WEBVTT - #499 Guest Host Earlonne Woods with Joaquin Ciria 0:00:01.440 --> 0:00:04.520 On the night of March twenty fourth, nineteen ninety, Felix 0:00:04.559 --> 0:00:08.040 Costo Rico was walking down an alley in San Francisco's 0:00:08.119 --> 0:00:10.920 Mission District. Witnesses saw a man get out of a 0:00:10.960 --> 0:00:15.960 white money Carlo and confront Felix, and the two started arguing. Suddenly, 0:00:16.079 --> 0:00:19.360 a shot rang out and Felix fell to the ground dead. 0:00:20.040 --> 0:00:22.440 The shooter jumped back into the car and sped away 0:00:22.800 --> 0:00:25.880 with another man at the wheel. By the next morning, 0:00:26.160 --> 0:00:28.920 rumors were flying around the streets that the shooter was 0:00:28.960 --> 0:00:32.720 a lifelong friend of Felix's, Joaquin Syria. They had grown 0:00:32.800 --> 0:00:35.760 up together in Cuba. Word was that the two were 0:00:35.760 --> 0:00:38.760 in a dispute over money. Joaquin had been out earlier 0:00:38.800 --> 0:00:41.479 that evening with a friend who drove a white money Carlo, 0:00:41.920 --> 0:00:43.479 but he claimed to be home with his wife and 0:00:43.520 --> 0:00:45.760 baby son for the night by the time the crime 0:00:45.880 --> 0:00:49.960 was committed. After viewing several lineups that included Joaquin's picture, 0:00:50.400 --> 0:00:54.040 two eyewitnesses id'd him as the man they seen. One 0:00:54.080 --> 0:00:57.920 witness claimed that she was eighty percent certain and that 0:00:58.200 --> 0:01:02.960 was close enough for the jury. But this is wrongful conviction. 0:01:16.160 --> 0:01:19.759 Welcome back to romeful conviction. I'm Mariline Woods, co creator 0:01:19.800 --> 0:01:22.800 and co hosts of the Ear Hustle podcast, guest hosting 0:01:22.840 --> 0:01:25.800 for Jason flummer Day. And I gotta tell you I 0:01:25.840 --> 0:01:28.800 served over twenty seven years in prison, and I used 0:01:28.840 --> 0:01:31.160 to always think about the people who were in here 0:01:31.200 --> 0:01:34.559 that were actually innocent, you know, dealing with the day 0:01:34.600 --> 0:01:38.200 to day grinding rigor of prison life. And that brings 0:01:38.280 --> 0:01:41.800 us to our guest today, Joaquin Sariah. Joaquin. Welcome to 0:01:41.840 --> 0:01:42.600 Wrongful Conviction. 0:01:42.920 --> 0:01:43.960 Thank you, thank you. 0:01:44.120 --> 0:01:48.200 Cool cool. And here to help tell Joaquin's story is 0:01:48.280 --> 0:01:52.040 Paige Kanap. She's the supervising attorney at the Northern California 0:01:52.120 --> 0:01:54.920 Innocent Project. Paige, thanks for being here. 0:01:55.200 --> 0:01:58.240 Yeah, I am super excited to meet you, Arline. I'm 0:01:58.280 --> 0:01:59.720 super happy to be with you. 0:02:00.160 --> 0:02:04.880 Morning. Joaquin. Can you tell me, like, since you from Cuba, 0:02:05.080 --> 0:02:08.200 what was your life like growing up growing now in Kilwow? 0:02:08.720 --> 0:02:12.280 It was beautiful. It was beautiful, you know for me 0:02:12.440 --> 0:02:15.440 to be a child growing now in my country. You know, 0:02:15.840 --> 0:02:19.600 so rein them my family frame and kill what you 0:02:19.720 --> 0:02:22.280 do a lot of teams you know that you're not 0:02:22.440 --> 0:02:25.760 able to do in this country. You know, I remember 0:02:25.800 --> 0:02:27.640 you know that in kill what we who to play 0:02:27.919 --> 0:02:30.960 you know in the three to one o'cloud two o'cline 0:02:31.040 --> 0:02:34.880 the morning, and it was no dingy everybody know everybody, 0:02:35.480 --> 0:02:39.400 you know, because it's an island. I had a royal 0:02:39.480 --> 0:02:41.000 beautiful shaohoo. 0:02:41.280 --> 0:02:43.800 Got you, got you, got you. So when you were 0:02:43.840 --> 0:02:46.760 a youngster, the US and Cuba was beefing. You know, 0:02:46.800 --> 0:02:50.080 they have a pretty fraud history, you know, the Missile crisis, 0:02:50.120 --> 0:02:54.800 the Communist revolt and bargoes. Not really a free flowing dialogue. 0:02:55.160 --> 0:02:58.800 So I'm just curious, like, what were your impressions of 0:02:58.840 --> 0:03:00.079 the United States back. 0:03:00.480 --> 0:03:02.760 Well, let me let me tell you this, man, everybody 0:03:02.880 --> 0:03:06.440 c what the majority we grow out believing everything that 0:03:06.480 --> 0:03:10.280 we're watching the TV about the United States. We really 0:03:10.280 --> 0:03:15.920 believe that Superman really exists. Anything that you go out 0:03:15.960 --> 0:03:19.640 from United States, we really believe that. Brother, you know, 0:03:20.280 --> 0:03:23.480 you know in we watch so brainwatched, you know that 0:03:24.400 --> 0:03:29.520 when we're watching movie A Superman, Wonder Woman, we really 0:03:29.560 --> 0:03:34.200 believe that these type of people exist in the United States. 0:03:35.480 --> 0:03:39.760 You know, unbelievable. So this see how I grow out 0:03:39.960 --> 0:03:43.320 and and and and wa quing. You knew the victim 0:03:43.320 --> 0:03:46.120 in this case, Phyllis bastar Rica. When you were a kid, 0:03:46.240 --> 0:03:46.960 back in Cuba. 0:03:47.440 --> 0:03:51.440 You know, a Phillis we all call hi colitles. He 0:03:51.680 --> 0:03:55.640 was close to my neighborhood, so mini mini minie time. 0:03:56.120 --> 0:03:58.720 We who to skate from the school to go swimming 0:03:59.160 --> 0:04:02.040 in the ocean, you know, go go hip some mango 0:04:02.200 --> 0:04:07.000 sugar cane. Everybody liked to be around Philly. You know, 0:04:07.080 --> 0:04:09.920 if you go into a party, you want him to 0:04:09.920 --> 0:04:14.160 be there. He was only laughing all the time, making 0:04:14.240 --> 0:04:19.840 a lot of joke. Definitely, he was a good friend, right. 0:04:19.920 --> 0:04:23.000 And I'm just curious, did you come from like a 0:04:23.040 --> 0:04:24.640 political family over in Cuba. 0:04:25.040 --> 0:04:28.240 My father he was a revolutionary, you know, he was 0:04:28.279 --> 0:04:33.719 a Commonist. He fight with they got through, you see, 0:04:33.839 --> 0:04:36.840 if they got got the power way. My father was 0:04:36.920 --> 0:04:39.760 a part of that. Yeah, the majority of my family 0:04:40.440 --> 0:04:43.920 they really believed, you know, in the Commonies. And it 0:04:44.120 --> 0:04:46.520 was problem in the house, you know, because we all 0:04:46.560 --> 0:04:50.440 got different views. Since my ely age, I got really 0:04:50.520 --> 0:04:54.640 really big trouble to fit in the Commonist party. I 0:04:54.680 --> 0:04:57.599 got trouble with that. So you know, at the age 0:04:57.600 --> 0:05:00.000 of eighteen, I was called to be in the army. 0:05:00.560 --> 0:05:03.160 I was in high school at that time. But they 0:05:03.200 --> 0:05:05.400 don't care. That was a man that told it called. 0:05:06.120 --> 0:05:09.080 You know, a lot of young people escape because we 0:05:09.120 --> 0:05:11.480 don't want to do that, you know, to go fight 0:05:12.040 --> 0:05:15.440 to some other country, like a lot of Joonts in Cuba, 0:05:15.800 --> 0:05:19.239 they were saying to Angola to fight a lot of 0:05:19.279 --> 0:05:22.800 all these young people got killed, you know. So me 0:05:22.839 --> 0:05:24.880 and I say, oh, I don't want to do that. 0:05:26.080 --> 0:05:28.640 So when I was called to be in the army, 0:05:29.360 --> 0:05:34.160 I remember that I was there maybe for about sismon 0:05:34.720 --> 0:05:37.400 and I escape. A lot of Johns they do that. 0:05:37.960 --> 0:05:40.880 After I escape, I go to my fatherly house and 0:05:41.440 --> 0:05:44.480 I spend some time with my family. Into my father 0:05:45.680 --> 0:05:47.400 come and told me, and he said, you know what, 0:05:47.520 --> 0:05:50.520 walking I don't want no trouble with the government. You 0:05:50.640 --> 0:05:53.000 have to give it, you say, do the right thing, 0:05:53.120 --> 0:05:55.960 you know. And and I respect my family, you know, 0:05:56.080 --> 0:05:58.480 I love my father so more that this is how 0:05:58.520 --> 0:06:02.120 I aim. Then, you know, in prison, you know in Cuba, 0:06:02.279 --> 0:06:04.640 it's not like right here, you know, right here, I 0:06:04.720 --> 0:06:08.560 waiting something hoppy to your yoka crying right in two 0:06:08.640 --> 0:06:10.200 or three days they take. 0:06:10.120 --> 0:06:11.720 You to court your due process. 0:06:11.800 --> 0:06:15.680 Yeah, in kull White difity in Culba, they directed you, Yeah, 0:06:15.960 --> 0:06:18.880 you can be out thea for one through three four. Yeah, 0:06:18.560 --> 0:06:22.280 I never go to court. Yeah, they see how it 0:06:22.400 --> 0:06:24.240 is in Kiwa damn. 0:06:25.000 --> 0:06:30.479 So in May of nineteen eighty, after spending some time 0:06:30.520 --> 0:06:33.920 in prison, you fled Cuba as a part of the 0:06:33.960 --> 0:06:37.200 Mario boat left, which from my understanding was a mass 0:06:37.279 --> 0:06:40.960 migration of around one hundred and twenty five thousand Cubans 0:06:41.000 --> 0:06:44.719 that was sanctioned by both Jimmy Carter and Fidale Castro. 0:06:45.200 --> 0:06:47.440 You were still a teenager at that time, right, yeah, 0:06:47.520 --> 0:06:49.640 And I want to ask you what do you remember 0:06:49.800 --> 0:06:52.320 about the boat ride from Cuba to Florida because I 0:06:52.400 --> 0:06:54.400 used to always see it on the news, you know, 0:06:54.560 --> 0:06:57.440 individuals on floats and stuff like that coming from Cuba. 0:06:57.720 --> 0:06:59.960 What what do you remember about that boat ride? 0:07:00.520 --> 0:07:04.240 Well, Frosseto, to be honest with you, bro, I see 0:07:04.320 --> 0:07:06.640 a lot of ball when I was in the ocean, 0:07:07.240 --> 0:07:10.160 you know, and we're talking about a ball that you 0:07:10.360 --> 0:07:14.200 might can pull twenty or thirty people in that ball. 0:07:14.600 --> 0:07:18.520 So what the Cuba government was doing need instead or 0:07:18.640 --> 0:07:22.760 pull twenty or thirty people? They who to put two 0:07:22.880 --> 0:07:27.840 hundred people in the bowl. So imagining and let me 0:07:27.880 --> 0:07:31.320 tell you, Mane, I see with my own eyes how 0:07:31.400 --> 0:07:35.440 a lot of ball that's appeal you know, in the 0:07:35.440 --> 0:07:39.200 ocean one minute that was next to us, and when 0:07:39.200 --> 0:07:42.840 I look, it's not a te anomal, it is like 0:07:42.920 --> 0:07:46.960 it is gone. So it was really, really really it 0:07:47.160 --> 0:07:49.840 was really ugly, you know, right. 0:07:50.520 --> 0:07:55.080 So fortunately for you you got here safely and you 0:07:55.240 --> 0:07:58.240 landed in Key West, Florida. Can you tell me what 0:07:58.320 --> 0:08:01.320 your feelings were when you first read the United States? 0:08:01.720 --> 0:08:05.040 At that moment, I feel, you know, I watched Hoppy. Yeah, yah, 0:08:05.120 --> 0:08:09.240 I wa Hoppy completely. You know that I fleck. I 0:08:09.320 --> 0:08:11.000 watched Hoppy. You know that. I mean you not a 0:08:11.040 --> 0:08:13.640 state that I don't have to live it a field 0:08:13.680 --> 0:08:16.360 no more. I don't have to water, you know about that? 0:08:16.880 --> 0:08:19.640 I going and they killed Biddy. Govin ain't on Sonty 0:08:19.760 --> 0:08:23.680 like that. I know. I washed the most power with 0:08:23.720 --> 0:08:29.640 fo komtri in the war. So that moment, anything that 0:08:29.760 --> 0:08:31.680 they told me WILLILL believe it. 0:08:32.280 --> 0:08:34.440 So over the next few years, you kind of skipped 0:08:34.480 --> 0:08:37.960 around to a few different cities and you finally ended 0:08:38.080 --> 0:08:41.800 up in San Francisco living with a woman named Nellie Hernandez. 0:08:42.200 --> 0:08:44.760 Nelly was a little older than you, and she has 0:08:44.880 --> 0:08:48.160 six kids. And back then you were hanging out with 0:08:48.200 --> 0:08:51.160 a couple of your partners from Cuba, your childhood friend 0:08:51.240 --> 0:08:54.480 Felix Costa Rica who had also made it to the US. 0:08:54.679 --> 0:08:57.920 And a guy named Robert Socorro. And there was another 0:08:58.040 --> 0:09:01.319 cat from Cuba that was a hustler name Candido ds 0:09:01.520 --> 0:09:02.960 What did you know about him? 0:09:03.320 --> 0:09:07.200 You know, Candido Dias, what I know about him? You 0:09:07.240 --> 0:09:10.280 know that he's a cute one. You know, he was 0:09:10.400 --> 0:09:13.800 living in San Francisco in the Sta Hotel, you know, 0:09:13.880 --> 0:09:19.120 in nineteen ninety. And I never think, you know, he 0:09:19.280 --> 0:09:23.520 had any typeo or bad feeling about me, a fat 0:09:23.559 --> 0:09:27.200 that I know. You know, we're talking sometimes and you 0:09:27.240 --> 0:09:30.960 know when you got the feeling that you don't click 0:09:31.000 --> 0:09:33.400 with the persion, you know, that's the way I feel, 0:09:33.520 --> 0:09:36.000 that the way he feel. But we never let it, 0:09:36.600 --> 0:09:40.960 you know, past to the level or having any type 0:09:40.960 --> 0:09:42.319 of problem with him. 0:09:42.440 --> 0:09:45.600 Okay, And when you was in San Francisco and asked 0:09:45.679 --> 0:09:49.280 us what was the San Francisco Police Department like? 0:09:54.440 --> 0:09:59.280 So in nineteen ninety in San Francisco Police Department, it 0:09:59.600 --> 0:10:05.960 was really really really I could root department. I already 0:10:06.120 --> 0:10:09.000 you know, listening in the three what they were doing, 0:10:09.440 --> 0:10:13.839 how they brand drag on people car you know, and 0:10:14.280 --> 0:10:17.959 and all that type of stuff. You know. Of course, 0:10:18.160 --> 0:10:22.480 not everybody, not every police is doing you know, some 0:10:22.880 --> 0:10:27.520 really Torigan, they really got some a lot of bad apple, 0:10:28.120 --> 0:10:52.160 you know in the San Francis Complete department. Hyah my 0:10:52.320 --> 0:10:55.560 twenty four, nineteen ninety. You know, my personal life at 0:10:55.600 --> 0:10:58.880 that time it was changing, you know for the bet 0:10:59.400 --> 0:11:02.040 you know, I mean my baby's mama, you know, Johanna 0:11:02.080 --> 0:11:06.360 pays about almost about a jayago before my son was born. 0:11:07.160 --> 0:11:09.600 I was a happy man, you know at that time, 0:11:09.840 --> 0:11:12.120 and all my friend, oh, my friend, what's happy with 0:11:12.160 --> 0:11:15.800 me too? You know, roveto socorro he was happy if 0:11:15.840 --> 0:11:19.720 Philidy who took coming to my house. It was a 0:11:19.760 --> 0:11:22.880 happy time for me, right, you know, at that time. 0:11:23.280 --> 0:11:26.920 Until, of course, your good friend Felix Basto Rico was killed, 0:11:27.200 --> 0:11:29.480 which happened on the night of March twenty fourth of 0:11:29.559 --> 0:11:33.240 nineteen ninety. So Paige, can you can you walk us 0:11:33.280 --> 0:11:34.800 through what transpired that night? 0:11:35.520 --> 0:11:38.800 Yeah, So what we know is that Felix Pasta Rica 0:11:38.920 --> 0:11:42.040 was walking down the street with a plastic bag. We've 0:11:42.080 --> 0:11:45.439 since learned from Roberto SoCoRo that Roberto was in hiding. 0:11:45.800 --> 0:11:48.960 He had just killed someone and had asked Felix to 0:11:48.960 --> 0:11:51.760 bring him some clothes and toilet trees and stuff. So 0:11:51.800 --> 0:11:55.000 he's walking over to the bay Bridge Motel where Roberto is. 0:11:55.320 --> 0:12:00.280 And in Clara Alley, which is sort of perpendicular to 0:12:00.320 --> 0:12:03.040 the Baybridge Motel, there are people. There's a guy in 0:12:03.080 --> 0:12:05.640 a car, Kenneth stuff, and there's a woman up in 0:12:05.640 --> 0:12:10.160 the window, Kathleen Guovara, and they both hear this loud altercation, 0:12:10.280 --> 0:12:14.319 this loud argument in the alleyway, and describe these two 0:12:14.320 --> 0:12:17.560 people kind of walking back and forth interacting with each other. 0:12:18.040 --> 0:12:19.920 There's a white Monte Carlo that the guy with the 0:12:19.960 --> 0:12:23.360 gun gets out of and he shoots Felix Pastrica in 0:12:23.400 --> 0:12:25.840 the street and jumps back in the white Monte Carlo 0:12:26.679 --> 0:12:28.800 and drives off right. 0:12:29.440 --> 0:12:32.679 And that even in Joaquin, you were spending time with 0:12:32.760 --> 0:12:36.760 another friend, eighteen year old George Varilla, who was actually 0:12:36.760 --> 0:12:39.319 the son of your former girlfriend Nellie Hernandez. 0:12:39.480 --> 0:12:42.520 Yeah, yeah, I remain. Me and Joe Barrela, we who 0:12:42.640 --> 0:12:45.640 to be real close when he wasched, you know around 0:12:45.840 --> 0:12:48.400 a nine. Yeah, oh, we who to go to the 0:12:48.480 --> 0:12:52.080 video Keda all the time. We watched Aditta to play video. 0:12:54.000 --> 0:12:57.079 I'm to be honesty, I feel, you know, even when 0:12:57.120 --> 0:13:00.199 I watch young I feel like he watch my son. 0:13:00.440 --> 0:13:00.680 Right. 0:13:01.320 --> 0:13:05.239 He would come to my house almost every two three days. 0:13:05.720 --> 0:13:08.920 Okay, so can you tell us like what you and 0:13:09.160 --> 0:13:11.920 you know George got into on the evening of March 0:13:11.960 --> 0:13:16.319 twenty fourth, before y'all have parted ways. 0:13:15.840 --> 0:13:18.920 I remembered that nine that wasn't home with my family. 0:13:19.480 --> 0:13:21.280 You know, I expaid that, you know, to stay home. 0:13:21.360 --> 0:13:24.600 I was in May and I received a phone call 0:13:24.920 --> 0:13:28.400 from your So when I got the phone your he 0:13:28.480 --> 0:13:30.720 started told me and he said, hey, man, what you're doing? 0:13:31.000 --> 0:13:32.640 I said, man, I'm right here. You know, I spent 0:13:32.760 --> 0:13:36.320 some time with Johanna and with my son. Man, I bow, 0:13:36.480 --> 0:13:39.480 why we don't go to play video? So he conveys 0:13:39.559 --> 0:13:42.920 me and I go out with here and he come 0:13:42.960 --> 0:13:45.720 out to peep me out. It is white Monte Carlo. 0:13:46.080 --> 0:13:48.160 Oh, George Rilla drove a white money Carlo. 0:13:48.640 --> 0:13:51.680 He got a white Monte Carlo. He peeped me out. 0:13:51.960 --> 0:13:55.160 Almost around seven o'clock we go to the CAA to 0:13:55.200 --> 0:13:59.720 play video. I remember that we got there almost around seven. 0:14:00.160 --> 0:14:03.720 Your saving toty with what play video? Buado the Blue? 0:14:03.920 --> 0:14:05.800 He come out and told me and said, hey, what 0:14:05.960 --> 0:14:07.720 can I have to go back to my house because 0:14:07.720 --> 0:14:10.360 my girlfriend. She come out from Richmond, so to make 0:14:10.400 --> 0:14:11.040 this toy show. 0:14:11.120 --> 0:14:13.559 We leave, and when you left, you didn't go straight home. 0:14:13.920 --> 0:14:16.559 You enjoyed stopped by Gallon's Bar first, where a lot 0:14:16.559 --> 0:14:19.160 of Cubans and Puerto Ricans ain't got at to see 0:14:19.200 --> 0:14:21.440 if you might meet up with a friend of yours there, 0:14:22.080 --> 0:14:27.000 But instead you ran into another guy, Roberto Hernandez, who 0:14:27.120 --> 0:14:28.880 was not exactly a friend. 0:14:29.160 --> 0:14:31.640 We don't get along, you know me, and he got 0:14:31.680 --> 0:14:34.800 a fire side. After I see my friend Manolo, I 0:14:34.960 --> 0:14:37.360 talking with Manolo for a little while and got to 0:14:37.440 --> 0:14:40.960 the fight. Joe Barrella take me home. I got to 0:14:41.040 --> 0:14:45.240 my house around a twenty five h eight toty Navid, 0:14:45.640 --> 0:14:47.640 I leave my how a game And did you know 0:14:47.640 --> 0:14:49.960 what you was wearing that night? Yeah? Yeah, that's something 0:14:50.000 --> 0:14:52.680 that I never go and forget that, Navid, because at 0:14:52.680 --> 0:14:55.600 that time, I don't know if you remain me that 0:14:55.720 --> 0:14:58.840 a lot of young people Epecio black people like me, 0:14:59.320 --> 0:15:02.280 we who to with that type post Jackie letter, JACKI 0:15:02.680 --> 0:15:06.800 you know that it washed all colorful letter, Jaki Song said. 0:15:07.080 --> 0:15:13.320 Ko Mamba Squad Song said, how roly So Coverda got you? 0:15:13.800 --> 0:15:16.560 I don't think that I think that I even can 0:15:16.600 --> 0:15:20.680 sleep with that Jackey d C how to much I know, 0:15:20.880 --> 0:15:23.880 Michael Mama squad. Yeah, and they see how I get 0:15:23.880 --> 0:15:26.000 out out of my house when yo body, I piped 0:15:26.000 --> 0:15:26.400 me out. 0:15:26.720 --> 0:15:30.080 Okay, cool. So George dropped you off at around eight 0:15:30.200 --> 0:15:32.720 thirty and you spent the rest of the evening at 0:15:32.720 --> 0:15:35.640 home with Johanna and your son. But by the next 0:15:35.760 --> 0:15:38.560 day there was already a rumor going around that it 0:15:38.680 --> 0:15:41.600 was you that killed Costa Rica, as you found out 0:15:41.600 --> 0:15:44.080 from your friend Manolo when you went to Gallon's bar 0:15:44.120 --> 0:15:44.920 the next day. 0:15:45.080 --> 0:15:49.320 Manolo and some Odo people wasch outside the bottom. When 0:15:49.360 --> 0:15:54.160 Manolo see me, Manolo approaching me, you know how, he said, hey, waking, 0:15:54.280 --> 0:15:56.560 how you doing? My friend? You know ween brace and 0:15:56.640 --> 0:15:58.760 he said, man why you don't leave the CD? And 0:15:58.840 --> 0:16:01.640 I look at here. I say, leady, CD, what are 0:16:01.640 --> 0:16:05.440 you talking about? Manolo? He said, Main CALITOQ last night? 0:16:05.640 --> 0:16:08.280 You know, I'm the rue noise that you beat it. 0:16:08.640 --> 0:16:11.280 And I say, hey, A stop playing like tod mate, 0:16:11.320 --> 0:16:13.479 do you show? What are you talking about? He said? Yeah. 0:16:13.520 --> 0:16:16.240 So when he told me now the Frost team that 0:16:16.320 --> 0:16:19.240 is coming, you know, in my mind, I just say, oh, 0:16:19.320 --> 0:16:23.120 Main's something wrong here, and I just started to be afraid. 0:16:23.480 --> 0:16:26.360 And it came out later that Condido DZ was the 0:16:26.560 --> 0:16:29.680 likely instigator of that rumor. But however it got started. 0:16:29.760 --> 0:16:33.040 The two homicide detectives work in the case, Art Gearns 0:16:33.120 --> 0:16:35.800 and James Crowley ran with that rumor. 0:16:36.120 --> 0:16:39.480 So Joaquin's name comes up really fast in the investigation, 0:16:39.920 --> 0:16:42.080 and from as soon as they get his name, he 0:16:42.160 --> 0:16:45.400 is the only person they ever look into, and so 0:16:46.160 --> 0:16:48.000 essentially what you can see in the police reports is 0:16:48.000 --> 0:16:52.400 the two homicide inspectors who have Joaquin as their one 0:16:52.440 --> 0:16:56.280 and only suspect, start showing his picture to the two eyewitnesses, 0:16:56.440 --> 0:16:59.160 neither of whom identify him. They ask her, well, who 0:16:59.200 --> 0:17:03.280 looks most like the shooter, and she says, well, she 0:17:03.320 --> 0:17:05.679 points to Jaquin's photo and says he looks most like 0:17:05.720 --> 0:17:07.960 the shooter, but she doesn't say it's him, and the 0:17:08.000 --> 0:17:10.600 guy in the car says he doesn't pick anybody out, 0:17:10.800 --> 0:17:13.440 but they still keep their focus entirely on Joaquin. 0:17:13.960 --> 0:17:16.280 But Joaquin didn't even match the descriptions that the two 0:17:16.320 --> 0:17:17.560 witnesses gave right, No. 0:17:17.680 --> 0:17:21.880 Yeah, so the police did get descriptions from the eyewitnesses 0:17:21.920 --> 0:17:24.480 of the shooter and the things they describe because they 0:17:24.520 --> 0:17:26.440 both sort of say they see him from a distance, 0:17:26.600 --> 0:17:28.639 kind of the silhouette. They say he's got an afro, 0:17:29.119 --> 0:17:32.400 and that he's wearing this long trench coat. And we 0:17:32.480 --> 0:17:35.800 know from independent witnesses, including the guy Joaquin got in 0:17:35.800 --> 0:17:37.520 a fight with, who you know, didn't like him and 0:17:37.560 --> 0:17:40.080 had no reason to lie for him, that Joaquin's hair 0:17:40.160 --> 0:17:42.280 is in a long Jerry curl, not in an afro, 0:17:42.680 --> 0:17:45.480 and he's wearing this short, short leather jacket and not 0:17:45.680 --> 0:17:48.520 a long trench coat. And in fact, no one had 0:17:48.560 --> 0:17:51.119 ever seen Joaquin ever in a trench coat, and he 0:17:51.160 --> 0:17:52.600 didn't even own a trench coat. 0:17:53.000 --> 0:17:55.840 You know, thank God that I just stop at the 0:17:55.920 --> 0:18:00.520 Gottam bottle because you'll see everybody see me how the race. 0:18:01.520 --> 0:18:04.960 Everybody the people they said by they DeFi they've remained 0:18:05.000 --> 0:18:07.600 by how I watched the race. They've remainbed that I 0:18:07.640 --> 0:18:08.600 got a Jerry craile. 0:18:09.560 --> 0:18:11.480 I mean, even when they search the house, they're never 0:18:11.560 --> 0:18:15.600 able to find anything to connect Joaquin, and and so 0:18:15.760 --> 0:18:18.280 you know, it doesn't match. He doesn't match the descriptions, 0:18:18.359 --> 0:18:21.840 and he's got an alibi. His his girlfriend and their 0:18:21.920 --> 0:18:24.920 roommate tell the police from the very beginning that he's 0:18:24.960 --> 0:18:26.280 home that night by eight thirty. 0:18:26.720 --> 0:18:30.800 Nevertheless, Garance and Crowley stay focused on Joaquin as a suspect. 0:18:31.200 --> 0:18:34.359 And so at that point, Joaquin, you went to the 0:18:34.400 --> 0:18:36.400 police station on your own, correct. 0:18:36.600 --> 0:18:38.680 I cannot take a no mom maent. I cannot take 0:18:38.680 --> 0:18:40.600 a no more you watch some more roomo that I said, Man, 0:18:40.680 --> 0:18:42.440 I have to go to to with the homo side. 0:18:42.520 --> 0:18:45.679 I have to go talk to with the homo side. Bolutalitly. 0:18:46.280 --> 0:18:49.520 I go with my loyo to speak to the homo side. 0:18:49.600 --> 0:18:53.520 About two and a half weeks after the shooting, and 0:18:53.600 --> 0:18:55.840 he tells them that he was with George Ferrella in 0:18:55.920 --> 0:18:58.359 the white Monte Carlo, and he tells them how to 0:18:58.359 --> 0:19:00.440 find George, says, I, you know, I dated it his mother, 0:19:00.520 --> 0:19:03.960 Nellie Hernandez. They live at this address. Here's what he 0:19:04.000 --> 0:19:06.320 looks like. Here's the car he drives, I mean, basically 0:19:06.359 --> 0:19:10.880 everything they need. And they pull in George Verilla and 0:19:11.320 --> 0:19:13.240 George is initially saying, well, I can tell you what 0:19:13.320 --> 0:19:15.600 happened up until the time Joaquin and I split up, 0:19:15.640 --> 0:19:17.840 and then he says he went home after and he says, well, 0:19:17.880 --> 0:19:20.640 I probably I probably went somewhere after though, and they 0:19:20.680 --> 0:19:23.000 never ask him where did you go? Instead, what they 0:19:23.080 --> 0:19:26.320 say is, we know Joaquin was the shooter. You're going 0:19:26.400 --> 0:19:28.359 to go down for this murder. He's you know, George 0:19:28.440 --> 0:19:30.120 is eighteen. They tell him, you're going to go down 0:19:30.160 --> 0:19:33.360 for this murder unless you stop lying and covering up 0:19:33.359 --> 0:19:36.640 for Joaquin. They essentially tell him like, he's just got 0:19:36.680 --> 0:19:38.560 to say that Joaquin is the guy in the car 0:19:38.600 --> 0:19:40.480 with him at the time of the shooting, and that 0:19:40.560 --> 0:19:44.480 Joaquin is the shooter. And George Verilla literally says, Okay, 0:19:44.720 --> 0:19:48.479 whatever you said, and then he repeats the story that 0:19:48.520 --> 0:19:51.399 they have now fed to him, and that's it. 0:19:52.640 --> 0:19:57.320 So I guess subsequently later you end up getting arrested. Joaquin, Yes, 0:19:57.640 --> 0:20:00.000 and you end up getting arrested based on a confession 0:20:00.320 --> 0:20:01.639 from George. 0:20:01.359 --> 0:20:04.320 Or at least from George saying exactly what the police 0:20:04.320 --> 0:20:05.119 told them to say. 0:20:05.520 --> 0:20:07.919 Okay, and so he was he fabricated her from the 0:20:08.160 --> 0:20:09.840 officers Garn's and Crowley. 0:20:10.040 --> 0:20:12.080 Yeah, I mean, they tell him he's got to say 0:20:12.080 --> 0:20:14.879 it's Joaquin. That's like. Then they keep going back to 0:20:14.920 --> 0:20:18.920 the eyewitnesses. Basically, the witnesses make positive ideas only after 0:20:18.960 --> 0:20:21.800 they're repeatedly shown Joaquin and for one of them. She 0:20:21.800 --> 0:20:24.359 doesn't even make a first positive Ida until the preliminary 0:20:24.359 --> 0:20:26.879 hearing when he's literally sitting in a red jumpsuit at 0:20:26.920 --> 0:20:29.359 the defense table, and then she's like, oh, I'm sure 0:20:29.400 --> 0:20:31.760 that's the guy. And she says it's based on his 0:20:32.200 --> 0:20:36.040 attitude that she can see is how she's identifying. I mean, 0:20:36.040 --> 0:20:38.600 there's a lot of racism all through this trial, Like 0:20:39.520 --> 0:20:41.520 she even says, I think they were speaking African. 0:20:42.359 --> 0:20:47.040 So on April nineteen, nineteen ninety, Joaquin, you were arrested 0:20:47.080 --> 0:20:50.440 in charged with first degree murder, bro what was going 0:20:50.520 --> 0:20:53.399 through your head? I mean, did you even think this 0:20:53.520 --> 0:20:54.280 shit was real? 0:20:54.800 --> 0:20:57.879 Do you know what? Let me tell you these whoop 0:20:58.280 --> 0:21:01.639 not even when I washed my try you, I really 0:21:01.720 --> 0:21:04.679 believe that everything worth real. I was thinking that I 0:21:04.840 --> 0:21:07.960 wasn't a can't the camera show looking all these people 0:21:08.600 --> 0:21:12.720 coming and pointed me with a finger, Yeah, that the 0:21:12.840 --> 0:21:16.720 main And in my mind I said main, I know, 0:21:16.880 --> 0:21:18.800 I know the camera is going come out and they 0:21:18.840 --> 0:21:22.919 go and say a smile you in camera, you know, 0:21:23.000 --> 0:21:25.720 because that was a famite show at the time. I 0:21:25.840 --> 0:21:30.600 you to watch that show tomorrow, you know, and I 0:21:30.640 --> 0:21:33.119 and I say, you know what I mean, what happened 0:21:33.119 --> 0:21:37.520 to me. I cannot believe it. You you cannot, being innocing, 0:21:38.240 --> 0:21:45.040 believe that what is happening to you is real. You cannot, 0:21:45.320 --> 0:21:48.800 you know, and that's what happened to me. And you know, 0:21:48.880 --> 0:21:52.359 to respond to your question, no, you know, I steel, 0:21:52.400 --> 0:21:55.320 don't get it, I steal. You don't even get it. 0:21:55.840 --> 0:22:01.199 Main you're being charged with frost the good morning. I 0:22:01.320 --> 0:22:02.600 just deal with them getting so. 0:22:03.040 --> 0:22:06.800 George had actually kind of disappeared, George Urella, he'd not 0:22:06.840 --> 0:22:10.479 shown up for the prelim, he was missing leading up 0:22:10.480 --> 0:22:13.720 to the trial. I honestly believe Joaquin's attorney just didn't 0:22:13.760 --> 0:22:16.080 think he was even going to have to deal with George. 0:22:16.080 --> 0:22:18.760 It was just going to be this eyewitness I D case. 0:22:19.240 --> 0:22:21.919 And so he did, I think, a fairly good job, 0:22:22.119 --> 0:22:25.919