>as people started to read it and they're like, can

0:03:16.600 --> 0:03:18.840
<v Speaker 2>you teach us what you're doing? And I would say,

0:03:19.760 --> 0:03:23.480
<v Speaker 2>why in the world would anyone want to learn about

0:03:23.480 --> 0:03:25.600
<v Speaker 2>this from me. I'm like no, no, I am like

0:03:25.800 --> 0:03:28.720
<v Speaker 2>struggling my way through. And after about two and a

0:03:28.760 --> 0:03:31.320
<v Speaker 2>half years, I had my house at a point where

0:03:31.320 --> 0:03:34.160
<v Speaker 2>I was like, oh, I get it now, like I

0:03:34.240 --> 0:03:36.160
<v Speaker 2>know what to do. I know what I was doing wrong.

0:03:37.240 --> 0:03:39.240
<v Speaker 2>And when people would ask me that, I finally said,

0:03:39.240 --> 0:03:41.520
<v Speaker 2>you know what, I cannot tell you how to have

0:03:41.520 --> 0:03:45.040
<v Speaker 2>a perfect house, but I can tell you how to

0:03:45.080 --> 0:03:50.800
<v Speaker 2>go from completely overwhelmed and hopeless to oh, Okay, I

0:03:50.840 --> 0:03:54.120
<v Speaker 2>get it now, you know. And so that is my

0:03:55.280 --> 0:03:57.600
<v Speaker 2>niche or niche or however you like to say it.

0:03:58.960 --> 0:04:01.520
<v Speaker 1>Well, I'm very curious what made it so overwhelming? I

0:04:01.520 --> 0:04:04.640
<v Speaker 1>mean I sort of think, like, you know, being paralyzed

0:04:04.640 --> 0:04:06.360
<v Speaker 1>and unable to write or something that you must have

0:04:06.400 --> 0:04:09.880
<v Speaker 1>been like sitting under giant piles of furniture or something.

0:04:09.920 --> 0:04:13.280
<v Speaker 1>I mean, what was going on with the house that

0:04:13.360 --> 0:04:14.800
<v Speaker 1>made it so out of control? You know?

0:04:15.920 --> 0:04:22.119
<v Speaker 2>It was just a constant disaster. Okay, So I could

0:04:22.120 --> 0:04:25.320
<v Speaker 2>have people over. I just needed two weeks to get ready,

0:04:25.440 --> 0:04:29.440
<v Speaker 2>that's all. So all I needed was so I would

0:04:29.480 --> 0:04:32.960
<v Speaker 2>take the first week to you know, declutter. I'm making

0:04:33.040 --> 0:04:34.960
<v Speaker 2>air quotes as I say that I would take the

0:04:34.960 --> 0:04:37.240
<v Speaker 2>first week to declutter, which really just meant I shoved

0:04:37.279 --> 0:04:41.600
<v Speaker 2>everything into my husband's bedroom because that was the door

0:04:41.640 --> 0:04:43.800
<v Speaker 2>I could lock, right, I would shove everything in there,

0:04:43.960 --> 0:04:45.440
<v Speaker 2>and then I would clean for a week because you

0:04:45.480 --> 0:04:48.159
<v Speaker 2>can't actually claim when there's clutter everywhere, right, And so

0:04:48.720 --> 0:04:53.240
<v Speaker 2>it was just a constant disaster. And I could get

0:04:53.240 --> 0:04:56.320
<v Speaker 2>my house under control, but I treated it like a project.

0:04:56.320 --> 0:04:58.800
<v Speaker 2>And so I would like, you know, take everything else

0:04:58.839 --> 0:05:02.159
<v Speaker 2>off the calendar on my house, get it, you know,

0:05:02.920 --> 0:05:07.240
<v Speaker 2>basically under control, and then think, okay, who, I'm done, right,

0:05:07.600 --> 0:05:09.320
<v Speaker 2>and then it would go right back to being a disaster.

0:05:09.960 --> 0:05:11.960
<v Speaker 2>Things I didn't know I had more stuff than I

0:05:11.960 --> 0:05:14.000
<v Speaker 2>could possibly handle. I had more stuff than I had

0:05:14.000 --> 0:05:17.000
<v Speaker 2>places to put stuff. And I didn't understand that correlation, right,

0:05:17.000 --> 0:05:20.080
<v Speaker 2>because I'm a highly creative person and I don't see limits,

0:05:20.080 --> 0:05:22.599
<v Speaker 2>and so, you know, that just didn't occur to me

0:05:22.640 --> 0:05:25.159
<v Speaker 2>that the too much stuff was the actual issue that

0:05:25.200 --> 0:05:28.600
<v Speaker 2>I had. So when I say that my house was

0:05:28.600 --> 0:05:33.279
<v Speaker 2>a disaster, I mean that I avoided having people come over,

0:05:33.680 --> 0:05:35.520
<v Speaker 2>or when I did have them come over, it was

0:05:35.560 --> 0:05:40.760
<v Speaker 2>a huge stressful deal. And so, yeah, go.

0:05:40.680 --> 0:05:44.080
<v Speaker 1>Ahead, Yeah, was that the most common issue? Then? When

0:05:44.120 --> 0:05:47.800
<v Speaker 1>people feel like their homes are overwhelming and out of control.

0:05:47.880 --> 0:05:49.599
<v Speaker 1>Is it that they have too much stuff?

0:05:49.960 --> 0:05:53.760
<v Speaker 2>Generally, yes, it's that and its routines. Like I always

0:05:53.800 --> 0:05:56.320
<v Speaker 2>tell people to start with the routines because part of

0:05:56.360 --> 0:05:59.200
<v Speaker 2>my issue was I always thought, what is the point

0:05:59.400 --> 0:06:03.159
<v Speaker 2>of any kind of a maintenance task when my house

0:06:03.279 --> 0:06:05.400
<v Speaker 2>is a total disaster. I need to get it under

0:06:05.480 --> 0:06:09.479
<v Speaker 2>control and then start maintaining. That never worked. What actually

0:06:09.520 --> 0:06:12.080
<v Speaker 2>did work was when I started doing those maintenance type

0:06:12.120 --> 0:06:16.039
<v Speaker 2>tasks before it was any better. Like, I just started

0:06:16.080 --> 0:06:18.719
<v Speaker 2>with the maintenance tasks that started to change my home.

0:06:18.839 --> 0:06:21.359
<v Speaker 2>At the same time, the more I did that, it

0:06:21.480 --> 0:06:23.560
<v Speaker 2>freed up time for me to get stuff out of

0:06:23.560 --> 0:06:25.640
<v Speaker 2>my house. And so those two things are equally important.

0:06:25.640 --> 0:06:28.520
<v Speaker 2>You really can't have one without the other. But in general, yes,

0:06:28.880 --> 0:06:32.120
<v Speaker 2>most people's issues are that they have too much stuff.

0:06:33.320 --> 0:06:35.720
<v Speaker 1>Well, it's an easy thing to have happen. And this is,

0:06:35.760 --> 0:06:38.320
<v Speaker 1>you know, running not too long after the holidays, because

0:06:38.320 --> 0:06:40.160
<v Speaker 1>I'm sure a lot of folks have just gotten a

0:06:40.200 --> 0:06:44.440
<v Speaker 1>whole news shipment of stuff into their homes. I mean, well,

0:06:44.440 --> 0:06:46.839
<v Speaker 1>what can you do if you find you have too

0:06:46.880 --> 0:06:50.159
<v Speaker 1>much stuff? Let's start with the getting rid of some

0:06:50.240 --> 0:06:52.080
<v Speaker 1>of this stuff first, and then we can talk about

0:06:52.160 --> 0:06:54.800
<v Speaker 1>the routines that are helpful for maintenance.

0:06:54.960 --> 0:06:58.279
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. So the number one thing that I recommend, and

0:06:58.320 --> 0:07:01.039
<v Speaker 2>this is all based in my own experience, is that

0:07:02.640 --> 0:07:06.440
<v Speaker 2>you should prioritize decluttering according to the most visible spaces

0:07:06.440 --> 0:07:10.280
<v Speaker 2>in your home. This is actually the opposite of what

0:07:10.400 --> 0:07:13.880
<v Speaker 2>most of us naturally tend to do. We tend to

0:07:14.960 --> 0:07:18.200
<v Speaker 2>think I need to declutter, and we start with the

0:07:18.240 --> 0:07:20.840
<v Speaker 2>linen closet, or we start with the top shelf of

0:07:20.960 --> 0:07:25.960
<v Speaker 2>the closet, you know, some obscure place where maybe we've

0:07:26.000 --> 0:07:28.720
<v Speaker 2>been thinking about, oh that needs to be dealt with, oh,

0:07:28.920 --> 0:07:31.800
<v Speaker 2>you know, or maybe it's that if I work on

0:07:31.840 --> 0:07:33.760
<v Speaker 2>this space and we don't really use it that often,

0:07:34.120 --> 0:07:38.600
<v Speaker 2>then maybe it'll stay decluttered. Right. But the problem with

0:07:38.680 --> 0:07:40.720
<v Speaker 2>that is that you put all this time and energy

0:07:40.760 --> 0:07:44.200
<v Speaker 2>into this space that you don't see and use consistently,

0:07:45.000 --> 0:07:48.520
<v Speaker 2>and therefore you're not seeing the results of the work

0:07:48.520 --> 0:07:52.840
<v Speaker 2>that you've done. And if you've spent all day decluttering

0:07:52.880 --> 0:07:56.760
<v Speaker 2>a back closet and then the doorbell rings and you're

0:07:56.800 --> 0:07:58.880
<v Speaker 2>still embarrassed to open the front door, or you let

0:07:58.960 --> 0:08:00.760
<v Speaker 2>somebody in and they say what you've been doing today?

0:08:00.760 --> 0:08:02.760
<v Speaker 2>And you say, well, I've been decluttering, and you see

0:08:02.760 --> 0:08:06.520
<v Speaker 2>their eyes look around like really, you know, and that

0:08:06.680 --> 0:08:10.000
<v Speaker 2>is so defeating, right, Like, it's so incredibly defeating to

0:08:10.080 --> 0:08:12.800
<v Speaker 2>have that happen that it makes you just feel like,

0:08:12.840 --> 0:08:15.440
<v Speaker 2>what's the point. But if you start in a visible space,

0:08:17.360 --> 0:08:20.160
<v Speaker 2>then the progress that you're gonna that you're gonna make

0:08:20.760 --> 0:08:24.160
<v Speaker 2>is something that you're gonna experience. You're gonna experience the

0:08:24.200 --> 0:08:26.320
<v Speaker 2>benefits of it. You're gonna see even though you walked

0:08:26.360 --> 0:08:29.680
<v Speaker 2>past that mess for months. Now you walk by and

0:08:29.720 --> 0:08:32.280
<v Speaker 2>it's clear and you're like, oh, that looks so good,

0:08:32.320 --> 0:08:34.720
<v Speaker 2>and it increases that decluttering energy. So it helps to

0:08:34.760 --> 0:08:39.719
<v Speaker 2>perpetuate your uh, decluttering energy and build that momentum that

0:08:39.720 --> 0:08:41.480
<v Speaker 2>everybody is looking for. So that's the number one thing

0:08:41.520 --> 0:08:44.920
<v Speaker 2>that as far as how to start decluttering. I have

0:08:45.000 --> 0:08:47.600
<v Speaker 2>my no Mess decluttering process, right, which is designed to

0:08:47.600 --> 0:08:50.440
<v Speaker 2>make progress and only progress. Never end up creating a

0:08:50.760 --> 0:08:53.200
<v Speaker 2>worse mess than you have before. Like you know how

0:08:53.200 --> 0:08:55.800
<v Speaker 2>everybody always says, oh, it has to get worse before

0:08:55.800 --> 0:08:56.880
<v Speaker 2>it gets better. That's not true.

0:08:56.960 --> 0:08:59.440
<v Speaker 1>You know, don't make it worse for it. So you

0:08:59.480 --> 0:09:01.559
<v Speaker 1>are not saying we should put everything in the middle

0:09:01.600 --> 0:09:04.160
<v Speaker 1>of the floor, took everything out of every kitchen drawer.

0:09:04.800 --> 0:09:07.959
<v Speaker 1>I and then and then you know, something happens. You're

0:09:07.960 --> 0:09:10.280
<v Speaker 1>pulled away, I gotta go pick a kid up from school, sick,

0:09:10.280 --> 0:09:12.120
<v Speaker 1>and then the mess is worse than it ever.

0:09:12.120 --> 0:09:14.200
<v Speaker 2>Was, well exactly. And you know a lot of the

0:09:14.200 --> 0:09:17.080
<v Speaker 2>people who send me emails will say, well, I did that,

0:09:17.240 --> 0:09:20.000
<v Speaker 2>and then I had stuff all over the floor for

0:09:20.160 --> 0:09:22.960
<v Speaker 2>six months, you know, or what I even without it

0:09:23.000 --> 0:09:26.280
<v Speaker 2>being that extreme method, I thought that the way you

0:09:26.320 --> 0:09:28.600
<v Speaker 2>had to declutter was to pull everything out of the space,

0:09:28.720 --> 0:09:31.160
<v Speaker 2>Like I just I thought that's what everybody said you

0:09:31.160 --> 0:09:32.679
<v Speaker 2>were supposed to do, and so I would try that,

0:09:33.040 --> 0:09:36.760
<v Speaker 2>and every single time I would end up overwhelmed and

0:09:36.800 --> 0:09:39.880
<v Speaker 2>defeated because I never finished it, you know, And so

0:09:40.000 --> 0:09:41.360
<v Speaker 2>it was worse than it was before, and I would

0:09:41.360 --> 0:09:42.920
<v Speaker 2>shove it all back in and where I used to

0:09:43.000 --> 0:09:44.800
<v Speaker 2>kind of know where things were in the pile, now

0:09:44.840 --> 0:09:47.480
<v Speaker 2>I had no idea. So yeah, so as first starting,

0:09:47.480 --> 0:09:49.880
<v Speaker 2>we start with the trash, like we just start one

0:09:49.920 --> 0:09:51.840
<v Speaker 2>item at a time pulling it out, and then I,

0:09:52.000 --> 0:09:53.800
<v Speaker 2>you know, my five step process takes you all the

0:09:53.800 --> 0:09:59.680
<v Speaker 2>way through, but it helps me know what to remove first,

0:09:59.720 --> 0:10:02.400
<v Speaker 2>and item that I remove makes me a little bit

0:10:02.440 --> 0:10:05.360
<v Speaker 2>less overwhelmed, helps me understand what I'm dealing with so

0:10:05.360 --> 0:10:07.240
<v Speaker 2>that when I do get to the point where I'm

0:10:07.240 --> 0:10:09.960
<v Speaker 2>making actual decisions, I'm ready for that.

0:10:10.960 --> 0:10:13.240
<v Speaker 1>Awesome. Well, we're going to take a quick ad break

0:10:13.280 --> 0:10:14.959
<v Speaker 1>and then I will be right back with Dana K.

0:10:15.080 --> 0:10:25.280
<v Speaker 1>White talking about decluttering. Well, I am back with before

0:10:25.320 --> 0:10:28.959
<v Speaker 1>breakfast interviewing Dana K. White, a decluttering expert. So we've

0:10:28.960 --> 0:10:31.319
<v Speaker 1>been talking about not pulling all the things out of

0:10:31.360 --> 0:10:33.679
<v Speaker 1>the every door, putting it on the floor, and then

0:10:33.720 --> 0:10:35.760
<v Speaker 1>winding up with stuff there for six months. First we're

0:10:35.760 --> 0:10:38.000
<v Speaker 1>going to get rid of the trash, I believe. The

0:10:38.040 --> 0:10:39.400
<v Speaker 1>next thing is we're going to get rid of any

0:10:40.240 --> 0:10:43.160
<v Speaker 1>dirty dishes or laundry. Right is that the next day?

0:10:43.200 --> 0:10:45.400
<v Speaker 2>Well, the next step is the easy stuff, which may

0:10:45.400 --> 0:10:48.199
<v Speaker 2>include dishes or laundry. Not the dishes and laundry or

0:10:48.240 --> 0:10:50.160
<v Speaker 2>easy like, I'm not saying that. What I'm saying is

0:10:50.840 --> 0:10:53.800
<v Speaker 2>emotionally easy, meaning I already know what to do. Right,

0:10:53.840 --> 0:10:56.320
<v Speaker 2>So the easy stuff is anything that I already know

0:10:57.240 --> 0:10:59.480
<v Speaker 2>what to do with it, that already has an established home.

0:11:00.000 --> 0:11:01.439
<v Speaker 2>I just have to do the thing. Sometimes I call

0:11:01.480 --> 0:11:04.440
<v Speaker 2>this per crest to clutter right, it's stuff that's laying around.

0:11:04.440 --> 0:11:06.720
<v Speaker 2>Like you, if you really work hard on your living

0:11:06.800 --> 0:11:12.480
<v Speaker 2>room and yet there is a recliner piled high with

0:11:12.559 --> 0:11:16.800
<v Speaker 2>clean laundry, your living room doesn't actually look like it's

0:11:16.800 --> 0:11:19.800
<v Speaker 2>been decluttered, right, because that iesore is there. But it's

0:11:19.840 --> 0:11:21.520
<v Speaker 2>easy to be like, oh, I'll get to that later

0:11:21.559 --> 0:11:23.840
<v Speaker 2>when I'm not decluttering. But it's important to get that

0:11:23.880 --> 0:11:27.400
<v Speaker 2>step done so that you have the actual benefit of

0:11:27.679 --> 0:11:28.280
<v Speaker 2>what you're doing.

0:11:30.440 --> 0:11:32.439
<v Speaker 1>And then after that that's when you tackle the more

0:11:32.440 --> 0:11:33.080
<v Speaker 1>difficult thing.

0:11:33.160 --> 0:11:35.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Next, the next step in my five steps is

0:11:35.800 --> 0:11:39.040
<v Speaker 2>the obvious donations, so I call them the duh donations,

0:11:39.080 --> 0:11:40.680
<v Speaker 2>Like why do I even have this? I don't have

0:11:40.720 --> 0:11:42.760
<v Speaker 2>to think about it. I'm just gonna go ahead and

0:11:42.800 --> 0:11:46.240
<v Speaker 2>get those out because again, with everything that leaves now

0:11:46.320 --> 0:11:49.240
<v Speaker 2>I can see more clearly what I'm actually dealing with.

0:11:49.400 --> 0:11:51.400
<v Speaker 2>And then at that point that's when I ask my

0:11:51.520 --> 0:11:53.040
<v Speaker 2>decluttering questions. That's step four.

0:11:54.080 --> 0:11:55.080
<v Speaker 1>All right, what are those real?

0:11:55.160 --> 0:11:57.520
<v Speaker 2>Quick? Let's run through. So there's only two and if

0:11:57.600 --> 0:12:00.240
<v Speaker 2>you if you can answer the first one, you don't

0:12:00.280 --> 0:12:03.680
<v Speaker 2>have to even ask the second one. So the question

0:12:04.040 --> 0:12:07.040
<v Speaker 2>declaring question number one is if I needed this item,

0:12:07.400 --> 0:12:11.240
<v Speaker 2>where would I look for it first, And it has

0:12:11.280 --> 0:12:13.400
<v Speaker 2>to be asked like that, Like, it's not where should

0:12:13.400 --> 0:12:17.920
<v Speaker 2>it go, It's not where would it be? It is

0:12:18.080 --> 0:12:20.040
<v Speaker 2>where would I look for it first? If I already

0:12:20.120 --> 0:12:23.080
<v Speaker 2>knew where it went it left in step two, right, Like,

0:12:23.920 --> 0:12:27.240
<v Speaker 2>I'm only asking this question because I literally don't know

0:12:27.480 --> 0:12:29.360
<v Speaker 2>where this thing goes. It doesn't have a home in

0:12:29.400 --> 0:12:30.880
<v Speaker 2>my house. And this is how I give it a home.

0:12:31.160 --> 0:12:33.800
<v Speaker 2>Where would I look first at the beginning of what

0:12:34.000 --> 0:12:36.480
<v Speaker 2>I assume is going to be a three hour search

0:12:37.120 --> 0:12:40.160
<v Speaker 2>tearing apart my house looking for this item. Right, So

0:12:40.920 --> 0:12:42.719
<v Speaker 2>where's the first place where I would look? And then

0:12:42.840 --> 0:12:44.960
<v Speaker 2>I take it to that place right now? Because this

0:12:45.040 --> 0:12:46.680
<v Speaker 2>is the key to the no mess, right, is to

0:12:46.760 --> 0:12:49.320
<v Speaker 2>go ahead and do the thing so that when I

0:12:49.320 --> 0:12:51.800
<v Speaker 2>get distracted, when I get overwhelmed, when I just am

0:12:51.800 --> 0:12:54.520
<v Speaker 2>like I'm done, I'm out. I can't do this anymore.

0:12:55.080 --> 0:12:58.360
<v Speaker 2>I have only made progress. I haven't made any piles,

0:12:58.400 --> 0:13:00.640
<v Speaker 2>i haven't put things in boxes to deal with later.

0:13:01.240 --> 0:13:05.199
<v Speaker 2>I've made real progress. And that's a game changer for

0:13:05.440 --> 0:13:06.680
<v Speaker 2>me and for so many people.

0:13:07.600 --> 0:13:09.640
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, what I love about this is I mean people

0:13:09.640 --> 0:13:12.240
<v Speaker 1>hear that and they're like, well, that's incredibly inefficient, waste time,

0:13:12.280 --> 0:13:13.880
<v Speaker 1>and it was like, well, sure, but you know we

0:13:13.880 --> 0:13:16.240
<v Speaker 1>could probably all use a little bit more exercise. Well,

0:13:16.280 --> 0:13:18.079
<v Speaker 1>and you're running up and down the stairs a few

0:13:18.120 --> 0:13:20.080
<v Speaker 1>more times. It is It's not the end of the world.

0:13:20.080 --> 0:13:22.960
<v Speaker 2>And it's so funny to me because I like, I

0:13:23.000 --> 0:13:25.559
<v Speaker 2>get emails from people pretty much every single day saying

0:13:26.520 --> 0:13:28.720
<v Speaker 2>I had all the reasons why this was a terrible

0:13:28.760 --> 0:13:31.480
<v Speaker 2>idea and so inefficient, and then I tried it. So

0:13:31.480 --> 0:13:33.400
<v Speaker 2>I'm always like, just try it because people are like,

0:13:33.440 --> 0:13:39.160
<v Speaker 2>I can't believe the power of actually being done with

0:13:39.240 --> 0:13:42.800
<v Speaker 2>that small thing. Because here's the real opposite of efficiency

0:13:43.360 --> 0:13:45.760
<v Speaker 2>is when you make little piles or you put things

0:13:45.760 --> 0:13:48.280
<v Speaker 2>in a box to go take to their homes later,

0:13:49.240 --> 0:13:52.079
<v Speaker 2>and then you have to go back through the piles

0:13:52.720 --> 0:13:55.880
<v Speaker 2>and ask yourself the question again to remember where it

0:13:55.920 --> 0:13:58.440
<v Speaker 2>was that you were supposed to put that thing, right, Like,

0:13:58.559 --> 0:14:01.520
<v Speaker 2>that's the opposite of efficient, cause you're redoing your work

0:14:02.480 --> 0:14:06.199
<v Speaker 2>and I need to just go ahead and do that thing.

0:14:06.240 --> 0:14:08.120
<v Speaker 2>Act on. The other thing that happens when I do

0:14:08.200 --> 0:14:12.640
<v Speaker 2>that is I face the reality of the space. Because

0:14:12.640 --> 0:14:14.800
<v Speaker 2>if I'm not actually going to that space right now

0:14:14.800 --> 0:14:16.920
<v Speaker 2>where I say I would look for it first. I

0:14:17.000 --> 0:14:20.200
<v Speaker 2>may be picturing a space like a cabinet that has

0:14:20.240 --> 0:14:23.120
<v Speaker 2>plenty of room in there for this random mug, and

0:14:23.160 --> 0:14:25.960
<v Speaker 2>then I actually get to the cabinet and I realize, oh,

0:14:25.960 --> 0:14:29.320
<v Speaker 2>I've got seventeen of this mechanical pencil that I said

0:14:29.320 --> 0:14:32.680
<v Speaker 2>I would look for here first. Oh okay, or this

0:14:34.120 --> 0:14:35.640
<v Speaker 2>drawer where I say I would look for it first

0:14:35.760 --> 0:14:39.160
<v Speaker 2>won't even close, you know. And so it's this reality

0:14:39.280 --> 0:14:44.120
<v Speaker 2>check instead of just this fantasy land of oh, yeah,

0:14:44.120 --> 0:14:45.680
<v Speaker 2>i'll do this later, I'll do this later, I'll do

0:14:45.720 --> 0:14:47.760
<v Speaker 2>this later. But I'm gonna face that reality and I'm

0:14:47.800 --> 0:14:51.680
<v Speaker 2>really moving actually forward in my home by doing that.

0:14:52.600 --> 0:14:55.240
<v Speaker 1>Love it. I love it. So let's talk about sort

0:14:55.280 --> 0:14:58.280
<v Speaker 1>of the daily maintenance habits then, because this is how

0:14:58.280 --> 0:15:00.720
<v Speaker 1>you're getting rid of stuff, this is how you're kind

0:15:00.760 --> 0:15:04.680
<v Speaker 1>of lightening the overwhelming amount of stuff that is in

0:15:04.720 --> 0:15:07.360
<v Speaker 1>the house. But you said that you also need to

0:15:07.400 --> 0:15:10.840
<v Speaker 1>do these sort of daily routines to keep on top

0:15:10.880 --> 0:15:12.720
<v Speaker 1>of things. So what are some of those.

0:15:12.760 --> 0:15:15.160
<v Speaker 2>Well, I mean they are as basic as it gets, right,

0:15:16.280 --> 0:15:21.400
<v Speaker 2>because when I started, I call it my deslopification process.

0:15:21.760 --> 0:15:25.720
<v Speaker 2>When I started, I was like, I don't know what

0:15:25.800 --> 0:15:28.320
<v Speaker 2>to do. I had tried all the methods, I had

0:15:28.360 --> 0:15:30.800
<v Speaker 2>failed at everything. I was pretty sure I was going

0:15:30.880 --> 0:15:33.040
<v Speaker 2>to fail again. And I was like, I don't know,

0:15:33.120 --> 0:15:37.680
<v Speaker 2>but I know that my friends whose houses are under control,

0:15:37.920 --> 0:15:40.920
<v Speaker 2>like if I have to stop by for some reason unexpectedly,

0:15:41.840 --> 0:15:45.240
<v Speaker 2>their kitchens are never a disaster. What did you take

0:15:45.240 --> 0:15:48.760
<v Speaker 2>from that? Well, I didn't know how they did it.

0:15:48.760 --> 0:15:50.360
<v Speaker 2>It didn't make sense to me, because here's the thing.

0:15:51.200 --> 0:15:54.120
<v Speaker 2>I would put off doing my dishes, and by the

0:15:54.160 --> 0:15:56.880
<v Speaker 2>time I did my dishes, I was catching up on dishes.

0:15:57.360 --> 0:16:00.000
<v Speaker 2>And so let's say that I had had a busy

0:16:00.360 --> 0:16:02.840
<v Speaker 2>and it's time to clean the house, and I'm going

0:16:02.880 --> 0:16:05.080
<v Speaker 2>to start in the kitchen, and I would spend five

0:16:05.120 --> 0:16:10.240
<v Speaker 2>hours catching up on getting my kitchen under control, five

0:16:10.320 --> 0:16:12.840
<v Speaker 2>days worth of dishes. Well, in my mind, logically, I

0:16:12.960 --> 0:16:15.880
<v Speaker 2>was like, well, if it's five days worth of dishes

0:16:17.000 --> 0:16:21.600
<v Speaker 2>and it takes me five hours, then obviously, logically it

0:16:21.680 --> 0:16:23.760
<v Speaker 2>must take an hour to do the dishes every day.

0:16:24.200 --> 0:16:26.600
<v Speaker 2>And so I would say to myself, I don't want

0:16:26.600 --> 0:16:29.240
<v Speaker 2>to do the dishes for an hour every day, and

0:16:30.080 --> 0:16:33.760
<v Speaker 2>that's not how dishes work. Dishes are if I do

0:16:33.880 --> 0:16:37.040
<v Speaker 2>them every day, it only takes me fifteen to twenty minutes, right,

0:16:37.520 --> 0:16:42.000
<v Speaker 2>and if I waited one more day, it's not twice that,

0:16:42.080 --> 0:16:44.480
<v Speaker 2>it's an hour. And then if I wait three days,

0:16:44.520 --> 0:16:46.680
<v Speaker 2>it's hours. You know, So I call that dishes metho.

0:16:46.720 --> 0:16:48.320
<v Speaker 2>It just does not work the way that I logically

0:16:48.360 --> 0:16:53.240
<v Speaker 2>thought it would. But doing the dishes every day changed

0:16:53.280 --> 0:16:56.360
<v Speaker 2>everything because I never had to start in the kitchen.

0:16:56.440 --> 0:16:58.200
<v Speaker 2>So when I was going to work on my house,

0:16:58.640 --> 0:17:00.360
<v Speaker 2>I could just start working on my house. I didn't

0:17:00.400 --> 0:17:02.480
<v Speaker 2>have to go catch up in the kitchen first. Right,

0:17:03.120 --> 0:17:08.439
<v Speaker 2>the other stretch of the other routine or task that

0:17:08.520 --> 0:17:12.000
<v Speaker 2>I tell people, if you're completely overwhelmed, do the dishes

0:17:12.720 --> 0:17:15.320
<v Speaker 2>and do a five minute pickup. Okay, Now, the dishes

0:17:15.320 --> 0:17:17.440
<v Speaker 2>are hard because the first day you are catching up.

0:17:17.640 --> 0:17:20.680
<v Speaker 2>If you're behind the five minute pickup, I actually mean

0:17:20.760 --> 0:17:27.120
<v Speaker 2>five minutes today, even if your house is every surface

0:17:27.160 --> 0:17:31.840
<v Speaker 2>is covered, okay, okay, Because the problem was I always thought, oh,

0:17:31.880 --> 0:17:34.960
<v Speaker 2>I need to get all those surfaces under control, and

0:17:35.000 --> 0:17:37.040
<v Speaker 2>then it would make sense to do five minutes. In

0:17:37.119 --> 0:17:39.679
<v Speaker 2>the meantime, all the surfaces were so overwhelming that I

0:17:39.680 --> 0:17:42.199
<v Speaker 2>didn't do anything, and then it just got worse and

0:17:42.240 --> 0:17:44.680
<v Speaker 2>worse and worse. Right, But if you'll do five minutes

0:17:45.040 --> 0:17:49.159
<v Speaker 2>of picking up and putting away today and then tomorrow,

0:17:49.320 --> 0:17:52.679
<v Speaker 2>and then the next day, and whenever you think about it,

0:17:52.680 --> 0:17:55.040
<v Speaker 2>it's amazing the impact that it'll have. And those are

0:17:55.080 --> 0:17:58.440
<v Speaker 2>also the same two things to do to keep your

0:17:58.440 --> 0:18:01.320
<v Speaker 2>house under control. Those two things will change your house

0:18:01.960 --> 0:18:03.440
<v Speaker 2>and they'll maintain your house.

0:18:03.840 --> 0:18:05.959
<v Speaker 1>Yep, we can do a lot in five minutes, especially

0:18:05.960 --> 0:18:08.720
<v Speaker 1>if we do five minutes every single day. Right, Well,

0:18:08.720 --> 0:18:10.600
<v Speaker 1>We're going to take one more quick ad break and

0:18:10.640 --> 0:18:19.840
<v Speaker 1>then I will be back with more from Dana. Well,

0:18:19.840 --> 0:18:22.439
<v Speaker 1>I am back interviewing Dana K. White, who is the

0:18:22.480 --> 0:18:26.639
<v Speaker 1>author of several decluttering books, Organizing for the Rest of

0:18:26.720 --> 0:18:30.520
<v Speaker 1>Us and then most recently, Jesus doesn't care about your

0:18:30.680 --> 0:18:33.480
<v Speaker 1>messy house. So this is a fascinating title to me.

0:18:33.600 --> 0:18:38.600
<v Speaker 1>Dana say, it hadn't occurred to me that Jesus had

0:18:38.640 --> 0:18:42.720
<v Speaker 1>thought much about my house, But it sounds like you

0:18:42.760 --> 0:18:45.880
<v Speaker 1>have worked with a number of people who have some

0:18:45.920 --> 0:18:49.200
<v Speaker 1>significant shame and guilt about the state of their home

0:18:49.240 --> 0:18:52.600
<v Speaker 1>to the point of thinking that like it's sinful to

0:18:52.680 --> 0:18:54.800
<v Speaker 1>have a messy house or something like that. So maybe

0:18:54.800 --> 0:18:56.840
<v Speaker 1>you could unpack that topic a little bit.

0:18:57.440 --> 0:19:03.040
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So I am a Christian and I, Uh, when

0:19:03.160 --> 0:19:09.040
<v Speaker 2>I started this journey, I assumed God was gonna show

0:19:09.080 --> 0:19:13.159
<v Speaker 2>me some secret that I had somehow been missing that

0:19:13.359 --> 0:19:16.480
<v Speaker 2>was gonna just make me go, oh, I get it now,

0:19:16.560 --> 0:19:18.320
<v Speaker 2>and then my house always be clean, you know, like

0:19:18.400 --> 0:19:21.520
<v Speaker 2>I because it felt like, you know, we don't have

0:19:21.560 --> 0:19:24.000
<v Speaker 2>time to unpack all of it, right, but it felt

0:19:24.040 --> 0:19:28.919
<v Speaker 2>like I was missing something because I would try to

0:19:29.000 --> 0:19:33.560
<v Speaker 2>get this thing under control and I just couldn't do it.

0:19:33.600 --> 0:19:35.800
<v Speaker 2>You know. Now, I've heard a lot of people talk

0:19:35.840 --> 0:19:38.720
<v Speaker 2>about the same thing from the perspective of someone who

0:19:39.240 --> 0:19:42.240
<v Speaker 2>can't stop cleaning, you know, like their house is perfect

0:19:42.320 --> 0:19:44.000
<v Speaker 2>and they keep going, and they keep going because they're

0:19:44.040 --> 0:19:47.320
<v Speaker 2>trying to be perfect for God, you know. And I've

0:19:47.320 --> 0:19:50.640
<v Speaker 2>heard them talk about how God showed them that his

0:19:50.760 --> 0:19:53.800
<v Speaker 2>love is grace and it has nothing to do with

0:19:53.840 --> 0:19:56.960
<v Speaker 2>what we do. And I was like, Okay, that's great

0:19:56.960 --> 0:19:59.359
<v Speaker 2>for them, but what about for me When I have

0:19:59.560 --> 0:20:03.600
<v Speaker 2>tried and I just can't do it. You know, it's like,

0:20:03.680 --> 0:20:06.880
<v Speaker 2>am I missing something? Is there something wrong? So as

0:20:06.960 --> 0:20:10.160
<v Speaker 2>I worked on my house, God was showing me very

0:20:10.200 --> 0:20:13.120
<v Speaker 2>separately that He just made me the way that I am.

0:20:13.280 --> 0:20:16.280
<v Speaker 2>My brain just works differently, you know, like we're all different.

0:20:17.000 --> 0:20:21.359
<v Speaker 2>There's that's not an excuse to have my house not

0:20:21.440 --> 0:20:25.359
<v Speaker 2>be under control. But at the same time, it's also

0:20:25.480 --> 0:20:28.040
<v Speaker 2>not a shame, like it just is an issue of Okay,

0:20:28.119 --> 0:20:30.239
<v Speaker 2>so my brain works differently. I got to figure out

0:20:30.240 --> 0:20:31.800
<v Speaker 2>what does work for me, because the problem was I

0:20:31.800 --> 0:20:36.640
<v Speaker 2>always was trying to do what you know, everybody would

0:20:36.720 --> 0:20:38.919
<v Speaker 2>say you were supposed to do in your house, and

0:20:38.920 --> 0:20:42.560
<v Speaker 2>I'd be like, well, this doesn't work right, And it's

0:20:42.600 --> 0:20:45.199
<v Speaker 2>because what a lot of people are teaching on this

0:20:45.240 --> 0:20:49.600
<v Speaker 2>stuff misses the actual starting point that I was at, right, Like,

0:20:49.680 --> 0:20:52.120
<v Speaker 2>that's that's a big point. It's not that what people are,

0:20:52.160 --> 0:20:54.840
<v Speaker 2>you know, advising and sharing and encouraging other people to

0:20:54.880 --> 0:20:58.159
<v Speaker 2>do is not correct. It's that my starting point was

0:20:58.280 --> 0:21:01.600
<v Speaker 2>so far back that I had a lot to do

0:21:01.640 --> 0:21:03.199
<v Speaker 2>before I could ever even get to that point, and

0:21:03.200 --> 0:21:06.040
<v Speaker 2>it just didn't make sense to me. So when I

0:21:06.080 --> 0:21:09.600
<v Speaker 2>acknowledge and accepted that, you know what, this is not

0:21:10.720 --> 0:21:16.119
<v Speaker 2>a spiritual issue, this is just I'm wired differently, and

0:21:16.119 --> 0:21:17.520
<v Speaker 2>I got to figure out what does work for me,

0:21:17.920 --> 0:21:22.000
<v Speaker 2>it removed that shame and it set me on a

0:21:22.000 --> 0:21:24.480
<v Speaker 2>path where I was like, you know what, I like

0:21:24.560 --> 0:21:27.840
<v Speaker 2>who I am and if that also means that I

0:21:27.880 --> 0:21:31.119
<v Speaker 2>struggle in my house, that's fine, and then I was

0:21:31.160 --> 0:21:32.960
<v Speaker 2>free to actually figure out what did work for me

0:21:33.160 --> 0:21:36.480
<v Speaker 2>instead of trying other people's ways, failing at those ways

0:21:36.520 --> 0:21:38.359
<v Speaker 2>and thinking, oh my word, what's wrong with me?

0:21:38.840 --> 0:21:42.359
<v Speaker 1>Yeah? Yeah. Realizing that everyone is different and our brains

0:21:42.359 --> 0:21:45.240
<v Speaker 1>work differently, yes, and we experienced the world differently, is

0:21:46.320 --> 0:21:48.160
<v Speaker 1>you know, good and good to know that God made

0:21:48.240 --> 0:21:49.320
<v Speaker 1>us all different as well.

0:21:49.240 --> 0:21:51.520
<v Speaker 2>Right, and it's a beautiful thing, right, Like we wouldn't

0:21:51.520 --> 0:21:53.760
<v Speaker 2>want to all be the same? How boring would that be? Yeah?

0:21:53.840 --> 0:21:56.280
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, Well I'm glad to find out that Jesus

0:21:56.359 --> 0:21:58.080
<v Speaker 1>doesn't care about the state of my house, So that's good.

0:21:58.200 --> 0:21:58.800
<v Speaker 1>I'm glad to.

0:21:58.720 --> 0:22:00.640
<v Speaker 2>Hear that exactly exactly.

0:22:01.040 --> 0:22:05.680
<v Speaker 1>So, Dana, you mentioned the daily housekeeping routines of doing

0:22:05.720 --> 0:22:08.040
<v Speaker 1>the dishes and doing the five minute pickup, but I'm

0:22:08.040 --> 0:22:10.720
<v Speaker 1>curious if you have any sort of other routines or

0:22:10.800 --> 0:22:14.560
<v Speaker 1>daily habits that more about, like how you organize your time.

0:22:14.640 --> 0:22:16.879
<v Speaker 1>Are the things you you know, do for yourself daily?

0:22:17.800 --> 0:22:23.040
<v Speaker 2>Yeah? So, I well, you know, as far as the

0:22:23.840 --> 0:22:26.439
<v Speaker 2>tasks that I do, I have four tasks that if

0:22:26.480 --> 0:22:30.600
<v Speaker 2>I will do these things, my house is great. The

0:22:30.680 --> 0:22:33.240
<v Speaker 2>number two. The top two are the dishes and the

0:22:33.240 --> 0:22:34.720
<v Speaker 2>five minute pickups, So I don't get if I don't

0:22:34.720 --> 0:22:36.840
<v Speaker 2>get to the other two, I'm okay, I'll survive, right,

0:22:37.200 --> 0:22:40.720
<v Speaker 2>But if I can do the dishes every day, if

0:22:40.760 --> 0:22:43.400
<v Speaker 2>I can do a five minute pickup, if I can

0:22:43.480 --> 0:22:47.160
<v Speaker 2>check my bathrooms for clutter, so that when it comes

0:22:47.200 --> 0:22:49.320
<v Speaker 2>time to clean the bathroom, all I'm doing is cleaning

0:22:49.320 --> 0:22:52.560
<v Speaker 2>the bathroom and not like you know, excavating from the clutter.

0:22:53.160 --> 0:22:58.400
<v Speaker 2>And sweep the kitchen floor, which is not about crumbs necessarily.

0:22:58.480 --> 0:23:03.280
<v Speaker 2>It's about combating what I call my slab vision, where

0:23:03.280 --> 0:23:05.520
<v Speaker 2>I just don't see that, oh, there's a pile of

0:23:05.520 --> 0:23:07.040
<v Speaker 2>things over here, or there's whatever. But if I will

0:23:07.040 --> 0:23:09.480
<v Speaker 2>sweep the kitchen floor every day, then it just is

0:23:09.920 --> 0:23:13.520
<v Speaker 2>a habit that helps me see those things. But the

0:23:13.560 --> 0:23:17.719
<v Speaker 2>way that I manage that is I have had to

0:23:17.760 --> 0:23:21.520
<v Speaker 2>come to the point where I don't assign those things

0:23:21.560 --> 0:23:24.480
<v Speaker 2>to a very specific time of day. Okay, So like,

0:23:24.520 --> 0:23:30.080
<v Speaker 2>for example, the five minute pickup, I knew that people

0:23:30.080 --> 0:23:32.960
<v Speaker 2>whose houses were under control did a pick up every night, right,

0:23:33.520 --> 0:23:35.680
<v Speaker 2>and so when I used to try to change, I

0:23:35.720 --> 0:23:39.639
<v Speaker 2>would be like, okay, okay, I am going to start

0:23:39.840 --> 0:23:43.280
<v Speaker 2>picking up the living room every night before the kids

0:23:43.280 --> 0:23:45.880
<v Speaker 2>go to bed, okay, you know, and then we would

0:23:45.880 --> 0:23:47.959
<v Speaker 2>do it for a night, maybe two nights, and then

0:23:48.000 --> 0:23:49.760
<v Speaker 2>it would be a week later and I would think,

0:23:50.640 --> 0:23:53.000
<v Speaker 2>oh my goodness, I forgot to do that. Okay, the

0:23:53.080 --> 0:23:55.080
<v Speaker 2>kids are already in bed, all right, tomorrow night, I'll

0:23:55.080 --> 0:23:57.800
<v Speaker 2>do that, and then I would forget again, and then

0:23:57.960 --> 0:24:00.439
<v Speaker 2>the next So what I came to the point of

0:24:00.480 --> 0:24:05.680
<v Speaker 2>realizing was whatever time it crosses my mind, that's when

0:24:05.680 --> 0:24:08.560
<v Speaker 2>I need to do it. And sometimes it's frustrating because

0:24:08.560 --> 0:24:10.240
<v Speaker 2>I like to have the whole family participate in the

0:24:10.280 --> 0:24:13.600
<v Speaker 2>five minute pickup. But if it crosses my mind to

0:24:13.680 --> 0:24:16.280
<v Speaker 2>do it when it's just me at home, then I

0:24:16.320 --> 0:24:18.960
<v Speaker 2>go ahead and do it. And strangely, me doing a

0:24:18.960 --> 0:24:21.600
<v Speaker 2>five minute pickup when it's just me at home actually

0:24:21.840 --> 0:24:24.159
<v Speaker 2>usually helps me remember to do another one, which we

0:24:24.200 --> 0:24:26.840
<v Speaker 2>always need when the kids are home too. Write And

0:24:26.920 --> 0:24:31.560
<v Speaker 2>so this not assigning it to a specific time was

0:24:31.600 --> 0:24:38.120
<v Speaker 2>actually very freeing because it kept me from giving up

0:24:38.440 --> 0:24:40.720
<v Speaker 2>because oh I missed that time again. I miss that

0:24:40.760 --> 0:24:42.920
<v Speaker 2>time again, and that could go on for weeks until

0:24:42.920 --> 0:24:45.760
<v Speaker 2>it just I just gave up completely, right of like man,

0:24:45.800 --> 0:24:47.720
<v Speaker 2>every single night when I'm putting the kids to bed,

0:24:47.760 --> 0:24:50.160
<v Speaker 2>it never crosses my mind to pick up toys before

0:24:50.200 --> 0:24:52.240
<v Speaker 2>they go to bed whatever. Not that my kids have

0:24:52.280 --> 0:24:53.680
<v Speaker 2>toys anymore, but you know what I mean, back in

0:24:53.720 --> 0:24:54.080
<v Speaker 2>the day.

0:24:54.080 --> 0:24:57.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, back in the day. Yeah, yeah, okay, wonderful. Yeah. Well,

0:24:57.200 --> 0:24:59.720
<v Speaker 1>I think there's something so freeing about realizing that routines

0:24:59.760 --> 0:25:03.200
<v Speaker 1>don't always have to happen at the same time every day.

0:25:03.240 --> 0:25:05.199
<v Speaker 1>And sometimes I tell people at this show, you know,

0:25:05.240 --> 0:25:08.159
<v Speaker 1>morning routines are morning can be a state of mind.

0:25:08.920 --> 0:25:12.399
<v Speaker 1>Sometimes your morning routine is more of a morning checklist,

0:25:12.720 --> 0:25:15.320
<v Speaker 1>and the morning checklist may happen over the course of

0:25:15.359 --> 0:25:17.520
<v Speaker 1>the day if your life is a certain way, and

0:25:17.560 --> 0:25:21.800
<v Speaker 1>that's totally fine too. So Dana, what's something you've done

0:25:21.840 --> 0:25:24.480
<v Speaker 1>recently to take a day from great to awesome?

0:25:26.520 --> 0:25:35.200
<v Speaker 2>Well, let me think. I put on my calendar, which

0:25:35.240 --> 0:25:37.680
<v Speaker 2>is funny because my best friend is my assistant as well,

0:25:38.080 --> 0:25:40.800
<v Speaker 2>and I just texted her the other day I said, Hey,

0:25:40.800 --> 0:25:43.760
<v Speaker 2>did you notice that two months ago I put on

0:25:43.760 --> 0:25:45.840
<v Speaker 2>the calendar that we're going to do our Christmas shopping tomorrow?

0:25:46.720 --> 0:25:48.879
<v Speaker 2>And she was like, She's like, yeah, I saw, I

0:25:48.880 --> 0:25:50.320
<v Speaker 2>put it on my calendar too. I was like, Okay,

0:25:50.320 --> 0:25:54.000
<v Speaker 2>good things. And I think it's that scheduling in, you know,

0:25:54.080 --> 0:25:55.879
<v Speaker 2>like this is we're talking I'm not sure when this

0:25:55.920 --> 0:25:59.600
<v Speaker 2>is coming out, but we're talking in December. And it

0:25:59.600 --> 0:26:03.120
<v Speaker 2>gets bananas, especially when your content is about decluttering, because

0:26:03.160 --> 0:26:07.320
<v Speaker 2>decluttering time is really really strong, you know, in January.

0:26:08.200 --> 0:26:12.399
<v Speaker 2>And so I schedule in my fun things and I'm like,

0:26:12.600 --> 0:26:14.719
<v Speaker 2>she and I go Christmas shopping every year, and if

0:26:14.800 --> 0:26:16.560
<v Speaker 2>I don't get it on the calendar. And I did

0:26:16.560 --> 0:26:19.119
<v Speaker 2>that as I was, you know, coming up with times

0:26:19.160 --> 0:26:21.560
<v Speaker 2>and dates where I could do podcast interviews and things

0:26:21.560 --> 0:26:23.760
<v Speaker 2>about the new book, and I'm like, Okay, this is

0:26:23.960 --> 0:26:28.320
<v Speaker 2>as important, if not more important, than all the other things,

0:26:28.359 --> 0:26:33.320
<v Speaker 2>because if I don't have that, then it feels like

0:26:33.359 --> 0:26:35.439
<v Speaker 2>what am I doing all the rest of this stuff for?

0:26:35.680 --> 0:26:38.680
<v Speaker 2>You know, if I'm not able to do the things

0:26:38.680 --> 0:26:42.000
<v Speaker 2>that bring me peace and joy and happiness and all.

0:26:41.840 --> 0:26:44.399
<v Speaker 1>That, way to get it on the calendar. Yeah, putting

0:26:44.400 --> 0:26:46.399
<v Speaker 1>things on the calendar is generally a good way for

0:26:46.520 --> 0:26:50.600
<v Speaker 1>making them happen, exactly exactly. So, Dana, where can people

0:26:50.680 --> 0:26:51.920
<v Speaker 1>find you?

0:26:51.920 --> 0:26:55.720
<v Speaker 2>You can find me at aslabcomesclean dot com that has

0:26:55.760 --> 0:27:00.560
<v Speaker 2>links to all my YouTube and podcasts, and I have

0:27:00.640 --> 0:27:04.159
<v Speaker 2>decluttering coaches noil who are certified by me and all that.

0:27:04.320 --> 0:27:07.000
<v Speaker 1>So yep, that sounds awesome. Well, Dana, thank you so

0:27:07.080 --> 0:27:09.240
<v Speaker 1>much for joining us, and thank you to everyone for

0:27:09.359 --> 0:27:11.840
<v Speaker 1>listening to one of these longer episodes. If you have

0:27:11.920 --> 0:27:15.000
<v Speaker 1>feedback from me about this episode or any other, you

0:27:15.000 --> 0:27:18.240
<v Speaker 1>can email me at Laura at Laura vandercam dot com.

0:27:18.680 --> 0:27:21.800
<v Speaker 1>In the meantime, this is Laura. Thanks for listening, and

0:27:21.920 --> 0:27:30.879
<v Speaker 1>here's to making the most of our time. Thanks for

0:27:30.920 --> 0:27:35.720
<v Speaker 1>listening to Before Breakfast. If you've got questions, ideas, or feedback,

0:27:36.040 --> 0:27:45.360
<v Speaker 1>you can reach me at Laura at Laura vandercam dot com.

0:27:45.480 --> 0:27:49.520
<v Speaker 1>Before Breakfast is a production of iHeartMedia. For more podcasts

0:27:49.520 --> 0:27:54.159
<v Speaker 1>from iHeartMedia, please visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or

0:27:54.160 --> 0:28:05.160
<v Speaker 1>wherever you listen to your favorite shows.